Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Car Tax Debate00:06:22
unidentified
And former Tennessee Democratic Congressman Bart Gordon and former Indiana Republican Congressman Greg Pence discuss the government shutdown and ways to bridge political division and achieve consensus.
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Virginia's first and only scheduled 2025 gubernatorial debate featured former Democratic Congresswoman Abigail Spanberger and Republican Lieutenant Governor Winsom Earl Sears.
They sparred over the government shutdown, transgender women in schools, abortion limits, and marijuana policy.
Good evening and welcome to tonight's debate.
I'm Deanna Albrinton, anchor for WRIC in Richmond.
And I'm Tom Shadd, anchor at Wavy TV and Fox 43 here in Norfolk, Virginia.
We have a live audience watching along with you tonight.
You're able to watch the debate in every television market in every county in Virginia, from Roanoke to Norfolk and from Northern Virginia to Richmond.
But before we get to the questions, let's go over the rules.
You will each have 60 seconds to answer a question.
Rebuttals and follow-ups get 30 seconds.
Candidates, when time is up, you'll hear this bell.
Each candidate will also have 30 seconds for a closing statement.
And with that, thanks for joining us, candidates.
Ms. Earl Sears, you're first.
Tom.
Thank you, Deanna.
We want to begin tonight with a topic that may be the only thing that unites all residents of the Commonwealth of Virginia, the dreaded car tax.
Ms. Earl Sears, you have said that you will axe the car tax in your first year in office, but you will have to replace the revenue for local governments.
So how will you come up with just over $3 billion every year?
Yes, thank you for having me, and it's a wonderful time to be here this momentous occasion.
This is my former place that I actually represented, Norfolk State University.
So on the car tax, you know, we could have gotten rid of that this year because Governor Yunken put it in his budget that we could get rid of it, but unfortunately, the Democrats decided against that.
And so my opponent, she says she's going to get rid of it too.
But she's going to have to ask her side of the aisle how to do that.
So we had the money.
We can do it.
But really what I want to ask this first question is, Abigail, when are you going to take Jay Jones and say to him, you must leave the race?
He has said that he wants to murder his political opponent.
And not only that, but his political opponent's children, too.
Ms. Earl Sears.
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, we're going to get to that question in a moment, but first we're talking about the car tax.
It requires bringing people together, Democrats and Republicans, to put any and all possible paths forward on the table.
You are correct that we need to ensure that the loss of the car tax doesn't mean loss of funding to our public schools and to our farmers.
Ms. Earl Sears better clarified.
And so in working together, we will work to not only repeal this tax, which of course also requires a constitutional amendment, but ensure our community is available.
Well, I think as everybody knows, I'm a Christian.
I'm a Christian before I'm a Republican, and I'm required to forgive people.
And it's hard sometimes when somebody has abused you, etc., but it's something you must do because not to forgive is almost like, as someone said, you drink poison thinking that it's going to affect the other person.
And I want to live a decent life, and I don't want to not have peace in my life.
And so I, as I've said before, I would not say that.
So that's why I'm wondering why my opponent won't say beyond its abhorrent and disgusting why she won't say it is not okay and that he must leave the race because Jay Jones advocated the murder, Abigail, the murder of a man, a former speaker, as well as his children who were two years, two and five years old.
You have little girls.
Would it take him pulling the trigger?
Is that what would do it?
And then you would say he needs to get out of the race, Abigail.
You have nothing to say?
Abigail, what if he said it about your two children, your three children?
Is that when you would say he should get out of the race, Abigail?
You're running to be governor.
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, I know you're saying that you would not personally say this, but do you think still that there is that place for that kind of rhetoric, the example that we gave, even coming from others?
So I'm responsible for my behavior and what I've said, I've just said I wouldn't say that.
I would not speak that way.
Look, I'm from a third world country.
I was born in Jamaica.
And when I was 10 years old, I saw that kind of political violence, which is why I'm asking my opponent to please ask him to get out of the race, have some political courage.
