Robert Evans, Jamie Loftus, and Maggie Mayfish dismantle Mark Zuckerberg's "worst person" label by exposing Facebook's toxic culture, from Noah Kagan's accounts of verbal abuse to the 2007 Beacon settlement costing $9.5 million. They detail how the 2012 PNAS emotional contagion study and delayed Cambridge Analytica shutdowns revealed a profit-over-privacy mindset, while NSA leaks and forced real-name policies harmed vulnerable groups. Ultimately, the hosts argue that Zuckerberg's "move fast and break things" philosophy created a corporate cult prioritizing short-term metrics over safety, cementing his legacy as a digital architect of societal harm. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Women vs The Con Artist00:02:47
This is an iHeart podcast.
Guaranteed human.
When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands.
I vowed I will be his last target.
He is not going to get away with this.
He's going to get what he deserves.
We always say that, trust your girlfriends.
Listen to the girlfriends.
Trust me, babe.
On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
I got you.
I got you.
What's up, everyone?
I'm Ego Modern.
My next guest, it's Will Farrell.
My dad gave me the best advice ever.
He goes, just give it a shot.
But if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.
If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration.
It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat just hang in there.
Yeah, it would not be.
Right, it wouldn't be that.
There's a lot of life.
Listen to Thanksgiving on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
In 2023, bachelor star Clayton Eckard was accused of fathering twins, but the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax.
You doctored this particular test twice, Miss Owens, correct?
I doctored the test once.
It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern.
Two more men who'd been through the same thing.
Greg Gillespie and Michael Mancini.
My mind was blown.
I'm Stephanie Young.
This is Love Trapped.
Laura, Scottsdale Police.
As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences.
Listen to the Love Trapped podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
10-10 shots five, City Hall building.
How did this ever happen in City Hall?
Somebody tell me that.
A shocking public murder.
This is one of the most dramatic events that really ever happened in New York City politics.
They screamed, get down, get down.
Those are shots.
A tragedy that's now forgotten.
And a mystery that may or may not have been political.
That may have been about sex.
Listen to Rorschach, Murder at City Hall on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Podcast!
I'm Robert Evans.
This is Behind the Bastards.
Assemble.
Sophie was angry at me for that opening.
This is the podcast where we talk about all the things you didn't know about terrible people.
And we laugh sometimes too.
Murder At City Hall Mystery00:15:06
We're talking about Mark Zuckerberg.
This is part two, so you shouldn't need a normal intro.
If you're listening to part two, you saw on the title, this is part two.
You know what's going on here.
My guests, as always on podcasts about Mark Zuckerberg, are Jamie Loftus and Maggie Mayfish.
Hi.
How y'all doing?
Oh, we're nice and warm from part one, baby.
Warm from part one and from the delightful internal heating effect of Dorito's blaze.
Yeah, I feel the furnace deep in my belly and right next to my uterus.
This is nice.
The powder's coursing through my veins, clogging my bloodstream.
I could die at any second.
Not clogging, enhancing.
Enhances the Deutsche.
People are misunderstood.
Now, oh, God, that was a good Dorito.
Is there a bad Dorito?
No.
No, no, there's not.
Fantastic.
Y'all ready to talk about Marzuk some more?
What's doing?
Marzuk?
Marzuk.
It's Mike Marwin.
Welcome to Marwin.
Welcome to Marzuk for someone who gets beaten by a Facebook hate mob.
Which we'll be talking about in part three.
Welcome to Marzuk, everyone.
So the bloom is well and truly off the rose of Facebook in the wake of the 2016 election.
Criticizing the social media company has become so common, as of articles declaring that young people have increasingly left the service behind, that it can be very easy to forget just what a darling Facebook was in its early days.
True.
I was a tech journalist in the wild and woolly era of 2010 when Facebook was cracking new number milestones every couple of months.
I remember when they hit half a billion and eventually a billion.
We would all write articles about Facebook.
This many people are on Facebook.
This is how much time they're spending.
Look at all this great stuff.
Now, there was a lot of excitement about what Facebook might mean for the future back then.
For most of the tech media, it lasted right up until the election.
I found a Business Insider article from 2015 that illustrates this pretty well.
It's titled The Fabulous Life of Mark Zuckerberg.
To give you an idea of its tone, here's a line from the introduction.
The Harvard dropout's current net worth is at about 33.4 billion, putting him at number 16 on Forbes ranking of the world's billionaires.
Here's a closer look at the life of the simultaneously down-to-earth yet extravagant CEO.
Now, it's this reporter's opinion that no one worth $33 billion can ever be considered down-to-earth.
But hey, maybe I got some sour grapes.
It is interesting to me that this seems to be a carefully concocted marketing ploy used by Zuckerberg.
The first big book about Facebook's founding, the book that was the basis for the movie The Social Network, was titled The Accidental Billionaires.
This is cutie title.
It is cute.
They stumbled into it.
Oops.
Oops.
You could be Zuckerberg too.
I wound up with more wealth than most of Africa.
Oops.
Oopsie.
Oopsie toodles.
I can't be doing wrong if I'm this successful.
If I just Mr. Magooed my way into a pile of money the size of the Sears Tower.
I can't even grow a beard, guys.
I'm just going to keep making fun of his.
There's not actually as much cash in existence as I have in my bank account.
Mark Zuckerberg.
Wow.
Yeah.
Now, the Business Insider article with all of its flawed and fawning pros still provides a decent little look at Zuck's early life.
It makes a point of really, really going into Mark's bona fides as a legit smart guy.
He seems to be very sensitive about his intelligence.
I could, I could.
The size of his intelligence.
Interesting.
Fun fact, Maggie, I could taste the anger in your voice when you said that.
It was almost like a Dorito.
Oh, almost literally compulsive.
Yeah.
Of the things that I've noticed, like just having immersed myself in Zuckerness, he is extremely protective of the idea that he is a genius on all things and not just Facebook.
So he's not in Mensas.
He's not in Mensas.
He's got a master's.
Like Jamie Laugh is.
How's that boob thread on Facebook when he's like?
Oh, I saw the update.
Mensas love Facebook, to be fair.
It's where they spread all their hate too much.
It is their platform that they need to have.
So they earned it.
They paid $75 to take a test on a Sunday.
Oh, IQ tests are a bastard almost as terrible as Mark Zuckerberg.
That'll be for our Stefan Molyneux episode.
I'm going to read a quote from that Business Insider article about how smart Mark Zuckerberg is.
