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April 2, 2001 - Art Bell

02:49:41

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - HAARP - Nick Begich

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01:13:06

nick begich

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unidentified		Welcome to Art Bell Somewhere in Time, tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		From the high desert and the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening and or good morning wherever you may be across this great land of ours from the island of Guam commercially.
		Good morning on the rock, eastward to the Caribbean and the U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north, all the way to the Pole and worldwide on the internet.
		This is Coast to Coast AM, and I'm Art Bell.
		I would like to welcome in the first hour of the show now, first time tonight, WABC Radio in New York.
		Thank you, Phil Boyce.
		I grew up with WABC.
		I nursed with WABC, and I rocked and I rolled with WABC.
unidentified		So it's great to be on there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Also, WBHP in Decatur, Alabama.
		WBHP.
		They're 1230 on the dial in Decatur, Alabama.
		Glad to have you on board.
		In addition, WHOS in Huntsville, Alabama, 800 on the dial.
		Huntsville, Alabama.
		All right, welcome.
		As the network continues to rocket toward 500 affiliates nationwide.
		Now remember, everybody, we are sending pre-feeds now.
		The show actually begins.
		We begin feeding on the network at 7 o'clock in the evening Pacific time, 10 o'clock back east.
		So if your radio station should so desire, there are three hours prior to the beginning of the live show each night available, which happen to be the last hours of the previous night.
		Kind of a good service to listeners, if you're able to do it out there.
		All right, I have so much, so much for you tonight.
		Right now, let us begin this way.
		As you know, I'm a ham operator, and so I watch the sun very carefully, and there has been a gigantic event on the sun.
		We have, when things are lowly in the sun cycle, B flares, sometimes C flares.
		We have M flares, which cause disruption to radio, depending on the class of the M flare.
		Then we have X flares, which are really big.
		And they produce disruption.
		They produce aurora sometimes the way we had last week.
		Boy, that was incredible, red skies.
		And then there is this scale that's above an X flare.
		So each one of these scales is graduated.
		And then above the X flare, there is another scale on the X-ray flux scale, and they don't even give it a name.
		Earlier today, at about 4.30, a friend called and said, hey, guess what?
		We just had a mega flare.
		And I said, what?
		He said a mega flare.
		And I checked it out immediately.
		And oh my God, it was a mega flare.
		That's the scale above an X flare.
		It's called a mega flare.
		I've never seen one, but they have happened.
		So I immediately got on the phone and began calling about, trying to figure out what the heck was going on and whether we were in the line.
		That is to say, whether it was pointed at us.
		Well, I found Bill Marquette.
		I talked to Mount Wilson National Solar Observatory.
		And I found Bill Marquette, who is the guy at the telescope.
		He is site director and chief observer at Big Bear Solar Observatory.
		And here he is, and we'll talk to him about exactly what happened today.
		Bill, welcome to the program.
unidentified		Oh, glad to be here.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you are the guy at the telescope, huh?
unidentified		Well, I've been in the business for 33 years, and basically as a solar observer, and one of my duties is to look at the sun and keep track of things.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Actually, that's not such a bad job, huh?
unidentified		That is a wonderful job.
		I look forward to it.
		I've worked.
		It's been an exciting last eight days.
		I've worked every day in the last eight days looking at this giant sunspot group.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, this would be what they call, I think, 9393, which is the one that everybody was squawking that if you did it the right way and didn't go blind, you could look at it, you know, using a pin in a box or something or another, and you could actually actually, it's so big, you could actually see it with the naked eye.
unidentified		Right.
		It was at its maximum development on March 29th, and at that time, it was 14 times the area of the Earth.
		So that's pretty big.
		That's the fun thing about this job, is it just about everything I look at is bigger than the Earth.
		And I keep, even though I've been here for a long time, I keep thinking about that.
		That doesn't do a lot for Earth man egos.
		No, it sure doesn't.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Everything you look at is bigger than the Earth.
unidentified		Just about everything, that's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, we had, of course, on Friday an incredible display of Aurora that came from a lesser event than apparently has just occurred this afternoon.
		It was amazing.
		We had blood-red skies here in the desert.
		In fact, do you know how far is it?
		I had emails from people who said they saw it in Puerto Rico, the U.S. Virgin Islands.
unidentified		Mexico.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's incredible.
		Absolutely incredible.
		And the other thing was, and maybe you can explain this to me just before we get on to the news.
		Somehow I got a lot of emails from people in Canada who said that they saw it, but guess what?
		They were looking south to see it.
unidentified		Yeah, well, those particles come in, and they're slightly unpredictable as to where they'll be the strongest.
unidentified		And we, Southern California, for example, where I'm located, just happened to be a really good place to look at it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So I guess this one must have come in at a latitude that was a little lower than usual.
unidentified		Right, they differ, but it's very, very rare, and we'll probably never see it again.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In our lifetimes?
		Well, that came I guess I expect it to be perhaps my last, although you never know.
		After all, this spot, this 9393, is now going around sun, right?
		So in 30 days, potentially it'll come back around.
unidentified		Yeah, most likely it'll come back much decayed.
		That's usually the pattern.
		These things usually use up their energy and the evolution is such that it'll be much weaker.
		Although sometimes we have things called favorite longitudes and that's where there will be a brand new eruption of magnetic flux coming up very near to this one.
		So it may not be 9393 but it may be related to 9393 in some way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Indeed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's quite a few up there right now actually aren't there?
unidentified		Yeah this is a little bit surprising to some of us the way this region developed and has this tremendous sunspot area.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well I had heard from various sources that we were past the peak of the sun cycle.
unidentified		That's exactly right and now if you look at from places that measure very accurately sunspot total sunspot area right now it's at a higher level than when it was at solar maximum this little spike due to 9393 plus a bunch of other spots more minor.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Could they be wrong about the peak Bill?
unidentified		Well probably not.
unidentified		It's common for the descending branch of a solar cycle to have these last big shots and most often these on the descending branch when we're going down towards minimum again are the stronger terrestrial, have stronger terrestrial effects.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well how strong was the one today?
unidentified		Today, you were talking about mega flare and the GOES X-ray flux scale.
		Actually what happened is that the scale saturated at about X17 or so.
		And the people in space weather operations in Boulder, Colorado are probably going to come out tomorrow and say that this could be an X22 or X21.
		And that would make it the largest flare since we've been ranking these things.
		There was an X20 back in August, 89.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And this could go as high as an X20.
unidentified		Well, it's possible that when they figure out beyond the saturation point that it may be an X20 to 22.
		I'm not sure yet.
		We'll find out tomorrow morning on that.
		So that would be the biggest one in my life I've ever seen in my career, in over 30 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Were they even accurately observing and recording 100 years ago?
unidentified		This would be the biggest since they've been recording flares in this manner.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Biggest ever recorded, then.
unidentified		Yeah, in the X-ray classification.
unidentified		Wow.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow.
		Now, there's good news and bad news.
		The good news is that you were telling me that because it had rotated almost over to the edge, it's not probably not headed toward Earth.
unidentified		That's correct.
		That's it.
		As far as we can tell right now, the terrestrial effects of this flare will be minor.
		And the one on the 29th, that was, I believe, an X 1.7.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		but it was in a very favored position.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So if this one had occurred a week ago or a few days ago...
		A couple days ago.
		What would have happened?
		Would we have lost satellites?
unidentified		Well, that's, you know, you never can tell.
		It's speculation.
		But that's a good possibility that satellites could be disrupted.
		They could be lost temporarily.
		And in some cases, damaged by a flare like this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So we, by a few days of rotation, we missed it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But just a few days ago, it really would have been a whopper here on Earth.
unidentified		Well, it certainly looks that way.
		You know, you never know.
		The nature is funny.
		But there's no doubt that it would have been much more severe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is there any chance of even minor effects from it?
unidentified		Yeah, there's probably going to be minor effects from this flare, because it was so large, and we are probably on the edge of the coronal mass ejection.
		But looking at the images earlier today, you could beautiful coronal mass ejection, and it was directed off to the west.
		Sort of like a garden hose.
		I mean, it's a pretty narrow deal, and a garden hose spraying out, and if the Earth is just in that path, and if everything is set up right, then you could have some major problems on Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It would have been, I suppose, in one way, interesting, but I'm sitting here saying, thank God, I depend heavily on satellites for everything I do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I was imagining earlier today the worst and, you know, wondering if I'd be on the air.
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
		Well, nowadays, we're pretty much on top of these things.
		And satellites can be somewhat safeguarded from events like this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How does the one that produced the amazing auroral display Friday, how much, is there a way to describe how much bigger the flare we had today is than that one?
		In other words, with the Richter scale and earthquakes, we know we go by a magnitude of 10.
		When you look at the SCOES X-ray scale, is it a linear progression or does it increase exponentially?
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		Second.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It does.
unidentified		Yeah.
		So it would be many, many, many times greater.
		Wow.
		But, you know, the interplanetary medium is so complicated that you don't know.
		We've had a lot of big flares, and we haven't had that many problems on Earth.
		And these are quite rare.
		Problems on Earth from large flares are quite rare.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		The last time that we had big problems was in 1989 from solar flares.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I remember that very well indeed.
		I worked for a 50,000-watt radio station, and I did the all-night talk show.
		And we depended heavily, of course, on out-of-state callers.
		And it got so bad in 1989, Bill, that I didn't have any out-of-state callers.
		Nobody could hear me out-of-state.
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, that was a famous solar storm yes yes it was horrendous all right well listen I really want to thank you for appearing tonight and telling us about this and particularly the part about it missing us thank you very much yeah thank you and it was a pleasure okay good night that's uh that's Bill Marquette thought you might just want to know at the site director and chief observer at Big Bear Solar Observatory it was a monster we had today if you want to know
		about it go to my website under what's new and then under bill marquette's name you will see a picture of what a cme it's from nasa of what a cme would look like if
		it were headed directly at the earth uh of this magnitude omega flare cme take a look at that you'll see the little earth there you'll see the big sun you'll see the flare and that is to scale just go to my website go to tonight's guest and look under the name bill marquette i think you'll get an idea of the scale of the the thing so the x-ray scale then is just like the uh the richter scale and the increases exponential so imagine the amount of energy that just ripped
		out of the sun today amazed at the top of the hour dr nick begich is going to be here and we're going to be talking about things electromagnetic we're going to be talking about harp all in
		they've been up again transmitting again harp has or what passes for harp it operates on their frequency and boy is it loud oh my god is it loud it's loud iss in hawaii and alaska and they've been coming up on 3.39 and other frequencies and so if you've wanted to know what harp is you're about to find out we're going to talk about other electromagnetic weapons as a recent electromagnetic victim
		I'm very interested in all of this.
		So Nick Begich is the guy.
		He'll be here next hour.
		Meanwhile, the news, which is never good, is not good tonight.
		As you know, a spy plane, one of ours, is now in the possession of the Chinese.
		We say it was over international airspace.
		They say not, of course.
		I figure, personally, either one could be true.
		Don't you?
		The Chinese have gone aboard, taken the crew off.
		They don't know where the pilot is.
		I heard something about his being missing, but the 24 crew, they've got them.
		We haven't seen them yet.
		We've been making demands to see them.
		It was an emergency landing after a collision with a Chinese fighter.
		So, you know, it's a pretty serious item.
		The president has been making some pretty loud noises, but with regard to China, that's, I think, about all we can do.
		There's not going to be any Entebbe-type rescue mission.
		You can be sure of that.
unidentified		You know, unless...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The only way I could think we might do something like that would be if, indeed, we were truly righteous, and our plane was not really over their airspace.
		Now, who...
		do i believe do i believe the u.s or do i believe the chinese mostly i don't believe either one of them i think either either one could be true and i'm sure they will give our major asset back to us the airplane after the after they're sure that the roll of film and the schematics are all in place and they know all they want to know we would do i'm sure exactly the same thing if we had a chinese spy plane that we brought down or a russian spy plane you
		remember the U-2 that went down in Russia.
		Well, you know, you can always be sure they're going to find out everything they can before returning our asset to us.
		It's kind of a red October in reverse.
		Last word they had from the crew was that Chinese soldiers were boarding the aircraft.
		It landed at Hainan Island in China.
		And every bit of state-of-the-art electronic eavesdropping equipment and secret stuff aboard that plane in the Chinese, you just know they're pouring over it right now.
		It supposedly is an EP-3E Ares-2, part of the World Watchers out of Whidbey Island Naval Air Station, Washington, and Kadena Air Base Okinawa.
		Gosh, I spent a lot of time at Kadena.
		Anyway, I've...
		I've got an awful lot more news for you I don't think the U.S. is going to take any sort of precipitous military action you never know we we might it'll be interesting to watch President Bush and see what he does about this if we were really righteous he might be tempted to do something if we really were over their airspace then what we have to do is bluster real hard and get them to give back the airplane but
		but boy you know they're pouring over it and you know if we had one of theirs we'd be pouring over it too probably putting it through some long quarantine making sure that their soldiers were okay and that the airplane was safe whatever excuse you would have while you send in the merry band of uh...
unidentified		schematic copiers i suppose uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		the crew would have had some opportunity to destroy the most things hopefully before they were forced down you would imagine there would be that that scenario right and there would be a certain number of things that you would absolutely destroy before allowing it fall into anybody's hands certainly hope so so that's the uh the mainstream news that's going on right now.
		Pretty serious stuff.
		I've got more news for you.
		News you will not hear elsewhere coming up in a moment.
		News you may not want to hear.
		Nevertheless, real stuff.
		I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		You'll distinguish you, Art Bell, somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		I'm used to be in the middle of a dry air.
		Timmy Rogers on the victor up high.
		I'm dancing.
		Baby, on a shoulder.
		Trying to look my life to the sky.
		Everything had a moon.
		Everything.
		Always wanting more.
		Even longing for Black Film and I needed more smile.
		Black Felma without a soft sunshine.
		new religion I don't want your lonely mention with a tear in every room.
		All I want's a love you promised beneath the haloed moon.
		But you think I should be happy with your money and your name.
		And hide myself in sorrow while you play your cheating game.
		Silver threads and golden needles can I mend this heart of mine.
		And I cannot drown my sorrow in the warm water wide.
		But you think I should be happy with your money and your name.
		And hide myself in sorrow while you play your cheating game.
		Silver threads and golden needles can I mend this heart of mine.
		If I dare not drown.
		You're listening to Arkbell somewhere in time.
		Tonight, featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It certainly is.
		Good morning, everybody.
		So in other words, summing up, we just had the biggest sun flare in recorded history.
		They still haven't figured out how big it is.
		It actually saturated their gear.
		So we missed it by a couple of days, a couple of days earlier, and you can equate this to a shotgun being pointed at your belly.
		Wasn't there somebody who said something about a shot across the bow?
		Who was that anyway?
		Who said that?
