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He is an author, a true crime podcaster, and one of the guys that's really dug deep into the Epstein case and beyond.
We're going to be getting into all that and much more, as well as the Trump 2.0 administration and this executive order on cartels being terrorist organizations.
Can't wait to get his take as he's currently working on a series via the CIA and drug running.
Iran Contra.
Anyone?
We're going to come back.
You're not going to want to miss it.
More Making Sense of the Madness after this.
And we are back.
Sean Atwood, it is a pleasure to have you on the broadcast.
Now, before we get into anything, Epstein, your current work, the True Crime Podcast, for those that don't know, you spent some time in jail.
You've actually written about that in one of your books.
You can take a look at his books over at SeanAtwood.com.
How do you come out of that and then become so interested not only in the crime that the mainstream media focuses on, but really this larger network of upper echelon criminals?
Epstein, really the focal point of that?
Oh, that's a great question, man.
The trajectory is a very long one.
And let me just say to people in America as well, shout out to people in America.
My documentary is on HBO Max right now.
It's called Sons of Ecstasy.
It just came out in January.
If people want to see my backstory, it's quite a good production.
All right.
So when I was in Sheriff Joe Apiro's jail from 2002 to 2004, we came up with an idea to write a blog with my writing that was smuggled out of the jail.
I was in the Madison Security, Maximum Security, Madison Street Jail 2004.
My aunt smuggled my writing out.
So this was dead rats in the food, cockroaches crawling all of us at night times, guards murdering prisoners.
People can research this.
Not big, bad gangsters.
They were murdering blind prisoners, mentally ill prisoners.
Brian Crenshaw, Scott Norberg gets to pay out millions in compensation.
So I asked a guard one day, how'd you guys get away with all this?
And he said, The world has no idea what's going on in here, and the public doesn't give a crap about prisoners.
So something just went off in my brain, and I started to write everything down on little scraps of paper with a tiny little pencil sharpened on the door.
Hid what I wrote in my legal paperwork and notes and stuff that I could release to my aunt through visitation.
She smuggled them out of the jail, typed them up, sent them to my family in England.
And that's how the activism began.
Was John's Jail Journal?
It's J-O-N.
It wasn't set up in my name because my parents were worried they would find out who was writing it and there'd be consequences.
But it's all still there, time-stamped online, that original blog.
So I was released in December 2007.
We set up the YouTube channel in 2007 principally to tell more jail and prison stories because that's what I've been doing.
But then over the years, it's evolved as I wrote books.
I've written 17 books now.
My first 10 years out of prison, I was living in my mixed bedroom writing books and just slowly building my socials.
I didn't have Pots Pissing.
So that all built up steadily.
And I went from writing my own life story as a trilogy, which you just showed on the screen, which was party time, hard time, prison time, to then thinking, right, I need to start writing about myself.
I have more important things to write about.
And I started to write about Pablo Escobar and Narcos and how this narrative of the DA and the badass American heroes who come in and kick the Colombian boogeyman's butts, war on drugs, phony narrative had to be exposed.
So what I did was, I mean, I'd read Killing Pablo and all these others that jump on that Western narrative and just credit the American forces for taking Pablo down.
They did have a role in it, but I've written the longest volumes about Pablo Escobar ever in the English-speaking world.
Now, it took me years to write it.
There's Pablo Escobar's story.
There's parts one, parts two, and parts three.
Presently, I've interviewed Pablo's son.
I've interviewed sons of the Cali Cartel.
And I've even published a book for one of the sons of the Cali Cartel called the Sons of the Cali Cartel.
And what I learned was getting all of this translated over from Spanish, the real story was how corrupt the DA and the CIA have been in Central and South America.
So, that's a good stopping point because obviously we got a lot of books here.
And people can go check out the HBO documentary.
I am pretty familiar with your story, but I'm still going to check it out.
I always like to see what they do.
Let's talk about that because people like myself that have looked into this kind of stuff now for almost two decades, right?
We know that the Central Intelligence Agency and people on the peripheral are aware of our encontra, but they don't know really the network that was set up there.
For instance, it wasn't the Americans that were buying the weapons, it was the Israelis, Mark Rich, amongst them, and he was getting them from Europe, sending them down.
It was this big, plausible deniability circle.
And then you had operatives that were basically flying planes down that were clones of other planes.
Barry Seale is the most famous one.
Although, again, you talk about these Hollyweird narratives, and American Maid is nothing like the actual story of Barry Seale.
For instance, in the very beginning, they act like they recruited him because he was smuggling cigars and they could find other ways.
Yet, if you read Barry and the Boys, this is somebody that's been in Intel, probably Wetworks, since the Kendi assassination and before, right?
