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Aug. 10, 2023 - Info Warrior - Jason Bermas
59:44
Leaving Television News And Truthful Views With Morrow And Paul | MSOM Ep. 805

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Wake-Up Moments In Journalism 00:14:36
Welcome to Making Sense of the Madness.
I am Jason Burmese and today we're going to talk independent journalism with Allison Morrow and AMP News contributor Chris Paul is going to join us to discuss Mitch McConnell and much more.
We'll be back after this.
For me, it's hard to overstate the importance of true independent journalism in
this country and around the world with so much mainstream muppet media propaganda out there, parroting a great narrative of authoritarianism.
And that's why it is my utter pleasure to introduce my audience today to somebody who broke away from the mainstream media and does some of the best independent reporting/slash interviews out there.
Her name is Allison Morrow.
Allison, thank you so much for joining us.
For my audience who is new, I know we've done many a show together prior to this.
First, tell them how you got into mainstream media to begin with.
Well, thank you for that very humbling intro.
I don't feel like I deserve everything you said, but I really appreciate it, Jason.
Thanks for always inviting me on your show to talk about all this fun stuff.
I got out of mainstream TV news in 2019.
I was the environmental reporter for the NBC affiliate in Seattle.
I had a very cushy job, honestly.
I never had to come into the station.
I got to go cover Wolverines and orcas and all kinds of really interesting topics.
And as I started to gain more competency in the field in which I was reporting, because keep in mind, most reporters are general assignments.
So they're going from city council meetings to a burning house to a murder to Trump, whatever, right?
They're throwing all these different, these different topics day by day, and they get a couple hours to try to understand what they're talking about.
But I had finally been put on a beat and I started to gain enough competency on my beat that I was able to see what I didn't know for the first time.
Because for many years, I had lived thinking that I could be what they often said in our editorial meetings, which was a mini expert by the end of the day.
And we had kind of convinced ourselves, I think we get to the end of the day, and we were a mini expert.
But once you actually do become kind of a mini expert, you really do.
Like I was starting to gain this competency in environmental reporting, I realized I actually didn't know hardly anything about these topics.
Not to the extent that I was selling it to the audience.
I think we were going on television every night, acting like we were the authority.
I mean, not just acting like it would say that at the beginning of the show, right?
Your most trusted name in news.
You know, don't go anywhere else.
We've got all the answers.
And what I was realizing more and more was that I just didn't have the time to do the reporting that I needed to do.
And so, sorry, I'm also a stay-at-home mom and my husband just took the 10-month-old away.
So that was a little background noise, my little producers.
But yeah, long story short, once I realized what I didn't know about these topics, the options were: number one, gain the competency if I was going to still go on air and talk about it, or quit.
Because I just, I couldn't anymore lie about it, I guess, right?
Because like for years, I wasn't lying.
I was just ignorant.
But then when I got to the point where I was realizing what I didn't know, if I continued down that path, I mean, essentially, I was selling myself as an authority when I knew really well that I wasn't.
And that was, that was just a sort of, I guess, crossroad for consciousness that I couldn't, I just couldn't continue any farther.
And so at the time, I discussed with my bosses about changing my position so I'd have a little bit more time to do the research I needed.
And I think in that field, I'm not necessarily sure how it works in the paper world, but at least in television broadcast news, it's really unfathomable to them that you wouldn't turn a story at four, five, six o'clock and be able to get it done within a few hours.
You come in at nine or 10 o'clock in the morning, you have your editorial board meeting, and then a couple hours later, you're expected to turn a story.
In their minds, like that's what they were paying me for.
They just couldn't see how that could change.
And I couldn't see how I could do the job that they wanted me to do anymore now that I knew what I didn't know.
So that's why I quit.
So there's so many things to go over there.
First of all, I love that you're not a fake it to make it person because there are so many people that try to fake it just to get into your position in the first place and roll with that.
I'll never forget there was a scandal way back in the day in upstate New York that they hired a weatherman who had no degree and he was essentially an actor.
And he was a bit, he was popular for the three months that he was on air until somebody did a little bit digging.
And they're like, hey, wait a minute, this guy doesn't have any kind of background whatsoever in meteorology.
So why is he a weatherman?
Now, you've already got this amazing job.
How did you get into it in the first place?
And then what was the realization moment?
I know you say it was gradual, but like you said, you had this cushy gig.
You were essentially doing a lot of things that you loved.
And then you have morals all of a sudden.
And you say, wait a minute, you know, I genuinely want to learn this stuff.
I'm not truly an expert.
What would you feel your field of expertise was as opposed to what they gave you?
Nothing.
I think that was my field of expertise.
I mean, if I had one, that's what I had the most competency in.
I have a master's of divinity degree.
So I can fake it till I make it with some of the best philosophy and religion students out there because a lot of them don't know what they're talking about either.
And then they go out and teach college students, which is why college students think they know everything, I guess.
And all they do is just recite Descartes and Kant and Kierkegaard.
And then everyone thinks they're so smart.
I've been in that circle.
So I could probably, I could hold myself in a cocktail party with some graduate students of philosophy and religion.
But next to that, I think the environment was a world that I did have competency in, but I started to realize how political it was.