		Something about a shot across the bow.
		Remember that?
unidentified		Let me think.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Something about a shot across the bow.
		Let me give you just a little bit of an idea of what's coming up in the first part of this month, all right?
		Tomorrow night, Dr. Gilbert Lavoie, M.D., and I'm sure I'm slaughtering his name.
		He's a medical doctor and internist, and he has been for years now researching the shroud of Jesus Christ, the shroud of Turin.
		I say Jesus Christ because he says he can prove that in fact that shroud was from Jesus Christ.
		That should be interesting tomorrow night.
		That'd be very interesting.
		The following night, heaven in a chip.
		Imagine achieving digital immortality in a computer chip.
		Well, we'll be talking about that with Bart Costco on Wednesday nights.
		So we've got, oh gosh, we've got all kinds of things coming up.
		Let's see, after Bart Costco, Albert Taylor.
		We're going to be talking to him a little bit about the shadow people, because I don't know what else to do about that.
		We'll talk more about the shadow people here in a moment.
		Albert Taylor, followed by on Friday.
		Well, that's who said shot across.
		That was Ed Dames, wasn't it?
		Major Ed Dames will be here Friday.
		Yes, I knew, of course.
		I just wanted to get you shouting at the radio.
		Monday next is Philip Hoague, no such thing as doomsday.
		But the issues he discusses are kind of doomsday-ish, mad cow disease, anthrax, earth changes, that sort of thing.
		Then on Tuesday of the following week, we're going to have a guest who wrote Deathbed Visions.
		And Dr. Carla Wills-Brandon is going to be our guest talking about deathbed visions and people who have actually felt the spirit of a person leaving the body at the moment of death.
		Deathbed Visions.
		We haven't talked a lot about that, but we're going to.
		So she'll be our guest.
		Then Friday the 13th, we're going to have Ghost to Ghost.
		It just seemed Friday the 13th seems like the day to do Ghost to Ghost.
		What do you think?
		Monday the following, we're going to have Harold Oort from Popular Communications here.
		You know me, I love talking about radio.
		The next night, we're going to, Tuesday, that would be, what, April the 17th, we're going to have Gordon Michael Scallion here.
		I talked to Gordon earlier today.
		He said, yep, guess it's about time I come back on.
		I said, yes, I guess it is.
		So Gordon will be here.
		The following night, Wednesday, Professor John Mack will be here.
		And he's Got it.
		He might also have something to say about the shadow people.
		The following night, Thursday, April the 19th, we're going to have Daniel Brinkley.
		Daniel Brinkley will be back.
		As a matter of fact, Daniel Brinkley came to see me today.
		Just late after, just as I was hearing about this mega flare, knock, knock, knock on the door.
		And there's Daniel.
		so he'll be here anyway that gives you a little bit of an idea of what From Chico, California, Associated Press, dayline, April 2nd, two of three cloned heifers at the California State University Chico Farm have died, and a third may be in trouble now.
		One of the three calves died at the farm last week.
		Another died over the weekend at the University of California Davis, which has also participated in the cloning experiment.
		The three heifers were born March 9th to two surrogate cows.
		A total of 28 cloned embryos were implanted into 14 surrogate Hereford cows.
		The three calves were the only ones to survive.
		So we're a cloning, but it's not a working out too well yet.
		Meanwhile, people are testifying in front of Congress about cloning a human being, and I don't think so.
		I wonder if the government is going to step in.
		I wonder if they should.
		I'm not a big fan of government stepping in, but this cloning thing with regard to humans is about to happen, and obviously it's not working out too well yet with animals.
		So we might not be real happy that we did that.
		Pigs are dying.
		Pigs are dying.
		Headline says, ABC News says, forget about the current media spotlight on mad cow and foot and mouth disease for the moment.
		Our discovery today is about a disease in pigs that in many ways is like AIDS.
		This may be one you haven't heard about, huh?
		The reproductive and respiratory syndrome, which often kills baby pigs, is characterized by a variety of conditions and is causing economic hardship for pig farmers.
		Affected mothers lose up to 10% of their pregnancies.
	Their babies are spontaneously aborted or stillborn.
	As many as 20% to 30% of survivors may suffer and die from respiratory disease like pneumonia.
	This virus is said to primarily attack a pig's immune system, we're discovering, leaving the body open to a host of other infections.
	Oh, that does sound like AIDS, doesn't it?
	Particularly in the lungs.
	Some pigs develop a chronic infection, become carriers, but show no symptoms.
	Boy, that sure sounds like AIDS, doesn't it?
	Research reveals that the virus is transmitted via semen, saliva, and blood.
	Those pigs herded closely together and transported in close quarters by trucks may be more susceptible to infection.
	To date, there is no evidence the virus can affect human beings.
	Yet, do you sense that we are really racing towards something fast?
	I mean, all of this information about our animals, which are going to be not edible if things continue as they are now, something is obviously going on.
	Somebody wrote me the following, and I thought it appropriate here.
	We live in a moment of history where change is so speeded up that we begin to see the present only when it is already disappearing.
	It's another way of saying we're quickening, huh?
	Think about that for a moment.
	We live in a moment of history where change is so speeded up that we begin to see the present only when it is already disappearing.
	And now, the shadow people.
	On Friday night, Saturday morning's program, it was as wild in this studio as you can imagine it gets.
	The first part of the program was totally obliterated by the sun.
	The skies in Nevada, southern Nevada, California, New Mexico, all the way down to Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands turned red, blood red.
	Some green and other colors were noticed as well.
	Here in the desert, though, we don't see this happen, and yet it did occur.
	The sky at what, about 10.15 at night, which should have been pitch black, well, it looked like a forest fire, and we, of course, got whacked by the sun.
	So that was pretty wild.
	But then it got wilder.
	From one caller that I had had the previous night, who I put back on the air again, because he sent me a phone number, we began talking about a subject called the shadow people.
	Now, I have never seen in my life such a response.
	I tell you now, I have had 2,000 emails from people who have seen the shadow people.
	What the hell have we stumbled into?
	What have we stumbled into?
	I could read you story after story after story.
	What happened is a fellow called up and said, you know, normally it's just like a moving shape I see in my peripheral vision out of the corner of my eye.
	And I talked about my old Dreamland intro.
	Remember that?
	Things seen at the edge of vision.
	Remember that intro?
	Well, for the rest of the night, I couldn't stop it.
	We had people calling about the shadow people who said peripheral vision at first, but after wild art, you can actually see these creatures straight on.
	And then I began to read my email after the program.
	And it went absolutely nuts.
	We're into something big here.
	I don't know what.
	I really don't know what.
	Somebody wrote to me, and Bruce wrote to me and said, Art, I'm interested in the shadow people topic.
	Haven't seen any, but I was wondering if you're considering having an expert speak on the subject on your show sometime in the near future.
	Where do you go to get an expert on something I never even heard of, the shadow people?
	They're not ghosts.
	They don't act that way.
	They don't want to see us.
	They move away when we do see them.
	They appear surprised when we see them.
	They're described as small, relatively, for a human being.
	Oh, excuse me.
	Did I say human being?
	I have no idea whether they're human.
	Probably not.
	Possibly not.
unidentified		OBE people, maybe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Maybe not.
		In other words, Bruce, I would be more than happy to get an expert on the shadow people.
		I mentioned it to Professor John Mack earlier today, and he said, yeah, well, we'll talk about that.
		So I don't know whether John really knows about it or is simply prepared to talk about it or what.
		But off the top of my head, there's no such thing as calling up a shadow people expert.
		So I don't know what to do with all this.
		I'm just telling you all that we have really stumbled into something very, very serious.
		I've had no less than 2,000 reports of people seeing shadow people, various levels of encounters with shadow people, and nobody talked about it until Friday, and now I can't stop people from talking about it.
		So, I don't know, folks.
		I'm digesting this one.
		I'm trying to figure it out.
		If I can find somebody who really knows about this phenomenon, obviously we'll have them on.
		I'm just trying to impart to you the magnitude of response.
		When I get 2,000 emails from people saying they've had encounters with these whatever in the heck they are, we're into something big.
		I'll work on it.
		If you have ideas, be sure and send them to me.
		If you happen to know an expert on shadow people, for God's sakes, email me.
		Amazing.
		Meat, you're going to want to brace yourself for this one.
		Speaking of meat, meat in Moldova, in Europe, Moldova, was human flesh.
		Tests yesterday have revealed.
		Two women were selling the meat outside a butcher's shop in the capital of Moldova.
		They were arrested for selling outlawed meat, but officials were uncertain until the tests that it was, in fact, human.
		A customer reported the women to police on Friday after she bought the meat, which they were selling by the bag.
		According to Interior Ministry officials, the bag, a bag of meat, human meat.
		Yuck.
		Women told police that they acquired the meat from a state cancer clinic, and authorities immediately launched an investigation.
		Oh, great.
		A state cancer clinic.
		police said they did not want to make an official statement on the arrest of the women because they didn't want to create public revulsion and panic pop pop pop pop pop pop pop pop Well, what do they think this story does?
		All right, I can see that I'm not going to make it to the phone, so sorry about that.
		Just too much I wanted to get to you.
		Check this one out again from, as always, Britain, where they get these stories, and we don't seem to.
		British scientists on the trail of Yeti, Bigfoot, brace yourself, folks, have found some of the best evidence yet for the existence of a mythical Himalayan creature.
		It's a sample of hair that has proved impossible to identify.
		In other words, not human hair, not ape hair.
		It is something new.
		Genetic tests on the hair, which was gathered from a tree in Butan, have failed to match its DNA to that of another animal, or any animal.
		The findings, which have surprised skeptical researchers, raise the strong possibility that the sample belongs to an as of yet undiscovered species of animal.
unidentified		Hmm.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In Butan, an expedition team was led by an official Yeti hunter to a forest in the eastern part of the country where he was convinced that an animal was at large.
		He told us that he had found evidence of the yeti in the hollow of a cedar tree.
		Rob McCall, a zoologist who was part of the expedition, said, Dr. McCall's team removed strands of hair from the tree and returned to Britain to have them analyzed.
		Brian Seitz, professor of human genetics at the Oxford Institute of Molecular Medicine, one of the world's leading experts on DNA analysis, who examined the hair, said, quote, we found some DNA in it, but we don't know what it is.
		It's not a human, not a bear, nor anything else we have so far been able to identify.
		It's a mystery, and I never thought it would end this way.
		So then, let me tell you this.
		I have a friend in the TV production business who is on to perhaps the biggest Yeti story ever.
		In the middle part of the country, I won't identify where yet.
		The people right now are very reluctant to Talk.
		They're afraid for themselves.
		And I'm not going to give away any of the incredible story, but I'll just tell you that in the middle of the country there has been a really, really major Yeti incident.
		Let's see, how can I put this?
		With a very great deal of evidence.
		It's just that the people involved are worried for themselves and for very good reason.
		So whether we're going to get them on the air or not is problematic right now.
		It's being worked on.
		I guess that's all I better say.
		Anybody want to give Sean Morton credit for calling the NASDAQ?
		He called the NASDAQ down to 1782.
		Today it, in fact, closed at 1782.
		Now, of course, after hours, trading no doubt changed that figure by 10 o'clock Eastern, but the market closed at 1782.
		And that's a fact.
		Sean Morton called that one, folks, big time.
		Big time.
		So I don't know what to tell you.
		I know a lot of you don't believe in prophets and prophecy and all the rest of it, but there really is.
		You know, there's something about Sean David Morton.
		I joked, you know, I always said he had the as many hits as the mafia.
		And since the mafia has calmed down a little bit, since the old days, he may have more hits than the mafia.
		I mean, he hit it right on the mark.
		Now, you may recall he said if it goes below that figure, then look out, Katie bar the door, anything could happen.
		If it goes above that figure, it's going to bounce back up and things are going to be okay.
		But just in case you were curious about the prophecy of Sean David Morton, there you go.
		I thought I would call that one.
		This person who sent it to me did, and it deserves recognition.
		He hit it right on the mark.
		Dead square on the mark.
		I've got a terrible story here, which I guess I'm glad I don't have time to read about a 12-year-old boy and what he did in Las Vegas at a local pet store.
		It's probably just as well I don't have time to read that to you right now.
		Anyway, Nick Begich, right around the corner.
		Can all this happen?
		What an incredible week.
		What an incredible year.
unidentified		You're listening to Arc Bell somewhere in time tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		Baby, grow up to be friends only in America and a report to the endly girl like you all for a poor boy like me in America and a kid who's watching pop a giant and
		We'll be right back.
		Radio Networks presents Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight's program originally aired April 2nd 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, everybody.
		The sun just spit the biggest spit, the biggest hawker that the sun in our history of recording this kind of stuff has ever spit.
		It's called a mega flare.
		A mega flare.
		Now, had it occurred about two or three days ago, it would have been aimed at the very gut of Earth.
		And what we experienced last Friday would be like child's play compared to what would have happened.
		It is by magnitudes much larger.
		We interviewed Bill Marquette, who's site director and chief observer at Big Bear Solar Observatory.
		And he said it actually saturated the instruments, saturated them, so they haven't even really figured out how big it is.
		It went up into an unnamed area that some people call a mega flare.
		You can see the X-ray flux on my website right now under What's New.
		Would have been a big electromagnetic event.
		And speaking of electromagnetic events, my guest coming up in a moment, Dr. Nick Begich, who wrote Angels Don't Play This Harp, will be here to talk about the angelic harp installation in Alaska and other ones like it around the world and other electromagnetic anomalies.
		And God knows we've been having a lot of those.
		One here in Burum, which like an electro magnetic blanket descended on us.
		And then one, of course, up in Washington.
		A lot of weird happenings lately.
		Could these be electromagnetic weapons being tested?
		Probably would be one of my first questions.
		Anyway, he's the expert, Dr. Nick Begich, coming up shortly.
		right where you are Now, Dr. Nick Begich is the eldest son of the late United States Congressman from Alaska, Nick Begich senior political activist Peggy Begich, his wife.
		He's well known in Alaska for his own political activities.
		He was twice elected president of both the Alaska Federation of Teachers and the Anchorage Council of Education.
		He's been pursuing independent research in the sciences and politics for most of his adult life.
		He received his doctorate in traditional medicine from the Open International University for Complementary Medicines in November of 1994.
		So really, it's Dr. Begich, isn't it?
		He co-authored the book, Angels Don't Play This Harp, Advances in Tesla Technology, and wrote Toward a New Alchemy.
		The Millennium Science, his latest book, Earth Rising, The Revolution Toward a Thousand Years of Peace, was co-authored with James Roderick in December of 99.
		Also is the editor of Earth Pulse Flashpoints, a continuing new science book series.
		He published articles in science, politics, and education.
		He's a well-known lecturer, having presented throughout the U.S. and in 19 countries.
