Boris Said, a former real estate investor turned pyramid researcher, reveals the Great Pyramid’s king’s chamber emits an F sharp harmonic (8 Hz)—matching Earth’s and human body frequencies—suggesting advanced ancient acoustics. His 1996 Shore Expedition uncovered a polished black granite sarcophagus lid beneath the Sphinx, hinting at a 25-degree angled "anomaly" and missing pharaoh mummies pre-2550 B.C., despite pyramids dating to ~3500 B.C. Orion’s star shafts align with Giza’s chambers, but legal disputes and permit revocations (like Shore’s $150K-funded dig) stalled findings. With modern tech, suppression risks backfire, yet global institutions may fear paradigm shifts. Said’s upcoming 45-minute documentary aims to spark interdisciplinary debate, questioning whether Egypt’s "Hall of Records" holds suppressed truths—or if authorities already accessed them. [Automatically generated summary]
From the high desert in the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening or good morning as the case may be across all these many time zones.
From the Tahitian and Hawaiian Islands in the west, all the way eastward over Clanover country, us, to the Caribbean, in the U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north, to Santa Country, at the Pole, even beyond all that, worldwide on the internet, this is Coast Coast AMI Martell.
Good morning.
Boy, is there a lot going on?
Let me give you a brief sketch of what's coming up this week on Coast tonight.
We'll learn what's really been going on in Egypt.
Because Boris Said is here, and he's finally ready to speak.
And he'll tell you why it has taken him this long to go public.
Boris Said tonight will be talking about the pyramids, a subject very, very close to my heart.
Since in about a week, I'm going to be there.
Tomorrow night, it'll be David John Holtz, who, as a matter of fact, is up in Alaska right now, and more reverse speech.
As a matter of fact, you can look forward to reverses on Mark Fuhrman, Brother Iron Mohammed, remember Brother Mohammed?
The Queen on Princess Die.
Area 51 calls, including that wild call that may have knocked us off the air, and the president himself, President Clinton.
That'll be tomorrow night with David John Oates.
Wednesday, it'll be Professor of Theoretical Physics at New York University, Michio Kaku.
Professor Kaku back once again.
And then Thursday, it'll be Guy Finley, who will be here talking about, in some ways, the quickening, the intimate enemy.
And that would be us.
Friday, Friday night, Saturday, it'll be Bob Lazar.
Bob Lazar is a physicist who says he worked at Area 51, back engineering certain portions of, you know what, circular craft that we would know as UFOs along with Gene Huff.
So it's going to be quite a week this week.
That is what lies directly ahead.
Well, actually, directly ahead lies Boris Aite.
He'll be here in a moment.
I've got to update a number of things.
Daniel Brinkley continues to be better by the second.
He's up eating solids and feeling great.
So it looks like the prayers out there worked.
Thank you all.
Daniel Brinkley, much better.
As a matter of fact, somebody's got to hold the guy down because the minute he starts feeling better, he gets ready to go.
Now, let me give you a sense of what is on the website tonight.
We rushed by overnight mail photographs from Boris Saeed down to me, and I scanned them of some of the things he's going to be talking about in Egypt.
Those photographs are on the website right now, and we will be describing those photographs for you and what it's all about.
Now, I rarely post ghost photographs because there are not a lot of good ones.
I've only had now, I think, two or maybe three good ghost photographs over all the years, what I consider to be superior.
And Carol Gardner, I think that's correct, I hope that's correct, Carolyn Gardner of Alcajone, California, sent me a photograph taken 112695 at the Mount Palomar Observatory in Southern California.
They actually belong to a neighbor of hers, and they were taken, she and her family were visiting there.
She's a little girl in the red plaid poncho.
You'll see two little girls there, and they're, of course, up at an observatory, and it's a typical picture you might expect somebody would take, a memento.
But I'll tell you what.
You look above the girl's head on the right, and you tell me what you see.
If this isn't a ghost photograph, I don't know what it is.
Sure looks like a ghost to me.
An awfully good photograph.
So we've got a new ghost photograph on the website.
The website is about to get intensely busy, so if I were you, I would get up there as quickly as possible.
And there are a couple of award pictures up there.
One is my wife with her picture and her awards.
That incredible lightning picture that she took through a double rainbow.
And you can actually see we brought the photo home, and we've got all the awards, and we took a photograph, and I'm very proud of her.
And you'll see that.
And then there is somebody named Clem Gellen in St. Paul, Minnesota, who sent me her award photograph, and she has constructed the funniest thing you've ever seen in your whole life.
Entirely made out of garden tools.
Garden tools.
She has constructed a chupacabra, which won an award at a fair.
And I laughed so hard when I saw this that I could not resist.
So I scanned it and put it up there.
It is a, well, it looks like a, yeah.
It Looks like a purple people eater or something.
Anyway, you decide for yourself.
It is one of the most ingenious things I've ever seen anybody do.
That photograph is up there for you to see right now.
Then there were a couple of, and I want to thank the gentleman, I don't think I have his name.
I'm going to have to punch this up myself, who sent these photographs in from Florida, which I scanned of a couple of funnel clouds.
And absolutely, actually, this is David Gardner from Cape Carl, Florida, who sent a couple of incredible, incredible photographs of funnel clouds in Florida.
So there you have it.
Now, let's see what else.
Oh, yes.
This is going to be a very, very big week on the rogue market.
My stock is now going through the roof, so I am prepared to make you rich.
Rich, rich, rich in rogue dollars.
You will have more fun on the rogue market.
