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May 29, 2004 - Art Bell

02:51:55

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Robert Felix - Climate Change

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01:15:20

robert felix

01:01:15

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art bell ▲ ● ▼		From the high desert of the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening, good morning, good afternoon, whatever the case may be, in whatever time zone you reside in.
		So many of them out there, and every single one of them covered by this program, Coast to Coast AM weekend version.
		I'm Art Bell and honored to be here with you through the weekend for whatever develops.
		And it will be one of those kinds weekends for this hour.
		It's devoted entirely to open screen.
		Unlined, no net phone calls.
		We just pick it up and do it.
		So numbers are a little different on the weekend.
		You might recall your list if you have one and if not wait for the wait for the bottom of the yard.
		We'll spew the numbers for it.
		Well, what an incredible week it has been for Ramona and myself.
		We took off for New York City last weekend, and of course I wasn't here as you know, we took off for New York City and on Monday at the New York Museum of Natural History we went to the screen debut the premiere of the day after tomorrow, which as you know is a movie ripping them up out there, I might add.
		I saw something indicating it's projecting a $100 million weekend.
		A $100 million weekend.
		Can you imagine that?
		Anyway, we got to go, and it was really cool at the Museum of Natural History outside.
		They had snow coming down.
		It was incredible.
		I mean, they had a machine making snow so that all the reporters there and all the dignitaries, you know, New York City politicians and the stars of the movie and everybody would get snowed on whilst they waited outside.
		It was very effective.
		And I took a photo.
		Well, actually, Ramona took a photograph waiting to get in.
		Guess who I should be next to?
		But one of the stars of the movie, Jake Dylan Hall.
		And so you'll see me with Jake.
		If you have seen the movie, then you will instantly recognize his face, or you may from elsewhere.
		I don't know.
		But that's on my webcam tonight.
		If you go to www.coastocoastam.com in the upper left-hand corner, it'll say Arts Webcam.
		Click on that.
		And if you look carefully, you'll see some little flakes of, well, not snow, what was meant to be snow, and it certainly looked like it.
		I actually don't know what it was.
		It may have been some sort of polymer or some I don't know.
		I have no idea what it was, but it was very effectively, it was certainly kind of like snow, whatever it was.
		And it was coming down on all of us.
		And then, of course, we all marched inside and went to the premiere.
		And, oh, my God.
		I told you, I told you that if you had seen 10.5 on television about the earthquake, this would make that look like a Sunday picnic.
unidentified		And it absolutely did.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is a motion picture.
		And, of course, I'm not going to give away the plot.
		But it is a motion picture that grabs you by the vitals the moment it begins and you're on a roller coaster ride.
		And what a ride it is.
		Oh, the special effects in this movie are incredible.
		Incredible.
		And by the way, be sure and stay to the very end.
		You know, when everybody else begins to get up and walk out of the theater because the credits are rolling, stick around.
		Because in the credits, you will see somewhere down there, inspired in part by the book, The Coming Global Superstorm by Art Bell and Whitley Striber.
		You'll see that in the end credits.
		So there you have it.
		It was a really indescribably odd experience to go to the premiere of a movie based in part on a book you wrote.
		It really was.
		It was nerve-wracking and fun and exciting and adrenaline-rushing.
		And you can't even imagine.
		So my perspective, no doubt, is very different than others, but I just loved it.
		I absolutely loved it.
		And I'm enjoying hearing by email what you all thought of it.
		And I certainly am getting emails.
		No question about that.
		Tons and tons of emails.
		So if you have a comment on the motion picture, it's going to be raging through the weekend.
		That's already a fact.
		And perhaps weekends to come.
		And then ultimately, you'll get an opportunity to get it on DVD, no doubt.
		All right.
		Well, if you'd like to send me an email, comment on it.
		You're welcome to.
		I would be Art Bell.
		That's A-R-T-B-E-L-L at MindSpring.com or Artbell at A-O-L dot com.
		All strung together, lowercase, of course.
		Take a look at that picture.
unidentified		It's kind of cool.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		With Jake.
		All right.
		This is from a scientist, a fellow named Monty J. Edwards II, who says, Dear Art, I am a scientist, physical chemistry at Marshall University, and recently read your book, The Coming Global Superstorm.
		I wanted to inform you how much of an impact this book has had on my view of atmospheric chemistry in the last week.
		I found it insightful, concise, but more importantly, very powerful.
		It is unfortunate that more mainstream scientists are willing to look in The opposite direction on this issue.
		Our very survival as a species is depending on a solution.
		I only wish that I would have read the book earlier.
		Thank you for excellence in broadcasting.
		Keep up.
		The good work.
		Monty J. Edwards II.
		So there you have it.
		The motion picture based on that book raging through this weekend.
		You can see it at a local theater.
		God, the special effects.
		Just incredible.
		a moment we'll review some of the rest of the world you you you you Thank you.
		You ever wonder about the news?
		I do a lot.
		I wonder about it.
		I mean, I'm about to read you and sort of skim through the headlines with you a little bit, but it's never good.
		The news is never good.
		Has that ever occurred to you?
		Surely there must be good things that happen out there, right?
		But they don't get in the news.
		The news is always 100% assuredly bad.
		Now, why is that?
		Why is really good news not newsworthy?
		But really bad news, in fact, the worse it gets, the better, right?
		Is it something about if it bleeds, it leads?
		It leads.
		Gunmen killed 10 in Saudi housing compound.
		It's typical, right?
		Is suspected Islamic militants wearing military-style uniforms sprayed gunfire inside two office compounds in the heart of the Saudi oil region Saturday, killing at least 10, including, by the way, an American.
		Let's see, intelligence agents encouraged abuse.
		Well, now, it's beginning to look as if it was not just a few isolated incidents of guards gone wild or something like that.
		It looks as though this does indeed go up the chain much as they may have tried to prevent that from occurring.
		Now the news is showing clearly that it does go up the chain.
		Several U.S. guards allege they witnessed military intelligence operatives encouraging the abuse of Iraqi prison inmates at four prisons other than the now most infamous prison.
		Court transcripts and Army investigator interviews provide the broadest view of evidence that abuses from forcing inmates to stand in 120-degree heat while in hoods to punching them occurred at a Marine detention camp in three Army prison sites.
		They see this is spreading and sounding an awful lot more like policy than random acts.
		America dedicated a Memorial Saturday to the now fast thinning ranks of World War II vets, a poignant last hurrah drawing together tens of thousands of old soldiers, sailors, and heroes of the home front.
		Frail now, full of spunk then, they were thanked for the service that helped save our world.
		And I guess you could say the world.
		Pat Tillman, you recall, Pat Tillman, right, the U.S. soldier who turned down $3.5 million to play for the Arizona Cardinals, went into the Army instead, who was killed, we now have learned, was most likely killed by friendly fire.
		The whole thing occurred during an ambush, and of course, everybody is looking everywhere.
		There's no single direction for your attention in your fire, and so friendly fire incidents do occur frequently in an ambush situation.
		Four members of the American Special Forces were killed in action in southern Afghanistan in the war on terror, so that continues.
		Maybe this is good news.
		I don't know.
		It's the only piece I could find that was even close to it.
		Pretty cool.
		Call it the moneymaker effect.
		For the second straight year, an internet unknown has won the famed World Series of poker.
		It occurred Friday, ravaging a field of professional players on his way to glory and riches.
		Greg Frosselman Raymeier, a patent lawyer from Stonington, Connecticut, earned a spot in the 35th annual No Limit Texas Holdham event after winning a $150 satellite tournament on PokerStars.com.
		So in other words, Guy went online, put up $150, ended up winning millions of dollars in a poker tournament.
		Now, my wife and I have become devotees of watching these poker tournaments on TV on the Travel Channel.
		They're very popular and fun to watch.
		And the one thing that we have noted, and you know when I had Amarillo Slim, a very famous, world-famous poker player on the program, I asked him why no women ever make it to the final table in all these poker tournaments.
		Never do you see a woman.
		They get close, but they don't make it.
		And I asked him why, and he thought I was setting him up or something, so he didn't answer the question.
	He went around that question 5,000 ways and then just flat wouldn't answer it.
	So I'm asking all of you, what is it that has prevented a woman from making the finals?
	It is one of the deepest mysteries right now known to mankind.
	And we have puzzled about this.
	Is it that a woman has tells on her face?
	That a woman cannot keep to herself the emotional moment, the critical moment in a poker game when you turn up the cards and you see a couple of aces, or the moment where you know you're beat, but you're going to bluff the hell out of the other guy and blow him into next Tuesday.
	What is it about a woman that has prevented her From making it to any of the finals.
	Now, we've watched many, many, many of these, and there's something special here.
	Even Amarillo Slim couldn't, or wouldn't answer that question: why not a woman?
	Back to a little weather news.
	The headline is Jetstream Jump Could Usher Unseasonably Hot Summer.
	Lately, Oklahoma weather has been unusually quiet for the month of May.
	Summertime pattern has established itself over the central plains, redirecting the stormy weather north of Oklahoma.
	This is written by somebody in Oklahoma.
	He goes on, what do I mean by a summertime pattern?
	Well, simply put, it has to do with the jet stream.
	The jet stream is a rapidly flowing content of air about 30,000 feet up that steers the major storm systems across America.
	Where the jet stream goes, so go these storms.
	For the past couple of weeks, the jet stream has been instead across the northern plains, Nebraska, Iowa, Missouri.
	This pattern has left Oklahoma City high and dry.
	The reason to raise an eyebrow this May is that it appears the jet stream simply jumped northward into a late summer pattern instead of what it usually does.
	One can only guess what the summer has in store with this kind of a setup.
	And that from Oklahoma, it's true.
	If you look at the map, the severe storms have jumped from where they normally are down in what we call Tornado Alley up into the northern part of the U.S. Just one more weather anomaly underway right now.
	Here's an interesting CNN report.
	Rapid Arctic thaw portends warming.
	A global warming is hitting the Arctic more than twice as fast as the rest of our planet in what also may be a portent of wider catastrophic changes, according to the chairman of an eight-nation study on Monday.
	Quote, there is dramatic climate change happening in the Arctic now, about two to three times the pace of the rest of the globe, according to Robert Corwell, chairman of the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment, in an 1800-page report.
	That's a big one to be handed to the ministers in Iceland in November, that melting, listen to me now, is destabilizing buildings on permafrost, threatening an oil pipeline laid across Alaska, that very expensive Aliaska pipeline.
	You know the one, right?
	Inuit hunters are reportedly falling more frequently, falling through the thinning ice, and the habitats for plants and animals have been disrupted.
	The benefits for human commerce might accrue because you might see an opening now of largely ice-bound short sea cuts.
	You know, a new route from the Pacific to the Atlantic.
	Russia might also win easier access to oil and gas as the ice cap shrinks and permafrost retreats.
	But this generally is not good news.
	Just not good news at all.
	The Arctic reacts mostly to global warming, blamed largely on emissions of gases like carbon dioxide, fossil fuels in cars and factories, partly because dark-covered water or earth once exposed soaks up heat far faster than white ice or snow.
	If you want to know what the rest of the planet is going to see in the next generation, watch out for the Arctic in the next five to ten years, they say.
	It's changing just altogether too quickly now.
	They just discovered, now my guest tonight is going to be very interested in this.
	He's talking about a new ice age, and lo and behold, they have discovered an underwater volcano off of all places, Antarctica.
	A previously unknown underwater volcano has now been discovered off the coast of Antarctica, off the coast of Antarctica, according to the National Science Foundation.
	The findings help explain Mariners' historical reports of discolored water in the area.
	That's what happens.
	The water becomes discolored, and they, of course, had no idea what that meant.
	What it really means is there is a volcano.
	Under there, the presence of a volcano was first suggested in sonar studies during a research cruise in January, but scientists were unable to return to the stormy waters of that region until April.
	They said the research vessel Lawrence M. Gould was returning from a study of a collapsed ice shelf when it passed right over the volcano.
	So that's pretty incredible stuff.
	Certainly a pretty incredible place you would think for a volcano.
	You would also think a volcano would begin to melt the ice, wouldn't you?
	And then finally, and I guess this goes with the weekend and the whole sort of thing we're doing right now, on the weekend of the opening of the day after tomorrow, researcher James Lovelock says that climate change may be proceeding much more quickly than previously thought.
	This report comes at a time when the main criticism of the film is that, why, everything happens much faster than it would in reality.
	Well, of course, it's a two-hour movie.
	You've got to fit it in there.
	Anyway, in the Independent, Michael McCarthy writes that Lovelock's conclusion is due to two recent climate events, the increasingly rapid melting of the Arctic ice sheet covering Greenland, which is, by the way, going to raise global sea levels, and the extreme heat wave in Europe last summer, which caused 20,000 deaths of mostly elderly people in France.
	There's no question in any reasonable scientist's mind that the heat wave was the first really bad event of global warming, says Lovelock, but the media picked it up only as a story about the wickedness of the French in not looking after their own old people.
	He's just As alarmed about the Greenland ice sheet, which is melting far faster than expected.
	Quote, I think in the past we thought more in terms of it would get hotter, things would change, you might be able to grow Mediterranean plants in Britain, stuff like that.
	It didn't seem all that bad.
	You knew there'd be some places that wouldn't be fine, but others, well, might be nicer than they were.
	Now, there is a growing awareness that global warming is far more serious than we ever realized, that it is proceeding more quickly, that it poses a threat to future generations and even to civilization itself.
	So there you have it.
	That's, of course, what I've been huffing and puffing about for a very long time now.
	Oh, incidentally, one more item.
	Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry says, should he be elected, he will put a stop to the nuclear waste dump at Yucca Mountain.
	Now, the reporter involved in this story that did it for Channel 8 in Las Vegas pressed Senator Kerry, and he was good to his word.
	He said, if elected, I will do everything within my power and the law to stop it.
	And so if they don't put it at Yucca, I wonder where they are going to put it.
