One of the Most Enjoyable Conversations I've Ever Had with Historian Bill Federer and Rob McCoy
Charlie welcomes one of the foremost history experts in the entire country, Bill Federer, author of the newsletter and devotionals (and 25 history books), The American Minute. Bill lays out exactly why America is an exceptional nation, unlike any other country in the history of the world. Bill explains why the soil of America was uniquely poised for a revolution of human freedom unlike any the world had ever seen. Why was the soil of America perfect for freedom when so many other regions of the world have failed to accomplish such an outcome? Bill has some incredible answers for this question that you have to hear. But fast forward to 2022, Charlie asks Bill why America is in trouble? What does history tell us about our current moment? What does the Bible say? What does the history of Rome and Greece tell us about the United States? But as Charlie points out, America is not Rome, it is not ancient Greece, so where does this end? What is the Fibonacci sequence and the Fifth generation of war have to say about America's current moment of conflict? For one of the most profound conversations you will ever hear, brought to you by Bill Federer and Rob McCoy, this is an absolutely can't miss episode of The Charlie Kirk Show. Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Extraordinary Conversation with Bill Federer00:02:51
Hey, everybody.
One of the most extraordinary conversations I've had in recent memory.
You are going to learn a lot.
We talk about so many different topics.
One of the most brilliant minds in America, Bill Federer.
We talk about the historical implications.
We ask the question: is America truly a historically unique country?
I think you are really going to enjoy this conversation with the brilliant Bill Federer.
It's a back and forth conversation.
It's worth listening to every word.
I learned a lot.
You're going to learn a lot.
There's no advertisers on this episode.
So support our show if you can at charliekirk.com/slash support.
I want to thank those of you that helped make that possible.
Edwina from Washington.
Thank you.
Nicole from Florida.
Mike from California.
Laura from South Carolina and Serena from California.
That's charliekirk.com/slash support.
You can email me your thoughts as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
That is freedom at charliekirk.com.
Deeply appreciate that.
And you can get engaged and involved with Turning PointUSA today at tpusa.com.
That is tpusa.com.
Start a high school chapter.
Start a college chapter today at tpusa.com.
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Buckle up, everybody.
Here we go.
Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.
I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
I want to thank Charlie.
He's an incredible guy.
His spirit, his love of this country.
He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created.
Turning point USA.
We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
That's why we are here.
We are here with Bill Federer and Rob McCoy.
Bill, welcome back to the program.
Hey, Charlie, great to be with you.
Bill is the history whiz.
Yes, he is.
Is that, I mean, Rob, I've never met anyone like Bill.
Prolific is one way to describe you.
How many books?
It's about 25.
All history books.
Yeah, I try to learn lessons from history.
People say history repeats itself.
Really, human nature repeats itself, and you observe the patterns.
It's sort of like the government is collecting all the information on you and all the listeners from their cell phones and emails and web searches, and they're taking all that data and running an algorithm on it to get predictive.
And so if you study enough history and you see the patterns, you can be predictive, right?
And so I tell people that history is not prophetic, but it is predictive.
So what does history tell you about the moment we're in?
Or tell us?
History Repeats Human Nature Patterns00:14:44
The default setting for human nature is gangs, tribes.
Power wants to concentrate into the hands of one person.
And you go back through history and you have the most common form of governments, kings, Nimrod, Pharaoh, Caesar, Kaiser, Sultan Tsar.
And you can plot it out.
At some point, it's going to max out on a global level.
And, you know, if Genghis Khan killed 30 million people, if he hadn't died, he'd have been happy to keep killing.
You know, Mao Zedong kills 80 million if he hadn't died.
And so that spirit is still there.
And then, but Jesus says wheat and tares grow together till the harvest.
So you always have, you know, I always try to spiritualize, but you always have the spiritual descendants of Cain always trying to kill the spiritual descendants of Abel.
You know, and the only thing that changes over time is military advancements allow the king to kill more people and technological advancements allow him to attract more people.
The stakes get higher, but it's that same fallen nature.
And at the same time, the stories we love best in the Bible are when things look hopeless and God raises up little nobodies with faith and courage.
And whether it's a David, a Gideon, a Moses, this is just our turn.
And so it's exciting.
And I think, you know, I don't can't speak for women.
There is such a thing as a woman.
And can't speak for women, but as men, we sort of like a fight.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I'm one of 11 kids, five brothers, five sisters.
You know, we would like always be wrestling.
And boys play cowboys and Indians and army men.
And it's sort of like we get to participate in the great struggle of all humanity.
So you study history.
Has there ever been a nation like America?
No.
So that would be the one thing that is different.
Yes.
It stands out atop of history.
Yes.
Why?
If I were to sum up in one word, it would be individual.
So America, you have rights and worth as an individual.
And the government's job is to protect your individual rights.
Every other culture, your worth and value is as part of a group.
So it's called honor-shame culture in the Far East.
If the group honors you, your worth goes up.
If the group shames you, your worth goes down.
In Islam, they call it the Uma, the community.
And if you're shamed in front of your community, they'll even kill their own daughter if she embarrasses them right in front of their group.
But the Judeo-Christian model is you have a worth because you're made in the image of God, not because you're a Brahmin in the highest caste or a Muslim male, or you can contribute to society.
You're worth something because you're made in the image of God.
And this God says there's no respect for persons in judgment.
Where did they come up with such a profound idea?
Actually, the law of Moses, right?
When Moses comes down the mountain, and the law says that every individual is made in the image of God.
And it's this awareness for 400 years, Israel didn't have a king.
So there was no hierarchy, no royal family to butter up next to.
And the idea is that God is watching everyone.
He wants you to be fair, and he's going to hold you accountable in the future.
Why didn't medieval Europe that had the law of Moses?
Why didn't they get this right?
Kings, they had the structure of once the Roman Empire fell, you basically reverted back to kings.
You did have in England the code of Alfred the Great, right?
A little history, you have the Viking invaders.
Right.
So you have Ireland and Patrick, and he would get rid of the Druid religion, and the Irish come to Patrick and say, okay, we don't chop off heads anymore.
How are we going to do government?
And so Patrick took a little of the Latin law, a little bit of the Bible, and a little bit of the Irish law, and he put it together.
It's called the Code of Patrick.
And so when these Irish missionaries would evangelize, they'd not just take the gospel, they'd take this Code of Patrick, and they would go into Europe and evangelize all those heathen hordes that had overrun the Roman Empire, and they would bring this law, and it sort of receded.
So in England, it was the Anglos and Saxons were tribes that had come in and they converted to Christianity.
And so it was Alfred the Great around the year 800 that he took this code of Patrick, codified it.
But later, William the Conqueror conquered England and brought in this top-down law.
So that's the struggle that we always see in England, common law versus the top-down law.
But why America?
Why was it all of a sudden we were able to bring the ideals of self-government into practice?
Because there was a struggle, obviously, against King George and our origins.
If we stand atop history, and I agree with you, as respecting the individual, what caused that to manifest?
