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Oct. 29, 2020 - The Truth Central - Dr. Jerome Corsi
01:09:21
Dr CVorsi DEEP DIVE Interview 10-28-20: Are Masks Necessary And Are They Harmful
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Thank you.
Okay.
So, Dr. Corsi, I am surrounded by you and three other doctors.
So what are we doing today?
Well, we're going to talk about masks and whether or not the masks are actually useful in preventing COVID-19 or whether they are harmful.
And Dr. Graves has put together a very good panel for us today with Dr.
Richard Urso and Dr.
Lee Merritt. And Dr.
Graves, thank you for putting this together.
Do you want to introduce your guests?
Yes, I would like to.
Dr. Richard Urso is very active, and so is Dr.
Lee Merritt. And I call these two freedom fighters.
Freedom Fighters for Medicine.
That's exactly what they are.
And they don't give up and they don't give in.
And they have research behind what they say and data And they can back up what they are presenting to the American people.
And they do this in many different ways.
And today we're privileged to have them on the show.
So thank you so much, both of you, for coming.
And we'll come back to you, Dr.
Graves, from time to time to comment and see how we're going along.
Dr. Urso, do you want to introduce yourself first and say a few introductory words?
Yes, sir. Thank you, Dr.
Corsi. Thank you, Dr. Graves.
I appreciate you guys inviting me to be here, and Dr.
Merritt also. My background, actually, I'm an ophthalmologist in training, but I did a lot of work with tissue culture for 11 years.
I developed a drug Nerve growth factor for topical wound healing.
And I felt like when this pandemic started, I had a lot that I could maybe contribute from a drug delivery And potentially, like I always think about things in terms of mitigation strategies, sometimes we don't have an ideal solution, and I felt like it was necessary.
I had a lot of experience with some of the drugs that were candidate drugs for the disease, and I saw no one was speaking out, and I'd had written a couple of patents on one drug went through the FDA and a couple of others that I still have in development that were on some of the drugs that were useful against this disease.
And so I got involved from that perspective, and I was really, really taken back by the fact that while we had a lot of mitigation strategies for every single disease we ever have, all of a sudden we didn't have treatment for a disease that had breathing problems, inflammation, infection, and blood clots.
So it just seemed really strange to me, and so I felt like I had to add my voice to this whole process.
In fact, there are no drugs yet recommended for prevention or early-stage treatment.
I think remdesivir is the only one that's received any approval.
Is that correct, doctor? Well, if you want, I can laugh now.
We can break this down clinically into infectious process, an inflammatory process, problems with breathing, and problems with blood clots.
We clearly have lots of outpatient medicines for blood clots.
Clearly, we do. So to not mitigate against blood clots would be really silly.
We clearly have lots of things that can help with inflammatory disease of the lung.
You know, all the asthma drugs work quite well, budesonide and some of the others.
So if people are having struggling breathing, it doesn't make sense that you wouldn't treat them.
Typically, that's going to happen in that second week when the viral load is going to be gone anyway.
And then, obviously, we have lots of medicines for inflammation, so it doesn't matter.
So in a sense, you can think of disease tolerance.
As part of this process, how do we limit damage?
And then we can think about attacking the infection part of it.
We can have a lot of talks about whether or not we have effective strategies for targeting the disease itself, but clearly we have mitigation strategies for inflammation, blood clots, and for breathing problems.
And I thought we had quite a good list of potential candidates on the infection side attacking the virus itself.
I think that's important.
That's not our precise subject today, but it's very helpful to get that started.
Dr. Merritt, do you want to give an introduction of yourself and a few introductory comments?
Sure. I'm an orthopedic surgeon.
I specialized in spine, and I did trauma for 30-some years, almost 40 years.
So I've lived in a mask.
And I also served on the NRAC, which you're probably familiar with in D.C., but it's the Navy Research Advisory Committee.
And it's basically a congressional committee, and by law, they have to have a physician on there.
And I was on it for a number of years.
And I looked at the time, this is quite a while ago, but I was looking at smallpox as a bioweapon.
Because when you really look at the world, that was the big bad actor that I was really afraid of.
And, you know, smallpox killed more people in the 20th century than all the wars put together.
If masks, it's a 0.2 micron virus.
These viruses, this virus we're dealing was at 0.12 microns, but they're all similar.
Airborne, very transmissible viruses.
And quite frankly, if masks had worked, I think we could have done a better job with smallpox.
What got me involved in this is, I always joke with my patients, if you want to know how to treat something that you have, just find the doctor with your disease.
So when this whole thing broke out, many of us who were basically not, because I was not working as a trauma surgeon, I was an elective surgeon, I got shut down and sat home for two months on my computer and interacting with doctors all over the world and getting to meet great doctors like Dr.
Erso and finding out all sorts of new things.
And I just heard unbelievably false statements being made about masks and about these small particle viruses and how they were transmitted.
And I just realized there was something afoot and I had to get involved.
Well, I'm not an MD and I'm not a medical scientist.
I'm a political scientist and I've worked as an investigative journalist.
So I don't claim any expertise in this area, but having listened to Dr.
Fauci and the medical experts from the NIH and the CDC, I mean, they get you dizzy with all their contradictory advice.
I mean, masks are supposed to be no good at all, and then we've all got to have masks, and then it's a crime if you don't have masks, and people are out arresting and demanding.
Of course, unless you want to riot.
If you want to riot and have Black Lives Matter and Antifa, you don't have to.
social distance or wear masks or do anything else except loot and riot and burn and create chaos.
So at any rate, I guess the beginning point, and Dr.
Urso will start with you, is that, I mean, the basic fundamental questions, is there any medical science behind the idea that Masks are going to prevent a disease like COVID-19 either from spreading, that we don't spread the disease if we have it, or we don't receive it if we don't have it from someone who does have it.
I mean, is there any scientific basis for that contention?
That's a great question.
You know, I actually, and the answer is no.
But, you know, I had done a lot of work.
I was at MD Anderson. I did work with tumor viruses, human papillomavirus.
And we work sometimes in a level 2 lab, and we'd never wear a piece of cloth, a hanky.
I mean, it's just, you know, everyone knows that that's not going to work.
And if you take a look at a lot of the people who do work with viruses at the highest levels, you know, they're all wearing pretty much what you'd call a hazmat suit.
So we know a lot of work's been done historically for the flu, and they're basically about the same size virus.
The COVID virus is actually a lipid capsule, so it's quite slippery.
It doesn't stick to water very easily.
And so not only is the virus a lot smaller than the holes in these typical masks, but a lot of data has been collected over the years.
So if we look at studies that have been done multiple times, they've done not only studies, but they've done meta-analysis.
