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June 17, 2025 - The Charlie Kirk Show
34:55
President Trump is a Man Made for This Moment
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Hey, everybody.
Charlie Kirk here, live from the Bitcoin.com studio.
Is the U.S. going to get involved in this war in Iran?
Well, we have the USS Nimitz mobilizing.
American troops are on guard.
President Donald Trump is issuing threats to the supreme leader.
We analyze and more.
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Okay, let's do some updates about Israel and Iran and potentially the United States.
Right now, there is a mass mobilization underway of U.S. aircraft and the USS Nimitz into the Middle East to be prepared.
In fact, the president right now, President of the United States, President Trump, is sending up some very serious, He says, quote, We know exactly where the so-called supreme leader is hiding.
He is an easy target but is safe there.
We're not going to take him out.
Kill.
I love that.
At least not for now.
But we don't want missiles shot at civilians or American soldiers.
Our patience is wearing thin.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
And then President Trump says two words in all caps.
Unconditional surrender.
For 10 years, President Donald Trump has said that Iran should not get a nuclear weapon.
For 10 years, he has been consistent about this.
And so now, President Trump is left with a choice.
Israel has done a lot of work in Iran.
They have bombed a lot of targets.
But there are some nuclear facilities where the weaponry is hidden within a mountain.
It is within a deep, deep bunker.
And it would potentially require U.S. involvement or what's called bunker-busting bombs, otherwise brokered by B-52 or American bombers.
Now, in situations like this, it's important to understand that we do not know all the facts or the circumstances or the elements surrounding this.
President Donald Trump has to make a very important decision.
Does the United States get involved kinetically against Iran?
So what would this look like?
If the United States were to get involved with Iran, you can see all public reports, it looks like there is a mobilization to the region.
America bombing Iran would be a direct escalation.
Now, it would not be the same as bombing their oil fields or even bombing the supreme leader.
The most basic action would be drop a bunker buster on their underground nuclear plant.
And some people claim that's the only thing we have to do.
But the cautionary tale that I would say both privately and publicly, and I'm going to Washington, D.C. tomorrow, and I will say this on the show, and I'll say this to anyone that will listen.
It's very hard to stop a war when you want, and it's hard to stop a war once you're in the midst of a war.
So let's say that the United States bombs Ford out with bunker-busting bombs, and Iran getting a nuclear weapon.
Not good.
No one wants that.
You can see how it's changed the geopolitical calculus when North Korea has a nuclear weapon.
It makes us treat North Korea in a way that we otherwise would not treat it.
We have to put more time, attention, detail, troops, intelligence, what otherwise would be a third world country, the fact they have a nuclear weapon.
We have to take them far more seriously.
If we were to bomb Fordow, Iran would likely and probably consider this to be an act of war.
Would they respond and try to target U.S. bases?
Would they try and target U.S. troops?
Would they activate sleeper cells within the interior of the United States?
These are all things that President Trump has to factor in.
On the other side, President Donald Trump has said, I will not allow Iran to get a nuclear weapon because he has said, when crazy people have weapons of unthinkable violence, you have to deal in reality.
The longer I live, the more I realize that puritanical, ideological approaches to situations like this are not helpful.
On one side is the Lindsey Graham, John Bolton types, where they are actively calling for regime change.
Can we play the tape of Lindsey Graham yesterday?
Who's just, quite honestly, just making a lunatic of himself.
He just looks like a lunatic on that.
Time for us to close the chapter on the mullahs and the ayatollah.
So let me first just paint to you the two extremes, and then also let you know that's actually not how life works.
And Donald Trump is actually rejecting both extremes.
Here is Lindsey Graham.
This is just lunacy.
This kind of analysis is not helpful.
This kind of approach, this kind of argument...
This is now that we want to go all in and take out the regime.
It's time for us to close the chapter on the Iranian Ayatollah and his henchmen and start a new chapter in the Middle East.
That sounds good, doesn't it?
But what have we learned when it comes to wars, and especially wars in the Middle East?
What you draw up on a whiteboard...
What you think theoretically is going to occur, there might be unintended and unforeseen consequences, especially when you're talking about a country two and a half times the size of Texas and has 90 million people and was an ancient and great power with well over a dozen ethnic groups.
You have underground Christians.
You don't really have many Jews left in Persia, but also you have secular younger Persians.
Who's going to run the country exactly, Lindsey Graham?
This sounds like Hillary Rodham Clinton in Libya.
So I'm pointing to the first extreme right now, the neoconservative extreme, the we must go take off the head of the snake right now.