		He's been featured as a guest on thousands of radio broadcasts, reporting on his research activities, including new technologies, health, and earth science-related issues, has also appeared on dozens of television documentaries and other programs throughout the world, including the BBC-TV, CBS-TV, Telemundo, and many more.
		Begich has served as an expert witness and speaker before the European Parliament.
		He's spoken on various issues for groups representing citizen concerns, statesmen and elected officials, scientists, and others.
		He is the publisher and co-owner of Earth Pulse Press and is also under contract as tribal administrator of the Chickaloon Village Council.
		Wow, a federally recognized American Indian tribe Indian nation.
		Dr. Begich is married to, I think it's Sheila Begich Slade and has five children.
		How prolific of him.
		He resides just north of Anchorage in the community of Eagle River, Alaska, USA.
		Dr. Begich.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		It's good to be with you again.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi there.
		I hear now something running in the background.
		Sounds like a fan or something.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, it might be wind.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		It's a little bit windy here, but that's probably all that it is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Then it may be our telephone that we have a big problem.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		How is it now?
		I hear it as well.
		It's kind of in the background, but it must be the phone lines.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, unfortunately, what happens is it gets amplified.
		We'll try recalling at the break here or using that other phone if we must.
		Okay.
		Anyway, Doctor, thank you for coming on.
		There's been so much that has been happening.
		So much.
		It's like, I don't know where to start.
		I guess we should begin.
		There are a lot of new listeners out there, and so give them a quick 101 on HARP.
		You wrote, of course, Angels Don't Play This Harp.
		And people have been asking me, because we heard HARP on 3.39, what we thought was HARP.
		They denied it.
		And by the way, it's been back, Doctor, on several other frequencies, and even back on 3.39.
		When we talked about it last, it quickly disappeared.
		You checked with them.
		They said, no, they weren't operating.
		But I don't know if I believe that.
		I'm not sure you do either.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right, that's right.
		And, you know, we've kind of followed some of this, and there's actually been a number of things happening.
		And it's really getting tougher to deduce where the signals are being generated, because there's a couple of things happening here in Alaska that may be responsible.
		There's also things happening in Russia as well as in China right now that may explain some of the signals that are being picked up.
		But if we look at sort of the mystery signals and we just sort of throw it in that category and say what are the possible sources, at least what are the possible sources here in Alaska, and there's essentially three that we can point to.
		One is, of course, the HARP itself.
		And when we checked and rechecked and tried to get some definitive information on that, we really couldn't find anything to confirm that HARP was responsible.
		That's not to say that it isn't either, because there's not a good deal of information being released there these days.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		The other place we looked is HighPass, which doesn't have the same operating frequencies but was and has been firing.
		HighPass is a, what was supposed to be a smaller facility located near Fairbanks, Alaska, very similar to HAARP.
		In fact, it's just been retrofetted in the last couple of months so that it gets a higher pulse power.
		And a pulse power is generated when the signal is sort of restrained and then released in a surge that causes a pretty good spike in terms of the energy discharge.
		This is what's responsible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What does high pass mean?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		High pass, I forget the full acronym, but it's essentially a phased array antenna similar to HARP producing radio frequency.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		It was thought to be less capable, but with these additions now they can get an ERP and effective radiated power of up to a gigawatt or a billion watts.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A lot of people out there are going, what are they talking about?
		Doctor, if you would, let's go ahead and change phones right now.
		You did it before, so just go ahead and change phones if you would, and I'll point you down.
		I understand that a lot of you are going, well, what are you talking about?
		High pass, harp, what are these things?
		Well, I understand that for hams, they pretty much know what it's all about.
		Well, some hams might not.
		I'm fairly technically familiar with what it is.
		Doctor, are you there?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I am.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Much better.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Much better.
		All the hum's gone.
		All right.
		So, you know, a lot of people don't really know what HARP is.
		Let's give them the quick version.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		You know, HARP is an array or a field of antennas on the ground.
		Right now, there are 48 in this array or this field.
		They're about 72 feet high, and then they have a cross diapole, which is like a cross running the opposite direction at the top.
		So they're big, big, huge antennas in a field.
		And these antennas are energized and they fire radio frequency energy, the same thing that essentially is being broadcast where people are hearing this broadcast tonight, except the energy is handled differently and that energy is focused in this array or this field of antennas so that it's concentrated into a relatively narrow band.
		It could be the equivalent of, if you were to use an example, and just a crude example, but a good illustration, you know how light is focused when you use a laser versus say a flashlight with light spreads out the same thing happens with the HARP system only with radio frequency energy.
		So it sort of concentrates or focuses the energy to a relatively small area and it creates by peaking or pulsing the power in a specific way you can create these huge surges.
		And in the case of high pass you can go up to a billion watts.
		Now think about that in terms of say a 60 watt light bulb in your house.
		If you can create an effective radiated power of a billion watts.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A billion watts.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And this is done by pulsing the energy essentially and something that can give a real high yield for a short duration of time but if that energy is repeatedly used in very specific ways it can then cause releases of energy in our natural systems in an unprecedented and profound way.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		In fact this whole discussion of what would happen if this solar activity had created more of a direct impact on the Earth, the discussion of what happens when that energy is discharged and comes to the Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, we missed it by like two days.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		And what happens in that is normally it can disrupt like energy systems, power grids, communication systems, radio broadcasts.
		The same can be done artificially using an instrument like HARP and using HAARP.
		In fact, if the energy is pulsed into this energetic area, the ionosphere and the magnetosphere, the same areas where the aurora takes place in the ionosphere, you can stimulate a number of effects that change the character of that part of our environment over a large area in much the same way as nature does it.
		The only difference is nature is shooting sort of random energy at various frequencies and wavelengths.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's the real difference, isn't it?
		In other words, they have all these arrays of antennas on the ground, and normally a signal like the one you're listening to on the radio right now or a ham signal starts out as a relatively narrow signal and just broadens out.
		And that's what almost all transmitters and antenna systems do.
		This antenna system, though, on the other hand, starts out as a broad signal, relatively broad signal.
		They have fields of antennas.
		I mean, we had a picture of HAARP, and it's just like, as far as you can see, antennas.
		So it starts out as a very broad signal, becomes a very narrow signal.
		By the time it gets to the ionosphere, it's like the laser beam, and that makes it incredibly more powerful.
		And that's what they're doing.
		Do they know what they're doing is the question?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there's actually a number of things that have come from this research over the last seven or eight years.
		And the things that jump out that really stand out are the first desired outcomes by the military was to enhance communications with submarines.
		They were able to prove that they could do that using this system on the ground, stimulating the ionosphere, this layer that begins about 30 or 40 miles above the Earth's surface.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That would be doing the same thing as a sunflare ultimately does, right?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right, except from this instrument on the ground, you get coherent or very controlled energy where you can be very precise in what energy frequency and waveform you're using.
		And what happens as a result of that, just like dialing a radio between stations, you get static, but when you hit a resonant frequency, a frequency that corresponds to the transmitter and receiver, you get a nice clear signal.
		The same is true with many parts of our environment we're finding, and as well as human health, and even machinery can be affected by storages of energy in a very precise way.
		But these window frequencies that affect living organisms, environmental systems, or equipment have been discovered and more or less charted.
		And by manipulating energy in very unique ways, what you get is electromagnetic warfare, one of the biggest issues in the revolution in military affairs that's being discussed by think tanks around the world in both the United States and in our traditional adversaries, press reports, China and Russia recently having made some pretty strong proclamations in this area.
		But when we talk about mystery signals, there have been a number of reasons to suspect, at least in my mind, that either China or Russia may in fact be responsible for some of what we're hearing.
		At the same time, we know that there's been a number of tests at the Geophysical Institute dealing with the high-pass system, which has now this very high effective radiated power of a billion watts at its peak power.
		HAARP eventually will be capable of that power density as well as they continue to develop it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Up to a billion watts.
		Remember to talk straight into that phone.
		That's really important for me.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and you know, when you look at a billion watts, I mean, one of the things about HAARP that was talked about early on was this huge power level that was never achieved before.
		And now, you know, that was back in mid-1980s when the program first began.
		And what's happened in the intervening years is the technology has advanced dramatically, causing both miniaturization, in other words, the systems are getting smaller to have the same effects that previously would have taken a much, much larger array.
		In fact, Dr. Bernard Eastland, the inventor of the HARP array, originally expected an array 20 kilometers by 20 kilometers square to create the maximum effects that he saw as possible.
		But what we know now is the same effects, many of them, can be created by creating a peak power or pulse power surge of sufficient power density to change the character of the environment by hitting these very specific window frequencies bigger frequencies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Change the character of the environment.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What do you mean by that?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, several things.
		First thing that comes out is the idea of modifying the ionosphere from its sort of random approach to how it handles its Energy to something more coherent.
		In other words, switching it from DC to AC, where it has an alternating current or a very specific pulse rate.
		What it then does is acts like a giant broadcast antenna in the sky, sending a signal back to the Earth that can penetrate the Earth and see for things like Earth-penetrating tomography, which is like X-raying or looking into the Earth several miles deep for underground mineral deposits or nuclear facilities.
		The other thing you can do with that is communicate with submarines at pretty high data rates.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But Doctor, how can you look into the Earth?
		I mean, that's hard to do even when you're down here on Earth and you're inserting instruments into the ground.
		It's hard to look into the Earth.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		how could you have enough power to look into the earth bouncing something off the ionosphere that's astounding even And they actually demonstrated this and talked about it openly on BBC television on a show called Horizons in a segment called Masters of the Ionosphere.
		And in that, they said that they were able to locate things as precision as underground mine shafts several hundreds of feet below the surface using this technique.
		So that idea, in fact, in order to get funding passed 1996, one of the mandates of Congress, of the Senate actually, in the appropriation, was that they show that they could do this earth-penetrating tomography application in order to get more funding.
		And they funded it under non-proliferation and counterproliferation of nuclear weapons in 96's defense budget.
unidentified		Huh.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the thing that has bothered me about it is the amount of power that would be required to go down into the Earth after a bounce off the ionosphere would have to first pass through human beings.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Before it passes through the Earth, right?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, so that means that potentially means what to a human being?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, in this case, it means quite a bit because the signal to pass through the Earth, you have to have an extremely low frequency signal, a very long wavelength in order to get through.
		Shorter wavelengths don't penetrate very deep.
		Well, these ELFs or extremely low frequency signals are the same signals that have been shown to be biologically active that affect human beings in the most profound ways.
		In fact, in our latest work, we talk quite a bit about this because the idea that the human system, the human body can be really violated by this technology in a way that not only changes, can change our health, but can also change the way our mental processes work, our behavior, can alter our emotional state dramatically.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You mean it could make us happy, it could make us sad, it could make us angry.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Panic, hysteria is one of the things that's pointed out actually in a number of publications both in the U.S. and China.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Panic and hysteria.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, by being able to using infrasound as an example, in a recent Chinese report that was released under a Freedom of Information Act request in January of this year.
		In fact, this researcher who pulled this, his attorney, the researcher Harlan Girard, who's been at this a long time, he FOIA what is called the Foreign Broadcast Information Service, which many people don't even know exists.
		It's an operation of the Central Intelligence Agency that translates 3,500 publications in 55 foreign languages daily, basically media and technical reports.
		One of those recent reports was this one on new technologies originating in China.
		The things that are being pointed out really confirm much of what we've been speaking about over the years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		China.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, where this China's in the news today, you know.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		One of our airplanes.
		Listen, Dr. Begich, hold on a second.
		We're going into a break.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		You'll listen to Arct Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from April 2, 2001.
		Coast to Coast AM from April 2, 2001.
		Some people want to fill the world with silly love songs.
		And what's wrong with that?
		I'd like to know that I go again.
		I love you.
		I love you.
		I can't feel anymore that I'm singing.
		Yeah, I'm in you.
		You're in me.
		I'm in you.
		You're with me.
		Cause you gave me the love, love that I never had.
		You gave me the love, love that I never had.
		You'll distinguish your art bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks for tonight, an oncore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, there was a time when I was naive enough that I thought our government, not the United States, the United States of America, would never, ever experiment on Its own people with something that could potentially be a weapon would affect our emotions, make us happy, sad, angry, out of control.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Our government would never, never, ever experiment on us with something like that.
unidentified		Right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Once again, Dr. Nick Begich.
		And oh, by the way, if you're trying to send a fast blast, too many people were trying to do it at once, so I think it's all okay now.
		You can try one now.
		Dr. Begich, welcome back.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Hey, it's good to be back with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, this is even a better phone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We've been experimenting now.
unidentified		We've got a better phone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I really put a phone on here, I hope.
		All right.
		You heard what I said.
		You know, I really used to be rah-rah.
		We would never, ever experiment on our own people.
		Do you believe that?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Not at all.
		In fact, in Earth Rising, we covered this issue with a chapter on just some of the most gross violations of human rights taking place in the United States.
		In fact, Secretary of Energy O'Leary, when she was in that position, suggested at one juncture that over half a million Americans had been experimented on as non-consensual victims, essentially, of human experimentation.
		This involved everyone from prisoners, orphans, minority populations, and other disenfranchised populations, military people as well, in tests on basically to see what would happen to a human being in the course of either weapons applications or other types of experimentation.
unidentified		Great.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Great.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So there's a long, rich history of experimenting on us.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		In fact, even this year in this current congressional budget, there's a settlement for indigenous Alaskans that were used in experiments back during the Cold War where they injected them with radioactive iodine to see what would happen in Arctic conditions over the long term.
		And finally, this year they're financially settling with this group of folks.
		But they're not alone.
		The fact that a half a million people is admitted to, we question whether that's an accurate number.
		The fact that no one's ever been held accountable for that, I think, is really something that everyone should be pretty outraged about.
		The idea that that can happen in the United States, there's a pattern in the history of it happening.
		There's been some disclosures periodically which have gotten the attention of the Congress.
		But those abuses continue.
		It's just a matter of whether or not they're disclosed, and they usually are in the course of time, and we hear about them from time to time.
		We've tried to collect some of that data, again, because the revolution in technologies is taking place now with even more profound weapon systems that have the ability to affect our health and our environmental systems.
		It's a great deal to be concerned about and something that we just can't dismiss.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you want to believe that your own country wouldn't do something like that.
		It's just like this American spy plane that's down on the Chinese island right now.
		Chinese are saying it was over their airspace.
		We're saying no way.
		Jose, it was over international airspace.
		I figure it's about 50-50.
		And, you know, they're over there using up every bit of Kodak film they can before they give it back, or probably Fuji film, I don't know.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, that's not surprising.
		And the fact is, I mean, I think we would do it if we had the opportunity.
		And the Chinese right now, interestingly enough, there's been quite a bit of saber-rattling from China, and mainly in response to our efforts in missile defense, something that we've been talking about, you know, for a long time.
		The Chinese have just this last couple of months announced one of the biggest increases in their military budget, which by U.S. standards is considered fairly small.