Now, as you log on to my website on the left-hand side under daily stops at the bottom, you will see the rogue market.
All you've got to do is click on that, go over there, fill out a form.
You'll get $10,000 rogue dollars.
I'll fill out yet another form, and you get $5,000 more.
Then go to the listings area.
Click on market and then listings and go to talk radio and you will see all the major talk hosts across the U.S. And I would urge you to buy Art Bell stock.
Now, the trick is buy it early because the price is going to go through the roof.
We're going to go over $10,000 this week.
I guarantee you, by the end of the week, it'll be over $10,000.
As a matter of fact, over the next couple of days, I'll bet you it goes over 10,000.
So if you buy early, that's how the market works with a rising stock.
You buy early, and then as everybody else buys, yours becomes worth more.
Now, you're not risking any real money.
Stop sending letters to me asking me where I'm listed on the NASDAQ or the Dow Jones.
This is the rogue market, not the real market, but it operates just like a real market.
As a matter of fact, if you make enough money, they will give you a prize.
And this is your opportunity to make some real money.
So buy Art Bell stock on the rogue market.
There are about eight or ten different reasons to go zooming up to the website.
A brand new and really spiffy ghost photograph.
I want your feedback on that.
The rogue market, of course.
The pictures of the twisters, which are outstanding.
The award photograph of my wife.
And, well, let me see.
What have we got?
Boris Said directly ahead.
So let me just sort of update you on a couple of things going on in the world.
We will get Boris on here in a moment.
Headlines, Clinton denies wrongdoing.
What would one expect?
President admits wrongdoing.
President Clinton says neither he nor the vice president engaged in any illegal activity in their fundraising during the 1996 campaign.
Maybe someday we'll do a show about headlines the way they really ought to read.
What would it read instead of Clinton denies wrongdoing?
Clinton urges test ban ratified, a worldwide test ban treaty.
Nice if you can do it.
Try and get China to agree.
NASA begins a shuttle countdown.
They're going back to Mir.
Despite, again, very severe troubles on Mir, we're going to put an American on board.
It is an experiment in mortal terror.
There's no question about it.
An experiment in mortal terror, and I really don't think that we should be putting another American on there, but ho-hum.
Troubles arrived in threes Monday at the Mir space station, just days before the U.S. space shuttle Atlantis is to be launched to visit the ailing station.
First, Mir's main computer failed for the third time in three weeks.
That problem followed by two brand new ones.
Failure of a carbon dioxide removal system and the appearance of a mysterious leak of brown fluid.
Those on the Mir, two Russians and American astronaut Michael Fole, were not in danger, space officials insisted.
And as planned, NASA's countdown for Thursday's Atlantis launch proceeded.
So there you have it.
We're going to send another American up to this experiment in mortal terror.
One other very sad note.
The passing of Kathy Keaton Guccione.
Bob Guccione's wife has died.
One of America's most innovative publishing executives has died at 58 years of age.
She died, I understand, in surgery.
And I am so sorry.
I am so sorry, Bob.
She died Friday, September 19th at Mount Sinai Medical Center in New York City, where she recently underwent a surgical procedure to bypass an obstruction in her upper digestive tract.
She, of course, spent the last two and a half years of her life fighting to get a fair trial for the inexpensive cancer treatment drug, hydrazine sulfate.
So not a direct, I guess, a connection with her cancer or perhaps an indirect connection, but we interviewed her, Kathy Keaton Guccioni.
Born in Greenwich, Connecticut in 1932, Educated at Deerfield Academy and Princeton University.
He speaks Russian, French, Italian, Spanish, and English, and is presently learning Japanese.
He is the writer-producer of Secret Chamber, a one-hour television documentary special which covered the opening of the rooms, or room rather, under the Sphinx, which was located during the Mystery of the Sphinx research in 1992 and 3.
From 1992-3, executive producer and writer of the 1994 Emmy Award-winning NBC TV feature documentary, The Mystery of the Sphinx, hosted by Charlton Heston.
Remember that?
In 1988, the director-producer of a TV documentary, The Voice of Africa, Conversations with a Zulu Witch Doctor.
In 1987, executive producer-director of TV U.S. Home Video, Dolphins.
In 1983, producer and co-writer of a TV industrial film entitled America First.
And he has a very rich history indeed.
He dislikes the use of the word metaphysics.
Says, neither do I think this vast area of interest is in any way, in quotes, supernatural.
I believe we humans are gradually evolving into a greater awareness of the world in which we live.
And I'm not going to read all the rest of this, but he has a very rich history, has spent much time in Egypt, Nepal, South Africa, Russia, Central and South America, and the Philippines, so widely traveled, and most recently a member of the shore expedition.
And as I said at the beginning of all this, if you will now go to the website, my website, for any of the many reasons I gave you a little while ago, you will see the photographs that we are about to discuss.
Boris, I am sitting here looking at a picture and an announcement of Zahi Hawass, who of course is Director of Antiquities.
And this regards a 1998 conference coming up on the Great Pyramids at Giza.
It says here, I'm going to read it to you, Ancient Secrets Revealed.
The question of who built the pyramids and how such enormous monuments were constructed have long been a source of fascination.
And everything from X-ray bombardment on the structures to experiments in hoisting two-ton limestone blocks have been tried to find explanations.
Through his discoveries of a tunnel under the Sphinx, air shafts in the Cheops Pyramid, and of the tombs of the pyramid builders, material still largely unpublished, Dr. Zahi Hawass is now in a position to unravel many of the mysteries surrounding these edifices.