Interesting goes back to the Reformation that goes back to the early church and the idea of a church government that's congregational in the model versus the hierarchical model.
The hierarchical model in England, the king was at the top.
And your relationship with God is through this structure of Archbishop of Canterbury and so forth.
But in the Protestant Puritan model, there's a group.
It's an ecclesia, a body.
And the pastor's job is to get everybody to have their relationship with the Lord and then coach them to become mature Christians and find their place in the body and plug in and this thing grows.
And that was the situation in New England, not in Virginia, but in New England.
And so they basically took...
Why not Virginia?
Virginia was a royal crown colony.
So almost from... Anglican then in nature?
Correct.
And Maryland would be Catholic, the only of the...
Right.
Maryland was founded by Catholics.
Charles Carroll or whatever.
Craig was the only Catholic who signed the Declaration.
He's from Maryland.
But New England was Protestant in nature, right?
Roger Williams.
Roger Williams, Rhode Island, Thomas Hooker in Connecticut.
You had...
Can you take it all the way back to when they were blown off course?
Yeah, this is interesting.
The Mayflower, right?
Yeah.
So the king in England passed the Conventicle Act, which is if you have five people meeting in a small group, they call them a conventicle.
It comes from the word covenant, where two or three are gathered in my name.
But if you're meeting without the government approval, the police will bust in and arrest everyone.
And then they passed the Five Mile Act.
If you were caught preaching within five miles of a town without approval of the government, they'd arrest you.
And then they passed the Act of Uniformity of Common Prayer Act.
You could not make up your own prayers because you couldn't make up one that's wrong.
So they wrote all the possible prayers down in a book and printed it.
It's called the Book of Common Prayer.
And so John Bunyan was arrested for having a group praying without approval of the government.
And he spent 12 years in prison.
That's when he wrote Pilgrim's Progress.
That was the setting.
If you disobeyed the government, they'd drag you before the star chamber.
It was a room with stars on the ceiling, and they'd twist your arm and brand you on the face as a heretic and cut off your ear.
And this is why the pilgrims fled to Holland.
They were there 12 years until Spain threatened to attack, and then they decided to come to America.
They were going to go to Jamestown and submit to this king-run colony.
They got blown off course, landed in Massachusetts.
There's no king-appointed person in their boat, and that's when they write the Mayflower Compact.
A church writing a forming government.
Forms of government.
Right?
You got these.
It was like one page, if I'm not mistaken.
Yeah.
But it was the church members forming a civil body politic.
And it was how many families?
80 families, 90 families, right?
There was like 101 all total.
There were some non-believers amongst the group, but it was predominantly the pilgrims.
Why are they called pilgrims?
They didn't actually call themselves pilgrims.
They call themselves separatists because they would meet separate from the Anglican church.
How did they get that term?
It was applied to them later, but it goes back to the big thing was pilgrimages to the Holy Land.
And so they would have lots of stories about going on pilgrimage.
Then, of course, Pilgrim's Progress.
But John Bunyan, the idea of somebody that's on a trip to the celestial city.
So we have these incredibly adventurous Christians that are bouncing around and they end up blown off course.
And so they tried some form of self-government.
Didn't they try socialism at one point?
Yeah.
So they didn't have money.
And so they went to investors in England who put up the money but formed a company.
Companies were a brand new thing.
In the Middle Ages, there were no companies.
It was a sin of usury to pay or receive interest.
And so you'd have to hit up a rich guy like a king to finance your voyage.
But by the early 1600s, they invented companies and investors, and they wrote bylaws.
And the bylaws said everything would be owned in common for the pilgrims for seven years.
Everything gained by cooking, hunting, fishing, trading shall go into ye common stock, and everyone's livelihood shall come out of ye common stock.
They tried it.
They almost died.
William Bradford said the young man objected to doing twice as much work as the old guy, but got paid the same.
The old guy.
This is in reflections on a Plymouth plantation.
Is that right?
Yeah, yeah.
The old guy considered it a dishonor to be ranked in labor with the young guy.
And the women objected to having to wash other men's clothes.
He's making the argument for private property.
Yeah.
And so he says that this communistic plan, he called it that, was tried by good and honest men.
He used the word communistic plan.
Communistic plan.
150 years before Marx.
Yeah.
Wow.
And so he said there had to be a fitter plan.
And so every family was assigned a parcel of land.
This made all hands more industrious.
The women now went willingly into the field, took their little ones with them to plant corn, while before they would allege weakness and to have forced them would have been considered great oppression.
That's a breakthrough.
Just for everyone listening on podcasting, you're doing this from memory.
Yep.
It's just repetition that I'm complimenting you, Bill.
You could say thank you.
Thank you.
He's so humble.
It's just he can't accept it.
So then we, we being the Americans, we kind of go into the private property direction, right?
Yeah.
So England tried a 15-year American experiment called the English Commonwealth.
So King Charles I got defeated in 1640 or so and got his head chopped off.
In the Glorious Revolution?
Yeah, this is prior to that, but that is a key revolution in 1688.
But this was like, you know, 1649 to 1660.
It's called the English Commonwealth.
It was an American experiment of a Commonwealth, a covenant.
They had no king.
Oliver Cromwell refused to take the title of the king.
He called himself Lord Protector.
He did an okay job.
He dies.
His son Richard can't keep it together.
And so William Penn's dad sails.
Oh, he's an admiral, sails over to Europe, puts Charles II on the throne, brings him back and reinstitutes the monarchy.
And in exchange, he gets an estate in Ireland.
And then he's a famous admiral.
And then, of course, his son founds Pennsylvania.
But so they had an American experiment for 15 years, but they brought the king back.
America, because of a 3,000-mile ocean, because Europe was the chessboard and America was sort of an afterthought.
I mean, we lost money.
It wasn't like Spanish gold anywhere.
It was a loser.
And because of that, the king said, look, just don't cost me any money and stay out of my hair.
And so for almost a century and a half, the Americans got to practice self-government, like training wheels.
And that's the dilemma.
We go into these countries, we get rid of Saddam Hussein, we give them a constitution identical to ours almost.
And in one election cycle, they vote in Sharia law.
And we scratch our heads thinking, gee, why didn't our former government work?
It's like, duh, they have an Islamic soil that you planted the seed in, where in America, you had a predominantly Judeo-Christian soil.
The Berlin Wall comes down.
We help them set up governments almost identical to ours.
It gets taken over by the black market, the mafia, the organized crime.
We scratch our heads thinking, why didn't it turn out like America?
Well, you planted the seed in an atheistic soil.
They had 70 years of atheism, right?
And so it worked in America.
You have seed and soil.
Our form of government's like a finely genetically engineered seed, but you plant seeds in soil, and the soil is a predominantly Judeo-Christian populace.
Right.
So that's why it worked in America.
So 1700s roll around, and all of a sudden Britain gets involved in the French Indian War, you know, by financing, by proxy.
Tell us about that.
Charlie, can I jump in on the with the Geneva Bible?
