All Episodes
Previous Next
June 25, 2022 - The Delingpod - James Delingpole
01:06:50
Sean Corrigan
| Copy link to current segment

Time Text
Welcome to the JellyPod with me, James Jellypole.
And I know I always am excited about this week's special guest, but I really am.
Sean Corrigan, I spotted on Twitter, tweeting out some immensely punchy Um, incisive things about the, the current insanity.
Um, Sean, um, tell me about yourself.
I know you, you run a company called Cantillon Consulting and you're based in Switzerland and you, and you know a bit about finance.
Tell me, tell me more about what you do first of all.
Okay.
So, uh, it's kind of long story short.
Um, I drifted into the city in the mid eighties.
Um, when, uh, it became the, The Vogue thing to do for people who had the opportunity to get there.
At the time, we used to be quite cynical about it.
We used to say the great thing about the city was it was better than working for a living.
Unfortunately, a few years later, our American friends took over and it got all very serious and the crisis got ever bigger and the central bank response got ever more lunatic.
And here we are, 25, 35, 45 years, whatever it is later.
And the world just keeps getting worse and the insanities just keep getting bigger and I keep trying to row upstream against it and try to point out some of the errors and the follies.
Sometimes they're amusing, sometimes they're insightful and generally they're ignored.
Yeah, I'm really glad that I've got you because, I mean, look, I have no, when I was at university, And I did the milk round where where, you know, in your final year where they come around to your to your university and they try and recruit you for for the for the merchant banks as they then were.
I failed the test.
I tried and they wouldn't have me.
I reckon I reckon they must have they must have seen even then that I was not suitable for creating dog shit products like collateralized debt obligations and flogging them on to to to gullible idiots.
Maybe they noticed I had too many morals.
But what really interests me is that despite my relative financial ignorance, to me it is clear as day what is happening in the world right now.
This is the culmination of decades of planning.
What we're witnessing is the deliberately engineered collapse of the global financial system.
We are being steered towards central bank digital currencies, that we are going to have more and more of our freedoms taken away from us, that climate change and the sustainability agenda is being used to force on us expensive forms of energy rather than, you know, cheap fossil fuel energy, that this is all a coordinated attempt to turn ordinary people like you and me
Into slaves of this of this tiny, tiny elite.
If it's obvious to me and I'm not a financial expert, why?
Why are so many people in the financial sector who presumably ought to be the brightest sparks on the block?
You know, they're very, very well paid.
Why are they still blind to what's going on?
Well, I think sometimes the infantryman in the trenches doesn't necessarily understand what the general staff are doing or the purpose of it.
Since they're in there dodging bullets and trying to fight back, they're too busy doing what they do.
We also have the position, as you say, that whether or not you believe that the elite are clever enough to have engineered every last move on this human chessboard that they seem to be keen on manipulating, Or whether they're just being opportunistic in trying to advance their fantasies every time something else they've done goes wrong and presenting it as a solution.
I don't know.
But we've had, I mean, OK, we go back to the 1968-ers, when the student leftists took over the West and the so-called cultural Marxists started to infiltrate through all our cultural, educational, institutional structures.
Three generations of people who've been educated this way, and it's become increasingly difficult in any sphere of life to speak up, to speak against it, to buck the trend.
Cancel culture has become something of a cliché, but we have something of a cross between the medieval church's penchant for seeking out and burning heretics and the worst of the Stalinist or the Maoist oppression of Running dog imperialists or whatever the public enemy was then designated as.
So I think it's difficult on both scores.
They're too busily involved with what they're doing.
Their careers clearly depend on persisting in this.
And also, where do they find contrary voices?
And when they do raise questions, what are the consequences for them?
Yeah, you make some good points there.
I was thinking About the age thing that you and I are.
We're getting on, aren't we?
We are probably we are probably I mean, I guess you're about the same age as me.
We're probably the last generation which had a reasonable shot at having an independent education, being at least possibly able to think critically.
And that the I mean, I think of the generations that succeeded me at Oxford.
The education they get there now is not the education I had when I was there.
Yeah, I think that's that's it's a cliche of our generation, but we were taught to think sometimes successfully.
The new people are taught what to think, and therefore they have a harder struggle.
It's not to say there aren't very smart, bright young people who do distrust what they see around them, who do question it, and who do often come to conclusions which are more consonant with ours, shall we say.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, I'm certainly not in the business of dissing people's intelligence or whatever.
There are very smart thinking young people who get there.
Clearly, humanity itself hasn't yet been degraded.
But the tools with which they've been furnished have definitely gone that way and deliberately so.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, I'm certainly not in the business of dissing people's intelligence or whatever.
I mean, it's just a matter of frustration and disappointment to me that so many people have so far failed to wake up to what's going on when it seems to be obvious.
I've given you my take on the overall picture.
Maybe you can give me yours.
What do you think is going on in the world right now?
Well, as I say, the idea that it's a vast conspiracy seems to some people to be to be ludicrous and immediately put put those espousing it beyond the bounds of credibility.
You go back to the 1930s, and H.G.
Wells, who was not just a science fiction writer, but was a Fabian visionary and a leading thought leader, as we would say in this horrible new phrase, one of the institutors of the United Nations and the whole pan-global movement, he wrote a book called The Open Conspiracy, and that's what we have.
The conspiracy is open.
These people make no secret of how they wish to re-engineer society and how they wish to reorder our lives, even to the most intimate of details.
So I think to believe that we're all tinfoil hats sitting on the dark edges of the internet becoming paranoid is clearly itself an unsustainable accusation.
So whether it's deliberate or not, clearly the intent has been to exploit every opportunity to further these agendas.
And, you know, we say the World Economic Forum and Davos and Klaus Schwab is the bogeyman.
They're symbolic, really, rather than necessarily the be-all and end-all.
He's not necessarily the spider at the center of the web or the grand puppet master, but it's a very convenient shorthand because the people who cluster around him and who share those views and promote those ideologies are the ones that we need to be terrified of.
Yes, I think the world, the world financial situation is clearly Has gone beyond the bounds.
