Frances is a geo-political activist, writer and long-time researcher of The Black Nobility.↓ ↓ ↓
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Welcome to The Delling Pod with me, James Dellingpole.
And I know I always say I'm excited about this week's special guest, but before I introduce her, a quick word from one of our wonderful, lovely, delightful sponsors.
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Welcome to the deling pod Francis leader.
I For understandable reasons, you want to remain visually anonymous.
So this is going to be audio only, at least for you.
I think it's too late for me, Francis.
I think they know who I am.
They know where I live.
And if they want to come and get me, well, there's not much I can do about it.
That's up to, in the lap of the gods.
But I'm intrigued to find out more about you.
I came upon you.
Because I chanced upon your excellent Substack essay about smoking.
And there are things I want to talk to you about later on, because I understand you've just done a germ warfare podcast on the black nobility, which is, I mean, I'd love to talk about that.
But first of all, Um, thank you for helping confirm my suspicion that the cigarettes or smoking a bad for you thing is yet another psy-op.
Is that what you believe?
Yes, I do.
I have always thought that from the very start.
I mean, I don't mean from recent start.
I mean back from the 70s when the price started to go higher and higher and the taxation on tobacco products was going out of the reach of normal people.
It was horrific.
As soon as that started happening, I knew there was something suspicious going on and I determined to remain smoking.
Especially when every time I had occasion to visit my doctor, which was barely ever, the first thing they asked me was, are you still smoking?
And the most recent time that I saw him, he prefaced our conversation in exactly that way and said, are you still smoking?
And me being the belligerent old moo that I am, I said, actually, I'm smoking twice as much.
Well done.
Well, I mean, it seemed obvious to me that Smoking is not as guilty as they have claimed, because if that were the case, then we should have seen a massive decrease in cancer diagnoses, and we have seen a massive increase.
So that proves that tobacco is not guilty.
Oh, what you mean?
Because so many fewer people smoke now.
And certainly, I think the UK has had the biggest reduction in smoking anywhere in the Western world.
And you're right, we haven't seen a corresponding decline in cancer deaths.
On the contrary, they seem to have gone up.
Also, there are a few more clues.
For example, do you remember that phrase, most doctors don't smoke?
Well, I was thinking, most doctors also think that vaccines are safe and effective.
So, I'm not sure what doctors think is necessarily a good guide to what is or isn't good for you.
Well, I dispensed with doctors out of my life in the late 80s.
I started to study traditional Chinese medicine and it took me quite a long time to qualify in that particular subject.
But I find that what I had to do in order to study that subject was literally drop absolutely everything I knew about medicine from a Western point of view and start looking at health and healing and life in general through the lens of yin yang and qi which was extremely difficult to begin with
But eventually I managed to understand it and in 97 I started my own practice after having worked for another herbalist for several years as an apothecary, first of all.
And I was trained by Dr. Mei Chen from Beijing who Sadly, I had to go back to China because the British government, in its infinite wisdom, decided to make the import of Chinese herbal medicines, a great many of them, illegal from 2003 onwards.
And that put me out of business.
So, Ah, yeah.
Yeah, you do surprise me, Frances.
I wonder at whose behest that particular decision was made.
I mean, so 2003, that would be under Tony Blair, wouldn't it, I think?
is that the that would be under Tony Blair wouldn't it I think erm I think it was yes I I was not that it matters They're all the bloody same.
Yeah, they're all of a muchness.
It's the uni party, isn't it?
It is.
At the end of 2003 I was absolutely devastated because I had been working in a charity providing Herbal medicine to people who were trying to get over addictions of various types.
I was helping people who were HIV positive.
I was helping people who had terminal illnesses because they were not able to get any help via the NHS.
And as soon as they made the import of Traditional Chinese herbs illegal.
They literally tore the rug out from under me.
So I, I went, I just sold up.
I sold up everything that I had.
I bought a truck, I stuck my two dogs and my cat in the truck and we left.
And we, first of all, we toured all around UK and while I was feeling my way, working out how to live like that as minimalistically as possible.
And once I'd got it all sussed, off we trotted to Dover and over we went to to Europe and went touring along until we landed in Spain which, oh it was just, Spain felt right for me because it was so warm after we crossed through the Pyrenees and my van recovered from the shock of the temperature.
The damn thing was spewing, absolutely spewing steam when we got through the Pyrenees.
But once I got into Spain, I just loved it.
And I toured round and around for ages looking for an off-grid property to buy.
And I wanted to be really actually off-grid.
You know, I didn't want anything to do with people.
You can imagine, all that work that had gone into qualifying as a barefoot doctor of Chinese medicine had been just kiboshed.
And I just wanted to be on my own and think up a new way of being.
And living off-grid and having a little farm seemed to me like The ideal thing, to give me what I needed, a grounding in the earth, and to give my animals, my two dogs and my cat, a real life, actual real life, where they could be properly free.
And it turned out to be absolutely wonderful.
And so that was the compensation for having lost my career that I had worked so hard for.
Is that where you are now?
No.
You're still in Spain?
No.
Well, again, the British government and all their bosses came to mess up my life again.
In 2008, With the financial crash, which was global, as you know, the first place to really suffer was Spain.
And everyone who lived in the village where I was in the middle of Spain, I was right in the middle of Spain, about a third of the way up a mountain.
And everyone who lived in the nearest village to me was suddenly redundant.
They were all guys working in construction in the city and they just didn't go to work anymore.
Now, I was earning my living at that time teaching their kids English.
I'd been helped out by the village to provide a little evening school for everyone in the village and it was very popular.
I had over 50 students and I earned enough to keep the school running and myself.
My little fruit farm didn't really provide enough to live on.
And so that was my supplement.
That kept me alive.
Literally overnight, I went from 50 students down to five.
Because the first thing that a family is going to cut back on is the extracurricular activities.
So there it was again.
The big black hand of black nobility came down on me again and took away the next career.
And I was like down to, I was down to absolutely zero.
I had no money whatsoever.
And the local estate agent came out to visit me and he said that a couple from Madrid had been in to see him the previous summer and had wanted to put in an offer for my property.
Because they had seen it while they were there on holiday and they wanted to buy my place, which I had only just finished restoring it.
When I bought it, it was six years.
Nobody had lived in it for six years.
So it took me years to get it looking really lovely.
And then this guy said, you know, they will make you an offer you can't refuse sort of thing.
And I was down to zero and he knew I was.
Everyone knows everyone's business.
In a small village like that.
And so anyway, he contacted that couple from Madrid and they did make me a fantastic offer that I couldn't refuse, part of which was cash in hand.
So, you know, they literally turned up with a brown paper bag full of cash.
I mean, so I thought, oh God, here we go again.
I'm throwing myself into the deep end.
