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June 27, 2025 - Jim Fetzer
01:57:49
The Raw Deal (27 June 2025) with co-host Paul from CA and special guest, Sofia Smallstorm
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This is Jim Thatzer, your host on The Raw Deal, right here on Revolution Radio Studio B, this 27th day of June, 2025, anticipating Paul from California to join me as co-host special featured guest today, Sophia Smallstorm.
The stress, the strain of contemporary events is so massive.
I felt it would be appropriate once again to do a diversion, look at, review issues that are completely separate from the ongoing wars in Ukraine with Iran, the slaughter of the Palestinians in Gaza.
So we're going to be talking about several books discussing the Kennedy whim, the relationship between the Kennedy men and their upbringing and their father Joe and his induced attitudes toward women and their relationship across the board, some of which turns out to be rather sordid, so brace yourself.
Meanwhile, we have a report of Putin and Etanyahu, which may be apocryphal.
In other words, this may not be true because I have other reports that are claiming that Putin is all in on the side of Israel.
Here's Veterans Today publishing, Putin Henetanyahu, read my lips.
Stop attacking Iran or prepare for consequences.
The West is providing Israel with diplomatic cover while fanning the flames of war on senior Russian diplomats stated.
They are sabotaging any path to peaceful negotiation.
In a direct and unprecedented warning, Veterans Today announces Russian President Vladimir Putin has issued an ultimatum to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.
Cease all military aggression against Iran and prepare for broader consequences.
Now understand, I would like this to be true.
The statement comes in the wake of a series of Israeli airstrikes targeting Iranian nuclear sites.
Strikes Russia is condemned as illegal, provocative, and destabilizing under international law, all of which is true.
The continued assault on sovereign Iranian infrastructure not only violate global norms, the Kremlin spokesman said, but also risks triggering a nuclear catastrophe and igniting a broader war in the Middle East.
Meanwhile, we have additional Russian defense minister warns of new hotbeds of instability.
Andre Belyasov says Afghanistan, main source of transnational crime, terrorist threats across Eurasian region.
Afghanistan.
Numerous hotbeds of instability are emerging around the world.
Russian Defense Minister Andrei Belisov said Thursday, speaking at a meeting of defense chiefs from Shanghai Cooperation Organization Member States in China.
He warned that these troubled areas are also being created with the SCO and along its perimeter.
The SCO comprises 10 member states, China, Russia, India, Iran, Kazakhstan, Khazarstan, Pakistan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, and Belarus.
A lot of stands there.
Thank you, Paul.
Glad to have you here.
Most have pointed to Afghanistan as the main source of transitional crime and terrorist threats in the SCL region, signing the spread of terrorist ideologies from the Middle East and the flow of militants into Afghanistan.
The situation in the Middle East has sharply worsened, he said, adding that efforts in the Asia-Pacific to form closed anti-Chinese and anti-Russian blocs have had a destructive effect on regional security, no doubt.
Meanwhile, former President of Russia Mendave from Russia today, Orty, yapping bitches in Brussels, a direct threat to Russia.
The European Union has emerged as a hostile force to Moscow, former Russian President Dmitry Mendave has claimed, accusing the bloc of arming the neo-Nazi Kiev regime to attack Russia.
In a telegram post on Wednesday, Mendavev stated that the old EU as an economic union has essentially ceased to exist and in its current perverted form is no less of a threat to Russia than NATO.
Brussels today is Russia's true enemy, he Wrote.
Slowly but surely, the EU is transforming into a self-sustaining military bloc that will gradually come to compete with NATO.
The ex-president accused Belarusian cockroaches and narrow-minded leaders of EU countries of advancing their militarization strategy based on an imaginary Russian threat, ushering a new era of rearmament.
According to Mendaved, the EU's goal is to arm the Kiev regime to the point where it becomes invulnerable to Russia, claiming Brussels is ramping up its military-industrial output and building military factories on Ukrainian soil.
The EU, he said, is also sending personnel to train Ukrainian militants so that they can kill our citizens and carry out terrorist attacks.
He also accused Brussels of brazenly using protests from Russia's frozen assets to finance its vile activities, which is undoubtedly true.
Paul, any comments on the stories as you heard them?
Well, our language seems to be coming ever more colorful, right?
We have Belarus and cockroaches and what do you call them, Brussels bitches?
Yeah, yeah, and yeah, you know, and we've all seen now that clip of Trump, you know, the president of the United States, I guess, canal dropped the F-bomb and this is now covered news.
I mean, this would have, you know, this sort of these sort of this sorts of language would have never been, I just, you know, what else can I say about it?
It's just published.
Yes.
I think that people in the public, for example, you and I are kind of in the public, I suppose.
But I believe that, you know, politicians and television news presenters should be held to a higher standard.
And I think the coarsening and the vulgarization of our everyday language is overall not something that I welcome.
Yes.
Yes.
Well, I tend to agree.
And I do think it represents a coarsening of relations of loss of diplomacy, especially promoted by Trump's thuggish manner, which he may have found useful in New York real estate transactions, but doesn't translate well to the international scene.
Here's Richard Solomon Inun's review, real politic analysis of the Russia-China commitment to Iran.
How far the Iranian praise Greater Israel project goes remains to be seen.
While I appreciate the joint statement from China and Russia condemning the U.S.-Israeli attacks on Iran, actions transcend words.
If the U.S. goes beyond a foot then and Cannonball dives into the Iranian pool, the stakes of this conflict will be high, going beyond the survival of the so-called axis of resistance and Iran's survival as a nation state.
Also at stake would be the future of BRICS, BRI, the multipolar order, and the security and the stability of Russia and China.
The same risks and rewards apply to the Petrodollar and the U.S. Anglo-Zionist empire, both in its role as global hegemon and its very existence as an empire.
It's possible the U.S. Zionist attack on Iran is some crazed American-Israeli negotiating tactic or theatrical chaos distraction.
Global finance turned chaos into a profitable, well-oiled machine.
So it often looks like chaotic insanity is really market manipulation.
This could all be a Wall Street del Aviv insider trading scam with foreknowledge of the spikes and dips and the added plus of damaging Iran.
Buy low, sell high, as they say, or follow the money.
Paul, I'm going to bring you.
Hang on.
Remember when the Wall Street Zionist insider sold right before 9-11?
Any drum insiders who sold immediately before he made his first big super steroid tariff speech and bought a day ahead of his public retraction made our killing.
Paul.
You know, you know, sometimes, like I say, I like to, you know, to maybe jump in or interject when I hear a point that's worth emphasizing and it gets lost amongst subsequent text when you read.
So, for example, you know, this negotiating tag, the characterization as a negotiating tactic, I don't really think it could be more accurate.
You know, it reminds me of the idea of what we used to call the major persuader, you know, or for example, you know, when cops either they pull out their taser and or back in the day, you know, when they had the Billy Club and you just have to either, you know, just touch them a little bit or, you know, even just show it to them and to let them know, okay, this is, this is who's boss.
And I think really, you know, we all know it's not about nuclear weapons.
So we can be pretty well assured that we don't want any more major players in the oil business than are currently out there in the field.
And this has just been an ongoing theme for what now 40, 50 years.
And I think that it's when viewed in that light, you know, hey, we're going to drop a few bombs, you know, a little major persuasion here.
And then some rascal, right, some varmint like Trump can just go, okay, now let's have a ceasefire.
You know, it's just the whole, the whole thing is just disgusting.
Go ahead and continue with your stories.
Here's a nice piece from the Truth Seeker, what Iran Achieved During the Conflict with Israel by Rayhan Udin, Middle East Eye.
After an 11th hour exchange of fire and a sweary address to reporters from Donald Trump, Israel and Iran have ceased Hostilities.
U.S. President announced a complete and total ceasefire late on Monday, ending 11 days of clashes.
Israel landed hundreds of attacks on Iran on 13 June, saying that it wanted to remove any chance of Tehran developing nuclear weapons.
It attacked Iranian nuclear and military facilities and assassinate high-profile security intelligence and military figures as well as nuclear scientists.
Tehran, which denies it seeks a nuclear weapon, retaliated with ballistic missile strikes on Israeli towns and cities.
At least 439 Iranians were killed and 28 in Israel.
While the assault left Iran undoubtedly damaged, it nonetheless provided lessons about its nuclear and military capabilities, as well as the domestic standing of the Islamic Republic itself.
There's little question Iran suffered a setback on its nuclear program, according to Mohammed Islami, an expert on the proliferation of conventional and unconventional weapons in the Middle East.
Precision Israeli strikes severely damaged key components of Iran's nuclear infrastructure, Islami told Middle East I, signed attacks on a heavy water reactor at uranium enrichment facilities at Natanz and Fordo, and research labs in Isfahan.
