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Feb. 7, 2025 - The Culture War - Tim Pool
02:02:01
Ex-USAID Official EXPOSES Corruption, Trump & Elon GUT Deep State w/ Catharine O'Neill, Texas Lindsay, & Ryan Matta

BUY CAST BREW COFFEE TO SUPPORT THE SHOW - https://castbrew.com/ Become A Member And Protect Our Work at http://www.timcast.com Host: Tim Pool @Timcast (everywhere) Guest: Catharine O’Neill @cathgillihan (X) | https://meriwetherfarms.com/ Ryan Matta @RyanMattaMedia (X) Texas Lindsay @TexasLindsay_ (X) Producers:  Lisa Elizabeth @LisaElizabeth (X) Kellen Leeson @KellenPDL (X) My Second Channel - https://www.youtube.com/timcastnews Podcast Channel - https://www.youtube.com/TimcastIRL

Participants
Main voices
c
catharine oneill gillihan
20:42
r
ryan matta
12:39
t
tim pool
01:03:53
| Copy link to current segment

Speaker Time Text
tim pool
Over the past week, Democrats have been apoplectic.
They're outraged that USAID, which they call USAID, is being gutted.
They're reporting that as of today...
There's only going to be about 290 people actually working there because somewhere around 12,700 people will be placed on leave.
We don't know for sure exactly how it's going to go down, but apparently, according to NPR and a few other outlets, Marco Rubio is like, nah, we're not going to keep these people around.
And Trump and Elon, they're saying it should be shut down completely.
Now, depending on what you read, if you watch The Daily Show, for instance, they're going to tell you that U.S. Aid, they call it, is foreign aid.
Why would Trump want to stop foreign aid?
And there are actually people outside in the streets protesting, saying, we want foreign aid.
And then if you actually read what's going on from people who are in the know, yeah, this is more likely to be some kind of money laundering scheme, perhaps.
Maybe it wasn't always.
But you take a look at how some nonprofits that are doing, I think, what were they doing?
A transgender puppet show?
No, a transgender opera in Ireland.
People are wondering, $1.5 million, why are we spending that money?
Well, many people are pointing out that this money will go to nonprofits.
The nonprofits then basically fund the extravagant livelihoods of people who live in the D.C. area, who then dump tons of money into Democrat campaigns.
I don't think it's all just Democrats.
I think it was largely deep state, neocons, you know, Democratic establishment.
But since Trump came in, the Republican Party has been kind of different.
So we will get to the bottom of this and figure it out.
Before we do, my friends, make sure you buy some cast brew coffee, of course.
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Welcome to the Culture War.
We've got a bunch of really amazing guests.
Let's start right over here, sir.
Who are you and what do you do?
ryan matta
Ryan Metta, documentary filmmaker, investigative journalist.
tim pool
Right on.
Okay, so you know a bit about USAID? A little bit.
All right, a little bit.
We have another wonderful guest.
unidentified
I'm Lindsay Penny.
Formerly Texas Lindsay was my famous handle before until I moved out of Texas.
And I am also an investigative journalist.
tim pool
Right on.
And then last but not least.
catharine oneill gillihan
Hello, everyone.
I'm Catherine O'Neill Gillihan.
I am the CEO of a beef company, Meriwether Farms in Wyoming.
However, I worked at both the State Department and USA during Trump's first term.
tim pool
You want to just grab that mic, pull it up a little bit closer.
So you know all the secrets then, don't you?
catharine oneill gillihan
I know a few.
tim pool
A few secrets.
Well, let's just get into it.
What is this thing?
Why is it so controversial?
Why does Trump and Elon, why do they want to shut it down?
And why are Democrats trying to resist that?
ryan matta
I'll jump in there.
So USAID is the money laundering arm of the CIA, basically.
It's the linchpin that connects our State Department, the Department of Defense, and the CIA. Its budget is twice that of the State Department and the CIA. So what number is that then?
I think it's $50 billion.
tim pool
$50 billion?
ryan matta
A year budget.
unidentified
Wow.
ryan matta
Yeah, so USAID goes into third world countries.
Over a 10, 20, 30-year period.
And they use NGO structures like you would use offshore bank accounts, basically.
They use an NGO. They fund an NGO that funds an NGO that funds an NGO that carries out their dirty work, basically.
And Lindsay, you guys can jump in on that.
unidentified
That's absolutely correct.
And I think one of the reasons that Elon is so adamant to go after them, especially one of the first things for Doge to attack, is because they were the ones that were funding the censorship industrial complex.
You know, they went to war with Elon, with the advertiser boycott ban.
And that was literally funded by USAID. Wow.
It was funding the NGOs.
They even funded Media Matters.
They funded Politico.
tim pool
What, really?
unidentified
Yeah, absolutely.
tim pool
USAID gave money to Media Matters?
unidentified
They also gave money to Pfizer.
Out of the top ten recipients, number two on the list of USAID was Pfizer.
So it's insane that our U.S. tax dollars are going to not only funding these overthrowing of governments in other countries, but it's also funding now NGOs and having them do the work that they themselves cannot do.
When you have a non-governmental agency that comes in to censor people, but it's being funded by a CIA cutout, it's because the CIA can't do that.
It would violate the Constitution, the First Amendment rights.
But when an NGO does it and you have all these other universities and institutions that are joining together to collude and come up with a scheme and plan to censor the American people, it wasn't just during COVID, but it was also during the 2016, I mean, the 2020 but it was also during the 2016, I mean, the 2020 election where they started to form a plan to censor anything about mail-in ballots before mail-in ballots was even talked about by anybody and no one even knew anything about
So they were already putting together a scheme of academics and these NGOs and all of these former CIA directors on these boards were forming a plan before it was even a known issue for the American people of how they were going to censor them and how they were going to keep them quiet when all these mail-in ballots became an issue.
So it's a scandal of the century for sure.
tim pool
So when you were there...
What were they doing and what did you know about?
catharine oneill gillihan
Yeah, so I spent most of my time at the State Department.
Oh, I'm so sorry.
tim pool
You can pull it way up.
catharine oneill gillihan
Way up?
Okay.
Yeah, so I spent most of my time at the State Department, but in 2016, I was on the transition team.
So I was responsible for combing through all of the congressional budget certifications and going through the line items and identifying.
Some of these issues that we've realized now.
But the momentum from the outside of pressuring these agencies or cutting them wasn't there.
So I had nobody to go to, really.
So here I was, 23-year-old, looking through all these numbers, but there was no one in the administration at the time that was really willing to cut them.
So I spent three years at the State Department.
In kind of the humanitarian area, and then I went back to the campaign in 2020, and then John McEntee, I don't know if you guys have heard about him, he called me when I was on the campaign.
He's like, Catherine, you've got to come back to USAID. We've got to shut it down.
tim pool
What year was that, sorry?
catharine oneill gillihan
That was 2020. Wow.
So because I had spent three years at the State Department, so I had a lot of experience there.
And he was assembling a team for the second term because, you know, the first term there were a lot of issues with personnel.
Unfortunately, Trump didn't know who to trust.
So he brought in a lot of people that he thought were good, but ended up not being good.
So John called me and asked me to come back and be the White House liaison and staff the agency with people that were actually going to execute Trump's agenda.
I showed up November, what was it, 6th of 2020, the day after the election, and there were so many people already there in place that just didn't want to change, didn't want to leave, and we just didn't have the top cover we needed, unfortunately.
So we weren't able to accomplish what we wanted to accomplish.
tim pool
So there was an effort in 2020 to dismantle USAID? Well, it was, yes, absolutely.
catharine oneill gillihan
But we just – we didn't have – the climate wasn't there.
There weren't people from the outside like you guys talking about all this crazy stuff.
So we didn't have the momentum that we have now to do what we wanted to do.
unidentified
Wow.
tim pool
So that says to me that when Elon started talking with Trump, Elon Vivek about Doge, which I can't believe he actually got that name through.
unidentified
It's amazing.
tim pool
It sounds like Trump already had this intention.
With the funding of...
I did read that there was this coordinated...
Excuse me.
Coordinated Advertiser Boycott Against Axe where they were trying...
They were literally pressuring all these companies to drop their ads.
And USAID was funding some of those NGOs that were pushing for that.
Sounds like Elon got pissed.
Talked to Trump.
Trump said, we're trying to get rid of it.
Elon said, let me come in and gut it.
And that's why top of the list when he gets in was to target this institution.
Seems like Trump was going to do this with or without Elon.
ryan matta
100%.
So I had a private investigator run every dollar that the United States government has sent to Guatemala in the last four years.
We've sent $797 million to Guatemala in the last four years.
And 497 million of that went to USAID directly.
And then a ton of other NGOs that are structured under USAID. He did a favor for me.
He went all the way back to Obama in 2012. And we've given the Guatemalan government roughly $4 billion.
tim pool
I'm going to pause real quick.
And I'm going to tell you why I keep saying USAID. Because saying USAID is like saying anti-fascist.
It is a manipulative term.
Sorry.
ryan matta
I've been saying it for so long.
unidentified
I'm used to it.
tim pool
But this is what happens.
When I turn on the Daily Show, they say Trump is shutting down U.S. aid.
People don't know.
They're talking about an institution, the Agency for International Development, and they think Trump is literally taking water away from dehydrated little children in third world countries.
ryan matta
Not a chance.
tim pool
Right.
When people – USAID is the same thing as saying anti-fight.
They go, aren't you anti-fascist?
And you're like, bro, they're going around beating people with clubs, okay?
I'm opposed to what that is.
But they're opposing – shut up.
Then when they come out and they're like, but you really are opposed to USAID? I'm like, the institution USAID? Yes.
Foreign aid we can have a discussion about after maybe we secure our borders.
Anyway, I digress.
catharine oneill gillihan
So I was actually at the State Department yesterday visiting some of my former colleagues, one of whom is running the whole reorganization.
And so Secretary Rubio issued some waivers, you know, because there was a stop order on all foreign aid going out the building, right?
But he issued some waivers saying that if this is life-saving medicines or if this is critical, mission critical or totally in line with our national priorities, then, you know, we'll review them and keep them going per the review.
And there's been so much insubordination that some of these...
Employees are actually refusing shipments and deliveries of the goods that we're sending just in spite of whatever's going on.
So here they are crying, oh, Trump's shutting off all of our funding and blah, blah, blah.
But at the same time, my friend Pete was like, no, actually, they're not doing their job now.
So we can't get these things to wherever they're going.
That's how bad it is.
tim pool
It's what we saw when Trump shut down the DEI stuff.
You saw that they're like, OK, well, now we're not going to teach about the Tuskegee Airmen.
And it's like, well, listen, we're not saying don't tell people about important things that happened in history.
We're saying stop being racist.
But to spite the machine, these scumbags are pulling moves like this.
unidentified
And saying he was going to cancel Black History Month was another move from them whenever he canceled DEI. But wait, wait, didn't they shut down Identity Months?
tim pool
I heard that.
catharine oneill gillihan
The DOD, yeah.
unidentified
He still issued in order to celebrate Black History Month on February 1st, so, you know.
But there wasn't anything said about that when it actually happened by the mainstream media.
But the fear-mongering was there.
Just like there's fear-mongering going on for anyone taking the buyout from Trump to quit and get paid for eight months.
You hear...
Senate Democrats and on CNN today about how there's no guarantee that these people actually get paid on the eight months if they take it now and if they accept the resignation and the buyout by the Trump administration, that they're on their own.
And so although 40,000 people have accepted it so far, there's still 60,000 now, which is good, but there's still a big fear-mongering campaign that you have no legal recourse to collect your money if he doesn't follow through and pay it, which is...
Absolutely ridiculous.
They're just trying to...
tim pool
But that's not what they're saying.
The Democrats said there is a chance if you take this, you will not get paid.
unidentified
Right.
tim pool
What they are saying is we intend to shut the government down in March once we have the ability to block a continuing resolution, and we will block your pay if you take this deal.
So...
On the surface, once again, they play.
unidentified
So they're going to do it.
catharine oneill gillihan
Yes.
tim pool
They are playing these.
These are the games that are played.
We should be very careful of saying things like Antifa or U.S. aid or you might not get paid.
They're trying to insinuate that Trump would block the money.
No, Trump's a dealmaker.
He says you're going to get paid until the end of September.
The Democrats then came out and said, we will shut the government down if you take this deal.
They are looking these government employees in the eyes and say, if you take Trump's deal, we won't.
You over.
catharine oneill gillihan
Yeah.
No, and that's what it's really going to come down to.
I mean, this is another issue that we had the last time around.
So when we were finally in office, right, I was at the State Department, you know, reviewing these, the budget that we made, because you make it internally and then it goes through OMB, Office of Management Budget, and then OMB officially sends it to the Congress.
And at the time, Bob Corker, Senator Bob Corker, was the Senate, the chairman for the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, and he hated Trump.
So every time that we wanted to cut something, he would just plus it up again.
So this, I think, is going to be another issue that we're going to see because obviously the Congress is in charge of...
So it's going to be interesting to see how Trump's team handles this issue this time around, because I think they're a lot more seasoned.
The momentum is there, like I was saying, and I think the pressure needs to continue, because these members of Congress, at the end of the day, they want to be popular, they want to get funding, they want to, you know, win their elections.
So if there's this drumbeat...
And pressure that's kept on them, we may have a chance to get some of this through.
tim pool
I just want to point out, I went to the website, I went to USAID.gov, and in 2014, the top recipient was the World Bank Group for $2 billion.
