All Episodes
Previous Next
March 10, 2023 - The Delingpod - James Delingpole
01:42:16
Mark Steyn
| Copy link to current segment

Time Text
I love Denny Poll.
Come and subscribe to the podcast baby.
I love Denny Poll.
And listen mother come subscribe with me.
I love Denny Poll.
Welcome to the Denny Poll with me James Denny Poll.
And I know I always say I'm excited about this week's special guest but I really, Before I tell you who it is, you know already, I'm going to have a quick word from our sponsor.
Slowly but surely the world is waking up to the positive impact a real food diet can have on your health.
I want to introduce you all to a brand I've discovered who have changed the game for me.
Hunter and Gather are an ancestrally inspired real food and supplements brand, simplifying optimal healthy living by making the most amazing range of products.
I can really recommend their mayonnaise, which I had for lunch today.
I tried it for the first time and it's brilliant, and it hasn't got any disgusting seed oils in it.
Right now, I'm also a huge fan of their organ supplements.
Out with the synthetic multivitamins, in with nature's richest source of nutrients.
Freeze-dried from Icelandic lambs, the liver capsules are now my morning go-to, and the effects of that daily dose are enriching.
It's time to thrive, folks!
We've teamed up with the folk at Hunter & Gather to offer you a 10% discount on their amazing range, which you can redeem by heading to HunterAndGatherFoods.com and using the code TDP10.
Enjoy!
Well, my surprise mystery special guest, Mark Stein!
At last!
Hey!
Yep, good to be back with you, James.
Mark, I had this brilliant plan.
I thought, if I can somehow lure Mark onto my show, maybe he'll have me back on his GB News show.
How's that looking?
Uh, there's a slight problem with that, in that, uh, GB News, uh, has replaced me with, uh, I forget the- what's it called?
It's the, uh, Lord President of the Privy Council show, uh, hosted by a guy called, uh, Jacob- Jacob- is that- Jacob Rees-Mogg?
Is that the guy's name?
Uh, so yeah, GB News is in a- I saw you with, uh, Michelle Dewberry, who is one of the best things about GB News.
But I loved, as you were talking, I loved the way I could actually hear jaws hitting the floor in the studio, because people are always going on about, you know, controlled opposition, all this kind of thing, but there were degrees of distance between people and you'd gone, you'd leapt ahead further than the rest of her panel were prepared to go.
Um, yeah.
I always feel... I did a show the other day with, um, with Corey Bernardi on Sky News Australia.
And Corey is pretty out there.
He's prepared to go quite far.
And Sky News Australia, weirdly... I mean, even though it is owned by Murdoch, isn't it?
Yeah, it is.
And yet... And run by Lachlan, his son.
And yet, I think of all the...
Mainstream TV outlets, it's the most... it's prepared to go the furthest.
And even that being so, I could almost see Corey's earphones buzzing as his producers must... Apologise for what he said!
He didn't mean that!
Death jab!
No, no!
That's true.
And as you say, Corey Bernardi, who is a very nice chap, used to be a senator from South Australia, I think, Adelaide.
And he's actually prepared to go further than most of his Sky Australia colleagues are.
And as you say, Sky Australia goes way further than Sky UK would go.
But even so, no matter how far all these people are prepared to go, you always go ahead.
So that's why people love you, James.
Yeah, well, I'm glad to hear that.
Well, Mark, if it's compliments time, I wanted to say to you, actually the first thing I wanted to say to you was...
All the journalists that I admired and considered either my equals or my betters in your case.
I mean, you know, like, I was a mainstream media journalist for what, 25 years?
And you must have felt the same.
There were these people who, when the balloon went up, When we were in the trenches, or in our foxholes, holding the line, these were going to be the guys who you'd want next to you, manning the .50 cal, or with their Lee-Enfields or whatever, holding the line, and they weren't going to run away.
And every single one of the bastards, we could name names if you like, every single one of those bastards, apart from you, has just run away.
I mean, they just, they haven't bothered to fight at all.
Have you noticed this?
Yeah, I have, and it's almost... I'm glad you brought up the Lee-Enfields, because I think there's a police department in India that still uses them, and I think the Arctic Rangers in Canada still use them, but the rest of the Empire has cast aside the Lee-Enfields.
In much the same way that the UK media in particular, to a greater degree I think than almost anywhere in the Western world, has cast away any of the real weapons they have to hold state power to account.
And I don't know... I watch these things and it's just like watching some little surface... It's like some little stupid Punch and Judy show I was trying to explain this in reaction to my difficulties with Ofcom.
I'm not a partisan, because my problem is that I disagree with all the political parties.
And when it comes to the Covid years, the Conservative Party, the Labour Party, and not just the two main parties, but all the parties that supposedly hate the UK so much they want to leave the country, They want to leave the country to set up a country exactly like the one they've just left, because the Scottish National Party and Sinn Féin are on the... When it comes to the Covid regime, Conservatives, Labour, Scottish Nationalists, Sinn Féin are all one big happy family.
Yeah, yeah.
It is one massive, massive uniparty.
And I don't know... When did you wake up To what was happening.
I mean, going back to the beginning of the alleged pandemic when we saw the videos of Chinese people dropping dead in the streets and then we had the story about Italy, northern Italy, where just the hospitals were full and people couldn't get beds and they were all dying in their droves and it was coming our way soon.
What was the point where you went, hang on a second, something isn't quite right about this?
Before it got to Northern Italy, the Chinese, because there was a thing, I don't know that it was that big in Britain, but it was certainly big in Canada about 15 years ago, SARS, which, because some guy from upcountry China went to Hong Kong, stood in the elevator in this fancy hotel in Hong Kong, infected the people in the elevator, they flew back to South Africa and Canada and wherever,
And a whole bunch of people died in Toronto hospitals because of this thing, because China lied.
And at that point, actually, the World Health Organization was also totally incompetent.
So the minute I hear the words, government of China and WHO, I take it as read that everybody is lying.
Then, when you think to yourself, well if it is a public health emergency, then China persuade, this is when it gets to Italy, they persuade the mayor of, I think it was Milan, to launch a sort of hug a Chinaman thing to show you're not racist.
I love that.
And at that point, you know, oh, wait a minute, this is going to be one of these things where there's like phony virtue signaling and all the rest of it.
So then it's in northern Italy.
Then you look at this social distancing, which I've never believed in because it comes from some guy, I think in the late 19th century, came up with this idea of six feet.
Apart, but there's no science behind that.
And then the cruelty, the first thing I objected to was the cruelty of the lockdowns.
So there were these pictures, I don't know where they were from, of some care home And there's the little 89-year-old grandma on the other side of the window, and her grandkids and family are outside, and all they can do is look through the window at this 89-year-old who's been condemned to die alone.
If it had worked, I'll tell you the other thing that just did it for me.
It's a feature we had on my show for a long while.
It was a very popular feature with people who have no idea about the British police because the British police were among... we extended it eventually elsewhere within the Commonwealth, but it was initially just the Brit wanker copper of the day.
You had to be English, Scottish, We had the Police Service of Northern Ireland made a gallant contribution.
All this, they'd been given these extraordinary powers and then they abused them.
So every day there was video of them arresting people who'd gone for a walk in the Pennines or wherever it was, you know, no threat to anyone.
So you began, you understood from day one that the state ...has taken these powers that it's actually not capable of wielding in any sane way.
And then you saw the scenes from Victoria in Australia.
You couldn't go, if you were in Melbourne, you couldn't go more than three miles from your home.
And so the regime itself seemed bonkers from the start.
As I said, that Britwanker copper of the day was a hugely popular feature and just basically meant... Because we were just getting bombarded with stupid... Oh, where did you get that cup of coffee from?
Oh, I got it from Costa.
Which Costa was it?
Oh, oh, sorry, it's the Costa that's three miles away.
Well, why don't you go to one that's only half a mile away?
Uh, well, I prefer the one that's three miles away.
That's, uh... I can't get, I can't get a... In what sane world does the state have the right to tell you which crappy branch of crappy Costa can you get your crappy cup of burnt coffee from?
Yeah.
No, I agree.
Although I was thinking there that the danger is that we are now sounding like all the other commentators who are all, to a man and woman now, they always knew that lockdowns were a really bad idea.
They were always against them.
They were just a bit quiet about it at the time.
But now they're absolutely committed to the idea that masks don't work, obviously.
I mean, how could anyone have worn a mask?
And all this craziness, it was like something, nothing to do with them, Squire.
Yeah, but it's not just the journalists.
