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March 12, 2005 - Art Bell
02:54:23
Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Peter Novak - Binary Soul Doctrine - Willie Nelson - Alternative Fuels
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Time Text
This is a test.
The High Desert in the great American Southwest I bid you all good evening, good morning,
afternoon whatever the case may be in your time zone All of them covered by this program, Close to Coast AM.
I'm Art Bell, here to escort you through the weekend.
My honor and pleasure to do so.
It's going to be a great weekend, folks.
Absolutely great.
A little breaking news for you.
A flaming object was spotted streaking through the Saturday night sky out across western Oregon.
Now the impact... Yes, impact.
So it hit the ground.
Hurt all the way from Salem to Medford, according to various reports.
A 3.3 coincidental question mark earthquake in Washington newspapers.
Across the western half of the state.
And KPTV, we're getting phone calls from people who saw the object summer Jensen of Portland said while she was just sitting in her living room with her dad, when the flash came outside, they rushed to see what it was.
She said, I've never seen anything like that in my life.
Saying the object seemed to be moving slowly compared to a typical meteor or shooting star.
Well, it's a UFO, isn't it?
Unidentified flying object, right?
Until they find the rock.
Now, they may find the rock, but I've always said this about meteors.
Until they find the evidence, they really don't know what it was.
Anyway, getting reports from all over the Northwest of quite an occurrence tonight.
That is ongoing.
At 7.30 p.m.
Indianapolis time, cascading extended rapid-fire waves of sonic booms lasted for about five minutes.
The person sending the email said, I thought it was thunder.
Maybe fireworks at first, but sonic booms for sure.
No mention on the local news.
So, that's all kind of breaking, developing news, and we'll watch it as the program continues tonight.
Something big over the Northwest.
A briefly worldwide, a gunman opened fire Saturday.
I guess you've heard about this at a church service.
Great, huh?
It was being held at a suburban Milwaukee hotel.
It killed seven people.
He killed seven people before taking his own life.
Authorities said officers found four people and the gunman dead when they arrived at about 1 p.m.
at the Sheraton Hotel.
Three others died later at a hospital.
And so there you have it.
A gunman opening fire at a church.
The suspect in the courthouse shootings of a judge and two other people, here we go again, waved a white cloth and surrendered to authorities Saturday, but not before police say he killed an immigration agent and held a woman hostage for hours in her own apartment.
Too much of this in the news, huh?
Ukraine withdrew 150 servicemen from Iraq on Saturday, beginning a gradual pullout as Shiite and Kurdish politicians refine plans to form a coalition government that officials say includes an agreement not to turn the country into an Islamic state.
And this, Rod Stewart, has proposed to his longtime girlfriend, At the top of the Eiffel Tower, how romantic can you get in Paris?
Stewart's record company said Saturday, that would be BMG, that Stewart went down on one knee and proposed to his 33-year-old to-be-bride, Penny Lancaster, at the French landmark on Wednesday.
She did accept they will be married.
Go Rod!
All right, now the following refers to Last Saturday night's blowout show with Popular Mechanics magazine, Mr. Chertoff, I have posted tonight an open letter on the website, which you're welcome to go and read slowly if you like, but here it is.
It's an open letter to my listeners, just so there is no confusion about my position, and I don't want there to be.
Please let me state for the record, I do not believe that President Bush ordered or authorized the 9-11 attack as was posted on the Rentsite 9-1704, Thomas Bouya.
It was an article by Thomas Bouya.
This was only one, though, of many such articles found on that site.
Yes, we do have a free press, of course, and it is constitutional to write such trash But it is also my right to say I think those who are making such charges are repulsive, and publishing such articles is yellow journalism.
The Rentsite has been attacking me now, and you may not be aware, for several years.
I've never fired back, because frankly what they've chosen to say about me is not important.
However, what they charge about the President, our President Bush, and America is damaging to all of us.
Now, much as I think we must always be alert to what our government does, and we must, I also feel that we must be alert to B.S.
when we see it.
If there were any proof, any proof, that our president ordered the murder of our citizens, we would be in the middle of impeachment hearings right now, or worse, much worse.
Make no mistake, that is what we're talking about here.
There may be some questions in all the confusion of what happened in 9-11, I'll grant you that, but none of it, none of it adds up to, we did this to our own people.
It's not possible to be just a little bit pregnant on this issue, and I'm not going to be, I will not be part of the blame America first crowd.
No thank you.
I've examined all the so-called evidence offered by those who make claims ranging all the way from bombs to missiles and a whole lot more.
I find no smoking gun.
That said, Coast to Coast AM, this program, has had several guests that have talked about these claims without challenge!
The moment one guest was put on the show airing an opposing view, the wingnut crowd began yelling, How unfair!
How can a group of people who claim to be open-minded possibly take such a closed-minded view?
Perhaps they're not as open-minded as they claim.
Worse yet, They call names and they make threats.
Oh, how many threats have I had?
You know, I've been doing this a while now, folks, and threats and name-calling and threats of boycotts and stuff like that, they don't affect me.
One post-9-11 effect is quite clear.
We're a much less civil society.
I believe much of what is being charged is, frankly, political, not criminal.
The wingnuts, of course, are not going to admit this, but scratch just a little deeper and you're almost always going to find a Bush hater.
Now, I'm not a Bush fan for reasons that have nothing to do with 9-11, but I'm also not a Bush basher.
I voted for John Kerry, as I've told you, and I did that because He made a promise not to put nuclear waste in my backyard.
Most politics are local and was in my case.
I'm for the most part neutral, frankly, with regard to President Bush.
I'm a libertarian who believes in personal responsibility and less government in our lives.
Now being almost 60 years old, Maybe I'm an old-fashioned American who believes that America is still the best country in the world.
I come to this view having seen much of the rest of it.
America surely is not perfect, but it is the best.
Maybe some of our tax money would be really well spent by giving our young people in America a round-trip ticket to the country of their choice.
I'm guessing Most would hurry back with a much improved world view.
And so I have had that letter posted on the website for you to take a look at.
Now of all the bologna I received after last week's program, one of the more interesting I thought was the following.
If you don't think Three quarters of the ham operators that Art Bell spent so much time talking to are not working for the government?
You'd be nuts.
So, I took the trouble of writing emails to four of my amateur radio friends and asking them for admissions.
Which three of them are the government agents?
I have yet to hear back from them.
In a moment, I have a surprise for you.
Sound of explosion.
Music.
As many of you know, one of the points of contention that I do in fact have with our president is over energy issues.
I feel very, very strongly About them, and a friend of mine called up here a little while ago, earlier tonight, about an hour and a half ago, I guess.
And after sending me an email, I guess maybe one of the, no, the best known country singer in the world is Willie Nelson.
Willie Nelson called me, I don't know, a couple hours ago, maybe, and he wanted to talk a little bit about biodiesel.
Now, I've got a big, you know, 37-foot RV.
I love it.
And I'm told by Willie that I could put biodiesel in my RV, smelling somewhat like a French fry tooling down the highway.
And burning the leavens of, you know, I guess, fast food places or whatever.
I don't know what the deal is, but Willie Nelson does.
Ladies and gentlemen, Willie Nelson.
Willie, welcome to the program.
Hey, R. How you doing, buddy?
I'm doing great.
You're in your traveling... Where are you, anyway?
Well, we played in St.
Fort Louis, Louisiana, tonight, and we're headed down toward Lake Charles.
And, yeah, we're on my bus.
You're usually on the bus, aren't you?
Yeah, yeah.
And we're using...
And have been for quite some time.
100% biodiesel.
Man, that is so... First of all, what is this stuff made out of?
Well, what we're using in our buses is soybeans.
Soybeans?
There's several different things.
The original diesel engine was designed to run on peanut oil.
But the soybean production in this country is making it possible, you know, to use it.
I'm reading some things here that comes out of biodiesel.org where anybody can check it out on the internet.
It's easy to use than any other diesel fuels with more benefits.
It can be used all year long.
It's the safest of all fuels to use, handle, and store.
Alright, I want to know a lot more about it because I want to try it myself and that's in fact one of the questions.
How do I try it?
In other words, take my diesel pusher RV for example.
Could I put biodiesel in that without any other change to the engine?
Yeah, and if it's later than, you know, than a 1944 or something like that engine, all you have to do is just back up and pump it full of biodiesel and take off.
And I'm running my new Mercedes on it.
My wife has a Volkswagen.
Volkswagen's never had anything in it but biodiesel.
And what we're using over there comes from the grease traps in the restaurants on Maui where we live.
A guy goes around, collects all the grease traps, Takes it back, recycles it, takes out the detergents, comes up with 100% vegetable oil, and we put it right in our cars, and it really does.
The tailpipes do smell like french fries.
Ah, so they do.
So if you're following somebody doing this like yourself, there is a distinct french fry smell in the air?
Yes, sir.
It beats the usual diesel smell, huh?
What did you say?
I said it beats the usual diesel smell.
Well, it beats the usual diesel spill because it can't be that healthy, especially for school buses.
If school kids could breathe french fries all day long instead of the diesel that they breathe, I think it would be better for them.
And not only that, it's better for the environment, it's better for the farmers, it reduces our dependency on foreign energy and foreign oil.
And that's what, you know, I think we should be thinking about.
Plus, Willie, I'm sure it's self-perpetuating as you tool on down the highway smelling like a french fry, probably 15 cars behind you get hungry.
Well, you know, I told you that story, you know, about when I was accepting an environmental award in L.A.
a few weeks ago, and I was telling me and my wife, I have automobiles that are environmentally friendly, that runs on biodiesel, and I said the other night, I pulled my car in the garage and closed the door, left the motor running, went to sleep, woke up the next morning, and I'd gained five pounds.
It is that safe.
Other than the five pounds, that's a true story.
Well, no, I didn't do that, but I thought it was funny.
It is.
Could you do that?
Could you close up a garage, leave the motor running, and be alive in the morning?
All right, the next obvious question is, where can a person... I mean, I'd love to fill up and try it, Willie.
Where can I do it?
Well, the way to find out is to go to biodiesel.org and they will show you maps around the country where you can get it.
After I talked to you earlier today, I was trying to find a spot in your area where you could get it.
And what I found with Sparks Nevada was the closest thing I could find.
But you know, we last night, we had a truck come to our hotel and filled up our buses right there at the hotel.
We didn't have to go anywhere.
Oh, darn.
So there are plenty of spots, anyway.
After all, it's an RV.
I travel.
Now, suppose I got to a place where I could fill up with biodiesel and I had Let's say a quarter of a tank or a half a tank left of regular diesel.
Could I put the bio right in behind it?
Yes, you can.
You can put it right on top of it.
Any blend will work.
I'm using 100%.
A lot of the truckers that run in cold weather like to use a B20, which they say runs better in cold weather.
When we get into cold weather in the winter, we'll probably use a blend also, but right now we're using 100%.
So, what happens when it gets cold?
Does it tend to congeal in some ways?
It gets a little thicker, I think, in real cold weather.
And if it wasn't for that, it could be used in airplanes.
So, eventually, I think they'll work all that out.
All right.
Willie, if it were in mass production, for, you know, all across America, for the truckers, and they use a lot of fuel, and fuel's getting really expensive, any idea what the Well, it varies.
Here's an article that I was reading, and the question was, what will this do to the price of biodiesel?
And it said, based on DTM's Alternative Fuels Index, the average price of No.
2 diesel in mid-October was $1.53 a gallon.
The price of B20 Which is a blend of 20% biodiesel and 80% regular diesel was $1.72 a gallon.
Now the tax incentive could lower the price of B20 to be approximately the same price as diesel based on these numbers to about $1.52 a gallon.
Alright, this would obviously help the farmers across America who would grow our fuel.
It would help our air.
It would help everything involved.
It would help our dependence on foreign oil.
This is, you know, it's pretty big stuff, Willie.
It is.
Pretty big stuff.
So, what do you have to do to get this rolling?
Well, to talk about it, you know, I'm listening to you on XM Radio now, and a friend of mine, Bill Mack, has a show on XM Radio on Channel, I think it's 171, and every Wednesday I've been having an hour show where I talk to truckers who call in, and we've been talking about biodiesel, and I've been getting their opinions and telling them where they can find it.
So far, I have had no complaints.
Every trucker who's used it said it gets better gas mileage, it burns cleaner, and it's the future.
And it's going to take a little talking about it.
The demand will have to get there before we get the supply.
Well, I've got about a gazillion truckers listening to this program right now, so the bottom line for these truckers is, if they go by one of these locations, or go to biodiesel.org and find out where they are, They can give it a try, and that's how we can make this happen, huh?
Right, and you know I own a truck stop and this truck stop is just south of Dallas on I-35E and I think it's exit 384
I believe.
And we sell biodiesel there and I would like to invite truckers to come by.
We have a lot of truckers who come by all the time and try it out.
And we've never had anybody who was dissatisfied.