I signed on the dotted line and I got myself back to the UK, back to several shades of grey in the UK.
Oh my God, what a downer that was!
Wow.
So that was 2008?
Yeah.
So how have you been managing since?
Oh, I don't know.
I just seem to be Guided in some way, I seem to always land on my feet.
Even when things look as if they're going to be really bad, that is not what happens at all.
I bought myself another truck, got the dogs and the cat into the truck and went off travelling all around the UK again because I had loved doing that.
That was wonderful.
And I stayed a few months here and a few months there.
And then I went up to Aberdeen where I'd lived before because my husband had worked on the North Sea oil rigs when we were young and we still had friends up there.
And so I went up to Aberdeen and one of my friends up there was running a massage for sports therapy business in Aberdeen University.
And when I told her about Chinese medicine she was very curious, so I spent six months showing her the Chinese version of massage, and that was great fun.
We had a lot, you know, got me through my depression, which, you know, you can imagine I was I can.
I'm getting chased about here.
So I did that and then I was quite happy that she was really good.
She really picked it up fast and she incorporated it into her business and still does even to now.
And we're still friends obviously.
And then I trotted off on my travels again.
and came back south mainly because I mean Aberdeen's full of lovely people but the weather up there James oh my god you know you've got to be proper tough to live in Aberdeenshire and it was too much for me it was too cold so I came back south again and by this time my son had Got himself a little family, started a small family down near Bournemouth.
And so I thought, well, I'll go and see them.
So I then spent the next brief period trying to help my son with his ever-growing family.
And one of his children had cerebral palsy, was prematurely born, With Cerebral Palsy.
And so both my son and the mother of his children were absolutely exhausted with the effort.
And so I decided to give up the travelling and stay with them for a little while and help them out.
And then, by pure luck, found myself a really lovely place to live.
And so now I've... and I've been here in Dorset ever since.
I love Dorset.
It's super green.
Rains a bit too much, though, you know?
Yeah, but that's the price you pay for the green, isn't it, really?
Yeah.
It's a lovely county.
Yeah, it is.
Well, in 2013, my son's father, who had worked on the North Sea oil rigs, unfortunately he had had cancer for a long time and he died.
And I was really suspicious about the way that he died, about him getting cancer particularly.
And when I looked into it, It occurred to me that there was something about working on the North Sea oil rigs that was causing people to get cancer because he wasn't the only one of his team and fellow and friends and people in Aberdeen in general that had gone down with cancer after having worked on the North Sea oil rigs.
So I then got involved in the anti-fracking movement and In 2013 we set up our first anti-fracking camp at Balcombe in Sussex.
Do you remember that?
I do, yes.
At the time I was, I tell you for instance, I was very pro-fracking.
I'm not sure what I think now, but at the time it was being sold to me certainly as the kind of the root out of our energy problems.
But tell me what was your objection to fracking?
I mean apart from the fact that, do you think, what's the connection between fracking and cancer?
Well after a great deal of study, and I do mean real in-depth study, I discovered that there is That all oil and gas drilling rigs are radioactive.
Ah.
How come?
Well, they're drilling down to such deep levels and through so many layers of rock, a lot of which are naturally radioactive layers.
As they drill down, they're using a mud, a slippery mud, that transports the fragments of rock back up to the drill floor.
And those fragments of rock are radioactive.
Right.
But in addition to that, if they're fracking, they then put a horizontal pipe, they go down, straight down vertically, then they go horizontal.
And it's through the shale.
They're going through the shale bed.
And as they do that, they've got a steel pipe going through the shale bed.
They have to perforate that pipe so that they can extract the gas from the rock or the oil.
But in most cases, it's gas.
The, the perforation gun that they use to perforate the steel is a depleted uranium perforation gun.
I got the, yeah, it's made by Halliburton.
Oh, it's funny isn't it?
Because, you know, I mean, I was, It's quite tricky because I know that a lot of elements within the Green Movement are essentially the useful idiots of the people who run the world.
Anyone involved with the climate change industry is basically Working for Al Gore, who is in turn, you know, working for the New World Order.
But at the same time, what that means is, when you take these positions, like my pro-fracking position, you sort of assume that what you're being told by the pro-fracking side is all correct, because you think anyone opposed to this, as opposed to oil, as opposed to technology, but what you're saying Does kind of make sense.
I mean the connection between drill workers and I mean, I'm very I'm very suspicious of the oil industry generally not because of the whole climate change industry, which I think is a distraction but because I think that we are lied to about the nature of oil.
I think it's I think it's Not made from fossils and dinosaurs.
I think it's abiotic.
Yeah.
I think everything we're told about energy is a lie.
Yes.
So what you're saying doesn't shock me.
Well, one of the things that I learned while I was on camp, I mean, obviously I camped out at Balcombe for the whole summer.
And all the time I was there I was being fed information from all sorts of areas.
One of the things I noticed was the climate change people were trying to take over.
They wanted to make anti-fracking all about climate change, and those of us that were on camp, we didn't agree.
We didn't agree that it had anything whatsoever to do with climate change.
We were concerned about the pollution to the water table, aquifers, Around as well.
Yep.
And we were concerned about, we weren't concerned about the radioactivity because we hadn't learned about that then.
In 2013 we didn't know that.
But right at the beginning it was the fluid, the amount of fluid that they were going to be using to frack And they were going to make that fluid unusable ever again because it was going to be laced with so many chemicals.
That was our main problem.
Well, that was getting ignored by the media and they were homing in on this climate change angle.
Isn't that interesting?
We didn't agree at all.
No, that was not why we were there.
But that's the media for you, isn't it?
It's not just the media.
It's how they, with a capital T, how they roll.
What they do is that they infiltrate groups like yours and co-opt them by inserting people sympathetic to their particular cause.
I mean, in the same way that the anti-war movement in America in the 1960s was deliberately and cynically hijacked by the people who invented the hippie movement in order to make anti-war look kind of feckless and a feckless and irresponsible and drug-ridden position.
It's how they do it.
It's controlled opposition, isn't it?
Absolutely.
It's funny you should mention that because that was my very first protest was against Vietnam outside the American Embassy in 1967.
I was 15.
Was it?
Yes, I was 15.
That was my first ever protest.
Wow.
Yes, I mean, and what was it?
Was it just Did you under... I mean, my position on the Vietnam War has changed completely.
I used to watch, when I was a teenager, I used to watch NAMM movies with my brother.
And I've always, always been rooting for the Americans against Charlie, you know, because, you know, I, I, yeah, but, but you see, this is how the brainwashing process works.
You think that the American, just as in, in, in cowboy and Indian movies, I was always rooting for the cowboys.
I now realize in both cases that the, the, the, those hapless GIs, um, and Marines and, and those, those cowboys were basically serving the cause of evil.