I love the way like Rishi Sudhak, who mysteriously lost the leadership election but somehow wound up in number 10, gives some big exclusive interview to the spectator in which he said, oh yes, I never believed in any of this lockdown stuff for a moment.
And I... Did you speak up in Cabinet about it?
Well, no, I was just the peripheral Chancellor of the Exchequer figure, so nobody asked my opinion about anything.
I sit three seats down from, you know, the Deputy Assistant Under Lord Privy Seal, so nobody cares what I think.
I mean, it's pathetic, all that.
Yeah.
I wouldn't have anyone from the last three years in any government or public office ever again because they were on board with all this.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, I'm with you on that.
But I mean, I'd go further.
I think that the whole allegedly democratic system is so completely broken that We're not going to get over this until we have something completely different.
I do not see how a system that can allow what happened in the last three years to happen can protect our freedoms.
No, I would agree.
One of the sort of crude lessons of history, I always thought the Westminster system was one of the greatest systems of government ever devised, and I note that unlike most other countries in Western Europe that fell either for Nazism or Communism or Fascism in the 20th century, Canada and Australia and the UK and all the rest Didn't.
So I thought it was quite a resilient system.
And what's been striking to me is actually countries that you would normally have thought of as the sanest countries on earth, such as Australia, turned out in fact to be the nuttiest about this stuff.
And I think that is, and the dishonesty that has continued Uh, that you can't, you still can't talk honestly about what has happened.
And the fact that half the country, whether you're talking about Britain or Canada or wherever, that half the country is actually still on, that you can go and see people still wearing the same stupid mask hanging off the nose, you know, tatty mask hanging off the nose, or all kinds of things flying in this way, flying out that way.
Um, Tells me that there are tens of millions of sane people who actually enjoy just being told what to do about every aspect of their lives, and in some strange way they don't want to give that up.
Although...
In their defence, I suppose you could say that they've been subjected to two years at least of military-grade PSYOP by using a battery of techniques, you know, government propaganda ads, look into his eyes and tell him that he shouldn't take the death jab, I don't know.
And our trade, I mean, I don't know about you, Mark.
I went into journalism partly because I was completely unsuited to getting a proper job, but partly because I was kind of... I like chucking stones at glass windows and seeing what would happen.
Yeah.
And sort of being curious about the truth.
So what happened to the other guys?
Well, I think that's completely changed in journalism.
I was never, you know, like a hard... I was like a musical comedy boy.
When The Independent launched, you know, for some reason they put the arts department and the sports department on the same floor, and the sports department was creeped out at having all the artsy-fartsy pansy boys nancying through the sports department to get to the arts department.
And so I would have been quite happy, in a sane world, I would have been quite happy just spending my life immersed in songs and music.
At a certain point, I had this conversation, I ran into an old actress friend just before I had my heart attacks a couple of months ago, and she's someone who was a Labour lefty all her life.
And at a certain point, something happens, you know, curtain wobbles and you see the gap between the two and you see what's behind the curtain and you can't unsee it.
And so my friend, this lifelong Labour lefty, has seen another world just behind the curtain that is more real to her and she can't go back just to being a Labour lovey all over again.
And it's the same with me.
I can't take interest in...
I'm...
I regard myself as a conservative and as right-wing as anybody, but I can't take any... I can't... You expect me to be interested in whether, you know, Rishi Sunak gets replaced by Boris Johnson again?
I have no... It's the same in Canada.
It's even worse.
Because one of the characteristics of the Covid years has been that politics has failed, as I was saying, all the parties agree with each other on the Covid or felt they felt obliged to agree.
And so legislatures are, why should I care about votes in the House of Commons?
Or even whether it's the House of Commons in Ottawa or the House of Commons in London.
Because none of them are actually talking about anything that matters.
And at one point, if it's one thing to be the tip of the iceberg, but actually if you've got nothing really to do with the iceberg and you're just some little bit of flotsam and jetsam that's bobbing off 20 miles away from the real iceberg, there's no point wasting your time with it.
I look at these conversations You know, on GB News or the Canadian or American equivalents, and they're not talking about anything that is going to matter to me and my children in the world to come.
Yeah, I had this thing on my London Calling podcast with Tobes, and we'll maybe talk about Tobes a bit later on, you probably want to, but Tobes of course is stuck in the old world.
He believes in the old paradigm.
And when he sort of tries to advance the agenda in the show, you know, he'll bring up a story about, I don't know, the latest deal that Rishi Sunak has cooked up to ensure that Northern Ireland something something protocol Brexit.
This has got nothing to do with anything that matters.
We've got global tyranny being imposed in real time, and you're talking about this meaningless fudge.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
No.
And it's... And the thing about it is it's insulting.
It's not... As I said, I...
You know, when the independence started, I was a drama critic, so I had to go to the theatre four nights a week.
So I know the difference between a good drama and total crap.
And this is the thing, it's an insult to the intelligent.
It's like a lousy soap opera of ugly characters with nothing to say.
I don't understand.
In a way, I've never had... The very first time I was on GB News and I was asked whether I followed British politics and I said, well I've got no interest in who next week's Lord Privy Seal is, if that's what you mean.
This whole...
You know, what's interesting, Covid was interesting in that respect, because whether you had a nominally left-wing government or a nominally right-wing government, you know, Justin and Jacinda in Canada and New Zealand, or nominally right-wing governments like Scott Morrison and Boris Johnson in Australia and the UK, They all did the same bloody thing!
You know, it's almost as if they all get the same facts off the fax machine at six in the morning, and whether or not they're right-wing or left-wing doesn't actually matter.
They all did the same thing.
No, that can't be right.
You're sounding like one of those tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists.
There's no way.
It's just cock-up.
Every country has this set of useless politicians which all have the same ideas simultaneously.
That's how it works.
Yeah, yeah, no, no, it's fantastic.
And so you have a choice between... When it comes to the election, you've got like six cock-up parties on the ballot.
And you have to sort of divine which one is... Are they all going to cock things up in the same way?
Or if the fourth cock-up party...
You know, in Ulster, like where they've got 19 parties on the ballot, so you have to think, is the official Unionist cock-up party going to cock things up in a different way from the Democratic Unionist cock-up party?
You know, it's not really worth wrapping your head around that.
I think it's a safe bet that yes, they were.
I mean, look at... I mean, Tice's... What's Richard Tice's party called?
Well, I can't remember, because there's, like, Reform, Reclaim... It's all... Like, they've all got those... They've got those fantastic... I love... My favourite British political party in recent years was whatever that thing was, the Party for Change.
Do you remember that?
That was Anna Soubry and, like... Oh yes, that one!
Five dissidents.
They were all these wacky characters.
You know, the Tory guy had switched to Labour, and the Labour guy had switched to Tory, and the Scottish nationalist had switched to Plaid Cymru, or whatever.
And they'd all come together to form the Party for Change.
It's a fantastically... fantastic name.
Because the essence of the party was that they didn't want to change anything.
They didn't want to... they were...
They wanted Britain stuck in the European Union forever.
They didn't want to change anything about immigration policy.
They were actually the party for no change, but they called themselves the party for change, so they got a great press.
I mean, that was the perfect British political party.
Maybe that's the secret of naming your party.
It's like the reform is about keeping things the same as well.
Yeah, yeah.
Do you not think, I mean actually I think there are probably competitors in this field, but I would say that probably the biggest story in the world right now, and maybe of our lifetimes, is the poisoning of large sections of the populace on government orders, by government mandate, but using bribery,
Bullying, restriction of privileges, which I'm surprised to learn it was within their power to grant us all this stuff.
People have been forced to take these alleged vaccines which aren't vaccines.
They've suffered.
Life-changing injuries, death, children have died as a result of this jab they didn't need.
I would say, I mean, you know, I'm not the greatest investigative reporter, but I would say that's a pretty big story.
And yet, you are about the only journalist on TV I've seen even talking about this issue, even though the data is now there.
How do you explain that?
Well, I can explain it with certain of the guests we've had.
Every so often we'd hear from somebody who said, yeah, oh, I was supposed to go on this morning with Philip Schofield to talk about my vaccine injuries.
And then the producer wrote back and said, Philip doesn't really want to go there because he'll get in trouble with Ofcom or whatever.
So, I would always say, let's get this lady on our show instead.
I mean, and I also know it too, I think you've made this point, that I knew people in the first months who officially died of Quote of COVID, unquote.
That's to say, particularly musician friends of mine.
There's a guitarist I adored, and he was still playing, and he was terrific.