These sites represent decades of accumulated technical effort and institutional knowledge, he said.
The level of damage that Israeli and later U.S. strikes inflicted on Iran's nuclear sites is not fully clear.
Iranian authorities are clearly carrying out assessment to determine the extent of the damage.
No nuclear fallout has been reported at the sites.
Several nuclear scientists were also killed by Israel.
Building infrastructure is one thing.
Rebuilding a generation of homegrown scientists with deep expertise in nuclear physics, engineering, and centrifugal design is far harder said Islami.
As for Iran's nuclear diplomacy in the near future, the conflict may have given it a clearer sense of how to move forward.
Up to now, U.S. intelligence assessments suggest Iran is not yet actively pursuing the manufacture of a nuclear weapon, years away from being able to produce one anyway.
Iran is a member of the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty, by the way, it is now withdrawn, and insists it has a sovereign right to enrich uranium for civilian purposes, no doubt about it.
Iran did suffer its military infrastructure.
Assets, including missile launchers, were directly attacked by Israel.
It's also burned through a significant chunk of its existing arsenal of ballistic missiles, which will need replacing.
Despite its losses, Iran's missile program made a powerful impression.
Its projectiled repeatedly breached Israeli and allied regional air defense systems, impacting both civilian and military targets.
Iran has shown that it can not only survive, but retaliate in meaningful ways.
That capability cements its status as a regional military power.
The strikes on cities like Tel Aviv and Haifa caused major damage, completely destroying apartment buildings and other sites.
While Israel has withstood rockets and missiles from Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Houthis over the past two years, none of these groups managed to inflict the level of cross-border damage seen in recent days.
Eli Risk, a Lebanese political and security analyst, said Iran showed its allies in the region how far it is willing to engage in direct military action.
In recent years, Iran had been less prone to direct attacks, relying more on proxy wars with its allied groups.
Iran wasn't even silent on American attacks, Ritz told Middle East Eye, referring to Iran's retaliatory strike at the U.S. al-Udaid military base in Qatar on Monday.
It was a symbolic attack.
But nevertheless, the fact that Iran also insisted on responding to that gave more and more reassurance to its allies how far Iran is willing to go.
Also, the war rallied the Iranian people.
Beyond nuclear and military considerations, there were far more existential questions posed over the past two weeks regarding whether the Islamic Republic would survive until the end of the war.
Both Israeli and U.S. leaders insisted regime change was one of the conflict key aims, in addition to curbing Iran's nuclear ambitions.
Ultimately, however, there was no groundswell in support of overthrowing the government and political system on the streets of Iran.
Well, the most important conclusion to draw is that the United States is not in the business of pursuing regime change against Iran's risk.
It still deems that to be too risky an endeavor.
Despite Iran having a shaky few months on the global stage with the fall of Bashir al-Assad's autocratic government in Syria, actually he was a democratically elected president, as well as a severe weakening of Hezbollah during his war with Israel, Netyahu was still unable to persuade the U.S. to help Israel overthrow the Islamic Republic.
Indeed, the war may have had the opposite effect.
By inadvertently helping to rally the Iranian people around its leaders, it actually made the Islamic Republic position stronger.
And those who didn't designate Israel as enemy are going to do so now.
Even those who formerly didn't support the Iranian government, he said, so this was a major strategic blunder for Netanyahu.
Paul, your thoughts?
Well, my first thought is that's way too lengthy of an article to read on here.
There's just so much there.
And, you know, it's just your typical word salad, a lot of speculation.
I mean, how does he know they rallied the Iranian people?
I don't think any of this stuff, I mean, I'm certain that the Israeli people are not rallied and the Iranian people as well.
Probably most of them feel similar to the way we do, which is all this nonsense, all this BS for what?
For nothing.
What's the point?
It's just, you know, the big bully flexing his muscle.
And again, we all know this is nothing to do with so-called regime change.
Although what that really means is that, of course, you know, that the political economic apparatus in these countries is not going along with the global playbook.
We'll call it that.
Nuclear weapons, of course, are a convenient pretext to get involved and to use as a talking point.
And by the way, it's very similar to the fake space programs that all these places have.
Nobody's going to give up the nuclear fraud because it's too useful overall.
That's why, for example, you have the fraud of the Chinese space program and the fraud of the Indian space program.
If you've ever seen some of those videos, they're hokey beyond belief.
These governments find it quite useful to have these quote-unquote programs as just another means for them to strip their citizens of their money, to rob the treasuries of the government.
And of course, for the West, it's great political fodder.
In other words, oh, this person, this country here is close to developing a nuclear weapon.
I mean, like I said, we've seen this for decades and decades and decades now.
So again, I'm going to affirm my position that even if nuclear weapons exist, and I am firmly convinced that they do not, that this conflict is not going to go nuclear.
Nobody's going to drop any nuclear weapons on each other.
And it's going to be, I don't know, prolonged, if you will, because there's a lot of mileage they're getting out of this.
And there's a whole lot of stuff going on in all these places, including the U.S., that's far more important to the citizens than what I would call this big, huge fireworks distraction.
In reality, when you throw some missiles at another country and knock down a few buildings or a few apartments, you know, it really is in essence a fireworks distraction.
And as far as I'm concerned, we don't have any evidence that our so-called bunker busters destroyed any, you know, valuable military facilities over there.
We have to take their word that these things can go 200 feet under the ground and blow up things.
And we have to take their word that Iran indeed does have facilities that are two and 300 feet underneath the ground.
This is all something that we, the average person, cannot confirm.
Here's some additional developments.
Iran's parliament has built a suspend cooperation with the International Atomic Energy Agency in response to the U.S. bombing, which complements withdrawal from the nonproliferation treaty.
And while Iran in the past, of course, has denied any interest in developing nuclear weapons, Tulsi Gabbard reaffirmed the conclusion of the U.S. Intel community, including CIA, that Iran was not pursuing nuclear weapons.
We now have multiple reports that various countries are willing to give Iran nukes of their own, which would include North Korea and Pakistan.
Trump, meanwhile, says he'll bomb Iran again if it restarts enrichment program, but doesn't think it will happen.
On the contrary, I guarantee for a certainty it will happen.
Iran is not going to give up its enrichment program.
And a difficult, difficult, one second, Paul.
In a difficult front, is that he's being contradicted about his assessment of having obliterated those processing sites, not only by Iran, which had been confirmed by Saudi Arabia, but also by the Defense Intelligence Agency out of the Pentagon, affirms that it was not a successful strike.
So Trump, by insisting, is putting himself in a predicament of looting credibility across the board, Paul.
Yeah, okay, so great.
That just sort of confirms, you know, the point I was making, you know, which is a valid point.
But what I wanted to say, jump in there, when this whole idea about they're going to start again, their enrichment program and so on and so forth.
So how would we know that any country is doing a so-called enrichment program when these are all conducted in what we could at the minimum describe as very secure or even secret facilities and or underground facilities, which we allege that Iran is doing?
How the hell would we know whether they are beginning or starting or stopping any so-called enrichment program?
To me, this is astounding that the average American person, and again, they probably don't pay as much attention as you and I, to be honest.
I think most people are fairly oblivious to this.
And if they do say anything in a conversation with somebody else, it's just a talking point that they've heard, such as enrichment program.
I would contend that we don't have any way to know for sure whether any country is on some sort of an enrichment program.
By the way, whatever the hell that means.
You know, the whole, again, the whole notion of this enrichment to get fissile material is, in my opinion, shall we say, legend or theory.
Paul, I think you're putting yourself out on a limb because during the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action, there were International Atomic Agency inspectors present at the enrichment facilities.
Iran was participating, conforming to the low levels required for nuclear power plant electricity production.
Scott Ritter was one of the inspectors.
So there's a whole lot of confirmation.
We have countries around the world using atomic energy for peaceful nuclear production of energy, Paul.
So I think the idea of denying that this enrichment take place for that purpose is frankly ridiculous.
Well, no.
You lose credibility by making assertions of that exaggerated.
Well, Jim, if there's anything that I'm good at, it's losing credibility.
It doesn't distract from my point.
You know, this notion, okay, so when the inspectors leave, all right, now what?
I mean, when I was a young man, in between, you know, one thing or another, I worked at a meatpacking plant.
Quite the job.
I had to show up at six in the morning, and it was really literally like going to work in a refrigerator.
Overall, it wasn't pleasant, right?
Because they keep the temperatures very cool while you're working.
Well, here's the point.
This meatpacking plant had a periodic so-called inspections, we were told, right?
Now, I never saw.
