Art Bell

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July 23, 2006 - Art Bell

02:40:50

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Dean Radin - Consciousness and Quantum Entanglement

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01:14:00

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01:02:43

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art bell ▲ ● ▼		From the high rise in the Southeast Asian capital city of Manila, that would be of the Philippines, I would wish you a good morning, good afternoon, good evening, whatever it may be, wherever you are.
		Hi, everybody.
		This is Coast to Coast AM.
		I'm Mark Bell, and I'm still laughing because in the section when you would normally be listening to the news, the network is running a series of little promos, and one of them happens to be JC.
		And I was just remembering the conversation I, the last conversation I think I had, as a matter of fact, with JC.
		My God, it was a riot.
		Anyway, hi there.
		We almost had Stephen Greer here in the first hour.
		I'll tell you more about that in a moment, as well as read the story that prompted that.
		But his car broke down on the way to the program, on the way to a telephone where he could do the program.
		And I'm very sorry because I really, really wanted to interview him.
		But we will get to that, no doubt, in weeks ahead.
		Looking at the world, never that great a thing to do.
		Israel faces fierce battles with Hezbollah.
		Mideast diplomats were pressing Syria to stop backing Hezbollah as the guerrillas fired more deadly rockets into Israel's third largest city Sunday.
		Israel faced tougher than expected ground battles, bombarded targets in southern Lebanon, hitting a convoy of refugees.
		Oops.
		Israel's defense minister said his country would accept an international force, perhaps and preferably from his point of view, NATO on its border after it drives back or perhaps weakens Hezbollah.
		But his troops describe the militants they encountered as smart, well-organized, and ruthless guerrilla fighters who do not appear afraid to die.
		Sniper attacks targeted two pickup trucks early Sunday on a busy highway, killing one person, wounding a second.
		This in Indiana.
		No, not Iraq, Indiana.
		One person wounding a second.
		Police asked other motorists who had been through the area to check their vehicles for bullet holes.
		That's great.
		Now you have to stop and check for bullet holes.
		Hours later, two more vehicles were struck by bullets on yet another four-lane highway about 100 miles away.
		But there was no immediate indication of the two cases might in some way be connected.
		So if you're in the Indiana area, you might want to pull over, check your tires for air, and check your chassis for bullet holes.
		Then getting to Iraq, not good.
		Bombs killed more than 60 people, wounded more than 200 Sunday in Baghdad.
		And the northern oil center of Kirkuk, a dramatic escalation of violence there as the U.S. and Iraqi forces cracked down on Iraq's most feared Shiite militia.
		The prime minister there left Sunday for talks in Washington this week with President Bush to discuss sectarian violence, which had risen sharply since Iraq's national unity government took office two months ago.
		Miss Puerto Rico did it, and I did not get to see it over here.
		It may come to us here in the Philippines on a delayed basis, but an 18-year-old from Puerto Rico who hopes to someday star in U.S. and Latin American films was indeed crowned Sunday as Miss Universe 2006, the runner-up a Japanese young lady.
		And then this story.
		Gas prices move past $3 to an all-time high.
		Nationwide, gas prices hit an all-time high in the last two weeks, rising nearly two cents to just now over $3 per gallon.
		That's an average nationwide higher in many places.
		According to a survey released on Sunday, the national average for self-serve regulars stood at $3.01.5 a gallon Friday, up 1.98 cents in the last two weeks.
		Holy smokes.
		How in the world are people even making it from one place to another?
		All right.
		In a moment, I'm going to read you a story that had Stephen Greer on the way to the program tonight.
		But again, his car, not powered by any new technology, did not make it to a telephone in time to get on the program.
		I'm very sorry about that because when you, in a moment, hear the story, it's just going to blow your mind.
		So that coming up in a moment.
		I'm Art Bell.
		Just a couple of items to run by you.
		One, you'll notice on my webcam this evening that I've got a photograph of, well, actually out my office window.
		And what is normally a little stream down below the condo here in Manila is now become more like a river, and it's getting more like that all the time.
		We are experiencing typhoon Glenda.
		Glenda, Aaron says that female typhoons are much more unpredictable, something I think we all know.
		In other words, they will just keep coming and coming and coming and coming with rain bands.
		And certainly Glenda has been doing that to us, I think, ultimately headed toward Taiwan, I hope.
		But Glenda took a bit of a more of a west-northwesterly course as opposed to northwest.
		And that's going to put her a little close to us, closer to us, unfortunately.
		So that's one.
		And the other, at the beginning of the program, I wanted to mention I am still available by email.
		You may email me at any of the traditional locations.
		That would be artbell at mindspring.com, A-R-T-B-E-L-L at mindspring.com or artbell at aol.com.
		Now, why was Stephen Greer headed to the program tonight?
		Easy answer.
		The following press release that I'm going to read to you and hopefully we'll get him by next weekend to explain this because it's a biggie.
	SETIs make alien contact.
	Question mark.
	According to Dr. Stephen Greer, yes, SETI has received multiple extraterrestrial signals.
	This news, he says, is confirmed by senior employees within the SETI program.
	Now, I suppose we could also try and get Seth Shostak.
	He certainly is a senior employee in SETI.
	This is what Greer had to say at a recent Exopolitics conference: quote: We have confirmed, and I'm not going to give the name yet because we're trying to coax this guy out of the closet, but one of the senior people at the SETI project, which is the Carl Sagan Search for Extraterrestrial Project, has confirmed to the disclosure project that they have received multiple, I repeat, multiple extraterrestrial signals, Greer said.
	But that now they are getting external, probably NRO or NSA jamming of those signals, and they are getting very frustrated.
	Greer continued.
	Question is, why hasn't the SETI project funded by Paul Allen, the co-founder of Microsoft, come forward with this information?
	I'm a little uncomfortable even mentioning this, except for the fact that the public needs to know that this effort, which has received a great deal of mainstream media attention, has actually confirmed to us, has been confirmed by two inside sources.
	That's two sources, folks, that they have received extraterrestrial signals and have confirmed them as being extraterrestrial and that they have now become increasing in frequency and number.
	Dr. Stephen Greer, of course, is head of the Disclosure Project, a nonprofit organization with almost now 500 former military, intelligence, and government employees who go on record about their various experiences with aliens and alien technology.
	Since the national press conference of 2001, viewed by millions of people across the globe, Stephen Greer has been referred to as the authority on the truth about extraterrestrials.
	For Greer to come out and make a statement of this magnitude, something is definitely up.
	We will wait patiently to see whether or not the SETI insiders take the stage and become whistleblowers for this monumental secret.
	Now, this is a non-trivial press release, to be sure.
	And we had Stephen Greer, as I just mentioned, all lined up to come on the show tonight and explain whatever might be the latest.
	However, his car bogged down.
	Now, from Hong Kong, not very far from me, it's about an hour and a half plane flight from me.
	And incidentally, that's a plane flight I'm going to make here pretty soon, go and visit Hong Kong.
	Famous astrophysicist, I really want you to listen, all of you, I want you to listen very closely to this story because I want to talk about it.
	Famous astrophysicist Stephen Hawking said Thursday, I believe the previous, that the late Pope Paul John II once told scientists they should not study the beginning of the universe because it was the work of God.
	The British author who wrote the bestseller, A Brief History of Time, said that the Pope made the comments at a cosmology conference at the Vatican.
	Hawking, who didn't say when the meeting was held, quoted the Pope as saying it's okay to study the universe and where it began, but we should not inquire into the beginning itself, because that was the moment of creation and it was the work of God.
	Scientists then joked during a lecture in Hong Kong, I was glad he didn't realize I had presented a paper at the conference suggesting how the universe began.
	I didn't fancy the thought of being handed over to the Inquisition like Galileo.
	The church condemned Galileo in the 17th century for supporting the discovery that Earth did indeed revolve around the sun.
	Church teaching at the time placed Earth at the very center of the universe.
	Many people still think it's there, by the way.
	But in 1992, Pope Paul II issued a declaration saying the church's denunciation of Galileo was an error resulting from tragic mutual incomprehension.
	I like that.
	That's a good line.
	I'm going to have to remember that.
	If you ever get in trouble with somebody, simply say it was an error resulting from tragic mutual incomprehension.
	Hawking is one of the best-known theoretical physicists of his generation.
	He has done groundbreaking research on black holes and the origin of the universe.
	He proposes that space and time have indeed no beginning and no end.
	And so this creates, I think, a very, very, very important question for all of us on the planet, no matter where you may be, my side, your side, whatever side.
	And that is, I've had scientist after scientist, great physicists, as you know, on the program, some of the greatest minds of our time have come and spent hours with us here on the air.
	And to the very person, they all say that science is now beginning to get a grasp on virtually everything that has created us, everything that is.
	Well, with the exception, perhaps, of that first instant, that moment of creation or that moment of whatever it is that happened.
	Now we're getting very close, and indeed science is pressing forward to investigate that actual instant of creation, if that's what it was.
	Question is, should we not investigate that?
	Are we moving over the bounds?
	Should we not move into God's territory?
	Even if science has the ability to look, dare we look?
	Should we look?
	The scientists, I'm sure, would say, of course.
	That's what science is, the investigation of the gigantic questions that we all want to know about.
	In this case, the moment of creation of all that is around us.
	Everything.
	The planets, all the suns, everything material, everything we can touch, the dimensions, all of it created in that instant, that brief, unmeasurable instant when something smaller than a quark, something smaller than, well, we can't even really measure a quark yet, but something smaller than that which we can only imagine became everything.
	It's hard to imagine, and it's hard to imagine that any of it occurred short of a God, right?
	So, I thought I would ask you all about that.
	I'm sure that I wonder how a lot of you in the religious community would respond to that.
	In other words, obviously, if you believe in God, no, that's wrong.
	I shouldn't say that.
	It's not obvious.
	Even if you believe in God, you still might support the scientific inquiry into the moment of creation.
	Now, it's a little dangerous, yes, because perhaps science might suddenly discover that, well, it somehow was not God.
	Or maybe that question is not to be answered under any circumstances.
	I don't know, but the Pope said that.
	Stephen Hawking reflected on it, and I think all of us would do well to reflect on it too.
	So how would you answer that?
	Is it simply wrong to look into that instant in time?
	They're very close.
	They're right up, virtually right up to that very instant of creation.
	Every single scientist, though, says that that's it.
	That's as far as they've been able to go.
	And some of you, I suppose, might rest easily and simply say, well, they can't do it.
	They're not going to be able to do it.
	They simply will not go ahead and let them try.
	They will not find out.
	On another subject, stepping into a research area marked by controversy and fraud, Harvard University scientists said Tuesday that they are trying to clone human embryos to create stem cells that they hope can be used one day to help conquer a host of diseases.
	Now let's think about that one a little bit.
	They are trying to clone human embryos, clone them.
	You know what that means, right?
	Taking a little bit of cellular material from, I don't know, you or me, and then cloning a person in order to get embryos to get stem cells.
	Now, what's the difference between taking stem cells from a human embryo and taking stem cells from a cloned human embryo?
	I'm not altogether sure.
	Dr. Stephen Hyman said, quote, we are convinced that work with embryonic stem cells holds enormous promise, end quote.
	I'm sure it does.
	The privately funded work is aimed at devising treatments for ailments like diabetes, Lou Gehrig's disease, sickle cell anemia, leukemia, very serious diseases.
	Harvard is only the second American university to announce its venture into the challenging politically charged research field.
	The University of California, San Francisco began efforts at embryo cloning a few years ago only to lose a top scientist to England.
	It has since resumed its work, but is not as far along as experiments already underway by the Harvard group.
	Now, we, of course, have lost many researchers to Europe.
	And the reasons for that are that we kind of put a bit of a restriction on that kind of research.
	Not a bit of a restriction, quite a heavy restriction.
	And our scientists become frustrated, and they take deals elsewhere.
	So that's another one I'd like to ask you about.
	Is there any difference in your mind?
	I mean, we're talking about serious diseases.
	Add spinal cord injury to that.
	But is there any real difference in your mind between cloning a human embryo and then getting stem cells and just, you know, taking an aborted human fetus and getting stem cells?
	Maybe you would say, oh, yes, Art, there's a giant difference, of course.
	Because if you've got a cloned human, you don't have a real human.
	You don't have a human with a soul.
	You don't have a human with all the regular attributes of humans born in the normal way.
	So sure, it's okay.
	Maybe those at Harvard and at other prestigious universities and such think it's okay.
	I don't know.
	I wonder if you think it's okay.
	Dolphins may be indeed a whole lot closer to humans than previously realized.
	New research, get this, shows that they communicate by whistling out, prepare yourself, their own names.
	The evidence suggests that dolphins share the human ability to recognize themselves and other members of the same species as individuals with separate identities.
	Now, God, that's interesting.
	Separate identities.
	The whole notion, let's think about this one, the whole notion of separate identities goes to the realization of self, right?
	To consciousness, doesn't it?
	What is consciousness?
	Consciousness is the understanding that you are.
	Am I correct?
	I think I'm correct.
	The understanding that you are.
	My understanding that I am, that I live, that I am part of all that is around me.
	So if a dolphin understands its own name, that means it understands that it is.
	Am I wrong?
	The research on wild bottlenose dolphins will lead to a reassessment of their intelligence and social complexity, raising moral questions over how they ought to be treated.
	The research was carried out by Vincent Janick of the Sea Mammal Research Unit at St. Andrews University, who's found that bottlenose dolphins seem to be among the animal world's quickest learners of new sounds.
	He said, each animal develops an individual distinctive signature whistle in the first few months of its life.
	That appears to be used in individual recognition.
	The research has its origin in the late 1960s when dolphin trainers first noticed that captive animals each had their own personal repertoire of whistles.