I would love to hear.
He wasn't just a computer nerd, though.
Zuck loved the classics, the Odyssey and the like, and he became captain of the high school.
The Odyssey and the like.
Yes.
And the like.
Yes.
Can you picture the writer being like, what's a second book?
What's a second book?
What's the second classic book?
Well, there was an article that I read that was like, he loves the Greek classics, you know, like the Enneid.
The Eniid.
We'll be talking about that at the very end.
That's a Latin classic.
Yeah, it is a Latin classic.
It's actually Roman propaganda written by Virgil so that he could make the case that Octavian had like a deep connection to like Roman history.
Like it was literally a propaganda novel to rewrite Roman history in the image of Octavian after Octavian destroyed the fucking Republic.
So, you know, the Greek classics.
The Greek classics.
The Greek classics, like this Roman propaganda novel.
I hate Harry Potter culture, but there is a very like a disgruntled Hufflepuff vibe to Mark Zuckerberg.
Like he wants to be in anywhere else.
Mark Huffelberg.
Now, the article goes through some of the gushier, us-worthy details of Zuckerberg's charmed life since starting Facebook.
For example, here's what it says about his wedding to Priscilla Chan.
Green Days.
No!
Green Days, Billy Joel Armstrong performed, and Mark designed Priscilla's Ruby Ring himself.
Green Day performed at their wedding.
And he designed a rare zone.
And The Accidental Billionaires makes a point of when it's talking about like the place that everyone at Facebook lived in when they all first moved to California, that they were always playing Green Day because they're so into punk rock.
They're like, guys, you heard of this record called Dookie?
Fucking Green Day.
Wait, what era?
This has to be like post-American idiot.
It's got to be, right?
Yeah, it was like 2005.
Oh, that's how exciting.
How exciting.
It's a real exciting time to be a Green Day fan.
Now, the few details about his life that Mark lets out into the public sphere are carefully curated.
He's one of the many Silicon Valley CEOs who takes a token $1 a year salary.
You'll always hear that.
Of course, that number ignores what he makes in stock, and it ignores expenses like the $610,454 Facebook spent in 2014 to charter private jets for Mark and his friends.
The Business Insider article and many other ProZuck pieces I have read make a lot of hay out of the fact that he doesn't drive a fancy car, instead preferring a Volkswagen GTI that only costs $30,000.
Now, if you've got that kind of money Mark Zuckerberg has, I don't think you should have it, but if you got it and you're going to buy a car, you're an idiot if you buy a car that anybody can buy.
You get a fucking blimp like that Google guy.
At least be that.
I mean, yeah.
It's even more sus to get a right, like, hi, hello, fellow kids.
I am just like you.
I drive Volkswagen like you.
It was like, are all Volkswagens?
You have to tape the gas back off.
Okay, where are you?
Chairs drops out.
Where are the bodies?
Yeah.
Zuckerberg.
They're somewhere.
Now, while Facebook was expanding and the world was falling in love with Marky Zuck, there were signs that everyone's favorite new tech billionaire.
There were signs that everyone's favorite new tech billionaire was maybe not the nicest dude to be around.
Noah Kagan worked for Facebook for nine months in 2005, back when the company was first starting its meteoric rise to world dominance.
Kagan later wrote an e-book that touched on his experiences there.
In it, he recalled Mark Zuckerberg pouring water on an engineer's computer after a product demo that he thought looked like, quote, shit.
Here's a quote from Kagan's e-book.
While I don't remember the feature we were working on, engineer Chris Putnam and I had spent almost a month building something we thought Mark would love.
He walks to Chris's computer and we demo the product to Mark.
Mark thought it was shit.
I know so because instead of giving product feedback, he screamed, this is shit, redo it, threw water on Chris's computer and walked away.
All of us stood around in shock.
Kagan also claims that Zuck, like far-right gang leader Gavin McGinnis, has a distinct fondness for samurai swords.
Oh, don't say that.
Getting a sword.
Open with that.
We get it now.
I remember my first sword guy.
It was before I had the language to identify a sword guy.
And I was like, well, I know I feel unsafe, but there's more to it than that.
Yeah.
It's more than just a general unease that I have.
I also feel bad for this dude.
He could so easily kill me with this sword.
With his samurai sword that he bought for $45 at a gas station.
Yeah, yeah.
And bought a stand for it.
And bought a stand for it.
Always buy a stand.
Well, they need you to see it.
You got to display that.
Yeah.
Hide it.
No, He's like, I want you to know exactly what I'm like.
Yeah.
I'm like this.
What I would use to kill you.
I know I look like this guy, but I'm also this guy.
Now.
Are you guys ready for the samurai sword story?
Yes.
Oh, that's good.
That's pretty good.
It's pretty good.
This is like when Gaddafi had his astronaut short story.
This is the Mark Zuckerberg of that.
Quote, he'd walk around with a samurai sword, fake threatening to attack you for bad work.
Where the hell he got that samurai sword, who the hell knows?
Luckily, no employees were harmed while I was there.
He'd come around and pretend to cut you, joking, if you take down the site, he'll chop your head off.
You have to remember, you have a 23-year-old Uber nerd running one of the fastest-growing sites on the web.
As mature as he could be, he was also still immature.
He had some great motivational lines.
With love, he'd say, if you don't get that done sooner, I will punch you in the face.
Or I will chop you with this huge sword while holding a huge sword in hand.
But with love, guys.
Oh, it's just like a lovingly like a loving.
I'm going to cut you with this sword.
Men in their 20s should have businesses.
That makes a lot of sense.
Well, the thing is that he has stunted his growth.
Like, he doesn't realize this because he's living his own life.
But from an outside perspective, you cemented yourself as a 22-year-old inept at talking to people and connecting with people, and you've stopped your life.
Well, as he learned from his later colleague, he should just lean into that image and just go for it.
Lean into this pile of shit.
The next paragraph starts with Cheryl Sandberg.
Let's get to it.
I do want to share one story about me when I was 23 years old, just for fairness.
So I'm not judging Mark for immaturity.
I vomited down an elevator shaft.
In between the shaft and the wall, because I had to puke.
I was super drunk.
And I knew, okay, I have to puke somewhere.
If I puke in this elevator on other people, that's going to be bad.
But when the door opens, I can bomb the dump.
I respect that.
That's innovative thinking.
I didn't want it to hurt too many other people, but I realize now as a sober man, I really fucked some repairs.
This is a bad weekend for you.
No!