I was starting to realize how many special interests were coming to the table for these topics that I was covering.
And I only could scratch the surface of them.
And honestly, that's how most reporters are.
They have just barely scratched the surface of what they're talking about.
And if they're not regularly encouraged to be critical thinkers about these topics, they're not regularly encouraged to question the government or question even nonprofits that say that they're there to help, then, you know, you're just trying to get your story done.
And yes, of course, there are the people there that are huge egos.
They think they know everything.
They're trying to save you from yourself.
That definitely exists, don't get me wrong.
And there's probably a lot of that.
But there are also people like me who really believed in journalism, wanted to do the best job I could.
I believe that I did do the best job I could.
I would have done better if I could have done better.
And frankly, when I could have done better, I finally quit because that was the best I could do at the time.
The best thing I could do once I finally had that crisis of consciousness was to, or conscience, I guess, was to just leave.
That was the best option at the time, which is, you know, I don't know if I'd call it sad.
It's just a reality of the news business that journalism is very difficult to do in mainstream news.
I think that as far as your question about what were my wake-up moments, well, there was one day where I was put on a story off of my beat because they needed somebody to just cover this press release that had come out from the Department of Health saying that a doctor in the Seattle area was experimenting on his patients.
And we just kind of ran with it.
We went and stood outside his office at 10 o'clock at night.
My producers thought it was a great, a great lead story, you know, doctor experimenting on his patients.
And we just regurgitated the press release from the Department of Health.
And then we said, no comment from the doctor.
We weren't able to get a comment.
Well, of course, we weren't because, you know, we kind of went on this after his office was closed.
So anyway, that was a huge mess.
And we completely defamed this guy.
And a couple days later, I was able to interview him and his patients.
And I realized I had gotten it totally wrong.
And the Department of Health had used me basically, this like willing disciple, I guess, just going along with it, thinking that the government was telling us the truth.
They had just used me to like screw this guy's career.
And I met patients who were alive like many years after what the Seattle Cancer Care Alliance and other hospitals had told them they would be.
And their treatments were thrown out because of this battle between the Department of Health and this particular doctor who wasn't doing anything illegal.
And these people physically suffered because of my reporting and others in the industry.
That was a real aha moment because I realized not only that the government could do this, but also that I could participate and that my participation in it had dire real-world consequences for people.
And so that was kind of the beginning of starting to go, whoa, you know, I've seen this now.
Like I like you're walking down the street and you get mugged for the first time.
You're like, this can happen, you know, and so it changes the way you look at everything.
So I started to change the way I looked at my beat too.
You know, well, where's the government doing this in this situation?
It seems like a harmless story.
There was a time, so fast forward, you know, I don't know, a year, a few months, there was the paper bag versus plastic bag debate.
The Washington state government wanted to outlaw plastic bags, which they did eventually.
And I was going to go to the Seattle Aquarium for this press conference, which this is very common.
If you want to get your message out there and basically have reporters do no research, the best way to do it is just have the press conference, have all the key players there.
They don't have to go call or do any research.
They can go to their take their lunch break.
You have the B-roll there.
You can shoot video of the aquarium.
They have plastic bags you can shoot video of.
It's like, it's a one-stop shop, as they say in our business.
And that means you'll definitely make your deadline by five and your boss isn't going to yell at you.
Great day.
Well, I tweet about this.
I tweet that this is happening.
And it was a very uncritical tweet.
And somebody from the Washington Policy Center, which is a more conservative-leaning think tank, policy think tank, which doesn't exist very much in Washington state.
They wrote me, this guy, Todd Myers, wrote me.
And he's like, hey, just so you know, you should do some research about plastic bags versus paper bags because paper bags require a lot of input that causes environmental natural resource harm, water, fertilizers, pesticides, all this stuff.
And if you just do a one-use off of a paper bag, some of this research shows that it's worse than a plastic bag.
The plastic bags problem is in the disposal.
And I was like, uh, what?
So I started doing all this research.
Seems like a very simple topic, but in this research, and I found that he was telling the truth, that there was a lot of controversy in the environmental reporting world or the environmental science world about what's really better, a plastic bag or a paper bag, or even a reusable bag that you get at the grocery store.
Like, how often do you have to use a reusable bag for it to have been worth the input?
You know, the whole cycle, the life cycle analysis.
I had never heard that before.
So, then I was like, oh my gosh, if this could happen on a paper bag versus plastic bag story, where else is this happening?
So, then, like, fast forward to the Clean Water Act.
I have to do a story about the Clean Water Act.
I needed to read a 50-page Senate report on the Clean Water Act to feel like I had competency to go on air that night.
I had no time to read it.
I was shooting my own video, editing my own video, tracking it.
All I could do was like the Republican I found that was willing to go do a quick phone interview within my deadline parameters and the Democrat, basically.
That's all I could get.
And that had to be good enough.
And I couldn't read the report.
And I said to this anchor who had been at our station for 40 years that I was really concerned because I was going to go on air and talk about this.
And I didn't have time to read the Senate report that I really needed to read about what was going on with the Clean Water Act.
And she said, just say what NBC says.
They typically get it right.
That was her solution was just copy and paste what NBC was reporting about Trump and the Clean Water Act and just run with it.