We can see that we're in a situation now with this unleashing of rapid price rises and of key product shortages over the past two to three years.
That again, whether deliberate or accidental, it's being exploited.
It's being exploited to introduce controls on our movement.
It's a reordering of our basic utilities.
We're not allowed gas boilers.
We won't be allowed electric cars.
Our flights will be rationed.
They're trying to get us weaned off meat and livestock protein.
All sorts of things like this.
It's not just whether the state plays a bigger role in the economy, as was the debate maybe through the previous hundred years and into the 60s, 70s and 80s.
It's now about how the state interferes in every single decision we make from the moment we wake and how much it monitors us.
Yeah, yeah.
It surprises me that people can't make the connection.
So, for example, in The Guardian today, there is a story which is which is to me, obviously, has been planted there about asking the question, are people's private flocks of chickens, people, people who keep hens in their own homes, are they responsible for this surprising outbreak of bird flu?
Are they are they are they spreading it?
And you're thinking, well, this is not about bird flu, which I think is probably about as real as COVID is real.
In other words, they just fudge it with the testing.
It's clearly a war on smallholders, people who want to be able to keep their own hens, to be able to have their own eggs and stuff.
It's a war on private property, on what you can do with your own land.
I mean, can you imagine even 10 years ago, Telling people sometime near near in the future, you will not be allowed to have hens in your own garden, which is what this is working up to.
You mentioned boilers, the same thing.
If you said to people, right from now on, it won't be up to you how you heat your home.
You know, you won't be able to look at the different options and make a decision based on cost and efficiency and so on.
We are telling you now that you are going to have to have by law, you won't be able to sell your house.
You're going to have to have in your home a boiler which is so pitifully inefficient, you're only going to get a warm trickle in your bath.
You're going to be shivering through the winter.
It doesn't work.
And that's the rule.
I mean, why aren't people more up in arms?
This is obvious what's going on.
I think the problem is, is there's such a such a drumbeat of these measures that it becomes wearisome always to oppose them and to spend your whole life Opening the newspaper, looking for the, as you say, the planted story, the carefully seeded scare, the hidden agenda, and read it in.
Once you're awake to it, you see it everywhere.
Every single thing, whether it's advertising, whether it's supposed fictional narrative on the TV, in the movie theatre, wherever.
The narrative is all-pervasive and all-powerful, and it's very wearisome to erect your defences against it.
It's also difficult when one meets with friends or family.
You don't want to spend all your time complaining about the new tyranny and the new government measure and the new... So you try to shut it out and get on with your life.
Part of you doesn't want to believe it and part of you finds that it's just either too socially frictional or too mentally wearisome to continue to raise the issue.
Yeah, I agree.
It's exhausting and it's kind of...
It's kind of depressing, because every time you talk about it, you have to sort of acknowledge the full horror of what's going on, it'd be so much easier to just pretend it's not happening.
But I, my view is that we're so close to the to the endgame that It behooves us, I think, behooves us to speak out wherever and whenever possible.
I was invited round to tea with some friends the other day and while my wife was away looking around the garden, because she's heard this stuff before and she doesn't like it particularly, I seized the moment and I delivered this Five minute truth bomb rant starting with the history of the creation of the Federal Reserve.
And everything else sort of springs from there.
Once you know that the American financial system is a criminal conspiracy, that essentially the people who print the money, print the dollar are a bunch of crooks.
Everything else sort of starts to make sense.
I mean, if the very basis of the world's most powerful currency is a bunch of criminals printing money and reaping the proceeds before the money goes into the general economy, it becomes, you know, I mean, I know people find it hard to accept that the world is run by gangsters.
But until people realize this, We're never going to be able to break free.
There's no point to the pussyfooting about bound the world.
I for example, I get this a lot of people on our side.
They say oh you shouldn't go there because what people do is they think you're a conspiracy theorist and and you know, it dilutes the message.
Look, you can't dilute the truth.
The truth is the truth.
There's no point pussyfooting around anymore.
Yeah, I mean, I think we're clearly, as you say, whether it's an endgame, we're clearly at a very critical stage here because the momentum is building.
We have this, what I call the unholy trinity.
We've had COVID, climate and QE.
And all of those are designed to expropriate us one way or another.
We've restricted movement.
We've shut down supply.
We've pumped extra money in.
We've diverted scarce capital resources into unusable, unscalable, undeliverable methods of providing the very basics of our lives.
Diesel is the lifeblood of the world economy, and natural gas is probably its oxygen, if it's not stretching the metaphor too much.
We've criminalized them.
The forces that be, even without a vote anyway, have said to the financial regulators, and the central banks have jumped on the bandwagon and set up all these institutions to say that when you and I save our money, it can no longer be put to providing us with some realistic energy in the future when we need it.
It has to be diverted to Climo corporatism, to the Carbo cronies.
And you go on and on, and all this has been done by fiat.
It's all been done behind closed doors.
It's been done as a technocratic decision.
It's been dressed up in all the argot and the jargon of financial sustainability and prudential regulation and la-di-da-di-da.
And it's nothing but a basic, it's a heist.
When Larry Fink says that he has all these billions of dollars which people put in his funds at BlackRock, He is now going to use them to make sure that companies pursue the World Economic Forum and the UN agendas.
He is effectively stealing your money and perverting his fiduciary duty in the pursuit of his interests, not yours, which were the reasons that you gave him the money in the first place.
But he's lauded for it.
He's not excoriated.
He's not taken to court for it.
He's feted everywhere he goes around the world and everybody bows before him.
This is one man.
I've picked him out because the name stands out and he's a prominent figure.
But again, this rot goes from top to bottom in our in our current system.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He's lauded.
He's lauded not by ordinary people who haven't a clue who Larry Fink is and they've barely heard of BlackRock, even though probably.
Well, BlackRock, of course, owns, I think, is the majority shareholder in 40 percent of all the leading companies of America.
Well, it is the biggest fund company.
Yes, indeed.
So and because it's Because it's it's carefully constructed through these things called ETFs, which are collective investment vehicles.