Again, not a good person here, but better than Mark Zuckerberg, which is a low bar.
Yeah, and also you learned, which...
Let's not go that way.
Oh, okay.
I don't actually steal light bulbs.
Yeah, just a few days.
I am still a ruined, ruined of a human being.
Santa Monica light bulb bandit.
But I don't have a business.
For good reason.
Sophie manages the podcast.
For good reason.
In 2008, Facebook hired Cheryl Sandberg, the author of Lean In.
And generally as slimy as a fucking girl.
Let capitalism queen go off.
Go off.
Hashtag girl boss.
Oh my God.
The girl boss narrative is my favorite.
There's a great podcast y'all should listen to.
It's not on our network, but it's great.
It's called The Dream, and it's about MLMs.
And it talks about an MLM that's all based on the hashtag girl boss lean in shit.
Super, super interesting.
Yes, women can also destroy the world.
Yeah, us too.
Us too.
We can eat the planet too.
Yeah, we can be just as bad.
So go off.
Did you guys hear women are running the CIA now?
Oh, dudes.
Hashtag feminist death sites.
Yeah.
Oh.
Listen, give us a chance to buy into this power structure.
We waterboard with LaCroix now.
But we still waterboard.
Tons of people.
We're like, we're guys gals.
We still waterboard.
Yeah.
Listen.
Listen.
I actually get along better with guys than I do with girls.
It's really weird.
I get already.
I waterboard them better too.
I'm like, guys, I know I'm going to sound like one of those girls, but I actually think Mark is really nice.
And he's just kind of misunderstood.
You know what?
I like agree with that.
And let's shun all other women that disagree with us.
They're kind of like bitchy girls.
Yeah.
Like, oh, we shouldn't hire them anyways.
This podcast will not go into nearly enough detail on Miss Sandberg, but we will talk about her in the future.
Yeah.
Ha ha.
At the time, Sandberg's job was to be the adult in the room at Facebook, to reassure the investors and the world that this broy frat robot suddenly harvesting data from millions of people was being managed by competent, thoughtful human beings who would act responsibly with the great power placed in their hands.
Charles Sandberg does at least a very good impression of a human being.
Super good.
Yeah, she does a really good job.
The new dictator is a woman with a smile on her face.
One of her smells.
Yeah, always a white woman with a smile.
Yeah, always a white woman.
Oh, yeah, and the whitest woman.
The whitest woman and a big smile.
The frontline interview, one of the representatives that they sent, that's basically all she did was smile and say, oh, yeah, we know.
And we're listening.
We know.
And we're listening.
We know, and we're listening.
We know we fucked up.
We're listening.
Corporate feminism.
Buy soap.
Buy soap.
Now, in 2006, Facebook introduced the news feed, that infinitely scrolling thingy that has replaced the way roughly 40% of Americans get their news.
The timeline was programmed with a distinct preference for controversial content by virtue of the fact that people were most likely to chat about things that made them angry or scared.
They were also more likely to share articles that angered or scared them.
Ooh, skanked.
Skanked.
Skanked them.
Skank them.
Skanked them.
Skank them.
Skanky.
Bro, did you ever skank like in high school, like us, the ska dance?
You know what?
Ska is my favorite genre, but I have never been to a show or danced.
I felt like for sure you had like busted.
I was not a rude boy.
No.
But Streetlight Manifestos may be my favorite band.
Fucking fantastic band.
Yeah, yeah.
It's not too late.
It's not too late.
Never too late to skank.
Never too late to skank.
Thomas Kalnaki, if you're listening, sponsor the show.
I don't think you have any money because you're a ska musician.
I don't even.
But you're great.
Hey, if you're listening, give us five stars on iTunes.
You know what?
We'll give you some money.
Yeah.
Send us your Venmo.
Send us your Venmo.
We feel like you could probably use that.
So, when the news feed launched, Facebook also made a change to its privacy policies in order to make the news feed work better.
Oh, yeah.
Here's the New Yorker.
Hiring Blind Spots Explained00:04:03
Quote, unless you wrestled with a set of complicated settings, vastly more of your information, possibly including your name, your gender, your photograph, your list of friends, would be made public by default.
Now, that New Yorker article was published in 2010 after some of those unpleasant chats between Zuckerberg and his friends about all of his weasel behavior.
You know, after all those chats and stuff went public, like this article came out.
The author of the article is a guy named Jose Antonio Vargas, and he's a good journalist, I think.
I think it's a good article.
He spent some time with Zuckerberg, and when the subject of privacy came up, this happened.
And I'm going to quote the entire bit from the article because it's fantastic.
Privacy, he told me, is the third rail issue online.
A lot of people who are worried, and this is Zuck talking, a lot of people who are worried about privacy and those kinds of issues will take any minor misstep that we make and turn it into as big a deal as possible, he said.
He then excused himself as he typed on his iPhone 4, answering a text from his mother.
We realize that people will probably criticize us for this for a long time, but we believe this is the right thing to do.
Zuckerberg and I talked about the first time I signed up for Facebook in September 2006.
Users are asked to check a box to indicate whether they're interested in men or women.
I told Zuckerberg that it took me a few hours to decide which box to check.
If I said on Facebook that I'm a man interested in men, all my Facebook friends, including relatives, co-workers, sources, some of whom might not approve of homosexuality, would see it.
So what did you end up doing?
Zuckerberg asked.
I put men.
That's interesting.
No one has done a study on this, as far as I can tell, but I think Facebook might be the first place where a large number of people have come out, he said.
We didn't create that.
Society was generally ready for that.
He went on, I think this is just part of the general trend that we talked about, about society being more open, and I think that's good.
Then I told Zuckerberg that two weeks later, I removed the check and left the boxes blank.
A couple of relatives who were Facebook friends had asked about my sexuality, and at that time at least, I didn't want all my professional sources to know that I am gay.
Is it still out? Zuckerberg asked.
Yeah, it's still out.
He responded with a flat, huh, dropped his shoulders and stared at me, looking genuinely concerned and somewhat puzzled.
Facebook had asked me to publish a personal detail that I was not ready to share.
Huh.
Yeah.
I think that's a really interesting bit of insight there.
That's a crossroads for Lil Zuck.
For Lil Zucky Zuck.
And I think it points to how stupid I think he is, that he can't think of other situations until they're in his fate.
Like, until his face is shoved into it.
And also seems like a very straight white guy attitude of just like, I mean, I think we come up against this all the time is just like stuff that truly didn't occur to him, like not even malicious at this point.