So in other words, Zahi is suggesting that he is ready to tell all, particularly with regard to X-ray bombardment discoveries.
And I just thought I would read that to you as sort of a setup to what you are going to tell us.
I did a lot of automobile racing, and I was on a couple of American Olympic bobsled teams and was in the real estate business.
And then through a chance meeting, really, with Dr. Jim Hertok, oh golly, 12 or 13 years ago, I wound up in South Africa running a film project to interview a Zulu high priest, a high senussi, or witch doctor, if you like.
And that's what got me into this business.
From that, I guess I went to filming some dolphins in Florida with some sports photographers and was involved there with some studies of Autistic Children.
And we wound up slowing the dolphins down with super slow motion so the kids could see them better and that sort of thing.
And then I ran into John Anthony West, who quite by accident, who I hadn't seen for 40 years, we'd sort of been friends when we were teenagers.
And I wound up with him in the original Sphinx project, The Mystery of the Sphinx, which was in Egypt in 1990 through 1993.
I would think a lot of the audience got an opportunity to see that.
I did.
I remember that.
The Mystery of the Sphinx, what an incredible program.
All right, see, I chewed up the first half hour, so look, we'll be clear next half hour.
Take a rest, and we'll come back and really bite into all of this.
Boris Aid is my guest.
We're going to be talking specifically about the pyramids, what he thinks is inside, what part he played in the shore expedition, and why he is now no longer a part of the shore expedition.
Believe me when I tell you, this will be an interesting evening.
unidentified
Egypt, I'm Art Bell, and this is Coast to Coast A.M. You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from September 22, 1997.
Coast to Coast AM from September
Coast to Coast AM from September 22, 1997.
22, 1997.
Coast to Coast AM from September 22, 1997.
You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
Tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from September 22nd, 1997.
Certainly has great significance to our founding fathers.
There's all that stuff about the pyramids.
I have my own theory, which I'd really like to share with you, which I was hoping I'd be able to share in this shore expedition film, which now seems like it's not going to happen.
Okay, my feeling is this, in a large sense, that there were ancient civilizations that were as advanced or more highly advanced as our own.
You can call it Atlantis, Lu, Lemuria, whatever.
I believe there were ancient civilizations.
And I don't believe that those people, those advanced scientists, hid their secrets from the world like a dog buries a bone.
I don't think that you've got to dig in the ground for buried treasure because that's what the pirates used to do.
And I happen to believe that the pyramid, for one, is an example towering 450 feet above the plateau of advanced science.
There are countless mathematical formulas expressed in the pyramids.
Astronomers claim, and Robert Boval wrote a brilliant book, The Orion Mysteries, about the alignment of the air shafts or star shafts with the planets of Orion, where the pharaohs allegedly made their home in the afterlife long before, long ago.
We found an even more amazing thing when we were there.
We took Tom Danley, who's a sonics expert, he's a NASA consultant, to do some testing in the king's chamber of the Great Pyramid, because anybody who's been there knows there are some very strange resonances, and if you lie in what they call a sarcophagus, which I don't believe is a sarcophagus, and you hum or you chant, there are certain notes which seem to connect you with the pyramid.
It's like you just get into kind of an altered state if you lie in there and chant.
So Danley went in and did some measurements.
And we took sensors and we placed them in the five chambers above the king's chamber.
And then we put a huge set of amplifiers and woofers in the king's chamber and began to test resonances.
Danley found that, and I think he's been on your program, Danley found that there were certain resonances or vibrations or musical tones, it all means the same thing, which were resonant in the king's chamber and which were reinforced by the structure of the chamber.
And these five notes, according to Danley, formed a chord, and musicologists like Jim Hertock and composer Fatheed worked with these notes and they found them to produce an F sharp chord.
Now I'm not a musicologist.
I'm a filmmaker.
I'm a documentarian.
But ancient texts, according to Jim Hertock, relate, Egyptian ancient texts relate that F sharp was a harmonic of the earth.
In other words, it was a vibration in harmony with the earth.
And other teachers and spiritualists have suggested that F sharp is a harmonic of the human being, of the body.
What happened was when Danny got back to his studio in Chicago and examined his recordings, he found that there were some vibrations resonant in the chamber which were below the range of human hearing.
And they occurred even when he wasn't making any sound.
To give the audience an idea, when we come and go from commercial breaks, we play a 25 hertz, what's called sub-audible tone, which causes the radio station's equipment to run the commercials and so forth and so on.
And then we play another one when we come back.
These are sub-audible tones at about 25 Hertz.
What we're talking here about, which the human ear really can't hear unless you amplify it greatly, we're talking about even much lower frequencies.
The frequency thought to be the frequency of the very earth itself, which was around 8 Hertz.
Now, the interesting thing about it is that when we raised those notes, three or four octaves, so that you could hear them, lo and behold, they produced the same F sharp chord.
Now, where did the sound come from?
What Danley believes, and you've got to remember that the pyramids used to have smooth sides, Danley believes that the ambient wind coming off the Sahara Desert, blowing across the ends of the air shaft, created a flute-like effect and created these vibrations.
That little bit of air through those tiny eight-inch shafts exciting 2.5 million blocks of granite.
It seems absurd, but in Danley's own words, he says, it may seem unlikely, but the sounds are there.
And that was the example, precise example that I planned to use in my film, was we've got a guide with an Egyptian Coca-Cola bottle blowing across the end of it.
Carl Monk has done some amazing theories, and there are formulas that describe the circumference of the Earth and the location of the pyramids of Teotihuacan and all sorts of wonderful things.