When you were talking about this soil, and you talk about the seed of self-governance, the Geneva Bible was unique, and that's what the pilgrims brought because in the commentary in the margin was commentary on civil government.
So this was something that was not just, this was preached in the pulpits.
So they were prepared for this.
So it was not only a spiritual connection, but they were also seeking self-governance.
So it really was fertile ground.
And it prepares the way for what Charlie just said for that question of the 1700s.
You'd have the first and second great awakenings and all these things that took place.
Does that tie in with where Charlie's going?
Oh, yeah, definitely.
That the Geneva Bible, which was used by Shakespeare and Queen Elizabeth, had all these margin notes that talked about the people having control.
Basically, it emphasized the pre-King Saul period of ancient Israel, pre-King Saul.
This is when they come out of Egypt for 400 years, no king.
King James comes along, and he wants to have his King James Bible with no margin notes.
And he emphasizes the King Saul and on period of Israel history where there's the anointed king.
Divine right again.
They're both talking about the Bible, but one is pre-King Saul, the other is post-King Saul.
Now, King James wanted his Bible to be so good that nobody would ever want to do another translation.
And so he did have it bounce from one team of Puritans to Anglicans to Presbyterians, and they all had a say in it.
And so it is an excellent translation, but it doesn't have the margin notes.
And in his instructions to the translators, he said he did not want any novel terms like ecclesia being translated congregation.
That's why Tyndale got killed.
Yep.
Yeah.
King James Bible Translation Struggles00:05:09
So we roar into the 1700s, and all of a sudden Britain is in a little bit of trouble, and they start to have to tax the colonies.
Expand more on this seed and soil argument that led us to the culmination of the 1770s.
It's interesting.
So the British, the king of England went on to become the most powerful king on planet Earth.
He was a globalist.
He was a one-world government guy.
And so in the middle 1700s, they controlled Bengal and Bengal, India.
Bengal, India.
And they basically took over and said, okay, all this, you know, subsistence farming and stuff you've been doing, we're going to switch it up.
We know how to do this.
And they changed their economy so much that there was a drought and it turned into a famine and 10 million people died in Bengal in the middle to late 1700s.
And so the British East India Company is going bankrupt.
And so they go to the king and say, hey, we want to tax Britain.
And the people in Britain said, no way.
And so the king says, okay, well, you can tax the colonies.
And it started to escalate.
And the king wanted to take away our ability to print our own money, take away our ability to appoint judges.
So all the judges were appointed by the king.
But he didn't realize that, by the way, King George III went insane.
He had prophyria, a blue blood disease.
You know, you intermarry, preserve the royal bloodline.
Uncle Daddy.
But anyway, so the king of England was a globalist, and America's founders decided they didn't like this globalist king telling us what to do.
So they broke away and flipped it and made the people the king.
So the word citizen is Greek.
It means co-king, co-ruler, co-sovereign.
So kings have subjects who are subjected to their will.
Republics and democracies have citizens.
And so, if you're a citizen of America, you are a co-ruler.
You're a co-king.
So, we pledge allegiance to the flag and to the republic.
We're basically pledging allegiance to us being in charge of ourselves.
And so, when somebody protests the flag, what they're saying is, I don't want to be the king anymore.
I protest this system where I participate in ruling myself.
It's like, okay, somebody else will be glad to tell you what to do.
So, fast forward kind of to where we are today.
We don't have to go through all the 1800s or 1900s, but we're in trouble as a country.
What does history tell us about where we are right now?
Very similar to ancient Israel toward its end.
Which end?
Which temple destruction?
So, there's a wicked king Manasseh, and he's sacrificing kids to Moloch.
And God is a just God, he can't help it.
He's just by his nature, and he can't do it.
And there's nothing more unjust than killing an innocent baby that's not done anything wrong.
And so, the prophets come to Manasseh and said, You're doing the same thing that the people that were here before Israel came in did.
And because they did it, I brought in the Israelites to drive them out.
And because you're doing it, I'm going to drive you out.
So, judgment was pronounced, and Manasseh dies, and his grandson is eight years old, Josiah.
And he's 16 years old.
He starts to seek the Lord.
And he's in his early 20s.
He tells him to clean out the temple that his granddad had trashed.
And the priests come out with the scroll of God, the law of God.
The Jewish commentators say it was the last copy of the law on planet Earth because Manasseh not just was killing babies, he was destroying the Bibles.
And so they read the law to this young king in his early 20s, and he rips his garments and repents.
And he sends to a prophetess in town named Holda, the wife of the king's tailor, and says, What's going to happen?
And she says, Tell the man that sent you that judgment is going to come, but not during his lifetime, because he repented when he heard the words of the Lord.
And so, for the rest of the 31-year reign of Josiah, there's this revival that takes place.
And the Levites are teaching the law.
They have this huge Passover.
And so, I'm praying for a Josiah generation, right?
So, we've been killing innocent babies.
A just God can justly judge us.
But, with people like yourself and Turning Point USA, there's a lot of young people that are rending their hearts and they're saying, God, use us to turn things around.
And I believe that God can put it off and give us a revival.
Jeremiah 18 says, If I intend evil for a nation and they repent, I'll relent from the evil I intended.
He also says, If I intend good for a nation and they do evil, I'll relent from the good I intended.
So, the choice is in the hands of God's people, of my people who are called by my name.
As a nation, it's the pulpits in America that need an awakening to the fact that we've been given the freest form of government in a constitutional republic, similar to the Israelites in the wilderness when they had the decalogue.
And then Jethro appoints, you know, tells Moses, you have thousands, hundreds, fifties, tens, federal, state, county, local.
So, you have representative government, you have a constitution, which is, you know, the decalogue for them.
Machiavellianism and Dictator Power00:14:34
And as a nation, we just have to return to the lawgiver and acknowledge that we have not been honoring the laws of nature and nature's God.
And like you, Bill, I believe it will be a Josiah generation.
I love that insight.
That's awesome.
Is it fair to say, Bill, because let me interrupt myself?
There's a lot of people that email us that believe they're experts of history and they know the cycle of civilizations, and they say we're right on that cycle.
But is it fair to say, since there's never been a nation like America, as you say, stands atop history, that how this ends is actually unpredictable, that we don't know because of individual liberty.
Is that fair to say?
Yes, yes.
The other main ones are Greece and Rome.
So Athens had a Athenian democracy.
And then there was Philip of Macedon, and he conquered some of the people.
Philip II, right?
Correct.
Alexander the Great's father.
Correct.
He almost got me on that.
And he conquered some gold mines at Amphipolis.
And he takes the gold and he bribes some citizens of Athens to betray their own city.
And they would gather together in their marketplace.
Yeah.
They would gather together in their marketplace and talk politics and they'd say, well, we've got to defend against this, that.
And these paid traders would stand up and say, wait a second.
I hear, let's not get carried away.
I hear Philip's not such a bad guy.
He's not conquering these cities.
He's liberating them.
And these paid traders would gather around themselves what Lenin called useful idiots, people that actually believed the lies.