		I mean, it's in the billions of dollars, tens of billions, as opposed to the hundreds and hundreds of billions that we spend in the West.
		The difference is what you get for your money.
		In China, your labor for your top-notch scientists is a fraction of U.S. cost.
		Your infrastructure maintenance is a fraction of the cost when you consider the price of labor and materials.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right, that's right.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		So the money really goes a lot further.
		And when you're talking about scientists as a group of people, certainly China out of their over a billion population has produced some of the finest mines on the planet.
		Those are being applied to the Chinese version of the revolution in military affairs, which has been the subject as far back as November of 97.
		It was in the United States Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.
		There was some really interesting testimony by a Michael Pillsbury, which really was sort of looking at what was China's approach to new technologies and the leapfrog in technologies that was taking place.
		And essentially, the Chinese, by their own admission, essentially have pointed to not just weapons against hardware, but weapons designed specifically to disrupt information system, including human mental processes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I really want to talk about that a little bit, human mental processes.
		Would it be possible, Doctor, with HAARP or any of the other potential weapon systems, they hate it when we say that, to, let's say, a battlefield situation, could you aim a weapon to the ionosphere and then down to a battlefield where the enemy was en masse and cause them to either be so confused that they could not function or even worse yet, cause them to essentially go mad and begin slaughtering each other?
		Would a weapon like that be conceivable?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		You could create mass hysteria and fear, certainly and panic.
		In fact, a test of this kind of idea was first discussed going back as far back as 1969 by science advisors to Lyndon Johnson.
		It then became sort of the discussion in the 70s.
		The CIA was reported to have tested this.
		In fact, we cite the source of where that came from in Eastern Europe before the end of the Cold War.
		But yeah, in fact, going even, this is the idea of bouncing a signal off the ionosphere back down to the earth where you can disturb the thought process over a large population.
		The idea was to agitate or disrupt a population.
		And the idea that you could do this on a mass scale by stimulating the ionosphere goes way back in the literature.
		Even Brzezinski talked about it in his book Between Two Ages, which was published in 1973.
		He later became national security advisor to Jimmy Carter.
		And he Was talking about stroking the ionosphere in just the right way to return a signal to affect emotional states of populations.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that the kind of thing that HAARP could do, Doctor?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		In fact, in terms of, again, the military, when we addressed this to them, and it was approached, the subject was approached also by the Canadian broadcasting system on a program called Undercurrents.
		And the military's response was, look, it's a side effect for us.
		We're not particularly interested in what it might do in that regard.
		And that's what their response was on National Canadian Television.
		And that was John Heckscher commenting on it.
		And from our perspective, when we look at just the body of data surrounding this subject, whether it's HAARP used in this way or some other instrument, we've seen last month the military, the Marines in particular, released a new microwave or millimeter wave weapon for creating heat sensations.
		What they didn't tell us that really needs to be said is that by just changing the frequency or waveform on that transmitter, you might be able to create any number of other effects beyond just heating of the skin.
		In fact, that's probably one of the more milder effects or one that they think at least the public would accept as a crowd control technology.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, let me tell you what the people who run these kinds of things, because I am friends with some people who are experts in what they call non-lethal weaponry.
unidentified		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And they stress non-lethal.
		They say, well, would it be better to be able to do something like this to a group of people or to have to slaughter them in cold blood?
		They make that case.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, that case is always made, but when you look at the history of non-lethal weapons, going back to, say, Northern Ireland and rubber bullets and tear gas, things that are considered non-lethal by most standards, those weapons over the course of time have killed many, many people.
		In fact, by comparing them to, say, Bosnia during the year where there wasn't much going on there, but everyone was heavily armed, not with non-lethals, but with lethal weapons, no one discharged anything for a year.
		Whereas in Northern Ireland or any other place where, quote, non-lethal, unquote, are used, death does occur from asphyxiation with gas if you have asthma or lung conditions.
		If you're using sticky foam and it gets on the face, you suffocate slowly.
		There's lots of ways to die.
		Rubber bullets can hit you in vital points and kill you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know Palestinians have been killed by rubber bullets.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Sure, and you can get the same kinds of situations.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		If you're hit with an electric baton or some other discharge of electromagnetic energy, it can interfere with heart rhythm and stop the heart rate.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, you said they were working on this a long time ago, so we can only sort of imagine what the state of technology is.
		Oh, it's advanced.
		Very advanced.
		And so you've got to ask yourself, how would they test something like this?
		Now, just how would they test something?
		Let's say that you could affect a city-sized area or even a smaller area than a full city-sized area.
		How would you test this?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, the battlefield environment is the ideal place, actually.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, yeah, but since we don't have any current battles, big ones going on, you might have to test it on a civilian population.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, and that's exactly what has happened historically over time.
		When you don't have a war environment, then the U.S. tends to become the battleground for the experiments.
		And, you know, in the case of, say, the Gulf War, there was lots of rumor about infosound devices, devices that could create a sense of panic and fear and mental distress.
		This was actually reported after the war in the Scottish media as one of the reasons why you saw the mass panics and just a whole generation of fear that came in the battlefield.
		In fact, the same technology we found in the United States patent dealing with that idea of creating a signal that you could carry on a broadcast of a radio transmission into an area that would carry this sort of signal below the audible level of perception so that it affected emotional state.
		And they actually use it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you wouldn't even know it was happening to you.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		In fact, the Chinese article that we were talking about being recently released under that Freedom of Information Act request talks about an infrasound weapon specifically designed going back to weapons testing of the 60s and 1970s that was able to create debilitating effects on humans, including the sense of hysteria and panic.
		And this could be created by creating a signal from a remote location and generating it into the battlefield environment or carrying it on, say, a radio broadcast as what was reported to have happened in the Gulf War.
		The idea of non-lethal weapons, another thing to remember is the definition, according to some of the people on the military side, is a weapon that kills less than 25% of the time.
		By that definition...
		Right, right.
		And Clayborne landmines, the reason I'm laughing is a landmine has that level of lethality, but no one would call it non-lethal.
		It just happens to maim rather than kill in most instances.
		The fact is, non-lethal weapons in all of the military protocols on deployment and use point out very clearly that these systems can also be lethal.
		And yes, of course, in a riot-controlled situation, would you rather contain the crowd or kill the crowd?
		That's an obvious thing that most human beings would say, let's contain the crowd.
		What we're concerned about is how we do that and what is the effect of that.
		And the other part of it that we're highly concerned about is that the protocols between Department of Defense and Department of Justice give priority funding to those things with dual use, things that are going to be used against American citizens as well as our declared enemies.
		That becomes important for Americans to understand is that these systems aren't just intended for adversaries, but also to contain things like what we saw in Seattle a little over a year ago, civil disobedience, where some of it got out of control.
		But would we want to see the implementation of mass control of protesters when they're peaceably assembled?
		Or do we want to preserve that right in America in terms of dissension and right of assembly?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know.
		Ask yourself if President Richard Nixon had had one of these available to him back when he was so irritated at all the demonstrations that were going on.
		Would he have used it?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely, yes.
		In fact, Zerbigny Brzezinski at that very same time in the early 70s suggested that no matter who was in power in his book Between Two Ages, he said, when this technology is available in this century, whoever's in power will be tempted to use it and will use it to further their political ends, regardless of whether they're conservative or liberal.
		And I'm paraphrasing a little bit from Between Two Ages, but that's the gist of it.
		And when you look at the evolution of these technologies and now what's being poised and thrown out to the public as this great revolution in military affairs and electromagnetic warfare, the fact that it rubs right up against traditional American values and has created, again, the dilemma of choosing between safety and security and giving up civil liberties.
		And that's the place where many of these technologies are currently taking us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I guess if the Russians and the Chinese and others are developing this technology, we don't have any choice, really, do we?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, to a point.
		I mean, certainly we need to develop countermeasures.
		We need to have a clear understanding of what we're facing.
		But one thing to keep in mind, when you're using electromagnetic weapon systems, if they're discharged and tested in any open environment, any good surveillance technology, any country with good surveillance technology could not only deduce where those emanations were coming from, but what their potential health effect would be.
		And certainly our government is well aware, based on the studies, just the ones that we've uncovered in the public domain, not to mention what must be hidden from public view.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but you couldn't reveal that you knew it was being done to you without revealing that you had it too and you had knowledge of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Otherwise, how could you track it?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And that takes us right back to these mystery signals we're hearing right now.
		Isn't it interesting that it would come at a time when the Chinese and Russians are very concerned about missile defense, a missile defense system that's being deployed in Alaska based on HARP technology that was tested at the same frequencies that we know of by their own admission?
		Wouldn't it make sense that one of our adversaries would want to demonstrate their capability in the same area?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How would you stop a missile with electromagnetics, with ARF?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How would you do that with what, say, HARP has or any of the others?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		There's a couple of things that come up.
		The idea of using energy to catch a missile and then to destroy it is what we're really talking about.
		And there's a couple ways that that can happen.
		And you know, we hear a lot about this idea of a missile-to-missile defense system, and they'll probably build it, but it's not the likely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're thinking this is the more likely way to do it.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		In fact, I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How do you get power so narrow, so defined, that you could actually destroy a missile?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How do you get that?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's actually a United States patent that's owned by the Department of Energy.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		It was granted on September 25th, 1990, and it's patent number 4959559.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute, do that again.
		A lot of people want to look at it.
		Okay.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		4959559.
		And this is an electromagnetic or other directed energy pulse launcher.
		And it was developed for the Department of Energy.
		As I said, it was granted in 1990, so it was developed in the late 80s.
		And essentially, what they have created is a weapon that if you saw it discharged, it would look like a ball of lightning traveling at near the speed of light, which is 186,000 miles per second.
		And this ball energy or this ball of lightning, within the patent, they describe it as like a photon torpedo right out of Star Trek.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Got it.
		You know, I think I've seen one.
		I think I mentioned this to you before.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		This thing in Australia.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, have you ever seen that satellite photo?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		I've not seen it, but I remember we talked about it.
		We were trying to figure out what it was.
		Well, it was after that that we tripped over this patent, and it makes a good explanation for what was seen, because that was traveling at this huge velocity, and the only place you could test this is over a huge, fast, open space, because, I mean, it would be just a fraction of a second that you would actually see something fly by.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And, you know, and that's, you know, when you think about this type of weapon, you remember that other sort of blob of energy taken from the, I think it was the space shuttle?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that actually is what I was talking about.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that whole idea of...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And what you saw erupt from the Earth into space was like a ball, a plasma ball of something.
		It just went, boom!
		It was the most amazing.
		And obviously the shuttle cameras were waiting for it, so we knew there was some kind of experiment underway.
		Right.
		And it looked like a plasma ball firing into space.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		And this, you know, when we started writing about this stuff in HARP initially, and then what we found is a lot more, and people confused them.
		And that's something we should point out is when we're on the air like tonight, we're talking about a lot of different weapon systems.
		And we don't want to confuse them.
		Because what we're talking about now is something quite different than HAARP.
		If you want to go back to HARP for a minute, it can create what's called an electromagnetic pulse or a surge of energy capable of disrupting sensitive electronics.
		In fact, this idea is really capitalized on by the Chinese.
		In fact, in this Senate Intelligence Committee, one of the things that the Chinese point out is a first-strike option which allows, as they say, and I quote, the inferior to become the superior.
		And this is the Chinese approach to defense, is to create the best electromagnetic weapon systems.
		And here's the things that they would try and attack, according to the Senate testimony, is radar and radio stations using smart weapons, but then jamming technologies for communications, attacking communication centers and facilities and command ships.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Doctor, we're at the top of the hour.
		This is exactly where we're going to pick up when we get back.
		All right, stay right there.
		And the reason is because I think that we were attacked in Perump, Nevada.
		Remember that attack?
		I said for the first time, and I don't jump to these conclusions, I think we were specifically attacked.
		All the microwave, land microwave, satellite, everything disappeared and then slowly came back.
		There's nobody in the world that's going to tell me that we weren't affected by something the military was doing out there, and that wasn't very long ago.
		I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		You're listening to Ark Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight, featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		Can't say goodbye without your love.
		Oh, baby, you won't leave me awake.
		I can't accept.
		I surely miss your tender kiss.
		I surely miss you.
		You're listening to Arkbell somewhere in time.
		Tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A little while ago, I used a pretty dramatic word, attacked.
		I thought we were attacked, and I stand by that.
		And in a moment, I will explain it and we'll ask Dr. Begich what he thinks.
		All right, we're going back now to Dr. Nick Begich.
		But just very briefly, as you know, we went off the air for the second time in the history of this program.
		Only this one was the weirdest idea.
		Last time it happened, a satellite began tumbling in space, and so we lost the satellite.
		This last outage was much more intriguing.
		We were able to actually watch what's called the EB level, the signal level, on our end and up in Oregon slowly over a 45-minute period, go from full signal that we've got right now, God, I hope so, to a point where we lost lock.
		It was so low.
		It was so diminished, it virtually went to zero, and we lost signal.
		They had no more satellite signal.
		We had to go to a backup landline.
		At the very same time, and we can prove it with graphs, the local internet service delivered by Land Microwave also on seven different receivers, microwave paths, in every case went to zero.
		And I mean, zero.
		So with all that in mind, something happened here in Perump, Nevada.
		Now, who has the technology to be able to do that, to shut down satellite signals?
		In fact, all microwave signals over a very broad spectrum from 2.4 gigahertz to about 11 and 13 gigahertz.
		Now, gee whiz, who could do something like that and confine it to an area like Perup?
		I said attacked.
		Maybe we were experimented upon.
		I don't know.
		But I tell you, what happened was not natural.
		Doctor, what could do that?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, this is exactly the kind of effect that some of these new technologies are designed to create.
		Whether it's our own experiments or someone demonstrating their own capability in a covert way, but a way that we would recognize, that's certainly a plausible explanation as well.
		The Chinese and the Russians both have been pursuing this whole line for really decades in terms of, you know, when they look at it is what can we do from their perspective to leapfrog ahead?
		Or what areas are our systems, because they are so sensitive, what areas can that sensitivity be attacked?
		And this is where the EMP or electromagnetic pulse weapons and other technologies that exploit the weaknesses of our system.
		And that weakness is the very technology upon which it's built.
		In fact, our own government has spent huge sums of money in developing what are called hardening technologies to protect us from this kind of attack.
		And this was sort of the subject, as we were talking before the break, of what was coming up in the Senate hearings on Chinese capability.
		Not only are the systems that can generate these kinds of effects being created, but at the same time other technologies are advancing in the areas, say, nanotechnology, where things are being miniaturized.
		We're getting more bang for the buck with smaller and smaller systems.
		The Chinese actually refers to them as magic weapons because they seem like they're just something right out of science fiction.
		And that shows up actually in that Senate report.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, normally you wouldn't think the Chinese would be that advanced.