So there are all of these sciences expressed in this structure, which we persist in calling a tomb.
I believe that its sonic significance was that it would produce an altered state.
I think they're doing some work at Harvard and also at Stanford, which we're trying to get our hands on at the moment.
But if you subject the human body to a bombardment of certain key low vibrations or low frequencies for a week or two, it may tend to produce an altered state, make the body more accessible to healing, may even create out-of-body states.
I think it's very strange if you stop to think that if the pyramids were in fact built in 3,500 B.C., for the first thousand years of their existence, not a single mummy of a pharaoh was ever found in Egypt.
I believe the Sphinx is older only because of the brilliant work that I think Robert Schop from Boston University did in identifying the marks on the outside.
But the problem with the pyramids is you don't have an outside.
I mean, if you ask me for an opinion, I'd think they were older.
But assuming they were built in 3,500 B.C., the first Pharaoh's body that was ever found, I believe, was in 2550 B.C. So where were they all before that?
One might imagine that that trip would be made while what we know as the soul would still be within the body, which might suggest they might try to get them in there just prior to death.
Yes, or possibly they might just put them in there when they were ready to go and create an out-of-body trance and send them on their way.
There have been suggestions, according to Jim Hertock, there's some suggestions that the pharaohs were tested on their knowledge of the universe before they were allowed access into the afterlife.
And so perhaps when the Pharaoh thought he was ready, he just went and got in the box and the priests made their sounds and away he went.
You said in the beginning, if you go into the Great Pyramid and you lie in the sarcophagus and you spend time, that you will begin to enter in some sort of altered state.
Well, I've had a lot of very strange experiences there.
I had one which was witnessed, which was documented, and that was that we were in there for the night, and I was there with another person.
And I had some Tibetan chants that Dr. Hertok had given me, and I was playing them on quadrophonic speakers in the room.
And I had a sensation that I was going out through the top of the pyramid.
And I can remember, and this is 1992, and we were in the middle of our Mystery of the Sphinx show, and I had the distinct impression that I was walking in the rain.
And I thought, well, now this is strange, you know, that I must be dreaming about my own show, because, of course, we'd stated that rain had damaged the pyramid, damaged the pyramid and the Sphinx.
And I wound up, of all things, playing backgammon in a cafe at the foot of the Sphinx.
There's a cafe where a lot of friends of mine played backgammon late at night.
And I wound up playing backgammon with them.
Now, you know, some people go back and become put and common and other people go get the dance with Nefertiti.
I went and played a little backgammon with my buddies.
And when they woke me up, I was very disappointed to come to in the pyramid.
And I thought to myself, well, I slept through my first night in the pyramid.
What a more.
And as we were walking down the stairs, my companion said, you know, what did you experience?
And I said, well, I went for a walk in the rain.
And she said, that's ridiculous.
It's July.
Well, when we got outside the pyramid, that was the first shocker because it had rained all morning, all night.
And on into the morning, there were puddles everywhere.
Really?
Absolutely.
And you can believe this or not, and I'm not sure that I believe it or not, but when I went to the down-to-the-backgammon game that night, I remembered something about having an incredible run of doubles from my dream.
And I thought it was a dream.
When I got down there, there was a wooden table, which is still there today.
You can see it next week when you go.
In which my friends had carved the run of doubles.
Two double sixes, a double four, and two double ones.
And they had carved it into the table and said they'd never play the game with me again.
No, not at all, because I think everybody believes there is something to this.
And I think that there is some sort of key with low frequencies.
And it would make sense to me that if that is not some simple burial place for people, that it is indeed attached to the earth for a very specific, as you said, scientific purpose.
And we need to discover that.
And that would suggest that in some ways there was a civilization in some way far advanced from where we are right now in a different sort of way.
If there was this great civilization prior to ours, something the Christians will get very angry if we consider seriously here, and they built this instrument, this scientific instrument, literally into, in combination with the earth, then what may lie ahead?
In other words, what may we yet discover?
What secrets do you think the pyramid may yet hold and the Sphinx?
Well, certainly they must have a lot to do with energy.
Because if you look at the size of the stones, we in the Mystery of the Sphinx interviewed a crane operator who couldn't imagine how, even with modern cranes, you could place 200-ton stones from a sand base.
They must have had something to do with energy.
If you go to Baalbek in Lebanon, the stones weigh 1,500 tons, and they're piled three and four courses high.
So, obviously, they must have known something about it.
So there must be a knowledge there having to do with energy, having to do with an awareness of where we are.
Somebody told me an amazing thing today.
I mean, we're one day after the autumnal equinox, if I've said that correctly.
It was yesterday.
It is apparently a fact, though I don't know it, that from outer space, if you look down at the earth on the day of the spring and the autumn equinoxes, on those two days, as the sun is leading the pyramid of the sun at Teotihuacan, it is beginning to shine on the pyramid of Giza.
And only on that one day.
Now, I don't know if that's true or not, but it's been confirmed to me by a couple of people.
All right, there is some thought that within or beneath the Sphinx, the paw of the Sphinx, may lie chambers in which something called the Hall of Records may reside.
Now, that would be, or I guess is said to be, a sort of library documenting all the technology of this previous civilization.
I know there's a chamber there because I've seen it on two different scientific instruments.
In 1991, Dr. DeBeke documented a 30-by-40-foot rectangular anomaly about 35 feet below the surface under the paws of the Sphinx.
And he did that with seismic technology.