That's the way to get the word out.
That's the way to get this started.
Simply get people to try it.
And I know a lot of truckers are listening.
So guys, there's no downside.
Right, Willie?
No downside?
No downside at all.
Just try it and call hard and tell them what you think about it.
And you're going to go down the street smelling very differently, and you're going to have, Willie, just as much power as you do with regular diesel, is that correct?
Yes, you do.
My drivers swear by it.
Now, in the beginning, if you've been running regular diesel in the beginning, you may have to change your filter a little earlier, because it does clean the engine, and that stuff's got to go somewhere.
So, you may have to change your filter A little earlier than you normally would, but after that, and you keep running biodiesel, well then, you won't have that problem at all.
One last question, what is the exhaust comprised of, actually?
Well, it would depend on, I guess, how much blend you have in there, but regular biodiesel, if you have, if you're running soybeans, 100% soybeans, which seems to be the most Popular thing.
There is no downside.
You know, John Deere is coming out with their first biodiesel B2 equipment at Waterloo, Iowa.
All right.
Listen, Willie, buddy, it's been too long.
You and I did a show together, I think now several years ago.
Yeah, we did.
Let's see what we can do with this and let's get a whole program some night.
Do a whole program again.
How about that?
I would love to do that, Art.
In the meantime, buddy, take care of the night.
All right, you do the same.
We'll be listed.
All right, see you later.
Willie Nelson, folks, and Biodiesel.
He's using it, and you can too, and I'm going to give it a try.
I'll find one of these sites, fill up, and French fry my way down the road.
As I said, it's self-perpetuating.
Everybody's going to get hungry behind you or something.
Pretty cool stuff from the high desert in the middle of the night.
Open lines directly ahead.
Oh Writers of the storm
Into this house Into this world
Like a dog With
Oh Yeah
Oh Yeah
Oh Oh
When your mother hits the phone BOOM!
To talk with Art Bell, call the wildcard line at area code 775-727-1295.
The first time caller line is area code 775-727-1222.
To talk with Art Bell from east of the Rockies, call toll free at 800-825-5033.
line is area code 775-727-1222. To talk with Art Bell from east of the Rockies, call toll-free
at 800-825-5033. From west of the Rockies, call 800-618-8255.
International Callers, International colors.
may reach Art by calling your in-country Sprint Access number, pressing option 5 and dialing
toll free 800-893-0903. From coast to coast and worldwide on the internet, this is Coast
to Coast AM with Art Bell.
Rocking through the night time. My guest at the top of the hour is going to be Peter Novak
and the first question listed for Mr. Novak is a grabber.
It's, what makes you think you've discovered the secret of death?
What makes you think you've discovered the secret of death?
Now that's the way to begin an interview.
One of my favorite topics, indeed, is from life after death, or whether there is even any.
That's where we're going tonight if you'll just stay right there.
**Splash** **Dramatic Music**
Alright, then let's rock.
Open lines is what it shall be.
Wild Card Line, you're on the air.
Hi.
Hello, Ark.
This is Roger near Fort Wayne, Indiana.
And can you go to the Mars Surveyor image on your computer to the 90-degree rotation of the close-up?
Of what?
Of the glass tunnel.
No, I can't make it there that quickly, but I've seen it a hundred times, sir, so I certainly know what you're talking about.
Okay, I want to give you my interpretation of what it's showing.
Sure.
Those little white things that look like crescents?
Yes.
Those are support arches supporting a transparent shield underneath which, in my opinion, is a combination greenhouse, public thruway, And a solar heat collector.
Well, if it's that, then that'll certainly shake up the world, sir.
I don't know what else it could be, sir.
If you look closely at it, I'm looking at it printed out on paper under a bright light.
Right.
Right.
No, it's as interesting a theory as any until we actually get to Mars.
We're not going to know.
Without question, the apparent, or seemingly, glass-type tubes that he's talking about are fascinating absolutely fascinating they look not a natural right they look like they've been built or there's some sort of some some sort of transportation system or you know who knows what they just don't look natural hopefully we'll get there in our lifetimes to find out East of the Rockies you're on the air hello hello hello hello hey my name is Chris I'm calling from Madison Indiana hello Chris I was just listening to you and Willie
Our buses here at our school system just started last week using soybeans.
No kidding?
Yeah, I think if all bus systems should do that, you know, it would help our environment.
It apparently would, and even more than that, consider how many truckers are out there listening in the night.
If they began the movement themselves, and they can without changing anything, all they've got to do is pull up to the right dispensing station and give it a try.
Maybe, you know, maybe we can make this happen whether the powers that be want it to or not.
Yeah, that's right.
Okay, thanks.
Thank you very much.
You'd be surprised what the private enterprise system can do if it puts its mind to it.
If enough people, and there are plenty of truckers out there, decide well then, hmm, I don't have to do anything special to my truck.
I don't have to convert anything.
All I've got to do is go fill up and give it a try.
And it's going to work.
Well, then why not?
Maybe we can force a change.
Maybe we can disturb the oil force, as it were.
And we have the power to do that.
You have the power to do that.
Simply by taking the suggestion and running with it.
Finding one of these spots and filling up.
What's for the Rockies?
You're on the air.
Hi.
Hi, Art.
I fully agree with you.
That was a great interview with Willie, and we need to do something about this evil empire of oil that keeps raising the prices and putting the people down.
I think we should have an Energy Independence Day and run on soybeans.
Do you think there's a conspiracy going on?
I'm sure there is, because these oil prices here in Southern California...
I live in Los Angeles, and this is Edson.
I'm calling from Los Angeles.
I think we're headed over $3 a gallon by summer.
I could be wrong about that, but that would be my guess.
And when it gets there, people are going to be screaming bloody murder, and this will be one answer.
That's true.
We've got to do something.
We've got to do it now.
And I applaud Willie Nelson for getting the ball rolling, and you too, Art.
So let's get the soybeans in the tank instead of the oil from the Mideast.
I'm with you.
Let's rock.
All right.
Thank you very much.
Why not?
I mean, what's to stop us?
Usually there's some kind of, you know, some caveat, right?
Something that has to be done that, for example, a trucker would have to convert his truck or his engine in some way.
And you can see that people wouldn't go out of their way necessarily to do that.
But if all you've got to do is pull up to Station dispensing this stuff and that's it and you give it
a try and you begin smelling like a french fry for a while But you get a good ride well
Then let's rock first time caller line. You're on the air hi
If I push the button you are you're on the air now hi I was wondering would it be possible to get a copy of the
ABC UFO special on the video oh I would imagine that ABC would be willing to provide that
to you for price Yeah.
I managed to catch a glimpse of a 1-800 number on the end credits at the end of the program.
Do you have that number?
Would you know it?
Oh, I do not.
However, if you call your local ABC affiliate, they'd be able to, you know, the ABC affiliate near town, they'll be able to give you the number.
Okay.
All right?
All right, thank you.
All right, thank you.
Wildcard Line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Is this the Art Bell Show?
It is, and you're on the air, sir.
Oh, okay.
Good.
I heard you guys talking about biodiesel.
That's right.
And I thought I'd put my two cents worth in on that.
Are you out there in a truck right now?
Actually, I'm driving a three-quarter ton van, sir.
But I understand I'm a combustion engineer, so I have some background in this.
All right.
Turn your radio off there, Mr. Engineer.
Okay, you got it.
All right, so what do you have to say about it?
Basically, one of the things that people tout with biodiesel is it's an environmentally friendly fuel.
Yes.
Keep in mind that it's still a hydrocarbon.
Sure.
So you're still going to make carbon dioxide and water vapor.
Sure.
So you're still going to have a lot of the, I guess you could say greenhouse gases coming off the Come out of the stacks of the trucks or exhaust pipes of the diesel?
No, I don't doubt that you're correct, sir, but even if it helps wean us off our dependence on foreign oil from the Saudis and others... I have no argument with that.
Then it would be worth doing on that basis alone.
Right, I agree with that, but, you know, people seem to think that biodiesel is going to be environmentally more friendly.
What they don't realize is, they don't realize on the production side of the equation, it still takes electricity And heat generated by either natural gas or some other fossil fuel to drive the process.
Sure, sure.
So what you lose on the back end, you pick up on the front end on increased costs to produce the fuel.
Until it's produced in mass, and then I guess, you know, look, if we do nothing more than help American farmers, and it would help American farmers if you could make it out of soybeans, for goodness sake.
Absolutely.
And we wean ourselves off the foreign oil, that's enough for me right there.
Oh, and I have no problem with that.
I agree with that.
I just want people to understand that from an environmental standpoint, it's not necessarily as clean as... It's like burning methanol.
Methanol helps farmers, no doubt about it.
But still, you have things on the back end of this that most people don't consider when it comes to... Now, there is a price.
Look, there's a price for everything.
And I'm sure that there are some greenhouse-like emissions.
I don't think there is any magic, absolute magic key that we can glom onto and begin to use.
So I'm sure there is some price, but again, if we manage to not use foreign oil, thousands, millions of gallons of barrels of it, then that's a good thing, isn't it?
If we help American farmers who can grow the fuel, then that's really a good thing, isn't it?
And, uh, we still have to keep worrying and be concerned about greenhouse gases at the same time.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
Good morning.
Hi, this is, uh, Frank from, uh, Athens, Georgia.
Hey, Frank.
Hi, uh, I'm a student at the University of Georgia, and, um, we're working to get biodiesel on our buses there.
Uh, oh, really?
Yeah, um, we're actually working on a campaign right now to get the university to put biodiesel in the buses.
Mm-hmm.
I just wanted to let anyone else know, maybe in the university system, that this is definitely a good alternative to the diesel that the buses run on now.
Something that we as students should definitely work to promote, you know, throughout the university systems as a whole.
I think so.
I couldn't agree more.
Thank you very much.
It is.
Yeah, it is.
And it's something we can do right now.
It's something we can do with no change.
And even if you're forced to buy regular diesel at the next stop, for example, You've begun the process, so when you find these locations, as are available on that website, where did I put it?
Biodiesel.org will document the locations for you.
Then, let's do it now.
Let's rock.
First time caller line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Hi Art, this is Larry here, Florida.
The signal on my cell phone died, but I was talking to you during the break.
Um, yes sir.
About the, uh, biodiesel?
Yes.
Yeah, um, like I said, uh, like I told you during the break, um, I used to live in Indiana, where they were doing the big thing with the gas oil, uh, producing methanol.
Yeah, somebody just mentioned that a moment ago, and your cell phone's breaking up a little bit now, but yes, you lived in Indiana.
Right, yeah, that was me that mentioned it.
Yes.
I lived in Indiana.
And the farmers that were producing the corn for the methanol were beginning to lose their government subsidies because of producing the corn for the methanol.
No kidding.
In other words, let me get this straight.
I want to be sure here.
Normally they would get subsidies, but because they were producing something for an alternative fuel, they would lose their subsidies?
Yes.
Several farmers that I know of are actually going bankrupt because of it.
So I'm just wondering if it'll be about the same thing with the biodiesel or the soybean diesel.
I don't know.
I don't know, but at some point the American people are going to get angry about this.
Yeah.
And they're going to just say, enough already.
If we have a reasonable alternative, then by God, let us get the hell out of the way.
And let us use it, don't you think?
Uh, maybe that time has now arrived.
Wildcard Line, you're on the air.
Hi.
Hello.
Hello.
Yeah, is this Coast to Coast AM?
Yes, it is.
It's Art Barilla, and you're on the air, sir.
Oh, oh, sorry.
All right.
Time delay.
Let me go turn off.
Yeah, turn off.
I thought you had a screen here.
I'm calling about the biodiesel.
In the town which I live in, which is Ithaca, New York, in order to avoid clogging the drains, they have separate drains from the restaurants for cooking oil.
This is already harvested and used in the buses, but unfortunately I heard this on NPR as well as on Coast to Coast on May 5, 1997, and it was one of your shows.
It was a Tuesday-Wednesday, Art, the host, and the guest was Ann Martin, and it was about the use of pets that are euthanized for products, and she was talking about their use in pet foods, but on NPR they were talking about the use of the fat from Euthanized pets is mixed in with the restaurant fat waste as diesel fuel.
And if we love our beloved pets and don't want cruelty and don't want beefettes... Well, we don't need to do that to get diesel fuel.
We can do it from a purely grown product in the ground.
A farmer can raise soybeans, which are all you need.
Didn't you just hear, Willie?
Pure soybeans.
We don't need Sliced and diced cats or dogs or anything else.
So I don't know where that's coming from, but the fact of the matter is all we need is soybeans and we've got plenty of those.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
All right.
Yes.
I've listened to you for 10 or 12 years.
I can barely hear you, sir.
You said you've listened for 10 or 12 years.
Yep.
Listened to you on the radio.
Really had a lot of respect for you.
But now?
You know, I don't want to get down on you here, but... Oh, go right ahead.