You know, that's the important thing about telling people when they say, it's USAID. It's like...
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the World Bank is not in need of handouts.
ryan matta
Well, you'd think, too, that they would go to some of these countries that all this money is going to and get some spokesmen from these countries because you go into these countries that USAID operates in their country and they are literally begging us.
I was just in Guatemala, just in El Salvador.
El Salvador, over, what, like 60 or 70 years that USAID was in their country, El Salvador was turned into the deadliest country in Latin America.
Guatemala, over the last four years, has had 190,052 children have been kidnapped out of Guatemala, trafficked through Mexico, and processed into our border, at our Texas border.
Those are children aged 0 to 17 that our government has taken custody of over the last four years that are just from Guatemala alone.
How do you move that many children out of Guatemala?
You don't.
But five NGOs were just raided on April 25th of 2025 for trafficking children.
And these are the same NGOs that are getting funded by USAID and are operating both.
Right.
tim pool
This is funny.
When you go to their website right now, it just says on Friday, February 7th, 2025 at 1159 p.m.
Eastern, all USAID direct hire personnel will be placed on leave globally, with the exception of designated personnel responsible for mission-critical functions.
The reporting last night was that it's going to be 290 people from 13,000.
catharine oneill gillihan
Yes.
Yes.
And the other thing is, so...
Like I was saying, so I was in an undersecretary's front office at the State Department.
The acronym is J, but it stood for Civilian Security, Democracy, and Human Rights, or some long name that really doesn't mean anything.
But, you know, we actually...
We're frustrated with USAID because we had programs, not that I think they're necessary, but we oversaw programs that had their own line items, that had their own funding, that had their own everything.
But USAID was also doing the same thing in similar countries.
So there was all this overlap and redundancy.
And so bringing USAID back into the fold is actually the way it should be.
And that's how it was originally set out when President Kennedy created the agency by executive order in 1961.
So bringing it back into the State Department and realigning it and making sure that there's not funding everywhere and everyone's doing their own thing is actually what we should be doing.
tim pool
Yeah.
Were they responsible for Ukraine?
unidentified
Oh, hands down.
You can see their handprints all over it.
I mean, USAID was actually funding nine out of ten news agencies in Ukraine and still to this day is true.
So when you're funding nine out of ten of their...
That's how you're controlling the narrative for everything there, especially when you're going in there and having USAID with the regime change and installing Zelensky and not allowing any other elections, knowing that the thumb of the U.S. government is controlling and dictating all of that is proof in itself.
But you have to be able to control the narrative in order to do that, and funding the media is a good way to get it done.
tim pool
Yeah.
So how does this work, though?
Is USAID directly giving cash straight to a news outlet?
ryan matta
No.
tim pool
Or their intermediaries?
ryan matta
NGO. NGO, an NGO, and then the fourth NGO down the line gives that to the news outlet.
Because it's like I said, it's like an offshore bank account.
You've got to go from country to country to country to country, so it's almost untraceable.
You go NGO to NGO to NGO to NGO. The NGO that's actually giving the money to the media outlet might not even realize that that money is coming from USAID. Right.
catharine oneill gillihan
Well, and the other thing is it's such a revolving door, right?
So actually, there was someone in my office.
I don't remember exactly what her portfolio was, but one day we were sitting in our meeting and she's like, oh.
By the way, I'm going to go work for Open Society Foundations.
Like, oh, okay.
Because Open Society Foundations, which is the George Sorogroos, receives grants from USAID and the State Department.
And so what happens is that you have all these former employees of these agencies that know the system, that know the inner workings, that know how to write this special language to get the grants.
And then they spend a few years I even saw yesterday there was actually a grant given.
unidentified
To teach people how to write grants to get them approved for the USAID. It's absolutely the biggest circle jerk I've ever seen in my life.
But it's a monster.
It's an octopus with tentacles that keep going and keep going.
And they've got their tentacles in every area around the world that hasn't banned them yet.
Because multiple countries have actually kicked out USAID because they didn't want them involving themselves in their politics at home.
So I don't know if anyone has the full list of that, but it's growing.
tim pool
I asked Grok because ChatGPT has become unusable.
I don't know if anybody's tried using it recently.
You know, I'm just going to say this for ChatGPT.
I don't know if it's a setting or whatever.
I just don't use it.
It's got a reasoning function now.
So it used to be you open up ChatGPT and you ask it a question and it would give you an answer.
Now it spends two minutes just saying, I'm looking at what you're saying and I'm just like, I don't care.
I go to Grok, I typed in, did the Open Society Foundation receive USAID funding?
And it goes, yes, according to various sources, it did.
However, the specifics of such funding and the total amounts allocated for projects can vary.
To summarize, yes, they do receive USAID funding.
The details are murky, blah, blah, blah.
So then I said, what's the estimate?
There are reports suggesting that USAID provided approximately $260 million to organizations linked to George Soros' Open Society Foundations.
The figure was highlighted in discussions like the funding of various projects, particularly in regions like Albania and Macedonia.
Another source indicates that East-West Management Institute...
Partly backed by Open Society Foundation, received more than $260 million over the years from USAID for projects in countries like Georgia, Uganda, and Serbia.
However, these figures might not represent the total or precise amounts given to OSF as funding can be routed through various intermediaries or for specific projects under broader initiatives.
Also, there might be discrepancies or different interpretations.
So I'll put it this way.
When you do a Google search for how much money USAID may have given to Soros' NGO, It's not immediately clear.
I'm sure if you dig up the documents, you can probably get a better answer than I could just by simply Google searching it right now.
If it is true, regardless, we know for a fact that Open Society Foundation funds NGOs that operate in the United States.
We know that Soros funded many prosecutors, district attorneys across the country, and that would imply, and I'm going to say this with some legal liability shields, if it is true...
That USAID was funding Open Society Foundations.
That would mean that USAID was indirectly funding political overhaul in the United States, which some would describe as a coup or a civil war or just outright simply corrupt.
ryan matta
You want to see something fun?
Search USAID regime changes.
Top 10 USAID regime changes in the last 10 years in Grok and see what you pull up.
See how many USAID is involved.
tim pool
So how do I want to phrase this one?
How many?
ryan matta
Yeah, was USAID involved in carrying out a regime change?
unidentified
USAID, how many countries?
tim pool
Let's just do this.
How many countries did USAID help overthrow?
Let's see how it answers that one.
The exact number of countries where the United States Agency for International Development has been implicated in overthrowing governments is highly debated and often shrouded in controversy.
According to various posts on X and some news articles, there are claims that USAID has been involved in regime change operations in numerous countries.
Some users on X mention specific countries like Thailand, Burma, Pakistan, Serbia, Ukraine, Honduras, El Salvador, Panama, Syria, Afghanistan, and Iraq, and others.
Another claim from X post is that USAID has been involved in overthrowing 83 governments over 50 years.
Though this is not backed by official documentation or universally accepted sources.
Specific historical cases involve Iran in 1953. The CIA, with covert funding possibly through mechanisms like those used by USAID, was involved in the coup against Prime Minister Mohamed, how do you pronounce that, Mossadegh?
Guatemala in 1954, Chile in 1973. Salvador Allende.
However, while USAID has been accused of supporting regime changes often under the guise of promoting democracy or through humanitarian aid, these operations are typically covert and intertwined with broader US foreign policy efforts.
Well, I'll break it down.
They say, important point, there is no official USAID documentation admitting to such activities directly.
Many of these claims come from sources critical of U.S. foreign policy, which can introduce bias, and their involvement in these events is often part of a larger strategy involving multiple U.S. agencies like the CIA. The simple argument that people have made is that what USAID does is fund insurgent groups—I'm sorry, activist groups in various countries.
So have you guys ever heard about the Tales from an Economic Hitman?
Famous story.
You can watch the interview or read the book.
Basically, this guy says, what we would do is we'd go to a country and we'd say, hey, we're going to give you international aid.
We're going to give you development.
We're going to put billions of dollars into your infrastructure, roads, stores.
We're going to bring in McDonald's.
We're going to bring in Starbucks, whatever.
Not specifically those, but that's, you know.
If the country said no, they would then say, okay, you want to play it the hard way?
We'll play it the hard way.
They would then try to fund opposition politicians to change or overthrow the government.
If that did not work, invasion or assassination.
Or I'm sorry, if that didn't work, they would try to take the politician out in one way or another, and then it would ultimately lead to invasion.
So that's like Iraq's and I'm Hussein and Libya with Gaddafi.
I'm not saying that's true.
catharine oneill gillihan
that's what's been alleged i i think it's true because i yeah yeah i we would have so we would have and again this was when i was at the state department um but you know just being in the foreign aid uh agencies um so we would have people coming to our office that would allege that especially i remember one guy from macedonia he would come in he was
i can't remember where he was in their government but he was some elected official and he's like please please stop your government whoa please please stop your government from trying to overthrow ours.
Please.
I beg of you.
And unfortunately, I don't know exactly what happened because we were so overwhelmed.
And like I said, there was no top cover.
We didn't have, we had Tillerson who was fired pretty early and then Pompeo who was useless.
So, you know, we were unable to really do anything, You saw this man say this?
Oh yeah, he came into our office.
And I can't remember his name, but he's- Is this like classified stuff?
tim pool
It sounds like you're in trouble.
catharine oneill gillihan
No, no, it's not classified, but- Because it's all public.
I mean, it's all tax dollars, so you can see.
unidentified
I had a similar experience yesterday.
My driver, they picked me up from the airport.
His name was Abdullah.
And we were in conversation about why I was here and how I was coming to talk about USAID. And he said, oh, I'm very familiar with USAID. He said, I'm from Afghanistan.
He said, and USAID came into our country under the guise that they were going to be helping us rebuild and helping children and all of that.
And he said, All I know is one day I went to sleep.
The next day I woke up and my country was unrecognizable.
I didn't recognize it anymore.
And everybody was flailing and it all started when they showed up.
And I was just like, wow, it gave me chills.
tim pool
So tell me how this happened.
Why did this guy show up?
What was the plan?
catharine oneill gillihan
So he had found...
So my former boss did...
Faith outreach on the campaign in 2016. And so she had a lot of, you know, Christian groups that she dealt with on the campaign.
And so there's this event called the National Prayer Breakfast.
And there's an international component to it.
And it actually just happened.
And so anyway, it's just, you know, they just found her through some of these groups and asked for a meeting.
And she said yes.
Gosh, I wish I remember his name.
And super tall, typical, like, Eastern European, you know.
And he was just so, so upset by what our government was doing to his country.
You know, a democratically elected government that we were coming in and funding the opposition and essentially overthrowing their government.
ryan matta
Well, I just got back from Guatemala, and I believe in 2017, Todd Robinson, with the backing of USAID and the State Department, tried to get Guatemala to pass a law that made abortion legal.
And their country is like 80% or 90% Christian nation, and that sparked the largest mass protest.
I mean, Guatemalans from all across the country, even indigenous people from the tribes in the jungles, came out in March in solidarity and shut it down.
Why is our government involved with trying to make abortion legal in other countries?
unidentified
Well, USAID had a decades-long program called the Population Control Program, and it was ran openly.
It was even covered openly and referred to as a population control program in the 90s to control third-world population birth rates and to curtail them so that it did not impact our resources here in the United States and hurt our country.
You shouldn't call it that.
I didn't call it that.
Actually, they called it that.
They called it the Population Control Program.
And it was really...
There was a fire lit under it when Henry Kissinger was Secretary of State.
And he had a mission in place and installed the president of the Population Program under the U.S. government that would go and...
And try to incentivize, especially in countries like India, they would go to poor villages and use cash to incentivize the men to get vasectomies or even incentivize the women to sterilize themselves and pay them to do so.
So it's absolutely...
Just horrendous thing to know that our country was involved in that and this organization that supported it and propped it up.
And they even praised it.
And this newspaper, the Detroit Free Press, actually, in 1992, was giving the USAID accolades for the decrease in the birth rate in these third world countries and for the work all credited to USAID. So that doesn't get darker than that.
catharine oneill gillihan
Amendment.
It's called the Siljander Amendment.
Are you familiar with that?
unidentified
I'm familiar with the name.
Wasn't he the president of this program?
catharine oneill gillihan
No, he was.
So it's an amendment restricting any of our foreign aid dollars to be used.
I'm reading it right here.
be used to lobby for or against abortion. - So it's not just abortion.
unidentified
Now they just put it under the guise of empowering women and birth control.
- Of course. - But it's all still for the same goal, to prioritize the American empire and so that we do not have to worry about our resources being hindered by a population boom in a third world country and it's crazy. - Yeah, but if the US banned abortion, to prioritize the American empire and so that we do Yeah, but if the U.S. banned abortion...
tim pool
And was advocating for family policy and putting on TV like moms with seven kids and they were going like, wow, look at the greatest thing ever.
You should be like them.
And then was going to these foreign countries and being like, you should get an abortion.
There's some logic there.
Make other countries not have kids while we have lots.
Instead, it's just across the board, nobody have kids.
So it seems not less interested in anything having to do with America and more having to do with global population control.
unidentified
It's nihilism.
I mean, it's just, it's cheering on your own demise.
I don't know why anybody would want to do that.
But we definitely were encouraging it.
We weren't encouraging it as much at home during the 70s, 80s and 90s, but we were definitely encouraging it abroad in these third world countries and incentivizing people who were hungry and wanted to put food on their table for them to sterilize themselves.
