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Oct. 5, 2024 - Judging Freedom - Judge Andrew Napolitano
30:11
INTEL Roundtable w/ Johnson & McGovern - Weekly Intel Wrap Up
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Hi, everyone.
Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom.
Today is Friday, October 4th, 2024.
It's the end of the day.
It's the end of the week.
It's time for our very favorite segment, which is the Intelligence Community Roundtable with my two dear friends and colleagues and collaborators who do double duty for us every week.
Ray McGovern and Larry Johnson.
Ray and Larry, welcome here, my dear friends.
Thank you.
We have much to talk about, a little bit with Ukraine, but much with Israel and the various events that have happened since we were all together last.
But before we do that, I want to play a clip from Julian Assange, which the viewers have seen and I think you've seen, but it's very profound.
It's a summary, in his view, of what the CIA did to him.
And I'm going to tell you now what I'm going to ask you after we watch this clip.
Is this credible?
Does American intelligence do the kinds of things that Julian Assange has complained about?
Chris, Julian Assange, cut number two.
We revealed the CIA's vast production of malware and viruses.
It's a version of supply chains.
It's a version of antivirus software.
Cars, smart TVs and iPhones.
CIA director Pompeo launched a campaign of retribution.
It is now a matter of public record that under Pompeo's explicit direction, the CIA drew up plans to kidnap and to assassinate me within the Ecuadorian embassy in London and authorize going after my European colleagues Subjecting us to theft, hacking attacks, and the planting of false information.
My wife and my infant son were also targeted.
A CIA asset was permanently assigned to track my wife, and instructions were given to obtain DNA from my six-month-old son's nappy.
This is the testimony of more than 30 Current and former US intelligence officials speaking to the US press, which has been additionally corroborated by records seized in a prosecution brought against some of the CIA agents involved.
The CIA's targeting of myself, my family, and my associates through aggressive extrajudicial and extraterritorial means provides a rare insight Larry,
to you first.
Are allegations like this credible or stated differently?
Does the CIA, does American intelligence do the kinds of things that Julian Assange just cataloged?
Yes.
Yeah.
No, he was spot on.
He wasn't exaggerating.
And Ray's in a better position because Ray had a firsthand visit with Julian and saw what he was being subjected to.
Ray, your views on what he said and Assange the man.
There's no better man, no man with more integrity, with more smarts than my friend Julian Assange.
Yeah, this is what the CIA can do.
It's all very legal because the National Security Act of 1947 says that the CIA shall perform such tasks and duties as the president shall from time to time.
Direct.
Even if he directs crimes like murder.
Well, he doesn't need to be actually told specifically of it.
John Kennedy wasn't told of all these machinations against Fidel Castro and how they're trying to kill him.
Sometimes there's plausible deniability where they don't tell the president chapter and verse, but they proceed as though they have carte blanche to do.
To lie, cheat, and steal, as Pompeo famously said, and to do worse.
Now, Pompeo is quite an example.
He went to West Point, and the word is he graduated tops in his class, and there's an honor code at West Point.
And, you know, when my kids went to UVA, after they left Charlottesville, when it said leaving this county, I used to kid with them, and I'd say, oh, now you can lie, cheat, and steal.
Because there was an honor code at UVA just as strong.
So I imagine there's a similar sign as you exit West Point.
Hey, you're graduated now, top of the class.
Lie, cheat, steal, and do other things to your will as much as you want.
You're okay now.
You're blessed and you're insulated from prosecution.
Here's the West Point honor code.
I will lie, cheat, or steal.
We will not lie, cheat, or steal, nor tolerate among us anyone who does.
Chris, do we have the boast by Pompeo?
I was the CIA director.
We lied, we cheated, we steal, stole.
We had entire training courses.
That surprised you at all, Larry?
Nah, I mean, training courses online, come on.
You've got to protect your cover.
So by definition, you end up lying to friends who aren't clear to know.
Sometimes you end up lying to family about what you're doing.
But the kind of deception he's talking about is it's one thing to cover your identity so you can carry out a mission.
It's another thing where your entire purpose is to mislead the American people.
I mean, so one of those big examples we have right now, the misleading of the American people, is the claim that Iran is the number one sponsor of terrorism.
That is simply not true.
It's objectively not true.
All you have to do, go to the State Department's Bureau of Counterterrorism, look at their annual reports on country reports on terrorism.
They list the top 10 groups that are most active in the world from the last six years.
Not a one sponsored by Iran.
Not a one trained by Iran.
Not a one funded by Iran.
So this is a lie that's manufactured.
And yes, Iran provides support to Hezbollah and to Hamas.