And they would so confuse the city that they couldn't mount a defense.
Philip marches up to the walls.
They throw the gates open.
He takes over.
And the people of Athens did not get a chance to rule themselves again for over 2,000 years.
I mean, once they fell, you had Alexander the Great.
They didn't rule themselves.
You got the different kings and the Romans and then, you know, then the Ottoman Empire.
They did get a brief freedom after World War I, but then now they're in debt and they don't rule themselves.
And then the Roman Republic, there was about the 5th century, 6th century BC, you had... Romulus.
The Roman Empire started.
Romulus and Remus.
But it was originally a king named Tarquin who ruled Rome.
And he had a son who raped a virtuous woman named Lucretia.
The rape of Lucretia.
You know, Michelangelo, Leo da Vinci, they all did the artwork.
And so this Lucretia was so upset that her virtue was tarnished that she got the Roman leaders together and committed suicide right in front of them.
They get so upset, they kill King Tarquin, and they pass a law that if anybody declares themselves a king, anybody can kill them without any repercussions.
And so for 500 years, nobody in Rome wanted to come anywhere close to being called a king.
And so they set up a republic.
Matter of fact, Publius was one of the founders.
That's Publius, right?
He was building a mansion.
And the rumor went around that Publius was thinking of making himself king.
When he heard the rumor, he destroyed his own mansion.
I mean, nobody wanted to come in.
So for 500 years, Rome was a republic.
Until Julius Caesar.
And until Julius Caesar, right.
He makes himself dictator for life.
Crossed the Rubicon.
And so you examine these other democracies and republics.
What would happen is they would get, in Rome's case, top heavy.
They had such a bureaucratic structure to them and people making their living off of this that they were able to usurp the power and revert to a dictatorship.
Let me ask you, did Rome had inflation?
Yes.
Deep state?
Oh, definitely.
Bureaucracy?
Yeah.
Dumb, endless wars?
Lots of debt?
Sexual perversion?
You say yes for the podcast.
Yes, yes.
Because I don't know any country that has those things.
Yeah, they had a Department of Royal Pleasures, and that was Nero and some of these other corruptions.
That sounds like Netflix.
Yeah.
They would go around and collect the young people and bring them to the president.
I mean, the little children.
And he would abuse them.
Could you imagine such a thing?
No, but I'm going through the list intentionally.
Inflation.
How about borders?
Did they have good borders in Rome?
They opened the borders, and you had the Visigoths come across, and the rivers froze, so they came across, and nobody chased them out.
And so they stayed, then they stayed, and then some more came across and more career crossed.
How about lack of language?
Everyone speaking different languages.
The language originally was Latin, and then all these different groups that would come in kept their own language, and it broke up the unity of the Roman Empire.
How about government assistance, paying people not to work?
Yeah, the bread in the circus, the dole of bread.
And so the leaders would distract the people with violent entertainment, but then would give him free bread.
And as long as they gave him free bread, the people wouldn't complain about the borders being overrun.
And so it was a welfare state.
We don't give free bread at national parks for the bears.
Of course not.
How about corruption in government?
Yeah, definitely.
It was called, even Jesus talked about that.
He says the lords among you call themselves benefactors.
And everybody would have to kiss up to somebody who would have to kiss up to somebody who would have to kiss up to the emperor.
And Julius Caesar, one of the historians, said that after he took over, that he was the richest person in Rome and that he owned the state.
And so it was all corrupt.
It was all buttering up to people above you, and everyone was living in debt.
They did inflate their currency.
So they had silver coins, but they would mix in lead until pretty soon it had no intrinsic value left.
It doesn't take a ton of analysis to say, wait a second, aren't we living through these sorts of things?
So does it help us through that?
I went through the whole list, corruption and governments, deep state bureaucracy, endless wars.
Was Rome involved in foreign wars?
Yeah, this was one of the tactics actually goes back to Pericles in Athens.
And he was one of those leaders of a democracy.
He was a citizen, but he was getting too powerful.
And if you got too powerful and were thinking of making yourself a king in Athens, 6,000 citizens could vote to ostracize you.
And they'd take little broken pieces of pottery and they'd put your name on it and they'd count them all up.
And if 6,000 people, you were kicked out of town for 10 years, ended your political career.
And so Pericles, the talk was of ostracizing him.
He intentionally lets relationship with Sparta deteriorate until it breaks out into a war.
Once war breaks out, everyone wanted a strong leader.
So instead of them criticizing, you're getting too powerful, now since war broke out, everybody wants a strong leader.
So why is it there was the conspiracy against Caesar, beautifully articulated by Shakespeare?
Why is it that you knock off Caesar and all of a sudden they say, actually, let's go for his nephew, right?
Augustus, and then Tiberius.
Why didn't they want to go back to the Republican model of government?
Well, the Ides of March is when the Republic senators killed Julius Caesar.
They had a position called the dictator.
It was a one-year position where if Rome was attacked, they realized somebody would have to call the shots in a hurry.
But Julius Caesar decided he wanted to make himself dictator for life.
And so the senators surrounded him, stabbed him on the Ides of March, March 15th.
And then they had a funeral for him.
And the people liked Caesar because he would conquer in Gaul and Europe and bring back lots of booty and lots of slaves, lots of Slav, Slavic people.
They'd bring them away with permanent servants.
And so the people liked Caesar because he was giving them free stuff.
Anyway, they get his general, Mark Anthony, to speak at the funeral.
And instead of him smoothing things over, he stirs them up to a riot.
This is sort of like a Jesse Jackson Al Sharpen.
I mean, he's like stirring them up, thinking, holding, you know, the Shakespeare's play, holding up the tunic and saying, and this stab hole was done by, you know, Brutus and all these different ones.
And the people get stirred up into this massive crowd and they begin to go to these senators' houses and trash them.
Could you imagine like mobs going to like, you know, Supreme Court justice houses and stuff like that?
I never imagined.
And it got so chaotic that they said, look, the only way we can settle this is to get a relative of Julius Caesar's.
And it was Octavius who became Augustus Caesar.
But he just flat out became himself dictator.
He was a nephew of Caesar.
He was nephew.
So, but I'm getting at something here, which is what is it about how we're made, our natural, original programming where we want to be ruled?
What does history tell us about that?
And Rob brings this out, but St. Augustine called it libido dominandi, the lust to dominate.
And it's part of fallen human nature.
So Cain kills Abel, and you have one king taking a kingdom from another king.
And so you put some kids on a playground, one's the bully.
You put some junior high girls in a click, one's the diva.
But what's the yearn to be dominated?
I would say two things: fear and free stuff.
Okay.
So when people are afraid, they'll trade freedom for security.
And so originally, you know, the first invention was the plow.
Cain was a tiller of the soil.
Then people started hitting each other with them.
They turned into weapons.
And then people would gravitate together for protection.
And you get people together.
Somebody's a little bit better at knowing how to fight than the rest.
And everyone says, you be our captain.
And you fight, you win.
That's a good thing.
