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July 19, 2021 - The Charlie Kirk Show
40:31
Project Veritas Whistleblower EXPOSES Critical Race Theory in a Children's' Toy Manufacturer—LIVE with James O' Keefe
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Media Status Quo and Disinformation 00:14:34
Hey, everybody.
Today on the Charlie Kirk show, James O'Keefe, he rolled into our room here with a platoon of people, and we gave him a hard time.
But more importantly, he's actually doing great work.
Project Veritas, James O'Keeffe, and he has a whistleblower about the maker of toys for your children and how they are trying to make the toys to try to teach your children not to be little racists from Hasboro.
It's kind of a freewheeling episode.
It's a lot of fun, and it's made possible by all of you that support us at charliekirk.com slash support.
When you support us at charliekirk.com slash support, you allow us to continue to grow.
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Buckle up, everybody.
Here we go.
Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.
I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
I want to thank Charlie.
He's an incredible guy.
His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created.
Turning point USA.
We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
That's why we are here.
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Hey, everybody, Charlie Kirk here with The Salt in the Brunei, otherwise known as James O'Keefe.
You brought a couple people in the room with you.
Yes.
See, I can give you a hard time, James, because we've known each other a couple years.
You do give me a hard time.
But you are one of the few people that actually do something meaningful in the movement.
I appreciate that.
So you are now on a whistleblower project.
Tell us about that.
Whistleblowers are in the room right now.
You can't see them, but USPS whistleblower, we had two TV insiders.
One came on your stage, April Moss, CBS Detroit.
These are people currently employed by television news networks, postal service.
A new one came out today, Hasbro.
Big story, critical race theory.
They feel compelled to go public with information that people are trying to keep hidden.
And it's the heroism because they're going to lose their jobs now, Charlie.
So we have a dozen that have come out, and it's going to be hundreds.
So we're going to hear from Dave in a couple seconds here, but I want to just get into this idea of whistleblowing.
This used to be something the media was actually interested in.
Right.
And you just are kind of filling the void of courageous expose style journalism.
Well, I think there's a relationship.
The journalists have become slave to their access.
They've become dependent on protecting the people in power.
They want to protect the status quo.
CNN invites Clapper on, even though he committed perjury.
They have a symbiotic relationship with the very people they're supposed to be holding accountable.
So no one is willing to do this sort of aggressive watchdog journalism anymore.
In the 20th century, these whistleblowers lost their mortgages, their homes, they got divorces.
But now there's life after whistleblowing because of the digital age and websites like Give, Send, Go.
Facebook insider Morgan Common last month raised half a million dollars, Charlie, in 24 hours.
What did he expose?
He released documents inside Facebook as a software engineer.
They had, quote, vaccine hesitancy.
So Facebook admitted.
Even if what someone is saying on Facebook is true, they will censor you and they don't want you to know that they're censoring you.
And to me, that's the part that's so shocking.
They want to hide what they're doing.
We want transparency into big tech.
So the whistleblowers are coming out in spades, Charlie.
So you got onto this years ago.
First, of course, Andrew Breitbart, Hannah Giles story, and it's an amazing, it's an amazing story.
Your book is called two books.
One's called Breakthrough.
That was the coming of age of me getting arrested and facing the retaliation and enduring that.
The second one's called American Pravda, which is about the 2016 election and exposing bird-dogging at rallies.
And there's a new one, Charlie, we're just announcing this weekend called American Muckraker.
This is a very ambitious book.
It's coming out in January, but I just announced it today.
And this one's really about.
Can people pre-order it?
Yeah, as of today.
Yes.
It's on Amazon.
Go buy a message.
The book is called American Muckraker, Rethinking Journalism for the 21st Century.
And this book is really an ambitious book.
I read 100 books about journalism in the 20th century.
And what I've realized is that there's sort of life after whistleblowing now.
There's a different era, but we have to reinvent or recreate the era of Upton Sinclair and Ida Tarbell and Ida B. Wells.
Lincoln Stevens, all of these folks.
So Ida B. Wells and others, I was actually going to ask you about this.
What's the common theme of the great pieces of journalism that expose the Teapot Dome scandal?