It's horrible, but...
tim pool
Well, there's that Democrat in Michigan who announced that she sterilized herself.
Did you see that?
unidentified
In some cases.
tim pool
She's like, I refuse to get pregnant while Trump is president, so I got sterilized.
unidentified
Sex strikes really did something, I tell you.
tim pool
Yeah, but I'm wondering if you experienced anything other like that man saying, please don't overthrow our governments.
Was there anything else like that?
catharine oneill gillihan
Gosh, so many things.
You know, when I was at the State Department yesterday, it was all coming back to me.
I think you have PTSD. I think I might, actually.
But, you know, because this was eight years ago.
And, you know, every day was something.
One of the things that does come to mind, so our undersecretariat oversaw the Refugee Bureau.
PRM, Population Refugees and Migration, which is a very corrupt bureau also.
And one of the things that I think that needs to be reformed is the classification system.
Oh yeah.
Because they weaponize that.
You know, they make things...
And I'm not saying anything classified on air, so don't get worried.
Well, I don't think I have to be worried about that.
No, I know.
Well, I'm just, for anyone watching, I'm not violating anything.
But I think what they do is they use that to manipulate information because you have FOIA, which is Freedom of Information Act, right?
So anyone can request a FOIA. And so they use the class of...
to kind of protect information, to hide things from the American taxpayer, because we should be accountable for the people paying our bills.
So there was one instance where there was a foreign national from Iraq who came through our refugee program.
He's in California.
And he had gone through the vet, right, supposedly.
And he was living in California.
And so when you come to our soil, you have two years to apply for, you're given legal status, and then you have to apply to become a legal permanent resident.
And then after that you can apply to become a citizen.
But his legal permanent resident status was denied because they found out that there was a warrant out for his arrest for assaulting a police officer in Iraq and having ties to a terrorist group there.
But they did everything they could.
They did not want, because this was obviously during the Trump administration, so people didn't want refugees in the country, and they did not want that getting out.
And so they did everything they could to try to hide that.
Finally, it was, you know, it was in the DOJ revealed his name and everything, but it was kind of brushed under the rug because they didn't want to counter their narrative, right?
So, but there were lots of instances like that where The American taxpayer should know what's going on with our tax dollars.
It's not an unreasonable request.
And so I think that by bringing a lot of this funding into one place, because all of it runs out of one office of the State Department.
It's called the Office of Foreign Assistance.
The acronym is F. And everything should be through there.
There shouldn't be accounts in all these different agencies and bureaus and departments.
It should be one account.
The money should come in one place.
It should go out one place.
So there's no confusion on where it's going.
unidentified
But even when it goes out and it goes to all of these NGOs, then they funnel it to someone else and then they funnel it to someone else.
Then it just, even if it all goes out one place, which I agree with you, it should, there definitely needs to be more transparency.
And now there's a huge spotlight on it and hopefully it will get what's needed there.
tim pool
So understanding what USAID does.
And that there was an effort, at least to some degree, in the first Trump administration to break it apart.
Now, put that in the context of Democrats saying he's going to dismantle our government.
What they were talking about is this international operation of the U.S. overthrowing unfavorable governments to expand U.S. I don't even want to say U.S. I would say like Western.
I don't even want to say Western.
I guess you'd call it...
Cabal?
I don't know.
How do you refer to it?
I mean, these people don't represent American interests.
They don't represent the interests of France or Germany.
unidentified
They represent the interests of the World Bank and NATO. Those are the two things that they are...
Tied to, and everything they do, their entire mission is to align with the World Bank and NATO. Anything that does not align with that becomes enemy number one, and that's who they go after, and that's one reason they went after Trump.
Trump was a number one enemy of NATO when he took office.
tim pool
The question is, if Trump won in 2020, would he have gone so hard against these organizations, or was it that he saw how they were weaponized even against him?
catharine oneill gillihan
Yes, because we were ready.
tim pool
So you think it was going to happen?
catharine oneill gillihan
I mean, I don't think—I think it would have happened, maybe not as quickly, but, you know, there were people like John McEntee who were ready to turn things around.
However, I will say I don't know if the external drumbeat— He needed everything that they threw at him to get Where we are today.
unidentified
And there's a fire under him that we never saw before.
tim pool
That's what I was hoping for.
unidentified
He wanted to drain the swamp.
Oh, yeah.
I think everybody was hoping that was sitting on the sidelines going, what is going to happen this time?
And then he hits the ground running and everybody's head spinning.
Even everyone in mainstream media can't even keep up with what's going on because it's one thing after another.
And he knows where the bodies are buried this time.
It's a different ballgame altogether.
We're three weeks in now, or a little over two wheels in.
tim pool
I've been referring to this as Trump's march to the sea.
You have this great battle in his first term.
It was kind of light.
He was playing ball quite a bit, but trying to do his thing.
And then the empire obviously strikes back in 2020. Now Donald Trump, the first thing he does when he gets in, is he is going scorched earth on deep state institutions.
I think...
His view is he's going to strip them of their resources.
This is why I called the March of the Sea.
Sherman goes down and burns farms to the ground to make sure the Confederates can't even eat food or transport goods.
There's no roads.
There's no railroad tracks.
Trump going in, offering buyouts to the CIA, firing FBI. Now they're saying there's insubordination because the feds don't want – they're trying to sue.
It's crazy.
And then he nukes USAID, and he's doing it so quickly that there's no way for them to respond.
I would just say, you know, my advice, and I'm a lawyer, is I'm just like, Trump should instruct all of his administrators to start firing people individually for various reasons, like, that they can.
That way you don't get a class action.
If Trump, you know what, right now they're saying that there's going to be a lawsuit from USAID staff, because this is a blanket bang.
He said, you're all out Friday.
So, 12,000 people are going to join this massive lawsuit, and if that reverses, they all come back.
But if they start going right now, I mean, maybe with USAID, you just attack the institution as quickly as you can.
With other institutions, just have the higher ups that are saying, you're fired because you were late.
You're fired for that reason.
And when they say you can't do that, they'll say, sue me.
And then that's going to require 10,000 individual lawsuits, which is going to be nuts and impossible for these people to actually deal with.
unidentified
Yeah, it could be a smart move.
I mean, forcing them all to come back to the office, I think, was one strategy because a lot of people got so cozy working at home and moved away and are working remote and not even close to where they need to be to continue to work and come into the office every day.
So I think one thing I do think was a genius strategy on Trump's part is how he set up Doge.
It wasn't a newly formed thing.
He took something that Obama put in place to upgrade the computer systems for the government.
And he just...
Renamed it.
I think it was called the United States Digital Service Agency is what it was.
And knowing that he would need congressional approval to set up Doge, he went in and just took this thing that Obama set up and said, oh, okay, we're going to change this name and you're going to come in and basically update and make our digital systems more efficient, along with a lot of other things.
But I think that was a genius move because a lot of senators, Democratic senators especially, That's how you play the game.
catharine oneill gillihan
That is how you play the game.
And this is the thing, is that Trump's team is seasoned.
They've been in waiting.
They know how to game the system.
They've been on the inside.
So they've shown up with guns instead of knives, you know?
They've shown up with the right tools to make it happen.
unidentified
And two individuals, I think, that work.
Longer hours and faster and harder than anybody I've ever seen before are Trump and Elon.
So you have these two forces that are literally working around the clock.
I mean, somebody said the other day, when I go to sleep, Elon's tweeting.
When I wake up, Elon's tweeting.
And I don't know when he sleeps.
It's true.
It's the same about Trump, though.
tim pool
Maybe Elon's more than one person.
unidentified
Well, he's not Adrian, okay?
Have we not established that yet?
catharine oneill gillihan
Did you see when they were trucking in the sleep pods?
unidentified
Oh, yeah.
And they're saying that they're going to sue them for giving a gift to government officials because that company said they were going to give them for free.
I'm like, good lord.
Everything that is good or seemingly good that they're trying to help is going to come under attack no matter what.
tim pool
What I really love is how all these Democrats and liberals are coming out being like, it's a bunch of 20-year-olds that are working doge.
unidentified
That's what founded this country.
tim pool
What is going on?
And everyone's like, bro, y'all were calling for 16-year-olds to vote.
You had Greta Thunberg at 1617 screaming to change governmental policy.
You got no room to stand here.
unidentified
Everyone complaining is either falling down the steps, having a stroke, or needing a walker in order to make it up to Capitol Hill.
So we really, I think the fresh youth coming in is needed.
A revolution was started by a bunch of 20-something-year-olds that wrote our Constitution in the first place.
tim pool
So what happens to the rest of the world now?
Obviously, without the strong backbone of USAID, War III will begin, right?
ryan matta
Well, let's take a look at El Salvador.
What happened when Bukele got into power?
It took him about two and a half years of his first five-year term.
And at that two and a half-year point, when the cartels finally retaliated back, that gave him the voting power that he needed in Congress to basically temporarily suspend the Constitution.
Then he was able to arrest any gang members that had markings on their face that indicated how many people they've killed.
And they went straight to prison.
They didn't get a court date.
They went right to prison.
And then he also kicked USAID or cut off funding to USAID. Because what he said is, at one point, the money was going to the El Salvadorian government.
Then when Bukele got control of his government, USAID said, you know what?
You're being like a dictator.
We're not going to give the money to your government anymore.
We're going to tell you what NGOs it's going to go to.
We're going to give it to the NGOs directly.
And Bukele says, you know what?
It's not our money.
That money doesn't belong to El Salvador.
It belongs to the American taxpayer.
Just keep your money.
We'll fund our own government.
And in two and a half years, he turned it from the deadliest country in Latin America to the safest country in the world.
Tim, I tell you.
tim pool
In the world?
ryan matta
In Latin America.
It went from having, I think it was 183 gang-related homicides in one weekend to almost not one, I think there was a few gang-related homicides the entire year of 2024. I think there was only 130 murders in the year of 2024 in El Salvador.
That's insane.
From thousands.
tim pool
El Salvador's homicide rate as of 2025 is 0.91 per 100,000 people.
A decline from 106.3 in 2015. Do you know what the U.S. homicide rate is?
No.
I believe it's 6.3 per 100,000, meaning that El Salvador is now substantially safer than the United States.
ryan matta
Substantially.
Tim, I tell you what, every single person you walk by is happy to meet you.
They're optimistic.
They're introducing themselves.
You see 13-year-old girls and 14-year-old boys kicking a soccer ball, running down the street at 11 o'clock at night, just joking.
It's joy.
It's happiness.
tim pool
You went down there?
ryan matta
I just have been there for like the last three weeks.
unidentified
Oh, wow.
You liked it so much.
tim pool
I want to go.
I'll tell you my story.
I was playing poker.
And at MGM National Harbor, and I was sitting at a table, the guy to my left was Salvadorian, and...
People were talking as they normally do, and the guy mentioned that he was from El Salvador.
And then I was like, oh man, I hear it's going really well down there.
Bukele's doing amazing.
And he's like, yeah, my family's moving back.
And I was like, your family's moving back to El Salvador?
And he was like, we moved here because it was dangerous, but Bukele saved the country, so we're going home.
ryan matta
I was like, wow!
It's funny you say that, because I just was at a little mart.
And I interviewed a kid.
And him and his family had to flee five years ago.
And he had just moved back and started a business back in El Salvador.
He was only gone because it was so dangerous that the gangs were coming to him.
And he lived within seeing distance of the police station.
And his buddies from high school were asking him, like, hey, we need to know how many cars are in that parking lot or X amount of cops working right now.
That's like their initiation to try to get him to just do a little bit of work for the gangs and then kind of initiate him in.
And he's like, when they started to contact him, he's like, I knew I was going to be forced to join the gang.
And I had no choice.
My parents got me out.
We got out.
tim pool
The question then becomes, is USAID intentionally destabilizing nations like El Salvador, expanding crime, making things worse?
Or is it a product of corrupt individuals in the United States are funneling money to themselves under the guise of helping third world countries?
unidentified
It can be both.
tim pool
It can be both.
So I'm wondering for like El Salvador, which I don't know the strategic importance of El Salvador to the United States.
Maybe you get some wealthy lawyer in D.C. Who's like, here's an easy way to get money.
Hey, we have an NGO that helps democracy in El Salvador give us $20 million, and they go, fine, write the check, and the guy does nothing.
He funnels some of the money and says, here's what we spent it on, and it goes to random garbage, and then he makes himself well off.
Or are they intentionally going to El Salvador and saying, we're going to give money to legal activist groups that are leftists that will get criminals out of jail so they can wreak havoc on this nation?
ryan matta
A little bit of both.
So USAID in El Salvador is known as the Beltway Bandit.
Anybody that wants to receive money from USAID, it's common knowledge that they're going to skim 60% off the top for themselves.
tim pool
Wait, USAID is called the Beltway Bandit?
ryan matta
Yes, that's how they're referred to in El Salvador.
tim pool
Mike Cernovich, wow, in El Salvador.
So they say Mike Cernovich was saying that he wouldn't be surprised if like half of the economy of the D.C. area is just money laundering.
Government funds being sent to these NGOs where these executive staff pay themselves hundreds of thousands of dollars.
And you wonder, let me tell you, what's the industry of Loudoun County?
Loudoun County is the highest median income in the country and potentially even the world.
Because, I mean, how do you beat the United States' highest median income county?
Maybe not, though, but per capita for highest income, there's like these enclaves of ultra wealthy billionaires.
So that doesn't count.
