Coming up on Washington Journal this morning, your calls and comments live.
Then, all this week.
Good morning.
It's Monday, December 23rd.
Over the course of the campaign, President -elect Trump made numerous threats to investigate, prosecute, jail, or otherwise punish his perceived opponents, including private citizens.
A new poll asked respondents if they would support that.
So this morning, we're asking you.
Do you support or oppose President -elect Trump's targeting of political opponents?
Here's how to share your thoughts with us.
If you support Donald Trump's targeting of political opponents, call us on 202 -748 -8000.
If you're opposed to it, it's 202 -748 -8001.
You can send us a text to 202 -748 -8003, include your first name and your city state, and you can post to social media, facebook .com slash c -span and x at c -span wj.
Welcome to today's Washington Journal.
We'll start with that poll I mentioned.
It's from Monmouth University, and it's released December 12th.
And the headline is, Republicans would not be that bothered if Trump goes after political enemies.
Here's some of the findings from that poll.
48 % say President -elect Trump is, quote, serious.
About suspending laws and constitutional provisions to go after political enemies.
47 % believe the president -elect is exaggerating, so he won't actually do it.
23 % of Republicans would be bothered if president -elect Trump suspended laws and constitutional provisions to go after political enemies, so that's a little less than a quarter.
77 % of Democrats and 55 % of independents would be bothered.
We'll get more into those specifics, but let's hear from President -elect Trump.
This is from a week ago.
It's his first post -election news conference, and he promised more defamation suits against the media.
And you need a fair press, and the press is...
No, I see others.
I have a few others that I'm doing.
I'm going to, as an example, we're bringing...
I'm doing this not because I want to.
I'm doing this because I feel I have an obligation to.
I'm going to be bringing one against the people in Iowa, their newspaper, which had a very, very good pollster who got me right all the time.
And then just before the election, she said I was going to lose by three or four points, and it became the biggest story all over the world because I was going to win Iowa by 20 points.
The farmers loved me, and I loved the farmers.
And it was interesting the way she did it.
She brought it down two weeks before.
She said I was going to only win by four.
That was a big strike.
But that was good because she brought it down from, like, 22 points to four, or whatever the number was.
Way up.
Way up.
Easy win.
Never even thought to go there.
I respect them.
I love them.
And they understand there's no reason to go there because she brought it from way up, walk away, which it was.
And it turned out to be in the election, too, by the way.
It was a win by many, many points.
And then she brought it down very smartly to four a couple of weeks before.
And everyone said, wow, that's amazing.
He's only up by four points.
Then she brought it down to where it was down by three or four, whatever number she used.
And that was the Des Moines Register, and it was their parent.
And in my opinion, it was fraud, and it was election interference.
You know, she's gotten me right always.
She's a very good pollster.
She knows what she was doing.
And she then quit before.
And we'll probably be filing a major lawsuit against them today or tomorrow.
We're filing one on 60 Minutes, you know about that, where they took Kamala's answer, which was a crazy answer, a horrible answer.
And they took the whole answer out and they replaced it with something else she said later on in the interview, which wasn't a great answer, but it wasn't like the first one.
The first was grossly incompetent.
It was weird.
And that was fraud and election interference by their news magazine, a big part of CBS News.
So, as you know, we're involved in that one.
We're involved in one which has been going on for a while and very successfully against Bob Woodward, where he...
He didn't quote me properly from the tapes.
And then on top of everything else, he sold the tapes, which he wasn't allowed to do.
He could only use them for reporting purposes, not for sale purposes.
And he admits that.
And I think we'll be successful on that one.
And we have one very interestingly on Pulitzer, because reporters at The New York Times, Washington Post got Pulitzer Prizes for their Wonderful, accurate,
and highly professional reporting on the Russia, Russia, Russia hoax.
Well, it turned out to be a hoax, and they were exactly wrong.
I wonder what you think about the question of President -elect Trump targeting his political opponents.
Our lines are support and oppose.
Also want to make sure you know about this story that just broke this morning, and that is this.
Here's the Associated Press.
Biden gives life in prison.
To 37 of 40 federal death row inmates so Trump can't have them executed.
It says President Joe Biden announced on Monday, that's today, that he is commuting the sentences of 37 of the 40 people on federal death row, converting their punishments to life imprisonment just weeks before President -elect Donald Trump,
an outspoken proponent of expanding capital punishment, takes office.
We'll have more on that as the story continues.
But we will get back to our topic and take your calls.
Here's Anna up first on the line for support in North Carolina.
Hi, Anna.
Good morning, Mimi.
Morning.
I don't think it's really whether or not it's supporting him and going after political opponents.
My feeling is that if there's just cause to do so, then I think he should.
I'm kind of leaning towards, I've seen a lot of people targeting Trump for, you know, eight years, just brutally.
And I don't think the legacy media has treated him fairly.
You know, they do fact check on him, but like in the debate, they didn't do Kamala Harris.
I don't know.
I just feel like, you know, with that J6 hearing that they had, or not the hearing, but the whatever, the committee, the Nancy Pelosi hearing.
Yes, the January 6th committee hearings, yes.
And those documents that disappeared, they can't be found.
I mean, that needs to be investigated.
It's just, I don't know.
I just, I don't want to say, I don't think he's going targeting
You feel that that wasn't fair?
Like, for instance, National Security Advisor Michael Flynn
All right, Anna.
And this is Lily in Annapolis, Maryland.
Hi, Lily.
I want to let all of America know how Dan, I mean, it's just astounding to me that he got re -elected.
This man has proven himself to be nothing but a psychopath, a deranged, and for him to be allowed to continue and go after
So Lily, respond to Anna who said that he was targeted unfairly by Democrats.
What he did, I mean, there's going to be consequences for this kind of behavior.
It's astounding to me that people don't see that.
I mean, the way he has conducted himself over the years, I mean, just talk to the people who live in New York.
They know him like the back of their hand.
That's why he lost New York.
I mean, he is just, this is a man who needs...
All right, Lily.
Let's go to Houston, Texas, to Melba.
Melba, you support.
But yes, everyone has the right to defend himself and his name and her reputation.
And I think just this unfettered leash, unleashing of invective against him without any restraint or any fact checking, it's just not acceptable.
We have to stop that in America.
We just have to stop that.
It's so cool and we're better than that.
Would that be just for the media?
Everybody.
Do you think that...
Well, for the media especially, because they've finally gotten their comeuppance.
So here is...
They've finally been exposed to the bias, you know, unbalanced and unfair opinions that they have been putting forth here.
And I'm just hoping that they do better going forward, because they can't do any worse.
So here are some other targets, according to the Politico article.
President Joe Biden.
It said that Trump has frequently called Biden corrupt, and in June reposted a true social message that said he should be, quote, arrested for treason.
He said, this is his promise, quote, I will appoint a real special prosecutor to go after the most corrupt president in the history of the United States of America, Joe Biden, and the entire Biden crime family.
Do you agree with that, Melba?
All of the above.
And I hope he takes them to task.
All right.
And here is Marianne in San Rafael, California, opposed.
Good morning, Mimi.
Morning.
I really like how you kind of dig or go back and forth.
I hope you will with me, but of course I oppose people going after people.
This is not kindergarten we're going to throw down in the schoolyard or something.
But I'd like to point us and Mr. Trump back to some things that happened here in this country, like killing of Indigenous people, giving them blankets laced with smallpox,
breaking their tools so they couldn't exist out here.
The 49ers, you know, our great football team.
Well, the real 49ers went after the Indians and just killed innocent people, children.
It's related because I don't think this country is going to move forward in any way until we take care of The vile, horrible thing that this country was built on, the way that the violence,
and he comes from an alcoholic family.
His brother died in, I think, in his 40s, early 40s, of alcoholism, and I just think, you know, he must know that, I mean, I think the guy has a human bone in his body, I'm hoping,
because I'm not opposed to him completely, but yeah, I'm just hoping that...
Hoping for some healing out here.
We're in California and we have ours and then there's the Trail of Tears to Cherokee.
People had to walk 3 ,000 miles.
Try walking 13 miles.
It's just a wound that I think we can't get over.
One time you had the question on this show, is the American Dream still possible?
And I just don't think the American Dream is going to be possible until people really look at Alright, Marianne.
Let's talk to Rick next in Saratoga Springs, New York.
What do you think, Rick?
Oh, thanks for taking my call.
Well, the way I see it is, what 78 -year -old man who's the presumptive Republican nominee for President of the United States, who's never been arrested,
who's under four jurisdictions with 84 felonies?
That doesn't make sense.
They said the laptop was false.
Prior to the 20 election, they had 51 former CIA operatives say that it wasn't, and it was true.
They've done this over and over again.
So they said...
Hold on, Rick.
So those former intelligence professionals said that the laptop was in line with...
Wait a second.
And here you go again with C -SPAN leaning to the fact that you know the FBI had the laptop and you know they had access because they have high clearance.
You're right.
President -elect Trump has said that he wants to prosecute them as well.
So what do you think?
Go ahead.
I'll let you finish your topic, your comment.
Yes.
Leon Panetta went on Fox News and said that it's completely false.
He doesn't care.
It was still Russian disinformation.
And then if you look at it, Hunter Biden sitting with his father telling somebody that Unless you send us 5 million, we're going to wreak havoc on you.
Okay.
And here's what Politico is reporting about the 51 intelligence professionals who signed the letter about the Hunter Biden laptop.
It says this.
You could see that at Politico.
Here is Cal, New York City.
Cal, what do you think about the targeting of political opponents?
I suppose I was clearest in my mind about the attacks that he was having on journalists, on people in the media.
I think a lot of those are over exaggerated threats.
I think that as far as the media is concerned, I think his point is to just damage their credibility.
I think about the earlier hearings this year with Congress and how they were bra -beating the ...heads of these various universities for their supposedly anti -Semitic policies and how they were just browbeaten to the point that,
you know, their jobs were in risk.
Some of them, you know, a couple of them actually quit their positions.
I think for Trump the lawsuits are a scare tactic.
I think he would rather have, you know, these folks testify in public.
All right, Cal.
I want to bring something to your attention, also some breaking news.
The Matt Gaetz Ethics Report is expected to be released today.
CBS News says that Matt Gaetz Ethics Report says his drug use and sex with a minor violated state laws.
It says that the former representative of Florida Republican who briefly stood to become President -elect Donald Trump's nominee to be Attorney General.
Hello.
Can I start with a joke?
Okay.
What do you get when you cross a hummingbird with a doorbell?
What?
A humdinger.
Okay.
Mimi, you're a humdinger.
Okay, but let's get back to our topic.
What do you think of the targeting of political opponents?
Well, I think if they've done wrong against him, he should have his recourse.
I think it's being characterized a little incorrectly.
And I don't think this is one of the major problems right now.
I'm amazed that we don't have...
You haven't had any shows about the congressional report on January 6th and the two articles about Biden not being able to be president because of his mental acuity.
So I think those are way more important.
But I do think Mr. Trump, President Trump, does have the right.
All right, Bruce, and you mentioned January 6th.
We've got an interview on MSNBC.
This is New York Democrat Dan Goldman.
Oh, please, MSNBC.
I mean, come on, guys.
Well, we'll play some other stuff.
Don't worry.
We'll get it all there.
So this is Dan Goldman.
He played a role in President Trump's first impeachment trial, and he spoke about the threat against January 6th committee members.
Obviously, the January 6th Committee did an investigation that was authorized by Congress, upheld by courts of law.
It was totally legitimate, and it's part of their duties.
But just the fact that because Donald Trump does not like what happened means that those people should go to jail says everything that you need to know about what his expectation is for Kash Patel, for Pambadi,
for the Department of Justice.
And that's why they are there.
That's why Kash Patel is there, because he has also promised.