		However, they seem to have walked out with a lot of our secrets.
		And so I guess what you cannot do, you can steal.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, and something else to consider is when it talk about the health effects of electromagnetic fields, the Chinese are probably the oldest practitioners of energy medicine on the planet through the system of acupuncture, although there might be some debate about other cultures that had it.
		Certainly the Chinese understand the effect of electromagnetic fields on human health.
		Acupuncture is based on an energy system of the body that can actually be measured on the surface of the skin by skin resistance differentials that distinguish where those acupuncture points are.
		So ancient Chinese understood that you could affect a person's health by affecting their energetic system.
		What modern science has rediscovered is how to do this with the, not with needles as in old acupuncture, but with new technologies that can interfere with not only that system but other functioning systems of the human body.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, we read the story here, I think, a week ago about, or two weeks ago now, about, wow, a new weapon that will heat your skin and cause you to be uncomfortable.
		And we have that weapon now.
		It'll heat your skin.
		It's non-lethal.
		But to me, it was like, well, yeah, maybe non-lethal on setting number one and number two.
		But what should you do on 10 or 12?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's not just the intensity.
		That would affect, say, the intensity of the signal.
		And what their own experiments showed is that it will create actual burning of tissue at high enough energy densities.
		But what also was not discussed when that system was unveiled is millimeter waves near microwave wavelengths have been shown at very different frequencies to have very different kinds of effects.
		In other words, on the one mode of operation, you create the sensation of heating.
		In other modes of operation, you could create disorientation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Disorientation.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		You could create fear and hysteria or any number of effects depending on the sophistication of the transmitter and the knowledge level of the operator.
		But from the military reports, in terms of the dosimetry, what dosages of what amounts of energy in what waveforms and frequencies can affect our health has been analyzed to death by the military.
		I mean, through reports that they release to the public even, there's a great deal revealed in those in terms of affecting, say, the heart or the lungs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I was going to say, doctor, can you induce heart failure with microwave?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		At the right pulse rate, yes, you can.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Heart failure.
		Okay.
		if an autopsy was done on somebody who had been remotely killed with microwave heart failure what would that autopsy likely show well if it was done well it would show the symptoms of a heart attack that wouldn't be uh...
		you really couldn't determine a natural from a you mean you We wouldn't say, wow, look at this.
		This guy really got hit by a microwave beam, huh?
		You wouldn't say that.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Not necessarily.
		I mean, if it were a sloppy job, I suppose, at high energy densities, you'd see things that were not normal with a normal heart attack.
		But the idea of these weapons are to be able to use them in a way where you have plausible deniability as well.
		I mean, the idea of covert war and the idea of not a big scene on the CNN news when there's body parts scattered across the body field.
		Instead, you have a much different visual image of these weapons.
		That's actually looked at by the military.
		We wrote about it in quoting their own publications as an advantage because even though it may be more devastating or as devastating, it's not as visually offensive to the American public opinion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, you just drop over.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right, right.
		And, you know, when you think about it, the idea of burning someone, first of all, I mean, think about that concept of the Marines and unveiling this as one of the ways they thought, well, okay, let's talk about a use that maybe the public wouldn't object too strongly for.
		But, you know, the last time we used burning as a basic method of coercing behavior was somewhere back in the Middle Ages, and I hope we're not headed back there.
		But that's the last time.
		Yeah, and unfortunately, you know, what we're talking about as well with these technologies, you know, there's so much variability, and yet there's so much unknown as well.
		We don't know, for instance, what potential side affects our own operators.
		In fact, the early versions of some of these weapons, the side lobes coming off of the machines actually affected the operators themselves with the same negative effects.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So I wanted to ask you about HARP.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, when HAAARP is cranked up, do they operate that right on site or do they operate that remotely?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, they have the capability of doing it remotely.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		In fact, that was what was originally engineered in, were fiber optic links that gave them really high data densities and real high data rates where they could control every aspect of the facility without ever having to set foot on it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, why would they want to do that?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, there's several reasons you can think of.
		One is, of course, to get away from the side loads and radiation with your scientific team.
		The other reason would be it would be less obvious at the system where operating if you didn't have a full contingent of science.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, put it another way, don't cook the cooks.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right, right, right.
		And, you know, and it allows you a lot of the ability to have the facility in a remote location and yet not have a lot of traffic in and out of it.
		I mean, you can essentially operate it from where you're.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So in other words, you could say, my God, look, what are you talking about, HARP operating?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All we've got is a guard at the gate over there.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right, exactly right.
		And that's been the standard pitch by the HAARP planners.
		You know, the big change in the last few years on HAARP is the amount of public discussion and how readily they respond to the public.
		I mean, they no longer facilitate some of the international news team's interview requests that previously were considered.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, Heck, there was a time, do you remember, we're going to have a HARP guy on the air and we're going to have him actually debate with you.
unidentified		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I think they've decided they just didn't want to do that.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah.
		And you know, I mean, there's, I understand, I mean, certainly we understand that, you know, they're uncomfortable talking about some of these issues.
		And the fact is, you know, that's fine, and we understand the rationale behind it.
		Our concern has always been not necessarily to say, hey, let's just stop HAARP.
		Let's not do HARP.
		Let's not look at any of the potentials there.
		It has always been, whatever we do there, let's make sure it makes sense and it lines up with American values.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I would ask if they even know what they're really doing.
		I'm not so sure about that.
		And that applies to the Chinese and the Russians, too.
		I'm sure that if we were to go to the HAARP facility and get to walk the halls in the HARP facility, we probably would not find any pictures of Dr. Begich on the wall.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		No, no, I'm afraid not.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		In fact, you know, I mean, the whole thing for us has been...
unidentified		Yeah, we might.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		We might indeed.
		But, you know, it's, again, it's a situation for us is this system and systems like it, this whole revolution that the military has been selling the public, and yet only in incremental bites.
		I mean, we didn't even, as a general population, start to hear much about it until this new presidential administration, yet many of us have been talking about it for seven or eight years now.
		Finally, they're saying, hey, we're in a revolution in military affairs.
		We're in a leapfrog ahead of the technologies right in the middle of these areas.
		And these areas are why I think we need a lot of public discussion.
		Idea of mind control technologies, the idea of environmental systems can be controlled by man's technology.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's talk a little bit about mind control for a second.
		Now, I'm not saying that this is it, but we have kids shooting kids at a rate that is.
		When I was going to school, this didn't happen.
		It just didn't happen.
		Now, children are shooting children on a regular basis.
		I'm sitting on a story here from Las Vegas, a little 12-year-old who hid himself inside a pet store until all the employees left yesterday, I guess it was, and tortured every single pet he could find in the store after they left to death.
		Now, this is behavior that is not rational from a 12-year-old.
		Shooting other children is not rational behavior, and it's recent behavior.
		And I'm not saying that it's because of HAARP or anything like HAARP, but I'm asking if it could be.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, let's look at that for a minute.
		Look at the things that create stress in modern society.
		And one of the things that is this is the whole area and the basis for these same weapon systems that are used to target populations.
		When you think about just the amount of energy surrounding us as a population and how that's geometrically increased and is increasing even more rapidly with the advent of, say, cell phones and cell towers as a new technology introduced to our environment, what we know about this energy is it creates an overall stress level to the body, and that can be measured in any number of ways.
		But just on a sort of a subjective level, you notice that as soon as the power goes out in a community at how relaxed your whole body tends to feel as the stress is sort of released, it's almost like exhaling.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very interesting point.
		It is.
		It's like you stop and you sit and you go, huh.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And you breathe again.
		It's almost like you breathe again.
		And when you think about that low-level stress and in the urban areas, it's even more intense.
		I mean, that's why when you go out to the country, you notice immediately, and you stop and think about this, it all makes sense.
		I mean, as an instrument, the human being is the most sensitive instrument on the planet.
		Little, slight variations in any number of factors can be sensed by the human body in a way that's unduplicated anywhere else by man, at least at this point.
		But when you think about then the idea that energy can interact with the body in profound ways shouldn't be so unusual.
		Even low amounts of energy, it's the amount of how that energy interrelates with the body.
		A good example, and we use it often, is this flickering effect of light energy from something like a television set like in Japan causing epileptic seizures in hundreds of kids.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And it was very low energy densities.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		It wasn't so much the amount of energy.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And it was an accident, too.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		It was the frequency, the pulse rate that created an interaction with the human brain that caused that epileptic seizure.
		And this same low-level energy, these windows of energy that can create changes in the human being at a cellular level, at a chemical level, the same type of concept can be applied to hardware and environmental systems.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, here, let me ask you this question.
		Could one of these weapons or technologies conceivably cause apathy?
		We're talking about all kinds of emotions.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Apathy, would that be one of them?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Essentially, or you're lethargic and you're apathetic and you just don't really give a damn about much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That wouldn't be too hard?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		No.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		In fact, if you study the brain and the activity of the brain in its various emotional states, and then take a signal and drive it in from an external source to recreate or to cause what's called brain entrainment of the brain to lock onto that signal so that the predominant brain activity in the human beings exposed to that signal are the same as they would be if they were in that emotional state essentially places you there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well then, let me ask you this.
		Has anybody thought about or ever correlated the timing of HAARP activity with political events?
		Suppose, for example, that you were running for president.
		This is just a what-if.
		And you would benefit by an apathetic nation of voters.
		In other words, if you produced enough apathy, why more of the other guys' voters would stay home than yours.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		Would you do it?
		Well, according to Zbigniew Brzezinski, who is certainly someone to listen to, in his own writings, he says, yeah, they'll use it.
		If they have the capability to influence political outcomes to further political ends, doesn't matter who's in power.
		If they think they can get away with it, they'd probably try it.
		You know, that's, I mean, even for me to say that, I mean, I come from a political background, as you said in the interview.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know you do, yes.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And, you know, when I look back on sort of my own family's history and the people I've met in my lifetime, would it be beyond some of these folks to do that?
		The answer is absolutely not.
		They would do it in a heartbeat.
		You know, others, would they fight it with every ounce of strength they have in their bones?
		Absolutely.
		But they tend to be in the minority at this particular time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But you can't fight what you don't know about.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Exactly right.
		And when you think about all of these things that we're talking about, I mean, we've been able to deduce from the literature, we go through thousands of documents to put together our material.
		I mean, when we did Earth Rising the Revolution, it was 4,000 documents reduced to 650 that we quoted.
		And getting that information and putting it together in a coherent way is a big part of what we do.
		But when you look at political leaders, for instance, in the Air Force budget, 40% of their budget is black-funded.
		This is of the equipment side of the Air Force budget.
		That's billions and billions and billions of dollars.
		But the Congress doesn't know what they're handing the money out for.
		Only a very small number in the Congress get to know that.
		And you have to hope to God that they have enough intelligence on the intelligence committees to ask the right questions.
		And I can guarantee you they don't.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Jeff in Palmdale, California asks, how complex are these technologies to build?
		In other words, could the private or commercial sector ever develop them and utilize them to influence government bodies?
		In other words, don't go the other Way around if they're not that complex and they can be, but if the Chinese can do it, why couldn't somebody in a private lab somewhere do it?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		They are doing it.
		In fact, we took into the European Parliament on February 5th, 1998, a working model of an infrasound device, a device described very accurately in this Chinese press report that we had mentioned earlier.
		This infrasound device, when we demonstrated it to the European Parliament, was so compelling that when they passed the final resolution dealing with disarmament issues, they added a clause dealing with the initiation of treaty dialogue to ban any electromagnetic weapon or any weapon that could be developed that would influence human behavior and human thinking.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, there's a treaty we're going to rush over and sign, I'm sure.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, the whole idea that to get a political body to get to the point of saying, of recognizing the technology exists and even putting that in a formal document is a huge step that no political body, to our knowledge, has ever taken before.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's a big step, but getting, say, the U.S. to sign that is near an impossibility.
		Hold on, Doctor.
		We'll be right back.
		From the high desert, this is Coast to Coast AM.
		Thought you didn't even know these kinds of things existed, did you?
		Would we use them?
		Would we have the cojones to use them?
		You know we would.
unidentified		You'll distinguish Arch Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		Coast to Coast AM from April
		2nd, 2001.
		Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		You don't know me.
		You know, you don't got me there.
		You don't got me there.
		You know it's all your reason.
		Got to say it's you, you want to see the blues, and you know it don't come easy.
		You don't have to shout all things about, you can't even play them easy.
		Forget about the power and all your sorrow.
		There's a future of a plan, it will soon be your tomorrow.
		I don't have to much, I only want to stand.
		You're listening to Arkbell somewhere in time.
		Tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Would governments try to control the mind of people?
		Well, let's just think about that a little bit.
		Wasn't there that little experiment with LSD?
		Didn't they give service people LSD to see what would happen?
		That's pretty brutal stuff.
		If you could sit back and just cleanly push a button and control people at a distance without physically ever getting anywhere near them, would the people who gave the LSD push the button?
		Ask yourself that question.
		Dr. Begich will be right back.
unidentified		Dr. Begich will be right back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hey, Doctor, I've got an interesting message from Bill in Anchorage, Alaska, who writes, Art, when my cabin shakes like an earthquake, it usually means 100 mile per hour gust getting hammered right here now.
		Already heard at least four trees snap.
		Are you having bad weather up there?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, we're getting some pretty good wind whipping through here.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Where I am, it's been kind of coming and going throughout the evening, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So it's those kind of winds, do you think?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, this guy's saying trees are falling over.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, we have in south central Alaska a huge spruce beetle kill, so we have a lot of standing deadwood.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And with the winds that are going right now, that's probably pretty accurate, especially up against the mountains with a wind velocity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Holy mackerel.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		So, yeah, that's happening.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		As we're talking about weather, we're having a problem.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You might have mentioned it.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Oh, why?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		First time call our line.
		You're on the air with Dr. Begich.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, this is Mark from Montreal phoning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Montreal, yes, sir.
unidentified		Since I'm going to go with the tenor of your program and suggest that maybe some of these experiments may be opening other dimensional holes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well.
unidentified		And is there any evidence, any scientific theory, any abnormality disease that the doctor has noticed?
unidentified		And also through the Van Allen radiation belts?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		There's kind of two different questions.
		The first one I don't really feel like I can answer.
		I don't really know that that whole area is kind of out of my realm.
		The idea of affecting the Van Allen belt is sort of a different question.
		I mean, what we're talking about and what we've been talking about are the idea of affecting environmental systems.
		The Van Allen belts have been impacted by thermonuclear detonations, for instance, in the upper atmosphere in the past.
		You know, the idea that we sort of experiment and then sort of look and see what the result is and determine whether or not it might have been damaging over time, this is a very dangerous approach.
		And this is the same approach we're taking with the new systems that are being deployed, only these are much more precision.