He was 90-something, and he died of... he died, quote, of COVID.
Now, as the years go by, We've all learned that the average age of COVID death is higher than life expectancy in most countries.
So these are people who are in extra time anyway.
So I've known a few of those.
But the friend of a friend, I know the number of people who tell me, oh, yeah, my cousin took the jab and was never the same.
A little girl dropped dead at sports practice, not far from where I'm sitting right now.
The fascinating thing is the government was then the media do their best to normalize these things as if it's perfectly normal for somebody at rugby practice or at hockey practice at high school just suddenly to drop dead.
They're normalizing a lot of this stuff.
They use the highest people in the state including Her late majesty the Queen, who said you were selfish if you didn't get the... Oh, there's a thing, you've probably seen this on American TV, because I think the last time I saw it was one of those things down in Florida, at the Breakers Hotel.
And if you went up to your room and watched 20 minutes of American TV, you'd get bombarded with pharmaceutical ads.
And all the pharmaceutical ads are the same.
See, they're 30-second ads.
You get 20 seconds saying it's a great new pill.
If you've got a bit of a headache, take this pill.
It'll do wonders for your headache.
And then the last part of the ad is, says, warning.
May cause bloating, involuntary flatulence, triple hernia, and coronary arrest.
If symptoms persist, call the doctor.
Now the fascinating thing, that's all, we all get used to that, watching 10 minutes of American TV, you can't avoid seeing that.
All the side effects, all the side effects.
The fascinating thing about Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, Johnson & Johnson, is there were no ads for the individual products.
There were just these things from Joe Biden or Justin Trudeau or Emmanuel Macron saying, get your booster shot now.
General, because in America, if you'd done the Pfizer ad, the AstraZeneca ad, the Moderna ad, you would have to say, warning, may cause myocarditis, may cause Guillain-Barré.
Uh, syndrome may cause the Ramsey Hunt, whatever it is, facial paralysis that dear old Justin Bieber's got, may cause sudden death syndrome.
Uh, if symptoms of sudden death syndrome persist, please consult your doctor.
Uh, and they didn't have to do that because instead the government took over the marketing And it was the politicians who said, make sure you take the booster.
And so that was a way to get around.
So they've never had to do honest advertising in the way you do for any basic headache pill.
Yeah, and I'm not sure that the governments are going to escape liability, aren't they?
These people, despite having pushed this toxic product, there's probably some clause where they don't do jail time.
Yeah, no, and I think actually when you You know, I couldn't care less about Matt Hancock and all that kind of stuff, really.
Not in the least bit interested.
But I do think there are people who should go to... And again, you used the phrase, I think, at the Conservative Woman, whenever it was, a few days ago, about the Nixonian concept of the modified limited hangout.
You know, so even Fauci's sort of belated, Oh, yeah, yeah, may have come from a lab in China.
That's more to do with actually not getting to the nub of it, which is that the crazy United States government is funding gain of function research.
In a part of the world where there are no security protocols anyone would want even if you were just going to see a dentist.
So the whole dishonest conversation, the death of media and in fact in most countries now it's dependence on government funding.
You know in Canada Uh, the, uh, the Trudeau, um, Mr. Trudeau's ministry introduced direct funding for newspapers.
So, in other words, newspapers are being subsidized by the government.
In, in the UK, it's slightly more, uh, artful in that they nominally buy advertising in the Daily Telegraph or something, but suddenly you notice that His Majesty's government is the biggest advertiser In the newspapers.
This is all a way of just keeping everybody super tame.
And as I said, you know, making them think that the real action is, you know, watching some Tory guy get into a spat with a Labour guy.
And what do you think Bill Gates got when he gave three and a half million dollars to the Telegraph and twelve million dollars to the Guardian?
I don't know how much he gave to the Mail or anybody else.
Maybe he didn't.
Maybe the Mail could just be relied on to pump out this propaganda anyway.
But, I mean, that's quite a lot of money, isn't it?
Yes.
I don't think if you were You know, I don't think if you were a person of integrity... You did your word from your sponsor at the top of the show, and that's fine.
We all know what he got for that, and that's good, and I'll try his mayonnaise, because the poor quality of mayonnaise where I happen to be sitting is absolutely terrible, so I'd like an alternative on that.
That's fine, I've got no problem With a guy, a shoe salesman, saying I'm gonna give you so much money and I want a 30 second shoe commercial.
But why are newspapers, what is Bill Gates getting?
Because they used to make, we used to hear all this stuff that, do you remember, I mean this is going back, you know, half a lifetime or whatever, when Rupert Murdoch Bought the Times of London from Lord Thompson.
The whole idea was that Rupert Murdoch couldn't be trusted with the Times because he wouldn't observe the distinction between editorial and advertising.
They would bleed into another.
But now, somehow, Yeah, we've accepted a world in which Bill Gates can give $12 million.
Oh, he's given $12 million to the guy.
Is he getting a full-page ad every day for the next 30 years?
No, no, no, he's not getting any ad.
No, no, he's just decided to give $12 million.
What's he buying with the $12 million?
Because I wouldn't take 12 million.
I mean, I could use 12 million right now because I'm about to sue Ofcom, but I wouldn't take 12 million from Bill Gates because he's buying something with that.
Now, he's not buying a page of advertising and he's not buying... So what is it?
Is he buying the editor?
Is he buying the paper?
What is it?
I mean, this is, again, this is wholly new, particularly in Fleet Street.
So we've got The mainstream, the legacy of media I think is probably better called bought and paid for by the government and Bill Gates.
So partly it's bribery that has caused newspapers to pump out propaganda rather than do their job and partly we can probably agree it's cowardice on the parts of the journalists who just want to sort of Keep their income rather than stand up for principles.
But even so, I mean, we're talking about a situation where The population, people's mothers and fathers and sons and daughters, have been poisoned by the government, by big pharma companies, using this thing which is not as sold, not a vaccine, hasn't passed its testing procedures yet.
Isn't that the biggest scandal of our time and why aren't people more up in arms about it?
Well, what's interesting, I think, is that the medical profession was also co-opted by this.
So the basic medical ethic, you can't give informed consent to a medical procedure if your doctor doesn't know anything about it.
And one recurring theme of everybody who came up, whether they were people who were widowed Uh, by the vaccine or people who were themselves crippled by it is that when they eventually got either their loved one or themselves before a doctor, the doctor knew nothing about these side effects and the doctor received no guidance from the NHS.
And if they ever did meet a doctor who knew anything about it, the doctor only knew about it because he'd gone Googling, in a bored 40 minutes one night, he'd gone googling and wound up at the website of some guy called James Dellingpole or whatever.
That, they knew, they knew, the doctors, unless they, you know, actually went looking, they got, within the hospital itself, this is what is disgraceful, these side effects were not even officially acknowledged in the hospital.
Now, we had a lady on the show, Who had Guillain-Barré syndrome from the vaccine.
And she went to a little hospital in the Lake District.
You know, a little county hospital, whatever it is.
And she'd never heard of Guillain-Barré syndrome.
And the nurse said, well, neither had I, but there's nine other people in the hospital with it.
You know, so in other words, whatever batch of vaccine had been Handed out in this particular neighborhood had resulted in a disease.
Nobody knew anything about Suddenly becoming you know filling beds all over this little little hospital it's the same thing with the and again, this is What is interesting to me is, it's one thing to say, oh well, you know, the Guardian are taking all this money from Bill Gates, but what's really depressing is the little local newspapers.
And you can see this, it's, you know, I look at it in my particular neck of the woods, but in, you can see it in American and Canadian little weekly newspapers that just reporting the death of a 12-year-old girl as if it's a normal occurrence.
And, uh, at some, where, this is the old classic America, who are you gonna believe, me or your lying eyes?
Well, people, actually large numbers of people still prefer the narrative to the, to the lying eyes.
The, uh, the young lady, this was a story we covered on the show, the young lady in Dublin, uh, I think she was 27 or something, she's got two flatmates, The flatmates notice that she's a bit late down for breakfast.
They text her, text her, text her.
Not getting any response until eventually, like 11.45 in the morning, they open the door and she's dead.
And it's all done in this anesthetized, antiseptic, sterilized prose.
In which, uh, and these are what, you know, real newspaper guys, like when David English ran the Daily Mail, these are like, this is the way into a story.
You've got this totally photogenic young lady, David English, classic material, 27, 28, she's dead.
Then you have the statistics showing the excess mortality rates among young and middle... I had my heart attack!
I've had my heart attacks.
The cardiologist says to me, he says, you know, we're getting all this evidence.