And Donald Trump is doing a phenomenal job of resisting these calls for regime change.
He's playing around with it on Truth Social, as he should rhetorically.
President Trump should rhetorically taunt and rhetorically threaten regime change.
Absolutely he should engage in information warfare.
Play cut 285.
Be all in, President Trump, in helping Israel eliminate the nuclear threat.
If we need to provide bombs to Israel, provide bombs.
If we need to fly planes with Israel, Do joint operations.
But here's the bigger question.
Wouldn't the world be better off if the Ayatollahs went away and replaced by something better?
Wouldn't Iran be better off?
It's time to close the chapter on the Iranian Ayatollah and his henchmen.
Let's close that chapter soon and start a new chapter in the Mideast, one of tolerance, hope, and peace.
Okay, that sounds good, but that's pathologically insane.
I'm sorry.
It is.
How do you know it's going to be better?
Yeah, the Ayatollah's awful.
But maybe he's one of the few guys that can keep that country together and not have a 90 million person civil war.
Lindsey Graham is so consistently out of his mind, it's hard to even comprehend.
Iran is hugely diverse.
It is a massive country.
Do the people agitating for war even know that?
Because be clear, regime change is war.
Just to understand, regime change is not like changing the head coach at the Chicago Bears.
It's not how it works.
Oh, we're going to bring a new head coach.
I think that some people think that it's as easy in, like, sports terms.
Oh, we're just, okay, Nick Saban is gone.
We're going to go bring in the coach from University of Washington.
Sorry, Andrew.
Oh, okay.
Mario Cristobal left the University of Oregon.
We're going to go bring in Dan Lanning, which actually ended up being very good regime change.
It doesn't work that way.
It's not like a clean transfer.
Typically in the Mideast, it's very messy, creates a quagmire, and then there is civil war.
Do you understand how large Iran is?
It's massive.
It's a very big country.
It's mountainous.
It makes Afghanistan and Iraq look like a cakewalk.
Just look at this beast of a country with all the different regions, all the different dialects.
And then you have a major refugee concern of Mohammedans that will come to Europe and endanger more Christians than Jews and Mohammedans that will come to America.
No, that is wrong.
So that is one extreme.
Now Donald Trump rejects that and he says, no, no, no, I don't want regime change.
He's never ran on regime change.
He doesn't believe in regime change.
He is resistant to that.
But there is another extreme.
There is another extreme, and I get the temptation of being the other extreme.
I actually agree with a lot of this other extreme.
A lot.
I think it's healthy to have this other extreme more than the neoconservative extreme, because this extreme has been underrepresented in the public dialogue and discourse the last 20 years.
The other extreme is one that I deep respect and reverence for, because I actually think if we had that other extreme, we would not have invaded Iraq.
This other extreme is philosophically important.
Important to consider, and that's the Ron Paul extreme.
And I love Ron Paul.
Ron Paul is awesome.
I would have Ron Paul on the show regularly.
He is a hero because Ron Paul had the courage to challenge old, sacred cows of the Republican Party.
He made people defend the indefensible.
But the Ron Paul perspective is strictly isolationist.
He would say, who cares if oil goes to $140 a barrel?
That's not our role.
We don't need to police the Strait of Hormuz.
It doesn't matter if Iran gets a nuclear weapon.
Kind of fortress America, fortify it, and let the rest of the world do what it wants to do.
Sounds good, but it doesn't work as the American economy is actually largely dependent on intertwined global trade.
You don't have to like it.
It's the way it is.
I'm going to keep on building up these two extremes because President Donald Trump actually finds himself in the era methodic mean and a very prudent middle to weigh both options.
He is not an isolationist nor a neocon.
He's an American patriot.
Also, let me add on the Lindsey Graham side.
Bombing the oil field sounds good, right?
Okay, you want summer gas to go to $180 a barrel and to go to $7 a gallon?
I don't think so.
The Iranians have said they have a couple red lines.
Taking out the Ayatollah and bombing their economy is probably one of them.
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Music So you have these two extremes.
I honestly don't think the neoconservative extreme needs to be represented philosophically anymore.
It's uninteresting to me.
They've done a mess of Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, the entire Middle East, Ukraine.
We know what the neoconservatives believe.
I do think hearing out, and honestly, I agree with a lot of the I think isolationist is used as a pejorative, but let's just say restrained community.
But it doesn't matter what Charlie Kirk believes.
It's actually not that relevant.
Let me tell you what President Trump has in front of him.
And this is the stuff of which statesmen are made.
A statesman is a man at the highest moment when you have the weight of the shoulders, like Churchill or Lincoln, of the world on your shoulders, you act with prudence and not on ideological fervor.