	This prompted speculation that dolphins had their own language and might even have individual names.
	And once again, the way I think about it is that if they have names, then they understand that They are.
	In other words, they have consciousness, ladies and gentlemen, and if they do, they indeed ought to be treated a very great deal differently than they presently are treated.
	I said yesterday that most things that are available in the United States are available here as well.
	Now, that is not entirely true.
	For example, one cannot get Krispy Krem Donuts here in the Philippines.
	Oh, sad day.
	We don't have them.
	However, they are coming.
	I just got a story sent by a listener.
	Headline is, Krispy Cream awards development rights for the Philippines.
	Krispy Cream Donuts, Incorporated announced today that it has awarded development rights for the Philippines to the Great American Donut Company, Inc., owned and operated by the principles of Max's, one of Philippines' leading restaurant chains.
	There is a very good restaurant here called Max's, which was originally actually designed for the American GIs who were at the time here in the Philippines, and then quickly spread and became popular among Filipinos.
	Now, Krispy Kreme has made a deal with Max's, so very shortly, we are going to be able to get Krispy Krem donuts even here in the Philippines.
	All right, ladies and gentlemen, open lines coming up, so you know the numbers.
	If not, we will recite them for you shortly, and we'll do some open lines headed toward the top of the hour.
unidentified		From Manila, I'm Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Indeed, here I am once again.
		Hi, everybody.
		We are having Typhoon Glenda, and it's really ripping around here.
		We're getting rainband after rainband after rainband.
		And we were just talking about some of the screening software that I've got here.
		A number of people sent me an email about that, and they said, hey, Art, how do you answer telephone lines in the Philippines?
		And the answer is they sent me this incredibly wonderful software that allows me to simply push a button here and answer one of the lines.
		Well, it's a little flaky tonight, but it's not from the typhoon.
		Apparently, it's from what's going on in California.
		And of course, in California, you guys are getting slammed with more heat than you've had in a long time.
		As a matter of fact, so much heat that the power companies are beginning to get a little edgy about being able to provide power to all of you.
		At any rate, in a moment, we will test the situation, see if everything works all right.
		That is coming right up.
		I'm Art Bell from Manila.
		By the way, let me clear one other thing up, and that is tonight, incidentally, coming up is a very interesting program.
		It concerns consciousness.
		Dean Raden will be here, and he was here during some of the consciousness experiments that we ran some time ago.
		The nine successful, worrisome experiments that we ran.
		So he'll be here, and we'll talk about consciousness.
		Last night, I think I made a comment that with the state of the world, the wars going on, Newt Gingrich's remark that we were in the first stages of World War III and all the rest of that, the situation with the warming of the planet being felt right now very heavily in California, elsewhere across the North American continent, and in fact the entire world.
		Believe it or not, here in the Philippines, so that you know, they're also talking about global warming.
		It's a big issue here.
		And if it's a big issue here, my guess is it's a big issue all around the world.
		So my comment was, if things really got down to the nitty-gritty, if there was a big rock headed for us, and I've joked that I would, you know, I'd talk that one in, a number of people said, well, are you changing your mind, Art?
		Are you beginning to get to the point, Art, where you would indeed use it?
		Well, of course I'd use it.
		If we were down to the fate of the world, I would indeed use that and anything else, any other tool at my disposal in the position I have to try and rectify whatever situation, you know, dire situation might be at hand.
		So of course I would do that.
		I hope that clears it up.
		I won't tamper around and sort of play games with it, but if need be, I would certainly use it.
		First time caller line, you are on the air, I think.
		Hello, Steve.
unidentified		Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, wherever you are, sir.
unidentified		I'd nice to talk to you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm in Manila, the Philippines, specifically, and it's afternoon here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How are you doing, bud?
unidentified		Not too awfully bad.
unidentified		First time I listened to you, I was on leave in the military 20 years ago, driving at night through Oklahoma, scanning the radio, and I came across one of the most fascinating radio programs I'd ever heard, and I've been hooked ever since.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It is, you know, you're exactly right.
		It is a fascinating radio program.
		I don't know of any other radio program that, on a regular basis, deals with the kinds of questions that we do here.
unidentified		That's very true.
		It's provocative.
		It's fun to listen to.
		It's just fun.
		But you had mentioned it a little while ago, the scientist searching for the moment of creation.
		I think it's, personally, I think it's a critical thing for science to do.
		I think if they were to find that moment of creation, as I told you, Screener, it would also validate scripture in the second letter of Peter that explains the end result of the Big Bang.
		In the 2 Peter, it talks about all the elements will be dissolved with a loud noise and fire.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But Steve, let me stop you and just ask you one quick question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If instead of validating what you believe and have faith is true, it were to prove that there was some reason in physics to explain what happened other than God, how would you handle that?
unidentified		I think I would handle it by saying the greatest and first physicist and scientist would be God himself.
		I just find it unfathomable that what we are today happened by chance.
		I think everything, scientific, physiological, whatever realm someone wants to talk about, I think there has to be an originator of that field.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I agree with you, Steve.
		I think it would not be a definitive answer.
		Even if they came up with something that physics could say, okay, here's exactly how it happened.
		It still would not say that there was not a hand of creation behind it.
unidentified		I agree wholeheartedly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But who knows?
unidentified		Yeah, well, maybe we never will in this juncture.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So what do you think about the Pope's statement that we ought not be looking at that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think that he's simply wrong?
unidentified		Yeah, I do.
		Because when I heard you talk about that, I didn't necessarily think of the Pope, but I thought about fundamentalists who look strictly at Scripture and say conclusively that the earth is only 4,000 years old based on a historical biblical timeline.
		And I think that viewpoint is just as absurd as the Pope saying we ought not to search for that moment of beginning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think that the Pope's apparent fear of looking into this is indicative of the possibility that he thinks we might find something that would not be agreeable with what we know of the Bible?
unidentified		Exactly.
		You're reflecting exactly on the Pope that imprisoned Galileo.
		Galileo discovered that we evolved around the sun and the sun, not around the earth, and because of his scientific views and discoveries, it was contrary to the church's belief and imprisoned him because of that.
		And I think this Pope has the same mindset.
		It's a power issue.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Steve, right from the middle of the Bible Belt, that's Steve.
		And obviously, he's not in fear of that sort of thing.
		That's a very small sample, of course, but as I mentioned, right from the middle of the Bible Belt.
		Let's go to east of the Rockies.
		And hello there.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Thank you for taking my call.
unidentified		This is Jeff coming to you from the blackout capital of St. Louis, Missouri right now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You say blackout?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What do you mean?
unidentified		You haven't heard about the storms in St. Louis?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I've heard about the storms raging across the central part of the U.S. Are you saying you're in full blackout right now?
unidentified		Oh, no, not full blackout.
		We were one of the few lucky ones that still had power.
		But at the height of the 560,000 without 560, 100,000 of those six figures.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That would be 560,000 volts.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that what you mean?
unidentified		No, 560,000 homes without power.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Homes without power, okay.
		Yeah, that's a lot, all right.
		Well, the weather is worsening all over the world.
		Here in Southeast Asia, obviously, the typhoons are getting bigger, more frequent.
		That's happening with hurricanes off the U.S. East Coast.
		And the weather is getting warmer, and all of that is pushing these damn storms to be bigger and bigger and bigger.
		And I wonder how many more years of that we can take.
unidentified		I don't know, but they called this one of the worst storms in 30 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There you go.
unidentified		And then my main comment was about the Middle East.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		I do believe we are watching the players and chessboards set up for the Third World War.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You agree with Newt Ingrid.
unidentified		Yeah, but not necessarily.
unidentified		We're in it right now, but I think the players are being set up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I suppose you could certainly look at what's going on right now and say this looks an awful lot like what the Bible says will happen.
unidentified		Yeah, I think as long as Germany, I mean, Tel Aviv or Jerusalem is not hit, I think there's still a chance.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but they're getting pretty close.
		All right, buddy, thank you very much.
		I very much appreciate the call.
		And the Israeli Prime Minister made, I think, a comment about one of the Israeli cities the other day.
		He said that'll be the end of it if they hit that.
		So they're going to hit it if they can.
		We all know that.
		What the response from Israel would be, I certainly don't know, but it would probably be quite severe.
		Are we in the first stages of World War III?
		Do you believe Newt Gingrich is correct?
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Yeah, hi, Art.
unidentified		How you doing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing fine.
unidentified		It's good to hear your voice from over in the Philippines there.
unidentified		I just saw Al Gore's movie last night, the Inconvenient Truth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, really?
unidentified		Yeah.
		They brought it up because people called up in Lake County in California and asked them to play it.
		We figured they wouldn't have it up here at all.
		But, boy, it's really compelling.
		I learned some things from it that I didn't realize China has higher fuel mileage standards than we have in the United States right now.
		And I'm looking at the thermometer, and it's pretty scary.
		I mean, it feels like it's something that we can change.
		I think Stephen Greer said we become accustomed to the things that we can change and focus on things that are out of our realms pretty much.
		And I think we should pay attention to the trying to change our habits.
		It's a real inspiring movie.
		It's got a lot of good solutions.
		And I would highly recommend it to anybody.
		But also, if you wanted to do a prayer ahead of time before it's too late, maybe a group prayer for peace in the Middle East is really appropriate right now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Stephen Greer, sir, is more of an optimist than I am.
		I would like to believe that it could be rectified and changed.
		And I suppose there are small things at the margins that we can do that might help out.
		But I'll tell you, if I'm going to be dead flat honest with you, given a choice to pick we can stop all this or it's too late.
		I'm afraid I'm in the too late category.
unidentified		Yeah, I've gone along with you on that stuff before.
		I mean, I've talked to you a number of times.
		I had the dogs and the harmonica and the stun guns thing we did that time.
		I'd rather be talking about stuff like that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You have to get a stun gun right there, don't you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I heard it.
unidentified		That was it.
unidentified		Yeah, you want to hear it again?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		fire away.
unidentified		Go ahead.
		Can you talk?
		Can you sing for art?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can you try it on your knee for me?
unidentified		Yeah, right.
		That was a good one.
		I think it was you, the guy that just knocked everything down to hell when he tried his wife, the way he would bought for his wife.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, that was me.
unidentified		That should definitely go on record, that one.
		No, you've got to see the movie.
		Honestly, I've agreed with you on so many things, and I've been hooked to you too for decades and almost decades.
		It's really worth seeing, and you really got me in the gut when you said what Newt said last night, the beginning.
		I'm feeling like it's out of control.
		But the movie, it all ties in together.
		It really does.
		And it's not that hard to change things.
		And little pie pieces add up to bringing the curve down and lowering CO2 emissions.
		It's not that hard to do.
		It's just that we are so engaged in this oil thing that it's almost like they really want to wreck the world.
		For some reason, the car manufacturers aren't doing well in America, but they keep having high-mile cars.
		The rest of the world is going ahead of us, Art.
		America's gone, our infrastructure and our way of being seems to be faded almost intentionally to be a failure.
		It's absurd.
		And seeing this movie makes it even just more clear.
		I know you probably don't want to see it, but if you can see it, I know you'll be singing this movie.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I'd love to see it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know that a lot of people kind of roll their eyes when it's Al Gore you're talking about.
unidentified		Yeah, but he's so funny, man.
		I tell you, he's engaging.
		He seems like a completely different person in this movie.
		Well, not that complete, but I mean, honestly, he's like, it's worth seeing.
		It's not something to roll your eyes about.
		I didn't think I'd even see it.
		I'll wait until it comes out or whatever, but I think now's a good time, especially with the thermometer hitting.
		There's hundreds of thousands of people everywhere that are out of power, not just, you know, in the Midwest, California, in the Bay Area, hundreds of thousands of people have been out of power.
		States want to alert.
		The American Weather Association said that the weather, they said that it's global warming like a week ago.
		I've never heard it again on the news.
		They said, well, they attribute it to global warming.
		So the truth is there.
		It's scary.
		I don't know what else to say.
		I'll let you get some other calls.
		I'm so happy you're there and you've been able to move and start a new life.
		That is just fantastic.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, my friend.
		Take care.
		He's, of course, right.
		Now, I am a bit more of a pessimist about all of this.
		That doesn't mean that I do not think that we should begin doing things as quickly as we can to mitigate whatever is going to happen.
		We should have been doing that for a long time.
		We should have done it a long time ago.
		But that doesn't mean that we should stop now.
		It's just that really press to the wall.
		I try to always be as honest with my audience as I can.
		I look at what's going on here.
		Of course, we've got air problems here in the Philippines, and I've been to China.
		And if you could see what's going on in China right now, it would just scare the hell out of you.
		The amount of factories that are cranking as hard as they can, the amount of industry and trucks and cars that are on the road and the status of the air, Bangkok would be another example.
		The United States has actually done quite well in recent years compared to a lot of, for example, Asian nations.
		So I suppose there is hope.
		Let's go to the first time caller line.
		You're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		How are you?
unidentified		My name is Wayne from Gary, Indiana.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, Wayne.
unidentified		Yeah, the first time I ever listened to this show was actually the night that you retired.
unidentified		I believe it was in December.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Boy, what a night to pick, huh?
unidentified		Yeah, a few years back.
		And I also wanted to say that I was in the Philippines in 1996.
		I think that was my second trip over to Asia.
		And every time I've been over there, I had a great time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it is a wonderful country.
		It's got some problems, of course.
		But the people here in the Philippines are the most friendly, wonderful people you would ever want to meet.
		It's kind of time travel in more ways than one.
		Like right now, for example, it's Monday afternoon coming up on 2 o'clock in the afternoon here.
		So you and I are time traveling right now a little bit.