You know, I just, you know, looked at the evidence in 9-11.
Yes.
And, you know, the film.
I don't know how you can look at that and not have some questions in your mind.
Oh, I didn't say I didn't have questions.
I said there are questions.
Did you hear what I read a little while ago?
Well, actually, I just got part of it.
I was in my vehicle, but... I see, so you didn't hear.
Well, there are questions, but what I'm saying is that none of them point to uh... we did it to ourselves president bush authorized
the attacks that knocked down a killed
thousands of americans on set up with this kind of stuff and that's the
article that i was referring to sir well what about the evidence
The other way.
What evidence have you... I'm not talking about the President.
We're talking about the evidence that Al Qaeda did it.
stop right here and you give me the evidence that president bush ordered
this right about the airtime is your assertions that i could about the
president who said evidence to the other where the evidence that uh... uh... okay
well i i think there's a ton of a unit of the plane you ever see any film to show them in a plane
No, and I have not reviewed.
That would be something the FBI would do, would review all of those films.
I think they have the names of the hijackers that were involved.
Well, they say they have the names.
Yeah, they say they have the names.
Well, at least seven have been proven to be still alive.
Yeah, I've heard that rumor, too.
It's not a rumor, it's a fact.
It's a fact.
And where are these seven?
Well, I don't have their exact information.
Oh, darn.
You don't?
It's a known fact.
Is it?
And who knows this fact?
Well, the facts have been printed.
Where?
There was one of the Saudis who was actually a pilot in Saudi Arabia.
You know, I don't have their names.
A pilot?
Yeah, an airplane pilot.
An airplane pilot.
One of the ones that they said was supposed to be flying one of the planes or something is a Saudi airplane pilot.
Uh-huh.
Let's let that go.
Let's look at one of the things in the film.
If you look at... Which film?
Building Number 7.
Which film are you referring to?
The Illusion film, 9-11 Illusion.
9-11 Illusion, that's the one I don't know about.
In Plain Sight, I know about.
Well, I think it's probably the same film, but you see Building Number 7 when that drops.
Yes.
You know, four and a half hours after the other buildings were already down, supposedly, there's an explosion in there, and then this building goes down.
Now, if you look at the film of that, there's no way that building didn't come down other than demolition.
I mean, the way it came down, perfectly straight, I mean, give me a break.
I mean, if you could look at that and say, well, part of the building was taken out by Yes, clearly, sir.
If you look carefully, you'll see a great deal of the fascia is gone.
And if you listen to the structural engineers talk about the way the columns in that building number seven were harmed and stressed, then I think they've proven from, or at least fairly conclusively, there's still work going on on that part of it, but that there was sufficient Hi, my name's Alan.
evidence to indicate that there had been enough damage to bring number seven down
most of the rockies you're on the air hello uh... my name's alan i'm from idaho falls idaho
uh...
i was uh...
boy i tell ya uh... you were doing the show on the uh...
uh... biodiesel Yes, I had Willie Nelson on a little while ago and he's running biodiesel and I thought that was pretty cool.
Yeah, I do too.
I'm an electrical engineer and it really interested me.
Some time ago I had a Mercedes.
And I was really low on fuel, and the only thing that I could find that was open in this little town was a grocery store.
No kidding.
And what I did, I had about an eighth of a tank of number one diesel in it.
It was an old Mercedes.
And I put two gallons of corn oil in it.
Right off the shelf.
Right off the shelf, okay.
Right off the shelf.
And what happened?
Well, it smoked really black for a while and then quit because it wasn't processed, I suppose.
I didn't have the power that I usually had, but it got me the next 25 or 30 miles.
Into the next town where I could get diesel.
Well, according to Willie, um, you know, he has no less power.
Um, he's getting the same kind of mileage.
And, um, you know, it comes right out of the ground, uh, as in something grown.
Right.
Instead of having to drill for oil.
Well, we've got millions and millions of truckers on the road out there.
My God, sir, imagine if...
If they took our word for it, Willie's word for it, and stopped and filled up on biodiesel, and that began to happen more and more and more, and we get the ball rolling, and before you know it, we've changed the world.
A big change, too.
Yeah.
Actually, as an electrical engineer, there are probably going to be small, inexpensive modifications Well, apparently... To make it even better.
Yeah, apparently with all this, oh sir, there's not even a modification that you've gotta do.
No modification needed.
Soybeans.
Right into the truck.
Oh my, maybe we'll change the world.
Listen, this is Coast to Coast AM, when we get back, Peter Novak.
We're gonna talk about what happens when you die.
I'm Art Bell.
You've been inside, but you don't see too many faces.
Coming in out of the rain, and hear the chairs fall down.
Be inside the sand, smell more touch.
There's something inside that we need so much.
The sight of a touch, or the scent of a sound, or the strength of an oak when it moves deep in the ground.
The wonder of flowers to be covered and then to burst up through tarmac to the sun again.
Or to fly to the sun without burning a wing.
To lie in a meadow and hear the grass sing To have all these things in our memories haunted
And they used them to count us to five!
Five!
But as you saw, take this place, on this trip, just for me Five!
Take a picture!
To talk with Art Bell, call the wildcard line at area code 775-727-1295.
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From coast to coast, and worldwide on the internet, this is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell.
What is the greatest...
Question in life.
What do you think the greatest question in life is?
Well, for me, I think there is no question about it.
It's whether there's anything after.
What is the nature of death?
Is it really the end?
The worms crawl in, the worms crawl out.
The end of consciousness.
The big sleep.
Nothing on the other side.
Or, as thousands have suggested, there is something they say, those who have come back.
On the other side, it's the biggest question there is for humanity.
A former psychological counselor, Peter Novak, walked away from patient care in 1985 to devote himself to the full-time study of death and the afterlife.
He has examined and compared the afterlife beliefs of dozens of cultures, old and new, interviewed hundreds of near-death experiencers, past-life regression subjects, psychologists, parapsychologists, theologians, and religious scholars around the world.
He's spent the last 19 years studying an ancient religious belief The Binary Soul Doctrine, which he says provides a scientific explanation for virtually all afterlife phenomena being reported today, as well as a majority of mankind's cultural traditions about the afterlife.
Peter has been interviewed on several radio programs, appeared on a number of TV shows, has been a featured speaker at several conferences, In addition, his research has been featured in a number of academic and professional journals as well as magazines.
There is no bigger question here to deal with it.
In a moment, Peter Novak.
Over the years, I've...
I have interviewed many people who have gone to the door of death.
They've been physically dead, and they've come back, and I've heard things that have curled my hair, but, you know, there's always that seed of doubt.
I think all of us wish very strongly in our hearts to believe there is something that comes after death.
It carries very strong desire, maybe the strongest of them all.
That there's always that seed of doubt.
If you haven't been there and done that, well, there's a seed of doubt.
And there cannot be a better way to open up any interview than to ask this first question.
Peter, what makes you think you have discovered the secret of death?
That's some question, Peter.
I think I have discovered this because all the evidence seems to support that conclusion.
All the different types of afterlife phenomena being reported today can be explained by one theory.
And virtually all mankind's different religions seem to be traced back to one original afterlife belief.
So then, when you say you've discovered the secret of death, you mean a combination of studying the religions, studying The testimony of those who have died and come back, all of that, is enough for you to say, yeah, it's real.
Alright, but here I'm going to try and play the devil's advocate with you a little bit, because believe me, Peter, I want to believe.
I want to believe.
And I think most people do.
They don't want to believe that's the end of it.
They want to know.
Well, we do want to know.
Yes, we do want to know.
And that wanting has led me down many paths, you know, into EVP and all kinds of, you know, looking at ghosts and looking at all these reports that people have come back and you're just saying that all this evidence put together is a verdict.
Yes, I think so.
I think that's a really good analogy because If you're in a courtroom and you see all the evidence that's pointing to one conclusion, then yes, you can feel comfortable making that conclusion.
Now I think that the problem that we've had is that not knowing this ancient theory that used to exist, we've looked at all the different kind of afterlife reports and we've seen them as being very different That's concerned me, Peter.
Number one, people should be made aware that not everybody who clinically dies comes back with stories of white lights and relatives and all the rest of it.
Not all of them come back with that.
A significant portion of them do not.
Maybe even a majority of them do not.
Isn't that true?
That does seem to be true.
But the ones that have the stories, the stories do seem to be consistent.
And as far as a lack of memory about what may or may not have happened while they were unconscious or while they were dead, does not in itself deny that something happened.
Memory loss is very common.
No, it doesn't deny it.
And you make a good point about the stories being similar.
Peter, by now there have been thousands and thousands of these reports.
Near-death experience.
That's right.
How truly similar are they?
Well, they seem to be to follow a basic pattern.
They start off with a dark phase and they end up with a light phase.
And statistically they've shown that majority of people actually report the dark phase more than the light phase.
However, the people that... What do you mean by dark?
Did you say dark face?
Dark phase.
In the beginning they will say that they rose from their body and then they found themselves in a black void or a black tunnel.
Usually that's a very brief period of time in a near-death experience and then they move on to a realm of light.
Out of curiosity, Peter, I once interviewed a young lady named Sarah.
Who had an NDE that I will never, in all my memory, forget.
All my life, I will never forget it.
It was so vivid.
How many people experienced... She had seen rooms, some rooms with some agonizing people in them.
Other rooms containing joyful things.
Sort of a... I don't know.
That's the right word for it.
A panorama of what seemed like good and joy and then evil and, you know, both sides of it.
Others have reported relatives, that sort of thing.
How many report that kind of thing?
Well, how many report visits to heaven or hell?
Yes.
Or, you know, visions of, I guess, what could be heaven or hell.
Actually, it's an interesting distinction.
Some people report both.
Some people report visions or visits to heaven or visits to hell.
Some people will report a visit to heaven and then a vision of hell.
They're looking into hell from the outside.
How many people do this?
That's what I call the light experience.
Where they have a period where they encounter a huge area and it's filled with all kinds
of forms and structures and meaning and a great deal of memory that they will experience
during this phase.
Of all the people that do have the near-death experiences, it is less that report this than the people that just report The dark phase.
I don't know the exact numbers, but it is less.
The majority, the single most commonly reported element of near-death experiences is the dark phase, where they're just floating alone.
Peter, if we were to do a survey in modern America and ask how many Americans believe there is an existence, a consciousness that is after death, Mm-hmm.
What kind of result do you think we would get?
Well, I think that what you're asking is how many people believe in life after death.
Yes.
And I think that the numbers are high.
I think they're in the high 80 percentile.
The last ones that I've heard of within the last 10 years.
It's interesting that even though America is, and basically the whole world, is growing less and less religious, we still seem to be very strongly have strong belief in afterlife, in survival.
I think more people believe in heaven than in hell, but still just basic survival, I think the majority of people
do believe in it.
Well, just because people are becoming perhaps less religious in a structural way, that doesn't mean
I don't know, that doesn't mean that... Well, not spiritual, but...
Yes, that doesn't mean they don't have a different spiritual view perhaps, but still
a spiritual view.
Right.
Why is it so important in this day and age for people to believe in life after death?
I think that it is important because I think all cultures need to believe in life after death.
Why?
Because they believe in life after death, then they start questioning the value of life.
They start questioning the value of their own life.
They start questioning the value of their neighbor's lives.
And they start, you know, if someone is walking down the street and he doesn't necessarily
think his life is of any value, he doesn't necessarily think that his neighbor's life
is of any value, well then he's not going to be a very law-abiding citizen.
You know, I have tossed that into the face of a lot of people who come on my program
and believe that sort of thing and they say nonsense.
Why would you think that even if I believe there's nothing after this life, that I would behave in some criminal or immoral way?
It's just not true.
Even though I don't believe in life after death, I'm still a moral person.
I still conduct myself on a day-to-day basis, dealing fairly with people.
Well, it's a question of value.
What you do value and what you don't value.
If in the end, if you decide, if you believe that we live and we die and then after we're gone there's nothing left of us, if there's no memory of Any of our experiences or any of our choices, then none of those experiences, none of those choices have any intrinsic value.
And if they don't have any intrinsic value, then why act as if they do?
And I do think that... So you're saying that it's important that people believe so that there is social stability in the world?
Exactly right.
I think that if you look back through history, every civilization has I've got a guy I interview, Matthew Alper, and he wrote a book called The God Part of the Brain.
He believes that there is something in our brain, some part of our brain, that is used because we have the greatest fear in the world for man is that of death.
And the only way that our brains can deal with the fear of death is by concocting the notion that there is something more.
There is a creator and there is a life after death and that's how we deal with the fear of it.
Otherwise, we couldn't deal with the fear of it.
Well, that's absolutely true.
That is the other option.
Either there is a genuine experience, a genuine survival, a genuine life after death, or all the stories we hear about it are just people making up stories.
And that's why I think my research is so important, because it shows that all these stories are basically saying the same thing.
