The Great Police DEBATE w/ Michael Malice, Jason Ellis, Angry Cops, & Alex Stein
BUY CAST BREW COFFEE TO SUPPORT THE SHOW - https://castbrew.com/ Become A Member And Protect Our Work at http://www.timcast.com Host: Tim Pool @Timcast (everywhere) Alex Stein @PrimeTimeAlexStein (YouTube) Guests: Michael Malice @michaelmalice (X) Jason Ellis | https://thejasonellis.com/ Richard Hy (Angry Cops) @AngryCops (X) Filmed LIVE at The DC Comedy Loft My Second Channel - https://www.youtube.com/timcastnews Podcast Channel - https://www.youtube.com/TimcastIRL
Hey, everybody, I am Michael Malice, and I'm here to remind you that the cops are not your friend, that you can talk your way into an arrest, but you can't talk your way out of them.
Well, ladies and gentlemen, I am Tim Poole, your host, along with co-host Alex Stein.
This is going to be a lot of fun.
And of course, I think to kick off the great conversation, I will start with the truth, and that is no cop anywhere for any reason has ever done anything wrong.
Okay, if you think this is flattering, that speaks to you.
What I want to point out in all seriousness is it doesn't matter if you're Republican, Democrat, communist, anarchist, fascist in your day-to-day life.
What matters is how you interact with the police.
And you need to appreciate that they are not there if they show up to never talk to the police.
They are there to hurt you by their own admission.
And I want everyone to repeat after me something very simple.
If you have a producer who's not doing their job, you get rid of them.
If you have a photographer, if you have a sidekick co-host, whatever, you get rid of them.
It is when you have a monopoly on a service where there's absolutely no accountability.
If you watch anyone, I don't know how many people here have been burglarized.
I hope it's few of you, but some of us have.
There's not even a...
If a store doesn't deliver a product, you get a refund or store credit.
It is only a monopoly when there's actually not even a pretense that, yeah, we're here to protect you, but if we didn't, well, tough shit.
There's nothing.
We're not even going to pretend to do something about it.
And everyone just kind of takes this as a given because this is the world we grew up in.
And my point is, it's not at all acceptable that someone who takes a job onto themselves and who doesn't deliver, you're just like, oh, well, what are you gonna do?
And Michael, you're very intelligent, and I respect you, and I'm glad that you dressed up like me.
Maybe unintentionally, but I must have a story.
But I would have to push back on the monopoly thing because there's tons of private enterprises that do private security work, including people that fight against the exploitation of children and work alongside police and do better than police because they're privatized.
Correct.
So yeah, we don't have a monopoly on protecting the American people.
You have a monopoly on arrest, you have a monopoly on putting people in jail, and it's always a given that if there's an emergency, there's not a 911 that is like an Uber service where people who have to maybe be qualified pass certain certifications and then they can have a rating based on.
I know someone who's this mentally handicapped guy who's doing a lot of great work because teachers' unions do a great job of protecting the predators from having any consequences for their behavior.
In this scenario, when someone comes into my property and attacks one of the residents, you would agree that – or is the position then put them down, shoot them?
So if you look at cases like Jordan Neely in New York, if you look at the 2020 riots – this is a great example of this – the cops have no interest or obligation to enforce the law.
Every so often, they're just going to say, yeah, you know what, we're not going to do anything about it.
And you have absolutely no recourse.
In fact, they are far more interested in arresting and persecuting people who are there enforcing the public safety than they are in attacking and harming criminals.
Like I said earlier, if someone burglarizes your house, you're going to have no consequences whatsoever.
But if that person steals from a CVS or whatever, they're on the streets in five minutes and the cops just shrug their shoulders.
The cops have a lot of influence with the politicians who give them orders.
And you do not hear them saying, wait a minute, you guys are legalizing shoplifting and this is causing problems in the community because they are just there to follow orders.
Now, I do not – cops, again, are human beings.
They are not sociopaths.
They just follow orders from them.
And that, I think, is something far worse than not having a sense of right and wrong yourself.