And if you look over and over, And all those studies, there's very little data showing that it works.
There's maybe two studies that show some benefit, and there's out of maybe 128 that I was able to look at at one point.
So what we find actually is that when we look at cloth masks, for instance, it's actually not only Not only is it not beneficial, but it may actually be harmful because it acts like a petri dish.
And the other thing is, you know, even Fauci was quite, you know, he was quite helpful with this.
He said, when you have a mask on, you see a lot of, unfortunately, in healthcare settings and community settings, There's a lot of fiddling.
And so for various reasons, there's probably more fomite transmission when you have a mask.
You're always touching it. We know not in the OR to ever do that.
But clearly in study after study after study after study, it was not effective.
And I'll tell you, Dr. Corsi, one of the things for me as a doc, I love to give patients prophylactic things that they can do to help themselves.
to overcome disease.
Another mitigation strategy.
What can we do to help people?
So I was really wanting to say to people, yes, it'll work.
I was looking, I even looked at all the N95. I was like, you know, but the N95 is really even not, that's the two studies that actually were helpful.
But they're not that protective because even in N95, it's a non-oil, N stands for non-oil resistant.
And a lot of these little particles would just blow right through there because first of all, they're smaller.
Electrostatic charges. You know, you're talking about lipid capsules.
I don't know. In the flu research, again, it's very inconclusive that they work.
And all the fiddling and the fact that they don't fit well, I think clearly I felt bad about the fact that I couldn't tell patients, hey, this works.
And so for a while, I just kept quiet about it.
Because I didn't want to take away the placebo effect of wearing a mask.
And I'll tell you, it's really a bad part of being a dog is telling people, hey, this is not going to work.
And so what really got me going and feeling like I needed to speak out, though, was the harm of masks.
Masks divide. Masks become a virtue signal in a sense.
We now have this idea that masks and a lot of this fear is actually a virtue all of a sudden.
And in fact, if you're not going to go along with the program, you're a bad person.
And I just, at that point, when I saw people, old woman getting punched in the stomach, somebody getting tased, people arrested, an 18 and a half month old thrown off a plane.
At that point, I felt like, you know, I literally cannot be quiet anymore.
We are actually creating harm with the masks on various levels.
One is they don't work and we're creating mass divides now because it's been a culture where, you know, when I go to Thanksgiving, I'm worried that my neighbor is going to tell that we have 20 people over there and it's just two families.
But we have a lot of family.
Like I told you, I had six kids.
And now I'm going to be worried if I don't wear my mask, if somebody's going to accost me on the street.
I had somebody tell me today that she got yelled at by some 6'3", 280 pound guy that scared the heck out of her and her eight year old kid for not wearing a mask.
And it's just mass divide and they're harmful.
And if you look at children, if you look at the effects on children, you're seeing that all that, especially in the under eight year old group, All those cues, those social cues, have gotten to the point where they miss out on that.
And after a while, they feel like they're in trouble.
They don't wear their mask, they're in trouble.
And we have kids that are autistic kids that are wearing their mask at home because they feel like they're going to be in trouble if they don't wear the mask.
They don't want to be different. So there's harm.
They don't work. And I felt like because masks divide our culture, and they did a brilliant, brilliant selling piece of my mask protects, You and your mask protects me.
It's like, you know, how do they get away with that?
I mean, my food nourishes you and your food nourishes me.
I mean, does that make any sense?
I mean, so anyway, that's my opening thoughts on that.
Okay, that's very good. And Dr.
Merritt, the same question.
Is there any scientific medical science that would say that wearing masks is going to help prevent COVID-19?
Well, and I want to talk about the science because, you know, I always hear this, and I heard this from a high school teacher in my town, oh, for every paper you can cite that masks don't work, I can find five that say they do.
And that's generally what's happening here.
I've been fighting the mask mandate in Omaha, Nebraska.
And I'm fighting against essentially the entire University of Nebraska Medical Center staff.
They seem to be just completely bought into this.
So when you look at the evidence here, it's not about counting papers.
It's about the quality of the evidence.
And these guys at the university, they love controlled studies.
They really love randomized controlled trials until it doesn't fit their narrative.
So what you're hearing from the people that believe in masks are basically two things.
The papers, and there's actually some fraudulent papers out there.
We've gotten to the point where people are accepting papers into the major medical journals that are theoretically peer-reviewed.
That are just unbelievably bad and would never have made this muster in a real world.
So the fix is in on some of this.
But there are two types of false papers.
The first is a classic post hoc ergo proctor hoc argument.
In other words, because something happened before something, it caused it.
And the argument here is, look, in New York City, when we put on masks, the death rate went down.
Well, they're showing a bell-shaped curve, the exact same curve of Sweden or France or the UK or any other nation or place you want to show.
It's a seasonal death curve of viruses.
Now, the magnitude can be worse or better, depending on where you're looking.
But their masks did not change that curve.
They want to tell you that social distancing didn't work because, look, the curve went up.
And then isolation helped because, oh, we flattened the curve.
And then masks really worked because, look how it went down.
It's nonsense. That's a nonsensical argument, but they're accepting that.
The second type of argument is, well, we know that masks cut down on some of the particles getting through, so it must work.
It must decrease your amount of input to you, and so you're not going to have as much virus floating around.
But that's just also not the case, and it's not the case on the infectious disease literature.
We used to think that the preponderance of people in the infectious disease community used to believe you had to have a certain viral load.
Below that, unless you got really hit with a lot of viruses, it didn't make a difference.
But now, when they've actually looked at, that was basically a fallacy of how they were doing the tests.
Now they believe one virion.
And they know for a vet, they've figured it out for adenovirus.
It's about six viruses.
So one virion is one virus particle can be infectious.
So the idea that, oh, I'll just cut down by 40% and it'll make a difference is fallacious.
And the other thing I have to laugh at as a surgeon, and Dr.
Ursa knows this too, You know, here's what we're taught.
So there are multiple types of masks.
The N95 mask is not the one you get from OSHA. That has a one-way valve.
And so, yeah, you might screen out some particles coming in, but when you breathe out, it just blows out all over your neighbor.
That's not useful.
The N95 surgical mask, when we're in surgery, and this was designed for tuberculosis, which is a much bigger particle, a much bigger wet globular particle that can be screened by the N95 mask.
But it's fit to us.
It comes in sizes. We're taught how to put it on, and as surgeons, we know how to take it off so we're not contaminating ourselves or the world.
But that's obviously not what's happening.
What we're seeing are people in cloth masks that when they take them off to go to dinner, they put them on the table, they put their phone on them, they don't wash their hands after they touch their masks.