	Anyway, coming up in a moment, 30 minutes of open lines just ahead of tonight's guest from the high desert in the middle of the night.
	I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		I'm Art Bell.
		Can you hear my heartbeat?
		Don't you love her face?
		Don't you love her as she's walking out the door?
		Like she did one thousand times before.
		Don't you love her ways?
		And tell me what you say.
		Don't you love her as she's walking out the door?
		All your love.
		All your love is gone.
		To sing a lonely song.
		Of a deep-loved dream.
		Seven horses seem to be on the north To talk with Art Bell, call the wildcard line at area code 775-727-1295.
		The first-time caller line is area code 775-727-1222.
		To talk with Art Bell from east of the Rockies, call toll-free at 800-825-5033.
		From west of the Rockies, call 800-618-8255.
		International callers may recharge by calling your in-country sprint access number, pressing option 5, and dialing toll-free, 800-893-0903.
		From coast to coast and worldwide on the internet, this is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Couple of quick notes, everybody.
		Tomorrow night, open lines, start to finish.
		The whole thing is going to be open lines tomorrow night, so if you have any suggestions.
		Special lines, let's say, that you would like to see us entertain the possibility of.
		Email me.
		Suggest it.
		Between now and tomorrow, and I will take your suggestion perhaps to heart.
		You never know.
		ArtVell at Mindspring.com or ArtVell at AOL.com.
		And there are a couple of other things here.
		Granted, we stayed at a fairly prestigious hotel in Manhattan.
		However, here in Little Perump, Nevada, when you go and you get, say, a breakfast in the morning, you get a couple of eggs, toast, you know, the usual, right?
		Some orange juice, maybe, and sausage, and that's it.
		A little cup of coffee, say.
		You know, it might be a couple of people.
		Here, it's a very reasonable place we live in.
		A couple of people might be about six bucks.
		Maybe.
		Unless you hit a special, then it might be all of two or three bucks.
		Well, we had exactly that breakfast at a hotel in Manhattan.
		Two eggs, a couple hunks of toast, some sausage, and anyway.
		The bill was $58.
		$50.
		Now, that's a culture shock.
		I'll tell you what.
		A couple of eggs for two people.
		$50.
		Holy smokes.
		Now, they did have, I'll grant them, a very good $16.
		$16 burger was delicious, but $50 for a couple of eggs.
		Holy moly.
		Absolutely.
		Well, if you were going to live in Manhattan, you'd have to be making a lot of money.
		www.patreon.com You know, going back just a little bit in the program, I reiterate my wonderment at the lack of any good news in the news.
		Good news never gets, or with very rare exceptions, never gets printed.
		Why would you think that would be?
		I mean, surely in the world, there would be a nearly equal mixture of good news and bad news, right?
		And yet bad news absolutely dominates.
		Moreover, that is what people want to hear.
		Otherwise, there would be good news on the radio and on television, in the media in general.
		There would be good news.
		People would go, huh?
		They just want to hear the bad news.
		What is it about human nature that makes people want to hear the bad news.
		And speaking of it, and the weather, William at Continental Divide, Colorado writes: Tornadoes, in fact, Tornado News is preempting your program right now in parts of Kansas, Colorado, Nebraska.
		Having to use a C-Crane radio to hear you right now on KSTP since we can't pick up any local radio stations within 400 to 800 miles.
		Wow.
		So that jet stream indeed has shifted north with it, and the tornadoes and violent storms have shifted along with it.
		So they are north now, and they are really vicious this year.
		As we flew toward New York City, for just about the entire flight, I was on the left-hand side of the airplane, able to look north.
		And all we could see were these incredible thunderheads built to God knows how many, just barely below us.
		You know, we were just kind of over the top of them and unrelenting lightning just watching the vicious weather across the central part of the U.S. And, of course, the report of tornadoes the day following our flight east was horrible.
		So the weather.
		West of the Rockies, you are on the air.
		Hello.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, ma'am.
unidentified		Oh, I'm sorry.
		This is Anne in Walnut Creek in Contra Costa County.
		I just wanted to congratulate you and Whitley's fever.
		I mean, it's obvious from the reviews that I've read and that I've heard on the radio, including Terry Gross of Fresh Air on NPR, and she's just the creme de la creme.
		She's wonderful, that, you know, people are looking at the movie that was made from your book as being a very complex, multi-level movie and experience, and setting a lot of people to thinking, and you're getting some, there's some controversy among environmentalists, and you're getting some favorable comments from environmentalists.
		So I think you're accomplishing some of your goal.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hope so.
unidentified		Yeah, I hope so.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I really hope so.
		You know, it's obviously entertainment at its best.
		I mean, the American public loves that kind of thing.
		The world's public loves it.
		The movie opened worldwide, by the way, not just in the U.S. Oh, that's good.
		And I'm getting a million emails, and people love it.
		Now, the reviewers, of course, tend to go to scientists who tend to say, ow, this could never.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, that kind of thing.
		But I do think it's causing millions and millions of people to think, well, hey, maybe it could be.
		Right.
		It's a science fiction movie, although it's based on enough of a nugget of reality that if you don't come out of that theater thinking about what's going on in our world right now, you weren't paying attention.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		And there are some science fiction movies in our heritage that were made years ago that people are still thinking and talking about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It is a wonderful predictor of the real future.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It always has been.
unidentified		Right.
		So good for you.
		I can't wait to see it.
		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you'll enjoy it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bye-bye.
		And take care.
		Yes.
		Science fiction has always had a way.
		And I think the reason for that is because the really good science fiction writers, in my opinion, build their story, fiction as it may be, against a nugget of reality.
		And so, more frequently than not, as years pass, that nugget of reality at that earlier time proves out to be scientifically viable and is something that is developed or something that occurs if prognosticated.
		That's why so many times science fiction movies become science reality.
		On the first time, caller line, you have arrived.
		Good evening.
unidentified		Good evening.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Hi.
		I wanted to discuss something that you brought up a little while ago about Yellowstone.
		They had this on the Science channel tonight.
		Yes.
		And they were explaining exactly what was going to happen if it did go.
		They said it would kill tens of thousands of people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, the American public doesn't understand this cold era.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It would be such a massive explosion that the entire Southwest would be reeling.
unidentified		Well, with the earthquake about to hit, I think a lot of people now are beginning to wonder if this is not going to happen.
unidentified		And we're living in the last days, and God told us, Jesus told us this was going to happen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We are riders on the storm.
unidentified		Yeah, and like this movie you were talking about, how the water came into New York.
unidentified		Well, if this asteroid hits like it's supposed to, that's why it's going to happen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That would do the same thing, yes.
unidentified		Yeah, they said that Florida would go underwater.
unidentified		The whole East Coast would be affected because it's going to come in on the east side of the United States.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it could very well occur.
		Thank you very much.
		There could be also an earthquake mid-Atlantic.
		They discovered that.
		There are any number of things that could cause tidal waves that would do roughly to New York what you saw done or will see done yet in the day after tomorrow.
		A wildcard line, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Yeah, I'm Paul from Columbia.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Columbia, what, South Carolina?
unidentified		Columbia, South Carolina.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Paul, go ahead.
unidentified		Well, 30 years ago, I dreamed about buildings falling down in New York City, and then 9-1-1 happened, five buildings fell down.
		30 years ago, also, I dreamed about a tidal wave hitting New York City, and that it froze and became a solid sheet of ice.
		And I saw previews of the movie.
		I haven't seen a movie yet where it shows New York freezing over.
		And then the movie trailers shows tornadoes.
		And every time I dream about tornadoes, they happen.
		Like April 19th, I dreamed about three tornadoes and 40 of them hit Illinois.
		So I don't think it's science.
		I think it's more, I don't think it's science fiction.
		I think in movies more science.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, have you ever thought of the following possibility?
		Maybe you're doing it.
		Maybe you're making this happen.
		Maybe it's you.
		Like with the Krell in Forbidden Planet, where those meters Keep going up, and you're using endless amounts of power to turn your imagination into horrible reality, sir.
		I appreciate you.
		I know.
		I appreciate your call.
unidentified		Thank you, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, take care.
		The monster of the id.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hey, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hey, yes.
unidentified		Dave in Shepherdsville, Kentucky, listening on WHAS.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		I was calling just because I was going to say I believe that we're living in the end times.
		I believe the world's going to end.
		Do you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You take the biblical version, I take it.
unidentified		Yes, I do.
		I do believe that Jesus Christ will ultimately prevail, but I believe that the dark church is coming out a lot faster and in more unison than perhaps, let's say, the Christian church does.
		Because they're all seem to be divided, you know what I mean?
		There's a Methodist.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you think this is it, eh?
unidentified		Oh, I do believe that we're living in the end times.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You think the horns are going to blow soon?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The galloping hooves.
unidentified		Yeah, I just hope the rapture will save us all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, not all of us.
		I mean, that's the thing about the rapture, right?
		The rapture is selective.
		It's just going to take the Christians while everybody else is left around going, huh?
unidentified		Yeah, but the Christians is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		See, I've got a little bit of a problem with that, you know, that just the Christians are going to go up.
unidentified		I believe it's more than, well, it says that the gospel will have to be preached in the whole world before the end can come.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So, in other words, everybody will be given their choice.
unidentified		That's what the Bible does per se.
unidentified		And, you know, the word rapture is not actually even in the Bible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It really is.
unidentified		It's more of an interpretation by the church.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, right.
		Exactly right.
		And the whole concept of it just has always seemed not quite right to me.
		Now, if everybody got the word, I suppose that would be, I don't know.
		Would that be fair?
		There are some who just would not believe the word were it laid down right in front of them.
		West of the Rockies, you are on the air.
		Hello.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		This is Jim from Yuma, Arizona.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Jim.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		How are you doing today?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just spiffy.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off, Jim.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's very important.
		Otherwise, you'll get confused, or I will.
		All right, so what's up?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, partner, I've been listening to you for about, oh, almost eight years now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Long time.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yep, my son turned me on to you because he used to drive at night while I was back in the sleeper sleeping.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Uh-uh, father-son driving team.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir, we were for a while.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		I had to get off the road because I had a little bit of cancer I had to take care of.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But I'll tell you what.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Twice I have seen your triangle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Once over Yuma, Arizona, and once near 29 Palms.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, it's not my triangle.
		You refer to the sighting that I had.
		What I saw, and I guess what you saw, clearly were not a conventional aircraft.
		That doesn't mean that they are not ours somehow or another, but if we really are making something like that, then we're really much more ahead of the game than we thought because, gee, it defied gravity.
		It had control of gravity.
		It wasn't flying.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, it was just as quiet as could be.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		We couldn't hear a thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There you are.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But what I called about was your movie.
unidentified		Oh.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Went down and saw it last night.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And it was really good.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I was a little disappointed that it didn't go into more detail.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course, you have two hours to document the end of part of the world here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you only can chalk so much detail into it, but what a roller coaster ride.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
		I'm getting ready.
		I'd tell you what.
		After those prices you quoted a little bit ago up there in New York City, maybe they need that superstorm's eye to go over.
		Hey, partner, you have a good night, and we'll just keep listening.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, take care.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wipe out those over-zealous capitalist New Yorker.
		Oh, my.
		It's still, the city is electrifying.
		You know, maybe I'll put up some shots after a while of the skyline that we took from our room.
		It is incredible.
		But imagine that, eating just a couple of eggs, a couple pieces of toast, a couple sausages, and 50 bucks for breakfast.
		Whoa.
		On our international line, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Me?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You.
unidentified		Hi.
		Congratulations.
		I haven't seen the film yet.
		I've seen trailers, but it's such an important message.
		So well done.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		And I'm going to be dragging a bunch of people with me, and they think they're going just for the special effects, but they don't know about the lecture afterwards.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the special effects are beyond compare.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's nothing ever done like this, I assure you.
unidentified		I must say, though, and did I see things?
unidentified		I saw just on the telly, a very quick clip of a huge wave overtaking the Statue of Liberty and on the shore, the Twin Towers?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't think you saw a heat wave overtaking it.
unidentified		Were the Twin Towers still standing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I don't want to give away.
unidentified		Oh, I'm sorry.
		I beg your pardon.
		Okay, I didn't realize I would be giving something away.
		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Never give away parts of a.
unidentified		Never.
		I don't go to a movie if it started.
		No.
		I don't like to know anything, so I apologize.
		It was a trailer, so I kind of been thinking about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know.
		A lot of people.
		Anyway.
unidentified		Anyway, what I want to quickly say so we can get on to other callers is thank you for running the repeat of the broadband power line thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you're very welcome.
unidentified		I mean, it's not my area of expertise to say the least, but it's so damn important.
		And I know that what happened in the States when they were doing the 9-11 inquiries with the panel on the second day with Giuliani that they cut once the family started shouting their protests because it had gone on for so long and no questions had been asked of Giuliani.
		And so they cut, and So you didn't find out what happened.
		And what happened, and I wanted to ask your opinion, they were frustrated.
		And they're saying, why aren't you asking questions?
		Why aren't you bringing the whistleblowers in?
		Why aren't you asking about Motorola?
		And they kept saying, why aren't you asking about Motorola?
		And they also were saying that there were fire men's wives and families.
		I mean, they didn't have any other agenda.
		But then they started chanting.
		They trained and they funded Al-Qaeda.
		They trained and they funded Al-Qaeda.
		If you nothing else, remember this is the sentence.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Ma'am, hold on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Ma'am, who trained and funded Al-Qaeda?
unidentified		They were saying, you know, the American government, Giuliani, they were saying, he's not a hero.
		He's a murderer.
		Why aren't you asking him?
		Why aren't you asking him the questions?
		Where are the whistleblowers?
		Because the families have worked on the situation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I do want to understand what you're saying here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are the whistleblowers about what?
unidentified		About 9-11.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What about 9-11?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The people who think what?
unidentified		Well, I don't know.
unidentified		I'm not a whistleblower, but usually whistleblowers are people who have inside information that need protection from.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, I think that I've got it, and I don't agree with it.