We're good.
I think?
Republicans will uphold their duty.
They will uphold their oath to the Constitution, not to Donald Trump.
And they will recognize that Cash Mattel is unqualified and dangerous and should not be the FBI director.
So, Congressman, quick follow -up.
I mean, you speak of political enemies of Donald Trump.
You served, of course, as lead counsel in the first impeachment trial of Trump when he was in office the last time.
Would you be considered a political enemy?
Are you fearful that you could potentially be targeted or prosecuted?
Well, I've been on lists, enemies' lists, and I guess that is a possibility.
I welcome that possibility.
I hope that they put their attention on me and not the good men and women who are career public servants in the federal government who are just doing their jobs and who are really subject to retribution.
I can happily and ably stand up for myself and I have a megaphone here in Congress.
I have the speech and debate clause defenses.
So yes, if he's going to attack his enemies, please bring it on Donald Trump.
And let's go back to the calls to Bertha in New Jersey.
Bertha, you're opposed.
Actually, my name is Eartha, like Eartha Kitt.
But I'm opposed to what the Democrats and the Republicans...
Now it's like getting petty.
Everybody is forgetting about actually the American people.
And that's what it's all about.
I don't hear anything about us, the American people, who are... are really basically suffering out here.
All I hear is revenge and back and forth.
And these same Democrats and Republicans are so beholden to the billionaire, to special interests.
And big pharma.
They don't really...
I don't see them really caring about us anymore.
I've been a Democrat all my life, and I'm so disappointed in them, and I've always been disappointed in the Republican Party.
And Fox News, the mainstream media, all of them, they're a disappointment, too, because they're getting off track.
It's all about the American people, not about what's going on.
And our education system, it begins there, and that has failed us, and I can tell by a lot of these comments.
The education system has failed us.
It's not equal and it never has been.
And that's all I have to say.
Happy holidays to you.
Happy holidays.
Kurt in Mount Union, Pennsylvania.
Good morning, Kurt.
Yes, Christmas.
Merry Christmas.
What I'd like to reflect on the wisdom of which is what is good for the goose is good for the gander.
Let's see if all these people can withstand the scrutiny that they put on him.
So, Kurt, I want to ask you something.
We got a text from Larry in Milford, Michigan, and he says, as a MAGA, I don't care how Trump goes after people he has grievances with with his own resources, but he should not use the Justice Department.
What do you think of that, Kurt?
I told you, Mimi, I said that what's good for the good for the gander.
They used it against scrutiny.
All right.
Let's go to...
Oh, sorry.
Ruben in Philadelphia, opposed.
Go ahead, Ruben.
An election official in Georgia warned President Trump that somebody was going to get hurt and violence is going to take place as he keeps an eye on these lies to be spread about him winning the election.
And on January the 6th, that actually happened when the police officer shot Ashley Babbitt and when they beat the police officer up and Brian Sicknick.
He was killed on that day.
And Donald Trump is still continuing these lies.
And why is MAGA allowing this to happen?
He just lied about the people in Ohio eating cats and dogs and the mayor said to come out and say, please, Mr. President, stop spreading these lies.
It is Donald Trump who is the opponent of this happening in America.
He's been doing it since he came down the gold escalator, promoting violence inside of his rallies.
It is Donald Trump and the people know this.
All right, Ruben, and this is a text we got from Larry in New Jersey.
The incoming administration needs to concentrate on the business of carrying on America's business, not his own.
And this is Ed from North Texas.
Trump administration should focus on criminals no matter what their title or background is.
This includes suing the media for false claims and all those getting kickbacks from false claims.
Also an investigation on how politicians like Liz Cheney
Here is a recent interview with President -elect Donald Trump's daughter -in -law, Lara Trump, responding to a question about what should happen to Liz Cheney.
She made these comments on Wednesday.
Here it is.
This thing from the very beginning has been a hot bunch of garbage.
The idea that they have tried to force this down the throats of the American people since January of 2021, they thought this was the ticket.
Look, they were desperate for anything to happen to make sure that Donald Trump never got back in the White House.
The moment they have been dreading, again, we're 35 days away from that moment right now.
I can't wait for it.
The country can't wait for it.
The world, quite frankly, can't wait for it.
But they said, you know what we'll do?
We will take this thing and we will blow it up out of proportion.
We'll ruin people's lives.
We'll throw people in jail regardless of whether or not they did anything.
We'll put people on no -fly lists.
We will make people admit We're good to go.
I think?
Anyone who did anything illegal ought to be held accountable and I'm not a legal expert or a legal scholar but I do know that when you break the law that means you go to jail and you serve time.
What they have perpetrated on the American people by way of this January 6th hoax is absolutely terrible and it is a stain on our country's history.
These people ought to be ashamed of themselves.
I know they aren't, so we'll go ahead and shame them.
We'll go ahead and make sure they never forget that history recalls every single day from now.
Wait till Donald Trump gets in there.
Wait till Kash Patel gets in there.
Wait till Tulsi Gabbard gets in there.
Wait till these people start shining a light in all the dark places that the Democrats and the establishment never wanted us to go.
Our question for this hour, for the next half hour of this segment is, do you support President -elect Trump's targeting of his political opponents?
The phone numbers are on your screen.
If you are in support of that, it's 202 -748 -8000.
If you're against that targeting, it's 202 -748 -8001.
And we'll talk to Peter in New York.
Good morning, Peter.
Good morning.
How are you today?
Good.
I'm against it because I do not want to see Donald Trump sink to the Democratic level.
I mean, if anybody can't see that those were politically motivated, it's hilarious.
It's also racially motivated.
Look at all the prosecutors and stuff that went after him.
This is, you know, it's sad that the Democrats have been doing this and now they're trying to turn it around.
I mean, if you watch MSBC, you know how crooked the Democrats are because you can listen to their lies.
Thank you for taking my call.
Kelly in Clemens, North Carolina.
Good morning, Kelly.
Good morning.
Merry Christmas, everybody.
And I support this because it's not what people are saying.
It's not that he will just be going after them because they don't like him.
These will be over...
Over actual laws that have been broken.
He will only go after people who have broken the law.
And the ones that they went after him, that was political.
That was exactly political, if you know the law.
And no, I'm not a lawyer, but I watch one a lot.
That does show me what was correct and what wasn't correct.
But these people, you're going to find out, it's all going to be exposed.
And you will find out that a lot of our government, a lot on both sides, on Republican and Democrat,
that they have been involved with Diddy.
People he likes like who?
Alright.
And here is Denise in Freedom, New York.
Good morning, Denise.
Good morning.
I'm asking that you bring up the interview with him with Leslie Stahl where she, right before the election, said that the laptop was false.
Show people that.
I think that he has every right to go after people that It's fraud what they did.
The White House working with the mainstream media is the biggest fraud on the American people, and it started with the Russia collusion.
For three years, we dealt with that.
But bring up the Leslie Stahl interview.
Show how she treated the sitting president of the United States.
She should be...
He should go after her.
This is an article from NBC News that says this.
Kash Patel, so he's the nominee to be the FBI director.
It says, Kash Patel once said he would come after journalists.
It now hangs over his FBI candidacy.
It says, Trump's pick for FBI director has vowed to come after the media.
But he also later emphasized to NBC News that his comments apply only if people broke the law.
That's at NBC News.
It says, This is his quote.
We're going to come after the people in the media who lied about American citizens, who helped Joe Biden rig presidential elections.
And whether it's criminally or civilly, we'll figure that out.
And Democratic Senator John Fetterman was a guest on Sundays this week on ABC, and he talked about meeting FBI Director -Nominee Kash Patel.
Here he is.
You met with Kash Patel, I believe, right?
Yesterday, well, yes.
He's talked about going after Trump's enemies.
Yeah, and we've had conversations, but all of these interviews were all off the record and those things.
So I'm not going to go into detail, but he absolutely is that that's never going to happen.
He's not going to use the FBI to go after Trump's enemies.
Did you believe him?
He's written a lot.
And let's talk to Danny in Wildwood, Georgia.
Good morning, Danny.
It's amazing to me that everybody's got a crystal ball that knows what Trump's going to do.
I'm sorry, but none of us know what he's going to do.
So let's don't jump to too many conclusions and let's see what he does.
And let's go from there.
I was a born registered Democrat ever since I could vote up to, you know, two or three cycles ago.
I started out conservative and I started voting that way.
I live in the very northwest corner of Georgia.
Most of us were Democrats, now we're Republicans.
But give him a chance.
I don't understand.
Hunter Biden, we know what he did.
It's not a secret.
The people of this country are not stupid.
That's the problem.
I am, I guess, a lower middle class person.
Make about $40 ,000, $50 ,000 a year.
That's really no money.
I know what's going on.
And people in my county know what's going on.
And you talk about election stuff, you know, they add on the TV, there was never any, not one election thing wrong.
I live in a county of 16 ,000 people, 10 ,000 voters.
I know three personal people that election fraud was on.
I know one man that had been dead five years that voted, and he had already registered to vote in the runoff.
This is facts.
This is not somebody in a little town in Trenton, Georgia, with 10 ,000 voters.
And so, you know, you don't think stuff happened in the rest of the country?
Don't be naive.
Come on, we're smarter than that.
We're smarter than that.
Even a person like me, with a one -year college education, no degree, I'm smarter than that.
And the people in these counties where I live in North Georgia, This is ABC News that says this.
Trump backs House GOP accusation Liz Cheney tampered with January 6th committee.
She called the allegations malicious, cowardly assault on the truth.
It says that Republican Representative Barry Loudermilk, chairman of the House administration's subcommittee on oversight.
In a new report suggests that former GOP Representative Liz Cheney should be investigated for alleged criminal witness tampering, claiming she played an integral role in shaping key witness testimony before the January 6th committee investigating the attack on the U .S. Capitol by a pro -Trump mob.
President Donald Trump posted early Wednesday morning on his social media platform, quote, Liz Cheney could be in a lot of trouble based on the evidence obtained by the subcommittee,
which states that numerous federal laws were likely broken by Liz Cheney, and these violations should be investigated by the FBI.
Well, Liz Cheney put out a statement.
Here's a portion of that.
She says this.
Chairman Loudermilk's interim report intentionally disregards the truth and the select committee's tremendous weight of evidence.
Here's Charles in Virginia.
Hi Charles, what do you think?
Hey, good morning.
Thanks for taking my call.
Good morning.
Let me turn this down.
I, uh, I'm just, um, I just, as I was sitting here waiting, I'm just, I was just, word came to me.
And that is that, uh, for all the so -called Christians in this country, certainly believe in God.
And I've heard a few people come and call in this morning about how they trust in God and put and pray for and glad that Trump is in office because God ordered.
I just want to say, God does not like folks to take revenge.
And the word came to me is that vengeance is mine, says the Lord.
So for a president to take vengeful acts against people who investigated the truth on January the 6th,
I just think it's appalling if all of these folks who honor and worship This incoming president, it just speaks to who America really is as far as I'm concerned.
And I still go back to one question.
When he made the Hollywood, when the Hollywood tape came out whereby he could touch anybody's vagina because he's famous, so on and so forth, and he can get away with it because he's famous.
All these women and men who love Donald Trump so much, if he could touch your daughters, your mamas, your sisters.
And let's go to Kendall, New York.
This is Teresa.
Teresa, what do you think?
Should Donald Trump target his political opponents?
Good morning.
I'm a little torn on this.
I do believe what the gentleman before said about vengeance is nice, but also I believe that it has got to shine the light, you know, and he uses who he wants to.
I do also know the cat is the cat of justice.
And I think that me and the American people are crying out for justice because a great injustice has been done by the ones that hold a great responsibility to the American people through the media and through,
you know, through the media and through, you know, the government.
