Trump 2024? In-Depth with ‘The Chief’s Chief,’ Mark Meadows
On a special extra episode of The Charlie Kirk Show this week, former Congressman and White House Chief of Staff to President Donald Trump, Mark Meadows—one of the show’s earliest original guests joins Charlie again to talk through the politics of the day—where we stand, how we got here, and most importantly: where do we go now? You’ll get exclusive insight from the highest ranking Trump official on what it was like during his time in the West Wing as well as an update on election integrity, China, NIH, Infrastructure, and so much more. Charlie and Mark walk through what it will take to reclaim Congress for the good guys before diving into the million dollar question: is the Big Man coming back in 2024? Get the inside scoop and opinion from one of Trump’s most trusted advisers, here only on The Charlie Kirk Show. Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Taking Back The House00:04:05
Hey, everybody.
Today in the Charlie Kirk Show, my conversation with former chief of staff Mark Meadows, close friend of the president, we talk about how are we going to take back the house?
How are we going to take back the Senate?
How do we get better elected officials?
Is President Trump going to run in 2024?
What can we do about election integrity?
This conversation is very political in nature.
For those of you that care about that, I think you're going to love this podcast.
Email us your thoughts, freedom at charliekirk.com.
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If you want to get involved with Turning Point USA, go to tpusa.com, start a high school group today, start a college group today at tpusa.com, and we will see all of you at AmericaFest, where we have Tucker Carlson, Donald Trump Jr., Kaylee McNanini, Ted Cruz, Candace Owens, and more, tpusa.com/slash AMF EST, AmericaFest.
Write it down.
Put it in your phone right now.
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Mark Meadows is here.
Buckle up.
Here we go.
Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campuses.
I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
I want to thank Charlie.
He's an incredible guy.
His spirit, his love of this country.
He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
That's why we are here.
Hey, everybody.
Welcome to this episode of the Charlie Kirk Show.
With us today is a friend of mine, an American patriot, one of the good guys.
He loves his country, and he did a great job in Congress and also serving the wonderful President of the United States, Donald Trump, and has a book about it.
The Chief's Chief with us is Mark Meadows.
Mark, welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show.
Hey, Charlie, it's great to be with you.
Thank you for the work that you do.
And all those that are tuned in right now, just a real heartfelt thank you to all of you.
And I want to, can I remind the audience of something that you may not even remember?
So I was actually a member of Congress on the Oversight Committee.
Jim Jordan and I would just take it to him.
And then all of a sudden, you know, Charlie Kirk shows up in the back row.
And so I do a shout out.
I mean, and it's my staff who says, Hey, do you see who's in the back row?
And I said, Yeah.
They said, Well, do you know who he is?
I said, Of course I know who doesn't know who Charlie is.
But thank you for fighting the fight.
And not just with so many members on Capitol Hill, but on college campuses and in the churches and the public arena each and every day.
You're a true friend.
Great to be with you.
Likewise.
And I'll never forget, Mark, you were one of our first guests on the Charlie Kirk show where we just had a couple of little recorders.
We came into your office.
That's when you were still in Congress, and you were so generous with your time.
And it was just awesome.
And you've been, you did an amazing job in the White House as chief of staff.
So I want to start there.
Tell us about your time in the White House, what you're talking about in this book, and kind of some of the detail and the insight that you think more Americans need to know about exactly what happened in the White House.
Well, Charlie, this book is really the truthful account of what actually happened.
We've had so many of these different authors that have come up and they supposedly were in the room where it happened.
Undermining The Administration00:06:06
You and I both know, based on our relationship with President Trump, our personal relationship, not just professional, that he is all about America and willing to do that.
So I bring to life a number of stories, some that have been reported on in a non-factual way by people that have worked with him.
Certainly the fight that he had, even against people that were in his own administration, we see some of these people, whether it's Secretary Esper or General Milley, Dr. Fauci, they all make appearances in this book, but we also give some stories that are not out there.
And I'll give you a prime example of one.
Dr. Fauci literally was trying to advocate so strongly for the funding for the Wuhan Lab.
And so the story is in there.