We went back there in the spring of 1996, and Dr. DeBecki, with ground-penetrating radar confirmed that there was in fact a rectangular anomaly under the paws.
This was part of the Shore expedition or it was the first time was the West, the John West expedition.
So in other words through ultrasound and then now through X-ray as well there's confirmation in both technologies that there is a chamber indeed under the Sphinx.
I'm perfectly willing to accept that there's a library down there, but I think that I still believe that the obvious clue to the existence of an advanced technology is 500 feet above the earth in plain sight.
I mean, you can walk in there for $6 and have a look at it and measure and test to your heart's content.
There's nothing secret about it.
We just don't understand how to figure it out yet.
Like Rubik's Cube or something, you know, if you don't know how to do it, you can't do it.
And I guess we are just, you know, a lot of what we're talking about is conjecture regarding why they're there, how they got there, and what they're for.
I think the thing, the one thing that's at the bottom of all of this is that we've got to look at it.
I think that to simply dismiss something that awesome as a tomb and ignore the fact that there are pyramids in England and Japan and China and Tibet and also Central and South America is doing somebody a disservice, doing us ourselves a disservice by not investigating these things.
How can you imagine, since you mentioned that, Boris, that I can certainly imagine in Egypt, for some reason that we might not imagine, they came up with the concept of the pyramids and built them somehow.
All right, but the rest of the world.
I mean, the rest of the world then was not even connected.
So how could pyramids appear across the rest of the face of the globe?
Well, it's a great question if we're going to view the thing three-dimensionally.
I mean, I heard you say that my good friend Michio Kaku is going to be on Wednesday night.
He's a great believer in the fact that you cannot understand the universe if you look at it as three-dimensional.
If you look at the drawings on the plains of Nazca and try and imagine how they could have been done by somebody on the ground, so many of the monuments on the world, all over our world, had to have been conceived from a height.
Otherwise, how did they manage to make them?
How do they manage to do these huge drawings that span miles, acres?
I understand that there's a way now of establishing that there's some sort of cosmic radiation and you can measure that if you get the right kind of samples.
But again, that's over my head.
What I'm advocating is that we look at these things and we look at them and not hide them and not pretend that they're not there and above all, not keep this knowledge from people who are curious, who are interested, who'd like to have opinions on it.
Well, I certainly agree with you regarding Professor Kaku, who will be here Wednesday, that it is arrogant for us to believe that we can understand all looking at things in simply three dimensions when there may be many, many more, which will bring insights and instant understanding when we can get to those dimensions.
And one has to wonder if what we've been discussing about the frequency and the altered states produced inside the Great Pyramid might not be the gate to get one to that understanding.
Well, every civilization before ours has believed in something of that sort.
The Zulus and the Aborigines and the Maoris and the Native Americans, the Hopis, all believed that there was a way of getting to the center of the earth or in any event to get out of here, to get into another dimension.
And Art, I've got to tell you, that there is so much hurling of rocks and epithets and what one guy said and somebody else said, I don't know.
John seems to have a knack for making people angry.
I don't want any part of it.
I had an expedition with John.
It was, I thought, quite successful.
It didn't end so well, but we certainly approved a point in spite of all the acrimony that there was between the Egyptian officials and John West.
And I think that we established that there was probably a chamber under the Sphinx.
I think Dr. DeBecki would rather use the word possibly, but in any event, certainly there was something worth investigating there.
And I think that we established pretty clearly that a case for an older Sphinx, which is what we set out to do.
And it entertained a lot of people, and John Won and Emmy, and so forth.
To make a long story short, I walked into Zahi's office in August and I said, look, you know, I have an apartment here in Egypt and a horse, and I'd like to know whether there's something I can do to make this up to you.
And he said, let's do another film.
And I will be your Egyptian host and whatever.
What would we do a film about?
And we had a very affable lunch.
And I suggested to him something I'd always wanted to do, which was a documentary about legends surrounding the Great Sphinx.
I mean, there are legends of King Solomon.
There are all kinds of wonderful legends.
And Zahi said, yeah, fine, let's do that.
And how can I help you?
And I said, well, I'd like to bring a crew over and we'll film you talking about legends of the Sphinx.
So he said, yes, I'll do that.
And I went back to New York and I raised $50,000 from two investors and went back to Egypt with a crew.
And we filmed Dr. Hawaz talking about pyramids and tunnels and all sorts of wonderful things.
And at one point, he said, well, where, Boris, do you think this thing will be shown?
And I said, I think it'll be a cable show.
And he said, well, why not a network?
And I said, because I think if you want to have a network show, you've got to have some extraordinary piece of news, something that will get their attention.
So Dr. Hawaz took us out to the rear of the Sphinx one day with our crew following along obediently.
And he crawled down into a hole under the tail of the Sphinx, which we've since been in and done radar studies and found nothing, I might tell you.
But there's a huge sort of an excavation inside the rump of the Sphinx, which has been all shored up like a mine shaft.
They've been prowling around in there.
And Dr. Hawaz allowed himself to be filmed standing in the bottom of that hole.
And he said, it's a great quote.
He wrote it.
I wish I'd written it.
He said, even Indiana Jones wouldn't dream to be here now.
We're now inside the body of the Sphinx, and we don't know where this tunnel leads, but we're going to open it for the first time.
So with that in hand, with that statement in hand, and some lovely sort of images of the Sphinx and the pyramids, I came back to New York and set about selling a documentary.
And one of the networks did, in fact, express some interest.
And they said, look, if you're really going to open this thing, sure we're interested.