And then that's it.
And to me, that was not a good answer because I was starting to realize that the national news knew less than I did.
I mean, here I was a full-time environmental reporter.
Of course, I believed at the time I knew probably more than the vast majority of any reporter about these particular topics because I was the only one, one of the only ones in the whole country for a television station who covered this day in and day out.
You know, some reporter in New York City that's like just put on the Clean Water Act one day, they don't know anything.
They just know that they hate Trump and they, and it's clean water.
You know what I mean?
Who doesn't love clean water?
They don't know anything about it.
So I was like, I can't just do that either.
So it got to the point where I was starting to realize I just can't, like, I cannot do this anymore.
And Jason, what I started doing was then I would just do dumb stories that like had no consequence or meaning for the community because I thought, well, at least if I got to the end of the day and did this dumb story, I wouldn't feel like I was misleading people because I did know everything about this.
Just, you know, stuff that was, that was really like, you could just do in 45 minutes that had like no long-term consequences if I got it wrong.
And I was like, I don't want to do this.
I have a master's degree in like philosophy and religion.
I'm capable of thinking through complex topics.
I want to do this, but I'm not going to be able to do it in this position.
And then when I tried, because like I said, I did have a great job.
I had great benefits.
I had a lot of vacation time.
I was making the most I had ever made in my life.
Informed Choices Washington 00:15:53
I had a take-home car.
I never had to come in for the meetings.
I mean, I had a great job.
They were like, no, we're not, you're not changing your way of doing things.
You're going to be on air every day at five, six o'clock, you know, for the most part, barring maybe an investigation every once in a while.
This is just the way it is.
And I was like, I just, I can't do it.
So that's, that was it.
Well, I'll tell you what, it's extremely admirable to step out of that very comfortable situation and not just go along to get along, which you alluded to many times.
We got to take a break.
But I want to hone in on the fact that you talked about disciples and how a lot of this is kind of like religious mantra that parrots this authoritarian narrative.
And we're the authoritative source.
So we're always going to get it right.
And how that is so different from what you've learned over the last several years in independent media.
We're going to take a break.
It's making sense of the madness.
I am Jason Burmese and we'll be back after this.
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We are back with Allison Morrow.
And Allison, you alluded previously to the idea that so many of these institutions, whether it be environmental institutions or mainstream media institutions, political institutions, they often operate like religions.
And unfortunately, religions where you have these true believers at the bottom, but then you have charlatans at the top that are manipulating the system.
You know, how can you speak to that with this big degree of yours?
It's funny because I do get a lot of questions about why I have a master of divinity degree, how that applies at all to journalism.
But yeah, it actually does.
It gives you quite a bit of insight because my sub-specialty was psychology and counseling.
So that was a whole other level of trying to understand the human psyche and attachment, I guess, to something that makes you feel like you've got meaning and purpose and how that can get so just misconstrued into something that does look like you become a demigod.
Me personally, that's my spiritual belief about all this.
I believe that big picture, power is more attractive than money to people because it is like the fall, the fall of righteousness.
Like that is, that is the heart of the spiritual battle is the person who wants to be God.
And so I do think there is this demigod complex among everybody, but particularly in fields where you can exert a significant amount of influence and you can shape the world the way you want it.
That's kind of the way I look at somebody like Bill Gates.
I think he has enough money.
He wants to socially engineer the world the way he wants it to be.
He's totally got all that sort of demigod attribute about him.
But let me tell you this story.
When we were discussing the sort of moments of awareness, there was one a couple months before I finally quit where there was a conference about to start brought together by Informed Choice Washington, which I had never heard of before.
Now I know them very well.
But at the time, I had never heard of Informed Choice Washington.
I don't even know what they were informing you about.
And they were bringing in doctors to talk to people about the vaccine mandates for childhood immunizations at schools because at a time, the Washington state legislature was sparring over whether they should get rid of the, I think, religious and philosophical exemptions.
So to take those away and only have a medical exemption as an option.
And these doctors were coming to town to talk about it.
Now, my station was already covering it.
We were covering this, but the way we were covering it was we'd go to these protests.
I wasn't because I was the environmental reporter.
I was with the Wolverines, remember, but I would come back and watch our coverage of it.
We'd have somebody go interview a mom at a protest.
It was like, you know, this is wrong.
I should be able to have medical freedom for my family.
And then we would put the Department of Health MD, doctor, you know, infectious disease person on.
And that would be like your balanced coverage.
As if like the mom who's just, we let the sound bite on about how she should have freedom and the Department of Health telling you that her freedom is infringing upon everyone's health is like a fair battle.
Like that to me, I was never learning anything.
And at the time, I didn't really have much of an opinion about it.
I didn't know anything about vaccines.
I mean, I just didn't know, but I was curious.
You know, one of the reasons that I was picked to be the environmental reporter at my station was because my boss said, I believe this S-H-I-T.
Okay.
In other words, I believe in clean water.
I like having clean water.
I make my own kombucha.
I grind grain to make my own bread for my family.
I buy from local farmers.
I care about grass-fed, pasture-raised animals.
Like I'm really deep into that stuff.
So I don't hate the environment.
I love the environment.