Their masks are visibly dirty in some cases.
They don't wash them every five minutes.
It's a nightmare. Now, there's only been one randomized control study of cloth masks.
It was published in 2018 in the British Medical Journal.
And what it showed is that if you put on this cloth mask regularly, this was in healthcare workers, you had six times more risk of getting sick with an influenza-like virus than if you didn't wear a mask.
That was the conclusion.
And it actually showed also that That surgical masks weren't that protective.
It showed that 97% of the particles went through the cloth mask and 44% through the surgical mask.
I'll just say this last thing about medical school.
When you're taught to wear a surgical mask in the OR, this is funny, because I hear this all the time from people.
This is one of those other myths of masks.
Well, I know it helps because it keeps me from sneezing on my neighbor.
No, it doesn't. It keeps you from visibly sneezing on your neighbor.
But what really the damaging particles are, are the ones you don't see.
It's not the big globular particles.
Viruses, we've tested that.
The viruses are dead in those particles.
The particles that get you are the ones you don't see.
The tiny little virons that slip out.
We're taught in this surgical suite when we're medical students, if you're holding a retractor and the surgeon's about ready to do some big case and you can't move, what do you do when you sneeze?
You know, there's all these kind of rules we have in the OR. And your tendency is you want to look behind you.
You want to turn as far away from you as you can.
But what that does is present the side of the mask towards the patient wound and they know.
We just sneeze that stuff out the side of the mask.
So we know that doesn't work.
So there's a lot of mythical thinking about this.
I heard an epidemiologist from UNMC yesterday say that, well, he's got a lot of surgeon friends, and if there were a problem wearing masks, we'd know about it.
Well, there actually are problems.
He probably doesn't look at the literature.
It actually does show that blood gases change in surgeons, especially older ones like me, after four hours.
And I bet he's actually never measured the data.
Again, this is kind of like the models of different things.
You know, it's always nice to have a model, but let's look at the data of reality.
My friend who's an internist has a meter for looking at CO2. And when she actually put the CO2 meter in the mask, It went up above 9,000 parts per million.
Now, OSHA says 1,000 parts per million is the upper limit that they will allow.
So the science that they're presenting is, number one, false.
And I'm with Dr. Erso. The biggest problem is they don't consider that, number one, we have other options, good early treatment, for example.
And the second thing is they don't ever talk about the risks of wearing masks.
And I had, I think, yes, I think there's a problem for anybody that wears a mask.
If somebody has heart condition, my advice is if they force you to wear a mask, you get the least competent mask possible.
Those little stupid paper ear loop mask, because you want oxygen and you want the CO2 to be off gas.
You don't want to wear a really competent mask.
And these cloth masks may not hold the virus back, but they do give you CO2 buildup.
And if you're getting a heart condition, you better jerk that thing right off and get some fresh air if you're having chest pain.
That's the problem. So there's a lot of risk with this, not the least of which to our children, because children need to read faces to develop.
And I sat next to, at our white coat summit that both of us went to not too long ago, I sat next to a pediatric psychiatrist and I just asked him a simple question.
If we stop these mask mandate If there's this mask mandate nonsense right now, will our children be okay?
And he basically said no.
He said, this is like putting children in a swimming pool and bringing up the water.
The shortest ones drown first.
So the people that are damaged, the children that always have, they're not from great homes, they have problems, they're being damaged by this.
And I hear this from social workers and teachers.
Yeah, if you're an older child, like Dr.
Urso said, over eight, and you've got a good family background and you've got things going, you're probably going to be okay if we stop it now.
But there's a point at which even they're not going to be okay.
We have to stop this.
We're seeing suicides in teenagers.
So that's probably the worst risk, but there are others.
It's interesting because I think in the public consciousness,
when MDs are in operations, and even if you've never been in an operating room,
never had an operation, seeing the movies or the pictures,
you always see surgeons wearing masks.
So the idea is common culture.
Well, if the surgeons do this, this is an antiseptic environment.
They're trying to prevent any disease from coming into the body when it's cut open.
Well, clearly the mask must have, just like all the gowns and all the other equipment,
the washing that the surgeons do.
So masks must have some impact because the popular culture and the mind
gets to form this image.
Dr. Urso, what do you think of that?
Thank you.
That's a great point.
You know, a surgeon's mentality is pretty, for lack of a better word, pretty macho.
You know, we wear a mask.
We'll wear it all day. But the reality is masks do, you know, you are going to retain CO2. I mean, there's no question about it.
I saw kids running sprints in masks outside with a woman kind of pointing at them.
Basically, some of the kids were like pulling the mask down because they were It's not running out of their nose.
And she was sitting there.
And we literally had a person who is now appointed as the mass police on kids that are in lower high school and telling them to pull their mass back up.
And they're on an open field.
I mean, we've gotten to this ridiculous point where, like I said, mass divide.
Mass are creating a lot of problems.
And they clearly, we know from our surgical experience that they do not work.
for the flu.
COVID, lipid capsule, N95, and even N95, like I said, a couple of studies that were positive were N95, but they did not, for the most part, most of these studies didn't work.
And a lot of the reasons why, when people theorize about it, it's because of the fiddling.
It's because when they cultured stuff on the clothes, with the mask going out the side, they found the clothes were full of bacteria.
And people were touching their clothes and things, but surgeons don't.
Like Dr. Merritt said, we know we never do that.
We just... In fact, I remember the first time I touched the mask, I got yelled at because people said, we've got another nose picker, and I was looking around to see who it was, and they were talking about me, and I was like, what did I do?
They're like, you've been touching your mask, and it's like picking your nose, and I was like, what do you mean?
They go, well, all the bacteria, everything's on your mask right now.
Don't touch you. Do not touch anything you touch.
You cannot touch anything above or below a certain point, and so Even if you're observing, they don't want you doing that because you're going to then touch other things in the room.
At the end of the day, we don't have to reinvent the wheel.
Like Dr. Merritt said, unfortunately, we've had a year of science fiction rather than science.
I don't know why they're doing that.
The Lancet just published an article of complete fabrication by Harvard doctors of all things.
They basically said that hydroxychloroquine doesn't work and it was killing people.
They're obviously a complete fabrication.
We know because they retracted it because there was no data set.
They actually asked, say, let's see the data, and they didn't have one.
So, I mean, that's our major journals.
They're being political.
They're being politicized.
They're offering advice for us on how to vote.
They're offering advice on masks that doesn't actually go for the last three decades, where we saw that, unfortunately, The flu virus doesn't work, gets through these masks.
And let me give you an example.