I heard one day that some USDA inspector came by and, you know, shot, we used to call it, shot the shit, you know, bullshit with some of the management and then left.
But we never saw them.
And this whole, this whole notion of, you know, so-called inspections and inspectors, you know, come on.
Again, appreciate your skepticism and cynicism.
We've hit a break.
We'll be joined by Sophia Smallster.
We'll be talking about the Kennedy Women's diversion from the mayhem taking place around the world.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
Welcome back to the Raw Deal today, this 27th day of June, 2025, where I'm very pleased.
My featured guest today, Sophia Smallstorm, has been doing research into the Kennedy women, the Kennedy family, and its industry.
I have two books at hand I would not have, but for Sophia's recommendation, one entitled Once Upon a Secret, My Affair with Resident John F. Kennedy and its Aftermath by Mimi Alford, and, which is only a few hundred pages, but a 900-page behemoth by Lawrence Leamer entitled The Kennedy Whim and the Saga of an American Family.
A lot of this stuff, alas, is rather sorted.
You may want to brace yourself.
Sophia, welcome back to the show.
Hi, Jim.
Thank you so much.
You have another book, though.
You have the Darwin Porter book.
on the death of Marilyn Monroe, right?
Yes, indeed.
Yes, indeed.
Marilyn at Rainbow's End by Darwin Porter, which I take to be the most definitive analysis of her death, which may surprise many who thought the Kennedys were responsible.
I'm convinced they were not, have never taken it seriously.
But here's an explanation.
Sophia, continue.
Well, you know, Jim, this is going to be a casual discussion because I am surrounded by books on the Kennedys now.
And I don't know how this happened.
You're the one who led me into a horrific direction with this, which was Mr. Darwin Porter, right?
I had no idea.
Sorted is mild.
It is mild.
So this all started, Jim, because I tried to tell you a few months ago about Mimi's book.
And I don't think, I think you were distracted at the time that we were talking.
And then I brought it up again a few weeks ago and you ordered it and you began to read it.
And I explained to you that Mimi Alford was somebody that I knew.
Okay, she was a personal, more than an acquaintance.
I actually worked with her in New York.
And this was about 19, let's just say the early 80s.
Okay, early to mid-80s.
And she was about 20 years older than I was and a very pretty, very dignified, absolutely lovely woman.
But she always seemed sad.
And I didn't know why.
I didn't try to probe or pry.
And then at some point in the early 2000s, like 2005, 6, I read something online about how this woman was outed.
New York Daily News had published an article about her.
She had been JFK's Monica Lewinsky, right?
The equivalent, a squeeze, an intern in the White House.
And I learned that a book was written soon after this.
I think it was actually 2012 that she published her book, something like that.
So I bought the book and I read it because I had known her.
I mean, seriously, I'm the type of person, if somebody tells me, somebody I know tells me they've written a book, I'm likely to buy it.
If I like the person and I find the person to have been interesting, whatever.
So I bought the book, read it.
I couldn't believe it.
It was so sweet and earnest.
Jim, what did you think of the book?
Oh, I agree completely.
She was so naive when she went to work as an intern.
And then to have JFK escorting you through the private quarters of the White House and into the Lincoln bedroom and then seducing her there, it was very touching.
Sophia, she seemed like a completely genuine 100% person, naive in many ways, with whom JFK appears to have had a relationship where he was completely free from the affairs of the world.
He had no sense of responsibility imposed upon him when he was with Mimi.
These were precious moments, I think, for him, kind of, you know, reflection or reconstitution or composing himself.
As you've observed, it was a sexual relationship, but it was not romantic.
He never kissed Mimi even once.
But it was a very touching story.
Yeah, so it's not touching how he seduced her, Jim.
It's actually quite horrifying.
She's been, you can Google her, Mimi Alford.
She's done some interviews.
I actually contacted her after I read the book, and I managed to get through to her.
And we communicated by email.
And she had no idea, it seemed, of the, that Lee Oslaw did not kill JFK.
She was absolutely oblivious to this possibility.
And really, the two most, what's the word, compelling aspects of her book are the seduction in the beginning, how she was lured into this.
And then also the constant, you know, she flew on Air Force One.
She had to stay in hotel rooms and wait for the president.
And she assumed he was doing political things, you know, hobnobbing with people, signing papers, having talks.
And the Secret Service or Dave Powers would let her know when he was ready for her.
And then she would be in this hotel room all day.
But then the most compelling part of the book was when she learned of his assassination and her reaction to that.
And that is absolutely worth reading.
And it broke my heart.
It was just so, so absolutely human, right?
That's the word.
Mimi was human.
Is.
And that's how this all started for me.
And, you know, honestly, then there was, I was talking to a friend about Mimi's book because I put Mimi's book in my online store, avatarproducts.com.
I finally got an account with Ingram, which is a giant book distributor.
It's very hairy to get accounts with these giant, giant companies.
But I put in some good books.
Everybody, J.D. Vance's Hillbilly Elegy, worth reading.
It is a tremendous book.
And then I have Mimi's book.
I have a number of others.
So avatarproducts.com.
I'm giving a little plug for my store, Avatar Products, A-V-A-T-A-R.
And so, you know, a friend of mine on the phone, he said to me, well, have you ever heard of Lem?
I said, what?
Who's that Lem?
And he goes, Lem?
J-F-K and Lem.
I said, Who's Lem?
He goes, I don't know his last name, but just Google it.
So I did, and I was just a bit stunned to find what I found.
And then I googled a bit more, searched, I should use the word search, let's not promote Google.
And I found this book that seemed to have a lot of reference to Lem Billings.
And it was titled R. F.K. Jr. and the Dark Side of the Dream by Jerry Oppenheimer.
So I bought it and I couldn't believe it.
This is the man that's secretary of HHS now, you know?
And it taught me so much about this Kennedy Klan.
And I was reading the Kennedy women at the time because, oh, there's a little free book hutch down the road.
So there's something conspiring to educate me.
And always, Jim, as I said to you yesterday, when you read about the Kennedys, particularly the Darlene Porter books, you grow up fast.
Okay.
And so this free book hutch down the road, there's somebody in my neighborhood who have some very, very interesting books.
And I have filched a number of them.
I've also put in my own books that I'm getting rid of.
So I've been fair to the neighborhood.
But this Kennedy Women book by Lawrence Lemur was sitting in the book hutch.
And if you include the index, it's like 900 and I don't know, 29, 30 pages.
So I started to read it.
I got halfway through it and I was very surprised.
So here's, I'm going to set up the paradigm.
The Kennedys were proud of their Catholicism, extremely proud, and they were Irish.
And the power structure in America was not Catholic and not Irish.
It was Protestant from other origins, you know, upper class whites.
And so the Kennedys, Joe Kennedy, the patriarch of the Klan, was very ambitious about getting this Irish Catholic foothold, not just into the governance of Boston and Massachusetts, their state, their home state, but also America in general.
And his aspirations were long-reaching.
He wanted to have his eldest son, Joe, be president first.
But Joe, unfortunately, left the world early in a plane crash in the Air Force.
So then it was John F. Jack Kennedy, who was supposed to, you know, slide into the office of the president for eight years, two terms.
And then he wanted Bobby Kennedy in there for eight years.
And then he wanted Teddy Kennedy in there 24 years.
He wanted the Kennedys to rule America.
So Joe Kennedy was extremely powerful, extremely influential.
He made a lot of money.
He was, I would say, ruthless.
But the strange bifurcation in this family unit was the way that the women were raised as uber Catholics, strict, strict, strict.
They went to convents.
They had to pray all the time.
They had to be extremely frugal and good.
Rose Kennedy, the matriarch, became a child of Mary in her teens when she attended a convent in Europe.
And yet the men were allowed to be as flagrant, un-Catholic, let's just say, except in name.
They could behave any way they wanted to, especially where women were concerned.
And this was accepted by the Kennedy women, which I guess was maybe the way of the time.
But I have to say that the scandals and the recklessness of JFK and back to Lem.
So Lem, I found out, was Lem Billings, Kirk Lemoyne Billings.
He met John F. Kennedy at Choate, a boarding school, a preparatory boarding school in the Northeast.
And they became very, very good friends.
And Lem Billings was gay.
In those days, they didn't use that word.
They said homosexual.
And he did not hide his attraction for, which became deep lifelong love for JFK.
Lem Billings was at John Kennedy's side all the time.
There are pictures online of them piggybacking each other.
But it went farther than that.
He had his own bedroom at the White House, Lem Billings.
And we have to thank Lem Billings for the re-decoration, the refurbishment of the White House.
Because when Jackie and John Kennedy moved into it, it was horrible.