But then this captain has kids and grandkids who claim to be a special family that everybody wants to kiss up to.
And then they're a political family.
Then they're a political machine and a political mob.
And before you know it, you got yourself a king.
And the king claims to own everything in town.
And he gives out favors to everybody that kisses up to him.
And so they're getting their free stuff.
And if anybody doesn't do what he wants, he threatens to kill them.
And so it's a positive and negative motivation.
That's the way human nature is.
They call it the bribe or the bullet, silver or lead.
You know, in Chicago, the gangs would either bribe you, buy you off, or, you know, you'd be added to the Clinton body count list.
But it's this idea of human motivation is a positive and negative.
And if you want to take power away from the people, if you can get them into fear, they will trade freedom for security.
Or if you can get them to receive free stuff from you long enough till they become dependent.
And then you can say, okay, to continue this free stuff, you have to incrementally give up your freedom to me.
So as we look at history and we look at what it could possibly teach us, tell us who Machiavelli was and why he's important to understand to process the modern American left.
These are great questions.
I've read everything he's written.
It's awesome.
So Machiavelli lived 500 years ago in Italy.
Italy was a bunch of city-states, Venice, Genoa, Naples, Florence, Siena, and they all had armies and fought.
And Machiavelli thought if one prince could control all of Italy, it would stop the infighting.
So he writes a book called The Prince, where he advocates the ends justifies the means.
The end of one prince controlling all of Italy is such a good end because it'll stop the infighting that any means necessary to get there is justified.
Light cheat steel.
So if a prince conquers a city, the people in the city would hate him.
But if the prince pays criminals to kill cows, burn barns, smash windows, sort of do anti-BLM type stuff, the people will cry out for help.
And the prince will come in and get rid of the very criminals he bribed to create the mess.
Nobody will know the better for it, and everyone will praise the prince as a hero.
So it's good marketing.
You create the need and fill it.
You go around the back of the house, set it on fire.
Then you go on the front of the house, sell them a fire extinguisher.
They'll pay anything for it, and even thank you for being there.
So it's called Machiavellianism, where you create or capitalize on a crisis to consolidate control.
Or as more recently you've heard it, never let a good crisis go to waste.
You know, Rahm Emmanuel, Hillary Clinton.
And so this is the idea that if you can get them into a crisis and the people will panic, give up their freedom, and then you can be the hero in restoring order.
But part of restoring order is you taking control.
So it's very important for our audience to understand who Machiavelli was.
We're in a game, a global game right now.
Tell us about globalists that came before.
You mentioned King George being one of them.
That's number one.
Tell us about kind of what drives a globalist, what globalists have existed before.
And then secondly, how do you defeat a globalist?
Because no one's ever done it successfully before.
First of all, there's always hope, and there's always, if the devil were all powerful, we'd have all been dead a long time ago.
He's not.
I do have to take exception.
A globalist has been defeated.
It's called the Tower of Babel.
No, I said all of them have been defeated.
Oh, all of them.
I said she's never been successful.
A globalist has never been successful.
Okay, I didn't get it.
That's okay.
Tower of Babels, that's my favorite one.
That's right, Genesis 11.
One of the things I like to do is watch physics type videos.
And one of them was on the Fibonacci sequence, the golden ratio 5 PHI.
And it's a rate of geometric expansion that you observe in seashells.
Little circle, little bigger circle, little bigger, bigger circle.
You observe it in tornadoes and in hurricanes.
And it's applied to other areas.
Like when Bitcoin first came out, they said, oh, it's going to expand at a certain rate and investments.
Well, I thought I'd apply it to empires in world history.
Fibonacci Sequence and Geometric Expansion00:04:17
And you begin to see the same canekill and able, Libido Dominandi, the lust to dominate.
You got Nimrod Tower of Babel.
And then you have 2,000 years of Egyptian pharaohs and 5,000 years of Chinese emperors and Indian Maharajas and Genghis Khan Julius Caesar told the Hun.
And if any one of them hadn't died, any one of them would have been happy to conquer the world.
And so in that sense, death is a blessing and the devil has to start from scratch again.
But anybody that has any predictable skills can see that at some point it's going to max out on a global level.
And Jesus says the wheat and tares grow together until the harvest.
And so it's the same human nature, the selfish, fallen human nature versus the godly, you know, loving human nature.
And the stakes get higher and bigger, and it's going to max out on a global level.
This is just our turn.
But with the 5G and the satellites and all the great reset, which you've written on so tremendously, we can see it taking a global level that it's never done before.
But I still think that the good Lord can press the pause button if we repent.
Just so people understand, expand more on what the Fibonacci sequence is and how that would play into this idea of the laws of nature and nature's God.
Almost give a gravitational pull on wannabe autocrats.
Well, it's a rate of geometric expansion.
So a number plus the previous number equals the next number.
You take that number plus the previous number equals the next number.
That number plus the previous number equals the next number.
And so this gradual rate of expansion that you observe, and if you were to plot it out, it would be doing that seashell that comes around with a little bigger each time.
And so when you look at these kingdoms of world history, you know, the Akkadian Empire, you know, 2250 BC, it was the biggest empire.
And then it gets conquered and then comes along, you know, the Babylonian Empire.
And then it's conquered by Osiris of Persia.
And then Persia's the biggest until it's conquered by Alexander the Great.
And each one, it's with a new military invention that one country gets before the rest.
And they have a limited period of time where they can use that new military invention to conquer others before the other ones catch up.
And then it pauses the expansion for another generation.
And so you have, you know, Cain killed Abel with a rock, but then the next was a bronze weapon.
And then the Greeks had that, and then an iron weapon, and the Romans had that.
And, you know, a phalanx spear, a scimitar sword, the composite bow, right, that the Mongols had.
You know, it was like, could shoot as far as an English longbow, but it was a third as size, so you could use it on horseback.
And then stirrups was the invention that the Muslims got before the rest of Europe and a curved scimitar sword.
And anyway, as the new military advanced in that fallen selfish human nature would break the dikes, the dam, so to speak, and it would flood and conquer a larger area.
And then the other ones would learn how to make those weapons and then it would pause that expansion.
But now it's all done technologically, and it's a battle for the mind.
And there's interesting 19th century military theorist named Kalvitz, and he gave the classic definition of war.
The purpose of war is to force your enemy to submit to your will.
Okay, so you're killing their bodies.
Why?
Well, because their mind is loyal to the other side.
Well, what if you could just mess with their mind?
Demoralize them, get them into fear, get them to paralyze, confuse them.
You can force your enemy to submit to your will without having to kill them.
Well, here's the next step.
It's called fifth generation warfare, where you get your enemy to submit to your will without them even being aware they're in a war.
And that's what we're experiencing right now.
That's fifth generation warfare.
Chills right there.
That's intense.
So if we were conquered, the conqueror would make us give up stuff, like our guns, like our freedom of speech, like our bank accounts.
Civilization Cycle From Prosperity to Decline00:09:23
Who thinks doing the conquering?