		For instance, that whole concept of electromagnetic pulse that we've talked about on and off through the evening, that was first discovered with a thermal nuclear detonation in the South Pacific that knocked out power in Hawaii for several hours.
		And it sort of dawned on everyone then, well, wow, wouldn't this be powerful, detonate this above the United States or Soviet Union, and you knock out all their sensitive electronics, and that's the end of them.
		And of them.
		Well, then they started saying, okay, well, how else could we create this without the side effect of radioactive fallout, which sort of messes up the whole deal?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Because then you've got a real clean killer.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
		And now they go, okay, now how do we take energy out of the environment and use it in a weapons application?
		And if you go back to HAARP again for a moment, when Senator Stevens, now chairman of appropriations, first went to the floor of the Senate to get money for the HAARP project, his idea, and he said it was like something out of Jules Verne, the idea of being able to shunt energy down from the ionosphere and introduce that into the power grid as a source of electrical energy.
		That's where this project started in Senator Stevens' mind when the first $30 million appropriation was given back in 1993.
		And where we've come since then is with a lot more understanding about ionospheric processes, and now those understandings are leading to exactly what was talked about in 1994 as the use of a new weapons missile defense system.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, I want to take a second out, and I want to allow you to plug your books.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You've got the original, of course, and then Earth Rising the Revolution is your new one, right?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Right, right.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And it's probably the most in-depth in terms of all of these issues we've talked about today.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is it all new, or is it sort of an update as you have learned more?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		It is really a new book.
		We cover harp for maybe 30 or 40 pages, and the rest of this, it's almost a 300-page title.
		The rest of it is on other technologies that people will find quite interesting, many of which we've touched on tonight.
		But Earth Rising is probably the most complete work of new technologies and the most well-footnoted.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Talk right into that phone.
		Okay, so Earth Rising is the new one, Earth Rising the Revolution.
		It's available on my website.
		We have a link to you right now.
		How else do they get the book?
		Bookstores or?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Bookstores, certainly Amazon.com, and I can give a toll-free number, which is 888-690-1277.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And for out-of-the-country callers, it's 907-249-9111.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		But again, in country, 888.
		If you haven't heard that in a while, in country.
		888-690-1277.
		888-690-1277.
		Earth Rising, the Revolution.
		How much is that book?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		With shipping in the United States, it's $21.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		$21.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And it covers these new technologies and sort of takes off where HARP left off.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		In fact, it has a chapter dedicated to the issue of mind-control technologies.
		There's over 100 sources referenced there.
		It has a section on privacy, which is extensively referenced, including biometrics, the kinds of things that we saw being a little bit of experimentation in terms of the Super Bowl using images of all these people matched against one another.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I was there.
		I was in Tampa.
		I was at the Super Bowl.
		I felt so violated.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, this whole concept, you know, we disclosed that this would be coming into the mainstream in the United States when we released Earthrising in the very end of 1999.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And in Europe, and particularly Great Britain, the level of surveillance of civilian populations is just unbelievable.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I heard that, and I almost needed a counselor.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		You know, and you've got now in the U.S., I mean, the idea that this is happening in the United States, the presumption of innocence is sort of out the window with the presumption of isolate everyone as guilty.
		And the thing that's disturbing me more than anything is sort of the underlying, the undercurrent in much of the military writing that really speaks to the idea that an adversary of American policy somehow is a villain in the United States.
		And to oppose American policy through the means that we have at our disposal within the United States is so fundamental to who we are.
		The idea that anyone would see that as threatening should be disturbing.
		I mean, we should have the right to say in an open debate our opinions on a number of these topics.
		And they would just assume that we didn't.
		And that level of arrogance, I think, speaks volumes to where the risk is also in these technologies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think there's a new signal out there that's saying, use oil.
		Don't think about other stuff.
		Use oil.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air with Dr. Begich.
unidentified		Hello.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, hello.
unidentified		Oh, sorry about that.
		I didn't think I was on.
		I was waiting there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, you are on.
unidentified		And that's Robert from Los Angeles.
		Hi, Nick.
		I really appreciate what you've done, and I've worked in the fence, and you're pretty much right on target.
		You realize that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, Caller, before you continue, are you on a speaker phone?
unidentified		No, no.
		There's a tiny echo I sense.
		Is it better now?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What kind of phone are you on?
		A cellular?
		Yeah, I can.
unidentified		Well, let's see if this is better.
unidentified		How's that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that's more.
		Oh, that's so much better.
		Don't ever use that other thing.
		That's like Chinese torture.
		And anyway, you were saying.
unidentified		Yes, I've worked in the fence, and I wasn't sworn to any secrecy, but being around the fence, you talk about a lot of interesting things.
		I've actually witnessed and watched one of those in Nevada, one of those plasma tests.
		Oh.
		And it was really early in the morning.
		I was with a friend, and we saw this white orb bobbing up and down.
		And it just didn't look, it really looked ridiculous.
		It was about, we were pretty close to it.
		It was about the size of a Volkswagen Beetle, and it was a circular round white orb.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where were you in Nevada?
unidentified		We were basically from Los Angeles to Vegas.
unidentified		We were out, I don't know exactly, we're in the XYYZ road out there somewhere.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Zizzix?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Zizix Road?
unidentified		Yeah, but in the opposite side.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know where you are.
unidentified		Yeah, there's a bunch of semis out there.
		We could see in a distance there's semis out there, and they're using that as, I guess, their science lab.
		But they're assuming that the thing was just going up and down like an elevator.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, if you were going to experiment in America, where would you do it?
		Obviously, you would do it out in the middle of nowhere.
		You'd do it out in the desert.
		Basically, you'd do it in my backyard.
		That's why we see so much stuff out here.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		You know, actually, that is why a lot of these projects were located in remote areas.
		I mean, that's why HAARP was located in large part for why it's located where it is.
		It could have been more central.
		It could have been in a much different place.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It could have been in Philadelphia, but no.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, you need the northern latitudes.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		But nonetheless, it's so far removed from the mainstream that it was thought to be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Why do you need the northern latitudes, Doctor?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's where the magnetic lines of force intersect the planet.
		And one of the objectives is the closer you are to that, the more easy it is to influence with less power.
		In other words, to get those higher distances and to transfer that energy through the atmosphere, you want to be as close to the magnetic lines of force as you can be, and you also have to have available large amounts of energy.
		Alaska tends to have both, so we're ideally suited.
		And the idea of deploying a weapon system on U.S. soil versus in orbit and a satellite-based system is certainly more desirable.
		And Alaska has been pegged for the new missile defense system, which actually, its construction will violate the ABM Treaty.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I saw the other day we had a successful missile test and they blew something out of the air.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that all kind of, if what you're saying is true about these weapons, ultimately, then what are we doing working on these kinetic things?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		These are, you know, these, the idea of them advancing this, I think that's really the cover story.
		Certainly they're going to probably even build it and deploy it, but the real systems that are going to work are not going to be ground-to-air missiles.
		And the number of misses in the sequence of tests, and one of the leading scientists on that project abandoned it, and it was revealed in the U.S. media that this woman abandoned it because they were manipulating the tests so that they couldn't miss.
		And, you know, I got an interesting piece of material that was sent to me on missile defense because it is being considered here.
		And it's entitled NN, National Missile Defense Core Messages.
		And this is what all of the people working in procurement and various aspects of the program here in Alaska are being told to say.
		And it's essentially their talking points or their key messages that they want out there.
		And when you look at how this is being postured and what's being considered, this is an event that is violating a treaty that has stabilized world peace for the last over 20 years.
		And the ABM treaty unilaterally being abandoned by this administration is going to create all kinds of problems which have already started to reveal themselves.
		And we were saying this long ago, but it's its whole perception management, the way they script the messages.
		No one's free to really say what's on their mind.
		they can only say what's handed them in script form.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's a pretty sad state of mind.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Nick Begich.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Hello, this is Marie from Hampton Roads by way of WNIS.
unidentified		My question is, what percentage of the reported cases of panic disorders in America would you suspect could be attributed to electromagnetic pulsing, and could such pulsing permanently render people subject to having anxiety disorders that are irreversible?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		That's an interesting question.
		Actually, there's a paper that was, it's a paper that was contracted by a number of Ukrainian and Russian scientists, and it was published in 2001 by the Cellular Phone Task Force, and it's called The Influence of High Frequency Electromagnetic Radiation at Non-Thermal Intensities on the Human Body.
		And that's a mouthful, but the nut of it is they really looked at low levels in terms of intensity of energy at the high frequency ranges and the effect on the human body.
		And what's revealed in this is the idea that the body remembers certain electromagnetic fields in a way that when they come back again the second time or the third time, it reinforces and takes a weaker and weaker signal to create the same effect.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So easier to do each time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So her question was, what percentage of current attacks might be, of course, there's no way to really answer.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		No way to tell the answer to that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But her second question was, could it be a permanent effect eventually?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And the answer to that is yes.
		In fact, the idea that you permanently invade someone's psyche, for instance, with these kinds of technologies, could you drive them crazy?
		And the answer is absolutely yes.
		You had mentioned the idea of chemicals.
		What we found, and that was from the MKUltra and the projects surrounding the CIA's work.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, well, if they would do that, the physical, we're going to take you and either not tell you what we're giving you or we're going to force you to take this and see what happens.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If they do that, then would they push a button at a distance?
unidentified		Heck yeah.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		In fact, we found through Freedom of Information Act requests documents from the procurement sections of the CIA during that time, and they were actually also testing electromagnetic weapons technologies or technologies.
		And we've then found patents going back into the 60s and a number of other things.
		But the fact is, the MKUltra program and the programs surrounding it involved more than chemicals.
		They were also looking at these more exotic systems.
		People remember most of the documents were shredded by Gottlieb and others at the CIA, but the ones that weren't shredded were in the accounting department.
		What did they buy and what was that equipment?
		And some of that was eventually extracted.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Begich.
unidentified		Hello.
		Yes.
		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, yell at us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're not too loud.
unidentified		Okay, sorry.
unidentified		Is this better?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Okay.
		For Dr. Begich, something you, I live in Orange County, California, and something you said reminded me of an aberration I saw a few weeks ago in the sky almost directly above just before dark.
		It looked like heat lightning, only there wasn't a cloud in the sky.
		And that made it so eerie.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Interesting.
		Yeah, I don't know what that might be.
		You know, one of the things that needs to be kept in mind as well is there's a lot of things being observed, and drawing conclusions or quick conclusions, a lot of people are doing that.
		And I think we can sort of back off a little bit, wait a little bit, and chances are paper shows up eventually that proves what many of these things are.
		It's like the flashes and what we were talking about earlier, the space shuttle visual image of that ball of energy sort of leaving the planet and then later finding a patent that says, hey, that's exactly what you'd expect to see.
		You know, then you start to see how these things link together.
		And I think over time we'll see how many of these unusual observations link together.
		I mean, just a few years ago, there were some observations above storm clouds where energy discharged up into the ionosphere, sprites.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sprites, yes.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and before then, nobody even knew they existed.
		And all of a sudden, here's this new phenomenon, this electromagnetic phenomena.
		We don't even know what role it necessarily plays in weather generation or communications or anything else for that matter.
		And that's something we're going to probably learn.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It probably wouldn't be that hard to produce sprites, would it?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		No.
		Actually, that whole idea of shooting energy up into the ionosphere and at least getting the same energy densities as might be created from sprites, I think that's possible today.
		You know, there's another technology, and it's an ionospheric mirror technology using sort of a laser for creating the same effect in the ionosphere as HAARP can create.
		So what we're finding is sort of this proliferation of other ways to create the same kind of effect, much in the same way as creating, say, a psychological effect in the human being can be stimulated by any number of carriers carrying the right signal, the same as being found out about natural systems.
		In other words, any number of ways can be developed for manipulating environmental systems.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, if there was a doctor, if there was experimentation going on, wouldn't we see it reflected first in things like, I don't know, road rage, for example.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		People who just see, and I understand that it's frustrating driving out on the highways, but all of a sudden we have this epidemic of road rage where people are screaming, yelling, tossing unkind signals at each other, and sometimes bullets.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		You know, I think if there were independent monitoring of some of these facilities and some of these events, you could start to draw some correlations.
		And this is where I think there's a big gap.
		And maybe what the earlier caller was really alluding to is what can we see happen that creates international monitoring that we can have some level of confidence in what's going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		And that's where the answers are going to lie.
		But ultimately, behind all of this is a bigger question.
		And that question deals with the whole secrecy syndrome that corporations and government have colluded over the last 40 years to deny the public access to knowledge at a time when we really need this knowledge.
		Because science and technology determines what countries are strong, thereby which governments are strong.
		And it's incumbent upon all of us to at least have a general understanding, like we're having tonight, about what these things can do, and then the opportunities to debate those and sort of determine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, that's what I want to set up, Doctor, is a debate.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And again, you're up for it, right?
unidentified		Absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I'm going to work at setting that up.
		Doctor, we're out of time, but I want to say again, your book, Earth Rising, the Revolution, is available right now.
		Can you still get copies, by the way, of Angels Don't Play This Harp?
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		We still have that available and imprint.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Same telephone number?
unidentified		Absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, so that's 888-690-1277.
		It'd be a good thing for you to read up on, folks.
		That's 888-690-1277.
		Dr. Begich, as always, thank you, my friend.
		And I guess you better duck up there.
		It sounds like the winds, 100 mile an hour winds, oh my.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's getting a little intense.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take it easy.
		Get under a bed or something.
		Thank you, my friend.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, and God bless.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take care.
		That's Dr. Nick Begich.
		Big winds in Alaska.
		Right now, I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		This is Coast to Coast A.M. You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		Inside of the sand, the smell of the touch, there's something inside that we need so much.
		The sight of the touch, or the scent of the sand, or the strength of an oak leaves deep in the ground.
		The wonder of flowers to be covered and then to burst up through tarmac to the sun again.
		Or to fly to the sun without burning a wing.
		To lie in the meadow and hear the grass cling.
		All these things in our memories are from the U.S. to the coast.
		Goodbye!
		Why?
		Why take his own, take his face on this way.
		Take my heart here.
		Why?
		Take a free ride.
		Take our friends.
		I find things in my dreams.
		But I will have a strength to hear.
		So hard to do with my fears.
		And to end my life with all my life.
		But by now, I know I'm never in front.
		I know I'm never in front.
		Premier Radio Networks presents Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight's program originally aired April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Open lines directly ahead, so who knows what we're going to run into.
		Maybe the shadow people.
		Listen, Carmine in Milwaukee, Wisconsin says, listen to this now.
		There's a lot of hot air in Nevada as well.
		There's no way our government has a massive antenna ray in Alaska.
		You ever hear of airplanes?
		Everyone would see it and report it.
unidentified		Duh.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's what Carmine says.
		Carmine, if you have a computer, go to my website and go click on the HAARP website just below the name of Dr. Nick Begich.