The paint was peeling.
There was mishmash furniture all over.
And it was Lem Billings who educated Jackie as to how to procure period antique furniture, where to get it, what to pay for it, how to arrange it.
She beautified the White House and has been given credit ever since for doing that.
But it's really Lem.
Lem was the one.
Sophia, our co-host, Paul, has shown remarkable restraint here and not interjecting, but he has comments he'd like to add to the conversation.
Paul, go ahead.
Oh, well, no, I was enjoying listening to the dialogue, but thanks.
Yeah, hi, Sophia.
Good to have you on.
I did not know you're going to be a guest today, so it's a nice surprise.
Yeah, I read a paper years ago.
I believe it was Miles Mathis.
Others have written about it as well, showing all these photos.
And yeah, it's hard not to conclude that JFK was probably bisexual.
I can't imagine.
I mean, a fully straight heterosexual man carrying on a long-term relationship with somebody that's openly gay.
I mean, I've had friends that are gay, but I wouldn't call my relationship with them Intimate and certainly, you know, the idea of moving somebody into your house and providing them a bedroom, I mean, that kind of says a lot.
So, yeah, it's a very interesting portrait that she's painting today.
Sophia, continue.
So, I'm going to go on with Lem Billings.
I'm going to segue into RFK Jr.
And Bobby Kennedy's assassination left really RFK Jr. fatherless.
Ethel Kennedy, who was very ambitious about getting into the White House as first lady, was, I can't supply the adjectives because I didn't know her, but I'm sure she was devastated when her husband was assassinated at the Ambassador Hotel.
But she was also very, I've come across the word furious, angry that she had lost her chance to be in the White House.
And she left RFK Jr. to Len Billings.
He became his surrogate father.
RFK Jr. was a lost soul.
He attended multiple boarding schools.
He was very bedraggled, dirty.
He had a falcon.
He had a pet, I don't know what it was, a lion, some kind of big cat.
The school bent its rules to allow him pets because he was very interested in zoology and the environment.
He dressed very, very, he was dirty all the time, long, unkempt hair.
This falcon, he lined, according to Mr. Oppenheimer, who has had an awful lot of resource available to him, including people who knew RFK Jr. from boarding school days.
So he draped his room on the walls with black fabric and pinned pictures of his father, Robert Kennedy, onto these sheets or whatever were on his walls.
And he had a bust of RFK in his room on a shelf, and the falcon sat on it and pooped all over it all the time.
So this is bizarre.
This is bizarre, right?
And he was a very lackadaisical student.
He was doing drugs.
He was dragging young women into the chapel and having sex with them.
He was thrown out of many, well, I'll say three schools.
The last school was extremely nervous about his drug use and was afraid he was going to kill himself and didn't want any liability for that.
So this was a lost soul, indeed.
And all his accomplishments, as we've read about them, he kind of just stumbled into.
He didn't, this was not a range.
He didn't have a direction, except for that which Lem Billings gave him, which included drug use.
So I was saddened by this and shocked by it.
And then the Darwin Porter book came that you told me about, Jim, which was, it has this long title.
It's a pink book.
Where is it?
I have it.
Oh, here.
Marilyn, Don't Even Dream About Tomorrow, Sex, Lies, and Murder and the Great Cover-Up.
That's really the subtitle.
Yeah, the title is Marilyn at Rainbow's End.
And I highly recommend this book.
It's absolutely fascinating about Hollywood, all the figures at Times, Sinatra, Marlon Brando, James Dean, you know, Elizabeth Taylor.
You're going to learn aspects of Hollywood as it appears to have really been.
And it is going to be, well, as Sophia puts it, you grow up fast reading that book.
But Jim, I have to say that I think what this Darwin Porter does is he recycles books.
And I think Marilyn at Rainbow's End was one book he wrote.
And then he wrote this other one, which is titled Marilyn Don't Even Dream About Tomorrow.
And he has, you know, included information from the first book into this book.
So there might be two books out there.
So anyway, whichever one you get is going to grow you up fast, as I said.
So I made, waded through that book with a barf bag next to me, metaphorically speaking.
So disgusting.
So disgusting.
For example.
No, I'm not going to give examples.
Okay.
You can all go out and buy Darwin Porter.
You can buy Oppenheimer, RFK Jr., The Dark Side of the Dream.
But I got used to it.
I got used to it.
And what I learned was the Kennedys were reckless.
Hollywood is reckless.
Then when I started reading the, I bought another book, Jacqueline Kennedy O'Nassis, Darwin Porter, Her Tumultuous Life and Her Love Affairs.
Don't ask me why I'm buying this stuff, but I am.
And in that book, he, no, excuse me, erase sentence.
I'm too practiced at saying RFK, but JFK had to confess on their honeymoon to Jackie about all his diseases.
I mean, the unfortunate diseases and conditions he had, which included all his back problems, his Addison's disease.
But he had chlamydia constantly, which is a bacterial infection, STD, as they say.
And he had gonorrhea.
And he got gonorrhea from his first visit to a prostitute, which is how he lost his virginity.
He went with Lem Billings.
They paid $3.
I don't think Lem did anything, but he did.
That's how he introduced himself to the Sex Act.
And he contracted gonorrhea, which he had.
That and Chlamydia, he seemed to have all the time.
And poor Jackie, Jackie's going to her friends, he should have told me this before, Before we were married, right?
Yes.
So this seems to be gossip, but really what I'm getting at is his need to be satiated, his pimps, Frank Sinatra and his brother-in-law Peter Lawford, both of whom were located in Hollywood, every movie he went to, and he used to slip out with Lem Billings and go to the movies, eluding the Secret Service when he was president.
Okay, and he would see a movie, and well, let's include his senatorial days in Massachusetts in the late 50s.
He wanted all the starlets.
He had to have sometimes three women a day, and they all had to be new.
He would get tired of them.
And it appears that Hollywood all wanted him, right?
And what you learn from these Darwin Porter books is that these people are obsessed with sex.
And if that's how it was in the 50s and the 60s, I cannot even imagine what it's like now.
If I may.
I think it's evolved into pedophilia on a large scale.
And if the Diddy tapes were ever released, not to mention the Epsteins, it would just blow the public mind.
Paul, go ahead, Paul.
Well, you know, I find it interesting that this person's name is Darwin.
And we're talking about the nature of men and the relationship between men and women and this urge that we all have or that we all had.
You know, to me, it just rings true with my experience with other males.
Now, when I was younger, growing up, I was attracted to other guys that were, you know, good-looking, confident, you know, guys, the kind of guys that both guys liked and women liked.
I mean, it was a perfectly normal thing.
And again, I did sports in both high school and college, and then I was a member of a fraternity and so on and so on.
And when I got out into the working world, I did quite a few sales jobs.
Most of them were commission-only.
And you are around a hard-driving, generally good-looking men with persuasive skills and personality and charm.
And I got to tell you that none of this is shocking to me because I'll just give you a couple of examples.
I knew a guy who was quite, you know, popular with the gals, shall we say, had a lot of girlfriends.
And he found one that he really liked and wanted to marry her.
So he got engaged.
And during his engagement, which I believe was six or seven months, if I'm not mistaken, he told me that he slept with five or six other women.
And, you know, now this is all young men in their 20s, but this is the kind of thing that it's just there for some guys.
You know, it's like when RFK Jr., supposedly in his autobiography, talked about the fact that, no, it wasn't him.
Somebody else wrote something about him and said that it was, he kept a journal of the women he slept with and, you know, wrote it down.
And, you know, it was like 30-something women.
He was, you know, the conquest.
And I just thought to myself, you know, who does that?
I mean, I had the normal urges of everybody else, but I used to shake my head at some of the things that I heard or was aware of from other guys, including, I mean, this will conclude my remarks here, but just I thought it would be interesting to add.
So I was interviewing for a sales position one time.
I believe it was an auto dealership.
And one of the managers, because one of these places, they have like a general manager and then they have, you know, what you call assistant managers, right?
And this guy was, you know, obviously a successful guy, dressed the part, looked the part, talked the part.
And during our interview, you know, one of the things that they do, they try to sell you on the idea of working there, you know, how it's going to be and how much money you can make and so on and so on.
And I remember what he said to me.
He goes, yeah, he said, this is a great business.
I said, I finally am making enough where I can afford to have five different girlfriends.
And it's like, I just remember going, oh, okay.
Now, this was never an ambition of mine.
But, you know, at the same time, you do, you do sort of understand the freedom that money and power and fame and sexual attractiveness brings.
So literally, some of these people live in a world where they can have other women or other men anytime they want because they just have that high status.
