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Dec. 1, 2023 - Lionel Nation
39:02
Henry Kissinger: American Statesman or War Criminal

Henry Kissinger: American Statesman or War Criminal

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Okay, my friends, please, a word to the wise, no sloganeering today.
Let me see if we can do something which I've wanted to do for a long time.
And I'm finding it more and more difficult.
I want our chat to be limited to lucid, adult, intelligent, focused, evidence-based, not opinion, but commentary and analysis.
Let us please use as little sloganeering as possible.
I know this is difficult.
I know this is difficult, but I read some of the comments, and I've got to tell you something.
What you wish does not make it so.
When you say, I don't like Gavin Newsom, that is not a response.
That is, I don't know what that is.
That doesn't mean anything.
When you refer to Hillary as Killery, And you repeat the same tropes and memes and ideas that everybody else has.
That's boring.
There's a fellow I know who is nothing but a bumper sticker sloganeer.
That's all he does.
That's all he knows.
That's all he says.
It's the same thing over and over.
The plandemic.
Crony capitalism.
Black pill.
I mean, just, you know, killery.
I'm going to talk about Henry Kissinger, but I'm going to try my best to see if I can bring you back and focus and say this is not like other shows.
We don't just do bumper sticker stuff.
And let me ask you something.
What will the legacy of Henry Kissinger be?
Not to you, but to the world.
What will his legacy be?
Are you able to do this if you could say, you know what, I don't know anything about this.
I appreciate that.
I don't know anything about this.
I just know slogans.
He's supposedly a war criminal.
Why is he a war criminal?
How is the Secretary of State a war criminal?
It's the President that signs off and he hasn't done anything.
How is he a war criminal?
How?
He's the Secretary of State.
He's not doing anything unless he's obstructed justice or something.
I've never understood this.
People just say these things.
Christopher Hitchens, well, you know, Pinochet.
Pinochet was in charge of his government.
Augusto Pinochet is a different story when they stripped him of immunity.
This guy was a Secretary of State and National Security Advisor.
What are you talking about?
Why would he be subject to war crimes?
Is Antony Blinken in charge of, is he susceptible to war crimes?
Or Colin Powell?
Why?
Why?
And these same people who say, well, you know, Hillary, Hillary.
Do you honestly believe?
Let me ask you a question.
Do you honestly believe that Hillary Clinton killed anybody?
I know people say this all the time.
But all joking aside, do you believe that Hillary Clinton is a murderer?
I mean, do you really?
Or have you been caught up in this kind of a sloganeering fest?
Do you think there's any evidence?
Because people say it all the time.
Well, you know, if you know that Clinton's hello, and there's all these memes, hello, has he died yet?
Now, you can say all you want about, wow, that's all these people have died, and you can say, okay, so what?
What does that mean?
What do you mean?
What does that mean?
Why are you saying that?
Why do you say that?
I want to pull you out of that.
I want to pull you into the world of the adult.
I want you to understand, That what you like and don't like does not mean anything.
It's not analysis for you to say, I don't like Gavin Newsom.
Okay, I don't like it.
I've got friends of mine who are so unable to handle anything involving Israel-Gaza.
I was talking to somebody who said, it was great the other day, great to see protesters in Grand Central have said, are you for them trying to break down doors of stores and scaring people?
Is that what you want?
Did you see that part?
Did you see some of the tree lighting signs with the swastikas?
Are you for that as well?
Well, does anybody know what they're talking about?
No.
So who was Henry Kissinger?
What was he?
I can't believe somebody who looks like that can be 100 years old.
There's only something to these people.
David Rockefeller and others, they live a long time.
I don't know if they have some kind of special blood transfusions or I don't know.
Please.
Please, no adrenochrome jokes.
Please, don't.
Don't.
I know you're into that.
I know it.
I know it.
I know every trope.
Meme there is.
Believe me.
See how they're trying to crank up Pizzagate again?
It's like, oh no.
Listen, my friends.
We have to be the adults.
Remember, all of this is possible.
But you've got to have proof.
Don't fall into this meme vortex.
Don't.
Don't.
And I'm seeing it already in so many respects.
So let me go back to this.
Who was Henry Kissinger?
Rule number one.