You and I think that we're investing in the top 30 shares of an industry or a country.
We put it into Larry Fink's vehicle.
But he then uses the shareholder rights that go with this to force the companies to pursue his agenda.
You don't you have effectively signed that over without you knowing that you have done so.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
And they invent all these these superficially significant sounding words, phrases, like, do you remember the phrase stranded assets?
I remember that that that being introduced to the lexicon a few years ago to the financial lexicon.
And the notion being that, that if you had, if you were invested in, say, an oil company, or heaven forfend, a coal company, you were invested in stranded assets, that these assets were effectively, realistically worthless, Because inevitably, the world would soon wake up to the fact that these fossil fuels were damaging the environment so much that no way would they be worth investing because they would soon be unusable.
But this is this is an absolute lie.
I mean, even if you use the the the International Energy Agency's figures, they you know, their projections show that long way into the future, fossil fuels will still be will still be Providing the majority of our energy so how on earth can they?
Stop us investing in in companies that produce them.
I mean, how does that work?
Well, this is I think one of divas Marcus Carney's famous inventions, isn't it?
This stranded asset business.
He's a he's a leading figure in the in the drive behind this But yes, though the whole point of it was it was a self-fulfilling process so We won't invest in oil companies today because they'll be worthless tomorrow.
Therefore there won't be any oil and gas and or it will become so expensive that the ridiculous so-called renewables will seem competitive through this artificial restriction of supply and this destruction of capital.
So it's been a very clever way of preventing people from using their own money and their own volition to continue in the way they want rather than the way that the elites want.
And as you say, the IEA, which I tend to call the implacable enemies of affluence, because this is a body, again, which is supposed to be there to coordinate a ready supply of oil so that general prosperity and general economic progress is not hindered.
It's supposed to work as an arbiter and a fair deal, honest broker, between producers and suppliers to keep everything more or less in balance.
And it's again been captured.
It's another institution eaten out from within by the parasitic ignumon wasps of Davos.
They've planted their grub in it, it's eaten it from inside, and now Faith Birol runs around the world telling everybody that they can't have any energy, they have to build windmills.
Yeah, I like that, ignumon wasps.
Those are the ones that lay their parasites inside the body of another animal.
Yeah, if you think alien, then you basically have the concept, yes.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, funny if I was going to the pre pre 2020, I'd been planning to write this book called parasite was about this very phenomenon about how every institution gets infiltrated and taken over and ceases to be to perform its ostensible function, and instead becomes captive of the of the parasite within its its It's horrific what's what's going on.
I can't think of a single institution that hasn't been hasn't been corrupted.
And you mentioned the IAEA.
What were the initials?
So it's supposed to be the International Energy Authority, but it's the implacable enemies of affluence.
Yeah, absolutely right.
I think if it's got initials, it's evil.
I think that's the safest assumption we can make.
Cantillon, do you do sort of financial advice or how does it work?
Well, I'm somewhere between a glorified sports commentator and a cheap Nostradamus.
My thing is to try to look at these themes, to try to look at the way the world's working and try to point out to usually institutional clients where I think that they're missing a trick or two or what certain
I mean, I do get specific with things like, I think the price of oil will probably go up this week, but that's kind of an attempt to focus what I'm saying in the larger timescale and over the bigger horizons into something which is of more immediate relevance to take the attention and to show there's a practical import to the things that I'm saying.
I don't manage money myself for other clients, so I talk to the people who do it and I try to say to them, look, this is my view of the world.
This is what I think you might be missing.
Have you considered that if this is going on, maybe this would be an implication for what you are doing with your clients' money?
That's my role.
So I'm obviously going to ask you, what advice are you giving people right now?
Well, it's very difficult because, you know, we're in this world where, as you say, arguably we're on the verge of a collapse.
I mean, if you're cynical about it, the inflation which they've unleashed, whether or not they still believe their own magic that somehow or other this vast, this vast barn full of dry tinder would never catch a spark, it clearly is now burning.
And in some cases, they're still adding bales of hay to it.
The European Central Bank is still not cut back on its bond buying programs.
And indeed, because of the differences between what's going on in, say, the Italian bond market and the German bond market, they're even effectively threatening to reinvigorate their programs.
The Federal Reserve has just started to act and has already terrified people, even though interest rates now in the United States are one and three quarter percent.
The last time CPI inflation, last time prices were rising this rapidly in the mid 80s, Interest rates were 10 times this.
They were 17 and a half percent.
So you can see how futile even this gesture has been, even though it's terrified the markets and terrified the over-leveraged and the unicorns and the tech ponzi's and the crypto idiots.
So there is an argument that they've got to this point now.
Well, if the inflation runs out of hand, what we'll simply do is we'll cancel all your existing money and we'll issue with our dreaded central bank digital currencies.
There'll be a one world currency, not only where we have intimate control over it, We will also have intimate monitoring over it because it will be tracked.
So when you have now a £10 note in your pocket, you still have some vague anonymity about how you will spend it.
When you get your 10 units of CBDC credit, it will be digital.
And so wherever you spend it, it will be logged and it will probably eventually interact with an Internet of Things reader on the things you buy.
So not only will all your movements and all your transactions be tracked, they will also inherently be rationable.
So they will say to you, you have exceeded your carbon ration.
You've had too much sugar this week.
You've had four units of alcohol this week.
You actually had some meat protein.
You cannot spend your money on it anymore.
And of course, what also can happen, as we've seen in China in this last couple of weeks, whenever you go to protest or anything, your money will be cancelled.
Your movement pass will be cancelled.
You will not have access.
to the services or the media or the physical proximity of those to whom you wish to take your place and complain.
So this technocratic digital gulag, which they're building around us, could be the upshot of where we are.
So in that world, what do you invest in?
Now, if we stand back from the apocalyptic for the moment, because A, we don't know whether they're competent enough to deliver this, and we don't know the timescale over which they deliver this, so we still have to act.
I think that the three key points is there is too much money in the world.