But again, using the Israeli government's own statistics from the Israeli foreign ministry, there is no support for that.
Let's jump over to the latest in Israel with respect to Hezbollah and Hamas.
TASS, the Russian newspaper, reports that Moscow, the Kremlin, warned Prime Minister Netanyahu against invading Lebanon.
The Russian ambassador to Israel warned Russians in Israel to get out.
Putin declined to take a phone call from Prime Minister Netanyahu, apparently was furious and anxious about the phone call.
What do you make of all of this, Ray McGovern?
I think Netanyahu is rather feeling very nervous.
It's clear that the Russians are going to support Iran.
The Russian Prime Minister just left Iran.
The head of their National Security Council just left Iran after his third visit.
Now, I know from experience that Russian Prime Ministers and other high officials don't visit a country about to be at war or starting a war without being assured that this war is going to come out all right for their client.
That happened in Vietnam when Prime Minister Kosygin went down to Hanoi in 1975, I think it was.
No, it was earlier than that.
73. Yeah, 73. So, you know, the Russians are going to support Iran.
They'll do it as quietly and as effectively as they can.
They're not going to jump in militarily unless...
And when they have to, they will not only jump in militarily, but they may bring their companion now with whom they're joined at the hip, namely China.
And there have been a couple of recent pronouncements from the Russian foreign minister and from Putin himself saying, look, this is Defense Alliance now.
Don't mess with us.
Don't mess with China because we're in this in a kind of joined, cooperative, joint way.
That's a warning one must heed.
I'm not sure that the Pompeo's or his descendants like Blinken's of the world get it yet.
Larry, wouldn't Netanyahu be insane to challenge Putin to test him as to whether he's a man of his word?
Oh, yeah.
Look, there are a number of things in play here.
Let's first start with Russia's supply of air defense systems to Iran that are in key strategic sites such as nuclear facilities and oil depots.
But on top of that, Russia has, I believe, been intervening behind the scenes.
Since it refused to take Netanyahu's call, it's now had discussions, I'm sure, with Azerbaijan and Turkey.
Well, why them?
How do they matter?
Azerbaijan is the source of oil for Israel.
That oil passes through Turkey.
Turkey collects the cut and delivers it to Israel.
Without that supply of oil, Israel doesn't have an alternative supply because the Houthis have cut off the oil coming up from the Red Sea.
So Israel is dependent upon that.
And this is one example.
Where they can intervene.
In addition, two and a half million, so roughly 25% of the population of Israel are Russian citizens.
Several of them are wealthy oligarchs.
And they've got some sway within the government as well with Netanyahu.
And I am confident that Russia has delivered a message to the Israelis and to the Europeans and to the Americans.
That any attack by Israel on Iran where there are Russian soldiers in place on defensive positions would be viewed as an attack on Russia.
That's one of the reasons that after all this big talk the other night where Israel denied that any missiles hit, that they took them all down, which was a flat-out lie, they haven't fired back yet.
And actually, I'm beginning to think they're not going to.
Because the other element here is China.
China and Russia have conducted military exercises with Iran for the last five years.
And those have been naval exercises, principally, to keep the Straits of Hormuz open.
China is in a position that it can't afford to have the supply of oil coming out of the Persian Gulf cut off.
So this combination of, I think you've got Russia, China, plus Russia.
And I think it's been made very clear to Israel they'll pay a very terrible price if they act in a way that's going to provoke and require a reaction from Iran.
Just a little light moment, Ray, before I ask you my next question.
One of the viewers writes in suggesting a book called Forward by Raymond McGovern.
Very clever, Tommy Two Gloves.
Very, very clever.
Would Netanyahu...
Oh, excuse me.
Lindsey Graham, you know where this is going, and John Bolton have both said in the past three days the United States should attack Iranian oil refineries and oil capacity.
What the heck would that do to the price of gasoline in New York and Los Angeles and Chicago and Washington.
Well, if you're an American citizen, you wouldn't want to do that unless you are rooting for Trump.
I mean, if the price of gas goes up from $2.99 to $3.499 before the election, that's doom and gloom for Trump.
You know, going back to what Larry just said about military exercises, Chinese, Russian military, sometimes with Iranians, naval exercises.
Well, they were going on.
They were going on on the 11th of September when the foreign ministry spokeswoman, Maria Zakharova, A double containment strategy, she said, is what the U.S. is doing.
And what we will answer that is, we'll answer double containment with double counteraction.
What could be clearer?
What could be clearer that they're joined to the hip?
Now, President Putin said on September 2nd, and I quote, the People's Republic of China and the Russian Federation are allies in every sense of the word, period, End quote.