		I think that the bottom line there was she was really sort of saying the whistleblowers who are going to say what?
		That 9-11 was planned and executed by some secret government behind the U.S. government?
		Was that going to be it?
		Or even the U.S. government standing and elected as is?
		Was that going to be the premise?
		Well, I'm sorry.
		I think that is absolutely ridiculous.
		Totally ridiculous.
		I don't buy into it for one second.
		Not for one second.
		So blow all the whistles you will.
		I don't think you'll find that to be the truth.
		East of the Rockies, you're on air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off, please.
unidentified		I'm nowhere near the radio.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, good.
unidentified		This is Robert Collin from El Paso.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Robert.
unidentified		Sorry, I just wanted to let you know I saw the movie today.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you did.
unidentified		Excellent.
		Yes, it was.
		Something unexpected happened during the movie, though.
		When they were showing the people migrating to Mexico.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, wait a minute.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		See, you're getting into a part where you're going to give away part of it here.
unidentified		Oh, I'm sorry.
		Well, there was a part in there where people were just, you know, they just started applauding.
		They started laughing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I just didn't know what to do.
		Well, I certainly understand why they applauded and laughed.
		And I'm not going to give it away, sir.
		You know, look, okay.
		Thank you for the call.
		And I realize the urge of those of you who have seen the movie to talk about some of the really incredible parts of it.
		That's what he was about to do.
		Maybe when most, or the majority of you have seen the movie, then we can talk about parts like that.
		But until then, really, to give away parts of a really cool movie that you have not yet seen just is a really big, big no-no.
		And yet I do understand the urge.
		Believe me, I do.
		The storm.
		The movie, The Day After Tomorrow.
		It's playing right now.
		The day after tomorrow is today.
		But with regard to the storm, the overall storm, ladies and gentlemen, we're all on board for this ride.
		Get your tickets.
		The conductor is waving, and we're about to take off.
		And the surfboard is Planet Earth from the high desert in the middle of the night.
		I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		I'm Art Bell.
		Riders of the storm.
		Riders of the storm.
		Into this house we're born.
		Into this world we're thrown.
		How high will gas prices go this summer?
		How high will gas prices go this summer?
		Be it silent, sand, or the smell of the touch, there's something inside that we need so much.
		The sight of the touch, or the scent of the sand, or the strength of an oak that roots deep in the ground.
		The wonder of flowers to be covered and then to burst up through tarmac to the sun again.
		Or to fly to the sun without burning a wing.
		To lie in the meadow and hear the grass sing, to have all these things in our memories hold.
		And they used them to help us to find Yeah!
		Fly, fly that she saw Take this place on this trip Just for me.
		Far more.
		Take a free roll.
		Take my face.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Have I seen?
unidentified		It's for free.
		Wanna take a ride?
		To talk with Art Bell, call the wildcard line at area code 775-727-1295.
		The first-time caller line is area code 775-727-1222.
		To talk with Art Bell from east to the Rockies, call toll-free 800-825-5033.
		From west to the Rockies, call 800-618-8255.
		International callers may reach ART by calling your in-country sprint access number, pressing option 5, and dialing toll-free 800-893-0903.
		From coast to coast and worldwide on the internet, this is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's coming up, Robert Felix, will be definitely in tune with our topic tonight and the movie itself in a lot of ways.
		We will turn out to have a lot of agreements and a few disagreements, but what Robert Felix has to say, he wrote a book called Not by Fire, but by Ice.
		And we'll get to that in a moment.
		Carl and Janine from Gold Coast, Australia.
		Yes, the movie opened worldwide.
		Write fast blast and say hi, My wife and I saw a day after tomorrow down here in Australia.
		We loved it.
		Want to see it again?
		Might even buy the DVD.
		Great effects, real buzz seeing your name on the big screen.
		73s, that means best wishes in hand, Carl.
		In Gold Coast, Australia.
		Yeah, well, many of you may never experience seeing your name on the big screen.
		It was cool.
		That's what I would say of it.
		It was kind of cool.
		I mean, to sit there, even though I had to stand up, you know, it was at the end when everybody was standing up and getting ready to leave as the credits were rolling.
unidentified		I had to stand up and crane my neck a little bit, but there it was.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And it is.
		It is.
		It is kind of cool.
		Anyway, coming up, Robert Felix, a former architect who became interested in the Ice Age cycle back in 1991.
		I originally interviewed him in 97.
		He spent the next eight and one-half years full-time researching and writing about the coming ice age.
		Then he concentrated on spreading the word Robert's book not by fire, but by ice, has achieved international acclaim from readers around the world.
		Today, Felix continues his research and is more firmly convinced than ever that the next ice age could begin any day.
		In fact, he believes it already has begun.
		Coming right up.
		All right, here we go.
		Robert Felix, welcome to the program.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Art, I'm glad to be on with you.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Last time, 97 with me, eh?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It was, and I think that was just slightly probably before your book came out.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That would be correct, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Congratulations, by the way.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That is so great that you are getting the word out.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, Ice Age is that we do have this little movie making the rounds this weekend, and it is more or less shaking up the world.
		So a lot of people are going to be thinking about some of the material you're in the process of presenting.
		There's no question about that.
		It's going to wake them up.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And there's no question but what an ice age is coming, as far as I'm concerned.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		Well, I've long said, Robert, that to me it doesn't matter whether it's a cyclical event that man's hand can't control or change in the slightest or whether we're actually having an effect on it or any of the above.
		It just doesn't matter.
		It's, in my opinion, underway now, and so we must begin planning for it now so that a lot of the things you see unfold in the movie this weekend will not come to pass.
		Now, I guess in the introduction, it said that.
		It said that from your point of view, no matter how we differ on how it may form, you believe the process is underway now.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I absolutely do believe that.
		And, you know, I won't give away your movie, but in the very beginning, it mentions that there was an ice age about 10,000 years ago.
		And a big part of what I say is that ice ages do return in a dependable, predictable cycle.
		It's a natural cycle.
		And this cycle is not something that I came up with.
		This cycle was discovered in the 1970s by a group called CLIMAP, Climate Long-Range Investigation Mapping and Prediction.
		And what they did is they looked at deep sea cores for the last 500,000 years.
		And they discovered that ice ages have begun or ended abruptly, and you talk about abruptly, abruptly, just like clockwork every 11,500 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, you said deep sea cores.
		Let's talk.
		We're going to be talking a lot about cores.
		And I have some evidence from coring in ice, not under the ocean.
		But I guess what you're talking about is going to a very deep part of the sea with some sort of robotic apparatus and drilling down and getting a core.
		Is that correct?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		They take deep sea cores into the ocean floor.
		But also, yeah, later on, I agree with you about the ice cores, too.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's not disputable evidence.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, the ice cores are just like, you know, a history book if you know how to read them.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And it does indicate that there have been these, for example, these flash freezes, the most recent evidence, I think, in Peru.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And previously, scientists, when they find this sort of thing, Robert, they just sort of, if it doesn't fit in with what they otherwise expect, they just, I don't know, they cast it aside and say it's impossible, and therefore we reject the evidence.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely, they do.
		You know, I believe that they discovered the speed with, well, there was one lady, Genevieve Woyard, who published in the 1970s that an ice age at the end-Emian period began in less than 20 years.
		So the knowledge has been around, but everybody laughed at her.
		And the reason she said that is because in Europe, warm weather trees, according to the pollen record, warm weather trees disappeared in less than 20 years, which everybody poo-pooed.
		And then in the early 80s, when they were drilling deep cores into the ice in central Greenland, they found more evidence of ice ages beginning abruptly, and that was discarded.
		But by 1989, they couldn't ignore it any longer.
		And there was a project called GRIP, Greenland Ice Core Project, that drilled almost two miles deep into the ice in central Greenland.
		And they drilled deep enough that they were able to physically look at the ice that had formed as much as 250,000 years ago.
		And this goes along with what you're saying.
		They discovered that every ice age during the last 250,000 years, and there were many more than they realized, every single one of them began in less than 20 years, sometimes in less than 10 years.
		Ice ages begin incredibly fast.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Robert, is there any question any longer about global warming?
		It seems like there's very little question now.
		All the scientists are agreeing this is occurring.
		I mean, look at Alaska, for example, where buildings are destabilizing.
		They were built on permafrost.
		Well, it's not perma and much frost anymore.
		And the buildings are destabilizing, and trees are falling down.
		And I'm telling you, it's getting really, really weird up there.
		Native Alaskans are falling off or into the ice because it's not frozen enough to hold them anymore.
		So, is there any question about and then you look at pictures of the North Pole 10 years ago, 20 years ago, and now, and that'll send the hair on the back of your neck straight up.
		The ice sheets in the Antarctic breaking off, all of that.
		Is there any question about what's going on in global warming?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, that depends on how we define it, Art, because from my research, I do not believe that there is global warming caused by humans.
		What I see is ocean warming, because I agree that there's ocean warming.
		However, the temperatures in the atmosphere are declining.
		Temperatures on land are declining.
		But most of the figures you see, they talk about surface temperatures of the planet are rising.
		Well, surface temperatures include the ocean, which is 71% of our planet.
		I think the ocean is heating because of this cycle and because, and this is a primary contribution that I believe I'm making, I believe that they're heating because of underwater volcanic activity.
		Now, a little bit earlier, I heard you reading part of that article or discussing part of that article about the underwater volcano found off the Antarctic coast.
		That's right.
		And, well, that would certainly, and you also mentioned that that could make the ice melt, which I think you were doing a little tongue-in-cheek, but absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, oh, of course.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course it could.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Now, that article just came out on May 21st, that newly found volcano.
		And it's interesting, there was another article just last week that I read that Deception Island in Antarctica is that when cruise ships go down there, what it is, it's a volcanic crater about eight miles in diameter that collapsed so that water is flooded into it and the cruise ships can go in there.
		This is off the coast of Antarctica.
		When the cruise ship goes in there, everybody strips off their jackets, they pull their vests, their thermal underwear, their boots and their socks, and they jump into the ocean because deception is still active.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So that's part of that.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But here's the big one, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's incredible.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But here's the big one that you don't hear about.
		In the Arctic Ocean, now I didn't know about this when I wrote the book.
		I just discovered this in the last year.
		In the Arctic Ocean, where we're talking about the ice melting, scientists in the last year have discovered the Gakel Ridge.
		It's a gigantic volcanic mountain chain that stretches beneath the Arctic Ocean.
		It's something like 1,800 kilometers long.
		It has deep valleys.
		It has 5,000 meter-high summits.
		In other words, the mountain underwater volcanoes are 3 miles high.
		The Gackle Ridge is far mightier than the Alps.
		And we have discovered just within the last year that there is surprisingly, and I'll quote here from the article that was published in the Max Planck Society, surprisingly strong magmatic activity in the west and east of the ridge.
		It's one of the strongest hydrothermal activities.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did you say magma or magnetic or?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Magma.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Magmatic.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, all right, very good.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so it's one of the, the scientists saw one of the strongest hydrothermal activities ever seen at mid-ocean ridges.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And this was just published on July 18th of 2003.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'm sure you've seen the satellite photographs, have you not, of the northern part of the world and how much ice was there, say, in 91 versus now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Have you seen those?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, and I've had, you know, frankly, I've had a hard time explaining that because I don't think it's caused by humans.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		So when I found this article that says that this underwater of organic chain, which is bigger than the Alps, is active, then all of a sudden...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's say it's volcanism, both down south and up north.
		That would be increased volcanism in the last X number, you know, a couple of decades or whatever to cause this massive melting.
		To what would you attribute the sudden increased volcanism?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I think that has to do with the Ice Age cycle.
		And the reason I say that is 11,500 years ago, there was greatly increased volcanic activity.
		And so much so just before we went into that small ice age, relatively small, but there was drastically increased volcanism.
		23,000 years ago, before we went into that disastrous ice age, there was major volcanism.
		They found mammoth bones interspersed with up to three feet of volcanic ash in Alaska.
		So volcanism on land, the record shows that volcanism on land has in the past increased at the beginning of each ice age.
		Now, one of the things I said in my book way back when, back when I started researching in 1991, scientists thought there were about 10,000 underwater volcanoes in the entire world.
		Then in 1993, they discovered 1,100 more underwater volcanoes down off the coast of Easter Island.
		So in a matter of like two months, they increased the world supply of underwater volcanoes by 10%.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Got it.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Now, we know more about the moon than we know about the ocean floor, really, because now, if you go to NASA's website, NASA now estimates that there are as many as 1 million underwater volcanoes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I mean, this is a major change that no one is really exploring yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's the way a planet has of expressing the amount of energy within.
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		And there are some that I've interviewed recently, Richard Hoagland and company, who believe that a Planet's energy output, that our planet's energy output is now up, and that the other planets in our system exhibit a similar increase in energy.
		Had you heard that?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I hadn't heard that exactly, but my understanding, I've got one article here, is that some scientists believe that Mars is now coming out of an ice age.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And I doubt that there's too many SUVs on Mars.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there is what appears to be global warming going on on the planet Mars.
		No question about it.
		No question about it.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I will definitely accept that word, but I don't go along with the human cause part of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, that's fine.
		In my opinion, it could be either one or both.
		And from my point of view at this stage of the game, it doesn't matter because we need to start recognizing that whatever it is, it is occurring, and we should begin to plan for agriculture in the new setup.
		Now, here's someplace where we're going to agree, and that is the temperature of the oceans.
		It can indeed cause an ice age, and people are confused about this all the time.
		They keep saying, well, then, let's think, if the oceans get warmer, how the hell could that cause an ice age?
		It would just be nice to swim in.
		And so I'm confused.
		How does a warmer ocean cause an ice age?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay, and that's really...
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And then in 1997, we had one that was even worse than that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		What El Niño does is that's a warming ocean, essentially, is that the ocean, there's a strip of the ocean down near the equator that warms by up to 14 degrees.
		And what it does as that water warms is it increases evaporation.
		Any cook will tell you this.