		But what I mean is, by time travel, I mean when you're here, it's kind of like going back to the 1950s in the U.S., if you can imagine that.
unidentified		Yes.
		I wanted to ask you about, have you gotten used to the time that the sun rises and sets every day?
		My girlfriend is from the Philippines, and she tells me that no matter what season it is, the sun rises at 6 in the morning and it sets at 6 p.m.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'm not sure that's exactly true.
		It might be almost true.
		I'll have to take a look at that.
		I'm certainly used to, I'm kind of on a different schedule.
		You know, I used to be up till 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 in the morning every single morning.
		But now I've kind of adjusted myself to be on a different schedule.
		And I'm generally up by about 9 o'clock in the morning here in the Philippines.
unidentified		Oh, I've been to Puerto Rico quite a bit, and I was wondering if the weather patterns are the same over there, that you could be just a few feet away from where it's raining, and you're completely dry, but say across the street, it's a torrential rainstorm going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, there is, thank you.
		There is some of that.
		Right now, of course, we're in the middle of a typhoon, so we're getting torrential rains, period.
		I mean, it is just really coming down out there.
		Nevertheless, across the face of the world, we seem to be doing just fine.
		On the wildcard line, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Blair and Sedona.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hey, Blair.
unidentified		Hey, I remember when I talked with you two years ago, you played that stop prying into government matters or dire consequences will result just before Stephen Greer came on.
unidentified		I hope he's doing okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hope he's doing okay, too, and I would sure like to get him on the air to explain this press release.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That is really, Truly exciting stuff.
unidentified		Oh, I bet it is.
		Well, I run into the Drumvolo Melchizedek a lot here in Sedona, and he talks about on his flower of life about the 26,000-year cycle that our sun travels around the galaxy.
		In 13,000 years, we head away from the center of the galaxy and we fall asleep in consciousness, so male paternal takes over to protect the clan, so to speak.
		Then for 13,000 years, after the Kali Yuga, the Dark Knight of the Soul, we come into the light and we're led by the feminine.
		And Drumbelo wrote a book called Living in the Heart, and he basically is saying his argument is that we need to think more from the heart instead of the mind because thinking through the mind causes this polarity consciousness of yes, no, good, mad.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I have not been a great follower of his for many years.
		I'm not sure what I'm in doubt about, but I just have not been a great follower.
		I sort of get his email bulletins all the time.
		Nevertheless, he could be certainly right about those particular cycles.
unidentified		Yeah, at the very least, you know, with the sun going crazy here, we could be heading into a new vibration in the solar system, and it's affecting the Earth.
		And it's one of those cycles.
		If it's 26,000 years, we've only been doing this for 5,000,06,000 years of study in the Western society, so we don't even know about these new cycles yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you could be dead right about that as well.
		We certainly don't know the thousands of years of cycles of our own Earth, do we?
		Listen, I've got to scoot.
		We're out of time here.
		It's obvious to me that I'm going to have to do an open line show and just sit down and talk with all of you because there's a lot going on across the face of our globe.
		Coming up after the break, Dean Raden.
		Dean Raden is an amazing man.
		I'm Art Bell, not so amazing, and almost getting all wet here in Manila, where it's raging out there with Typhoon Glenda.
		We'll be right back.
		Think about it, folks.
		All the way, all the way from Southeast Asia.
		I mean, I'm on the other side of the globe.
		How exciting is this?
		I mean, it really is exciting.
		From one side of the world to the other side of the world, you and I are conversing as though I was still in Nevada.
		It's amazing.
		Only a company the size of mine, and we are, of course, a very large company, could possibly pull something off like this.
		This is amazing to be able to do a radio program, a talk radio program, from one side of the earth to the other side of the earth.
		That is no small feat, to be sure.
		Coming up in a moment, Dean Raden, who earned a BSE Magna Cum Laude in Electrical Engineering from the University of Massachusetts.
		He also has an M.S. in electrical engineering and a Ph.D. in psychology, both from the University of Illinois.
		For 10 years, he conducted research on advanced telecommunication systems at AT ⁇ T, Bell Labs and GTE labs.
		Then, for the majority of the last 20 years, he has investigated psychic phenomena in academic and industrial positions.
		Dean served as a member of a classified research project investigating psychic phenomena for the U.S. government at SRI International, headed PSI research programs in Silicon Valley for nearly, or not nearly, for two scientific and industrial think tanks.
		He's been senior scientist at the University, make that the Institute of Noetic Sciences since 2001.
		He's also adjunct faculty at Sonoma State University in California.
		I'll make it through this.
		Dean's research has been featured in numerous magazines, and he has appeared on several radio and television programs, including this one.
		In addition, he is author of the book, The Conscious Universe.
		And we're going to talk quite a bit about the conscious universe and entangled minds.
		All coming up in a moment with Dean Radin.
		From the middle of Typhoon Glenda, well, actually, not the middle, the periphery of Typhoon Glenda, I bid you whatever time of day it is, wherever you happen to be.
		Hi.
		Dean Raden, welcome to the program.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Thanks, Art.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's always good to be on your show.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's been a while and a lot of water under the bridge since we last spoke, Dean.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I have so many questions for you.
unidentified		Go on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Dean, can you give us and the audience a little bit of a sort of a 101 on what was going on at Princeton?
		I presume the experiment is still going on.
		I think it's on the web.
		People can actually log on and see the little eggs chirping away.
		That experiment is still underway, correct?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's still going, yes.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you're talking about the Global Consciousness Project.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		This is a worldwide project where we have random number generators.
		These are electronic circuits that generate zeros and ones.
		That's all they do.
		Randomly.
		And they're operating 24-7, and every five minutes they send a summary of their data up to a server at Princeton.
		This has been running now for eight years.
		And it's part of an experiment looking at the relationship between mind and matter, where the mind is the attention of the world, and the matter is this random network that we have circling the globe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		So these little computers, you call them, I think Princeton calls them eggs, are nothing more than, as you point out, random number generators.
		Are they really random, Dean?
		That would seem, it sounds like an easy job, but it isn't all that easy, is it, to actually make it random?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		To make a truly random device.
		is more difficult than it may seem.
		It's true, because if you have some kind of circuit that is not shielded, for example, then if somebody brings a magnet or some other source of electromagnetism near it, it could influence the generation of the bits.
		So these circuits are designed so that they're in metal cages.
		The metal cages are grounded to the PC.
		They operate on the battery output or they're a controlled power supply from the PC and lots of other things to ensure that it is as random as we know how to make.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		And these eggs are located in how many parts of the world?
		How many altogether?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		There are 65 now.
		There are actually a little bit more than that, but there's about 65 are active at any given time.
		They're typically attached to we have hosts around the world.
		People have a PC which is attached to the Internet, and it's just a little device that sits in the back of the PC and just keeps going all day long.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Spitting out random numbers.
		And then the key to all of this, I guess, is when they start to become non-random.
		That has meaning.
		That has some kind of meaning.
		And I guess we're not altogether sure just yet what that meaning is, or are we?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, the experiment was started as a result of testing a hypothesis.
		So we have at least some guidance on what we think we're doing.
		The hypothesis is that mind and matter are related in some way.
		We don't know whether mind gives rise to matter or maybe matter gives rise to mind.
		But there is a relationship between the two.
		That's the hypothesis.
		And so if there is that hypothesis, then in essence you have the equivalent of an equation with some sort of equal sign between mind and matter.
		So if mind suddenly becomes very coherent, and the coherence we're talking about is all of the minds become aligned in some way, then we can assume that because of the equal sign between mind and matter, that matter must also become coherent in some way.
		So what we look for then are large-scale world events where we can infer that a large percentage of the world has become coherent by virtue of their attention on one particular event.
		And then we see whether or not the random network remains random or does it become patterned.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		And you've got eight years under your belt now, Princeton does, of doing this.
		I know in certain instances, for example, 9-11.
		I've got to remember a lot of the audience is not familiar with what we're talking about right now because it's really been some time.
		So for example, at 9-11, I know that all of this is graphed.
		There's an actual graph that you can look at.
		And I think, was it 30 minutes or some period of time prior to 9-11, the graph just took off like sort of a hockey stick?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It took off about two hours before the first plane hit the World Trade Center.
		And there were a number of other anomalies.
		There's a very strange sequence of non-random events that occurred in the random network that day.
		It basically was not behaving randomly.
		And in fact, a way to describe what happened is with a tsunami detector, the way that it would work is you put a whole bunch of buoys scattered throughout the ocean, and you monitor their height.
		And most of the time, the height, the average height of all the buoys is random because they're separated sometimes by thousands of miles and you wouldn't expect the heights to correlate.
		But if a tsunami occurs, then the whole ocean rises and then drops again.
		And you'd be able to detect that by looking at these very large, slow correlations among the buoys.
		So the Global Consciousness Project, then, in a metaphorical sense, is measuring the movement of consciousness.
		It's the ocean of consciousness.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that's a very good analogy.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		And so if a wave of attention comes along and pushes this entire ocean of consciousness, that's what we're detecting in the eggs.
		The egg, by the way, stands for electrogiagram.
		And it's a little play on the term electroencephalogram.
		So just as you put electrodes in somebody's head to make an electroencephalogram, in this case we put electrodes on Gaia's head, meaning the earth, and we create an electrogiagram.
		That's where the word egg came from.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So, and again, you mentioned that these are shielded very carefully against any external electromagnetic influence of any sort, and that's understandable, but that also means that whatever is affecting these eggs is either beyond infrequency or affect electromagnetism.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, it actually goes beyond simple electromagnetic shielding because there are other things that can affect random output.
		For example, component aging could affect it, temperature could affect it, possibly proximity of a person, all kinds of things.
		So we need to rule that out as well.
		And the way that we rule out what might be called mundane environmental effects is by putting the output of the raw random stream, we put a logical XOR.
		This is an exclusiveOR logic gate.
		And that is, so the raw output is matched against a series of alternating zeros and ones through this logic sequence.
		And what this does is it removes any mundane drift in the output.
		So the way to think of an egg, a better way to think of the egg is it's a black box which is designed in such a way that the output will be as theoretically perfect randomness.
		That's the way that these things Are devised.
		And the disadvantage of this kind of design is that it then becomes very difficult to know what's happening in terms of the physics.
		We don't really know what's happening in terms of the physics of the device, of what's being pushed around to make it not random.
		But the advantage of it is that we know that whatever is going on is not a normal physical influence.
		It's got to be something else.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And by that, let me go back to what I said.
		In other words, with the kind of shielding you do, it's obvious then that whatever force, maybe that's the right word to use, is causing these eggs to become non-random in any given circumstance, it's probably not measurable from an electromagnetic point of view.
		It's in some other right word.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's some other domain.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Some other domain.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That's exactly right.
		In which case, the metaphor that I used, it's as though the eggs are floating in a medium.
		And what we're looking at, I believe, is something like a distortion in the medium itself.
		So if, as the mystics have said, if we live in a medium that is made of consciousness, and the medium can be distorted in some way, then the possibility arises that that is what we're actually detecting.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Huh.
		God, that's fascinating.
		I read a story a little earlier indicating that they now have learned that dolphins, Dean, actually understand each other's, they actually have names.
		They actually have names, and they're able to call each other by names.
		Now, after thinking about that a little bit, it seems to, I don't know how you measure what consciousness is, but I always thought that perhaps self-awareness might be one of the measuring sticks of consciousness.
		And if a dolphin knows its own name, my God, that means it's aware of itself, doesn't it?
unidentified		Sure.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, sure.
		I think chimpanzees also, we have a sense that they are aware of themselves because when they look in the mirror, they know that they're looking at themselves.
		Whereas if a dog or a cat looks in the mirror, they won't react as though they know it's themselves.
		So that gives us a way of testing whether the creature has some sense of self-reflection.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Dean.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Then wouldn't that mean, for example, that when the eggs are reacting to something, whatever it might be, that they're reacting to a pool of consciousness that includes not only human beings?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, we've actually been able to test that.
		The question all along has been, could it be, for example, that Gaia, meaning the planet, has some kind of planetary awareness?
		Or are we actually detecting the result of billions of minds?
		Is it us or is it the planet itself?
unidentified		Indeed.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So we did figure out a way to test that.
		And the answer, I'll tell you the outcome before I tell you how we did it.
		The answer looks like it's responding to us and not necessarily to the planet at large.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now I'm dying to know how you know that.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so we have about eight years of data so far and 204 events to date that we've looked at.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		These are all large-scale major world events.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That was a question I was going to ask.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		204 measured events.
unidentified		Right.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So the overall odds against chance as of about last month was 300,000 to 1.
		So we have pretty good odds against chance that we're not dealing with a chance effect.
		There really is something going on.
		Now we notice that because there's so many different kinds of events that we've looked at, everything from 9-11 to planned meditations to the funeral of Pope John, Paul, and so on, large-scale events, that 51 of those events were what we call impulse events.
		These are things like 9-11 and also earthquakes typically.
		They're very unexpected things that happen suddenly at a moment in time.
		When you go back and look at those 51 events, what we saw first, we just eyeballed it.
		We saw that about two hours before the event, there was a rise in the overall network, meaning a change in order in the network about two hours before.
		So we first noticed this most clearly with 9-11, but as we went back and looked at these other impulse events, we kept seeing it again and again.
		So we did an overall analysis of these 51 events, and there's very strong evidence that two hours before the event that the whole network begins to change.
		So then – It's not exactly two hours in every case, but when you take the composite result of the 51 events, it's clear that around two hours you've gone beyond chance.
		You're now in a statistically significant domain.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, the implications of that are staggering, and that alone begs a million questions, because obviously there's some sort of maybe you'd be the one to answer it, not me, but there's some sort of time element involved here that, you know, on the face of it seems completely impossible.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		But now it'll become more impossible because the purpose for creating this network to be running continuously is so if we came up with a new hypothesis, we can go back in the historical data and try something new.