Just like, I just, uh, I still prioritize my money over your privacy, but that sucks, dude.
That's like a lot of what he says.
Yeah.
Now, I found this particularly fascinating in light of a Daily Beast article I read back in 2015, how Facebook exposes domestic violence survivors.
The article is, as you'd expect, about a bunch of people whose abusers were able to get in touch with them and start harassing them again because Facebook required those women to use their real names to start Facebook accounts.
Quote: Of the major social networking services, Facebook alone requires users to use an authentic name listed on an acceptable form of identification, such as a driver's license, a passport, or a bill.
LinkedIn's user agreement asks for a real name, but does not specify any required documentation.
Twitter, Instagram, and as of 2014, Google Plus all allow pseudonyms.
This has also been an issue for transgender people.
We don't even get into that.
And sex workers.
Yeah, sex workers.
A lot of people who Mark never considered.
And because almost everyone working at Facebook was another white guy, was not no one there that you ever prioritized.
And this will be a problem that will crop up when we start talking about the genocide being enabled by Facebook.
But it's an issue when you run a company this big that impacts the lives of this many people and you don't hire folks specifically to be like, oh, I'm a member of this particular community and this might be an issue for, say, gay men because you, Mark Zuckerberg, don't realize that this is the thing we have to deal with.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's an online nation and he thinks that he can be the leader of it without caring about any of the people in it.
White Guy Club Culture00:14:54
What don't you learn about the world as the son of a wealthy dentist who goes to Harvard?
Oh my God, you're right.
And exit.
Oh my God, you're right.
You're right.
You're right.
Yeah, he's wealthy.
He knows extremely well.
Yeah.
It is crazy that, I mean, you would think the second that you have this wide of a reach, you would prioritize getting people with different perspectives in, or it's almost like your product will turn on you.
Yeah.
Well, it's that ego that he has, that he is unwilling to confront and hides at all costs.
Yeah.
He plays the philanthroper, the like, I care about the people when join my book club.
Yeah, join my book club.
Let's learn together.
Let me listen.
Let me go across the world and listen until you'll elect me for president.
The only book club I'm interested in joining is the Doritos book club.
Oh, what is it this month?
It's actually tribed by Sebastian Younger.
Fantastic book.
Oh, wow.
Really good book about PTSD.
Oh, wow.
Doritos recommends it too.
Thank you, Dorito.
That's a good suggestion.
Yeah.
Ads.
It's ads time.
Oh, okay.
That's what that was a lead into.
Products.
Products.
There's two golden rules that any man should live by.
Rule one, never mess with a country girl.
You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes.
And rule two, never mess with her friends either.
We always say that, trust your girlfriends.
I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of The Girlfriends.
Oh my God, this is the same man.
A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist.
I felt like I got hit by a truck.
I thought, how could this happen to me?
The cops didn't seem to care.
So they take matters into their own hands.
I said, oh, hell no.
I vowed I will be his last target.
He's going to get what he deserves.
Listen to the girlfriends.
Trust me, babe.
On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
What's up, everyone?
I'm Ago Modem.
My next guest, you know, from Step Brothers, Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network, it's Will Farrell.
My dad gave me the best advice ever.
I went and had lunch with him one day, and I was like, and dad, I think I want to really give this a shot.
I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings.
I'm working my way up through it.
I know it's a place they come look for up and coming talent.
He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet.
Yeah.
He goes, but there's so much luck involved.
And he's like, just give it a shot.
He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.
If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration.
It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat just hang in there.
Yeah, it would not be.
Right, it wouldn't be that.
There's a lot of luck.
Listen to Thanks Dad on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
10-10 shots fired, City Hall building.
A silver .40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene.
From iHeart Podcasts and Best Case Studios, this is Rorschach, murder at City Hall.
How could this have happened in City Hall?
Somebody tell me that.
Jeffrey Hood did it.
July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest.
Both men are carrying concealed weapons.
And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead.
Everybody in the chamber's ducks.
A shocking public murder.
I scream, get down, get down.
Those are shots.
Those are shots.
Get down.
A charismatic politician.
You know, he just bent the rules all the time, man.
I still have a weapon and I could shoot you.
And an outsider with a secret.
He alleged he was a victim of flat down.
That may or may not have been political.
That may have been about sex.
Listen to Rorschach, Murder at City Hall on the iHeartRadio app.
Apple Podcasts are wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm Laurie Siegel, and on Mostly Human, I go beyond the headlines with the people building our future.
This week, an interview with one of the most influential figures in Silicon Valley, OpenAI CEO Sam Altman.
I think society is going to decide that creators of AI products bear a tremendous amount of responsibility to products we put out in the world.
From power to parenthood.
Kids, teenagers, I think they will need a lot of guardrails around AI.
This is such a powerful and such a new thing.
From addiction to acceleration.
The world we live in is a competitive world, and I don't think that's going to stop, even if you did a lot of redistribution.
You know, we have a deep desire to excel and be competitive and gain status and be useful to others.
And it's a multiplayer game.
What does the man who has extraordinary influence over our lives have to say about the weight of that responsibility?
Find out on Mostly Human.
My highest order bit is to not destroy the world with AI.
Listen to Mostly Human on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
And we're back talking about podcast products services Facebook.
All right, let's get back into it.
For the most part, up through the early aughts, Mark Zuckerberg's brand in most of the world remained quite strong.
He was the genius who changed the way the world communicated.
And he seemed like such a humble, down-to-earth guy.
In 2010, he was even given a guest star role on The Simpsons.
He played a bit part.
Lisa is trying to convince Nelson to stay in school rather than drop out to focus on his business.
They meet Mark Zuckerberg at some sort of expo thing, and he goes on a little rant about all of the great innovators in the tech industry dropped out of school, which is true.
Now, I'll say this.
I think this is another example where it's really easy for a guy like Mark.
If you were a coder, which I am.
Why do you need to go to college?
Well, Jamie's a hacker and all of his, but yeah.
It's the same thing.
Like, as a writer, you can get a writing degree and get a journalism degree, but you could also just start writing.
And it's the nature of the business that if you get stuff published, that starts your career too.
It's not like that for everybody.
If you're an electrician, you kind of got to get some training.
If you're a surgeon, you kind of got to go to school.
That's why we're in faker professions.
Yeah.
That's why we're in professions where you can be a faker.
In my experience.
In my experience, someone could be like, so you have a degree in journalism?
And you go, aha.
And then they're like, sounds good.