Please lose this good versus evil.
Please.
Please.
Here's Laurie Cuck.
Bless your heart.
Thank you, Laurie.
Hey, Sparky weighs in.
To be America's enemy can be dangerous, but to be a friend is fatal.
Yes.
And there's also this wonderful quote where he supposedly said, and I think it was, I don't know if it was attributed to him, but that The people who fight the wars are stupid or whatever it is.
I don't even know if he said that.
This is Alan.
I saw him recently in New York and he looked bad.
I mean, he was being basically carried into a building by his security detail.
You know, he had family, had a son and a daughter.
I think his son may have worked for Conan O 'Brien or something.
We don't know really much about it.
And Nancy, what about his wife Nancy?
A real tall Nancy.
He lived in Kent, Connecticut.
That's in Litchfield County.
That's way out there.
So let me start again.
It's okay to say, I don't know.
I don't know who...
I don't know.
Maybe.
Look at this.
He got to that age by sheer malevolent determination.
What does that mean?
I don't know, but it just sounds good.
It's what we...
Sloganeering.
I don't know when it's like, I can't take it anymore.
It's like, do you feel any embarrassment?
If you were in a room of adults or scholars and you said this, they would look at you like, who is this?
And you'd say, I don't know, that's all I know.
I just know the tropes.
I know the memes.
He got us into Vietnam.
No, he didn't.
Somebody wrote that.
Look at this.
He got us into Vietnam.
Not even close.
Somebody believes that.
Somebody believes that.
He got us into Vietnam.
No, he didn't.
Not even close.
Oh, my God.
99 years too late, someone writes.
What's your beef with him?
What's your beef with him?
Why are you making this personal?
Give me some facts.
Not this malevolence.
You see the way we act?
You see?
This is the level.
And I know you're, I know.
And by the way, of the people watching, it's just a few people.
I know you're bigger than that.
But let's face it.
I wish somebody would say, I wish we had a little tab that said, I don't know what I'm talking about.
I wish we had mood rings that say, I've never studied this guy in my life.
I don't know the first thing about Henry Kissinger.
I have no idea.
I don't even know what the guy...
I don't know.
I don't know what the guy does.
By the way, I'm going to be on Mark Simone today at 1040.
It's okay that people don't get it.
But we can...
But we have to guess the truth.
Henry Kissinger was the closest thing to a father I ever had.
I love that.
A war criminal traitor.
Why was he a war criminal?
How can you be a war criminal?
He was a Secretary of State.
What?
He was a traitor?
If anything, believe it or not, Henry Kissinger was the consummate patriot.
He was the realist of realists.
He was the antithesis of the typical liberal Mentality and the like.
He wasn't a traitor?
Now, foreign policy?
Lunatics.
Sometimes, by virtue of what people thought then.
You see how we do this?
We just say these things.
And I know you don't know what you're talking about, and it's okay, but I want to disabuse you of this.
I want you to come to the point, and I want you to say, you know what?
There's a new year coming.
My God, I'm going to...
I'm going to stop saying this stuff.
I'm going to stop being this usual.
Let me see.
Kissinger.
I'm writing the decision, the Mr. McAdvisor, and the Middle East Atlanta.
Yeah.
Hang on.
I've got to write this thing.
This is my thing.
Join me at 10.40am when I join Mark Simone on 7.10 as we discuss Kissinger, the myths, misconceptions, and misinformation regarding Israel, Hamas, Gaza, and the Middle East and Turalia.
This won't be for everyone.
Trust me.
Good.
That's what I'm going to say.
That's what I'm going to say.
And remember something, and this is important, and I appreciate this.
You are the most enlightened folks around, and apparently some have absolutely No idea what you're talking about.
Kissinger was a grand negotiator.
Kissinger was a suck-up.
He was an absolute fawning, obsequious blowhard.
Now, this is who he was.
This is who he was in terms of his mentality.
Sparky writes, Kissinger went to school in the U.S. From a fairly young age, but didn't lose his accent.
He fought in the U.S. Army in World War II and was put to the path of importance because he could speak German.
That is true.
By the way, some people do not lose accents.
And the reason for that is that when you learn accent, at a certain age, when you get past this particular realm or this particular place, it's very difficult for you to lure or to come back, so to speak.