And so that's why when these politicians, when it comes out, they're engaged in all this activity and behavior, none of it shocks me, but it's interesting.
All excellent commentary.
Sophia, we're about to hit a break.
It's here upon us.
We'll be right back with Sophia Smallstorm.
We're talking about the Kennedy women.
Some of this stuff is rather lurid.
We're seeking to spare some of the nastier details, but we'll be right back with Sophia and my co-host, Paul.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Jim, listen, I look forward to talking with you more about this.
I have to get back on me.
Yeah, thank you, Jim.
Yeah, thanks.
back.
Welcome back to the Raw Deal on this 27th day of June 2021.
We're my special guest today, Sophia Smallstorm and co-host Paul from California.
We're discussing the Kennedy Women's Soviet.
You mentioned Lynn Billings' relationship with Jacob K. You know overwhelmingly more about this than do I take my impression is Jacob K was the petty responsibility sexual favors is there any reason to think that Jack took an hexy role no no
no reason to think that in relation to RK Jr he assumed his fatherly role did it involve any sexual aspect I'm gonna presume it did not but I could be wrong which is the reason I ask uh possibly but I have not read anything to that effect affirmatively there is another book that I'm going to receive because a friend of mine who says hello to you he's a big fan
of yours Dave from the East Coast and he bought another book I told him to get the Darwin Porter book on Maryland but there are so many Darwin Porter books I think by mistake he ordered it's a very expensive book on Amazon it's 60 bucks and it's titled something like The Kennedys All the Gossip That's Unfit to Print and there's a lot of Lem Billings stuff in there and so I don't know whether he gets into RFK Jr. and
Lem Billings but the companionship was the important aspect of that relationship as it was with JFK.
JFK discussed politics with Lem Billings.
Lem Billings was not a dope and you know one thing I want to go back to the angle of this that you know is rooted in the women.
So Jackie Bouvier, whose father was a man called John Bouvier, Black Jack, known as Black Jack Bouvier.
He was very unsuccessful in his financial dealings.
He descended into drinking and financial failure.
And his wife, Janet Bouvier, divorced him for Hugh Auchincloss.
Who was kind of an older man, sort of stuffy, but had a massive porn collection, it appears.
And once again, you know, these upper crust families seem to have this underbelly of, some people would call it darkness.
Some people would call it scandal or lascivious interest.
Black Jack may have been a financial failure, but...
wasn't he very successful with women blackjack was gorgeous he really was he um jackie looks exactly like blackjack she looks nothing like her mother janet lee who became lee rodse will whose real name was caroline caroline lee bouvier jacqueline lee bouvier were the two daughters and um once her mother married into the once their mother married into the autchenclos family
they had money again but blackjack was kind of left to to dangle in his own life and he was a tremendous womanizer as seems to be all these people but jackie and lee were both raised to marry Well, as successfully as they possibly could.
Lee married a Polish prince, Stanislav Rotsiwil.
And I remember my mother, my mother did not like the Kennedys.
I heard about this throughout my childhood.
And when I read the Kennedy Women, Lawrence Lemer's book, I realized why.
Because the Kennedys were gloatrotting while the rest of the country was in a depression.
The Kennedys were in all the papers, the Kennedy clan, you know, with their, as one biographer wrote, their Colgate smiles, right?
And then that bifurcation between the pious female side of the family, who worked like dogs to get the male side of the family into positions of power.
So Eunice Kennedy, one of the Kennedy sisters, was tremendous, had tremendous political savvy, and her father Joe said of her, she would have been a great politician.
And this is where I'm going to veer into crude language, had she had a set of balls.
But she didn't.
She was a girl.
So Jackie told her friends as she was coming out into society as a debutante and studying at the Saukman in France.
She told friends that the man she would marry, quote, had to be intelligent, handsome, charming, rich, and filled with an unbounded ambition to succeed, perhaps having homes in Palm Beach, Manhattan, and Beverly Hills.
I also want him to have the personal magnetism of blackjack.
So apparently she didn't call her father dad, she called him blackjack.
And I told, I read you this quote, Jim, the other day, and you said, that's pretty much what she got, right?
Hey, yeah.
But what she didn't count on was the infidelity, which was flaunted in her face.
Joe Kennedy had bought into a studio in Hollywood.
I'm going back a generation.
And he was very interested in Hollywood.
He ended up having an affair with an actress, Gloria Swanson.
She's very odd looking today.
You need to, I mean, all these people who say, oh, Michelle Obama was a man.
Have a look at Gloria Swanson.
But anyway, she was a star in Hollywood in many films, and she was a regular mistress of Joe Kennedy.
And this is where, you know, my heart hurts.
Rose Kennedy, the pious Catholic, the child of Mary, who raised her daughters to be the same and allowed her sons to be however Joe wanted them to be, she needed to have them successful, but the rest she turned a blind eye to.
So Joe Kennedy, in one of their mini homes, had installed state-of-the-art projection equipment.
So he had what we call today a home theater.
And he used to get first-run movies to show to friends and family in this home theater of his.
And he would always bring with him into the home theater these blonde bombshells.
And he would be dressed in a robe and bedroom slippers with this blonde on his arm that he would tell his kids and their friends was a secretary who was helping him with a project.
And it wasn't, of course.
And poor Rose would appear wanting to see the film as well.
And she would see her husband with this blonde, and she would simply turn around and leave the room.
So this extended into the life of JFK, RFK, Teddy, and the women just had to live with it.
They had to live with it.
But it hurt Jackie deeply.
And there is a, I read this just this morning.
I marked it because it's, again, very sad.
So there was a moment when JFK was seen actually in the act of prayer.
And it was when his son Patrick died, right?
Remember Patrick, the baby that was born six pounds.
And the sad thing is he was born in 1963 and he only lived a very short time.
He had respiratory distress syndrome reading.
But had he been born 50 years later in 2014, he would have had like a 95% chance of survival.
So the methods they had then to deal with preemies were not very good compared to what we have today.
But here is an excerpt from the book.
Lem Billings flew to JFK's side.
This is right after Patrick died.
He remembered, so this is a quote from Lem, Jack got down on his knees and prayed like he'd never prayed before for his son to live.
Sorry, so I misspoke.
This was right before he died.
Jack got down on his knees and prayed like he'd never prayed before for his son to live.
He promised that if God would let Patrick live, he'd even give up what he called Poon, which was his sexcapades.
He also promised that if Patrick's life could be saved, that he would not run for the presidency in 1964.
Really?
Yes, yes.
So that's very damn peculiar.
Fascinating.
I know.
So get this.
So I'll just read from the book.
For an hour, JFK stood at a glass partition looking in at Patrick in his attempt to breathe regularly.
Finally, he left to visit Jackie in her hospital room.
In the early hours of the morning of Friday, August 8th, 1963, he was awakened by a doctor who told him that his son was dead.
Sedated, Jackie was still asleep.
When his boy died, it almost killed the president, Larry Newman, a Secret Service agent, later said.
He went into a private room and for about an hour we could hear him crying.
It was more like moaning.
It was the deepest form of anguish.
So, yeah, so here is JFK at his core.
Here is the soul that I think I'm opining here and, you know, forgive me if I'm going over the top, but he threw that soul out the window many, many, many, many, many times in his life.
So I'll read one more paragraph.
In spite of his grief over Patrick's death, JFK was also aware of its political implications.
David Powers, his aide, overheard him telling Jackie, we must not create an atmosphere of sadness at the White House because that would not be good for us or for anyone, certainly not for the country and not for the work I have to do.
So the Kennedys had this, you know, they had the icing on the cake outward appearance to the public and the world, which was what Jackie termed it Camelot.
And in fact, Camelot was one of JFK's favorite movies, the musical.
And they also had this very chaotic, crazy, reckless on the part of the men and deeply deep distress on the part of the women.
And then, you know, let's move into the Maryland territory.
So there was this pillow talk, and J.F. Edgar Hoover, the head of the FBI, was very aware of it.
All the Kennedys would engage in this pillow talk to their many lovers, and the many lovers would remember it.
And JFK also experimented from what I'm reading from this Kennedy Jacqueline book with cocaine, anal nitrate poppers.
He popped one under poor Mimi's nose at the Bing Crosby Estate, and she started to have a bad physical response, shortness of breath, rapid heartbeat.
She had to be taken into a back room and babysat by David Powers for a couple of hours till she calmed down.
And so he was doing some things that, you know, were probably progressive for the time.
But there's an expression, loose lips sink shits.
Say that, Jim.
Let's see how fast you can say it.
He also had a long-term relationship with Mary Pynchant Myers that included, you know, LSD trips and the like, which appears to have been a more serious intellectual and emotional entanglement than his other relationships.