So at that point, I talked to Dr. Shore, who I knew had a great interest in this, and who I'd talked to before I went the first time and told him what I was going to do.
And Dr. Shore said, well, we'd like to get involved.
And I think the next amount of money we needed was $100,000.
And he said, well, I'll put up the $100,000.
And we entered into a joint venture agreement.
And the deal was that he was going to be in charge of all science, and I was going to do the filming.
In April and early May, Dr. DeBecki, with ground-penetrating radar, confirmed what he'd found in 1991 with his seismic work.
He confirmed that there was, in fact, a chamber under the paws of the Sphinx, that it looked to be about 30 by 40 feet, and it looked to be about 35 feet below the surface.
But of course, we're dealing with shadows and disturbed Earth.
He also, around the back of the Sphinx, discovered a tunnel about two meters wide that seemed to be about 15 feet below the surface, coming out of the tail of the Sphinx and heading in a westerly direction up under the causeway towards the Copra or Chefron pyramid.
Now, at that point, Dr. Shore requested permission to do some diamond drilling and drill a hole down under the paw.
And that was refused.
They said, oh, no, you know, you can never drill under this.
You might damage the Sphinx, et cetera, et cetera.
And basically, they agreed to take it under advisement.
But Dr. Shore was running the permit end of things, you see.
So I was just told, well, wait, and we'll have it for the next trip.
So we came back in November.
And in November, we brought Tom Danley with us.
And took Tom Danley.
That's when he did his resonance experiments up in the Great Pyramid.
Because I felt that the whole show shouldn't just hang on.
If we get underground and there's a tablet that says made in Atlantis, well, Eureka, nobody will believe it anyway, right?
So I thought we needed some other corroboration besides just the records.
And so Danley did his work and we filmed all of that and we got some wonderful footage.
And also we found an interesting thing.
I had been told, and I've got to go back away, Art, here, in 1992, one of the plateau guards for a princely sum of, I don't know, $20 or something, took me late one night down a well.
Under the causeway, under the causeway leading from the Sphinx to the Cheffron Pyramid.
And it was about halfway up the causeway.
Okay.
But the story that I was told by an old Nubian guide was that the well had been dug in 1946, after the war, in a search for water.
And that there were two little Nubian kids down in the well chipping away with hammer and chisel, which is how they dug in those days, when the bottom of the well collapsed, and they fell about 30 feet.
When the dust had settled and they lit their torches, they found that they were sitting, to their horror, on a sarcophagus.
And there was a tunnel, they said, leading down towards the Sphinx.
And that part of the story may have been exaggerated.
And in that tunnel were other sarcophagi.
And they were terrified, and they ran up out of the well, and they said, we're not going back down there, and there's no water anyway, and the thing was abandoned.
Now, again, that's hearsay, but that's what I was told.
So in 1992, when we went down that well, at the bottom of the iron steps, which were pretty rickety, let me tell you, there was this cavern that was, I would say, filled to within about six feet of the ceiling with blackish water.
I've got the first photograph, which shows the pyramid in the background, at least a portion of it, somebody's red car, and one, two, three, four gentlemen there.
So what we did at the time, in order to basically conceal the location, because everything was all secret, you know, we were sworn to all this secrecy.
Sure.
We filmed these guys rappelling down that shaft, which actually led nowhere.
The well is accessible by a fairly rickety and dangerous ladder.
And the well is, I would say, 120 meters west and slightly south of that shaft.
Hold it right there, and we'll pick up when we get back.
All right.
Now, the first photograph you'll see is of this home crew standing by this immense cavern, which you can readily see would be hidden by those normal tourists around the Great Pyramid.
And the second picture you'll see is of somebody rappelling down the side of this immense cavern, which Boris has just told us leads absolutely nowhere.
When we come back, we'll find out exactly where we're going next.
unidentified
This is Coast to Coast.
You're listening to Arkbell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from September 22, 1997.
Music I've got a black magic woman.
Got a black magic woman.
I've got a black magic woman.
Got me like I can see.
That is a black magic woman.
She's trying to make it come about me.
Ooh, you can dance.
You can dance.
Having the time of your life.
Ooh, you see that girl.
Watch that scene.
Digging the land and free.
Ooh, you can dance.
You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
Tonight's an oncore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from September 22nd, 1997.
Maybe I should stop you for a minute there, Art, because those are the two pictures that we basically took and we've talked about because we didn't want people to know where this place really was that we'd found, because we hadn't found it scientifically.
It had been a legend.
It had been something we sort of stumbled on.
The rest of the pictures are absolutely accurate and depict what's going on, but I thought maybe at this juncture I should tell you why I'm suddenly talking about all this after two years of silence and why the need for secrecy in the first place.
And when we got to the bottom, now this is 1992, in the dark, I had brought a rubber flashlight and a mask with me, and I brushed away some of the muck and slime that was on top of the water, and lo and behold, it was as clear as Perrier under there.
And much, I think, to my guide's horror, I went in the water.
Well, I went in very gingerly because of all of the sediment that it aroused.
And I dove down, took a couple of deep breaths, and sure enough, to the right or to the east of where we were standing, I had a compass with me, was what looked to be a pile of stones.
Now, you remember the legend, right?
They piled some stones up over the tunnel to protect the dead and covered over the top of the sarcophagus and got out.
There were clearly some signs of disturbed stones down there in the bottom of that well.
And I just filed that knowledge away and we went on and we did our film and we left and so forth and so on.
And now the scene shifts and we're back in 1996.