It's just, especially the Democrats, but also some Republicans, you know, whoever is guilty.
I think that they should pay because no one is above the law.
You know, so, I mean, that's my opinion.
And this is Gary Alam on X who says, Trump will repeat the last administration on political interference since this is now the political normal.
And Richard in Las Vegas texted, this isn't about revenge, it's about telling the truth.
And John in Waverly, Pennsylvania, Turnabout is fair play.
As Democrats like to remind us, nobody is above the law.
Jonathan in Waynesville, Ohio.
Jonathan, you're opposed.
Yes, I'm opposed.
I mean, Liz Cheney called him out.
He's a crybaby, first of all.
And she called him out.
And the deal is, is he got called out for all of his BS.
So, Jonathan, you said he's liable for rape.
He's actually liable for sexual abuse.
And that's something that got...
Well, so, yeah, I followed some of it.
But it boils down to that he's liable.
Well, he's liable for that.
Fine.
Whatever he was liable in the court of law, that's what he's liable in the court of law.
He's 34, convicted felon here.
I mean, wake up to this.
I mean, and American people just think that, I don't know, it's brainwashing to me, you know?
And somebody stayed in here with another opinion, I'm sure.
My girlfriend here.
But it's, she called him out on it.
That's the whole point.
And 34 convictions.
Yeah, we got that point.
This is a recent interview about the Des Moines Register Iowa poll.
You remember President -elect Trump talked about that in a previous clip that I showed you.
This is pollster Ann Seltzer, and she talked about her findings versus the end results and the accusations that came out of that.
This was recorded before Donald Trump filed his lawsuit against the Des Moines Register.
Here she is.
The reality is that more people supporting Donald Trump turned out.
I'm eagerly awaiting the Secretary of State's turnout reports that will happen in January to see what we can glean from that.
But there wasn't an adjustment to my data when we saw that it was going to be a shocker that I would have said, "Okay, let's adjust it." It's not like I know ahead of time what the right numbers are.
So you kind of take the data designed to reveal to me our best shot at what the future is going to look like.
I'm mystified about what the motivation anybody thinks I had and would act on in such a public poll.
I don't understand it.
And the allegations I take very seriously.
They're saying that this was election interference, which is a crime.
So the idea that I intentionally set up to deliver this response, when I've never done that before, I've had plenty of opportunities to do it, it's not my ethic,
but to suggest without a single shred of evidence that I was in cahoots with somebody, I was being paid by somebody, it's all just kind of, it's hard to pay too much attention to it,
except that they're accusing me of a crime.
I want to know what you think about that.
And this is Kurt in Browns Mills, New Jersey.
Kurt, are you supporting this?
Yes, I am.
Good morning.
Speaking for myself, this story is seven years late.
I mean, if it really mattered.
Throwing bombs at this point is kind of stupid.
But the truth is, now it says that Donald Trump, now he's a better man than me, I'm thinking.
I'd like to read this.
If your enemies are hungry, give them food to eat.
If they are thirsty, give them water to drink.
You will heap burning coals of shame on their heads, and the Lord will reward you.
So I think Trump said that his success will be his vengeance.
So I think he's a better man than me.
But the truth is, I'd love to see Joe Biden actually answer questions in the court of law.
Well, I'm telling you what he said.
I believe that no one's above the law and uh, if you have nothing, if you've done nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about.
But I believe everything is on its head and the justice system has been corrupted since they spied on Trump and even who knows.
It goes on and on, but the truth is they will never be brought to justice because they plead dementia.
These days, if you watch these people that are in power, they get in front of the and On the line for oppose,
this is Nicholasville, Kentucky.
Eric, you're next.
Good morning.
I think most people, especially Republicans, are missing a very big point here, which is Trump wants to go after people who investigated an incident that we all witnessed.
And most of the witnesses who testified on January 6th were people from his administration.
A lot of them, people he appointed himself.
And those are some of the people that he wants to go after too.
So this isn't about Democrats or anything Democrats are trying to do to Trump.
Trump is going after anybody that has anything negative to say about him or expose about him and that has been primarily people he has appointed himself even when it comes to him complaining about rulings about by judges many of those judges have been judges he's appointed so Eric,
you talked about January 6th, and I want to ask you about this.
This is in Politico about the people that Trump has said he wants to prosecute.
And one of them is U .S. Capitol Police Lieutenant Michael Byrd.
It says Trump has joined with his supporters, some of whom took part in the January 6th, 2021 Capitol riot, to call for the prosecution of Byrd, the U .S. Capitol Police officer who shot and killed rioter Ashley Babbitt as she attempted to breach.
You look at those videos of January 6th.
If those were Democrats, what would Republicans be saying right now?
Alright, and this is Julie in Rhode Island on the line for supporting.
They tried to put him in jail.
They tried to bankrupt him.
He even got shot.
And January 6th is not an insurrection.
Nobody got put in jail for that.
And I watched this woman and her husband was military.
They went to her house to come for her husband who was at the Capitol but didn't go in the Capitol.
Eight of the.
I believe he should be brought to justice because He
shot her in cold blood.
Thank you.
Joan in Elkins Park, Pennsylvania.
Good morning, Joan.
Good morning.
I don't know what's wrong with these crazy women that are supporting Trump.
The man said he could grab women's crotches.
He assaulted a woman in a department store.
He's a twice impeached president.
He's a liar.
He incited an insurrection.
What the hell is wrong with people?
This country is pathetic at this point.
To have these bunch of people trying to make excuses for this man that is the worst president that ever got to the White House, and they voted to put his behind in there again.
Hopefully, they get what they deserve.
Because this man is the worst thing that ever happened to the United States of America.
And that's all I have to say.
Thank you for listening.
Goodbye.
I don't necessarily support the way that you're terming support.
However, justice, in fact, is part of our Constitution.
It's a big part of our country and our founding fathers put it in to the Constitution to try and maintain a little bit of civility in this country.
You know, okay, let's look back for one example.
First example, Adam Schiff.
Okay, it's a good thing Mr. Trump decided to have that call recorded by the archives.
Because that guy went out in front of the general public and made up the entire story.
He declared what was said on that conversation was all lies.
And so if you look at the mischief that's been going on in the background nonstop, what's your definition of support?
How about let's change that definition like the Democrats like to do.
Let's change it to justice.
You know, the fact of the matter is...
Wait, wait, but Brian, I'm not following what you were saying about Adam Schiff and the conversation.
Tell me more about that.
There's a phone conversation between him and who?
Adam Schiff came out in front of the entire world and declared that Trump had an unjust phone call.
He told the world this is what he said.
Which phone call are you talking about?
About Ukraine?
About the one where he asked for...
An investigation of Hunter Biden?
Well, yeah, where he's asking about Joe Biden saying, son of a you -know -what, you've got to fire this guy, and there's some political nonsense going on with the taxpayer money being held hostage over bureaucratic politics in another country.
Okay, so he makes a phone call to Zelensky, and unfortunately...
I'm still not clear.
Brian, you're saying that there was, so the audio was never released of that phone call with Zielinski, but the transcript was released, but I don't think it was the complete transcript.
Is that what you're talking about?
Yes, ma 'am.
It was documented by a different source, the Intelligence Committee that Adam Schiff sits on was part of, okay?
So they did it as a safety net to understand that.
These guys have no interest in furthering the United States as a whole.
They want to in any way maintain control in some capacity, even to the point of lying in front of the world about a conversation.
And then they attempted to impeach him.
Don't forget millions of dollars.
That was twice.
And Ethel is in Shreveport Louisiana, on the line for opposed.
Hi Ethel.
Good morning, Mimi.
I have a couple of points that I like to uh Bring to the forefront.
Number one,
Donald Trump has an issue with anyone at any time.
First of all, it was Dr. Fauci.
He was considered an outcast because of the COVID.
Then he chose to, I'm sorry, back up.
First, it was Obama.
Obama didn't have a birth certificate.
He badgered Obama and his family about his birth certificate.
Then Dr. Fauci.
Then he has used the news media as a way to keep his name in the public eye and on everyone's mind.
The news media have made an obsession with Donald Trump.
We're good to go.
Other politicians, past and present, as opposed to talking about the American people, don't buy into the unnecessary falsehoods of Donald Trump coming into 2025.
And I would hope that you all would give more constructive...
And Randy in Millington, Michigan, by text, I don't agree with targeting political opponents.
I hope all these people that think it's all right to start targeting political opponents feel the same way when the political party in charge changes to a different political party.
And Rob in Fairfax, Virginia, amen to the caller Anna from North Carolina.
It is not targeting political opponents.
It is about equal justice under the law.
Caller from Maryland, Trump derangement syndrome on full display.
And that's the time we've got, but we've got a lot more time later in the program for Taking your calls.
Coming up next, we continue with this week's holiday author series on Washington Journal.
Eight days of conversations with America's top writers from across the political spectrum on a variety of public policy and political topics.
We'll talk today with Batia Unger Sargon, an opinion editor at Newsweek, to discuss her book called Second Class, How the Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women.
Plus, your phone calls.
We'll be right back.
We're good to go.
I think?
We're good to go.
Starting at 9 p .m. Eastern on C -SPAN.
C -SPAN Now, our free mobile video app or online at c -span .org.
Witness democracy in action with C -SPAN.
Experience history as it unfolds with C -SPAN's live coverage this January.
As Republicans take control of both chambers of Congress and a new chapter begins with the swearing in of the 47th President of the United States.
On Friday, January 3rd, don't miss the opening day of the 119th Congress.
Watch the election of the House Speaker, the swearing in of new members of Congress and the Senate, and the first day of leadership for South Dakota's John Thune as the new Senate Majority Leader.
On Monday, January 6th, live from the House Chamber, Witness Vice President Kamala Harris preside over the certification of the Electoral College vote.
We're good to go.
Welcome back.
It's Washington Journal's annual Holiday Authors Week series and it continues this morning.
Eight days of conversations with America's top writers from across the political spectrum on a variety of public policy and political topics.
Today we have Batia Ungar Sargon, an opinion editor at Newsweek, and her book is called Second Class, How the Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women.
Batia, welcome to the program.
Thank you so much for having me.
It is so great to be here with you and all of your viewers.
So from the title of your book, how are you defining elites?
So one of the things that academics, sociologists, anthropologists, people who study America from a data point of view have noticed over the last few decades is that this country that was founded on the idea of classlessness,
on the idea that every person should have equal access to the American dream, has increasingly become divided.
By class, and what I mean by that is, if you have a college degree, you are increasingly likely to become a homeowner, to have children who are.
Have that passed on to them the privilege of the American dream to be able to afford an education for your children, to be able to afford adequate health care.
You live longer, you make, on average, about a million more dollars over the course of your career than people without a college degree and, in general this, This idea of the American dream, has become something that only people with a college degree have access to.
And meanwhile, people without a college degree are increasingly facing things like deaths of despair by suicide, by overdose, by alcoholism.
They are less likely to be homeowners.
Their children are downwardly mobile.
And so this class divide has really opened up in America, separating out the haves from the have -nots along class lines.
So I would define elite as anybody who's working in a job that requires skills that they learned in college who are in the top 20%.
So that's making more than $135 ,000 a year.
And then how would you say that this group, the elites as you called them, have betrayed the working class?
What do you think they did to the working class?
Well, basically, over the last 60 years, since 1971, which was the high watermark for working class wages, after which they began to stagnate and then decline when you factor in inflation,
we have put into place policy that was an Upward transfer of wealth from people who work with their hands for a living to people who are in that top 20 % who work in jobs that require skills that you learn in college.
Those policies took money from our working class neighbors and put them in the pockets of people who are in that elite.
And those policies include things like NAFTA, which shipped 5 million very good paying working class jobs overseas to China.