We've disrupted the ordinary supply of goods and we're diverting and or making redundant vast amounts of hard earned physical and human capital, both with the greenery and now, of course, with the Russian sanctions and the other fragmenting of the so-called rules based order.
All these things mean that everything will become more frictional, more expensive, more difficult.
So whatever happens to the The cost of living index over the next year, whether it peaks and comes down as they hope, we're going to have much more friction, much more difficult creating wealth, much more dislocation, much more degradation of the information on which consumers, producers and entrepreneurs rely.
Things will become more difficult, more arbitrary, and therefore valuations will be lower and the generation of wealth will be more difficult.
And therefore you have to find ways of looking at who is defending best against them.
At any particular moment.
So, like all the history of investment, you have to look for the right-minded entrepreneurs and the nimble, active people in the world of work and business.
But I think you need to look for slightly different skills in them now because they're going to have to be the people who survive, who will develop or already have the capabilities of surviving very difficult times.
Right.
Can you give me some examples of what those might be?
Well, this is a search that we're on.
I mean, I'm working with a couple of guys, a couple of three or four very clever guys in the States who are quite active investors in various fields.
And we're trying to put together a program to do this.
So I'm trying to look at the macroeconomic background to this and trying to Find little signals and hints and forewarnings.
Some of these guys are looking through their own skills in analyzing companies and looking to see in previous instances who did well, who did badly, what sorts of industries, what types of people.
And one of the other lessons, of course, is the people who've put up with this most in the last 40 years when we've forgotten how to deal with it, thanks to our great good fortune, are the people in places like Latin America, where this is a chronic problem that flares up and then goes, it's like a sort of a malaria in Latin America.
You've always got the fever.
Sometimes it's really intense and sometimes you get the chills rather than the heat, the sweats.
But these are the sorts of people who look at it.
So it's difficult.
There's no glib answer to it.
But you need to find companies who, one way or another, and the managers of these companies who realize the difficulty, who can cope with very turbulent, very rapidly changing movements in In capital investment, in pricing, in border controls.
And one of the other great problems with this sort of environment, and we've already seen it, is that traditionally, of course, our ill-educated, economically ignorant, politically fearful governments are always prone to intervene.
The minute they see something, they're the ones who knock a hole in the wall, and they go and try and put a few different bricks in place, which then Spoils the balance of the structure and weakens it rather than strengthens it.
So we're already seeing interventions to, for instance, block the exports of palm oil from Malaysia or wheat from India.
We have the Americans already talking about thinking about banning petrol exports.
The Australians are talking about banning natural gas exports.
We have the governments now.
The price of fuel is too high, so the government is sending you a check in order to allow you to continue to buy the fuel.
So there's no incentive there to economize on either or substitute or whatever.
And of course, this is another little dark area because all these little government checks and subsidies are effectively a way of getting you accustomed to the dreaded universal basic income, which is where your whole livelihood will depend upon state handouts, which of course also is most intimately linked to digital currencies which of course also is most intimately linked to digital currencies and Internet of Things transaction So this is, again, a very difficult area.
Yes, it does sound it does sound slightly like there's no hope.
I mean, I guess here's the thing.
You're a friend of my friend, Tim Price, aren't you?
Yeah.
I had a good chat with Tim about, you know, what he was, where he was.
Because because Tim is of our party he takes a similar view to us and he his belief is that this is the investing moment of a lifetime in as much as there are certain things which are going to do really really well because they've done well historically and one of those things is mining stocks which are historically massively undervalued and could perform extraordinarily
And he was also recommending a trend following fund, which is very different from a tracker fund.
He suggests that if you can invest in a fund which should take short positions as well as long ones, in other words, for those who don't know about that, to bet that the market's going to go down rather than it's going up, that these these sort of funds traditionally perform very well.
In times where all the regular funds are losing money hand over fist.
Are you with me on, or rather with Tim on this?
Well, the mining thing is clearly a case because, I mean, one of the abiding idiocies of the pretend environmental movement, and I say this because one of my little cliches is never, never confuse agreeing with somebody who actually cares about the environment because nearly all of the programs they call for destroy it rather than help it.
But if we switch away from hydrocarbons and we have to go to windmills and magic mirrors, we're going to need to dig an awful lot of holes out of the ground all over the place.
So there is a certain truth in the mining side of things.
Plus, of course, many mining companies are traditionally badly run.
The large conglomerate mining companies are now populated in their boardrooms and their executive suites by the same WF apparatchiks that we've got everywhere else.
So instead of BHP or whoever concentrating on digging out iron ore.
They're traveling around the world talking about hydrogen and whatever else is the new bit of zeitgeist to surf in this in this area.
We now have a thing.
I think today we got an election result in Latin America where Colombia looks like it's going to the first left wing government, which basically only leaves Brazil out of the whole of South America, not in a left wing Environmentally oriented, native people supporting anti-mining ideology.
So all these things are going to be more difficult.
There's going to be more and more environmental restrictions on them.
So maybe it's the miners themselves are harder sometimes or a more difficult choice.
You can't just say miners.
You have to find the ones that have the scope to move and have the right people in charge.
But clearly what they mine Is likely to remain pretty scarce for a long time.
Yes.
And the more so that they cut down hydrocarbons and chase renewables.
As for the track of the trading long short fund, I'd agree with you.
And in fact, the guys I'm trying to work with in some regards that several of them have have a background in that exactly that area.
The problem here is that you have to avoid investing in a hedge fund, which is theoretically what these things are.
Which just has the name and doesn't have the purpose because hedge funds undoubtedly end up being populated by people who just chase the fact that they can borrow a lot of this money very cheaply and end up chasing whatever is going up.
So rather than rather than these people really focusing on trying to trying to smooth out the turbulence of markets and return something to you in the meanwhile that excuse me do excuse me they're basically Fee chasers who are chasing the moment with an awful lot of leverage involved.
So you have to be careful there.
But if you can find the right ones, then yes, OK, these are the sorts of people who might be valuable to you.
Yeah, yeah.
But this this, of course, is all pie in the sky in a way.
