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June 30, 2023 - The Charlie Kirk Show
35:36
The Five Fatal Flaws of Transgender Ideology with Frank Turek
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Fixed Genders and Biology 00:07:59
Hey everybody, Tana Charlie Kirk Show, a full episode with the very smart and terrific Frank Turek from Cross Examined.
He has a book that you should get now in its third edition, correct but not politically correct.
So check it out.
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Here we go.
Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.
I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
I want to thank Charlie.
He's an incredible guy.
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We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
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Joining us now is one of my favorite guests, author of Correct, Not Politically Correct, and also cross-examined, amongst many other things, Frank Turek, who has an important piece we're going to talk about this hour, Five Fatal Flaws in the Transgender Ideology.
Frank, welcome back to the program.
Charlie, great being with you, sir.
How are you?
I'm doing very well.
Thank you.
So walk us through this piece, Frank, and take as much time as you need.
Five fatal flaws in transgender ideology.
Frank, walk us through it.
Yeah, the first one, Charlie, is that the design of the human body proves there's only two genders.
Because look, a human being can only produce either a sperm or an egg.
There's no third category, Charlie.
And if, you know, the left's always saying, well, there's 57 genders or whatever they are.
Well, people can't produce 57 different reproductive outcomes.
Okay.
They can only produce a sperm or an egg.
And those that can't produce any one of those outcomes, a sperm or an egg, that represents an incapacity, not a third capacity.
So the design of the body, I think, proves beyond any shadow of a doubt, there's only two genders, Charlie.
Yeah, and even more specifically, two sexes.
So let's go to the next second, which is transgenderism must presuppose fixed genders.
What do you mean by that?
Yeah, this is what so many people seem to miss is on one hand, the trans activists, the leftists are trying to say there's all these different genders and gender is completely fluid.
On the other hand, they have to unwittingly presuppose there's only two genders.
Why?
Because if I'm a man and I think I'm a woman, I have to some idea what a man is and some idea what a woman is to know that I have this mismatch between my psychology and my biology.
If there was no fixed gender known as a man and no fixed gender known as a woman, I would have no way of knowing I had gender dysphoria.
Also, if I tried to make the so-called transition from being a man to being a woman, which as we'll see here in a minute, is actually physically impossible.
But if I wanted to try and do that, I would have to have some idea of what a man is and some idea of what a woman is to even know that I had this gender dysphoria and that I could try and make the transition.
So on one hand, they're trying to say there's all these different genders, it's completely fluid.
On the other hand, they have to presuppose there's only two fixed genders to make transgenderism even possible.
And that's a great segue to a third point, which is you could change your mind, but not your biology.
Yeah, before I get there, let me say one other thing about this, Charlie, because there's a bit of a civil war in the so-called LGBTQ community, which isn't really a community anymore.
Because Charlie, if the Ts get their way that there are no fixed genders, the L's, the Bs, and the Gs don't exist because they rely on fixed genders.
I mean, how can you be lesbian, gay, or bisexual if genders aren't fixed?
They rely on fixed genders.
And of course, as you know, Charlie, the feminists aren't too happy with this either because if there are no fixed genders, there are no women.
And if there are no women, there are no women's rights.
And this, of course, is why you have strange bedfellows now.
You have J.K. Rowling, the author of the Harry Potter series, who is probably personally politically liberal.
But Charlie, she's come out and saying, you're erasing women.
You're erasing women by this ideology.
And although she's been called a TERF, a transgender radical feminist or something, she's actually standing by the principle that if the transgender activists get their way, Charlie, they've erased women and they've also erased lesbian, gay, and bisexual in terms of their identity.
And by the way, this is why Matt Walsh's brilliant documentary, What is a Woman, they have so many of these academic leftists completely flummoxed by the question, Charlie.
What is a woman?
Because a woman, because when he asked them the question, if they define a woman as a biological female, then transgender ideology is false.
If they refuse to answer, which is what they tend to do and what they did on his documentary, then transgenderism isn't possible.
Because who is transitioning to what and whatever happened to women's rights if you don't even know what a woman is?
They can't define that because they'll say, well, a woman is anyone who wants to be a woman.