They're all consistent, and you wouldn't have that consistency if people were just randomly making up stories.
Well, another part of it is a life, a full life review.
Of those, Peter, who report a life after death experience, how many report a full life review?
Kind of a fast, you know, Well, first of all, the life review actually tends to occur at the very beginning of the light stage, or during the transition between the dark phase and the light phase.
After they're floated in the dark void and then they go through the tunnel and they find themselves in the realm of light, usually the life review occurs at the very beginning of that light phase, and I think that it occurs in the majority of the cases of people that report a light phase.
Have you ever had an experience yourself?
Have I had a near-death experience?
Not to my knowledge.
Although I am under the impression that an awful lot of people in the modern age have had near-death experiences as young children experiencing fevers and whatnot that they don't remember consciously.
Well, I remember fevers as a youngster.
Most young people go through that.
I'm 103, and I began to see things and imagine things.
But, gee, Peter, that seems to me, if you're going to count that as an after-death experience, to me it lessens the... Well, I'm saying that I believe that it's possible for people to have near-death experiences that they don't remember consciously, but yet It's been noted by many researchers that near-death experiences tend to change a person's attitude, a person's behavior, a person's perspective on life.
I think there's a lot of people in our culture that even though they don't recognize that they've had near-death experiences, you still seem to see the effects of them as if they had had them.
Maybe they didn't remember it.
In other words, they straighten out their act.
They become a more moral person.
More spiritual, more looking at the big picture.
Alright.
How many of these do you suppose might be false reports?
Concocted stories?
I think it's certainly possible.
I'm sure that some of them are.
I have had questions on my own mind about some cases I've read about.
People were always wanting to get some attention.
But I do think that the vast majority of the cases that you read about, the cases that are chalked up, are valid.
They're genuine.
I would tend to go along with that, but I suppose somebody might concoct such a story, particularly somebody with a religious background.
That's one way to certainly proselytize, isn't it?
If you can go up to somebody and say, look, there is a God, there is another side, because I've been there and done that.
That's a way of imparting and proselytizing your religion.
What is this binary soul doctrine that you talk about?
It seems that 2,000, 3,000, 4,000 years ago, cultures all over the planet, religions all over the planet, had the same idea about what happened after you die.
They believed that people possess, while you're alive, two separate souls.
When you die, these two souls would separate from each other and they would go off to have very, very different kinds of afterlife experiences.
Now the interesting thing about that theory is that a lot of these traditions describe those two souls the same way that modern science now describes the conscious and the unconscious, or the left brain and the right brain.
And if you ask yourself, well what would happen if the conscious and the unconscious actually did survive death but divide apart in the process, that theory explains virtually everything you can find about different kinds of afterlife afterlife phenomena.
It explains near-death experiences, it explains ghosts, it explains poltergeists, it explains
past life regression, it explains reincarnation in heaven and hell, it explains limbo.
I think that it even explains traditions about zombies and vampires.
Are you a religious person, Peter, yourself?
I think that it depends on how you define the term.
I guess you'd have to say that I am, although I don't think that any organized religion would claim me as their own at this point in time.
Well, the question would be whether you claim any of them as your own.
I would have to go back about 1,600 years before I found one that really spoke to my heart.
1,500 or 1,600 years?
years before I found one that really spoke to my heart.
Fifteen or sixteen hundred years?
Yeah.
Wow.
Yeah, actually, I think that the first two or three hundred years of Christianity had
the story pretty much true.
Alright, hold it right there, Peter.
We're at the bottom of the hour.
So, we'll break here and come back with Peter Novak and the Secrets of Death.
From the high desert in the middle of the night, I'm Art Bell.
Don't you feel it growing day by day?
People are getting ready for the move.
Some are happy, some are sad.
Oh, we're gonna let the music play.
What the people need is a way to make them smile.
It ain't so hard to do it in the house.
Gotta get a message, get it all through.
Lord, I'm out of control, this has to end.
I'm Out Of Control I don't know why.
I don't know why.
Can you hear my heartbeat in this song?
I don't know why.
Can you hear my heartbeat in this song?
I don't know why.
Do you know that behind me?
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this is close to coast a m with art fell you know actually that's something i've
always worried about that uh... one reason for religion
might be but keep everybody serving for
uh... peter said it himself that's the reason people need to live you don't believe in
life after death because otherwise there would be no control everyday now
we have more stories about people walking into churches with guns and
opening fire or office buildings are whatever and then Like and subscribe!
Doing themselves at the end.
It seems like that might be that kind of people.
You know, if you didn't believe there was anything coming after, then what would stop
you from doing something like that?
Again, you know, the whole premise that people need to...
Need to believe in life after death so that there's a little bit of control out there.
Otherwise, we've got more people marching into churches with guns, doing away with people and then themselves.
It worries me because the whole darn premise is just so logical as a reason to have that belief.
In other words, control of the masses, Peter.
You see, it doesn't help me believe it.
It makes me worry because it's a logical premise to keep people in control.
You know, the big lie.
And I'm not saying it's that because we're as bad as anybody in my audience.
I want to believe, Peter.
But that's a pretty logical premise for people keeping people under control.
Well, certainly, but that's not why we should believe.
That's why we need to believe.
That's why we need to believe.
We need to believe as far as we need to have something that we can believe in.
In order to maintain society, to keep society from self-destructing.
But the problem is, okay, we're in the modern age, right?
Yes.
And we have all this information and data coming in from every quarter.
Yes.
And, you know, this is not the way it was a hundred years ago, two hundred years ago, a thousand years ago.
Nowadays, things are very different.
Nowadays, we hear all these different kinds of stories about near-death experiences and about past life regression and about This belief from this culture, and that belief from that culture, and they all seem to be very different.
And because of this, people are having a hard time saying, well, you know, why should I believe in anything?
They all seem to be telling me something different.
Why should I believe in anything?
They're different, Peter, but they're also similar.
And again, I go back to my good friend Matthew Alper, who talks about this God part of the brain.
And he said, look, you know, even if you go to these Desert, some island, a jungle island in the South Pacific where, you know, modern man has never gone before.
When you get there, you're going to find some natives who believe in something.
They worship the sun, or the moon, or they make sacrifices, or, you know, they believe in something.
They are going to believe in something, yes.
But my research has convinced me that There is a common denominator when it comes to their afterlife beliefs.
People aren't just coming up with whatever kind of idea they could come up with out of their imagination.
Inevitably, the afterlife beliefs seem to always follow the same basic patterns, and that suggests to me that they are actually looking at the same phenomenon.
Peter, what did you do?
Did you actually go out and interview people who have made these claims?
I have interviewed people and I have done a lot of research of other people's work.
I actually look at myself as being the next generation of afterlife research.
Right now we have tons of people that are out there studying near-death experiences.
We have tons of people that are out there studying ghosts.
We have another set of people out there studying poltergeists.
Another set of people out there studying out-of-body experiences.
another set of people out there studying soul retrieval, another set of people out there
studying past life regression.
And each of these sets are coming away and they are saying, okay, this is what we see.
And they will give you a report and it is a consistent report within that group.
They say, okay, everybody talking about these kinds of experiences are saying this, this,
this.
Each of these groups are separate and they are not taking into account what the other
groups, presumably are also talking about what happens after death, they are not taking
As far as I know, my research is the only research that has seen a connection between all these different groups.
Yes, they are all looking at the same phenomenon.
They might be looking at it from slightly different angles, but it is the same critter.
They're all looking at the same thing.
Christ, and we did not get a chance to interview Christ, but other than, yes, we've had phenomena after phenomena, people with near-death experiences, people who have no more heartbeat and no electrical activity supposedly in their brains, and somehow then they come back.
But, Peter, nobody who's been really dead, really dead, As in, dead for hours, or days, or weeks, or months.
None of those folks have ever come back.
That's arguable.
I would give you a set of people who claim to have done just that.
Well, let's hear about it.
All of the people who have engaged in past life regression will tell you that yes, they have been regressed in their memories, they have seen past lives, they have They have seen their past deaths.
They have seen what happens between one life and the next.
They actually are literally claiming that yes, they died and came back from the dead.
They're here now.
They were alive before they died.
So this is a whole set of people that are claiming that.
Well, you're right.
There are people claiming that, but still, these claims are coming from active, alive, living brains.
Anna, the point I was trying to make is that nobody who's really been dead, physically dead, for an indisputable amount of time, a month, none of those people have come back.
They're not coming back and giving you subjective reports of their experiences.
However, we also can look for objective reports.
We can look at ghost reports.
We can look at poltergeist reports.
These are second-person reports of presumably what would be an afterlife experience.
Well, that's true.
I mean, of course that's true, and there have been regressions into what appear to be prior lives, but the skeptic would say, okay, this is something, a fantasy concocted in a living brain that you're hearing about, that I had this prior life, and I died in such a way, and Now, getting back onto your side of things, people seem to be able to give details of these prior lives that are then verifiable.
And that does, I've got to admit, that's pretty strong stuff.
There are some very, very good reports of verified past life memories, yes.
But what gets me excited is that there is a pattern within all these different sets of reports.
It's a consistent pattern that I don't think could happen by chance.
It would definitely not happen if these were figments of people's imagination, whether they were deluding themselves or whether they were intentionally creating these stories.
This pattern that is occurring within all the different sets would not
be there if they were just being created out of the person's imagination. I think this
pattern represents proof that all these different sets are actually looking at legitimate
objective phenomena. Well, do you have any examples of people who have described prior
lives and then the proof has been obtained that they were right or in some cases wrong.
I mean, how does that work out?
Well, actually, you'd want to look at basically the life work of Ian Stevenson.
He's a professor at the University of Virginia and he has devoted his entire life to researching Memories of past lives.
It's not past life regression.
It's spontaneous memories of past lives.
He's written many books and articles and he's basically devoted his entire professional life to researching this and he's come up with an entire mountain of data suggestive that these past life memories have been validated.
He goes and looks at the memories.
He writes them down.
And he verifies, you know, different details within the required memories.
So, you know, there's a lot of detail like that out there that's very impressive.
Can you cite any specific examples, you know, the hard proof kind of stuff of what people have said and then has been verified later?
Are there any good examples of that?
Well, there was one example within Stevenson's work Where there was a young boy that claimed to have been the husband of a wife of a family in India when he was like six years old.
He started making these claims and they took him to the other town and he identified a whole host of people that he had never seen before and he identified them by name and by profession.
And identified where they lived within the town.
It was very detailed recollection.
That's pretty impressive, R.A., especially coming from a child.
Very impressive.
Okay, let's say that reincarnation is real and that we do live many lives.
Have you come to the conclusion, Peter, that we do live many lives?
Is that your personal belief?
I believe that at least some of us live many lives.
I don't know that we all do.
Maybe we all do.
I don't know everybody.
All I know is that the data I have seen has convinced me that it is a phenomenon that has recurred repeatedly among members of the human race.
What is interesting to me is that in a lot of past life regression reports, It seems that reincarnation is pointless.
They seem to go through life after life after life and they never seem to actually get anywhere.
They never seem to learn lessons.
Every life, they're making the same mistake over and over and over.
That was going to be exactly my point, Peter.
If you have no active recollection of a past life, then what good does living many of them do you if you cannot carry the experience from one to the next?
It doesn't do you any good, and that's the problem.
That's the problem, and that's what my whole research has been focused on, is the fact that if If we divide at death, if our minds divide apart at death and we lose memory, then we cannot progress forward.
We cannot evolve.
We cannot grow.
We are simply stuck.
Exactly.
And that's the problem.
I think that that is basically the number one problem that virtually all of mankind's religions were originally I think the Catholics, early on, believed in reincarnation, right?
You're absolutely right.
know that they call themselves Catholics back then, but very early on in the Christian Church,
yeah, I think that they did. There's a lot of evidence to suggest that.
Um, okay, you're absolutely right. Early on in the Christian Church, and then it was apparently
removed from doctrine, correct?
It seems to have been removed from doctrine, and there's a very good reason why they may
have wanted to do that.
And I think I know what that reason is.
I mean, we were talking about it a little bit earlier.
You just covered it.
Really, you said, what's the point?
Mm-hmm.
Isn't that why it was removed?
Because... Well, no, actually, I don't think that that was why... Oh?
I don't think that's why they removed it.
I think that they removed it in the early part of the 4th century when the Church merged with the Roman Empire, with the Roman government.
Because, okay, if you're the government and you have control over the church, and the church is saying to everyone, okay, you have many lives.
You reincarnate many times if you want to get things right.
Everything's okay.
Well, then that reduces the control that the state has over you.
However, if the state has the power not only to kill you in this life, but also to permanently condemn you to eternity in heaven or hell, That gives the state an awful lot more power.
But in order to do that, the state has to deny the existence of reincarnation.
So I think that they did that in order to increase the state's ability to control the population.