		You know, if you put a pot of water on the stove and you start heating that and it starts boiling, all of that moisture starts rising up onto your ceiling and falling back down, dripping on you.
		Same thing with El Niño.
		As the seas warm, all of that moisture rises into the sky.
		And then, because the world is revolving, of course, but that moisture then travels over the continents, it cools down, it falls back to the earth as rain.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you attributing all of the ocean warming to underwater volcanism, or are there other factors?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I am attributing it all to underwater volcanism.
		I'm certainly not having everyone agree with me on that.
		But yes, I think it's all.
		And one of the big reasons I believe this is that this has been published in science is that the warming begins at two miles down.
		The ocean is warming two miles down before the surface.
		And I have no way in the world of imagining how we humans could heat the ocean two miles down prior to heating the surface.
		So that is why I would believe that.
		My concern is what happens when all of this moisture starts falling in the wintertime?
		There's no question of the warming oceans, they have warmed by 2 to 3 degrees since 1950.
		No question.
		I agree with you 100%.
		And that in turn has led to greatly increased precipitation.
		Right now, worldwide, flood activity is the worst that it's been since before Christopher Columbus.
		And again, what happens when all of that rain starts falling in the wintertime?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		More flooding.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		More flooding, but snow.
		You know, when, well, a couple of years ago, anybody who was listening in Kentucky, a couple of years ago, there were some rainstorms in Kentucky where they received 15 inches of rain in one day.
		Now, Kentucky does get snow.
		If that has fallen in the winter, meteorologists, when they try to predict how much snow will fall if a rainstorm should turn to snow, they add a zero.
		I'm simplifying a little, but not much.
		So one inch of rain added zero would be 10 inches of snow.
		Well, that means that 15 inches of rain in Kentucky, if that had fallen as snow, would have been 150 inches of snow.
		It would have buried every one-story house.
		Every one-story building in town would have collapsed from the weight.
		It would have buried every trailer truck on the freeway.
		It would be an unmitigated disaster.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It might even be the beginning of a new ice age.
		I mean, nobody might get out from under that one, 150 inches.
		All right, hold it right there.
		Robert Felix is my guest.
		Not by fire, but by ice is his book, and he does agree there is another ice age well on the way.
		We may disagree as to some of the cause.
		But once again, when all is said and done, does it really matter?
		Well, not that much.
		We do agree, you see, it's happening.
		So we ought to begin planning for how things will be when it's finished happening.
		Because it's underway right now.
		I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		Out on the street I was talking to a man He said there's so much but there's love of mine that I don't understand You should...
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art bell ▲ ● ▼		The observations are the same.
		Robert Felix is my guest.
		He thinks the warming of the oceans is caused by volcanism.
		I don't know that it really matters what's causing it.
		Fact is, the oceans certainly are warming.
		Now, in a moment, we'll discuss exactly what that means, and it means a lot more than you think that it does.
		Once the oceans begin to warm, the ice begins to melt, there are a series of events that will occur.
		Check that.
		That are beginning to occur now and will accelerate.
		will explain.
unidentified		Outro Music Outro Music Well, all right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So we may or disagree, Robert, on what's heating the oceans, but the fact of the matter is the oceans are heating.
		Those measurements have already been made.
		Woods Hole has made all kinds of interesting scientific observations of late, and the oceans are heating.
		So now what I'd like is for the audience to understand when the oceans do heat, what that's going to mean and how the dynamics begin to happen.
		For example, there's the Atlantic drift.
		You might talk about the ocean currents in the ocean.
		What it means when the ocean heats.
		How does all of this translate to an ice age?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You bet.
		You bet.
		Thank you.
		Yes.
		You know, we do see the pictures of the melting glaciers, and I believe that the glaciers that are floating in the water, I don't have to believe it.
		I mean, it's true.
		The glaciers, as they float in those warming waters, are indeed melting.
		But when you go inland, it's an entirely different story.
		And this is one of the reasons why I believe that we're seeing the beginning of the Ice Age right now.
		Glaciers right now are growing in Norway.
		They're growing like crazy in Norway.
		Glaciers are growing in Canada.
		Glaciers are growing in Ecuador.
		Glaciers are growing in Switzerland.
		They're growing in Russia.
		They're growing in New Zealand.
		They're growing inland in Greenland.
		They're growing in Antarctica.
		And here's one article you may not be aware of.
		Glaciers are growing right here in the United States.
		And this is one newspapers should be yelling this to the high heavens, and anyone should be listening to your movie or watching your movie.
		Glaciers are growing in Washington State.
		Glaciers are growing in California.
		In Washington State, on Mount Rainier, there's a glacier called the Nisqually Glacier.
		The city of Tacoma gets some of their water supply from the Nisqually.
		And because of that, they began measuring the Nisqually Glacier back in 1931.
		It's the best measured glacier in the northern hemisphere.
		The Nisqually Glacier is growing thicker at the rate of 18 feet a year, two stories a year.
		And glaciologists expect that added weight will make it begin advancing within this decade, meaning within the next six years.
		It will begin advancing.
		That is because of these warming oceans.
		They're sending, and to answer your question, they're sending up the excess moisture, coming back to in the lowlands as rain, but in the mountains it's landing as snow.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But again.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Now, glaciers are also growing on Mount Shuckson in northern Washington state.
		When you get to California, Mount Shasta has seven glaciers.
		All seven of the glaciers have been growing since 1950.
		The Whitney Glacier, which is the largest glacier on Mount Shasta, is growing.
		Several of the glaciers have doubled in size since 1950.
		And I think we're getting a disservice done to us because we're not being told about this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So we have glaciers growing all over the world.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		We do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But on the other hand, we also have ice melting at an alarming rate in the north part of the world and the south part of the world.
		Now, this is fresh water entering saltwater and diluting salinity.
		And now, again, I want to get back to the ocean, if we could.
		Sure.
		How is it, please explain that these warming ocean temperatures combined with the fresh water coming from the northern and southern part of the world entering the ocean, how will all this end up causing an ice age?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, the best I can do there is I can refer back to an article that was in Discover Magazine in September of 2002.
		In fact, Discover Magazine devoted a lot of the magazine.
		The cover said, a new ice age.
		And it has to do with these ocean currents that you're talking about.
		The Gulf Stream has been getting a lot more fresh water in it in the Last 30 years than it has ever had before.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We can see where it's coming from.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Yes.
		Well, what happens is a Gulf Stream picks up warm water from the tropics and moves it north up between the United States and Europe.
		It moves it to the north and it ends up warming England and warming parts of Europe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They're quite a bit further north than New York City, and yet actually, I believe you'd find that that part of Europe is roughly the same latitude as Labrador.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So it should have the climate of Labrador, but it doesn't.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		It's a lot warmer because of the Gulf Stream that you're talking about.
		Yes.
		As all of this fresh water, and there's no doubt, I mean, you mentioned Woods whole Oceanographic Institution a little bit ago.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And they're the ones that have been tracking this.
		And they're the ones that realize that all of this fresh water that has been pouring into the Atlantic, fresh water both from the melting and also from the huge increase in precipitation, that fresh water could change the salinity of the ocean enough.
		What happens is that the warm water goes north until it gets up somewhere near Iceland, and then it starts to sink back down into the depths of the ocean, moves back to the tropics, and then it comes back up, and it's like a giant conveyor belt that continually moves this warm water to Europe.
		Too much fresh water in the past has apparently, but scientists believe this, is that too much fresh water can cause that conveyor belt to shut down.
		And it can shut down in a matter of three years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I read some amazing things about that.
		As you point out, it can shut down very quickly.
		And the recent measurements, I'm trying to recall exactly, but it was like 30 or 40 percent change in this conveyor belt already measured.
		And of course, as you know, Europe had this incredible heat wave where thousands died in France last year.
		And I just read an article that scientists are saying, well, here you go.
		That was the number one event.
		That marks the beginning of this whole thing, this cycle.
		Whether we agree or disagree on the causes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I agree with you that it could very well mark the beginning of the cycle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, you're agreeing with the scientists.
		So I'm sort of curious if this conveyor belt stops, which it could do very quickly.
		The ICE Corps say this kind of thing happened, despite what a lot of scientists say, very quickly, not over thousands of years, as we learned in school, but rather quickly.
		Now, what exactly would occur.
		Robert, can you project what would happen if the conveyor belt stopped?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it would be an absolutely worldwide disaster.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Average temperatures would drop by and this may not sound like much at first, but average winter temperatures would drop by 5 degrees over much of the United States, and they dropped by 10 degrees in the northeastern United States and Europe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're right.
		That doesn't sound like much.
		It sounds uncomfortable, but it doesn't sound like much otherwise.
		But it's a lot.
		What does it mean would happen?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, the thing is, in the last ice age, temperatures were only about seven degrees colder than they are right now.
		It's not a cold age.
		It's an ice age.
		You know, there was a scientist back in the 1970s, Morris Ewing, who was head of Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory.
		He said it's cold enough to have an ice age right now.
		All we need is more precipitation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I guess what I want to understand is if I live in Paris, Robert, or I live, I don't know, in London, and this occurs, what's going to happen to me?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, the mountain glaciers are going to start growing.
		They're going to start advancing down from the Alps.
		Rivers and harbors are going to start freezing up.
		In the United States, the North Atlantic shipping lines can be caught in ice.
		You know, this last winter, we had a case where Boston Harbor had ice, and New York City had ice that the Staten Island Ferry couldn't get through.
		Well, one of the big things that would happen in the Northeast is that their winter oil supply is brought in by water.
		And so there would be a big problem just almost immediately if those shipping lanes started to freeze.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They would freeze.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And that's enough.
		You know, there was an occasion during the Little Ice Age, during the 1600s, during that Little Ice Age, when the ice started advancing out of the Alps.
		And what happened in England is that they started getting more rain than usual.
		And the winter rains lasted for about six weeks longer than normal.
		That was enough to disrupt the planting season.
		It destroyed the wheat supply.
		And literally millions of people starved to death.
		My big worries is that we'll be fighting in the streets for food long before we're covered with ice.
		That's one of my favorite things.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		People are always wanting some sort of timetable.
		If this were to happen very quickly from that side, if it did happen very quickly, what are we talking about?
		How many years ahead of us?
		How much time before things begin to get untenable, and as you have just suggested, people are starving and fighting for food?
		That's pretty awful.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, this depends.
		And I mean, your movie, I won't give it away, but you're certainly saying it begins quickly.
		And I've been thinking, a lady, I heard a lady call during the last hour and asked about Yellowstone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		If Yellowstone should go off, I would say that we would be in an ice age in a matter of weeks.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Weeks.
		Explain if the caldera there let go.
		What would happen if Yellowstone let go?
		What would happen?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, for one thing, Yellowstone, the last major eruption was like 640,000 years ago.
		And at a magnetic reversal, by the way.
		But during that, when that happened, the volcanic ash in eastern Nebraska ended up being seven feet deep.
		I mean, scientists now that have done excavations, it was seven feet deep.
		And a volcanic eruption that size, there would be 12 to 14 inches of volcanic ash on the Gulf Coast.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sounds like Vesuvius.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it would be the worst volcanic eruption since Toba of 75,000 years ago.
		Now, if you've got seven feet of volcanic ash covering Nebraska and covering the entire Midwest, how much food is going to get through?
		None.
		We would be fighting in the streets in days.
		And that's what I worry about, is if that goes off, then it would cool the entire planet by about 20 degrees, and I would assume that underwater volcanic activity would be increasing at the same time, because it usually does.
		It's tied together.
		So you'd have oceans even warmer than they are today, pumping all of that moisture into the skies that are 20 degrees colder, and it would be just snow.
		The Earth would be like a giant snowball.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What are the indications now at Yellowstone?
		What are we seeing?
		What are the warning signs right now?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, one of the big ones is that the land around Yellowstone since 1923 has risen 29 inches.
		And that has risen as much as most active volcanoes.
		So, you know, when Mount St. Helens exploded, there was the bulge that happened first.
		They've also discovered at the bottom of the largest lake at Yellowstone, and I don't know the name of that lake, but at the bottom of the largest lake, there's now a bulge in the bottom of the lake the size of seven football fields.
		Really?
		And I've heard callers to your program talk about the heat there, is that the ground in some areas of Yellowstone has gotten so hot that they've had to close some of the trails because it was burning people's shoes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I had heard that, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		And so I see those indications.
		There also have been reports of many more earthquakes there than normal, which are also a hardbinger.
		Now they may settle back down.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It has done that.
		We've had swarms of earthquakes at Yellowstone, and then it does quiet back down.
		Now, one of these times, it may not, it may let loose.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, if that one goes, then if that goes, and I certainly hope it doesn't, but if that goes, Then, your scenario of speed is absolutely on the money.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Again, a lot of my listeners don't live near Yellowstone, so they may not understand the magnitude of what you're talking about.
		I live, for example, in Nevada.
		What would we look forward to here?
		Or Southern California, what might it notice if Yellowstone let go?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, the ash, number one, the lava would be expected to shoot 30 miles into the sky.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Not the ash.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lava.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lava, 30 miles into the sky.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		30 miles into the sky.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		They calculate that if Yellowstone should go, everyone within 600 miles radius would be killed almost instantaneously.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My God.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But then what would happen is that all of this ash would rise into the sky, and the Earth revolves, so the entire planet would be shrouded in darkness.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But you're saying everybody within 600 miles of Yellowstone would virtually be killed instantly?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That is what scientists believe.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I suppose you would have, if you get lava going 30, did you say 30 miles?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		30 miles, the lava 30 miles into the sky.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's not a typo.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		30 miles into the sky.
		That's hard to even contemplate.
		See, You'd have falling rocks.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it would be incredible.
		And this, by the way, is not coming from me.
		I do have a link to this on my website, by the way.
		It's iceagenow.com.
		But in February of 2000, BBC had a long session on super volcanoes and on Yellowstone.
		And Michael Rampino of NASA was one of the people on there who's a volcano expert.
		But he said that the temperatures could drop by 20 degrees worldwide, at least temporarily.