It's not exposed the Chicago stockyards.
It's not black or white.
I think there's a, again, journalism, you have this dichotomy between access and autonomy.
In other words, you have this tension between burning your source and protecting your source.
And Veritas, I think we strike that balance.
In other words, these guys are literally risking their lives and their reputations, and they're being fired from their jobs for the public's right to know.
I think journalism has become so bastardized.
CNN is saying the opposite of what is reality.
So in the 20th century, you had these muckraking newspaper reporters.
I think the 1960s, 1970s, Chicago Sun-Times, you had people who would go undercover.
They don't do that anymore because they don't want to shake the Apple card.
Do you think it's because it's a corporate project?
It's a really, we talked about this last time.
It's not just politics.
It's fear.
It's the consolidation of media and newspapers.
It's tech companies preferring in their algorithms, the New York Times and CNN.
It's the bifurcation of the American economy.
It's a lot of things.
But now what I've realized is that the journalism depends upon citizens.
It depends upon the people that we brought on stage today.
It depends upon all of you guys do the work.
And so recently you had a couple, another whistleblower with a local Fox station.
Tell us about that one.
That was Ivory Hecker in Houston, Texas.
Ivory was doing a story on the Texas heat wave, and she went on the air a month ago and basically said, I'm being muzzled by my TV station.
What was happening, Charlie, in Houston was Fox 26, local affiliate, was saying you cannot report on hydrochloroquine.
You cannot talk about hydroxychloroquine.
They also said that she can't report like a Bitcoin story because they said, well, you know, this is their words, not mine.
They said, African Americans don't care about Bitcoin stories.
So that was, again, journalism has become corrupted.
And Ivory was so outraged that she decided to go on air in a very theatrical way and say, they're muzzling me.
And they fired her.
And as a result of what Ivory did, it inspired another whistleblower, April Moss, to come forward from CBS Detroit.
And they're getting top-down orders not to pursue certain stories.
Right.
So they said, we don't care about our audience, about what our CEO cares about.
So they were saying out loud what we all know to be true.
And I think journalism, it is a, you know, you run a foundation, I run a foundation, we're a non-for-profit.
And I do think that the commercial imperative interferes with truth-telling.
Because there is no, I wrote in this book, American Mockbreaker, which you all should, I don't, I know I'm going to do a shameless plug.
This is a book that I don't get any of the money.
It all goes to Project Veritas.
I say in American Mockraker, you almost have to be a masochist to expose the truth.
You have to jump on grenades.
You have to face indictments and arrests and false accusations.
You have to endure suffering if you want to be a truth teller.
And that's what these people do.
And it's our job to have their back.
So let's talk about another project you have, which is your lawfare project.
Right.
You're getting very involved in suing companies and you call this Retracto 2.
Can you walk us through this entire thing?
Well, Veritas has essentially become kind of a law firm because in order to tell the truth, and again, historically, journalists settled scores of lawsuits.
60 Minutes settled dozens, if not hundreds of lawsuits.
People don't remember that in the 1980s.
CNN settles lawsuits all the time.
But they don't have that appear on their Wikipedia page, Charlie.
If you read my Wikipedia page, it literally makes people shriek because they're like, this is crazy.
This guy, Dr. Hootage, he's a criminal.
I personally settled one lawsuit in 2009 because I recorded someone without them knowing I was present in that conversation.
I decided early on that in order to do what I have to do, I can't settle litigation.
So we've taken lawsuits all the way to federal trials, jury trials, and we've won.
We have not lost one lawsuit to Project Veritas.
And we've sued, most recently on offense, the New York Times for defamation.
And one of the handful of people to get past motion to dismiss, which means we get to put New York Times reporters in a room under oath on videotape and ask them all types of questions, which is required by law to answer.
How long has it taken you to get that to that step?
It's cost us $300,000 and it's taken us about six months.
Six months.
What was the complaint?
The complaint was a defamation lawsuit against the New York Times after reporter Maggie Astor reported that we had made a, quote, deceptive video that was disinformation.
And the video showed a Somali guy.
Remember this one from September.
Oh, yeah, the ballot harvesting.
He's like, I have bad it's, I have lots of bad it's.
