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May 14, 1999 - Art Bell

02:02:16

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Whitley Strieber - Bill McDonald - UFO Crash

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30:06

bill mcdonald

01:03:04

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		This is a special edition of Coast to Coast A.M. with Whitley Streeber.
		You can reach Whitley from West of the Rockies at 1-800-618-8255.
		From East to the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		And now, here's best-selling author, Whitley Streeber, filling in for Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're back with Bill McDonald.
unidentified		Close to 6 a.m.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Corey is a Reiki master, a craftsperson, an artist.
		To learn about her work and to see some of her work, you can go up to www.artfell.com to the guest pages.
		Click through the link of tonight's guests to www.
		Alien UFOART, excuse me, that's alienufoart.com.
		And you will be there.
		I would think it would be interesting.
		If you want to look more into Lori's work while we talk, you could click on Tarot Bags or you could click onto the Reiki page.
		I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly.
		And you will learn that this man is married to a very interesting lady.
		And not too many masters of this extraordinary technique for self-empowerment, which has fascinated me for years.
		Not too many of them are real.
		And this one is very real, Lori McDonald.
		And I think that you will find what she has to say about this on the website fascinating.
		My wife Ann is with me tonight, as always, helping me producing the show and feeding me questions.
		And this is a question I don't think any man would ever have thought of.
		Reiki can be used for discipline.
		How about keeping Bill in line?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Energy exchanges between humans in the environment.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		She demonstrated on my headaches and on my animals who were sick from time to time, including rather large pythons and boa constrictors.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute.
		Let's go back here.
		Pythons, boa constrictors.
		Now, is this house full of animals?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Not anymore.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Not since the boy was one and a half years old.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, I was just going to say that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		In the door to my den where the snakes were.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I was just going to say that a house with a toddler and lots of big snakes would be a very unusual place.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm so glad that he's...
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's about breastfeeding, and when a human child is breastfeeding, you don't want it around any large predators of any kind.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course not.
		Okay, let's go on now.
		We are up to the UFO material.
		You have sort of wandered into the UFO community not too many years ago.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, I started in 1992.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		1992.
		I guess it was about, it must have been 1995.
		I asked you about a UFO sighting that had been described to me of a craft flying inland from the Pacific across in Ventura, I think it was, Ventura, California, that had what appeared to be flames coming out of the rear of it.
		And it was a very, very good sighting by a gentleman with a fair number of credentials who knew wherever he was speaking.
		It was not a burning airplane.
		And you immediately knew exactly what kind of engine this was.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
unidentified		Yeah.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It was an external fuel.
		It was a concept prototype that had been built by a combination of companies, including Skunk Works, Lockheed, a number of planes.
		And it was actually burning fuel on the outside rear portion of it.
		They called it the flying pumpkin seat.
		But basically what it was was a vehicle that fed fuel out onto the outer hull through little slits.
		And the ignition was on the outside and it would push it along.
		And it was one of several concept prototypes where the flight corridor is that area that takes them in to over Death Valley and into several runways in Nevada.
		Runways at Tonapa, runways at Mercury, and occasionally runways at Papoose or at Groome.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hey, you were probably one of the few people who can answer the question I'm about to ask you with some authority.
		That is, there must be many experimental and secret aircraft that are mistaken for UFOs.
		I want to ask you about a very specific type.
		This is the large dark triangle with lights on each angle, usually red, green, and blue, or red, white, and green, different combinations of color.
unidentified		How large?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, very large.
		This is football field size.
		These things are seen from time to time.
		It's a fairly commonplace UFO.
		They're never seen moving very fast.
		One has been videotaped in Scotland.
		It's not a very clear videotape.
		I've seen it.
		But you can see that the object is moving and it turns up on its rear angle.
		And then, in other words, it ceases to be a triangle.
		And you can just see like a black line because the thing is now on end and then it just suddenly disappears, probably because it's accelerating very quickly.
		I believe that this fits the description of the object that Art saw out near Area 51 some years ago.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, you're talking about a vehicle that is performing outside Of the parameters of what we are building ourselves in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, what I'm talking about is something that is defined gravity, and we're not able to do that yet, is what you're saying.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's not totally true.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The F-131 Super Sentinel is a tri-middle-shaped vehicle, very similar to the one that you saw in the very first regular episode.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's also known as the Aurora, isn't it?
unidentified		No.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		No, the Aurora is actually three aircraft.
		Okay.
		You have the TR-7 Thunder Dart, which is mini-Aurora.
		You then have the SR-75, which is the mothership.
		And then you also have Big Aurora, which is a much larger version of the Thunder Dart.
		It's a full scramjet thing where it needs a full tank of fuel just to take off.
		Then they have to refuel it just after takeoff.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're coming up on a break.
		I hear that music, and so we're...
		Speaking to Bill McDonald, who just as we went on break reeled off a mind-boggling list of secret aircraft, which he knew like the back of his hand.
		I'd like to go back to that list, Bill.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, Whitley, most of those planes are actually old news.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's amazing to me that they're still, you know, on the classified list.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's true that some of the Aurora craft have been in Jane's All the World's aircraft now.
unidentified		Exactly.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		But the best part of the story is how I found out about a lot of this stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Actually, that's what I was getting to.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I had a number of old retirees back in 1992 that were telling me not only about the Sentinel, but also about the different Aurora aircraft.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, what exactly does the Sentinel do?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, the Sentinel levitates.
		It's a non-aerodynamic vehicle.
		It creates electromagnetic fields around itself, divorces itself from gravity, and then basically just propels itself in any direction using a navigational system that operates on the concept of a sphere as opposed to a level plane.
		And the vehicle's very top secret.
		It was flight tested out at Tehachapi.
		It's called the Tehachapi Triangle is actually the nickname that it has.
		But it's also been known as the Super Sentinel.
		And its job basically is to intercept and interdict high-altitude inbounds that during the Bush administration were known as fast walkers.
		And there was also slow walkers, but those were the ones that came low to the ground and hovered over like a rocket base or something and messed with a missile.
		That happened in Maine and Montana and a couple other places, including Capustin Yar in Russia.
		But the main thing was they needed interceptors that could go up there and at least put a show of force into the air.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, why would they want to put a show of force into the air?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, my witnesses, and remember, I can't confirm or deny any of this, but my witnesses.
		My witnesses, which includes Colonel Corso and a Wright-Patterson witness who crawled through the interior of the Roswell ship for four months before helping to roll it up and stick it on a cargo shipping container.
		And he actually described the identical description years before I met Corso, and Corso gave me an identical description even though he didn't ever know any of those guys at Wright-Pat in 1952.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Fascinating.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		So, you know, I'm a detective, and when you've got a bunch of unconnected people describing the same thing, you have to accept some of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's very interesting to me that a man here who is a detective would get into this field relatively recently and would get so far simply because he had those skills.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, you have to remember, the best part of the story is actually that John Andrews, who died on Good Friday a couple of weeks ago, worked for the Tester Corporation as one of their chief designers, and he ran the San Diego office for many years.
		and he was best friends with Ben Rich.
		And when Ben Rich was dying back in 96...
		He was the handpicked successor, Ellie Johnson's handpicked successor.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		And this guy was confirming to John Andrews for years all the same stuff that our Counterintelligence Corps witnesses and my Wright Patterson witness and all these old retirees from Palmdale and Skunk Works and everywhere were confirming to me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And what were they confirming?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		A, that the United States government knew about UFOs and B, that there was two kinds, the ones that we build, this is Ben Rich's exact words, the kind we build and the kind that they build.
		And to make it even more interesting, Ben Rich stated to Andrews that an item, and he emphasized AN as opposed to the item, because the item was the top secret designation for the original variant of the U-2 spy plane that is now known as the TR-2, the TR-1 and TR-2 variants.
		The original version for budgeting in Congress was called the item, and that's all it was called.
		But an item referred to the Roswell spacecraft recovered by the United States Army Counterintelligence Corps back in 1947 and shipped off to Wright-Pat to an underground nuclear bomb storage pit.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, I have a little story about that, about the Counterintelligence Corps and Cav Cabot, who, of course, was on.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Sheridan Cabot.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sheridan Cabot, the first Counterintelligence Corps man on the scene at Roswell, was approached by the interviewers who were interviewing at the request of Congressman Schiff from, now deceased, sadly, from New Mexico, interviewing various Roswell witnesses for the GAO report that became so famous a few years ago about Roswell.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Boy, was that smoke?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the GAO report was actually not smoke.
		I mean, it concluded that a lot of the records had been illegally destroyed.
		What was smoked was the Air Force document that papers like the New York Times bought with extraordinary, breathtaking lack of critical interest, claiming that the Roswell incident had been caused by the dropping of crash test Dummies in 1952.
		Now, come on, guys.
		We're dumb, but even we aren't as dumb as you think we are.
		Nobody, I think, in this country, to her credit, Maureen Dowd of the New York Times laughed openly at that story, even as the science editors were adopting it as gospel.
		Okay, I'm getting off on a bit of a rant.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, because we're actually talking about modern aircraft, but the whole point is I wanted to make sure that the listeners understand that this is not stuff I've seen with my own eyes.
		I have very good sources, all of whom are very ill.
		Everybody's got cancer who's still alive.
		That's a subject for a whole other night.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		When Sharon Cabot was interviewed anyway by these GAO guys, he said, there's absolutely nothing in any of this.
		But he said, if you find out anything, you mustn't tell.
		Yeah.
		So we have there the privately stated words of a counterintelligence, of the first counterintelligence corps man who was on the scene.
		So the aircraft, the spacecraft itself ended up in the hands of the counterintelligence corps, and then Mil McDonald, through his relationships with this generation of people, gave through your father, as I recall.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		No, actually, I was introduced to these people like Kevin Randall and Don Schmidt.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Kevin Randall and Don Schmidt wrote a book, I believe, called UFO Crash at Roswell.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		And The Truth About the UFO Crash at Roswell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And The Truth About the UFO Crash at Roswell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And so they were certainly authorities in the field.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		But these old guys talked to me because they already knew who my dad was.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's what I was getting at.
		It was really through your dad's reputation and good offices that you got so much more out of them.
		The same thing happened to me when my uncle, Colonel Edward Streeber, introduced me to General Art Exen, who knew a great deal about this stuff.
		And he told me so much about it that I was able to write a novel called Majestic about the subject.
		And he gave, I believe, the same two guys, Randalls and Schmidt, a brief but telling interview for their first book.
		Okay, so let's go on now.
