Richard C. Hoagland and David Oates expose "Kent," a NASA JPL whistleblower, as a fabricated disinformation agent after reverse speech analysis revealed coded phrases like "we deal with a snide bigot" and "Langley" (linked to DIA or rogue groups). Kent admitted his name was fake, claiming a shadowy organization—tied to NASA’s Surveyor Mars images—suppressed truths to "unravel Christian fabric." Despite his claims, Hoagland insists the data, not conspiracy theories, matters most. The episode suggests Kent’s story was a deliberate distraction from upcoming revelations, including April 25th’s Del Mar presentation and Friday’s Surveyor image release, implicating insiders like Mark Carlotto in orchestrated deception. [Automatically generated summary]
To talk with ourselves in the kingdom of my from east of the Rockies, dial 1-800-825-5033, 1-800-8255033, west of the Rockies, including Montana, Wyoming, Colorado, and New Mexico, 1-800-618-8255.
Don't love me now, you'll never love me again.
I can't do it, hear you say it, we'll never break together.
And if you don't love me now, you'll never love me again.
I can't do it, hear you say it, we'll never break together.
I'm Mark Bell, and this is Coast to Coast A.M. You may recall, at the end of last week, we had a call from a man who represented himself as Kent.
Actually, he gave us a last name at that time, which we didn't hear, Kent.
Kent wove a tale, a story, a very shocking story, of his employment at JPL, NASA.
He claimed that he saw, by accident, some very clear and sharp photographs of the Sidonia region of Mars.
Photographs that we could only dream about having.
Very, very clear photographs showing unambiguous artifacts, buildings, that sort of thing.
The story then continued that he was called by his supervisor and later that day, in the early afternoon, fired Canned.
And so then we went to work on a tent.
First, Linda Moulton Howe spoke with him for about two hours on the phone.
Then Richard Hoagland began a communication with him.
Both at that time, both Linda, who said at that time she thought it was solid as a rock, and Richard Hoagland said 98%, we believe the story.
So we then endeavored to get documentation from Kent regarding his employment at JPL, trying to verify various aspects of his story.
What you are about to hear is the result of an investigation into his story and into Kent.
This involves the use of reverse speech.
And I am sure the people at NASA will be gratified to hear that what was done to them after they appeared on this program is now going to be done to one of their detractors, namely Kent.
So in a moment, Richard C. Hoagland and David John Oates and the investigation into Kent.
The Bajan Free Play Radio.
What could be more appropriate for Mother's Day?
That number again, 1-800-458-7134.
Alaska, Hawaii, and Canada.
Call area code 918-687-0404.
Or on the internet, it's www.americangoldrose.com.
All right, now the alleged case of Kent.
We'll call it the case of Kent.
As I said, Kent was first interviewed by me on the air.
All of you heard that.
I presume you heard it.
Then there was a follow-up conversation with Linda Moulton Howe that lasted about two hours.
And then a sort of ongoing sporadic communication with Richard Hoagland in New Mexico.
And we kind of went silent on the air about the whole Kent thing until we figured out what was going on.
Well, I think perhaps you should tell us what you know in the first person.
In other words, following the interview that I did on the air, the audience would not be aware of the communication and the concerns and what Kent said when he would call you and that sort of thing.
Well, obviously, when you sent me the facts from Kent and did the interview, I was very interested for obvious reasons.
If this, in fact, was taking place, if we had a bona fide leak, someone who had seen something that was genuine and who was concerned for his safety after the events that transpired during the interview, anyone would be concerned at both the human level and also the professional level.
So the evening of the interview, I placed a call to the motel where he was staying.
And I had obvious connections, like to set that up with one phone call.
He agreed in our conversation to stay in touch.
He seemed very surprised that I called him.
In fact, he didn't seem to know who I was at the initial conversation, which I felt was a plus.
He did say he had been to a library after this incident when he got to Ohio and that he had looked up The Face on Mars, which was a book written some years ago by anthropologist Randolph Opozos, which was a description of our first investigation of SRI.
And he then connected my name with, you know, obviously the investigation in that document.
But other than that recognition and the idea that I would call him in the middle of the night in a hotel room, it seemed perfectly copacetic.