Multiple interests that are working together, but it's with globalists.
Some of them have been out in the open, like George Soros and Klaus Schwab with the World Economic Forum and, you know, previous generation, the David Rockefeller name, you know, and then his dad, you know, John D. Rockefeller.
And some of them, I naively think that they can set up a nice world.
But until you change human nature, it will never happen.
So, Bill, let's talk about that.
Where did this idea, this phenomenon in recent times come from where they believed human nature was malleable, not permanent or fixed?
Where did that idea come from?
I mean, probably Rousseau, you know, pre-French Revolution, that the Age of Enlightenment, but ironically, it never comes to pass.
In my book on socialism, the subtitle is how the deep state...
Right here.
Yeah.
The real history from Plato to present, how the deep state capitalizes on crises.
Crises or crisis?
Crises to consolidate control.
Right.
And so the Plato, he's the first one that talked about everybody owning everything in common.
And it sounds nice until you think it through.
Somebody has to be in the government handing out the common stuff.
And they're always going to be tempted to funnel a little extra to their family and friends on the side and always be tempted to hold back from someone they don't like.
And before you know it, it gets discretionary.
And the saying is, he who holds the purse strings has the power.
And so every attempt at everybody owning everything equally always ends up with a deep state bureaucracy passing out favors to their friends, ruled by the most corrupt guy at the top, a dictator.
And then people say, well, wasn't the early church socialists?
I point out the early church was the early church.
Socialism is counterfeit early church.
But it also didn't work in Acts.
Didn't they get into fights?
I mean, it wasn't scalable at all.
It wasn't communism.
It was communism.
They willingly gave.
The government didn't take it from them.
They laid it at the apostles' feet.
That was a willingness, as opposed to someone saying, you know, what's yours is mine and what's mine.
I'd have to reread Acts, but I think it fell apart.
I could be mistaken.
Well, yeah, it did.
And the Apostle Paul had to go raise money from other churches to come to the church.
But it wasn't sustainable because you have to create something at some point.
But the idea is that the early church, the difference between the early church and socialism is the word voluntary versus involuntary.
There it is.
So the early church voluntarily sold their property, laid it at the feet of the apostles.
Socialism, right, is taking away people's property and laid at the feet of Pilate.
So this idea of human nature, whether or not it could be changed or not, it's almost a predominant view now in academia and in the top levels of our society and government.
It started with Rousseau.
I believe Marx played into it, Engels.
Hegel definitely believed in it.
And then went into the 20th century and it's now the predominant view in every high level of society.
How important is it that we recognize what human nature is?
I think that's the most important divide in America today.
Yeah, you know, the U.S. Constitution is the longest in existence national constitution.
France has gone through dozens of different forms of government in the same period that we've had one.
Italy, you know, Mexico, I mean, all of them have gone through dozens of different forms of government in the same period of time that we've had one, with the exception of the Civil War.
But this idea is our founders understood one thing very clearly, that man is a fallen creature with a selfish human nature, and therefore Madison, and here Madison said there are no angels on earth.
If all men were angels, then government would not be necessary.
It's nature versus nurture.
The nurture is that we're going to obtain to this level of excellence, but our founders understood nature, the sin nature, that powers have to be separated because power wants to concentrate.
But these idealistic folks believe that we're going to obtain perfection, which doesn't exist in the nature of man.
But they also think they could perfect the human being itself, don't they, Bill?
It's creepy.
Yeah.
That's even worse than utopianism.
Yeah, and alter the DNA.
And, you know, if we're made in the image of God, they're trying to mess.
If you don't like somebody, you don't like their picture.
The devil doesn't like God, and we're in the image of God.
He doesn't like humans, so he's going to try to mess this up.
But yeah, you can't change.
And so even so, so in the book, I go through Plato, and he talked about that democracy is doomed to fail.
Philosopher Kings.
The best you can hope for is a philosopher king.
And how's he going to stay in power?
He's going to take possession of the children, going to bring them into the city and teach them lies, noble lies.
But the lies will help him stay in power.
But it's this, from the very beginning, Plato talks about you want to reprogram these kids, take away their parental input, and you want to reprogram them to serve the state.
And every attempt at socialism always targets the kids, wants to brainwash the kids to serve the state.
But it never happens because the state is made up of human beings that are selfish.
And they're always going to make decisions in their own best self-interest.
And so God's answer was you take the Tower of Babel and scatter it.
You take the centralized power and just scatter it and let people be as independent as possible.
But, you know, one of the things with Plato, and we had talked about this before the program, of how the lack of morals always precedes the collapse of a civilization.
And I mentioned an individual.
So Plato, democracy means demos, the rule of the many, right?
So demos, people, cross-see rule.
And so the many, the people rule.
And the chief characteristic of a democracy is tolerance.
Everybody tolerates each other.
Tolerance and apathy are the signs of a dying society, Aristotle.
Yeah.
It's just so apropos to where we are.
It's tragic.
I love my Aristotle.
Got him right up there.
There he is.
And so they tolerate each other.
That's nice.
And then they tolerate people that are a little bit off.
Then they tolerate people that are a lot off.
So finally, they're tolerating lawlessness.
And it turns into chaos.
And that's when all the people say, we want somebody to come along and fix it.
And that's when you get this philosopher king comes along, promises to fix it, but then stands up in the chariot of state, holding the reins of power, and he's revealed as the tyrant.
But this phenomenon of democracy devolving into chaos out of which a dictator arises was studied by J.D. Unwin, spelled U-N-W-I-N.
J.D. Unwin, he's an Oxford anthropologist, 1934, writes a book called Sex and Culture.
And he studied 80 civilizations over 5,000 years, and he observed trends.
And one of the trends was that sexual promiscuity always precedes the collapse of a civilization.
He talked about civilizations going through five, four stages.
First stage is a period of pain and poverty.
So they go through war, they go through famine, and the people work hard to climb out of that mess, and they become productive.
And then they work together and they become patriotic.
And then finally, they become prosperous.
And then they want to enjoy their prosperity and they become promiscuous.
Is that where the Teitler cycle comes from, the Scottish historian?
Yes, yes.
And so this idea, very similar to an athlete, when he's young, he's focused, disciplined, watches his diet.
He becomes productive, right?
And finally, he gets the championship and he's the champ for a couple seasons.
And then he gets a little bit lazy, doesn't exercise as much, eats some fatty foods.
He gets challenged into the ring of competition and gets the tar knocked out of him because in reality, he's a couch potato.
And so this is what happens.
You get these civilizations work hard, work together, become productive, patriotic, prosperous, and then they become promiscuous.
J.D. Unwin even called it a sexual marketplace.
He said, when women as a whole say nothing happens unless there's a commitment, the guys say, fine, they make the commitment, and then they go out and be productive for their wife.
And then something else happens, little kids appear, and the guy is another emotion becoming protective.
And when all the men of the country are productive and protective, rising water floats all boats, the country becomes productive, protective, expansionistic, creative, even militaristic.