Do you have a degree in journalism?
No.
Okay, good.
Then you're clearly a journalist.
Yeah, good.
Yeah.
So, anyway, a little rant there.
Now, 2010 was a time in which Zuckerberg and his ideas were the toast of Silicon Valley.
And what did Mark believe?
In 2010, he sat for an interview with TechCrunch.
They pressed him on the matter of other people trusting him with their data.
Quote, when I got started in my dorm room at Harvard, the question a lot of people asked was, why would I want to put any information on the internet at all?
Why would I want to have a website?
And then in the last five or six years, blogging has taken off in a huge way.
And all these different services that have people sharing all this information, people have really gotten comfortable, not only sharing more information in different kinds, but more openly and with more people.
That social norm is just something that has evolved over time.
We view it as a role in the system to constantly be innovating and be updating what our system is to reflect what the current social norms are.
I'm not pushing society.
I'm changing Facebook to adapt to the changing social norm of selling your data to companies.
Well, the funny thing, I've now realized that Zuckerberg says a lot, like, you know, like, I want to bring the world together.
But that is code for I want the world's information.
I want every single person to be on my website so I have their information.
I have their contacts.
I got to steal all of my Facebook.
I got to steal all of them.
All of them.
It is weird to me, like how long, and I don't know at what point this occurred to you.
It took me a long time to figure out what the concept of data mining and big data was and like what it meant.
Because when I was in college, I was like, well, who would want my data?
I don't have any money.
Like, all I have is student debt.
Like, who cares if they have my data?
Because I have nothing to hide and I have nothing.
So who cares?
And I wrote, I was a copywriter for big data companies for six months.
I would write 10,000 words a day about big data and still couldn't understand why.
I'm like, who gives a fuck unless you have money?
But now I feel like now it's very easy.
But this was like five years ago.
I had no fucking clue.
And it was my job to know.
So I'm bad at my job.
It didn't make sense.
We all have a lot of going on.
Right.
Yeah.
No, I do say there's a great frontline documentary.
You just look up frontline Facebook on YouTube.
It's all up there.
That there's a journalist on there who's like the first person to like request a copy of his data from Facebook and realized how much was being logged.
Another good journalist.
Solid play.
Because again, I was the same way.
I didn't pay any attention to what was happening.
I did not care.
No.
One IOTA.
There was shit going on.
And when you're taking like, I don't know, like, especially in the era that was super asinine where you're like, you've got bumper stickers and there's, you're taking quizzes all the time.
You're like, well, what would people do with this information?
And now I can't watch Bander Snatch without being like, they're taking my opinions on frosted flakes and selling Bander.
This is the next one's good.
Yeah.
TV's now going to sell me personalized ads.
And I do think Netflix is making a big mistake with like focusing on like, ah, this many people watched the fucking bird box movies.
Well, it's as successful as Black Panther.
No, because nobody had to pay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No one would have seen 45 million.
Birdbox would have made $7 at the box office.
Making money at Netflix.
Yes.
Yes.
45 million people saw cumulative 18 minutes of bird box where they were cooking, checking their phone, and pooping.
And wait, what?
What are the rules of this world?
Why?
They put birds in a box, guys.
And I think that that makes it worth our time.
I do think that that quote from the TechCrunch interview maps out Mark's ideology pretty well.
The world wants to be more connected.
His only job is delivering that connectivity.
And as long as Facebook is connecting more people faster, he does not need to worry about anything else.
This was mapped out even more eloquently by the company motto based on a quote by Mark himself: Move fast and break things.
Unless you are breaking stuff, you aren't moving fast enough.
Now, the title of this episode, part two, is Move Fast, and the title of part three is Break Things.
Oh, he does.
I'm not really talking about that little genocide.
That's the way I live my life.
Ha ha.
Yeah.
Ha ha.
Nothing.
A lot of people have ended their lives now.
Ha ha.
Now, it is important to understand that at every level, Facebook, the organization, is programmed to work this way.
I'd like to quote from a great CNBC article with the revealing title, Inside Facebook's Cult-like Workplace Where Descent is Discouraged and Employees Pretend to Be Happy All the Time.
Solid title.
Really, really lays it all out.
It sounds like one of those really long Fiona apples.
Oh, yeah.
Ooh.
You're about to tell me a lot of stuff.
I'm ready.
Quote.
Employees feel pressure to place the company above all else in their lives, fall in line with their manager's orders, and force cordiality with their colleagues so that they can advance.
Several former employees liken the culture to a cult.
This culture has contributed to the company's well-publicized wave of scandals over the last two years, such as government spreading misinformation to try to influence elections and the misuse of private user data, according to many people who work there during this period.
They say Facebook might have caught some of these problems sooner if employees were encouraged to deliver honest feedback.
You can't deliver honest feedback if you're moving fast and breaking shit.
Well, you can't deliver honest feedback with a fucking katana either.
Well, and also, why would you tell someone I think this product that we're about to launch might break something if you're part of half of your job is to break things?
Right, you're encouraged to.
In Mark Zuckerberg's Facebook, employees rate each other, and then managers give them final grades that determine whether or not they'll be promoted, fired, or given raises.
Never learns a lesson.
Never, ever, ever.
Never, ever, ever.
I've quoted Bojack Horseman once before in this show, but another one of the truest fucking things that show ever pointed out, one of the characters is an agent saying that the age in which you get rich is the age in which your growth is forever stunted.
So if you're rich at 20, you're 20 forever.
Yes, that is very true.
100% accurate.
Buy a shirt at TeePublic so that I can stop aging at age 30 and buy my own blimp.
That sounds reasonable.
Yeah, that's a good idea.
Yeah, still optimistic.
Sure enough.
Anyone want to have a light bulb fight after that?
I'm not going to lose that light bulb steal in spirit.
I'm not keeping the light bulbs.
I just like the way they shatter when you throw them at people.
That's better.
You're right.
You're right.
It's way better.
I'm not taking these light bulbs.
I don't want them.
Cricket, cricket.
Cricket.
I don't need your judgment, Maggie.
Robert, do you do this in groups or a solo?
Yeah, I do it in groups.
No, you joking.
Okay.
Yeah, it's a fun.
I'll come along next time.
This could go a lot.
If you're doing it alone, it's like just drunkenly throwing light bulbs at strangers.
No, I throw light bulbs at people I love.
Oh, that's unusual.
It's a show of affection.
Yes, this sounds very good.
Just like at the ground next to them, so it's like, pah.
It's like a little puff.