It's when you take obedient orders from people who are depraved like Gavin Newsom, like Nancy Pelosi, and just close your eyes and do whatever they tell you.
Regarding your situation, it is crazy to me that the only solution we put forward is you have to call the government and the government is not going to do a good job of it.
So I'm not going to even deny for the sake of this debate that the cops are a necessary evil.
But I'm just going to have everyone walk away, I hope, tonight with understanding that nevertheless they are an evil.
He said that I don't want the cops to be proactive.
That speaks to motive.
Now imagine if I have drugs, its intention to distribute.
If we're talking about manslaughter versus murder, talking about motive.
He is comfortable getting on a mic in front of everyone that's being taped and putting words in my mouth.
Now imagine a cop has a bad day.
You're arrested.
He has to testify.
He will have no problem saying, I heard him say it.
I heard him say he doesn't want us to be proactive.
Now it's your word against his and you've got a jury, half of whom are going to be complete idiots and think the opposite of you.
It's two against one.
And this happens all the time.
I don't care what anyone thinks about me tonight.
I care about what you walk away with and realize.
If you talk to the cop, you just saw he didn't hear everything I did.
i said and remember everything i said i don't blame him but what happens when he writes that police report what happens when he testifies against you you are fucked well i just want to say this and michael makes some good points and i I would say overall, cops probably aren't bad, Rich.
But my question for you is: when you looked at the pandemic and you saw some, like the mask police, that they're actually using people like yourself to enforce stuff like wearing a mask.
Like, is there a line that you would draw where you're like, hey, listen, I believe in the First Amendment more than I believe in my superior telling me what to do?
So I want to say that Michael is right in some aspect of this, right?
There are people that follow rules and those rules are bad and they shouldn't follow them.
However, on the same side or opposite side of the same coin, there's a thing called police discretion, which I've used before, which says that if I look at something as an individual that happens to be a police officer and I deem that I don't want to do anything about it, good or bad, we can debate that later.
I can choose not to.
And I'll give you a personal example of how I did it in the right way, and that's New York State has very strict firearm policies.
I had somebody that came from out of state that had a legal permit from out of state, but in New York State didn't recognize that pistol permit.
I pull him over.
He had marijuana at the time.
It was illegal.
I pull him out, search the marijuana.
He tells me he has a firearm in the car he's carrying legally.
He's not in New York State.
What do I do?
I unload the firearm, put the firearm in the glove compartment, I put the ammo on a seat, and I say, hey, I'm not one of those New York City cops that doesn't like guns.
I'm all about you carrying legally.
Go home.
If you load it, keep it in your hand, in your, whatchamacallit, the glove compartment.
and that sure so my anyway what i'm trying to say is ignored it Only cops have the discretion, as he pointed out, that at any time they can throw you in the back of their cop car, throw you in a cell, say disorderly conduct.
Yeah, because inside every cop is a feral pig that is one comment away from putting your head through a wall.
What's that, Officer Oinksalot?
Google domestic violence rates and police.
Well, you shouldn't trust what this pig has to say, but I would hope everyone at home Googles that.
And here's something else about the police.
In the same way that obnoxious people who talk too much are drawn to podcasting, as the three of us can attest.
Everyone up here.
Everyone up here.
And in the same way that people who want to prey on children go to where the children are, violent people are going to be drawn to jobs where they're able to use violence without impunity.
It's a small percentage, let me be clear.
But cops are human beings, and human beings act in certain ways.
So if I'm someone who's a sociopath, I'm going to be a politician.
If I'm a loudmouth asshole, I'm going to be a podcaster.
And if I'm someone who likes to take out his violence on other people legally, I'm going to end up as a cop.
There's plenty of leftists who will tell you that it's appropriate him to beat me into a coma because, hey, you shouldn't be calling black people the N-word.
Cops are the only other group where if you say the wrong thing, they feel entitled to knock you into a coma and pat themselves on the back for it.
They tell you explicitly, anything you say can and will be used against you.
And here's something else.