		We're back with the Roswell Craft.
unidentified		Describe what you were told.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, the Roswell craft, and this is a composite of all witness testimonies put together, including Sheridan Cavett's boss, who was...
		I was the last guy to work with Leonard H. Stringfield before he died, and he had had a number of sources.
		So I used his information as the foundation to test these other people to see if they were describing the same thing, and indeed they were.
unidentified		Right.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		So then Len dies, and I talked to him eight hours before he dies, and then I go to Roswell the following summer, and I get to interview these guys.
		And this was the summer of 95.
		And they confirmed everything that Leonard's sources had told him.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, we're coming up on another break, and after we come back, we're going to find out what they confirmed and what that spacecraft was really like.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is Whitley Streeber standing in for Art Bell.
unidentified		It's Coast to Coast A.M. This is Coast to Coast A.M. with special guest host Whitley Strieber filling in for Art Bell.
unidentified		The End
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Out there to get their message across, and they know that not everybody is a millionaire.
		I have just come to realize that's www.alienufoart.com.
		Well worth a visit.
		Okay, Bill, we're back, and we are talking about the Roswell spacecraft.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, Whitley, the Roswell spacecraft is a vehicle that appears to have been grown as opposed to assembled from subcomponents the way, let's say, an airplane or a car gets made by having parts put together in a factory.
		This thing is a single integrated unit.
		Everything appears to morph in and out of or grow in and out of everything else the way living organisms are all single integrated in their form.
		The spacecraft resembles certain species of sea animals, such as stingrays.
		It's kind of a diamond.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you mean in its shape?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, in its general shape and configuration, it looks a lot like a diamond-shaped stingray.
		It's got vertical stabilizers or fins that are very similar in appearance to the teeth of certain species of sharks, or i.e.
		the dorsal fins.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bill, I need to interrupt you for just a minute for an announcement that I forgot to make as we came back, and that is that we are going to go to the phones in the next hour.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Normally we go to the phones in this hour.
unidentified		Okay.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, the Roswell ship looks like a living sea animal.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Was it alive?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Pardon?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Was the ship itself alive?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's the interesting thing.
		When the power was on, it certainly had the complexity and perhaps even the guidance equal to a living organism.
		However, its flight crew was obviously organic and living beings, very similar to us, except that they were more amphibious in reality than we were, because, as I will explain later, the Roswell ship's wings allowed it to fly conventionally through the atmosphere rather than just hovering like, say, the standard UFO does.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So did it, could it do that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Could it do that sort of remarkable anti-gravity?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yes, absolutely.
		But the neat thing about the Roswell ship was that its outer skin is its engine, and it's able to fly using cambered lifts.
		It had wing camber that blended to a fuselage, just like these modern spy planes that are built by Skunk Works.
		But it's all smooth.
		It's what Jen Rich called biomorphic.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		When you say its outer surface was its engine, what do you mean by that?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I mean literally the outer layer of its skin, the part that is the outside layer of its skin, its outer hull, was its engine.
unidentified		How did it work?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Magneto aeroelectrodynamics.
unidentified		Meaning?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Quite simply, electromagnetic waves and lines of electrons moved at very high speed from the nose and leading edge extensions of those wings toward that little tail, nubby tailpipe that it had and the trailing edges of its wings at very high speed, allowing it to slip through the atmosphere in a manner similar to the way a wet pumpkin seed flips between your fingers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, here's a question that you may not be able to answer, but I would like you to think about it and take a stab at it.
		I think a lot of the listeners will know where I'm going with this.
		What if a material which was made of a foam of magnesium sandwiched with layers of bismuth was somehow involved in this machine?
		What significance might that have?
unidentified		Do you have a microphone?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		A lot of significance because bismuth, magnesium, three isotopes of osdium, germanium, a ton of silicon, some aluminum, some titanium, some gold, and other numbers of elements in various alloys and in various layers were found,
		stamped and imprinted within layers, almost like polylaminate composite layering, which is a new way to make airplane skin.
		Very similar.
		It's like one of the skin layers that made up the structure of the wings and the body of the vehicle was in patterns similar to neuroganglia tissue and seems to function like massive layers of microprocessors.
unidentified		Or a neurological.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The reason I asked the question was, of course, that one of the most unusual materials in the world is one of the things that was so-called Arts Parts that was sent to Art Vell by an unknown individual claiming it to have been part of the Roswell craft.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is a small piece of magnesium in a foam form, which we don't know how to make, layered with thin layers of bismuth that have been heated to a very high heat, and we don't even know what keeps the layers together.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That's exactly how the layers within the hull and wings of the Roswell ship were described.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It was almost impossible to cut apart, but the gash had come apart like road rash or the stripping of living tissue and layers, so they could actually take the layers and examine them within the edges of the gash of the vehicle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		On Monday night, I'm going to ask Bill Mallow, who has done a lot of research on this material, a question, and I'm going to ask you the same question now.
		This material, I have kept some of it in an envelope in my office.
		I took it out of the envelope just by chance a couple of months ago and found that there were scorch marks around the material, on the envelope near where the material had laid against it.
		Scorch marks, and yet the material itself was in a plastic bag, so it wasn't like dirt or dust or something.
		It were actual scorch marks.
		What would that, what might have caused it?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, we have to ask you some questions.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		First of all, when you put your fingernail to the scorch marks, does it scratch off?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, it does not.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Does it, have you tried to remove any layers of the scorch mark with like steel wool or a nail?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I have not yet done that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, you need to do that.
		And if it still doesn't come off, then you need to get it over to this lab at Stanford University or at one of the other major metallurgical laboratories and pay them to do a double-blind test, meaning you don't tell them anything.
		You tell them you just want the whole thing analyzed, and you'll give them the information you have after they've given you a blind analysis.
		But you have to put up the money.
		It could be several thousand, perhaps tens of thousands of dollars.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course, my concern is, since this is sitting in my office, is it radioactive?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And Linda Howe, who has had even more research done on this material than I have, assures me that it's not radioactive.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, you could get a Geiger counter from any fire department and just run the wand over it.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		If it's not putting off alpha or beta particles, then you don't really have to worry.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But it's doing something to slowly scorch this paper.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's no question about that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's clear that the scorch marks are related to the presence of the you have a problem in that there's a chemical reaction of some kind going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Except it's not, because it's okay, we're coming up on our break.
		When we get back, we're going to go inside the Roswell spacecraft with Bill McDonald and find out what it was like to live and work in that environment for the people or aliens who were there.
		We're talking to Bill McDonald and we are just about getting ready to go inside the Roswell spacecraft and find out what its occupants would have experienced while living and working inside this craft.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The interior of the Roswell ship was set up around seven seats.
		The most forward seats faced forward.
		Then there were two seats behind those that faced each other.
		Then there was a bell dome reactor just behind those or between those two side-facing seats.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What is a bell dome reactor?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's a small bell-shaped device coming out Of the flight deck or floor of the interior of that crew cabin that then tapers to a small tube that runs up to the ceiling or upper portion of the crew cabin and merges with it seamlessly.
		That tube is what some people have called a diapole or a magnetic wave guide.
		And the reactor in the floor is almost virtually identical to the one that Bob Lazar described in his spacecraft.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Because you're describing how would this have actually looked?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, you have to go to my website if you have a computer.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't have access to a computer here where I am right now.
		Okay, well, let's see if I can get it.
		What I want you to do, and I will repeat the website, is www.alienufoartall1word.com.
		And everyone at home who has a computer can go to your website and do that, but I don't, and so you've got to describe it too.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, I'll describe it.
		That's not a problem.
		There are seven seats arrayed inside of a long cocoon-shaped crew cabin that is the interior of this fuselage portion of the vehicle that the wings merge into.
		It's like where the spine of the vehicle is.
		And inside there are seven seats.
		And they're arranged in rows of two, going back to the last one, which is recessed into the narrowest portion of the crew cabin, where there's a little niche where one of the aliens' heads actually plugged into that niche, direct physical contact in that niche.
		And the seats of the two guys directly in front of him, moving from the rear back toward the front, faced him.
		In other words, they were riding backwards inside the vehicle.
		And then the next two seats were facing across to each other, and between them or just slightly off-centered from them in the gravitational center of the crew cabin was this little metallic dome that just like morphed out of the floor.
		And it morphed into a small vertical pole that went up to the overhead ceiling of the crew cabin.
		And forward of that, in that seating arrangement, was two more seats that we assume were like the pilots because they had wraparound consoles where the consoles merged with the armrests of these seats.
		And these are metal seats that literally grow out of the floor.
		And the armrests merge with the consoles so that everything morphs and wraps around each individual little humanoid or little human child-like alien so that he plugs into his crew station and then the crew station plugs back into him.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so we have the reason I asked you so much about the dome is that for those listeners who have read my book, Breakthrough, you will find in it a description of an experience that I had that I have never known whether or not it was real, where I was in a UFO and I describe a black dome-shaped object that this individual had his hand on.
		And I find it very interesting that for the first time in my life, I am hearing that same thing, same sort of thing being described, in this case, by Bill McDonald.
		And what I would like to ask you now, Bill, since I have ended up on a sort of a detective journey on my own here, is what is your authority?
		Tell me a little bit about how you deduced this description from the various sources that you had.
		And how high a level of reliability and credibility do you feel that it has?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, my military sources have pedigrees that, in my opinion, are beyond reproach, because long after Kevin Randall and Don Schmidt had moved on into other areas of UFO research and presentations, I kept at it with these guys, just focusing on the inside of the ship and the anatomy of the aliens.
		That's all I cared about, was the ship and the aliens.
		I didn't care about the detective work beyond that because other people had already done that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, I understand that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is your area of focus, and that's exactly right, what we're talking about.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Right, but now you're talking about this dome thing.
		The military guy who was like, he was just out of flight school.
		He had a photographic memory and no family.
		So he got yanked by a very senior general whom I suspect was Nathan Twining himself back before he was a general.
		But it could be somebody else.
		It could be Clements McMullen or Martin F. Scanlon.
		But somebody knew who this kid was, and they yanked him out and they put him, and he thought he was being punished until he actually got there.
		But he got to the Patterson Field site at Wright Pat, and he saw the spaceship and suddenly knew he was being honored rather than punished.
		And his job was to document what he saw going on during the last four months of that ship's tenure or incarceration or, you know, it was being studied there at Wright-Pat Air Force Base.
		And then, and he got to crawl through it repeatedly over that four months period of time.
		Now, he's alive today, but he's got leukemia and he's sick.
		He's got neck problems.
		I mean, this guy is very, very unwell.
		But he wants to get the story out before he dies.