I mean, there's that famous picture where he's sitting there with Porter Doss.
So you've had Escobar's son come out and say that Escobar was working with the Central Intelligence Agency at that point.
When we are talking about the cartels, at least in that period of time, how much are they shepherded by the military-industrial complex and the Central Intelligence Agency?
Is it 100% orchestration, or do they kind of let them fight amongst themselves until they recruit ones and then support them?
And then at any other point, you know, support the next guy.
All right.
You've raised several points first.
So when I was interviewing Escobar's son, Juan Pablo, he was very poker-faced, very serious, never ever cracked a smile until I asked him one question.
And I said to him, Who was the biggest drug trafficker in the 1980s?
Was it your father or George H.W. Bush?
And his eyes widened and he smiled.
He was like, George H.W. Bush.
So what they do, Jason, is for a period of time, they work with a cartel.
And then once they have utilized that cartel for their purposes, that cartel is sacrificed and they move on to the next one.
So for example, there would have been a period of time in Mexico when El Chapo was getting protected.
Mexico wants to claim millions of dollars.
in aid because they're fighting the war on drugs.
So to claim that money while working with Chapo, they launch war on Chapo's enemies to protect Chapo.
So Chapo's thriving, but he thrives so much and he's so public.
The word comes in from the states, you've got to move on to the next one now.
And all the time, the CIA are facilitating weapons for white product transfers.
It's going both way, all the way back to like Barry Seal.
I wrote a book called American Maid, exposing the movie American Maid.
So Barry Seale, drug drops are coming into Maine, Arkansas, and Bill Clinton was providing the state troopers who were providing security for the drops.
And the movie was initially supposed to be called Mina.
And the director, his father, actually worked on the Iran-Contra case.
In fact, the one shining star moment in the movie is when they show the actual archive footage at the very end of a press member actually doing his job and trying to ask George H.W. Bush about his role or knowledge.
Even Lee Hamilton, who has been the bagman for the deep state investigations on the Warren Commission, Iran Contra, headed up the 9-11 Commission, came out after the fact and he's like, you know that George Bush, he probably had a little bit more to do with this than he acknowledged in these hearings.
But please continue.
Yeah, there's a world where crime and government coexist.
And Daniel Hopsick's book that you referred to earlier really opened my eyes to a lot of things as well.
So you've got Bill Clinton providing the state, Arkansas state security for the drug drops.
You've got people like Barry Seale flying it in.
And it was all working out rather well until two boys were found dead on the train tracks.
And in my book, Clinton Bush and CIA Conspiracies, it's four stories interwoven.
And one of those is the stories of Linda Ives.
So Linda Ives, God bless her, her son, Kevin Ives, and there was Don Henry, found side by side in these train tracks.
The Clinton crime family had this Fame Malik medical examiner character who would just say anything.
I mean, you could have gunshots to the head and he would say you drowned in a pool.
That's how pliable he was for the Clintons.
And this goes back to Clinton's mom.
I mean, Sean, to this day, you can have people that are on Clinton property hanging from a tree with a shotgun blast in their chest and they'll say it's a suicide.
So, I mean, you know, think about this, folks, back in the 80s and early 90s.
I mean, they're a dime a dozen at that point, but please continue.
Yeah, so Clinton's mom, somebody died on her shift when she was working in the medical profession.
And Fammy Malik came in and cleaned that up.
So he always had Fammy Malik under his wing.
Now, when Linda Ives was protesting, you know, because one of the dads knew these kids couldn't have died side by side on the train tracks.
Fammy Malik said they'd gone into a psychedelic trance because they'd smoked so much green, laid side by side, and the train had run over them.
Even the emergency crew who arrived on the scene could see that the blood was not fresh.
So they were suspicious from the get-go.
So Linda Ives, she presented herself to Bill Clinton on multiple occasions.
And he was kind of, I'll look into that if he would speak to her at all.
I've never ever got back to her.
But they had encountered one of these drug drops and been eliminated.
That is what we widely believe in the community that's researching that.
So then I got two questions for you on that one.
For those that have looked into this, number one, do you believe wrestler Billy Jack Haynes that he was one of the enforcers there that night?
Because he's made that claim.
And then number two, it has also been the claim has been made that Robert Johnson, who was basically the fixer for the Central Intelligence Agency, was actually Bill Barr.
And Bill Barr had this long running, people don't understand.
I mean, he was a kid basically when he was recruited by the Central Intelligence Agency.
He came through, he was a hotshot lawyer on the upcoming, joins the Central Intelligence Agency before he even passes the bar exam, becomes the youngest attorney general ever under George H.W. Bush.
And when he gets into the private field, he happens to work for Kirkland and Ellis, who did a lot of work for Mr. Epstein.