And while I, the question is on my mind, clearly Joe raised the boys to be womenizers to use women as sex objects to enhance their own lives.
But what was Rose's attitude toward the girls?
I mean, were they being raised to be modest or libertine?
I'm curious.
Once Patricia Kennedy married Lawford, Peter Lawford, who was a British actor, and moved to Hollywood, there was tremendous looseness in that particular family unit, which extended into relationships that Patricia had with people that I believe went both ways.
Yeah.
Pardon?
Ben and women.
Yes, I believe so.
And this is how Hollywood was.
My friend who is sending me the $60 book because on all the gossip that's unfit to print by Locke, what's his name?
Porter, Darwin Porter.
He said he can't read the rest.
He just cannot get through the rest of this book because it's so disgusting.
And in particular, what you learn about Hollywood actors and actresses, the people you saw in movies, you thought, what a great movie, which includes what a great message this movie has.
What a great story.
What a great plot line.
The people acting in these films were nothing like that.
Nothing like the characters in the stories that they were playing.
So my theory is here now.
It's a developing theory that this loose lip sink ships was very integral to the demise of JFK, RFK, Marilyn Monroe, and Mary Meyer, and maybe others, others that I don't know of.
But there was so much information the FBI was aware of that was getting out.
And if you think about it, there were five inaugural balls when JFK was elected president, and Jackie only went to three of them.
JFK received dexedrine injections from Janet Trevell, his physician, one of his attending physicians, in order to pet him up enough to get out there and do all this.
But he also, the last ball that Jackie did not attend, and she was exhausted, had starlets brought from Hollywood, numerous starlets to satisfy JFK.
And he was regretful that there were these left surf starlets at this particular event.
He said, if I weren't under such heavy scrutiny, I could have spent the night with Angie Dickinson and Kim Novak.
This is on the night of his election.
Tomorrow is the first day of his new administration.
And it didn't stop.
You know, Angie said about JFK, that her affair with JFK was the greatest 15 seconds of her life.
Well, this book says seven minutes.
Just a quick phrase it reminds me of notches in the gun belt.
This is, you know, go ahead.
It's fascinating.
But Sophia, did you answer my question about the Kennedy women?
I mean, that rose, you know, okay, Patricia got loose when she married Peter, who was profligate out in Hollywood.
But what about the, were they raised to be chaste or were they raised to use sex to, you know, manipulate men?
I think they were raised to constantly push their husbands into more higher visibility, power, and to do whatever was necessary to stay in that family unit because they couldn't get divorced.
So Jackie, Jackie was at the brink of divorcing John Kennedy, but Joe had a meeting with her, the elder Kennedy, and said that this is reported.
I don't know that it's true, but he offered her a million dollars to stay.
This was before they had any children.
But she was so devastated by what he was doing, which was very, very, very flagrant.
At a party, he would leave for 20 minutes or two hours.
And it would get back to her that he had had some fling with somebody in those 20 minutes or two hours.
And then Marilyn Monroe.
I mean, that was very, very well known.
And this is the other thing.
The press was extremely quiet.
They didn't report this stuff.
It was just discussed.
So here's my question to you, Jim.
Had we not had assassinations of two key Kennedys, and had they actually occupied double terms at the White House successively and dominated the White House for 24 years, as Joe envisioned, what would the press have done over those 24 years?
The Kennedys wouldn't have stopped doing what they were doing.
And some of this, a lot of it might have gotten out, right?
Yes, but the world would have been completely different.
I mean, Jack wasn't taken out over pillow talk, but because he was threatening to shatter the CIA into a thousand pieces, I think in all probability he would have succeeded, so there would have been no CIA.
The Joint Chiefs were upset because he had not invaded Cuba, contrary to the unanimous recommendation.
He'd signed an above-ground test ban treaty with the Soviets, contrary to the unanimous opposition.
And now he was pulling our forces out of Vietnam, where they believed a stand had to be taken against the expansion of international godless communism.
So we not only would not have had a CIA, we would not have had a war in Vietnam.
The mob was upset because they thought they had an agreement with Joe that if they assisted Jack in taking the White House by guaranteeing Chicago and therefore Illinois went with him, that he'd lay off the mob.
But after he made Bobby Attorney General, he brought more indictments and convictions than ever before.
Even Edgar had refused to acknowledge the existence of organized crime because just as he had sex dossiers on the members of Congress, the mob had sex dossiers on Edgar and his close personal friend Tyde Colson that inhibited him until after the Joe Valachi hearings, when having been described with such detail, the existence of the mob could no longer be denied.
The Texas oil men were opposed because Jack was going to cut the oil depletion allowance.
So of course, you would have had not only more prosecution of Bob, you would have had the deletion of the oil depletion allowance.
The Eastern establishment surrounding the Fed was upset because he published United States notes.
I remember holding one of these as a young Marine Corps officer with a red embossed imprint saying United State note instead of green Federal Reserve note on the ground that paying interest to a consortium of private banks for publishing the currency of the United States was absurd when the Department of Treasury could print the currency for no interest at all.
And of course, he was at loggerheads with David Ben-Gurion, who was the founder of Israel and its first prime minister over the development of nuclear weapons, which Jack opposed on the grounds that it would lead to a nuclear arms race, and where Ben-Gurion appears to have resigned in disgust after assigned Mossad to participate in the assassination.
So you would have had a really different world, Sovia.
And by the way, the right wing was very concerned that there would be a Kennedy dynasty of the kind you described, that Jack would serve two terms and then Bobby two and then Teddy two more.
That had them alarmed.
So they want to cut off the head of the snake.
And of course, Linden himself forced himself on the ticket in Los Angeles in order to take out Jack so he would accede to the presidency.
And he could assure everyone who participated in the assassination they'd never pay any penalty for having done so.
Because in his position, he could manipulate the outcomes, such as by creating the Warren Commission to cut off all the other investigations, some of which were actually making progress, as in Texas.
So it would have been a very different world.
Now, no doubt, there would have been, under those circumstances, more attention to their personal lives.
So I suspect that your inference is correct, that had this happened, this hypothetical scenario, we would have learned much more and the public maybe would have become a bit disillusioned with a Kennedy lifestyle.
Well, I don't think, as you say, it was not just lifestyle, Jim, but one of the aspects of information gathering that's missing from all these Darwin Porter books, all the books, is LBJ.
LBJ is not mentioned.
And you know that LBJ was right there in the White House and had his own plans, as you say.
In fact, one of the Kennedy plans, the Kennedy Klan plans, was to dump LBJ on the 1964 ticket.
Oh, yeah, no, no.
Jack had already made the decision.
He already confided in Evelyn Lincoln as personal secretary.
He wasn't going to run with LBJ again.
He was thinking of the governor of North Carolina at the time to be running the 20 seconds of the scan.
And it was widely believed that it would so tarnish Lyndon Jack couldn't run with him again, but he wasn't going to run with him again.
And Lyndon was a bit panic-stricken over the prospect that he might actually be prosecuted for some of his many crimes.
I mean, But the guy was also a notorious woman.
I think he was having secretaries right in the old office of the one time.
Ladybird walked in upon him without the instructions that whenever the first lady left the private quarters, he was to be notified.
Yeah, well, they were all like that.
They were all like that.
And all I can say is I'm learning about angles of this Camelot creation of theirs, which was very superficial, that the public believed in.
The flag-waving public didn't know any of this stuff.
And I think that they would have been very upset had they known this.
You know, what it reminds me of, too, is it's just, you know, they say we're living in different times, or that was a different world then.
And I think this is not an inaccurate assessment of it, as I believe, of course, I was just very young back then, but I believe that was a time when political leadership, you know, and the power structure was much more, not just protected, but venerated, for example.
And it has shifted.
It took, in my opinion, probably a few decades and a few different presidencies.
But now I believe that these politicians and presidents are the kind of people that we can take potshots at and that are mocked.
I don't believe back then, and again, I wasn't reading the political editorials or cartoons back then in the 50s and 60s and so forth.
But I don't think there was as much mockery of politicians then as there is now.
And to me, it's kind of a paradigm shift.
It may have been something that was implemented or planned.
I don't know, but I think that's absolutely.
Oh, you're absolutely right.
We've hit a break, but you're making an excellent point.
We'll continue right after.
Stand by.
Well, unless I miss my guess, the whole audience finds this as fascinating as DuPal.
And I, and Paul, Your point was impeccable in the past.
Having lived through all of this, the press was far more respectful of the private lives of politicians and other public figures for the most part.
But in Hollywood, of course, that was an exception because that was the stuff of gossip.