If you tell a cop something that would help your side the story in a lawsuit in a criminal case, that's hearsay.
Oh, he said, but if he doesn't remember something you said or gets it a little wrong, like he did repeatedly today, all of a sudden, it's his word against yours, and now your story doesn't add up, and now you're a liar.
And now very quickly, bad things are going to happen to you as a consequence.
Well, actually, I don't ever talk to the police without an attorney.
So the amount of people that I've questioned that I've read their Miranda rights to, which start off with, you have the right to remain silent.
If you don't understand that.
Or if you should.
But there's a difference here.
Everybody's talking about like, are you smart enough to understand it?
If I say you have the right to remain silent, and then I continue to question you, and you say, okay, I would like to be questioned, there's no much more I can do.
I'm not a psychologist.
If lawyers want to then take up that aspect of saying, hey, Alex is so dumb, how dumb is Alex?
Alex doesn't know when to shut up.
And then they can argue that.
But unless you're of noticeable mental decline, I'm going to read you your Miranda rights.
I'm going to ask you at the end of them.
Do you understand each of these rights I have explained to you, having these rights in mind?
You realize, okay, this person has no idea what the fuck I'm just talking about.
And that's happened to him repeatedly.
But he knows as long as he's got the assent, just like when you check up the terms of service on some website or thing, his hands are clean, and he can go and pursue the arrest and the conviction.
So if you feel like police officers taking advantage of people that don't understand their rights or don't understand the conversation that they've been in, I would ask you to bring me with some sort of story.
Just bring something up where you were having a conversation with somebody who felt as though they could not talk to you or didn't understand the conversation.
And then you continue to have a conversation with them.
You should laugh right now because that's obviously humorous.
Now imagine what happens when there's no cameras and there's no witnesses and he's in a bad mood.
mood, all of a sudden he's going to be very happy to remind you of your place in life
life and who you should be talking to with the with the police mouth boy so so before we go to the aunts i do want to ask what would we have if there were no police well we need security so this idea like security like the people that try to get me to stop skating some ledge at the front of a building and they're fucking dickheads yeah they suck yeah specifically those people only them we want to clone them great contribution um Security is an extremely important thing.
These movements that you see in these big cities to defund the police are to me insane because they're defunding them to a point, but they're keeping them in place to make sure people can't protect themselves.
So you have the police taking out Kyle Rittenhouse.
You have them taking out Daniel Penny, but everybody else is rendered helpless and defenseless.
So security is far too important of a job to be left to monopoly, let alone a government monopoly.
We need police accountability and we need private security to increase.
But as it is now, there is no accountability.
And the people who are the, if you're in New York, one of the reasons I moved to Austin, thank God I did, is because I, thank you.
I knew if someone broke into my house and I have pretty cool shit and I tried to defend myself, especially with a firearm, it's far more likely that the law would fall upon me than upon the guy breaking into my house.
We see this over and over.
And those laws are enforced and only enforced by the police.
I know that's not like Latinas because we know they can scrap.
Somebody doesn't want to deport them, and I'm behind that movement.
Thank you.
But the thing is, in reality, you have to, and this is going to sound super cliche and shitty.
You have to bridge the gap between community and police, right?
If you don't, then nobody's going to respect you.
And if you don't bridge that gap, if nobody respects you, then every time you show up, they're going to disrespect you, get in a fight with you, push the boundaries until they're resisting or obstructing, and then you have to effect an arrest.
And so there is an image like my fantastic partner has to show that police officers should have because they are part of this larger authority of the community.
So notice how easily he lied about my views and put words in my mouth.
He said, I don't want cops to be big, burly guys.
I said that the police, that's not what I said.
I said the police as a career attracts violent people and it's a small percentage.
I said those words or words to that effect.
At no point did I say it's preferable for the police to be small people.
And again, I don't care what you think about me.
I don't care everything about any of us on this panel.
What I care about is when you talk to the police, they will easily twist your words without any guilt whatsoever or any kind of consequences or apology.
And you're the one who will be ending up paying the price.