And even at one point, had to say in hearings that he may have to recuse himself from anything Epstein because he worked for that law firm.
So is he Robert Johnson?
All right.
So the woman who was there that night, who's dropped names, I'm trying to remember her name.
Her name was like Charlene something.
And she was dating a corrupt prosecutor out of Arkansas who was part of what was going on with Clinton and the CIA.
Luke Brunel's Connections00:13:52
But off the top of my head, Jason, I can't remember the names she dropped, but the names that you've just mentioned, I'm not familiar.
Okay.
All right.
Fair enough.
We are going to take a quick break.
When we come back, let's really jump into Epstein because one of the things, and I think probably the most important thing that people really miss is the evidence that Epstein not only has been around for a very long time, and yes, the blackmail is there and the child abuse is there, but he also seems to be an arms dealer and seems to be coming up in that same time period of Iran-Contra where we know, I mean, people got slaps on the wrist, they got pardoned and commuted after the fact.
And the guy that they made the face of it, Oliver North, got TV shows and radio show deals and book deals and became a millionaire.
That's how you discourage government drug running, folks.
We're going to take a break.
We're going to come back.
More Sean Atwood and Making Sense of the Madness after this.
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And we are back.
So.
So let's get into Epstein because, first of all, you know, again, you say you started looking at this stuff in like 2007, 2008.
You know, I'm the first guy Alex Jones ever gave a show to at InfoWars.
I was there in that 2008 period, even in the beginning of the Epstein story, you know, when Palm Beach happened.
So I've been looking at this for a very long time.
It wasn't really until that Trump era where you had individuals coming out like Vicki Ward, talking about Epstein, the connection to Adnan Khashoggi, again, somebody notorious during that Iran-Contra phase of arms dealing, that I started to look at that aspect of it.
And lo and behold, that really seems to be a big part of this network, you know, hooking these people up.
I don't know, facilitating the deals.
I would imagine that is some of the Israeli angle and why he has a passport with a Saudi Arabian identity during that time period, etc.
And then recently, when we were supposed to get the Epstein list that I don't really even think exists, it's not like a client list.
That's kind of a joke.
I mean, they have plenty of video.
They have plenty of photographs.
They know the networks.
They know about Leslie Groff, Sarah Kalin, Nadia Marsenkova, and probably a slew of other people that we barely heard about.
So they know.
But on the They Might Be Drunk podcast, Lewis Black talks about his encounter with Epstein, going to the New York Mansion.
And he goes there, David Blaine shows up.
A lot of people don't talk about Blaine.
He's on the list.
He's hanging out with people who are literal pedophiles to this day, folks, and buddies with Epstein, just pointing that out.
And he says that the encounter with Epstein was really bizarre.
He pulled him into a room.
And if you haven't seen this, this is online.
I've covered it.
And he had a big whiteboard up.
And he goes, hey, do you know what this is?
Lewis Black has no idea.
He goes, these are weapons systems that I was having discussions with the Israeli defense minister over last night.
Okay.
You have the Israeli defense minister over and you're talking weapon systems in the late 90s, reeking of arms dealer.
I went on a little rant there.
What do you think?
Do you think that is an aspect of this Epstein case that really people have not focused on?
All right, let's tie this into, you've thrown so much information at me.
I'll go all the way back to when you started.
So you mentioned Iran-Contra, George H.W. Bush, Oliver North, and then you've got Felix Rodriguez also.
Oliver North and Felix Rodriguez were like the caution underneath Bush for Iran Contra.
Oliver North had his diary, of course, you know, documenting the white.
Now, the person who did go to prison was Ari Ben Menashi, and we interviewed him on my channel.
This was before the great removal of the Epstein content.
I had like 60 million views on the Epstein case at one point.
All got nuked.
I've had over 25 videos taken down for bullying on the Epstein case, for reading the literal documents that were public.
I mean, that's the kind of YouTube censorship.
It's not just COVID-19 for everybody.
They didn't like people reading those documents.
Go ahead.
Is that recent or is that back then?
Oh, no, no.
I mean, two months ago, they took another Epstein.
Here's how it works for me.
I haven't been monitoring, I'm trying to get remonetized right now, but I've also had my channel since 2007.
So basically, the more I post, the more things get taken down all of a sudden.
Like if I'm stagnant, maybe I'll get one every few months.
If I keep posting, which I've been posting a lot recently, every couple of weeks they find something.
And yeah, no, they give me the bullying excuse on the Epstein cases.
And it's like, I'm reading some of the most grotesque stuff, like, hey, this girl has been drugged and she doesn't know where identification is.
And she ended up on an island somewhere.
And what's that?
The Dubin family, Glenn Dubin, and I think his wife are on that island at the time.