President Donald Trump is a man made for this moment.
This is why President Trump was elected President of the United States.
So on one side, he's getting phone calls from Lindsey Graham.
Mr. President, we need to invade Iran and liberate the mullahs.
Wrong.
That's a non-starter.
I'm sorry, George W. Bush.
That was an administration ender for George W. Bush.
And the more that we remind people about Iraq and Afghanistan, I actually think it allows us towards a healthy way of viewing what's happening in Iran.
And then the other side, which is the online MAGA base, especially the younger MAGA base, is very against U.S. involvement in Iran.
And I understand it.
I share it.
I get it.
I totally understand it.
We've known nothing but quagmire, lies, deception, intel agencies that have spied on Trump, intel agencies that lied about weapons of mass destruction, intel agencies that misled us about Libya, intel agencies that led us about almost every single corner of the region.
We took an online poll.
90% of our audience and 400,000 people voted were against the United States getting involved in a war in Iran.
President Donald Trump has been saying this for nearly 10 years.
Here's a montage of President Trump saying Iran cannot have nuclear weapons.
Play cut 315.
You cannot let Iran have a nuclear weapon.
You cannot let it happen because the But everybody stopped.
They were ready to make a deal.
We would have made a deal that was great for everybody.
No nuclear weapons.
You can't give them nuclear weapons.
Now they're going to have a nuclear weapon.
But I wanted to make a deal with them.
No nuclear weapons.
You can't have nuclear weapons.
Nuclear weapons are the single greatest threat to this world.
To the whole world.
And Viktor Orban understands that.
And some others do, too.
I just didn't want Iran to have a nuclear weapon.
I said, you know, we're going to make a great deal.
Everybody's going to be happy.
You're going to be rich as hell again.
Everything's going to be great.
But you cannot have a nuclear weapon.
You can't let Iran have nuclear weapons.
Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon.
Very simple.
They cannot have a nuclear weapon.
And that's just a short little taste of what he's been saying for 10 years.
It's the man in the arena that counts.
It's easy to lob criticisms.
Easy to say, oh, why is it you are even mobilizing?
The USS Nimitz, and we have no idea how this is going to work out, but I encourage you, as you view the next couple of days, to not view things overly ideological.
In fact, we should resist ideological fervor.
Saying, oh, take out the oil fields!
No one wants poverty for the Iranian people.
You take out the oil fields, get ready for $180 a barrel gas, a lot of Iranians starting to starve, and potentially an Iranian civil war.
Take out the Ayatollah!
Resist that temptation.
That's not prudence.
That's not self-control.
That's something else talking.
That's a zeal.
And that very same zeal got us involved in a pile of garbage in Iraq.
It all felt good with shock and awe in March of 2003.
We're unstoppable.
We're going to take Iraq in a weekend.
Turns out it didn't work that way.
A lot of people died.
A lot of Americans died unnecessarily.
And so President Donald Trump finds himself in the Decision-making chair.
President Donald Trump, 10 years ago, said two things.
And he ran on it.
Not just recently, but he ran on it for a decade.
And both these things can simultaneously be true only thanks to the real politic approach of President Donald Trump and the MAGA agenda, a book that I wrote.
These two things he said 10 years ago.
Iraq war was a bloody catastrophe and a disaster, and it will never happen again, and Iran cannot get a nuclear weapon.
Only President Donald Trump can hold both those things in his hands.
Only President Trump, with prudence and practicality and wisdom, is able to weigh them both, thread the needle, and walk the tightrope.
President Donald Trump is a man made for this moment, and we should trust him.
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We have with us a great man from Oklahoma, Senator Mark Wayne Mullen, who is the liaison between the House and the Senate for the big, beautiful bill.
We're also going to ask about Israel and Iran as well.
Senator, great to see you.
Hey, Charlie.
How are you doing, brother?
I'm doing great.
First on the Iranian news, what is your analysis of what is happening?
What is going on?
Iranian nuclear program.
And what is your thoughts on how Israel's been handling and brokering this war?
Well, I think it's interesting for...
I want you to understand what you brought up, Nimitz, repositioning.
The president's posture here is the one word we need to take away is deterrence.
The president is trying to prevent an all-out war by deterrence, peace through strength, which I think is very important here.
As far as Israel, I think Israel is doing everybody in that entire region.
I don't care if you're Egypt or you're Egypt.
I don't care who you are, if you're in that region, you do not want the Iranians to have a nuclear weapon because they will kick off a nuclear war if they have it.