And he says, one of the guys say, I don't care that it's illegal.
They were already bragging on video.
And the New York Times comes out and says, well, there's a disinformation campaign.
So what you begin to realize is that what they do is they project onto us what they are.
So they're doing disinformation.
They're collaborating with Stanford Institute of God, some professor in some room who just writes some opinion.
They cite the opinion as facts.
And it's not most journalists don't actually materially lie.
These hyperbole and circumstantial evidence and hearsay, and they circularly source the quotes.
And before you know it, you have this vortex of propaganda.
So we said, enough is enough.
We are suing the New York Times.
I'm suing CNN.
I'm suing Twitter.
I will depose you under oath if it costs me $10 million.
I don't care.
So help me God, I'll raise the money.
So far, we've raised the money.
We got past motion to dismiss.
Yeah, so that's the key, though, right?
Because a judge sometimes throws this stuff out.
And that would be the greatest travesty of injustice known to man.
And it happens, Charlie, because most lawyers are risk-averse cowards, and they don't want their clients to talk about what's going on.
I don't get it.
I've told my lawyers, we are going to be public about the process.
If any judge is so utterly irrational that they make a mockery of the rule of law, we will merely quote the order.
We quote the transcripts.
In the New York Times response to our defamation lawsuit, Charlie, they admitted the New York Times was forced to answer questions because we got past motion to dismiss.
The New York Times admitted in court.
They didn't even call anyone for comment.
They admitted in court they got the facts wrong in the article.
And Liban Muhammad, they said they did break the law.
But they reported in the article that he didn't.
So the New York Times has admitted in court something, and they still haven't corrected the article.
So we're making a mockery of them by virtue of what they've done.
Most clients don't do that because the lawyers say, don't say a word.
Don't say a word.
Don't talk about your case.
Are you planning to settle?
If the New York Times offered me $100 million, I'd tell them to go F themselves.
$100 million.
You got no price.
What's the market cap, the New York Times?
Probably $4 billion.
Okay, that's my price.
Okay.
Is it $4.8?
Am I right, Matthew?
I know my lowest.
What's the current market cap of the New York Times?
I will bet you it's a seven.
I know my marketing.
I know my small cap publicly traded NASDAQ stocks that no one makes.
I don't know about that.
But if the New York Times has to offer me one penny about their current market cap, that might be my...
Certificates of ownership is your full liquidation of James O'Keeffe Enterprises.
What they need to do is they need to correct the damn article.
Listen, this is an Orwellian thing.
You know, two plus two equals four.
They've admitted, this is very important.
I know we're in the weeds here.
I'm going to get in the weeds.
It's important that you understand the nuances.
The New York Times admitted in the Supreme Court of the state of New York that they got the facts wrong.
It's signed by the New York Times lawyers, but they still haven't corrected the article.
If that isn't defamation, what is?
If that is an actual malice, meaning they know they're lying, then what is?
You tell me.
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The Courage to Sue for Defamation 00:07:31
Do you think that conservatives need to sue more?
If they are being defamed, I think that libel law, I think it's very hard.
And Neil Gorsuch did a great dissent on a recent case involving Times v. Sullivan, which I think is bad law.
It's awful law.
I think the actual malice standard of public figures is too high.
I think it's impossible to be held liable for anything.
And I think because Jack Dorsey and Mark Zuckerberg and Google prefer the New York Times and their algorithms, that gives them infinite power.
In other words, the New York Times and CNN have as much power as Google, Facebook, and Twitter does.
Because of that, I think that people need to start suing for defamation.
We need a people's defamation defense fund in this country, and the lawyers need to understand, because I'm going to make a gross generalization.
It's true.
Most lawyers are cowards, and the litigation business is a racket, and they want money, and they charge $1,000 an hour.
It's disgusting.
But we need clients who have good fact patterns to sue if they're defamed by the New York Times.
And I got to lead the charge.
I'm happy to do it.
What lawyers are you using then to kind of pioneer ahead?
Well, I'm using Hermit Dylan and Ron Coleman, who's awesome.
But they're an amazing.
They're going to be at risk of being disparate.
That's why they're so courageous.
And people say, I'm at risk for being disbarred.
