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April 22, 2024 - Lionel Nation
17:41
What Precisely Is Evil? The Joe Rogan/Tucker Carlson Interview

What Precisely Is Evil? The Joe Rogan/Tucker Carlson Interview

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Use promo code DIRTY10 for 10% of your Let the record reflect that I am absolute agog, filled with delight, most respectful, absolutely ebullient, effervescent.
I am spiritually tumescent.
Over the notion of Messrs.
Rogan and Carlson.
I can't say it enough.
It reminds me that maybe there is a light at the end of the tunnel that is not a gorilla with a flashlight.
Or the light of an oncoming train.
My two favorite podcast platforms for reasons that I will describe.
My two favorite are Joe Rogan and Lex Friedman.
We'll talk to Friedman later.
Joe Rogan does something which is the most important of them all.
This is what separates him from everybody else and why I love this man.
He is unabashedly amazed by things.
I love the word Agog.
Agog is such a wonderful word.
Full of intense interest or excitement or eager to be agog.
Synonyms for agog.
Anxious, avid, breathless, eager, enthusiastic, excited, expectant, exhilarated, impatient, in suspense or tenterhooks.
There is nothing that he does not find fascinating.
And he doesn't in any way hide his imane fascination over something, which is the most wonderful thing in the world.
The things that humans do is that moment of that aha moment, that moment of ah!
Yes!
The light bulb!
Yes!
I have it!
And Tucker Carlson is himself willing, brave, intrepid, and willing to handle things.
And he is at a very...
I know what I'm talking about.
I never met the man.
We talked years ago in one of these TV things.
He does not remember.
But he is at a crossroads in his life.
I know this.
I can tell.
And it's a very important crossroads.
And what he is going through...
By the way, think of what I'm saying right now.
It's not just a review of the subject matter, but a review of him.
Kind of a cheap version of armchair Freudian psychoanalysis.
That's all.
Take it for what it's worth.
And they're fascinated by today's subject, evil.
Which I have been fascinated until I basically removed it from the emotional palate.
There is no evil.
Evil is this higher order construct that we give to behavior that we cannot We can't fathom.
We can't understand.
We can't grasp it.
How someone can do something that to us is so devoid of any connection to humanity that we call it evil.
And I, for decades, have studied and been fascinated with serial killing.
Not the serial killer, but what is it that motivates the individual?
Incredibly important conversation that Joe Rogan and Tucker had.
And I want to analyze it from my point of view.
And I'm in no way disputing it.
I'm just adding some color to it.
I'm adding some thoughts.
Just a few ideas.
Just a few...
A few levels of interpretation that might help in the appreciation of the subject matter.
Evil would want men to breastfeed their children.
Here's the illusion that we fall for time and again.
We imagine that evil comes fully advertised as such.
Evil people look like Anton LaVey.
Yeah.
You know what I mean?
No.
Well, we do.
We do.
And that's because we have to make sense of it.
We do it with Hitler.
We do it with anybody who does something.
We will attach the accoutrement, the trappings of evil.
Hannibal Lecter is in no wise the usual serial killer.
I don't want to say my favorite, but the most fascinating is Bernard Giles.
That is what you would call an evil.
I say it's not an evil.
There is nothing evil.
Evil is a word that we give things credit.
We elevate it.
It's very simple.
It's somebody who wants To exact something from you either, I'll make it very, very simple, either because of the delight he has or she has in hurting you, that's sadism, or he or she wants something from you, will take it, and it's a form of psychopathy or sociopathy.
But evil is a word, of course, that we give because, well, we just don't want to think that things are as simple.
As they really are.
Black cloak.
Exactly.
Sickle.
Evil is an independent force that exists outside of people, that acts upon people.
I really believe that.
I've experienced it.
No.
I don't know what that means, but it's good.
A lot.
And it's obvious.
And what vessel do they choose?
The weak.
It's weak men and women who are instruments of evil the weaker the leader The more evil that leader is Okay.
I think this deals with the susceptibility of it.
Yes.
If somebody's going to act upon a weak leader, if somebody's going to impart some type of control over it, where the weak leader is a puppet or something, yeah.
But the evil leaders are not necessarily weak.
And unfortunately, we've reached a time in American history where every leader is either a woman or a weak man, pretty much.
And so, I'm sorry to say it, that's just true.
I don't know what that means.
I don't know what that means.
Weaker the leader.
That's what Mike Johnson.
Everyone's like, oh, Mike Johnson's such a nice guy.
Well, I know Mike Johnson, and he's...
Perfectly nice guy to the extent that he's like polite and seems kind of meek and restrained and he's not saying motherfucker ever, you know what I mean?
He's got like very sort of buttoned down affect.
But he's a weak man.
I absolutely disagree.
He could be a weak man.
He could be a weak man.