In Canada, and I can't recall the exact dates, but I think it was like 2012 or 13 or 14, a group of nurses who were forced to wear the mask because they Didn't take the flu vaccine, made an argument, they went to court, and they won the case because they showed the data that it doesn't stop the flu.
So it's not going to stop COVID. COVID is the same size or smaller, and it's got a lipid capsule.
It's going to go right through. Now, there are things that work, Dr.
Corsi. There are. But I mean, basically, you're going to have to get in a space suit if you really want it to work.
Right. And, you know, that's why this is not a smart deal, because they don't work.
We're just being a placebo.
And I think it's really a control factor.
And we're not even getting to the point, which you actually can probably address really well, which I almost want to throw it back to you.
It's the civil liberties problem.
And I mean, at some point, we're doing things that are placebo.
And in a sense, we're Our civil liberties are being taken away.
Our rights are being taken away.
That's my feeling on it.
We're going to get to that because I think what you're saying is they have more of a social control impact than a real health impact.
I'd be interested in Dr.
Merritt in the same question.
We have this culture of people visualizing the Surgical operation room.
And everybody's wearing masks.
Everybody's wearing gowns.
Everybody's washed up.
And, you know, so masks must play an impact.
I think the public mind just logically draws that conclusion.
Well, in the operating room, masks are there for two reasons.
One is so we don't accidentally...
And this is high-level surgical medical discussion.
One is so we don't drool into the wound or accidentally have our nose leak into the wound.
And the other one is so we don't...
Yeah, it's splashed from blood and fluids.
It's that simple. I mean, it's to protect us and it's to protect the patient, but not from viruses.
Nobody ever thought it was from viruses up until this outbreak.
And, you know, people that have this idea that it really is holding, there's so many studies that show That they don't even hold the particles in.
When they really put them into a head clamp, and the Maryland Institute of Environmental Sciences or something did this, and they showed that it's the small particles that get through, and those are the damaging ones.
So they really don't work.
It is a political.
And for whatever reason, though, the reason it's so important here, masks may not seem like a big step, But they're going so overboard.
The other thing, in addition to, it's almost humorous, some of the stuff that's being, it would be humorous if it weren't so serious, the stuff in the literature that they're fabricating.
But why are they so, you know, why are they so just exercised over masks when there are other things we could do?
For example, there's no question that we can mitigate the environment.
You know, one of the false narratives here is that When you sneeze or when you breathe, the viruses are coming out of you and they're just going towards the person that is in front of you.
That's not the way the world is.
We live in a fishbowl.
If you could picture that all the air around you is like a fishbowl filled with little viruses that are part of air fluidity.
And in fact, there's a very, very smart guy, Dennis Rancourt, who has put out great videos of this.
And great article about reviewing this and talking about the physics of the airflow and what this means.
And he said, even if all the masking in the world, if the mask worked 100%, the minute you take the mask off your mouth, you're exposed to what's around you.
And, you know, the funny thing is, all the people publishing these papers and the guys that are really involved in this masking up are, in my opinion, not as smart as the common guy who, like the bartender in a restaurant where we go, said, isn't this silly?
You know, you have to wear a mask to get in here, but the minute you get in here, you can take it off and sit at the bar and sit at the tables.
That is only for people control.
You cannot argue that in any reasonable scientific way.
You see people in Las Vegas at the casinos taking their masks down below their chin to smoke.
Come on now. This is a joke.
Even if they only work in laboratory environments, they don't work outside of the hospital.
Dr. Graves, you want to comment at this point?
There's quite an interesting discussion.
Several things. When you are in a surgical suite, we have to remember that that is a controlled environment.
It's not like what we live every day, going to the store or living in our homes or participating in life.
It's a very controlled situation.
For one thing, the temperature is much lower.
We know that. We know that there are all kinds of filtering of that air, and so on and so forth.
And so it's certainly not the mask that is protecting the patient or us, other than just exactly what Dr.
Merritt just said. You know, and it's not very scientific.
It's for protecting us from sneezing into a wound or drooling, as she said, or any other type of thing, or protecting us from the blood.
And so this is just so ridiculous.
And just like she just commented on, I mean, I go to a place where I work out and you walk in the door, you have to wear your mask to check in.
And then as soon as you're checked in, you take your mask off and go in and work out.
I mean, that is ludicrous.
I have another place that I go to to work out and the health department came in and told him that he has to have the people mask when they come in the door.
It's exactly 13 feet from the door to where you work out.
And so they have to wear, the health department wants everybody to wear a mask 13 feet into the door.
And then take off their masks to work out.
That's how ridiculous this is.
This is nothing more than puffed up dust, which is people.
They're just puffed up dust who have got a little bit of authority and now they are taking it to an extreme.
That's what it is.
A very good point.
Dr. Urso, I've often commented, just again from a common sense point, we're not born in little biohazard suits.
We don't come in with a space suit on.
So evidently, God's design is that we're supposed to be out here in the environment and From what I've read about virology, we already have lots of viruses in our bodies.
They're from past generations, who knows, but they're there.
And there's always viruses and bacteria of various kinds in the atmosphere, but there's also antibodies that are exchanged between people, which are partly by breathing.
There's many things in the environment.
And if God had meant us to be screening all of these out, living in an antiseptic environment, it seems to me like the whole purpose is to get your immune system to be robust enough to handle many of these threats.
Am I completely off-key here?
No, that brought up a really good point to me.
This has been looked at in dentists, because you can imagine the massive amounts of exposure dentists have had.
So over the years, some studies have been looked at on dentists, and they basically saw that because they get this massive exposure to upper respiratory viruses, that is incredibly rich In the upper respiratory system, secretory IgA, and they're just very, very resistant overall to infection because our immune system, like I said, disease tolerance mechanisms, they mitigate problems in a sense.
Probably in this case, I think I could think about it, that one thing that mitigates the disease for kids is that they have a lot less ACE2 receptors.
But in this case, with dentists and older people, They develop other mechanisms in a sense.
Sometimes you can have some attacking things, B and T cell immunity, but then again, there are other mitigating disease tolerance.
So attacking things are one side of it and disease tolerance is another.
And what you find is in those populations that have really high exposures, historically, They've had really interesting immune systems where they had high amounts of...
In this case, I know the dentists have really high amounts of secretory IgA, which is an antibody that basically helps them to defend themselves against this.
And so that's what you see in nature.
And we've historically, over many years, in all pandemics, we see, again, a natural pattern.
There's a high list of susceptibles early on in the disease, a lot of cases, a lot of deaths.
And then it's the susceptibles...
You know, perish.
You then end up with a smaller spike later on.
And really what we're seeing here, there's no data to show that doing a mask has actually helped that at all, ever in any time.