That's why the tabloids became so popular.
They would report the stories the mainstream would not.
And in many ways, Darwin Porter's books are like tabloid journalism written in large letters because he's letting it all hang out.
Sophia, continue, please.
Yes, Darwin Porter has a really good way of stringing information together, a lot of which could be just hearsay, but like Oppenheimer, he seems to have resources that if you read enough, you start seeing overlaps from different people.
And it sounds, you get a picture that starts to fill in.
And so my question and my friend's question on the East Coast is, you know, Jack Kennedy, he had some really serious, serious ailments.
He must have been born with some spinal issues.
He was in tremendous pain a lot of the time.
He had a lot of narcotics that were injected into him finally to control this pain.
He had Addison's disease, which I'm trying to find the part that I marked when he told Jackie all of this.
And she was so horrified that she was learning it so late.
But it seems to me that a person who has that many problems, physical illnesses and problems, that his first order of things would be to deal with his own problems, right?
This is a sick man.
This is not a well man that we're talking about here.
And then to have as his second most important thing that he needed every day to satisfy was this crazy sexual addiction.
I mean, it's really, really over the top.
So he had those two things going at the same time.
And can you really run the country?
Is that number three?
What is it?
How does it stack up in terms of how many hours there are in the day and what you have to do otherwise to take care of your needs, let's just say?
Sophia, so you said that he was probably born with spinal problems.
Is there a reason that you say that?
Because of course the legend is, is he heard his back in the war with the sinking of his PT boat and all that?
No.
He had issues as a child.
Jackie, that's a good question on my mind, too.
Jackie, I mean, Sophia, does that mean Jack and Jackie hadn't had sex before their marriage?
Because you would think these kinds of issues would be ones that would be initiated when they first began having intercourse.
He didn't disclose anything.
Apparently, even though at the time, in that time, in the 50s, a lot of the debutantes had to really hold on to their virginity because there was such a fear of getting pregnant.
So other creative forms of sex were practiced and conducted wherever possible, in the backseat of cars.
And the debutantes just didn't give it all up because the scandal that would follow.
Abortions were difficult to get.
And a lot of these families had those kinds of connections, but you didn't want anything getting out.
And this is where, Jim, I hold on to the importance of certain kinds of information just could not be widely circulated.
And these debutantes were terrified that they would never be able to marry well if they had an out-of-wedlock pregnancy.
So there was an expression in French, it's de mie vierge, and it translates to half virgin.
And I mentioned that to you.
Right?
So these were, they were that.
They were half virgins.
But Jackie was, I would say that Jackie had a lot of testosterone, more than the average female, because she had size 10 AA feet, very big hands, square shoulders, a narrow sort of androgynous silhouette, which worked well with designer clothes.
Compared to Marilyn, here's another interesting little tidbit.
Jackie spoke in what was her normal voice until JFK started having an affair with Marilyn Monroe.
And then she adopted this breathy, sexy voice because she thought it was like that of Marilyn Monroe.
And there is a term for this.
It's called the false feminine.
Today, the equivalent is not that sexy breathiness so much, but it's the, hi, little mini mouse voice.
I'm so harmless and I'm so cute and I'm so feminine.
And women are not using their diaphragm to speak.
They don't speak from their chest.
They speak high nasally like a little mouse.
And they learn this.
They learn this in order to appeal to men more.
That's what they think.
And not come off as powerful and strong and smart, a go-getter.
But Jackie really was those things.
She was a very smart woman.
She translated a lot of books from French about Indochina for JFK.
His profiles encouraged.
She contributed a tremendous amount of research to that.
She never got credit For it, but she was constantly working alongside him and a very wonderful asset in many ways, not just her beauty.
So it's just sad to me that she had to put up with being, you know, cast aside while he would sneak out for an hour and he had to have all these women all the time.
I'm still looking for the part about his illness disclosures, which is crazy.
I'll find it.
Hello, Jim.
Yeah, I'm Lizzie.
No, I'm not going to.
Somebody should talk while I look for this.
Oh, Paul, what's your thoughts, Paul?
Yeah, well, it just kind of reminds me of what I was mentioning earlier about the nature of a lot of men.
But I want to make clear, of course, that it's not all men are like that.
It just, it brings to mind the idea of the spectrum, you know, the spectrum of human beings, the spectrum of personality that we all have, that we all have and that we all have displayed in our lives.
And of course, as we age, as we get older and wiser, we sort of realize that, you know, if we were to do things again, you know, we would have been nicer or kinder.
I mean, that's probably one of the many things I would change in my life, you know, growing up is that I would have been more considerate of other people's feelings, for example, because, you know, that behavior that, and again, I mean, I did have some predatory behavior when I was younger, nothing on the scale of what we're talking about here.
And nothing, I believe in many ways it's sort of pathological, if you will.
But again, you know, the, you know, when I made that comment earlier about Darwin, you know, just because of the, it's just the nature of men versus women.
And the only other thing I'll add at the moment is talking about the feminine characteristics and how some women portray themselves to the world or to men.
Yeah, I think every man knows what he likes and what he's attracted to.
And I have to say, for me, some of today's very outspoken, aggressive personalities and women is very unattractive.
And I remember there was nothing more attractive to me, even when I was younger, of what I would call a demur smile and sort of in many ways also a sort of a mischievous smile, but something that was, shall we say, understated.
And my brother used to call it the smoldering secretary look as well.
But again, you know, all these men that we're talking about here and that Sophia has mentioned, these were all famous men in many ways and or wealthy and are very, very physically attractive.
So it's just a different world that they inhabit.
That's really the bottom line.
And they can choose to have character or not.
And that's why, in my opinion, having character and honor is always something that has been admired and has used to be more promoted, I believe.
I believe that older people have always promoted notions of refined behavior to younger people and for good reason, because I do think that as a society, we need those guidelines.
And I think in many ways, they're sorely lacking today.
Yeah, the wisdom that comes with age and experience.
Sophia, did you find the past?
I did find it.
So I'm just going to read it to you.
This is the fourth night of their honeymoon in Jack and Jack.
Yes, in Acapulco.
Santa Barbara?
Was this in Santa Barbara?
No, Acapulco.
Go ahead.
So they were in a villa owned by Don Miguel Aleman, the president of Mexico, and an old associate of Papa Joe's.
So on the fourth night in the villa, JFK revealed to Jackie the contents of a mysterious alligator bag, which he would frequently take into the bathroom with him.
On that memorable evening, he came clean with her.
He reached into the medicine bag and removed a needle.
Don't worry, babe, he said.
I'm not a junkie.
But now that you're my wife, you need to know about the shots I have to take.
I have Addison's disease.
She was not familiar with the disease, and he explained it to her.
Named after Dr. Thomas Addison, the British doctor who first described the condition in 1849, Addison's disease is a rare chronic endocrine disorder in which the adrenal glands do not produce sufficient steroid hormones.
Patients suffer from abdominal pain and weakness.
Treatment involves replacing the absent hormones with hydrocortisone and fludrocortisone.
Victims suffer from muscle weakness, fever, weight loss, anxiety, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, and headaches, along with night sweats.
I'm skipping one line because I don't want to read it on the air.
This was not all.
He also told her that he suffered from prostatitis, an inflammation of the prostate gland, which caused him a chronic pelvic pain.
He told her that because of his prostatitis, he had intermittent urinary infections.
He informed her that when his semen was examined, it was found to contain pus cells.
Sometimes I have to have a prostate massage.
He saved the worst revelation for last.
Before the war, he had developed a case of gonorrhea, which his doctor, William P. Hurst, was able to cure.
But he had also contracted a chlamydia infection, which he had never cured.
He had tried to explain to her that chlamydia was a sexually transmitted infection of the urethra that causes a white discharge from the penis.
He told her that he often experienced a burning sensation during urination.
And I'll skip this.
She shivered at the bad news when she heard that chlamydia could be transmitted during vaginal, anal, or oral sex and that women got it frequently.
An infected mother could pass the disease onto her baby during vaginal childbirth.
So anyway, she asked him if she were in danger having intercourse with him.
Anything is possible, he answered.
That's why I carry around this medicine to prevent something like that from happening.
And she later told Walton, Walton was another gay man that he was very good friends with, that JFK was very good friends with.
After all those confessions, I Could never truly be free of my fear that I'd come down with a venereal disease.
Childbirth, I knew, was also a potential problem.
Yeah, so it's possible, you know, she had this baby Patrick that died, and she was very upset.
She thought that maybe JFK's diseases had something to do with that, particularly the STDs that he constantly got reinfected with.
And she was, you know, she had told Joe Kennedy that if she ever came down with a venereal disease of any kind, he would have to pay her $20 million to stay with this guy, this son of his.