That's one of the reasons that I don't like, I don't like it when special interests come in and sell false products to people or false ideas to people because it turns off all these potential, you know, these potential groups of people who would care about their health and their families, health related to this if they got the truth.
But instead, they go, that's just another government propaganda campaign, you know, and a lot of times they're right about it.
And so that's one of the reasons I really don't, I don't like it when the propaganda gets pushed because I do care so much about the environment.
Anyway, that's just my rabbit hole for a second.
So let's go back to the vaccine story.
So at the time, you know, I'm not covering it, but I suggest that if we're going to up our level of coverage, like in a way that somebody might get something out of, maybe we should consider sending a reporter, because we did have a health reporter who basically worked with Seattle Children's Hospital, just did whatever they said.
So that, you know, paid content is another great topic idea for you to cover.
But they, this reporter, I thought, well, she could go to this conference and hear from these MDs who say that the exemptions should be maintained.
I had never heard of doctors who questioned childhood immunizations.
I didn't hear of doctors that said we should have the right to not vaccinate our children and specifically to go to school.
So I was fascinated by that because I was genuinely curious.
I wanted to know if there were health problems that immunizations created.
So I suggested it.
That's all I did.
I just, I forwarded the email from Informed Choice Washington to my assignment desk, to the health reporter, and I think to my manager.
He got it somehow because I got it talking to him.
He called me.
I'm sure he didn't put it in an email for a reason.
He called me and said, if you think this is a story worth covering, then I don't trust you on this topic because I can't remember his exact way of saying this, but essentially, if I think that these people deserve any, any voice on our air, I am delusional.
I'm willing to just let any psychopath say anything on our air because that's how he believed.
And he was a true believer.
To go back to your question about the religion, he wasn't saying that because he believed that we got all this money from Pfizer and like he knew better.
And this is a guy who would not like GMOs.
He was very anti-Monsanto, anti-Roundup.
He liked, you know, big pharma.
He would totally be down that, down with that with me.
But when it came to vaccines, that was like a no-go conversation.
You know, you're killing people if you don't get immunizations.
He could not see past it and he wasn't curious whatsoever.
And he, so he told me, I was never allowed to even talk about vaccines in our newsroom.
Now, this is not report on it, okay?
I wasn't even allowed to say, hey, Sally, you know, I'm eating my cheese sandwich, my raw, raw milk cheese sandwich.
Did you hear about this conference about the vaccines?
I wasn't even allowed to say that.
I wasn't allowed to talk about vaccines.
Like, I wasn't even allowed to voice it into the ether in the newsroom.
And I'm like, is this for real?
I had never had anybody in management say something like that to me, but it gave me real insight.
And I'm grateful for that experience because it really showed me how certain topics are just completely untouchable in corporate news.
And climate change is one of those, and vaccines are another.
So, of course, I went to the vaccine conference because I was like, well, now I'm really interested about what's going on.
And that has really changed my world.
I'll tell you what, that's been like a whole new world that has opened up to me.
But, but that was a moment where it hit me.
Like, you know, he wasn't thinking his paycheck was going to suffer if we went down and interviewed somebody at this conference or even just sat there and heard what they had to say.
He believed that we were going to be damning the public to some kind of like, I don't know, 18th century outbreak of a terrible virus that was going to kill off the human race.
I mean, that's truly how he believed about it.
And I'm grateful for the experience because it showed me that way of thinking.
Well, it shows you how anybody can have their blind spots and be indoctrinated by like these Bernesian tactics of safe and effective.
It was around long before the COVID-19 44 nightmare.
Oh, yeah.
Especially in association with a lot of the shots out there.
Allison, that moves us on to what you're doing these days, which is true independent media.
And I've been so impressed with the experts that you've brought on, the documentation that you've gone over, and really the fact that you're not left or right either.
And you're kind of down the line.
In fact, your reporting in the past really didn't have anything to do with politics as you knew them at the time.
So, you know, talk about that journey and what you've learned as an independent journalist and just the, I guess, complete inverse of what you experience with somebody telling you what you can and can't talk about or do and having the time to explore issues more than getting out that, you know, four-minute piece in a 24-hour cycle.
Four minutes would have been very long.
I got 90 seconds.
And if I went over 90 seconds, I usually had to cut six seconds or something over it.
I was not allowed any more than that.
Well, you know, I guess beginning of COVID, I decided I was going to start interviewing censored people and talk about how little I knew when I was in the TV news industry, even as like an expert, all right, in my field, because I was noticing how people were making these life-altering decisions, not just like for their health, but jobs.
They were losing their jobs over what corporations were doing or government agencies were doing.
And all because they were believing what they were reading or seeing on TV, thinking that this is like the real information, that these people know what they're talking about.
And I just wanted people to know, not necessarily like, don't read it, I mean, or watch it.
I mean, you can if you want.
I don't care.
I just, I just want you to, I just want to give you an ingredient label.
You know, you're being handed something without an ingredient label.
I just want you to know the ingredients and then you can choose whether you want to watch it or not, but just know what you're getting.
And I think I used the analogy the other day when I was talking to somebody.
It's like you go to a five-star, you think you're going to like a five-star steak restaurant or something and it's like it's 100% grass-fed, grass-finished or whatever.