So I want to stick to what we're talking about here.
But yes, they censor.
And you know what I didn't mention?
There's another arms dealing contact.
Guess who the biggest arms dealer in the UK is?
It's Prince Andrew.
He's the UK's arms dealer.
So please continue.
Yeah.
So this takes us.
Ari Ben Monashi then.
What he said was that you've got this official story in mainstream media about Gillen.
You know, she's sad because her father has died.
She's broken to bits.
You know, she's devastated.
And she comes to America and then, you know, meets Jeffrey.
And, you know, Jeffrey helps her emotionally like kind of replaces this father figure.
But he said the reality is that Bob Maxwell had already indoctrinated Gillen into this world.
And, you know, research in Maxwell, if anyone's read the assassination of Maxwell, and I've written about him extensively in my Epstein books as well, then you come to find out that he's one of the most remarkable networkers in the history of the world because not only was he allied with the Mossad, MI5, the CIA, he could sit down with the president of America, president of Russia, the prime minister of the UK, Israel.
Plus, he had alliances with all of these different criminal organizations, ranging from the cartels to the Yakuza.
It was quite remarkable, this spider's web that's still trying to be untangled to this day.
So if Ari Ben Monashi is correct, and Gillen was indoctrinated into that world prior to meeting Epstein, and Epstein was brought in, and Robert Maxwell didn't approve of Epstein in the beginning.
It was that Ari Ben Monashi told us that.
But that was how they connected Jeffrey and Ghelen way before this official narrative.
And of course, arms dealing is a principal part of that.
Wherever you've got the biggest industries in the world, oil, arms, drugs, women.
Yeah, it's going to be in that nexus.
Yes, absolutely.
And really, that's what I don't think a lot of people get.
You know, I mentioned those names before, but look who they married off to, right?
Like all of those women that I mentioned that were under Ghillen Maxwell and more than likely part of that initial sweetheart deal at a Palm Beach all happened to marry very, very wealthy men.
And we're talking about in the hundreds of millions, if not billionaire range.
So they've done very, very well for themselves.
And even the Marcinkova story, I know that Nadia has changed her last name.
She's probably the one I'm the most sympathetic to.
Don't get me wrong.
These other women were brought in basically, I think, as teenage girls, no matter what, whether they were legal or not.
But Marcinkova, according to the documents, is the 14-year-old girl who's bought from her parents in Yugoslavia.
So again, that's another thing people don't realize that's been in the public arena.
It should be a bigger deal that this guy was allegedly purchasing teenage kids that would then help run his network that had a wide range.
You know, speaking of that network, you have had some arrests, right?
You have Luke Brunel.
You have Ghislaine Maxwell herself.
Ghislaine, I think, doing almost 20 years, just lost an appeal a couple months ago.
Hopefully she's going to stay there even though she's denying that she had any involvement in any of this.
And her family's very wealthy and still attempting to get her out.
Who knows where that goes?
Trump wished her well, everybody.
Just pointing that out.
And then you have Brunel, who ended up committing suicide and may very well have.
I have no idea the conditions he was under there in a prison in Spain.
Now, Brunel's really interesting because he's connected to the fashion industry, much like Les Wexner, who hasn't done a day in jail, let alone really been questioned properly by authorities.
That's another one of these connections that people aren't talking about, and that's into the fashion industry to not only have access to women, but young girls.
I mean, Claude Hadid, for instance, they had a 60-minute piece in the 80s of how it worked with like 14 to 16-year-old girls in America long before the days of the cell phone, where they would set them up in dormitory situations, take them out to dinner with these people and basically pawn them off.
And if you wanted work, you know, you were a teenage girl having sex with very, very wealthy and influential men.
So the question becomes, have we seen the end of any prosecutions?
Are guys like Wexner going to go scot-free more than likely because of their intel connections?
I think there's an untouchable class, and that would include Wexner.
That would include Bill Clinton.
Because if you look at the flight logs of Clinton, there was dozens of flights where he left his security detail behind.
And you've got all these East European sounding female names on the flight logs.
And that goes to John Luke Brunel, like you just said.
So many people are familiar with Glenn Maxwell as the chief procurer, but they're not so familiar with Jean-Luke Brunel.
And he, big in the fashion industry.
And there was a point where Epstein bragged, he slept with over a thousand girls from the Brunel pipeline, including 12-year-old triplets.
And he praised the oral capabilities, let's just say, which is absolutely disgusting.
Now, in France, they don't mess around.
I believe that Brunel was snuffed out in the blink of an eye in the Parisian prison.
And I believe that Maxwell was allowed to live because of her relationship with the Clintons.