It seemed perfectly the way someone who was concerned for things that they had gotten in way over their head about would be responding.
We left it that he would call me, and he hung up.
24 hours later, roughly midnight the next night, this was what, Friday night you did the interview?
Saturday night about midnight, the phone rang, and it's Kent.
And he's much calmer.
He said he'd had time to think about things, that he was trying to arrange to get documents to me from his Wells Fargo friend who had put him in touch with you.
And that he had left in such a hurry he hadn't taken anything with him, and that he was going to try to have his friend go in and basically get the required materials so we could document his employment.
He was not at this point giving me or apparently you his correct name.
And this kind of bothered me even then, which is why I was holding out that 2%, because if you want to go public, it's like being a little bit pregnant.
You either go public or you don't go public, but you can't kind of halfway go public.
And I won't use his name because he may want to write this under his own name.
The point is we had a number of different people investigating from a number of different directions, calling JPL, calling people in the personnel department, calling subcontractors, looking through the website.
The bottom line was we could turn up nothing on a Kent Smith.
More interesting, my friend in Hawaii turned up by going through the mailing departments and the supervisors in charge of couriers and all that, that there was no documentation sent either to the UN, to Langley, or to NASA headquarters on the 14th, certainly not photographs and certainly not by FedEx.
So that part of his story, apart from his identity, did not apparently check out.
And because my friend's pretty good and was able to reach several different levels and talk to people who were just there doing their jobs, it seemed increasingly unlikely that there had been some kind of curtain or screen dropped around this whole thing.
And it became more likely that there were major problems with Kent's story.
In the meantime, I think it was Monday night that he called and he was in a really desperate panic.
In fact, he was in such a panic that I know you talked to him and you can confirm that he sounded really on the edge, right?
And he said at that point, he said, I'm not going to go to Washington.
I'm not going to see anybody.
I've just got to hide.
I've got to get lost.
You know, they're going to get me.
They're going to get me.
And he went on to describe the activities of the Defense Intelligence Agency at JPL.
Now, this rang kind of a bell in my alarm system because he had moved from dumb courier who sees photographs he's not supposed to see to someone who now was telling me that there was a lot going on at JPL, there was military influence, people were being watched, and that there were other missions involved besides Mars Surveyor.
Well, as a matter of fact, he was so afraid for his life, we should tell the audience, that you said, look, stay off the phones, without notice, show up at my home.
One of the developments was David Oast was on vacation and traveling around the country.
And I made a copy of the interview on Friday night.
And I was not able to set exit to him until he arrived back on Monday.
So it was there Tuesday morning.
Today is Wednesday of.
Tuesday morning, David got his copy of the tape and immediately proceeded to start to analyze it.
In the interim, we had these other people doing due diligence, including my friend Tammy Taylor at UPN, who had offered to physically go to Kent's friend and pick up the documentation, his W-2s, his payroll slips, all that.
I became increasingly concerned when weird things kept happening.
His friend wouldn't call him.
He wouldn't show up.
He couldn't get down to the studio.
In other words, more and more excuses for doing the obvious to keep this person safe began turning up.
So by the time Kent called tonight, I not only was suspicious for a variety of, shall we say, gumshoe reasons, good, plain investigative technique, but I also had, as an ace in the hole, a preliminary overview of a transcript that David Oates had prepared at great cost to time and effort and all that because he just got back from this trip.
It's incredibly time-consuming and intensive, and David, you know, really deserves a gold star for coming through because, frankly, if I had not had David Oates reversals to confront our friend Kent with, we would still be in limbo and not know whether this was real or some big shaggy dog story.
But the fact of the matter is that when he called me tonight, he sounded much more coherent.
Now, this is a pretty fancy thing they're doing, folks, because I asked Richard, he got a call from Kent, who was on the run, and you got caller ID there, and I asked you at the time, you may recall Richard, what did the caller ID say?
And you said it showed a New England area code.
That meant Kent had gone from Ohio to New England.
Yeah, see, everyone has to understand the reason you and I were, shall we say, somewhat predisposed to believe that Kent was telling us a version, a close version of the truth, is there is other evidence being developed behind the scenes, which points to the fact that JPL is not giving us the full picture on these pictures.