Wow.
So, you know, this is a sad, sad state of affairs to me.
I mean, who wants to marry a famous man?
And, you know, I read a book when I was 10 years old, and it was about Jackie Kennedy.
And I remember reading in that book that as a young girl, she said that she would marry someone who would become president of the United States.
Now, here's another thing.
They were constantly afraid of assassination.
And Jackie was constantly afraid that somebody would take a shot at JFK or that her babies would be kidnapped for ransom.
And even when John F. Kennedy Jr. was in law school, NYU, in New York, there were all kinds of threats to kidnap him as an adult, if you can believe that.
Yeah, I believe it.
Tell me, Morris, go, Sophia, this is so wonderful.
Well, here's a line.
So there was a Senator George Smathers.
Am I saying that right?
Yes, sure.
He was one of the friends to call a crewmate of JFK.
Yeah, he was one of JFK's closest comrades during their sex hunts together, even showing up in pre-Castro Havana.
So, all right.
Even after his announcement to the Senate, we're going back into the 50s now, JFK added to his list of movie star seductions, picking up glamorous editions who included, as mentioned before, Sophia Lorentz.
She turned him down about five times.
But this is the thing.
He was unrelenting.
He would break women down until they said yes.
And Jim, as you pointed out to me early, early on when I was just starting to read about these people, he was given lots of testosterone shots.
And that elevated his libido tremendously to the point that maybe he couldn't even contain it.
So he added to the list Sophia Lorraine, Jean Simmons, and Lee Remick.
In Washington, he carried on affairs with both Pamela Tourneur and Mary Pinchot Meyer.
They happened to be roommates.
Meyer was the beautiful, rebellious, and socially adept ex-wife of a top CIA official.
Even such a womanizer as gorgeous George Smathers warned JFK that he'd better taper off his poon tailing it.
That was his word for sex capades, JFK, poontailing.
JFK responded, this needs to go down in history.
The American voter doesn't care how many times I get laid.
The relationship with Mary Myers had this ironic aspect that when he Howard Hunt was on what he thought was his deathbed, he confessed to his son St. John, and I talked about it with St. John, that the chain of command went from LBJ to Cord Meyer,
Mary Pynch and Meyer's former husband, who was head of covert office for her CIA at the time, to David Atley Phillips, Western Hemisphere CIA, to William Harvey, who was CIA assassination worldwide, to David Sanchez Morales for the Dallas operation.
So that Cord, her former husband, was right there in the chain of command for the assassination.
The relationship with Mary, Peter Jenny has a wonderful book entitled Mary's Mosaic that I highly recommend, a different aspect about a relationship with Jack that was more like, but actually far more profound,
her relationship with Mimi, because Mary was far more intellectual, roughly a peer socially and otherwise of JFK, and he had a very profound relationship with her.
I think she had a very important influence upon him.
I highly recommend the book.
So Pia, if you've not, you know, read it before, you want to add that to your list.
Peter Janney Marries Mose.
Okay, I will.
So now, another thing that I wanted to bring up is his deployment to the naval base back early in his life, and that was ordered by J. Edgar Hoover.
He was assigned to a station in South Carolina in the frenzied aftermath of the Japanese Pearl Harbor attack.
And this was because they wanted to get rid of him because of his affair with, I'm trying to think if it was Inga, Inga Arvaud, the Dane.
Do you remember that?
Yes.
So Inga was a Danish, kind of like a gossip journalist or something.
And apparently she had an affair with Jack Kennedy.
I think they had very strong feelings for one another.
It wasn't just a, you know, fly-by-night thing.
So her torrid affair with Jack Kennedy captured the attention of Kennedy hater J. Edgar Hoover at the FBI.
He told his lover and chief assistant Clyde Tolson, the bitch is the Mata Hari of Washington and that upstart Kennedy brat is effing her and giving away naval secrets, which she's reporting back to Hitler himself.
Hoover called Captain Seymour A.D. Hunter, JFK's superior officer.
Jack Kennedy is revealing naval secrets to some Nazi bitch Hoover charged.
It was agreed that JFK could not be dismissed or disgraced because of the powerful position of his father.
I'll tell this Kennedy boy that he's going to be transferred to a naval unit at sea.
That way he'll learn no secrets to share with the Nazis.
In the meantime, I'll give him a desk job in Charleston out of harm's way.
Though, there you go.
Fascinating.
It was an issue.
I maintain it was an issue.
Well, part of one of the arguments, you know, when Linden was after Jack got the nomination beating LBJ, Bobby went by the Linden suite to offer him a symbolic pro forma invitation to run with Jack and was just dumbfounded when Lyndon jumped on it,
threatened to expose that Jack had Addison's disease and therefore wasn't expected to live a long, healthy life, that among his paramours had been a beautiful woman who was an agent for East Germany, information provided by Edgar, and that if he were not on the ticket, then any legislative proposal sent down by the White House would be dead on arrival because in his position as a powerful majority leader, he'd bottle him up in the Senate.
So Jack and Bobby were boxed in and they couldn't figure out a way to work their way around it and had to accede to Lyndon's demands, which of course was basically setting him up for being taken out in Dallas as events would play out.
Paul, you wanted to add some further thoughts?
Sure.
Just a sort of a reflection of just what I was thinking about the term that we probably all heard before of unbridled ambition.
And, you know, we've all had it in our lives.
You know, I at one time had ambition, nothing on, you know, this sort of a scale, of course, but it just sort of makes me think that, I mean, this world is made very interesting.
I don't know, you could say much more interesting, but the world is made very interesting by very ambitious men.
And I believe in many ways we can be both thankful and maybe otherwise for the drive and ambition of some people.
And it also reminds me, this will be the last little thing.
Thank you for the time, Jim.
There's a line from a movie.
And I don't know, the movie escapes me as well as the character and the situation, but the line was, they said it was in Latin, which was sic transit gloria del munde, which roughly means thus passes the glory of this world.
For whatever that's all worth.
Sophia, give us kind of an overview of what you learned from all this research in the closing moments we have today.
And I believe the whole audience shares my fascination.
And thanks for all of this.
Really utterly absorbing.
Yours.
Sophia, are you there?
Oh, sorry, I was on mute.
I don't know how to close because I just keep learning more and more.
And you know, this takes me to my often used, often commented remark that's all very redundant.
But the thing I say a lot, which is that truth is an expanding picture.
Truth is not reductive.
It doesn't sit in a small spot in the palm of your hand and you know it and you have it.
It's something that keeps adding material.
And as you add material, you change your point of view, you know?
And my point of view keeps shifting and changing and expanding as I read all these books.
And I actually have you to thank for sending me down this crazy path.
I think it's wonderful, Sophia, you absorb it so well and analyze it with such sensitivity.
I think it's an illustration that a man with a mixed personal life can nevertheless make monumental contribution to public life and advance the interests of the United States, even if those in the know might question his personal morality or lack thereof.
Others, like Lyndon Johnson, are not only corrupt in their personal life, but do not make those monumental contributions to the good of society other than through corrupt measures.
Lyndon was notorious where Bobby Baker was his bagman and took vast sums of money to get an audience with Lyndon.
You had to bring a bag of cash.
In fact, that was the reason for the vote in the Senate the afternoon of the assassination, the Bobby Baker scandal.
Lyndon was really petrified at the time.
But the fact of the matter is that Bobby Baker had, in the aftermath of Lyndon joining the ticket, actually announced in public that JFK would not survive his first term in office and that he would die a violent death.
And Linden would send his chief administrative assistant, Cliff Carter, down to Dallas to make sure all the arrangements were in place for the assassination.
What we have from Darwin Porter and the other books that concern the Kennedy women and the like in the wonderful memoir by Mimi Alford is another side of the life of JFK, whom I continue to admire as a great figure in American politics.
And Jim, if I can second what you just said about the fact that people can have all these flaws and still make monumental contributions, I would really, I think that's a very valuable statement.
And also would second what Sophia said about we have you to thank for opening our eyes to many things over all these years of research that You put in, but just the single act of printing and circulating United States notes, currency, in spite of, in front of, and under the nose of the central banking system Federal Reserve notes at that time, in my opinion, was a singular act of courage that no other politician would dare to up to this day.
So he is certainly to be admired for that.
Paul, I want to thank you for your many comments today and Sophia.
It was sensational.
For the audience, spend as much time with your family, your friends, and people you love and care about.
We do not know how much time we have left.
Use it wisely.
Have a wonderful weekend.
Support Revolution Radio.
And even though I'm an agnostic, I now use a phrase God willing.
We'll be back on Monday.
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