Now, those things don't get said without...
The Chinese haven't jumped in and said, yeah, we're in there every inch of the way.
But they are, and the reason I keep mentioning this is because this is the tectonic shift that even Sullivan, much less Blinken, don't seem to get yet, that they're up against two, against one.
It's a no-win situation for the United States, either in Ukraine, in the South China Sea, or in the Middle East.
About an hour ago, Joe Biden, maybe for the first time in his presidency, if not the first time in his presidency, the first time in a long time, walked into the White House press briefing room and just spontaneously began to answer questions.
Here's one that fascinated me in which he reveals he hasn't spoken to Prime Minister Netanyahu in a while.
Biden.
Two, Chris.
At this point, you still haven't spoken to Netanyahu.
Is it fair to say that you have little personal influence over what he decides to do?
No.
Look, our teams are in contact 12 hours a day.
They're constantly in contact.
I've already had my presidential daily brief.
We've already had an interface between our military, our diplomats.
They are trying to figure out if this is high holidays as well.
They're not going to make a decision immediately.
You know, I had an interesting conversation, Larry, and I thought of you and Ray and Colonel McGregor and Scott Ritter and the others with Professor Gilbert Doctorow earlier this week.
He's of the view.
That Biden controls Netanyahu rather than Netanyahu controlling Biden.
And that the Israelis are doing, much like the Ukrainians are with our weaponry, doing our bidding, fighting the Russians, trying to drive Putin from office, as absurd as that is, that's part of Victoria Nuland's plan, Part of her other plan, not necessarily hers, but others, was to have the Israelis kill Arabs for the Americans.
But what do you think of Professor Dr. Rowe's view, Larry, Yeah, it's utter nonsense.
I mean, this administration having a strategic thought?
The administration that supplies 155-millimeter shells to Ukraine and runs out?
The administration that supplies a variety of wonder weapons to Ukraine and they end up getting countered by the Russians and they run out.
the administration that four weeks before an election announces that it has no more money for people that suffered damage in the hurricane because they gave it all the way to Ukraine and to illegal migrants.
And yet, It's insanity.
These guys don't have a strategic brain to rub together or rub on.
I mean, it's just ridiculous.
The one driving this train is Bibi Netanyahu.
Bibi Netanyahu has been said before, I think Scott came up with it, bought and paid for.
The Congress.
And this administration is, you know, they could stop this war in an instant if they simply cut off the money in the arms, but they won't.
not because they're keen on conquering Iran and living out John Bolton's fantasy, but instead what they're about is they're submitting to what Israel's gonna do.
I mean, Israel has been giving Ray, TASS reported that the Russian Navy neutralized about a dozen Israeli missiles and drones aimed at Hezbollah.
Might the Israelis have come just a little too close?
To the Russian Navy, which is in the Mediterranean, has a port there.
Might the Israelis have come a little too close to the Russian Navy for comfort?
And isn't that utterly reckless for them to do so, if true?
Well, fair is fair, right?
If the US can intercept missiles firing from Hezbollah or from Iran, I hadn't seen that report yet.
It's not surprising, although it is a step toward showing that the Russians are in this full bore.
With respect to Gil Doctaro's views, they're not out of, you know...
They have had people like Noam Chomsky glomming on to such views, namely that Netanyahu and his ilk are our client, or our, you know, we're running them.
I don't agree with that at all.
Suffice it to say that the experience of the last 10, 15 years have convinced me.
Actually, 20 years.
Look at Iraq and how Ariel Sharon had Little Bush.
It's pretty clear to me that, as Larry said, Netanyahu at least feels he's in the driver's seat.
I shudder at the thought that he may be right, particularly in these next five weeks before the election.
Larry, I have to jump to Ukraine.
But before I do, can you give us just a...
Yeah, not a lot.
The reports that they took out 20 planes, I think, is wrong for this reason.
Iran warned Washington and Moscow in advance what they were going to do.
They had at least two-hour warnings, and with those warnings, Israel got alerted and was able to get planes and people out of the way, which is why you only had one Person killed out of 180 missiles, 180 plus.
And that was an accident.
That was some guy walking across the street and a fickle finger of fate got him.
A big booster rocket fell on top of him.
But Iran's purpose was not to destroy.
Iran's purpose was to tell the United States and tell Israel, who missed the message in April, In April, they said, hey, we can hit you if we want.
And after that, the United States and Israel said, look how bad Iran is.
They fell.
We shot down 99%.
Okay.
So this time, Iran fires.
And 90-plus percent got through, even though Israel said, oh, they shot down most of them.