Point being, every field, you're absolutely correct, have people who are assholes, beauty queens, politicians, teachers, barbers, everything, anyone count on it.
It is only the police, when someone is an asshole, that they have the legal right and discretion to, if you're giving them an attitude, throw you in the back of their cop car and fuck your shit up for a very long time.
Yeah, but there's also a duty in the military if people have to do that.
Then you have the My Life Massacre.
So just because something's on paper, and I'm sure that happens sometimes.
I'm sure there's a lot of times because you trust your partner, people trust their partners.
You see your partner being out of it.
It's like, oh, you're like, oh, shit.
Thanks for checking me.
And that person will be grateful.
But there's plenty of other times when you and your partner, it's YouTube against the world, and someone who's from a certain socioeconomic class is giving you lip, and you're not having it that day.
And I don't know that I would do differently in that position.
If you're against police, do you think individuals should be trained in police?
Sorry.
If you're against police, do you think individuals should be trained in public schools to de-escalate, shoot, fight hand-to-hand combat, handle crime scenes, evidence, large-scale criminal organizations?
So I would love it if not only were more people incentivized and have that sense of no one's coming to help me because when crime is seconds away, the cops are minutes away.
And one of the great things about living in Austin is knowing that I sleep with a piece under my bed and one in my office.
And if someone comes into my house, I'm not going to have to live in fear.
If you have a village of 100 people, and they all say, Rich is going to be our cop.
We trust him when we like this guy.
When he stops somebody, he knows that he's got fear of being shunned or ostracized for acting out of line.
Yes, I. And so the problem we have now is in these very large cities of millions of people, the cops are like, don't know you, don't care, I'm done with you.
Well, this is actually something that they tried to fight because for a long time, you would have white cops in black neighborhoods, and this naturally had some kind of antagonism.
Okay, regarding William McNeil, I've seen both videos.
I believe the headlights not being on is a bullshit charge.
So this may have been a DWB, but I believe he also had a suspended license, and they may have known that, pulling him over, but that wasn't mentioned in the video, I don't believe.
Because it's not, if it wasn't on camera, there would be more of a difficulty of a burden of proof.
But also, because of your distrust of police, something that's happened, I think, in the positivity that people thought was going to be a bad thing is that more and more officers are getting body cams.
And I don't know if you'll agree with me or not, but I feel that since more and more body cams have come out, you've actually seen the police are more correct and honest in their police report taking and arrests than dishonest, like astronomical.
I think the percent of cops that people regard as corrupt is far lower in reality than people have claimed.
Corrupt ones are not the ones getting bribed on the take.
That's not a significant issue.
It's the good cops that are the problem because they are the ones who will smile and nod and follow orders from politicians and do whatever they're told.
If you went back to 20, I'm not here to be reasonable.
If you went, I don't have to be reasonable.
I got a badge.
If you went back to 2019 and asked doctors, hey, would you ever give a medication to every single one of your patients, even for a disease that they can't really get?
I'd never do that.
Hippocratic oath.
Are you crazy?
That's insane.
Then COVID happened.
And there were some who didn't, but they all bent the knee because doctors and wet cops are human beings.
So they will always bend the knee to those in power at the means they're just going to be able to do that.
Oh, God, I didn't even know you were still here, Taylor Laurence.
Oh, you scared me.
I'm scared to do it.
unidentified
It's just like when I call in, I don't shut up.
All right.
Okay, so what can we do to get it to be normalized for police departments to drop the body cam footage sooner and faster, especially when a viral encounter like William McNeil takes place?
And not like in a physical aspect, but to like blame the person, whether it's the cop or the individual, for guilt.
So you have to be very careful with how much information you put out at a time.
Let's say that it's something more heinous, like a murder or a serious assault where somebody's shot.
You can blame somebody.
And social media is well known for this.
I've done a couple of videos.
Angry cops.
Anyway, so you've got to be careful with the amount of information that you put out and what information you put out.
And although police departments need to be responsible and react to community requests in order to once again gain the trust of the community, which is important, we also have to put the investigation above that because the victims, Because the victims are the most important thing when it comes to an investigation.