He also did, and by the way, this is if you want to know his personal, he went from Nazi Germany, left, I think at the age of 15, I think it was very, he came here late.
He went to, he, his, by the way, his father was very, very, a very important person in the gymnasium, you know, or the gymnasium, as you would say.
Kissinger's father was very interesting about this.
Lewis Kissinger.
He was, let me see, Henry's father, I think it's a gymnasium.
This is a guy who came here and basically had to start.
Yes, his father was dismissed from his teaching job.
When he was 50, he and his family fled Germany.
So, he saw his father lose his, yes, his father taught in the gymnasium or college preparatory.
He saw his father lose power.
And when he came here, he recognized that it's critical for him to surround himself with the powerful.
He was extremely valuable during World War II because, number one, he spoke German.
Number two, he being a Jew would certainly, you don't have to worry about him not understanding the fight and the plight against Nazi Germany.
You will never understand or grasp the notion of what Nazi Germany was.
You will not.
You use that term oftentimes.
You kind of confuse it with fascist.
There is nothing.
We talk about genocide.
We talk about genocide on Israel's part and in West Bank and Gaza.
But there is nothing.
Nothing that is as blatant and as focused and as targeted as the anti-Semitism that was exhibited by the Nazis.
So here comes Kissinger.
He goes and he becomes, he elevates tremendously.
I think he went to City College at first and he went to Harvard and he just, he kissed the arse of Mao, Stalin.
Nixon.
Nixon on some of the tapes was talking about, hey, are these Jews?
And he says, well, you're right.
I mean, he didn't care.
He did whatever he had to do.
In 1972, there was this period of time when all of a sudden he was considered so sexy.
And he loved it.
He says, power is the ultimate aphrodisiac.
Remember that?
And he was, I think it was Jill St. John or...
These bevy of babes who were supposedly attracted to him.
But what he was, more than anything else, he was the classic realist.
And I don't have any particular feeling one way or the other in terms of his personality, whether he's a good guy or a bad guy.
It doesn't work that way.
Sparky says, I stand corrected.
I thought Kissinger came to the U.S. when he was in elementary school.
I think he was...
I think he was in Kissinger to U.S. When how old?
I think he was, yeah, 15. When Kissinger was 15, he and his family fled to avoid Nazi persecution.
And, listen, now, here is the thing which is the most important.
And this is the thing, Sparky, I think that you have to realize.
When you're at the level of international foreign policy, like I said, redundant, realpolitik, you have to lose this idea, this notion of who is the good guy and the bad guy.
And one of my biggest problems I have with some of you marvelous people is that you live in this Manichean world of good versus evil.
Good guy, bad guy.
You can't look at somebody and say, he's a leader.
He's just...
It's the way he is.
Like, you can't look at Netanyahu without understanding what his...
Just look at him as a black box.
Just look at him as a politician.
Understand what his goals are.
Understand what his political ambitions are.
Understand what his concerns are.
But you can't do that.
And other people can't.
Because they have to hate him.
You have to hate him.
Especially if you want to hear some of the most ridiculous, the most simplistic analysis ever.
And by the way, that's why I think people like Mearsheimer are so great because he looks at things and he always smiles and he talks about it like that's the way things are.
There is a video, not a video, but a Twitter focus.
I think it's called...
The world can be brutal or something like that.
And it shows, and there were these hippopotamuses or hippopotami going after a gazelle or something.
And it was the most brutal.
I mean, they grabbed this thing.
This is life.
This is life.
And it's like, no, the hippopotamus is doing what it's supposed to do.
I don't know what you're supposed to do.
This is reality.
This is reality.
I was talking to somebody today who still cannot handle death.
Death of a parent, death of a relative.
And I'm thinking, you've got to understand something.
They're dead.
This is not to forget the legacy of whatever, but you can't live in this la-la land of Maple Leaf.
So what I'm trying to tell you is that he was a person who came along and he said, I have an idea.
I think Bismarck, was it Bismarck?
He did his treatise.
He looks at the world as a very, very, as a chessboard.
And ultimately, he says, I want the United States to be supreme.
How it gets to that point is a different story.
Here's one for you.