He said there's a whole trend of heart attacks, and he showed me all these graphs saying the Pfizer is an accelerant.
So things that might have showed up when you were 87 or 94 instead show up 20 and 25 years earlier, which is why we have the excess deaths of all among the young and middle-aged.
They're kind of 28 to 55 where the big bulge of excess deaths is.
That's as basic as it can get.
It's dead people.
We have stories like the hospital in Perth.
The guy died on the Tuesday and they couldn't get him to the mortuary that day because there were so many bodies in the mortuary.
So they couldn't get him to the mortuary till the following day.
So they faked the date of his death on the death certificate And one of the doctors or nurses objected to it, and so it became public.
But basically, the mortuary's full, so we're now having to fake the date and time of death, so that this poor guy... We have to lie about when this poor guy died, because we couldn't get him into the mortuary when he died.
Why?
How much more do you need?
If this was a genuine media, we wouldn't need to be talking like this because it would be on the front page of every newspaper and it would be leading all the news bulletins.
Yeah, in the same way.
You're absolutely right that a young person dies tragically and mysteriously would have been classic tabloid fare and it would have been splashed all over back in the day and they'd have speculated as to the causes and they'd have speculated honestly as well.
In the same way, footballers... I mean, football is... I don't follow it, but it's quite a big thing, I understand, in this country, quite popular.
And if famous footballers suddenly are unable to carry on playing for famous team on their incredibly inflated salary, because they've suddenly got mysterious heart problems, or they've dropped dead, You'd think that would be quite a big deal and subject to lots of analysis from the sports writers who love their colourful, flowery prose.
Yeah.
But they don't.
No, it's extraordinary because if you remember, whatever it is now, 40 years ago, AIDS broke through into mainstream media coverage because people like Liberace and Rock Hudson Uh, came down with it.
So, showbiz was the way into making a, a, a, a particular medical topic interesting.
Now we have Justin Bieber, who just, you know, Justin Bieber, who was, is Canada's teen heartthrob.
Used to be me, but now it's Justin Bieber.
And, uh, his face is like, it's all twitching, twitching, twitching.
Justin Bieber has cancelled his world tour So, if Liberace is a way into AIDS for the average person, why isn't Justin Bieber a way into all these excess Covid vaccine side effects for most people?
You know why, Mark?
Because it has nothing whatsoever to do with the safe and effective vaccine, and I don't know why you're even suggesting it in my time.
No.
Can I say, what I should have said at the beginning of the show is actually, how are you?
How is your health?
Well, I had absolutely terrific medical treatment in France, and I thank Those doctors and nurses tremendously for saving my life.
I was within 15 minutes of death according to how occluded your ventricle is and which you know is a bit of a shocker to me and And I had a very lovely recuperation in France.
And then the GB News guy, whose name escapes me, I think it's Angelus Flopadopoulos or something, but he then took it... I love the media.
This is why... By the way, because he thought, okay, Stein's had two heart attacks, he's in a very weak condition.
This is the perfect opportunity to screw him over.
And that's what I, how I always used to think of the media, that they were like cynical opportunists like that.
But that thing like, oh the guy's had two heart attacks, so this is, he's on his deathbed, let's really screw him over now.
That only works if at the same time you're not a complete poodle, if you're not a court eunuch to state power in all the other things you do.
So it's not enough to butch up and screw Stein over if you're a court eunuch to state power the other 23 hours of the day.
And so that's my actual problem.
Had a, you know, dark admiration for the fact that... Because he sent me... He sent me flowers when I was in the hospital in the south of France.
Sent me a fabulous bouquet of flowers, so lavish that the guy from the lobby flower shop presumed that he was my gay lover.
So they did this little sort of song and dance presentation of flowers from my gay lover, this guy at GB News, Angelus Flopadopoulos, and then Flopadopoulos totally screws me over and I'm thinking, ah yeah, that's the London media I always loved.
But it doesn't work!
If your product is vapid and bland, and as I said, you're just a court unit to state power, which is what the TV and radio stations in the UK are, and alas, for the most part, the newspapers too.
When I heard that you had the heart attack, and you don't have to answer this question if you don't want to, but I thought, ooh, has he had the clock shop?
Was it one of those?
Yeah, I'll tell you, I'll tell you, because I think I've said it.
People say, oh, he travels everywhere.
That's why he must have had the vaccine.
And no, that's not because one of the first things that happened.
I came to understand very quickly that the only people who can't be denied entry to a country are citizens of that country.
I happen to be an Irish-Belgian-Canadian, so that's three passports.
I never believed in this.
All the trouble in the world is caused by people with multiple passports.
When, whatever it was, the last Lebanese war broke out, it turned out that Uh, 40% of the population of Lebanon also have an Australian passport, and the other 60% also have a Canadian passport.
All the trouble in the world is caused by all these people with multiple passports.
Then the COVID happened.
And my kids happened to be at college in Montreal, and I was south of the border in the US, and the open US-Canadian border basically became Checkpoint Charlie with East Berlin on both sides.
I mean, absolutely insane.
So, I'm an Irish-Belgian-Canadian, that's three right there, you know, I've, uh, I, you look through your family tree and, uh, and, uh, so now I'm one of these guys who travels with six passports sewn into the lining of his coat.
That's how I got around.
So that's not why...
I had, when the vaccine came up, I got two shots at the local fire station because someone in my immediate circle had the so-called underlying condition.
So I'm not like, I'm not My doctor was stunned because I never agree to anything.
She's been trying to get me to have a colonoscopy for a decade and hasn't succeeded.
I say, you know, not really.
I say no.
I won't go on.
Don't like going on pills, all the rest of it.
And so I had the two.
And at that point then I looked at the health, I think it was the UK actually, the UK Health Security Agency statistics and you see they don't actually do Even whether or not they are responsible for my heart attack, they don't do what they... They don't perfect infection, they don't prevent you infecting anybody else.
So what's the point of them?
The official position of the United States government is you need to get one every two months.
There's no... So I wasn't...
You know, as I said, you're usually far ahead, and I know your theory that whatever it is, a quarter of the world's population is going to be dead in a couple of years or something.
I look at these... I'm into demography.
I wrote a best-selling book about demography 15 years ago.
It's very difficult to do that, and it's incredible to do.
It's like not a subject...
It's a difficult subject to make interesting.
So I know about fertility rates.
I know about birth rates in Western European countries.
And I look at the fall-off in, say, a very stable population, such as Norway, where they have whatever it is, 16,000 or whatever it was, 2018, 16,000 babies.
2019, 16,000 babies.
2020, 16,000 babies.
2021, 16,000 babies.
2022, 12,000 babies.
What the hell happened?
Their fertility rate fell off a cliff.
Why?
2020, 16,000 babies. 2021, 16,000 babies.
2022, 12,000 babies.
What the hell happened?
Their fertility rate fell off a cliff.
Why?
You know, it's...
Whether or not you're right about whatever it is, a quarter of the world's population being dead in two years, the actual fertility rates, that drop-off in the Norwegian fertility rate and similar ones in Germany, Switzerland, basically that drop-off in the Norwegian fertility rate and similar ones in Germany, Switzerland, basically everywhere you look, you know, that alone is a bad indicator for where all
The reason I was chuckling when you mentioned your book, I'm not sure whether it was that book, but I have to say, I blanked this out of my memory, but one of your books, whichever one I reviewed for the Mail on Sunday, I read it when I was on holiday in Salcombe, and I was going through a bad patch anyway with a lot of worries and stuff,
And your book sent me into such a spiral of despair that I ended up pretty much having a nervous breakdown.
I mean, and actually it was the beginning of the worst decade of my life.
Not that I'm holding you responsible in any way, but it's just come back to me.
So thanks for that book.
Oh, I don't want to bring on a second nervous breakdown.
No, you won't.
I'm over that now.
I've been through the black-pilled stage and I'm now white-pilled and that's fine, but I do find it really quite sad and moving and horrible to hear that that was, that you are yourself a victim of this Terrible global conspiracy, I would call it, to make us take these deadly, potentially deadly, substances and inject them in ourselves.
I mean, do you feel bitter about this, or angry, or determined to take revenge, or what?
Well, I'm mindful of things that a young person, you know, 21 or 22, said to me, who said, Yeah, I wouldn't.
Who was himself, whatever it was, double or triple jabbed and said, yeah, I wouldn't do it now.
But I don't like to think about it because knowing what's inside me, you know what I find weird is that people say, well, You know, I took the vaccines, nothing's happening.