They said, not only can we kill you, but we can permanently convict you to heaven or hell for the rest of your life.
We have that kind of power over you.
So you better pay attention and do what we want.
That's a pretty darn good point.
I see exactly what you're saying.
Of course it would give them more control, because let's say you had committed murder and there was a death penalty awaiting you.
Gee, what difference would it make to you if you're just ready to hop on to the next life anyway?
Right, right.
If you thought there was an unending supply of lives to be had, then you're kind of looking at things a lot differently than if you think there's only one chance and you've got to get it right the first time around.
Yes, that's quite true.
But, you know, it leads me back to my chief worry about all of this, Peter, and that is that it almost, I don't know, it almost sounds like you're preaching the importance of believing in an afterlife so that we all behave ourselves.
And you're sort of tossing in a lot of things about the stories being the same and so forth.
It still sounds like you believe that we should have it for control.
No, I think that if we cannot believe, we're in a lot of trouble.
But that's not why we should believe.
We should believe because the evidence points in that direction.
We are intelligent people.
We have gotten to the point in our communications on this planet in the 21st century that We're not going to accept some minute little belief system anymore.
We have the whole world to look at and all the world's reports to consider.
And if those reports don't convince us of life after death, then the world is going to be in a lot of trouble.
But we are intelligent.
That fact is not going to change.
If we look at the reports, we do not see a consistent vision of life after death.
We're not going to believe in life after death, regardless of whether it's going to destroy civilization or not.
That's irrelevant.
We are logical creatures.
We're only going to believe in life after death if logically it makes sense to us.
You believe the interior passages of the Great Pyramid support this view, don't you?
Yes, actually I do.
What is it about them?
Okay, well let me give you a little preview of the passages.
When you start into the pyramid, it's a single passage going down at about a 30 or 45 degree angle.
Yes.
And it goes down and almost gets to ground level before it forks off.
And it forks off and has one passage going Upward, another passage going downward.
The passage going downward goes to like a rough hewn cell or crypt.
Meanwhile, the passage upward goes up four ways, and then it splits off into two different passages, one of which goes to like a burial chamber called the Queen's Chamber, and then the one higher goes up to the burial chamber called the King's Chamber.
But now this So there's, so in this, in the pyramids passageways, there's basically two forks in the road.
The first fork in the road actually is, the fork that goes up in the first fork of the road is actually closed off by a, I believe a granite plug.
Whereas the second fork in the road, it's similarly defined, similarly, clarified, because the larger the passageway to the key chamber is enlarged, right?
So in the on the first fork in the road, the upper passage is blocked.
Whereas in the second fork in the road, the upper passage is actually enhanced.
It's like saying, oh, come this way.
This is a better way to come.
All right.
So, Peter, hold it right at that point.
We're at the top of the hour.
And at a fork in the road, I guess.
One blocked and one available for passage.
We'll find out what that means when we get back.
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My guest is Peter Novak and Peter's a little nervous but he's got a He's got something very important to talk to you about, and that's whether there's actually life after death.
And that is what we're talking about, and at the moment about the Great Pyramids.
this will be right back tell you a little secret here
When I used to first get on the air, you know, when I was very early in my career, before I'd get on the air every night, I'd have panic attacks.
Did you?
Yeah, I'd have a hard time breathing.
I'd break out into a cold sweat.
And I don't know, it'd go on for a while and then the program would start and they'd stop.
As soon as I started doing what I wanted to do, it would all go away.
And I'd forget all about it, but it went on night after night after night when I used to get a panic attack.
So, I understand getting nervous.
I mean, you've written two books, The Lost Secrets of Death and The Division of Consciousness.
I just finished a third one.
A third one?
Yeah, I just got in the mail yesterday, so it should be hitting the shelves probably in October or November.
And the name of it?
Original Christianity.
Original Christianity.
Good!
We'll talk about that a little bit.
I'd love to talk about that a little bit, as a matter of fact, but we were in the pyramids.
Let's get that out of the way.
I think that two, three, four thousand years ago there was a single world religion, and you know the Christians are going to be all upset with that phrase because they think it's coming, but I think there was something that happened a long time ago.
You think it was an original world religion?
Well, I don't know if it was original.
I think it was a one world religion.
I believe there was a belief system.
A one world religion, huh?
That encompassed all civilized locations.
Or, you know, the majority of civilized locations.
And I think that our best snapshot of that is in ancient Egypt.
Okay.
And I think that they created their Great Pyramid The Great Pyramid shows exactly what they believed happened after death.
I had heard that they thought that the Great Pyramid would be a launching platform, kind of, for the soul.
There's a lot of different theories about what they believe, but what I have discovered is that the interior passageways of the Great Pyramid are a perfect reflection of the binary soul doctrine.
It's very simple.
And by that you mean the splitting of the souls?
Right, there's two splits.
The first split happens at the first fork in the road, and that's where the mind separates from the body.
The body continues down into the underground passageway, symbolically representing the fact that the body dies and there's no hope for it at all.
And the upper passageway you see is blocked by the granite plug and that shows that nothing physical can go on the upper passageway.
Oh, I see.
In other words, to pass that granite, you would have to be not in the physical.
You have to be non-physical.
It's only your non-physical elements that can go through the upper passageway.
I see.
Okay, that makes sense.
Okay, so you have your two non-physical elements going through the upper passageway.
Then you find you come to a second Fork in the Road.
And unlike the first Fork in the Road, both passageways are open.
But like the first Fork in the Road, one passageway is something special about it, right?
The upper passageway has a much higher ceiling.
It's called... I forget what it's called, but anyway, it's a real high ceiling and it really encourages It visually encourages you to take the upper passageway.
But there is a fork in the road, and I believe that... Actually, so there are two forks in this passageway.
I think the first fork in the road represents the first death, when the mental half of the person divides apart from the physical half.
Yes.
But then the second fork in the road represents what the binary soul doctrine talks about.
It talks about where The mind actually divides the part in two.
It goes into two separate sections.
Religions used to call the second death.
You see the same report about the second death in a lot of different religions.
You see it in the ancient Egyptian religion.
You see it in ancient Judaism.
You see it in a lot of different ones.
And I believe that the Great Pyramid reflects this in the diagram or in the design of the passageway.
Well, what it does mean is that's what the Egyptians may well have believed.
Right.
But it doesn't necessarily lend any sort of absolute reality the way testimony does about a prior life, for example, of life after death.
It sort of illustrates what the Egyptians... It shows, right, it shows that that belief in the second death, the belief in the division of the mind after death, it was a common belief within Within Egypt back then.
Okay, I can swallow that.
Now my research has convinced me that what we are seeing today being reported about near-death experiences and past life regression and ghosts and all the rest support that ancient belief system.
All these ancient, all these modern reports can be explained by that ancient belief that the mind splits apart into two parts.
And what's amazing to me, Art, what's amazing to me is that, you know, 4,000 years ago, the Egyptians and all these other traditions, all these other cultures, they believed that the mind had two parts.
And now, today, our modern science has come to the same conclusion.
Our psychologists have said, well, we have a conscious and an unconscious.
Our neurologists have said, oh, we have a left brain and a right brain, and they're very different.
That's quite true.
And this is a virtual duplication of what these ancient people used to believe.
As a matter of fact, we have a modern psychiatrist that works out of Harvard.
His name is Schiffer, and he's written a book called Of Two Minds, and he says that the right brain and the left brain Not just two halves of the mind, but that they actually represent two separate selves that exist in the brain at the same time.
Most of the time these two selves are integrated together, but they can function completely independently of each other.
That's exactly what the ancient Egyptians believed.
They believed that when you die, these two halves of the mind were completely separate and function completely independently of each other.
Okay.
You know, it's just amazing to me that modern science has come to the same conclusion that these cultures believed all these thousands of years ago.
Well, maybe because it's a, I don't know, it's a kind of a natural way for us to go.
I mean, we are aware of our consciousness when we're awake, and we're aware of the fact that we have a subconscious as well, that sometimes manifests dreams and all the rest of it when we sleep, right?
Let's talk a little bit about original Christianity.
If you just wrote a book about that, I'd be quite curious how different is original Christianity from what is practiced today?
Well, I can answer that question with one word, and that's reincarnation.
If you look at the Christian beliefs, And then you factor in reincarnation into the mix.
Yes.
That changes everything.
It changes everything.
And it comes out looking like a completely different creature.
And I believe it is, in order to do that, basically you have to adopt the binary soul doctrine as an element of original Christianity.
The two minds, yes.
Now, we know that original Christianity believed in resurrection.
They believed that at the end of time, the dead would be reawoken.
They would rise from the dead.
A lot of very modern Christians believe that.
Yeah, that is the fundamental element of the Christian belief, and we know that that goes back to the earliest years.
However, we have also discovered, I mean relatively recently, we've discovered that Well, we discovered proof.
We suggested, we suspected for a long time that this was true.
But with the discovery of some ancient scriptures, we found it to be true that the original Christians believed in reincarnation.
Now, you said proof.
That's a very strong word.
What has been uncovered?
Well, the Nag Hammadi scriptures that were found in Egypt in 1945 have documented that they did in fact believe at least certain segments or
certain sects of Christianity believed in reincarnation
from the very earliest years. Now it poses a very interesting problem
because how could they have believed in reincarnation and also have believed in resurrection
at the same time? I don't know. Well the only answer to that that I can come up with
is that they believe that there were two parts to the soul one part would reincarnate regularly and the other part
would not come back again until it was resurrected at the end of time.
Okay.
That's convenient, I guess, for that theory.
But I still ask, even if reincarnation is real, and it may well be real, there's quite a bit of compelling evidence that it is real, and that it was written out of religion, I still don't get it, Peter.
And what I don't get about it is, If you have no conscious memory of prior lives... Why?
Then so what?
You might as well, you know, you talk about being dead.
Worms crawl in and worms crawl out.
Absolutely, absolutely.
It essentially is that.
If there's no carrying forth of the memories and the experiences, the life experiences from one life to another, then you might as well say you're dead.
Exactly right, Art.
That's exactly right.
And you have touched upon the central problem with religion, the central problem with Christianity, the central problem with the Eastern religions that believe in reincarnation.
I think the answer to that, you know, we're going deeper and deeper into religion here.
Yeah, that's fine.
Is this split in the soul, right?
The problem, the answer to that problem, is that this is not the way it was supposed to be.
We were not originally supposed to divide apart at death.
When we did, it screwed up everything.
I think that the moment when all that got screwed up was it was recorded, maybe incorrectly or obscurely so, but it was recorded as the fall from grace in the Garden of Eden that was in the Bible and all that.
It was at some point early on in the human race.
So, let me see if I've got this straight.
The human mind splits upon death, and one part of it reincarnates, and another part of it, if I've got this right, proceeds to heaven or hell?
Well, it can be understood as that.
It can be understood as that.
The other part, actually, what it does is it ...descends into its own memories and its own emotions and basically it creates dreams for itself out of its memories and emotions of its own life.
It reviews its own life, you know, like the life review that you hear about from near-death experiences.
It reviews its life again and again and again and the more it does that, the more it starts to judge itself.
I've got that.
Peter, let me be absolutely straight.
The part that splits These two minds, the part that reincarnates, that must be the unconscious part.
No, the conscious part is the part that reincarnates.
See, I could have understood if it was the unconscious part, because that would account for the lack of the bringing forth of the memories.
See, memory is contained in the unconscious.
Memory is stored in the unconscious.
The conscious mind, by itself, Alone, by itself.
It has no memory.
It has no emotion.
It has no... It's completely dispassionate.
It's verbal.
It has free will.
It has the ability to make choices.
But it does not contain memory.
All the ancient religions specified this.
They said that one half of the soul had free will.
of the soul, it had free will, it had intellect, it had the spark of life.
It never died.
The other half, the soul, it had memory, it had emotion.
Okay, I think I do understand where you're coming from.
So the unconscious part of the mind storing all the memories is what goes to heaven or hell, or on to the next level, I guess we'll talk about that here in a while, but goes in that direction, while the conscious portion, which is only in the here and now, and doesn't contain all the memories, that's what reincarnates, and that accounts for the fact that you lose your memory.
It's just the here and now part of the mind.
That's kind of interesting.
And then, okay, so let's break over to the other part, that part, that unconscious part that has memories.
That's what has the near-death experience?
Well, Art, that's what has part of the near-death experience.
The near-death experience, remember, it has two parts.
It has the dark part, the dark phase and the light phase.
And I believe that these two phases are actually being experienced by the two different parts of the mind.
I think that the dark phase is being experienced by the conscious mind.
Now, if you look at the different reports of people that are going through the dark phase, you'll see something very interesting.
You'll see that they have a sudden reduction in their emotional intensity.
They seem to suddenly not be very concerned about their family or about their loved ones or really about much of anything.
But then, when the story changes and all of a sudden they start describing the light phase, when they're in the realm of light, Everything changes and all of a sudden they are experiencing extreme emotions and they're totally focused on the memories of their past life.