		And Carmine, right there, you'll see the gigantic antenna site that you said couldn't possibly exist.
		There it is.
		A beautiful photograph of it, Carmine.
unidentified		The...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We were talking about behavior.
		I told you I was holding this story, and so you're a late audience.
		I guess maybe you can take it.
		Maybe you can't.
		A 12-year-old boy is in custody right now for what some are saying, calling the worst case of animal abuse they've ever seen.
		The Pet Smart at Tropicana and Eastern, that's in Las Vegas, was the scene of a horrible crime.
		A young boy apparently hid in the store until after hours and then proceeded to kill and maim all kinds of the store's animals.
		He crushed rats to death.
		He killed and tortured birds.
		He even switched fighter fish to Other tanks to watch those kill.
		The Metropolitan Police Department says it's one of the worst cases it's ever investigated.
		Police say the 12-year-old boy managed to hide from store employees by crawling between and behind some dog beds.
		Once the store was closed and the employees were gone, he crawled out and began the killing spree.
		What god-forsaken kind of behavior is that?
		When children walk into schools and start shooting, what kind of behavior is that?
		You say it's not new?
		Yes, it is.
		It's relatively new.
		So anyway, look, this hour, whatever you want to talk about, is fair game.
		We've got a plane down in China.
		We're threatening.
		They're threatening.
		They're probably taking pictures and doing what they can do, which is what we would do if we had one of theirs.
		Cloning, I did mention that in the first hour, a bunch of cloned animals are beginning to die early.
		They're just up and dying.
		Their immune systems belly up, and then they're belly up.
		And they're getting ready to clone a human being.
		What do you think?
		Anyway, it's up to you.
		Anything you want to talk about is now fair game.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Yeah, hi, Art.
		This is Kevin from Helena, Montana.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Kevin.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Extinguisher Radio Force.
unidentified		That's what I'm doing right now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Okay, I only get to listen to you at the wintertime when I'm working at night shift.
		And I remember a couple of years ago, you had a couple guys call in and they said they shot a Bigfoot.
		Yep.
		I think it was in Oregon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
unidentified		And then I went back in summer or on daytimes and I never heard anything about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the answer to the end of the thing is that these guys did indeed say they killed a Bigfoot.
		They were prepared, as a matter of fact, to lead me to the body.
		They were going to dig up the body.
		It was two of them.
unidentified		I remember that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But the problem is that the audience, during the course of the program, scared the hell out of them.
		Virtually said they'd be accused of murder.
		And so they decided that perhaps it wouldn't be such a good idea.
		I mean, who wants to get charged with murder?
		And so they disappeared prado.
unidentified		Did they?
		Yeah.
		Okay.
		I have one favor to ask.
		My wife is sitting here.
		After I get off the phone here, could you play her that big foot sound that you have?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You want to hear that?
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
		I want her to hear that.
		It's just an eerie feeling, an eerie sound.
		She thinks I'm goofy because I listen to you.
		I run a loader at night on a crusher.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you goofy?
unidentified		At times.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you?
unidentified		At times I am, but I really enjoy your show.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, now here, I'll tell you what.
		Tell you what I'm going to do.
		You wouldn't say a bad word on the radio, would you?
unidentified		Oh, no.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Have your wife turn the radio up.
unidentified		Turn the radio up?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yep, tell her, turn it up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, rarely do I ever tell the caller to do that.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn the radio up right now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, here we go.
unidentified		Here it comes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there you have it.
		Now, I guess I've waited just a few more seconds, and as soon as it's done, why?
		Have her turn the radio back down again.
		Have her turn it down?
unidentified		I turned it down.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Put your wife on the phone.
unidentified		Okay, hold on.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, now if you were to hear that in the woods, and believe me, this is authenticated as a sound of a Bigfoot recorded in the woods, what do you think?
unidentified		Well, I'd probably be pooping bricks.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Pooping bricks?
		I appreciate that.
		Put your husband back on.
unidentified		I think we should be afraid of the music too.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Pooping bricks is what she said, sir.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		And now we go camping a lot up here in Montana.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, at least you used to, huh?
unidentified		Yeah, no, we still will.
unidentified		And now I just tell you, if you hear that sound, you be sure to wake me up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I appreciate the call.
		Thank you.
		All right, thank you.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Ark.
unidentified		This is Carol in Sacramento.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Carol.
unidentified		I'm so sorry.
		Every time you say something about that kid, the 12-year-old that had to do about the animals, I have to turn you off.
		I can't even hear it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
		That's why I held it till late in the show, so not too many people would turn it off.
		But it's such an example of behavior.
unidentified		But yes, I do believe they are the manchurian candidate.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you hit a tone or something.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What now?
unidentified		The Mancurian Candidate?
		You know, I think they're practicing our young kids just to see what they'll do.
		And isn't that the most horrible thing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If true, it is the most horrible thing.
		Yes, thank you.
		The Manchurian candidate syndrome.
		Well, maybe, certainly you could conclude that if there was experimentation going on, that the young, most impressionable minds would be the first affected.
		Isn't that true of everything?
		Not in the older folks.
		Diseases come along, and who does it get?
		It always gets the young people and the old people first, right?
		They are the first affected.
		Those with the either undeveloped immune systems or the slightly worn-out immune systems, they are the first to go, right?
unidentified		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hello.
		Hello.
		Rick down here on Old Cape Cod.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Cape Cod?
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Rick.
unidentified		Yes.
		Sorry I missed talking to the doctor there, but we have this PayPal radar, PAYPAWS.
		There's three of them in the country, one in Sacramento, one in Bangor, and one here on the Cape.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And they do, I mean, the one on the Cape, it can observe aircraft in Europe.
		Okay, now what's weird, I've been on the Cape most of my life, and the weather patterns have really shifted, and there's like a 30-degree spread where we don't get any weather here on the Cape.
		We get it, you know, on the islands south of us, Martha's Vineyard, Nantucket, and Boston gets hit.
		Right.
		And we get nothing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The skies just.
		They're changing, sir.
		I mean, there's no question about it.
		It's obvious our weather is changing.
		Everybody's noticed.
unidentified		Yeah, and the skies just open up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Matt Lara hasn't noticed, but everybody else.
unidentified		Yeah, and then we've had a tremendous amount of aircraft activity, including the E3P-3.
unidentified		I was a former aerospace engineer, but the E-P-3, we've had C-5s, we had S-3As that are sub-killers, flying up and down the coast all night long.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, I wonder what they're up to.
unidentified		Well, they're having fun.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Having fun.
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you very much.
unidentified		Take care.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you take care, too.
		Having fun.
		Yeah, modern-day fun, maybe.
		It just may not be the way it used to be, you know.
		Don't forget our international line open.
		Give it a try out there, no matter where you are in the world, and whatever you want to say.
		800-893-0903.
		We want you to test our...
		We're really experimenting with this.
		And we're in a continuous dialogue with a phone company, too.
		Welcome to the Rockies.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hi there.
		This is Dave over in Las Vegas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Dave.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How's Vegas?
unidentified		Oh, very good.
unidentified		It's nice and beautiful today, as I'm sure you saw.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A little windy.
unidentified		Oh, yeah, but I can live with the wind.
unidentified		But the problem is, you know, I just can't live with these kids going out there and creating mayhem and killing the animals like that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I'm sure this one, since it happened in Las Vegas, is probably hitting you guys pretty hard.
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
		Well, you know, back in the olden days, we were taught sportsmanship.
		You don't shoot an animal unless he has a fair chance to get away.
		Now, going into a pet store and killing little animals in a cage that are defenseless like that, it just shows a lack of morality.
		And maybe even more, maybe it's like the cloning that's going on.
		You find that the animals are starting to get all these horrible diseases and die and all these things like that.
		Maybe our genetic code is breaking down some way, and it's like this kid that goes and kills the animals.
		I mean, they wouldn't do that back in the 1880s.
		They had more respect for life.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They didn't do that back in the 50s.
		I mean, there were isolated cases of things that happened.
		But look at the, I mean, go to the school shootings.
		Those didn't happen as late as the 40s and 50s.
		It never happened.
		Now it happens all the time.
		What the hell's changed?
unidentified		That's right.
		Maybe our genetic code is breaking down and we're devolving.
		Maybe it is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, they said that's why the Grays were abducting us because their genetic code was breaking down.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So maybe that happens to every society after a while.
unidentified		Perhaps.
		Maybe we'll have to go out and find a new genetic strain to boost ours up because I'm telling you, this is getting to the point where every day you turn on the TV, you find a school shooting.
		You find some kid throwing another kid off the building.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Some new horror.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		Some new horror, exactly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I agree with you.
unidentified		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
		I don't know about our genetic code changing, but maybe it's frazzling at the ends.
		Who knows?
		I just know something has certainly radically changed.
		I had a quote earlier in the show.
		I wonder what I did with it.
		I'm still trying to figure out what to do about the shadow people, by the way.
unidentified		Like, what do you do?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Pick up the phone book?
unidentified		Shadow, shadow people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Shadow people expert.
		Here we go.
		There's the number.
		I mean, there's no such thing.
		I got thousands of emails about that.
		What am I going to do about that?
		Who is the expert?
		Who do you talk to about that?
		Anyway.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Oh, good morning to you, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off, please.
unidentified		I am turning it off right now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Okay, this is Chris over in Hawaii calling from KVHK, I mean, KHVH, I mean, KHVH is the Big 830.
		That's right.
		And I've got several items for you tonight.
		I wanted to report to you about the Friday night you were asking people from south of the southern latitudes if there was any glow in the sky.
		And definitely that night there certainly was.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You saw it out there in Hawaii?
unidentified		That's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow!
		I know that I got email from the Virgin Islands.
		I got it from Puerto Rico saying they saw it there, which was astounding, but Hawaii.
unidentified		But we weren't seeing...
		It was more of a glow in the northern part of the sky.
		Yes.
		I wasn't seeing northern lights or anything, but it was definitely...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What you weren't seeing were the shooters, the movers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But if you saw a glow, you were seeing northern lights, believe me.
unidentified		Uh-huh.
		Okay, well, it was definitely glowing.
		Now, the other thing I want to tell you about was my own experience with a shadow person.
		Before I get into that, there's something I want to say to you personally, and that is you've been talking a lot about leadership, okay?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		I heard you mention the other night that you're a libertarian.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Well, I am too, and I really feel strongly that it's probably a reasonable alternative to the parties that be.
		Now, Harry Brown, good fellow though he may be, may not have what it takes to be the president.
		I nominate you to be a candidate for president.
		You can do it.
		I mean, telling you, you got the savvy, you got the intelligence, you got the bully platform.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you want to really hear something perhaps sad.
unidentified		What's that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think I can do more from here.
unidentified		Well, Ronald Reagan was a great communicator, and he started out in radio.
		Okay.
		I know.
		And can you imagine a ticket that goes like this?
		Art Bell for president with Richard Hoagland as vice president.
		And if you won, you could put Richard Hoagland in charge of NASA.
		What irony that would be.
		I mean, that's a nice position.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It would almost be worth it just for that.
unidentified		Oh, absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		To see Richard march into NASA to head it up.
		To see people dropping dead in the halls.
		And anyway, sir, you called for an obvious other reason.
unidentified		Well, that's the shadow person.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes, yes.
unidentified		Okay, now I have, throughout my life, I've caught those glimpses here and there.
unidentified		I really don't, you know, it's something you keep to yourself because you go, well, I must be matching things or whatever.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know, everybody kept it to themselves until I opened it up, and now I don't know how to stop it, and I don't know how to address it, and where do I get an expert?
unidentified		Well, here's one thing I would say, okay, now when I was much younger, I used to take a lot of psychedelics, okay?
		And I've never seen a shadow person under the influence of LSD or psilocybin or mescaline, nothing like that, okay?
		However, I did take what was called the witch's drug, Belladonna, one time, okay?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
unidentified		And I saw a whole world of shadow people, okay?
unidentified		And I'm wondering if it was an altered state in which, you know, it's a specific, very specific altered state.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course, you know what people would say, but I would be quick to say, sure, it's possible.
		Maybe it opens the door for that sort of thing.
		And maybe you were just having utter delusions, you know, for taking the drug.
		Who knows?
		It could be either way.
		I still, I'm really troubled.
		I've had, I'm telling you, I've had thousands of emails now on this, and I don't know what to do about it, but I've got to do something.
		On the international line, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
		Where are you, please?
unidentified		I'm in Hong Kong.
		My name is Ben.
		How are you doing, Ort?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing all right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What are you doing in Hong Kong?
unidentified		I've been teaching here for about 22 years.
unidentified		Oh, that's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You called one time before.
unidentified		If I did, it would have been from Eugene, Oregon.
unidentified		I've been listening to you since 96 when I was on a teaching sabbatical in Oregon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How hard is it to get the internet in Hong Kong to be able to listen to this?
unidentified		Oh, easy.
		I use Real Player.
		I've got you, you know, from that on the web.
		Tune in on my Macintosh.
		Very simple.
		I'm about to leave the office.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's what, afternoon there or something?
unidentified		It's about 5.25 p.m.
		I'm just about winding up, and I was listening, and you said you'd like to hear from an international call.
		This is experimental, and it's very easy to call you from here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How did you do it?
unidentified		The access on AT ⁇ T is at dial 800-961111, and then there's a computer message to dial in the number you want.
		And I dialed your number, and didn't even get an operator coming in.
		Usually, there's an operator coming in asking, is this a collect call or not?
		And with an 800 number, usually you can't even get through because you can't do that collect.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's because we have a special deal.
		We have the first international 800 toll-free line in the country right here.
		And did you get those instructions from my website?
unidentified		No, I've used ATT before, so I knew how to dial, although I don't dial 800 numbers in the States with that.
		But I have dialed it occasionally, but very rarely.
		I usually use something else, which is a lot cheaper.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, listen, while I have you, I really want to ask, as you know, we're really going round and round with China right now over this airplane that's down on the island.
unidentified		Yeah, there was a demonstration here in Hong Kong at the U.S. Consulate about that yesterday.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
unidentified		Yeah, Hong Kong people don't normally demonstrate against the United States, but there were about 70 or 80, I think, that were demonstrating at the consulate against the United States.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is it generally thought there that the U.S. plane was, in fact, violating Chinese airspace?
unidentified		Well, most people here aren't talking about this because there's something else about China that's got them a lot more concerned, which is the disappearance of mainland or actually, well, they're now Chinese scholars who are of mainland origin have been disappearing there.
		People have been going from Hong Kong, not even on professional business necessarily.
		And in the last week and a half, it's been revealed that people have been seized as far back as August.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my.
		Listen, my company's paying for this, and they have infinite amounts of money.
		So can you afford to hold on through the break?
unidentified		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, then stay right where you are.
		Just kidding, boss.