In other words, they think if you make it through the first fortnight after you've had the jab, you're in the clear.
And as I said, what this cardiologist was showing me is this idea that they can just, they're just sort of lurking around inside you and they decide to make their move, whether they make their move, you know, 10 days later, a month and a half later, or two years 10 days later, a month and a half later, or two years later, that you've got a permanently, your insides are
And I think there's, I mean, as I look back on it now, I don't know, I mean, for example, no one has ever been able to come up with coronaviruses.
There's like thousands of them that are all out there.
And no one's ever been able to come up with a vaccine for a coronavirus.
They come, they go, another one comes, another one goes.
And so the idea that you could suddenly...
Whatever it was, four or five different pharmaceutical companies could all manage to pull off something that they had never done in the entirety of human history is one of the disturbing aspects of this.
And I would say, again, that's a failure of media because you would have thought that medical correspondents would be saying, well, wait a minute, Wait a minute, no one's ever done this.
Are we quite sure we've got all our ducks in a row here?
And likewise with the way just basic virological public policy was thrown out, so that we did things we wouldn't have done with the Spanish flu a century ago, or with the Great Plague of London three and a half centuries ago.
So the, again, the entirety of mankind's experience of this stuff is, because I did a reading at my website of Daniel Defoe's Journal of the Plague Year, which we all laugh at now, we see the guys going around with the stupid You know, the stupid beak mask and all that.
And we think, ha ha ha, what stupid little primitive people they were in the 17th century.
Nothing that is in that book is as nutty as what we have done in the last three years.
Yes, Philip Schofield embracing Holly Willoughby in their plastic, stupid suits.
Yeah.
Yeah, no, I'm totally with you.
I was thinking, when you first started writing about geopolitics, etc., I was pretty much on the same page with you about everything.
I think probably I believed in Benign interventionalism to make the world a better, more Western place, you know, British civilisation.
I believed that I was a conservative and I believed in conservatism and so on.
I believed in the British Empire.
Now all that's gone out of the window as I've realised that the version of history we're sold is just the narrative.
It's not real.
And in the same way, I was wondering how much of a sort of awakening you've had.
How far down the rabbit hole are you?
What do you think is going on right now?
Well, I mean, just to, you know, talk about where I came in on that.
I'm not in favour of American wars anymore.
Obviously, I mean, it was pretty... But you were, like me, weren't you?
I mean, originally, you thought... Well, after... I mean, for some, people talk a lot of rubbish about Afghanistan.
So, that picture behind me is Lady Butler's picture of the last...
British survivor of the first Afghan war, managing to get away from the native hordes.
But after that, the British, who didn't want Afghanistan formally in the empire, nevertheless applied sufficient pressure to neutralize because they didn't want to direct British land border with the Russian empire.
They didn't figure that was in either party's interest.
So they were happy to have Afghanistan as a buffer state and they applied sufficient pressure to maintain it as a buffer state and you know there's lots of things you can say about Afghanistan but if you happen to have been there between
Say, up until King Zaheer was overthrown in the 70s, if you'd been there for the 50 years before, that would have been actually one of the safest places to be on Earth, while everybody else is fighting the First and Second World Wars.
So, the whole simplification of Afghan history annoyed me.
And I assume that the Americans, when they went in there, Uh, had, had some serious goal.
I mean, I talked to, I don't know who I meant to talk to, but I talked to, uh, George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, and they all said things to me that sounded as if they were up to speed on it.
And, uh, they took my suggestions in hand and always act upon them.
Uh, I certainly wouldn't want you to think I was responsible for the last 20 years.
But what happened... The Pentagon is a holy... America is... And this is where left-right divisions don't make any sense, because the Peacenik left, the Bernie Sanders left go, war is never the answer.
The right goes, oh we support our troops, we've got the bumper sticker, thank you for your service.
Nobody addresses, nobody on the American right And I fell out with a lot of conservative friends on this.
Addresses the fact that the American way of war doesn't work and hasn't worked since 1945, which is barely within living memory now.
But you know, Korea, Vietnam, the helicopters in the desert.
Uh, all the way to these endless unwon wars.
Um, so I don't want America going to war anymore because they're crap at it.
But it works for the guys who are running it because you were the assistant undersecretary of defense in the Pentagon And then you become a lobbyist and you persuade the government to buy into some huge armaments program for the next 20 years.
So if you're in Afghanistan for 20 years, you're firing a lot of bullets.
And that's great for the bullet manufacturers.
But I wrote, I think the first time I wrote it was in 2008, I said, 24 hours after the last Western soldier departs Afghanistan, it will be as if we were never there.
And I got that wrong, because it wasn't 24 hours, it was about 24 minutes.
And you look at the stupid things we were doing there in the last month.
They ran the rainbow flag up outside the U.S.
Embassy, one of the most expensive embassies on Earth.
It's now in the hands of the Taliban.
And nobody knows where the rainbow flag, the LGBT QWERTY flag has gone.
Nobody knows where it is.
Because for some reason we thought that the way to endear ourselves to the Afghan people was to fly the rainbow flag over the... I mean...
That's why, you know, I can't get on board with Ukraine.
I've no idea.
I love Ukraine.
I love Ukrainian women.
I was in Ukraine at the start of the war and I'd forgotten how fabulous the women look and I love the Ukrainian women.
But if you just look at the amount of money that has been dumped on that country in the last year, nobody has any idea where it's gone.
This time it's like the military-industrial complex says, OK, the 20-year war is over.
We need another 20-year war.
Tell you what, just to simplify matters, let's not even have the US Army directly involved.
Let's just make it money and weapons, because that's where our main interest is.
Right.
So you're well down the...
The military-industrial complex rabbit hole, which is, I mean, quite a big one.
But where are you on the even bigger picture?
Do you think there is a sort of New World Order planned?
Is there a sort of sinister cabal?
How do you explain what's happened in the last three years, for example?
Well, I think there's two things.
I'm not entirely persuaded the Western world matters much anymore, and I'm always struck by how you're, if you're, well, Ukraine is a very good example of that, when they're, oh, the whole world condemns Russia!
And then you suddenly know, well, the South Africans and the Indians and all kinds of people say, well, wait a minute, I'm not sure we're on board with that.
And so I think the Western world doesn't matter much anymore, and a lot of people are making their accommodations with the future.
Then you have this slightly creepy cloud.
I mean, I'm prepared to believe... I generally have come... One thing that I do still believe is that the easiest thing is just to take
Everybody at their word so if there's some nutter jumping up and down in the street in some Town on the West Bank saying death to the great Satan I I take him at his word that actually he means that similarly when Klaus Schwab starts doing all this stuff about the VR's are masters of the future and
I'm inclined... I'm inclined... I don't even believe... I don't believe he can keep up that accent all day long.
I wouldn't be surprised if he turned out to be a Welshman or something.
But I... I'm inclined to take him at his word.
And what's weird to me...
Is the way all the leaders today seem largely interchangeable.
You know, so Jacinda Ardern could just as easily be Prime Minister of Canada and Justin Trudeau could just as easily be President of France and Emmanuel Macron.
You know, they're all, they're a class apart.
And they're happy to have a kind of managed politics where every so often in Canada or Australia the parties of government change, but nothing that matters.
Changes.
And that's because they're all agreed when they meet in Klaus Schwab's hollowed out Alp for the Spectre board meeting every year, they're all generally agreed on the direction.
And it's a bit like the European unionization of the world.
Do you remember whatever it was when, whichever, was it France or the Netherlands held the referendum on the European Constitution?
And somebody like Jean-Claude Juncker or whoever it was said, if it's a no, we say we go on.
And if it's a yes, we say forward.
That's actually our politics in a nutshell.
Yeah, yeah.
Both those leaders you named were part of the World Economic Forum Young Leaders program.
I mean, quite a lot of them are.
And you say they're interchangeable.
They could also change sex without noticing the difference.
There's a sort of weird That's a rabbit hole you've got to get on sometimes.
Elite gender inversion.
Do you know about this?
No, no, what is that?
Well, it's too complicated to explain, but... No, I wouldn't rule that out at all.
I mean, the thing about it is, you know, Canada's a small country, and the joke is... I mean, it's a huge country, but its elite is small, and everybody knows everybody.
So, there's a certain element of me That accepts that Justin Trudeau is a real human being.
I had dinner with his mum in Montreal a while back, just after the sesquicentennial at which the then Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall had been caught laughing at the Inuit throat singing that they'd been made to sit through an hour of.