		And again, that would be just a disaster.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Doing a little quick math, you know, you're talking about lava being blown 150,000 feet up, roughly, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, that's, you know, we're up to the edge of space there.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, we're looking at a volcano that is, it would be the biggest volcano That has ever erupted since Toba.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm just trying to think, though, if you blew lava up to 150,000 feet, you'd reach super cold temperatures.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You'd get rocks.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Rocks would be falling from the sky.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Rocks would be falling from the sky.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		They would.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		God.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It is just, I don't like to think about it because the other problem is I don't see how one could prepare for it.
		So that one is one that I don't...
		I sure hope it doesn't happen.
		I mean, that would be a...
		I don't know.
		An ice age, I think we can prepare for.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And you were saying it would drop temperatures worldwide.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did you say 20 degrees?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		degrees worldwide.
		And when Toba erupted, that is what happened.
		And scientists believe that there were probably a lot of humans on the planet at that time, but that it killed probably all but a few thousand.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's hard for the average person to even contemplate a disaster of that, even imagine.
		I mean, a 600-mile circle of total death.
		Right.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It is.
		It is.
		And I imagine that's probably why our government doesn't talk too much about Yellowstone, because what could you do?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nothing.
		Nothing.
		Absolutely.
		Evacuate a 600-mile range around Yellowstone.
		I wonder if they would even, you've got to wonder if they would consider that at the business level.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		This would have 10,000 times the explosive force of Mount St. Helens.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And with that, we'll take a break, Robert, top of the Alacona, from the high desert in the middle of the night, which is where we talk about things like this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm Art Bell, and this, of course, is Coast to Coast AM.
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art bell ▲ ● ▼		While you're contemplating what would happen if Yellowstone let go and lava was blown 150,000 feet or better into the air and mostly out of the air, frankly, to the edge of space, and then came raining back down as rocks and virtually incinerated everybody in a 600-mile radius of Yellowstone.
		While you're contemplating that, and then of course the pain would begin from that point out, it's unimaginable anything that big.
		While you're contemplating that, I have contemplated a question for Robert Felix, my guest on this matter, and others.
		In a moment.
		The End Once again, Robert Felix, and ladies and gentlemen, his book is Not by Fire, But by Ice.
		And that book has been out.
		How long now?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It's been out since 1997.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I did upgrade it last year, and I think it's fourth printing, something like that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's a good one, then.
		Yes.
		All right.
		I'm going to make you the President of the United States.
		How about that?
		President Felix has a kind of a ring to it.
		President Felix.
		All right.
		President Felix, if a group of scientists from renowned institutions and universities came to you in a sort of a panic and they said, President Felix, here's the evidence.
		Yellowstone is going to let go in an apocalyptic manner.
		And they describe to you the miles of lava being thrown into the atmosphere and beyond.
		And they say, Mr. President, this is going to happen.
		And we feel very soon now, based on the following very sound scientific data.
		What would you, President Felix, do?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I'd have to be very hesitant about announcing that to the public for fear of panic.
		That would be really tough.
		I would have to be so positive of it if I were to read that.
		You know, I'm not president and I'm one lone voice.
unidentified		I have made you president, but you are president.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		and I don't want to give away your movie, which is what I have seen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There are going to be certain elements of it.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		So I'll just have to say it for myself: is that I would probably, at first, do nothing because I would not want to.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you'd be like every other president.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I would probably do nothing for fear.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And if it's wrong, oh, my gosh, you know, you have people evacuate and then you're ready.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you would doubt the scientists then, even if they laid what appeared to be concrete evidence on your Oval Office desk?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You know, from all of the research that I have done over the years, I have discovered that I can pretty well find the figures to back up whichever position I want to back up.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And so I would have to really trust those scientists very strongly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, so President Felix would sit back and say, well, there's nothing we can do.
		Or you would do, in the end, nothing.
		In other words, you would think that the possibility of being wrong and evacuating an area, a third of the U.S., let's say.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Once I were positive of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		By the way, is that what it would amount to?
		Would you have to be evacuating about a third of the United States or what?
		If you did act.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Number one, I'd have to be positive.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You've already said that.
		But let's say you had to evacuate.
		How much would you have to evacuate?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, you'd evacuate the 600-mile radius, excuse me, 600-mile diameter around Yellowstone.
		And depending on how it looks like the prevailing winds are, much of the Midwest.
		Because if that area is going to be covered with seven feet of volcanic ash, I don't see how people would survive that.
		That is going to cover every railroad.
		It's going to cover every freeway.
		There's no planes going to be able to come in and rescue anyone.
		It's going to go into the rivers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Water supplies are gone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What about the aftermath in other ways?
		I mean, you talk about a 20-degree temperature drop for the world.
		Wouldn't that mean that large parts of the world, including where you're standing right now, might well be totally frozen over?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		During the eruption of Toba, which was a super volcano like Yellowstone, three-quarters of all plants in the Northern Hemisphere were killed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Three out of four.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Three out of four of all plants in the Northern Hemisphere.
		So one of the first things I would do is start stockpiling food.
		As a government, I'd be stockpiling food.
		As an individual, I'd be stockpiling food.
		That would be very important because there will be no food supply for a while if this happens.
		But then that's just the first phase.
		And then you start getting all that snow and all of the cold and all of the rain that's coming with It it would be just so tough to supply.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		it would also almost make your movie look preferable um Yeah, apparently it would be much worse than the scenario of a virtual new ice age starting out as it did in the day after tomorrow.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But the effects, the end effects, I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They'd be perhaps more severe, but the same sort of thing would happen, wouldn't it?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, it would.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And I really, you know, I don't know the timing exactly, but I do believe that we are on the verge with all of the things that have been going on with Yellowstone, with all of that activity, and volcanic activity around the world is now the greatest that it's been in more than 500 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, how much, in the real world, how much more concerned should we be about what you've just told me about Yellowstone?
		You know, the people burning their feet, the cordoned-off areas, the government not much talking about it.
		I mean, what level of concern should we have on a scale of one to ten?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I would be concerned right now on, let's say, a number five, because the earthquake activity has picked up, because it is acting in ways that it hasn't acted in recorded history.
		You know, it's too bad that we don't have more information to go on.
		The last time it actually exploded, and this could be a small one, too, about 13,800 years ago, there was an explosion in one of the lakes where one of those lava domes built up, like is building up now.
		Yes.
		And that only affected areas for about five miles around.
		So we have to wait and see what else is coming.
		Because if it's just something that's going to affect things that are five miles around, that's no worse than Mount St. Helens.
		And that certainly wasn't a disaster to the entire country.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But Yellowstone, in the manner you described.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		If it does that, because Yellowstone is such a large caldera, I don't think anyone recognizes how large it is.
		It's 52 miles wide and 28 miles long.
		That's the caldera.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		People just don't understand that volcanic activity can come from other than the top of an apparent volcano, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		There's that kind of volcanic activity.
		And then in the oceans, of course, there's rift volcanoes.
		And I talk about those in the book, too.
		But rift volcanoes are where all that happens is that a crack opens up in the ground and lava starts pouring out.
		They have rift volcanoes in Iceland where you can actually see it happening.
		But back in the 1990s, there was a rift volcano discovered off the coast of Oregon, off the coast of Astoria, Oregon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I remember that.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It was a coaxial, called a coaxial volcano.
		It was about four miles long.
		And the thing about these underwater volcanoes is they pump lava into the sea that is 2,100 degrees hot.
		That's 10 times the boiling point.
		And the water boils.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Could you tell me how that then converts in the way it modifies the ocean water it's connected with?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, a certain mass of a lava will heat how much water to what degree?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You know, I don't know the answer to that.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But I think that underwater volcanoes, for instance, had an awful lot to do with the dinosaur extinction because there were literally hundreds of cubic miles of lava that poured into the seas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you dispute the theory that it was an object from space colliding with Earth, or do you believe that to be accurate?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, I think it was underwater volcanic activity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You do?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, really?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You know, the Chicxalub crater in, and I address this in the book, too, by the way, but the Chicxalub crater in the Gulf of Mexico, the one that we say was caused by that huge asteroid, there are some scientists, and I know that Charles Officer of Dartmouth College is one, who's published a book on it, that some scientists believe that was caused by massive, explosive, underwater volcanic activity.
		And I would agree with them.
		You know, that caldera, Tixalube, was first discovered by workers for Pemex, for the Mexican oil company.
		They were drilling for oil, and they drilled through a layer of andesite, which is volcanic glass.
		And so when that was first discovered, it was identified as a volcanic crater.
		Now, part of the problem of identifying it, it's a half a mile below water.
		So it's not something you can just go take a look at.
		But yes, I do believe that was caused by what I'm talking about right here.
		I believe that was a super volcano.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of what magnitude compared to, say, what we just talked about with respect to Yellowstone?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If you go back to what you have to do.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It would be bigger.
		Yes, the crater, scientists believe that crater, well, they don't believe it, they've measured it, it was about 110 miles across.
		So that is, what, that's four times bigger than Yellowstone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know that they've measured the debris and coring they've done, oh, I don't know, off the coast of South America up into the Caribbean, they've measured some coring that had the debris that they thought was from an asteroid hit.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But you're saying, no, no, no, This debris came from the spitting of a volcano thousands of miles away.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I believe it did.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		One of your listeners emailed me before the program tonight and wanted me to talk about the iridium because the debris that you're talking about, the iridium, there's a layer of clay around the world at that borderline 65 million years ago.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That layer of clay is about a quarter inch thick and some areas thicker, and it has iridium in it.
		Now, some people think that entire layer of clay is iridium, but no, what it is is 10 parts per billion is iridium.
		And it turns out that some of today's volcanoes, some on the island of Reunion, some in Hawaii, have 50% of that amount of iridium even in their emissions today.
		So I believe that that iridium came from massive volcanic activity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Or I suppose also an asteroid strike could initiate.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Look, I'm no expert on this, but if you slammed something gigantic into the Earth and penetrated the Earth to a great degree, couldn't you begin a chain of seismic events and maybe even volcanic activity?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That wouldn't surprise me at all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So it could be that one set off the other, could it not?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It could be.
		It could be.
		There's other occasions where the extinction 248 million years ago, there appears to be craters from that time, the Popagai crater in Siberia, but it also corresponds with the time of massive lava flows in Siberia.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But these craters that are made when there's that big hit, you believe these, what, are volcano artifacts?
unidentified		I do.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So it's like looking into the top of an extinct volcano?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I do.
		Because of the debris, and some of it is volcanic debris.
		And the biggest clue that scientists say that it was an asteroid is that iridium.
		And yet that iridium can be explained as coming from volcanoes.
		So, yeah, I think it's an earthly process.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You say a modern volcano will exhibit 50% the amount of iridium found in the course?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Some of them.
		Volcanoes on the island of Reunion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How do you account for that kind of difference, though, in the amount of iridium?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It apparently depends on how deep in the earth the lava came from.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And so I would assume that the bigger the volcano, the deeper it comes from.
unidentified		Yeah.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It is still up in the air.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you at all speculate on the cause of volcanic activity of suddenly becoming, in other words, of the planet suddenly getting a lot of volcanic activity?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Why?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I think it has to do with the earthly process called precession of the equinoxes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Precession, is that just a way to measure time?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, what it is, is, you know, the Earth is, let's see if I can draw a picture here for the listeners, but the Earth is tilted on its axis.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I mean, our axis of rotation is tilted away from true north.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay, and if you ever watched a top as it spins, you've noticed that the top never stands perfectly straight up and down.
		It tilts.
		Sometimes it tilts to the right, sometimes it tilts to the left, but it's constantly on the move.
		And the Earth does the same thing, but on a much slower scale.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		If you could look at the Earth from space, you'd see that just like a spinning top, the Earth's axis of rotation tilts.
		And the Earth's axis of rotation constantly moves in a circle, just like that top does.
		And that circular movement, that's what's called precession.
		And it takes about 23,000 years to make that full circle.
		So if you could put a long stick through our axis of rotation, long enough to reach into the heavens, you'd see that stick right now would point towards the star Polaris.
		And that's why it's called a pole star, because the North Pole points toward it.
		But 12,000 years from now, it'll point toward a different star.
		It'll point toward Vega.
		And 23,000 years from now, it'll point toward Polaris again.
		Well, that's precession.
		And ice ages match that cycle.
		Increases in volcanic activity match that cycle.
		Increases in flood activity match that cycle.
		And that precession is what I believe is causing these earthly changes.
		And that's why we're seeing the increase in volcanic activity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's fascinating.
		So the precession in the amount of tilt there is in the Earth.
		That's what we're saying, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, the tilt, no, this is just that the entire axis of rotation makes a full circle every 23,000 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, in effect, though, the tilt is changing a little bit.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay, yes.
		It also tilts up and down a little bit and changes, but this is the one where it's pointing.
		Where our North Pole points to in the heavens is constantly moving.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And for whatever reason, we have these calamitous things happen to our Earth at two sides of that 23,000-year cycle, every 11,500 years.
		And that means that we are pointed a different way from the Sun, essentially.
		And the Sun is a magnetic star.
		And I believe that that magnetic activity, as we are changing, we are going in and out of alignment with the solar system's magnetic field.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, so many of my guests, Robert, talk about events of a biblical nature almost that occur on a cycle from 11,000 to 13,000 years, Somewhere in there, it doesn't matter who you talk to, Richard C. Hoagland, gosh, just on and on.
		People who predict major events, people who talk about planets that come and go.
		That fits into the same kind of cycle that you're talking about, doesn't it?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, it does.
unidentified		Planet X, so-called Planet X. And I don't know whether there is such a thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nor even go into Zachariah Sitchin's work.
		All these cycles is what I'm saying.
		There's a big similarity there.
		No matter who you're talking to, right now we're talking to Robert Felix, but he's talking about the same kind of cycle, the exact same kind of cycle.
		Now, that alone should give you a pause.
unidentified		It don't come easy.
		You know it don't come easy.
		It don't come easy.