But if the women as a whole say there does not need to be a commitment, water seeks its own level, and you'll have a bunch of guys getting pleasure-focused and selfish, and fewer kids are born to fill the ranks of the military.
And when enough of the men of the country do this, they get weakened and then conquered by the next rising civilization.
The Greeks had a fixation on children, especially boys, did they not?
Indoctrination and Nazi Ideology Origins00:05:21
Yeah.
Talk about how a society starts to forsake their children in that cycle of decline.
That's a good question.
Yeah, it's selfish.
It's instant pleasure.
I use the little comparison.
Our founding fathers sacrificed their prosperity for their posterity.
But today, we have leaders that are sacrificing our posterity for prosperity.
They're saddling our kids with an unpayable debt.
As long as we can live okay, we're fine.
It reminds you of Hezekiah, where he shows all the treasure in the temple.
And Isaiah says, What all did you show him?
He goes, Everything.
He goes, Everything you showed him is going to someday belong to the king of Babylon.
Your grandsons will be eunuchs in the palace.
And Hezekiah's answer was, Well, as long as it's not going to happen during my lifetime, you feel like reaching through the Bible and slapping him, you know.
And it's like our founder said, No, I care about the future generations, and I want delayed gratification, intergenerational promise.
Yeah.
And so we've been moving toward this present, and it's manifesting not just killing the unborn, but now we got proposed bills in California of baby 2018.
Yeah, let's just look at the transgender stuff, the drag queen stuff, the chemical castration.
And so I want to ask you about that.
We don't have a ton of time remaining, but this is something I've been wanting to get you on for a while.
Talk about how in the 1800s and 1900s, this desire to remake man, the ubermensch, as Nietzsche would put it, how scientific innovation and breakthrough enabled that.
Talk about the mad scientist and why we should always be wary of someone who worships science and not God.
Like you Valley Qatari, whatever his name is.
Yeah, there was Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr.
And he became a Supreme Court justice, and he is the one who did the horrible Buck V. Bell case, where there was a woman with a low IQ and the idiot women, forced sterilization of women in the 1920s, I think it was 20s, but they piggybacked on Jacobson v. Massachusetts for that decision.
But I mean, to hear it to have the government say your IQ is not high enough, we are going to sterilize you.
And it was based on this faulty science that says, well, you know, and if your parents and grandparents have a low IQ, you have a low IQ.
So Oliver Wendell Holmes' infamous quote was, Three generations of imbeciles is enough.
And so here he is without precedent, by the way, just flat out saying it's in the government's interest to sterilize these kids.
Well, that was actually used by the Nazis.
And they quoted him even in the Nuremberg trials.
And so in Germany, you have, I think it was Ernst Rudin, but he wrote articles that were published in Margaret Sanger's magazine.
And he talked about the Übermenschen, the super race.
Yes.
And then the rest were the Untermenschen, the under mankind.
And so here, the seeds of the Nazi Holocaust were planted by these Margaret Sanger, Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr. types that actually had some funding from some corrupt, wealthy people, you know, the Bill Gates of the day.
But they pushed this narrative.
And, you know, there was a German in the 1930s that there was a German colony in Africa for a while.
And some of the Africans moved back to Germany.
And the government decided that they would sterilize all of these German-African mix people.
And it was forced sterilization.
But then that eventually turned into the Holocaust.
But again, it's man playing God.
And Whenever God would send an answer in the Bible, it would always be through a child.
You know, they're struggling.
He appears to Samson's parents and says, okay, you're going to have a baby and he's going to be the deliverer.
And of course, Moses' parents.
And go ahead.
I was just going to say, I was moved when I, and I've heard you speak many, many times, but when you pointed out that Charles Darwin and Abraham Lincoln have the exact same birth date.
And you pointed out, here's one man who's contending for the freedom of, you know, black Americans.
And at the same time, Darwin, you know, has this origin of species.
And people don't know the subtitle of it, but it's the origin of species by means of natural selection.
And then the subtitle, which they've removed now today.
It's the Negro population.
It says, or the preservation of favored races in the struggle for life.
He was a complete racist, just like Margaret Sanger.
And this is the destruction of mankind.
And it's the most racist approach possible.
And yet, this is what is indoctrinating our children for generations.
New Creature in Christ Plan00:10:58
I was blown away when you listed that.
Yeah, February 12th, 1819, if I'm not mistaken.
But Lincoln's best known for Emancipation Proclamation Freeing the Slaves.
Darwin's best known for evolution and the idea that some are more evolved than others.
And Lincoln put in God We Trust on Our Coins, and evolution has been used to remove the belief in God.
And Stalin acknowledged that when he was raised in an Episcopal school, but then when he went to school and he read Darwin, that's when he became an atheist.
And that's when Stalin ended up killing 60 million people.
And once you get rid of God, then there is no right or wrong.
And it's just a power grab until you die.
And they entertain a thought that they care, but it's just selfishness manifested.
And I think, you know, I always come to a spiritual aspect.
That's how I stay encouraged.
I love that about you, Bill.
That number one, God always waits until things look hopeless and then he raises up little nobodies with faith and courage.
But the other thing is, why are we here?
Why do we even exist?
And I thought, okay, let's look at it from God's point of view.
Here's God.
He exists for eternity.
He makes everything.
Everything he makes follows laws.
And to get an idea of how big God is, in 2003, the Hubble telescope was focused at a spot in the sky where there was nothing.
The spot was the size of a grain of sand held between your fingers at arm's length.
Nothing there.
They focused the Hubble telescope.
After 11 days, they developed the images.
In that tiny spot was 10,000 galaxies with hundreds of billions of stars in each galaxy.
And because light travels in waves, with blue being the shortest, fastest, and red being the longest, slowest wave, they saw the red shift.
These galaxies were moving away from us.
And they looked in other directions and they've come up with the estimate that the observable universe is 93 billion light years across and get this, still expanding at the speed of light.
And the largest star they found is Stevenson 2-18.
It's a supergas giant.
It's so large, if you were to place it in our solar system, it would engulf the orbit of Saturn, the sixth planet from the sun.
One star that big?
And God made it all.
And what could you possibly offer this being?
Why would he make you?
One reason, you're different.
Well, how are we different?
Well, everything he makes follows rules.
Laws of planetary motion, laws of gravity, laws of physics, laws of optics.
And it's almost like, you know, Ben there done that.
I can make everything.
At some point in eternity past, God said, You know, I would really like someone in my image that could love me.
Now it gets interesting because love, by definition, must be voluntary.
So, in this framework of everything he controls, he created one little thing.
He doesn't control your will.
Now, he could control it if he wanted to, but that would defeat the very reason he made you different than everything else.
And if he were to force you to love him, he himself would know he's forcing you to love him, and he would know your response is not a love response.
And so, he respects your will.
And the second part of it is he has to hide himself behind his creation because if he ever revealed himself in all of his universe-creating, omnipotent power, I mean, light brighter than a million suns.
If he appeared to you, your response, if you didn't melt, it would be like the Apostle John in the book of Revelation: I fell at his feet as dead, right?