We imported millions and millions and millions of low -wage workers to compete with the jobs that remained here, further driving down the wages of the working class,
but putting those savings in the pockets of people who hire working class.
All of these things were policies that
And do you think this betrayal was one party over the other?
Or do you think both political parties are to blame for this?
I think that there was a handshake agreement between the elites on both sides.
However, those three policies that I named were enacted by Democratic administrations.
So, while the Republicans, We're good to go.
We're good to go.
I think?
I want to play for you independent Senator Bernie Sanders.
He was on CNN and he talked about his thoughts on how the Democratic Party has abandoned the working class.
Take a look and then I'll get you your reaction.
Raising the minimum wage to a living wage.
On Tuesday, in the election, in the state of Missouri, a conservative state, they became one of the many states that voted, I think, 58 % to raise the minimum wage.
Now, how is it that in Congress and the Senate, we haven't even brought a damn minimum wage bill onto the floor?
We are the only major country on Earth not to guarantee health care to all people as a human right.
The Affordable Care Act is a stopgap measure.
It is not addressing the real healthcare crisis in America.
Why aren't we saying, yes, healthcare is a human right.
We're going to take on the insurance companies and the drug companies.
We're going to pass the PRO Act to make it easier for workers to join unions.
We're going to expand Social Security by lifting it up.
We're going to demand that the billionaires start paying their fair share of taxes.
You know, Dana, all of these issues that I'm talking about, these are not Bernie Sanders' ideas.
These are, without exception, popular ideas that Democrats, Republicans, and independents support.
Now, the people who don't support it is the billionaire class, and they've got a lot of power.
But we've got to be prepared to take them on.
Batia, your reaction to that?
First of all, I just have to commend Senator Sanders for even speaking in this way.
The rage that he feels about how working class Americans are treated in this country, I feel it too.
I think a lot of them feel it.
So just huge kudos to him for speaking up on the issue.
The solutions he proposes are not the solutions that I found when I was traveling around the country and interviewing hundreds of working class people that they want.
And what I mean by that is Bernie Sanders is the perfect example of the good faith - his answer is let's raise taxes on the rich take that money And give things to working class people.
That's not what working class people want.
What they actually want is something Senator Sanders talked about in 2015 when he was asked by Ezra Klein, shouldn't you support open borders if you care so much about the poor?
What about the global poor?
To which Senator Sanders said, Open borders?
That's a Koch brothers proposal.
They would love to bring in people to work two, three dollars an hour and compete with the American working class.
I don't believe in any of that.
That is the kind of solution that Senator Sanders no longer believes, but that working class people understand very, very intuitively that the supply of labor, an endless supply of people to compete with them, is going to drive down their wages.
They see that at the end of every month.
They understand that trade deals I think?
From Hispanic working class people, he got the majority of Hispanic men.
He got 25 % of black men.
Why?
Because he was providing an alternative to the redistribution model.
He was providing a protectionist model that said, I'm going to protect the labor of the American worker by limiting the supply of the competition, by making better trade deals with tariffs.
These are all things that will make sure that when a working class person goes to work, they're...
We're good to go.
We're good to go.
Batya, Senator Sanders also talked about access to affordable health care.
What do you think about policies geared toward that?
Health care is so unbelievably important.
Our health care system is so broken.
We're good to go.
I think?
Much less immigration and much more access to health care.
The first party that gets to that combination is going to do extremely, extremely well because what we have right now is one party that believes in controlling the border but does not really have a health care plan and the other party that's willing to talk about health care but has basically ceded to the open borders activist and donor class because the Democrats' donors really like that kind of far -left radical idea.
I want to read a portion of your book called Second Class.
This is about political party, and it says this.
Talk about that portion of your book, Batya.
I would say the American working class is defined by a radical, radical tolerance.
A radical moderation.
These are people who are unbelievably generous, both in what they do and how they see other people.
So the majority of the women I interviewed said, I would never get an abortion, but I sure as heck would never judge another woman who didn't have the luxury of making this decision.
So they're both pro -life and anti - ban okay so which party should they vote for right it's funny because again donald trump showed up and sort of gave voice to that exact um idea and he sidelined the far right which had been saying no exceptions and all of this stuff um they are very very pro -gay and this includes very christian people republicans
We're good to go.
We need to treat every individual with dignity, but I sure as heck don't want somebody coming into my kid's school and confusing them with things that I should be teaching them.
They cared a lot about their material circumstances, and they did not look to political parties or leaders to tell them what to believe or what values to have.
This is the American working class, radically, radically moderate and fatally underserved by both parties.
Can you talk a little bit about the book itself and who you spoke to, how you did the research, how you got this information, and kind of how you went about writing this book?
So finding the people who are profiled in the book was the biggest challenge, right?
Because once you find the right people, they tell their own stories.
And the book is just full of people's stories about the struggles and triumphs of being working class in America.
And I was reporting it in 2022, 2023.
And the way that I went about finding them was.
What I wanted was for the people's stories to be interesting enough to carry the story, to carry the narrative, but also I wanted each person to be representative of a larger cross -section of the American working class, and so I started with data.
There's a wonderful professor at Brigham Young University called Joe Price and he has a team of grad students who can help people like me who studied in the humanities and don't have a very good grasp of how to handle surveys.
He helps you understand the sort of data bird's eye view.
Who is in the American working class?
I said to him, I want that bird's eye view from a data...
Quantitative perspective.
How many people are working class in America?
What are their races?
Where do they live?
What jobs do they work in?
How many of them are homeowners?
Which jobs have the highest homeownership rate?
Which states have the highest homeownership rate?
One of the biggest surprises was that the American dream for working class Americans is much...
We're good to go.
I think?
We're good.
I narrowed down the top impediments.
All right, let's talk to callers and we'll start with Gary in Meridian, Connecticut.
Good morning, Gary.
Yes.
Good morning, Mimi.
Good morning, Ms. Sargon.
I just want to take issue with how you began your discussion.
You posited that this country was based on egalitarian principles.
Well, it wasn't.
It took until 1920 for women to have the right to vote.
Initially, people who didn't own property couldn't vote.
This country was designed to protect the wealthy, and it's been years of fighting to change that.
The African Americans are still fighting for the right to vote.
So how you posited that this country was based on egalitarian principles really bewilders me.
I don't disagree with much of what you're saying about the way things are now, but I really have to disagree with that premise that you stated.
I'm curious what your educational background is that qualifies you to write this book.
All right, Gary.
Thank you so much, Gary.
That's a very important point.
I don't believe I said the word egalitarian.
I said classlessness.
The idea that anybody could rise up and could make something of themselves.
But you're absolutely right.
That did not include women and certainly did not include Black Americans until after the Civil Rights Movement.
So I totally take that point.
You're right.
I should have made that much clearer in my opening, God forbid, not to erase the work of the abolitionist movement and Abraham Lincoln and everything that followed the Civil Rights Movement, Dr. King.
So I accept that criticism completely.
But, you know, the whole idea of the Declaration Of Independence, the Bill Of Rights, all of our amendments, the Constitution was to protect, not just, you know, We've
got a question for you on X from J .D.
Redding who says, So.
One of the things you hear a lot, if you turn on liberal media, if you watch MSNBC or CNN or read the New York Times, you'll hear this refrain,
Trump's signature achievement was a tax cut for the rich.
I'm sure we've all heard that many times.
I don't think that that is an accurate statement.
First of all, a lot of the people that I interviewed for my book recall We're good to go.
I think?
Much more money than if you're making $55 ,000 a year and you get a 24 % tax cut.
But to the person making $55 ,000 a year, that is very significant.
So these were big achievements and as a result of them, if you look at 2019, The bottom 25 % of wage earners saw a 4 .5 % wage increase for the first time in decades, whereas the top 25 % of wage earners only saw a 2 .9 % wage increase, which means that Trump was the first person to shrink the gap between the top 25 % and the bottom 25 % in
decades five decades maybe.
So you look at something like that.
And at the same time as he was limiting the supply of labor and imposing massive tariffs massive tariffs 25, 30 on China, Inflation was only 1 .8.
So to me, that is what people who voted for him are trying to get back to.
I think in the liberal media, they were cast as white supremacists trying to return to the 50s and to Jim Crow era and so forth.
But what they really wanted was just to get back to 2019 when they had a little bit more money in their bank accounts at the end of the month to spend on things that gave them dignity.
And I say this as someone who heard this many times from people who are working class.
They could point to the specific Trump -era policies that put money back in their pockets.
I don't think that Trump won because he was fighting wokeness.
I think that's sort of a fantasy of Republican elites who don't want to talk about the economy.
They want to talk about the transgender issue because that's their piccadillo.
But I think that the reason that Trump won was because many people who were Democrats five years ago voted for him in swing states, and many of them were Let's talk to who's in Dunlop,
Tennessee.
Hi, Ron.
You cannot have communism with a middle class, because if people have hope, then you can't have communism.
You've got to have, like, no hope.
And that makes you have the government take care of you.
And, you know, I think we'd be in big trouble here if it wasn't for the Second Amendment.
But, you know, during COVID, more billionaires were created from COVID, because all these large...
Corporations got to stay open, and all the mom -and -pop shops got shut down, and it destroyed the middle class.
And this is what they're aiming to do.
They're aiming to kill our middle class so they can usher in communism here.
And I hope people wake up to that fact, because it's going on.
You know, 95 % of the media is owned by people from Davos, Switzerland.
CNN spam, you know?
It's Comcast, Disney, Paramount.
All right, Ron.
Let's get a response.
Go ahead, Batya.
Thank you so much, Ron.
You know, I often say the Democratic Party right now is kind of like a plane.
There's, you know, a few people in first class and then a lot of people in economy.
And what their message to the people in economy is.
You can fly for free so long as you stay in the back of the plane, right?
So if you look at the data right now, the Democratic Party's coalition is no longer the multiracial working class like it used to be for so long.
That is now the MAGA movement.
The Democrats now, the people who vote for Democrats consistently are the college educated, the elites, and then the dependent poor, people who don't work.
So they are this sort of very polarized party and you look at so much of the policy and it really reflects that it's either sort of bolstering the status of the poor but without actually improving their life there's no upward mobility Or it's sort of helping the rich, putting money back in the pockets of the rich.
And there's so much data to back this up, this realignment to where the Democrats became the party of the rich.
So 65 % of Americans who make more than $500 ,000 a year today are living in Democratic areas.
These are Democrats.
75 % of donations coming out of Silicon Valley, Democrats.
Joe Biden got...
10 points more, 10 % more of the billionaires than Donald Trump did, even though people are often saying Trump is a billionaire controlled by billionaires, etc.
But it's actually they're gravitating towards the Democratic Party.
95 % of donations out of the top three management consultant companies go to Democrats.
75 % of hedge fund donations go to Democrats.
So we're really seeing this realignment.
Nine of the 10 richest counties in America now are Democrats.
And meanwhile, Trump won with the majority of people who earn.
under a hundred thousand dollars a year so we've seen this radical realignment um and i think that what we're in the midst of right now is the republican party deciding whether they're Happy with this, right?
Because for so long it was the Democrats who were the party of labor and the Republicans who were the party of the rich.
Trump sort of took an axe to all of that.
But of course there were elites on the right who would much rather go back to catering to, you know, rich conservatives who only care about the woke issue and only care about symbolic issues.
I think they're not quite sure.
We're going to see in the next four years whether the Republican Party has realized who their new base is.
And I think actually healthcare, which came up earlier, is going to be a really big part of that.
Whether we see...
Good morning.
I am enjoying the conversation.
I do believe or actually side with some things that this young lady is saying.
However, I am one of those Democrats that I do believe we need to, first of all, not group people because of the fact that if it's a Democratic political party,
but I'm an individual that happens to vote for a lot of things that are right for a lot of people that are in need.