		You know it don't come easy.
		Nothing made you, you want to see the blues.
		And you know it don't come easy.
		You don't have to shout at me about you can't even play them easy.
		Without a reason why, you're blown in all sky high.
		You're blown in all sky high.
		Our love happens to fly.
		You couldn't touch the sky.
		You've blown in all sky high.
		Oh, round my home.
		Then down, down like a stone.
		I'll give you love.
		I thought that we had made it to the top.
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art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, how about the Hopi?
unidentified		You could add them to the list, right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Andrea in Pertalos, New Mexico, says, All right, the Hopi Indians agree with your guest.
		It is indeed the precession of the equinoxes that causes the Earth changes, and thus it is a natural cycle.
		One volcano eruption pollutes the air more than all six billion years of us do in one year, or all six billion of us do in one year.
		Very, very interesting.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		We'll be right back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's funny, it did just occur to me that not just Robert Felix, but all of these people, even including the Hopi, Hopi, you can add to the long list of those who predict something is going to occur and in a certain possession by a certain time.
		Robert Felix.
		So how do we know how close to the edge of this moment of repeat we are?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, one of the things that I'm looking at is I'm watching the El Ninos because I believe that those El Ninos are an indication of what's to come.
		Now, in 1982, we had the El Nino of the century.
		Had you ever heard of El Niño before 1982?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Now, most people hadn't.
		It was no big deal.
		1982, we had the El Nino of the century.
		It caused those huge floods in South America.
		It did $8 billion worth of damage.
		We called it the El Nino of the century.
		Then in 1997, we had another one.
		It did $97 billion worth of damage.
		And that has been renamed the El Nino of the century.
		I would say to watch El Niños.
		Now, here I'm guessing, but the next large El Niño should occur somewhere in 2008, 2009.
		And I would say watch that.
		And if that is even bigger than the previous El Ninos, I think we're on our way.
		That's one of the ways that I would say to watch.
		Another thing that I would watch is what's happening in Europe, because if this Gulf Stream shuts down the way that the Woods Hole scientists think it could, then Europe will be affected, I would say, first.
		Europe and the fire.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Actually, what scares me about Woods Hole is they say the process is well underway.
		It's well underway.
		And they say it could intensify.
		It could happen very quickly.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, they say it could happen within three years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's weird that you could come to this point, I guess, where I'm no scientist, but where the salinity had been diluted enough, the temperature had changed enough that suddenly the current would virtually not just keep slowing at the alarming rate it's slowing now, but would suddenly quit.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		Not just slow, but actually quit.
		There are some scientists now who are predicting an ice age for Great Britain within the next 20 years.
		And the Pentagon is looking into it.
		So you had asked earlier about what would you do as the president.
		Well, the Pentagon is looking into this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You clearly said you would do nothing.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That was about Yellowstone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that's right.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That was about Yellowstone.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I am doing something about this about this.
unidentified		Well, you know what?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We can make it about this if you want, because really, what can you do about volcanoes?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Not that I know of.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nothing.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right?
		Can't do anything about it.
		So it's not all that different a question, President.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, but when it comes to ice ages, I am screaming to the heavens as much as I can to look at it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In order to do what?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, one of the things, during an ice age, if that's what it is as an ice age, it's not a worldwide catastrophe.
		During the last ice age, what happened essentially was that the climate of Chicago moved to Georgia.
		That's what happened.
		And temperatures didn't fall that much.
		Seattle was covered by more than a half of a mile of ice.
		But the ice expansion of the city.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You see, things like this would be very meaningful.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I've got a lot of listeners in Seattle.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So when they hear covered with a half mile of ice, this has meaning to them.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It was.
		It was covered by more than a half a mile of ice.
		The ice extended as far south as Olympia.
		But 150 miles south of Olympia, and scientists know this from the plants that were growing in the area, 150 miles south of Olympia, it was only about seven degrees colder than it is right now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But this is still cold comfort for those in Seattle and the other areas you mentioned, a large number of my listeners.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, almost all of Canada was covered by one to two miles of ice.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, you see, again, I have many concerned people because we're heard all across Canada.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So thank you.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		What I'd say, watch Newfoundland, watch New Brunswick, because as near as I can tell, previous ice ages, it essentially started there by having, not because it was getting colder, but because they were just getting more and more snow, more and more snow.
		And then it works its way west.
		Now, last year, and if you have listeners in New Brunswick or Nova Scotia, I'd love to hear from them because the last couple of years, I believe they've had record snows.
		And so that's something I've seen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, we have listeners in that area.
		Yes.
		I mean, there's strange stuff going on all over the globe.
		My listeners in Alaska, oh, they could tell you tales about what's going on in Alaska right now.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Different story there.
		Now, Alaska, and that gave me a problem, too, Artist.
		How do I explain, if I'm thinking we're going to an ice age, how come the permafrost in Alaska is melting?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I mean, last several years they've had trouble with the races up there, the big dog sled races.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They don't have the snow and the ice to have the race.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		What I think is happening, I think it has to do with the warming oceans, is any landmass that is close to the warming oceans where the breezes, the warmer breezes are blowing over them, is going to be melting.
		But when you go inland, that's where the difference is.
		When you go inland, the Antarctic ice sheet is growing thicker.
		The Greenland ice sheet is growing thicker.
		Now, the Antarctic ice sheet covers something like 5 million square miles.
		The Greenland ice sheet covers another 700,000 square miles.
		That is twice as big as the continental United States.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's big.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That is 100 times bigger than all of the rest of the world's glaciers put together.
		So what I'm saying here is 99% of the world's glaciers are growing.
		We are only hearing about the ones on the edges that are melting.
		I think that it has started.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I guess people are not as inclined to measure one as the other.
		Would that be true?
		If what you're saying is correct, then why do we not hear about the actually, you know what?
		I have heard a little bit.
		I mean, I've seen a couple of stories about the thickening ice sheets.
		I have seen a couple of stories.
		But in general, you're right.
		People believe that things are melting.
		Why is that getting all the attention if it's not scientifically the whole story?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
		I've got an article here, August 22, 2002, from the Goddard Space Flight Center that radar image satellite records are showing that there is an increase in Antarctic sea ice cover.
		I have another article that shows that glaciers in Antarctica have been moving, and this was March 9, 2003, that glaciers, masses of Antarctic ice have been moving twice as fast as usual.
		And there's seven glaciers mentioned here, the Boydell, the Schrodigren, the Edgeworth, the Bombardier, the Drygowski.
		They've actually entered active surging phases toward the sea.
		So if they're surging, I mean, the reason they're surging is because of the added weight.
		They're surging towards the sea, so there's more of them to melt.
		And also in Greenland, I have scientific, these published papers that it's growing thicker.
		But that's from satellite images that not everybody gets to see.
		But you can take a cruise ship.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I know, but if it's an ultimate truth alongside the other truth about Alaska and the areas that we know are melting, I mean, I must tell you, Robert, to look at the North Pole 20 years ago and to look at it now is pretty damn frightening.
		A lot of it, a high percentage of it even, is just flat gone, Robert.
		I'm even hearing rumors that they're encouraging people who are flying over the pole, you know, to go to a quick trip to Europe or whatever, to keep their windows shut while they're going over the pole.
		Now, you know, maybe that doesn't have any meaning.
		Maybe it does have meaning.
		I have no idea.
		But those who have peeked out of their little windows while going over the North Pole have been astounded at the amount of blue water.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Well, I think, again, I think it has to do with the underwater volcanic activity.
		During the last ice age, the Arctic Ocean had no more ice on it than it has right now, even during the depth of the last ice age.
		And I believe that has to be.
		I mean, how do you explain that?
		How would that have happened during the last ice age when Canada was covered with two miles of ice and the Arctic Ocean had no more ice than now?
		How would you explain that other than underwater volcanic activity?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I don't know either.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Certainly willing to consider what you're saying.
		I don't know myself, but I'm willing to consider it.
		It seems like you assign an awful lot to volcanic action, including what killed the dinosaurs and all the rest of it.
		So you're a very strong believer in this.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I am.
		I'm certainly not in the mainstream here.
		I'm alone, and yet I have quite a few scientists that do agree.
		There's a scientist, there's a question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, okay, hold on.
		Let's go back to the reason why this is really important.
		Why, you know, your side of things regarding the building ice and what that means in the larger scheme of things is just virtually ignored compared to the melting that's going on.
		Why?
		I mean, I just don't get that.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		The only thing that I can imagine is that I think that during the last 20 years, any scientist who would have pointed this out or really pushed it would have lost their funding.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Why?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Because we believe so strongly in man-made global warming that to me it's almost become a religion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, maybe so.
		Yeah.
		But listen, it is happening.
		I mean, global warming, that is.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Ocean warming is definitely happening.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I absolutely agree with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, but as goes the ocean, so goes our fortune, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Our fortune is with the...
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		This comes from Alabama meteorologist John Christie.
		He's been studying satellite data since 1970s.
		And he has found, and I haven't heard of any scientist who disagrees with this, is that temperatures in the atmosphere are going down.
		Temperatures on land, I'll give you one to consider, is the United States Department of Agriculture draws a plant hardiness zone maps.
		These are the maps you see on the backs of seed packets that show you where it's safe to plant something.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, in 1960, the USDA drew up a plant hardiness zone map that covered Canada and the United States, and they divided the entire area into 10 zones based on temperature.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		In 1990, the USDA drew up a new plant hardiness zone map, and I have both of those maps on my website.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the difference is?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Temperatures in, for instance, in Tennessee and Alabama, temperatures in many of those areas during that 30 years declined by 10 degrees.
		Average temperatures by 10 degrees.
		They didn't go up.
		They went down.
		But we're not hearing about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Here's one we did just recently hear about, and maybe you'd like to comment on it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I'm sorry, I don't remember the scientific institution that made the discovery, but the story was basically that the horrid Dust Bowl, that time in the United States where the middle part of the country turned into an unlivable, almost surface of Mars, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The Dust Bowl, that was an artifact of a couple of degrees of ocean temperature change.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I believe that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There was a recent story about that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So I thought that might, you'd figure that might fit right in with what you're saying.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I didn't see that, but I do.
		You know, there's a scientist in Germany who also is publishing about Little Ice Age.
		It's a scientist by the name of Dr. Theodore Landscheit, and he's at the Schroeder Institute for Research in Cycles in Solar.
		He's studying solar activity in Germany.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And he has published a lot, and I have links to his papers too.
		But he believes that, and as far as I'm concerned, he proves it.
		But he believes that we'll be into a new ice age by the year 2030, which isn't, I think it's going to be even sooner.
		But here's someone with worldwide credentials, essentially, that's essentially saying the same thing.
		And I think your movie is going to help so much make people aware that something is coming.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, but there's nothing that really can be done about it.
		Or, you know, is there?
		I mean, let's say the worst-case scenario happens.
		I believe recently with regard to the Pentagon, it was commissioned that somebody write up the worst-case scenario, which was pretty scary.
		What do you consider to be the worst-case scenario?
		I mean, you know, mainly we've got listeners here in North America.
		How will the North Americans be affected?
		And what should they do?
		What can any individual do to prepare for what may be soon you're saying?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, one of the things I would say is, again, is going back to food, because I think that food will be the big thing, and just the knowledge.
		If we know the truth, you put me on a plane to Alaska and you tell me in advance where I'm going, and I'll figure out what to do, and I think people will figure out what to do.
		But if you tell me I'm going to Miami and then you dump me off in Alaska, I'm in trouble.
		And I think that's what's happening today.
		We're being told we're going to Miami.
		We're being told these things.
		But I think we're headed into this ice age.
		With that said, though, greenhouses.
		I think greenhouses will be like gold because then you'll be...
		Yeah, little private greenhouses, I think, will be a great idea for somebody.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Would it be that bad?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, would agriculture otherwise in all the good familiar breadbasket kind of areas of the U.S. be not longer, any longer possible?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, you don't need a full-fledged ice age.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		If snow should remain on the ground in Canada, let's just say eight inches of snow remains on the ground through one growing season.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That would definitely ruin it.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That's all it takes.
		It doesn't take a mile of ice.
		Last year I was doing an interview on a radio station in Kentucky, and a farmer called in.
		He said that his farm had been in the family for more than 100 years.
		And this was talking about the previous year, but it had rained so much that spring that he was not able to put his tractors in the field.
		That farm had put out a corn crop every year dependently for more than 100 years.
		And just because it was too rainy, he couldn't put his tractor in the field.
		That's the sort of thing I think we're, you know, it's not going to be, it doesn't have to be this great big drastic happening that the TV coverages are going to be showing.
		But these farmers aren't going to be able to work, you know, or they're not going to be able to plant.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is this going to be true across the entire current growing areas of the U.S.?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I don't know where it will be at the same time.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Now, I can tell you where the ice ended during the last ice age.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, assuming that we're into an ice age, where would you draw the line with regard to agriculture?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There'd be a new line to draw, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		During the last ice age, as I said earlier, the ice went as far south as Seattle, as Olympia, Washington.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I understand.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm asking you for guesses.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, then that ice moved back up to the Canadian border at Idaho, in Idaho.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And then it essentially followed the Missouri River.
		On the north side of the Missouri River, there was a cliff of ice about 15 stories tall.
		On the south side of the Missouri River, people were able to live.
		So I assume farmers would be able to.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Boy, that is a pretty sharp dividing line.
unidentified		It is.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		15 stories of ice on one side, not ice on the other.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Now, if you've got listeners in Wisconsin, they can call in and tell us about the Eskers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What are those?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		E-S-K-E-R.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Those are the moraines that were dropped there by the glaciers.
unidentified		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're going to have a chance for them to do that and for others to do it too because we're about to go to Open Lines with Robert Felix.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So if you have a question for Robert, now would be the time to dial.
unidentified		When I think back on all the crap I learned in high school, it's a wonder I can't think at all.
		And my lack of education hasn't hurt enough.
		I can read the writing on the wall.
		Hold a throne with gifts as nice black colors.
		Thank you.