So we're talking, I'm talking to Margaret Trudeau and we're all like yucking it up and having a grand old laugh at what's just gone on.
And so in a certain sense, I know that there's a person called Margaret Trudeau and she had a son called Justin Trudeau who is a real person at some level.
But then you look at this Nonsense of him, like, jetting in, was it the Commonwealth Conference?
And he and Boris are sitting there doing this mock self-deprecating thing about which one of them has the smaller private plane.
And you realise that however real they once were, once they get into this crappy little circuit, they're nothing.
They've left whatever was real far behind.
Yeah.
Well, there is a theory, which obviously I subscribe to, which is that these people are selected from a really quite early age.
I mean, Trudeau, we know he's Fidel's son, don't we?
They're remarkably narrow, small circles in which these people operate.
They all know one another.
They're all actually interrelated.
And, I mean, when you really go out in the rabbit hole, you start realising that these are The same kind of people, if not directly related to, the people who've been running the world since forever.
Have you seen the Egyptian pharaoh that looks like Barack Obama?
I mean, the spitting... The very spit!
I'm not, I'm not, you know, as far as you, because very few people are, but I remember saying, like, you know, 15 years ago I ran into trouble in Canada and I wrote in, and David Icke Supported me, you know.
Margaret Atwood, who is, you know, I regard as rather more talented than David Icke.
Margaret Atwood was a bit late to get on the bandwagon, and by the time she climbed on the Stein bandwagon, David Icke was already on there.
But I couldn't resist making jokes about the space lizards, and, you know, the Princess of Wales had told him A month before she died, that her ex-husband was one of the Space Lizards.
And so I was in just some Space Lizard jokes, and David Icke sent me a rather plaintive email saying, I supported you, Stein, and why did you just, like, laugh at the Space Lizards?
And so I, you know, I did a follow-up, I just did a paragraph following up somewhere where I said, yeah, I, on balance, I shouldn't have done the Space Lizard jokes.
Because actually, at this stage, That theory makes as much sense as anything else.
And I was pretty... I was, you know... Something has got... You said you're opposed to the British Empire.
If I could have picked any time to live my life, it would probably have been between the revolutions of 1848 and the outbreak of the Great War in August 1914.
Totally.
I regard that as the zenith of our civilization, and we've been running on the fumes of it ever since.
And there were two theories.
One is the David Icke kind of thing, that there's some master plan behind all this.
And the other is we are just entirely exhausted.
And you see that on it, you know, if you go to, like, the early... Puccini died, whatever it was, 1924, I think it was, and you can say that opera died with popular opera that people actually knew about without having to be told that this thing that is a totally unpleasant experience is, in fact, a great operatic work of art.
Opera died, we don't have opera anymore, and we can't really do really great painting and sculpture anymore, and we can't really do symphonies.
But it doesn't matter, because we've got all these new forms, vernacular forms, like pop songs and sitcoms and whatever that we can do.
We've got Banks's graffiti art, don't forget.
Yeah, Banks' Graffiti.
But the fact is that all those vernacular forms, like the pop song or the sitcom, are absolutely bankrupt and exhausted, too.
We seem to me to be a totally exhausted civilization, so that if you say to, you know, People, what would you rather talk about?
Would you rather talk about how there's a sudden adult... In the province of Alberta, cause unknown is now the leading cause of death.
Which is weird!
It might be worth talking about, or would you rather talk about how somebody misgendered, they put a trans model on the cover of Sports Illustrated or Playboy or whatever, and then some beastly person misgendered her.
We're circling the drain.
And it might well be that the drain circling theory is enough and you don't need the space lizards.
On the other hand, you know, people think, people would love, I would love it if it were like a thriller.
I would love it if you could actually, you know, send 007 up to Klaus Schwab's hollowed out Alp.
Uh, and he runs around there, uh, shooting all the minions in the Bako foil capsuits, uh, and finally having his big showdown with Klaus Schwab there.
But the, the total civilizational exhaustion...
That's been going on over the course of the last century seems as compelling as anything, so I'm not quite as pill-wise, I'm not quite up to where you are yet.
It is given to few.
It is given to few to be on that level.
By the way, just on that James Bond analogy, James Bond is MI6, presumably, rather than MI5.
Well, either way, he's working for the enemy.
I mean, the notion that the security services in the UK or the US work for We The People, that's a fantasy as well.
Yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely, I mean, I find that's what's Again, it causes me pain with the, my, you know, I used to, when I guest hosted for Tucker Carlson, I was basically the warm-up act for Sean Hannity, who comes on at nine o'clock.
And, and Sean is a very, you know, he's a nice chap in many ways, but he does this thing, uh, my, uh, you know, I've been law enforcement all my life.
My mother was a prison guard or something, I don't know what it is.
And he goes, uh, I know these demons.
99.99% of these FBI are fine, straight shooting, upstanding, and it's not true!
The FBI head office in Washington is completely rotten, and so are all the branch offices.
And you have all this thing now where they're, you know, faking up Plots, you know, the current theory is that January 6th in the US was a Fed's erection.
In other words, the FBI basically arranged the whole thing and just co-opted a few of the more aimless MAGA types as crowd scene extras.
In it, the FBI, you know, the correct position in my shoes is to say, if elected, the first thing I will do is abolish the Federal Bureau of Investigation because it's beyond reform.
But you can't even get, you know, that default that, I know these fine upstanding G-Men, 99, there's a few bad apples, yes, six, seven, Nine tops, but they're fine upstanding G. I mean that side of the moron right, the rube right, just drives me nuts.
Yeah, totally with you.
I was just thinking that one of...
In my normie days, as it were, when I was, you know, believed in all this stuff, I went out to Virginia to meet the G-Man, Keith Ward and Liddy.
Right.
Who, I thought, he's lovely, I mean he was absolutely really personable, you know, did jail time for Watergate and stuff.
Anyway, when you do, when you spend a bit of time in the rabbit hole and you look into the Kennedy assassination, you realise that G. Gordon Liddy, the late G. Gordon Liddy, so I can say this now without fear of being offed I presume, he was intimately involved in the, I mean there were a number of hitmen, you know, Oswald was the Patsy and so on.
And I think, I seem to remember that, it's a long time since I listened to a podcast about this, but I think Liddy actually shot a cop who looked like Kennedy to give, give the, when they exchanged the bodies.
I don't know.
I mean, but these guys are not our friends.
They are not acting.
Well what I find odd about that, because that came up a few weeks ago, I think, about the CIA involvement in the Kennedys, and what I loved Oh, I'll never forget where I was when I heard when Kennedy was shot.
But I have completely forgotten where I was when it turned out the CIA was involved with when Kennedy was shot, because for some reason that never made the papers.
And that is what is so creepy and unnerving here.
The actual stitch-up of Trump Once it looked like he was going to win the nomination, where basically the CIA outsourced
A lot of its activities that would have been illegal within the United States, so they would find somebody like Papadopoulos attached to the Trump campaign in London, and then outsource it to various members of the Five Eyes, like the Australians and the UK, to take it from there.
The thing about it is, if you assume That all the organs of government are essentially working against the people's interests.
Everything makes sense in a way that it doesn't.
And so the question then becomes, well, who are they working?
Who are they working for?
The Hunter Biden stuff.
That's on Hunter Biden's laptop.
If that's what's on his laptop, the stuff there about 10% for the big guy, Joe Biden, you have to bet that the Chinese have got tons more stuff on Joe Biden and Jim Biden and Hunter Biden as they have on Justin Trudeau.
And so, as I said, I come back to the thing where I don't think the Western world really matters anymore, which is why, you know, we've spent the last three years essentially, you know, not being infected by a Chinese virus, but in fact being infected by Chinese ideas on state control, limited freedom of movement, limited freedom of speech, and all the rest of it.
And I think a large number of people, I think it is, for some people, it's as simple as money.
They're just making their accommodations with the future.
We've got to talk about your exit from GB News and Ofcom, I mean, who are the bad guys in all this, do you think?
Well, I think Ofcom is bad because I think the reduction of, you know, Good Morning Britain or whatever to state propagandists this last three years was very much at the behest of Ofcom.
In the first weeks of the pandemic, they issued this so-called advice, basically alerting Uh, broadcasters, that they would not take kindly to any questioning of the government narrative.
You know, again, this... And people say, well, wait a minute, we had that in the Second World War.
Oh, okay, so we're at war, are we?
In that case, who's the enemy?
Well, in this case, I think we were at war.
Governments were at war with their own peoples.
That's why they took war measures.
And Ofcom is a big part of that.