No, but what is the thing that you say anybody can be?
So you could change your mind, but you can't change your biology.
Talk about this, Frank.
And I would go even a step further, which is my new perspective, which is gender is a word that has been mainstreamed.
There's two sexes.
We totally agree, man and woman.
I don't even know if there's, I don't even think we have to admit there's genders.
I think we use them interchangeably, but you can change your mind, but not your biology.
What do you mean by that?
Well, in fact, you've even said this.
I've heard you say it at some of the college campuses.
You use the analogy of anorexia, which is what Dr. Paul McHugh, a psychiatrist at John Hopkins University, first revealed.
He said, transgenderism, affirming someone in their transgender, so-called gender identity is like affirming an anorexic that they're overweight.
They're not overweight.
Someone who has a mismatch between their mind and their biology needs to get their mind fixed, not their biology.
Their biology is what it is.
So if you have a woman who thinks she's overweight, but she's really anorexic, you would not help that woman by saying, honey, let me get you some liposuction, right?
I mean, you would say, no, I'm sorry, dear, your mind is telling you tricks.
You're dangerously underweight.
We need to get you nutrition.
And you wouldn't tell a transabled person, this is kind of a new thing out there, where people are saying, you know, I really, in my mind, am disabled, but all my limbs work, but you cut off my right arm for me.
No, you wouldn't say, yeah, let me do that.
You'd say, no, you got a problem in your mind.
And Charlie, if your beautiful daughter at one point said, you know, I'm a mermaid, dad, you wouldn't take her off the coast and drop her in the ocean, would you?
I mean, you would say, dear, you're suffering a delusion here.
This is the problem.
You can change your mind, but you can't change your biology.
You can't change your 100 trillion cells.
You can't change your DNA.
Saving Babies with Courage 00:03:29
And by the way, Charlie, one of the reasons I appreciate your work and TPUSA and TPUSA faith is because you're trying to get particularly pastors and Christians to speak up for the truth.
But Charlie, let me tell you this.
People like Bill Maher and people like Richard Dawkins, probably the most famous atheist in the world today, these men, unfortunately, have more courage than most American pastors.
Bill Maher has come out and said, look, you know, kids go through phases.
You know, if every kid knew what he wanted to be when he was eight, the world would be filled with cowboys and princesses, but they're not.
In fact, he said, when I was a kid, I wanted to be a pirate.
That's true.
Thank God nobody took me seriously and took me for peg leg and eye removal surgery.
And then Richard Dawkins, Charlie, recently came out and said, I'm sorry, there's only two genders.
It's science.
Get over it.
I mean, he has more courage and more sense to speak on this issue than most American pastors, Charlie.
We got a lot of work to do.
We got a lot of work to do to try and get people and Christians to try and speak up on this issue.
We have to overwhelm the system.
Look, they can fire one person who speaks out.
They can't do it to 100,000.
They can't do it to a million.
Most people find this ridiculous.
And most people haven't even heard the logical arguments.
They think, oh, wow, 13-year-old, they're going to kill themselves if they don't get benzodiazepines in addition to hormone blockers with Lupron.
No, no, no, no.
There's a rational way to think about this.
And you went through it beautifully, Frank.
And then most people know this is wrong.
Hey, everybody.
Look, if you're pro-life, listen carefully.
It's important to advocate for pro-life laws.
I'm all in favor of that.
Pro-life legislation, supporting pro-life candidates.
But you have to simultaneously do the other thing.
I believe you actually have an obligation, which is to support women in need and babies in need that are at risk of being aborted.
Look, when you introduce a girl to her baby by providing an ultrasound, you're giving her the truth at the most critical and important time in her life.
85% of the time when they actually see the baby, they choose life.
Now, mind you, pre-born provides resources.
They provide diapers, baby clothes.
And I encourage you, if you're pro-life, to pray about this, are you giving money to actually support the unborn if you are voting for pro-life?
Look, $140 gives five mothers a free ultrasound and saves babies.
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Whether you want to save one baby or five or hundreds, this opportunity is just a phone call or click away.
I think the world of pre-born, I give money financially.
And every one of you that are pro-life, I believe you have a duty and an obligation to go to preborn.org slash Kirk and give as you can, give your best gift, or call 833-850-2229.