I've been there before and I've been helped.
So when I hear Oh, the Democratic Party, we're elites in this and that.
I'm that moderate Democrat that I'm in the middle class.
I have a master's degree.
I work.
I probably am at the bottom of that middle class.
Yes, you're correct.
We are scuffling to continue to be able to provide for our families.
I take care of an 80 -year -old family member, blind.
I also have a disabled son that I'm trying to get through college.
And I see on the job where when money's supposed to go to the correct party or the correct people that are doing all of the legwork, that money only goes...
Up to the higher people that are in the organization.
That's your CEOs, that's your manager, and they're all in the cahoots together and pretty much kind of whip you down at the bottom to do the work.
We work through the pandemic and this young lady, she's really telling the truth about a lot of things that a lot of people don't hear about.
But please don't group me with I'm not saying you, ma 'am, but I'm saying a lot of people don't group certain people or don't group people with higher up people that are making these millions of dollars.
Us down here that are Democrats, we're really scuffling and we're just trying to do the best for everyone all over the world.
We think we're doing right.
But thank you very much.
Go ahead, Batya.
Wow.
God bless you, Sean.
You're the exact person that both parties should be fighting for your vote.
The role that I'm sure you play in your community, the role you play in your family, taking care of both a child who has struggles and a parent while working full time.
That is...
The struggle for dignity for the American dream.
And as far as I'm concerned, which either party successfully convinces you that they have your interests at heart and makes your life a little bit easier, that's the future.
So I just, what I want to see and why I wrote this book is because instead of seeing both parties ignore people like you, Sean, I want to see both parties fighting for your respect.
That's the America that I want to live in is a country where somebody like you who works so hard and then comes home and is taking care of both the generation above you and the generation below you has two parties struggling,
fighting for your respect and to make your life a little bit easier.
You're the backbone of this country and honestly that is why I wrote this book and I just hope that what I say resonates with you.
Thank you so much for the call.
We have a text from Greg in Dallas.
He says this.
That is so true.
I mean, look, I think...
You're right.
You can't convince these rich ghouls to pay people more when they have been allowed to do this for so long.
They're not going to do that out of the kindness of their heart.
It is not in the nature of power to share itself.
It is not in the nature of corporations that have had two parties encouraging them to sell out the working class to suddenly grow a conscience.
What you can do is what I think Trump did in the first term, which is if you limit the supply of labor.
Labor is like everything else.
It adheres to the ironclad law of supply and demand.
So if there's less workers, each one has to be paid more or they can't get the profits.
So, by simple, We're good to go.
Meatpacking.
This used to be like the job to have.
You would have communities that had this big plant and people would get great jobs there.
The wages were incredible.
The conditions were incredible.
The hours were incredible.
You could retire in dignity.
And if you look now at who is doing our meatpacking, it is illegal immigrants working for much less wages.
Working in much less safe conditions.
And the scandal is that a lot of them are children who have been trafficked here by these cartels and are now effectively enslaved to them and have to pay off whatever is $5 ,000,
$10 ,000 that was used to get them here by these murderous cartels while making $6 an hour.
It is so utterly infuriating, and yet this was all done completely by design in order to bring down the prices for people.
Let's talk to Marvin in Michigan.
Hi, Marvin.
I worked 30 years through the labor union in Detroit, level 91, 334.
I was in the construction trade, concrete, demolition, worked for big companies, Ron Shelley, Bob Marlowe.
And I made over $120 ,000 a year.
And I just have a high school education.
The ladies should try to uplift the young people in state and trying to get jobs and stuff and training instead of standing there coming like she got on the back of the plane.
You can ride for free, so.
I totally disagree with that statement.
And also, I would like to get some rebuttal from the lady.
She keeps saying the Trump administration.
They have right now, just like I just said, retired at 49 with 30 vested years, a good pension, everything, through the union.
The Trump administration is trying to eliminate the apprenticeship programs from the international unions for a young guy like she's saying.
Alright, we got that.
Marvin.
Go ahead, Bhatia.
Thank you so much.
Marvin is absolutely right.
Unions, trade unions are one of the remaining avenues for working class people to achieve the American dream.
They're incredibly, incredibly important and they do secure that middle class life for working class people.
The problem is, is only 6 % of the private sector is unionized.
So while Americans feel really good about unions right now, they're not flocking to join them.
And I think it's because in the high schools they don't get pushed.
In high school, it's very common for kids to be told, you know, you're kind of I think that's terrible.
I totally agree with Marvin.
We should be uplifting kids.
We should be telling them that this is a dignified way to live.
That you'll be able to support a family on this wage.
That you'll have great benefits.
You'll be able to retire in dignity.
So I'm completely in agreement with all of that.
I totally agree with him that the trade unions are great and wonderful and a staple and a mainstay of this country.
Very supportive.
The problem is that not enough Americans are unionized and as a result They don't have access to those benefits.
In terms of cutting the apprenticeship, I had not heard of that.
I'm going to look into that, Marvin, because that's a terrible thing.
And if that's happening, you can be assured that I will raise my voice against it because apprenticeship programs that get young men specifically into working class jobs that have a future are unbelievably important.
And Batya, you had said early in the program that the Obama administration had cut vocational training in high schools.
Can you tell us more about that?
Why those were cut, and then in the next Trump administration, what has he said about those programs?
We know he has said that he wants to close the Department of Education and give that function over to the states.
Yeah, so the idea, I think, from the Democrats, if I'm going to steel man what they were doing, they saw this globalized economy.
They saw these jobs being shipped overseas to China and Mexico due to these very good trade deals for China and Mexico that they had signed.
And I think the idea was, look, those jobs are not coming back.
President Obama said that many times.
What we have to do is get everyone to go to college.
We'll build a knowledge industry here.
We'll send all of our young people to college.
They will join the knowledge industry.
And then we'll just...
We're good to go.
We're good to go.
We're good to go.
I think?
President Trump has talked about vocational training.
There are plans being put out now by the GOP that focus very much on this idea that you don't have to have a college degree and you shouldn't have to have a college degree in order to achieve the American dream, in order to be able to support your family.
I think all that's great.
I do think a lot of it from the right comes from this feeling that when people go to college, they become indoctrinated into leftist and democratic ideas, which I actually think is true.
But so all of which is to say, it does seem promising.
We're good to go.
I think?
created for the ideal American consumer which if you think about that as a person who has extra money disposable income right which is who you know these these these ads are targeted at is going to be people in the elite so we really need to see a revolution both in terms of I think you know the the economics the training the material side of things but also in terms of the cultural aspect of things of restoring respect to the hardest working Americans Kevin is in Ellicott City, Maryland.
Good morning, Kevin.
Jeezy.
I don't even know where to begin.
Like, the idea that you go to college and you become indoctrinated.
I mean, I went to college.
My wife, my children went to college.
I don't, this is exactly the problem in America today.
The author makes these broad statements like it's true.
It's like she's listening to Joe Rogan or something.
And they tell this kind of partial fib.
It's like this kind of thing out there.
And this is the challenge in America today.
We have so many people making these big comments like it's real, like everyone's woke, and it's this idea that's really making America less smart in the decisions they make because the information they get is from podcasts and people like this who make these statements that is so ignorant,
it's unbelievable.
Like, college education, regardless how you use it, Is a benefit for a lot of Americans.
And you should not be discouraged.
Trades are wonderful.
If you can get into trades and that's your decision, that's wonderful.
But we can't continue to demonize so many things and say, oh, it's bad to go there.
And if you look at the statistics, who makes more money, who has a better life, who lives longer, it's typically people that are either college educated or could have a trade and be in there.
Don't discourage people from getting a college degree like you're going to come out like brainwashed, like your parents didn't raise you properly.
It's just a bad comment.
And just the last point is this.
Donald Trump lost 2 .5 million jobs.
He spent $8 .2 trillion in our debt.
And at the end, he spent 4 .2 unmanaged COVID money that he was giving away to everybody.
And that was the money people were getting.
They didn't have jobs.
He had lost his millions and millions of jobs because of COVID.
And then our international relations was horrible.
So he rewrites history and makes all these promises.
And I will promise you, after four years, you're going to see some of the same things.
I lost so much money in the stock market under Donald Trump.
It's finally gotten back.
Biden's created 18 million jobs, manufacturing's up.
And so it's this ability to have a rewrite history.
It's just disappointing when I listen to someone like this talk.
All right, Kevin, let's get her response.
Go ahead, Batya.
I could see why he was triggered by the word indoctrinated.
But the truth is that the number one predictor for whether people will vote for Democrats is a college degree.
That's all I was trying to say.
I should not have used the word indoctrinated.
It was a little too aggressive for this context.
And I apologize to Kevin and appreciate his comment.
But the number one predictor, the only group Kamala Harris won with was white college -educated voters, especially women.
So that correlation is there.
You might say it's not causation, it's correlation.
Well, okay, so what's causation?
I mean, it seems pretty, I mean, You go somewhere.
I have a PhD, so I spent a lot of time in the context of universities.
It's very hard to be a conservative there, you know, and then humanities, upwards of 90 % of professors are not just liberals, but very liberal.
So, you know, it's just, it's a thing.
I think most people can see that it's a thing.
But I apologize for using the word indoctrinated.
I see that that's triggering and I won't, I'll try, you know, try to be more careful with my words.
The problem is, is I think he's actually agreeing with me, even though he thinks he's disagreeing with me.
He is agreeing with me.
That a college education has become the prerequisite for the American dream.
And that is terrible.
It is unfair.
It is unjust.
It is wrong.
We need many more people.
Our economy relies on the labor of the working class.
So when we say that a college education is going to be the only way for us to allow people to have the American dream, we are effectively saying we get it, but all of you who we rely on to survive, you don't get it.
You don't get to be a homeowner.
You're going to come to my house and clean my house.
You're going to deliver my Amazon packages.
You're going to deliver.
We've got a text for you that says, How exactly do we create and fund that without raising taxes?
Or are you not for the actual solution, universal healthcare?
I would support universal healthcare in a heartbeat.
I have no problem raising my taxes.
The problem is, I think I have much more in common.
And Donald Trump has much more in common and the MAGA people have much more in common with the Medicare for All, AOC, Ro Khanna, Bernie Sanders wing of the Democratic Party than those people have with the center of power of the Democratic Party.
That's kind of what I want people to understand.
If AOC comes out with a proposal for Medicare for All, I'll probably support it.
I think that healthcare is incredibly important.
I don't think that you have to pay for improvements to Medicare with people's tax dollars.
I think that there are a lot of very easy, obvious policy things you could implement tomorrow that would make healthcare much more affordable and much easier for people to deal with, starting with things like price transparency,
starting with things like Forbidding AI from being used to deny claims.
A lot of these conversations we're having now after the horrific shooting of Brian Thompson.
These are important conversations to have.
What I would say to this person is they immediately jump to assuming bad faith on my part because I don't support the solution that they want.
But I don't feel that way about them.
I would support your solution even if it's not the one that I would implement.
Why can't we do that?
Why can't we say we recognize the same problem?
Let's have that conversation instead of always saying, well, you're clearly on the other side.
Obviously, Batya doesn't want to pay more taxes.
No, we're on the same side.
It's not left versus right anymore.
Those distinctions do Thomas is in Deerwood,
Maryland
A lot of linguistic propaganda.
The reason why I use that term is because if you look at what's going on today, you see the segregation, and the segregation is being pushed by white Americans.
It's not being pushed by Latinos or Americans.
It's being pushed by white Americans.
And this is why you see when she talks about the unions and things like that.
Like the guy before said, they should be uplifting people that go to college.
But you see, white people have realized that they are being, like the group said, replaced.
Number -wise.
Not physically, but number -wise.