		So what we came up with was to go back and find every earthquake of Richter 6 or larger that was in a populated zone or non-populated zone.
		And as you know, along the tectonic plates, there are earthquakes happening all the time, some of them around where people are, but a lot of them there's nobody.
		So we went back and looked in our random network to find out what was happening in the network around the time of earthquakes, before, during, and after.
		And what we found is overall, about two hours before earthquakes, only in populated zones does it begin to increase.
		In areas where there is no population or just a very small population, you don't find that increase.
		So this is why we think that there's something important about the population.
		In other words, lots and lots of people who suddenly pay attention to the earthquake that is related to this effect.
		Now, one possibility is that just as in the big tsunami that happened in December of 2004, the animals started running away.
		Well, maybe people do sense this.
		And we're not indigenous people who tend to live out in the islands, and we don't pay attention to it.
		But at some level, some deeper level, we actually do sense that these events are coming up.
		And that's what we're picking up in this network.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think, again, that you're picking up actually people, Dean?
		Or do you think that, oh, for example, you're getting more of a sense from what we all know the animals have more of a sense of this sort of thing than we do.
		So could it be coming from the animals?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's conceivable that it's coming from anything which is conscious or has consciousness, which includes animals, of course.
		We would like to be able to test, for example, when we looked at Y2K, we found a big effect.
		And then we went back and looked at all of the other New Year's.
		Overall, the change of New Year in each time zone, you can see an effect.
		So if we could figure out when the New Year's Ease, New Year's occurs for dolphins, Say, or if we found out when whales celebrate something, we'd have a way of testing the difference between humans and animals.
		But so far, we haven't figured out how to do that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's really the whole thing, of course, is incredibly remarkable.
		And I'd really be interested in where you think the research goes from here.
		In other words, you've pretty well, at 300,000 to 1, it seems like you've nailed down the fact that, hey, folks, this is not just some accident.
		This is absolutely real.
		Where does the research go from here?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, one thing is to try to figure out the difference in the response of the network for different kinds of events.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Since we have events ranging from unexpected things like terrorism and earthquakes to plan things, we don't know yet why some events create this effect and others don't.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		All right.
		Dean, we're already at a breakpoint, so hold tight.
		We'll be right back.
		Dean Raden is my guest.
		We're talking about one of my favorite things in the whole world, consciousness.
		From Manila in the Philippines, where a typhoon rages outside.
		I'm Mark Bell, and this is Worldwide, Coast to Coast AM.
		Indeed, here I am.
		My guest is Dr. Dean Raden, and he's already given us kind of a 101 on what's going on at Princeton University.
		And, my God, some of this is pretty heady stuff.
		In other words, they've got these computers spitting out random numbers, and they really are random, and protected against any sort of electromagnetic effect or whatever else might be out there.
		And then they have detected now in a total of 200 measured events, 51 of them being events that nobody could have predicted, you know, like 9-11 or like an earthquake, something that you just possibly could not have known about.
		And the odds now, computed carefully, of this being a mistake are 300,000 to 1.
		In other words, this is real.
		Something is really going on.
		And that's what we're going to talk about this evening, as well as the issue of entangled minds.
		I'm sure Dean will have a lot to say about that.
		All coming up in a moment.
		Once again, Dr. Dean Raden, Dean, an obvious question, certainly that has occurred to me is the following.
		The egg action, I've been up on the website, and I have a lot of people who email me, and they'll typically say, hey, Art, the eggs are going totally berserk tonight.
		That's a separate topic.
		We'll talk about that.
		But with regard to the egg action, sorry for the phrase, is it regional?
		In other words, let's take the tsunami as an example in my part of the world over here right now.
		Were you able to observe a greater non-randomness in the eggs that were reporting from this part of the world than you were, say, in North America or Europe?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So far, the only event that we've looked at in any detail for localization was 9-11.
		And part of the reason why we're not looking at it still is because the network is not quite large enough.
		We don't have enough points around the world in order to get a good topological map.
		But for 9-11, because of the importance of that date, what I did was separated the eggs first by hemisphere and then by continent and then by coast.
		And when you do that, you're able to actually trace down that the largest statistical deviation was the east coast of the United States.
		So there is some inkling that there is a way to localize.
		Because, I mean, we're always asked if you have a two-hour warning that something's about to happen, that alone is not very useful.
		You need to know where.
		And then, of course, the next thing is you need to know what.
		So the where and the what are questions that are outstanding and are on the agenda for what's next.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So the answer is it is probably regional, although 9-11 would be not enough of the sample, I suppose, to proclaim that as science, but it looks like it might be regional.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it was an exploratory analysis, and it was promising enough to have us go ahead and continue to look at that in more detail.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		How much more funding, and are you getting enough funding for this?
		I mean, this seems so incredibly important to me that the government and others ought to be all over it with funding.
		You can always use more funding.
		So where are you with that?
		Are you beginning to get the attention of the mainstream scientific community now?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, you asked what's next for this project.
		And one of the things was to bring it to the attention of the scientific community more directly.
		So we have published papers in scientific journals, but I noticed on the Coast to Coast webpage that the feature article is about a conference on retrocausation.
		So we were actually at that.
		I was there, Roger Nelson was there, Richard Schaup was there.
		We're all analysts on this project.
		We went to this meeting, which was at the University of San Diego, and it was part of the American Association for the Advancement of Science, part of the regional conference.
		It was primarily for physicists talking about the issue of retrocausation, and Roger Nelson presented the results of this two-hour precursor event, because it looks like a retrocausation event.
		And this is one of the ways we're reaching out to primarily the physics community to present an anomaly that physicists ought to, first of all, be interested in, and second of all, probably can help us understand what's going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		I'm sorry.
		Does this have anything to do?
		It does, doesn't it, with entanglement, with entangled minds and with the whole you know, you remember the IBM experiment with showing what was it?
		Explain that IBM experiment.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Were they actually I think you may be talking about a form of entanglement called ghost entanglement.
		Entanglement refers to a prediction from quantum theory, which says that if any two particles interact, including photons, atoms, molecules, anything, that when they separate, they remain connected in some form.
		It's as though they become a single object that just happens to be in two places at once.
		Well, this allows you to do a number of very strange effects that look for all the world as a form of bilocation, in a sense.
		So what I think you may be referring to is that if you entangle photons or electrons and you have one of the entangled electrons, say, go through a mask that spells out IBM, and now you look where the other, what's happening to the other electrons, they will also spell out IBM.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That is what I'm talking about.
		And honest to God, I don't know what I'm talking about.
		It just seems that one is such a great mystery with some similarities to the other that they seem, excuse the expression, entangled.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		Yeah, it is.
		Actually, it'll make your brain hurt if you try to really understand this stuff in detail.
		And it's one of the curious things about quantum mechanics in general that most of the founders of quantum mechanics and Richard Feynman, the Nobel laureate, kept saying over and over again, here's what the mathematics says.
		This is what we can test in the lab.
		And entanglement is a very real thing.
		But if you try to understand it in common sense terms, you will fail.
		It doesn't make sense.
		It's not common sense.
		It's way beyond common sense.
		And yet the state of the art is advancing so quickly that it's being used already for secure communication, and people are well downstream in creating quantum computers using entanglement.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's a good question.
		Would it actually be secure communication?
		If you found a practical way to use entanglement for communication, would it really be secure?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It would.
		It would be as secure as anything we know how to make.
		Because quantum cryptography is based on this general notion that essentially there is no key.
		The only person that could hold the other side of the key, which would break the code, is the other entangled photon, say.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now you're talking directly to the minds at NSA.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And if they wouldn't pony up some money for this, then they're just not paying attention, Dean.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, the Global Consciousness Project is probably related to entanglement, because I think it's an important element of this.
		But we have spoken to people in the government who are interested in the predictive capability.
		But so far, all of the funding has been from private individuals who are simply interested in the project.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But if you're talking about a form of communication that, for example, has no key, nor does it require a key, you're talking about something that would be beyond mildly interesting to organizations like the NSA and the NRO and all the rest of them.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		But that level of research is getting an enormous amount of funding.
		That's getting government funding and industry funding.
		That's major and mainstream.
		What we're talking about is taking these ideas and pushing it a little bit to see what role does it play with consciousness.
		And that's when we start stepping on controversial ground.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I want to read you something that a listener sent prior to your coming on the air tonight.
		I recently read Dr. Raden's much-needed book, Entangled Minds.
		Dr. Radin reviewed experiments that look into the future by a few seconds.
		That is RNGs, for example, as well as experiments that have a dependence on space, distance, ESP, card guessing, and RNGs.
		Prophecy, such as the Bible contains, is not bounded by time and distance.
		The prophecies of the Bible are supposed to come from a source that is outside of and not limited by ether.
		Please ask Dr. Raden to comment on the notion that being stuck in time and space, as we are, like flies on a coil of sticky tape, could explain the graduated by time and space success of the experiments.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That question ended in a way that I didn't think it was going to go.
		I thought the question was going to ask whether it's conceivable that prophecies are genuine, given that what we know, what we can see in the laboratory now, in which case the answer is yes.
		We don't know how far in the future a prophecy can go because in the lab we've generally been limited to matters of seconds or minutes so far.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He noted that.
		I think, as a matter of faith, he assumes that the biblical prophecy is accurate.
		Let's see, again, please ask Dr. Rayton to comment on the notion that being stuck in time and space, as we are like flies on a coil of sticky tape, could explain the graduated by time and space success of the experiments.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I'm not sure that I understand what that question is.
unidentified		How would you interpret that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I was really hoping that you would easily interpret that because I was wondering about it myself.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		No, I got stuck on the sticky paper, and after that, I couldn't understand it.
unidentified		It's a nice metaphor.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is it a good metaphor that we're kind of stuck like flies on a bit of a coil of sticky tape in time?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, we are, but only in the sense of an illusion.
		You know, our perceptions of reality are a construction.
		We don't see the world the way the world actually is.
		We see the world the way that we construct the world.
		And there's this whole series of experiments, I talk about this a little bit in the book Entangled Minds, that show very dramatically that the way that we experience the world, both in time and in space, really is a construction.
		And you can do very slight changes to your expectations about what you're going to see, and you will see completely different things.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		You're sort of in the predictive, the looking at and the predictive stages of this whole experiment in looking at world events and the correlation with what the AIGS report and all the rest of it.
		Dean, is it possible, and I know that you're very well aware of the experiments that I did, about nine of them, and they all worked out positively.
		We actually did create, it seems, rain.
		We did affect people's health.
		We did certainly affect the weather.
		And it kind of scared me.
		So is it possible that mass consciousness is something that can not only be monitored for predictive effect, I guess, or predictive ability, but also can be used in a proactive manner, as I think I demonstrated in those experiments?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Can you create a tsunami in the ocean of consciousness by having everybody jump at the same time?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yikes.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I think the answer is yes, but just as the metaphor that I just used, there are unintended consequences.
		And that's the tricky bit, because we don't really know the details of what we're dealing with.
		We don't know, for example, that if you want it to rain in a certain place and you get a couple million people to agree to that and to intend it, that you may well get rain.
		But we're dealing with a complex weather system and you may create a drought somewhere as a result.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Or a flood.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Or a flood.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's exactly, of course, what stopped me.
		And I finally realized, you know, what the hell am I doing?
		However, the success, I think, of the nine experiments, that's not a gigantic number, but it was amazing.
		And then it began to scare me a little bit.
		And as you know, several years ago, I stopped doing it.
		Now, if there was some sort of global threat, and we're not all that far away from that kind of thing, whether you want to talk about human behavior or you want to talk about the current state of the planet and what's going on with the warming and all the rest of that, there may come a time when it may be worth trying because otherwise we're going to be in a lot of trouble, and I don't know anything else that can affect systems like the weather and the rest of it other than this.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's probably true.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I mean, especially in terms of global warming, if we go beyond the stage of last resort, then we have nothing to lose at that point.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My feeling exactly.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		When it comes to something like peace, you know, like if everyone prayed for peace in the Middle East, it'd have to be very carefully constructed on what that means.
		Because peace means different things to different people.
		And, you know, one way of thinking of peace is as though we're spreading mental valium over the entire Middle East and everyone just calms down.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, no, very well said.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It may well be, for example, Dean, that peace to a Palestinian might be the eradication of Israel.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		So do we mean creating a sense of peace within each individual or something larger than that?
		It would just have to be thought out very carefully before an effort was made.
		Now, I know that there are dozens, maybe hundreds of groups around the world that are praying for peace.
		But my guess is that if you imagine that we're all in this giant ocean of consciousness, that hundreds of groups are doing the equivalent of throwing boulders in the ocean.
		And they will create ripples, but the ripples will tend to all wash each other out because they're not.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They're trying to throw each other out, yeah.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		They're not being done at the same time, and they're not in the same wavelength and all the rest.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		How much do we know, Dean, about the effect of one mind versus 100 versus 1,000 versus 5 million?
		I mean, you know, I've got the ability to perhaps, I don't want to use the word manipulate, but get the cooperation of perhaps millions of minds toward one single effort.
		So how much do we know about the difference?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I think the data so far suggests that it's not so much the number as the coherence of the number.
		So for example, if you have 5 million people and they're somehow able to do the same thing at the same time, and they're really on the same wavelength, their intentions are aligned, you get a really big effect.
		But if you have a couple million people and half of them are thinking, well, I don't know about this, and the other half are thinking their minds are scattered in some way, you could very well get a complete wash and get absolutely nothing.
		So the reason I say this is because these field consciousness experiments, that's what the Global Consciousness Project is.