Yeah, yeah, this is super creepy, but we're going to do this.
I'm not creepy, bitch.
Anyway, listen, I want to congratulate Alex Stein on his Ozempic use and Tim for having a great choice of headwear.
Michael for looking like Saddam Hussein and the two bald bookends just for showing up.
Thank you.
All right, Michael, I think, look, you've raised some good points, but look, man, you are from the US fucking R, USSRSR, whatever, how many initials I forget.
I think you got a lot of.
I think between the NKVD and the KGB, I think you got a lot of generational trauma that you're still dealing with, Michael.
All of you, in a recent episode of my wonderful YouTube channel, Ask America with Edgar, I was kicked out of the national zoo lately by police officers.
I was unfortunately racially profiling animals, and they did not like that, and they kicked my ass out.
Please, I encourage you to view the episode because YouTube is throttling it big time.
Regardless, though, those cops were friendly.
They were doing their job as they ushered me out and threw me onto the street.
I was saying for the sake of this debate, I'll say the police aren't necessary evil because People are of the belief, and I'm not going to argue against that today, that but for the police, we would have like 2020 with 24-7.
A lot of people and probably some in this room join the military because they think, okay, I want to protect my country.
I want to help my community.
I want to keep America free and safe.
And that's very commendable.
And then many people in the military are like, what the fuck am I doing here?
I was completely lied to.
But the thing is, you can't quit the military because you're going to get court-martialed to possibly go to jail, but you could quit the police force at any time.
And how many of them walked during COVID?
Very, very few.
They were more than happy to tell you, fuck you, you're not going to be able to say goodbye to your loved ones because I need my paycheck.
I was just thinking about like how it's wild how we need to come up with these big laundry lists of things to arrest some politicians or corporate leaders on because they constantly break the law all the fucking time.
Well, no, he has a that he has a good point, though.
Well, I want to say my very good friend, uh, Joe Exotic, the Tiger King.
You know, he got, we love him, but he got famous after he went to prison.
If he would have gotten famous before and he had the money to actually fight in his case with a good criminal defense attorney, his outcome would have been totally different.
One of the cultural issues that I think is a big problem is people who have large followings get what they want from corporations, from governments, because they can create fear of public pressure.
If you go to New York State, specifically the city of Buffalo, the one that I police, the amount of people that get picked up with illegal firearms, not to say that they're carrying concealed in a legal manner.
I'm saying like people that do it in like for drug sales, for other illegal activities, parts of gangs.
Their intent is to shoot another person, right?
The amount of people that get youthful offender status, juvenile offender stats, and have the second or third or fourth gun thrown away because they're from a socioeconomical people.
And it's not a problem.
We can understand.
No, no, no, no.
I'm saying because of crimes they committed.
Not because of concern.
I'm saying specifically because of gang violence, honing in just on gang violence and drug activity.
The amount of people that have no money that get public defenders, where the prosecutor's office, the district attorney's office, is like, there's too fucking many of them.
We're going to drop down their, I put a gun to a guy's head and said, I'm going to fucking kill you.
And then the cop showed up and stopped him.
And we're going to knock it down to attempted assault.
So many thousands more than Enron, who eventually got killed.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that if every single person who went before a judge on a crime requested a jury trial, the system would implode.
And to quote Officer Law Enforcement, yes, some of these people are made up of people that are inside of your community, which are dumb.
And a specific example is that we had a gang rape on video, Facebook live streamed, and of a special needs girl who was 16.
The video of it, video of it, and five guys were involved.
Two of them were juveniles.
And the kidnapping was thrown out.
Or I'm sorry, the rape was thrown out, but the kidnapping stood because one person thought that even though she was kidnapped, she could still consent to sex.
I'm 100% serious.
One person thought that even though you're kidnapped, you can still consent to sex.
So that person would not go forward with the rape charges of the five people that raped especially this girl on camera with her crying, no, stop.
All right, so the reason why you're given a ticket, the explanation is on the ticket.