And you see, even if you look at her, she wears the Star of David on her neck.
Her parents didn't tell her, go to the union.
Her parents told her, you gotta try to get to Harvard.
So, Thomas, you talked about segregation.
What kind of segregation are you talking about?
All right, Thomas.
Any comment there about you?
Well, white people are the only group Donald Trump lost ground with this election.
And in a significant way, he gained ground with every group of minorities, including Black Americans.
Black men gave him 25 % of the vote, which is Pretty unheard of for a Republican.
He got the majority of Hispanic men, 46 % of Hispanics overall, 40 % of Muslim Americans, which was more than Jewish Americans, which is something I feel some type of way about.
So, you know, I just don't see this narrative as holding water.
I don't think Americans feel negatively towards people based on the color of their skin.
I think Americans feel very proud of having overcome that on an individual level and on a national scale.
So I think the evidence that that, you know, To Austin,
Texas.
Cindy, you're next.
Cindy, are you there?
Yeah, can you hear me?
Yes, go ahead.
Okay.
Yes.
I just want to say to your guest, I really appreciate her comments.
Maybe about a month or so ago, a little more, I saw her on, I think, C -SPAN's Book TV possibly be interviewed and was highly impressed with her being interviewed there as well.
I want to thank you for the comments about the first party that gets to limiting immigration and kind of combining the Bernie Sanders economic message is the one that's going to be the ultimate winner.
I want to say I...
I'm much older than you, but I am college -educated, a prestigious, whatever I heard David Brooks say recently, one of the 34 prestigious colleges in this country, graduate.
And what I have observed, and coming from Flint, Michigan, so that says a lot, I think, about my background, very working class in my values, but not stupid enough to vote for MAGA.
I think the MAGA designers are highly intelligent and highly intuitive about what gets American voters going, but the MAGA voters are not so well educated or astute.
What I want to ask you is what I've been doing because I was too young to pay attention back in the day is go back to NAFTA.
Go back to when George Bush Sr. got rid of defined retirement benefit plans and switched everybody to the 401k system and look at those congressional votes and who voted that's still around.
And I was actually quite shocked to see That for the NAFTA vote, which, yes, happened during Clinton's administration, but was an idea, my understanding is,
that also came from George Bush Sr. and maybe even somebody in the Reagan administration, which he was.
Nancy Pelosi voted for NAFTA.
Dick Durbin in the Senate from Illinois voted for NAFTA.
Now, I expect Chuck Grassley to be on that list.
He's a Republican from Iowa.
I was blown away that Democratic people, Nancy Pelosi just needs to retire now that she's broken her hip.
These people who claim to be for the Democrats are really, as you say, for the corporate elite.
I just couldn't believe some of the names on that list.
I checked all the California senators at that time.
All right, Cindy.
Thank you, Cindy.
I have not done that, but now I kind of want to go back and take a look at those lists.
Thank you so much for the comment.
Here's Michael, who's in Texas.
Hi, Michael.
Hi, how are you?
Good.
Good, thanks.
Good, thanks for taking my call.
I just wanted to say, I'm Texas, and I'm in the middle of a big red state, but I'm a die -hard, I guess you'd call me a bleeding -hard liberal, but I think that your comments about, I guess, to me,
I took it as degrading the educational aspirations.
Everyone does, I mean, our country needs to have people that are, it's like a line from the Rutgers Club, someone has to be a ditch digger as well.
Someone has to make the burgers, but the fact that you seem to want to denigrate wanting a higher education seems a little harsh.
The smarter, and I think you brought this thing about causation versus correlation, the causation that it seems that people become more educated, they tend to be Democrat.
Well, maybe you're looking at it from the wrong point of view.
Maybe because you're educated, you tend to see a better way forward for things.
Conservatives want to go back.
Progressives...
I .e., your elitism and your causation to education makes us want to go forward.
Maybe you're looking at it in a different way.
And also, I also wanted to address the fact that America seems to be so stuck on binary reasoning and thinking.
You're either black or white.
You're either Republican or Democrat.
You're either man or woman.
When in the real world, we operate on varying degrees within those.
Alright, Michael, we're running low on time.
Let me get you an answer.
Oh, yeah, I totally agree.
There's so much more consensus than, you know, polarization is a totally elite phenomenon.
That's the number one message of my book is if you travel around the country, you will find enormous unity and love Americans have for each other, including for people across the political spectrum.
Working class people just don't have the luxury nor the appetite of hating people based on who they vote for.
Across this country, you have working class people working side by side with praying side by side with breaking bread with people who voted for Trump.
And so we can take a page out of their playbook.
On the college thing.
The reason I'm so down on college is because in the name of this so -called expertise, we have sort of come to worship not actual expertise, but the interest, the economic interests of the elites,
of the expert class who have implemented again and again and again policy that hurts their less fortunate neighbors while they continue to rely on those neighbors' labor to survive.
That is the thing that I find appalling and unacceptable is in the name of higher And real quick,
Batia, before I let you go, about policies for the incoming Trump administration, the people you talked to, did you find them in favor of
They love tariffs, that's for sure.
Working class people feel that those tariffs protect the fruits of their labor and make them worth a lot more.
Makes $88 ,000 a year.
And these are in right -to -work states in the South, where most of the steel mills are.
That's because Trump put a 25 % tariff on steel and aluminum coming in from China.
It protects wages.
We should want our neighbors to make more money.
And they were very in favor of controlling the border.
These people are not anti -immigrant.
People would apologize to me.
They would say, I'm not anti -immigrant.
I love immigrants.
I have immigrants in my life, in my community.
But it is an undeniable fact that they've brought down the wages of the working class.
And they really appreciated Trump's attempt to reverse that.
All right.
Batia Ungar -Sargon, opinion editor at Newsweek.
The book is called Second Class, How the Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women.
Thanks so much for joining us.
Thank you so much for having me.
God bless you and happy holidays.
You too.
After the break, more of your calls in Open Forum.
Anything you want to talk about public policy or politics -wise, please do start calling in now.
Republicans, 202 -748 -8001.
Democrats 202 -748 -8000 and Independents 202 -748 -8002.
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Washington Journal continues.
Welcome back to Washington Journal.
It is open forum.
You can start calling in now.
And while you're doing that, here is President -elect Donald Trump.
He was at a Turning Point Action Conference yesterday in Phoenix, and he talked about immigration policy.
And talks about a new approach to fighting illegal drugs.
But I've informed Mexico that it just cannot continue.
We're not going to let it continue.
The United States has lost 300 ,000 people a year.
Think of that.
I don't know.
I mean, how many people?
Everybody you meet said, I lost my daughter, I lost my son to drugs, to fentanyl.
Mostly to fentanyl, but to drugs.
Families are being destroyed, and we're going to stop it.
We're not going to let that happen.
And we're also going to be doing something that's, I think, going to help a lot.
We're going to do very big advertising campaigns, just like a campaign for running for president.
We'll spend a lot of money, but it'll be a very small amount of money, relatively.
We're going to advertise how bad drugs are for you, how bad they are.
They ruin your look, they ruin your face, they ruin your skin, and ruin your teeth.
If you want to have horrible teeth, take a lot of fentanyl.
If you want to have skin that looks so terrible, take fentanyl.
We're going to show what these drugs are doing to you.
Nobody's done that before, and we're going to do it.
That was yesterday.
If you'd like to see the whole event, it's at our website, c -span .org.
And this is thehill .com with the headline, Trump says he's planning large -scale ad campaign on fentanyl crisis.
You can read that at thehill .com if you'd like more information on that planned ad campaign.
Let's talk to Aaron in Truth or Consequences, New Mexico, Republican.
Hi, Aaron.
Hail Trump, Mimi.
How are you?
Good.
How's it going?
I'm from Massachusetts.
Unfortunately, I live here now.
I don't care about immigration, but I used to be addicted to fentanyl.
Healthcare, right?
That's what Bacha said?
Yes.
Luigi Mangione's arraignment is today.
I hope we see a lot of support for him out there.
He's our new Christ figure.
You know what, Aaron?
He's also an alleged murderer.
Don't you see other ways of showing your displeasure?
We need copycats of Luigi!
This is Christina, Oakland, Michigan, Independent Line.
Hi, Christina.
Good morning, and thank you for taking my call.
And where do I begin?
This country has gone so out of whack.
I find one of the biggest problems we have is all the money in our politics.
That's become big business.
Ever since the Supreme Court, the conservative Supreme Court passed Citizens United saying everything is free as a speech and so is money, somebody like Elon Musk
Now, you know, something's wrong someplace.
So, first of all, I think we've got too much money in politics.
Second of all, I think we've got too much religious beliefs.
I'm a Christian.
I had 12 years of Christian education.
I never learned Christ to preach violence.
And that's how you take care of problems, by violence.
Just what that last gentleman said.
I worked in the healthcare field.
I'm a retired RN.
I worked in surgery.
Everything became a business.
It was do more with less.
Push the people more.
Do I think Donald Trump really cares about working class people?
I was?
No, he doesn't.
He really cares about marketing.
He's a terrific marketer, and that's what is in his favor.
This country is subject to marketing like crazy.
I mean, that's all we do is commercials, commercials.
I'm 78 years old.
I remember a day when we were told...
Uh, paid TV, you wouldn't get commercials.
Well, now we got paid TV in the form of cables and everything else, and it's commercial, commercial, commercial, commercial.
Because we are so subject to influence of marketing, it is ridiculous.
We should start thinking about what's really important and get the money out of politics.
That would be the biggest step, but it's not going to happen.
Because there is too much money in politics.
Got it, Christina.
And this is a story from Axios that says this.
Congress's age debate reignites over member living in retirement home.
This is Congress's long -simmering debate over the age of its members has resurfaced over revelations that Representative Kay Granger, a Republican from Texas, has been living in an independent living facility in Texas.
The retiring former House Appropriations Committee chair's absence from votes since July has led some of her colleagues to raise concerns.
Granger acknowledged in a Sunday statement to Axios that she has, quote, been navigating some unforeseen health challenges over the past year.
Since early September, my health challenges have progressed, making frequent travel to Washington both difficult and unpredictable.
Her son, Brandon, told the Dallas Morning News that she has been, quote, having some dementia issues late in the year.
And this is Katrina in Georgia, Line for Democrats.
Good morning.
Hi, good morning, and thank you for taking my call.
I have a laundry list of things, but I'm going to try to keep it short.
I definitely agree with age limits, and this is a prime example of why.
We need to have age limits.
This country cannot progress forward with people of old age or of old thinking being in charge of this country and making decisions.
This country needs to grow and progress and without young minds, young ideals, and views, this country will continue to live in the hatred and woes of what it was basically grew on.
In addition, Trump, his thing on trying to fight drugs and things of that nature, Trump has no substance.
Trump has no morals.
Trump is a person who just continues to spew all kinds of division.
And for anyone who thinks that this man is educated, whoever thinks he's a genius, I really do feel for you.
As far as this country, this country is ruled by lobbyists.
Lobbyists have this country.
Us, the people, for the people, that no longer exists.
It's for the people who have money, who can buy votes, who can take over industries, who can continue to feed us horrible food, who can continue to pollute our air, who can continue...
Just think about how many people, how young people are now.
The number amount of people who coming up with cancer.
Those questions, our government is felling us.
They're felling us every day.
And until we recognize that these people need to start showing where their money is, start showing who they're backing, Congress should be an open book.
We should be able to see everything.
They should not be able to invest in certain companies or be on certain panels or in charge of committees.
There's certain things that, as citizens, we should know.
It's a money grab, and that's the reason why they don't want to leave these crazy jobs, because they have the best health care, which they don't offer to us.
They're able to see what companies are moving, what company is going to close, or whatever, and so they can be able to move their money.
We are in a farce.