		Thank you.
		To talk with Art Bell, call the wildcard line at area code 775-727-1295.
		The first-time caller line is area code 775-727-1222.
		To talk with Art Bell from east of the Rockies, call toll-free at 800-825-5033.
		From west of the Rockies, call 800-618-8255.
		International callers may reach Art by calling your in-country sprint access number, pressing option 5, and dialing toll-free, 800-893-0903.
		From coast to coast and worldwide on the internet, this is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My guest is Robert Felix.
		His book is Not by Fire, but by Ice.
		You might want to read that book, and that really is suggestive of a very good question for tomorrow night.
		You know, we're going to be doing open lines tomorrow night, and I thought perhaps one question I would ask you all is, how do you think the world will end?
		You've had so many choices presented to you here on Coast to Coast AM about the way it might end.
		Just being one of them, more or less.
		So that'd make a hell of an open lines question, wouldn't it?
		How do you think the world will end?
		Why not?
		It's that kind of weekend.
		From the high desert, I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		Gunshot
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Once again, my guest, Robert Felix, who basically I think would say the earth would end, the world would end by volcanoes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Right?
		Well, let me read something to you that's the very first part of my book and the Way I came up with the name for the book.
		A long time ago, the universe was made of ice.
		This is an ancient Scandinavian legend.
		Then one day, the ice began to melt, and a mist rose into the sky.
		Out of the mist came a giant made of frost, and the earth and the heavens were made from his body.
		That is how the world began, and that is how the world will end, not by fire, but by ice.
		The seas will freeze, and winters will never end.
		That's the ancient, you know, and when you think about it, you think back to Noah's flood, or you think forward to one, but what was happening in the north during Noah's flood?
		It had to have been snowing like crazy.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I suppose, yes, where it was colder, Noah's reign was indeed obviously snowing.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It would have had to have been.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And so that's the Scandinavian legend, is that's how they would say that it's going to end.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's dip into the greater gene pool out there and see what they have for you, Robert.
		Very good.
		So we'll begin with line one.
		You're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hello.
		Yes.
		I am acutely aware of the changes because 27 years ago I fell into a deep coma and I was out of contact with the world for many years.
		And I came out of it just a few days before 9-11.
		And to me, it's just unbelievable how the climate has changed and weather patterns.
		It's just so unbelievable.
		And yet people in this day and age are not alarmed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How long were you in this coma?
unidentified		About 24 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You were in a coma for 24 years.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That would be something.
		I mean, to come out and to look at the world after that long abandonment.
		What put you in such a coma?
unidentified		Well, they told me when I came out of the coma that it was a drug interaction that occurred 27 years ago.
		And it fried my brain.
		I was taking too many prescription drugs and it fried my brain and it put me in the coma 27 years ago.
		And I didn't come out of it until just a few days before 9-11.
		And it's just unbelievable to me how the world has changed and the weather patterns.
		And yet the people in this day and age are not alarmed.
		I mean, you just...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lobster's not alarmed.
		Actually, for at least a few seconds from the lobster's point of view, I'm sure the water gets very pleasantly warm.
		Actually.
		Right, Robert?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I don't want to find out.
		But yes, I've heard that.
		Same with frogs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lobster doesn't know what's happening to him until it's too late.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wildcard line, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
unidentified		Hello.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		You're up.
		Patternie.
		Yes, you.
unidentified		Oh, I'm sorry.
unidentified		Thanks, Sir, for taking my call.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're very welcome.
unidentified		Robert, I had a couple questions for you regarding the ice age.
		You had talked about how soon it would start, or kind of guessed around about it.
		How long do ice ages last?
		And the second question is what happens to the oceans?
		Are they going to rise or decrease?
		Should you buy that land property that's under the water right now?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Those are both very good questions.
		The ice ages, previous ice ages, have lasted for about 5,000 years.
		The ice starts to build up and build up and build up, but by the end of 5,000 years, it's essentially back to normal again.
		And then at that 11,500-year period, back it comes.
		As to what happens to the oceans, during the last ice age, sea levels were 370 feet lower than they are today.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's correct, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That's where the water comes from that builds up all that ice.
		For an example, the Bering Strait, which I think is about 170 feet deep at its deepest point right now, that was above water.
		And so there was a giant land bridge that connected Asia to Alaska.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you are saying that suddenly, if there were to be a repeat, that the ocean levels could be 300 feet or more lower than they are right now.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It could expose new land all over the place.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		During the last ice age, the east coast of the United States was 100 miles further east than it is now.
		Most of those states would have been twice as big as they are now.
		So, yes, that has happened every time.
		And by the way, there is evidence that sea levels are declining right now.
		We hear about rising sea levels, but there's evidence that they're declining.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, this doesn't seem like it would be a disputed measurement.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, it doesn't.
		We hear anecdotal stories about sea levels rising, but in the country of Tuvalu, which is a country out in the Pacific Ocean, it's comprised of nine small islands.
		The highest point on any one of those islands is 12 feet above sea level.
		So back in the early 1990s, Tuvalu was worried about rising sea levels and the fact that they could be inundated.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But actually, Robert, there were some islands that had to evacuate, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, because of storm surges, yes.
		But in Tuvalu, they assigned the job to the official meteorological agency of Tuvalu to measure sea levels.
		And during the next 10 years, sea levels declined by 2.5 inches.
		That is a huge decline.
		but we're not hearing about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That was published in I mean, obviously, I shouldn't say obviously, because I don't understand how these measurements could be beyond dispute.
		I mean, either the ocean levels are rising or they're falling.
		Right.
		It's not one.
		You know, it's got to be one or the other.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		The stories that you see in the newspaper talk about what the computer models say would happen if the ocean levels rose.
unidentified		And you're still telling us that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In reality, the opposite is occurring, though.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		In reality, the opposite has been occurring.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But that should be gigantic, important news.
		It should be.
		And Robert is the only guy telling me this.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That was published in the United Kingdom in the year 2002.
		And sea levels over also, they found the same thing in the Solomon Islands and in Nauru.
		And I'm not even sure where Nauru is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This just seems to argue so hard with conventional wisdom science.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It does.
		Well, I think that some of the conventional wisdom is not science.
		I think it's something else.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, yeah, I guess I've got that.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Tish Ganser calling.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Welcome.
unidentified		And I live in the Great Lakes State, and we love Lake Michigan.
unidentified		And I just, first of all, Art, it's just an honor to talk to you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Just love the pace of the program.
		And Robert, boy, I just love listening to you.
		You are so unpretentious, and I like your non-alarmist approach.
		And you just have such a depth of knowledge.
		I mean, what a neat interaction between you and Art tonight.
		Art, you just keep asking the neat questions, and Robert coming back.
		I'm just thoroughly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, do you have a neat question?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I want to keep her on the air all night, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What'd you say?
		Well, he said he wanted to keep you around all night.
		I don't want to keep going too long.
unidentified		But I have learned so much from this.
		And I have a question.
		Our lakes, all the lakes we enjoy here in Michigan, all our little lakes, were they the result from the last ice age?
		And as far as I'm going to hang up and listen to your answer, Art, as far as your question, will the world end in fire or ice?
		I don't think the world's going to end.
		I think it's a fire.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My question was more overall.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How do you think the world will end?
unidentified		How do I think the world will end?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		I don't think it's going to end.
unidentified		I think we're going to end up with a better heaven and a better earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		All right.
		Cool.
		Thank you.
		Thank you very much.
		I appreciate the question.
		And all right, her precious Great Lakes.
		Robert, were they the product of the last ice age?
		And or, she doesn't like the alarmist point of view.
		How will the Great Lakes fare in the next and or coming ice age that you're talking about?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You know, I can't answer that one.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I know that some of the lakes in the Seattle area were certainly caused by, because that's the area that I live, I know that some of those were definitely carved by glaciers as they receded and advanced.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you cannot tell her if her lakes were made by the last glacier.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, I don't know the answer.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How would they fare during the one that you're talking about?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I would have to look on my maps, but boy, a lot of that area was covered with ice.
		But not all of it.
		So it depends on which part of the state she's in as to what happens.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very interesting.
		All right, got it.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Dennis from Palm Springs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Robert.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Dennis.
unidentified		Great movie I saw it tonight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, thank you.
unidentified		It's kind of alarming, but I'm with you guys 100%.
		I'm a long-time listener.
		And I just wanted to know if the scenario you're talking about, does that have to do solely with Yellowstone blowing up?
		And if Yellowstone blows up, am I safe in Palm Springs or should I?
		Because the United States is safe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hold it.
		Wait for your answer.
		Let's see.
		Does, well, no.
		The larger picture on the ice age, well, does it have to do with it, Robert?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, Yellowstone doesn't.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You know, Yellowstone has not had a major eruption in 640,000 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So these are very different discussions.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		One about the cyclical ice age, and the other about Yellowstone and what might be happening.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		So if Yellowstone, yeah, but without Yellowstone, we will still have an ice age because that's part of the natural cycle.
		As far as I know, Palm Springs should be fine.
		During the last ice age, the American Southwest was slightly wetter than it is now.
		So maybe you'd have a little more rain, and it might be two degrees cooler.
		It should be wonderful.
unidentified		You have one more quickie.
		So if Yellowstone does go off, are you saying that there's no place on the planet that's safe to go?
		Would be going forward.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's see.
		There would be a 20-degree drop globally, which would have...
		Robert, what would that bring with it?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, the main thing it's going to bring with it is the lack of food.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And again, this is a big if, but if Yellowstone goes off and you've got seven feet of ash, you've got all of that ash landing on the rivers, and then when it rains, all of that ash is going into the rivers and washing into the seas, it would essentially, you'd be looking at massive extinctions in the seas with all of that ash.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I guess massive extinctions on Earth, period.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It would be an extinction event.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		But I would still think that Palm Springs, any of those places, I'm thinking for a normal ice age, going as far south only as Oregon would be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's the best time I've ever had, Robert, in the movie The Day After Tomorrow.
		This area would be, well, I don't know, relatively okay, and I'm not giving away too much here.
		And usually my city, you know, just over the hill here in Las Vegas, it's destroyed right off the bat.
		But lately, there's been better news for the American Southwest, and I'm very grateful for that fact.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I think the American Southwest will be fine.
		I think any place south of North Carolina should be fine.
		So there's a lot of places.
		During the last ice ages, the tropics were only about four degrees colder than right now.
		So there's a lot of hope.
		There's a lot of places.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, but of course with the Yellowstone occurrence, we're talking about a far different event, very, far different event.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I hate to even talk about that because that's hard to even comprehend.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, and yet you felt obviously compelled to discuss it to some degree tonight, and that's why I kind of probed you and said, look, how serious is the latest news about Yellowstone?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're saying five on a scale of ten, maybe.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I think so, because of all of the earthquakes and all of the things that are indeed going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		International Line, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hello, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		Art and Robert.
		It's Sprint Colling from Winnipeg.
		We're doing a bit of a coast-to-coast party here with me and my buddy Norm.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, ask Norm to turn the radio off.
unidentified		Norm, turn the radio off.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thanks, Norm.
unidentified		Thanks a lot.
		Okay.
		Okay, sorry about that.
		Just a question that has to do with this whole ice age and with the volcanic eruptions and what have you.
		I've been listening to your program for some time in terms of this Planet X thing coming through.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you also, sir, see the similarity of not just Planet X, but I mean what the Hopis say, what so many others on this program have said about roughly the same timeline?
unidentified		Very, very much so.
		This 3,600-year thing, if it's on a rotational orbit and it's coming within 20 million miles of Earth, and if we do buy into the idea of it being about three to five times the size of the Earth, you look at what the Moon does, just in terms of the pull on the tides.
		If we have a planetary body coming within that distance of the Earth, it's got to be doing like a sucking effect on the volcano, on the volcanic activity of the Earth.
		We're looking at teutonic shifts.
		We're looking at the Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you're referring to the magnetic influence of another body that close to the Earth.
unidentified		Exactly.
		It's covering it with meteors and comets and all the other things that are tied into its gravitational pull.
		We're looking at meteors and comets and everything.
		We're looking at planets that we haven't ever seen before.
		Put all that together and say, okay, what your theory, Robert, is that the whole thing is volcanic.
		What I'm suggesting is that the volcanic may be attributable to an extraplanetary force working its way coming closer and closer to the planet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's a wonderful question.
		Robert, right.
		If there were something cyclical, like a planet X, couldn't this caller be right that the eruptions that you're talking about could be the effect of some oncoming magnetic field change produced by some other planetary body?
		In other words, everything you've talked about, couldn't that be attributable to some other major event or attendant to that event?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		If there is such a thing as Planet X, yes, I think it could.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And you mentioned the magnetics, because magnetic reversals do occur to the same beast.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there are magnetic reversals.
		They're talking about the same sort of timelines.
		Is that correct?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, we had the magnetic reversal or excursion, where the magnetic north pole wandered south and then popped back up again.
		We had the Gothenburg magnetic reversal 11,500 years ago.
		We had the Monolake magnetic reversal 23,000 years ago.
		We had the Lake Mungo magnetic reversal 33,500 years ago.
		That's when the Neanderthals went extinct.
		All of these things are right on that same cycle.
		I haven't studied the Planet X thing.
		I don't know whether it's true or not, but if it is, then it...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know if it's true either, but, you know, there's sit and there's a lot of things to think about.
		And when you start putting together all of these things that are on the same rough cycle, no matter which one it ends up being, you've got to get the shivers a little bit.
		I mean, they're world ending events, and they're all in the same damn cycle.
		That's got to have some significant, very significant meaning.
		So that's why I thought maybe a good question would be, how do you think the world's going to end?
		I mean, it could be any one of these events, right?
unidentified		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You sound so cheerful.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, I've been studying this so long that sometimes I even doubt myself.
		But then I've realized, no, it's coming.
		But what other choice do we have than to face it square on with a smile?
		I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, with a smile.
		That's right.
		And you've got a smile in your voice as you talk about it, Robert.
		So that's good.