That is 833-850-BABY.
Go to preborn.org slash Kirk.
That is preborn.org slash Kirk.
So Frank, build out number three.
I know we touched on it briefly here, but number three here, you could change your mind, not your biology, which then kind of segues to number four.
Christians Speaking Truth 00:15:12
Sex is not assigned at birth.
And I do want to pick up the pastor thing, but let's start with number four.
Sex is not assigned at birth.
Yeah, for transgender advocates to succeed, Charlie, they got to get people to believe what they know is really the unbelievable idea that sex is assigned at birth rather than discovered.
We all know it's discovered.
I mean, when a baby pops out of the womb, we don't, the doctor doesn't go, gee, I wonder what this thing is, right?
We immediately know it's either a boy or a girl.
It's quite obvious.
And by the way, Charlie, as you know, I do a lot of work in Christian apologetics.
I wrote a book called I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist.
And when I go to a college campus, I'm giving more of the evidence that Christianity is true, that God does exist.
And sometimes when people suggest there's no evidence for God, I'll ask them, is there any evidence for gender?
And Charlie, if they say no, I'll say, I can't believe that.
I love that.
I can't help you with the God question, man.
If you can't look in the mirror and know what you are, how am I going to convince you there's an invisible being that created and sustains the world?
You won't believe what's right in front of you.
I mean, come on.
Yeah, and they accuse us of not living in reality.
And this really is a war on reality, is what it is.
So number five, and then I want to talk more philosophically.
I want to talk more.
And we have some pieces of tape here that are important here.
There is no basis for transgender rights.
What do you mean by that?
Well, I mean, there's no basis for any rights unless God exists, whether it's transgender rights or just human rights.
There are no rights at all if there is no God.
As our Declaration of Independence put it, we hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created and endowed by their government.
No.
Endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights.
Among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Governments are merely instituted among men to secure these rights, not to give you rights or not to take away rights.
But Charlie, in our country today, it seems like we have people who are creating rights every 10 minutes, and many of them are atheists.
They have no way to justify rights.
If there's no God, everything's a matter of opinion.
It's just my opinion against your opinion, or it's just Hitler's opinion against, say, Mother Teresa's opinion.
There is no standard unless God exists.
There is no objective standard of rightness, which means there are no rights.
Everybody just has their own opinion.
Now, you know in your heart, I know in my heart, we all know in all of our hearts, if we are really honest about this, that there are certain things that are objectively right and other things that are objectively wrong.
One of the things that is objectively right, the right to life is an objective right and everybody knows it.
We may suppress it.
We may want to go our own way, but we know it's true.
The problem is we also know that it's wrong to mutilate children, yet some people are suppressing that now, Charlie, in the name of some sort of transgender ideology, which I think is horrific.
And if we don't start calling evil what it really is, our country is going to crumble and young people especially are going to get hurt.
So we need to stand right now, draw a line in the sand.
I don't care whether you're a Christian or not.
You know it's wrong to mutilate children.
Why are you allowing it on your watch?
Yeah, no, that's exactly right.
The pastors.
You know, you spoke at our pastor summit in Nashville, Tennessee, 1,100 pastors, and we had a variety of speakers.
You did a great job, and I'm glad you were there.
I think we have you come in in San Diego as well to our upcoming one in September.
So not, I would say maybe 20% or 30% of American pastors are speaking out on this.
Now, let's be clear, this is not the only thing they should be speaking out, obviously, but maybe a little mention here or there.
Your thoughts on this.
Two questions you need to ask someone who says we ought not be involved in politics as Christians.
First question, should Christians care how other people are treated?
Who's going to say no?
Of course.
Next question.
Should Christians care how people are treated by their government?
Well, yeah, of course we ought to care how people are treated by their government.
Welcome to politics, ladies and gentlemen.
It's not our first calling, but as you have said, Charlie, our first calling is to bring people the gospel.
Our second calling is to ensure that the government allows us to do the first calling because governments can stop our ability from preaching and living the gospel.
You don't think so.
You can go to some of the countries I've been to, Iran, Saudi Arabia, China.