Here's the ticket.
This is what you're ticketed for.
There's the explanation.
They may not have said it to you in person, which is odd.
Normally, I would do that as a courtesy, but it's on the ticket.
When they give you the ticket, there's the reason why they stopped you.
For the, I scan your plate or I type down your license plate without pulling you over or having anything prior to.
The license plate in New York State and all other states is owned by the state.
You're renting the plate from the state.
The state is the state, or the plate is the state's property.
So I, as a representative of the law enforcement agency within that state, can then run it.
And if you are suspended, if the registration is suspended or there's no inspection or the inspection expired, or a large thing is that car or the registration that comes back is stolen, then I can, you know, pull it over.
So anybody that would like to say, if you run the plate without them doing anything, that's bad and illegal, I would then ask you, well, how are we supposed to catch stolen vehicles when the registered owner puts that plate out as stolen?
unidentified
Yeah, now are they now legally that they're supposed to tell you why they pulled you over, right?
Because you get pulled over, it doesn't mean you get to demand that they tell you right then and there for the reason of the stop.
And like I said, in the most extreme situation, if they don't say anything, then the ticket that they give you is the reason for the stop, which normally they would explain and say, here's a ticket.
So when you're stopped by police in New York State, because I can speak for that because I know that you are required to show identification and your license for traveling on New York State throughways, thoroughfares in the city, et cetera, because tax dollars paid for the city's roads, the state's thoroughfares, et cetera.
So if I pull you over and you refuse to answer any questions, that's one thing.
If you keep the window rolled up and refuse to show ID, which is required of you, and you sign an agreement when you take your driver's test and get your ID, then it would be obstruction and I could arrest you for obstruction.
Likely, most states, though, obstruction is a lesser violation charge.
So I might break out your window and tow your car or break out your window and pull you out, but then I would give you a violation level ticket.
So, a person could, if they get pulled over, crack their window a little bit, when you walk up, just hand the license insurance or registration and then say nothing, and that's all they have to do.
So since we have kind of varying opinions here up on the stage, what would reorganization of different police departments, such as the NYCPD, look like so that way it more aligns with societal norms, i.e., more federalization, more bringing it down to the basic levels of the bureaus?
Or is it just too far gone and we just got to replace everybody with big booty latinas?
But for the most part, cops really aren't that bad.
They're not assholes.
Now, I'm hearing pornstash sitting here saying that no cops are ever held accountable.
However, I would argue that's not true, especially when we have cops that are being held accountable for merely following their trainings, such as Derek Chauvin.
Yeah, well, if you're a victim, you talk to a cop.
I'm talking about just if you're a suspect, if you're being considered as a, they want to charge you with a crime, it never benefits you to talk to a cop 0% of the time.
And this is what they say.
And this is Rich will say.
They say, oh, you know what?
You need to be, if you're good to us now, oh, we're going to tell the judge and the DA and they're going to take it easy on you.
The judge and DA don't give a fuck.
unidentified
They don't give a shit.
I'm going to agree.
You shouldn't be talking to cops without lawyers.
But at the same time, I'm not going to say that he's doing a bad job by getting a problem.
It was the only bike I could find, and it was raining, and the cops pulled me over while I was pedaling down the road at one in the morning on a girl's pink bike.
I also want to make another serious point, which is this.
People might think, okay, like, but legal system worked out.
I'll tell the truth.
If the choice you're facing is to plea and get three years in jail or roll the dice with 12 on a jury and possibly look at 40, a lot of you would take the three.
I probably would.
So what he's talking about with those interrogations is you're forcing that person into a situation where it's three versus life.
And of course you're going to admit to being guilty to something you didn't do because the alternative is much, much worse.
If your story, you're very nervous, and we've all been nervous, but in a job interview, and maybe your story differs in some details, now they can say, look, you told the cop here you go in the supermarket.
Here you said they're going to 7-Eleven.
Now you're lying.
So now we got you, and you said you didn't like this person.
That's motive.
So listen, we could put you away for life, or we could just have you for two years.