I'm watching Tucker.
I find out from Tucker Carlson that we're funding this Chinese lab.
And I call Alex Caesar and I tell him, I said, we're going to cut off the funding.
We're going to make sure that we cut it off.
And we got pushback.
Not some from Alex Cesar, but certainly a lot from NIH.
And that's a story that's appropriate for the day, Charlie, because we got Dr. Fauci now with NIH, Francis Collins, Dr. Fauci, all of a sudden saying, well, there was gain of function research being done, and the American taxpayer was funding it.
And the testimony that we gave before Congress may not have been factual.
Here's the bombshell.
It's worse than that.
I believe that Dr. Fauci knew all too well that his testimony was in fact erroneous based on emails, if the Biden administration is willing to look for them, emails that he actually was part of back in February and March of 2020.
I mean, and that would be lying under oath and a variety of different crimes.
And so what you're saying is that Fauci was intimately aware and then lied about it in front of testimony in many of these hearings.
Well, I mean, the emails would seem to suggest that it was brought to his attention that they were doing gain of function actual research in Wuhan.
I do know this.
Dr. Fauci was well aware that the American taxpayer dollars was going to China, and he continued to advocate for it after President Trump said, we're not going to do this anymore.
And it's just one of the many flip-flops that we see, but we tell that story.
The other is we tell how President Trump actually makes decisions quickly.
You and I have seen this on behalf of the American people.
He'll get what I call creative chaos, where back and forth he'll, you know, in the Oval Office, there will almost be certainly verbal fights, but sometimes it made me so uncomfortable.
You know, you just see different cabinet members going back and forth.
He'd see how passionate they were.
He'd get the facts and he'd make a quick decision.
We missed that.
We missed that with Joe Biden being at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.
Yeah, it's just hard to even process what we have.
So can you talk a little bit about just, you know, I want to hone in on this, how President Trump was running the government with your help and others, but he was being undermined by people within the administrative state and that apparatus.
We call this the deep state, but to what extent did that really exist, Mark?
Because it's a hard thing for people.
People think you win the election, you take over the whole government.
That's not true.
Well, you don't take over the whole government.
And honestly, even with some of the very people that the president put in place, people that were, they were supposedly MAGA people that were coming in to work for him.
Really, what they were were swamp creatures.
You know, they had had Potomac fever.
They had drank the Kool-Aid over and over again.
All they cared about was the power that existed around the Oval Office.
And so here's so you ask if it was real.
So as chief of staff, I came in.
The leaks drove me crazy.
We fired a couple of people.
We asked them to use their talents in other places very quickly when we found out.
But even within the West Wing, we found that there was a lot of people that, for their own personal advantage, they would talk to the press, they would leak out less than flattering stories, oftentimes, in fact, almost all of the time, with only partial truth.
So I was chief of staff for maybe a week.
We're going over a speech that the president is going to give later that evening.
Literally, while I'm meeting with the president, while we're making changes to the speech, they're reporting on the news.
Somebody had leaked a speech out, and that came from the West Wing and others.
And so what we did was actually said, well, less people are going to get to see that speech.
We had people pushing back like crazy.
How are you taking me off the approval list?
Well, it's amazing how many speeches didn't get broadcast before he gave them after that.
But that's a minor thing.
You know, you got people that were weaponizing the Intel community.
You've got the Department of Defense many times that had one agenda and they would strategically talk to reporters and these background sources.
But the swamp does fight back.
And for those that are tuned in right now, if you think it's a minor problem, it is a major problem.
In fact, the president, when he was, you know, October of 2020, he said, Mark, I wish we knew then what we know now because we would have done it differently.
And I can tell you, going forward, we're going to do it differently.
Navigating With Raycon00:02:56
And that's a good segue.
And we can kind of bounce all around here.
It looks like he's going to run.
Yeah, I tell you, if I were a betting guy, of course, you get to talk to President Trump on a regular basis.
If you and I were betting, we would go all in on the fact that he's running.
I can tell you this, and I talk about this in the Chief's Chief.
You know, he's asked me to look at a number of things.