And it was the opposition, the Viet Cong and the Red Indians who one should have been rooting for.
It's funny you should mention that because when we watched cowboy and Indian films when I was a kiddie, we didn't have a television.
We used to go to Saturday morning pictures.
Pay our sixpence and sit there for a couple of hours watching cowboy and Indian films.
And I was on the side of the horses.
I didn't care about any of the people.
I was more concerned about the horses getting hurt.
I was very unusual as a child.
Frances, just on a side note there, I watched Ben-Hur the other day and it's a, I mean, it's a magnificent film in its way, although I think it's probably, it contains an element of Zionist propaganda in it.
Yes, nail them in.
Kel's surprise, you know, the fact that Judah Ben-Hur wears a Star of David around his neck when he goes around the racetrack.
I don't think the Star of David was even a thing in those days.
It's more of a sort of an occult symbol.
It's a modern phenomenon.
But anyway, did you know that 30 horses 30 horses were killed in the making of that film, and you just think what a ruthless bastard the director must have been.
I mean, as I'm sure they all were, but what a tosser.
However good the film was, it wasn't worth the life of one horse.
No.
Well, no film is.
I mean, it's just entertainment, supposedly, but really it's brainwashing, isn't it?
Yeah.
Oh, God.
It sounds to me like you were awake at quite an early age.
I mean, what was your awakening process?
Well, I don't remember very much before.
I was four years old and I was playing in bomb craters in the East End of London.
That was my playground.
I used to jump over the back fence and climb down into the bomb craters and play with all the knickknacks and bits and pieces and bricks and bits of wood, and I'd make myself pretend houses for my dollies and things.
I played in that environment.
And when my mum found out that's what I was doing, She told me off, obviously, and said, you know, you can't be going down there.
It's dangerous.
And I said, well, why?
And she said, because to me, it was the most exciting place in London to be down a huge crater.
And she told me that this had been a world war.
So I believed, being four years old, that the whole world looked like that.
That the whole world had been bombed up.
Everybody's streets had some houses standing and other houses gone.
I thought that's how it was.
Normal.
That was normal to me.
And when I found out that that wasn't the case, because we got taken on holiday to Somerset when I was about six, five or six, and there were green fields and cows and forests and things, and I thought, well, where was the World War here?
You know, how come this place didn't get bombed up?
And so out of curiosity, I was pestering my parents all the time.
What was going on here?
What was war, effectively, was my main curiosity.
And when I found out as much as I could from my mum and my dad and my grandparents, I was dead against it.
I was like, that is not happening.
That is just so wrong.
Over my dead body.
Yeah.
I don't want to see anybody else having to grow up.
In an environment like I did.
And so you can imagine, looking at what's going on in Yemen and Gaza and Iraq and everywhere else that has happened since, it breaks my heart because I was told when I was a little kiddie that the United Nations was set up to prevent all that.
And I've never seen a day in my entire 72 years of genuine global peace.
I've not seen it.
And so that turned me into an anti-war activist.
At four years old!
So by the time I was 15 I was champing at the bit to go and say my piece and I found out about the demonstrations that CND were putting on and I didn't have any money or anything but I just told my mum I was going to visit a friend and I got onto the trains and I bunked the trains into central London
And I found the demonstration and I took part.
Well, it just so happens that my grandfather spotted me in the crowd on television in the BBC News.
What are the chances?
Well, he was the only person in the family that had a television, so the chances were very small.
You know, I mean, my God, how did that happen?
Come the following week, my grandfather, in his whacking great big tanker, because he was a tanker driver, turned up outside my school to pick me up from school, to give me the lecture of my life about being in central London, risking my life.
And he wasn't going to tell my mum, but he wanted me to promise that I would never do anything like that again.
I thought he was psychic until he actually confessed that he had briefly for a second seen me in the crowd.
I thought, my God, what's the chances of that?
So I then had to conduct my protesting completely secretly from then on.
It had to be All clandestine.
I got so used to it.
From then on I was always sneaking off and doing things like, mainly to do with anti-war and the Animal Liberation Front.
I really liked that.
I was part of that.
Right.
And then Stop the City.
I don't know if you remember that campaign.
That was in the 90s.
I don't remember that.
Stop what city?
The City of London, of course.
Oh, I see.
Yeah, sorry.
What we were doing was we were trying to draw attention to the fact that the City of London is an independent city within Greater London and is a pariah on our backs.
That's what we were trying to do.
The police came down on us like a ton of bricks and I was very fortunate to slip away because at the time I was working in the City of London.
So I was able to slip back into my office all innocently as if I hadn't been involved at all, you know.
That was fun.
What were you doing?
What was your job?
Oh, my goodness.
I was PA Secretary to the lady that invented Inmarsat, which is an international maritime satellite system.
Oh, right.
So you were in the belly of the beast.
Oh, utterly.
I worked my way into the belly of the beast deliberately.
Wow.
Yeah.
That's interesting.
Oh it was.
It was very exciting.
So you're getting insider, insider.
Did you get any sense?
Because obviously Inmarsat is connected with the intelligence services.
I mean all these telecommunications.
Did you get any feeling that... Well...
At the time, in Marsax's offices, were inside the Lloyds building.
You know that big ugly monstrosity?
Yeah, yeah.
That's where it was.
And it was secret.
It wasn't a separate business at all.
It was definitely under the wing of Lloyd's List.
You know, the people that run Lloyd's.
And my job was so easy, James, honestly.
I had nothing to do.
By the time 10 o'clock came in the morning I was sitting there filing my nails like you see in all the James Bond movies.
I had the easiest job going.
So I had access to all the Archives, and I had a little poke about and learned as much as I possibly could about the origins of the insurance business, and what that was all about, and just decided all.
So this is just a racket, basically.
Insurance is just a racket.
A gambler's racket.
And sometimes it hurts them, but most often than not it doesn't.
Right.
Yeah, well, I can see that.
I can see that.
Anything else you discovered that we wouldn't be able to intuit already?
I mean, obviously, there was the thing about the Lloyds names, wasn't there?
Yes.
Everyone used to want to become a Lloyds name so that they could sort of get free money until it went sour.
Well, quite.
When it went sour, it went really, really sour, really quickly.
And they decided originally there were only 100 names.
I believe now they've got thousands of names.
Cushions the blow a little bit more for them when they do have a big hit.
But you do know, don't you, that Lloyd's of London insures everything.
They insure satellites, aircraft, every ship on the ocean.
Just about everything is insured by them.
And if it's not insured directly, it's insured indirectly.
Right.
And to what degree do you I mean, obviously it's dodgy because all these industries are dodgy, we know that.
Totally dodgy, yeah.
