3 Pastors on Lockdowns, Liberty, and the Essential Church LIVE from SAS
Charlie is joined by three very special pastors—Jurgen Matthesius, Rob McCoy, and David Engelhardt—LIVE from Turning Point USA's Student Action Summit who offered timeless advice, knowledge, and wisdom to a crowd of thousands of young, christian patriots. They talk lockdowns, liberty, freedom, and even some advice on your love life from Charlie's own pastor, Rob McCoy. This is important & classic Sunday content you won't want to miss. Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Hey, everybody, on the special Sunday episode of the Charlie Kirk Show, an exclusive conversation in person at the Turning Point USA Student Action Summit.
If you want to support our program, go to charliekirk.com/slash support.
Email us your questions about this episode, freedom at charliekirk.com.
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So take out your phone, get to your podcast provider, podcast or Spotify.
Without any further ado, buckle up.
Here we go.
Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campuses.
I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
I want to thank Charlie.
He's an incredible guy.
His spirit is love of this country.
He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created.
Turning point USA.
We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
That's why we are here.
Good morning, everybody.
We wanted to start off Sunday with that incredible worship service and also now a pastor's panel because what's really happened the last nine months in our country is the church has been deemed non-essential.
And these three pastors have stood up for freedom and for liberty at great personal expense to all of them in different ways.
And I've had the opportunity to speak at both Jürgen and Rob's church.
I hope to be able to speak at David's church soon.
So David Engelhart is from New York City.
Anyone from New York here?
Well, you should all go to David's church.
So David, I had an opportunity to get to know a couple months ago.
And David came out very vocally against Black Lives Matter, BLM Incorporated, saying that this is not what Christians should be supporting or getting behind.
And David is very, very courageous and is in great, is in great, let's say, company here on this panel.
And of course, Pastor Rob, my pastor from Calvary Chapel, Thousand Oaks, Rob opened his church completely back in May and has never looked back and has had an unbelievable couple months really bringing people into the church and fighting for freedom and liberty.
So David, why don't we start with you?
Talk about these last couple months.
And also, everyone in this room has had to deal with social justice warrior, virtue signaling, BLM Incorporated.
Look how good of a person I am, Black Square posting activists online.
You took a stand against this.
I think you're an inspiration to every young person out here because so many young people out here are understandably a little bit skittish to confront this BLM Incorporated nonsense.
Tell us why you did it and kind of explain to us the biblical backing.
Yeah, so I, you know, we planted a church in New York City two years ago.
I have a law practice too.
So we're kind of, we're downtown New York City and we have a really mixed church.
We have people from all different backgrounds.
It's not a kind of homogenous group of white people that all wear suits.
That's not who it is.
It's New York City.
And we never had any racial issues.
We actually had the opposite of that until last spring.
And not only culture, but pastors and churches were saying these outlandish things like everyone in your church is a racist, independent if your best friend is a black person.
And I was saying, this is insane.
What are you talking about?
How are you dividing the body of Christ in this kind of way?
Brothers and sisters, best friends, people have known each other for 20 years.
And I started to feel this rift in our church.
And people were saying, David, you need to speak up about it.
You need to speak up about it.
And so I did.
And the truth is, God, in Christ, in faith, you know, Galatians says that in faith we are the sons of Abraham, that we are a part of a new nation, and we're joined together as one.
If you look at secular systems like socialism, axiomatically, from the beginning, it's about dividing you and telling you you have something that someone else doesn't have, and it's their fault that you're in that position, right?
So there's this division that takes place.
We see it in the book of Genesis.
God says to Eve, He says, He says, Excuse me, the serpent says to Eve, He says, God has this amazing fruit, and He doesn't want you to have it.
You're a dirty little human being, and if you ate it, you would become like Him and you would be empowered.
Do what you're not supposed to do for your own empowerment.
And that is what this movement is calling.
It's based on narcissism, it's based on avarice and greed.
It's all about me, my own position, my own wealth, my own power.
And it's completely in contrast to the scripture, which is that we are for one another.
I lay down my life for you.
I don't take your life for me.
That's exactly the opposite method.
And that's the message that so many pastors and many big churches around the country are preaching.
And we're saying, no, it's exactly the opposite of that.
In the family of faith, in a community of faith, we're for one of each other or one another to our own hurt, to our own pain.
And once that message, that's the cross, right?
Jesus to his own pain, for our own blessing, for our own salvation.
And declaring that created an amazing opportunity to say, no, we're for something totally different.
And this real, really ideological, cold civil war that we're in the midst of right now, there's a real clarity to see who is on the good guy's side and who's on the bad guy's side, breaking stores, looting, destroying places, especially in a city like New York.
So how many people?
That's amazing, David.
Give it up for David.
That's incredible.