		And he wants somebody to, you know, chronicle it the right way so that he'll remember it after his death.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		When you talked to these people, were you able to take notes or how did you...
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Most of these people did not want to be audiotaped or videotaped.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, I can understand that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		And Teddy's on that than I did, but I took notes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I have to interrupt you again because I've just got so many questions.
		I know the listeners do too, and everybody, As soon as we come back, so many questions.
		I know the listeners do too.
		And everybody, as soon as we come back from the news after the top of the hour, the phones are going to be open to you guys for the rest of the night.
		I've been a hog here, but I just have to ask you, Bill, do you have any sense of what all this secrecy is about?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely.
		Whitley, you've got to have secrecy.
		If you don't, you'd have economic chaos.
		That's the bottom line.
		The big secret was taken away from the government and taken away from the military back in 1969, and it had been a long process even before then.
		It was Truman and Eisenhower that had Nixon working for them that was getting it augmented and transferred over to the private sector because this technology has to be introduced a little at a time or you have economic chaos.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And then you get back to Phil Corso and the others who have apparently been introducing this technology.
		Because, you know, I'm way far beyond the issue of is this all real or not.
		It is real.
		I mean, anyone who looks at the NASA video, the NASA mission STS-80 video, you can see with your own eyes that these are clearly spacecraft or space beings or whatever they may be maneuvering under intelligent control of somebody.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I absolutely concur with you.
		The bottom line here is it isn't just Colonel Corso talking.
		It isn't just our survivors of the Counterintelligence Corps, the Wright-Patterson witness, or the guy who knew Ben Rich, who's now dead as of this year.
		It's all of them talking independently of each other.
		They don't know each other or they haven't seen each other in many, many years, but they're all telling the same story.
		And so as a detective, I have to accept that there is reality to this because you're not going to have a bunch of old guys telling the same lie when they're facing the Reaper.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, we're coming up on the break now.
		And when we get back, we're going to open the phones.
		You can ask him questions.
unidentified		618-8255.
		This is Coast to Coast AM.
		Now, filling in for our bell.
		Here's Whitley Streeber.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is Whitley Streeber.
		It's Coast to Coast AM.
		Our guest tonight is Bill McDonald, who has managed to get this old jaw to drop just about all the way to the floor.
		Lines are open.
		West of the Rockies, 1-800-618-8255.
		East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		Carl in Washington.
		Got a question for Bill.
unidentified		Hello, Carl.
		Yeah, we're here.
		I've got some questions, but Whitley, omit needless words.
		You're interrupting him all the time, and you're going on too long about your stuff.
		I want to hear what this guy has to say.
		I've heard you before, and I'm interested in what you have to say, but there's only so much time.
		My questions are as follows, and then you can give them to me.
		I'll just take them off the air.
		You said the vehicle from Roswell was like a living creature, and it had aspects of like marine life.
		You said the inhabitants were amphibious in quality.
		And so what I want to know is, was this thing capable of being submersible craft, for one thing?
		Also, I want to know about the aliens themselves.
		I want your guests to dilate on that subject especially.
		For instance, I want to know, did they have, for instance, excretory organs?
		Did they have any sexual organs?
		Did they have any sort of like digestive system?
		Now, I could have a thousand more questions, but I'll stop there and let other people ask other ones.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Bill, you got your response?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, absolutely.
		The answer to his questionnaire is as follows.
		The spaceship was metal and crystalline in structure and form, different allies and stuff, but it mimicked the function and form of living tissue down to the molecular level in its complexity and in the way it worked.
		Secondly, the aliens were humanoid in shape.
		They looked like little kids.
		They were described as having these absolutely incredible, angelic expressions, even though they had died horrible deaths.
		They had skin that was not like ours.
		You and I have semi-permeable tissue.
		They did not.
		Their skin under the microscope, according to Leonard Stringfield's three doctors, was more like artificial screen mesh.
		To the naked eye, it looked like the tiny beaded scales that you see in an albino baby Hawaiian gecko.
		They were immersed in a fluid that was also the ballast for the vehicle for tambered flight in an atmosphere.
		They absorbed nutrients and hydration and oxygen through their skin, and we assume they excreted through their skin because they were found to be with only a vestigial digestive tract and no alimentary canal.
		If they ate food, it was like a pre-digestive pablum that would be completely digested, and they did not excrete the way terrestrial animals do.
		Any excretions would have been very small particles, and it went out through their skin.
		There are certain species of frogs and salamanders and juvenile amphibians that are like tadpoles that do the exact same thing here on Earth.
		There are certain species of frogs that you can buy at the fish store that spend their entire lives underwater, absorbing their oxygen.
		Even though they have vestigial lungs, they absorb their oxygen through their skin.
		They excrete through their skin, and they rarely eat.
		Sometimes they eat, but many times they just receive nutrition through their skin.
		And that's what these aliens were like.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bill's website is www.alienufoart.com.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You can get to him through Art's website, through the guest area.
unidentified		Fritz from Phoenix, you're on the air.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Fritz.
unidentified		Whitley, you're doing just fine.
		Being a journalist yourself, you know exactly how to pull information out of Bill.
		Bill, your artwork is fantastic, unbelievable.
		You make a fantastic contribution to the subject and for millions of people to see.
		I think art should really go into this and make it aware to the public.
		It's fantastic artwork.
		My question is to you, Bill.
		Did you ever have an encounter?
		Did you see a UFO?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Light that was of a different consistency than the late afternoon sunlight, which was reflecting off an airplane that was coming in on the regular vectored approach to LAX.
		It was a jet liner.
		There was small light literally flying circles around the aircraft and zipping around its tail.
		It reminded me of cybernetic anthropomorphous machine systems device, like some of the stuff that was developed using Strategic Systems Division circuitry and microprocessors.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What is the Strategic Systems Division?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That's where my dad used to work.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		At Brockwell.
unidentified		Yeah.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's the East Anaheim facility.
		They used to call it Audinetics when it was North American.
		But anyway, these CAMS devices, you sometimes see them out in Nevada or in the more secret areas out in Utah, Michael's Army Airfield, Area 6314, you know, different things like that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now you're running this stuff past us so fast.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know about the other listeners, but I haven't ever heard of Area 6314.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's an extension of White Sands Missile Range.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		There are runways in those mountains, and the X-33 is sometimes launched from out there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the X-33 is?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It is the lifting body-shaped forerunner to what will be the future space shuttle, the Venture Star being the much larger version.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		These are both built by Skunk Works, by the way, Lockheed Martin.
unidentified		Hey, Bill, Kate.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's go on to our next caller, Larry in Montreal, Canada.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Larry, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi, Mr. Sriver and Mr. McDonald.
		I got one question for you.
		It's about the group the nine.
		They said they got one ship.
		I don't know if you know the group the nine, but they said they got one ship and there were some alive.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The nine refers to the nine original agents of the United States Army Counterintelligence Corps, all of whom had nicknames based on old desperados from the old west.
		However, they were augmented by two pilots, one of whom is still alive and is one of my informants.
		We call him Dutch.
		He lives not far away from me.
		We also have the one ship that they're referring to is the Roswell ship.
		And so that nine is the Counterintelligence Corps.
		That is the legend of the United States Army Counterintelligence Corps.
unidentified		Those are good.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They're coming up on another break.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		They come quick.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They do come quick.
		And after we get back, we will.
		This is Coast to Coast AM.
		West of the Rockies, it's 1-800-618-8255.
		East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		This is Whitley Streever sitting in for Art Bell.
		www.alienufoart.com Bill McDonald and Lori McDonald's website.
		If you've got a computer, get on it, take a look at it.
		It's fascinating.
		We were talking to Larry in Montreal.
		Larry, you still with us?
unidentified		Yes, I'm still with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, what's next?
unidentified		Okay, the next thing, I know in Japan they got some good development on biochips.
unidentified		I strongly think what Mr. McDonald is describing might be some kind of bio-ride more than some kind of airplane.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, I have to tell you that I can't agree with you on that, and that's because my witnesses' descriptions were very long, very careful, and very precise, and they were all describing the same thing.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Also, you can design things in metal and crystal that mimic the shape and form of biological structures, and you can create circuits that function with the same degree of complexity as neurological structures within the brain structures of any higher order animal.
unidentified		Wow.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Without it actually being a bioroid or a bio-something or other bioroids are from science fiction.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's not conscious, is what you're saying.
unidentified		But we're really near of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, caller.
unidentified		Thank you all very much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to Sheila in Miami.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sheila?
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Sheila.
unidentified		You're doing fine, Whitley.
unidentified		Don't worry about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so you think the first caller was wrong?
unidentified		Yes, I did.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'll count that as a vote.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, you don't have to disappoint.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		Mr. McDonald, if I heard you right, I heard you say that one of the aliens had their head plugged into like a little niche in the back of the craft.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
		The niche was very similar to the structure of the cervix inside of a human being.
		And the crown of the head actually fit into the dent in that structure so that it was a complete fit.
		And it is assumed that this being was either the translator between the flight crew and the artificial intelligent cortex of the vehicle itself, or that all of them were in direct contact with the ship, either through their keyboards or the finger-shaped indents in their armrests, and also through the back of their heads in their seats.
		But this one alien in the back was reclined more, and his head was pushed back more, and he had his very own view screen in the back, unlike the rest of them that all shared the giant wraparound view screen at the very front of the crew cabin,
		which was directly behind the double-tiered instrument structures that was covered by this forward sensor array shield that was very thin but translucent from the inside looking out and was also unscratched after being embedded in the face of the cliff on Judd McKnight and Jason Ridgway's land, which is now of course owned by Hub Corn.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		So could he have actually been the pilot and the one in the front not?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well I'll tell you why I think it's the other way around.
		The two guys in the front had no opposable thumbs.
		Instead they just had four fingers.
		All the guys sitting behind them had opposable thumbs as well as the four fingers, making them each with five-fingered hands.
		Of the two in the very front, the guy on the right-hand side had something like a joystick that morphed out of the right-hand side of his console, and it had a four-fingered hand grip that fit his hand and structures of his hand perfectly,
		and he moved that around like the joystick on some of the more advanced fighter aircraft training simulators, or similar to the joystick on somebody's Nintendo, except this thing's not made out of separate parts.
		This thing's morphed completely out of the capsule.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If I may just interrupt here for a minute.
		I mean, you are, this is quite amazing.
		I have a question that's come up.
		You're describing creatures that actually were differently shaped in different parts of the craft or had different types of hands and so forth, almost as if they were kind of purpose-built or purpose-built.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		They were artificially bred to exist in a sterile fluid to perform reconnaissance.