And at some point, when some back sheet has been given to a high court judge, she'll be Bill Cosby'd out when the media is not as focused on it.
She's in some country club in Florida right now doing yoga.
It's not like she's in hardcore conditions, but someone had to face the wrath of the public and be sacrificed.
And that was her.
You know, Brunel snuffed, Epstein snuffed.
I don't think it's going to go upstream with any other names to respond to your question.
But there are some overlaps with the Diddy case, and many people are speculating as well as to whether it will go upstream with Diddy, Clive Davis, people like that.
But it seems like these billionaires, even if they do get them, like Nygard, you know, they're so old and they've had such a long run of being protected.
What kind of justice is that for the survivors?
Billionaires and Blackmail00:15:32
Well, let me say this.
It's better than nothing, right?
Nygaard's another one because Nygaard, and one of the aspects we haven't talked about with Epstein and these guys is the transhumanist aspect.
I mean, Nygaard almost takes it to another vampiric level.
Although, again, Epstein, you have to wonder because they never investigated his New Mexico ranch.
And, you know, this is on a plot of land that is very remote.
You would imagine that we know about the surveillance going on in the New York facility, which is probably the smallest facility and in the most, you know, populated area.
We know almost nothing about that.
Can you imagine not only about the island, which people focus on, but that New Mexico Zorro ranch, which had a helipad, you know, and by the way, what we have seen, it was facilitated for the army of Epsteins that he was trying to build, where 20-plus pregnant women could have also been there at some time.
It sounds like something out of the island of Dr. Moreau.
Unfortunately, it is reality.
We're going to come back.
We're going to talk a little bit about that because I also want to get into Alan Dershowitz and his role because whether Dershowitz is guilty of anything, he's certainly guilty of, you know, representing these people in courts of law.
And I want to dig deep into that.
It is making sense of the madness.
More with Sean Atwood after this.
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All right, Sean, let's talk a little Dersh, okay?
So Dersh was to come on this show.
He was there in the very beginning, and I literally introduced him as the most notorious lawyer of our generation, walked right off.
Didn't even let me get a question in.
It's fine.
That's how we roll sometimes.
I would say there is no more.
He literally fits the definition of notorious lawyer.
You can't name another person.
I mean, down the line, O.J. Simpson, Jeffrey Epstein, Trump and the impeachment.
And those are just the top like cream of the crop highlights.
You go down, again, the line.
So Dersh also represented Les Wexner against Virginia Guffray Roberts, won.
They both won.
So I always am very, very careful about what I say.
Even when I was going on about Dersch, they were witness accounts from people like Maria Farmer, who I had interviewed, what she had said, what we were in the documents, etc.
There is no doubt he helped facilitate that Palm Beach deal.
Brags about it.
Okay.
So he's the guy they bring in for Epstein, who I want to remind people, when he got that conviction, he didn't even stay in the jail for those months that he was supposed to be there.
He was escorted out and followed by a private investigator who said he was going to literal private homes where girls or women were showing up to, again, service this guy.
That's the prison time Jeffrey Epstein did.
And then we want to talk about Biden preemptive pardons.
Well, this is just as bad.
You've got unnamed people who are supposedly shepherded from any kind of prosecution.
I would imagine, and here's my speculation, that some of those names I'd mentioned before are those people.
There may be more.
What is your opinion on Alan Dershowitz?
Because I recently had his biographer on.
Young kid, a kid's only 21 years old, got interviews even with O.J. Simpson, basically everybody that was still alive that he represented over the years and his brother who doesn't like him.
When I brought up Wexner in the book, and again, I'm not saying this.
I always tell people this is what's said.
Dershowitz says that the rumor going around was that Epstein had had a homosexual relationship with Wexner and was blackmailing him.
Now, I don't know if that's Dershowitz running interference.
He likes that disinformation, smart guy.
If that really happened and he's just frustrated that he's been basically labeled a pedophile by a bunch of people, et cetera.
What are your thoughts on Dershowitz and that revelation that's coming out in the book?
All right.
So you've raised so many points again.
Let me go back to the beginning.
You mentioned first about Ohio and Wexner and Epstein.
And in response to your very first question, actually, you asked me how I went from writing about true crime to Epstein.
I went from writing about myself to then writing a series of books that deconstructed the war on drugs.
And it was while writing the war on drugs series of books I came across, what was it, the airlines run by the CIA, Southern Air Transport, I think was one of them.
Air America.
They made a movie about it.
Robert Downey Jr. and who's the other guy?
Omel Gibson.
Yeah, go ahead.
And how that stuff was bankrupted and then relocated to Ohio by Wexner and Epstein.
So that's what put me onto the path.
I went from deconstructing the war on drugs to finding out about the transportation of human beings by these people, by this same apparatus.