Well, they may or may not be because it's that old phrase, birds of the feather, flock, etc.
The information I'm alluding to is not reverse speech.
It has to do with some new information developed and communicated to me just in the last half hour from the time we decided to do this from Tom Van Flander.
Well, before I get to Ken, what Tom is working on, and there's a very quiet set of briefings that are going to be continuing now tomorrow and the next day in Washington, is information indicating good hard forensic evidence possibly leading to proof that the raw picture we saw two weeks ago was not a raw picture.
All right?
I'm talking hard science.
And I can't say anymore right now, but it's pretty damn good evidence.
I've seen it.
My evaluation is it really could be a smoking gun that we're not dealing with raw data.
Now, it's against that backdrop that I'm having these continuing conversations with Kent, right?
Because he is telling us a lot of people who are going to work in the streets, right?
unidentified
So there's a long reason to believe that they have to find this truth, or without just a short term.
The part of my life was a cold night.
And I had this preaching from David earlier in the afternoon, so I knew, I understood how I worked with that, so I did work.
So he probably said, I'm coming.
I said, well, we are going to hear the fact that I'm waiting.
And then he started telling me about his brother and the documents and the fact that his Wells Fargo friend turned out to be a JPL security friend and that the reason they had come down on him, remember the two feds I told you about that supposedly greeted him back at his apartment after he tried to access these documents?
He said, well, they're really after him because he took some pages out of a log.
And I said, wait a minute, Ken.
I said, just hold it there.
I said, this is a scam.
I said, this is an inside job.
You're being put up to this.
You're not a totally willing participant.
But this is a number to basically attack Bell's credibility and mine.
Well, there was this stunned silence in the phone booth.
It was like I'd thrown a hand grenade into the small confined space of the phone booth.
And then Kent said, after a very long pause, how did you know?
And I said, because, I said, we reversed you.
And he said, oh, and I can't use what he said.
Oh, shoot.
It was a little stronger.
And then he said, he started telling me, he completely changed.
He said, you know, he said, I've got to tell you, you know, I work for, and he named an agency that he ostensibly worked for.
And he said, this is part of the disinformation campaign.
And it is targeted at Bell.
All right.
Well, absolutely.
And he said, we didn't think you'd catch on this quickly.
I said, Kent, actually, at this point, he'd given me his, quote, real name, which we've agreed we're not going to use on the air tonight because once a liar, twice a liar.
If he's picked some other poor slob out of the phone book, we don't want people to go after him.
You know, I said, look, I said, we're really all on the same side here.
You know, there's a constitution.
Does anybody above you, behind you, and back of you, putting you up to this, understand that all we're after is the truth?
And then that's when he said, well, he said, my phone card's running out.
Can you call me back?
And he gave me the number of the phone booth he was in.
He hung up.
I dialed him back within three seconds, and the line was busy.
It was busy for a minute and 37 seconds.
And then when it rang, it rang through, and he wasn't there.
So obviously he was calling his superiors, and then he obviously split.
And I don't think we're going to hear from Kent again.
Well, as I said, he's got my private number, as you well know.
And if he wants to call right now, you and I both know damn well he's listening to this.
If he has any defense for what's coming up and what's been said already, then he should be calling my private number and giving me a number where I can call him back and get him on the air.
Well, the thing that's important to remember here is that the way we caught him was a combination of good old-fashioned detective work, things that did not add up.
You know, if the intent of this was disinformation to destroy my credibility, that's a pretty pathetic goal because, Richard, I'll put anything on the air.
You know that.
That's me.
I'm an open forum, and I'll put anything on the air.
And I do.
And when I put it on the air in the first place, I didn't warranty it to be the truth.
Simply his story.
So if he was a disinformation agent, part of a government agency trying to discredit me, you know, it's like ridiculous.
It's just ridiculous.
Nothing there is going to discredit me.
I will continue to put interesting stories on the air without warrantying to anybody that it's absolutely the truth unless I know it to be.