So Israel's doing them a favor by taking the fight to them.
And I think they're doing a great job.
And it's systematically too, right?
So you think about it that the Iranians, So they fight proxy wars, and they fight proxy wars with Hamas, Houthis, and Hezbollah.
And over the last year and a half, I mean, literally, Israel has decimated every one of them.
And then they took out their air defense.
Which Israel now controls the air defense over Iran, showing that they were just simply loud mouths, not able to back up anything.
People worried about a full-scale war.
it would be nearly impossible for the Iranian regime to actually be able to put troops into Israel.
Now they can fight a cohort war, which they are.
They're shooting missiles, which they are.
I believe that you're going to see a lot more terrorist-style activity happening in Israel, God forbid.
But what President Trump has done here is he's positioning assets by warning Iran because there has been Some credible information that they would like to hit the United States because they feel like that we are supporting Israel, which we are, but at the same time, they don't want to draw us into the fight.
And what we're doing is we're positioning ourselves so they don't draw us in a fight.
And so I think Trump is handling this, President Trump is handling this very well.
And Israelis are doing the Lord's work here by literally...
And so what do you have to say for some people, and I share some of this concern, that we do not want regime change.
Is there something short of regime change, of getting rid of the nuclear program and not potentially destabilizing the country that could result in a civil war?
I'm basically asking, in your estimation, Senator, what do you think victory looks like?
We are absolutely not talking about regime change.
The president hasn't talked about it.
We are not.
This is not Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State having the Arab Spring.
That is not.
What we're trying to do here.
President Trump has made it extremely clear that he would love to have diplomatic relationships.
He even talked about trade with Iran.
However, they will never be able to have a nuclear weapon.
So what victory looks like is their inability to ever have a nuclear weapon, or inability, that we never want them to have a nuclear weapon.
So when we can knock out their infrastructure and prevent that from ever happening, that is victory.
And this is what prevents a forever war, by the way.
When you don't know what victory looks like, if you can't define victory, that's how you have a forever war.
I'd go back and use the argument in Afghanistan.
After we took out Osama bin Laden, we should have left.
We shouldn't have dragged that on.
And I think a lot of guys that fought there would feel the same.
And so if you can define victory before it starts, which that's what President Trump has said, we will never allow you to have a nuclear weapon, ever.
Full stop.
We knock out their infrastructure, we're done.
As far as regime change, that's not on us.
That's on the people of Iran to figure out what they want to do themselves.
That's not our fight or our problem.
Yeah, and look, J.D. Vance made a really important point.
President Trump has been remarkably consistent about Iran not having a nuclear weapon.
Ten years ago yesterday, Senator Mullen, President Trump business.
And a little buried nugget in his speech was, I will stop Iran from getting nuclear weapons.
This was 10 years ago.
He talked about the border.
He talked about an invasion.
He talked about trade.
He talked about how we don't win anymore.
Let's play cut 303.
The consistency 10 years later.
It's really something.
Play cut 303.
I will stop Iran.
From getting nuclear weapons, and we won't be using a man like Secretary Kerry that has absolutely no concept of negotiation, who's making a horrible and laughable deal, who's just being tapped along as they make weapons right now.
Senator, that was ten years ago.
This is a through line of the MAGA movement.
Thoughts?
Well, I think you said it right, Charlie.
President Trump has been very consistent.
He has made it very clear we will not allow you to have a nuclear weapon.
Full stop.
And that's what this fight is all about.
Unfortunately, the Biden administration did not keep the Trump administration policies in place on anything, which is why you had disastrous withdrawal out of Afghanistan.
We had disastrous foreign policies all over the country.
That's why the Ukraine war started.
That's why we had destabilization around the world and aggressive China, because they got away from it.
But you also had an aggressive Iran who...
President Trump, by the time he got in, unfortunately, diplomacy wasn't working.
President Trump said in April that they have 60 days.
They have 60 days, and I think it was April 12th, that they had 60 days to negotiate doing away with their nuclear program.
And by the way, at midnight on the 60th day, going into the 61st day, is where the airstrikes from Israel started.
So he doesn't bluff.
Once he puts a red line out, he makes that red line very clear and decisive, and he backs it up.
And so, Senator, for people that I represent in my generation, and I share a lot of this, we're very weary of long quagmires Iraq war.
But President Trump has a different philosophy here.
He wants violent, precise action.
He does not allow a publicly stated line to not have fulfillment.
And what is the profundity and the significance of that when it comes to foreign policy?
People know where he stands.
It's clarity.
He's made his point clear in his position, and he's backing it up by repositioning our assets by deterrence.