Like that would be my belief.
And it's really McDonald's, but you don't know that.
You know, you think, you think it's all these things, but it's really McDonald's.
Like, would you still eat it?
And I was like, I wouldn't.
So I just wanted people to know.
That took me down, that took me down the path of interviewing people who were written about or discussed on these mostly national outlets, but then that would get regurgitated by the local news like I used to work for.
Because I wanted to know who they really were.
These people who were the dirty dozen during COVID that spread all the misinformation, or this person who's an extremist and is using this treatment that could kill people, or what's ivermectin?
Or all these people who were basically discussed as crazy.
I remember that moment that my boss told me I couldn't cover vaccines, for instance, and that's the way he saw these doctors.
So I remembered that and I was like, well, I didn't find those doctors that I went and talked to at that conference after I was told I was never allowed to talk about this topic.
I didn't find them to be psychopaths at all.
I actually found them to be quite interesting and they were very smart and board certified.
And I mean, I thought it took more faith to believe they were psychopaths than to believe they had something valid to say.
I mean, it just took a greater leap of faith to believe they were psychos.
I don't know how they could practice or maintain their license or heal people that way.
I mean, why weren't they just killing people left and right?
So as I started interviewing censored people, which was not great for my career as an independent journalist as far as money making is concerned, I'll tell you what, like YouTube got onto that one real fast.
I started to realize once again, like how much information there is out there, how many special interests.
It just upped the game of what I already realized when I quit TV, that this information war is non-stop.
And it's very hard to, you know, we're going to say get to the bottom of it.
It's very difficult to get to the bottom of a lot of these topics, which then I think from a personal standpoint, that got me really interested in what I can know.
And so I think professionally, I approach it as just a conversation with somebody.
I don't have necessarily an end game in mind other than just trying to understand them a little bit better, not trying to find agreement or disagreement or argue with them.
I think my old colleagues would probably say, what I do isn't journalism because I don't, you know, I don't push back a lot.
You know, I'm not trying to argue with them constantly.
I just listen to them and I ask questions and I give the viewers a chance to ask questions.
That's one of the benefits of being a supporter is that you get to go one-on-one with these people and ask and ask questions, whatever you want to know.
And I would say, but at least I'm truth in advertising.
Like, you know what you're getting when you show up.
I'm not trying to pretend like I'm one of you.
You're outlets where it's like, don't listen to anybody else.
We're the most trusted name in news.
We're the most accurate.
I tell people, don't trust me.
You know, do the research.
I'm just a person who used to work in TV news who's trying to learn and I'm taking you along for the journey.
That's all I'm doing.
And I'm not trying to pretend like I've got all my ducks in a row.
But from a personal standpoint, as I've interviewed countless censored people from all different perspectives, religion, health, science, politics, you name it, I've gotten very interested in personally like growing my own food, raising livestock, figuring out what's in my soap.
Truth In Advertising 00:03:38
How do you grow fruit trees?
That's like my latest thing because I'd like to have some fruit trees in the yard so that we don't spend so much money on mangoes and whatever anymore.
This stuff is very intriguing to me because it's something I can go out and actually do.
And at the end of the day, I can pick a mango.
Like, I know I grew that.
I'm picking this actual piece of fruit.
It's going to feed my family.
And it's like a full circle thing.
Whereas I think often we're spending too much time in this world, this digital world where we're fighting with each other and we're getting pulled into, I think, these battles that are way bigger than us.
And we don't even realize we're being used by.
And we're wasting so much time actually living.
And maybe that's part of the pathology of whoever is the puppeteer.
Like it is to do that because you're not going and meeting your neighbor anymore.
You're not going out and growing food.
not you know you're not just like spending time with with your kids or or the people that you used to find to be your friends because they posted something on facebook that you didn't like politically and now all of a sudden you can't talk to them anymore i mean maybe that is part of the plan i don't know but but from a professional standpoint i think i'm still where i i was which is i'm i keep realizing all the things i don't know i'm i'm less i think i'm even more more so or less so i guess attached to any particular idea.
I really just, I just don't have any buy-in when it comes to proving someone right or wrong.
I personally, you know, maybe I should take that back.
The people, I guess I would say if I had like somebody from the CDC who pushed fake stuff during COVID, that would be a point where I would be like, okay, you know what?
This person needs to be exposed.
So I won't say I never have that.
But when it comes to a lot of topics that I'm not really well versed in, I think I just approach it, especially the sensor people, the people who aren't at the top of the power structure.
I just approach it like, I had the chance to have coffee with this person right now.
What would I ask them?
You know, even if it was just the two of us, I had nobody watching.
I'm just interested in learning more.
You know what?
If they take everybody for a ride, then I guess that's what they do.
If we learn something, then that's great.
You know, I just want my audience to know this is your opportunity to hear from somebody you might otherwise not get to hear from.
Ask whatever questions you want to ask and then go grow some basil in your garden and like just live your life.
That's that.
Well, first of all, I think it's great because that's what true free speech is: allowing somebody to elaborate on their message.
That's great.
Number two, practical solutions to real world problems.
Like you said, growing your own food, reaching out to your neighbors, being involved in your children's lives.
These are all things that we can do today, not tomorrow, and we can continue to do and really are positive things because I do think we need to connect more.