If you're a person that has, if you're a person of sound mind and sound body and you choose to make a business decision with all the information in front of you, how is that a bad thing?
Because if I'm a police officer saying, here are your rights, and here's all the information in front of you, is that not capitalism?
Is that not giving you all the information that's necessary and available?
I already told you to make a choice and then you choose it.
Should the people who live in various communities upon themselves create private enterprise that would be supported by individuals who had subscribed to the service to go to businesses and go to homes and take people who are here illegally and deport them?
No, I don't think it should be done in the community because that's not gonna be effective, right?
But my point is if it's Right, but my point is if they're just looking at Austin and I know that they're going to be bad in Austin as an illegal immigrant, I'm just going to go to San Antonio or somewhere else.
So unless it's some kind of federal border thing, it's really going to have an insane amount of loopholes.
But also, there'd be tons of people who aren't getting free welfare, they're already getting free schooling, they're already getting driver's licenses, they're not getting all these other things.
So, the number of people who come here, the problems with the immigrants isn't necessarily like that stereotypical guy who's like outside Home Depot wants a job.
It's the people who are just here to be on the dole and then to raise their kids to vote Democrats.
So, if you have a system where law enforcement is privatized, everybody, or I should say, in the majority of the country, most people are like, we all agree these people shouldn't be here.
Okay, so in this hypothetical scenario, where everybody agrees, people who enter here illegally or in violation of the will of the market and the community, we want them removed, it doesn't sound like you can do it.
So, in this system, then it would just be incumbent upon the citizenry to be like, we're going to go out and we're going to grab people and remove them.
So these kind of questions conflate different things, right?
So it does matter because people are certainly willing to put resources to someone who's a member of a gang, but they might ostensibly be forgetting rid of that grandma.
Yeah, because, I mean, I guess my point then, rather than my question, would be that politicians and the elected officials who make the laws or the DAs who decide to prosecute are the much bigger problem because if you use the analogy of the deep state, right?
The issue is that we would say people who are unelected bureaucrats who don't follow what the Trump administration wants to do, for example, are the problem.
And the people who would follow what the Trump administration wants to do are the ones who are the good ones.
But for some reason, in your opinion, when we elect politicians or we elect DAs, suddenly the cops who follow what the people elected to do are the issue.
So, but if the majority elect the president and then the unelected bureaucrats don't follow what the president did, then that's I would have been very happy if the unelected bureaucrats defied Biden, for example.
Second of all, by design, the people do not elect the president.
We have an electoral college because the founding fathers were very much scared that voters would have too much power.
So they elect electors and electors elect the president.
And this might be a minor issue, in your opinion, or other opinion, others, but the popular vote is not the determining factor, or else we would have President Hillary, which I'm sure you wouldn't like.
So what the majority want, it's first of all, it's also the majority of voters, is of no relevance when it comes to my rights.
Freedom means I do what you want, not what you want, or majority of people want.
I think what you're referring to is my point being that when you become a cop, you give up your conscience because you're there to obey the orders of sociopaths above you.
Let's say that what emerges in this private market system is they say, listen, we can't sustain a business off of at-will contracts, so we require a one-year commitment.
On the point about private security, potentially replacing cops, we, I think, all agreed that there's a problem with tickets, for example, when you're driving erratically, disproportionately affecting lower-income people.
Would a private security force not disproportionately impact lower-income people because they wouldn't have the funds to hire the best security?
I'm going to answer his question earlier because I think it's much more, and I'll get to yours.
Yes, in America, there have not been examples of cops rounding up and killing people, thank God, killing kids.
My point being, I don't think that the Polish mind or the German mind or any other country's mind is that radically different from, God help us, from how American people operate, number one.
unidentified
But can you show that having a private police force would be somehow better than what we have currently?
Because all you've done is criticize the police that we have in this country.
You haven't shown at all that a private police force would somehow be better.
Do you have an example?
Do you have any data?
What do you think would say that would be actually possible?
We can all agree that there are good and bad police, and a lot of us have seen both.