It's fun.
Like firecracker.
I didn't do this to be judged, okay?
I'm not gonna be able to do that.
It's gonna be a great behind the basketball.
You can be unethical and still be legal.
My life.
I prefer to be ethical but illegal.
There you go.
Yeah, that's right.
That's the right course.
Treat people well, break the law.
Laws aren't people.
Now, so employees rate each other.
Managers give them final grades that determine whether or not they'll be promoted, fired, or given raises.
These grades are issued by quota, so managers are pressured to underrate perfectly good employees just because the quota of good employees has already been met.
It sounds like a stressful mess.
The article goes into substantial detail about the review process.
This quote in particular stood out to me.
Quote, These twice-yearly reviews encourage employees to be particularly productive around June and December, working nights and weekends as they race to impress bosses before reviews, which are typically completed in August and February.
It's especially true in December.
The half-Facebook predominantly uses to determine which employees will receive promotions.
This rush causes employees to focus on short-term goals and push out features that drive user engagement and improve their own metrics without fully considering the potential long-term negative impacts on user experience or privacy, multiple former employees said.
Emotional Contagion Proven00:05:25
Wow.
Move fast, break the world.
Wow.
Sounds like a guy that's too dumb to run a company.
Sounds like 20-year-olds shouldn't have much responsibility.
Yeah.
He was stunted at like...
At like age 20.
Yeah.
18, 20.
Something like that.
Man.
Learn something all the time from that show about the sad horse.
About the sad horse.
Depressed horse show.
The depressed horse show has some, has some truth in it.
That's true.
Yeah.
And horses are inherently sad.
You never see a horse living on land and like looking happy.
You've never seen a horse die?
Yes.
Me too.
Oh, no.
Sad.
Loofy's the same horse.
Both air.
Nor and I were like, we killed a horse.
Jamie Loftus and I murdered a horse.
I have a light bulb.
I'm not going to believe how it did that.
In our defense, the horse started it.
Yes, yes.
Very sad horse.
So, Mark Zuckerberg has never wasted much time worrying about the consequences of his actions.
He's more of an ask questions later kind of guy.
And as he aged into a tech titan, Mark Zuckerberg remained pretty cavalier about people's privacy.
This would all come to a dangerous head for the first time in 2007 with a Facebook product called Beacon.
I would like to quote from a book titled, Appropriately Enough, Move Fast and Break Things, which is a really good book about all of these monsters, but not just Zucky's.
All Silicon Valley gross products.
This was essentially an alert system that told your friends you had purchased something on a partner site.
It was built as an opt-out system, so you had to actively tell Facebook each time you didn't want the site to broadcast your purchase to all your friends.
It was a total disaster from the outset, but Zuckerberg was so confident that he knew better than his users that he refused to turn it off for many weeks while the PR disaster escalated.
Eventually, he relented and posted a mea culpa on his blog, saying, We've made a lot of mistakes building this feature, but we've made even more with how we've handled them.
Despite Zuckerberg's regret and a payment of $9.5 million for a class action suit over Beacon, many who worked with him feel he doesn't really understand privacy.
Charlie Cheever, one of his key programmers, told Kirkpatrick, who's some guy, I feel that Mark doesn't believe in privacy that much, or at least believes in privacy as a stepping stone to radical transparency.
Wow.
The way he put out that press release is the same way he talked to the guy that he fucked over.
I am so sorry.
I did something wrong here.
I did something wrong.
So go away.
Stop it.
Go ahead.
It means nothing to me.
Yeah.
Never has.
Who cares?
I've always been rich and always will be.
Yeah.
We'll have it resolved within the year.
Parentheses, year.
Now, radical transparency is a buzz term Mark brings up whenever he needs a high-minded ideological justification for doing precisely whatever the fuck he wants.
In 2012, whatever the fuck he wants included fucking with people's emotions just to see if that was possible.
Here is a quote from the hilariously named Peanas Scientific Journal, and it's PNAS, but what else could I call it?
Oh, bless their heart.
It's the Peanut Journal.
It's a very serious scientific journal.
The big dick dirt journal.
The big swinging dick of science.
We all got slapped with science's swinging dick on this one.
If you don't go with the swings, you're going to get slapped.
Here's Peanas.
Oh, no.
Oh, I'm not.
In an experiment with people who use Facebook, we test whether emotional contagion occurs outside of in-person interaction between individuals by reducing the amount of emotional content in the newsfeed.
When positive expressions were reduced, people produced fewer positive posts and more negative posts.
When negative expressions were reduced, the opposite pattern occurred.
These results indicate that the emotions expressed by others on Facebook influence our own emotions, constituting experimental evidence for massive-scale contagion via social networks.
AKA, we used Facebook to see if we could make people sad.
And we can.
And it works.
It works.
Now, the researchers who carried out this study had previously studied real-life social networks to study the same sort of emotional contagion, but with like actual groups of friends.
Your buddy's sad.
She calls you.
He calls you.
You get sad too.
This is the way people have always worked.
They then went to Facebook to see if the social network was down to play guinea pig with its users.
Facebook totally was.
They and the researchers found, quote, emotional states can be transferred to others via emotional contagion, leading people to experience the same emotions without their awareness.
In other words, they proved that emotional states like anger or hopelessness could be spread via Facebook.
Facebook proved this by determining what kinds of content got pushed to the timelines of each of its users, effectively manipulating their emotions just to see if it was possible.
People got angry.
Facebook responded with faux regret, and Mark Zuckerberg kept pretty quiet about this whole thing.
But if you followed the guy's history and intellectual development, you can understand why an experiment like this would be pretty in line with his past behavior.
Yeah.
It's just another like woman versus cow situation.
Right.
It's like if one girl is deemed unhot, then other people will agree unhot and right and then we'll just reshape what is hot.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's fun.
What else is fun is products, also services, consumable items that you can spend money on and then have in your home.
Woman Versus Cow Debate00:04:50
The big swinging dick of capital.
The beings of the swinging dicks.
The hanging labia.
The heavy labia of these wonderful women CEOs who seem to love all that women and care about people.
If you want to support the heavy swinging labia that support this show, buy these products.
There's two golden rules that any man should live by.
Rule one, never mess with a country girl.
You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes.
And rule two, never mess with her friends either.
We always say, trust your girlfriends.
I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of The Girlfriends...
Oh my god, this is the same man.
A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist.
I felt like I got hit by a truck.
I thought, how could this happen to me?
The cops didn't seem to care.