Meanwhile, if you like the ambulance chasers, they never get disparaged.
They never get disbarred.
That's what I write about in American Mock Raker.
There's a perverse incentive to do the wrong thing because you'll be rewarded in society.
If you don't tell the truth, if you do tell the truth, you'll be punished.
So there's a perverse incentive.
But what we got to find, Charlie, is the lawyers who are brave.
We're working with a great firm right now with the New York Times case.
What's the name of it, Nancy?
The name of it.
Claire Locke.
Claire Locke.
And they've successfully gotten a spast motion to dismiss.
And we're making videos about these lawsuits.
We're going through the videos and we're showing people the motions and we're showing people.
You know that they cited Wikipedia in a legal motion?
The New York Times.
Who's representing him?
Perkins Coy?
Yes.
Huh?
I think so.
Yes.
I think so.
I'm going to.
How about Kirkland Ellis?
Well, they have a general counsel, cited Wikipedia, and they say, well, O'Keefe is libel proof.
Yeah, they're going to farm out the other side.
Who cares?
They say, O'Keefe is libel proof.
Libel proof.
Because Wikipedia says mean things about him.
And they thought that I wouldn't publish this, but I did.
They weren't expecting that, Charlie.
So you have risk-averse lawyers that are willing to push through this stuff.
What districts are you suing in?
We're suing New York Times in state court.
In New York.
And you're having judges that are allowing this stuff to proceed.
Well, again, yes, but we've won seven lawsuits in a row.
And people say, well, that must be because you have good judges.
No, it's because we're on the right side of the facts and the law.
And in North Carolina, we had a federal judge rule on a directed verdict, which means the jury came out.
I mean, this is something out of a movie.
And the federal judge gaveled the case and said, this is absurd.
And I'm going to paraphrase the federal judge because cameras were not allowed in courtrooms.
He said, he looked over at the plaintiff who was suing me.
He said, if Mike Wallace at 60 Minutes were sued for this, people would laugh.
Their whole argument rests on the case that I'm not a journalist.
But you can go back to your philosophy class.
I mean, you are what you do.
You're defined by your actions.
They rely upon their own credibility by virtue of their own decree that they're credible.
Yes.
They rely on the fact that, well, I'm the Washington Post.
You should believe me, but the facts show that you're wrong.
It doesn't matter.
I'm the Washington Post.
So every argument they make in court is fallacious.
Every argument they make in court is anathema to logic.
They say, well, but he's O'Keefe.
He's a criminal.
And the judge says, but what has he done?
Well, doctor's videos.
Can you give me a specific example of a video he's doctored?
When you actually put them under oath, they can't answer that question.
Federal judge gavels the case, looks at the plaintiff, and says, If you sued Mike Wallace for what you're suing.
Mike Wallace is dead.
He was a 60-minute person.
Who was the original gotcha?
The original undercover.
He said, if you sued Mike Wallace for what you're suing James O'Keefe for, people in this courtroom would laugh.
Case dismissed.
It cost us $2 million to take them all the way to a jury verdict, but we did.
The New York Times?
This is the Chirley Teeter case.
Bob Creamer, your friend in Chicago.
Yeah, my friend.
I'm just kidding.
I'm a friend with thug union organizers.
I'm being specialized.
These are my friends.
But he's in your backyard.
You're from Chicago.
Proximity is friendship.
I'm kidding.
I could give it to you.
Give it to me.
So, Chicago, he's married to Jan Schaukowski.
He sues us for reporting what his colleagues said.
I remember this was a great video.
This is one of your favorites.
I know I mention it all the time.
It was cited by Trump in Hillary.
In the debate, yeah.
Bob Creamer on tape saying it was Hillary's idea to have these costumes and bird dogging and whatnot.
And you know what?
He sues me for defamation.
And the media reports that part, but what they don't report is the fact that it was gaveled on a rule 50-directed verdict in federal court.
They selectively edit that out that Shirley Teeter sued me for defamation.
So the moral of the story is you can't settle litigation.
You have to take them all the way to the end, and that's what we do at Project.
Isn't it exhausting?
I mean, you're open to discovery then on the other side.
Sure, I got nothing to hide.