For a residential neighborhood.
In an urban area, it's Loudoun County, Virginia, just outside of D.C. We're like 10 minutes, 20 minutes away.
What's their industry?
You know, if we go to Michigan back in the day, it's the auto industry.
It's the Rust Belt, right?
If you go to North Dakota, you know they got frack fields, they got oil production, things like that.
You go to Seattle, they have timber.
So you go to Hollywood, it's culture, it's movies, or at least it was.
What is Loudoun County producing that these people have more money than anybody else?
unidentified
Power over corporate interests.
If you buy the right politicians and you pay them off, your corporations are going to thrive.
And there's no better place to do that than where all of the D.C. bureaucrats live right outside D.C. But let's break down the source of income, right?
tim pool
So the point is, you go to Seattle.
And I was in Portland, Seattle, and I was asking people—I love asking this question.
What is the—like, how does this city have money?
How do people live here?
What do they produce?
And when I'm in Portland, they're like, oh, this big timber industry.
You know, it's not all of it, obviously, but there's a lot of trees, and it's changing.
But, you know, they produce a North American rock maple.
It gets shipped, you know, for production and a lot of things.
It's like, oh, okay, so they make a lot of money doing that.
So we know where the money comes from.
They chop a tree down.
They go to somebody and say, I got a tree, you want it?
They say, sure, I'll give you 50 bucks.
That person gives 50 bucks.
Someone in Loudoun County, where the average, I think the median income is like $170,000 a year.
What is that person doing that someone hands them money?
unidentified
Lobbying.
tim pool
But where does the money come from?
And the answer is actually really simple.
Your pocket.
catharine oneill gillihan
Correct.
That's correct.
tim pool
At gunpoint.
Right.
When you look at these other cities, and they're like, we make cars here.
Everybody has, it's like, you ever see Tommy Boy?
Was that the movie with Chris Farley?
catharine oneill gillihan
Yeah, great movie.
tim pool
They're like, the city's going to shut down if the auto plant goes.
There's no city anymore because the auto plant has all the jobs.
We know people are choosing to give money to the auto plant so people can live.
In Loudoun County, nobody's choosing to give these people money.
They are looting your bank account so they can live like kings in the capital city.
ryan matta
Absolutely.
And they control the politicians that pass the policy that make it legal for them to do so.
And they're very well protected.
They're very well funded.
And it's almost impossible to stop.
Unless you do it from the top down.
tim pool
Let me just stress this one last time.
The industry of Loudoun County is ripping you off.
catharine oneill gillihan
That's correct.
Absolutely.
The DIC, Development Industrial Complex.
tim pool
The MIC. Development.
And this is the DIC. So going back to the question I asked before, in all seriousness now, what does the world look like with USAID gutted?
What happens?
ryan matta
It starts to heal.
Take a look at Guatemala and what's been happening in Guatemala over the last 20 or 30 years.
And I'll just tell you from what the citizens have told me.
I'm no expert in USAID by any means.
But basically they say that USAID comes in in over a 10, 20, 30 year period.
The first thing that they want to do is they build out this network of NGOs.
And then they use those NGOs to basically try to take over failing media outlets.
And they also use organizations like the National Endowment for Democracy as like their recruiting and staffing arm.
And then they basically make job postings for specific Guatemalan nationals.
And then they take those people and they go to the failing media outlet and say, hey, we'll donate $10,000 in subscriptions a month, but we're going to put this person as the primetime host.
Then once they have control of the media, they use that media outlet to amplify the politicians that will do their bidding, and they use it to undermine the politicians that won't do their bidding.
And then over a 5, 10, 20-year period, they've basically installed your entire Supreme Court, your entire electoral college, they've taken over your justice system, they've taken over a majority of your Congress.
And the only thing left standing right now in Guatemala, including the president and vice president, USA played a major role in getting them elected, if you even call it that.
The last thing standing in their way is their Attorney General.
Now, you see USAID has spent the last year Spending millions and millions of dollars to try to attack and discredit this attorney general.
And she's the only one right now who's standing in the way.
She's also getting respected by Tom Holman.
And the Trump administration is working with this attorney general right now.
She's the only one that can investigate the election fraud.
And she's the only one that can investigate the child trafficking that's going on.
She raided five NGOs that were accused of child trafficking.
And for the first time in recorded history, and that's going back all the way to 2012, the amount of children coming from Guatemala to America has decreased by 23%.
In one year.
She rated them in April of 2025, and the numbers come out in October of 2024. Sorry, she rated them in April of 2024, the numbers come out in October of 2024. So that's only a six-month period, and that's a drastic decrease.
tim pool
What happened in Brazil?
unidentified
USAID got involved.
Of course, they show up and they unleash their unlimited funds of NGOs to come in and start censoring him because he was a threat to NATO.
He was a threat to what they wanted for their agenda for Brazil.
So the real censorship that was happening during COVID and everything else, everyone was focused on that here.
I think in the U.S. more than they should have also been focused on Brazil with NATO.
He actually was even banned recently from attending Trump's inauguration by the current sitting president.
They banned him from traveling to the U.S. to attend Trump's inauguration.
A former president.
That is insane.
ryan matta
According to Mike Benz, it was William Burns, the director of the CIA, who flies to Brazil with 50 of his CIA homies and basically holds a meeting with Bolsonaro where he tells Bolsonaro that you need to stop questioning these Dominion voting machines.
And that was when they started to divert.
Our government, our State Department, was diverting semiconductors during a semiconductor shortage so that they could create more voting machines than Brazil has ever had in any election in Brazil.
And then, wasn't it Mark Milley who flies over there like two weeks prior to the election and starts arresting some of his military generals?
If I'm not mistaken, quote, fact check me on that, but I'm pretty sure that happened.
And, yeah, it was like two weeks before the election, he arrested like five or ten of Bolsonaro's top military generals so that Bolsonaro couldn't contest the election.
Am I right on that?
tim pool
I don't know if I can find it.
ryan matta
Yeah, probably it's hard.
catharine oneill gillihan
February 10th, 2023, General Mark Milley spoke with Brazil's chief of the joint staff.
By phone.
Nope.
Sorry, that's not it.
tim pool
Yeah, a lot of people don't know that Brazil had their own J6. Yes.
Yeah.
unidentified
It was way bigger, with a lot more support from the people.
tim pool
Is it true that they had a shaman, though?
Let me see if I can find that, because everybody was saying they did, but I'm not sure they actually did.
catharine oneill gillihan
I have a funny story about Brazil at the UN. So I was stationed up there at the UN. I think it was in 2018 or 2019. And so have you guys ever been to the UN? No.
It's a dark place.
unidentified
I bet.
catharine oneill gillihan
It's a dark place, but it's all...
tim pool
I have been there, yeah.
catharine oneill gillihan
Oh, you have?
unidentified
Yeah.
catharine oneill gillihan
Okay.
So have you ever been on the floor where all the votes happen?
tim pool
I might have.
Not when I was in session or anything.
catharine oneill gillihan
Okay.
tim pool
I knew someone who worked for their news agency, and they gave me a tour.
catharine oneill gillihan
Okay.
tim pool
So I'm pretty sure I got to go and check that out.
catharine oneill gillihan
So the way that it works is that there are all these different resolutions, and each country has a vote, right?
And so everyone's on the floor kind of working votes.
You know, trying to get votes to go one way or the other.
And so I can't remember the resolution we were working on, but I believe it was something to do with the pro-life.
But, you know, Bolsonaro was president at the time, and their representative, they're essentially their guy at the UN. Was maybe a holdover from the previous administration, and he was not in alignment with whatever Brazil's values were at the time.
So I had met the president's son at an event, and I got his number, and I told him I was at the State Department and whatever.
And so I was with my colleague Ron, and we were having real issues with this guy.
He was not voting the way that he should have been voting.
I sent Eduardo a WhatsApp message.
I was like, hey, I know we met at this event.
I don't know if you remember me, but I'm here at the UN. I'm on the floor, and I just want to let you know that your delegate is not in alignment with your whatever position it was.
The guy was gone in 20 minutes.
He was ripped off the delegation.
unidentified
He disappeared someone?
catharine oneill gillihan
Well, he wasn't killed, but he was pulled off the delegation in 20 minutes.
Wow.
It's dark.
It's dark, but it wasn't a bad thing.
The problem was that delegate was not representing.
The Bolsonaro administration properly.
That was the issue.
It wasn't that he was not, you know, he was not there representing what they wanted to represent.
And I knew that because I had met Bolsonaro.
And so, but that's another problem with these big UN organization and NGOs is that you might have someone at the top.
These countries, they may have someone at the top, but it doesn't trickle down.
You know, into their delegation or into their organization.
ryan matta
Look at Trump's term, his first term.
catharine oneill gillihan
Exactly.
ryan matta
Every single ambassador, not every single ambassador, but a majority of ambassadors in these third world countries were actually undermining.
Trump's agenda.
Todd Robinson in Guatemala being such a prime example of that.
And so I think that Trump knew that if he wanted his agenda carried out, that he had to gut the organization that was funding everybody that was working against him.
And USAID is that organization.
catharine oneill gillihan
Absolutely.
Yeah, it has to, you know, there's been such history of them just running the ship themselves.
You know, they don't respond to demo Democratically elected leaders.
No, no.
unidentified
They had to change their tone on that.
I mean, Brazil was all over the Twitter files.
There was a huge aspect, especially with the Global Engagement Center.
catharine oneill gillihan
Oh, the GEC. I know the GEC very well.
Yes.
unidentified
Which was funded and started by USAID. And you would go through the Global Engagement Center documents and there he is.
There's the shaman.
tim pool
But he was not...
Part of their riots.
unidentified
Oh, that's too bad.
tim pool
That is a Bolsonaro supporter, but he wasn't out during the J6-style riots in Brazil.
unidentified
Did anyone steal a podium?
tim pool
A lectern.
A lectern guy is very serious about correcting the record on that one.
They call him a podium guy, but it was in fact a lectern.
In fact, it's just sitting in the other room.
unidentified
Wait.
tim pool
The actual one?
unidentified
No.
He didn't actually take it home.
You almost had me, Tim.
You almost had me.
tim pool
But you saw it in there, didn't you?
unidentified
I did.
tim pool
Yeah, as a replica.
unidentified
I wasn't tempted to steal it.
I don't know why, but, you know, to each their own.
No judgment.
ryan matta
So in a funny story, or not really a funny story, but, you know, when the elections took place and the attorney general in Guatemala was trying to investigate the elections, USAID... For 180 days, staged a Rent-A-Riot-style protest outside of the Attorney General's house.
And then, when that wasn't working because they were trying to put enough pressure on the current president because his term was ending, they wanted him to violate the Constitution and remove the Attorney General from power before their installed president could, or was forced to, if you will.
When that didn't work, they took the angry mob of protesters.
They took 1,000 people down to her neighborhood.
They stormed the gate of her neighborhood.
Went to her house live-streaming.
This is all live-streamed.
Went to her house, pulled back the foliage, live-streamed her address, and then the screens go off, obviously.
They kick in her front door, they go into her house, and they pee and poop all over the Attorney General's house.
That would be the equivalent of the January Sixers on January 6th leaving J6 with a mob of 1,000 people, going down to Merrick Garland's house, kicking down his gate, and going into Garland's house.
You know what would have happened to those people if they would have did that?
tim pool
We wouldn't know what would have happened to them.
ryan matta
Oh, no.
They'd have been done.
tim pool
They'd be gone.
Just no one would ever hear from them again.
ryan matta
Ever.
tim pool
Yeah.
ryan matta
And that's what USAID funds around the world.
So when you ask what's going to happen when they're gone, I think the world's going to become a lot better of a place.
tim pool
What I'm trying to understand is, how is it that there are still so many liberal podcasters and YouTubers that build audience, get millions of views, despite the fact that what's going on with USAID, foreign intervention regime change, is in our faces?
You go and watch some of these guys' shows and they will lie explicitly about what's going on, but the cat's out of the bag.
The stuff's overt and in our faces.
We know for a fact they spent $1.5 million on a transgender opera in Ireland.
So what are these?
We had a viral video from a guy the other day where he's like, I hereby reject and denounce the Democratic Party.
They've been lying to us.
Elon goes in an audit and we find out they're spending all our money this way.
I'm furious.
And there are still these liberal podcasters being like, everything's fine.
Elon's bad.
Don't audit the government.
unidentified
It's a cult mindset at some point when you can't wake up and see what's happening.
I mean, when you're looking at Trump used to be a Democrat, Elon used to be a Democrat, all these people that are now the faces of the Republican Party at one point were Democrats.
I mean, but if you can't look and see the disgusting things that our government has been funding, I mean, when it turned and started censoring its own people and using USAID funds to do that, that was...
I mean, that's indefensible.
You cannot defend that.
I mean, you'll have Sam Harris come out and say that it is defensible because Trump was so bad, which is laughable because you have to base things on principle, not in just whatever is convenient for your narrative.
But I mean, it's just insane.
tim pool
The direction we were going, and we may go if Trump doesn't succeed in his endeavors, though it seems he is, would be that there would be a stateless entity of military power over every country.
Not that I would call it a one-world government, but the way things had been going in the United States, the institutions like USAID, the CIA were not beholden to the American people.
They were effectively butting off from the U.S. government to become their own international cabal of intelligence and military power.
And if Trump did not win, the American people...
Would be subjects to this international intelligence and military operation.
unidentified
The playground for this, the test ground, so to say, is Ukraine.