And these distinctions reflect the characteristics of the conscious and the unconscious.
Somebody once said something to me, it was actually John Lear repeating something somebody else said, but the bottom line is, maybe even Whitley, the bottom line is, the line was, and it's always bothered me, Peter, When you die, you know, you'll be given the choice of going to the light or the darkness.
Don't go to the light, they said.
It's a trick!
Go to the darkness.
That the light is a trick.
And nothing has ever bothered me as much since, Peter.
This is actually something that I believe that they teach in Tibetan Buddhism.
Really?
Yes, yes.
If you look in the The Tibetan Book of the Dead, it will talk about that same thing.
Well, now all you've done is worry me even more now.
Okay, now the thing is, a lot of ancient religions, they would, they decided, they seem to have decided, that it was impossible to prevent this division of the mind from occurring.
They thought it was just too hard, or maybe it was completely impossible to prevent this Division of the mind from occurring.
And so, instead of trying to prevent that division, what they would do is try to help a person to identify with one half of the mind, and disidentify with the other half.
And that way, the division would not bother them as much.
Now, some of the Eastern religions, like Islam, and like Hinduism and Buddhism, they seem to have identified with the conscious mind, with the conscious half of the mind.
Um, whereas other religions like, um, Christianity and, um, Judaism, they seem to have identified with the unconscious.
They said that, you know, the most important part of yourself is your own innermost soul and your feelings and your emotions.
And whereas the Eastern religion said the most important part of yourself is the dispassionate, unfeeling, abstract part of yourself.
And I believe that they did this because they basically gave up hope on preventing a division from occurring and said, well, this is the next best thing.
If you can identify with just one half or the other... In other words, if we can't stop it, then let's join it.
Yeah, basically sour grapes.
That's remarkable.
I'd never heard, frankly, of this division of the minds before, and now how it's treated by the of the various religions is absolutely fascinating.
All right, Peter, we're at the top of the hour, so hold tight right where you are.
And we will continue.
Peter Novak is my guest.
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Alright, so there are two parts to our mind.
The binary mind, if you will.
One part, the conscious part.
Now this is exactly opposite of the way I would have thought, but it's intriguing to think of it this way.
The conscious part actually just being that part which lives in the moment.
Not the part that has any of our memories or any of our experience at all, but just that part of our mind that lives in the moment.
The conscious moment.
And that's the part that reincarnates with no memory of the past.
So I don't know then what is the substance to that part of the mind.
On the other hand, Peter says the substantive part of our mind is that which holds the memories and the experiences and that is the subconscious part of the mind that goes in a very different direction.
In a moment, once again, Peter Novak.
I guess it really is humorous in a way.
All these years since hearing that trick thing, it's bothered the hell out of me.
And I don't see how I'm possibly going to pass on and get to that fork in the road, the darkness and the light, without... I don't know.
Pausing there on the path and looking back and forth.
Hmm.
Darkness.
Hmm.
Light.
Hmm.
John Lear.
Darkness.
Light.
Darkness.
Light.
Big choice, right?
Probably be stuck there looking back and forth.
Peter, welcome back.
Thank you.
That trick thing is going to bother me.
And I hate to hear that there's any substance apparently to it.
Alright, so our mind divides.
Right.
And is there any modern eyewitness kind of testimony about this, about soul division?
Anybody who's come back and talked about the division of the mind?
Actually, there have been a few.
I was actually surprised to discover that there were eyewitnesses to this in the modern age.
When I had written my first book, I was going purely on circumstantial evidence.
I realized that there was actually eyewitness evidence supporting this.
I have since discovered that there are a number of near-death experience subjects who have reported having their minds splitting apart after they die.
Now, some of these subjects, they say they will report that they saw themselves splitting in two.
They saw another part of themselves separating, going off in another direction.
but there are other or other
reports of near-death experiences where they would actually described
were when their minds are very different that they would experience subjectively
being in both hands at the same time but suffering and looking at each other
very strange well again the the half of the mind that becomes reincarnated
the conscious half
uh... seems of you know that's the place where i go well so what
It doesn't mean anything to us, since we're not going to remember it.
It means nothing.
But there's the other half of the mind, the subconscious, carrying all the memories.
Is that the one that gets to the fork in the road between the light and the darkness, or is that fork just fabrication?
I believe that fork in the road does occur.
I do not believe that choice does not come into that situation.
You do not choose at that point in time whether your mind is going to divide apart or not.
If your mind is going to divide apart, by that point it has already been decided.
It is already a foregone conclusion if it's going to happen or not.
If it's going to happen, it's going to be because over the course of your life, you have already divided your mind apart while you were living.
In what way?
You did that by alienating your unconscious mind from your conscious mind.
All of us, as we go through our lives, our unconscious is constantly whispering to us, Oh, you should have done this.
You should have been like that.
You should do this.
You should do that.
That's true.
It's basically our moral voice originates from our unconscious.
And it's preaching constantly to the conscious mind.
It is.
It's saying, you know this is wrong.
Right.
We have a choice.
We have a choice.
We can listen to this or we can ignore it and reject it.
And very often we do because the conscious mind is the stronger of the two halves of the mind.
It can push the unconscious away.
It can repress it.
It can ignore it.
It has free will, right?
Right.
And so, if one half of your mind is rejecting the other half of your mind while you're alive, then when you die, it does not surprise me if those two halves of the mind completely divide apart from each other.
If, on the other hand, over the course of your life, you listened to your moral voice of your unconscious You embraced it.
You recognized it.
You tried to integrate its messages into the way you live your life.
Then you would not divide yourself in two in life, and then you would not divide apart when you die.
Got it.
Got it.
Got it, got it, got it.
That's why you said, some people reincarnate, you believe, and some do not.
Is that correct?
Right, right.
And I also think that's why some people, like some of the Most exalted, most advanced Hindu holy men and Buddhist holy men, they claim they have reincarnated with memory.
They have not divided apart between lives.
They were able to maintain their memory from one life to the next.
Now what we see today of that phenomenon is very, very faint.
Now you see like these lamas and they will come back and they will have They will have enough memories of their previous life to
recognize personal possessions from their past life.
But there are elements of mankind's ancient traditions that lead me to an amazing hope,
to a very exciting hope for me.
That is that I believe that in mankind's distant past we all knew how to do this.
We reincarnated with memory again and again and again and again to the point that we would
have a continuous self-conscious awareness for 500 years, 1000 years, 2000 years.
If you look at the traditions of cultures in the Middle East, of Egypt, of India, of Mesopotamia, of even the Bible and the Jews, they would say that Way back, way back.
People lived for a long time.
They lived for 500 years, 1,000 years, 2,000 years.
That's right.
And I believe, my research into the binary soul doctrine has convinced me that what those traditions are actually saying is not that their physical bodies I don't want to lead you down a path that's going to get you into any trouble here, but trouble is my middle name.
whole. The incarnate is again and again and again as the same person. I absolutely understand.
Well, wouldn't that mean then, and I don't want to lead you down a path that's going
to get you into any trouble here, but trouble is my middle name, doesn't it mean that modern
America, Peter, modern America is pretty much a country of very separated souls.
I'm afraid so.
I think that probably most of the world is right now.
But that's not necessarily something that should surprise us.
If you look at the different religious traditions, they say this.
The Bible says Oh, we had the fall from grace in Eden, and now mankind is basically screwed.
We're in deep trouble.
You basically see the same story from India.
They say we're in the Kali Yuga.
It's the most degenerate There's quite a bit of modern evidence out there that what you say there is true.
Basically, that we're screwed.
However, you do claim that there are examples of those who live a pure life and listen to their subconscious implicitly and remain whole, but they are darn few and far between.
They are few and far between.
I think that they used to be less.
If you look at the traditional names of some of the high kings of Egypt, they have names like he whose lives repeat, he whose has had many lives.
I think that reflects the fact that they reincarnate with memory again and again and again.
Alright, let's talk about the people who have the split minds, most of us, frankly.
Basically, yeah.
Alright, so in their case, what evidence exists of, yes, okay, their consciousness goes flying into another life that doesn't know a damn thing about the prior life there, but what happens to their subconscious?
Well, their subconscious, we see reflections of separated subconsciouses In a number of different afterlife reports, we see that in the life phase of near-death experiences.
We also see that in reports of haunting ghosts.
You think that produces such, I don't know, some of them are so unrested that they simply cannot proceed as they should otherwise and they become ghosts?
No, I think that these are actually separate halves of a human mind.
Right, I get it.
That they are so... Basically, they're mentally disturbed.
They're mentally dysfunctional.
Because they are split minds.
They're only half of the whole mind.
Right.
And because they are so dysfunctional, you see evidence of mental illness in Haunting Goose.
You see evidence of mental illness in an awful lot of different kinds of afterlife A phenomenon.
You're right.
Well, I mean, a lot of it seems crazy.
What's done and, you know, the displays put on and the rest of that.
It does seem kind of crazy.
Yeah.
The other half of the coin is the poltergeist.
I think that the haunting ghost and the poltergeist, we're looking at two different halves of the mind.
Whereas the haunting ghost tends to be completely frozen in their own memories.
I suppose that's true.
Emotions and they're completely subjective and they're not aware of what's going on around them. The exact opposite is
true about Poltergeists, they don't seem to have any memories or
emotions of their own and they seem to be completely focused on what's going on
Around them. They're completely objective oriented Um, I suppose that's true
But there must be then also why yes, I shouldn't say must Are there a group then that go where it to a tradition?
Do they get to a traditional heaven or something in between?
Where do the rest of these souls that don't become poltergeist or ghosts go?
The question is, if you see this ghost and he's doing whatever it is he's doing, he's doing it again and again and again, you're looking at him objectively.
You're looking at him as from a third person.
You can't necessarily tell what he's experiencing Within his own mind.
Right.
Within his own mind, he could be experiencing that he's in hell.
It's very interesting if you look at different reports of hell from near-death experiences.
There are two different kinds of reports about this.
One, in which people during a near-death experience, they discover, oh, I am in hell, or it feels like I'm in hell.
And they would ascribe a scene of extreme Agony and torture.
Very, very horrible to even read these reports.
But then you also hear different kind of reports about people who go to heaven and then they get to look into hell.
And what they see there is a very different kind of thing.
They see these creatures that are walking around and they're just kind of aimless and they're just kind of having internal surges of anxiety and distress.
You're right.
And they're not aware of what's going on around them.
I've had that described to me, Peter.
Believe me, I've had it described to me.
I think that their internal experiences, that they are in hell.
One version, you're looking at them from the outside.
The other version, you're having it described to you what they are experiencing inside.
It's the same thing.
I'm trying to hold out some hope here.
Do some of these minds slip through to what we conventionally think of as heaven, or do you think not?
Absolutely, I do.
Oh, you do?
I think that there is such a thing as heaven.
Actually, I think that there are two different kinds of heaven.
I think that there is a heaven for a separated mind, and then there is a totally different kind of a thing for the person whose mind does not divide apart.
I think that for the person who has a separated mind, it is basically a dream world experience.
It's a dream reality.
It's a construct that they have created within their own minds.
But this would be a level below a complete reincarnation, wouldn't it?
Should we think of it that way?
I wouldn't think of it as a reincarnation.
I still think that... No, I'm saying a level below.
In other words, a complete reincarnation would be the whole mind.
So would a split soul that goes to what we think of as heaven be in a better place than somebody who had wholly recreated?
No, I think they would be in a worse place, but they may not realize it because without their conscious mind they do not have the intellectual capacity to realize the limitations of their existence.
They don't have the ability to make choices.
They don't have the ability to Um, to be free and independent and creative.
But they wouldn't realize that either, so it wouldn't be a big problem for them.
In other words, uh, their free will is gone, but they don't... They're basically having a happy dream.
Yeah, they're having a happy dream, so they don't care.
They don't care that their free will is gone because... Right, because they don't really realize it.
But there's a whole different level, a whole different level of people, I believe, whose minds do not divide apart at death.
And I can only look to different traditions that have reported the experiences of these people.
They actually describe them as like mini-gods.
They are immortal.
They have supreme happiness and complete freedom.
And I think, to be perfectly honest, it's probably close to impossible for us to describe what it is that they're experiencing.
Well, I'm appreciative of the fact that you're doing the best you can.
Anyway, this is a whole different way of looking at all of this for me, and it's perhaps a logical way.
I can sort of understand what you've been saying.
I really can.
So, the split minds that go to a heaven, it's really not as high a calling As the whole mind that goes forward and becomes another complete person and their life continues for, well, indefinitely?
Right.
You don't know.
If they have their mind whole, you do not know if they necessarily come back and reincarnate on earth or not.
They may choose to do that.
They may choose to do something else.
We don't, you know, we have really no idea what options would be available to them at that point.
So they could reincarnate as some kind of gods, or some kind of aliens, or some kind of something that we can't possibly even understand?