What you have done is you are taking political calculations about your future as governor.
Well, as governor, you have to make hard choices, and that means telling Jay Jones to leave the race.
I have seen what it means when people are shot in the streets and thrown in the back of cars just for political purposes.
I don't want to see that in America.
America must never be that place.
And Abigail needs to say something.
unidentified
Marce Earl Sears, you're out of time there.
We do have one more follow-up question for you before we get to rebuttals.
One more question for you.
This is on the topic of endorsements.
President Trump has endorsed the Republican incumbent Attorney General.
Do you need Trump's endorsement to win the race in Virginia?
I think in her response to the question that you asked, my opponent proved my point, which is when violent rhetoric comes from her side of the aisle, she refuses to denounce it.
The statement that you read from President Donald Trump was violent rhetoric that she refuses to denounce.
And I wish she would stop using language like that.
But I am also glad that she began speaking about the issues of affordability because as we are talking about issues of affordability, I am the only candidate on stage who's put forth a plan to actually lower costs for Virginians.
Yes, we are moving on to the next topic with Tom on federal workers.
Thank you, Deanna.
It's been more than a week since federal lawmakers allowed the government to shut down with more than 150,000 government workers.
Virginia is facing the brunt of the impact.
So Ms. Earl Sears, knowing its impact on Virginia, if you were governor now, would you ask the president to use his power to work with Democrats to reopen the government?
So my opponent all summer long has been playing political football with federal workers by trying to say that she loves them more than anyone else.
Well, let me tell you what love looks like.
It looks like Abigail calling Senators Kane and Warner and telling them, go back, do your job, and vote against a government shutdown.
We only need eight, eight Democratic senators.
That's all we need.
And we cannot find eight.
And yet, and yet we can find two in Virginia.
When are you going to publicly say to Senators Kane and Warner, go and do your job and keep federal workers working?
That's the way you stop the shutdown because right now they're having to work and especially our military without any pay.
I'm a United States Marine veteran and it is definitely hard, especially in the enlisted ranks, to work without pay.
You can do something about that.
You're the one who's been talking about all that love.
Well, show love to keep them in their jobs.
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, the question, though, that I'm looking for, the answer to is, would you ask the president, if you were governor, to use his power to work with Democrats to reopen the government?
So the president has already said that he would do that.
But you know, before anything gets to the president, it's in the Senate right now.
The House Republicans have voted and it's in the Senate.
And all we need for it to get to the president so the shutdown stops is eight Senate Democrats.
That's just it.
Eight Senate Democrats.
And we cannot find any because they're playing political football as you have been, Abigail, all this time.
Love is a verb.
It's a show-me.
It's a doing.
Love is not a shutdown.
When are you going to ask Senators Kane and Warner to please keep federal workers working?
unidentified
All right, we're going to go to Ms. Spanberger next on this one.
Knowing the shutdown's impact on Virginia, if you were governor now, would you urge the two Democratic senators to vote to reopen the government until a deal can be worked out with Republicans?
Well, importantly, when I was in Congress, when I entered Congress, I entered during the longest government shutdown in history.
And two weeks into my time in Congress, I went to the White House.
I sat down in the situation room with a group of Democrats and Republicans and President Trump, urging him to come to the table, urging him to make a deal.
That is how we started the path towards ending the government shutdown with leadership from the president.
The current lieutenant governor has stood up for Virginia workers.
Because right now, at this moment, when Virginia's federal workforce and contractors and communities across the Commonwealth are suffering because of this government shutdown, it is only increasing the challenge that they are facing after months and months of the attacks from this White House under Doge.
The entirety of that time, my opponent has made light of federal workers losing their jobs, saying it's not a big deal.
Ms. Spanberger, time is up, but just to clarify, then you would not urge the two Democratic senators to work with Republicans to reopen the government.
To clarify, I would encourage everyone, our Democratic senators, our Democratic House members, our Republican House members, to work together and drive efforts to come back to the table.