They've launched the digital ID over there.
They've launched all these things that you can't get away with doing.
They've been testing them out on the Ukrainians while all of this has been going on through COVID and everything else.
Billions and billions of dollars, both our corporations and our government, using our tax money to kind of play with the dystopian reality of what that would look like, to have the World Bank, USAID, all the actors involved in that, what it would look like for them to be in control and install a puppet president and not allow democratic elections.
But we also have to point out that USAID also funded over $50 million in total to EcoHealth Alliance, which was working with...
Wuhan in the lab there.
Is this still allowed to be talked about now?
I don't know.
On YouTube?
tim pool
I'm pretty sure they confirmed it.
The CIA report came out saying...
unidentified
The CIA finally came out, but the CIA was the one that was funding this research.
tim pool
The CIA made a report in the Biden administration that COVID likely originated from a lab, and it was only when Ratcliffe got in that the information got released.
And as he clarified, we did not draft this report.
The report existed.
We're just releasing it, which is important because that means the CIA has known for years this was likely what happened.
unidentified
They funded the research with EcoHealth Alliance through USAID, over $50 million.
And they were working directly with the EcoHealth Alliance president, Peter Daszak, since at least 2013. I worked with the whistleblower to help get his story out, Dr. Andrew Huff, who worked over at EcoHealth Alliance.
And he said the CIA approached them through In-Q-Tel, which is basically the...
You know, so I asked, like...
tim pool
What happens without USAID? And you were mentioning that, Ryan, that the world starts to heal.
But I'm curious, like, how does Russia respond to this?
How does China respond to this?
And what does that mean for the global powers?
I think Rubio recently said we're entering a multipolar world.
unidentified
Well, USAID has already been banned from Russia, and they're actually—their news coverage of this has been—if you even say anything about how Russia is happy about USAID being disbanded, you're just spouting Russian misinformation.
tim pool
I'm just like, what is the reaction?
Is Russia going to make a move on various territories now?
Are they going to say, oh, now we have carte blanche, there's no resistance?
What happens?
What does China do?
ryan matta
I personally think that Russia is public enemy number one because they wouldn't allow USAID in their country.
unidentified
But neither would China, but that's how they got into China is through EcoHealth Alliance.
That's how the CIA, USAID got into China.
They were never allowed – USAID was never allowed into China.
That's how they got that backdoor there.
tim pool
I think the issue with Russia largely has to do with expanding NATO's borders.
ryan matta
For sure.
tim pool
And of course Russia is right there and China is not.
So it's priority for NATO. But I'm also curious about Assad and Syria, the Arab Spring.
Right?
So, as the story goes, Saddam Hussein, largely defiant to Western policy, and then he's gone.
And Gaddafi...
ryan matta
Gaddafi?
tim pool
What the claims I hear is, I'm not saying it true, is that Gaddafi wanted to trade oil in, I think, dinar?
ryan matta
Yeah, gold dinar or something.
tim pool
Yeah, and he wanted to create like an African Union and the West was like, you will not interfere with the petrodollar.
And so they said we're going to remove them.
Now Libya is a hellscape.
There's active slavery, there's militias killing each other, it's just warring tribes.
And I'm curious what USAID's involvement was in the Arab Spring and ultimately Syria, if you guys have any idea.
unidentified
They are directly tied to it.
USAID was funding that whole scandal.
What year did the Arab Spring take place?
catharine oneill gillihan
2011. Oh, 12. I thought it was 12, but it's...
unidentified
I believe it started in 2011. I believe that media was still actually covering stories like this of scandals and not trying to bury them as much.
So you can still pull these stories up and read about them and they're not...
have the slant that they do today running the...
holding up narratives for the CIA like they do now.
tim pool
You know what's fascinating is that when the Arab Spring was happening, Facebook and Twitter...
We're given large credit for helping to ignite the Arab Spring protests because people were organizing.
And let me tell you something that's really funny.
So at the time, I was hanging out with a bunch of friends in various hacker spaces in Los Angeles.
If you guys know what a hacker space is, it's basically hackers rent a space and then they hang out.
And some of my buddies were deeply involved in online activism stuff.
Back then it was very much free speech, legitimately.
The hacker community turned into weird woke garbage over the next few years.
But I had some friends who were working on projects where what they would do is they would create dial-up internet lines.
So they would set up a phone number that would give you dial-up internet access so anyone in the world could call that number.
If they had a modem hooked up, it would give them rudimentary internet accessing text files and, you know, not media or anything like that.
And I remember one of my friends being like, hey guys, I noticed something kind of interesting.
Have you noticed that a lot of these Libyan – Libyans that are posting about what's going on in Libya are speaking perfect North American English?
Why?
Why would Libyans speak with the – why would they be tweeting perfect North American English slang and otherwise?
unidentified
AI in action.
Those are bots built to build an area.
tim pool
At the time, it was largely believed to be sock puppet accounts operated by various contractors.
And Barrett Brown.
At the time, had done some research on something called Project PM, where he uncovered, I believe, I could be wrong about this, the Air Force had been, individuals at the Air Force, had been producing sock puppet accounts on social media that were then distributed to various private contractors for use, where the plan was one individual would operate 50 different Twitter accounts.
And what they do is...
If you post something on X where you're like, I don't think the U.S. should be involved in Libya, you instantly get slammed by 50 responses from various people saying, I don't know, I think you're wrong about this one.
The Libyans need our help.
They're suffering.
And then you get responses from people being like, I'm a Libyan and Gaddafi is killing our people.
Please, we beg of you.
And that's when my friends who are activists were like, I noticed a lot of these prominent accounts are speaking perfect English.
The response officially was, it's because...
The people who are Libyan, who are on Twitter, were educated in the West before going home.
They went to school here, they have friends here, and when they went home, they're using Twitter because Twitter's not largely used in these other countries.
Yeah, nobody bought it.
The argument was, this is U.S. intelligence trying to convince the American people to support revolution and intervention in Libya, which they ultimately did.
unidentified
And they did the exact same thing with the Ukraine war.
I mean, anytime you posted anything about the Ukraine war, you instantly got these little, I just don't understand how bad they are.
tim pool
Part of me thinks, like, are we in the PSYOP right now?
Is everything we're talking about the actual side?
Because how could they be so bad at this?
You have a global operation with billions of dollars and you screwed it up this bad?
I don't know.
It seems hard to believe, but I guess, you know, it happens.
catharine oneill gillihan
I'm reading an OIG report on USAID's involvement in the Arab Spring.
tim pool
Oh, yeah?
catharine oneill gillihan
It's very interesting.
Lots of things.
It's pretty dense.
I'll send it to you.
I don't know how to interpret it.
tim pool
How do I find it?
What is it?
catharine oneill gillihan
It is...
Let's see.
Go to...
Let's see.
Hold on.
How did I find it?
It's the Office of Inspector General.
Because all of USAID's websites are shut down.
So it's the survey of USAID's Arab Spring challenges in Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, and Yemen.
ryan matta
I think Elon needs to publish everything that was on USAID's Twitter and archive it and make it public for research purposes.
catharine oneill gillihan
I agree.
ryan matta
I mean, that was a treasure trove of evidence, and that needs to be made public for the American people to have access to.
tim pool
Interesting.
Here you go.
From USAID.gov, Office of the Inspector General.
Survey of USAID's Arab Spring challenges in Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, and Yemen.
catharine oneill gillihan
So they were there.
That's the answer.
ryan matta
They're everywhere.
They're always there.
tim pool
Yep.
catharine oneill gillihan
But this is an instance, I was just reading kind of just my skimming off the top, this is an instance where the State Department and USAID were not on the same page, according to this report, which probably happens more often than not.
ryan matta
I mean, look at Venezuela in 2019, when the aid trucks were caught on the bridge, and then they burnt the aid trucks down, and they were filled with automatic weapons.
I don't think that's aid.
unidentified
No, and you can even portray this in movies with the USAID trucks that are just full of weapons.
I mean, it's a money laundering and weapons laundering mechanism under the guise of aid.
It's a perfect cover, or it used to be.
ryan matta
And it's weird because they fund both sides.
They'll fund the government, and then they also fund the cartels and the guerrillas.
tim pool
This is the kind of thing right here that I think should give people pause.
Are you guys familiar with this?
ryan matta
No.
tim pool
This was a scandal when in Syria, There were particular groups.
I'm not sure if it was ISIS or who this was.
But you can take a look at this weapon firing at the back of a truck that says Mark Plumbing.
And it's got an American phone number on it.
And people were like, how did a truck from, I think it was from Michigan, end up in Syria to be used by rebel forces?
Or let me see.
I think I actually have the story here.
If it'll load.
It is not loading.
There's the, uh, what is it?
Truck on the front line of Syria war.
Here we go.
Let's pull this one out.
Is that it?
There we go.
Texas plumber's truck.
Texas, not Michigan.
Traded in.
Ends up in Syria with terrorists.
unidentified
Oh my gosh, Joe.
tim pool
I have questions.
Yeah.
catharine oneill gillihan
Wow.
tim pool
He traded his old F-250 last year.
The truck went to auction.
Still wearing his name and phone number.
Got his new vehicle.
Fast forward to this week, his truck appeared on Twitter in a decidedly different role.
How did this thing make it there?
There's actually a straightforward explanation for how the truck ended there.
Allegedly, in Syria, the export market for the U.S., across the globe, cars, blah, blah, blah.
The truck likely passed through numerous hands and ended up in a dealer's lot in Syria before Mark I had fully broken in the vehicle to replace his blah, blah, blah.
Hair-trigger conspiracy theorists.
Oh, come on, man.
It's all a big accident that some Texas guy's truck made its way to Syria in the war.
I'm going to give you a simple solution because I prefer Occam's razor.
In the absence of evidence, the solution that makes the least amount of assumptions tends to be correct.
Would we like to make the assumption that the truck was traded in, sold and put on the export market, was then auctioned off in a foreign country that was then auctioned off in a foreign country that was then auctioned off in a foreign country and found its way to Syria?
Or how about we say, instead of making all those leaps, which is quite conspiratorial, we can just say someone in the U.S. gave it to Syria.
That's it.
Now, if you want to speculate beyond that, that it was U.S. intentionally providing resources to rebel forces in Syria, we can then dive deeper and say the U.S. had a very, very powerful and vested interest in Assad crumbling and his government collapsing, which, of course, recently happened.
So I'm going to go ahead and say, based on what I know about the Syrian war, the U.S. interests, the Qatar-Turkey pipeline, Ukraine, Gazprom, Russia's gas control into Western Europe, that it's more likely...
That the U.S. was sending resources to rebel factions.
That's it.
ryan matta
What are we hoping to get out of it, though?
tim pool
Syria?
ryan matta
Yeah.
tim pool
We were trying to build a pipeline from...
It's called the Qatar Turkey Pipeline.
There's a gas field that Iran and Iraq both have access to, and they wanted to build a pipeline that went through, I believe it was Iraq, Syria, Turkey, into Europe, so that it would offset the Gazprom natural gas monopoly in Europe.
The U.S. went to Syria and said, we would like to build this pipeline through your country, and Bashar al-Assad said, we are allies with Russia, and this would damage their economic interests.
We're not going to let you do this.
Of course, Russia has a naval base in Tartus.
So the U.S. got angry and said, okay, fine, I guess, but we're upset because Gazprom controls about a quarter of natural gas flung into Europe, meaning that Russia has an outsized ability to control the market prices.
So what ends up happening next is Syria, Russia and Iran have a discussion and Iran says, look, we can tap the same gas field, send the pipeline through Iraq into Syria, Turkey, and then Russia doubles its control.
The U.S. then said, yeah, if you do that, we will wipe you out.
And back in, I think this was like 2009, the CIA had basically been discussing ways to get Assad out of power because of this problem.
And then The Guardian reported, I think it was in 2012, the intention to overthrow the Assad regime was now apparent in the Beltway.
People knew this was coming.
And when the fighting started in the Arab Spring, this is basically where the reporting comes from, the U.S. had this vested interest in helping rebel factions overthrow their tyrannical government.
Then you can take a look at the Burisma scandal.
Why is it that the U.S. has a former counterterror director from the CIA working on the board of a gas company in Ukraine?
Why does the U.S. want control in Ukraine?
All of this is connected.
The argument on the surface is that the U.S. is – or I should say NATO. It's trying to get a hold on energy prices in Europe.
Remember the riots in France over the price of petrol?
The problem is that Russia does not care of Western interests and is going to charge what they charge.
As the West has tried to negotiate better prices, Russia says, screw yourself.
They're going to work with China.
The argument is, and I don't know if they believe it, NATO wants to get energy prices down to allow rapid expansion in Europe to compete with the Chinese economic bloc.
And Russia is basically blocking that because they're the ones who are dominant with energy.
So when the U.S. tried going to Syria and say, we'll build our own pipeline then, Syria blocked them saying, no, because we're friends with Russia.
The U.S. was then like, well, then we have no choice because there's no, I should say NATO again, or the U.S., whatever.
We have no means of actually controlling prices and expanding the European economic block because you're barring our access.
And you're now going to try and undercut us by going to Iran and having them tap our gas field.
War.
And here we are now.
Syria's collapsed and Ukraine is at war.
And that's completely obvious to anybody who's been tracking what's been going on with this stuff going back 12 years or longer.
I remember back when it was, I think it was General, was it Wesley Clark?
He said there's seven countries we're going to overthrow and he started listing them off.