I mean, this is sort of medium to long term we're talking about.
In the meantime, we've got to survive the coming shit show, which is which has more to do with I don't know, making sure we've got enough food, making sure that we've got the means of defending the food.
It's going to be hard, isn't it?
Well, yeah, I mean, there is part of you which thinks that you're going to have to join the Michigan militia, yeah, and learn how to fire a rifle and buy enough ammunition and live on a hill with With motion sensors and electric fences around it and some livestock and some crops in the middle.
But clearly that's not feasible for us with our soft hands and our urban lifestyles.
So, yeah, I mean, I think that is the thing.
I mean, clearly now survival is going to be a much higher priority.
And again, if we're looking at a simple economic thing for that, then yes, if we have to devote more and more of our resources and our time to the basic scrabble to survive, keep ourselves Closed, fed and warm to the extent we can, then we have far less disposable income to spend on the fripperies.
Which is partly, of course, why in the last year or so some of the lockdown beneficiaries like Peloton and all these other sorts of airy-fairy, metro-Marxist, lockdown-Lotus-Eater, diversionary Um, activities that have taken such a big hit because ultimately people won't be able to afford it, won't have the time to do it.
They'll be working two jobs and they'll be growing the chickens if they're still allowed them in their back garden rather than rather than enjoying La Dolce Vita as they have done over the past 20 years or so.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
So what are we going to?
It seems to me that This can end one of two ways.
It can end with the triumph of the elites, or the predator class, as I call them.
You know, the culmination of their decades-old, centuries-old plan to turn us all into slaves of their new system.
Or, sufficient numbers of us wake up in time to save the day.
I see my job as spreading the word through my podcasts and my punchy, punchy comments on Twitter and Getter and so on.
But I'm interested in your perspective as somebody in the financial sector.
Do you get the impression that because, look, We know that the powers that be, the cabal, the predator class, the people who fly to Davos every year, who go to Bilderberg meetings, who go to members of the Triateral Commission or the Committee of 300, we know that they are the committed baddies.
And then you've got their useful idiots, the people who are benefiting from Financially, or they feel that they will have a place above the arc, you know, with the with the predator class.
So those people are actually bad actors who are never going to be come over to our side.
But below that, you've got a lot of.
Wealth generators, entrepreneurs, people in the financial sector, CEOs of company, Companies who are beginning to realize that whatever this great reset is, they're going to be on the wrong side of it.
They are not part of the plans.
And I would have thought, for example, that would apply to the airlines.
I mean, I would have thought that the airlines are beginning to realize the CEOs, surely that that air travel is not on the list of things which are going to be permitted in the future.
People like them.
Are you getting the impression, the circles you move, that they are starting to take notice and wake up?
Or are they still asleep?
Well, are they still asleep or have they been promised their reward?
I mean, you say an airline CEO, but how many shares does the airline CEO have in the company?
How closely is his career and his financial well-being linked to the performance of the airline over the long haul?
If he can deliver his airline into some rump hydrogen-powered private jet corporation for the super-rich, he'll probably get a position on some NGO or a UN body somewhere or other and live the life of Riley even as we poor peasants shuffle back and forth.
Or the life of O'Leary, you might say.
Or one wicked Blackpool.
Well, yeah, but even O'Leary, he's been He's been as vituperative of, for instance, the anti-vaccination mandate people as anyone.
OK, so perhaps he's more aligned than, say, the head of Lufthansa is.
But how many of these people exist?
And are they still, as you say, are they still aware that their existential threat to their business, if not to themselves personally, lies with compliance?
I don't know.
I mean, ultimately, what do we need?
We need an Elect for Windsor.
We need a solidarity movement.
We need to be in the street.
None of our political parties represent us.
They're all, again, cast from the same mould.
They're all a bunch of actors who come from the same drama school.
They perform a slightly different role on the stage for our applause, and then they retire to the green room and have a drink together and laugh at us for buying tickets.
Our politicians are all of the same thing, and every time we get a political movement which tries to go back to the old values and give an alternative, they're immediately painted as far-right, extremist, and particularly where this has to be a coalition government, nobody will go into coalition with them.
So you immediately disenfranchise the 20, 25, 30% of the people who want to vote for what was a mainstream party 10 years ago, but now is being painted as Adolf Hitler's rebirth.
So if we can't do it in Parliament, we have to do it in the streets, peacefully, of course.
But we have to have mass resistance.
There are still 9 billion of us and 900,000 of them or whatever the number is, 90,000 possibly.
But until we all mobilise, they can continue pushing us.
Yeah, I think what you say about political movements is true.
I was watching this interview, an old interview with Um, with Bill Cooper, I don't believe I've come across Bill Cooper.
He's sometimes thought of as the conspiracy theorist, conspiracy theorist.
He, of course, he was, he was, he was dead right a long time ago.
Um, uh, and, and he was, he was killed for his troubles in the end.
Um, but one of the points he made was, that's right.
His interviewer asked him, you know, why do you think you're allowed to get away with, with, with saying what you say?
Um, and he said, well, Um, they're much more interested if you start to form a political party, at which point, um, they give you the warning, either, you know, if you want to carry on what you were doing, you better you better limit yourself to what you say, because otherwise you're dead meat.
And I think that applies to any of the sort of supposed insurgent parties.
You know, I mean, Nigel Farage, for example, is is is given permission to be the voice of anti-immigration.
But I think if he embraced the whole gamut of things, you know, I mean, he was he was absolutely useless throughout the the vaccine rollout and he was clapping like a performing seal for the for the NHS, along with the rest of them.
So he knows that there's only there's only so far he can go.
And I'm sure that would that would apply to any new parties that came up.
I think you're also right about That the only thing we can do is peaceful resistance in the streets, but the current political system is not going to change anything because everyone at a high level in government, anyone at cabinet level in the government knows what's going on and they have taken the side of the oppressors.
Which is not encouraging, is it?
No, that's right.
Well, I mean, The man who's supposed to be the ultimate enemy of freedom at the moment, our convenient Mr. Putin, said exactly this at St.