And when you start looking at it, getting prepared and talking about who would be cabinet secretaries, where do you make sure from a personnel standpoint?
Because what you have to do is have the right personnel to make sure that it's executed.
And candidly, we want people that are all in for the America First Agenda.
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Preventing Conservative Co-Optation00:08:03
Well, so talk, let's talk politically, though, because the Republican Party is he's very popular in the Republican Party, but amongst the donors and smart people, I think there's some hesitation, and I don't share that hesitation.
Um, where they say, I don't know if I want him to run, I don't know if there's a path, I don't know if he can win.
What are your thoughts on that, Mark?
Because they're there, as you probably get some of those phone calls, right?
And yeah, so help us navigate through that.
Yeah, I get that on a regular basis.
Now, perhaps not as zealously with knowing that my relationship with the president still is one that is very strong.
And having served as his chief of staff, I may not get it quite as much.
But yeah, we get that from the donors.
Well, here's the interesting thing: nothing will make people see that Donald Trump actually acted in their best interest as much as Joe Biden doing as poorly as he's done.
You know, who would have imagined?
In fact, the president Trump mentioned this the other day.
He says, Mark, can you imagine it was going to be this bad this quickly?
And the answer is no.
And I had a very low expectation.
You know, it's hard to be below last on an expectation, but I had a very low bar for what they were going to do.
Here's the other thing that I think we start to see: the left has lurched so much.
You get to see this each and every day on college campuses and in the public square.
They've lurched so far to the left that all of a sudden people want to fight her on their behalf.
You know, when you look at CRT in the schools and telling parents they're domestic terrorists, I mean, at this point, you've got unaffiliated voters and what I would say, moderate to conservative Democrats, if there's such a thing as a conservative Democrat left, they are all of a sudden saying, you know what?
At least Donald Trump was willing to fight for me, and I need somebody that's willing to fight.
And the critical race theory is one key component.
You know, we have got to, we've got to understand that you don't judge people by the color of their skin.
It's by the content of their character to quote Martin Luther King Jr.
Yeah, that used to be an American principle.
So let's talk a little bit about kind of where the conservative movement is right now.
And it seems that the conservative movement is growing.
It is broadening.
I think it's younger than ever before.
It's more diverse than ever before.
It's very energetic.
And I think that is confusing the Democrats in a variety of different ways.
I think they thought that we would go away and all of a sudden say, you know what?
Yeah, let's put Mitt Romney or Liz Cheney in charge of our party after everything that happened.
And they're not really sure how to deal with that.
So, but from a policy perspective, this is something you dealt with in the Trump administration.
One of my fears, Mark, is that if Republicans take back the House, which I believe we will, and we could talk about that in the Senate, is that kind of the Chamber of Commerce agenda will kind of set in again.
You were the head of the Freedom Caucus.
You were the number one advocate for this sort of type of conservatism.
What do we have to do to make sure that the Republican Party doesn't kind of get co-opted by all those sorts of interests if and when we take back chambers of power?
Well, listen, it will get co-opted if we are not vigilant.
And I appreciate you bringing this up because you have and those that support your movement have changed the demographics.
Most of the Republicans have gray hair like me, and they've been around for a while.
It's such a refreshing thing to a guy that's been in the fight that says, all right, I'm willing to pass the baton to a younger demographic that honestly is as conservative as I am and some of them more so.
You got, I mean, listen, I was with you in Arizona when the president came in.
I mean, you guys were rocking the roof off of that particular, I mean, it was incredible.
And I walked away.
I said, wow.
I mean, you know, you heard about your work.
I was very familiar with your work, but I'd never felt the energy up close and personal.
And you said that you could fill that place.
And not only did you fill it, I mean, there was waiting lines.
Remember, the protesters out there took tires and wheels off of a van to try to keep people from coming in.
And so you're up against it each and every day.
And so are we.
And we're up against some of the battle is not just the left like you were talking about.
It's the swamp, the chamber of commerce kind of folks that honestly, they want business as usual.
There's two kinds of people that love to spend money in Washington, D.C., Democrats and Republicans.
And so what you have to do is actually come together and actually work with a coalition.