They do.
The only thing that I can hide, I have a First Amendment right to protect, you know, freedom of association rights for the donors to our nonprofit.
I can protect them.
I can protect sources, but everything else, I got to be an open book.
And that's the difference.
But isn't it exhausting to have to open up everything?
I mean, everything's exhausting.
Life is hard, and people work hard in all different types of professions.
But this is sort of our cross to bear.
And we, you know, we, our team, we try to get a team of people who believe so much in what they're doing that, you know, they do the right thing.
So I want to get to David in a second, but I have a question unrelated to this.
Can you explain the melodrama thing that you're like the music man or like Oklahoma and like the dancing?
Can I explain the just explain the entire new like evolution?
Like James O'Keefe 2.0.
I've always been musical.
I was no, just like the whole thing.
Like you wear bulletproof vests and you dye your hair and, you know, like the Gary Indiana thing or whatever you're doing.
You want me to explain the fact that I'm like 76 trombones come marching in, whatever the whole thing you're doing is, right?
Well, you know, I think that politics is downstream from culture, and I think I'm probably not motivated by politics.
I think I'm more of an artistic person.
And I think, you know, Cinema Verite, which is Project Veritas, we show the truth in 24 frames per second.
And essentially, you know, we believe in, you know, we put music in our videos.
We made a music video about Jack Dorsey and CNN.
It was very funny.
And I'm glad you liked it.
I know that you did.
And we have dancers that come on stage here, and we do a whole production.
We produce our videos.
And I've always been a theatrical person.
I think I'm more motivated by the artistic exposing the truth aspects than politics.
And I think that's just who I am.
And I've always been that way.
I did the Acorn story.
I put a pimp costume on in the bumper, and everyone gave me grief about it.
Hannah wore the prostitution get up in the office.
We both throw out the fur into the office.
But, you know, Andrew taught me early on that, you know, it's a cultural fight.
Yes.
And I think more people need to dye their hair and make music videos.
Critical Race Theory Training at Hasbro 00:14:07
Yeah, we're going to pass on that for now.
But that was a dig, Charlie.
Yeah, I could tell.
So, no, I have a lot of people ask about it.
I actually kind of like it.
The way I look at it is you're just kind of owning this entire fighting the world.
I might as well have fun while I'm with you.
We don't like to.
I mean, like, that's kind of how I view it.
We don't like to pretend.
I don't like to pretend.
A lot of people in politics pretend I'm not a pretender.
I like to be who I am.
And I think the people that come to us appreciate that.
And I can't pretend.
So that's who I am.
This is what I do.
And so much of exposing the reality of the world is to sometimes ridicule the world, to effectively ridicule them.
It's impossible to counteract ridicule.
They do it all the time.
They make movies.
They make art.
And I think we're fighting the powers that be.
We're fighting the establishment.
And this is what we do.
This is what Project Veritas is about.
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David, welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show.
You are one of the new whistleblowers here for Project Veritas, and you work for a toy design and manufacturing company.
Is that a good way to describe it?
Yeah, I work for Hasbro right now.
Hasbro.
And you at our event uncovered that there's critical race theory training or something around that.
Floor is yours.
Tell us about it.
Sure.
So I decided to come to Project Veritas because I was asked to go.
Well, I was kind of told to go to a critical race theory training at Hasbro.
At first, I didn't think it was going to be anything too incriminating, but I just decided to record it just because I've been watching critical race theory and intersectionality just kind of spreading through our country and our institutions for years now.
So I'm like, I'll record it.
And then it actually started and then my jaw hit the floor.
So I was like, I need to send this to people.
They need to know what's happening.
Okay, so what is your role with Hasbro?
I'm packaging engineer.
Packaging engineer.
What was involved in the training?
The training, it was just a video showing like children at different developmental stages and then stating at what developmental stage, how much racial bias they're exhibiting.
So how young did they get?
Did they say three-year-olds even?
Five-year-olds?
I think the earliest was six months?
Six months.
So is this training mandatory at Hasbro?
It was mandatory for me.
I don't know how many times they've done it before this.
I would say this was at least the second training.