We can't have the Charlie Kirk show or a church in any of those countries.
Why?
Because politically they've ruled it out.
And we take it for granted that we have religious freedom in this country, Charlie, but we need to stand up to ensure we keep that religious freedom.
And for no other reason, to preach and live the gospel and to help other people know what the right thing to do is.
Very powerful dialectic.
Do you care how other people are treated?
And do you care how the government treats us or treats people?
I want to tell you guys about something every single one of you can benefit from, and you guys need to change.
It's who we use when we go to get mortgages.
Look, I balance a lot of stuff.
I'm traveling all the time, my show, and I recently needed to get a mortgage to get something figured out.
And it was a tough one.
And I didn't want to go to those woke banks.
I, you know, I did previous, my last mortgage we did.
It was with a woke bank, and they were just, they were bureaucratic and they donate the BLM and the gay agenda and all that stuff.
And I said, what can I do to actually, and I said, of course, duh, hello, andrewandodd.com.
They're Christian.
They're conservative.
Our worldviews are aligned.
They're fabulous people.
When I needed a mortgage, of course, I went to my friends, Andrew Delray and Todd of Aiken at Sierra Pacific.
And look, this is the first time I used them because, you know, we were just recently started doing stuff on the show and partners.
I said, okay, let's see how it is.
You know, we do a lot of things together.
I was blown away.
They respond within minutes.
They walked me through everything.
They took care of all those details I didn't have time for.
And I said, boy, guys, I now see how great you guys actually are.
Responsive.
And yes, no more of this woke stuff.
Stop using the woke banks.
Oh, I want to refinance my home and I'm going to go to a bank that hates me.
Stop doing that.
Instead, go to AndrewandTodd.com.
So if you or someone you know is moving from blue states to red states, AndrewandTodd.com.
Have an aging family member that needs financial relief because you may be a reverse mortgage, AndrewandTodd.com.
Are you self-employed and finding it hard to qualify?
Or first-time homebuyer?
AndrewandTodd.com.
Again, what I love, again, I'm just friends with them.
So I could tell you, I have no other reason to say this except that it's true.
They're fabulous.
They work hard.
We go out to dinner together.
They're great people.
So don't depend on those woke banks, the big banks.
They do a terrible job, by the way.
They're funding all the destructive stuff.
They want centralized bank digital currency.
They're all part of the great reset.
This is a group of men.
Get rid of that.
This is a group of guys.
They do a great job.
And stop depending on woke banks.
For what I needed, I saw it firsthand.
They got it done for me.
And it was very complicated.
It was a ficket.
It was a maze.
It was a labyrinth.
And they said, oh, you got to do this and this.
And I'll make this phone call.
We'll do this and this paperwork.
And again, these other banks that I deal with, it's like, here's 955,000 pages to sign, and they don't call you back, and they don't work weekends.
I had a problem with one of the things on the process because it was one thing that wasn't filled out.
And they respond on a Sunday within minutes.
You're trying to get a response from a woke bank on a Sunday.
You'll say, sorry, no response.
So check it out.
It's AndrewandTodd.com, 888, 888, 1172.
That's how you call them and say, Charlie Kirk sent you.
You might actually get them on the phone.
Again, they're value-aligned, honest, trustworthy, wonderful people.
I use them.
You should use them too.
Super responsive, blown away.
And I could say, if they're good for me, they're good for you.
Love these guys.
AndrewandTodd.com, 88-8, 888, 1172.
And finally, some of you might say, oh, Charlie, bad time to buy a home.
I don't know about that.
You should look what's happening.
Commercial real estate is one thing.
Private single-family home ownership, it might actually stabilize and go up in the next year.
If you're young, it might be the time to get in.
Think about it, pray about it.
But most importantly, go to AndrewandTodd.com for all your mortgage needs.
Great guys, AndrewandTodd.com.
So, Frank, I think part of the problem is many pastors are just afraid to engage on these topics.
Why do you think that is, Frank?
I think part of the reason is because they're afraid they're going to lose people on their staff because people in the congregation are going to walk out and they're not going to have as much income to come in.
I think that's one reason.
And actually, in reality, that will happen initially, but then you're going to have more people showing up at your church and they're going to be truly devoted disciples.