Believe it or not, we are out of time, Allison.
You are on across platforms.
You can find her on Twitter.
You can find her on Rockvin.
You can find her on Rumble and Locals.
Anything else you want to plug?
No, that's good.
Thank you, Jason.
It's been a real fun honor as always.
Appreciate it.
I love having you on, Allison Morrow, an independent journalist worth checking out.
When we come back, we're going to talk Mitch McConnell and much more with Chris Paul.
It's Making Sense of the Madness.
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Voter Rolls and Conspiracy Theories 00:08:40
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Welcome to a new era of connecting patriots.
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So some of the anomalies that that citizen that called the meeting with us pointed out, they noticed that there were about 93 people that were registered to vote or on the voter rolls.
Whether they cast about or not, we're not going to get into that.
Just the fact that they were on the voter rolls with the birth date of 1850.
There were 232 people registered to vote with an address to our local prisons.
There were 4,144 people that were 90 years old and older.
There were 125 people registered to vote or on the voter rolls that were registered to, or their address comes back to nonprofit NGOs and different businesses.
There were 300 people, approximately 300 people with no first name, just the last name.
There were about 110 people that were possible double voters, basically the same name, date of birth, address, but two different voter ID numbers.
People were registered to vote at various shelters and all that.
And we even found one person on the voter rolls by the name of Jesus Christ, which we found it kind of interesting.
Again, none of this proves that there's wrongdoing or anything like that, but that does indicate to us that we kind of need to take a closer look at what our voting system is looking like out there.
And we're working closely with the register of voter.
We've brought up these issues with her, and she's addressing those on her end.
And we're kind of developing a plan because our ultimate goal is to restore people's faith in the voting system.
And so, you know, we're creating a relationship with her.
And a lot of times people come to us and they say, hey, you know, what can we do?
Well, my recommendation is create a relationship with the register of voter, with your local sheriff, with your board of supervisors, you know, with your DA, and just make sure that your county, whatever you live in, is secure as much as it can be.
As much as it can be, those are the haunting words in my head because you're not allowed to question election integrity.
And all I have to say, Chris, is that, well, I'm glad Jesus Christ is voting again.
Thank goodness he's on the rolls.
I'm very happy about that.
Just a stunning piece.
I mean, that's out in California, where they had that little recall election of Gavin Newsome, even though we're being told that Gavin Newsom is incredibly popular, maybe more popular than Joe Biden, Chris.
It's pretty wild stuff.
We're going to talk Mitch McConnell and more, but what are your thoughts on that clip?
Well, you know, it's interesting that you mentioned the Gavin Newsome recall.
I actually did an event for that when I was still in California, a signature signing event, because it was clear that Gavin needed to be recalled.
And so the recall effort was successful when we got to the election.
And then, of course, they turned on the California election machine.
And Gavin was kept as governor by an overwhelming margin.
The decision on that election came in immediately.
So good for him.
It's funny, my first major experience of the government censoring me was at that petition event.
I did a video.
A friend actually filmed me on her Instagram of me talking about how my California voter registration had been changed to permanent mail-in ballot status without my knowledge or consent.
And I simply talked about that on this video.
She posted the video and that post got taken down.
And that post actually appears in FOIA documents that Judicial Watch was able to recover in early 2021.
The California Secretary of State's office flagged that post specifically and asked for that to be taken down and the social media companies complied.
So I have verifiable proof that the government coordinated with the social media companies through SDK Knickerbocker or SKD.
I always mess that up.
But it is a Democratic PR firm.
And so, you know, people have been making for the last few years this argument that these social media companies are private platforms and can censor as they wish, and that the government's not the body directing all this.
I've had verifiable proof for well over two years that that is not the case.
The government has absolutely been directing censorship through the states and through the federal government for years now.
Well, Chris, you sound like a Larry Elder-esque white supremacist when you say those things.
I don't know what else to say.
I mean, Jesus Christ is voting again.
We should all be smiling and happy, and we should thank the Lord for Mitch McConnell.
Now, Trump has recently expressed his displeasure with McConnell and the fact that he's not speaking up more about the latest indictments.
And then on top of that, you have McConnell because he's just so popular out in front of his constituents in Kentucky.
And they literally boo him for five minutes with a one-plus-minute chant of retire, Chris.
But no, this is a very popular politician.
We like that he's 81 years old and having stroke-like events in front of the press.
Very competent and really been great for this country.
Well, that's quite a claim, Jason.
Mitch McConnell's had an interesting ride since his massive, overwhelming electoral victory in the fall of 2020.
Donald Trump endorsed him late.
That was a Senate seat that the Democrats had invested a lot of money in and thought that they might get a win there.
Maybe the regime had decided Mitch was on his way out and they would be happy to replace him with a Democrat that they could then groom for the next 30 or 40 years of fully regime complicit decisions in Kentucky and that that would be a great move for them.
Mitch ended up dominating in that election somehow.
And so here we are.
You know, he missed a couple months of this calendar year already because at a dinner event, he apparently fell over, suffered some concussion, and then was just out for a couple of months.
And he's been back.
He's been, we saw the health issue, I guess that was a week or so ago.