He and Rockefeller and others believed that if you could show Mao, it's one thing where, you know, when they saw, and by the way, Mao and Stalin were as smart, if not smarter, than anybody combined.
They knew exactly what Kissinger was doing and they understand what was going on.
Their idea was that they could go to China and they could say, by virtue of the fact that we, the United States, the great repository of democracy, we're going to show you, dear China, how you can benefit, how you can become beneficiaries of our version of democracy if only you kind of lighten up and open your hearts and involve yourself in Free trade and
we'll help you.
And listen to what Rockefeller said.
Now remember, we had different schools.
You've got Kissinger over here.
You have Big Neb Brzezinski.
I don't know if he was evil.
He just sounded evil.
He sounded like he should have been one of those Austin Powers characters.
He had a hard-on for Russia.
That was his thing.
Then you've got Newland and the NATO folks.
They have another world view.
Sparky says...
BB really blew smoke up Elon's rear on Elon's recent visit.
It's the other way around, my friend.
It's the other way around.
Why do you think Elon went?
What was Elon going?
You missed that one.
You missed that one.
You think Elon was...
You think BB's going to do anything?
You think BB...
No, no, no.
Why did Elon Musk...
I'm glad you brought that up.
Why did Elon Musk go to Israel?
Why?
Kissinger was one of the architects of the deep state.
No, the deep state exists whenever you have any kind of organizational situation, whether it's a homeowners association, student council, mean girls.
It's kind of a Turkish terminology.
It is there.
The deep state, see, again, you're personalizing this.
You're thinking that Kissinger created this.
Do you understand this?
Promote the Starlink, yeah.
Now, let me explain something to you.
This is important.
Okay, here we go.
I've got to read these.
Pentagon is more powerful than the UN to be trialed for war crimes.
No!
First of all, you've got to be a member.
Member state of the ICC and the Rome statutes and all that, which we are not.
So they have no jurisdiction over us.
That's number one.
And number two, the Pentagon is not subject to war crime.
The Pentagon is the military arm.
You can't charge the IDF with a war crime.
You charge Bibi with a war crime.
You charge leaders with this.
You see what we're doing?
We're just throwing words out.
It was wonderful, and I appreciate this.
There's this wonderful, like this spewing of almost understanding it, but not really.
And precision counts.
Sparky says, by the way, Super Chat Center has just been turned way down on your channel in the last several days.
Good!
I was watching my dear friend, and I have nothing but respect for my dear friend, Judge Knapp, Napolitano.
He has some of the best people on, some of the most, I think, pequent and critical analysis.
Bravo, Judge.
Bravo.
And that could not have been done a long time ago.
Another thing, too, you're seeing turned down is this censorship about COVID talk and vaccine talk, which is a very good thing, and the like.
No!
Understand something.
Remember, when somebody's going there, Tesla's on the phone, or Elon's on the phone with BB, theoretically.
He said, okay, listen, what'll work?
Okay, you come over here.
And you're going to, basically, you're endorsing me.
Now, had Elon, why doesn't he say, okay, I want to also, while I'm there, I want to go to Gaza and I want to talk to some Palestinians.
Oh, no, no, no, no.
Why isn't that the case?
He's already figured out, ultimately, this is politically and commercially beneficial to him to do this.
I respectfully submit, dear friend, that tide has turned.
You have got to back off, back up, and take both sides into consideration.
This has come back to sting you.
Bobby Kennedy is going to figure that out.
not in Spain, Sabrina.
I want you to always look at the way things are, and I want you to remove from it this notion of personality.
Good versus evil.
Liking somebody.
Liking the way they look.
Liking the way they act.
Memes and that sort of thing.
Let me go back to what Sparky said.
Why do you think Elon Musk went there?
Why?
I like the way they're walking around with this Kevlar or whatever.
Believe me, that's the safest...
When you're walking around with BB and Elon, that is the safest place.
On the planet, he was nowhere near anything.
Remember years ago when Princess Di was walking through minefields?
It was a parking lot.
They're not going to let her anywhere near a minefield.
But it looked good.
Sparky says, maybe I should have put in BB attempted to blow smoke.
Elon was the one doing the fooling.
It's not, there's no fooling.