		It's looking at consciousness as a field, in a sense.
		This has been going on for about a decade now, and they started in small groups, like a group of meditators.
		And it does appear as though it's the coherence of the group, the group mind.
		Sometimes it's called like being in the zone.
		When a group can be in the zone or a sports team is completely in alignment, magic happens.
		You know, in the Olympics, I forget what year it was, but the U.S. hockey team won the Olympics, and they weren't expected to win at all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Against all odds.
		And you're exactly right.
		There's a kind of a zone.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		There's a zone in it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Even in the work I do, even in the work I do, Dean, I can feel it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's a certain time when I get in a certain place, and I know I can do no wrong.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		And that level of coherence in a group can create magic.
		In fact, I was interviewed for a documentary a little while ago by People from Boston who are looking into the possibility that the Red Sox won the World Series because of this incredible zone that Red Sox fans got into.
		When they saw the possibility of actually winning the pennant and then winning the World Series, the whole city just became like one giant mind.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Here, here.
		What a wonderful example that is.
		I mean, again, talk about against all odds.
		It was just impossible.
		But night after night, the impossible kept happening.
		And you think it might have been that, a whole city in such alignment in their thinking.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, there have been a lot of studies looking at whether there is a home team advantage.
		And it is very, very clear.
		The statistics are very clear on this, that there is a home team advantage.
		So that's just on a very small scale.
		That the home crowd helps somehow.
		And there are some normal psychological reasons, but maybe it goes beyond that.
		The home crowd will help.
		And so if you now have a building coherence in a place like Boston and surrounding areas, could they help the team?
		I think the answer is yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I think clearly it is.
		In fact, I think the odds makers in Las Vegas, as a general rule, give about three points, and they don't give things for nothing.
		Three points to a team for a home field advantage.
		Something like that is fairly normal, so it's real.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's real, yeah.
		So what about a home team advantage for the entire planet?
		I think you're right when you said earlier that if there was something that was threatening the entire globe and everybody understood it, and now with modern media, we can get an enormous number of people all thinking the same thoughts at the same time.
		I think we could see the equivalent of a miracle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of a home team advantage for the planet.
		All right, Dean, hold tight.
		We're up here at the top of the hour.
		God, this is fascinating stuff.
		Dean Raden, Dr. Dean Raden is my guest.
		We're talking about consciousness, and we're talking about really beginning to talk about doing something about it all.
		And we'll pick up on that exact point when we get back from Manila in the Philippines.
		But it really doesn't matter.
		I'm Art Bell.
		It is indeed.
		Hi, everybody, from Manila.
		In the Philippines, Southeast Asia, I am Art Bell.
		And that song just said, there are times when all the world's asleep.
		Well, not really, but there are indeed times when very large portions of the world are asleep.
		And I wonder if that makes any difference at all, or if the conscious mind at times when it is awake, when it really is conscious, is producing a different result than when it's asleep.
		I suppose you could look at the eggs on one side of the world, where mainly everybody's asleep at a certain hour, versus the eggs on the other side of the world.
		I don't know.
		That's a question we'll ask.
		The whole thing is fascinating.
		Talk about a home team advantage.
		What happened in Boston was nigh on to impossible, and yet it happened, as Dean pointed out, kind of a home team advantage.
		We'll explore all of this further with Dean Radin in a moment.
unidentified		Dean Radin in a moment.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Once again, Dr. Dean Raden, Dr. Raden Hawley in Georgia sends the following fast blast, and it's exactly my concern.
		It says, hi, Art.
		So basically, if we get everyone on the planet convinced that global warming is causing the planet to get hotter, and everyone is in the same place and worried all together, might it not be that we are heating the place up simply by thinking about it?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		We don't know how far to push, how far the push can go.
		In other words, all of the effects that we see in the Global Consciousness Project are changes in order, changes in statistical order.
		So these are not gigantic, we're not pushing mountains around.
		We're pushing around order.
		Conceivably, if given that there's the butterfly effect in the weather, the chaotic effects in the weather, it may be the case that all of the concern would change weather patterns in some way.
		But whether it actually warm up the planet, literally, that's still unknown.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it may be unknown, but I've had this subtle feeling for some time that ultimately consciousness, directed consciousness, may be a greater power than atomic energy.
		I don't know.
		I've just had that feeling.
		And so what Holly says does concern me.
		In other words, science, most of science is now becoming convinced.
		For a long time, it was very controversial about whether or not we were actually getting global warming.
		That's kind of settling down to almost everybody believing it.
		And as more and more scientists come out with declarations that, yes, it's happening, yes, it's speeding up faster than we thought, then more and more people begin believing that.
		And perhaps like me, they're a little pessimistic.
		And there you go.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it could feed on itself.
		It's possible.
		But as I said, whether the minds of people can cause the world literally to heat up, that's not so clear to me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Or conversely, whether we could cause it to cool down.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I think collectively we can tweak it.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		We can push it in various ways, but for very large-scale effects, like pushing an asteroid out of orbit or something of that sort, that I'm not so sure about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't think we've given that one a try yet, and I hope we don't have to.
		But there may come a time, either with the global warming, which is beginning to get rather serious.
		I mean, look at what's going on in North America right now.
		West Coast of the U.S. are having power brownouts, and everybody's worried about power and the temperatures and all the rest of it.
		It's beginning to get rather serious, and if too many more years go by and it keeps increasing at the present rate, it's going to get very serious.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah.
		And perhaps one of the biggest dangers is that Things change slowly enough.
		I mean, even over the course of a couple of years, that's extremely fast in geological time.
		But on the human day-to-day work, it's not that fast.
		But we could find ourselves in an extremely serious trouble in a couple of years, and then we have to do something.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
		Exactly.
		That's what I'm concerned about.
		So it may come to the point where either myself or whoever is sitting in this chair may decide that it needs to be used because otherwise there's going to be mass trouble.
		Anyway, getting back to something else I mentioned in that little piece of bumper music, all the world's asleep.
		Well, of course, that doesn't occur.
		But indeed, about half the world at any given time probably is asleep.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So I wonder if there's have you looked at all at either 36 or 38 time zones, because there are a number of them are on the half hour.
		And anyway, you can separate the world into the waking half and the sleeping half.
		The sleeping half, in terms of time zones, actually occurs mostly over the Pacific Ocean.
		Because in terms of population, there's very, very little population on the portion of the Earth that covers the Pacific Ocean.
		In fact, from space, you can approach the planet and almost see only water if you come at it at the right angle.
		So we can separate then and look for what happens at the stroke of midnight in the time zones where there are people versus time zones with no people, and basically all of the effect is occurring in the time zones with people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So that's that suggests.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that really true?
		You said basically most of the effect.
		I mean, that's very significant.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I have a graph of that in the book, Entangled Minds.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		By now, a lot of people are going to want to get their hands on your book.
		So how do they do how?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		They can buy it off of your website.
		They'll end up on Amazon.
		Or they can go to entangledminds.com, and they'll still end up at Amazon or anywhere.
		I was in an airport the other day, and I saw it in an airport bookstore.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, really?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, so it's all sources where you can buy books.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'll tell you, when you see it in an airport bookstore, you know you've made it.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that was exciting.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sure it spread a big smile across your face to see that.
		It's, I believe, our future, and I sure would like to see more money and more effort being poured into this.
		You made a statement a little bit earlier that kind of blew me away.
		You said that entangled communication or communication using this method is now mainstream.
		Well, I didn't know that, Dean, so tell me more.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'm not an expert in quantum cryptography or in quantum computing, but I do know that certainly the U.S. government and most of the major computer manufacturers are very heavily investing in the next generation of computers, which are going to be quantum computers.
		And the reason why is because a quantum computer can operate at thousands to millions of times faster than current technologies.
		They compute not simply zeros and ones, but in effect they compute the whole range of possible answers all at once because they're working on wave-like structures rather than particle-like structures.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So a quantum computer then, Dean, would be able to, for example, give me an idea of the difference in what a quantum computer would do versus the fastest we've got at the moment.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I actually have a quote somewhere in my book.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I won't look it up at the moment, but it's something like a desktop quantum computer would be able to out-calculate every existing computer on the planet, just one.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		We're dealing with such a significant increase in computing power from the equivalent of a desktop quantum computer that everyone sees that as the obvious goal in mind.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		And actually, it is because of the interest in creating such a computer that advancements in entanglement research have advanced so quickly as well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry.
		I'm a real fan of Google, Dean.
		You can damn near get anything answered you want in the world on Google.
		But a quantum computer, one of the things a quantum computer might be able to do, correct me if I'm wrong, is to look elsewhere for answers to questions.
		And by that I mean look into time or even into another dimension for the answer to a question.
		Or is that too far out in Leftfield?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I don't know about another dimension, but possibility of looking through space and time.
		I mean, from a conventional point of view, I don't think you're going to get anybody working on quantum computers to admit that.
		But I do work in that field.
		And since quantum mechanics is not limited by space and time in the usual ways, I think it is conceivable that a quantum computer might be possible to build that is able to look through time.
		I mean, we know that we can do it.
		We can do it.
		And there are people who believe that the brain essentially is a type of quantum computer.
		It behaves a lot more like a quantum device than it does like a classical computer.
		And we know through experiments that I've done and other people have done that it is possible in the lab to show that we can respond about three to five seconds before a future event.
		This is response in an unconscious way.
		It's your body responding before your mind's aware of it.
		But we can demonstrate that now in the laboratory.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		God, that's incredible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So would you expect that as it's developed, a quantum computer would actually quite quickly surpass the human brain and perhaps even approach what we consider to be some form of consciousness?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I think it very well might.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		The thing is that if we can design a brain essentially, which is I think what a quantum computer will eventually be, once it becomes smart enough to be able to start designing itself, it will essentially evolve probably hundreds of thousands of times faster than we're evolving.
		In which case, you can almost imagine that the instant that the first quantum computer comes online, it will explode In terms of its intelligence, and immediately become a whole lot more intelligent than anybody who has ever lived on Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that potentially terribly dangerous?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, it could be dangerous.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I mean, it it could decide with there are a lot of science fiction stories based on this general notion that the computers decide that we are an annoyance and we have to go away now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Either an annoyance or we're ultimately perhaps suicidal or something.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, even if it were very carefully designed to do the very best for man, the best for man might turn out to be something that we're not all that pleased with.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		One would hope that you can build into such a thing the Asimov's three laws of robotics.
		But as Asimov wrote again and again, there are all kinds of tricks involved even in his three laws and reasons why computers would do something that doesn't make logical sense from our point of view.
		So it is a risk.
		But, you know, any advanced form of science is a risk.
		It's a risk to study consciousness deeply because, as you said, I think it's very likely the case that a significant understanding of consciousness would be far more powerful than atomic energy.
		Because if it turns out that consciousness actually is more fundamental than what we think of as the fundamental physical forces, then we're dealing with some element of creation itself.
		And that becomes a little tricky.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That actually takes me back to something very much earlier in the show, and I don't know if you heard the first hour or not, but the Pope actually made mention of the fact that he would rather not see us investigate the actual moment of creation, that there's great danger from his point of view in our investigating that moment of creation.
		Anything after that, as far as the Pope is concerned, is fine.
		But investigating the actual moment of creation, he says, is a no-no.
		I take it you would not agree with that point of view.
		Or do you?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, I guess I don't.
		I mean, as a scientist, I'm driven by curiosity.
		I always would rather know.
		I'd rather be cautious.
		And if there was any inkling that opening a door is the bad thing to do, I would think very hard about opening that door.
		But so far, we've done okay.
		And I think that in general, it's better to know than not to know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I suppose I don't want to crash any websites, but we should make the bulk of the audience know they can actually go and look at these eggs.
		They can actually log on to a website, and they can watch these eggs.
		There's kind of little noises associated with the eggs reaction from different parts of the world.
		And they're listed, and there's little dings and dongs.
		And every now and then they do go crazy.
		And I have a lot of people in the audience who watch these eggs, and I'll get emails saying, oh, my God, Art, they're going crazy.
		Is it worth doing that?
		In other words, is it worth sitting there and watching what's going on or monitoring what's going on and then looking for an event?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course, you can do that, but that's not the way that the project is run.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Because we're dealing with a large random system, there will be times when just it from the other direction where we first look at a world event and then we look at the data associated with that world event.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you're still looking at it all historically, really.
		So Mike in Auburn, Washington, who asks the obvious, ask your guest if any specific predictions have been made by these eggs.
		And of course, the answer to that is no, correct?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you ever think that the research into all of this, Dean, could get to the point where something more specific than you can now look at could be discerned?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I think almost certainly.
		When Roger Nelson gave this talk at this physics symposium, one of his last slides said that not only is this a unique database, that nothing like this has ever been created before, but we were surprised when Roger and a physicist named Peter Bansell were the ones who went back in the database, looked at the earthquakes, and found this two-hour precursor.
		They were very surprised to see that.
		So this is just one of probably lots of surprises that await us when we have enough analysts looking at the data and then try to understand what it's trying to tell us.
		In other words, it's as though we have a lot of data, we can correlate it against all kinds of things, stock market, you name it.
		We expect that there are many surprises waiting.
		Because anytime a new instrument is developed, and this essentially is a new type of instrument, it reveals a new element of the world, a new element of reality, and opens a new door of knowledge.
		So it's waiting for us to go through it, and we just need more people to go through it who are able to analyze it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're sure right about that.
		Terry in Wenatchee, Washington says, remember the Apollo 13 incident where those people in Cape Canaveral, Florida, literally stopped and prayed in public for the astronauts.
		The whole city came to a stop for a significant period of time with everyone focusing on the astronauts' safe return.
		Now, I don't know if your project goes back that far.