So they take matters into their own hands.
I said, oh, hell no.
I vowed I will be his last target.
He's going to get what he deserves.
Listen to the girlfriends.
Trust me, babe.
On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
What's up, everyone?
I'm Ago Modern.
My next guest, you know, from Step Brothers, Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network.
It's Will Farrell.
Woo, woo, woo.
Woo.
My dad gave me the best advice ever.
I went and had lunch with him one day, and I was like, and dad, I think I want to really give this a shot.
I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings.
I'm working my way up through and I know it's a place to come look for up and coming talent.
He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet.
Yeah.
He goes, but there's so much luck involved.
And he's like, just give it a shot.
He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.
If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration.
It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat.
Just hang in there.
Yeah, it would not be.
Right, it wouldn't be that.
There's a lot of luck.
Listen to Thanks, Dad, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
10-10 shots five, City Hall building.
A silver .40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene.
From iHeart Podcasts and Best Case Studios, this is Rorschach, murder at City Hall.
How could this have happened in City Hall?
Somebody tell me that!
Jeffrey Hood did.
July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest.
Both men are carrying concealed weapons.
And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead.
Everybody in the chamber ducks.
A shocking public murder.
I screamed, get down, get down.
Those are shots.
Those are shots.
Get down.
A charismatic politician.
You know, he just bent the rules all the time, man.
I still have a weapon.
And I could shoot you.
And an outsider with a secret.
He alleged he was a victim of flat down.
That may or may not have been political.
That may have been about sex.
Listen to Rorschach, murder at City Hall on the iHeartRadio app.
Apple Podcasts are wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey, I'm Nora Jones, and I love playing music with people so much that my podcast called Playing Along is back.
I sit down with musicians from all musical styles to play songs together in an intimate setting.
Every episode's a little different, but it all involves music and conversation with some of my favorite musicians.
Over the past two seasons, I've had special guests like Dave Grohl, Leve, Mavis Staples, Remy Wolf, Jeff Tweedy, really too many to name.
And this season, I've sat down with Alessia Cara, Sarah McLaughlin, John Legend, and more.
Check out my new episode with Josh Grobin.
He related to the Phantom at that point.
Yeah, I was definitely the Phantom in that.
That's so funny.
Share each day with me each night, each morning.
Say you love me.
You know I.
So come hang out with us in the studio and listen to Playing Along on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
We're back.
Data Selling Revelations00:08:39
Maggie Mayfish just said something through a mouthful of Doritos.
I did.
I'm about to do the same.
Yeah.
Oh, man.
Vetter than us.
Swinging Labio.
I'd rather lick these.
Yes.
Yes.
In June 2013, while Facebook was in the midst of playing with their users' emotions, Glenn Greenwald published an article to The Guardian based on Edward Snowden's releases.
The article revealed that the National Security Agency had been given access to huge amounts of data from Facebook, Google, Apple, and several other major internet companies.
When Mark Zuckerberg was asked about Glenn Greenwald's article, he said, frankly, the government blew it and lamented that the state had done a bad job of protecting privacy.
Pretty bold, Barbara!
Pretty bold!
You know what?
Just because it's so bold, I'll give him that one.
I'll give him that one.
Yeah.
Now, in March of 2015, The Guardian broke what would turn out to be a critically important story.
Millions of Americans' personal data had been harvested through a Facebook app without their knowledge and handed off to a little company called Cambridge Analytica.
In an interview Mark Zuckerberg gave with Recode in 2018, he swore that as soon as Facebook was alerted to the harvesting of their user data by Cambridge Analytica's Alexander Kogan, quote, we immediately shut down the app, took away his profile, and demanded certification that the data was deleted.
However, further reporting from The Guardian showed that Facebook didn't suspend Kogan or Cambridge Analytica until March of 2018, like two or three months before the interview in which Zuckerberg swore they'd banned his ass back in 2015.
Now, I'd say it has been proven beyond much doubt that Mark Zuckerberg's attitude about the value of other people's privacy has not changed much since the days when he stole people's pictures to build an app where kids could vote on which of their female classmates was hotter than a cow.
Thankfully, we know how Mark Zuckerberg and the other Facebook top brass really feel about the value of their users' privacy.
Last year, the British government released an enormous cache of internal company emails to the public.
The data included this bit from 2012.
I'm going to quote Recode's fantastic coverage, and Karis Wisher with Recode has done some of the best reporting on Mark Zuckerberg and the best holding of his frontline documents.
When he hurts when he's sweating and like Karis Wisher is a great journalist, really good shit in the tech industry.
Of the tech journalists, she's like, she's solid.
Excellent.
I'm going to quote Recode's coverage.
In 2012, Zuckerberg suggested that Facebook charge some outside developers for accessing and collecting data on users through the company's APIs, software that allows Facebook to share data with other apps.
If we make it so devs can generate revenue for us in different ways, that makes it more acceptable for us to charge them quite a bit more for using the platform, Zuckerberg wrote.
He suggested that developers could offset these charges by spending money on Facebook ads.
Now, Facebook said they didn't actually go through with that, but the fact that Mark Zuckerberg himself suggested doing the same thing Cambridge Analytica would do three years later suggests he probably was not that muffended by the concept.
Mark published a Facebook post to address this and other revelations.
Quote, like any organization, we had a lot of internal discussion and people raised different ideas.
Ultimately, we decided on a model where we continued to provide the developer platform for free and developers could choose to buy ads if they wanted.
This model has worked well.
Other ideas we considered but decided against included charging developers for usage of our platform, similar to how developers pay to use Amazon, AWS, or Google Cloud.
To be clear, that's different from selling people's data.
We've never sold anyone's data.
But it kind of sounds like that's exactly what Facebook did.
Here's Recode.
Quote, in some cases, Facebook granted other businesses like Netflix and Lyft special permission to access information that other companies didn't have.
So they didn't sell data directly, but people who paid Facebook a shitload in ad dollars got access to more user data, which they didn't pay for, but they got access to because they were paying more money to Facebook, which is different from paying for data because a lawyer can argue that.
Right, totally.
Well, when you lay it out like that, it's legally distinct from selling access to people's data.
And I'm sure it is in a court of law until it's proven not, hopefully.
Yeah, it's like until the laws need to be made to make the distinction clear.
Yeah.
To make it a crime what they did, which I think is ethically a mo it's like a crime in the hearts of any decent person.
But anyway.
Yeah, well, we know how Zucky feels about ethics.
Zucky Zuck.