But wherein lies the particular dodginess in your view with regards to insurance?
Well, it's the vast sums of money that they make.
They make a huge amount of money and people that own These businesses at the very, very top are utterly obscure.
You can't find out who they are.
Well, I mean, you can if you're in the position I was in, and that was how I got onto the Black Nobility.
Do you know, that's a fantastic segue there, Frances.
I was going to do it for you, but you did it for me, so thank you.
Well, it was obvious, really, wasn't it?
Well, it was.
Sooner or later.
So, okay, so here's the thing, Francis.
I mean, I've been interested in the sort of things that you're interested in for a much shorter time than you.
I've been on the fast learning program.
I've gone from kind of sort of kindergarten to PhD student in the space of two and a half years, I think, or three years.
But, so some of the things I've picked up.
Okay, so one often hears about the 12 or possibly 13 satanic bloodlines.
You know, there's the families like the Rockefellers, the Rothschilds, the Collins, the Van Dynes, the Lee, the, you know, there's a few more.
Your theory, as I understand it, is that those are kind of lower tier Power brokers and that the real families who run the world are in fact the the the papal bloodlines, the black nobility.
Is that right?
Yes, more or less.
It's a bit broader than that.
The Black Nobility is a nickname that they got for themselves just around about the time that they set up the Vatican in 1927 or 9.
No, not 19.
You mean 15.
No, I do mean 19.
It's a nickname.
No, not 19.
You mean 15.
No, I do mean 19.
It's a nickname.
The black nobility is just a nickname.
Oh, okay.
Before that, they were literally the nobility, the aristocracy of Europe, all European aristocracy families, not just the few that were in support of the Roman not just the few that were in support of the Roman Catholic
Church around Rome and Venice, not just those, but all of the aristocratic families of Europe had by that time, by the 19th century, intermingled and intermarried to such an extent that it's now a huge web, a huge web.
And even if they haven't got their principalities and their land, They still kept their titles and still passed their titles down to the next generation.
Yes.
Now, I suppose that if we were talking to a sceptical person, or what I might call a normie, their response to this would be, yes, well, of course the aristocracy used to wield enormous power, but
Those days are long gone that they've been crippled by things like the inheritance taxes and so on or the dissipation that inevitably happens down the generations the weakening of bloodlines or whatever and that they are a sort of anachronistic irrelevance with no power.
What would you say to that?
It would be wonderful if that was true, but what had happened was instead of being disappearing under the weight of the expenses of running the country pile, they just became more criminal in order to support the country pile.
And what they're doing now is international Crime syndicate, that's what the aristocracy is.
Sorry, I hate to be so specific, but that's what it is.
Because I have to say, I've been, I've done one previous podcast on the black nobility.
Laura, you spoke to Laura.
Yes, I spoke to Laura and I mean, she told me some interesting things, but what I was going to say is that There are not many people who know about it, are there?
So I was wondering, how did you get your information?
Oh, how did I start?
Um, ah, I...
John Coleman...
The first author that I actually read was John Coleman.
I think that was the start.
And from there I learned about a great many of the aristocracy from Lyndon LaRouche and Oh gosh, there were so many.
Saturn, Anthony Saturn.
Yeah.
I know these are all obscure writers really, or they're writers that have been marginalised.
Yes.
And in the case of LaRouche, even imprisoned for what they were doing and saying.
And that made them all the more interesting to me.
You know?
Yes.
If somebody is being marginalised for what they're saying, then I'm more interested in what they're saying.
You know?
The power... Well, of course.
Because we know, those of us who've looked into this stuff, that nothing gets published in the mainstream unless they want it to be.
Published.
Publishing is part of the propaganda.
The brainwashing by which we're all kept in check and in ignorance.
So yeah, people like Anthony Sutton, sometimes they slip under the net, but generally the system gatekeeps to ensure that these authors don't get wide circulation.
So I've heard of the ones you mentioned, but have you got other sources as well?
I don't... Webster Tarpley is a really good source for me.
I like his stuff.
He's worked very hard and he's persecuted something awful.
I haven't even heard of him.
Who is he?
Well, he was a member of the LaRouche team.
He was part of that team when LaRouche was alive, and now I think he works pretty much independently.
I don't see anything of him that's recent, I must confess.
But since I read Webster Tarpley's stuff, I've pretty much been Well, because we've got access to the internet now, I've pretty much been independently doing research by myself.
And how many of these families are there?
I don't know, there are so many!
Because what they do, I don't know if Laura managed to get this across to you, what they do is they change their names a lot as well.
They intermarry and double-barrel their names.
So you'll get, for example, the Orsini family, which is an old Roman Empire senatorial family.
They are pretty much one of the top families, but they've got multiple branches beneath them.
So as the Orsini family, in the last 2,000 years, has been in power in Italy, It has spawned like a web of smaller families, sub-families.
And then there's the Farnese and the Medici and the Borgia.
And then when you come into the rest of Europe, the German aristocracy and the French aristocracy, and that's to say nothing of our aristocracy, which
Our royal family is part of the Guelph, which is a black nobility family, subbed down to the Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, which has changed its name to Windsor to make it more palatable since the Second World War.
Right, so they're Guelphs.
That's the Guelphs and the Ghibellines, isn't it?
That's right.
The two kind of rival clans.
Yeah, they still do, I think, have rivalries between themselves.
And I think that that kind of rivalry was what put paid to the Russian family.
The Romanovs?
Yeah.
I think that there's been a lot of Yeah, yeah.
They didn't want the Russian family.
The Russian family were not as exploitative as the European families would have liked.
They actually objected to the exploitation of their people.
And so they couldn't survive because they were too nice.
So they got bumped off.
That was what it was about.
Bumping off is their thing.
They love bumping people off.
It's their thing, isn't it?
Yes, well I must say one of the many eye-openers I've experienced in the last two or three years is realizing that any big name that you think of as etched in your memory as somebody who's died young was almost certainly bumped off rather, you know, I mean you think of Bob Marley assassinated by the CIA probably with a poisoned football boot or you think of
Martin Luther King, JFK, Bobby Kennedy.
I mean, the list goes on, doesn't it?
Princess Diana.
Diana, yes.
A big one, that one, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Do you have any theories on the death of Diana?
I mean, who was behind it, why?
Well, I don't need a theory.
She wrote a little note, didn't she, in her diary, saying that she thought that Charles was plotting to have her killed.
Oh, no, I don't mean the hows.
I mean the whys, what the motivation was.
I think the motivation was quite sad, really.
Had made the mistake of being persuaded into marrying her when his heart was elsewhere.
And now his heart is where it should have been in the first place.
Yeah.
So here's the thing, Francis.
I don't know how much you know about me, but I had a fairly traditional education and I went to university with a lot of The kind of people you describe.