Seemed to be a health issue at least.
Maybe he was hypnotized or something, but it looked like the power just shut off in Mitch's brain for a little while.
And now we have this.
I mean, if I was a conspiracy theorist, I would say that this looks like a massive public shaming that Mitch is enduring over time.
And I can't say that he doesn't deserve it.
Yeah, I'm really hoping that this is going to be the end of the Mitch McConnell's of the world, of the Diane Feinsteins of the world.
I mean, we need to have, the thing is, we need to have that every time they're out in public until they finally do step down and we can get some better people that are going to be held accountable for their actions because he has failed on so many of the big issues and continues to fail on those issues.
When we come back, we're going to go over this clip with RFK Jr. discussing Russia Gate and the media collusion with the Democratic Party to perpetrate a hoax.
Imagine that.
FBI, Republicans Align? 00:15:00
We've still got a lot of Republicans that aren't owning up to that fact.
We're going to be back after this.
It's Making Sense of the Madness.
He's been
a concern that if you have a national police agency, it will be weaponized by the president to serve a political agenda.
And that was a fear from the beginning of the creation, when both the FBI and in 1947, when the CIA was authorized, everybody, Republicans and Democrats, were deeply, deeply concerned because they said these national police agencies are really a feature of totalitarian regimes like the Stasi and East Germany, the KGB and Russia.
And we have had a problem from at least the 1960s of the FBI being weaponized against political dissent.
And then there were reforms in the 70s and 80s to a series of FDI directors after Hoover's death tried to depoliticize the agency, but it now is heavily politicized.
We saw the FBI legitimizing Russia gate, the propaganda against Trump.
And I'm not a fan of Trump's, but I don't think that the FBI should be deployed against any presidential candidate, whether I agree with that candidate or not.
And the Christiel file and all of these things that had now, you know, the Durham report has shown us that a lot of those are untrue.
They were propaganda that was abetted by people within those agencies.
And both the, you know, the CIA participated too.
You had 60 CIA agents or high-level officials signing a petition, signing a public letter that said that the Hunter Biden laptop was a faith, was Russian disinformation when they either didn't know or they knew it was.
And that's something that we should not tolerate.
Do you think they should be punished for this?
Yeah, of course they should be punished.
Of course they should be punished, but will they be punished?
Chris, I think that he eloquently lays that down in two minutes.
He could have gone further, in my opinion, of the crimes of the FBI and the CIA over the years.
I think he was right to point out initially people feared that a president would use these as tools, which they do in many cases to go after their political opponents.
But at the same time, we kind of had this really weird situation where they were already going after Trump as a political candidate.
But then when he was the president, they took it from a seven or an eight, ramped it up to a nine or a 10.
And now we're on off the scale mode, let's be honest.
So is there a chance at accountability other than just exposing how this is working?
Well, I mean, maybe I'm overly optimistic, but I think that accountability is absolutely coming.
I've thought that this entire time throughout this entire period, because I believe that the people are going to sooner or later fully understand what has been done to them and what has been done in their name.
And I think that that awakening process is at a very fast pace at this point.
I think the events with these Trump indictments are pushing that process forward at a pace we've never seen before.
You know, RFK Jr.'s candidacy is going to be a big factor in that.
I think I've said to you on the show before, it is my belief, and it has always been since I heard about his candidacy, that he is going to wake up big portions of the still sleeping left about issues like the vaccines, ultimately about climate change, and then finally about our election fraud in this country.
Because there's no way in the world that the Democratic Party is going to allow him to win the Democrat nomination, no matter how popular he becomes by that point.
I've suggested that potentially there might be a unity ticket forming as a third party option if the Republicans pull off something similar with Donald Trump, or perhaps that RFK Jr. could be appointed attorney general in a second Trump term.
I think there are a lot of options here.
And I think that Robert F. Kennedy Jr. pretty clearly believes it's his life's mission to pursue this sort of injustice and this sort of corruption because, you know, he's in the very, I mean, almost impossibly rare position of having his father executed by this regime, his uncle executed by this regime.
There's not too many other people that can say that.
And I can't imagine that he's going to go around trying to make deals with the people responsible for all of that.
Well, I got to say that I still remain skeptical that anybody worthy is actually going to be held accountable or be prosecuted for any of these crimes, unfortunately.
We've got to take a break.
But when we come back, I want to hit on that because there's been talk of if Trump gets in, Bannon says we're going to get the assassination files on both the Kennedys, MLK, Malcolm X.
He even talked about the files on Epstein under bar.
I mean, that seems like a pipe dream.
When we come back, I'm going to add something to that.
But if that were to happen, I do believe our entire system would be upended and should be upended.
And maybe we could have a true reformation of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
But we'll talk about that and more when we come back.
It's making sense of the madness.
We're joined by Chris Paul.
Check them out over at Badlands Media.
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What should people know about that whole blow up with Project Eritus?
I read a few people wrong, and that's my fault, but I learned from that.
And I think I'll be a more effective messenger as a result of that.
That'll free me up to do the next chapter, the next stage of my evolution, which is OMG, which is decentralizing journalism.
And sometimes things happen for a reason.
That's my goal.
That's my mission.
And I didn't ask for that, Lincoln.