This is a farce.
And until the people of this country take charge and start asking these people to show your hand, We're going to continue to be in the stand that we're in.
All right, Katrina.
And we mentioned this news about the death row commutations.
This is Politico.
It says, Biden to commute sentences of nearly all men on federal death row.
The president will block Donald Trump's chance to quickly resume executions.
It says, so this was 37 of the 40 men condemned to death, the second mass clemency in the weeks following the pardon he issued to his son, Hunter Biden.
This is what the president said in a statement, quote, Make no mistake, I condemn these murderers, grieve for their victims of their despicable acts, and ache for all the families who have suffered unimaginable and irreparable loss.
But guided by my conscience and my experience as a public defender, chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, vice president, and now president, I am more convinced than ever that we must stop the use of the death penalty at the federal level.
Now, we mentioned it was 37 out of the 40.
So it says here, Biden's commutations exclude three prisoners convicted for what the president characterized as terrorism.
You can read the rest of that at Politico.
Randy in Kentucky Republican Line, good morning.
Good morning, thank you.
I don't know if I'm understanding what you're saying about Biden's situation.
I called him for something else I was wanting to say, but if I could, are you saying that they're going to be free to the public or they're just going to be denied being put to death?
No, it's just that they won't be put to death.
They are actually going to be life in prison without parole.
So how does Biden justify from someone who does a hate crime?
To someone who killed a bunch of children or whatever it may be.
Those people hate no matter what they do.
When they kill somebody, they hate.
And I've never understood hate crimes.
I've never understood any of that stuff.
But what I wanted to call in for was the lady that was on there before.
It would be nice if you could have other people on with predicting the future of how our economy and how our income is going to be.
When we get all the AI and all the robots implemented, we're bringing in this country so many uneducated people that they'll be basically unneeded, just like so many other people that are already here in this country will be unneeded.
You won't need data entry people because everything will be basically done.
So how much are you going to pay?
How much do people, do they have it figured out?
How much do they want to pay me?
I discussed this with a young person many years ago.
What do they want to pay everyone?
Just a basic wage?
Everyone gets the same?
And we have some elites that tell us what we do and what we don't do.
And then, if I steal your money, say $50 ,000 a year, or even a million dollars a year, whatever they decide it will be, if it's not enough for me, can I steal your money?
All right, Randy.
Hey, how you doing?
I'm just calling this morning to say I was Democrat.
I was.
But when I saw Kamala Harris kept saying that she's going to give this much to this many people, she's going to give to pregnant women, she's going to give more to family,
people who've got families.
Well, what about working class citizens?
Anybody can just see clearly how she lost.
She lost for giving to somebody who wasn't working.
Giving to the mamas that ain't working.
And we got enough of those people out there that ain't working and feasting off people that's working, taxpayers' money.
And, you know, people get sick and tired of it.
And that's what she was doing.
I was a Democrat till I kept hearing her saying, give, give, give.
But she never said anything about the working class citizens.
And that's why I went to Donald Trump.
Trump is for the working people and thank God for AI.
People say we don't need AI.
Come on, man.
We need AI.
People don't even know how to go on the right side of the road.
We need AI.
We need electric cars.
We, you know, we need that GPS.
Thank God for a GPS.
At least you know where you're going.
These people got so dumb and crazy.
They thinking that AI gonna destroy everything.
Donald Trump gonna, you know, it's corporate and this and that.
We made it through the George Bush administration.
We made it through the Ronald Reagan administration.
We made it through even Joe Biden's administration.
And we will make it through Donald Trump's administration.
But we gonna have 12 years.
of Trump administration.
I bet you my bottom dollar, 12 years.
Four years, Mr. Trump, and Mr. Trump gonna elect somebody for eight more years.
He got the government locked down.
He got the Supreme Court locked down.
Let me tell you something, another thing.
Democrats just now waking up to say...
Oh, how did he get this passed, and how did they change the government?
Well, you got one set of people that's smart, and that's the Republicans, and you got another set of people that's dumb.
Republicans is, like, very smart.
They know how to pass a bill.
They know what to do to pass a bill.
Democrats think this way is supposed to be to the end.
But yeah, hey, you got food.
You should have changed the government if you wanted to change.
Thank God for Donald Trump.
Got it.
And this is Rochester, New York, Democrat Berta.
Good morning.
Good morning.
I just want to say that in some states, felonists can't even vote.
But we got a felon going into the White House.
I am so ashamed of our country.
I don't know what to do.
And all those who vote for Trump, they're going to see what Trump is going to do for them.
All right.
And this is Larry in Fort Calhoun, Nebraska, Republican.
Hi.
Good morning.
Morning.
I want to say, in a couple of days from now, Washington Journal is going to be on on Christmas and I said this last month I can't remember who it was.
I told it would be nice if Democrats call on Christmas and not speak of hate, because Christmas is a sacred day and you should not speak of hate.
So if you're a Democratic caller, Kind of keep your comments civil.
But Larry, shouldn't everybody keep their comments civil?
Of course.
And I'd say there's a few Republicans that way, too.
But not as bad as the Democratic and the media.
It's so divisive to speak of hate.
And there would be a good program for you to have callers, only Democratic callers only.
Explain to me what good hate is.
So that's my comment for today, and I wish everybody Merry Christmas.
Merry Christmas, Larry.
This is from thehill .com with the headline, President of Panama Fires Back at Trump at the Canal Belongs to Panama.
It says that the Panamanian president shot back Sunday after President -elect Trump suggested the Panama Canal return to U .S. control.
Quote,
As president, I want to express clearly that every square meter of the Panama Canal and its adjacent zone belongs to Panama and will continue to do so.
The sovereignty and independence of our country are not negotiable.
It says the canal is not under direct or indirect control neither by China nor by the European Union nor by the United States nor by any other power.
As a Panamanian, I strongly reject any manifestation that distorts this reality.
You can read that at The Hill.
And here is Bobby, St. Paul, Minnesota, Independent.
Hey, thanks for taking my call.
I'm from West St. Paul, Minnesota.
And I want to talk about the Melendez brothers.
I think that's kind of faded out with everything that's going on.
And a reminder that the Melendez brothers shot and killed their parents in cold blood.
And I think there was a Netflix documentary that brought this back to be reexamined.
Also that they were models, the model prisoners.
And my point is that apparently the dad was a sex fiend that was sexually abusing the boys.
And they had made a plan and they shot their, once again, shot their parents in cold blood and now they're looking for...
To have their sentence pardoned, whatever the terminology is.
But people have to remember that they pre -planned this killing, number one.
Number two, they shot their dad and shot their mom.
Their mom was still alive.
They went outside.
And at that moment in time, that moment in time, they should have rationalized and said, geez, look what we did.
You know, mom's still alive.
The mother that brought us...
to this world, the mother that raises us as babies, the mother that's got us through adolescence.
So they went back in.
Instead of calling 911 to save their mother, they reloaded and they shot her to death.
And and after, when they left, they called 911, and of course, we know the rest of the story.
They came up with this bogus story.
But the mere fact that they had an opportunity to save their mother, But oh, no, no, no, we can't do that because she's going to be a witness.
That's why they should never see the light of day outside of prison.
Thank you for taking my call.
All right, Bob.
That's my point.
Edward is in Arlington, Virginia, line for Democrats.
Hi, Edward.
Hi, how are you?
I'm doing great.
I just want to say a couple of things.
You have to have intellectual, emotional, and or moral short circuit.
Okay, Edward.
And this is Floyd in Iowa, Republican line.
He got out because it was so dirty.
He thought that MMA was dirty.
He got into politics.
But he should have known it because even in junior high school, we had to study a bit by Clausewitz.
He said politics is war by other means.
Anything's going to go.
And Truman, our president, said if you can't stand the heat, get out of the...
Wait a minute, wait a minute.
This just in.
Matt Gaetz, you are the father.
And this is Terry in New Jersey, Independent Line.
Good morning, Terry.
Good morning.
Mimi, if that's your name, I think it is.
Merry Christmas.
The only thing I want to say here, and Merry Christmas to all, I've been watching you.
I watch and watch and watch, and don't cut me off, please.
You know, everybody who's sticking up for Mr. Trump should really take a trip down memory lane.
And I think you should show them that.
I wrote you a letter.
No one's talking about the school shootings.
No one is talking about what's really going on here.
And I think that there's so many people I agree with who called in.
People really need to remember.
Women have very long memories.
Take a trip down memory lane.
I implore you to do so.
Have a nice holiday and thank you for taking my call.
And this is Rosemary in Alabama, Democrat.
Hi, Rosemary.
Hi.
How are you?
I'm doing great.
Go right ahead.
All right.
I just wanted to just make one comment, and that is, how did we ever allow the richest man in the world to buy an election for Donald Trump?
That is my only thought.
Thank you.
And some news for you from this morning.
This is the New York Times about a merger.
Honda and Nissan aim to merge as global competition bears down.
It says Japan's second and third largest automakers hope the $50 billion deal would help them catch up with Tesla and China's BYD in electric vehicles and advanced software.
You could read more about that at the New York Times.
Kendall in Cincinnati, Ohio, Republican.
Good morning.
Good morning and happy holidays to everyone out there.
One of the big problems that I hear Democrats coming up with, talking about how President Trump got re -elected, this is the problem.
There were 9 million Biden Democrats that disappeared when it came to voting for Kamala.
So anytime Democrats want to question where did the election, where was it won and whose fault is it?
They need to look right within themselves and ask, where did those 9 million Biden Democrats disappear to?
That's huge.
And secondly, I have pushed forward in the first Trump administration and continue to do it now and even the last time to lower the student loan rates to 2%.
All right, Kendall.
And I got an update for you on the Matt Gaetz ethics report.
As we mentioned before, that has been released by the House Ethics Committee.
And the New York Post is reporting this morning.
Matt Gaetz files lawsuit against damning House Ethics Committee probe findings on sexual misconduct.
It says that the former representative filed a lawsuit Monday today against the House Ethics Committee seeking an emergency temporary restraining order to try and stop the release of its damning investigation into his alleged sexual misconduct and illicit drug use,
arguing its release would prompt immediate and widespread media coverage.
Gates filed the lawsuit after denying allegations published in a leaked draft of the report ahead of its official release in full.
And Homer in Florence, Massachusetts, Independent.
Good morning.
I'd like to point out your biased narrative that you guys put out.
How can you say, geez, is Trump going to weaponize the DOJ against his people?
From the time he came down the escalator, I heard all of the squad, including Rashida Tlaib, saying we're going to impeach the MF -er.
And then I remember all of them saying, and then Letitia James and Fannie Willis.
Alvin Wright.
And happy holidays to you, Homer.
Ed in Pennsylvania, Democrat.
Good morning.
Good morning.
I'm 87 years old, and I have a master's degree in science and a master's degree in communications.
I'm 40 graduates beyond my master's.
And I would like to make some comments about...
In my Vietnam vet, and I did my service out in Kansas, Topeka,
Kansas, and there was a university I could attend out in Topeka, Kansas, Washburn University,
and it was close to the Menninger Foundation Hospital for Mental Illness.
People had mental problems.
And I was able to attend some classes in the evening.
So what I observed about this President Trump is that he never accepts any responsibility for the riot at the Capitol.
He didn't express any overall... responsibility for his financial problems up in New York.
So he seemed to me like a non -president.
You know, he never accepted it.
I would classify him as a hypocrite.
And a hypocrite is he believes life is what you fake it.
You know?
And that seems to suit this fellow that's going to be president.
He never accepts anything.
He never apologizes for anything.
He just refers his problems to other people.
Hello?
Yes, we heard you, Ed.
Yes, that is my opinion.
Even the Puerto Rico, they said it was a...
All right, Ed.
We got that.