They did do a little masking back in 1918.
But again, if you look at the data right now that they're putting out there, like Dr.
Merritt said earlier, it's pretty much garbage data.
And our own immune systems are quite successful at helping us.
They're wonderful machines at helping us to defend ourselves against these things.
So I'm going to go back to one last statement, Dr.
Corsi, because I don't know if I made this clear enough.
But in all the health, I said a couple of the studies showed a little bit of benefit with N95. But overall, when they did the things that we're talking about, in healthcare workers and in community settings, In M95 and below, none of those studies have worked.
None of the studies where they actually went out and tested people.
And now, they weren't masterly powered, so it wasn't like thousands of people.
So you could say it was a little underpowered.
But at the end of the day, none of those studies, none of those randomized controlled trials, not one, not zero, worked.
So I think it's clear.
I think to make that argument, You have to have data.
And unfortunately, they don't have data.
And as you said, we've been doing this for millennia, and we've been doing it quite successfully.
Right. Dr. Barrett, the same question?
Well, I mean, actually, I had the honor of falling asleep right in front of Tony Fauci one time.
And, you know, I should have stayed asleep rather than listen to him.
But he, you know, he flip-flops all over the place in this mask.
As Dr. Urso said, there are a lot of papers.
One of them actually just came out on influenza, published in the CDC's own journal just last summer, just while this was all going on in May of 2020.
And what it showed is they looked at influenza and they looked at in the community to try and stop community spread.
And they looked at three things.
Masks and they did wear High-level masks.
They weren't the little cloth masks.
But they wore good masks, hand washing, and disinfecting your environment.
And believe it or not, none of it made a difference to influenza.
So if it doesn't work for that, it doesn't work for this.
And they know it. That's my point.
The other thing is, he mentioned the pandemic of 1918, which is an interesting point, because they don't tell you the whole stuff about that either.
You know, we lost 50 million people worldwide, roughly, in the pandemic of 1918, as opposed to this non-pandemic of a million, okay?
Now, but who is it that died in the pandemic?
It was very clear.
It was the people that never had been exposed or gotten sick with the flu.
So, for example, in China, where they had an epidemic of flu a few years before the pandemic of 1918, they had very few deaths.
Now, they weren't vaccinating anybody.
They weren't masking anybody.
They just let people get sick.
And they had very few deaths.
In India, where they hadn't had an epidemic of flu for a long time, people were dying so fast they couldn't even burn them.
And our Eskimo villages, the Eskimo up in Alaska, they wiped out whole villages because, again, they'd never been exposed to the flu.
And the problem, one of the other myths here is we should never get sick.
We should never expose ourselves.
We're creating a generation, especially I see this in the 20-year-olds, that think they need to stay in the basement to be safe.
And where's the endpoint there?
That's like, I'm afraid I don't have enough muscle, so I'm going to sit in the basement and worry about it.
No, you're going to get out and go to the gym, right?
Your immune system needs that kind of treatment too.
We also know from, you know, we've known for decades that vitamin D improved your immune system against viruses, that it helped you fight off viruses, that vitamin C can be used, IV vitamin C against these things.
Now I learned about zinc with this one, but I know that we knew about the others.
You know, the FDA made IV vitamin C illegal two years ago, and here we are using it to save people's lives.
But I kept, when this whole thing came out, I kept looking at the, there was kind of a bimodal distribution.
There were the people that were dying just precipitously, and then there were the people that just walked away from it, which was the vast majority.
And I kept, you know, kicking my computer screen and saying, for all the tax dollars we give to the CDC, why don't they investigate and figure out what the difference is between these people?
Well, we didn't get it from the CDC, but we've gotten it from Indonesia and some other countries that are really concerned.
And Indonesia looked at over 700 people in their hospital that were sick, dying, or dead from this virus versus the vast majority that walked away.
And they found out that 96.2% of the people very sick and dying had a D level below 30.
Now, and that's in Indonesia where, you know, people are out in the sun.
You can't get the D level above 30 unless you're taking a supplement.
Why aren't they telling us this?
And recently a study just came out that showed that people that are getting very sick and dying from this have deficiency in zinc.
Well, Dr. Zelenko said quite a long time ago, and all the people that have figured this out, zinc, vitamin D, vitamin C, hydroxychloroquine, we can protect people.
We have the way to do that.
Your immune system needs to be strengthened and you need to get the right information.
And you're not getting it from Fauci and these guys for reasons that you probably know better than I do.
Well, another kind of point on this is that I think about, you know, not only all the fiddling you do, I see people now in their cars wearing masks.
And hearing stories about people in their homes wearing masks.
And I'm saying, wait a minute, how are you going to protect yourself in your car with the windows closed in the winter wearing a mask?
Now, Dr. Urso, does that make any sense at all?
It makes no sense.
I mean, I'm sitting here because we've kind of beat this to death a little bit, and there's a good reason for it, because there's literally no logical argument to do this.
And we know if we work in a lab, think of the people who work in a lab.
I go back to that again.
Working in high-level labs, nobody wears a mask of this style because the viruses are too small.
And if you look at, you know, smoke particles, they're much bigger.
Smoke comes right through. A lot of times we've looked at people, Dr.
Merritt actually did a nice lecture that I listened to where she showed how people who would do drywall, how they were the N95, and you look at them, they just have all this drywall all sitting around.
The mask was on their face with all the drywall you can see going up their nose.
So what you see over and over again is that these masks are just not built and suited to do this.
I think if we really want to be serious about it, I think we need to put a...
I'm going to say we need to get everybody into hazmat suits, and that's what we need to do.
But you know, at the end of this day, we have basically lost the forest for the trees.
And like what Dr.
Merritt said, mitigation strategies for limiting disease, prophylaxing, makes all the sense.
Vitamin D is amazing.
I mean, I think in one study in Spain, over 80, eight times more deaths, between over 60, three and a half to four, I think.
So, and as she said, under 30, of course, is...
Is level considered low, but where your receptors are fully saturated is level 50.
All right, so we try to get, I try to get all my patients up to a level 50, and I usually find people need about, for every 30, 35 pounds, you need about a thousand micrograms.
So basically, I mean, a thousand international units.
So most people are going to need Three or four or five or six thousand.
Fauci, as small as he is, takes six thousand.
I think that tells you something about it.
And I wouldn't doubt it if he's taking a little bit of hydroxychloroquine.
But I think in general, these strategies make more sense.
That should be more of our conversation.
We don't want to say we're going to prevent the disease with a mask.
We've got a bunch of different things.
Zinc. Vitamin D, quercetin, that are actually...