		They were drones.
		They were obviously part of a greater hive society, in my opinion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So these were not playing with a full deck in the same sense that we are.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		They were I disagree.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I think that they had a high degree of intelligence, and there have been a number of people who've been out to the crash site who have picked up very strong emotions of fear, pain, disappointment.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You mean psychics?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, what I'm talking about is anomalous intuition.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I see.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I don't like to use the word psychics that much because I'm still not comfortable with that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		But there is some anomalous intuition demonstrated to me out at the crash site on my three trips out there by different people that does fit with what the military guys are telling me, even though there's no contact between any of the parties.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, it's 1-800-618-8255.
		East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		Les in Honolulu, you're on the air with Bill McDonald.
unidentified		Hi.
		And I'll just give you a second vote.
		You're doing a great job also, Whitney.
		Thanks.
		I have, I guess, three or four related questions.
		These extraterrestrial life forms that visit us now, are they of the same civilization from the Roswell craft?
		And are they here to help mankind or are they here to help the secret government?
		Or are they here, have they actually invaded and the secret government is in a position where they're forced to cooperate?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, you've opened up a whole other wing of my investigation into UFOs.
		I'm putting together a book scenario right now that my agent at Toad Hall has called the Oasis Earth scenario.
		And in it, I postulate 11 different alien species.
		But of those 11 different species, I postulate multi-species factions that are sharing the Earth and using it as an oasis in, you know, along the various interstellar caravan.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're coming up on a break, Bill.
unidentified		We'll be back with...
		You can reach Whitley from West of the Rockies at 1-800-618-8255.
		From East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		And now, here's best-selling author Whitley Striever filling in for Art Bell.
		About you and about you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is Whitley Striber, Coast to Coast AM.
		Tommy, Memphis, Tennessee.
		You're on the air.
		Hello, Tommy.
unidentified		Hello, how are you doing?
		Hi.
		I was just curious, did they find any kind of, was there an alphabet or any kind of written language of any kind of sort, maybe symbols or something that represents some way of communicating to each other?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		There were several different fonts found all over the interior of the forward section of the crew cabin and also on the hatch to the exterior upper left side dorsal hatch.
		It had some writing on it.
		The writing is in my drawings on the website.
		Also, I have very close-up slides.
		Whenever I do lectures or come to somebody's town, I show close-ups of the alien writing.
		There was also alien writing found on the crossbar, that little I-beam that is like part of the flexible skeleton of the interior of the vehicle.
unidentified		Wow.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That also had writing on it in a very similar language.
		These were called icons.
		They weren't really letters.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Was anyone ever able to read this writing?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		My father had an amazing opinion.
		This is the same icons that Jess Marcel Jr. observed and was able to reconstruct.
		It's the same symbols that were described by a number of witnesses To different abductions over the years, Whitley.
		But the interesting thing is, is that according to my dad, it looks like mathematical symbols.
		And my father had always been dead against Roswell.
		In fact, he was so dead against it that for a long time he just didn't want to communicate with me at all.
		But on my wedding day, he goes into my den during the wedding reception and he takes a look at it and he says, gee, Bill, you know what this looks like to me?
		And he gives me this wicked look that I've never seen in my father's eyes before.
		And he says, these are mathematical symbols of some kind.
		If these people speak in a language, it's probably a language of mathematics.
		And I was like, gee, thanks, Dad.
		What a nice wedding day.
unidentified		Wow, what a story.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Roger in Roanoke Park, California.
		You're on the air.
		Hello.
		Hello, Roger.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		How are you doing?
		Hi.
		I'd like to say thank you for taking the call.
		I've tried many times over the years.
		And I've enjoyed, I know Mr. Bell for many years.
		He's quite a gentleman.
		I served at the National Security Council for 28 years as a science officer.
		Graduated UCLA when I was very young.
		And you guys are right on.
		Everything you're talking about is, I would confirm, is being correct.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you, sir.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		We really appreciate people like you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I must tell you that I'm rather in awe of what's going on here.
unidentified		Isn't it good?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I did not know that Bill McDonald knew all of this before I got him on the air.
		I'm hearing a lot of this for the first time.
		He's one of our special ones.
		Well, yes, apparently so.
unidentified		Apparently so, yeah.
unidentified		Boy, am I amazed?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I'm going to fight it back someday.
unidentified		Well, the bad guys do everything they can to keep us buried.
unidentified		We've been living in a kitty litter box for a long time, but we're going to be okay, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, apparently I let somebody out of the kitty litter box somehow or another.
		I'm very amazed.
		I think that I'm just in awe of this.
		But incidentally, I might mention that Bill's website is www.alienufoart.com, or you can link to it through the Art Bell website.
		And I just want to keep that in front of your mind because it's a wonderful, unique website, beautiful art, and some extraordinary things they offer for sale created by himself and his wife, Lori.
		Hayden in Ukiah, California, if I'm pronouncing that correctly, you're on the air with Whitley Streeber and Bill McDonald.
unidentified		Hi, Whitley.
		Hi, Bill.
		How are you?
		Hi.
		Can you hear me all right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We can hear you beautifully.
unidentified		Okay, fine.
		The caller before last kind of blew me off of my question.
		I was going to ask if symbols in the craft had been reminiscent of hieroglyphics, which seems to be a commonly reported comparison.
		They're not exactly like hieroglyphics, but similar to it.
		Would you describe them that way?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, sir, you have to understand that hieroglyphics is one particular kind of symbolized language associated only with one culture, and that's the Egyptians.
		The correct term, everybody uses the word hieroglyphics.
		It's very common, but it's wrong.
		The correct term is icons.
		Icons are symbols that different cultures have, of which hieroglyphics is one kind of set of icons that are used in writing, especially ancient writing, or in writing that is other than what we normally attribute to recognizable language.
unidentified		Okay, well, let me cut to the chase if I can, Whitley.
		Sure.
		This might interest you.
		There was reported in that those documents, I think they were called the Majestic 12 documents that came out about a year ago.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I remember those documents that are now part of Joe Firmage's website, I believe.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I've been studying them with Dr. Robert Wood and his son here on the West Coast.
unidentified		You have?
		Okay.
		There was reported in those documents, if I recall, a book that they found at the crash site.
		Is that so?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Are you talking SOM 1-01 or something else?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What is SOM 1-01?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It was an instruction manual for a special team to go and collect.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's an instruction manual that we made.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you talking about a book that was found that belonged to the craft?
unidentified		Yeah, it belonged to the craft and the visitors.
unidentified		I thought there was something in one of those Majestic 12 documents that related to that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I have no information that corresponds with that.
		My witnesses have always described silicon chips with patterns reminiscent of flowers or neuroganglia tissue.
		When you stick them in certain little flats on the consoles, they make the instrumentation and everything perform different functions.
unidentified		Okay, well, I guess I'm asking a question that doesn't have a basis.
unidentified		Thank you very much.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		No, there might be something.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's just that I haven't heard of it from my sources.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The only book that I've heard of in my own research, Betty Andreason Luca, who is a close encounter witness who was extensively interviewed by a gentleman named Ray Fowler, who's written a number of books based on those interviews, mentioned being given a book, a little blue book, which she kept for a couple of days and could never remember the contents of.
		Aside from that, I don't believe there are any references to any books anywhere in the literature of this experience.
		West of the Rockies, it's 1-800-618-8255.
		East of the Rockies, it's 1-800-8255033.
		William in Charlotte, North Carolina, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, William.
unidentified		All right.
		This is a wonderful show.
		It's a wonderful forum, and we're real lucky that y'all are able, and you're not being bleeped out by Big Brother.
		But anyway, a question, I was talking about this at dinner just last evening with a friend of mine about the origins and things like this.
		And just tell me if you've ever heard of this theory before, because I'd never heard it, and it sure didn't make sense to me.
		Everybody's worrying about the missing link in our evolutionary process.
		And someone, my friend of mine said, someone wrote a song about the aliens came and actually mated with humans, you know, or mated with apes.
		And that's how humans came and they can't find the missing link.
		Have you ever heard this theory before?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, Actually, that's a misinterpretation of a very long and complex amount of research done by a man named Zachariah Sitchin.
		They didn't breed with apes.
		The whole idea is that genetic material taken from Homo erectus was spliced together with some genetic traits from the quote-unquote Anunnaki or Nephilim in order to create either Homo annecessor, Homoarchaic, or perhaps Homo sapiens sapiens directly.
		However, I can't concur with a lot of that because I read everything there is to read on the different human species because forensic anthropology is my hobby.
		It's stuff I love.
		And I think Zechariah got a little bit of it mixed up because there is plenty, plenty of DNA similarities and identical DNA strands throughout the entire strands that demonstrate that Homo neandotilensis, while possibly being a different species than us, is still very close to us and that the lineage seems natural.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And there's also a skeleton that's been found in Portugal just recently.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Right, that's Homo annecessor.
unidentified		Yes.
		Another quick question.
		Was there any evidence of art or music aboard the spacecraft?
		Pictures or anything that made sounds?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, the view screens put up all kinds of tactical and iconic and designs that we would call art.
		I don't know what they call it, but it's very pretty stuff.
		If you look at my illustrations on my website, you'll see some of it in the cockpit drawing on the billmart.htm page of my website.
		You have to remember, and I want to get back to your other question for a second there because I wasn't quite done.
		I subscribe to the idea that between 450,000 years ago and 65,000 years ago, subtle alterations were made to certain populational groups that resulted in us, but it wasn't as complex a gene splicing operation as what Zechariah said.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bill, we're coming up on a break now, so we're going to come back.
		We're 1-800-618-8255 west of the Rockies.
		East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		This is Coast to Coast AM with Whitley Striever and Bill McDonald.
		This is Art Bell.
		Get a pen and paper ready because I'm going to give you a place to get some storable food.
		I've not done this lightly nor quickly, and I've checked them out.
		A whole bunch of companies in the gym.
		This is Whitley Striever, Coast to Coast AM with Bill McDonald.
		We're going to go to the phones as quickly as possible, callers.
		We know there are a lot of you waiting in line, so we're going to answer the questions as quickly as we can.
		Malcolm, Reno, Nevada, you're on the air.
unidentified		Yes, I want to know if the aircraft or UFOs contain any type of weaponry, if there's ever been any attempt at human control of the Roswell aircraft, or if the UFOs that we have currently, you know, the U.S. Arsenal, whatever, are being developed as offensive, defensive, or maybe still delivery vehicles.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		One of my informants from out at the Mercury-Tonapa area helped to design flight simulators for just such vehicles.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		He also confirmed the existence of what we call HPACs or human-piloted alien craft.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Human-piloted alien craft.