Everyone from Virginia, the most impacted state in a time of shutdown, as our communities are suffering after months of Doge and attacks on our federal workforce.
Everyone in Virginia should be coming together and urging the president.
Ensuring Fair Share00:07:12
unidentified
We are going to move on to the next topic, which is data centers and my colleagues.
So data centers are coming to Virginia, and many localities want to welcome them.
And it's important that they pay their fair share.
And as governor, I will ensure that data centers pay their fair share.
But we have a challenge looking towards the future as it relates to our energy generation here in the Commonwealth.
We are the largest net importer of energy in the country.
And that requires real leadership in contending with what is an impending energy crisis.
And unfortunately, as we see an impending energy crisis, my opponent has supported efforts from the Trump administration to take millions and millions of dollars of energy investments away from Virginia.
This is all the while that energy costs continue to rise for Virginians.
That is why in my affordability plan, I laid out plans to reduce the cost of energy here in the Commonwealth.
unidentified
Ms. Spanberger, as a follow-up, you stated the data centers must pay their fair share.
So what does that look like exactly to you?
Are you committing that to Virginians not seeing more price hikes?
So importantly, there is currently an SCC case moving forward.
And so, pending the results of that case as it moves forward, it may require action within the General Assembly to ensure that large utility users like data centers are paying their fair share for the energy that they consume.
For anyone who wants to view the further plans that I have to reduce energy, it is at affordablevirginia.com.
unidentified
Thank you, Ms. Spanberger.
Ms. Earl Sears, what is your idea for offsetting the high costs of data centers, energy demands, and preventing additional rate hikes for Virginians?
So, the Virginia Clean Economy Act, when it was passed, every single Democrat voted for that.
Every single one.
And by the way, my opponent, Abigail Spanberger, has supported it.
Well, let me tell you what it did.
Speaking of no energy, it took 11,000 megawatts of power immediately off the grid, Abigail, without anything to substitute for it.
And all you want, again, is wind and solar.
Well, you know, it's that little thing called the, well, the technology revolution that's still happening.
And it's that little thing called the, well, industrial revolution that's still happening.
Businesses need power.
What are you going to do about that?
Well, let me tell you what we are doing.
We have started in the Southwest a micro-reactor program to see how we can bring energy to the southwest and make it a regional energy hub, as a matter of fact.
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, you're out of time, but I do want to follow up there.
So the question was, what is your plan for offsetting those high costs of data centers' energy demands?
What is your plan for making sure Virginians don't get stuck with the bills?
So what we need is an all-of-the-above approach to energy.
We need clean coal, we need oil, we need nuclear, we need natural gas, and we need, yes, renewables.
My opponent's only plan is solar and wind.
Well, what happens when the sun goes down?
unidentified
There is nothing.
Ms. Earl Sears, we do need to move on to the next question.
All right.
Thank you, Deanna.
We have a question tonight from a Norfolk State University student.
Let's listen.
Young people are leaving Virginia for more affordable housing and better job opportunities.
What initiatives or policies would you implement to make Virginia a more attractive place for young professionals to live, work, and build their future?
Ms. Earl Sears, we'll start with you.
How do you respond to the students' economic concerns?
Yes, so what we have done in Virginia, what we're continuing to do, is we're bringing jobs here because we want our children who are born here, raised here.
We want them to stay here and we want them to do very well because we want them to create generational wealth.
And a good education will do that.
But when the education happens, they also need the jobs.
And I don't know if you've been seeing, but we have created over 15,000 new business startups, never existed until we came into office.
New business, high-paying startups.
And then we have created, as I've said before, over 265,000 jobs.
And we have another 225,000 job openings right now.
And, you know, I was just with the governor, Governor Yunken, out in Charlottesville, where Afton Scientific announced 200 more jobs.
unidentified
Thank you very much.
And Ms. Spanberger, what economic policies or initiatives would you implement to make Virginia an attractive place for young professionals to live, work, and build their futures?