Petersburg this week.
He said, if you look at what they call democracy in the West, we simply vote for the same sets of people dressed in other things, and none of these elites represent their own countries and their own peoples.
And by and large, unfortunately, whether or not you like the man, whether or not you agree with what he's doing in Ukraine, he often has a knack for cutting to the very nub of the issue and saying things that That others in his position will not say and articulating them quite well.
And again, here is perfectly correct that we do not have represent.
We have a we have a sham elected dictatorship between two rotating sets of mamas who all believe in the same thing and all pursue the same agendas, with the exception of a few hot button distractions, which lends them lends them the superficial veneer of being different.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
They're just traps.
I mean, they'll Communist term for them is controlled opposition that they and this is what this is what revolutionary communist movements and similar movements have always done that the moment you seem to be a viable opposition, they co-opt you and say in some way, whether you whether it's unwittingly or otherwise that they get you and they
Funnel all the kind of potential opposition supporters into this group where they can be corralled and and yeah, it's it's it's not good By the way, I noticed earlier on you you subtly hinted that you're not a fan of cryptos is is that right?
I Think yeah, I've been a long-standing skeptic of this.
I mean, I think there's there's We're a no-coiner, Sean.
No, I'm a no-coiner, of course.
Well, I'm an old boomer, aren't I?
So I'm far too dyed-in-the-wool for all this.
So granddad, you don't know.
Yeah, the trouble is that what these people don't realise is that in the 17th century, in the 30 Years' War, we had pretty much the same thing.
It was called kipper and vipper site, where everybody issued their own new currency because there wasn't enough of the other stuff and it wasn't trustworthy.
And it's called Kipper and Whipper site because in the end it became so degenerate you had to weigh the damn stuff to try and find out what it was actually worth.
And the Kipper and Whipper is the scales moving up and down in German.
There's a certain core like all good manias and all good cults.
There's a certain core to this which has logic in that we cannot trust government to issue money.
We should have private money.
And private money should be allowed to compete so that you and I should decide what we will trust as a payment for our services and our property and find others to exchange it who will voluntarily accept that.
And therefore, that way, we keep money as a medium.
We keep it as the oil in the engine rather than the fuel.
And therefore, our underlying economic interactions are much better balanced and much more sustainable.
There clearly will still be errors and mistakes and losses and whatever, but they won't be systemic.
So there's a truth in that.
And a large part of this truth is based on things which were most prominently articulated in the last century by the guys from the so-called Austrian school.
Von Mises in the States and in Austria itself, and Friedrich Hayek over here largely, although also in the States later in his career.
But of course, they then corrupted it themselves.
They've built this whole hierarchy of fleas upon fleas upon fleas ad infinitum of this coin translates into that token, which now lends money to this.
And we've built a whole series of interlocking Ponzi schemes around this system.
So this is now collapsing.
The darker worry I have is the reason this was ever tolerated.
Because if you try to issue your own pound notes and write James Delling on them and try and pay me with them, We can both be prosecuted in most countries for counterfeiting and for breaking the state's monopoly on legal tender.
Script issue, particularly in the States, this is a big issue.
You cannot issue your own coins, but you can issue a crypto.
How did they get away with it?
Well, the dark idea here is that, again, deliberate or not, or opportunistic, this has been a beta test of the CBDCs.
This is the digital currency which will ultimately supplant them.
So when crypto collapses in a heap, The central banks around the world could say, OK, so we can understand this blockchain business and how you program it and where you do this, that and the other, because these anarchists and pirates and coiners have all very helpfully done all the sea trials for us.
So now we can launch the great ship of state and you will all have to be down below rowing at the oars forever.
So I worry that this is the thing.
I had this little thing.
Man was everywhere born free and he's now in blockchains.
So I think that's where we might end up.
Right.
OK.
Because, of course, cryptos for a lot of enthusiasts, at any rate, are our only way around the collapse of fiat currencies, which is inevitable, and our only way of avoiding, of finding a sort of parallel currency to save us from CBDCs.
Yes.
In essence, that is why they began to exert an appeal.
But as it says in itself, doesn't it?
If Bitcoin can go from fractions of a cent to $70,000 and then all the way back to $20,000 in a few weeks, it's clearly not a money.
The whole point of a money is that it stays relatively stable in value in the amount of real goods and services which is exchangeable.
So however well-intentioned this was to start with, the ultimate flaw was it became the great speculative bubble of the last five years or so.
So it defeated its own purposes.
Well, you can't really blame it for the external forces, which I mean, look, there are two factors here.
What one we live in the most extraordinary time financially, that the whole system, as you say, has been hyper manipulated.
And and it is being it is they've set the whole the controls for the heart of the sun that they're deliberately trying to destroy the financial system.
So so shares have have no no Sort of obvious metric, but you can evaluate the value of them anymore.
The bond market is just insane.
We live in extraordinary time.
So it's inevitable that there will be massive fluctuations in the price of everything.
And that includes cryptos.
So, you know, I mean, I hear what you say.
Totally.
Obviously, I'm not a no coin.
I'm still, you know.
I'm hoping all my crypto things go well.
Yeah, yeah.
Thank you.
But what's the alternative?
Are we just going to have to carry gold and silver?
Well, gold and silver, of course, have their merits.
And the world was not without its problems when gold and silver underpinned money.
But they didn't ever seem to be as large or as debilitating or as long lasting as the ones we have now.
And of course, usually the manias, panics and crashes which went in and around those were largely to do with the fact that people were trying to find ways of not using gold and silver and were piling unbacked credit on top of them, on top of the promise of their delivery, which couldn't be sustained.
So gold and silver, I mean, part of the reason I call my thing Cantillon Consulting is that Richard Cantillon was the guy who effectively profited from both the Mississippi bubble and the South Sea bubble 200 years ago and wrote part of the reason I call my thing Cantillon Consulting is that Richard Cantillon was the guy who effectively profited from both the Mississippi bubble and the South Sea bubble 200 years ago
The value of paper can go up and down.