Remember, Sparky, they know what they're doing.
It's, how does this work?
And Elon has made the calculated decision that in terms of his commercial success, political success, and the like, it is probably smarter for him to align himself with pro-Israel.
And that's very interesting.
So take that into account.
Put it over here.
Don't react to it.
Don't.
Don't react to it.
There is this...
Give an example of one thing.
The moment you lose yourself in the argument, the moment you, for example, there's a, I think he's very, very good, Max Blumenthal.
Max Blumenthal despises, despises Israel.
I'm not saying he's had many Jewish, I'm not saying that.
You will never hear Max Blumenthal say, that was a good move.
That was good.
That was bad.
Palestinian, that didn't work.
This worked.
Oh, no, no, no, no, no.
No.
Remember when we used to talk about Putin and whatever?
You've got to ask yourself, are you able to really understand this, or are you pro-Putin?
I know people who hate Putin so much, they can't.
Here's one for you.
This is one of my favorites.
Piers Morgan.
I always want to say Pierce Brosnan.
Pierce Morgan said, but you know, Bibi, Israel, if they wanted to, they could have leveled Gaza.
Okay, well, if Russia wanted to level Ukraine, it could as well, but it didn't.
Don't you give them any credit?
Oh, no, no, no.
You see what's going on here?
You see?
Look at this objectively.
Take the skin out.
Don't always perpetuate like I'm pro this or pro that.
Call it the way it is.
Call it the way it is.
Nobody ever understood Ukraine and Russia.
Never.
It's that simple.
If it is seen as politics, Elon has a problem.
Elon's problem, by the way, is very good, will manifest itself months, years, a significant period down the road.
It's not anywhere even remotely near or close.
What does that mean?
He's too loved in this.
Sparky says, are you insinuating that the Elon BB thing was a work?
Say it ain't so.
Not only is it a work, it's always...
It's always these photo ops that make no sense.
None.
Remember when you're running for office and you have to go look at a factory or something?
What is the purpose of this?
Why are we doing this?
You've got to look at the factory.
But nobody believes it.
Well, it looks good.
Half of what people do is because that's the way it's always been like that.
Now, going back to...
Henry Kissinger.
There are people who love playing Risk, the game of Risk.
They love geopolitical maneuvering.
And they love...
Let me tell you something.
You listen to what Kissinger said.
Remember at first he said, Donald Trump, he was absolutely 100% for Donald Trump, and he's going to pull back a little bit.
And then he was 100%, he thought...
He was very careful because he knew.
He knew flat out.
He and Kennan and others were right backing Putin.
Because what NATO did in the West and Newland was ridiculous.
He knew that.
So at first he says, you know, I think maybe Ukraine should not only work things out, maybe give some back.
And he changed his mind.
And then he said, well, I think Ukraine might best maybe be...
Amenable to joining Europe, but not NATO.
And he changed his mind.
I mean, he just said whatever he had to say because he's Henry Kissinger.
You see, let me explain something.
Sparky, you'll understand this.
The work about Henry Kissinger is this.
If you take everything he has ever said, everything, and give it to Jim Varney, who played Ernest, remember Ernest P. Worrell, Ernest goes to camp, Ernest, have him say, What Kisner said?
No, but people would laugh at it.
There was nothing profound about anything that he ever said.
But because he had that base, gravelly, Germanic, Teutonic, professorial kind of evil or good, you don't know, kind of thing, we loved it.
He was considered this genius, and he never said anything.
He never said anything where I felt like, wow, I never thought about that.
That's the beauty of it.
The beauty of foreign policy is basically saying nothing but with some finesse.
People who would say these ridiculous things about Putin that he wants to reconstitute the Soviet Union, they laughed at that.
Remember, the people, we've got to understand something.
Americans know nothing.
So you can always go on any TV show.
You're going to be on for a few minutes, number one.
Number two, nobody knows what the hell you're talking about.
So you can say anything you want.
I believe, put it this way, I would much rather have Kissinger on our side, and I think he was on our side.
I think, absolutely.
He wanted to make...
The United States, the most powerful country, no matter how many people he had to kill, no matter how many people, he didn't care.
He was 100% what you would call a patriot.
He was absolutely, positively, 100% American.