		From the high desert, this is Coast to Coast AM.
nick begich ▲ ● ▼		I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
		When the sun comes up on a busy little town, down around Santa Claus, and the folks that ride the boat on the day, round about their homes, the people of the town are strange, and the town of Wales are named.
		Well, you're talking about Santa Claus, oh, oh, oh, oh, Santa Claus.
		Well, the people in the season, the dogs ever come, they are the dark of the town.
		When the cops are just a-line, they ain't a-line, when the sun goes on and down.
		They say that the fire is insane, they're Mr. Perkins again.
		You'll listen to Arch Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from April 2nd, 2001.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is my bumper music for my China caller, China Grove.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just for him.
unidentified		Very much.
		I like the Doobie Brothers.
		I like your choice of music in general.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, well, thank you very much.
		And since you're calling from China and you said something so dramatic, I wanted to let you follow up on that.
		What's this about?
		People disappearing, please?
unidentified		Well, since last August, it's been revealed that there are at least three that we know of, three scholars.
		One of them was based in the United States.
		She was in China with her family, and they detained them.
		They let the husband and child leave, but I believe she's still there.
		Her name's Gaoyan.
		And then there are two others.
		One of them was based here at City University.
		One of the, we have about seven of these tertiary institutions.
		And he went to visit a friend just across the border in Shenzhen one night, and they lost track of him.
		And it turned out he was arrested.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Gee, Shenzhen is supposed to be the safe place there.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
unidentified		Well, it's the one that's got more capitalism, that's for sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I guess the political control remains as it is further up in China.
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
		Oh, yeah.
		And then there's a third guy who was actually teaching in Guangdong, in Zhongshan University.
		His family is here in Hong Kong.
		And he, I believe, I'm not sure if he had Hong Kong residents or U.S. residents, but his family is here.
		And then he also, it turned out, he was seized.
		And he, I believe in his case, it was as far back as last August.
		The woman I mentioned, that was a few weeks ago.
		And the guy from City University who went to Shenzhen, that was also very recently.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Does anybody have any idea about motive?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, why were these people seized and what happened to them?
unidentified		We're all speculating.
		It doesn't, I mean, the research that these people were doing, well, the one from City University, he was said to be very non-controversial, very non-political.
		The one who was in Jungshan speculated, he thought that his work was controversial, that he was doing some research on China's support for North Korea during the Korean War and also Chinese involvement in Southeast Asia.
		But my impression, well, I don't really think that's so.
		Well, I've got a colleague who I think is much more controversial, and he went to Beijing over Christmas to visit family, and he came back with no problem.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you at all concerned about, I mean, after all, even though it's Hong Kong, it's already reverted.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And are you at all worried about saying the things you're saying right now on an international phone line when you and I both know they're monitored?
unidentified		I've been thinking about these things for many years, but I also think it'd be a betrayal of self to not do that.
		I've been teaching courses in political philosophy for 20 years, and I deal with issues like anarchism, libertarian thought, critical views of Marxism.
		So I'm not about to suddenly stop after I've been doing this for 20 years.
		And I've got a book on China's nuclear weapons program, which I put out 10 years ago.
		So I've dealt with this a long time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I really, really appreciate your call.
		And number one, I hope you will call again.
		Number two, I hope you'll keep me apprised of what's going on with this story.
		Because I have a lot of friends who are going up about to make trips into China.
unidentified		Well, are they Chinese or these are non-Chinese people?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		These are non-Chinese people.
unidentified		Well, seeing, as I said, these three, they're Chinese, and not only are they Chinese, but they're of mainland origin.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Gotcha.
unidentified		They're not of Hong Kong origin.
unidentified		They're people who are born in the mainland.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I fully understand, but we have 24 airmen right now that are, as you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So, all right, listen, thank you very, very much, and call again.
unidentified		I will, all right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take care all the way from Hong Kong, China.
unidentified		be right back Well, all right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's once again give out that international number.
		We just snagged Hong Kong, so give it a shot.
		You've got to learn how to do it.
		Our website will give you some information, or you can ask the ATNTA operator.
		The 800 toll-free line from anywhere in the world is 800-893-0903.
		800-893-0903.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hey, Art.
		Hello.
		Well, about these shadow people.
		Yes.
		I'm a shadow person hunter.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're a shadow person hunter?
unidentified		Yeah, well, I don't really call them a shadow people.
unidentified		I call them the bad dream people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, yes, but in a lot of cases, these, in fact, most cases, these so-called shadow people are seen by people in a waking state, not dreaming.
unidentified		Right, right.
unidentified		But what I've discovered is that they are the products of our bad dreams, or not bad dreams, but just the bad side of us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you mean, for example, then, that if you were asleep dreaming, you might conjure up a shadow person that somebody else might see?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that what you're saying?
unidentified		Exactly.
		What they do is they enact the more darker side of ourselves.
		Some people call them golems.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, then, if you knew that somebody was conjuring up a shadow person, it wouldn't be hard at all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You'd just say, hey, stupid, wake up.
unidentified		Well, no, I don't know specifically what people are doing.
unidentified		I mean, this is like more on a collective subconscious level that these beings are being conjured up and running around and doing bad things.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You slaughter them?
unidentified		I slaughter them.
		Well, I'm up to 137.
		I'm hoping this year I'll get a higher.
		Yes, I have.
		God.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's carnage.
unidentified		Well, you know, they killed someone close to me, so it's like a vendetta.
unidentified		Well, a mission.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, Vendetta.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if you're doing this because they killed somebody close to you, then it'd be a vendetta for sure.
unidentified		Yeah, exactly.
unidentified		All right, well, that's...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Even shadow people.
		137.
		Easy to the Rockies.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi, Eric.
		Hello.
		I have an idea for a segment that could drive an open line section.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And that would be.
unidentified		Okay, given the events on the sun Today?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, we missed that.
		Can you imagine, sir, we missed it by two days?
		That could have wiped out every satellite we've got.
		In which case, I wouldn't be on the air tonight.
		A lot of us probably wouldn't have computers.
		The internet would be down.
		Electrical lines, we'd be in the dark.
		All kinds of things would have happened if that thing had hit us head-on.
unidentified		Well, consider it by a factor of 10.
		Say that, you know, a week from now, the scientists came out, so there's no use in holding back the truth.
		The sun is going to go supernova in three days.
		And there's widespread panic, and it's the end of humanity.
		But then our friends, the grays, pull up and they say, look, there's no time to explain.
		We've been watching you.
		We're not going to let humanity be lost to the sands of time.
		But the problem is we only have one mothership in the area.
		So we can only save 100 of the best examples of humanity.
		Who should go?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And who would decide who went?
unidentified		Who should go?
		I think that you pose that question.
		I think it would generate some interesting discussion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It would indeed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		100 members of humanity.
unidentified		And what kind of materials, what kind of technologies should they bring?
unidentified		I mean, what represents humanity?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't think any regular people would go.
		And as far as the House, the Senate, and the executive branch are concerned, it would be a matter of, I guess, longevity.
		And they'd all go, and we'd sit here and fry.
		Do you really doubt that?
		I think there would be a lot of furor over it, but perhaps Right?
unidentified		You're probably right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So we'd be frying.
		We'd be crispy critters, and they'd be up there legislating.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi, Art.
		This is Anthony in Fairbanks.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Anthony.
		How's the weather in Fairbanks?
		Because it sure isn't very good in Anchorage.
unidentified		It's pretty good.
		It's getting up into the 40s almost during the day now.
		It looks like spring might finally be here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but I mean, they're getting like 100-mile-an-hour winds at Anchorage.
unidentified		It's been a little windy around where I am, but not really too bad.
		Okay.
		Anyway, I had a comment about the shadow people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, this is...
unidentified		Okay, I've never personally seen any of them, but do you remember the Patrick Swayze movie Ghost?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Do you remember what came for the bad guy near the end of the movie after he had died?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Well...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There are some people who say that it's, you know, these are death's couriers.
unidentified		My guess was they were shocked that you could see them while you're still alive.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, yes, indeed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I suppose seeing one, if you think they might be death's couriers, that would be not good.
unidentified		No, it wouldn't.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Not a good omen.
unidentified		And I had one other question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
unidentified		I know you have Ed Dames coming up later this week.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		End of the week.
unidentified		Yes.
		Is his Mindfire course available anywhere?
		Because I'm not even sure where to look for it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely, and you're going to find out all about it at the end of the week.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know something?
unidentified		What?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This gigantic mega flare we just had.
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure sounds like a shot across the bow to me.
unidentified		Oh, yes, it does.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I appreciate your call.
unidentified		Bye.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		First time caller line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		I had a couple things I wanted to bring up.
		One was I'm a Canadian.
		I'm a.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A tasty Canadian.
unidentified		Yeah, I'm a retired Aurora pilot, which the Aurora is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The Aurora is our airplane, not yours.
unidentified		No, no, it's...
		The Aurora is a Canadian version of the P3 Orion, and the...
		No, no, it's not the super advanced.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is some other Aurora?
unidentified		Yeah, it's a copy of the U.S. Orion and the Navy's EP-3 Aries.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I see, all right.
unidentified		As a pilot of one of those, the contention that it ran into a fighter jet, regardless of whether it was being flown by a Chinese or not.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Does that make a lot of sense to you?
unidentified		it's like uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		saying them bonnie cut off my ferrari it's a big lumbering i think the only real question is well i mean we'll never really know what happened out there but i i'm i'm with Or could we have been over Chinese airspace?
unidentified		You know what?
unidentified		I think that's something that's something we'll never know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I agree with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think we'll always say we were over international space and they will always say we were over their airspace.
unidentified		They have to.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		lives and c_n_n_ is reporting now that uh...
		uh...
		we are allowed to see our twenty four crew people however I heard that we're not allowed to see the pilot.
		Well, that he's missing or something, yes.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I know I heard that too.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm not sure what the story is there.
unidentified		That he wandered away from the airport.
		The other thing that I wanted to mention was, again, about the shadow people.
		Yeah.
		I heard your show the other night and it floored me.
		I was almost in tears.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I had people write to me who were in tears because they've been seeing these creatures, whatever in God's name they are.
unidentified		I've seen them my entire life.
		And the only people I've ever told were my parents when I was little because I didn't know it was something wrong.
		I thought they were just part of nature.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, if you'd told a flight surgeon back when you were flying that plane you just told me about, you'd have been on the ground so fast.
unidentified		Exactly.
		I told my parents, and based on their reaction, I didn't tell anybody for years.
		I told a girlfriend when I was about 18.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How did she react out of curiosity?
unidentified		She thought I was nuts.
		She had a real real problem with it.
		She was fairly religious and just automatically assumed it to be evil.
		And yeah, so from those two, I just learned to keep it quiet and doing what I do, doubly so.
		I'm a normal guy and I can't have that kind of thing.
		I've got a wife and two kids that don't know.
		And to hear people talking about it, I don't know if it's the same thing.
		I can't say for sure.
		But a lot of it sounds so, so similar.
		It's spooky.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know what I'm going to do about this.
		I've got to find somebody who knows about it.
		I appreciate your call, sir.
		And to my audience, I guess I would ask if there is anybody out there who really knows about this phenomena and really has studied this phenomena.
		Anybody you could recommend to me as a guest on this phenomena, email me at artbell at mindspring.com, artbell at mindspring.com.
		Or if you are yourself somebody who has investigated this phenomena, I want to talk to you.
		We've really opened a door here that is not going to close until we get some closure.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi.
unidentified		Turn the radio off.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, indeed.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, where are you?
unidentified		Where are you?
		I'm pretty good.
		I've been in Jackson, Mississippi.
		Okay.
		You were talking about that demented 12-year-old in Las Vegas?
		Yes.
		I think it's TV, movies, music, popular culture in general.
		I have two nieces in a town near here.
		They don't have cable.
		They don't have satellite.
		And such would be totally unthinkable to them.
		These things were not thought of when we were kids.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, wait a minute now.
		There's millions of kids, millions and millions who have video games, television, satellite, cellular phones, like you're on now.
		Anything in the world that you can imagine, modern technology, they've got it all, and they don't go berserk.
unidentified		There's always the 1%, though, with this 1%.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's not even 1%.
		It's a zillionth of 1%.
		But I just can't believe that these things you say...
unidentified		Wasn't it 30 years ago or something?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think about 30 years would be my guess.
unidentified		When the Nightingale put the Vietnam War in our laps.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, it wasn't just that.
		There were a lot of things that went on in that realm, that span of time.
		Not just that.
unidentified		I really didn't believe it myself.
		I thought, you know, kids are smart and that and everything.
		But when I first saw Apocalypse Now, which was a very strong movie, I came out of that theater just a little warped.
		But I'm an adult, and I shook it off and said, we've got to watch this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That was a pretty warped movie, actually.
unidentified		Yeah.
		And you see this almost that bad on TV every day.
		The TV show Tour of Duty, which I think is a pretty good rendition of Vietnam, is on every afternoon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But look, when I was young, we had on TV people killed Indians by the thousands.
		I mean, thousands of them.
		Just boom, boom, boom.
		They'd pull the wagons in a circle and they'd kill Indians like they were in an arcade.
unidentified		Up close and personal?
unidentified		No, I mean, blood guts are going back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Not so much.
		They pretty much just fell off the horse, sometimes in a very spectacular fashion.
		Sometimes even the horses got shot.
unidentified		You remember the tail end of the movie, I think it's called The Bounty Hunter, Rutger Hauer?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Where he put the grenade in the terrorist's mouth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, yes.
unidentified		And said a bad word, screw the bounty.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, something like that, yes.
unidentified		Stuff like that.
		They see this stuff every day.
		They are so desensitized.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think it's just a matter of time?
unidentified		Like we recently had a boy, 14 years old, but as big as a grown man, kill a little six-year-old girl, a niece or a cousin or something, doing a wrestling move he saw on TV.
		Children don't understand what they're doing.
		They have no conception.
		They see these things on TV and think, gee, I can try that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, they brought that up.
		I know of that case, and they brought that up in the court, and it was tossed right out on its ear as a motivation, as a defense.
		Are you aware of that?
unidentified		No, I work nights, so I try to sleep days, but it doesn't surprise me that they would throw it out, poor little baby, pat him on the head, and send him back out in the streets.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
unidentified		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, listen, I appreciate your thoughts on the matter, and you might be right.
		I don't know.
		I hope you're not, because if you are, then we're doomed, aren't we?
		Because that's not going to change.
		The violence and all the rest of it on television, in the movies, all over our culture, that's not going to change in entertainment.
		No way.
		Because that's what people are paying for.
		Follow the money that people want it and what people want and are willing to pay for, they will get.
		Well, listen, we're out of time.
		I'm sorry that we're out of time because every line, including the international line, is ringing.
		So, quesh raw.
		We'll do this again tomorrow.
		Try and be here for that.
		I'm Mark Bell from the High Desert.

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