So here's how we do it.
We hold people accountable.
You do a good job of that.
Others are doing a good job of that.
But here's the bottom line is you can't let them go back and pretend like Donald Trump was never the president and that our party is not forever changed because that's what they want to do.
There's this new movement, GOP.2.0, you know?
And when you look at it, all they're really wanting is GOP 1.0, which is before Donald Trump.
When he came down the escalator, everybody said that he couldn't win and he wasn't going to win.
They didn't take him serious.
They're doing the same thing now.
They're underestimating those that truly have been engaged.
Young people, union workers, the hardworking American that honestly may have been a typical Democrat voter in the past.
They're saying the Democrat Party has left me.
And what they're now looking at is how do we take back our government for we the people?
That's right.
But we're going to have to have backbones of steel.
Many congressmen and women do not have that.
Can you talk a little bit about that?
You served in Congress.
You did a wonderful job.
You were one of the most principled members of Congress and a leader.
People have lost faith in their government.
And some Republicans say we win these elections and we lose our country.
What should people be looking for right now in primaries?
What should people be looking for in selecting members of Congress?
This is a question I get all the time.
I'd love your wisdom on that.
Well, listen, what you want is someone who doesn't want the job for the title.
There you go.
You know, I mean, if the thing that they wanted all their life was to be a member of Congress, then you don't want them in Washington, D.C. Other is, is they need to hold it very loosely.
I was not a guy that ran on term limits, but now I'm all for term limits.
Listen, get somebody in, let them do the very best they can because they stay connected to the people back home.
And then the third thing that you want is someone who doesn't need to be accepted.
You know, because what happens is all these members come up here.
They're smarter than, you know, everybody tells them how smart they are, how funny they are.
They get invited to all these dinners, you know, the honorable this, the congressman or congresswoman, this.
And yet, what we see is a freshman class that has come in who's willing to be connected to the people back home.
You want values from Main Street back home going to Washington, D.C., not D.C. values going that way.
And so it really is hard because everybody preaches and they practice, try to practice a good game.
I can tell you, look at their career.
If their career is one where they've been compliant, they will be compliant here.
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Fighting Election Integrity00:14:59
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Yeah, I think that's really good wisdom.
We get that question a lot of Charlie, what should I look at in candidates and what can actually be done?
And so now I kind of want to talk a little bit about this question of how are we going to kind of decouple our mess, the mess from Biden and what he's done.
And what do you think are the issues, the actual issues you think that are the ones we should hone on and focus on?
I think CRT, I think the educational issue, the Department of Justice with what Merrick Garland has done, which is an unthinkable attack on moms and dads across the country.
What's your perspective from the political standpoint where we really need to focus our attention?
Yeah, so if there is a silver lining to the COVID pandemic, it would be in two different places that we need to really focus on.
One is holding China accountable, getting our supply chains away from the Chinese government.
I can tell you, having served with the president, he saw this as a real threat and one that honestly has not gone away.
If anything, it's gotten worse because what they're going to do is the supply chains, rare earth minerals, you name it, they're going to try to control everything that controls manufacturing.
So we need to do that.
And we saw that when some of the PPE was very difficult to get because it was coming from China and they used it as a leverage against us.
And that's problematic.
The second thing that is a silver lining of COVID is that we started to see what's happening in our schools, both in our universities and in K through 12.
We started to see that moms and dads, because we were teaching via Zoom, all of a sudden they're saying, I can't believe that's being taught in your classroom.
Can't believe that there's a political agenda by your teacher because many of us grew up in the public school system and we remember our teachers as being that person that would instruct us and invest their time and yet do it without a political agenda.
We're seeing that.
You know this.
I mean, this is the genesis of what you first started with in terms of your political interest.
But we have to make sure that we engage there as well.
So those two issues.
The third one is with the Biden administration, you can't replace capitalism with big government.
And everybody wants to, you know, they want to have big government.
And what they will do is essentially put everybody on some type of social program.
And I don't want to say social welfare because we're all about the safety net for those that really truly need a safety net.
But what they want you to do is actually be connected to the government, dependent on the government.