I think one of the problems is that there are people in NASA, and remember I've always separated the small group of what I call the rogue element from the larger body of the honest folks that really believe in the same things that we believe in.
That rogue element, I think, is so no prejudice in their analysis of what it is that we do and other guests you have on that talk about similar investigations.
And they have not followed Enterprise very carefully either.
But again, I want to go back to David.
Without David's forensic tool, and last September when David and I were on stage in Pasadena, a lot of people asked me, and a lot of people asked him separately, why are you guys getting together?
What can you possibly have in common?
And what we have in common is we're both at the cutting edge of some very controversial research, which circumstances have now brought together.
And the tool that reverse speech turns out to be, regardless of the interpretive value, merely as a forensic fingerprint tool, in this case, nailed Kent to the wall.
In other words, you really do conclude, and I almost hate to get David on the air before the top of the hour, but you do conclude that this was an attempt to destroy Michael or your credibility or both.
The old idea that if you throw enough spaghetti on the wall, some of it will stick, I think more than destroy, it was an effort to distract.
And the real essence of this mission is what's on those images.
And there's astonishingly powerful confirmatory evidence of extraterrestrial ruins tonight on Mars that are up on the website that can be reached through your website or going directly to Enterprise.
And if people don't lose focus and they keep looking at those images and the new analyses, and we're going to put some very important things up there in the next few days.
That's where we should be following the trail.
This political hanky-panky, this kind of grown-up men playing kid games in a sandbox, running around the country on phone cards, calling us anonymously from various phone booths in the middle of the night.
Well, he did say tonight, flat out, he said, you're getting really close.
And the reason I think we should take that seriously is as David is going to show you, this individual, Kent, was not the outsider, the poor dumb courier brought in for a kind of a gopher job ten months ago.
But from the pattern of the reversals, he is as part of the in-crowd in this rogue group as any of the other people that we have reversed or analyzed.
And that's the fingerprints that gave him away, which puts, in other words, we need to put into context what he said and the other things he revealed, because again, some of it could be disinformation, but the reversals show a pattern which is not disinformation, and that's how he got caught.
Once somebody has lied, I'm hesitant to believe anything at all they're going to say.
And I would like to offer one more time, just in case.
I mean, we all know Kent's sitting out there, probably with a nervous tick, listening to every word of this, anticipating the reversals that are about to come up.
And Ken, if you have any possible defense whatsoever, anything that you would like to get off your disinformational chest, you've got my number.
Call it from a phone booth or whatever.
Give me a number, and we'll call and get you on the air.
But you don't expect him to take me up on that offer, do you?
I don't do that kind of thing off the air and then come on the air and tell the audience a story.
I let it all hang out here on the air, whichever way it goes.
I always have.
That's my way.
And that's what I guess somebody out there simply doesn't understand.
I don't care what goes on the air.
As long as it's interesting, as long as it pursues ultimately the truth, I don't care.
I don't care.
And I'd just soon have him on here trying to defend himself to see if there's any possible substance or reason he would like to offer up for what he did.
And if the entire goal was to get to me, it was sure a poor attempt.
If it was to get to you, it was a poor attempt.
Because we're not about to accept that face value.
I certainly am not.
Anything anybody says, allowing it on the air is one thing.
Believing it and adding weight to it by saying I believe it is another.
Well, you know how process-oriented I am, sometimes to the point of pain.
And what I find heartening about this whole process is we've been able to lay out for the country, for your audience, the beginning of the story, the middle of the story, and now I don't think this is the end of the story.
And when we come back, we will do those reversals.
When the IRS takes on a taxpayer, and they do that frequently, usually a middle-class guy or some small business owner, the IRS wins a documented 85% of the time, which means that you have a 15% chance of winning.
They win by using fear, intimidation, and the option of a long, drawn-out audit because they have resources.
Taxpayer, endless resources.
So you need a strong defense, but you can't go get that defense after you have been sent an audit notice.
It's the kind of thing that you've got to do now.
Kind of like trying to go get insurance after your house burns down.
Tax Resources is a wonderful company that will provide you at a very reasonable cost, host tax advice all year long, and then more importantly, if you receive an audit notice, they'll do it all.