Importantly, I want to thank the students of Norfolk State for welcoming us to this campus, to the faculty and the administration.
Thank you for hosting this incredible event here.
And the young woman raised an incredibly important point, which is we attract people to our universities from across the country.
And we should want, and I do, and as governor, I will want to ensure that when they graduate, they will stay in Virginia to start a business, to start a family, and to start their career.
The challenges, though, that she mentioned are housing costs and affordability issues.
In fact, during the time that the lieutenant governor has been in office, the cost of buying a house has gone up 18 percent.
The cost of renting a house has gone up 14 percent with just an 11 percent increase even just this last year, the third highest in the whole country.
And my opponent so frequently talks about job creation.
Virginia has had seven months this year of rising unemployment.
The challenges are real, and Virginians need someone who will put Virginia first members.
Biological Safety Concerns00:15:20
unidentified
Okay, we had a very spirited debate on that.
Excuse me, Ms. Sears.
We've had a very spirited debate thus far, and now we're going to shift gears.
My colleague Deanna will take it from here.
Yes, we want to see where maybe there's some shared common ground.
Ms. Spanberger, what quality or qualities of your opponent do you admire?
I admire her faith that she puts into action through her time at the prison ministry that she frequently talks about, and I admire her service to our country, particularly as someone who chose to be an American and chose to serve.
I think those are admirable traits and, frankly, what makes our country and our Commonwealth a special place that people the world over come to our country to become Americans, to serve in the military and in elected office.
unidentified
Thank you, Ms. Spanberger.
Thank you.
A handshake.
Well, Ms. Earl Sears, with that, what quality or qualities of your opponent do you admire?
Yes, from what I've seen, I believe that she is a devoted mom.
I truly believe that.
And that she is a daughter who loves her parents very much.
And I do believe that she cares.
unidentified
Focusing on a K-12 school system, should transgender girls who are biological males be allowed to use girls' bathrooms and play on girls' sports teams?
On issues related to what's happening in our schools in each individual community, I think it's important that we have parents and teachers and administrators making decisions about their individual schools, not politicians.
And if we are talking about the safety of our children, I would ask why my opponent continues to support efforts to defund public safety, an effort carried on continually by this administration.
unidentified
Once again, the question was: should transgender girls who are biological males be allowed to use girls' bathrooms and play on girls' sports teams in K through 12?
My priority would be to ensure that local communities, importantly parents and teachers, educators, are able to work together to meet the unique needs of each school and each community.
Girls are informed.
And that is important.
And I say that as a mother of three daughters in Virginia Public Schools.
And as someone who used to investigate crimes against children, the way that we keep our children safe is by ensuring they are safe in schools, which includes funding law enforcement and public safety.
unidentified
But Ms. Spanberger, the question was, would you rescind the Yunkin administration policy requiring boys and girls to use bathrooms aligning with their biological sex?
And my answer is that in each local community, decisions should be made between parents and educators and teachers in each community.
It shouldn't be dictated by politicians.
unidentified
Please don't interrupt.
We're coming to you next.
Okay.
Thank you, Ms. Spanberger.
Ms. Earl Sears, you say that you do not support biological males identifying as females playing in girls' sports and have pledged to sign legislation restricting bathrooms by birth sex.
Does this position discriminate against transgender girls?
So we know that biological men are larger in strength than women.
We understand this.
This is biology.
If you look at football teams, you can see the difference between males and females.
This is not hard.
And that's why I'm asking my opponent, if your little girl comes home and said she was forced to undress in a locker room with a biological boy, what would you say?
She's crying.
What would you say?
Are you not going to answer?
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, now we're going to go to the opportunity for rebuttal now.
And Ms. Spanberger, we're going to start with you.
When the Dobbs decision was made, it was very quickly clear that state after state would move to restrict abortion access, as my opponent has previously supported.
In states where they further restricted abortion access, Ms. Earl Sears could be born.
Women pregnant very wanted children.
Women with ectopic pregnancies were sent home, and women have died.