And I said, when it turned out that we were not going to be allowed to drill a hole down into the room, and when it turned out we weren't going to be able to dig down into the tunnel at the back of the Sphinx, I said to Tom DeBecki, our radar guy, listen, what happens if we can get this radar of yours down 100 feet below the surface?
Will it operate?
He said, of course.
And I said, well, let me go show you this well.
So we went in the well, and I'm sorry, DeBecki was not with us in November when I did this.
What I did was I took Danley down there in November.
And we went down into the bottom of that well, and lo and behold, the water had receded about 15 feet.
And there were two sarcophagi in an intermediate level of the shaft.
When you descend that shaft, there is one level about 80 feet down, and then you go down another 40 or 50 feet to the bottom.
And at the 80-foot level, there were two disturbed stone sarcophagi, outer casings, with the sarcophagus missing.
And there was also an old iron pump, and there was, you know, obviously stuff had gone on there.
But I had not seen that on my first trip in 1992.
So clearly something had been taken down, a wall or something.
They had done some exploration.
Because when I went down in 92, it was just a well shaft without this sort of second tier.
Well, what happened was when we went down in November, when we went down in February, when we went back, and this is the expedition we've got to talk about later, in clearing a level area to put our tripod, I mean, it's like the old story.
It sounds corny when you say it.
But we were setting our tripod up so that we could do a sweep of the room with the Cine camera.
I mean, we were beside ourselves, and so we took, then we immediately, we sort of wired Mr. DeBecki up.
We had like a boatswain's chair to make it a little easier to get down.
And we sent Mr. DeBecki and his equipment and his son down into that chamber and turned the radar on, and lo and behold, there was no sarcophagus under the lid.
And the lid is almost two and a half feet thick, according to Mr. DeBecki.
It's colossally thick.
We did a minimum of digging.
It was illegal to dig.
We didn't want to do any digging.
We didn't want to upset anybody.
So we had the radar, and he said the thing is more than half a meter thick.
What he did find under this sarcophagus lid was a two and a half meter wide, quote, anomaly, unquote, with a domed ceiling.
All right, so in other words, if I'm guessing, and I talked to you earlier about this, you said they frequently would use sarcophagus lids to hide things.
Well, now this is according to our good friend and scientific consultant, Dr. Jim Hurtock, who was with us from the Academy of Future Science.
He said that in the ancient texts, there were a lot of references to the fact that in those days, because there was no such thing as grave robbers, they would often conceal a sacred chamber or a secret tunnel or something by putting what looked to be a sarcophagus there so that nobody would think of disturbing it.
I mean the digging we did was not more than three or four inches.
I mean we really didn't do anything.
We just cleaned off the lid.
I mean that was covered over every night and you know that was not an excavation.
I mean that was something we did with our hands and with screwdrivers and you know it was not a it wasn't an excavation.
But again you've got to understand my relationship with Dr. Hawaz has been very straightforward.
He has denied me almost nothing in the past two years, has been very forthright with me, has allowed us to film even up above the king's chamber, which is of course the subject of the Hoagland Tunnel.
And so I didn't want to have a, I didn't want to get on the wrong side of the Egyptians.
Yeah, I was asking Dr. Hawaz to dig a hole into the tunnel.
Now, at that point, it all came apart.
It turned out, to my horror, and I tell you, I never thought I was this naive, but apparently Dr. Shore's permit to explore had been revoked at the end of 1996.
I don't know specifically, but there are two or three different stories.
One is that all the permits were revoked because of all the trouble with Hancock and Baval and West.
I know for a fact, because I saw it, that there was a day in which Dr. Shore was engaged in doing a little illicit digging behind the steeler in front of the Sphinx, and I believe that one of the inspectors saw it, put a very quick stop to it.
Again, I was there and saw it, and I don't want to categorize it either way because you can't dig 35 feet through solid rock with a chisel, but he certainly was digging, and they certainly saw it.
I don't know why they revoked his permit.
I don't know why he didn't tell me they revoked his permit.
But I can tell you that Garrett Griffin, my director, and I, were down there in that well with all our photographic equipment, and we were illegal, and we were flabbergasted.
So at this point, it might be reasonable, Mr. Shore certainly knew his permit had been revoked.
Of course.
So, or expired, not renewed, whatever the case.
And so it might be reasonable to presume that Dr. Shore, with you already there, was going to let you proceed as far as you could proceed before they stopped you.
Now, what I did subsequent to that, and it's a matter of record, was I delivered a letter to Dr. Hawaz in which I gave him my word that I didn't know that we had no permission and offered him that footage.
I said this footage will not be released, publicized, or made use of in any way by anyone without your specific written permission to do so.
And I offered to give him the footage because I've been in Egypt for 10 years, and I just, I was appalled that this had happened, and we didn't know about it.
Now, at that point, you know, we're sitting in a bar that night, Garrett and I, we're putting this whole story together, and I don't know if this is the appropriate time or not to tell you this, but I mean, this was when I began to think that we had at one point a working relationship with Graham Hancock and Robert Boval, and we were using some of their footage in our original promo, in fact.
And then apparently they refused to sign a secrecy pledge.
But as far as I'm concerned, all bets were off when I found out that we were operating on my permit.
I mean, I got in trouble because I at one point, and I think it came out on your show, I asked my friend Richard Ogland, I told him that if we did in fact get permission to open the tunnel, I'd invite him to be my guest there.
We didn't want, I didn't want any, I'm trying to sell a television show, and I didn't see any need for secrecy.
But, you know, in retrospect, it's 2020 hindsight, right?