Now, you're on about the money flows of the apparatus.
We saw Wexner give the property to Epstein for peanuts.
And we saw Leon Black give Epstein hundreds of millions for financial advice.
So this story as to Jeffrey blackmailing Wexner, I find that hard to believe because the apparatus was just doing its natural thing, moving money to Jeffrey to do his thing with.
And in return, this is the difference between Diddy and Jeffrey, really.
You know, Jeffrey, it's politicians, royal family members, scientists.
You can see there's an intelligence agency mind behind that versus Diddy.
You know, it's celebs, it's Hollywood.
Even me and you reporting on Diddy, we're not going to get in trouble like we got in trouble because we were over the target with the Epstein stuff.
So with Dershowitz, when we first started covering Dershowitz and all that stuff was deleted as well.
You know, you've got Virginia making her allegations, which then were unsustained in the long run.
So people can take away whatever they think about that.
Look at Prince Andrew.
He's not done any prison time.
He's not got any convictions.
He got out of it through his mom.
You know, what was it, 10 plus million was paid out.
So it's a minefield with Dershowitz because he's so outspoken.
He's everywhere.
You know, he got on TV right away.
I only sleep with my wife kind of thing.
But there's an in at the center of these lawyers and these players and these politicians, it's just a big incestuous money go-round.
And you know, intuitively, you just think that he's an integral part of that machine.
Well, let me say this about Wexner, too.
You know, we focus on the fact that he's the Victoria Secret and the L Brands guy, but you did mention the Air America stuff.
He also had a group called the Wexner Group.
And this guy's an adamant Zionist, very involved in Israeli policies and politics.
And one of the things I focus on is the Wexner report that came out via Frank Lunt's post-Iraq war invasion, where Saddam has now fallen and it's in Israel's interest to keep the United States there.
And it's this long list of propaganda tools, including shooting like videos of pregnant women crying, et cetera, in that area to manipulate the American public into staying in that war.
Guess what we did?
We're still there.
It seems like it worked.
And he seems to be that guy on that level that, despite the fact they did that Hulu documentary about him recently in the last year, whereas the R. Kelly stuff was allowed to take off and people were, you know, looking at that.
And then all of a sudden, there was some kind of criminal justice there.
And there's something I was harping on for a long time.
And now the Diddy stuff, we're almost like in the blink of an eye, things changed.
The Epstein stuff is still very, very shrouded in mystery.
And I know there's a lot of big talk that we're going to get documentation, but you named Ari Ben Minash, and I'm pretty sure he's the source of this.
Again, I only put out what's out there.
I have no idea.
I've never been to an Epstein or Trump party, but they did have a relationship.
I would say Trump was pretty damn cavalier, however, in the run-up to the 2016 election, naming Epstein and his relationship to Clinton.
That to me kind of suggests that the guy wasn't having sex with anybody that was underage.
And of course, you know, the Virginia Guffray Roberts story.
He's kind of presented as a hero in that situation.
That he's the one at Mar-a-Lago that gets rid of Epstein because he's turned her out.
And her father worked for Trump for many, many years as a chef.
There's a lot of documents on that, etc.
When you look at that as the case, there's also the story that supposedly Epstein, and again, I'm not sure if it was Minash, but I think it was him, met his current wife, or not Epstein, Trump, his current wife, at an Epstein party, where basically he had 20-plus models who were there who were auditioning for wife number three.
And Melania was at that party.
I don't know if it's true, but it's out there.
There's also the business relationships.
You know, Whitney Webb has focused on that as they're falling out.
If you had to take all the information in, what is their relationship and what was the falling out?
Okay, what is whose relationship?
Sorry, Trump and Epstein.
So whatever exposure he had to Epstein was obviously much less than the exposure Bill Clinton had because he would never have gone down that road of using it as political capital against the Clintons if he didn't know Clinton had done 10 times more.
So I think that was quite a cunning strategy by Trump to parlay that into, you know, when he was campaigning against Hillary, et cetera.
I think that was a good strategy.
So you think that that's the limitation of them?
Because again, I mean, there is something there, right?
Those guys ran in those circles.
In fact, before I think it was the document dump around 2018-19 that had confirmed that Trump actually went on the plane, right?
That he was on that plane, et cetera.
Everybody would bombard me and say, oh, Trump's not on the list.
He never traveled on the plane.
I go, well, we don't know that yet.
And we only got, by the way, partial lists of partial flight logs, you know, of those type of things.
We have nowhere near what was really there.
But he was in Vanity Fair, Trump, being quoted as Glene Maxwell and Epstein came to his plane.
And he razzed Epstein for being late to his plane and flying on his plane.
So he was very friendly with him.