In fact, Tony Perkins at the Family Research Council points this out.
If you start preaching on the hard issues of the day, some people are going to get up and leave, but a lot more people are going to show up and they're going to be strong advocates and strong disciples.
And our own friend, our mutual friend Jack Hibbs, found this out.
I mean, his church has doubled since COVID, Charlie, as you well know.
You and I have both spoken there on numerous occasions.
And it's because Jack draws lines in the sand.
He does not back down on any of these issues.
He wants people to know the truth.
And that's what love does, Charlie.
Love doesn't mean you approve of what people do.
Love means you love them enough to tell them the truth.
And that's what Charlie, that's what Jack Hibbs does, and a few other pastors I know as well.
Unfortunately, the majority of pastors are silent on these issues, Charlie.
And I think maybe another reason is they don't know how to deal with them.
And that's why what you're doing at TPUSA Faith is you're equipping pastors with the ability to speak on these issues in a coherent and not obnoxious way.
Well, thank you.
I appreciate that.
And hopefully we can get more pastors to speak out and do the same.
And so what we have here is a spiritual struggle.
Frank, can you talk about this?
What is the spiritual component to the trans issue?
What are the invisible dimensions here?
What do the scriptures say about this theology when it comes to rejecting one's own biology?
God made us male and female in his image.
And when we attack that binary, we're attacking the image of God.
And we're not helping people by doing this, Charlie.
In the book, by the way, the book is called Correct, Not Politically Correct, and it's in third edition.
I originally wrote it in 2008.
I updated it in 2016 after the Supreme Court decision imposed same-sex marriage on the entire nation.
And then I just updated again this year with regard to transgenderism.
It does not quote Bible verses, Charlie.
This is not a book that's written from a biblical perspective in the sense that I'm quoting Bible verses.
I'm making the natural law, medical, common sense case that neither same-sex marriage nor transgenderism is either good for individuals or good for a society.
And the spiritual component, however, is the fact that we are made in the image of God, that there are men and women.
And by attacking that, by attacking the gender binary, we're attacking the very image of God.
And I think it's unpacked quite well to go to the Bible here by the Apostle Paul when he writes in his great book of Romans in Romans chapter one.
It begins, Charlie, with suppressing the truth, that we know the truth.
We know there's a God.
His invisible qualities are clearly seen so that we are without excuse.
But we often suppress the truth about him, Charlie.
And it's not just unbelievers that are guilty of this.
Sometimes Christians are as well.
We suppress the truth about God and about his standard of rightness because we want to go another way.
We want to do our own thing.
And Paul warns us that if we do that long enough, particularly on the sexual issues, God is going to leave us.
He's going to give us up to a depraved mind to the point where we are not only doing evil, Charlie, but we're cheering on other people who are doing evil.
Case in point, just yesterday, the day before, the governor of New York, Hochul, signed a bill which made, according to her, New York a safe haven for kids that want to get gender reassignment surgery.
She wants young people to get mutilated, to mutilate their bodies.
She should know it's impossible to change your biology.
Yet she thinks this is the way forward rather than good counseling, which is the proper way to deal with a mental issue.
You don't deal with a mental delusion with surgery.
You deal with it with psychiatry, with cognitive therapy, as you have said many times yourself.
Yet you have the left here completely deranged here, Charlie.
I mean, you see it when you go on college campuses, how they're coming up against you, trying to say that people have certain trans rights.
First of all, they have no... no way to justify what a right is unless God exists.
And secondly, they're actually for the mutilation of children when we know from the data, as I document in the book, that 80% of kids that have this so-called gender dysphoria grow out of it by the time they're 18.
So why would you give them Lupron, which is what we used to give to sex offenders to chemically castrate them, or God forbid, surgery to fix a problem that's going to fix itself anyway?
This is madness, Charlie.
It is madness.
And the enemy wants to try to get to as many children as possible and spiritually corrupt them and have them either believe in nothing and or destroy their life, which is exactly what we're seeing.
And the church has to stand against this, has to stand against it.
And I think it's important, Frank, and I'm glad you said transgender ideology, that this is something that we are teaching.
This is something that is increasing because it's a social contagion.