And by the way, that is way too much truth for a lot of people in New York City to be able to process.
And David has been a total hero.
So I encourage any of you in New York City to go to King's Church.
Is that what it's called, right?
To help support David.
But how many of you have lost friends because of this BLM incorporated nonsense?
And look at that.
Basically, the entire room.
And this is exactly by design.
You understand that, right?
The people in charge that, quite honestly, they do not have any form of peace about their future destination.
They want to divide our country at all costs.
So we just asked the question: basically, every single hand just went up.
So these are fracturing of real relationships that have happened where before this BLM incorporated nonsense, which is evil, by the way, and they're a terrorist organization, and we should be unafraid to call them that.
Before they came onto the stage, I grew up in an America.
I know this might be stunning for a lot of our high school kids here, where we actually really didn't care about race.
We cared about character.
I know this is a stunning thing for our high school students to hear about, but I went to a high school that was 53% English as a second language.
It was a very diverse high school in the suburbs of Chicago, Wheeling High School.
I think we have some 214 kids here somewhere.
And what was amazing is that people from all different walks of life, different countries represented, we got along incredibly well without any sort of 1619 project nonsense, critical race theory, because there was actually this belief that your skin color is kind of irrelevant and your character matters.
Now we teach our children the exact opposite.
Now we tell kids your character is nothing.
If you're white, you're in charge.
You just don't realize it.
And you must atone for it endlessly.
And you must take a knee.
You must post the black square.
And if you say one thing that might be wrong, we're going to destroy your life and you're never going to be able to do anything again.
And the fact that every person raised their hand here goes to show that this is not going to end well unless we stand up against this.
So I actually encourage everyone here, try and remedy those relationships the best you can.
That's not a good thing.
And if I would venture a guess, how many people would say that they stopped being friends with you?
You didn't stop being friends with them.
Is that probably true?
Look at that.
Exactly.
They stopped talking to you because they've been told to do that.
They've been told by the people, the celebrity culture, to disobey their parents.
They've been told to fracture relationships.
That's a bad thing for humanity.
It's a bad thing for our country.
And if there's just a couple things you take away from this conference, one of them is don't discontinue friendships based on politics.
They're going to do that to you.
And be ready for that.
You're going to lose almost all your friends by the time you turn 18.
But you'll find new ones.
That's why you're here, right?
That's why you're here at the Turning Point USA Student Action Summit.
However, don't be the person that says, I'm going to stop being friends with you because we disagree on certain public policy.
Rob, your church is fully open.
And if I was completely calling the shots, by the way, we are in a county building.
I hope you guys all understand that.
It would be no different if we were in a library or if we were in the local, you know, kind of, you know, swimming pool.
The point being is that we don't control this building.
So if I was in charge, I would open the doors and let every single human being in the county into this room, okay?
So, and I just want to say, our staff is doing an unbelievable job.
There have been the moving of goalposts and a lot of things that have been changing.
And so thank you for granting us grace and thank you for granting us some understanding and patience.
Our staff literally did not sleep last night.
We had thousands of people show up day of yesterday.
And so I just want to say that if it was up to me, we'd have it looking like Rob's church where people are just on the, you know, up on the rafters.
Exactly.
And what's kind of amazing is that there's a ballroom right down the hallway.
Why the county won't allow an overflow in the ballroom is beyond me.
However, we're thankful to be here at all.
So we do want to make sure we say that.
So we have a position of gratitude.
Rob, you had your church open.
Pastor, how many of you have pastors that refuse to open their churches?
Anyone?
How many of you know churches that don't open?
A lot of people.
Rob, what's your message for people that still won't open their church?
For people who still want to open their church?
Yeah.
Won't open their church.
Won't open their church.
I'd find a new church.
If your church isn't open at this point, you need to find a new church.
And the reason why I say that is watching church online is like watching a fireplace online.
You can see it and hear it, but you don't feel the warmth.
And in addition, the church is supposed to be the place where liberty is proclaimed.
2 Corinthians 3:17 says, Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there's liberty.
And when you're yielding to tyranny and government that says the church is non-essential, it's time to stand in opposition to that.
And the church has become so culturally relevant, they become irrelevant.
You post your black tiles and you think that you are doing a service for humanity, it's time to dismiss that church and find another one because they don't have a clue what they're talking about.
And I'll leave you with this last thought, Charlie, because I know you have more questions.
Matthew 16, Jesus takes his disciples to Caesarea Philippi.
And pay attention to this, especially folks not churchgoers, just to understand where we're coming from.
Matthew 16, Jesus takes his disciples to Caesarea Philippi, and he says, Who do men say that I am?
And they say, some say you're John the Baptist, others say you're Jeremiah.
He says, but who do you say that I am?