But is the answer to do away with police in favor of private security or rework the police system, for example, make it easier to fire a cop for not doing their job, which in the end is to uphold and protect the Constitution?
Because if police are human, then so are private security.
If some cop can be a feckless cunt, what is stomping private security guard?
And I kind of think the discussion of there not being a whole lot of humans in the police force coming up here pretty soon is something that we need to start thinking about.
It's amazing how freely you are putting words in my mouth.
And again, I don't care about this debate, but keep this in mind if you're ever talking to a cop or faced with a crime.
That's all I want you all to take away from tonight.
Go ahead.
unidentified
But just as cops are still human, humans are also cops.
These are people who have gone through trainings, and those trainings haven't been updated, and that they should be updated for increased responsibilities and increased actions for their authorities.
Honestly, I think they're, I'm going to take the cop side in this one.
If you watch the police body cam footage, a lot of times, even though in any other situation, they'd be knocking the person out, they're de-escalating.
And they're talking to someone who's complete trash and being like, sir, sir, sir.
And when that guy, there's a guy who went to Midtown Manhattan and shot up his office place.
When he came downstairs, NYC cops started shooting wildly at him and they missed and hit seven bystanders.
And the story that emerged was that the officers in New York were getting the bare minimum training because the city had decided if the cost of lawsuits are lower than the cost of training, they would prefer the lawsuits instead.
So I'll give you some real talk here about police range shootings because I was a range officer for my department.
So one, NYPD has different Glock setups than everybody else.
They have a 10-plus pound trigger addition.
So normally a Glock is like seven to five pound trigger pole.
They have one so it adds an additional five pounds.
If you do that to somebody, which most cops are, someone that gets one day of training that shoots their whatever it is qualification for their department, that's not training.
That's just qualification.
So you get officers that don't train, that only do qualification.
Now they have a heavier trigger squeeze.
And for everybody that knows anything about guns, the heavier a trigger squeeze is on a pistol, the firmer you have to grip it, right?
So you're sitting there pulling back 10, 15 pounds, and if you've got a weak wrist and low or no training other than qualification, you're either going to push the pistol to the left or pull it to the right.
So what a lot of, not a lot of, NYC used to be the pinnacle of police training.
Every department would look at them because they're the largest city in the States and they've got the largest department, like 40 or 70,000 officers, and they would say, what are they doing right?
And let's do it.
And one of the things that they see from New York State or New York City and what they're doing wrong is the additional pound on the trigger.
Is there fear, I would say, or a logical fear of training on a firearm because they don't want them to use it.
It's almost like an intentional neglect on firearm training.
So then the officers aren't good at using it.
Therefore, they're fearful of using it.
So now they don't use it.
And then what happens?
People that actually need lethal force are either hurt in the crossfire, are either not being protected and lose their lives because the individual that's attacking them is not being stopped appropriately.
Do you think, real quick, though, do you think there should be, if we allow for guns in places like New York, should they require bullets to say be frangible or something like that?
Yeah, so one of the big issues that organized crime starts to begin with is black markets, right?
We saw this very quickly in America.
What happened with the rise of the mafia was prohibition.
And after a while, they started shooting enough cops that the cops were like, I'm not enforcing this law.
And they repealed the law.
So if you have things like increased, you see this in Colorado, right?
If you have this kind of gang take over department building and you have a community where everyone's armed and everyone has a sense of community, very quickly, it's going to have to be, someone's going to have to be violent at some point.
Right now, it's just kind of the cops are going to come in.
Otherwise, it would be much harder to come in to begin with.
But there's no easy, anyone who tells you there's an easy answer when you have a large population with weapons who are intent on doing your harm, there's no one sense to answer this in any situation.
So if somebody has to go in there and they have to be violent, wouldn't you prefer to be a police officer that's held liable by the community instead of a bunch of individuals that can do it without any sort of use of force?
Where I disagree With you, is I don't think cops are ever held liable, or else all those cops who killed all those dogs would be rotting in jail right now.
unidentified
All right, guys, that has been the Culture War Live.