They will make phone calls to the IRS, answer, respond to the letters for you, and even make personal appearances.
Now, this service is $295 a year, and it is tax-deductible on top of that.
How do you beat that?
That's an awful lot of peace of mind for a very little amount of money.
The number is 1-888-82AUDIT.
Now, you can call that number right now, even here in the middle of the night.
1-888-82A-U-D-I-T.
All right.
When we get back, we will do the reversals that we've been talking about on Kent.
Should be very, very interesting with David John Oates.
And continue with Richard Hoagland.
And one more time, Kent, if you're out there, you have my private number.
Call it, and I'd be glad to put you on the air.
We'll be right back.
unidentified
Call Art Bell in the Kingdom of Nigh on the Wild Guard line at Area Code 702-727-1295.
Kent, the alleged JPL employee who claimed he was fired after viewing photographs, and the long saga of discussions between Kent, Linda Malton Howe, and Richard Hopeland over the last, well, going on several days now.
And tonight we turn the table a little bit.
We did indeed reverse a couple of NASA fellows who appeared on the show.
And tonight, and in moments, you are going to hear reversals of Kent, the man who claimed to be a JPL employee, but according to Richard, is more probably a disinformation agent trying to discredit me or Richard or both.
Now, I tend to believe things that I can prove that I have proven to myself.
And I have proven to myself that the Jacobs Ultra Team Ignition System is everything it claims to be.
Zero.
And check out their webpage at www.jacobselectronics.com.
All right.
Richard C. Hoagland, are you there?
I'm here.
All right.
That's one.
Let's go to this line and say, David John Oates, are you there?
And point of fact, it was very interesting for me to hear the whole story.
As usual, Richard kept me in the dark about everything, and I am just stunned that what I found correlated with the suspicions that Richard were already having without my knowledge at all.
And this is about the third or fourth time Richard's done this to me now.
And I picked up the tape about 10 minutes into the interview.
I was on a time crunch.
I'd just come back from vacation, and I really went straight to the heart of the matter.
unidentified
So this is the first forward transcript I picked up.
Put the cap onto the Federal Express cylinder, seal it, take it down to the lady where the Federal Express machine is, and then she fills off the labels, puts them on there, and puts them into the outbound box for Federal Express.
The thing this very first reversal revealed is that Kent was not the dupe, the victim, the guy who just tripped over something, but was much more conscious and cunning and planning than anybody in his position telling that story should be.
You know, this is actually how I have worked with police and investigative agencies in the past.
I was telling Richard, this is not uncommon to me.
I've found reversals before in the cases I've worked on.
The investigative officers have then gone and confronted the suspects and said, we have information in our possession that says this and this and this and this.
And I have seen people crack just like that.
And when Richard told me this guy cracked and admitted, I wasn't in the least bit surprised because it's in total keeping with the way I've seen reverse speech used in the past before.
The information is found, it's taken back to the suspect, he's confronted with it, and more often than not, he breaks down and confesses.
Like, say, if you went inside and had a sledgehammer or something and was knocking out the wall, there was like a rock of, you know, there was rocks that was coming out from that wall.
That one is related to the photograph, but it's a future tense possibility.
It's not a present-tense reality, if you understand what I'm saying.
I would say, if this is indeed talking about the pictures, he has not seen them if they indeed do exist, but he may.
I don't know.
The transcript does never go to the reality of these supposed photographs at all, not what I've done so far.
I'll have the whole transcript finished in time for Richard and my presentation at San Diego on Saturday night.
But there's nothing in here about the reality of the photos, but there are reversals, like I say, that a lowly courier should not have knowledge of, and a clear plan, and I think a disinformation campaign.
Okay, well, I didn't play that one because there was a word I was unsure of, but maybe if someone can listen to the reversal, they can pick that word out.
I actually think it's a, he's mentioning someone's name.
So let's run that.
I'm picking and choosing what I play, Richard.
unidentified
One of the photographs that we looked at was, okay, now picture World War II, okay, picture the bombed-out cities of Germany.
Back now to Richard C. Hopeland and David John Oates.
And gentlemen, I have a fax here from a ham in Richmond, Virginia, fellow ham, who says, look, what was said was they handle Houston.