Melatonin can decrease NLRP3 and flamysome.
There's a lot of stuff we can do to decrease our chances to get the disease.
And then if we do get disease, we got all these things we can do.
Like, you know, we can give an aspirin, we can give a breathing treatment.
There's a lot we can do. So in a sense, we're having a big...
discussion about something that, as I said, doesn't work and it creates division and it creates, in a sense, virtue signaling.
I basically would have to say this, you know, Dr.
Merritt and I, I think, would both agree, and Dr.
Graves, that one of the things that we see here is that there is harm to these.
There is harm. And the harm in children is real.
And the fact is that I think we just, I don't know how we bring this forward because I joke around about the boogeyman covering your feet.
I mean, people want a placebo.
They don't want to think that the mask doesn't work.
But I think if we were going to go forward and try to bring a narrative forward, I think we have to say we have things that really do work and they're very powerful.
But yet, you know, at the same time, we are so, we have censorship that I've never seen before.
So we can't even have a public discussion.
I'm sure that this discussion, if it goes on YouTube, is going to get censored because it doesn't look for the World Health Organization's Thoughts.
And to me, I didn't know they were the only purveyors of science these days, but apparently they are.
So again, it goes back to, what are we going to do about this?
We've really got to follow the data, the science, not science fiction.
We've really got to stick to that.
You know, reality, not myths.
And I think we really need to think about freedom over fear.
We're creating fear, and the masks only exacerbate the fear.
And I really think we need to kind of be thinking about, look, freedom needs to be a part of our choices.
They don't work, and I don't think you should be having everybody do these things.
And wearing them in your car just shows you how much fear there is.
The fear is massive.
Well, Dr. Merritt, I mean, a lot of these things, including the masks, in terms of real epidemiology, at least the limited amount I've read, You know, you quarantine the sick.
You don't quarantine the entire population.
The point here where no one can get sick.
If the tragedy is, well, okay, so President Trump gets COVID. Now everybody thinks he's going to die.
The fact is that the treatments, I mean, even for HIV AIDS, we don't still 30 or 40 years later have a vaccine.
We have a lot of treatments.
And we have a lot of steps that can be taken to prevent the disease, now that we understand it better, but they don't involve...
I look at the silly social distancing, and I watch it at a Biden conference with everybody sitting in their little circles, and I'm saying, if somebody went through a time warp, they, you know, rip and winkle, they woke up, they say, what are these people doing?
I mean, it's so bizarre.
It's like a Woody Allen movie of somehow the future of architecting some kind of strange reality where the people have gotten into this hallucinogenic state and they're living around in these little circles.
I mean, what do you think, Dr. Barrett?
Well, I mean, did you see that Biden actually had, they were distancing their cars.
They had a car rally that was socially distanced.
I mean, you can't make this stuff up.
You know, I think, to be honest, I think here's one of the only things you really need to know about masks, if they work or not, and that is that the city of D.C. has exempted themselves and their employees from masks.
The state of Wisconsin, I think Ohio and Kansas and several states, the state legislature is exempt and so is their building and so is their employees.
Now, you know politicians, if they thought this was really a deadly virus and that they would help save themselves with a mask, they'd be masked up to the yin-yang.
But this is a mandate for us little people.
And I think it really needs to be pointed out that this is so glaringly a power push and not a medical push.
You know, I just found out today, and I got this Dr.
Peter McCullough, who's been pushing out an outpatient early treatment protocol that he's, you know, he's from Baylor, and he's getting censored for doing that, as are other people that are successfully treating people.
But now there's a, he puts out this picture in six places around the world, including I remember one is Goa, India, and there's a place in Brazil, and I think, you know, a bunch of other countries like those.
They're sending people home with COVID kits.
So here we are worried about pushing people into their basements and giving them masks, but around the world, they're actually doing something constructive.
They're giving them COVID kits, and guess what they have in?
Just what we talked about, hydroxychloroquine, which is over-the-counter in many places, and zinc and vitamin C and vitamin D. I mean, how come?
So I tweeted out today, I said, so if you get sick, I'd call Goa India.
Don't go down to university, because that's how ridiculous this is.
I mean, yeah.
Dr. Graves, you want to...
I have a missionary that was over in Nigeria last week.
And as you know, it's on the counter, over the counter over there.
And so he went to several pharmacies and he took an empty suitcase for the very purpose.
And he just took his arm and he just went like this and just scooped up all of the hydroxychloroquine off of the shelf and put it in his suitcase.
and came back to the United States with a suitcase of hydroxychloroquine where it's over the counter over there and I just got a chart yesterday and it shows what Florida because I was interested to see what Florida was doing since they have removed the mask and it hasn't been quite a month yet it soon will be a month that they've had their unmasking and The chart definitely shows the death rate and the infection rate.
You can just see it on the chart just going down.
And it has really declined, not increased.
on this chart.
I also just want to quickly say, for those who are purists out there who think that the New England Journal is actually the living bible of all medicine, they had an article showing That the mask, and this was June the 1st, 2020, and it did show that the masks are not helping anyone, especially outside of the hospital, and that they are not protective.
And so anyone who's interested in following the Bible of medicine and journaling, which is the New England Journal of Medicine, is June the 1st, 2020.
Interesting. Another kind of observation I've had on this, and I've thought about this, Dr.
Urso, is, you know, I've looked at historically, and we've had plagues, and going back prehistorically, I mean, Thucydides writes about ancient Athens, 600 BC, with the plague.
That defeated Athens in the war against Sparta, basically.
But the point is that I've not seen a plague that's killed everybody.
And the proof of that is that we're here.
And eventually they all seem to die out.
In other words, they lose strength.
They weaken.
I mean, the plague or any virus has to kill the host in order to live itself, which is not a very...
Not a very good MO or something that wants to live perpetually.
It's killing the host that it's living on.
It takes more and more of a strong virus to penetrate healthy bodies.
So eventually they just die out.
I wondered, the virus is now, I think, mitigating, certainly in its seriousness, in terms of its impact, over 90% survivable.
And we don't have the hospitals filled with patients like we did back in March and April.
So I'm wondering if anything we did actually worked to mitigate the virus or if it just died out on its own.
Dr. Urso? Yeah, well, I think the lockdowns, distancing, masking did nothing for us.
In fact, what we're seeing now, we look back, is there's extra deaths from lockdowns.
We said a lot of extra things that we're seeing from that.
So not only did it not work, it was the wrong strategy from the very beginning.
We didn't You know, embrace early treatment, which is a horrible strategy for any doctor.
So if we go back and talk strategically on it, and you mentioned some things, you know, there are different types of pandemics, right?