And when I was younger, when I was an undergraduate, I rather coveted, I was a bit like Charles Ryder in Bridesaid Revisited.
I wanted to hang out with the Toffs and maybe even marry into them or at least get invited to their shooting parties and stuff and being invited to their grand estates.
And so I saw these people at close quarters and I got to know, you know, some of them are I don't know how many of them will still talk to me, but I like to think I'm still sort of well disposed towards a few of them.
Is it your thesis that they're all basically wrong-runs?
Anyone with blue blood, even if they're a kind of second cousin, they're basically in the game?
Or is it not quite as simple as that?
No, I don't think they're all involved.
I think some of them are too air-headed for this.
You've got to be criminally minded, really.
When I was at Lloyd's We used to, the board level secretariat would do a stenographer for meetings.
You'd have to take notes to do the minutes of meetings on a rotor.
And when my turn came around, the first thing I noticed about the meeting was they didn't take a blind bit of notice of me.
I'm sat in the corner doing my shorthand and taking notes.
And they were completely oblivious of my existence.
And before the meeting actually kicked off, they were having a very interesting discussion amongst themselves.
And some of them, not all of them, some of them are predatorial by nature and you can really see it in the way that they strut and talk and dress and and gesticulate you can see this predatorial side to some of them
they literally glitter when they think they're going to make a killing of some financial sort or another and one particular meeting that I was taking notes at I was absolutely mortar struck by the fact that they were competing amongst themselves to purchase land in Bangkok or Singapore at that time
so So I was paying attention, but I was looking as if I was busy doing my notes and not taking any notice of any of this side conversation that was going on.
It wasn't on the agenda, this subject, so I shouldn't have been making notes on this.
But the reason they were doing it was because we were about... I mean, Britain was about to give back Hong Kong to China at that time.
And they were hedging their bets by buying land in Bangkok and Singapore because they thought that the business interests would collapse in Hong Kong and move to Bangkok or Singapore.
So they were buying that seafront Well, one of the funniest things I've ever seen in my life happened.
to come out on top when that happened, when we actually handed back Hong Kong to China.
Well, one of the funniest things I've ever seen in my life happened.
The Thai royal family got wind of this.
And the king of Thailand made it a rule that nobody could own land in Thailand unless they were married to a Thai woman. - Yeah.
So all these people that had bought this land, they were scuppered.
They couldn't own.
Their ownership was null and void.
They couldn't own the property there.
and how he found out will forever remain a mystery. - Did any of them scurry to marry Thai brides?
I bet they did, yeah!
I can imagine it, can't you?
Book me a flight getting back into their office to his secretary.
Book me a flight immediately to Bangkok so that I can go and marry some prostitute on the street, honestly.
So, again though, you see, A conventionally minded listener would hear the story and go, well, this is, you know, this is the nature of capitalism.
This is what high-level businessmen are like.
They've all got psychopathic tendencies.
It's not all of them.
It's just a few.
You can tell the ones that have got that predatorial streak.
They're competitive and, you know, down to how shiny their shoes are, down to the last little thing, they're competitive.
But there are others who are completely business-like and very quiet, and they're not like that.
So you can't tar the entire aristocracy with a brush.
It's some of them, not all of them.
I mean, to qualify as a member of the Black nobility, is it about your ancestry or is it about your behaviour?
Because it sounds to me like you're saying... It's ancestry.
Oh, it's definitely ancestry.
Okay.
So it follows that you could be a member of the Black nobility and be a goodie, not a baddie.
Oh yes, you could be.
But they have a bad habit of bumping off their goodies.
Do they now?
Yes.
Say, for example, you were born into a black nobility family and were the number one son who should, by rights, inherit the title, the properties, the businesses, and so forth.
But you turn out to be a really lovely guy who wants to go around the world being happy.
You're not going to be regarded by your family as a suitable candidate for a serious candidate for that position.
So they do tend to get suicided.
Right.
Yes.
Well, so let's deal with our own aristocracy.
Oh, they're lovely hours.
Are they, because, well, you tell me, because obviously, so we've got the most obvious bad behavior to me that I've seen from, say, the Duke level of aristocracy is that they the Duke level of aristocracy is that they love raping the taxpayer by having wind turbines by.
But I mean, the Scottish Dukes are particularly bad for this.
The Scottish Dukes have all allowed wind turbines to be built on their estates, ruining the landscape for miles around.
So they're obviously after any form of subsidy.
They don't care about their responsibility to the countryside or anything like that.
And I mean, you've got The shocking anomaly whereby the Duke of Westminster, for example, still owns the freehold on vast swathes of London, so is able to claim ground rents and so on.
But this strikes me as just sort of slightly dodgy, dodgy capitalism stroke, you know, the injustice of class.
But you're saying it goes much, much worse than that.
I mean, what sort of...
Are you saying that a lot of our ducal houses and a lot of our marquesses and earls are basically criminals?
I can't say that because I don't know of any particular cases in our own, amongst our own aristocracy that I would call criminals.
Right.
But we do have a really strong history that goes back where the money that they manipulate and use now.
The money that they invest, the money that they have behind them, comes from very dodgy business practices like slavery and drugs.
Yeah.
In the past.
Yeah, I mean, slavery was finished a while back in the UK.
No, no, James, no.
Slavery is now far worse than it ever was.
Oh really?
Yeah, they don't need change, they just need debt.
Everything is debt now.
So if you're, if for example you want to travel to America, you can get a deal whereby you can Get paid for to go to America.
Say you're a Ukrainian woman, for example, and you want to get out of Ukraine, then you can get a deal whereby you get transported off to America.
But the deal is like, once you get there, you're a slave until you've paid off your debt.
Like indentured, a bit like the original settlers.
That's it.
Yeah.
That's still going on now and then and then beyond that every single person has debt and then the whole nation itself has vast amounts of debt.
So these are these are forms of slavery that just haven't got the taint of that name, but that is what they are.
Okay.
So by that token you're suggesting that a lot of these this black nobility Own the real owners of the central banks of the of the yeah of the various banking houses.
Yes.
I mean the Federal Reserve for example, we know some of the names, you know, there were at least some of the bank members, you know, JP Morgan and Rockefeller and so on but by your thesis They're just the staff, James.
Right.
Those are the staff, the people that you know about, whose names you know.
Those are the staff running the banks on behalf of the extremely wealthy.
The really wealthy don't count their money in billions, they count their money in trillions.
And they bank at the BIS in Switzerland.
Yeah, the Bank of International Settlements.
Are you suggesting that Jacob Rothschild wakes up every day and feels incredibly poor?
No, because he's dead!
No, that's the other one.
Oh, sorry.
Yes, sorry.
Sorry.
Right.
Sorry.
OK.