		I suspect it does not.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It does not, but coincidentally, the person in charge of bringing Apollo 13 back was Edgar Mitchell.
		Edgar Mitchell is the founder of the Institute of New Wetic Sciences.
		And I've spoken to him about this, and he feels that the actual probability of Apollo 13 coming back with the astronauts alive was very close to zero.
		There were just so many things that could have gone wrong.
		And it wasn't just Cape Carnaver that was praying.
		The whole world was alerted and was praying.
		He felt that it was the combined will of the world that made a near-zero probability actually happen.
		It basically was a kind of a probabilistic miracle that the astronauts were able to land safely on Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Something like Boston.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		In a sense, yes.
		We know how dangerous it is to take any shuttle or any spacecraft back into orbit, as we know from recent events.
		It's easy to just burn up.
		And yet these guys, who were in a very seriously crippled spacecraft, managed not only to swing around the moon, but to actually make it back in one piece.
		That is incredible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Small odds.
		Yeah, absolutely incredible.
		This whole thing is absolutely incredible.
		And it's so exciting.
		I don't see how you can keep from just sort of getting over-excited about the whole thing.
		I'm sure you have your moments.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Occasionally, yeah.
		I mean, it is my daily work.
		So I'm not going to say I'm blasé about it, but I find it certainly compelling enough to continue in the face of a lot of scientists who are not so happy with it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that alone is a very interesting question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You say a lot of scientists are not that happy about it?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's an element of strong conservatism in science in which this topic is considered to be too close to religion to be, or maybe to spirituality, to be comfortable.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Hold on, Dean.
		We're at a breakpoint here.
		So a lot of science out there is not so happy about this.
		Why?
		Because it's getting a little too close to religion.
		To faith?
		Isn't that fascinating?
		I didn't know that there was sort of another camp out there on this consciousness business from Manila in the Philippines, Southeast Asia.
		I'm Art Bell.
		Dean Raden.
		Dr. Dean Raden is my guest.
		We're talking about consciousness.
		And I guess we're also really talking about intent.
		And I've got a question about intent in a moment.
		And also the fact that science is apparently not so happy, or some of science is not so happy, about the work that Dean is doing and the work going on at Princeton.
		It is very controversial.
		And I suppose that in a way, as he mentioned, it kind of approaches religion.
		At any rate, we'll ask more about that.
		We'll also take calls at the top of the hour, all coming up in a moment.
		On this program, over the years, I've asked many doctors and many scientists if they believe in God or not.
		And I suppose I could ask Dean the same question.
		I think, though, the answer I'd get from Dean would not be such an affirmative, well, long pause and then no.
		Dean, why not?
		Let me give it a try.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I wouldn't say no.
		I would say I'm agnostic.
		One of the things that, in a sense, is required If you're going to call yourself a scientist, is skepticism.
		And skepticism, in its true sense, simply means doubt, that you are open-minded, but you doubt until you have some reason to change the doubt into belief.
		For me, the belief is based on data.
		I believe that some psychic effects are real because I see them often enough in the laboratory and I know the conditions under which I've seen them.
		But at the same token, you don't want to be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
		So the scientists that I'm talking about who don't like this topic are there are, of course, professional skeptical societies, but I don't really regard them as true skeptics.
		People who specialize in debunking and in debt.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, they're professional skeptics, Dean.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, this is what I mean, that they're deniers and debunkers as opposed to people who are actually asking the hard questions and be willing to accept it if they're true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		But let's move back to mainstream science.
		You're saying that some of mainstream science is not all that pleased with this line of research.
		And, you know, I do interview a lot of people, scientists, doctors, and in general, pressed, there'll be a long pause and they'll say, no, I don't believe in God.
		And I guess it's that group that's not so pleased, eh?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		No, I'm not sure it's that.
		I mean, I think someone can certainly be agnostic or an atheist and accept that there's something yet to be learned about consciousness that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with God.
		I expect, for example, that if you simply traced the meaning of spirituality over time, you would find that originally it was elemental spirits and other kinds of concepts that we someday may be able to actually figure out what they are in a scientific way.
		The whole history of science has been taking superstitions and ideas that are considered metaphysical or occult and slowly beginning to piece together a rational framework for understanding these things.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Isn't it almost the ultimate goal of science, one would think, to either prove or disprove what most people take as a matter of faith?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I'm not sure I'd put it in that way.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I would say more that the goal of science is to increase our knowledge about who and what we are and the world that we live in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, but that path inevitably leads, for example, a very good example is looking at the instant of creation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If we look and discern what that instant of creation really was, we probably either underscore everybody's faith or push some holes in it.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I think it would actually support people's faith because there certainly are some very well-trained scientists, including physicists, who are also extremely religious, and they have a very strong faith.
		And their faith is bolstered by what they learn in physics, because they would marvel at the amazing complexity and order that appears in the world.
		So I have plenty of scientists who are colleagues and friends who are very religious, and they don't see any incompatibility between their faith and what science is learning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You mentioned in your book, I think, one chapter it says here, a link between the atomic bomb and clairvoyance.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Explain that one.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Let's see.
		There's this guy named Sir J.J. Thompson at Cambridge University, who, among other things, was the one who measured the electron for the first time and got the Nobel Prize for it.
		He hired a man named Francis Aston as an assistant.
		And Aston, who was also a physicist, had read a book in 1908 called Occult Chemistry.
		And that book was written by the theosophists Annie Besant and Charles Leadbeater.
		So these are two clairvoyants who, in their clairvoyant vision, described the structure of the atom by shrinking themselves down in their mind to be able to literally look at an atom and draw it.
		And one of the things that they drew was what they called a new form of the element neon, which they called meta-neon, because it wasn't quite like what they imagined neon was supposed to be.
		And they said that this metaneon had an atomic weight of 22.33.
		So Aston read this.
		Some years later, four years later, Aston actually discovered a substance at that atomic weight while analyzing neon gas.
		He also called it metaneon after what the theosophists had said.
		And he presented it in a paper to the British Association for the Advancement of Science.
		Later, his discovery was called an isotope.
		And he then got the Nobel Prize for discovering isotopes, namely elements that could have too many electrons.
		It became a key discovery about atomic structure, which many years later became absolutely central in the development of the atomic bomb.
		If there weren't isotopes, you can't have an atomic bomb.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So this is a case where if it wasn't for the clairvoyant description of metaneon, Aston may not have discovered isotopes, in which case we won't have atomic bombs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Also this, and I'm really, really interested in this, toward the end of your book, you have a drawing.
		Of course, Joe McMonagall is a remote viewer.
		I've interviewed him any number of times here on the program.
		And we've talked many times about not just remote viewing, but remote influencing.
		Now, I guess right now we think of a single mind as, I don't know, not that strong an influence on anything.
		Perhaps able to influence a non-random computer or something like that.
		But that's about it.
		Not, as you pointed out earlier, to move mountains or something like that.
		However, there is a drawing of a mind amplification device.
		Now, can you explain what such a device do you believe it to be possible?
		And if so, can you explain how it might work, how it might be constructed?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, this is part of a long-term project on looking at the role of intention in the behavior of physical systems.
		And if it turns out that mind and matter are actually connected in some way, which I believe the evidence suggests it is, then conceivably it should be able to be possible to use that to do various tasks.
		I mean, like a silly task would be to create a psychic garage door opener.
		But nevertheless, a task like that, where you have an intention-operated switch.
		So what kind of a physical system would become the detector of this intention?
		And by the way, it only makes sense if it can somehow be tuned to an individual, because otherwise everybody would be opening your garage door.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		In addition, it has to be able to discriminate between a frivolous thought and a thought in which you really mean it.
		So there has to be some degree of intelligence in terms of the detector of the intention.
		So I didn't know how to build one of these, and I had the opportunity to work with Joe for about a year in which, as you may know, the way that Joe works is he doesn't want to know anything in advance because otherwise it'll tend to bias what he says.
		So I simply targeted him on future technologies that did this.
		A future technology, not too far in the future because I wouldn't understand it, but more like prototypes of working intention switches that I wanted him to then draw.
		And so he did this.
		I have a large file full of drawings and descriptions of technologies which are in the near-term future in which these intention switches are being made.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		That would require not only a discerning receiver to activate a switch, it would also require, perhaps, some kind of amplification device or what we would think of as a transmitter to aid the brain in transmitting a stronger signal.
		Yes?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Not so much on the brain side.
		It's more on the receiving side.
		The detector itself takes advantage of quantum properties and ways of manipulating the results of quantum events in slightly new ways.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Question.
		Would the receiver, Dr. Raden, be tuned to the transmitter or the human brain simply by some prior association?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		At least in these prototype devices, my understanding of what Joe has written is that it would have to be trained in the same way that a voice recognition system might need to be trained.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So there is an association that's formed, much like with IBM, and then from that point forward, you would essentially be tuned, the receiver would be tuned to that particular brain.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, yes, to the brain, but more towards the intention itself.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It's not the brain so much as the mind, the mind of the intender.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		All right, intention.
		Let me stick for just one moment with intention.
		I interview people like Dr. Evelyn Paglini.
		She is a witch.
		And when I have her on the program, Dr. Raden, she talks all the time about the importance of intention.
		You know, they make all kinds of claims that a witch can do this or a witch can do that or actually cast a spell on somebody and that it's all wrapped around intention.
		And I'm sure this is something that mainstream science certainly scoffs at a lot.
		But it sure is in the same ballpark, if you'll pardon the expression, as what you've been talking about tonight.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, intention and attention seem to be the key.
		That's true.
		When you look at the, say, Patanjali's Yoga Sutras written over 5,000 years ago, the whole process of meditation is essentially an attention training process.
		And the wisdom of the yogic masters basically said that if you learn to train your attention to a certain degree, eventually you learn how to calm your mind and your body becomes calm.
		That's like stage one.
		The second stage is you begin to run in the clairvoyance.
		When you are sufficiently still enough mind, you run into clairvoyance.
		When you get further down the line, you begin not only to adjust your at tension, but you begin to put a little bit of intention in it as well.
		And it's at that stage where you start to get claims of things like levitation and invisibility and the other so-called cities.
		So in the laboratory, at least, we haven't gotten to the point where we're able to see those kinds of effects.
		But we do ask people to apply their attention and intention, and that's where we get interesting effects in both distant healing and with random number generators.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is there any difference between Art Bell getting several million people to concentrate on one particular outcome, weather-related or whatever it might be, and a group of people praying?
		See, here we go again.
		We're beginning to get back to religion a little bit.
		But is there any difference between this intent work that we're doing and prayer?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		There's two general categories of prayer.
		One is you intend for something to happen.
		It's you wishing.
		The other one is thy will be done type of prayer, in which case you're wishing for the greatest good for all without having a specific outcome in mind.
		And people who do distant prayer for healing in particular oftentimes will say that the thy will be done prayer seems to work better than I wish this to happen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is there any science to support that?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Not too much yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, I know there's been a whole bunch of experiments done that claim that prayer with intent for somebody to heal has been shown again and again and again to honestly work compared to a random sample.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		The clinical trials are actually, the jury is out, I would say.
		Some of those studies have worked.
		There are two large studies recently, one at Duke University and one at Harvard University, that did not work.
		There are hand-waving explanations perhaps as to why they didn't work, but the fact is that professional prayers were told to pray for certain people and they did not get significantly better.
		In fact, at the study in Harvard, the people who were being prayed for and they were told that they were being prayed for, they did significantly worse.
		So the jury is out when it comes to praying for health.
		But when you come into the laboratory under much better controlled conditions, the jury is in when it comes to whether or not one person's intention can affect another person's physiology.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the answer to that is yes.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		The answer to that is yes.
		So we don't know yet how to get from one person intending towards another's physiology to praying for somebody else's health outcome.
		That's still a leap we don't know how to do yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is such a fascinating field.
		And again, you know, you made that statement about communications already being mainstream.
		You see, I just didn't know that.
		I had no idea that anybody was actually using quantum technology to attempt secure communication of any kind.
		And you're saying that's mainstream.
		I sure would love to know what's going on.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's big.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I'm sure you can find a guest who will talk your ear off on that one.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can you suggest somebody?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Let me work on it a little bit.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I'd appreciate anything in the field.
		I had no idea that was going on, and certainly I don't believe it's been talked about on this program.
		I can imagine that it would work, but I had no idea that it was working.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it is working.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's something that our intelligence agencies certainly would be all over.
		If you can imagine, communication with no key whatsoever, no possibility of interception, no possibility of decryption.
		That's just mind-blowing.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		They are the main funders of this research.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course.
		Wow.
		I learned something on this program all the time.
		Do you happen to know who's doing the main funding?
		Is it CIA, NSA, who's doing this?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		You name it.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		They're all funding it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They're all funding it, huh?
		Yep.
		Are we leading the world?
		Do you happen to know, Dr. Raden, in this field, or are we playing catch-up?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I think we're probably on par, although most of the basic research is coming out of Europe on this.
		When it comes to where we are in terms of technology, I don't know.
		I'm not an expert enough in that area to know.
		But when you look in journals like Science and Nature and Physical Review and the other main journals, a lot of the basic research is coming out of Europe on quantum technologies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Worrisome, actually.
		When you look at other areas of science, the United States, because of our you know, we're a Christian nation, there's no doubt about it.
		And for example, in genetic research, we've drawn a lot of lines in the sand that we're not allowing people to pass.
		In Europe, they're readily going across those lines.
		I guess it doesn't necessarily hit this field, but it's hitting other fields of science, and Europe is going nuts.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		And it is definitely hitting the field that I'm in as well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, is it?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		In the United States today, there is not a single active academic lab left.
		Not one.
		So the Princeton lab is basically in retirement now.