I never thought that would be my mission.
It just has become my mission.
And I'm excited about it.
We are back with Chris Paul.
And we were talking about upending the system.
And I think with the declassification of all those things, obviously you upend the infrastructure.
Whether or not that's possible, and I think it's a fever dream in many cases, you know, is another thing.
But I'd like to add one more thing on there.
I mean, there's a multitude of scandals government-wise that you could put in there.
But I think that 9-11 is essential.
And it's something that Trump has leaned into several times.
He's talked about the Saudi involvement, but then on the flip side, when he was called out at the Live Golf Tournament, he said, you know what?
There hasn't been a real investigation.
We still haven't gotten to the bottom of it.
And it's a shame because we should have by now.
Well, I agree, Mr. President.
So aside from all of those assassination documents, to truly understand how what I call the international criminal cartel run by the predator class works, this military media industrial complex of many nation states and their interests at the top of the cabal.
To expose that, you need to expose 9-11.
And if somehow, some way that happened, I think that's a death blow to the system, number one.
And number two, he has somebody on his side right here for life, because I think that is the litmus test.
We've been lied to for so long about so many things, and yet our entire foreign and domestic policy is still really based on that event.
I am in 100% agreement with you, of course.
I think that we are approaching those moments.
I think that, you know, part of this, you know, as I was just talking about, this awakening process, when we get to a certain point where people understand really the gravity of all this, they are going to be out for retribution.
And that is what Donald Trump is promising, literally using that word.
He knows what the country is going to wake up to.
Informationally speaking, he is ahead of us, right?
He knows things right now that we don't know and that we are not allowed to know.
And principally, he and his initial administration in the first term were committed to the belief that we have an overclassification problem and that that problem must be solved.
I honestly don't know how we got to the point as a country where we thought it was okay for the government to have kind of this quasi-parental role where they get to decide for us what is okay for us to know, what is okay for us to do.
They are not here to make those decisions for us.
They are supposed to be an outgrowth of the people as a collective, not an authoritarian, like not an authority that somehow exists over the people and has say over what we're allowed to know.
So I think that all of this stuff should be exposed.
I do believe Donald Trump, when he says he's committed to doing that.
And I think the world as it will look after that period is going to be a lot different than it looks now.
And I think that we need to actually begin thinking about what that world looks like and project our thought into that future world because that's ultimately going to be the lay of the land at some point within the next few years.
Well, you know, historically, this thing really does span almost a millennia.
When you look at the Manhattan Project of the 40s and then Bourne classified after that, and obviously the scandals and assassinations we previously discussed, you bring that into the 80s in the continuity of government program, which is the shadow government.
You begin to solidify an executive within an executive, one that can go after a standing president and one that gets codified even further after 9-11 with the Patriot Act, Homeland Security, fusion centers, signature reduction.
So there is a path out there to where this has led us.
My issue is: you know, you talk about the awakening and people getting upset.
I firmly believe that they may really put this guy in jail.
And is that the thing that sparks, unfortunately, some type of violent revolution where all bets are off?
And in my opinion, that is, in a way, what some of these people want so they can clamp down on the rest of the population.
Oh, yeah, I think that that's absolutely what they want.
I think that they've been gunning for civil war and trying to initiate something along those lines for the last three years.
I think that they really definitely do want that.
I also think that this period and the pace of this period, as frustrating as it might be to those of us who pay a lot of attention and are awake to the level of corruption and criminality and compromise,
as frustrating as all that is, you know, I tend to think, and this is my optimistic viewpoint, not everybody is going to agree, but I tend to think that this period is going at this pace so that we can awaken enough of the population so that we don't get into that civil war phase, right?
If we can say to people, hey, we get it.
We understand that all this stuff is wrong.
We understand that you want to fight back.
That's not the way we need to do it because there's this other stuff going on that we can actually see progressing forward.
And if we stay on this path, if we commit to this path and we are doing the right things, we are going to get to that destination and we don't need violence to accomplish it.
Because, and you may not agree with this, I think we actually represent a vast majority.
I don't think Joe Biden got 81 million real awful American votes in 2020.
I don't think he was anywhere near it.
I think Trump won the popular vote by millions, perhaps tens of millions.
And that means that the citizenry is a lot farther along.
The people are a lot farther along than we are led to believe.
You know, we still see people on CNN consistently saying, well, it's a 50-50 country.
No, it isn't.
No, I totally agree, especially when you talk about the numbers.
And I believe Trump had the popular vote.
I think this thing was rigged beyond recognition.
I don't believe in the 81 million fantasy man, the dementia patient at all.
And, you know, I've traveled the country and the guy is immensely popular.
I, you know, I hate to be a pessimist.
I just see the wheels and the mechanisms that are currently turning against him and how they have tried to push this great narrative, how they've censored many people and they've turned the DOJ openly on the American public.
But that's for another day.
Signed Banger Show 00:01:55
Chris Paul, as always, an amazing guest weekly.
He is an AMP news contributor, the host of Be Reasonable.
And we'll see you next week, Chris.
Thank you, Jason.
Thank you.
Guys, it's making sense of the madness.
Thank you for joining me.
Another banger of a show.
Remember, we're over at ampnews.us where the truth lives.
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