If my opponent were to become governor, that is what she would inflict on.
Ms. Earl Sears, I have to follow up right now because it was difficult for me to hear Ms. Spanberger, and I need to make sure that I have clarity on her answer.
So just to be clear, are there any limits that you support in terms of abortion access, including for minors?
support the current laws within Virginia, which include limits on minors obtaining abortions, which include limits after the second trimester.
I support those the current laws here in the Commonwealth of Virginia, and that is what is leading forward as a constitutional amendment here in the Commonwealth of Virginia.
I used to work narcotics and money laundering cases.
I regularly worked on task force arrests and search warrants in partnership with the Board of Earl Sears and state police as a federal law enforcement officer.
Importantly, anytime there is a warrant, an arrest warrant, a search warrant to detain someone, absolutely local law enforcement, local resources should and must be employed.
That is why, as my opponent has somewhat erroneously said, I never, ever would support making Virginia providing any sort of sanctuary policies here because local and state law enforcement must always work for federal agencies when there is a warrant.
Importantly, what I have been talking about is, and anytime there is someone with any level of criminality, someone wanted for a criminal offense, absolutely that cooperation shouldn't just occur, but it must.
unidentified
Thank you, Ms. Spanberger.
Now, Ms. Earl Sears, you've said you support local law enforcement's involvement with ICE raids, but critics argue that in high immigrant communities, they're seeing fewer people reporting crimes and cooperating with police.
Now, are you concerned about those negative impacts to public safety?
She's accused me of murder, which is very interesting because the very person who spouted murder, you won't even say that they should get out of the race.
And now you're talking about this?
My goodness gracious.
We have found 4,000 illegals who are criminally here.
And the number three MS-13 gang leader here we found.
We have found communist Chinese gangs here.
We have found cartel members here.
And they're here because my opponent did not vote to shut down our borders.
And because of you and that vote, fentanyl came across the borders and killed five Virginians every week.
Where were you when we needed you for that vote?
And then out of your own mouth, Abigail, you have said the first thing you're going to do is to make Virginia a sanctuary state.
Ms. Earl Sears, your time is up, and the question was, are you concerned about people not being able to or not cooperating with police, those people who are here possibly illegally for fear of being deported?
That was the question we were looking for, the answer to that question.
As an immigrant to this great country, I understand that the first part of obeying the laws of the country is that we have to obey the laws of the country.
And we, I am focusing on those who are criminally illegally here.
And my opponent did not vote for the Lake and Riley Act, which simply said if you're criminally illegally here, murderers, rapists, pedophiles have to go back home.
unidentified
We're going to move on to the next topic, education with my colleague Deanna.
Thank you, Tom.
Now on the topic of education.
Educating children in the Commonwealth is a top issue for Virginia voters in this election, as it was four years ago.
Ms. Earl Sears, you have stated you want parents more involved in their children's education.
Would you include parents in designing school curriculum, or should that be left up to the educators?
Yes, so I absolutely believe that parents ought to be involved in their child's education.
You know, I am my child's first teacher, and I don't co-parent with the government.
And so that's why I strongly support parents being involved in education.
But you know who doesn't?
My opponent, Abigail Spanberger.
She had the opportunity to vote for the Parents' Rights Act, but she didn't.
It simply said this.
If the curriculum is being changed, then I need to know as a parent.
Abigail, why did you vote against parents on that?
And it also said, if my child is not on grade level, reading, writing, arithmetic, all of that by the third grade, then I, as a parent, needs to know.
Abigail voted against the parents knowing where their child was by the time they were on grade level.
Why would you do that?
Why are you voting against parents?
Why are you not voting for them?
Then she voted against the parents knowing whether there was violence in the schools.
Abigail, this is a simple question.
Why did you vote for that?
Why would you vote for parents not knowing if violence is being?
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, I have a follow-up question for you.
I'm specifically asking not just about general involvement in education, but about designing the school curriculum more specifically.