		There are no other laboratories that are devoted to this topic in the United States within academia.
		There are a handful of professors who are interested and in a few cases teaching courses, but that's quite different than a laboratory.
		The whole thing is in Europe now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Hold on.
		We're at the top of the hour.
		Dr. Dean Raden is my guest, and you're now welcome to line up on the lines because we're going to open the lines and allow you to ask Dr. Raden questions.
		My God, if you don't have questions after hearing all of this, you just have not been listening.
		From the High Rise, located in Southeast Asia, specifically Manila, Philippines, I'm Mark Bell.
		This is Coast to Coast AM.
		Worldwide, indeed.
		Good evening, good morning, good afternoon, whatever it may be.
		It certainly is my honor and privilege to be escorting you through the weekend, and what a great weekend this has been.
		Kind of a nice welcome back.
		Dr. Dean Raden is my guest, and it just simply does not get any more fascinating than this.
		There's no question about it.
		My God, this is fascinating stuff.
		Entangled Minds is the doctor's new book, and I heartily suggest that you make your way to Amazon one way or the other and collect it for yourself quickly, because I have a feeling this is our future one way or the other.
		So in a moment, we're going to open the phone lines, and it's all you and Dr. Dean Rayton.
		I'm Art Bell.
		Once again, Dr. Dean Raden.
		Hi, Mark Bell.
		Hi there.
		Doctor, just before we begin on the lines here, I would like to say to you that, look, even though I'm not presently doing these experiments, if you decide that you would like to try some kind of controlled experiment, I am at your disposal.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Okay, that's a very generous offer, and I will keep it in mind.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Please do.
		I guess you're kind of cautious the way I am with regard to these experiments.
		In fact, you sound every bit as cautious as I am, if not more so.
		Is that so?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I have a healthy respect for what we're dealing with, yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's go to the phones and see what people have to say.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wildcard line, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Bell.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hey, greetings from Las Vegas, Nevada, Art.
		It's B.D. from LV.
		Hey, You know, as far as Dean goes, man, it's like from what he's saying, you know, with this Project 51 hits, it seems like that we're transmitting something from our brains, which may potentially lead us to believe that the mind-brain system can act as a transmitter-receiver of particular waveforms and affect these random number generators.
		And, you know, it goes back to the pineal gland, the Hindus, and the Pineal Gland started producing DMT at 48 days.
		48 days, 3,000 years ago, stated that that's when the reincarnation started taking place.
		And, you know, we're starting to verify all these things here in the 90s.
		I mean, are we getting to a tipping point, I guess, is my question?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, a tipping point.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are we at some kind of tipping point, Dean?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		A tipping point.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know.
		I didn't quite grasp that fully myself.
		But, you know, some kind of turning point.
		we're I guess that's almost fair to say.
		I mean, with what you've for example, I note that it's been some time since you and I talked, and the first time we talked and the second time, Dean, you were very, very tentative about a lot of this.
		This time, I listened to you carefully, and you're not as tentative as you were.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, we have a lot more data.
		I mean, it basically all comes down to what is the data trying to tell us.
		And the data has continued to compound in such a way that the possibility that it's a mistake or chance is becoming vanishingly small.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		300,000 to 1, that's vanishingly small, aren't it?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It'll still fluctuate here and there.
		It'll go up and down a little bit, but it's pretty much continually been going in the direction where at some point we have to entertain some other hypothesis.
		Let's put it that way.
		Something else is going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's move east of the Rockies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Bellheim.
unidentified		Hello, this is Jacob from Chanute, Kansas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		How you doing, Art?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just fine, Jacob.
unidentified		Pleasure to speak with you guys.
		My question is, in National Geographic, they had an article about the Mayan 2012 calendar and how they speak on the change of our consciousness in that turn because we're coming to a 25,000 and 5,000-year celestial event.
		I was wondering if you've studied or looked into any of that.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I've read a book or two, but I'm certainly not an expert in that area.
		The only thing which actually is relevant to the work that I've studied is the possibility that there is something peculiar about the galactic center in relationship to psychic ability.
		And that was actually a major surprise, even to the person who discovered it.
		And the discovery basically says that when the it has to do with the local sidereal time and psi performance in laboratory tests.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, what about this?
		The Mayan calendar, of course, ends in 2012.
		And on this program and any other program like it, we get endless references to 2012.
		So there is an expectation out there, Dr. Raden, that something's going to happen in 2012.
		If you look at this whole consciousness thing, that may turn into some intent that will cause something to happen in 2012.
		Any worry about that?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		There's always some worry that there's a self-fulfilling prophecy that goes on.
		But on the other hand, think about all of the concern about Y2K.
		And Y2K came and went without a hitch.
		Now, there was a lot of work in the computer business to make sure that it wasn't going to be a problem.
		But in this particular case, I wouldn't be too surprised if 2012 December 21st is it, if it comes and goes without a hitch also.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turns out to be another Y2K.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We can hope that.
		A lot of people do not realize the billions of dollars that were spent.
		They went and said, oh, what a total non-event.
		Well, one of the reasons it was a non-event was a lot of people did a whole lot of work and spent a whole lot of money to make it so.
		That's right.
		Yeah, for 2212.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		For 2012, there's nothing that we can do to prevent the alignment that is predicted to take place, in which case, maybe it won't be like Y2K.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Cross fingers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and North Bell High.
unidentified		Hi, this is John in Seattle.
		Hi, John.
		When Mr. Raden was on back in May 4th, it was my first knowing that there were these random generator eggs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		And I had in the back of my head kind of a desire to see if I could affect these generators.
		And, you know, really sparked an experience in my head.
		About three days, I'm guessing, after he was on, probably about 1 a.m. plus or minus, I'd been to the bathroom after break, and I came back to my table where I take notes.
		And instead of sitting down, I just turned and put one hand on the table.
		And it's like my consciousness turned a little bit, and I found myself like standing in the head of a giant entity.
		And the earth came out of his chest, and the word one flowed from his mouth across the earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's quite an experience.
		I have no idea what it means in the larger scheme of things, but it's an interesting experience.
		There is, I suppose, one thing somebody could do.
		Dr. Raden, it's possible to go to Google.
		I guess you could tell everybody how to go see the eggs, but if you go and you put in Princeton Space Eggs, it'll get you there.
		You'll eventually see them.
		Would it be possible are the eggs now marked geographically?
		Do we know where each one is?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yep.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are they actually marked on the screen display that you get?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Not on the screen display I think you're talking about is an overall display of behavior around the world.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		But there is a map that you can see where they're coming from if you go a little bit deeper into it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I guess what I'm asking is, could you go to the egg that is most regional for you and sit there and have a little fun and try to affect that particular egg?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		No.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		No, you can't get feedback like that in real time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		All right.
		I just thought I'd ask.
		There is, of course, that computer program we've referenced previously On this program that I have that I absolutely love, the one in which you can bring down a picture of the Earth, for example, and then random noise on the other side and try to get either the random noise or the earth to materialize.
		And I wish there was a way to get that distributed to more people.
		Is there, by the way, is that still available?
		Do you know?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		I don't think it's still available.
		I can give a plug to a company that just came out with a new experiment.
		It's called Cygenics.
		I'm not affiliated with these folks at all, but it's an interesting site.
		It's P-S-I-G-E-N-I-C-S, cygenics.com.
		And it actually is a random number generator that runs in software.
		And the fellow who developed it has a patent for this process.
		It's an interesting patent.
		So he's created what amounts to a similar experiment like you'd find at the Pear Lab, but you can download it and run it on your PC.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How cool is that?
		All right, I'll be on that as soon as I'm done here.
		First time, CallerLine, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden in North Bellheim.
unidentified		Yes.
		Hello.
		How are you gentlemen doing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Quite well, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Thank you.
		I have a theory to add to the discussion of mass conscious and if it is in fact an energy like we think of other energies.
		You were talking earlier a bit on the localization of these random generators and if they in fact or if in fact the phenomenon that is going on is that.
		But you guys pretty much have stated it, but I believe this energy, this mass conscious energy, undergoes an inverse square law, like how light energy is more prominent at source and it spreads out and dissipates at greater distances.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't think that's true.
		Doctor, you know, in a traditional transmitter, like an AM or an FM transmitter, what that caller said is certainly true.
		It's very, very strong at the source and then spreads out and becomes measurably weaker as it covers more geography.
		That does not seem to be true, or does it?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's an interesting question because there is some evidence that these effects drop off with distance.
		Yeah, I actually discussed that evidence in Entangled Minds because while it is very clear that something like remote viewing can work over distance of the planet, well, radio can work across the distance of the planet as well.
		You know, there are ways of getting signals in very far distances.
		And the fact is that we really haven't tested the non-locality beyond from about here to halfway to the moon, which is about as far as we've gone when Edgar Mitchell did a test coming back from the moon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Correct.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		So there's a couple of experiments looking at distance.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		And while it's not exactly inverse square, there does appear to be a decline.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, that would suggest, if true, that it is kind of like RF in a sense, that it does dissipate with distance.
		And that would also I don't know.
		It seems to me it would suggest to me that it is using a specific medium in which to communicate.
		This is a surprise.
		What you're saying right now is a gigantic surprise to me.
		I didn't expect that.
		I thought that across time and distance, there was no discernible lessening of this.
		I'm going to call it a signal.
		I don't know if that's right or wrong, but whatever.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		It is also true that at least within the experiments on precognition, that there is a falloff in accuracy with increased time.
		So both in time and space, the assumption for a long time was that this is completely non-local and that it is the same everywhere.
		But in looking, I've sifted through the data pretty significantly to see if I could find evidence for that or against it.
		And to my surprise, too, I found that there actually is some reason to believe that it does drop off, which is great because it means that there's a way to get a handle on what's happening physically.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's exactly where I was going to be going.
		In other words, some way to measure its frequency or the medium through which this communication is occurring.
		Ultimately, it would say that, wouldn't it?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
		It may be, however, that in the case of precognition, that the reason for a drop-off is because of the branching probabilities that occur.
		One second from now, the world is very likely to be the same.
		Ten seconds from now, if you try to predict it, it's going to be a little bit different.
		two hours from now, it's going to be extremely different.
		And the reason for these differences is because at each stage, if you imagine every atom could go in any different direction...
		That's right.
		And so the future simply becomes a much more probabilistic mush as the further out you go.
		And by the same token, the reason for the inverse square law is basically the geometry.
		It's a geometric issue.
		If you imagine signals spreading out like a sphere, the signal is dropping off because the surface of the sphere keeps getting bigger and bigger.
		And so there may be something like that, maybe a geometric way of thinking about how these things work.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, as you throw a rock into the water, you get a ripple.
		And that ripple, of course, as it approaches the shore, if it's a pretty good distance, begins to dissipate.
		Same idea?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and also the height of the ripple.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		The height of the ripple is the largest where the rock went in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		And then the amplitude of the ripple will dissipate because of friction and inertia and things of that sort.
		That one is somewhat less, has less to do with the geometry of the situation and more to do with physical forces that impede it.
		I don't think there's something like that that's happening here, but it's more that there may be a geometrical reason why these effects drop off.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Weill Carline, you are on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Valheim.
unidentified		Hi.
unidentified		Good afternoon in your time zone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good afternoon.
unidentified		Yes.
		Mr. Reiden, I was wondering if you really knew about the experiments in the R Soviet Union where they used a electrocephalogram, which is basically a medical device to read microvolts off the human mind, which doctors use.
		It's like a oscilloscope for the mind.
		And what they did is they put on a female, adult, and put her in one location, and then thousands of miles away, they put her child in another location.
		They induced pain into that children by a little pinprick, and the mother registered on the scope as feeling the pain of the child.
		Now, this is thousands of miles in distance where they conducted this test.
		And what was really weird about the test is not only that she read the pain, she felt the pain in her mind of the child being influenced with pain, but the speed and what was registered was faster than the speed of light.
		So the mind is actually transferring and receiving information quicker than the speed of light, which really is quite curious to me because Einstein's theory sort of blows that out of the water.
		That's true.
		But we're all somehow connected.
		They did this with animals too as well.
		They took a small newborn of one animal, I think it was a rabbit, I believe, and they separated it to an animal.
		And again, the mother that produced that offspring registered on the EEG as feeling, inducing the pain that she experienced.
		So with that in mind, I mean, your machines could be picking up not only humans, but maybe an economic disaster in the ocean where maybe animals are dying in mass numbers.
		We have mass extinctions happening on this planet in certain areas, and you'd be picking up those vibes too as well if we have a mass killing of some species due to environmental catastrophes and stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I suppose it could be, Doctor?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there's maybe 20 studies looking at these EEG types of experiments where two people are monitored and you do some sort of stimulus on one and measure what's happening at the other.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		And most of these experiments have worked.
unidentified		It's true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And what about his reference to the fact that it's I'm not sure that they've actually measured it, but is it in fact faster than the speed of light?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think what he's referring to is that sometimes the signal is seen in the receiver's brain or in their body before it actually occurs for the sender.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that certainly would be faster than the speed of light.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That would require some sort of superluminal signaling.
		And by the way, at this physics conference that I was at at the University of San Diego for forever, basically, physicists have said that it's impossible to do superluminal signaling because of something called Eberhard's theorem.
		It's a theorem which says you can't do this.
		And yet a physicist there made a presentation saying he thinks there may be a way to get around Eberhard's theorem and actually get a superluminal signal that goes backwards in time by 50 microseconds.
		And that blew us away because this is a mainstream physicist making a prediction that could be tested.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh my God.
		All right.
		Doctor, hold on.
		Dr. Dean Radin is my guest.
		I'm Art Bell from Manila in the Philippines.
		This is one fascinating program.
		Whether it's one millisecond or 50 milliseconds, if it's sent...