Nat Rothschild.
Yes.
Does Nat Rothschild wake up every day and rue the day he was born a pauper Rothschild and wishes he was actually an Orsini?
I shouldn't think so, no, because the Rothschilds have a position for eternity As advisors to the Vatican, so they are in a position whereby they can manipulate finance internationally.
I should think that that's more than adequate for them.
They don't really need... I mean, have you seen the piles that they've got in Buckinghamshire?
Yeah, yeah, I know, yeah, all of those.
Yeah, I think they do all right.
Just a bit.
So, tell me about the name that you occasionally see cropping up in conspiracy circles.
Is the name Hayzer?
P-A-Y-S-E-U-R.
Is that a thing?
Well, isn't that an American family?
I don't know.
I don't know anything about it.
It sounds like a French... It's a bit like Voldemort, you know.
It's one of those names that people mutter with dread.
Yes, well, it's a French... I think it's a French family that emigrated to America and did rather well.
But again, we're talking staff.
These are the people that run the industries that provide the aristocracy with their wealth.
You know, for instance, telecommunications, pharmaceuticals, all of those, oil and gas, all of those massive industries are all owned by the aristocracy.
And the Bank of England?
I mean, do try to find out who owns the Bank of England.
Well, tell me.
I'd love to know.
Well, so would I. I mean, no, it's impossible.
That is one of the most difficult things I have tried really hard to find out.
And no, you can't find that out.
Thing is, do these people, look, I mean, the level of wealth you're talking about, we must know where they live.
They must feature in society magazines and things.
They can't live completely under the radar, even if they do fly by private jets and stuff.
Where do they hang out, these people?
Well, the black nobility of Italy They have castles all over northern Italy and into Switzerland.
They have super yachts, the rest of the aristocracy, they've all got super yachts, and they've got private islands, a la Epstein type thing.
So yeah, they don't necessarily need to mix with the likes of you and I. Right.
Anywhere near us.
Right.
But they have to occasionally.
I mean, if they go fox hunting, say, they have to mix with the rest of the field.
But nobody knows who they are, do they?
That's true.
It's a guy sitting on a horse amongst several other guys all dressed the same.
How are you going to know which one's which and who's what unless you've seen their face before?
And in most cases, you haven't.
So they've got anonymity out from their obscurity.
You know what, Frances, this is slightly worrying, because I know you won't approve of the fact that I go fox hunting, but I do.
But when I've been out hunting, my main topic of conversation is the kind of things we're talking about now.
I just go out there and sort of red pill people.
And you're absolutely right.
When you're out hunting, you do not know who the people sitting next to you are.
You strike up conversations.
They could be a duke, they could be a farmer, they could be anybody.
And you sometimes don't even have time to catch their name because you're chatting and then suddenly the hunt takes off again and you don't know where you're going.
You're right.
I wonder what some of them have made of me.
They must think, you know, they can't decide whether to bump me off or whether just have me dismissed as a madman.
Well, I think that someone like yourself is very interesting to them in as much as you are curious and you have set up this podcasting thing whereby you interview People that are researching and working in all different forms of life.
And so you provide them with a window into what the Hoyper lawyer, what we, the normies, are up to.
Yes, that's true.
So you're useful.
I'm like a sort of interesting hamster or something, you know.
You don't look remotely like a hamster, James.
Well, yeah, or horse, I don't know.
I once went to this dinner at this, I can't remember what it was, I do find that the world of gardening, if you want to mix with the really, really, really, really super, super, super rich, The area that they encounter people like me is in the world of gardening.
Are you aware of this?
Yes.
Because they've all got big, big gardens.
So I was at some sort of dinner and I got sat next to this very beguiling woman.
I don't know.
She was clearly connected.
And she was because, you know, I was having this sort of conversation and she was clearly fascinated by what I was saying.
But I was fascinated what she was saying.
And she said that she comes from a family called Tion, I think.
I don't know how you spell it, but she said anyone who knows about these things, anyone in continental Europe would hear that name and know the significance of it.
I don't know.
Tion?
No, it doesn't mean anything to me, but Laura might have heard of them.
Yeah, I should have asked.
I should have asked.
It is, it is, it is fascinating.
It's like, another of the families I know that the Black Nobility family is Dora Pamphili.
If that's how you pronounce it.
And there is that palace that you can go and see in Rome now.
It's a tourist attraction.
You've got to book a while in advance.
But I read an interview with the guy who was the last of his line to live in that particular palace.
Absolutely stuffed with art in central Rome.
And I was wondering, well, how can you be one of those families And not be a wrong one, given what you said about how they tend to breed out, well, kill, kill, cull any family members who are not psychopaths.
I mean, it's weird, isn't it?
Well, I don't even think they need to be psychopaths, particularly, because if you look at it from their point of view, they are preserving 2,000 years from the Roman Empire until now.
They're preserving that empire.
It's still around.
I call it Roman Empire Mark 2 that we've got now.
Or Mark 7 or 8 or 9 It's like what we call the New World Order Is actually the re-establishment or the totalitarian establishment Of the Roman Empire globally And...
And they think that that's a good thing, you see, from their point of view, that is a really good thing because then everything will be controlled, everybody will be known about, down to your last little piece of genetic material and they can keep an eye on it all and it will all be on Kidori is their idea.
But underneath that idea, when you look at the Club of Rome and what they are up to with their climate change and hatred for carbon dioxide.
Yes.
When you look at what they're doing, to me it smacks of destroying nature completely.
Oh, it does?
I'm totally with you there.
I actually think that the intentions, the long-term intentions, are to preserve their own, the aristocracy, to preserve their own genetic sequencing, their own families, and destroy all other forms of life.
And I mean every single microbe, the lot, everything gone, so that they can redesign something that's far more to their liking.
Far more controllable, far more, far less risky.
I mean, when you think about it, why have they got seed banks and gene banks hidden away deep underground?
They'd spent an awful lot of money providing these things, saying, you know, well, come the glorious day, we'll have the seeds to start life again.
Well, yes, that's what they intend to do.
They intend to start their own design and wipe out that which we have, including us.
Where are you on the spiritual nature of this battle we're fighting?
Are you alive to that, that this is also as much a physical, a spiritual war as it is a war in the material world?
I love nature so much.
I believe in reincarnation.
I believe in the connectedness Of all living things, I think that we are one... I think that nature is one beautiful... Oh, I can't even find words for this.
That's why I hesitated to answer you, because it's such a massive concept.
So anything that sets out to destroy Even one little microbe to me is wrong.
The reason I ask that question is not because I want to evangelize on behalf of my Christian faith, but because it's very interesting that I think that if you look into Christianity at all and you read the Bible and take it seriously,
What you realize is that what you are describing is well described in the Bible.