Right, right.
But what they had done was they had basically graduated from... Graduated?
Graduated from Earth, right.
Because right now everyone here, we're struggling with this recurring There's a recurring cycle of soul division.
We reincarnate, we divide, we reincarnate, we divide.
If someone escapes that cycle, they would discover a freedom that I really think we could probably not even comprehend.
They would be completely free of the limitations That human being experience in this world.
But that would be a very unusual individual.
Most of us would be doing the fifth grade again and again and again, right?
Yeah, exactly.
All right, hold it right there.
When we get back, we'll begin to explore questions from all of you for Peter Novak.
I wonder if you were able to... Actually, I was quite able to follow along with this.
It's an intriguing and different way To think about it all.
From the high desert, I'm Art Bell.
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It's always absolutely fascinating watching the audience reaction.
Man...
As it began to sink in, people have paid my guest compliments.
My guest, by the way, Peter Novak.
Everything from, I think he's virtually discovered the religious equivalent of the theory of everything to a simple, come on art, Christians don't believe in that reincarnation BS.
You know, they regard it as heretical.
So you get all lines of opinion.
One thing's for sure though, it's a lot to think about.
One thing's for sure, if you listen to this program in order to sort of
get some brain food and something different to think about, you've
definitely received your money's worth this morning.
Peter Novak is my guest, and he's talking about the binary mind, the splitting of the mind with respect to life after death, with respect to whether we retain consciousness or not.
It's been quite a story.
Peter, welcome back.
Thank you.
Was this ever close to being a one world religion?
A single idea that virtually was grasped by most of the world?
It seems to be the case, yes.
I have found this same belief in dividing souls.
A soul has two parts.
It divides apart.
I found that idea in cultures all over the world.
I found it in Asia.
I found it in basically every continent.
I was very surprised to find that it was very widespread among the American Indian before the white men showed up.
I think that's right.
I mean, we can all look around the world right now, and whether it's admitted or not, we're really involved in war, as we have been, I guess, in all of man's memory, because of our different beliefs, right?
There are people attacking us because of their beliefs, and they've concluded, we're not going to convert to theirs, so they're going to kill us instead.
Either convert or kill.
So, some might argue we haven't made much progress.
No.
No, we haven't.
But I think that actually there's really only one belief, even today.
It's a choice, really, not a belief.
It's a choice of whether or not we choose to Listen to our own highest values, our own highest ideals, or we choose to ignore and reject them.
And that's the choice that people have always had and the choice that people always will have.
And I think that while you could argue that today you see a conflict between belief systems, I think the actual, the only conflict is whether or not we should listen to our own conscience, or whether we should listen to our own fear.
Hmm.
I think a lot of people who have listened to what you've said this morning feel some truth about it deep in their soul, but you just never know what people think.
We're about to find out.
First time caller on the line, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Good morning.
Good morning.
Hi, this is Sarah from Indiana.
Yes.
Well, I believe also that splitting of the mind is very fascinating.
But I believe that what comes around, goes around.
Karma.
If you do, yes.
Karma, yeah, okay.
It comes back to you.
Well, let's find out what Peter thinks about the whole concept of karma.
You're talking about the consequences of your actions, and I believe that that's an absolute law, and I think that there's a lot of evidence to support that.
I think that when the mind divides apart, both halves of the mind experience the consequences of their actions.
They experience those in different ways, but they do experience them.
So you're saying that even the mind that reincarnates consciously, the conscious part of the mind which has no memories, you're telling me it too experiences karma?
Yes, I think that it does.
I think that it experiences karma in that the elements of the life that it confronts, the elements of the life that it goes to next, reflects the consequences of the actions that it did in its previous life.
You realize that seems terribly unfair.
No, I think that's completely fair.
Well, Noah, how is that fair?
Now, Peter, listen to me.
If it's a conscious part of the mind that reincarnates with absolutely no memory of prior behavior, then it's getting karma that is punishing it like a little black cloud following it around, punishing it for something it has no memory of.
Now, where's the fairness in that?
Yes.
It still did those things.
Well... It still made those choices.
Now, its unconscious is suffering in its own hell.
Its conscious mind is reincarnated, but it still has to confront the consequences of its behavior.
The person, even if it divides apart, that person, that's not a way out.
That's not a way to avoid justice.
Well, okay, but it seems like, to me, it seems like strapping a crazy person into the electric chair.
Okay, but you're saying that because you think that... That it's unfair?
No, it is unfair.
It kind of is.
It depends on whether or not the person chose to divide apart and That goes way back to the whole question of, in the beginning, when we first started to divide apart and lose our memory between lives, did we choose that?
Did we do that consciously?
Did we realize that that was going to be the consequence of that choice or not?
If it was, then 5,000 generations later, we would still be justified in Confronting the consequences of our behavior.
Got it.
Got it.
All right.
Wild Card Line, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Hi.
Yes, hi.
I was reading in the book of Mary Magdalene, and Jesus was talking about each of the different parts of the mind, and he talks about the soul, the psyche, and what they call the nose, or NAUS.
You ever heard about this?
You're talking about the gospel of Mary, right?
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
It's very, very interesting.
Yes.
The Gospel of Mary does talk about, I think of the passage you're talking about, this was a passage, this was a book that was discovered among the Nag Hammadi scriptures in 1945, and the passage you're talking about, Mary asks Jesus, she says, okay, I just saw a vision, Lord, she says, and when I saw the vision, did I see that vision with my soul or with my spirit?
And he said, No, you did not see that vision with your soul or with your spirit.
You saw that vision with the new, N-O-U-S, that exists between the soul and the spirit.
And that's a very, very important passage in that book because that shows that when that book was written, That not only did it believe in the binary soul doctrine, believe that you have two parts, but it also believed that there was a unity that was believed to exist between the two parts.
That there was a wholeness, there was a completion, there was a actual self that existed.
And there was that self, there was that mind.
New means mind in Greek.
That mind, that wholeness.
That experience, that vision, is what you were saying.
Well, it also clearly shows that my listeners apparently do understand exactly what you're talking about.
Wonderful.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Hello.
Hello, this is Alper.
Am I on the air?
Yes, you are.
Okay.
I have a question.
I'm 20 years old, okay?
Right.
I'm a young kid.
I really don't think I know that much.
When it comes to this, I have a question, though.
Okay.
I believe that the soul, I mean, I don't believe in reincarnation.
But I'm a Christian, and like the Bible says, at the moment of conception you are given an individual immortal soul, and then I'm guessing that the Bible talks specifically about different things, like man being created in God's image.
So what I think is being reincarnated defeats the whole purpose of salvation, just like purgatory.
And that's basically what I mean, because Christ died for us all at one chance in our life, not the other.
Alright.
I'll hang up and listen, okay?
Alright.
Peter, there you have it.
Pretty conventional view.
It is.
What was the first thing you said again?
He's gone now.
Oh, he's gone now.
He said that... I forgot what it was.
It is conventional view.
However, the Bible actually does describe a person as having two separate parts.
He said that he believed that the Bible said that when you're born, God gives you an immoral soul at that point in time.
Actually, the Bible does not say that.
That was a decision that basically a political group decided to believe in around in the fourth century.
Well, Peter, I think he said that man was created in God's image, right?
Right, he did say that.
And perhaps God is of two minds.
Well, and that's actually very true.
In the Old Testament, in particular, it describes God as having both a soul and a spirit.
And in a number of cases, the Bible describes God as being a unity that is created That exists from a duality or from a multiplicity.
And that duality passed on to us in his image.
Right, right.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Hello.
Hello.
Yes, what is your first name, huh?
This is Brandy.
Brandy, okay.
Right there.
I have a few things that might help clear a little bit of this up with some confusion with other guests.
I'm a believer of reincarnation.
I believe it exists.
Um, many believe that Jesus Christ has reincarnated.
Um, a former guest, uh, Maurice Cotterell.
Yes.
Are you familiar?
Yes.
He kind of went into, like, how he sort of believed that Jesus has reincarnated many times in many different, um, if you will.
Where'd she go?
Uh, where'd she go?
Are you still there?
Hello?
You're still there.
We lost you for a moment.
I'm sorry.
Oh, sorry about that.
Well, anyway, I heard you were saying something like somebody told you don't go into the light because it's a trick.
Yes.
And then, Peter, you said that's like the sour grapes situation.
And I'm kind of wondering if maybe the Eastern people believe to choose light for reincarnation for a second chance of being better in a different life because maybe they know they've screwed up.
And they're too afraid of judgment quite yet, and maybe they think that because there is an option to go both ways instead of just one way, that maybe they're just not quite ready for judgment.
And maybe the Western thinks that we should choose the dark way for a chance of final judgment in hopes to get into heaven, even if they've had a less than perfect life, and hoping that they would have forgiveness from Jesus.
Well, the division where you have a choice between the light and the dark, I don't think you actually have a choice there.
The light phase, if you think about the conscious mind as being a lightbulb, it is very objective.
It looks and sees things around it.
But by itself, that lightbulb is surrounded by nothing but darkness.
So even though That light bulb is illuminating, it's showing off light.
It still perceives itself as being in a realm of complete darkness.
So I believe that the conscious mind, after death, it actually experiences itself as being in a realm of darkness.
Even though it is showing the light, it does not see anything reflecting that light back to itself.
What kind of feedback do you generally get from traditional Christians?
You're going to get a lot of them on the phone and so on.
I'm just curious.
I get the whole spectrum.
I think that really a lot more today than maybe 20 years ago, 50 years ago, people are a lot more open-minded.
They have been exposed to a lot more different perspectives and they're a lot more interested in seeing a An integration of the different kind of perspectives that are out there.
So you do get some are receptive to what you're saying?
Yes, some are receptive and some definitely are not.
Some are very dyed in the wool.
They have been taught what to believe and I don't think they've ever actually considered things for themselves.
They simply accepted what it is that they were taught from generations past and they've not Try to adapt that to any new information, any new data, such as we've seen in the last 50 years or so.
All right.
Peter, what does the binary soul, the whole thing about the division of the soul, the doctrine, tell us about American politics?
Oh, it's one of my favorite things.
Is it?
Okay.
Okay.
I think that the two halves of the soul, the conscious and the unconscious, the left brain and the right brain.
They really reflect the two political parties in America today.
The conscious mind is very objective.
It's very impersonal.
It believes in its own free will, its own independence, its own autonomy, its own ability to uh... work for itself the conscious mind believes itself to be a whole unto itself and that's because the conscious mind, the left brain mind recognizes details.
Is that the liberal?
Is that the democrat?
No, this is the republican.
This is the republican, conservative.
The left brain mind recognizes details and differences between itself and other people and that's because it sees itself as a whole unto itself.
Everything else is separate from itself.
Whereas the unconscious, the right brain, sees itself as a part of a whole.
It sees connections and similarities between itself and other people.
And because of that, the left brain mind sees power and authority and autonomy as its strongest strengths.
Whereas the right brain, the unconscious, sees relationships and feelings and a sense of connection as being its strongest strength.
In other words, that's alright as you whack up a lung.
So that would be the liberal side.
Yes.
Alright, got it.
First time caller on the line, you're on the air with Peter.
Hello.
Hello.
Good morning.
You're on the air.
Can you hear me?
I hear you.
Oh yeah.
My name is Chu.
I myself grew up in Taiwan and I came to the United States a few years ago.
Yes.
And because in Taiwan, usually people have a common idea that we all have, for example, if somebody has some bad thing happen to him, for example, you have some kind of disease or have some kind of car accident.
Yes.
People will say that, oh, in your previous life, you must have done something wrong.
Yes.
And for a long time, I don't believe it.
But I came to the United States two years ago.
And you believe that now?
Yeah, kind of.
And last year, I went back to Taiwan to have Surgery to correct my deviated septum?
Yes.
It's a very simple surgery.
However, the doctor, he removed all my turbinates, and right now, I have many, many problems breathing, and many, many, they call it atrophic rhinitis.
And I call one guy, and he lives in Texas.
He's Caucasian, he's American, and he's a Christian, too.
So he has some kind of, like, ability or something.
He told me many things bad about my past and my future.
He didn't tell me anything about my previous life.
Consequence?
Is that a better word?
Consequence?
that this man thinks that uh... what happened to him uh... was uh...
uh... you know punishment probably is the wrong word to use but uh...
uh...
consequence is that a better word consequence
here A consequence of what you did in your prior life.
All right, my guest is Peter Novak, and we're taking questions for him.
Actually, it's a fascinating look at who we might be and where we might go when this life is over.
From the High Desert, I'm Mark Bell.