But at the same time, then we have GB News.
I didn't know anything.
I'd been out of UK media for half my adult life.
So, when I was first offered a show by GB News, and I'd make suggestions as to who would be a good guest, they would always say, Yeah, but actually she died in 1997.
And I go, really?
And so I was totally, I was totally out of it.
But I do know this, you know, we had terrific ratings on that show.
By the time I had my heart attacks, we were beating Piers Morgan every night, Sky almost every night.
That must have been very sad for you.
No, I know.
It's not a thing.
I mean, I thought, this is pathetic.
This is pathetic.
I've met Frank Sinatra, and now I'm reduced to boasting that I beat Piers Morgan.
And so I didn't really know any.
And I thought it served me well, because I wasn't part of all the little games now.
And they liked it.
I had very agreeable Breakfast at the Carlton Club with the chairman and the the other hedge fund guy, you know They're hedge funders from Dubai and they all loved it and they thought and they liked the way, you know It seemed to be perfectly obvious that if that there are issues that aren't being talked about and if you've got a new station The way to impress yourself upon people is to talk about things that the other guys aren't talking about.
Now, at some point, the calculation changed at GB News, because Uh, for whatever reason, they've now become a... You know, I don't even know.
You know, so Ofcom can regulate my show, but it's okay for GB News to sign up a whole big bunch of sitting Conservative MPs, sitting MPs from one party and give them shows.
I don't even get that.
But it's become, I think, a rather boring You know, I hate talking like this because, you know, as I said, Michelle Dewberry is a lovely lady and there's, you know, there's other people there, Neil Oliver and people I like, but the fact is the management has decided to operate within this rather dreary political Punch and Judy Act.
I was puzzled, and I think you probably share my puzzlement.
I was talking about this with Tobes, as you know, and Tobes' view seems to be, well, This is what Ofcom says, ergo, they've got to play by them as the rules kind of thing.
Whereas my response is, I was brought up in a country, I was brought up to believe that we were one of the cradles of democracy, Magna Carta, you know, Simon de Montfort, Parliament, Civil War, Constitutional, whatever.
All these things that one imagined were great about this country, and one of them was freedom of speech, and another was that we didn't live under kind of Stalinist censorship, or have Orwell-esque bodies like Ofcom to stop us speaking.
So what's going on here?
Well, I agree with you.
I got into a similar situation in Canada with the Human Rights Commissions a few years ago, and it wasn't GB News which presents itself as an ideological crusader.
The corporate entity That was, you know, that had published my alleged infringements was Rogers, which is as mainstream as you can get.
They're publishers of the Dentist's Waiting Room magazine in Canada.
They operate email and telephone service and all that.
So they're not in the league.
They're not conservative.
They're not the guy who owned the company, was a classic supporter of the Liberal Party and all the rest of it.
But we had the first conference call, which I always hate doing.
So there's me as the offending writer, there's the editor, and then there's all the senior executive vice presidents of departments you've never heard of, and Ted Rogers, the chairman of the company, and Julian Porter, our fabulous QC.
And at one point, one of the senior executive vice presidents goes on the conference call, well, what's the endgame here?
And there's this long pause, silence.
I said, well, the endgame... I just spoke because the silence was getting embarrassing.
And I said, well, the endgame here is to get the law repealed and the Canadian state out of the censorship business.
And there was a pause, and then the senior executive vice presidents all said, Yeah, OK, that makes sense.
I'm on board with that.
And we pulled it off, whatever it was, five, six years ago.
The censorship law was repealed by the Canadian Parliament.
So my thing with Ofcom, and this is why I disagree with Toby Young, he's not thinking big enough.
My thing with Ofcom is, okay, in the 1950s there wasn't much bandwidth and there was a need for a body to allocate frequencies so that Radio Tyneside didn't clash with Supergold FM or whatever.
Yes.
That's fine, but Ofcom should have no powers whatsoever over editorial.
And that's what I said on air, and that is what I think should be the goal.
And I don't know why Tobes should think, oh, well, what we all need to do is, so it becomes all a bit, we need to learn to work within The regulations of Ofcom, so it all becomes a bit coded, but people will be sophisticated enough to know what we would have said if we were allowed to have said it.
So it's a bit like the May Day parade in the Kremlin in the Soviet days, where we'll need people to divine what's really going on because you can't actually say what's really going on.
This is England!
A land that used to be a crucible of liberty, and a man who presents himself as a... I don't... I like Toby.
I took him to... I took him to dinner in German Street.
I didn't even... it was so much in sterling, I didn't even convert it mentally into Canadian dollars, because it would have made my head explode.
And I did that for Toby, because I was enjoying his company.
And then... and then he does this thing.
Uh, where, you know, the normal thing is, and as I said in Canada, you know, David Icke was on board with getting the Canadian government out of the censorship business, and took Margaret Atwood a little longer to climb on board, but eventually she did too.
And that's what GB News should have done, and that's what Toby Young should have been calling for.
Well, that's brilliantly put.
There was no malice in Tobes, and I like him very much, and I'm sure his intentions are good, but it seems to me a basic Intellectual moral failing indeed.
And it's not just Toby, this is across the board of all those alleged right-wing commentators that I used to look up to or consider my comrades.
None of them is saying, end this censorship now!
This is not Great Britain.
This is just some tinpot dictatorship.
How can this have happened?
Who is Melanie Dawes anyway?
You know, Melanie Dawes, by the way, was my childhood bestie.
I went to her 21st birthday This is like, there's a plot of a Jackie Collins novel and Jackie should have written this.
Like, two best friends separated at university meet up years later when the one is micro-regulating the other's broadcast content.
Fantastic.
It is so weird.
I do, I've had this weird sort of zealot-like life where these people from, you know, I was at school with Chris Witty.
Yeah.
I was at, you know, university with Boris and Dave Cameron, and at college with Kate Bingham, the vaccine rollout czar.
It's spooky, but yeah.
I remember Melanie George's 21st birthday.
I'm pretty sure it was the same night as either Live Aid or Band Aid, and it was on the television.
Um, for those who were, wanted to retire to, you know, from the dance floor or whatever and watch what was going on.
Anyway, uh, there's a bit of a...
Yeah, well, that's what I find so odd because, you know, I take it she was agreeable company if she was your best friend.
Well, I'll tell you what it was.
Our parents knew each other and we were both the clever kids from the county.
So you tend to gravitate together, you know.
We weren't lovers or anything.
No, no, no, I don't like to think of that, because then you'd be one of the lizard people.
You'd have been once it all gets into icky bodily fluid type stuff.
No, but what I find odd about my friend Andrew Lawton, who is from London, by which I mean London, Ontario, not London, England, he doorstepped Uh, Melanie Dawes in Davos.
I don't know why Dame Melanie is jetting to Davos at taxpayers' expense.
But, uh, he was the only, he, he, he, who knows what, except you obviously, what Melanie Dawes looks like.
But he saw Melanie Dawes coming down the street, so he sticks a microphone under her and asks Dame Melanie about Ofcom censorship.
And as I said, he's from London, Ontario, not London, England.
And I don't understand why any of the guys from London, England don't think it's worth sticking a microphone under Dame Melanie and asking what's going on.
Why do you have to leave it to some up-country bumpkin from Northern Ontario, Western Ontario, whatever, to do all the heavy lifting there?
It's this widespread acceptance of tyranny.
I mean, okay, I'll give you another example that I haven't mentioned yet.
Charles Moore.
You know Charles, don't you?
Yeah, he was my editor at the Telegraph for years, yeah.
Exactly, and you'd think if Britain turns into the Soviet Union, Charles Moore's gonna notice and speak up about it, but Crickets!
Instead he's writing columns in the Telegraph about how we need to go to war with Ukraine to defeat the evil monster Putin.
You're just typing out a sheet that was prepared to you earlier by MI5.
We need to go to war!
Well I'm not in favour of nuclear Armageddon with Putin for the fairly obvious reason that if you look at our performance in Afghanistan or Iraq or anywhere else, we have no potential for any kind of strategic clarity.
So if we go to war, There's people on the right in America who want to go to war with China.
Well, the same thing would happen.
We'd lose.
We couldn't beat goat herds with fertilizer.
That's what's changed for me.
I mean, I haven't really changed.
I don't really know a lot about warfare.
I'm not terribly butch, as I said to you earlier.
I'm a little musical comedy boy.
So I'm a bit like the latter-day Bunny Roger, who used to march British troops across Europe in full makeup with a rolled-up copy of Vogue under his arm, and did very well at it.