Silver is the true sinews of the circulation.
In other words, a hard money is really at the very core.
It's part of the very structure of an exchange society.
And he wrote this 200 years ago.
So that's partly why I adapted his name.
So I'm with you on that.
But the practicalities are clearly beyond us.
We'd be in a better place if we had a gold standard or a gold silver standard, whichever.
It's very unlikely we'll get one.
I mean, there's all this talk currently out of Russia and the Far East that one of the upshots of this grand grand theft of reserves of 300 billion dollars of russians fx reserves will be that they will with their counterparts in asia and the global south as it's called will erect some form of commodity back currency which won't just be gold and silver it'll be grain and oil and fertilizers and whatever
now again there's a certain superficial appeal to this and there's a certain underlying logic to it but could it ever really be instituted and will it be instituted in our lifetimes uh i i i I have to say you have to be skeptical.
So I don't know what the answer is, James.
Crypto in some ways was a solution without a problem.
In other ways, it had a certain underpinning of sensing that we needed to get away from what we are evidently doing wrong and doing wrong on an ever larger scale.
But it has itself become a symptom Right.
of the failure of everything else.
And currently it's crashing and it's going to be replaced with something much worse out of the, out of the seeds of the ruins, the smoking ruins of crypto.
We will have the, the, the panoptic and the Skynet of the, of, of CBCD, CBDCs, I think.
Right.
I'm going to have to call you Mr. Sunshine, Sean.
I think, look, I think it's incumbent upon us, um, having painted a black picture of, of despair to try and offer at least some cause for optimism.
Um, Because look, it's shit or bust at this point.
Either, if they get their way, and this is the plan, this is something they've been planning for for years.
I mean, I was looking this morning at a clip of a David Icke interview In 1998, he was pretty, he predicted everything that's going on now, including CBDCs.
Yeah.
So this is where they're going.
They absolutely intend to take us there, at which point it's game over, there will be no rowing back from CBDCs.
Because where will you know, unless you've got a viable alternative, we're going to be stuck with it.
So we need to think About what what we're going to do.
Okay, so we're going to we're going to passive resistance fine.
But what are we going to what are we going to do as an alternative to this to this this top down controlled system?
You know, when we overthrow our political classes, or when when they sort of, you know, they lose all what what mandate they claim to have?
What are we going to replace it with?
How is it going to work?
Well, The problem is, of course, is the revolution eats its own, doesn't it?
So if we did overthrow them, what we would really need would be a bonfire of regulation, a bonfire of bureaucracy.
We'd need balanced budgets.
We'd need local democracy, probably direct democracy on the Swiss model to try and reign in government, which, by the way, is not itself foolproof or not Totally immune to being subverted or ignored.
We'd need hard money, free markets, entrepreneurialism, self-reliance.
The answers aren't new.
They're the answers that mankind has struggled with for at least 500 years, if not through the dawn of time.
But as we know, the problem is if we do overthrow it, the temptation is that those who are in power gradually become wedded to power and power structures and also even where the even where their own motives are purer than that they tend to be subject to a messiah complex they saved the world once
and so they therefore have to come back and like cincinnatus but without ever leaving the plow they continue always to be there to to redirect us along the right lines as they see it every time we poor humans air and stray from the path, and we end up back somewhere in the same situation.
But of course, we could win 70 years, 100 years or more of freedom if we do it.
The Soviet Union fell after 70 years of tyranny, partly because in the end the ruling elite got fed up with it and the people who were underpinning it, the apparatus, the security forces, the army, whoever, Didn't see any upside for themselves and so didn't fight to sustain it.
Could we get to that point with what we have now?
Well, that would be the longer term hope, even if it is somewhat of a of a dim candle.
The problem, as you say, is with this rush towards the sort of technologically backed eco feudalism, which the Devosians want with all this, you know, wild talk of useless eaters and transhuman Alteration and genetic modification and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah.
Will we ever have the chance to come back if we cross that threshold?
I mean, these really are.
It's the eschatol, isn't it?
It is.
It is arguably the worst situation, because it's not just now a human tyranny.
It's an anti-human tyranny that we face.
Yes.
Eschatol, would you say?
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's sort of the last thing.
Yeah.
Yeah, well, that's it.
I mean, I've become very interested in eschatology recently.
I mean, I mean, in a way, I think that you said you sound to me like you're pretty black pilled.
And the only stage after the black pill, if you're for those interested in such things as the white pill, you know, you realize that things are so completely over, that that it's up to God to sort this one out, because it does feel like we're living in in end times.
And that this is these, we are approaching the day of judgment, because The forces we're up against are so monstrously evil that only with God's help we can win.
But final, final thing.
You're in Switzerland.
I used to think of Switzerland as the safe haven, the place that, you know, not least because you're allowed to have your own guns.
You know, you require that you by law to have your own guns.
But I realized that that's not quite true.
But yeah.
Young people are supposed to know how to fire them.
Let's put it that way.
You're not required to keep one.
But the reason that Switzerland was given its neutral status actually was so that the cabal, the elites, could use it as their kind of safe haven for their ill-gotten gains.
It was nothing to do with a sort of proudly independent country just carving out a niche for itself.
Uh, in a world where freedoms are being taken away.
I mean, you know, you only have to look at the opening of the, uh, the, the ceremony performed at the opening of that, of that tunnel.
Um, with all the kind of satanic ritual in it or, or CERN, which is absolutely dodgy as dodgy as hell.
I mean, I think that is, that is a satanic project.
And I don't get, I last time I was in Switzerland, I didn't get the vibe that, that, that your, your, your parliament was any less infiltrated by By kind of, you know, the sort of cultural Marxist forces than anywhere else.
But tell me, how have your experiences been in the last couple of years in Switzerland?
Well, clearly, Switzerland, as you say, it's not an island in the global situation.
Clearly, there are young people have been indoctrinated, what we used to call the MTV generation, but that's well past now.
But the smartphone junkies, Are continually indoctrinated to believe in open borders and free migration and all the rest of the agenda.