		Wait a minute.
		Human-piloted alien craft.
		Can you expand on that a little?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there's two definitions for that, which has also been mentioned to me by some people, including John Andrews, who unfortunately passed away.
		That falls under two categories.
		Stuff that we build based loosely, as much as we can follow it, on blueprints and designs that have been reconstructed.
		Again, there's that word reconstruction.
		That's what reverse engineering is.
		And then B, those that were recovered one way or the other and are essentially what we would call hand-me-downs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's go now to our next caller, David, Big Island, Hawaii.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lucky man.
unidentified		Hey, good evening, gentlemen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, David.
unidentified		Yes, my question was these aliens that come to the Earth and stuff like that, do they observe what we're doing and stuff, you know, when they make their pit stop, like you said?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		They study the local fauna, but more than that, they ranch.
		They ranch us the way some of the ranchers in Australia and some of the Americans in the Old West used to ranch semi-feral herds of cattle and sheep.
		Most of the time they leave us alone, but when they need to harvest something, they cull it quietly without upsetting the rest of the herd so that you don't have veterinary problems down the road with large segments of that herd's population.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's get back now to the question that the last culler left behind about weapons.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Were there any weapons aboard the craft?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The Roswell ship had no weapons whatsoever.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The Roswell vehicle had lasers and masers and all kinds of wave propagation devices that you could convert into weaponry very easily, but they were used for navigation on a planet where there were no satellites or anything and needed to be able to triangulate its locations over the surface of the Earth versus wherever the mothership was that supported it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do they know why the Roswell crashed, or has anyone speculated as to why the craft was there?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What was it doing?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Reconnaissance.
		When the atomic bombs started going off, the analogy would be very similar to if you had a bunch of Bedouins using an oasis in the Sahara Desert and one of the local tribes suddenly had weapons of mass destruction.
		Everybody would take notice.
		Exploding nuclear weapons during the Second World War and out at Trinity site prior to the atomic bomb blast at Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and then for several years afterward.
		That's interstellar smoke signals.
		That's my hypothesis.
		That's the hypothesis of every single one of those old military guys that I talked to, including Colonel Corso and everybody else.
		Interstellar smoke signals, you've got a very valuable piece of strategic real estate with all of its resources here on Earth, you know, all of our keep with our callers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We've got to go to our next caller, Dee in Las Vegas.
unidentified		Hi, Dee.
		Hello.
		Hi.
		Hi.
		This is fascinating, Mr. Jonathan.
		Thank you for all the information.
		I don't have a computer, so where would I be able to get the pictures that you have described?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, Dee, that's real easy.
		Just give us a call or write to us.
		Which do you prefer?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Give out your phone number and the number they can call the address they can write you.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, the number is area code 949-496-8489, but only use it during the daytime.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's an order line, in other words, it's open during the day.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's a business line that the whole family uses, but we prefer that it only be used in the daytime.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's 949-496-8489.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Don, you're on the air.
		Austin, Texas.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hello, Don.
		I'm Don from Austin.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		I'm calling on behalf of the space UFO craft that was discovered.
		I'm going to ask a couple of questions.
		Now, do you have highly documentable proof of the photograph of the UFO?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I do not have photographic evidence in my possession at this time.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		However, I'm due to inherit it when certain parties pass away.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		Now, how about the maneuverability of the ship?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That ship had an envelope like you wouldn't believe.
		That vehicle could perform aerobatics unlike anything that anybody has ever seen even today.
		And that's another reason why the fluid interior was so good because it really cushioned those aliens against all of that inertial forces that would have otherwise had them slamming around the cockpit cabin.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, it's 1-800-618-8255.
		East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		Andy from Clackamas, Oregon.
		Your Honor.
unidentified		Hi, this is Andy.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did I pronounce it right?
unidentified		Yeah, you did, yeah.
unidentified		Oh, good.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I have a question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
unidentified		Yep.
		Do these aliens in their spaceship have any navigational maps to show them where they're going to?
		How to get there?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, what you have to understand is any space-faring species, including us humans, has to be able to develop a three-dimensional navigation process using advanced mathematics and local stellar groups and constellations to be able to move from one solar system to another.
		And so we can assume that they had navigation and mathematical process navigation similar to what we use.
		It seems logical, but, you know, who knows?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, when we come back, we're going to be talking about the face that Bill McDonald has forensically constructed on the skull that is presently being investigated by him and Lloyd Pye.
		It was found in Mexico that was discussed by Lloyd Pye with Hilly a few weeks ago.
		This is coast to coast A.M. Whitley Streeber standing in for Art Bell.
unidentified		Don't know when I've been so blue.
		Don't know what's come over you.
		You found someone.
		And don't admit my brown eyes blue.
		This is a special edition of Coast to Coast AM with Whitley Streeper.
		You can reach Whitley from West of the Rockies at 1-800-618-8255.
		From East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		And now, here's best-selling author, Whitley Streeber, filling in for Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is Whitley Streeber back with Bill McDonald and your calls.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Richard, Roswell, New Mexico, you're on the air.
unidentified		Yeah, Whitley, I basically called to ask a couple of questions, one from you and one from Bill.
		First one for you, your arts parts.
		Are you keeping that in a dense metal safe?
		You might be getting some magnetic reaction from the particles of the safe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Until I know why the material scorches paper, I'm keeping it where it is, is in a metal file cabinet well away from anybody.
		It's not in any kind of shielding because apparently it's not radioactive, but I don't keep it close to myself anymore like I did.
		I used to keep it in a drawer right in my desk.
		But there must be some kind of energy associated with it, and I've isolated it.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		You have got to get that thing analyzed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I've had it analyzed.
		You don't understand.
		Linda Howe and I, especially Linda, has had it analyzed literally dozens of times, and so have I, a number of times, and one of the analysts will be on with me on Monday night, but it doesn't mean it's terribly mysterious because of the inability, for example, to detect what energy might be there.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Have you compared it to that piece of almost 99% pure silicon that Paul Davids has in his possession?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, no, but I was not aware of the fact that Paul Davids, incidentally, is the producer of the Roswell movie that appeared on Showtime a few years ago.
		That is yet another reason why we've got to bring Bill McDonald back on this program.
		We haven't even talked about his work on that show.
		I don't think we're going to get to the phase reconstruction tonight because we've got so many calls yet to go through, which is wonderful.
		In any case, no, I have not done that.
		I didn't know about that.
		I will get on that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's been analyzed by Stanford and several other locations.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		He and Daryl Sims did it together.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Because we have done analysis of a silicon, an almost pure silicon object here in Texas as well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Caller, let's go on to your next question for Bill McDonald.
unidentified		Bill, can you expand on the harvesting of humans, I assume it's humans, and also when is the next time you're going to be in Roswell?
unidentified		We don't see much of your material here.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, sir, you'll have to ask the museum and you'll have to ask the Chamber of Commerce when the next time they're going to invite me back.
		That's all.
		Whenever we're invited, we're there.
		The last time we were there was for the 50th anniversary.
		Also, in regards to expanding upon, what was it exactly, again, that you wanted me to explain?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The issue of what the...
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Human DNA, liquid water, various mineral components.
		But human DNA apparently is extremely valuable to their reproductive process because they have to reproduce through a very complicated process known as replication, which is far more advanced than simple cloning.
		And it also allows for some individualization, but the problem, again, is you're always making the Xerox of the Xerox of the Xerox.
		So you have to have a DNA source in order to infuse DNA so that when you lose information or when you lose several genes out of a strand, that you can replace them with something compatible.
		And in Jurassic Park, they used frog DNA to help resequence dinosaur DNA.
		And it's the same basic idea in real life if you're talking about certain species of aliens who have a basic DNA structure similar to ours.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Sam in Minnesota, you're on the air.
unidentified		Yes, how do you do?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Sam.
unidentified		Good.
		You've been a very difficult man to get a hold of.
		I've tried for a long time to get a hold of you, particularly...
		Oh, sorry, Whitley Streeber.
		Okay.
		It's because I had an unusual reaction to the cover-up comedian without knowing what it was about, but that's a whole different story.
		The reason I'm calling in is because I'm related to a major general who was stationed at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base a great deal of his life and upheld a number of positions.
		And I, in fact, questioned him when I last spoke with him about your uncle, if he recalled the name.
		And he didn't recall the name, even ventured to spell it for me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And did or did not?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I didn't understand you.
unidentified		No, he did.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He did know.
unidentified		He didn't recall the name.
		He did know the name, yes.
		And I've tried to get a hold of you to try to get more specifics because due to some unusual behavior, the real dodgy nature that my grandfather has had about this subject, when I confront him about, you know, for example, Roswell or UFOs in general, he says it's a bunch of hooey.
		And in particular, when I was reading Transformation near him, he looked at the cover and without questioning what the book was about said, why are you reading that hooey son?
		You should be reading the Western.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Sir, if I may suggest, this doesn't sound very sensitive, but this is something that you have to understand.
		The time to talk to your grandfather, just like the time to talk to my own dad, is when they're very close to death and not until, because when they feel the reaper over their shoulder, then the attitude changes, the idea about the oath changes.
		Suddenly, they become very talkative because they want to get the truth out before they die.
		You have to be there.
		You have to be there to catch the confession or catch the information while they can still talk to you before they go into a coma or pass away or whatever.
		And I've been very fortunate.
		I was able to do that with Leonard H. Stringfield.
		I would talk to him during the very last week of his life, all the way up to the last eight hours of his life.
		Eight hours after our last conversation, he passed away, but he managed to get everything to me before he died.
		My Wright-Patterson witness and our CIC witnesses and the guy out here who was one of the pilots, the time to get them is when they think they're literally on death's door.
		And until that time...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was an intelligence officer in the Air Force all of his career.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But if I can find out his unit numbers and so forth, I will post them on my website.
unidentified		Okay, because my plan had been to corroborate with your uncle who had said he had mentioned Scuttlebutt, I believe, and Exxon had said himself.
		And I was hoping just to...
		And then if he flat out denies it, then I can say, you know, are you lying to me?
		You're lying to me.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		You gentlemen realize that General Exxon lives about 20 minutes from me, and he's still alive.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I did not know that.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, he lives 20 minutes from me in the next county over, and he's still alive.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you speak with him?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I haven't, but I can get in touch with him if somebody was to give me something to share with him to get him to talk to me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I certainly can do that.
		We're coming up on a break right now.
		We'll be back with your calls.