They've got the Baghdad Bob syndrome going.
They must have the same spokesman that the Ukrainians are using when they claim they shoot down all the Russian missiles.
Because you can watch the video.
I mean, I'm not great at calculus, but by God, I can add and I can count.
And you watch 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10. You watch 20 missiles come down and one gets intercepted.
So the message that Ron sent to Israel there was very clear.
We can screw you up bad if you persist.
When they came out at the end of that, they said, we've now sent our message, and if Israel chooses to respond and attack us, the next one will be more devastating, which means they're not going to give advance warning.
Israel's not going to be told in advance when it's coming.
And Iran has made it very clear they're no longer going to be patient.
If they get hit, they're going to hit back immediately.
You make a very, very profound...
Profound argument.
Switching over to Ukraine, do we know what the status of the Ukraine military is and the stability of the Ukraine government, Ray McGovern?
Yeah, we do.
They're losing.
They're losing fast.
A lot of them are surrendering, and they've lost at least one very strong point that prevents or has prevented the Russians from going all the way to the Dnieper River.
The question is how long Zelensky can stay in office when it's clear to most people that he had this great idea to send troops into Kursk.
Troops desperately needed in the Donbas.
And one of the reasons the Russians have gone at triple the speed they usually go is because there have been no reinforcements.
There have been no really good troops in the Donbas because they're all corralled now in a cauldron in Korsk.
So who's responsible for that?
It's very clear from Ukrainian media.
Zelensky.
How long he's going to stay around?
It depends on...
Harris.
And then, you know, he's not long for this world.
And the war is lost.
And if you look at U.S. intelligence saying, oh, no, we still have a chance.
Well, you know, that's Pompeo lying, cheating, stealing, and misinforming the American people.
Ray, how does Zelensky handle Russian advances?
the disaster of Korsk, and the coming winter with grossly inadequate energy.
Okay.
It's going to be very cold there in Ukraine.
You may recall that the Russians really avoided knocking out the major power stations, just their little shut-offs, their minor things.
Zelensky himself, and this is probably partly hyperbole, Of the energy facilities in Ukraine have been destroyed.
Think about what the winter is going to look like.
Now, will the Ukrainian people suffer from this?
They have an amazing endurance and suffering.
But should we allow that?
I mean, isn't there some sensible voice that can come up and say, look, this is really crazy.
Let's stop the damn thing.
We had a chance to stop it two years ago.
Let's stop it now for good and work out some sort of arrangement.
I think Biden is really missing the boat when he persists in this utmost desire or refusal to talk to the Russians in any way except, and thanks be to God for this, Secretary Austin is talking.
with Biela Ussov, the defense minister in Moscow, and that is a saving grace here.
We at least have the contact, one contact, that we used to have during the Cuban Larry, what becomes of Zelensky?
Do the right-wingers take him out, literally kill him?
Is there a coup fomented by the Americans?
And I should modify my question.
What becomes of Zelensky after November 5th?
What are your former colleagues in the State Department planning and plotting now?
They must know they have a disaster If I was the insurance salesman who sold Zelensky his life insurance policy, I'd be looking for a new job because my bosses are going to be mad at me because they're going to have to probably pay out.
I don't see Zelensky physically surviving this.
Because as the military situation worsens, the political jockeying is going to become more extreme.
And you've got this, you know, his former, his agent, the guy that represented him when he was, you know, doing comedy and, you know, playing the piano with private parts.
Yermak is the real power.
He's like, he's the power behind the throne.
He's a pretty ruthless guy who would actually dump Zelensky in a heartbeat.
So there's a lot of palace intrigue going.
Zelensky will be lucky to escape Ukraine alive and to go to some garden spot in the Caribbean and Florida and the Mediterranean where he can live out his days off the money he stole from the American taxpayer.
Gentlemen, thank you for your time.
I know we're all over the place with respect to Julian Assange, the CIA, Israel, Gaza, Hezbollah, Iran, Russia, China, Ukraine.
But I know you let me do that, and you always have thoughtful, insightful, and unique answers.
Larry, I won't tell Gilbert Doctor what you said.
Only kidding.
Only kidding.
He's probably heard it by now.
He's heard it and he's probably watching us and we'll hear about it bright and early on Tuesday morning or whenever he's on next.
I hope we can see you again on Monday morning as usual and of course at the end of the week next week as well.
Thank you gentlemen.
All the best.
Have a great weekend.
Thanks Jeff.
Great weekend to you too.
Thank you.
Coming up at 5 o 'clock Eastern.
We've been waiting for him all week.
He's going to be here.
He's going to be on time.
The inimitable.
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