		I mean, why not?
		What's going to happen is going to happen, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, if we can't do anything about it, we might as well enjoy it.
		Enjoy it.
		Enjoy life and do what is the best as we can.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's as good a view as any in the face of this kind of discussion, right?
		Well, maybe tomorrow night one of the questions I will ask you is, how do you think the world will end?
		Certainly there's been plenty of primer for it on this program.
		Make a dynamite question.
		From the high desert in the middle of the night, this is Coast to Coast AM.
unidentified		Coast to Coast AM.
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art bell ▲ ● ▼		This has a very soothing effect, doesn't it, as we discuss matters like, oh, Yellowstone blowing its cork, 600 miles of pure death surrounding it, that sort of thing.
		A new ice age.
		My guest is Robert Felix, and we'll be right back.
		So if you would like to indulge tomorrow night's question, one of them anyway, how do you think the world is going to end?
		And you want to investigate the way Robert Felix thinks it might end, not by fire, but by ice, you can probably find his book at Yahoo, even though it's been out this long.
		Can you still get it up Yahoo, at Amazon and those sorts of places, Robert?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		It's available on Amazon.
		It's available at a lot of the other bookstores.
		If they don't have it, they can get it in about three days.
		Or it's available on my website.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		By the time a person has fully digested your book, will there be enough evidence in there to convince them that this volcanic process is underway?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I think so.
		Well, naturally, I think so.
		But I've certainly heard from a lot of people who do agree with it, and I've gotten good endorsements from some solid scientists that agree with it.
		So, yes, I believe so.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you going to be investing in greenhouses?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I have certainly considered that.
		Another thing, when I first came out with this book, I was really hot on the thought that everybody should move south.
		And I no longer say that.
		In 1999, I think it was.
		But anyway, I decided if I was going to believe my own words that I had to move.
		And so I was renting a house at the time, and I let the house go, and I got a writer-rent.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where is it you live?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I'm in Seattle area.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you're in Seattle.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I'm in the seat.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my gracious.
		Yes, then according to your own words, then, well, yeah, let's hear this.
		So how did you rationalize staying in Seattle?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, first, what I did is I got the truck and I sold stuff, and the rest I loaded into a truck and put my Jeep on a trailer, and I headed off for Arizona.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And I did, in fact, move to Arizona, and I got there, and I realized my daughter lives back here, my granddaughter lives back here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was sort of an, oh, my God, what have I done together?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		What have I done?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		And I came back, and now I realize that there's more to this than just plain science.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There was nothing about Arizona you didn't instantly dislike?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Oh, no.
		I had lived there previously, and I like Arizona.
		I like it a lot, and I still go back and visit.
		But what I'm doing is I'm keeping track of what's going on in Nova Scotia and in New Brunswick.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So are you thinking there's going to be enough warning so that you could beat feet and get out of the Seattle area?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I hope so, but I'll tell you, every time it snows, I wonder if I'm right.
		I do.
		I honestly do worry about it.
		It's because we have had record snows.
		Four years ago, Mount Baker in northern Washington had 100 feet of snow in one season.
		I mean, that's deeper than the trees.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It was the most snow in one season that's ever been recorded anywhere in the world.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you think you'll have enough warning?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I hope so.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You don't sound that confident.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I honestly don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So I guess the alternative would be to say internally, embrace the ice and I'll die with my family and friends.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That's kind of the alternative.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, you've thought about that, right?
unidentified		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I have.
		And it's what good is the quality of life if you're in a place where there's no friends and no family and no anything?
		I decided that it was better to stay.
		So I'm not, I am no, I used to tell people they should move.
		I no longer say that.
		It all depends on their own circumstances.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Fascinating.
		First time call online, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hi.
unidentified		Yeah, hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Yes.
		I believe in everything that you're saying.
		I believe that you've got a good focus, and I believe there's a lot of things going on in our world right now that are affecting our condition as far as whether or not this earth is going to end within our lifetimes.
		And I personally believe it is, but it's going to come by the hand of man by intercontinental ballistic missiles fired upon the Antarctic, causing the melting of the ice down there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that would do it.
		I believe that would do it.
		Why do you believe that we would fire missiles intentionally nuclear devices at the Antarctic?
		Why would we do that, sir?
unidentified		I'll lead into this real quick.
unidentified		I was in the bookstore years ago looking for the quickening your book, and I loved it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I appreciate all that, but I want the answer to that.
unidentified		Well, I found Zachariah Sitchins, and I read him, and that's when everything started to make sense.
unidentified		Well, the secret societies that are in control of our Earth right now, they have a time schedule, and they will circle the Earth just as the Anunnaki did on the previous flood after Utnu Pishkin was warned by Enki.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You think that The New World Order people are going to fire missiles at the Antarctic and melt us.
unidentified		And when they return to this earth, they'll be worshipped as God.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Holy mackerel.
unidentified		What's left?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's a hell of a story and a hell of a way for the world to end.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What do you think about that, Felix?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I think I'll stay away from that one, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, huh?
		You're not going to tackle that one?
		No.
		Secret Society blasting the Antarctic.
		Oh, my.
		Wildcard Line, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
unidentified		Yeah, hi.
unidentified		Mr. Felix?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Hi, how are you?
		Well, you know, if this ice age were to happen, oh, I haven't seen your film yet, Art, but I'm looking forward to trying to get to see it.
		But if this ice age were in fact to occur, and we did, in fact, have sufficient warning, I think there might be things that we could do to minimize some of the calamitous effects of it.
		And one of them might possibly be to construct an array of nuclear reactors on the moon and essentially hook them up to a mess of giant grow lights, as it were, and point them towards the Earth and maybe warm up the Earth a couple of degrees.
		Also, on that same note, the same sort of principle could be applied to Mars.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I like this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You'd point them out.
unidentified		You could put them on Deimos and Phobos.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute.
		Let's come back to putting grow lights on the moon.
		Right.
		Powered by the sun, right?
unidentified		No.
unidentified		Well, you could use solar electrics as well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But you want to build nuclear power plants?
unidentified		It would be more efficient if you had nuclear power plants powering them.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And then focus all this light on the Earth.
		Sure, why not?
		Well, what do you mean, why not?
unidentified		It beats getting into fights with people over firewood and sweaters and stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So control the...
		An interesting question, Felix.
		With all that we've discussed tonight, these ancient cycles that we're talking about, can we do anything at all about them?
		Can we control their occurrence or lack of occurrence?
		Do we have the slightest possibility of affecting this in any way whatsoever?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I don't think we have the slightest possibility of affecting it one way or the other whatsoever.
		No.
		We can.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What about Grow Lights on the Moon?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		You know what?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It's going to take that kind of thinking, thinking out of the box to think of things that we can do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		It really is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Grow Lights on the Moon.
		I'll remember that one for a while.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hello.
unidentified		It's good to talk to you, Art, and thank you very much for the Coast to Coast.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're very welcome.
unidentified		Having a show like this is really splendid because when people discover what could happen to the planet, it's good to be prepared with distributing the information.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just wait till we ask tomorrow night how you think the world will end.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		One of the concerns that I have is that with foreknowledge of what might happen and happening within our lifetime, we might be facing solutions we have to create now, and that would be alternative community building.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I was wondering if that has been one of the factors that sealed bubble cities.
unidentified		Well, we've frequently talked about how it'll affect people personally, but not how we can create communities that can counterpose against an ice age.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Got it.
		All right.
		So bubble cities, that kind of thing, Robert.
		Would you go to that scale?
		Do you think that mankind, if presented with a catastrophe of a 20-degree change or something like that, those who remained would erect bubble cities and protect themselves from the environment?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, I would guess that when it does come, I would say that people will start moving south.
		That's what has happened in the past.
		You know, Genghis Khan swept out of the north in sync with a little Ice Age cycle.
		And I think we'll be seeing mass migration of people moving south.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So what will the northern nations do?
		Will Canada and the United States go down and simply, I don't know, annex a few nations in the southern hemisphere and say, look, we're stronger.
		We're going to survive.
		Sorry.
		We're taking Brazil.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know.
		I don't think we'd have to go that far.
		You know, I think that, you know, I've mentioned that I live in the Seattle area, and it wouldn't surprise me when this comes, is that people will be moving south, is that like the state of California will close their borders.
		I think there will be things like that where there will be fighting just about trying to migrate south.
		But the bubble cities, I don't know that we would have the will to do that, and I don't know that we would have, once we finally admit that this thing has started, I think it will be too late to do that sort of thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All righty.
		First time caller line, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hello.
		I think we just missed somebody.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hello.
		I'm not pushing the button.
		That's my fault.
		Wildcard line, I think you're on the air now with Robert Felix.
		Hello.
unidentified		Wow, I really like the idea of the grow lights on the moon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was pretty cool.
unidentified		I was wondering if I don't know if you're familiar with Earthship-style housing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I am.
unidentified		Yes.
		I was wondering if Robert knew about that kind of housing.
		If it was, say, in the southern Rockies, like down in the Four Corners area, do you think that would survive that sort of a catastrophe?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I would think that the Southwest being relatively okay, at least perhaps so, with what Robert has said, that that kind of housing might be very efficient, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I do.
		I have a friend who's getting ready to build an Earth chip house in Taos.
		And yes, I think that because they're so self-sufficient, I think that would be a great idea.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I wonder if it'll hum.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Robert Felix.
		Hello.
unidentified		How's it going, Mr. Bell?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's going pretty well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		I'm calling you from Louisville, Kentucky.
unidentified		I'm listening here on WHAS.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Big one, yes.
unidentified		I was just going to say that in my short lifetime, I'm 31, I've seen both extremes of weather here in Kentucky, which would just support pretty much the radical change of weather.
		In 945, we had a 22 below, the lowest ever recorded here.
		And then in 99, in a very hot summer, we had 104.
		And then the floods that he talked about earlier, they said it was like a 100-year type thing.
		And then two years later, we had the same kind of rain again.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
		I know.
		It's been incredible.
unidentified		So I've seen both extremes.
		And I kind of think that we live in an area south of the north of the equator where we get, you know, equal, like when you put the balance right between left and right, of the cold and the hot.
		And yet, these are extremes for us.
		The big weather we had in 94, we had a terrible big winter storm.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Man, we can just go on and on describing the record weather.
		No joke.
		And no joke, what's going on across the whole middle part of the country so far this year.
		It's been incredibly violent.
		Incredibly violent.
		In fact, earlier tonight I switched the radio on, and there was so much static on the radio that it was just like a lost cause.
		I mean, lightning strikes by the gazillions.
		And I looked at the lightning map, and the whole north central part of the United States is on fire with large-scale thunderstorms, really serious weather ravages.
		But you know something, Robert?
		We're not supposed to, as mortals, we're not supposed to really notice any weather cycles at all.
		The traditional teaching is in America and around the world that these events take place over much larger spans than we would ever notice anything occurring at all.
		It's ridiculous.
		Thousands and thousands of years.
		That's the traditional teaching, right, Robert?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		That is the traditional teaching, and it is totally wrong.
		These ice ages begin.
		There was an ice age, one of the ones that I could talk about is at the end Emian.
		The Emian was a period of warmth that lasted about 11,500 years that was very similar today, slightly warmer than today.
		And that ended 115,000 years ago, and it ended in less than 10 years.
		The climate went From temperatures warmer than today to full-fledged glacial severity in less than 10 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Then, just look what happened to our school textbooks.
		I mean, what happened?
		How come?
		And I mean, it has not changed.
		The school textbooks still say the same thing, right?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		They still say the same thing.
		And I don't know why.
		The cycle that I talk about, why isn't that in any computer models?
		I know of no geologist in the world who will disavow this cycle.
		It's called the Milankovitch cycle.
		It's written in the rocks.
		It's written in the earth record.
		It's not denied.
		If the computer modelers would put this cycle into their computer models, well, I think your movie talks about some ancient paleoclimate computer models, but if this would be put into those models, it would be a totally different story.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And that makes me so much want to talk about some of the plot of the movie.
		Yes.
		But you see.
		You're exactly right.
		Of course, it was a great movie.
		It was.
		Thank you.
		So, Robert, we've come to the end of it here.
		The show is just about over.
		Is there anything that we somehow didn't get out during the course of the show that you'd like to get in at the very end?
		Did we skip over anything?
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		No, I would just say that remember, the whole world will not be covered by ice.
		And we don't have to panic in that way if we can have some food and if we can be prepared to move south if we have to.
		But I am not suggesting that people move south at this time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It is interesting to me, Robert, that you adjusted your own life based on what you wrote and how you went into that psychological turnaround on, wait a minute now, what have I just done?
		That was stupid.
		I'm going home.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I won't label it as stupid, but I learned better.
		And until that point, I really hadn't considered that part.
		I was just looking at the pure science.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I do need to know how long had you been in Arizona when boom, the light bulb went off.
unidentified		One day.
unidentified		I felt, yeah, I did feel stupid.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		One day in Arizona.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		One day.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's incredible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's obvious that you really feel what you write about and that you're certainly a believer in your own take on science.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		I am totally a believer.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		This has been since 1991, and I'm more convinced now than ever.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Uh-huh.
		Well, if we could just, I don't know who you appeal to.
		NASA, perhaps.
		I mean, NASA does large-scale climate studies.
		Could you appeal to NASA to take these things into account?
		They influence a lot of the computer models.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		A big one that I'm appealing to is it would be so simple during the next El Nino to take a submersible down and look at the source of the heat.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Where is the heat coming from that causes El Niño?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Go find the source of the heat.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		All they've got to do, that's all it takes, is follow that heat to its source and we'll know whether I'm right or wrong.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, brother.
		Thank you for being on the program tonight.
		Continued success with your book, and we'll talk to you again soon.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		All right, thank you, Ice, sir.
robert felix ▲ ● ▼		Appreciate it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good night, Robert Felix, ladies and gentlemen.
		Not by fire, but by ice.
		From the high desert.
		Oh, don't forget, tomorrow night we're going to be asking you how you think the world will end.

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