		1-800-618-8255.
		West of the Rockies, east of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		This is Whitley Streeber.
		It's coast to coast AM, substituting for Art Bell.
unidentified		Number to call?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		1.
		6 a.m. with Whitley Streever sitting in for Art.
		Are you ready, Carl, in Natoka, Oklahoma?
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi.
		Mr. McDonald, I have some information that you may be interested in.
		I have a friend that witnessed a U.S. government UFO flight test up over the city of between Flagstaff and the Mesas up there.
		Okay.
		It was followed by an F-16 chase plane with a tanker.
		What year was this?
		Pardon?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		What year was this?
unidentified		97.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that's very fresh.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		How would I get in touch with you later?
unidentified		I'll leave my number with the producer, if that's okay.
unidentified		And then you're welcome to call me anytime.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That would be fine.
		Otherwise, sir, I can just give you my number right now.
		Okay.
		And we will keep the Art Bell listeners apprised as to how this turns out.
unidentified		Okay, and I have several other things that I'd like to speak about.
unidentified		First off, I was born with six fingers on each hand.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Are you a man who is currently polydactyl?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Or did you have them removed soon?
unidentified		No, they removed them at birth.
unidentified		They did it with all my family, and it's a trait that ran throughout our history.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Was the six finger identical to one of the other five?
unidentified		Yeah, identical.
unidentified		It had a nail and joints and everything else.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Was it like the same size and shape as a little finger or an index finger?
unidentified		Yes, it comes off of the little finger at the first joint after the knuckle.
unidentified		I see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, so what's your question?
unidentified		I have located here in Otoka County some ancient building bricks that are 750 cc's in volume.
		They weigh 5 pounds, 6.5 ounces.
		They were found below the dinosaur level.
		They are man-made bricks.
		I also have some human hand and footprints in red lava stone here.
		And I've also broken a certain genetic code that is encoded in the Egyptian hieroglyphs, which I would like to speak to you about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This whole area is a little off the subject of what we're talking about tonight, but it's an area that we're going to get into more and more, I think, as time goes on, because it's absolutely fascinating.
		Who are we and where are we really from?
		How long have we been here?
		And what does this world really mean?
		Those are all enormous, burning questions about the past.
		Thanks, caller, and we're going to go on to Joe in Chicago right now.
unidentified		Good morning, Whitley.
		Good morning.
		How are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very fine, thank you.
unidentified		And McDonald, how are you, sir?
		I have a question, and I'm posing it to both of you, and then I'll let other callers get through.
		I've heard a lot of things about Roswell.
		I heard a lot of things about the I-beams, the little beams with all these icons on them and things like this.
		I've heard a lot of this.
		There's one thing I haven't heard that I know for a fact, and I'm just curious if you ever have.
		You know the foil or the, I guess, part of the skin, the foil that, I don't know if Parts even had, I'm not sure.
		No, we don't know.
		Okay, there is something very amazing.
		I've heard many, many guests come on the show.
		I've heard many, many people talk about Roswell, but there's something extremely important that if anyone talked about that skin, whoever actually really saw it would mention, and no one has ever mentioned it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How do you know it?
unidentified		Well, I can't go into it right now, but I can tell you this.
		If I hear a guest on your show who says what it actually does, Whitley, I will definitely try to get a hold of you and put you in touch with something that I've seen.
		Okay?
		And this is not baloney.
		This is not any of that stuff.
		I mean, I've been in Chicago radio for years.
		And this thing, this skin does something extremely specific.
		And I've heard people say you can crumble it up and it goes straight.
		You can't cut it and all that stuff.
		That's not what I'm looking for.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I think I know what you're talking about.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The innermost layer of the ceiling of the vessel was actually the light source that provided complete, balanced interior lighting without any shadows.
unidentified		Talking about the adjustable adjustable.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you talking about the exterior skin?
unidentified		Right.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		No, I'm talking about the interior.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But I know, but the caller's question is about the outside skin.
unidentified		Oh, talking about the outside skin.
		Okay.
		Okay.
		And like I said, I've read all your books and Whitley are amazing books, you know.
		But there's one thing that no one has ever mentioned, ever.
		Well, okay, so that's why I'm talking about it.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		My curiosity.
unidentified		Let me tell you something.
		The person who told me this is probably known worldwide for a commercial product that he made.
		I can't go into that.
		But his brother worked in Roswell, and he was able to procure a piece of this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Coller, you're driving me nuts.
		I wish I could connect the dots with this one.
		But we're going to have to go on to the next call.
		It's Jose in Southern California.
		You're on the air, Jose.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, Mr. Streebert.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Streeber and Mr. McDonald.
unidentified		Mr. McDonald.
		Yes.
		I was wondering, could he elaborate a little bit on the propulsion system that powers the flight officer on?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Let me explain as basically as I can.
		This thing had several modes of flight.
		In an atmosphere, this thing would push itself along by making electromagnetic waves and waves of electrons move across the skin from the front to the back very fast, flipping it through the atmosphere at extremely high speeds.
		When it dove into the water and being neutrally buoyant because it was full of a fluid, it would collapse all of its electromagnetic fields so that it wouldn't contain an air bubble, and it would drop into the ocean like the fly-in sub from Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea, which also, by the way, answers another question from one of the earlier listeners.
		This thing could dive into the ocean and fly out again, literally like the fly-in sub from the older Win-Allen series.
		The thing was designed to be neutrally buoyant, and its whole shape was hydrodynamic as well as aerodynamic.
		The other thing is, if it wanted to fly slow and scan the ground, it would flip upside down on its back, where the three and a half to five degree up tilt to that tailpipe and to the trailing edges of the wings became a natural flap for the thing so that it could fly at a much slower speed and its glowing belly would not be seen from the ground at the same time.
		The thing would then flip over again, shoot off into space, and then slam back through the atmosphere like the wave riders that they've been experimenting with for the last 20 years that are built to the skunk works.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're coming up on another break.
		We're here with Phil McDonald.
		This is...
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		...the end of 5 a.m.
unidentified		seven days a week on Hot Talk 105.1.
		You're listening to Coast to Coast AM with Whitley Striver to talk with Whitley from west of the Rockies.
		Dial 1-800-618-8255.
		East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
		Now, filling in for Art Bell.
		Here's Whitley Streever.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is Whitley Striver.
		We're back with Bill McDonald and your phone calls.
		Fred in Minnesota, you're on the air.
		Hello, Fred.
unidentified		Yes, Bill.
		Two questions.
		One, where the UFO is based.
		And two, recently heard, supposedly through a highly placed Air Force source, that there are three spherical objects in permanent orbit on the dark side of the moon.
		I was wondering if you've heard of these and do they?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I've heard the rumor, but I can't confirm it one way or the other.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		As far as what was your first question again?
unidentified		Where do you postulate the UFOs are based?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, well, what I know about the Roswell ship is that it was able to access and amplify electromagnetic energy where it was close to the Earth, you know, from the magnetic field.
		And that it could do like zero-point energy outside of the atmosphere and outside of the influence of the magnetic field.
		But it would not have been able to make an interstellar trip.
		I don't think it could have traveled much further than the moon.
		So for that reason, I have to believe, based on the design of the ship, that it was supported by a much larger mothership.
		And that also is concurrent with a whole lot of the UFO sightings from the time of large cigar-shaped vehicles that seem to emit smaller vehicles.
		So for that reason, those two reasons, I believe that it was supported by a mothership.
		As far as where do aliens or any of the multi-species factions come from, nobody really knows.
		And I really am against all the different labeling of aliens and labeling of alien cultures and alien worlds and planets and the Pleiadians and the Venusians and all that.
		Because, you know, until John Q. Public has wreckage and cadavers or living emissaries right in the public eye under the watchful eye of the public news agencies, I really don't think we should be focusing on, you know, trying to create labels and stuff for all these beings when we should be focusing on trying to prove that they exist in a physical way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Eddie in New York, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi, Eddie.
		Hi, Whitley.
		I have some questions I'd like to ask your guest.
		I believe in UFOs, first of all, because I saw one many years ago on FDR Drive here in New York City.
		And this thing was about half the size of a football field, and it had brightly colored windows.
		And each window had a different color.
		And these colors in there would like knock you out.
		I mean, that's how incredibly intense they were.
		And they were all different colors.
		And I was wondering if this was the same kind of crap that was in Roswell.
		And also, I'd like to know whatever happened to the incident in Lake County television program that I saw a couple of years ago where the McPherson family was abducted, and it was video tape of the terrifying experience that they had on it.
		I don't know if you'd seen it or you're guessed it's the program.
		Right.
		I think that's right.
		You were interviewed on it.
		Whatever became of that family, and what is the story on that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I don't believe I was interviewed on that program.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think you're thinking of Stanton Friedman.
unidentified		Maybe it was Stanton Friedman, right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think that the program was not exactly a hoax, but I believe it was presented as fiction, as I recall.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know what you're talking about.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Now, that was presented as fiction.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was made to look sort of like fact, but it was actually a fictional show.
unidentified		Well, if that were the case, why did they present an update of, you know, a follow-up on it where they showed the they enhanced the videotape where it went black and so on and so forth.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That was part of the drama.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I think that was a UPN production, if I remember correctly.
unidentified		Well, I think the Clark did it, the Clark Productions.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, and it was shown on UPN.
		I think Yvonne Smith was even involved in that.
		She's a close friend of my wife.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Uh-huh.
		So I don't know any hoax.
		I don't know anything about it except.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I don't think it was a hoax.
		It was just a fictitious drama.
		It was a drama television.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Along the lines of the Orson Welles radio production.
		In other words, they weren't claiming it was real, but they weren't at the same time denying that it was fiction.
		In other words, it wasn't really a hoax.
		It was just sort of in between.
		It's not something I personally would have wanted to do.
		And your other question, Caller?
unidentified		Yes.
		Well, regarding to the UFO I saw, it had these brightly colored windows all around the middle of it.
		And also, when it disappeared over into Queens, and we got on the bridge maybe a couple of minutes later, the UFO turned into a great big ball of light in the sky, and it lit the whole area of Queens up.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		What year was this?
unidentified		This was in 19, I think the late 60s.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, okay.
		The UFO you're describing is very similar to an abduction case that was investigated for a long time by Bud Hopkins in New York City.
		The Linda Cortiel case.
unidentified		I'm not familiar with it.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's a lady that was abducted, and she was actually observed being abducted by observers on the ground, and she was floated out her window in a fetal position and then up into a craft that is close in color and description to what you're describing.