		If it's actually sent before the occurrence, then everything, just everything we know or we thought we knew about the laws of the universe in which we live is absolutely incorrect.
		We'll be back.
		I suppose even the white bird alone in her cage is expressing intent, right?
		The intent to be free, to fly or die.
		That's certainly intent.
		I don't know that a bird has the same form of consciousness that we do, but I've long suspected it to be possible.
		My guest is Dr. Dean Raden.
		We're talking about the experiments that have gone on at Princeton.
		We're talking about his work.
		And, of course, he's got a book, and I heartily suggest that you buy it.
		It's called The Conscious Universe.
		You can go to amazon.com, probably your ultimate destination, and get it again, called The Conscious Universe, something you want to investigate right away.
		Dean Radin will be back in a moment.
		Once again, Dr. Dean Raden.
		Dr. Raden, I'm going to ask this.
		I think I know the answer, but I'm going to ask on behalf of Adam in Alabama anyway.
		He asks a question for Dr. Raden.
		Does he know of any schools actively working on these topics that, well, might perhaps be looking for some grad students?
		Thank you.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, there are two universities.
		Gary Schwartz, of course, at the University of Arizona in Tucson, has a small program on mediumship research.
		And Bruce Grayson at the University of Virginia in Charlottesville has a program on survival research, including things like reincarnation and near-death experience.
		But that's it as far as I know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's sad.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, there are other locations like the Institute of Transpersonal Psychology and there's Saybrook Institute, both of which are in Northern California.
		But if someone is looking to be a graduate student and essentially become an apprentice and have mentors that can show them how to do things in the laboratory, there is no place, not in the United States.
		How is that?
		In England and Scotland, there are a half a dozen universities with multiple faculty and multiple graduate students.
		I'm talking about the University of Edinburgh in particular and also the University of Northampton in England.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So then even as an inquiring student, you might have to end up going to Europe is the answer.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Most students who are interested in this do end up in Europe, yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		On the international line, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Bell.
		Good morning or whatever.
unidentified		Morning, Dr. Raden.
		I did some experiments way back when for downhole tools, you know, for oil wells, and we used neutron detectors and gamma-ray detectors.
		And it was a prototype, and I was the only one that could make it work.
		We were just measurement the difference between chlorine and hydrogen using a neutron source.
		Every time I walked up to it, it would work.
		Others, it didn't work.
		Everybody else is just tearing their hair out because the thing wouldn't work.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That's like the opposite of Murphy's law.
unidentified		No, when you stick things downhole, you're sticking it in Murphy's mother's kitchen oven.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, how about this?
		How about cold fusion?
		Now, there's an interesting example.
		I think Paul and Flashman, they ended up going to Europe, but a number of universities tried to get cold fusion to work, and in some cases, they did get it to work, but in many other cases, they didn't.
		And one almost has to wonder if intent didn't have something to do with the whole thing.
unidentified		Well, with the tools that we were working with, you know, we were just basically detecting different speeds of neutrons and ratios of them.
		But for some reason, if somebody else tried to run this tool, it wouldn't work.
		And as soon as I walked up to it and said, you know, hey, what's wrong, little baby?
		And bang, you know, it would work.
		And I had PhDs tearing their hair out.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Are you good with other machines as well?
unidentified		Yeah, I'm good with electronics and the rest.
		Sometimes it seems like at times I can make things work, you know, just by kind of, you know, what's wrong?
		Oh, okay.
		And then all of a sudden, bang, it works, and everybody else just kind of, they don't know.
		Doing a stint fixing TVs way back when, in my apprenticeship, I had guys that say, well, what's wrong with this TV?
		And he wouldn't know, and I'd kind of just walk by to go outside and have a smoke, and I'd just kind of, oh, look at this.
		And about half an hour later, he'd be cursing and swearing because that was exactly the problem.
		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The moment he said that, the cold fusion thing popped into my mind, Doctor.
		They really had a problem with that.
		The people, it seems, that really wanted it to work got results.
		The people who were in doubt or very skeptical all bombed out.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, if the research on mind-matter interaction effects is true, and I believe it is true, it suggests that intention plays a role in any experiment, every experiment.
		So in the case of having machines work and not work, there's this famous anecdote about Wolfgang Pauli, the famous quantum physicist, who was known as being one of the top theorists in the world, but he had a reputation that whenever he came near a laboratory, no experiment would work.
		Things would break.
		And so there's both people who have the equivalent of a green thumb and people who have the equivalent of a black thumb when it comes to equipment.
		And in this case, the caller apparently had a green thumb.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, that's so true.
		It really is true.
		Something we don't understand, but your field may impart an understanding in all of this soon enough.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Bell.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hi, guys.
		David from Washington, D.C. Yes, David.
		I've got a couple questions, but the throwaway is the attenuation effect makes me wonder the relationship to dark matter.
		But my real question has to do with your comment last night about our being a warrior species and a comment that Dr. Paglini made one time about witches fighting it out on Lammis night during World War II.
		So my question for Dr. Radon is what happens when you have two groups that are diametrically opposed in their intention and they clash?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you have the Mideast.
		I don't know.
		Dr. Raden, any comments?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Well, if we were able to visualize the intention itself, I imagine it might look like something like waves or a distortion in the medium in which we live or something of that sort, like a disturbance in the forest from Star Wars.
		Ideally, they would cancel each other out, and so nothing would happen.
		But in the less than ideal case, they might interfere in a constructive way and create havoc.
		It would not be a pretty sight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it wouldn't.
		Well, what's bothered me about this, Doctor, is that those in the world, for example, who really wish us ill and would plow airplanes into buildings or be willing to kill themselves to take some of us out or whatever have an extremely strong intent.
		And, of course, we're just sort of whistling in the wind here, going along hoping for no terrorism or no trouble.
		But the intent on the part of somebody who's willing to give their life for their cause is going to be, strength-wise, much stronger than ours.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That's probably correct.
		And the reaction to that is, I think as someone said in the beginning of the Second World War, that once you awaken the sleeping tiger, you're in trouble.
		So in other words, if the intention of the United States is aroused and we become coherent, that's a massively powerful force.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
		Unfortunately, the history of the United States becoming a tiger is not until we've been attacked.
		And, of course, for example, Pearl Harbor being attacked was awful.
		It was horrible.
		But it wasn't the end of the world.
		Now we're beginning to get hold of these weapons that, when used, could conceivably be the end of the world.
		So by the time we make it to a dangerous point, that by the time we're actually attacked, it's too late.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I hope not.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I hope not, too.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Bell.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hi.
		I had one question about does Dr. Raden believe that the prophets' predictions of, say, the Bible or the Koran or any other religious text, would that have anything to do with the events that are happening now?
		And I think you just kind of covered that a little bit.
		But like say the prophets' predictions coming true because of people wanting the end of the world, because of say the prophecy of a promised land or after the end of time, so to speak, they would be promised virgins or whatever.
		I don't know what I'm trying to say there, but say enough people jumping into one religion or would that influence the sea of consciousness, so to speak?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I think that's a very good question.
		I think I know what you're talking about.
		I think the doctor does too.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, the issue about very long-term precognition is a tricky one because, as I mentioned before, from now until later, however long later is, there's so many possible paths to get from here to there that it becomes very difficult to predict beyond a matter of a couple of days.
		On the other hand, if there is something like a certain current of history that has a certain extremely strong endpoint to it, that it's conceivable that somebody might be able to predict, even thousands of years ahead, something that has this very, very strong attractor at the end.
		In which case, you can make a plausibility case for why some prophets may have predictions of some important endpoint, but they may not actually get the interpretation of it right.
		In other words, they get that something very important is coming, but they don't know exactly what it's going to be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Remote viewers like Joe McMonagall, are they using the same, for lack of a better word, ether, the same mode of transmission that's ultimately received by the eggs?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		We don't know enough to be able to answer that question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It almost seems that way, because they, of course, remote viewers claim that they can look and discern answers and things without respect to time past, present, or future.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		The whole point of the book, Entangled Minds, is addressing the issue of what sort of medium is necessary in order to have remote viewing and mind-matter interaction and precognition and all of the other phenomena.
		What is necessary?
		And the conclusion of the book is basically that a classical sense, a classical universe, doesn't do it.
		You can't have any kind of psychic phenomena if you're dealing with a fixed space and fixed time, or absolute space and absolute time, a Newtonian type of world.
		You need a different kind of underlying world in order to support these phenomena.
		And the world that looks like it's compatible with psi is the holistic environment that quantum mechanics suggests and some experiments now begin to show.
		So in a holistic medium, one way of thinking of it is as though we live in this gigantic bowl of jello in which everything actually is all connected, like the old concept of an ether, in a sense.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		If a disturbance actually occurs in the ether, it ripples out.
		It'll ripple through the whole thing, and everything is affected.
		So the only difference here is that for intention becomes a ripple, and it affects the entire universe.
		And vice versa, the entire universe is also affecting you back.
		So that's the kind of model that is both compatible with physics as we know it and becomes compatible with these kinds of consciousness phenomena.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If only we had the eggs working back prior to World War II and Hitler, and we could have looked at all of that, if only.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		First time caller line, you're on the air with Dr. Dean Raden and Art Bell High.
unidentified		Hi, how are you?
		My name is Matthew.
		And first of all, before I get to my question with Dr. Raden, I want to speak for just one second to all the aspiring graduate students out there.
		Ladies and gentlemen, I feel your pain, but there are more graduate programs out there than you think.
		You just have to get creative in finding a, quote, and I hope you'll forgive me, mainstream, more common graduate program and getting them to fund your fancy ideas.
		So for example, I'm driving across the country on my way to medical school, and I'm going to start an MD PhD program in neuroscience.
		And I picked a school that has a very good neuroimaging program.
		Now, I'm probably going to do my PhD work and get my training in interventional radiology, really trying to increase the resolution of how we can resolve signals in the brain.
		But I've been working towards the things that you've been talking about, Dr. Raden, for better or for worse, since I was probably 14 or 15 years old and I really started thinking about this stuff.
		But there really are ways out there where you don't have to just beg DARPA for funding, which is what I did for the last couple of years before I managed to get into a different program.
		Which brings me to my question for Dr. Raden.
		So I've already touched on it a little bit.
		If we're going to figure out how consciousness is affecting anything, or if there is a way that consciousness is affecting things on a larger scale, I feel like we need a better idea of what consciousness is.
		And in order to kind of quantify how, you know, a thought or an intention, so to speak, can actually affect something in any level and how we can, you know, if we've got some kind of random generating quantum device that we can, you know, statistically study and say, oh, well, something is definitely happening.
		Well, how can we demonstrate that impulse on an individual personal level?
		I want to work on that stuff.
		And I'm hoping that you can offer me some insight as I move forward and start thinking about the things I want to study in the next, I don't know, 10, 15 years on where you think the actual aspect might be, or if you have any insights to that.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		These are all very good questions.
		And actually, I completely agree with your strategy.
		Get mainstream degrees and mainstream topics and tune your dissertation or thesis work towards this area.
		Because while there are a lot of scientists who don't want to deal with this area, in graduate school, there's a lot more flexibility on what you can actually study.
		And more and more scientists are becoming open to the possibility that there's really something interesting going on here.
		So that is a very good strategy.
		In terms of what to study, there are now about a half a dozen studies looking at functional MRI to localize in the brain through the oxygenated blood where these effects are actually occurring.
		I talk about some of them in Entangled Minds, and there are other documents, other articles you can find.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How much luck are we having with that?
		What are we seeing in the brain?
		Are we beginning to center on the areas that are being affected?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Yes.
		I mean, for presentiment effects, these are unconscious prediction effects.
		If the upcoming target is an emotional target, then the amygdala of the brain lights up, and you can see it in the fMRI.
		If you have an experiment where you have two people isolated and you stimulate one with a light flash, the occipital lobe of the receiver lights up.
		And this is extremely important to know because it gives us a clue as to what is happening on the receiving side of these forms of signals.
		I put signals in quotes because we're not really dealing with signals.
		But by looking in the brain and looking in brain functioning on the receiving side, we can begin to piece apart what is actually happening.
		And this is all new within the past five years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Doctor, this is so fascinating.
		We could go on and do show after show after show on it, and I'm sure we will, and I'm sure we'll have you back.
		It's been a wonderful night.
		Your book, The Conscious Universe, as well as Entangled Minds.
		Entangled Minds is the latest, right?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's the one they should all be looking for at Amazon.com or whatever.
		You know, we're going to have to have you back.
		As I mentioned earlier, you were kind of tentative in the earlier interviews, but tonight you've been a lot more specific.
		So obviously, a lot has occurred in this field.
		Even with the limited amount of study that apparently has been going on, particularly in this country, there is a lot that's new.
		It's so exciting.
		I just cannot imagine that more...
		Obviously, people are attracted to it, but there's not more money pouring into it.
		And I guess if somebody's really interested, they can...
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		The easy way is dean at noetic, n-o-e-t-i-c.org.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Dean atic.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Dean at noetic.org.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that right?
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So if somebody's got some money they want to pour into this, no harm in asking.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Send me an email.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Send you an email.
		And you're obviously out front on all this.
		So Dr. Raden, thank you for being on the program.
		Thank you for being such a light in the night.
dean radin ▲ ● ▼		Thank you so much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good night, my friend.
		All right, there is Dr. Dean Raden.
		And as you all know, this is certainly one of my favorite topics in all the world.
		And after tonight, it's all the more my favorite.
		It has been my pleasure, my honor, to be with you throughout this weekend.
		I look forward to doing the same next weekend and every weekend thereafter from all the way from Manila.
		Manila in the Philippines, Southeast Asia.
		It is amazing.
		It is a very small world.

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