The politicians themselves, of course, are subject to the to the same currents, to the same upbringing.
The very ambitious realized that if they could ever deliver Switzerland to the EU or NATO, they themselves would be have a great, lucrative, powerful role, glorious role on the world stage thereafter as reward for their treachery.
So, but here you will find people talk about Bundesbörn, the central government in Bern, in the same sort of derogatory terms as the red states in America will talk about the Beltway.
And you will find lots of local politicians deriding the erosions of freedom and Switzerland's special status and even the overturning of popular sovereignty.
It's still a very big thing here.
It hasn't yet gone.
It is definitely It is definitely subject to erosion.
It is always subject to onslaught.
I mean, the Europeans never stop bullying Switzerland and never stop bad faith acting and reneging on past agreements and trying to introduce retrospective clauses to whatever commercial and cultural ties they have.
They never stop bullying it because the Bonapartists in Brussels want to want to take over the world without force of arms, but by using their so-called economic might to do in their soft power to do it.
So Switzerland is not immune.
And has changed somewhat for the worse from our perspective in these terms.
But it's still it's still it's still probably at the back of the of the Gadarene rush to self-destruction, which most of the other nations of the West are in.
Yeah, except that it was I think what put me off Switzerland most was that it seemed to be quite assiduous in pushing vaccine mandates.
No, they didn't mandate us.
They gave us a pass and they excluded those of us who decided that we didn't want it or didn't need it from a lot of society.
But it was never anywhere as bad as as Germany, France or Italy.
No.
So if you had your green card, if you had your pass, you could get in and do this, that and the other.
And you had to have your schedule up to date for that.
But The restrictions here were less draconian than elsewhere.
They were still too much, because as we know, lockdown itself was not only an epidemiological nonsense, but it was a grand assault on personal liberty.
But the Swiss did always allow you to take a quick test or whatever test to do whatever you needed to do if you did it.
And except for a very few professions, there were no there were no forced dismissals.
So it wasn't perfect.
And there was a lot of criticism.
And there still is, because They've extended the emergency legislation for another year, pointlessly.
The scaremongers on our equivalent of SAGE are already trying to talk up an autumn wave.
They've already bought another 30 million vaccine poisons for next year, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
The pass is still in operation because it may be needed to travel to other European countries, such and such and such.
But again, it's a lesser evil, but it has been one of the lesser evils here.
Right.
So I'm not going to ask you about your VAX status.
I think I can probably guess.
But what was it like if you didn't have one of those passes?
How difficult was it to do stuff?
Well, if you didn't want to go, if you wanted to go to a pub or a restaurant, you had to take a rapid test.
So that meant you spent Friday night queuing up to get one.
But for most of it, that then gave you 48 hours over the weekend to do your leisure activities.
You weren't barred from much in the way of of real life and you were never locked indoors.
I mean, they started to put something in about no more than 12 people indoors.
And there was quite a lot of pushback against that at one point.
And it was never really enforced, even in the worst of the first wave of the pandemic.
We were all allowed out and about in the streets.
They briefly started to try to discourage travel from one area of Switzerland to another.
But again, there was an immediate there was an immediate outpouring of outrage and they backed off on it.
So, for instance, while you poor Brits were all locked in your gardens with somebody snooping over ready to report you, we could go out cycling, hiking, swimming as long as we weren't in a group of I don't know what it was, five or ten, and we weren't all clustered together and blah, blah, blah.
So there were restrictions on liberties, but they were they were given the The monolith nature of how these spread from one European country to another, where all the governments played lockdown leapfrog.
Well, if they are doing it, we need to do it.
We need to do some more.
The Swiss, again, were very much at the back of the queue, so they were not blameless.
But given the circumstances and the pressures, they probably did as well as one might practically expect.
Right.
OK, so I'm now revising my plans.
Maybe Switzerland is a potential It's not a utopia and it's not a complete safe haven, but it's it's it's far, far from being the worst place you can be at the moment.
Yes.
Yeah, I know.
I think we know what that is.
That's got to be either Australia, Canada or New Zealand.
I mean, he'd want to be there.
Terrifying.
Mind you, Germany, Germany, France and.
Well, Germany, now they're talking about this old zoo, old regal, aren't they?
The the October Zoo, Austin.
So the idea now is they'll pass a law that from October to Easter every year, you will have to wear your mask in perpetuity indoors, including in your car, which is wonderful, of course, because it'll help keep them warm when they have no gas this winter.
So, you know, perhaps it's all joined up government.
Oh, dear.
Oh, dear.
And the Germans used to fancy themselves as so big and clever, didn't they?
You know, when they had their when they had their pants, they were rolling across Europe and look at them now anyway.
I love the Germans, by the way.
Sean, thank you so much for doing this, appearing on DealingPod.
And thank you for your depressing wisdom.
Well, I hope everyone doesn't rush out and commit suicide after listening to this, if they do do so.
Yeah, well, thank you for having me on.
It's been a pleasure.
Yeah.
You could be as effective as the jab in bringing about premature deaths.
Not quite my purpose in life, but there you go.
Well, um, so, um, Sean, just tell us what, if people want to consult Cantillon Consulting, tell us about where they can find you.
Well, the easiest thing is, uh, you'll, you'll find, you'll find me as you did, you did on Twitter at CantillonCH.
Um, and the easiest thing from there is there's an email address associated with it or whatever.
If you need something, drop me a line, send me a message, follow me.
Um, and if there's something that you'd like to discuss, I'll take it up from there.
That's probably the simplest way.
Yeah, yeah.
It'd be like, where can I get some cyanide, Sean?
Great.
Well, if you've enjoyed this podcast, I'm not sure enjoyed is quite the right word, but if you found it interesting, I do hope you'll find it in your hearts to support me or to continue supporting me on Locals, on Substack, on Subscribestar and on Patreon.
You can still pay me in fiat currency while it works.
And CBDC's in the future, no doubt.
At which point I won't be able to spend it because I'll probably be in the gulags.
Thanks very much, Sean.
Thank you, James.
Take care.
▲
Export Selection