And that way you don't have the freedom to live the American dream.
And so we have to really push back on that.
Lastly, the Afghanistan debacle, it could have been avoided, should have been avoided.
President Trump did avoid it.
And we need to make sure we don't get involved in endless wars, but at the same time, that we remain strong and that our enemies fear us.
Our allies can respect us and count on us.
And those areas we have to address.
So let's go to some of the big races.
Let's talk about some of the Senate races that are going to be critical because we get these questions a lot.
If that's okay, let's get into some of the particulars.
Yeah, no, you're going to get me in trouble, but I'm all in.
I'm with you.
Well, no, I mean, I don't mean to get you in trouble.
You don't have to tell me what candidate you like.
Let's just kind of go through the opportunities.
We could talk about Georgia, Arizona, New Hampshire.
Where do you think really are some of the opportunities for us to take back positions of power heading into this midterm election?
Well, well said.
Here's where I see the opportunity in the Senate.
It's going to be very tough.
It's going to be 50-50, 51, 49, one way or another.
And it's all going to depend on those that are tuned in right now.
Are they willing to get out?
Are they willing to believe, once again, and one of the things that's changed is Donald Trump, I think, has changed the types of candidates that will run and ultimately get elected.
We see that in Georgia with Herschel Walker.
You know, Herschel is there.
Listen, Herschel has a great life and he is willing to put that on hold and serve the American people.
You know, obviously, you can't be a University of Georgia Bulldog fan without loving Herschel Walker, but you can't be a fan of the American dream and not be a fan of what Herschel has been able to accomplish.
So I'm very bullish on the fact that Herschel will be able to do a good job in Georgia.
So that will be a pickup seat there.
You look at New Hampshire.
You mentioned New Hampshire.
There's rumors that Governor Sununu may jump into that race.
That's a huge pickup opportunity in a market that honestly investors and donors will make a big difference there because you, other than that market that comes out of Boston that's so expensive, the rest of New Hampshire, you can normally make a real grassroots effort.
They want a candidate that will show up.
It's a different kind of politicking in New Hampshire.
It's a different statement.
So I'm pretty bullish there.
Yeah.
And he's already won statewide.
Yeah.
And I mean, and one decisively.
So I think that if Sununu gets in, there's a pickup there.
The real question mark is, you know, in Arizona out your way.
And, you know, when you look at Arizona, that's going to be a real battle.
We've got some great candidates out there that are already working hard.
As you know, you're all in a number of places where you're giving guidance.
I will say this, Charlie.
You know, that's a real race.
You got a sitting member of the Senate who ought to act more like Kristen Sinema than he is himself.
And so if he would look in the mirror and see her reflection, he'd have a better shot at that.
But that's going to be an all-out war, probably one of the more expensive races.
But again, fairly bullish on that.
Now, the question is on defense, where we have to be, we have to keep Ron Johnson.
Hopefully he announces that he's going to run again in Wisconsin.
He's very popular in Wisconsin.
He is.
And listen, why is he popular?
Because exactly like you talked about, he has the interests of the people of Wisconsin and he brings those to D.C. and he doesn't allow D.C. to infect him.
And I use the word infect purposefully there.
And so as we look at that, and then Pennsylvania is going to be the tough one.
Bluntly, we should have not had a big problem there.
It shouldn't even be close.
I think that we have to make sure on election integrity issues that we continue to fight those issues, Pennsylvania being one of those where it's critical.
And so it depends on who the candidate is there and how they win.
And then in my old home state of North Carolina, Ted Budd, president's endorsed him.
I think he will be the next senator from the Tar Heel State.
But we've got to play defense and the map doesn't look good.
But at the same time, I think that we could end up with a one-seat majority and take Chuck Schumer's voice away from it.
Yeah.
And I think Adam Laxalt could win in Nevada, but boy, that's a difficult state.
That state is.
Well, it is.
Now, I'm going to be out in Nevada.
I'm glad you mentioned that.
I'm going to be out in Nevada here in a week or two because one of the great opportunities I think we have with Nevada is to actually turn the entire state from blue to red.