No doubt about it.
Now, granted, sometimes he might have seen these.
He might have been more understanding, but no.
No, no.
He was it.
Don't think for a moment that somehow he was something that he wasn't.
But I want you to do me a favor.
When you really get into this stuff, you will ask.
Or I should say, you should recognize the fact that there is nothing really human about this.
You see, that's what the Fox News take.
You see, you don't mean to do this, and I love you for this, but you take things personally.
You like people.
You like the way they look.
You love Trump, and Trump is your man, but you never can call him out on anything.
You can't do it.
It hurts you.
People pay far too much attention to Biden's doddering affect and the like.
What difference does it make?
Why are you focused on that so much?
Why?
Why are you focused on that?
Why does it make so much difference?
Why is it so critical to you?
Explain this to me.
Why?
I don't know.
I don't know what to tell you.
Why is it?
That there are people right now who believe in this.
You believe memes.
You believe mythology and old wives' tales and the heuristics of the...
I mean, I mentioned this before.
There are people who, honest to God...
Let me put it this way.
And I don't want to go too much into detail, but I will.
A little bit.
The people who want to...
There are so many levels to intel, it's not even funny.
But the folks who are really smart are the people who recognize your penchant for believing extremely ludicrous, monumentally colossal How do I say this?
Far-fetched, devious, manichaean, evil, and they know that.
So they will plant, or not plant, but promote and lure you into certain things and then have it go hot.
And you're stuck believing in something which started off as rather benign, but now it's too far.
Let me give you an example.
Never, ever, ever go anywhere near an event where at the same time they're doing drills.
Let me say this again.
Do you know how many drills, how many war games occurred on 9-11?
Have you ever researched that?
Of course not.
35, 40, I don't know.
War games can go hot like that.
Give me an example.
First, Sparky, by the way, says, fun watching the clip of Finkelstein.
Oh, yes.
Obliterating Piers Morgan.
I don't know what it is.
Yes.
Norman Finkelstein.
Watch him.
And by the way, there's some other stuff, too.
Watch...
Watch him years ago with Dershowitz.
Oh my god, they were at it.
Finkelstein, by the way, Sparky, was pretty much shelved.
I mean, this guy was nowhere to be found.
I mean, you'll catch him on Amy Goodman now.
He's back.
A lot of folks that are back.
And there's some brilliant people out there that are finding kind of a second wind, just like your Your limitations on speech have been raised.
There are people right now who find themselves coming back from the near death of whatever.
Anyway, let me go back to what I was saying.
If I know there is going to be a drill by the NYPD to mimic or simulate robberies, A robbery kind of detail, robbery drill.
That's when I want to rob a bank.
So that when you pick up the phone and say, hey, my bank's being robbed, somebody says, well, there's a drill going on.
No.
No, no, this is a real robbery.
No, there's a drill going on.
No, no.
No, you don't understand.
That's what I want.
That's what I want to happen.
So, you've got to recognize the fact, and this is the most important.
This is most critical.
Do not fall for this idea that somehow there's good versus evil.
The bottom line, Kissinger was diabolical, did not necessarily care about human toil, but nobody does.
You would not believe what Eisenhower said when he had to send men to their death in World War II.
That's the way it went.
But he was very interesting, fascinating, and today you're going to see one story that's repeated and rehashed about what a hero he was, and he was brilliant, and I mean, you know, was he?
Yeah, he was a smart guy, but that brilliant?
Not really.
He was the classic prototypical, Machiavellian, realist, realpolitik.
In the line with Big Nub Brzezinski and even Newland and those types where human beings are really not that important.
At any event, dear friends, I have to run right now because I'm going to go on this Mark Simone show.
He's a good friend of mine.
Good man of WOR.
We'll be back tonight.
I'm going to be posting some stories during the day.
We'll be back at 7 p.m.
Thank you for your insight.
By the way, Sparky, thank you.
And Laurie Cuck, thank you.
Raul says, Kissinger was a great...
Thank you, Raul and Sparky and Lori.
Thank you so, so much for your kindness and your increasing efforts to spearhead and to promote critical thinking and analysis.
Until tonight, my friends, remember these words.
The monkey's dead.
The show's over.
Suya.
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