And so, he hides himself.
People say, If God's real, why doesn't he show himself?
Because the moment he showed himself, your free will would evaporate.
In the presence of such a being, your response would be instinctive, and he's not interested in instinctive.
He can do instinctive forever, he's interested in a voluntary response.
And I use the illustration of a billionaire whose son goes to college, flies in on his private jet, drives up in his Lamborghinis, gold rings, roll his fancy clothes, walks around campus with an entourage.
He's going to have every girl wanting to meet him.
But if he lays that aside, drives up in an old clunker, he's got holes in his jeans, the uppity girls are going to ignore him.
But there's a girl that likes to study with him in the library, they eat together in the cafeteria, they become friends, and she takes heat from the click for hanging around this nobody guy.
But she believes in him.
They fall in love, they get engaged, and then he says, Hey, I want to take you back to meet my dad.
And they're like driving up to this castle mansion, and the girl's like, Whoa, you didn't tell me about all this.
Cha-ching.
He knows that she loves him for him, not because of all of his stuff.
I mean, here's the God of the universe lays aside his glory, comes humbled as a baby, and becomes man.
And the third part of it is he's just, he can't help it, which means he has to judge every sin.
If God does not judge every single sin, by default, he's giving consent to the sin.
And if God gives consent to sin, he's not just.
He denies his just nature, he denies himself, he ungods himself, he's kicked out of heaven.
So he has to judge every sin.
And so here's the dilemma: if he gives us free will, hides himself, gives us an opportunity, and we step out of line.
His just nature has to swat us and destroy us.
And so he comes up with a plan.
It's his plan.
The plan is his own son would become the lamb and take the judgment for all of our sins.
Blood must be shed for the remission of sins.
Right?
So God is just in that he judges every sin, but he's love and that he provided the lamb to take the judgment on the sin.
And people say, How can one person, right?
Well, Jesus is divine.
And you know, it says a day with the Lord is as a thousand years and a thousand years as a day.
Jesus experienced that day on the cross as if it was a thousand years.
And so I got a degree in accounting.
I like things that balance.
So you take an eternal being who's innocent, suffering for a finite period of time.
It's equal to all of us finite beings who are guilty, suffering for an eternal period of time.
Wow.
Right?
Infinity times finite equals finite times infinity.
An unlimited being suffering for a limited period of time is equal to all of us limited beings suffering for an unlimited period.
That's the Bill Federer brain right there.
And so this way, through Jesus, you and I can approach this omnipotent, eternal, universe-creating being who's completely just and not fear being judged because we're approaching him through the lamb that he provided that took the punishment for all our sins.
You're a new creature in Christ.
And get what is behind, strive for what is ahead.
So why did God make us for us to glorify him then, right?
Yeah, a relationship and love.
Right?
Charlie, that's what's so fascinating about the Declaration of Independence, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, happiness being the highest virtue, because the idea is it's good.
And something is good based on its ability to do that for which it was created to do.
And we find true happiness in him is the fullness of joy.
Our founders understood that.
And once we understand the laws of nature, nature's God, that's when we flourish as a people.
And that really, that's, you know, it's that triangle of liberty, faith, virtue, freedom.
You insert that in the Teitler cycle where as the culture's collapsing, that infusion of faith once again can revive a nation and to realize who he is and who we are and repent.
We're going one way.
Turn around and go the other.
Yeah, you know, the Bible talks about us being the bride of Christ.
Every romance novel, every Hallmark movie comes to this moment where there's a forsaking of all others and choosing the one.
Yeah.
Right?
And if we're the bride of Christ, it only makes sense that God would push us to a decision-making moment.
Are we going to care about whatever everybody else says?
Are we going to stand up for the Lord?
And that's what gives true freedom and strength because you're no longer afraid.
Amen.
Socialism, the real history from Plato to present.
Bill Federer, final question, just to reinforce it.
What gives you hope?
You do.
Amen.
Meeting all the Turning Point USA staff here in Phoenix, but all across the country, and seeing that God is not done.
He is raising up.
And again, someday we'll be dead and you'll be in heaven because you believe that Jesus will be.
We won't be dead.
We'll begin to truly live.
But I get it.
There you go.
But we'll be in heaven, you know, like when we've been there 10,000 years, bright shining as the sun with no less days to sing his praise than when we just begun.
So imagine you're there and you're walking the streets of gold and you meet Moses.
That'd be pretty cool.
Maybe Moses will invite you over to his place.
Jesus did say, In my father's house, there are many mansions.
And so you show up, and I heard one preacher say, In heaven, you'll travel as fast as you think.
And I'll probably show up late.
My wife will say, where were you?
I was thinking about something else.
But imagine being in bed.
Moses will probably have a pretty nice house, maybe with the fireplace that the logs don't burn up.
You know, get you the burning bush in the wilderness.
But then after the story we talked over, you tell us, Moses, what was the story like?
I mean, I read the book.
I even saw the movie.
But here you are in person.
The room will get quiet.
He'll stand up and he'll say, Well, I was 80 years old and Pharaoh, the most powerful military leader, was charging in.
We were unarmed.
And I held up my staff and I said, God, use me to deliver your people.
And the waves came in.
Then we're going to look around the room and see, David, tell us your story.
And the room will get quiet.
David will say, I was just a teenager and this thug Goliath was mocking our God and making fun of us.
And grown-ups were too chicken.
I said, enough, took my little sling, hit him in the head.
One by one, they'll all tell their story.
It'll be real exciting.
And then the room will get quiet, and everybody will look at you.
Say, you tell us your story.
What was going on in earth when it was your turn to be down there?
What were they saying about the baby in the mother's womb or marriage that God Himself instituted in Genesis?
What did you do when the whole world was against you?
What did you do when it looked hopeless?
For Jesus to walk in the room and a big screen to come down, show all kinds of great things happening, and him saying, This is what I had planned for you to do, but you just didn't have enough faith and courage.
And you look back at your life and you see that mountain that held you back, just a little anthill, that little fear of man.
What are people going to say?
Are they going to unfriend me?
Are they going to post something negative on the internet about me?
It's like, you know, I let that fear of man hold me back from doing all this great stuff.
And you can't go back to earth and do anything else for the Lord because you're already in heaven because you believe Jesus died on the cross to pay for all your sins.
But guess what?
We're still on this earth.
We still have breath in our lungs.
We still have feet that trod the soil.
You still can do those things you'll be known for forever.
That's a good word.
Amen.
Bill, thanks so much for joining.
Rob, thanks for co-hosting.
Yeah, my pleasure.
I just sat here and watched.
I was like, check out Bill's books.
We're going to be doing some things together at Turning Point Academy.
It's going to be really great.
Check us out, tpusa.com.
God bless you guys.
Thank you.
Thank you so much for listening, everybody.
Email me your thoughts as always.
Freedom at charliekirk.com and support the Charlie Kirk Show at charliekirk.com/slash support.
Thank you so much for listening.
God bless.
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