		And that particular vehicle might be of interest to Bud Hopkins, but is not in any way, shape, or form the same class, size, or any structure that the Roswell ship was.
		The Roswell ship was a winged vehicle.
		It was fat-winged, and it was small.
		It was only 32 feet long, and it was only 25 feet wide.
		It looked like a winged stingray or one of those wave rider crafts, those mini space shuttle designs that they're experimenting with now.
		Only it was all smooth, and it was one integrated unit.
		It was not assembled in any way like our spaceships and planes are.
		So the Roswell ship was a completely different class of vehicle.
		Okay, so you're looking at Roswell, a little sort of a scout ship without much range, but with a very, very highly specialized trans-medium ability, meaning it could go from vacuum to atmosphere to hydrosphere, back to atmosphere, and then out again.
unidentified		I see.
		All right, thank you very much.
		That really is for me.
		Thank you very much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to Rainbow in Susanville, Georgia.
		California.
		I'm sorry?
		Susanville, California.
		Rainbow?
unidentified		Yeah, good morning, gentlemen.
		Good morning.
		Whitley, to begin with, the first color may have had some points, but you're doing all right for a rookie.
		Guys, hang in there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Yeah, to Phil, let me ask you this.
		You know, I've read quite a bit about the Roswell crash over the last 30 years or so, and I wouldn't consider myself a particular buff, but maybe a student.
		One thing I've never heard addressed was, has there been a determination of the cause of the crash?
		Why did you?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		The most common scenario, the most believable scenario out of all of them is an upstroke of lightning from the ground that hit the ship, causing a major power overload.
		These materials were very indestructible by our standards, but when you're hit by lightning, there was an energy surge.
		It caused the upper left-hand dorsal side of the hull to implode and disintegrate, probably eliminating or sucking out two of the crew members because there were seven seats inside the thing, but only five bodies recovered.
		And the fluids, the thing fell toward the ground on the Corona Ranch.
		It hit the ground at the Corona Ranch, left a gouge and a small plug of debris, and then it skipped and tobogganed across 40 miles of hills until it slammed into the arroyo on what's now Hubcorn's Ranch.
		And there's a dip in that arroyo that it was obviously aiming to clear, but it missed it by 15 feet and it embedded in itself like a dart in a dartboard on the uppermost part of that slope high up.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you have another question?
unidentified		Well, no, just to continue with that, what evidence is there to indicate that upstroke of lightning?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's a lot of evidence, actually.
		Mainly, performance of the vehicles at the time suggested that they had the ability to sense any kind of rounds or anti-aircraft fire being directed at them or a missile, and they had the agility to be able to literally sidestep it.
		There was no ammunition.
		Radar was very primitive back then.
		The amount of energy that radar put out at any time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Bill, we're coming up on another break.
		That's the music coming in.
		My only comment about this is that I've been in airplanes that got struck by lightning twice, and they didn't blow up.
		So I wonder if that really is the explanation.
		We'll get back to this when we continue to take your calls after the break.
		This is Whitley Streeber standing in for Art Bell for Larry and Reno.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hi, hello.
		Mr. McDowns, your knowledge is incredible.
		Roswell, two questions to ask.
		Roswell, I've read about since I was a child.
		You were interrupted when someone had mentioned were there any occupants of the craft alive?
		I had read numerous accounts that they were all killed and then they had one alive that was taken and kept at Wright Pat.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Every one of my witnesses agrees on one thing above all else.
		There were no survivors and it wasn't possible for them to survive.
		Their skin structure was such that if exposed to open air, their body fluids would just leak out and spill out through their clothes onto the ground immediately.
		They were exposed to disease bacteria and decomposition bacteria.
		Their skin was not the kind like ours that protects us from that sort of thing when we're alive.
		So they were starting to rot even while they were still suffering.
		They were also suffering from extreme decompression sickness because of the low pressure of atmosphere versus a fluid.
		And so they died.
		The ones that weren't killed on the impact, one managed to crawl out and lean up against a boulder and go to sleep like taking a fiesta.
		And he died immediately there.
unidentified		I read about that one, yes.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Another one fell out halfway in and halfway out of the gash.
		All the other five, of the total five, the other three were inside the craft and none were alive, ma'am.
		They were on the ground less than six and a half hours and they were rotting as bad by the time my witnesses arrived at 6.30 in the morning.
		They were rotting as badly as if they'd been on the ground for three or four days in the heat.
unidentified		Wow.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So they were not like normal alien sort of issues or any alien normal in the sense that people who write us describe constantly seeing these creatures walking around in ordinary clear space.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		You know, Dave Jacobson's research says that a lot of them are in these fluid vats and they put abductees in the vats.
		I'm starting to think that maybe they wear some kind of skin coating when they're in atmosphere and that they dissolve it when they go back into a fluid.
		I think that because the Roswell aliens had opposable thumbs for the ones I call the mission specialists, I think that perhaps they had some kind of protection so that they could egress the vehicle to take samples, but that they were bred to be in a sterile fluid artificial environment for their entire life.
		They were bred to live inside that ship.
		The flight deck, the floor of that ship was like an aquarium filter, like a diatomaceous earth aquarium filter.
		It had tiny micro tubules in patterns reminiscent that you see in coral or on fingerprints.
		And the function was very similar to what you see if you cut open the inside of a kidney dialysis bag.
		The filtration system was very advanced.
		The flight deck was like the kidney of the vehicle.
		It kept their bodies clean.
		It kept them clean.
		Once the fluid had leached out during the final sequence of the crash, and remember it hit the ground twice, not once, that thing, it was losing its ballast, it was losing its momentum, it was losing its fluid, and they were starting to die even though they were shielded from the initial impacts.
		And they died horribly.
		But they died with the most angelic expressions of innocence on their face that these hardened World War II veterans had ever seen.
		They were expecting the horrible reptilian invaders from Mars.
		And what they got was these little organisms, these little beings that looked like innocent little children rotting at an accelerated pace.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's one of the most amazing descriptions of this I've ever heard.
		And for all of us, and I think I'm sure I speak for most of the listeners are wondering, could this be true in the absence of any documentation?
		And yet the way you present it in such detail and so quickly, it seems not like something that you have invented.
		It seems like something you're repeating, I must say that.
		Bill.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, I do lecture on the subject, and time is an element with commercials and with timetables.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's quite an amazing story.
		Let's go to Lynette in Southern Arizona.
		Lynette?
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi.
		Thank you for taking my call, and you're doing a great job, Whitley.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thanks.
unidentified		I have two questions.
unidentified		The first one being, Bill, how was the vehicle entered?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The vehicle?
unidentified		Well, the ship.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		You mean, why did it crash?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How did you get in and out of it?
unidentified		Yeah.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, well, there was a small hatch on the forward portion of the left-hand dorsal side.
		In other words, up top, there was a hatch toward the front that beings of their size could get in and out of real easily.
		The gash was so big and such a major portion of the wing was taken and stripped away in layers that a regular-sized human could crawl in right through the gash and crawl through the interior cabin and then crawl out again.
		You couldn't stand up in it, and frankly, it was tough to kneel up in it, even in the very center part.
		But, you know, and it was bone dry once that fluid evaporated.
		Makes me think that it was probably an oxygenated fluorocarbon kind of chemistry, something similar to Freon that evaporates fast.
unidentified		That's okay.
		That answers a couple of my questions.
		So anyway, the second one is, now you've just been talking about the craft that crashed at Roswell.
		Do you know of any other craft?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely, ma'am.
		I study a lot of aliens and a lot of UFO cases, both in my portfolio and in my research.
		You know, the standard disc comes in lots of different sizes.
		The Bob Lazar ship that the Tester Corporation did before my Roswell UFO kits came along is extremely accurate based not only on Lazar's story, but on other military people that gave John Andrews the heads up that this Lazar guy wasn't, you know, a liar.
		And same people who let him know that my data was accurate.
		And, you know, that's why he was supportive in me selling the idea to testers because I'm the one that brought the Roswell ship to them.
		The main thing is that there's lots of different vehicles, and some of them are not round, but they're kind of oblong-shaped.
		Others are kind of shaped like in a V, but with rounded tines or pods.
		The round ones are just one type, but they come in all kinds of different shapes and configurations.
		So, you know, I'm always discovering new spaceships, and right now I have in my own portfolio 60 or 70 different spaceship designs.
		They're all, you know, available either because they're public domain or because I was the one that did the composite on them.
		And I'm producing the artwork as fast as I can.
		And, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So when you say different ships, are you talking about the different classes?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Different species or different form different functions, or do you know?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, the larger ones obviously have more rooms in them, and they're like mobile laboratories.
		The smaller ones are almost purely scout vehicles.
		The really big, round ones that are like very, very thick frisbees are for carrying massive amounts of cargo.
		And the even larger ones that are very spherical are for maximizing the amount of interior volume for carrying whole hangars of these things plus whatever type of cargo that you'd want for the amount of power that you're expending.
		In other words, the economics of traveling between solar systems.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I see.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The smaller the vehicles, the more they're just for observation with just a couple of pilots or one pilot or whatever, and very little interior space other than just the relationship between the vehicle and its pilot, which provides each other life support.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		And I think the flight crew are like what we would call multiple brain nodes for the flight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, we're coming up on another break, and when we get back, we'll go to your calls.
		Wow.
		What a story.
		This is Whitley Streeber.
		It's Coast to Coast AM sitting in for Art Bell.
		My guest tonight is Bill McDonald.
		Bill's website is www.alienufoart.com.
		You can reach it either directly or you can go through artbell.com to the guest section to tonight's guest and get to him that way.
		It's an extraordinary website.
		Don't miss it.
		And an extraordinary man.
		Mike in New York, you're on the air with Bill McDonald and Whitley Streeber.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Regarding the Roswell craft and its occupants, we've all heard the discussions over the years about what, when, where, and how, but I was kind of curious as to is there why?
		Why were they here?
		What was their mission?
		Has there been any insight into that?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, actually, I spoken about that a little earlier.
		The atomic bomb testing that was beginning in 1945 through 1947 was why they came.
		If the Earth was a place where it was like an oasis in the middle of a vast desert of space, and all of a sudden these restless natives had weapons of mass destruction, the various factions that use that oasis would be extremely concerned and would definitely want to get reconnaissance on the matter.
		Another thing is there's a lot of mystery down in the oceans.
		There's a lot of minerals, there's intelligent organisms such as orcas and whales.
		There's lots of things in the oceans that would interest them as well.
		So between us with our nuclear weapons and whatever's going on in the ocean, there's more than enough reason to send a reconnaissance flight here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course, we don't know what the deep reason is for all of this persistent appearance of apparent aliens here.