So is that something you believe parents should be involved in, or do you believe that educators should be taking the lead and it should be left up to them?
I'm a mother of three daughters in Virginia Public Schools.
And just this week, I have spent time at my daughter's school for a school event, and I have emailed with another one of my daughter's teachers about her ongoing work.
So she should be advised that I've had some of that communication.
But it is important that parents are involved every step of the way, as I have been.
With my ninth grade daughter, who is actually here with us in the audience.
It's because of communication from her teacher that I purchased the books that she'll be studying.
Parent engagement is extraordinarily important, and I support the strength of our public schools because public schools across Virginia provide opportunities.
They provide opportunities for students everywhere.
And unlike my opponent, I do not support defunding your public schools.
I do not support taking public dollars out of public schools, as my opponent has advocated for the entirety of the year.
unidentified
Ms. Earl Sears, we're not going to be able to get to as many topics if we keep having to give Ms. Spanberger time as you're intentional.
It's important that there be transparency in what is available on the market.
As a former federal agent who worked in narcotics cases, as a CIA officer who tracked transnational criminal organizations, as the only person on stage who's had bills signed into law by President Trump related to stopping the flow of fentanyl into each other.
As the only person on stage who's had a bill signed into law by President Trump restricting fentanyl flowing into our country and tightening our border security.
And as the only person on stage with the endorsement of the police benevolent association, it is extraordinarily important that we have transparency and that there is a clear market in order to be enforced because it is in the absence of an open and clear and extraordinarily transparent market that law enforcement is not able to do what you're saying.
unidentified
Ms. Spanberger, your time is up.
Now we'll go to Ms. Earl Sears on this issue.
The governor has twice vetoed bipartisan efforts to legalize a retail market for recreational cannabis.
Would you sign a bill legalizing the commercial sale of any cannabis products in Virginia?
And, you know, I saw how badly our children were not being educated.
And so I came back.
I said, somebody ought to do something, and I figured that was me.
So the governor and I, as I've said, we've created all of these wonderful jobs.
In fact, my opponent was before the State Chamber of Commerce and saying in January that she was running on the successes of all the businesses that we've been able to bring here.
Now she's suddenly running away from it.
unidentified
Just a quick follow-up, Ms. Earl Sears.
So is there one thing that you would do differently from Governor Yunkin?
I support all of the strategy, and I think advanced is extraordinarily important.
But importantly, places where I do differ.
Places where I differ would be on the fact that Virginia lost its place as the number one place for business, and we have had seven months of rising unemployment rates here in the Commonwealth of Virginia.
I would work to lower costs and grow our economy in the face of these challenges.
unidentified
Thank you, Ms. Spanberger.
We're moving on to our next question.
Yeah, we are winding down tonight, and we want to end with one fun question.
So, this will be, I think, something that will bring a smile to our faces tonight.
The mother of presidents is the state of Virginia.
When I served as a federal agent at CIA and then in Congress, I always endeavored to put Virginians first.
As governor, I will do the same thing.
I will always put Virginians first.
And importantly, at this time, when we are seeing attacks on Virginia's health care, Virginia's workforce, and the tariffs that are wreaking havoc on our communities, my opponent has not done the same, putting her allegiance to Donald Trump first, no matter the cost.
As governor, I will work to lower costs, protect our schools, strengthen our schools, and keep our public safety.
That is why Virginia's firefighters, police, Democrats, and Republicans are supporting every Trump.
We want to thank you both, Abigail Spanberger, and Winston Earl Sears, for joining us tonight.
Thank you for joining us on this debate stage.
One of you will be the first female governor of Virginia.
A reminder to voters: Election Day is November 4th.
Have a great night.
Our coverage of the U.S. Navy's 250th anniversary continues this evening with a Victory at Sea concert with actor and retired U.S. Marine Rob Riggle as master of ceremonies.
Performers include Patty LaBelle and the elite Marine Corps Band, among others.
Watch live coverage from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania at 7:30 p.m. Eastern on C-SPAN.
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