Peter says, You're the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And for our Catholic brothers and sisters, that's that papal authority you hold to.
And Jesus says to Peter, upon this rock, I will build my, and everyone says, church.
It's ecclesia, right?
Church didn't come till 400 years later.
An ecclesia was a secular term.
Jesus co-opted.
He didn't say synagogue.
He didn't say temple.
He didn't use a religious term.
And Charlie and his brilliance, as we've been studying this together, isonomia and eleutheria were the two words that always hung above the door of the ecclesia in Greek culture.
The citizens would meet to decide the laws for their community.
And isonomia and eleutheria are liberty and equality.
The church is supposed to be in the public square.
We abdicated our responsibility.
Our founders understood only a moral people can govern a republic.
And when the churches are silent and not pushing back on tyranny, we've got a huge problem in this nation.
And if you're attending one of those churches just because you like their climbing wall or their smoke machine or the cool worship, give it a rest and move on.
Find a place that makes disciples of good citizenship so that you can help people understand what a republic is and start to infuse it with laws that bless humanity.
So a lot of people will say that was terrific, Rob.
How many people have heard that Jesus was a socialist?
Who has heard this before?
The whole room.
So, Jürgen, you actually, your family originally grew up in East Germany, East Berlin.
Is that right?
And this is something I think that applies to people of all faiths that are here in this room.
And people want to understand: is this true?
Because I think that some people are kind of afraid to even debate it.
And in fact, this is a tactic that is being used by the American left to try to put forward a heavily socialist agenda.
So is Jesus Christ some sort of a Marxist?
I love that.
Thank you so much.
So people think that Jesus was a socialist because, you know, he cared for the poor.
And the greatest way to care for the poor is to have someone in authority redistributing wealth for the poor.
So that's why they think that.
But I want to show you something in the scripture.
And the scripture is what the founding fathers use.
So in Acts chapter 1, verse 8, Jesus said, I want you to wait in Jerusalem until you receive power.
You shall receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you.
Acts chapter 2:500 people go up into that upper room.
But because it takes 10 days for the day of Pentecost to arrive, it whittles down from 500 down to 120.
380 people had better things to do than to wait for power.
Rob's a great Bible scholar, but I guarantee you, Rob probably can't get past maybe 16, 18 people.
I get 11, he gets about that many names of who was up there, who was up there that received power.
So that means there's at least 100 people.
We don't know their names.
The Bible doesn't tell us their names that receive power.
Why is that important?
Because God is a God of inversion.
This is really important.
Because whoever is in power, the wealth and the resources of the land flow toward those in power.
So in Genesis 47, Joseph is serving Pharaoh.
There's a famine in the land.
There's a pandemic.
There's a COVID pandemic in the land.
And so the people come saying, hey, we want seed.
And so he says, you can buy seed for money.
The next year, they say, well, we've gotten rid of all our money.
He says, bring your stock, bring your IRAs, your portfolios, bring your stock.
So they bring the stock.
The next year, the famine is still there.
The crisis is still going.
And they're like, well, you've already got our money.
You've got our stock.
What else do you?
And he says, well, sell me your land.
So they sell their land.
Now they got no land.
And then finally it says that they sold themselves.
And the Bible says this is in the Bible.
And people champion communism and socialism.
In the Bible, the Bible says, and so all the land became slaves to Pharaoh.
Now, we know that God delivered Israel out of slavery.
But nobody asked how do they become slaves.
They became slaves with the promise of free stuff.
They were told, come to the land of Egypt.
We're going to give you the land of Goshen, free stuff.
So Jesus, this guy with five talents, another guy, two talents with one talent, and they go and trade.
The guy with five produces five more, two, two more, one doesn't do anything with it.
So Jesus says, take the talent from the one and give it to the ten.
They're like, hang on, whoa, whoa, he's already got ten.
Jesus, that's right.
To him who has, more will be given.
To him who does not have, that's the exact opposite of socialism.
Now, watch this.
What God does is what our founding fathers did.
They understood that the wealth and the resources of any land flow towards whoever's in authority, whether that's a president, whether that's a pharaoh, whether that's an emperor, whether that's a king.
And that's human history.
So what God does is he gives power to ordinary people.
America, our founding fathers says, instead of us putting power and authority in a king, power and authority in a, we're going to put the power in we the people.
Do you know that up until America, the world was predominantly the few govern the many.
And the people that were rich were the few and the many were the peasants working in the field.
But because of our founding fathers following a biblical pattern of inversion, putting the power not in the potentate, but the power in the people, Americans went from poverty to what we call the middle class.
America has lifted more people out of poverty than all the nations of the world combined in history up until now.
Jesus was not a socialist, but you know who was a socialist?
The devil.
The last temptation of Christ, watch this, the last temptation of Christ.