It's not quote unquote within, it's actually against the natural law.
So also talk, Frank, you wrote the book, correct, not politically correct.
As you mentioned, that was largely in the debate about marriage, right?
One man, one woman marriage.
Just look at the sexual degeneracy in the last 10 or 15 years.
Did you ever anticipate when you first wrote that book the nonsense that we'd be living through now?
Well, actually, I kind of did.
That's why I left the first half of the book as it was when I updated it this year, because I said that this kind of degeneracy is going to happen, that people that are basically for man-woman marriage are going to be deemed like they're racists, like they're bigots.
Well, that has come true, unfortunately.
And if you take away a man-woman marriage and you say just any two people can get married, in other words, you make marriage genderless, then why two?
Because the reason it's two between a man and a woman is for procreation.
But if procreation isn't part of the deal, Charlie, then why stop at two?
Why not go to three, four, five?
And we're starting to see that now.
So the madness continues, Charlie, because we've broken away from the natural law standard, which comes from God himself.
Although you don't need to believe in God or you don't need to be a Christian or any other kind of theist to know this, you know it because it's written on your heart.
Now, as we mentioned earlier, you could suppress that to go your own way.
Morality of Marriage Union 00:08:15
But we point that out.
So in the book, correct, not politically correct, we're also pointing out, by the way, Charlie, that there is no such thing as a valueless society, that everyone's trying to legislate morality.
The only question is whose morality will be legislated.
Notice that Kathy Hochl up there in New York is trying to legislate a certain morality.
She's trying to say it's morally wrong to prevent kids from mutilating themselves or doctors from mutilating them.
Charlie, if we rewound this and went back 70 years, this is Joseph Mengela stuff.
We're experimenting on kids because there's no known protocol to change the sexes because it's impossible.
These doctors are making this up as they go, Charlie.
So it's tragic.
That's right.
It really is.
There's no basis.
There's no basis to permanently mutilate a child and irreversibly and call it science.
Frank, can you comment on the gender?
So we're coming to the end of not so pride month.
Pride is a sin.
How should we take this?
Pride is the deadliest of all sins, according to the Catholic Church.
And we may or may not agree with that, but that's their theology, what they've written and published.
Pride month.
This has gotten totally out of control, Frank.
How should we as Christians continue to respond to this ridiculous pride celebration of sexual degeneracy?
Well, I think as Christians, we ought to speak the truth, but speak the truth in a way that people can understand that the reason we're speaking the truth is not because we have to get our way.
It's not my way.
It's not my morality that I think ought to be legislated.
It's not your morality, Charlie.
It's the morality.
The one Thomas Jefferson said was self-evident.
The one the Apostle Paul said, the Gentiles and I have the law of the law written on their hearts.
So I'm not trying to impose my own view.
I didn't make these morals up, Charlie.
I didn't make up the fact that murder is wrong, that abortion is wrong, that rape is wrong, that theft is wrong, that men were made for women and women were made for men.
And the best way to perpetuate and stabilize society, which is the reason the government's involved in marriage to begin with, is to legally recognize the man-woman relationship over every other relationship.
I didn't make any of that up, Charlie.
It's not my morality.
It happens to be the morality.
And if someone has a problem with that, you really don't have a problem with me.
I didn't invent it.
You have a problem with the creator upon whose nature this morality is derived.
And we think, I think, and I think you think, Charlie, and I think most reasonable people, if they really looked at it, would realize that this morality is the morality that puts forth human beings to flourish the best.
That's why we're for it.
We want human beings to flourish.
And we're derelict if we sit on the sidelines and we think what we know what the truth is, and we're silent about it, Charlie.
We're silent.
We can't be silent if the world is going down and we know what the lifeboat is.
We know what the lifeboat, we know what the right thing to do is.
And we're trying to show people that.
They may reject us.
They may hate us for it, but we have to tell people the truth and leave the results to God.
That's what love does, Charlie.
Yeah, love is not affirmation.
Talk about that, Frank, because we're told that we must have gender-affirming care or affirm people's lifestyle.
Should we?
Well, no, not if it's harmful.
And this is harmful, as I document in the book, correct, not politically correct.