He could also be an imposter.
He could also be someone who's doing exactly what he wants to do.
He's somebody who took your faith and your particular hope and your dreams that he would be this facilitator of that which is, I don't want to say right-wing, but that is conservative or right or whatever the particular word is.
He fooled you.
He duped you.
He did it.
Biden has done this.
Not because they're evil, not because they're weak, because they're imposters.
The sleight of hand, the press, the digitator, the person, the con man, the charlatan, the snake oil salesman, the wrestler, the work, the heel, the person who is trying to convey, trying to do something to you against your will.
It's not that he's weak.
It's that you, we, everybody bought into it.
And time after time after time.
And by the way, there is a very real possibility, as many, many people are suggesting, that he might be the subject, Mike Johnson, of perhaps blackmail or extortion.
I don't know.
But that's for others to decide.
But I do not necessarily...
He could very well be weak, but he also could be the con man.
And that's the man you should be afraid of.
The people who you shouldn't be less afraid of.
Are the, you know, headstrong, loud, don't care what anybody thinks?
Yeah, those guys will go off track, but they're probably not going to a bit, you know, genocide or blow up the world in a nuclear exchange because they may be obnoxious, but they know who they are.
Ooh, ooh, do I disagree?
Oh my God.
Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh.
Weak people just become a host for evil.
No.
My idea...
To be...
How do I say this?
It is very difficult for me to be negligently evil.
For you to be evil because your weakness, your...
I don't want to say your moral lassitude, but your inability to be strong and to be swayed and to be persuaded and to be controlled by other people.
No, no.
That doesn't make you evil.
No, no.
It makes you more schmuck.
It makes you...
A vessel.
And don't think the headstrong are the most dangerous sometimes because their weakness is unable to realize that they're wrong.
It takes a brave person to say, wait a minute, I don't know what I'm doing.
I have erred dramatically.
I'm going to reverse course.
I'm going to admit my error.
Headstrong people have a hard time with that.
You know, an open, empty building that evil occupies, possesses even.
And that's exactly what's happening to Mike Johnson.
It's like absolutely crazy what Mike Johnson is doing.
But it's not because he's evil.
It's because he's weak and therefore susceptible to evil.
It could be.
It could be.
What we just saw right now is very interesting.
This is called when your explanation is more interesting than the reality that it attempts to explain.
I'm going to go back and tell you the story about Bernard Giles.
One of the best interviews ever, one of the only interviews, probably the only interview, well, that Piers Morgan did.
Was with serial killers.
And he asked some of the most stupid questions to anybody else, but to a serial killer, they were brilliant.
And he asked Bernard Giles, but why did you do it?
Bernard Giles, by the way, a little background.
He was a serial killer at the age of 20. He killed like five people.
I think within like less than a year or over a year.
I mean, he broke every, every rule there was.
And they said, yes.
He said, what is it?
What is it?
Why did you do it?
And he said, I was so there in the moment.
It was the most exciting thing he ever did.
He said, when he killed, he said he could see the atoms vibrate.
Now, is he evil?
It wasn't necessarily about the torture, from what I understand.
It wasn't the sadism.
It was what it did to him.
So you can call him evil.
See, I think one of the biggest myths is that man is good.
I disagree.
No, no, no.
Human beings are by default good?
No.
Absolutely not.
Good is defined as most people not doing bad at evil.
Evil is this Manichaean notion.
This word, this wonderful, wonderful word.
This Agathocacological is so wonderful because it is a word that basically means composed of both good and evil.
Again, these terms that we love, it's almost like people love to see things in this Manichaean version of good.
Versus evil.
Left versus right.
Up versus down.
It's just very simple.
Talk about a binary world.
This or this.
It is not black or white.
It's gray.
Make America gray again.
Embrace the unique color frame without referencing good versus evil.
Mike Johnson is not weak or evil.
He is a politician.
He is somebody who may have given in to what amounts to, sad to say, blackmail or extortion.
Or he's somebody who says, you know, I can make a lot more money going this way.
And I've got a lot more deals down the road to feather my nest and to cement my future.
Ukraine and Israel.
By the way, it's so funny.
There's this absolute move to say, you sold out when you gave all this money to Ukraine, but not a word about Israel.
And we'll talk about that later on.
So I thank Joe and Tucker.
I thank him.
But Tucker loves the moralistic.
The very simple...
I don't want to say Occam's razor, please.
I don't want to hear zebra hoof prints or hoof sounds or whatever.
I'm not saying that.
But there is no such thing as good.
Mike Johnson is a good person.
He is in a position right now where people do things where they compromise their own integrity, they compromise their own self-worth, and they compromise who they are.
Sorry to say.
Thank you, dear friends.
And thank you, Mr. Rogan and Carlson.
Absolutely excellent.
You make us think.
And that's a wonderful thing.
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