		We've speculated about that for many years.
		I hope one of these days we will get to that.
		Sean and Phoenix, you're on the air.
		Hello, Sean.
unidentified		Hi, Willie.
		Hey, Bill.
		I do agree the story you're talking about does have a ring of truth in it, Bill.
		I just want to make a few comments.
		First of all, to answer Mike from New York, I do agree that the crafts were here for observing data.
		You know, they have a relentless obsession with whatever's going on down here.
		I just had a really kind of wild, fanatical, fantastical comment.
		Maybe you made a comment before about the beings looking almost sort of childlike angelic.
		And I was wondering what the chances, if these were so-called fallen angels from a very long time ago, you know, with incredible knowledge.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Sir, when I say angelic, I'm simply referring to the fact that that's the wordage that my witnesses use to describe the innocence of little children or little babies.
		I understand.
		But I do not put a religious connotation on this one way or the other.
		I don't subscribe to the theory of fallen angels.
unidentified		I understand.
unidentified		Well, just, I mean, if they were so old, the reason they decayed so fast would be they had to preserve themselves in whatever technological armor they were wearing and just the mass intelligence they had from prior knowledge to a connected I mean religious yeah you know I just that's all I had to say you know just kind of you know a crazy thought so thank you it's not a crazy thought it's actually a very accurate thought when you have beings that have advanced to a certain point they're no longer in touch with
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		the environment so they don't have all the protections against microorganisms, bacteria, especially of an alien world.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		So it's actually a pretty good observation, you know, just expressed in a different way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to our next caller, Pauline, Laguna Hills, California.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hi, Pauline.
		I'm from California.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Hey, she's local to me.
unidentified		Trying very hard.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I've done a lot of traveling.
		I've been around the world three times.
		I've been to 18 foreign countries for extended visits.
		I've been through a lot more than that.
		Plus, I've been through a lot of life.
		I've suffered a lot of lives.
unidentified		It seems so.
		You absorb so much, and you retain it.
		That's wonderful.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, you bury a lot of friends, and I'm now in a wonderful marriage with a wife and a child, and now, you know, I'm learning what it's like to have a hearth and a home.
unidentified		Wait until you have grandkids.
		I have a lovely grandson, Parker and Alexis, my little granddaughter.
		And they're so smart these days.
		You have to watch them every minute.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my son's Alexis.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's your question, Pauline?
unidentified		Oh, my question.
		I'm sorry.
		Bill, let me get to the question, because other people are holding.
		Have you ever thought of the designs that were in the vehicle?
		Do they resemble anything of the crop circles that are in England or in the United States?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That's an excellent question.
		The answer, unfortunately, is not.
		There's been a lot of connections made.
		made in movies, including the Roswell movie that I worked on, which was a drama as opposed to a documentary.
		But in reality, the icons are not related to the crop circles at all.
unidentified		How do they resemble the hieroglyphics of Egypt?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, they don't.
		That's the whole point.
		They resemble mathematical symbols in icons unfamiliar to any here on Earth.
		They were described as being close to only one kind of icon, and that was the icons that were found in Nazca, Peru, by some archaeologists who showed up at Wright-Patterson when my Wright-Patterson witness was there.
		And some archaeologist was telling some general at Wright-Pat that the icons were reminiscent of icons found on a clay stone, you know, carved in stone and carved on clay in Nazca, Peru.
unidentified		Oh, also, one more question, and I won't keep it any longer.
		The bone structure of the alien, is that concerning something that you have that you're going to rebuild, a face?
		Is that anything to do with what's coming on?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		The Starchild, we're already finished.
		There was two skulls.
		One was of an adult woman, and one was of a five-year-old child with a head almost larger in some ways than the adult.
		And the skull was shaped in such a profound way that there's the possibility that it could be a new species as opposed to just a profound set of birth defects from our own.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're going to get into that in much more detail in another show, man.
unidentified		Also, these aliens, do they look anything like we're picturing by people who were abducted by them?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		So far, my research seems to support the general trends that most of the abductees and the experiencers are claiming in the UFO community.
		And the reason I can say that is because I've talked to a couple of Aborigines, I've talked to some women from Paraguay, people who don't have access to the sci-fi channel or any of the popular media.
		And they're describing the same exact thing that the people in New York City and here in California and everywhere else are describing.
unidentified		That would make it so then, evidently, hang.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, ma'am, the body of the information is building and it seems to be supporting itself quite nicely.
unidentified		Well, thank you for your time and your wonderful knowledge.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's go to our next caller, Brannon and Reno.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Brannon?
unidentified		Hi, Lou.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, my question was for Bill.
		It was concerning Roswell.
		I was watching a special, and I happened to see a series of photographs about Jesse Marcel.
		And in two of the photographs specifically, you can tell there are, he's wearing different pants.
		He's got band-aid on one hand, and it's not a next picture.
		Heavier pockets.
		And I was wondering, were there two different press conferences or just the one?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		No, but J. Bond Johnson told me that there were several sets of photographs taken during his visit.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		And contrary to popular belief, he was the only photographer there.
unidentified		Was it over a series of more than one day, possibly?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		No, it was all done at one time, according to my understanding of what he told me.
unidentified		Ah, well, I mean, I mean...
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		I've met with him at Coco's a couple of times.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		He's the actual photographer who took those photos, which were archived at Texas A ⁇ M University for so many years.
unidentified		Just my only question.
unidentified		Thanks.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, our next caller is James from Southern Pines, North Carolina.
unidentified		Hello, gentlemen.
		Yeah, I was wondering, you said there were different types of ships, and I was wondering if there are.
		Doesn't that mean they have to communicate somehow, and that the models you have or whatever show any indication of how they communicate?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Well, in developing my particular composites of different spacecraft, I've come to believe that spacecraft skin is an emitter as well as a power plant.
		And that the outer hull of UFOs that are truly alien can emit radiation in any frequency and in any spectrum and in any pattern that they so desire.
		So that that would also include beaming optical communication, you know, like lasers at the speed of light to each other or, you know, different waveforms in different frequencies.
unidentified		Okay, that leads me to my second question, and I came to this conclusion through Whitley's books.
unidentified		If they can receive or send in any frequency, does that mean that a human through meditation can send out a beacon to somehow contact them?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now you're getting into the area where a lot of the CSETI folks like to experiment.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		And the answer that I have for you is I don't know because I'm not knowledgeable in that area.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thanks very much, Caller.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's go on to Scott in Oklahoma City.
unidentified		Good morning, guys.
		Mr. Trueberg, thanks for taking my call.
		I just had one question.
		Was there anything found on the craft or around the craft that might have resembled personal effects?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		There was very few personal effects other than these little wafers that looked like microprocessors or program command processors that could be inserted into little slots on the consoles.
		But other than that, everything pretty much morphed into and was part of the overall vehicle itself.
		And then the aliens would plug into their stations and the stations would wrap around their little bodies.
		And for that reason, there was little to nothing that could be considered separate personal effects.
unidentified		Okay, that's what I wanted to know.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's go on to our next caller then.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's Karen in Houston, Texas.
unidentified		Hi there.
unidentified		Good early morning to you, fellas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good early morning to you.
unidentified		Thank you.
		I've got a question for you.
		In the Sunday newspapers, sometimes there's this children's picture puzzle, you know, where you can change your focal length and you can see a picture on top of a picture.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		You're familiar with that?
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Yes, ma'am.
unidentified		All right, in using that same kind of changing the focal length, would that kind of help where people see like different shapes of objects in the sky or one person sees it and another doesn't?
		Or they don't see the same thing.
		And I know that we're told that there's a lot of things that are built in inside of us.
		And so we have the ability to adjust how we see things through the material eye.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, the second half of your question, I can definitely confirm.
		There's a lot of abilities and abilities to adapt to environmental changes and needs.
		That is a natural part of us because of our evolution.
		And the first part of your question, actually, the process where you focus a different way and you get a different image, that only works really close up.
		But anywhere further than, you know, a couple of yards away, and that process really doesn't work so well.
		And once you're more than, say, I don't know, 50, 60 feet away, then it wouldn't work at all because your eyes, just like a camera lens, are already set at the focal length known as infinity where everything is in focus beyond just a few feet in front of you.
		And in my opinion, optically, those kind of effects don't apply to this.
		It's not a good analogy in this case.
unidentified		All right.
		I have a family friend who was taught martial arts in Africa where he went to a private school by a fellow who fleed the Nazi invasions and all that during World War II.
		He was from another part of Europe, but he settled in northern Africa and he became a teacher and he taught physics and such.
		And then he also taught martial arts.
		And I know that you can use this same change in focal length, looking into the face of another person, say, sitting no more than six feet apart.
		And there's also a change that occurs that way.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		That close, that effect would work.
unidentified		Right.
		And there are images that will appear, and anyone can do this.
		And so I'm wondering if there's some high-tech alteration of the focal length of our eyes that might help us to see what we think we see.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now you're into an area where we would have to ask an optician or a specialist in the medicine of eyes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's a fascinating question, but unfortunately at this point, we're going to have to leave it because you have outstripped the expert's expertise.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Our next caller is Valerie in Sacramento, California.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hi, Valerie.
		Hi.
		I've got a comment and then a question.
		My comments regarding Art Bell, and I'm kind of upset with him, mainly due to the fact that he's always stating, you know, the government keeps things from us, and why don't they just tell us?
		Well, he's kind of keeping things from us, and why doesn't he just tell us his situation?
		Not that we can do anything about it, but a lot of us are just kind of held out in suspense, you know, a little worried.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's nothing I can do about that either.
unidentified		I know.
		I was thinking about it.
		What's your question right now?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's your question?
unidentified		My question is, I don't know how far either of you have looked into time travel, but you had stated earlier that there was about 60 different ships that you had seen or people had posted about.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's called compositing.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		In other words, I've put together about 60 different ships.
unidentified		Is it possible that you're not going to be able to do that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute.
		You've done this by compositing.
		That is to say, taking descriptions from one person and then from another and using a process detection to put that all together into a single.
unidentified		Right.
bill mcdonald ▲ ● ▼		It's a matter of matching statements and then creating an image from all of the different details from the statements that are the same or that fit together.
		And then you know that you've got different witnesses basically describing the same kind of ship.
		And then once you have a good picture of what that ship is, you draw it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, this is Whitley Strieber.
		I am talking with Bill McDonald, UFO investigator, detective, man of many, many different, under many different hats.
		His website is www.alienufoart.com.
		We'll be back in just a few minutes.

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