Wanting to fight a war, but he is showing that he's prepared to fight if he must.
But he's at the same time, he's been through this whole bombing campaign, too.
He said he's been saying, I wish Iran would have came to the table.
I wish it would talk.
We're still willing to talk, but you're going to have to come to our terms.
We're not negotiating on your terms.
He has been consistent through this, through this entire situation, and that has been When world leaders know that they can trust what you say, and you're also backing it up with Reagan foreign policy, peace to strength, it gets people's attention.
And there is nobody better than this.
And by the way, there's nobody that wants peace more than President Trump as well.
And you can achieve both by showing strength and having straight talk.
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Senator Mullen, you're the liaison between the House and the Senate when it comes to the big, beautiful bill.
What should our audience know about these negotiations?
Well, they're fluid, and the president is very, very involved in this, Charlie.
What we don't want to do is get in a ping-pong back and forth where the House sends, where we send this back to the House, the House amends it, sends it back to us, and we end up going in to conference, and that would take weeks, if not months, to negotiate.
What we're trying to do is work all the problems out now, like with SALT, with the debt limit, with Medicare and Medicaid.
When we start talking about some debt limit increase, that is a very sticky subject for some because there's a lot of people in both chambers that doesn't want to put debt limit increase in this.
But understand that if we don't do this, this is a leverage point for the Democrats because we will have to raise our debt limit.
If we don't raise our debt limit, then we default.
And this is what I said on multiple places, not raising our debt limit is like not getting a business loan when you're buying a felon business.
You can have a business plan to make it profitable, but it doesn't mean you're going to make it profitable the first day.
There's a good chance that we can balance a budget in three years.
And this might get us to three years, depending on how much growth we have.
$4.5 trillion.
Huge debt increase.
I get that.
But we have to do it to get out of this problem.
As President Trump said, he didn't create this problem.
He inherited it.
It's on us to fix it.
And we've got to try fixing it.
And this bill moves us that way.
But I think probably the two sticky points.
Is the debt limit increase?
Well, three.
Debt limit increase, deficit reduction, and salt.
And salt could be the poison pill here if we don't get it right.
And so, yeah, we can't allow a poison pill.
Senator, you're from Oklahoma.
Oklahoma's well-run.
Governor Stitt is great.
You know that I visited Oklahoma State University.
You guys, I think, balance your budget or get close to it in an approximation of it.
You know, you guys have a great tax policy.
I don't understand.
What is the argument from Republicans for SALT other than they want to bring goodies home?
They are subsidizing J.B. Pritzker and Gavin Newsom and Kathy Hochul.
I know you've got to be the negotiator.
I know you've got to try to make a deal happen on SALT.
But I've got to be honest, it is a penalty for well-run red states.
Sure.
So, first of all, every state.
And the union is supposed to pass a balanced budget.
they're not allowed to carry debt.
United States, that's why I say if we would actually bring back line item appropriations where we had to appropriate every single dollar instead of bundling dollars like states do, we could actually probably balance our budget because what Doja's doing is just exactly what states do every day is they line item every single penny that is spent since we
Obviously, we do in the Senate, too.
And there's five representatives that this is their big issue.
And without their support, No, I get that.
I'm not minimalizing that.
So there's that negotiation that it's what our founding fathers wanted, right?
They wanted people to represent their backyard.
And I agree, state of Oklahoma should not be subsidizing New York and California because they have high property taxes and poor leadership in their state.
Used to, SALT was, you know, you could deduct all your property tax and you get a full deduction on it.
We cut that down to $10,000.
Your maximum was $10,000 that you couldn't claim more than $10,000 in these communities, which is the average household pays about $7,000 a month or $7,000 a year in property tax.
That's across the United States.
Obviously, in these blue-ran states, your property tax is much, much higher.
What we're negotiating right now is like, how can we get there?
The House bill put in $40,000 as a cap, which is an astronomical amount for states that – Or red states?
You're like, what?
You're paying $40,000 in property tax?
That's crazy.
But in New York, that's actually pretty common because, once again, they have a very poor rent state and they spend way more money than what they should be, so they put it on property owners' backs.
What we're negotiating right now is saying, okay, we're going to have to do something.
It's at $40,000 on the house.
Their number is 40,000, but what if we cap it?
What if we just cap it for those that need the benefit the most?
That's your teachers, your first responders, your factory workers, your line workers.
I mean, lower-income individuals.
Thank you, Senator Mullen.
Got to go.
Great, thank you.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
Email us, as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
Thanks so much for listening, and God bless.
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