Ha!
We know how he lives his life, haha.
So, that article also revealed that companies that Facebook found threatening to their bottom line had their access to user data restricted.
Quote, when Twitter launched the video service Vine in 2012, Facebook cut off access to its friend graph.
That meant users who signed up for Vine with their Facebook account couldn't see and connect with all of their Facebook friends inside Vine, an ability that would have theoretically helped Vine create a network much faster.
Yeah.
I don't feel that sorry for Twitter either, but you know, he's just crap.
God, I mean, imagine.
I mean, and Vine still managed to happen.
Yeah.
Yeah.
In spite of it all.
Yeah.
The Paul brothers are throwing out.
You know what, though?
Vine is how Alex Jones finally flamed out, and I'm I'll always be grateful for that.
Oh, really?
Yeah, that he was whining when he was on Capitol Hill shouting at people.
Yeah.
That was very sad to see.
In a good way.
It was a fun day.
That was a fun day watching the news.
Now, the emails that have been revealed make it clear that Zuck's issue was never with the selling of data.
He doesn't give one fuck about that.
He didn't seem to care a lot about the fact that he wasn't able to charge people to steal his customers' data.
In another email Zuckerberg sent in 2012, he complained that, quote, not charging still means people will overuse and abuse our APIs and waste money for us.
I think we should implement some kind of program where you have to pay if you use too many of our resources.
So, by 2015, there was a lot of shady stuff out in the world about Mark Zuckerberg, but the lion's share of the coverage of the man and his brain baby was still unfailingly positive.
And that 2015 Business Insider article that I keep gleefully quoting is only one example of a big fat pile of similar content.
Articles about Mark during this period tended to emphasize his casual dress and down-to-earth personality.
Many included a quote from Tyler Winkleboss, stating that Mark is the poorest-looking rich guy he's ever seen.
Since Tyler Winklevoss was literally born a millionaire, I'm not super trusting that he's a good judge of how poor people look.
Yeah!
What?
This is all.
He wears a hoodie and not a $9,000 suit.
Winkleboss.
Winkleboss is like, well, not to make too fine a point on it, but Mark Zuckerberg looks like shit.
He looks like the guy who fixed my toilet the one time that the rich person plumber wasn't available.
Here's another quote from that fantastic Business Insider article.
But despite his billions, Zuck seems incredibly down there.
Despite his billions!
He holds regular town hall-style Q ⁇ A sessions where he chats with regular people from all around the world.
I want to show you guys a shot from one that took place in May.
Maggie, I think you're the person to describe this.
Do you just want a clip of me crying?
He's just a man of the people.
He's just a man of the people, Mark Zuckerberg.
Oh, you know, he's just beating people.
He knows our struggles.
Someone's doing a shocker.
Someone's sure for sure doing a shocker.
I did read during this time he was like posting on Facebook about all his meetings.
And there's a post where he realizes in real time that slavery still has lasting impacts.
Yeah.
And, you know, how many of those people do you think are wax statues?
He keeps planning on that.
Just one Mark Zuckerberg.
I will note that there are not very many black men in the audience, but one of the few is right next to the family.
That's around.
Yeah, the ones that, yeah, I don't know how they asked that in the room, but somehow they got him to come to the front and surround Mark Zuckerberg.
Yeah.
2015 would be Mark Zuckerberg's last full year as being seen as mostly a good guy by the outside world.
The 2016 election brought questions of fake news and Russian propaganda being spread through the social network.
I've wanted to ground these episodes as much as possible on Mark Zuckerberg, the man, before we get into the terrible consequences of some of his actions.
Because the fact of the matter is that Facebook is a tool and a tool someone was going to build at some point.
There is no version of networked humanity where we don't end up with something like this at some point.
But Mark Zuckerberg is the first guy who got it right.
And as a result, his personal characteristics have had a huge impact on how this colossus has impacted the world.
Now, tomorrow, in part three, we're going to discuss exactly how Facebook, a Mark Zuckerberg production, has changed our world.
Throughout parts one and two, we've talked about him moving fast.
In part three, we're going to talk about what he broke.
Zuckerberg's Last Good Year00:03:52
So everybody ready?
Let's do it.
You got to plug a pluggable.
Okay.
Oh, dear.
Well, you can find me on Zuckerberg platform Instagram at Jamie Cry Superstar.
You can find me on Jack's website at Jamie Launch's Help and listen to the Bechtel cast on Tim's platform.
Yeah.
That's a lot of man's names holding a lot of the internet.
Yeah, you can also find me on all these male-dominated spaces on Twitter and Instagram.
Maggie Mayfish.
Yeah.
You can find me inside of any bag of Doritos you buy because therein my spirit resides.
Haunting.
You can find us on the Graham on Twitter at BastardsPod.
You can find us on the internet at behind the bastards.com.
Do that.
We're on every Tuesday.
We sell t-shirts on TeePublic.
We sell cups.
We sell posters, stickers.
We sell, they're not technically living sentient beings, but they've been engineered to serve you.
And they don't have any legal rights yet, so it's fine.
So yeah, all of that on TeePublic.
That sounds on the up and up.
On the up and up.
Right.
Yep.
Episode tomorrow.
When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands.
I vowed I will be his last target.
He is not going to get away with this.
He's going to get what he deserves.
We always say that: trust your girlfriends.
Listen to the girlfriends.
Trust me, babe.
On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
What's up, everyone?
I'm Ago Modern.
My next guest, it's Will Farrell.
My dad gave me the best advice ever.
He goes, just give it a shot.
But if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.
If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration.
It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat just hang in there.
Yeah, it would not be right.
It wouldn't be that.
There's a lot of life.
Listen to Thanks Dad on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
In 2023, bachelor star Clayton Eckard was accused of fathering twins, but the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax.
You doctored this particular test twice, Miss Owens, correct?
I doctored the test once.
It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern.
Two more men who'd been through the same thing.
Ray Gillespie and Michael Manchini.
My mind was blown.
I'm Stephanie Young.
This is Love Trapped.
Laura, Scottsdale Police.
As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences.
Listen to Love Trapped podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
10-10 shots five, city hall building.
How could this have happened in City Hall?
Somebody tell me that.
A shocking public murder.
This is one of the most dramatic events that really ever happened in New York City politics.
I screamed.
Get down, get down.
Those are shots.
A tragedy that's now forgotten and a mystery that may or may not have been political, that may have been about sex.
Listen to Rorschach, Murder at City Hall on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.