And Adam's running a good campaign.
You got some other candidates running for other offices there.
I'm going to be out there, but it comes down to four counties in Nevada.
And so we need to...
You're right.
And so we're going to work those.
And I, in my personal capacity, going to be working with some of the political operatives out there to make sure that we can plow the field and make it a little easier way.
Yeah, there's some interesting races that the New Hampshire one opens the map.
It'll force them to spend another $50 to $100 million.
I think Marco Rubio will be fine in Florida, regardless of debtings, Val Demings, or whatever.
I think he'll be more than fine.
Parnell in Pennsylvania is going to be that primary is going to be tough.
I've endorsed Parnell.
Ohio, we should be comfortable, though, despite a pretty good candidate on their side.
We endorsed JD Vance, but whoever it is, it's going to be fine.
I think that race is solid.
Ohio has become a deep red state.
I agree.
And so I agree with you with Florida and Ohio.
Both of those look really strong, and we've got strong candidates.
Val Demings is not to be overlooked.
She is tough.
I served with her in Congress.
She's a tough candidate, but Marco will do just fine.
You know, your willingness to get involved and speak out about these individuals is certainly critical.
And it brings an extra dose of energy that is out there.
And so I'm, again, I'm kind of putting Florida and Ohio in those win columns pretty easily.
And hopefully we'll add to those.
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And I think the map only gets better from this.
It's a tough Senate map.
It is because six years ago was 16 when we did very well.
So you kind of have to always calculate that.
That's right.
I want to end our discussion here, Mark, with the time we have remaining with the issue that I get more questions about than any other issue.
And it was kind of laced throughout your commentary around the country, which is voter fraud and election integrity.
Talk about what the president's doing.
Talk about where his head's at with this.
Talk about what people can do.
It is the most frustrating issue for people.
And it's honestly frustrating at times for me because I don't know how to properly answer some of these questions because I say, well, we have to wait for things to come out and we have to do this.
Where are we at with this, Mark?
Let's separate fact from fiction and manage expectations.
Yeah, listen, there's three things that we can.
I boil it down to six words.
We need to make it easy to vote and hard to cheat.
But the only way that we do that is in some of our work here at the Conservative Partnership Institute is actually, we've got a huge election integrity initiative.
Cleta Mitchell, who's been very quarterbacking that for us.
But here's what we have to do.
We have to work with the state legislatures, but we also have to look at truly where were the problems in 2020.
And a lot of people say, well, let's just win back the house and look at it going forward.
And certainly we need to look at going forward.
But what we can't do is ignore the fact that there was legitimate fraud that has to be addressed to what levels we don't need to be making all kinds of claims on what it should be or shouldn't be.
But here's what we do is audits are a great thing.
I think audits should continue to be done.
We're working not only in the states like in Arizona and Georgia and Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, where there's real work continuing on still, but we're working in states where President Trump was certified as the winner in states like Florida and North Carolina.
Because what we see is if they've run one play and they're able to get away with fraud, one case, then what will they do next?
I mean, in the state of California, they've passed statutes to allow for ballot harvesting and they've had that and it's legal there.
And yet the chain of custody where it leaves from the voter's hand and goes to the ballot box is not sacred.
So we need to do that.
So I'm all in for audits and continuing to work there.
But there's a real frustration out there.
Why isn't more being done?
Striking The Balance00:06:17
I can tell you, it's even in Virginia.
So there was a lawsuit just filed in Virginia.
Fairfax County in the last week or so had been instructing people to not put the last four of a social security number on absentee ballots.
Now, that's a requirement to do that.
And additionally, they said, well, you don't even need a witness for that.
They've walked back on part of that.
But November, this November in Virginia is going to let us know.
And we're already seeing some inconsistencies from Fairfax County and Virginia.
And Christian Adams has filed a lawsuit.
He's terrific.
He's great.
He is doing great work.
We're working hand, but we just got to stay on the offense and make sure that it's easy to vote and hard to achieve.
Well, so, yeah, and this is my fear, though, Mark, is that, and I said this to the president, how do we strike the balance, though, to make sure this doesn't suppress voter turnout?