You have insect-borne pandemics, you have blood-borne pandemics, and then you have respiratory pandemics.
So this is an airborne respiratory virus.
Who spreads their airborne respiratory virus?
Symptomatic people coughing, and that's who spreads it.
And what we have here in this thing is we've gone after people who are asymptomatic, and we have detailed contact tracing on asymptomatic people.
Asymptomatic people in this virus do not spread the disease, just like in every airborne respiratory illness of all time, all right?
So there's nothing different here.
They've created this narrative that that's not true.
I don't know how they've done it. They've done it with smoke and mirrors.
Because if you look at the early times when Fauci and Baron Kirkhoff were talking about it, basically they said exactly the words I said in no uncertain terms.
Detailed contact tracing has shown that in this virus, this virus, and in all previous viruses, asymptomatic people do not spread.
And it turns out in this case, kids do not spread.
Kids are not super spreaders.
So the strategies right from the get-go made no sense.
If you were going to go back and look at it, number one, we would have done early treatment.
Number two, It was quite clear all the way back in March that kids were not spreading disease.
I think it took until, I don't know what year before, before somebody under 10 died.
It took months before they reported somebody under 10 who died.
I think it was still May or something.
So at the end of the day, very, very few kids have been injured by this illness.
So wouldn't it have made more sense to let kids go to school and protect the elderly?
So all the strategies that they employed And you look at the guy who actually drew up the first strategy.
His name's Neil Ferguson from England.
And he's been perpetually overestimating pandemics.
I said on one talk show, I said, he's made a career of overestimation.
I mean, I can't believe people trot him out there over and over again.
And this is the guy we all listen to.
And when I saw it was him, like my political science major, part of me always looked at things sort of historically.
And so I've always looked at pandemics and always been very interested in them.
And I knew right away, I said, this guy's doing the analysis.
He's horrible. You might as well flip a coin.
He also overestimated climate change.
You did the same kinds of models there.
Exactly. So that's who you're talking about.
This is who we're following.
Thanks for bringing that up.
I didn't realize he did that too.
All of his models project exponentially these crises occurring until they reach proportions where the seawaters engulf the cities and millions of people are dying of the virus.
He doesn't take into account that the That these things do not necessarily increase exponentially, but the virus eventually peaks and ebbs almost naturally.
Well, I was going to say, I mean, for me, as a physician, I knew right away there was going to be mitigating things we could do.
I didn't even think twice about it.
And I was walking away at my state board and everything else.
We shouldn't be locking down. And like I said to you before, just breaking down its component parts, even if we don't have things that kill the virus, just like you said with HIV, we learned how to manage the virus.
Well, this disease... It's a lot easier to manage because we deal with this all the time.
And so it just, it's never made sense from the get-go and it doesn't make sense now.
And I can't sit here and pretend and make believe that it makes sense.
When the data doesn't fit, it doesn't fit.
We should have never let it down.
We should have never started mass.
Period. We should have done early treatment.
We should have started right from the get-go.
It should have never been this way.
And I'm happy to talk about it with anybody and say, you know, I'm sorry you were wrong, but you were very wrong.
And you've heard a lot of people. This is hypocrisy.
You know, this is not science.
It's science fiction. It's not reality.
It's myth. And so at the end of the day, I'm happy to kind of go through the data on that over and over again.
But it's still, I'll never back down from that because that's the truth.
Well, Dr. Merritt, do you see the same thing?
I mean, yes, the symptomatic people probably should be quarantined, and in any disease that makes sense, but the virus seems to be dying out on its own.
Are you confident that any of the steps we took The masks, the social distancing, the lockdowns, were any of these things really effective?
And are they, you said, you know, the post hoc propter hoc, we locked down.
So can we assume that was the cause of all these things?
Or did the virus just itself die out?
I mean, I think we can look at countries like Sweden and like Nigeria that was pointed out that didn't lock down, didn't do any of these things, and that the curve was no different.
You know, Nigeria, we mentioned earlier, their overall death rate It was 0.00004%, whereas ours in New York, where Tony Fauci gave an award for handling, it was 0.17%.
So maybe we ought to listen to maybe what they're doing in Nigeria.
But when we talk about the overall, if you look at the world numbers, the overall chance of dying from this is It's 99.991% chance of survival.
Give me liberty or give me 0.009% chance of death.
And in a flu season, It's 99.992%.
But that's not to say that there aren't bad things coming about.
And I have to say, I was worried when this first came out of China and when it first started killing people in Italy.
And my kind of rule of thumb is when doctors are dying and you can't sort it out, then there's a problem.
But that didn't happen very long.
We figured this out pretty darn quick.
Now, one of the really crimes here, in my opinion, Is the fact that, so we still have, in the bioweapons labs out there today, we have the smallpox samples that were given by the World Health Organization to Vector in the Soviet Union, as well as to us, but we didn't spread it around.
But Vector, we lost those guys in the fall of the Soviet Union.
And that stuff is out there in labs.
Now that's a 60% fatal virus, 60.
And here's the thing that bothers me, is that when I looked back in the literature on the potential, Hydroxychloroquine is not the only drug in this category.
They're called lysosomatropic agents, but they've known about these for over 30 years.
I actually published a paper, and it's something like, I don't remember the exact name, but it's basically, we've been hiding this fact for 40 years.
I can get you the name of the paper.
It was published in the AAPS Journal.
But, you know, if every year they tell you, oh, get your flu shot because 60,000 people or 80,000 people last year died of the flu.
Well, they're actually dying of influenza-like illness.
But nonetheless, how long have they actually, I can find literature going back quite a ways that shows they knew we could stop viruses with these things.
And a piece in the mainstream, the journal Virology in 2006 that actually talked about being able to stop influenza in the Petri dish with chloroquine.
If we knew that, why did we let all those people die of flu every year?
So you see, one of the reasons this is all getting shut down is this is a big hit to the pharmaceutical industry and the people that might want to terrorize us with viruses in the future if we have a treatment in our back pocket.
And I think that's part of this whole plot.
Masks are to separate us and make us afraid so nobody will listen to the people that say we have treatment, I think.
Can I follow up on that?
Sure, go ahead. Yeah, I want to follow up because she brought up an amazing point about this, and I think we're going off a little bit.
Hydroxychloroquine, their endosomal acidification process ends up affecting every single RNA virus that's respiratory.
The coronavirus family, the influenza family, adenovirus family, they all do this endosomal acidification.
So what ends up happening here is by the process of endosomal acidification, because hydroxychloroquine interrupts that, People will make particles that are very attenuated, very stunted, more or less.
In fact, what she's really saying is, this ends the need for any vaccines.