So just some understanding this, one of the largest toy manufacturers in the world is making their employees learn that the toys they're making might be made for a bunch of little racists or something.
Yes, they want to use toys to kind of teach children about racial biases to, I guess, maybe kind of correct what they see as some kind of wrong.
But it's just going to make more children discriminate based on race.
Did they say that part out loud?
Did they say that now we have to fix this in the toy manufacturing business?
They said something along the lines of they have a responsibility because they have such wide access to children.
Oh, really?
So that's pretty creepy, honestly.
Did I just say that?
Like, it's really kind of perverted.
So you're a shipping engineer and you saw this and you were inspired then to do something about it.
Walk us through that.
Was there a moment where you were wrestling with...
Man, I don't know if I got it in me to do this.
Well, I was already recording it, but before I sent it off to Veritas, I kind of hesitated.
I'm like, if I send this, I don't know what's going to happen from here.
I can't predict anything that's going to come forward.
But I figured it was important enough that no matter what happened to me, that people needed to know about it to protect their children.
Well, you did the courageous thing.
Thank you.
And the right thing.
So tell us what then motivated you to send it because there was that moment of struggle.
So we have thousands of people listening to this that are in college right now that have footage that you have, but they haven't yet done anything with it.
What motivated you to then send that?
I think I just thought about what the consequences were.
Like, if I didn't do anything, if I didn't send it, then it would continue to be pushed at Hasbro.
And I don't know how many children they would be able to indoctrinate through that.
But just there's too much critical race theory in our institutions already.
I figured if I could do anything to just kind of push back against it, then it would be worth it.
Well, and it's if thousands of other people, when they came across this stuff, exposed it, then there would be a movement against it.
Now, what makes this work is now James is saying, I'm going to catch you when you fall because I'm guessing you're going to get a letter or an email or something.
I could be wrong.
Well, they have to go through me to get to him.
And that's what we do.
We were able to do that.
So, walk us through that, James.
It's exactly what I mean.
In order for them to do anything to him, they have to go through Project Veritas.
What do you mean?
Lawsuit-wise?
You name it.
Getting sued, I'll pay his legal bills.
I don't think they want to sue.
They haven't sued any of the whistleblowers thus far because they wouldn't want to bring attention.
They're bringing publicity to what he's effectively documenting.
So they haven't done that.
So it's kind of jiu-jitsu, David versus Goliath Jiu-Jitsu.
And I said on stage here at Turning Point, you know, David, literally David, David is his name, versus Goliath.
David is getting new strength.
And Goliath, which is his organization that he works for, is being attacked on all sides.
And what's remarkable, Charlie, is that after David did what he did, over the weekend, we reached out for comment to Hasbro.
And when we reached out for comment, our comms team sent them an email.
Someone privately reached out to our proton male and said, hey, I work on the comms team.
I love what he's doing.
Wow.
We have that person's name, and we're meeting with that person, you know, now.
So it's just this thing that happens.
It metastasizes.
And the thing that's most remarkable about David is his courage.
The courage to do the right thing, not knowing if you're going to land with a safety net.
And it's kind of become this movement.
So, David, you could lose your job.
Probably, well.
How are you okay with that?
There are more important things than money.
We get thousands of emails every day of people that say, Charlie, I might lose my job.
I hope they all take this very seriously.
And also, Veritas is a resource to be able to catch them when they fall.
And you're right, there are more important things than money.
And obviously, I mean, money's quite honestly not very important in regards to having a functioning society.
I think most people, there are psychological studies which I don't have handy right now, but most people would rather, they're more afraid of losing what they have than gaining what they don't.
So most people don't approach life in the way that David does, but I would think there's thousands of people who do approach life.
Yeah, so it's actually, I have this written.
I was actually looking for it during our conversation.
It's Brett Weinstein.
It's called Loss Aversion.
Loss aversion.
That's what I'm saying.
I don't even remember what it was.
It's yeah, loss aversion, which is, and this really explains the billionaire class in America really well, is that someone who has a billion dollars will do almost anything to make sure you don't lose that ability, that billion dollars, right?
So someone is much more, we are as human beings, and some would make an evolutionary argument for this.