I should all tweet that.
Satan takes Jesus up and he shows him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory and their splendor.
And he says, all these have been delivered to me and I can give, I can distribute to whoever I choose.
If you would just bow down before me and put me in authority, I will give it to you.
That's the spirit of socialism.
If you give us more authority, if you give us more power, we'll look after you.
We'll take care of you.
Really?
Well, after we take our cut, and that's the spirit of the enemy.
Well said.
So David, in the couple minutes we have remaining, can you talk just about how critical it is that young people stay involved in this fight?
Also, what you see and what this gathering means to you.
You and I were talking backstage of its critical importance historically.
And also kind of just some marching orders for people that want to get further engaged in this fight.
Yeah.
So I would say that as far as critical importance, I've been seeing this phrase, a cold civil war that we seem to be engaged in ideologically.
We just had our elections stolen by ideologues, right?
And I just feel like through Charlie and through the movement, you guys are going, we're going to win.
Do you know that?
We're going to win.
We're going to win the war.
The battle, this battle, we're not sure about, but I can promise you we're going to win the war.
And God is raising up here with you guys the next generation of really leaders, kings, queens, influencers in our nation.
And you're young now, but there'll be a day where you're empowered.
And it is critical that the king is connected to the priest.
And what do I mean by that?
I mean that if we're not tethered to a center of moral authority, that power becomes tyranny.
And we start thinking like the bad guys think, I can tell them what to do.
I can tell them what to believe.
I can tell them how to behave.
And it's essential as you guys, and I really mean this, are raised up in a position of kingship.
And Revelation tells us that in faith that we all are kings and priests with God our Father through the Lord Jesus Christ.
And as you're raised up, my challenge to you guys, my marching orders are: please tether yourself to the priest.
Please tether yourself to a moral core that's based in eternity, not based in the fickle traditions or an immediate battle that we want to win, because often we lose the war by doing bad things to win the battle.
I love that.
So, Rob, I'm going to ask you to wrap up with a non-political question.
But you went around and gave young people relationship advice for years, and you have a very good talk on it.
So, as you know, take as much time as you need in 30 seconds.
But no, you have a little more time than that.
But just, I didn't have to actually, I think that a lot of young people are wondering exactly how am I supposed to proceed in this world because the kind of predominant culture in high school and college is definitely in one direction and actually creates really miserable people.
God created us as relational creatures, and there's two genders.
I know a lot of folks are confused about that.
The idea from God's perspective is when a man loses his life, he gains it.
We'd be created different in these two genders.
We're unique creatures, but we get to understand each other when we lay our life down.
We serve one another.
And then, serving one another, you have what is called a type of love that's called phileo.
It's misinterpreted as brotherly love, but it's a mutual love.
When you both lay your life down to serve one another, my wife and I have been married 30 years.
She could be opening up, thank you.
She could be opening up a gift on her birthday.
The room would be crowded like this, and none of you would have a clue, but I could tell by the movement of her eye whether she loves a gift or hates it because the two have become one.
And it happens when you serve one another.
And human beings are selfish.
But when you deny yourself, pick up your cross, serve one another, you find a relationship that stands a test of time, and kids are blessed, and the building block of culture is established.
And the reason why people don't want to have kids anymore is because they require selflessness.
And the definition of a father is a man who carries pictures in his wallet of his kids where his money used to be.
And I got five kids and very little money, but I wouldn't give a single one of them back.
And the last story: my dad died of Alzheimer's.
He had it for 15 years.
He had three tours of Vietnam, highly decorated Navy captain, senior executive vice president of a major bank.
He was a good provider and he was a good man.
He was president of the Rotary in the Chamber of Commerce, and he would take you on the tour of the house as a coping mechanism for his Alzheimer's.
And I didn't need a tour of the house.
I grew up there.
But I was polite as a son should be.
And he would take you on a tour of the house.
And when he was done taking you on a tour of the house, he'd take you on another tour of the house.
And it would be an endless loop.
And you'd go, oh, that's great, Dad.
But I noticed something about the eighth time through.
On the right side of the wall were all of his accomplishments and all of his plaques and all of his awards.
And on the left side of the wall were all the pictures of his kids.
And I noticed that he never showed me the right side of the wall.
He showed me his kids, me, and the rest of us.
That's what life's about.
You heard Tucker last night.
It's about selflessness and building community and planting trees of whose shade you'll never see for a future generation.
We failed you, but you will not fail the coming generations because you have a spine and a backbone.
And I'm going to do everything I can with what I got left in my life to make sure we're going to leave it better than we found it.
God bless you guys.
Build it.
God bless you guys.
Thank you so much.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
Email us your questions.
As always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
If you want to get involved with Turning Point USA, go to tpusa.com.