Libya and, you know, I think Syria is one of them.
And there's, Iran was one of them, I think.
And so I don't know how many of them have eventually been, have eventually collapsed.
But it is fascinating to me.
Going back to 2012, during the Arab Spring, I think it was 2012 when the Guardian reported this, and all of my friends, I had friends who were doing field reporting in Syria and Turkey on the issue, and they were basically saying, like, here's what's playing out.
Russia controls a quarter of the gas through Gazprom.
It's a pipeline that travels through Ukraine.
The West wants to control either Ukraine or get a pipeline in because then they can basically force Russia to drop their prices.
Sure enough...
We get the Maidan movement.
Sure enough, we end up in, what was it, 2021 when the war started?
unidentified
Yeah.
tim pool
Or was it 2022?
unidentified
Yep.
tim pool
Right when Biden gets back in, war kicks off.
And it's funny because in the period that Donald Trump was president, everything started calming down.
ISIS got obliterated.
Things were starting to stabilize.
Biden comes in.
Everything starts falling apart once again.
War erupts exactly where tons of people had predicted based on this energy issue.
Now, a lot of people don't believe it's true that they're trying to offset prices to compete with China because the West is particularly deferential to China.
And so it doesn't quite make sense that we need to compete with China when we've given over so much of our manufacturing and economic stability to China in the first place.
Then the question is, what exactly are these powerful governmental and corporate institutions actually doing?
No idea.
No idea.
On the surface, you can take a look at Gazprom, Ukraine, Burisma, Syria and all that and see how it lines up.
What the ultimate goal is, I don't know.
If we want to go Occam's Razor, then it really is simple.
The Nord Stream 2 pipeline was strengthening Russia's control of natural gas delivery into Europe.
Germany was basically saying, OK, Russia, we'll buy from you.
The U.S. was saying, Germany, how dare you?
Don't buy from them because that's empowering their economy and we're trying to shut this down.
So what happens?
According to, I think, Germany, they filed a lawsuit against a Ukrainian guy for blowing up the Nord Stream 2 pipeline.
When that happened...
The Western media was claiming Russia blew up their own gas pipeline by dropping a bomb in it, which made no sense.
unidentified
And then the working theory among people- They propped up Ukrainian that blew up- Exactly.
tim pool
People believe that it was actually CIA frogmen who went and blew up the Russian gas pipeline to limit Russia's ability to sell gas into Europe, which was strengthening their control and boosting their economy.
And this is another reason.
I mean, this is crazy.
Crimea, why did the U.S. want to secure Ukraine?
Shut down Russia and Crimea because it's their only warm water port, which gives them access from the Black Sea to the Mediterranean, where they deliver oil.
They have the Sevastopol Naval Station where their fleet is stationed.
The U.S. asking a Ukrainian guy to press the button.
The U.S. gave the weapons and the intel to blow up the Russian flagship.
Then you get these Democrats going, oh, come on, Russia has access to the Black Sea from other areas, not in Sevastopol.
It's like, sure, if they want to spend another $5 billion building a naval base.
Anyway.
unidentified
It makes no sense for them to have to.
To want to blow up their own pipeline.
Using that as the line of defense was laughable.
I don't think anybody could look at that and say, oh yeah, Russia would want to hurt themselves like that, so they would want to blow up the North Stream pipeline.
It made zero sense.
tim pool
Has any Democrat given a legitimate reason as to why Russia invaded Ukraine?
unidentified
No.
tim pool
They just say things like, oh, he's like Hitler and he wants to steal the land.
unidentified
That's the main narrative that they stick to.
One thing that whenever...
We helped install Zelensky after we removed the democratically elected president before Zelensky in Ukraine.
One thing that...
USAID money used their power to enforce with all of these new media agencies that are now funded by USAID in Ukraine, 9 out of 10, was that they are not allowed to air any Russian-talking people on the TVs in Ukraine, which is insane because a large percentage of the people in Ukraine speak Russian.
Just as much as they speak Ukrainian.
So that was one of the rules for them when they took over their media and told them how they could do it.
They used their money and power, USAID money, to tell them you cannot speak Russian on television.
tim pool
When I was in Kiev, everyone I met spoke Ukrainian and Russian.
ryan matta
When was this?
tim pool
This was end of 2013 and beginning of 2014. Wow, you were right there before the coup.
I was—that was the start.
It was the Euromaidan protests, and I got to see the top—the line of statue they ripped down.
And I ended up leaving, and then it was another crew that went in and actually went into Yanukovych's house.
It was crazy.
Yeah.
The overthrowing of this dude.
He fled to Russia.
But most of the people I met spoke Russian, and a handful spoke Ukrainian, Russian, and Polish.
I mean, my understanding is the languages are relatively similar, but in this area— You're bumping into a lot of these people.
But the Russian thing was interesting because what I was told that in the East, particularly like the Donbass region, everyone there spoke Russian primarily.
Though they could speak Ukrainian, their first language was Russian, and they interacted quite a bit across the border.
ryan matta
Well, let me ask you this.
What do you think would be a fair negotiation for a peace deal with Russia right now if Trump couldn't negotiate one?
tim pool
It's tough.
Russia should not have invaded.
The U.S. was using soft power.
And my view is international conflict is going to happen.
I know that kinetic war does happen.
But what the U.S. was doing was soft power.
And that's preferable to hot war.
So if the U.S. is basically saying we are going to fund special interests and Russia is getting mad about it and they're losing that fight, that's the fight I would prefer to have over people blowing each other up and Ukraine being turned into nuclear sludge.
That being said, I don't know the structure by which anything else could happen.
I don't think that there's one guy who's sitting there twirling his mustache and then doing the pinky thing saying, we're going to take Ukraine.
It's a bunch of different interests, and there's a probability.
If one guy says, we need cheaper energy, another guy says, we need cheaper energy, another guy says, we're being blocked by Ukraine.
It's not that one guy stands up and directs the armies to go and invade Ukraine.
It's that...
Special interests across the board start putting pressure in this area.
So again, I mean, it's complicated.
And that's what I'm trying to say is, probabilistically, what was happening in Ukraine with soft power was going to happen no matter what, whether the U.S. wanted it to or not, because all of the business interests, political interests of the West were aligned towards getting cheaper energy and were pissed off at Russia.
So it's a bad thing.
As to what should happen now, I wouldn't be opposed.
Personally, this means very little.
I am not an expert on the region, nor am I a politician, nor should I be.
But at this point, it should simply be the war is over.
That's just it.
Literally, the war stops.
Russia, you stop where you are.
Russia's going to secure a land bridge to Crimea.
The fact that Ukraine could join NATO means that the only real way that this stops is, well, there's a couple ways.
Russia is flattened and Putin is wiped out in hellfire.
Or the land bridge through the Donbass region, down through like Mary Pole and everything to Crimea is maintained and secured and becomes Russian.
The rest of Ukraine remains Ukraine.
But this means that Russia has no interest in moving beyond those borders because Crimea, where they have the Sevastopol port, which is like a like a like a near billion dollar port, is now firmly under their control.
If they don't the simple explanation for why they invaded.
First, let's go back to the seizure of Crimea.
How did they seize Crimea?
Literally, they walked out of the Safastable base and says, here we are.
We're in your territory.
So you can make the argument the referendum was fake and that the people there didn't actually vote in favor of Russia.
Maybe.
But the troops were already there.
It's not like they invaded Ukraine, stormed Crimea, and seized this territory.
They literally were there.
They want to stay there because they have infrastructure there.
They have their naval base.
They have...
I mean, look, if they lose Sevastopol, tons of their intel, technology, plans falls into the hands of NATO. They're never going to let that happen.
The only access they had to Crimea was an actual physically built bridge, which, of course, we saw was bombed by Ukrainian forces, NATO. So Russia is invading Ukraine principally to secure land access into Crimea.
They've taken it.
They now control that whole strip going down into Crimea as well as the physical bridge.
They don't need anything else.
If Trump negotiates, you keep that access.
The rest of Ukraine stays where it is.
There's no reason for any more fighting with Russia.
Russia will not need to advance.
They will have secure access to Crimea in their port.
The fighting's over.
If Trump comes in and says, we are going to repel you and push you out of this territory and restore Ukraine to its full sovereignty, Russia's going to say we won't lose Sevastopol.
It's not going to happen.
So I think the most likely scenario is the fighting just stops where it is and the current drawn borders stay where they are.
But again, it means very little coming for me and I have no idea.
unidentified
There's one aspect though that aside from the energy aspect, you have the bioweapons research labs that are in Ukraine that Victoria Nuland admitted to probably inadvertently accidentally in a hearing.
And Putin did not want that.
USAID-funded bioweapon research lab coming into his country and leaking viruses in the middle of – so we're two years into COVID when he finally invades Ukraine.
And he's brought this up several times when he's addressed why he's invaded Ukraine, and that was one of them.
ryan matta
Have you ever heard Jeffrey Sachs yet?
tim pool
Who?
ryan matta
Jeffrey Sachs.
tim pool
Let me pull this up and show you this map.
This is the current battle map of Ukraine.
Now, this area that looks like water, it's not water.
This is Ukrainian forces, military-controlled territories.
So this is...
The limit of the Ukrainian advance.
And so this does go, and you can see, into the curse creation of Russia.
That's where they began invading into Russian territory.
This strip right here is the most important element of the conflict.
So this is Crimea right here.
Let's go down.
And you've got Sevastopol.
And that's where Russia operates in the Black Sea, which they can go down to the Bosphorus, and then they get access to the Mediterranean.
That's where they can sell oil and fuel and other resources all across the Mediterranean, in and out.
If they lose this access, what do they have?
I guess the Caspian, what are they going to do?
Turkmenistan and Iran, I suppose.
But that cuts them off dramatically from North Africa and the rest of Europe.
So, what does Russia do?
They go in, and this is the territory they've claimed over the past several years.
They're not, there's some conflict, you know, Bryansk and Kursk.
And there was some incursions from those areas, plus Belarus is harboring weapons.
Don't forget you also have Kaliningrad over here, which is terrifying because it's a separate, it's a satellite state of Russia.
It is Russia, and it's bordered by Poland and the South, Lithuania and the North and the East.
This is what Russia wants.
I keep hearing from these Democrats that Russia wants to claim all of Ukraine and then invade Poland.
And I'm like, why?
No, no, no, like, honest question.
Like, you tell me that's the case, I say, okay, why would he do that?
Like, I'm not, it's not a gotcha.
I'm like, what is the motivation for doing it?
They've never given one because he's like Hitler and he thinks he should expand Russia and he wants to bring back the Soviet Union, blah, blah, blah.
And I'm like, uh-huh.
Well, then why did he just seize a land bridge?
This is what we call a land bridge.
It's a portion of land in Ukraine that stretches down and secures them, the Crimean Peninsula, which is where they have their naval base.
Some have then said, yeah, but Russia has other access to the Black Sea.
And I'm like, bro.
You're basically saying they should give up their naval base, which they've held for 100 years or whatever, rebuild a new one.
Not likely.
Not likely.
It's strategic.
Not if they have the opportunity.
It's clear that Ukraine is literally just NATO versus Russia.
I don't even think it's fair to call it a proxy war.
You can see some partisan fighting.
But this whole territory in red, that's controlled by Russia.
So that's the assessed Russian advance.
That's where they've stopped.
It's been years, and they've controlled this territory.
It's what they want.
So I think if Trump does come in, Putin said it's really hard to negotiate peace at this point.
I think it stops here.
And what is left of Ukraine stays Ukraine because there's literally, I mean, there's farmland.
I don't know that Russia is going to go and fight for that.
I could be wrong.
Vladimir Putin, maybe he is Hitler-esque and he wants to expand the glory of the former Soviet Union or whatever.
Maybe.
I have no idea.
But right now, this seems to be the most logical explanation for the invasion.
And it also lines up with what we think we know on the surface about the foreign policy over the past 20 years.
ryan matta
What do you think prevented, you know, Trump?
Ran his campaign on, I'll get the war in Ukraine ended before I even become president.
tim pool
I thought he would too.
I thought he would too.
ryan matta
What do you think was the determinant factor there?
What do you think prevented that from happening?
I definitely thought it was going to happen.
tim pool
I said this even a year or two ago, that the moment Trump gets elected, the fighting probably stops.
Not that the war is over, but that it puts a cessation of hostilities unofficially because Russia is concerned that Trump is insane.
And Ukraine's concerned that funding gets cut off.
So Ukraine's going to want to shore up their defensive positions as opposed to offensive.
However, I think the issue is it's, you know, the concern we had just before the election that I did, I did, I said this as well, that Biden has escalated the conflict so far intentionally so that Trump would have no means of negotiating an end of the conflict.
The attack on Russia, the invasion, the attack missile strikes into Bryansk and Kursk would put Russia in a position where they cannot allow anything other than conflict in those areas.
I mean, that is insane.
For what purpose did Ukraine decide they would start bombing the Kursk and Bryansk regions of Russia?
And that was an invasion to Russia.
Plus there were the drone terror strikes in Russia.
Attacking civilian targets.
There was that statue that blew up killing a blogger in Russia.
All of this escalating.
And I think the intention was Biden and the deep state knew they were going to lose this election.
Trump was going to take control, and they needed to make sure that they created so much damage that Putin would be forced to say, I'm sorry, Trump, but unless we get massive gains to accommodate what they've done, there's no end to this war.