Well, I think it's time to get ready To realize just what I have found
I have been only half of what I am It's all clear to me now
My heart is on fire I'm ready to go
The End Instrumental
The Hall of the City Street was beating The night from the neon's turned the dark to day
The night from the neon's turned the dark to day We were too hot to think of sleeping
We were too hot to be sleeping The heart of the city street was beating
We had to get out before the magic got away We were born with the night
Painted in the shadows I'll watch you at night
Till the morning light To talk with Art Bell, call the wildcard line at area code
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The first time caller line is area code 775-727-1222.
To talk with Art Bell from East of the Rockies, call toll free at 800-825-5033.
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From coast to coast and worldwide on the Internet, this is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell.
It is.
My guest is Peter Novak.
He'll be back in a moment tomorrow night.
Jim Birkland will be here with all the volcanoes popping.
You know, of course, Mount St.
Helens is last week, and that's not all in Russia.
All around the world, and a lot of earthquakes occurring, it's, well, actually a perfect time for Jim Birkland.
We'll talk about what's going on with the Earth tomorrow night.
in that use a little discussion i would say but in a moment back to uh...
you don't know that once again here's peter novak uh...
Peter, in your own personal life, do you think that you've connected the two halves of your mind sufficiently that you expect reincarnation as a whole?
No, I don't.
No, huh?
I'm no holy man, no.
I'm just a researcher, and other than that, I'm as screwed up as the rest of us.
All right.
First time caller of the line?
Hold on.
Excise that out.
We don't know last names, so that made me push the button.
Let's start again.
Your first name is?
My name is Ed.
I'm listening to you on KPNW here in Eugene, Oregon.
Excellent.
And I would like to ask Peter if he feels that the UFOs are reincarnated beings, and having had a sighting tonight which covered from Medford Apparently clear to Portland.
Well, they say it was a meteorite.
But you don't have to believe them because they don't have the rock to prove it yet, buddy.
And they're saying there was an explosion at Newburgh.
Right.
And everybody in the Valley is really excited.
A lot of us listen to you and we're wondering if, in the Bible, it says in the last days that will will be there'll be lights in the skies and I'd just like to have your guests opinion on all of this all right well let's start with I don't know about the last days and we'll have to wonder about that one but Peter the question about reincarnating as another entity or an entity that might be perceived as
An alien or alien to us?
Why not?
I certainly think that's possible.
A lot of different cultures believed that you could be reincarnated in another species besides human.
But whether these are or not, you know, I could just give you pure speculation.
But one thing I would add is that I have started to become intrigued lately About possible connections between the binary soul doctrine and reports of alien abductions, because there seems to be a couple connections there that are intriguing to me.
Well, I sort of jumped when you said that anyway, and abductions, a connection with, wow.
Well, I was just wondering if it's possible that these alien abductions are actually Out-of-body experiences rather than actual physical abductions.
There are some connections that seem to be potentially there as far as out-of-body experiences.
If it is only the unconscious mind that is being taken away, that would explain a couple of things.
It would explain why they have such a strong emotional What it wouldn't explain, unless you can tell me how, is how there would be eyewitnesses to abductions.
They've actually seen bodies rising through the air.
No, it wouldn't explain that.
No, it wouldn't explain that.
and they're unable to move well that will be but it wouldn't explain unless you can
tell me how it is how there would be a eyewitnesses to abductions they've
actually seen bodies rising through the air when it wouldn't it wouldn't explain
that yet no one explain that uh... wildcard line you're on the
air with peter novak hello
Mr. Novak?
Yes.
I wonder if you are familiar with Jane Roberts' work?
Seth, yeah.
Yeah, right, Seth.
Well, of course, she's dead now, but her books are still being finished.
They're doing work in Yale University right now, completing the rest of the works.
They figure it's going to take them several years.
So you see parallels in the work?
Oh yes.
Peter, did you take some?
I have not explored the Seth material nearly as much as I should and nearly as much as I intend to.
But yes, I am aware of at least some parallels between that and the binary soul doctrine.
Seth did talk about the human experience or the human psyche being dual, having two elements to it.
I believe there's a lot more there to be explored.
Okay.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Good morning.
Good morning.
Hi.
Yes, sir.
This is Charles, listening in on WABC in New York City.
Of course.
And Mr. Bell, your show is a beacon of a night to me and millions of others.
Thank you.
Thank you.
My thanks.
Just a question.
If we come back each time as a de novo, in the now conscious mind, How do you explain past life memories and the ability to be regressed and be, since each and every time we transit as a conscious single mind, how come we each and every time reincarnate as a binomial mind?
Where do we pick up that second mind?
This is a wonderful, wonderful question.
It is.
Congratulations for coming up with those questions.
Thank you.
Alright, now the answer.
The one question, well the one answer is that The division between the conscious and the unconscious, the division between the soul and the spirit, it's never complete.
It's never absolute.
It's experiential rather than absolute.
The division between the conscious and the unconscious is leaky.
There's always a certain amount of leakage that occurs.
You hear about this with Freudian slips and all kinds of things.
You cannot completely keep the unconscious down.
That would be one part.
The other part would be that I believe that we actually only have one soul and one spirit.
However, each lifetime, it's only a portion of that soul that we use for each individual life that we use and we record all of our memories under that one little portion.
So at the end of that life, that portion is separated away and we get a new portion of the soul that becomes the soul for the following life.
You're saying that, in other words, we come back with primarily a conscious mind, but there is some remnant of unconscious.
It's a big conscious, but a little unconscious.
Right.
There is some minor connection, and it is really our purpose in life, I believe, to increase that connection, to reunify the two halves of the mind.
How many people do you think are walking on Earth right now, Peter?
Who have achieved that incredible oneness that will guarantee them coming back again and again as a whole?
I hope that there are some.
I have no idea how many.
I doubt that the numbers were large.
I can only hope that there are at least some.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Hello.
Hello.
Yes, my name is Bill.
I'm from Washington State.
Okay, Bill, you're going to have to yell at us.
You're not too loud.
Okay.
In April of 1999, I died.
I don't usually talk about the experience much, but I'm willing to share a little bit of what I went through with that.
As the process went on, my final thoughts were a lot of empathy for people in the world.
Well, when you say you died, did you have a... you physically died?
You actually had a cessation of heartbeat and so forth?
Correct.
And you felt an empathy?
My last living thoughts, yes.
My final experiences were almost like the tapping of a computer keyboard.
I kind of assumed they were like synapse response.
And then the experience that I had, I refer to as, they're not there.
Like most people, I've been in many states of consciousness, awake, asleep, intoxicated, whatever.
But this was, I'm not there.
I just, I was not there.
And when I returned to my body, it was sort of a slight rush.
But this was this experience I had.
And about seven months later, I had a roommate who died in a fire.
And it was a terrible shock, an awful thing.
But about 30 hours afterwards, I felt her come through me, and she was a druggie, and she was lamenting her inability to do drugs.
And what I've carried from that is that the dying experience disassociates you from your consciousness.
And that, however, must be brief, because I could feel it in my roommate later.
You know, you somehow come back over time.
Time is a constant.
The first experience is completely dissociative.
You're not there, but somehow you do rematerialize.
All right.
Peter?
What's very interesting is that if you look at reports of near-death experiences, the first phase, the dark phase, the floating alone in an empty void, We're going through an empty tunnel.
It's very often described as a complete lack of emotion, a sense of disconnection and detachment and disrelation.
And that changes, of course, in the light phase.
But what's interesting to me is that the two phases of the near-death experience suggest That the mind is in the process of dividing apart.
However, you know, the person with a near-death experience, they do come back.
I believe that when they come back, the two halves of the mind, they were dividing apart.
They kind of snapped back together, kind of like a rubber band that was stretched apart and snapped back.
I think that that snap back actually ends up making the mind more whole, more complete, more integrated than it was before.
And that increased Well, that certainly is true.
I know people that have been hit by lightning.
experience, I believe, explains a lot of the psychic abilities and psychic phenomena that
people very commonly report after going through a near-death experience.
Well, that certainly is true.
I know people that have been hit by lightning.
Danion Brinkley is a very good example, hit by lightning.
And then a remarkable, overpowering ability to know about things and people.
And Daniel has told me that over a period of time, it faded.
It certainly is far from gone, but the amount of it faded.
Initially, it was so bad and so strong that the voices he would hear and the thoughts that he would hear from people near him would overwhelm him.
To the point of distraction.
It began that strongly and then sort of diminished a little bit at least.
Well, now I'm familiar with Danion's story, and as he reported it before his near-death experience, before his first one, he did not describe himself as being a very moral person.
Not at all.
And because of this, I think that after his near-death experience, his mind snapped.
Back together and became stronger and healthier and more integrated and a stronger paranormal perception of the mind.
However, if he continued with the same kind of life behavior patterns that he had before, that according to the Binary Soul Doctrine, that would have eventually re-divided his mind, which would have Reduced his psychic abilities once again.
Well, he's still working on it, Peter.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Peter Novak.
Hello.
This is Morris.
Morris, where are you?
Just outside of Houston.
Houston, alright.
I actually have memories of having a consciousness at birth.
And it's kind of strange because it's something that I've kind of remembered little pieces that I've passed down through my life.
I'm 47 years old now and I probably remember more now than I did 20 years ago.
But I've actually passed down this consciousness, or this memory of this consciousness.
Number one being that I remember that it was a decision of mine to enter this life and
I think it was more than likely my first one because I remember the shock of the first
of being born, the actually excruciating pain just because of the sensation of actually
having nerve endings or what have you, and just feeling the excruciating pain and actually
wanting to change my mind about my decision to do this.
Like, what have I done?
I thought the same thing when I was in Air Force Boot Camp.
I cried mama for a while.
Did it desensitize very rapidly?
That's basically what happened.
It desensitized to where it was bearable so I felt like I could go on with it.
But one other thing I do remember is that feeling that it was a test.
That this life was a test and I had a question of You know, knowing that I had this wisdom of what everything, what it was all about, and I don't remember all the details of that, but knowing that I had this feeling of what this was all about, and I thought, well, you know, how can the world be so screwed up, basically, and how could anybody possibly fail this test?
And then giving the wisdom that, well, you're going to lose this, You're going to lose the memory that you have when you go into this life.
Alright, well let me stop you there, because we don't have a lot of time, but the line he said that I thought was, that really grabbed me, was that he actually has memory of a blast of consciousness actually at birth.
That's amazing.
That's extraordinary.
That is extraordinary.
You hear that very rarely with the average person.
You do encounter that when people regress with Yes, sir.
Good morning.
It reminds me of that movie from Forbidden Planet.
most people do not have that naturally uh... right was for the rockies you're on the air with peter
novak good morning after
good morning uh...
remind me of that movie from forbidden planet beware the monsters of the year
that's right uh... maybe there's something to that game
Uh, you know, the negative, positive, and all this.
Maybe.
Might be responsible for the splitting.
And even more so, it'd be interesting to find out who the architects are responsible for creating that splitting.
Now, another thing that reminded me of, and I'll be too cocky, you've been, I guess, on your program many times before, and you mentioned, like in many worlds, theory of twelve dimensions and perhaps more.
Yes.
Which subscribe to the conceptuality that there might be duplicates or versions of ourselves that reside within these parallel dimensions.
Would that not also mean that we may have more duplicates of ourselves thereto?
Or that we might reincarnate to those other dimensions.
Who's to say?
I mean, if the theoretical physicists are correct, and there are eleven or more dimensions, then perhaps reincarnation in one of those is equally possible.
Peter?
I certainly think that is a possibility.
I tend to believe in the multi-dimensional theory of reality, and because This makes actually things very confusing when it comes to trying to integrate past life memories because if you are integrating a memory of a past life that was in a parallel universe, it may have had a different history than what we have here.
But I do think that's certainly possible.
And it might be much more difficult to remember because you would have no reference.
Right.
It would be so different that you would have no reference for it.
All right.
You have just written a book.
Is it called Original Christianity?
That's the one coming out this fall.
The ones that they can get right now are The Division of Consciousness and The Lost Secret of Death.
The Lost Secret of Death.
Is it singular in here?
It says Lost Secrets.
It's Lost Secret Singular.
Oh, Secret Singular, okay.
I would direct everyone on my website.
It's divisiontheory.com.
Division... Oh, I'm glad you gave that to me.
You should have done that earlier in the show.
Say it again.
DivisionTheory.com.
DivisionTheory.com.
All right.
Well, I hope a lot of people go there, and I hope a lot of people look into what you've said.
And I trust that they will, Peter, because, you know, at first when I heard you tonight, I wasn't sure that it was going to all sink in with me.
But it kind of congealed, you know, into the second half hour hour.
It began to congeal and I suddenly got it, buddy.
So thank you for being here.
I appreciate it.
And we'll have you back again.
Wonderful.
Take care, Peter.
You too.
And here she is.
This is Crystal.
Always the right words.
Get us out of here.
See you tomorrow night from the high desert.
Night all.
Midnight in the desert.
Shooting stars across the sky This magical journey Will take us on a ride You with the longing Searching for the truth Will we make it till tomorrow?
Will the sun shine on you?
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