I'm not going to get into that right now, that we're much more afraid of losing what we already have than trying to risk something to gain, right?
And so because of that, almost our entire society and human action is hardwired against preserving what you already have.
That includes jobs, social status, friendships, networking opportunities, Instagram followers, Twitter accounts, employment, college acceptance, scholarships.
And so we're willing to do things that even compromise our own values to then try to protect what we already have.
And then there's a second psychological study that shows this, which Veritas is pushing back against, which is called the Ash Conformity Test, which is when they brought five people into a room and four of them were in on it and one person was the test subject.
And the four people who are in on it all agreed based on the trial to, when asked, pick the shortest line and say the shortest line was actually the longest line.
So they'd all go into the room, all five of them, four people being in on it together, one person being tested, and they'd go down the line.
Which line is the longest line?
And they'd all say together the one that was intentionally wrong.
And 75% of the time, the last person who answered would agree with what their line would disagree with what their eyes said, but would agree with the first four answers ahead of them.
Right.
And because why, when asked about it, they'd say, well, I was afraid of the mockery or ridicule.
They were afraid of losing social status.
Yep.
But there are increasingly people that are not.
And the increased value people place on politics, the political variables, they just need more courage, more people coming out.
Do you want to see more people do what you've done?
Yes.
I think that if everyone who opposed critical theory, critical race, critical gender theory just came out at once and said, enough, we'd probably be done with this tomorrow.
But it's scary because the institutions just have so much power.
You might lose your job.
You might lose some friends.
Well, kind of friends.
But it's important.
People need to do it.
They need to have some courage.
Tell me about your background.
What led you in your life to all of a sudden fight a multi-billion dollar creepy toy manufacturer?
I don't know.
I come from pretty, I think, standard background.
Like I went to college at RAT, so I've had some pretty, I guess, prestigious jobs, like jobs I paid well, but I've also worked in factories and cleaning floors.
So I've met a lot of people and just I'm not really concerned with social status all that much.
I've never really thought about it too much.
It's weird to be in this kind of position, but that's exactly why you're perfect for it.
I don't know.
They made me necessary pushing all this CRT.
So when did you first get made aware of the idea of critical race theory as just a citizen?
A long time ago, but it was mostly called like intersectionality.
This was like six or seven years ago.
So was this when you were at college?
Yes.
So RAT is the Rhode Island Rochester Institute of Technology.
Got it.
Okay.
So, but Hasbro's in Rhode Island, right?
Yes.
I work remotely for Hasbro.
Okay.
So you got you.
So it was first called intersectionality.
And when all of a sudden did you all of a sudden say this is not good for our society?
Around the time where I noticed colleges had like segregation, they were starting to do segregated graduations, and they were just calling them like people of color only.
And I'm just like, that looks like you're saying colored people.
And I had a real problem with that.
And then I just started to pay more attention.
And then I noticed like it's in our media.
It's obviously in colleges.
And it's just spreading more and more.
It's in our military now.
So did you see what happened on college campuses then get into your corporate boardrooms?
Like into Hasbro?
Yeah.
So it was just kind of like a slap in the face because it's one thing to just watch YouTube videos of like people talking about CRT or intersectionality.
It's a whole other thing when you're called into a meeting and they're telling you, hey, so this is what we're going to be doing from now on.
So it's policy.
This wasn't just some, you know, whackadoodle Robin DiAngelo is going to come give an optional, you know, speech, right?
We're going to go pay your $900,000 to tell us about how racist we are, right?
This is policy.
I think, well, it's Hasbro working with another company called The Conscious Kid.
Yeah, I've heard that.
They want to make sure that their ideology is pushed at every level at Hasbro.
Everybody listening, I'm going to write this down because I need conscious kid.
I've had three people mention them.
They're this kind of like consulting kind of world transformation group that's basically going around trying to teach people how racist your children are.
Yeah, right.
They're not like, I don't know how big the company itself is, but they have big partners.
Like, they work with YouTube and Google and the NFL.
Like, that's those are major players.
So, I hope everyone understands this.
And by the way, James, this is a great thing for you to expose in the coming months and years, that there's this kind of like offensive coordinator equivalent.
There's a football analogy of these consulting companies that are kind of choreographing all of this stuff.