He even was quoted in, I think it was the New Yorker or New York magazine as talking about Epstein with the ladies and how he liked them very young, made that comment.
And this is even before the creepy Trump dance video over at the Epstein party with the big, tall, former basketball player turned senator.
I forget what his name was.
So they had a relationship.
Again, Trump was big in New York property, big in the Florida scene there.
My question is what that relationship is.
But at the same time, just like you, I think it was much more limited to, you know, than the others or he wouldn't have dared bring it up.
At the same time, I don't know that we're getting any Epstein files.
My focus is on the 9-11 files next, but let's just see what these assassination files bring us because I think that if we get all of them, that may actually bleed into that network beginning to deal drugs long before what we find out in South America.
What's your take on that?
So on the Epstein stuff or the drug stuff?
On the declassification into the drug stuff.
Okay, so what have they announced so far?
I'm sorry.
What documents are they going to declassify with the drug stuff?
Well, that's what I'm asking you.
So we're going to get the assassination stuff of Kennedy, of both Kennedy Brothers and MLK.
And we know how corrupt the FBI and the CIA are, right?
And we look at the stuff that came out via Kennedy during the Trump administration.
And there was things in there that you wouldn't normally think were in any relation.
For instance, that supposed picture of Hitler after World War II and that document where they were going there.
So when we are talking about black ops and networks, and especially when you look at Kennedy and guys like David Ferry and Clay Shaw, et cetera, in the New Orleans network, you know, my guess is that intelligence didn't just start drug running in South America in the 80s and that they may have been doing that type of work.
Obviously, not on the scale that you see in there.
Lucky Luciano's Legacy00:03:27
But do you think you're going to start seeing the emergence of that corrupt network that builds into that drug network?
This goes back hundreds of years, Jason.
Queen Victoria was the biggest drug dealer in the world.
If you look at the opium wars and the fortunes that were built off the back of the opium wars, that's not just European families, that's also American political dynasty families.
I mean, when China refused to take the opium, we went to war twice and beat the Chinese and forced them to take the opium.
So that was our policy.
We're going to deal drugs.
You ain't going to take our drugs.
We're going to go to war with you.
Now, as morals have changed over the years, when it's convenient for us, we pretend to fight a war on drugs.
But really, what we're doing is creating an illegal black market that makes this inflated profit price for the intelligence services to harness that to put into whatever operations they want to direct it to.
So let's go back to Lucky Luciano now.
The whole justification for a lot of this has been we don't want the domino effect of communism, you know, all these countries falling, Central and South America, and Nexus in Mexico, and they're knocking on the door.
Do we want the commies dealing the white and they have all that money to buy arms?
Or do we want the right-wing death squads that we're financing and supporting to have all that money from the white to buy our arms?
And before the white, it was the brown.
It was the, you know, they've got the golden triangle, Lucky Luciano.
We wanted Lucky Luciano's people in Italy to lay the law down post-World War II.
And they were given the pass to commit whatever crimes they want, provided they were withholding the underlying objective of the national security interests of the United States of America.
So crime all over the world is sanctioned as long as their client states or as long as they are like Argentinian death squads.
Klaus Barbie's a fascinating character.
I've written a lot about him.
Dershowitz also defended him.
There's another Dershowitz connection right there.
You know, you mentioned Luciano.
There's also Meyer Lansky.
And that kind of goes to my point that you look at this incestuous relationship with intelligence and organized crime and you see the organized crime connection possibly in these assassinations.
I do wonder if there is going to be that exposure of these networks.
I suppose time will tell.
And again, I don't know how much can actually come out.
For instance, when we get down to really the nitty-gritty of our intelligence networks, Andy Jacobson wrote the great book, Operation Paperclip in 2013 on the Nazis coming in.
And it's not just NASA, it's the Central Intelligence Agency.
It's everything.
And at that time, there were 500 million documents still classified on that.
We're long overdue for mass declassification.
Final Break00:02:01
We got to take one final break.
When we come back, I do want to talk Diddy.
How far does the Diddy story actually go?
We're going to come back.
We've got Sean Atwood with us, SeanAtwood.com is where you can find all the books.
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Cardio Miracle Hope00:06:49
So, Sean, let's do Diddy.
We talked about a plethora of issues that I think are much more large-scale.
However, there's always been this aura of blackmail in that industry.
A lot of people have talked about Quincy Jones.
You know, there's that infamous quote from Tupac when he was dating Quincy Jones' daughter, that Quincy had tried to have sex with him.
I always have my questions about Michael Jackson as a kid and what exactly happened to him.
But again, we've seen large-scale abuse not only in the Hollyweird arena, but the entertainment industry as a whole.