Something that Trump can't necessarily negotiate, so I have no idea.
I think that may be it.
Maybe.
ryan matta
What happens to Zelensky?
tim pool
Nothing.
ryan matta
Nothing?
tim pool
Yeah, I mean, if the war ends, Zelensky is just the president.
ryan matta
Okay.
unidentified
Maybe he'd go back to acting.
I don't know.
He's got a pretty good acting job right now.
tim pool
He does.
ryan matta
He works from home, makes a lot of money.
tim pool
I'm pretty sure that Ukraine is just a vassal of NATO, of the U.S. 100%.
Yeah, they operate under interests.
They're using their elderly men and women to fight a war for American interests.
Now, to be fair, there's a lot of people, when I went there, the surface-level conflict...
For a lot of the protesters, and I'll stress this too, if you want to say USAID was funding the protests and all that stuff, maybe whatever.
But the people there genuinely wanted to join the EU. It was money.
The Schengen zone.
The people I had talked to were not paid by the government or anything like that.
Although activist organizations that do organizing, giving people like that money allows them not to work on other things and they can spend all their time making flyers and telling people where to be.
The average person that I met, they were basically saying, We have an opportunity to stay in the free trade with Russia, the Russia Trade Federation, or join the EU, NATO, and the Schengen Zone.
And if we join the Schengen Zone, it means that a poor Ukrainian who makes $400 a month on average can move to the UK and make $4,000 a month on average.
That sounds good to us.
The EU was concerned that if we open up our borders to Ukraine, they'll all just leave the country because their economy sucks.
So they told Ukraine, you have to develop your economy to a certain degree where people are making a certain amount of money before we can open the door.
There was a split in the East for people who supported Russia and didn't want to join the EU or NATO. But a lot of the people that I met in Kiev were saying, we remember what Russia did to us and were terrified of being a part of whatever it is they want to do.
Russia was saying, we have free trade with Ukraine.
Our products flow to and from your borders.
If you open up trade to the European Union, that means European goods will flood Ukraine and then flood Russia, and it will displace our economy and our manufacturing.
So they said to Ukraine, you have to decide.
Do you want to get cut off from the trade you already have right now to join the EU, or will you just say no to the EU deal?
Yanukovych the president was basically like, I think I can play this game.
The EU offered billions in loan guarantees.
Russia was saying, we'll give you guarantees.
And then finally, the U.S. was like, we're done negotiating.
Storm the castle.
Boot him out.
Russia was then like, that's it.
The soft power fight is over.
And we're about to lose access to our warm water port in the Black Sea.
So they started first with the referendum in Sevastopol to make sure that this was controlled by Russia.
But then the only thing that we put the map again, the only access they have to too much.
Look at this.
For Russia to get in to Crimea, it's a physical bridge that was built.
And Ukrainian forces bombed that, I think, a year or two ago.
So Russia said, we have to secure this entire region.
You've got Kherson, Zaporizhia, you've got Donetsk, and Luhansk, and yeah.
What am I missing?
I don't know.
And that's what they've taken, and it's fairly obvious that they can control their access to the Black Sea.
That's basically how it played out.
There's a lot more to it.
Obviously, it's very surface-level stuff.
But, you know, the way I see this operating, like, I was there right when it kicked off in 2013. And it's funny, too, because I was working for Vice at the time, and I saw the protest starting, and I told the higher-ups there, I was like, we're going to Kiev.
And they're like, what's happening?
And I said, take a look, showed them everything, and they were like, go there and get on the ground.
And so we went on the ground and started reporting on this.
And what I found was genuinely a lot of people hated Russia.
I got to interview a former Soviet general, and he was an old guy, and he was like, the Soviet Union was hell.
He was speaking all in Ukraine.
I don't know what he was saying.
But he was basically saying that Ukraine under the Soviet Union was a nightmare the entire time.
We are terrified of what Russia will do if they get administrative control.
I met tons of young people who were, you know, millennials saying...
My family tells the stories.
We grew up at the end of the Soviet Union.
We want to have nothing to do with this.
We want to join the EU. And Russia is like, OK, well, we're not losing this control.
So Russia was never going to back down.
The funny thing is, when all this stuff was happening, Russia is basically securing Crimea.
There was a huge scandal, whether the referendum was real or fake.
People in the West are like, it's fake.
It's not a real vote.
Trump gets elected.
It was over.
When I was in Ukraine, it was the Maidan protests.
And then you had the emergence of separatist movements in 2014, which people started referring to as the Ukrainian Civil War.
After Trump got elected, I went back to Ukraine, met up with some of my contacts in Kiev, and I said, so what's been going on with the Civil War?
No, no, no, no, there's no Civil War anymore.
And I said, there's no Civil War, it's over.
And they're like, well, it never really got to the point where we thought that would make sense.
So basically nobody says that.
It's just separatist fighters in the East now.
They want to join Russia.
So the Donbass region, Donetsk, etc., the argument was there were many people there that wanted to be a part of Russia but had mostly died down and wasn't that big of an issue when I was there.
It was wild.
I was like, wow.
Then, of course, Biden gets elected and boom!
Now it's full-scale warfare.
I believe that if Trump did not win in 2016, this war would have happened a decade earlier.
ryan matta
And it would have been a lot worse?
tim pool
I don't know about a lot worse.
It would be the same thing, I think.
But who knows?
I think...
You know, perhaps, because I think Trump wasn't supposed to win.
ryan matta
I agree.
tim pool
Hillary Clinton was projected and expected to win.
I actually wonder if when they came out and said Russia interfered in the election, I wonder if Russia actually did.
Not in the way they describe it, though, because they can't, but that there was some degree of cyber warfare that we are unaware of that screwed over whatever it is, the mechanism they had at play.
So when Hillary Clinton's furious with sunken eyes and bags being like, I was supposed to be president, like, Yeah, the intelligence agencies fully expected that she would be, and there was no reason Trump was going to win.
And then, not that Trump colluded with anybody, but there was a bigger game afoot that disrupted whatever it is they had planned.
I'm not saying I know that for sure.
I'm saying they were caught off guard when they lost.
unidentified
Well, the Russian election interference, I think, was like a predicate for a narrative for them to go in and start censoring on social media, censoring Americans on social media, blaming the Russians would allow them to get away with it.
Blaming anybody, any American citizen that was aiding or sharing Russian disinformation allowed them to go in and start censoring them as well.
And swaths, by using AI webs, they would go in and delete tens of thousands of tweets and social media messages by scanning it using AI, using any of these terms that they deemed as Russian disinformation.
So basically it was just a narrative to enforce that this surprise upset didn't happen again and to censor it to make sure it didn't.
tim pool
Yeah.
The war has to stop.
I mean, they're drafting young women now.
They're drafting elderly men.
ryan matta
Mentally disabled children, kids, teenagers.
tim pool
Yep, yep.
It's done.
I mean, it's remarkable when I talk to, like, liberals, and I'm just like, the war has been over for a long time.
I mean, obviously fighting is still happening.
There's partisan conflict because there are Ukrainians in occupied territory that don't want to be part of Russia or whatever.
But Russia has secured the region they've meant to secure.
Ukraine is now relying heavily on drafting...
Elderly people and women.
And when you get to the point where you're drafting women to fight...
I'm sorry.
I think you're...
Elderly men and women?
Yeah.
Yeah, you're in trouble.
unidentified
Forcing them to fight.
I mean, it's just awful.
Enlisting women to fight a war that should have ended.
It should have never began in 2022.
tim pool
But if if Kamala won, I I think the likely scenario we'd be facing is that there would be some kind of mass casualty event in a civilian population of Ukraine that would be blamed on Russia, resulting in NATO intervention directly out of some resulting in NATO intervention directly out of some kind of fear or or casus belly that Russia has now become a terror state or whatever, and they're killing civilians with Trump in office.
I think the likely outcome is that will not happen.
And Trump is going to negotiate a settlement where Ukraine loses a lot.
But who cares anyway?
And Russia takes what they took.
Like the idea that that the West is dumping hundreds of billions of dollars into Ukraine without explanation makes no sense.
catharine oneill gillihan
It's a pattern.
tim pool
I go to a liberal.
We have a liberal on the show, and I'm like, why are we in Ukraine?
And they're like, to help the Ukrainian people.
I'm like, who's that?
And why should we spend $200 billion for a country that's not an ally?
Not part of NATO. There's no answer.
The real answer, of course, is economic control of the region.
It's great farmland.
It's got, as I mentioned, gas prom, natural gas, all that stuff.
And, of course, cutting off Russia from the Black Sea, things like that.
There's no—it's remarkable to me that when they say, like, Putin wants to seize all of Ukraine and then take Poland, I'm like, bro, Putin is not a comic book villain.
unidentified
He's not sitting there being like, soon I will take all of the world.
tim pool
He's going, we need cheaper oil, and we have economic, you know, trade routes through these areas.
We're going to— There's reasons behind actions.
These people live in a world where Elon Musk is sitting there being like, I'm a billionaire and the richest man, and now I will own the president.
unidentified
Ha ha ha ha.
tim pool
No, he's not doing that.
Elon's playing Diablo and being like, they banned my comedy website.
These people are dicks.
And then so he's like, I'll show them.
There's motivations behind actions.
catharine oneill gillihan
Did you see that, I think Zelensky even said it, that Ukraine only received 76?
tim pool
Well, going back to USAID, remember the story where fake companies were being set up in Ukraine to build fortifications?
And they weren't real and the fortifications never got built.
So when Russia started attacking and Ukrainian forces were sent to NATO, whatever, they were like, hey, there's actually no fortifications here.
I thought we paid to have these built.
And the Ukrainians that took the money were nowhere to be found.
And many of them were fake.
unidentified
Thanks, USAID. Where did it go?
ryan matta
Monaco.
catharine oneill gillihan
Monaco?
tim pool
Yeah, maybe.
unidentified
Use it to buy the Russian yachts that were seized.
tim pool
I mean, look, I gotta be honest.
If I set up a fake company in eastern Ukraine to build fortifications and then funneled, you know, $100 million or $50 million to myself, an F1 racer in Monaco or a yacht, perhaps?
catharine oneill gillihan
Maybe it all went to Loudoun County.
tim pool
I mean, I would...
I'll say this.
I would bet everything I have that at least one penny of that money is in Loudoun County.
I would make a substantial bet that large sums of that money found its way to Loudoun County.
But, I mean, in all seriousness, it's not even just Loudoun.
I'd be willing to bet that a lot of the money that was spent on Ukraine, so when they spend money on Ukraine, they don't fly the money in pallets to Ukraine and hand money to people.
Although, in this instance, they were transferring money to fake companies in Ukraine, yeah.
They spend money in America.
For weapons manufacturing or resources or consulting or security.
So a lot of that money is here and has never left here.
And it's probably two guys in Loudoun County.
And one guy goes, I've got money for Ukraine from the government.
Here you go.
And then hands him a check or something.
And then the other guy in Loudoun says, I'll get my information and security networks on it.
That money never left the county.
ryan matta
So let me ask you this.
Do you think that Trump should order to have everybody in his cabinet investigated like Bukele did and try to eradicate all of this corruption on both sides of the party?
unidentified
Oh, yes.
tim pool
USAID should be criminally investigated.
ryan matta
Audited to the fullest.
And they should track every penny to every bank account, to every offshore bank account.
And I'm really curious to see how many government officials...
Like you were saying earlier, we have employees that worked at USAID and they would go to the State Department or they would go to Open Society.
And the girl that I interviewed that worked at USAID said that it was common knowledge.
It was like a revolving door.
They'd go do two years at this NGO and then they'd come back to the organization and they'd go two years.
And then another person I interviewed said that...
One of the whistleblowers that we had that was saying that he was in D.C. He took a temporary assignment from Border Patrol to D.C. And he was the man that was cutting the checks to the NGOs that were involved in the migration and cutting for the ones that dealt with the children.
And he's like, we were cutting $600 million no-bid contract checks to Jewish Family Services, to Lutheran Family Services, to Catholic Charities, and all these different organizations.
And he said, what we're seeing is a lot of government employees were...
All of a sudden leaving our government and going and starting an NGO and then months later that NGO is getting a no big contract for $10, $20, $30 million.
catharine oneill gillihan
That's exactly how it works.
unidentified
It works in the same way with the FDA and the CDC when they leave and they get these big cushy jobs at pharmaceutical companies.
Or they'll charge them consulting fees on how to get approval for the FDA. It's just one big money laundry.
tim pool
Lock them up.
catharine oneill gillihan
I think that Trump in his first term He installed a five-year lobbying ban.
Unfortunately, it was reversed when he left office.
unidentified
That's what I worry about.
Will all this be reversed again when Trump is gone?
That is a big concern.
catharine oneill gillihan
But I think his team should definitely look into writing some sort of ban.
If you've served at an agency, then you are prohibited from working at...
You know, an organization that receives funds from that agency.
ryan matta
Didn't Putin make NGOs illegal?
Didn't he ban NGOs?
They seem like they're just part of the problem, that we allow these organizations to start up and then they carry out the, they circumvent the Constitution and they're committing the crimes that we technically ban our government from committing.
catharine oneill gillihan
Right.
Well, and so I was on War Room yesterday and Steve Bannon played a clip of the president, I think it was the president of World Vision.
Which is a Christian organization.
And he was, of course, advocating against shutting down USAID because they receive lots and lots of money.
unidentified
The only people defending it are the people on the take.
catharine oneill gillihan
Of course.