It's harmful medically.
And no, love does not require approval.
I mean, any parent knows that if he or she approves of everything his kid or her kid wants to do when they're 12 years old, that parent isn't loving.
You don't love people by approving what's evil.
You love people by seeking what's best for them.
And that means standing in the way of evil.
Every parent should know that.
And from a biblical perspective, Paul says, and by the way, this is the passage everyone reads at their wedding, but nobody obeys 1 Corinthians 13.
Paul says, love always protects.
Love does not rejoice in wrongdoing.
Love rejoices in the truth.
Love does what's right, Charlie.
It doesn't approve of evil.
And tolerance of evil is the virtue of a dying society.
And that tragically is where we are, Charlie.
We're a dying society because we're tolerating everything, including evil.
You've lived through enough pride months now.
I'm starting to see some pushback.
Do you agree that finally some people are speaking out?
And this was probably one of the most promising pride months, a sense of finally we have people that are calling out the wickedness.
Do you agree with that, Frank?
Yeah, absolutely, Charlie.
In fact, Douglas Murray was on a program recently.
And as you know, Douglas identifies as a gay man, but he was talking to a leftist on this program.
He was saying, do you know that support for same-sex marriage in America is dropping largely because the entire LGBTQ community is now identified with Pride Month, which is going after children.
And as soon as you start going after children, whether it's through this transgender surgery or these hormone treatments or the drag queens in New York City saying, we're here, we're queer and we're coming for your children.
Suddenly people are starting to pay attention now.
They're going, okay, we were okay with consenting adults doing this, but now you're going after our children.
And your producer, Andrew, yesterday on the program pointed this out, Charlie, that it's the logical outworking of these people to go after children because they know that the next generation, first of all, they can't reproduce themselves support.
They have to recruit and get people to get them.
They have to recruit because they can't reproduce.
Yeah, that's right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And now there are reasonable people that we both know, Charlie, like Douglas Murray, like Dave Rubin, who identify themselves as gay, but they are completely against all this pride hoopla here because it's actually hurting the acceptance of what they want to do in society by grouping all these other behaviors in with it.
And this is the problem.
It's the slippery slope.
It just goes on.
And by the way, Charlie, let me say one other thing about this.
I really don't think that overall the LGBTQ community was the most responsible for bringing gay marriage into law here through the Supreme Court.
I really think it was heterosexuals all the way back to 1969 who paved the runway for this because it started with Ronald Reagan, believe it or not, signing the first no-fault divorce bill.
Good intended, by the way.
He later came to regret that.
But the reason he signed it is because the culture had bought into the idea that marriage was just a romantic relationship that required romantic affinity between two people.
It didn't have anything to do with children, therefore.
Well, that kind of idea brought what was brought forward through the 70s and 80s and 90s to the point where people said, well, yeah, if marriage is just all about romance, why does it have to be a man and a woman?
Why couldn't it be two men?
And now we're bearing the fruits of that.
Now marriage is genderless.
Children are an afterthought in marriage.
And that's the real problem with same-sex marriage.
It's not same-sex marriage per se.
It's that marriage is now genderless, Charlie.
And if it's genderless, it no longer has anything to do with children.
And if marriage isn't the institution to protect children, Charlie, what institution is there to protect children?
There isn't one.
That's the problem.
It's a union of opposites, too.
Anyone who's married knows that it's a union of opposites.
It's two totally different parts that come together to create something that the independent otherwise would not be able to do.
Children, marriage, having a family, and other things too.
So marriage is a very specific thing, a new thing in and of itself.
And when you have two of the same thing, you don't get that same thing in creation that way.
Check out Frank Turek's third edition of Correct, Not Politically Correct.
Blessings from Frank Turek 00:00:39
Frank Turek is a great friend.
He's an excellent person.
I really think highly of him and honored to be in the trenches with Frank Turek, a truth teller for our time.
And check out his ministry, cross-examined.
They go to college campuses with apologetics.
He's one of the best, if not the best in the country on this.
Frank, God bless you.
See you soon.
Thank you so much.
God bless you, Charlie.
Thanks so much.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
Email us your thoughts as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
Thanks so much for listening and God bless.
For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.
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