But the point here is that we couldn't beat goat herds with fertilizer because we're at war for wrong reasons.
So we're going to war for dishonor.
We couldn't beat China at war.
China makes whatever the percentage is of our aspirins.
So five days into the war, everybody's going to have a splitting headache and won't be able to operate the planes and things.
They make all our underwear.
You can't go to war with the guy who makes everything in your house.
Likewise, you go to war with Putin has the biggest nuclear arsenal in the world.
And the idea that the idea that people say this is what I like.
There was some crazy ex former, you know, deputy assistant under secretary of defense from the Ford administration or whatever he was.
I heard on the radio a while ago.
He's actually gaming it out.
And he's like gaming it out, he goes, yeah, Putin, he can nuke, you know, almost any major European city.
But eventually, he runs out.
And then what?
You know, and I had a thing, it was just a throwaway line, but people keep quoting it back at me, after that whole Nord Stream pipeline thing.
I said, what's so weird about the world we're in?
And I tied it to, you know, the American fingerprints on the origins of the COVID.
It's like, if you sit back and look at it, it turns out actually, it's one of those movies where the good guys are the bad guys.
And I just said it as, Like a throwaway line.
But I've had quite a lot of people come back to me and say, no, no, no, you need to develop that.
Because if you look at what the United States government and its allies have done, they are actually seriously bad.
And I look at it from the other, like the Western world gets more west, the further east you go.
So all the craziness.
You're looking at the girl, you go to see the girl's swimming championship, and there's four pretty girls in bathing suits, and then the fifth one is, you know, six foot three with thighs like tugboats, no knockers, and a touch of five o'clock shadow, and appears to be packing a little extra as you scan your way down her swimsuit.
But what a great victory for girls, she's a girls swimming champion.
Now that's, that's, the United States is the cray, is the, is the locus of the craziness.
Then the next...
Crazy a bunch of people.
His Majesties, Dominions, Canada, Britain, Australia, New Zealand.
Because as Alistair Cook said to me 30-something years ago, he goes, the British thing is to mock, is to piss all over whatever it is the Americans are doing, and then adopt it badly two years later.
And that's what Canada, Australia... So they're the next bunch of crazies.
Then, rather less crazy, is the western part of continental Europe, where even a dinky little globalist metrosexual like Macron, after some protesters have damaged the first statue, he goes, no, we're not going to take down a single statue, and we're not going to rename anything, because they're all part of our history.
So that's that.
And the issue went away in France.
And then you move even further east and you get to the countries of Central Europe, you know, Hungary, Poland, Slovakia, whatever, and people talk Almost like the reasonable political class of normal nation-states like they used to do here a couple of generations back.
And so that's what's so nutty, you know, the West gets less West the further West you go, with America as, you know, crazy land and Britain, Canada, etc.
not far behind.
Yeah, yeah.
By the way, are you, like, permanently in the UK now?
No, no, I'm sitting in the United States right now.
I had a... When I... Because this show started during the Covid, so it was a little bit difficult.
But when I was doing it from London, I used to do I used to do Monday to Thursday in London and then I'd go to France for the long weekend from Thursday night to Monday morning, basically.
So I had the good fortune of having my heart attack in France rather than being dependent on the NHS.
Well, you'd be dead now, wouldn't you?
Yeah, I would be.
I would be dead.
Yeah, because I actually asked a statistician on the show, who used to do the health numbers for the Office for National Statistics, he showed me these record waiting times for ambulances, and if, as my French nurse showed me, I was within 15 minutes of death, Uh, then waiting two business days for an ambulance is not going to be conducive to your recovery.
And, uh, but I did.
I was, you know, I, so I did the show.
I did the show wherever I happened to be.
So I do, uh, do the show from the US.
I do the show from the UK.
I felt In a strange way, I felt a little embarrassed because I hadn't been paying close attention to British politics or anything for a long time.
And then I realized it was actually a huge advantage, because you don't know who any of these people are.
So when they say, oh, we've had a call back from the Minister of State at the Department of Transport, he's very eager to come on.
I go, who is it?
Because in my mind's eye, When I'm thinking of the cabinet table in Downing Street, it's still like Mrs. Thatcher and Willie Whitelaw.
Geoffrey Howe.
Yeah, and they're all just, like, sitting around.
And I thought that's a bit of a disappointment.
People will be on to me.
Yeah, I don't want to make it sound like... Because I went places that the other GB News guys didn't go.
I went to Ennis Killen for the Glorious Twelfth and all that kind of thing.
But I...
Uh, but basically, in my mind's eye, it was like, uh, politics is the Thatcher era House of Commons with the Tory party full of substantial men, uh, like, uh, the late Viscount Whitelaw.
And I thought that people will be on to me.
They'll realize I have no, like, all the cultural references to, and pop stars from the, you know, I'd say, they'd say, oh, we've managed to get so-and-so.
I'd go, who's that?
Oh, well, uh, She was a runner-up in Britain's Got Talent on 2040 and I'd be thinking, you know, oh a nice appealing British pop star.
You mean like Lulu or Dana?
I just had no idea and I came to see that that was actually a huge advantage in the way these things go.
So you're staying stateside now?
Back to the day job.
Well no, I was stuck in France.
I wasn't cleared to fly for a couple of months.
And then they eventually cleared me and I got on a flight to Montreal and sort of was delivered back to my home south of the border.
But I'm moving about rather cautiously.
And I'm not going to be doing all that, I'm not going to be jetting around in the way I was doing just three or four months ago, not for a while yet.
Is there anything you can do, or any sort of regimen you can pursue to kind of increase your life chances?
Yeah, in fact, my internist in the South of France was very clear.
She said, well, what do you do, monsieur?
And I said what I did in a typical week.
And so she was all for, you know, scoring out GB news shows.
Old Frankelopoulos has done you a massive favour.
And she was... And she just thought, you know, once a month I should play Easy Listening Favourites in the middle of the night on some, you know, nice calming radio station somewhere.
And, you know, she's probably not wrong about that, but, you know, I feel... I then watched this rubbish on TV, both sides of the Atlantic,
And listen to, I was in America, I was Rush Limbaugh's guest host for 15 years and I loved Rush, Rush was a brilliant man and I listen now to talk radio and they've got like sports bros, you know, doing a poll on who your favorite superhero is and I'm thinking no, none of this, the conversation Has to be.
We've got to direct the conversation to something that matters.
And until some of these sports bros or, you know, like on the show, on the Mark Stein show now, I on our Wednesday panel edition is with three young ladies whose combined age, I think, adds up to about two thirds of mine.
And I like them because they're butcher.
Then, so many of these big boss jocks from American talk radio are just talking, where they have the hard-driving rock music, right, so everything's, the theme tunes all sound like Eye of the Tiger sideways, and then they, and then they've got easy listening opinions.
Whereas me, I've got easy listening music and hardcore opinions, and that's the way around to do it, James.
So, Mark, if there are any viewers and listeners of this podcast who don't know who you are and what you do, tell them where they can find your staff and...
Anything else you need to tell them?
Well, they can find me at steinonline.com, that's S-T-E-Y, Stein with a Y, as in, why do I have to live in the UK and then watch some guy who's barely set foot in here the last 30 years tell me everything that's wrong with my country?
Stein with a Y, S-T-E-Y-N, online, and that'll get to me.
Brilliant.
Mark, I'm so glad I could finally get you on.
I'm gutted that I never got onto your show.
No, you were... I saw you with Jubes and I thought, he's never gonna match.
That was a uniquely fantastic... and everyone was stunned.
But we'll have you on the show.
As I said, I'm mostly working now with young ladies who... I can wear a wig!
Yeah, yeah, no, no, I know.
Compared to a lot of championship stars in the sports world, you're actually a fantastic... You make a great, fantastic, hot look.
If I... I tell you something, if my youngest kid, he was entering the track competition, state track competition, and you were the lady ahead of him, just crossing the tape while he couldn't get anywhere near, you would be a great...
You make a great female athlete.
You know how to give a compliment, Mark.
Thank you, thank you very much.
Thank you, dear viewers and listeners, for watching this show, and for your support.
You can support me, and I really appreciate when you do, on Locals, on Substack, on Subscribestar, and on Patreon.
You can buy me a coffee, because remember, the enemy wants to destroy people like me and Mark, and doesn't want us to earn a living ever again, so it's your duty, I'm afraid, to give us some help.
Thanks a lot.
Thanks, Mark.
You're great.
Thanks, James.
And keep well.
▲
Export Selection