But he was like, oh, well, you know, there are earmarks and the Congress, you know, the Congress writes earmarks for all these funds.
So of course it's tracked.
And I'm like, okay, then show us where it went.
It shouldn't be that hard if it was so organized and so tracked.
Then can you prove to where each penny?
Yeah, show us the receipts.
And they can't because you cannot track it after it leaves the door and goes to these NGOs.
They're supposed to report back, of course, but, you know.
tim pool
I think, do you guys know what the highest award in journalism is?
ryan matta
Walter?
tim pool
No.
unidentified
It's funded by USAID, isn't it?
tim pool
The highest award a journalist can receive?
You guys don't know?
unidentified
No.
tim pool
It's called the CIA assassination.
unidentified
Oh, yeah.
tim pool
Never heard that?
unidentified
Those are goals, right?
tim pool
Yeah.
You don't want a Pulitzer for doing good journalism.
You want it for being a shill for the machine.
The highest award, as the meme goes, when a journalist actually challenges the establishment, the government, or people in power, as we expect journalists to do, is who is that guy?
Who was a reporter who was tracking the crack epidemic and CIA ties, and then he shot himself twice in the head in an apparent suicide, they called it?
unidentified
Were you talking about the Octopus series?
tim pool
Well, I don't know about that.
unidentified
Yeah, who all got suicided in the 70s, 80s, and 90s, uncovering CIA corruption.
Gary Webb.
Yeah.
tim pool
Let's see.
Gary Webb was an investigative journalist who was, I believe he was, his Dark Alliance series.
And he was tracking crack cocaine origins in L.A. And apparently he committed suicide by shooting himself twice in the head.
And so the meme is the highest award in journalism is a CIA assassination or something like that.
My point in bringing that up is those things don't really happen.
And you take a look at our media apparatus and what do you find?
100% of journalists and corporate outlets are only reporting positive things about the machine state.
You can look to some outlets that have started to rise up in the digital era that have challenged the narrative, and they tend to be smaller.
Questions arise about how is it that Politico generates hundreds of millions of dollars per year?
I saw someone post about this.
They were like, with all due respect, Politico is a relatively new publication of limited readership.
Relative to some of the big publications, yet their revenue is comparable to some of these biggest newspapers in the world.
Then we uncover they have this professional Platinum Plus service.
That people just have to spend $10,000 a year on.
unidentified
Yul Roth had one of those.
I saw that in the Twitter files looking through his emails.
He got a daily Politico email subscription only delivered to his inbox every day.
So that kind of stuck out when I saw the Politico USAID thing coming out.
And then also Reuters got $9.1 million from the Department of Defense for social engineering and manipulation and deception.
That was the grant title from the DOD. News organizations.
Obviously.
tim pool
To put it simply.
unidentified
Propaganda.
tim pool
No, no, no, no.
They're intelligence.
They're private intelligence departments.
If Politico has such great intel, they can sell it to the government for thousands of dollars per person to the tune of a million dollars plus per year.
catharine oneill gillihan
Crazy.
tim pool
They're actually just private intel organizations.
Now, it's been stated quite a bit.
The saying, you know, 15 years ago was that you've got public intel and you've got private intel and news organizations are private intelligence gathering.
The argument was, though.
The public institutions are our security apparatus, and the private institutions sell intel to the public.
What we're largely seeing now, though, is these private companies realized governments are better customers.
And the fascinating thing is when the government is spending your money with no budget and they can deficit spend, you can charge them anything you want.
So when it comes to the greatest award in journalism, you don't really see it because these news organizations' best customers are governments.
It's not about the government.
See, what's happening is you've got people saying, like, the government is funding these news outlets.
Well, to a certain degree, some of them are getting direct funding from Congress.
Like, you know, I think NPR indirectly gets funding, PBS. What's happening is the government is buying insane subscription packages that seem to make no sense.
And that's giving a lot of money to these companies.
Call it a kickback.
Call it whatever you want.
If I were to sell anyone in this room...
A candy bar for $10,000, the IRS would come at me for saying, you're trying to evade taxes.
Candy bars don't cost $10,000.
But what if I said I handcrafted the candy bar and put gold on it?
That's basically what Politico and these other news organizations are doing.
So my joke was...
Become a member at TimCast.com for $1,000, and we'll put gold trim on the side of the website.
unidentified
Did you hear what one of the Doge guys did on his sub-stock?
He put, why I left my eight-figure salary job, and you had to subscribe in order to find out why he left.
I think he was like a 22-year-old.
Put the price tag at $10,000.
Somebody...
Paid it, and it was just a blank page, and there was nothing there.
It's like the ultimate troll move you could possibly do.
catharine oneill gillihan
By the way, I found...
This is the guy...
tim pool
You're not talking to the mic.
I can't hear you.
catharine oneill gillihan
Sorry, this is the guy that came into our office right here.
tim pool
Oh, you found him?
catharine oneill gillihan
Vlad.
Yeah, of course his name is Vlad.
tim pool
What's his full...
Can you say his full name?
catharine oneill gillihan
What is it?
Vladimir Gorchev.
Vladimir Gorchev, he's a member of parliament in Macedonia.
tim pool
And he came to the State Department begging the State Department to stop trying to overthrow his government.
catharine oneill gillihan
Yeah, prop up the party and overthrow, yeah.
tim pool
Prop up his opposition?
unidentified
Wow.
tim pool
It's real, man.
unidentified
So he just walked into the idea?
catharine oneill gillihan
Yeah, he met my boss at the National Prayer Breakfast because a lot of people come from all over the world that are Christian and other people.
tim pool
Wasn't the Trump admin basically like, yeah, okay.
What?
Trump does not seem like the kind of guy who wants to play those kinds of games.
That's more of a Hillary Clinton thing.
catharine oneill gillihan
Yeah, but the problem is that it was still controlled.
I mean, you think Mike Pompeo wanted to stop that stuff?
unidentified
No, Mike Pompeo was trying to hand out journalism awards to Assange.
catharine oneill gillihan
One of the people that he promoted, one of the careers that he promoted at the State Department testified against Trump in the Ukraine case.
tim pool
Oh, the Assange stuff is...
catharine oneill gillihan
The one that, my memory is so bad, it's been so long ago, but one of the senior members of the career Foreign Service that Pompeo promoted testified in the...
unidentified
I'm just so glad that Pompeo and Nikki Haley, neither one, he came out and announced one of the first things, that they do not have a place in his administration.
I thought he was going to go down that.
He kind of entertained the idea for a moment on the campaign trail, and I was like...
Are you kidding me?
tim pool
He banned Bolton from federal buildings.
He did.
unidentified
Yeah.
And another one that got banned from federal buildings, one of the ones I did an article for the Twitter files on was Natabakos.
You know that movie Zero Dark Thirty?
It was said to have been based loosely on her involvement with the CIA and overthrowing and all that.
She was directly reporting to Michael Murrell, who was a former CIA director, but she was working at Facebook and then she went to work at Twitter and was...
I'm helping censor the American people in her former CIA role.
And she sent an email to her, all of her CIA friends at Twitter, because there were so many, they had their own email list.
And she said, hey guys, just so you know, I know I was on the cover of the New York Post today for the 51 spies who lied.
Just wanted to give you a heads up that I'm aware of it, not to be alarmed.
Hopefully it will blow over.
And I'm like...
What email did I just read?
I have to read this again.
When I came across it, I'm like, oh my gosh, this is insane.
They're everywhere.
tim pool
The Assange stuff is, to anybody who is involved, Julian Assange was accused of insane sexual impropriety in Sweden, which to anybody, Richard was like, this makes no sense.
This is not real.
And the actual issue was that he was, and it's funny, like, why would the U.S. have jurisdiction over an Australian citizen?
Who was running a news publication?
I think it's pretty obvious.
So let's break down what WikiLeaks was doing.
WikiLeaks received information from sources and published it.
They would redact things that could...
unidentified
Sources that are dead now, by the way.
tim pool
Many.
But they would get information and they would redact things that were threats.
They would publish news stories.
They would put that out.
They even editorialized.
Famously, Colbert called out Assange for when the collateral murder video got released, he titled it Collateral Murder.
And Colbert says, this is not whistleblowing or leaking, this is editorialization.
And, you know, Assange pushed back a little bit and argued, but no, it's true.
Because WikiLeaks was a news publication not too dissimilar to anybody else.
Many of these corporate news outlets have their leaker drop boxes with encryption.
I think the only reason...
The charges got dropped and he got released during the Biden administration was that Julian Assange knows things.
He knows a lot.
And the reason why they raided the Ecuadorian embassy, in my opinion, is that Donald Trump, this is what I believe happened.
Trump sent envoys to the Ecuadorian embassy to talk with Assange and basically said, give us the information on who your source is and what you know about what the DNC and these people were doing, and we will let you go.
We will pardon you.
Assange said no, because he didn't want to compromise what WikiLeaks did for Donald Trump.
Trump said, then we'll do it the hard way.
Trump then wanted to have him extradited, brought to the U.S., where they could force him to reveal this information.
Biden, the administration, whoever was actually in charge, ultimately has Assange released because they were concerned that if Assange was still under lock and key at this point, Trump would get him and would get the information.
And if Assange was let go.
Trump would have no authority to be able to make that move against Assange to get any of this info.
unidentified
And there was a massive campaign from Australia across all their news networks and everything campaigning to free Assange, which I was really surprised by because the Australian media seemed so captured during the pandemic.
tim pool
But they still are.
unidentified
They absolutely are.
So it was crazy to see that campaign.
tim pool
Not for me.
At the time, I said they think Trump's going to win.
And if Trump wins, He gets Assange, and then he makes Assange spill the beans.
unidentified
They wanted to find out, I think, you know, the FBI is still stalling eight years later on releasing the laptop and phone data for Seth Rich.
tim pool
That's going to be big.
unidentified
Eight years.
The attorney that just went to try to get it released this time again was told there was another 30-day extension.
They've changed the prosecutors.
They've changed...
They have played this game to push this out, to not release this data for eight years.
It's absolutely insane.
tim pool
There was a Fox Business report early on.
This was published, NewsGuard certified, that Seth Rich was the source of the DNC email leaks.
unidentified
He was.
tim pool
And largely believed, the media has kept saying that's not true, it was a robbery gone wrong.
And one of the things that Trump was trying to get was on the record confirmation that it was Seth Rich who delivered the information to WikiLeaks.
According to one of the top WikiLeaks people, the DNC email leaks were delivered via a USB drive by a source in a park handing it off to him.
But the DNC and the corporate press argued Russia hacked it and sent it to WikiLeaks.
unidentified
Of course.
tim pool
If Trump was able to get Julian Assange to confirm that it actually came from a DNC insider, it would have upset the game like crazy.
My assumption is that Assange was concerned If WikiLeaks ever revealed a source's identity, it would destroy his life's work in the organization and the potential things they would do in the future.
So he didn't want to do it.
I don't know if I believe that to be true because the things they were doing to Assange, he could have ended by simply exposing them, but he didn't want to do it, which is weird for a guy who lives his life to expose malfeasance.
So I don't know for sure.
But I do believe the Biden admin ultimately got him out because they were concerned Trump was about to win.
And if he did...
unidentified
I broke this story last year, but someone that used to work with Assange's team did confirm to me that Seth Rich was the whistleblower.
And I had no idea that that was such a big scandal at the time when I broke that because I wasn't following it from the beginning and didn't follow the cover up and realize that it was supposed to be a big scandal.
My phone blew up and I got pressure from all these people I'd never heard of to come forward and reveal who I spoke to.
And I was like, well...
I'm not going to do that, but I would go under oath to say that this was what was said to me, but I can't tell you who my source is either.
So it's a constant circle jerk of protecting your sources, but also wanting to report what you know and what's been shared with you.
tim pool
Ladies and gentlemen, it's been a lot of fun.
This is a great conversation.
I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on anything, whatever.
I just read a lot, and foreign policy has been one of the biggest issues for me in a long time.
I've traveled to a lot of countries.
I've seen a lot of things.
So I'll just say, hey, look, man, maybe I'm wrong about a lot of this stuff.
But based on what I've read and the stuff that I've seen and experienced on the ground, these are my views as it pertains to Ukraine and USAID and all those things.
So fact check it all.
We're trying to navigate, investigate, and figure it all out.
So in the meantime, it's going to be amazing to see what happens tonight when USAID is effectively over.
And in the coming months, what that means for the rest of the world.
But I want to thank all of you guys for joining and hanging out.
If you guys want to shout anything out before we wrap up.
ryan matta
Thank you.
My name is Ryan Matta over on X at Ryan Matta Media.
I just released my new documentary that's on USAID and government-funded child trafficking.
I'd appreciate it if you check it out.
It's my pinned tweet.
Thanks, Tim.
unidentified
Thank you so much for having me, Tim.
I'm Lindsay Penny, formerly Texas Lindsay, and follow me on X. Thanks so much.
catharine oneill gillihan
I'm Catherine O'Neill Gillihan on Twitter.
I'm at Cath Gillihan, former State Department and USAID official.
But I also have a beef company, so check it out.
MeriwetherFarms.com, all natural, out of Wyoming.
It's really great stuff.
tim pool
Beef.
It's what's for dinner.
All right, everybody.
Thanks for hanging out.
We are back, of course, tonight at YouTube.com slash TimCastIRL.
Thank you all so much for hanging out.
We're going to have a lot of developments on all this news.
It's going to be fun.
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