And this is Judy in Signal Mountain, Tennessee.
Independent.
I don't understand how America condones the Israelis from seizing lands from everybody around them.
They've already taken more land from Golan Heights.
When they say that they are protecting their boundaries, what's the difference between them protecting their boundaries and Putin killing people to protect his boundaries?
I just don't understand how America supports this.
Thank you.
And Kathy in Belton, South Carolina, Democrat.
Good morning, Kathy.
Yes, I have a prepared speech that is more important than any speech I can imagine.
Peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
I will not be surprised if the earth starts to shake or the sky becomes a vivid blue.
Both can only be done by God.
My name is Kathy, a black female, senior citizen from South Carolina.
I am a first -time caller, telling the world that I will speak about God's master plan.
Remember this: Jesus is coming back for a church without spot or wrinkle.
In this speech, God will lift up the bowed -down heads, and God will cause those who are proud and mighty to be humble.
Only then will God lift up their bow down his also, because it is God's will to help all men saved.
This includes the great and small, rich and poor, free and bound, those rejoicing and those still in doubt.
Not for anyone thinking that this is impossible.
Most would agree with this thinking, But with God, all things are possible.
All right, Kathy.
And Judy in South Beach, Oregon, Republican line.
I guess I called in on the wrong line.
I'm a Democrat.
I'm sorry.
Kathy, that was beautiful.
I hope it's true.
Really, I truly do.
But what I'm calling about is Trump and his retribution.
And Joe Biden.
You know, the Hunter Biden thing was really ridiculous.
Hunter Biden wasn't running for president.
Trump, in his adult life, has had, before he was ever running for political office, has filed or he's been sued or tried to sue over 4 ,000 times.
I mean, this wasn't persecution going after Trump.
That's true.
He pretty much was used to getting away with whatever.
If somebody said something he didn't like or something that was true, he would try to sue him for slander.
I mean, this was his way of life, his way of doing business.
Now, since he became president, he's done some pretty horrible things.
I mean, he's done some horrible, horrible things.
He should be held accountable, and the media that calls him out on it shouldn't have to worry about losing their job or being sued by him.
I mean, that's free speech.
So I'm just saying, Trump has been doing horrible things his whole adult life.
All right.
All right, Judy.
A lot of things.
All right.
Thank you.
Bye.
On the line for independence in Knoxville, Tennessee, Corey, you're next.
Yeah, I was just wanting to make the suggestion that I think in order to increase jobs, to build new jobs, I think they should try to reinstate more assembly lines back into the industries, you know,
build more warehouses.
And I think that would help a lot with the economy.
And I also think it's important for military purposes as well.
If we ever go into a war, it's important to have warehouses and assembly lines for
And this is Jennifer in Oak Hill, Ohio.
Independent Line.
Yes, I would just like to talk about the WEPGPO that we've been working on for 40 years and it finally got passed.
I heard Mark Levine and Ted Cruz say yesterday that it was for every social security recipient.
It is not.
It is those people like me who, when I retired from the post office, They took 20 % of my retirement because I was going to get Social Security.
When it come time to get my Social Security, they took 85%.
So I ended up just making donations of my Social Security because I got none of it back.
My husband filed for Social Security disability when he got cancer and he had
And this is Lisa in Shreveport, Louisiana, Republican.
Hi, Lisa.
Clark in West Virginia, Republican.
Hi Clark.
Good morning.
Good morning.
Merry Christmas.
That means Christ.
People don't like to hear that now.
They like Xmas, but it's the other way around.
Okay, now listen.
Here's what I'd like to reiterate.
People are talking about there's too much noise in the background.
Is it me or you?
It's you.
I'm in a studio.
Oh, yeah.
Okay, I'm looking at you now.
But so, anyway, yeah, I helped.
Yeah, I might have made a mistake.
But what is, why is Elon Musk sticking his nose in our business other than just a bit, unless he wants to give some of his billions back to the poor people,
the people like the lady before us and other people that's hurting, he should just shut up and go away.
And Clark, are you in favor of the Department of Government Efficiency that he and Ramaswamy are going to be heading up, even though it's not a department?
Well, retribution.
But now, if he thinks in his mind that, yeah, he's been done wrong and, you know, he said that, then maybe I wouldn't blame him too much,
especially the ones that really tried to put him under the bus.
All right, Clark.
And Barb in Long Grove, Illinois sent a text about that.
She said, election contributions come from all sources, large and small.
Those that contribute very large amounts should not automatically be appointed to patronage positions in the government.
And here is William in Virginia, Independent Line.
Hi, William.
Hi.
Go right ahead.
Hokey, hokey, hokey, hi.
Tech, tech, VPI.
Solar X, solar I.
Team, team, team.
Merry Christmas, Mimi.
Merry Christmas, William.
Bob in, uh, my great Connecticut, uh, Kentucky, Democrat.
Bob?
Yeah?
Aye.
Go right ahead.
Yeah, no, I was calling in regards to, I hear a new law that's coming up back, and I wondered if it was true that they're changing the age for Social Security to 66 years and 10 months.
Is that a fact that he's going to sign it, Donald Trump, on January?
My guess, 20th?
You know what?
I hadn't heard that, but we'll do a little bit of research and see if there's anything coming up about changing the age.
I know that that has been proposed, Bob, but I'm not sure that there's an actual bill that is making its way through Congress, but we'll look at it, okay?
Okay, Mimi.
Merry Christmas.
Merry Christmas.
And Mike in Heartland, Wisconsin.
Republican, good morning.
Morning, Mimi.
I noticed this weekend you guys spent a lot of time talking about the so -called bipartisan spending bill, yet you didn't talk about the frivolous stuff that was in it.
All you talked about was the stuff that we might like as taxpayers.
We did talk about the...
Okay.
I heard something about...
Oh, he's gone.
Try to find that.
Maybe our producer can look into what that was about emails and protecting emails for people in Congress.
I want to get something specific for you so that we don't misspeak on what that provision would have actually done.
Kenneth in Los Angeles, Independent.
Good morning.
Well, good morning.
I'm surprised that I got in so early.
I want to encourage people that think that they're not going to be heard to call.
Let's see, what I would say.
What I would say is I think the whole idea, the rich, the idea of what the most paying...
I'm really surprised, regardless of what kind of specific information you can get on a person like Donald Trump.
My gut feeling from the very beginning, and I'm talking about before he even got involved in politics, he's not a man to be trusted.
He's a bait and switch he's never going to do.
One other thing, I'm just about to lose my thought.
What is it?
What people relate to with Donald Trump is not really his track record.
It's that he's dissatisfied.
And he's telling you you're being threatened.
People are relating to that and they're putting into office when he's not going to do anything about it.
Just because he tells you, yeah, I'm sick and tired of all this does not mean, and you are too, does not mean that he's the man to be running this country.
Thank you.
And here's Kathy in Denver, Colorado, Line for Democrats.
Good morning.
Yeah, good morning.
I'd like to offer a perspective.
I've been listening for quite some time.
You just don't hear.
As a nine -year -old little girl, I became a rape survivor.
Can you imagine what that brings up in somebody like me when my neighbors have filled in an oval for a rapist and a felon?
Can you?
Well, no, you can't, you Republicans, because you don't believe anybody that has been assaulted.
Right?
You and your God, your book of lies, tells you that it's okay?
So we've elected a rapist and a felon.
Oh my God, you Republicans, I can't even imagine how proud you must feel!
And I pray that no females in your family have to go through what me and all the other survivors have to look at, this piece of trash that we've elected.
He's a piece of crap.
Why can't anybody see that?
He's a liar.
He's a fake.
He's a phony.
And all you women out there, you better be careful because when you get raped, because now it's okay because guess what?
You get to put rape on your resume and it elevates you.
What on earth is going on?
So all you people that filled in that oval, I hope you're proud of yourself.
All right, Kathy.
Republican Line, Axtell, Texas.
Paul, you're next.
You know, family follows the Bible.
I'm not going to say he's a perfect man.
There's nobody perfect.
And I know a lot of people think that he's kind of an old bear.
But if you look back in history, some of your greatest presidents were Democrat.
You had good Democrat presidents.
You know, John F. Kennedy was one.
Harry Truman.
Democrat party now.
The Democrats are just upset because they got beat, and I mean really beat bad.
And African Americans voted on Trump.
All different kinds of, you know, especially Christians and Catholics and Bible, like me and my family, you know.
I'm not saying that he's a perfect man.
There's nobody on this earth that's perfect.
All right, Paul.
Here is Grant in Savannah, Illinois, Independent.
Hi, Grant.
You had one caller yesterday call in from North Carolina that wanted Biden to face a firing squad.
And getting back to Mr. Trump and his speech that he gave in Phoenix apparently yesterday, I agree that the fentanyl issue is a national crisis and needs to be addressed.
But my understanding is that much of the fentanyl is being brought across the borders.
Legally, I mean through people that just get, you know, get waved through and at the same time with the fentanyl issue, one of the pharmacists,
the pharmacists that prescribe it, you know, often they're not, you know, being penalized or tried or anything like that for their role in You know,
continually prescribing fentanyl when I know how it is addictive.
You mean opioids?
Yeah, opioids, yes, yes.
And getting back to the likely pardons Mr. Trump's proposing to make, I think it'd be totally ludicrous that the rioters at the Capitol would be pardoned.
When I think about it, back in the early 70s, I was...
You know, able to go to the Capitol.
And nowadays, of course, the only way any citizen can get to the Capitol and visit it is you have to, you know, arrange with your either senator or congressman, make an appointment.
And that's not particularly easy.
So the fact of the matter is those people, you know, illegally entered the Capitol, caused a great amount of harm.
We're good to go.
And here's Joshua in Los Angeles, Democrat.
Hi, Joshua.
Think like Robert Kennedy and Pete Hegseth, especially Trump himself, who was found civilly liable for rape, I believe in the E. Jean Carroll case.
For sexual abuse, yep.
Yeah, that's what ABC got sued over, correct?
Correct.
Sexual abuse, because that's so much better.
Especially Trump's policies, too.
It seems to me like Trump is trying to bring back... Turn of the century, like early 20th century, like imperialism by threatening Denmark and Canada, wanting the Panama Canal and Greenland back,
while at the same time supporting these insane tariffs on imported goods, which will bring up prices, especially for electronics and solar panels.
And at the same time, you see Donald Trump taking a more isolationist and populist spend and sort of places That really do matter, especially in the war in Ukraine, constantly chastising Zelensky,
while at the same time refusing to read his intelligence reports.
As Keith Kellogg, who's Trump's envoy to Ukraine and Russia, said to Bob Woodward in his book War, that Trump simply doesn't read his intelligence reports unless you make them over a page long.
And what I'm really concerned about is we have a commander -in -chief who's an abuser, who's a fraudster, who's been, what, divorced and remarried four times.
All right, Joshua.
Here's Karen in Cheshire, Connecticut, Republican.
Yeah, good morning.
I'm commenting on the woman that said that Trump was a rapist and the whole spiel there.
He's gone to so many funerals of the immigrants raping and killing our kids.
So I don't think he's a rapist.
He wouldn't be there.
Biden never showed up.
Second thing, never took a paycheck.
How greedy is he?
How greedy is he?
He doesn't take a paycheck.
I'm going to tell you that all the Trump supporters are very happy.
The Democrats are still crying, even on Facebook.
And here's Frank in Florida, Independent Line.
Yeah, this is Frank.
Yes, I know it's Frank.
Go right ahead.
I think the problem we're not getting at is the country's problem is called lawyers.
Number one.
Okay.
What's our problem in this country?
Look how many pages are written for a bill.
Okay?
He's going to hopefully stir up the pot.
In Florida, they advertise, we're going to get you more money for your claim, which makes our insurance rates go up.