And they're seed-funded by the big tech companies and they go into all these corporations.
And that's why you find unified messaging at every single one of these companies because these people come in with these playbooks and they implement it.
And that's what you saw at Hasbro.
Yep.
Closing Thoughts on the Movement 00:04:18
In closing, James, how can people give you a hard time, but that's because I actually respect what you're doing.
But everyone, in all seriousness, should support Project Veritas, one of the few organizations actually doing something.
You were doing amazing on our stage at our Student Action Summit.
Thank you.
And I hope all of our students are motivated to expose things on their college campuses.
As I was standing in line with David, you know, we did a little book signing and took some photos.
There were people coming up to us inside companies here at your conference.
I can't say the names of those companies, but apparently your students or their guests were coming up to us.
And I mean this.
I appreciate you letting us go over time today.
We had five people on stage.
David was the grand finale.
And every time one of we do this, there's another few dozen.
So I think there's a movement.
And the crowd was pretty amazing.
I mean, the energy was probably the best.
I've been to, I don't know how many have been doing this with you for seven years, six years.
And the energy today was probably the best energy I've ever felt.
They were shouting, David.
It was like tears are coming to my eyes.
David, David.
I mean, it was really special.
And we're getting tips as right now as I speak.
So it's like a movement of 100,000 people.
I don't think people believe that this is possible, Charlie.
They think that I'm crazy, but they don't believe it's possible until it happens because it isn't possible until it is.
So Veritas Tips at ProtonMail.com.
That's Veritas Tips at ProtonMail.com to do what he did.
The book is out.
All the proceeds go to Project Veritas Foundation.
It's called American Muckraker, and you could pre-order it today.
You are in the courage business, you people that are courageous.
That's right, exactly.
We're in the courage business.
So there's the closing thing.
We talk a lot about courage on this show.
Sure.
We talk about the ancient Greek definition of courage.
Because that's the big gap we have right now in America.
Your phrase at Project Veritas is be brave, do something.
There's someone listening right now.
They probably are just, they stop their car in their driveway and they have a pit in their stomach because they work for Goldman Sachs and they know they could be that next whistleblower.
I think you have to make a decision about whether you, when people say pursuit of happiness, which is what was written in the Declaration of Independence, I think there's also the pursuit of meaning.
And courage is the virtue that sustains all other things, all other virtues, right?
You've read your Aristotle.
Right.
So courage is the virtue that sustains all the other great things that we need to courage.
You need courage to love.
You need courage to do what he did.
So, you know, yes, there are ups and downs.
People don't like the volatility.
They want to just maintain.
But there are some things more important than maintaining, to quote your loss aversion thing.
And I just think that, you know, follow David's lead.
He's an inspirational guy.
He's a good man who believes in what he's doing.
And we all do.
And we need more people like this.
And, you know, have to go through me to get to him.
And, you know, whatever they need.
You got a bullet pervest on.
And I got a bullet per vest on.
You're in Oklahoma.
Like, so good luck.
You know, you got to do the right thing in life.
And that's what matters.
And I think that it's not the politicians who are going to help this country.
It's people like him.
We just need hundreds of people like him.
Yes.
They just need to give the permission to do it.
They need to know that they can do it.
And they can do it.
And it's more, this new wrinkle you have at Veritas is amazing where it's not just the undercover thing, but now it's the whistleblower thing.
Both combined.
Which is just what I know.
No, and saying, but it's a force multiplier.
It is.
It's a movement, never been done.
We're pioneering.
We're making it happen.
And David assumes new strength while Goliath is attacked on all sides.
And I said in my closing line, the hunter becomes the quarry.
The hunter becomes the hunted.
They fear him more than he fears them.
So many people, and I hope you know this, David, members of the ruling class have had to see their doctors recently because James O'Keefe keeps them up at night.
James O'Keeffe, God bless you, be brave and do something.
Thanks so much.
Cheers.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
Email us your thoughts, freedom at charliekirk.com.
If you want to get involved with Turning Point USA, go to tpusa.com.
And if you want to support our program, go to charliekirk.com/slash support.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
God bless you.
Speak to you soon.
For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.
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