And certainly during the 70s, I mean, it's not, I mean, it's an open secret, like the abuse that happened to teenage kids, both the kids of celebrities, the Drew Barrymores of the world, or if you just happen to be a random teenage groupie that found Steven Tyler attractive and got signed over by your parents at 15.
I mean, those are the type of things that were actually happening at that time period.
Now, you get into the modern day arena.
Here we are in 2025, but 2024, that story really breaks.
There'd been kind of this undertone of rappers on the DL for many, many years.
I still remember the Boondocks, awesome animated series based on a cartoon where they had that whole episode where essentially the thug rapper was really, you know, this closeted homosexual being run by the bigger producer, etc.
And here we are, Diddy style.
And now we also have the massive evidence of blackmail via tapes of this nature, etc.
How deep does Diddy go?
When does it start with him?
Is it pre-Biggy, post-Biggie?
And really, do you think he was recruited in with other higher-level accomplices if it is post-Biggie or around that type that time period?
All right.
I'm going to have to word this very carefully because I'm in legal situations with Diddy and Jay-Z right now.
And 90% of my Diddy content was deleted about two weeks ago.
So let me say this.
I interviewed Suge Knight.
That video is still standing.
And Suge Night alleged that What's happened to Justin Bieber, whereby he's alleged that Bieber was put on vacations with executives and high-up people in the industry, via Diddy.
And we're seeing the trauma right now, you know, internalized in Bieber, kind of like wearing him down.
He looks like Jesse from Breaking Bad on a meth rampage right now.
And the recent pictures of him, it's really sad, actually.
And then Sug Knight was alleged dropping names in like Clive Davis, etc., because he said that Diddy has only done what he's been taught.
So you think it's basically within the music industry?
Because there's a lot of people that are going beyond that, maybe in the entertainment industry.
I think it's that as well.
I don't think he was working for intelligence.
At least I haven't seen any of that type of information.
I've also seen the Sug Knight Bieber stuff.
You know, I always take what Sug Knight has to say with the grain of salt because he is literally as gangster as you think he is.
You could actually watch him run down a man with his truck and murder him.
That is why he is currently in prison.
However, it is really indisputable that Diddy was running flavor camp and that you had a plethora of youth in his vicinity.
And look, I'm 45 years young.
I'm still old enough to remember his MTV making the band series where he was completely narcissistic and abusive to young adults.
Everybody remembers the cheesecake thing.
I never trust a man that wears sunglasses inside.
I like to see the whites of his eyes.
Diddy doesn't like to take those sunglasses off too often.
I wonder if he's going to make it.
You know, and I hate to say it like that.
I think he makes it if it really is just kind of within the Hollyweird network and they can burn him.
And nobody higher up really has to pay their dues on this.
However, if he starts talking and squawking and it does go a little higher up, I mean, the guy just had a knee injury and was taken to the hospital.
You talked about El Chapo earlier.
People need to understand where Epstein committed suicide twice was the same prison they held El Chapo in.
Okay, it was the same facility that hadn't had a suicide for 13 years.
And you had Epstein have that happen to him twice.
I think he's in MCC, isn't he?
Isn't Diddy in the same Epstein prison or no?
So they shut that one down.
He's in MDC, which is like the sister facility.
And he's gutted right now because Luigi's getting all the attention and getting all the fan mail.
And his cardigan's selling out all over the world.
And he's no longer, you know, Diddy's got a chomo jacket on him because of the nature of his crimes.
And Luigi's getting hero worship.
So supposedly, did he's depressed over this?
On a more serious note, though, it's like someone's sexual orientation is fine.
But if you're pointing out there in videos to millions of people that you're this big, badass, macho character who's, you know, and you're promoting crime, and all these young people are watching this and they're getting sensor private prisons where BlackRock's got investments not only in the music promoting the crime, but the private prisons housing the young people.
$60,000 a year of taxpayers' money per person.
That's what gets me.
You've got these phonies with false backstories like Diddy sending a whole generation of kids to prison when behind the scenes he's out there allegedly diddling kids and doing all these things.
Sean, Sean, can't stop won't stop, bro.
Can't stop won't stop.
I never, you know, I always had a bad feeling about that guy.
Wu-Tang for Life00:01:18
That era, I was much more into the metal anyways, but if I was going hip-hop, we were going Wu-Tang.
Wu-Tang is for the children, Wu-Tang for life.
You can get all of Sean Atwood's books over at SeanAtwood.com.
I mean, from Epstein, his time partying to prison to Escobar and more.
It has been an absolute pleasure, Sean.
We got to get you back on the program.
Folks, you know the drill over here.
It is not about left or right to this guy.
It is always about right and wrong.
I absolutely love you guys, and we will see you on the flip side.
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