It ends the need for any virus.
What I always say when I finish this off is that hydroxychloroquine has been attacked so viciously because it kills an industry better than it kills a virus.
And as well. And I picked up on that as well.
And you said something very important there, Dr.
Merritt. You said that about the flu.
And I'm thinking to myself, then why are we pushing the flu vaccine so heavily every year?
I mean, every place you turn, whether it's at your parish or whether it's at your store or any place, You go to Walmart, they're giving the flu vaccine.
Sam's Club, whatever, Costco.
I mean, we're actually, you know, we are pushing the flu vaccine when we really didn't have to.
It's a silver bullet, I think.
And it's part of that. Nobody gets sick and we have silver.
Taking this little pill, it'll all go away.
Rather than work in your immune systems and take a $20 generic drug that may prevent your RNA from duplicating the virus, if they use it with zinc, get zinc into the cell, and there you go.
Your RNA doesn't reproduce the virus.
They actually did do a study on the flu in 2011 in China, and they did a bunch of 21-year-olds Kind of underpowered.
And again, just like all the hydroxychloroquine studies are designed to fail.
And I can almost say here with almost 99.9% certainty that hydroxychloroquine will attenuate the flu.
I'm that certain of it.
We've actually come to the end of an hour.
This has gone very fast.
It's been a fascinating discussion.
Craig, do you have any comments before we wrap up?
Right, and once again, I believe that what you've got is doctors here that our first priority is saving lives, and second priority then is doing what is correct for the science.
And what you're hearing from people like Fauci and Birx and Hahn and all of these others, and it's coming out from that organization that I won't mention again, that Dr.
Urso already mentioned. So no, we won't be putting this up on YouTube because you said the magic word of that organization, that global supposed medically related association.
So anyway. And who might that be?
I'm not going to say it.
They'll take us down.
We ended up in the doghouse for a week.
But anyway, it's darkness.
It is the darkness against the light.
It is these evil forces that want to control you and ensure that everybody does what they
tell us to do, whether it's good for us or not.
And they have evil, in my opinion, intent behind it.
And what we have to do is stay strong and push back against it.
And so too many people have already been indoctrinated into these mass and the social distancing.
I feel for the kids.
We've got a whole generation now of these youngsters that are growing up that will never be the same.
Their entire lives have been altered by this madness.
Dr. Corsi. Yeah, I might.
I have a question I'm asking.
Who is really Abbott and Costello?
You know, who's on first? It really kind of gives it away.
I'm going to ask each of the doctors to give their closing comments, and then Dr.
Graves will end with you. So, Dr.
Urso, your final thoughts here on this conversation?
I kind of went into it just a minute ago, but my final thoughts are, I think everyone on the call who listens to this call, you know, the early treatment is the key.
The prophylaxis is the key to ending this whole pandemic.
But let me say this one more time.
We do not have a pandemic anymore.
We have positive PCRs.
A lot of those are false positives.
They're 90% false positives.
We have endemic disease.
So we have small pockets of disease occurring.
Just as you see in Sweden, now they have one or two deaths a week or something like that.
We're going to take a little longer to reach that level because we're a bigger country.
So we'll have small pockets of disease, but we're not going to have pandemic-type breakouts as we go forward.
The masks are unnecessary, and so don't beat up your neighbor for your mask.
They're not effective against this virus and I'll be happy to invite you to a lab where we actually do tumor virus work and we do not wear those kind of masks.
We have other special masks that we wear.
So please do not beat your neighbor.
That's a mass divide.
We have other strategies and we can meet this disease and beat this disease with mitigating strategies and we have some offensive strategies also.
As far as waiting for a vaccine, I think that's something that I wouldn't be in a hurry for because we have plenty of things we can do, and this disease is not going to hurt you, especially if you don't have a lot of comorbidities.
Dr. Merritt, any concluding comments?
Well, I'd like to conclude with something that Dr.
Graves brought up, and that's about this flu vaccine and what I think is part of this whole agenda.
And that is, the CDC is on Dun& Bradstreet.
It's essentially a private corporation, and they own over 57 patents for flu.
And to tell you about the points you made, one of my friends, who's an old Vietnam vet, almost died of the isolation of being locked down.
What did they tell the Vietnam vets?
There was an article or a publication done by the Department of Defense, and it was published in January of this year, and it showed that if you take the flu vaccine, you have an increased risk of acquiring coronavirus by 36%.
That was done in young, healthy military and their dependents.
36% increase, it's called, and there's a term for it, and we know this is a reality.
So by giving the flu vaccine, you increase your risk of getting this virus.
Okay, they continued to tell the VA people through the summer, we don't know how to solve this problem, but you should get your flu vaccine.
And the CDC was pushing the flu vaccine up until about the middle of, I can't remember if it was like early May or end of April, I watched them slowly withdraw the ads from their site.
So, you know, that's a part of this that needs to be brought out.
There's a financial thing that's going on that colors their choices.
And I would say that the CDC should be disbanded, and it shouldn't be the people.
I noticed that in Germany, they've put legislation forward to now make their health departments only advisory, not regulatory.
Very interesting. Dr.
Graves, your concluding thoughts?
Well, I think that we've had a very interesting discussion.
I think that it's been very forthright and telling.
I think that it's time that we unmask the deception.
That's what I think.
I think it's time to unmask deception.
And to come forth with truth.
And it's hard to stand for truth when people have been so infiltrated with fear.
They are just so fearful.
I had a woman who literally almost attacked me in a Walmart parking lot because I didn't have a mask on and I didn't wear a mask in the store.
And she said, it's people like you who are killing us out here.
And I tried my best to explain to her, but all she did was become more belligerent.
And so it's very difficult to overcome that fear that they have within them.
And I think that what we need to do is when we are asked these questions to say, okay, would you please show me your science?
Show me your data.
Show me your proof that this six-foot distancing is something that works.
Show me your proof that masking will work.
I think that we need to start questioning and asking them for their data because they certainly aren't shy for asking us about ours.
And so I really think that that's one way that we can combat this.
Thank you. Well, thank you, Dr.
Grace, for putting this together.
This is Wednesday, October 28, 2020, and we're here with Dr.
Richard Urso and Dr.
Lee Merritt, and we've been discussing masks, and it's been a very interesting discussion.
I want to thank everyone for Being so really illuminating about the subject, I've gained a great deal from it.
I always conclude by saying, in the end, God always wins, and God will win here too.
I want to thank everybody for listening.
God bless. And we'll be back with more discussions with MDs on coronavirus and other medical subjects.
Thank you all very much. Good night.
Good night, doctors. Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you, Dr.
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