Now, I don't know if that is, in fact, what was said or not, but we were wondering, and if that, in fact, what was what was said, it would be very meaningful.
Now, keep in mind that Houston was the day after the event that he was allegedly talking to us about occurred.
On Tuesday, on the 14th, the photos came in from the second strip over Sidonia.
As they were being downlinked to Earth at around noon, Clinton and Golden and a congressman from the Houston district, congressional district, were giving a series of short speeches to the crowd at the Johnson Space Center in Houston.
And they kept talking about a manned mission to Mars.
We've all had interesting disagreements about the meaning of certain of these phrases.
But what I find striking is the commonality of the same theme in Kent's subconscious with other NASA people who we believe are aware of a hidden agenda.
And, you know, based on my 15 years of research with reverse speech, I know that groups of people or peer groups tend to run the same reverse speech patterns.
You can actually tell family members in reverse by the commonality of their reversals.
And so what we've got here on a preliminary analysis that was done just this afternoon under great pressure is a series of reversals that do not deal with what is saying forward.
It shows a clear undercurrent, a hidden motive, a hidden agenda, a man who knows far more information than what he should know, working in a conspiratorial, I mean, a conspiracy, the only word you can say with we, they, you, your, I. Sure, a lot of that.
Let me give out an 800 number for people who want to get tickets to David and my presentation, which will, in addition to these reversals, will have some pretty astonishing enhanced pictures from the actual surveyor, including from the third photo that's being released on Friday morning.
And that's tickets to the Art Belt Chat Club appearance of you and David on this coming Saturday on April 25th, better known as Richard's Birthday Bash.
Where and when?
unidentified
That's in San Diego in the Del Mar Hall of Theater.
Now, Richard, again, for the rest of the audience that may have joined at midnight, you armed with all of this information, and I guess a script of all of this, when Kent called you earlier today, confronted him with this, and he broke down and virtually confessed.
He claimed that he was part of a special disinformation unit of the Defense Intelligence Agency, and this had been a plan crafted to disinform you and me and the American people who listened to us, and that he was tired of the games, and the reason he was coming clear is because he was struck by the fact that I'd be willing to put myself on the line and have him come here to keep him safe.
And I really want to emphasize this.
When we talk about other folks and other groups and other agendas, we're really all human beings.
And I think the reason that he simply leveled with me tonight is because I dealt with him as a real person who was in trouble, who needed our help.
I can only assume that somebody somewhere or some bodies are very displeased with me and with you.
And this was a little plan to try and get us in trouble, try in some way to get us to grasp this and confirm it on the air as though it is our own belief, so as to discredit us.
That's the only thing I can imagine the motive would be behind it.
Well, with regard to the first image of the face on Mars, my hand is way up in the air.
Hell no, I'm not satisfied.
I wasn't satisfied that night.
I'm not satisfied now.
And as a matter of fact, the people who have interpreted the photographs, including Mark Carlotto and everybody else concerned, even Malin really wasn't satisfied and admitted that there was, what was the word he used?
Haze, whatever.
No, hell no, we're not satisfied.
Of course not.
Let us get a picture that Kent claims he saw, one that looks roughly right down on the face.
Well, again, now, given our understanding of who this person is and his involvement in something much deeper, the way you hook people with a lie, as you know, is to mix it with the truth.
Sure.
And what we found out as part of David's work and as part of our own investigative work, this was a lie concealing some truths.
And the important truths are still to be unveiled, so all I can say is stay tuned.
Well, look, my attitude is once a person is known to have lied to you, that you should disbelieve based on that, whatever else they tell you.
However, it might be interesting if Kent really is coming clean based on what you said out of sort of a guilty conscience because you offered him safe harbor, then maybe he would like to let us know who really is behind this.
The story you told on the air during, I don't know, what was it, 45 minutes total or something, I thought was very credibly told, very credibly told, and to be so credibly told must have been carefully rehearsed and planned.
unidentified
You have to know that me and my team, my team and I, for those English people out there, are very trained professionals.
And we do this for a living.
And it's in the American people's best interest that we do this.