In as much as it describes how the rebel angels, you know, revolted against God, were cast down and essentially
In their war against the Creator, God, have manipulated mankind and tried to supplant God by creating a kind of debauched simulacrum of God's creation on Earth.
So they want to sort of write God out of existence by showing that we can create stuff too.
So I'll give you an example of this.
The pharmaceutical industry is essentially a kind of, is the satanic flip side of your Chinese medicine, your Chinese herbal medicine.
Anyone who's studied herbology or Chinese medicine or these various fields, homeopathy, knows that out there, Waiting just to be gathered and used intelligently.
All these wonderful substances, be it black walnut as an anti-parasitic, or green bananas to soothe you when you've got diarrhoea.
All these wonderful things which I would argue are God-given.
And then you've got the pharmaceutical industry, which does what?
It uses petroleum byproducts to create kind of toxic substances with side effects, which somehow may, to a degree, have some of the beneficial effects of all the natural ones.
And you can go through the list, you can go through every industry and realize that The people behind them are at constant war with God's creation.
I mean, you may not be a Christian, but I think you can see where I'm coming from there.
I started off as a totally dedicated Christian.
Yeah.
I absolutely adored everything I heard about Jesus.
I thought the guy was top-notch.
I really loved him.
I think he still is.
Well, was in as much as he lived 2,000 years ago.
Once I started studying Chinese medicine, I made a few discoveries In the ancient books of Chinese medicine that shook me, one of them was gold, frankincense and myrrh.
And it was literally a eureka moment for me when I discovered that gold, frankincense and myrrh is a formula, a very, very ancient herbal formula for the treatment of all forms of poisoning.
I literally jumped out of my seat and punched the air because I realised then, in that moment, that I had found what Jesus had found.
That he had found this answer through his education.
There was a long period in his life when he was missing.
And that always intrigued me enormously when I was a child.
Where did he go?
Who taught him?
And when he came back from that period, he was so angry with what he saw.
And his reason, what was his reason for being angry?
It must have been what he was taught in the time that he was missing that had made him so angry with what he saw around him when he went into the temple in Jerusalem, for example.
And then I also noticed some of his parables are also stories told to Chinese children to teach them the difference between yin and yang.
When he was giving his Sermon on the Mount, the one in which he asked for fishes and loaves, he didn't feed 10,000 people, or however many it was, with five fishes and five loaves.
He fed their imagination and their mind by pointing out that fish is yin, and bread, or loaves, is yang.
And the difference between those two things, he taught them the basics of Chinese philosophy And then there was the baptism that he got from John the Baptist.
Well, there are four baptisms.
That's the first one, the baptism of water, but then there's air and there's earth and there's fire.
And because they chopped off, well, Salome and her dad chopped off John the Baptist's head, They deprived us of knowing the rest of the story.
And because they killed Jesus when he was only 33, they deprived us of the rest of his story too.
And that was a Roman stroke Pharisee decision because they knew that what he knew was brilliant and was fantastic.
And so when I was searching in Chinese medicine and And discovering all these things, I felt like I was finding out what it was that was missing from Christianity.
So it was like I was augmenting my Christianity rather than dismissing it.
I was augmenting it, making it grow to a much bigger concept.
And that concept doesn't have Any need to make a reference to God or to any human or anything that any human has ever written about God or anything.
If you read, for example, Lao Tzu, he says, the Tao that can be spoken is not the real Tao.
You cannot explain the magic of what we live in, of what we are and what we live in, in words.
It just cannot be done.
And I think that that's a brilliant way to look at things that, you know, you cannot expect yourself to be able to intellectualize this Fantastic thing, which is life.
And life has an amazing ability to fight back.
It itself fights back and has done for thousands and thousands and thousands of years, hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of years.
It has survived and it will continue to survive.
And so to me, life is the thing that I worship.
If I have to worship something, I worship the process of life.
And it's a miracle to me.
This is a way too big a subject for us to tack on to the end of a podcast.
I mean, I personally don't find that anything you've said to me about your discoveries since your early Christian days, that they contradict the message of Christianity or the divine nature of Jesus or indeed
By the way, I share the intensity of your feeling about what I would call God's creation, but I think that it is the very fact that it is so wonderful and ineffable that is as close as we're going to get to proof that it is created by an omnipotent, essentially benign and certainly ineffable
Being, you know, the thing I would always say to people who are sort of rejecting God or saying that it's kind of irrelevant.
Okay, well, where did it all come from then?
Because it didn't come from primordial slime.
I mean, the Big Bang Theory was invented by a Jesuit.
Evolutionary theory was funded by the Freemasonic lodges of Europe and probably by families like the Rothschilds.
So, I'm not buying that one.
When I was... Dr May Chen was my teacher for many years, and whenever I asked her really deep, in-depth questions such as this, she used to twinkle.
She was a tiny little woman in her 70s, but she looked about 40, and she was very eccentric.
And she would stop dead, look me straight in the eyes and say, Francis, it's magic.
Right.
And that would be it.
That would be her sole answer.
There you go.
Go away with that.
And then the parting shot was invariably, will you please stop drinking coffee and smoking cigarettes?
Well, she wasn't right about everything, was she?
No.
Actually, I will tell you, Frances, just because I like to talk about things that sort of crop up in my brain randomly.
I did a podcast about 10 podcasts ago with this guy who was very evangelical about the evils of coffee and explained very plausibly that coffee is part of the brainwashing tools of the enemy.
That when you have a cup of coffee it reduces the blood supply to your brain by 50% or is it the oxygen?
I can't remember but one or the other.
It's generally deleterious to our health and you only have to look at the how often coffee scenes appear in movies to realize how we're being programmed to drink more coffee.
And I started, I realized that At about 11 o'clock every day I have a coffee and a fag and I used to have a double shot of espresso with milk and froth on top.
I used to call it my homemade flat white.
And I had it with a cigarette and I used to look forward to every day, but every day I was finding that I wasn't really enjoying the experience.
I was just kind of, I felt shaky and agitated and you know, it would take me about half an hour to get back to a reasonable state of being.
And I did worry for a time that maybe this was a sign that I should give up coffee.
And then I went to, recently went to Columbia.
And I started drinking coffee as the Colombians drink it.
They don't, they don't generally have, well, they certainly don't have double espressos.
They have, they drink it weak like the Americans do, you know, like watered down.
I found that the experience was much more pleasant.
I wasn't feeling wired.
I was just feeling lightly lifted.
And I realized that actually the real problem with coffee is that we've started drinking double shots.
And we're not meant to.
It's a bit like the coca leaf is beneficial, it keeps you going on a long journey, but when it's synthesized into cocaine, it becomes this rather horrible gag that just makes you want more.