Because I don't want it to be where all of a sudden 15% of people don't show up in Herschel's race because they're like, oh, everything is broken.
How do we strike that balance?
100%.
So here's how we strike the balance.
And I appreciate you bringing that up.
I've mentioned similar things to President Trump on it.
Here's how you strike the balance.
You get an informed electorate.
And as part of the nonprofit work that we're doing, we're actually saying, all right, here's how you can make sure that you know the laws and that you stay involved.
I did this in North Carolina when my county, my original county was a Democrat county.
I said, well, what we're going to do is we're going to train people to know the election laws.
We're going to have them show up.
We're going to know how to contest when we see fraudulent activity and know how to do.
So that's so if you're thinking about not showing up to vote or not engaging, my message to you is don't do that.
Let's go ahead and figure out how you're going to show up not only at the ballot box, but you're going to show at the precinct level.
Let me tell you, you know how I got involved in politics?
I showed up at a precinct meeting.
There was one person at the precinct meeting.
It was me.
I became the chairman of the precinct.
And the rest is history.
And so half of the battle is showing up.
And so all those that are tuned in, I would ask if you are in a state where there's potential for it to be very close, we want you to engage.
We're willing to work with you.
If it's a nonprofit activity, a conservative partnership will help you there.
If it's political, we've got groups that we can refer you to to do that.
And I would say for 2022, let's stay engaged and show up not only for Herschel, but for a lot of these other candidates you just mentioned.
Yeah, I'm worried that there will be a suppression aspect if we don't strike that balance.
And we also don't actually give people the confidence in their elections back.
And it's a very serious issue, especially here in Arizona.
It is the number one issue, which is how do we let what happen?
And Mark, you were there in the White House watching the returns.
And we saw the late night dumps and all of this.
And also, what can we do to make sure we never get gamed like that again?
I know it was an unprecedented thing, but the problem was we were all kind of taken by surprise, and we really shouldn't have been, right?
We shouldn't have been.
Honestly, you know, it's there needs to be more litigious activity prior to each November's election.
We need to look at the state laws, and that's one of the things.
There's over 300 state laws.
So, to the person who's saying, why show up?
Because we're actually working with state legislatures to pass laws to make sure that the ballot box is sacred and truly can be counted on.
And that there is a way to audit it that will prove that if you have a fraudulent vote, there's an easy way to do that.
So, that's what we're doing.
And in addition to that, we need to understand that they ran a play.
You know, you mentioned Herschel Walker.
Part of what happened was he would find out what would work when he was running the football.
Part of it was his athletic ability.
The other is he knew if he ran off tackle for this particular team or to the left on this particular team, it would score.
Now we know their plays.
So now we know what to look at both legislatively and from an accountability standpoint.
I totally agree.
Mark, any closing thoughts?
Your book is Chief's Chief.
Everyone needs to go check it out and buy a couple of copies.
Any closing thoughts on this topic?
Yeah, so yeah.
So, Charlie, I want to finish where I started.
Thank you for your work.
For all those that have tuned in, thank you for partnering with Charlie and loving this country the way that President Trump loved this country.
The book, The Chief's Chief, will tell a number of stories, some of which have never been reported.
That you'll be able to, some of them humorous, some of them not so humorous, but all of them talk about America's greatness and the fact that he is a great president, willing to fight so hard on behalf of the forgotten man and woman.
And I would say this: listen, we've faced difficult times throughout our history as a nation.
And certainly this may be a difficult time, but it's not the most difficult time.
And I am very optimistic if the forgotten men and women, the people that are truly tuning in right now, the people who I dedicated the book to, if they will stay engaged, we'll have a better Congress, we'll have a better Senate, and quite frankly, we'll turn our country back to its founding fathers' principles.
Amen.
Well, thank you, Mark, for joining.
It's the Chiefs' Chief.
Everyone, check it out.
Good to see you, Mark.
God bless you.
God bless you.
Thanks, Charlie.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
Email us your thoughts, freedom at charliekirk.com.
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Thank you so much for listening, everybody.
God bless.
Speak to you soon.
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