Sorry to digress, but have you got any thoughts on that coffee thing?
Oh yeah, absolutely.
I agree with you.
What you're saying, effectively, is it's all in the dose.
Yes, I am.
That's exactly what I'm saying.
And this applies to absolutely everything.
I mean, even water will kill you if you overdo it.
I've heard.
Or land underneath a tsunami.
You know, just everything will kill you if it is toxic in large, large quantities.
So more is not necessarily better.
And I discovered that particularly in Chinese medicine because I thought that the quantities in the formulas that I had in my Materia Medica from China, the quantities that they were putting into the medicine were so high No, this is too strong.
So I was cutting down to a third of what they were using and still getting really good results with my clients.
So I thought this could maybe go down even lower.
And so I tried that, I went down even lower and still was getting good results.
Another thing that is really important Is something that my teacher taught me, was she said that all Western people are sick.
We're all sick.
And she said to me, you have never felt a strong positive pulse.
You have never felt one.
Because human beings are so far removed from being human beings, Now that we're all sick at some point or another.
So I wanted to prove this wrong, right?
I was like, no, no, that can't be true.
We're, you know, I was perfectly healthy.
I was a very healthy woman at the time.
And I thought, you know, my pulse isn't that bad.
And I felt it.
And it was.
I had weak My kidney is particularly weak on the yin side.
So I was like, oh, this is no good.
So I was feeling everybody's pulses.
This is when I was first studying, learning how to diagnose with pulses and tongues.
And I discovered that she was right, nobody was well.
And then one day, after I'd been practicing for, I don't know, about three years, four years, a Jamaican guy, a martial arts teacher, Came into my milieu and I asked to take his pulse and his tongue and he had a perfect pulse.
It was the only person I ever could say had perfect health.
It was very different from everyone else's.
So yes, it is very rare.
It's very rare.
What was his secret apart from doing martial arts?
Well, His diet, because he, his diet was particularly restricted.
He didn't, he smoked and he smoked cannabis quite a lot.
Yeah mon.
Yeah.
He was a proper Rastafarian type of guy.
He had dreadlocks down to his waist.
Yeah.
His food was what his mother had fed him and he stuck rigidly to the diet that his mother had fed him, which was From what I could make out, chicken and rice and beans.
Yes, that is the standard.
For the most part, yeah.
Ackie and saltfish.
Yeah.
And collard greens, I think they're called.
Are they?
He was also such a fitness freak.
He'd get out of bed first thing in the morning and go run seven miles along the beach and back.
Every day, no matter whether it was raining.
Which beach was this?
He lived in England?
Yes, he came to... I was living in Clacton-on-Sea in Essex at the time.
And he came and stayed in our town to help the martial... One of my friends set up a martial arts studio teaching Wing Chun.
And he invited this guy from Bristol, the guy was living in Bristol.
I invited him over to come and help him out to set up this school and Mike, his name was, and Mike came over to Clacton and helped to set up the school.
Obviously he wasn't planning to stay so he needed lodgings and I gave him the use of my spare room.
So I got to know him pretty well and watched, observed the way that he lived and what he liked.
And when he wasn't running along the beach, he was practicing Wing Chun in the back garden.
And then he was giving classes all afternoon and evening.
And then he was doing more exercises in the back garden in the pitch dark.
This guy barely ever sat down.
And when he was sitting down, which was only when he was smoking a bit of puff, he would be Talking and laughing very loud.
He was extremely loud.
I remember one day I was in the bath and I had my head underwater and I could still hear him.
He had such a powerful pair of lungs on him, you could hear him even through the water.
The guy was an exceptionally powerful person.
He had a powerful body, a powerful mind, And a very, very powerful spirit.
I really loved him.
I thought he was great.
You've made me feel very envious of this man's health.
Yes, everyone who ever met him was absolutely... he literally shone.
He was so shiny.
Oh my God, this guy was beautiful.
Yeah.
I don't think doing podcasts is a recipe for...
For super health.
But there we are.
Nor is researching the Black Nobility like I do.
That's not particularly healthy either.
Well, Frances, it's been fantastic chatting with you about all manner of stuff.
I hope you didn't say anything that... I haven't listened to your German Warfare podcast, so I don't know what you said.
Have I missed out anything key?
And to be honest with you, I haven't heard the German War Project podcast either.
And you know how when you're doing these, I dare say, you have this feeling.
You can't remember what you said afterwards, can you?
I cannot remember a thing.
And I don't go back either.
No.
So, you know, I think I covered slightly different things this time.
And our conversation has been much more wide ranging because we talked about How I'd gone through my whole life, really, with this sense of warfare is definitely not on the agenda.
And that was one of the things that drove me to research the Black nobility, because warfare is their favourite thing.
All they ever seem to want to do is cull the populations.
They love it.
And have done forever.
I find that really offensive.
So actually, James, I know I'm not just blowing smoke up you or anything, but this has been a really enjoyable conversation because we've covered so much more ground than just one subject.
I mean, you haven't even... I've loved it too.
Yeah, it's been really good.
I like a chat.
I like a chin-wag.
I like a bit of digression, as you'll have gathered.
It's been absolutely lovely.
Frances, I hope that I meet you one day and see what you actually look like, oh woman of mystery.
Tell us where we can find your stuff.
Well, unfortunately, I am person non gratis on Facebook and Twitter and all the other platforms.
You can only find my writing now on Substack.
Under my name, Frances Leader, I don't try to hide myself at all.
So if people go on Substack and search Frances Leader, they'll find you?
Absolutely, yeah.
Well, that's good.
Well, look, I'm going to delve into your archive now, having been enticed by your smoking.
And I loved hearing, I really did love hearing your story.
It's great having somebody completely left field like you on, and I've loved talking to you.
I'm so sorry that you can't practice Chinese traditional medicine anymore.
Oh, I do.
Yes, I do.
I found British herbal substitutes wherever I needed to.
Have you?
Yeah.
I don't make a living at it, but then I don't make a living at anything.
I'm hopeless at making money.
Well, if we ever meet Frances... It's all a spiritual thing for me.
If we ever meet, please will you check my pulse and just steer me towards some traditional Chinese herbs?
Yeah, I'd love to.
I'm sure it will happen.
You don't know, do you?
What's going to come around tomorrow?
You don't know.
You don't.
You don't.
Well, it only remains for me to thank my beloved, lovely, delightful viewers and listeners.
Thank you for watching my stuff.
It's nice that my message gets out there and you find my stuff interesting.
If you'd like to support me, Do subscribe to my Substack or my Locals, Subscribestar or Patreon.
I try and spread it out a bit because I'm fearful I'm going to get cancelled and one of them is going to cancel me and I'll have to move to the other ones.
Buy me a coffee if you want a one-off treat for me.