I began to realize what had happened.
What you should know, Art, at this point, probably, is that in February, before we ever left on this ill-fated trip, we had a meeting at the Fox Network.
And we had been negotiating with Fox to air the show.
We'd been negotiating in good faith with them for about three months.
And when we showed up at the final meeting, which was a week before we were to come to Egypt in February, Fox presented us with a contract, a 54-page contract, which had half a dozen paragraphs in it that basically took total control of everything away from me.
Took control of the script, of the content, of the subject matter, of everything.
It basically made the film a work for hire and gave control to Fox.
The payment that we were going to get was going to compensate Shore almost completely for all the money he'd put in.
And my partners and I were going to wind up with one-third of half of the net profits.
And as you know, in Hollywood, there ain't no net ever.
Now, at that point, I have to tell you, we were not in this thing for the money.
I mean, we've never really been in it for the money because with the kind of work that's involved here, you could make three films.
So it wasn't like we were holding out for a better deal.
I didn't want to sign the contract because the film was 90% in the cap.
And I didn't see any reason to allow anybody to take editorial content.
That's right.
Because I was afraid that it would wind up another Geraldo's call, where they would not use the stuff in the pyramid, the Sonic stuff, or any of that good stuff.
And it would just become a treasure hunt.
So I would decide to call 3-1-800-618-8255 and basically, you know, sell out, I guess, my other investors.
I, at the time, I probably should have thought a lot more about it than I did.
But I just said no, and that was the end of that.
And I figured, well, it's a disagreement between two associates.
So now, apparently what Shor had told the Egyptians, and I can only surmise this, was that we had to come over because we had a deal with Fox and we had to finish the film.
My guest is Boris Saeed, and I say, an expert on the pyramids, telling us the story of the Shore Expedition.
Quite a story it is.
And his split with the Shur Expedition.
And we're talking about the pyramids, what they are, what they might be.
We'll get back to them in a moment.
Coming up this week, folks, for those of you just joining this hour, aside from Boris tonight on the pyramids, tomorrow night, David John Oates, reverse speech on Mark Fuhrman, Thiron Mohammed, The Queen on Princess Dai, The Area 51 Calls, and Bill Clinton, coming Wednesday, Dr., actually Professor Michio Kaku, professor of theoretical physics at New York University.
Thursday night, Friday morning, Guy Finley on quickening-like topics.
And then Friday, September 26th, this will be the last interview he'll do in a long time.
Bob Lazar, a physicist who claims to have worked at Area 51 back engineering, craft said to be at Area 51.
So it's going to be quite a week, and then I will be in Egypt and elsewhere.
And we'll get back to the subject of Egypt in a moment.
All kinds of things up on the website for you to see.
The pictures that we are discussing tonight with Boris are there.
There is a new ghost photograph that'll knock your socks off that's there, and I don't post many ghost photographs.
Take a look at it, please, and let me know what you think.
There are photographs of a chupacabra made up of garden tools, which is one of the more innovative things I've ever seen in my whole life.
My wife's photograph with all her awards, and many more things.
The rogue market, of course, my stock is now going through the roof, headed toward 10,000.
If you want to get part of it and be part of it, go to, again, my website, which I'll give in a moment, at www.artbell.com.
Didn't even take a moment.
And go to the rogue market and buy some Art Bell stock.
because if you buy now, by the end of the week, you are going to be rich, rich, rich.
We have had two hours of fascinating insight into the pyramids, into Bora Said's involvement with the pyramids, into his involvement with Zahi Awas, and then the Shore expedition.
At the beginning of the discussion, we speculated about what the pyramids might be.
And Bora Saeed, like myself, thinks they may in effect be a Stargate.
I just got this facts.
Art, did you have a chance to read Project Gateway to Orion's Analysis of the Orion Pyramid Theory?
I sent it to you about two weeks ago via Priority Mail.
Boris said he wasn't sure when the pyramids were built.
Well, the research Larry Hunter and myself have done shows the Orion complex, the Giza Pyramids, and the surrounding pyramids must have been built prior to the 4th dynasty.
Now, Project Gateway to Orion, that sounds an awful lot like a stargate, doesn't it, Boris?
That is what you believe the pyramids may be is a stargate?
unidentified
Well, that isn't exactly what our research pertains to, although there are certain people who within our product who do hold those beliefs.
What we're doing with Project Gateway to Orion is trying to get a better understanding of the topographical representations of celestial bodies.
So what Baval did in the Orion mystery is he correlated the three pyramids at Giza to the three belt stars in the constellation of Orion.
So now what Larry Hunter, my research associate, Park, realized, he was a navigator.
And by taking global positioning satellite system positions on the tops of each of the three pyramids, he was able to superimpose a map of the Giza, marking the latitude and longitude, onto a map of the celestial sphere.
So the celestial sphere is broken up into right ascension and declination.
And if you were to get the positions of the stars on that grid and superimpose it onto the latitude and longitude, you could predict latitudinally and longitudinally where the other stars in the constellation would fall.
Now this is what Beauval tried to do in the Orion mystery, but he wasn't quite as scientific about it and he made an error that was discovered by Mr. Hunter when he initially did his research.
And what he discovered, and I think Boris would be familiar with this, is that Bavol assigned the Zaliop Alarion pyramid to the star Bellatrix.
And then he assigned, which would be a shoulder star.
It would be the Orion from Earth's perspective.
It would be Orion's right shoulder.
And then there's another pyramid at Abu-Ruwash.
And Baval wrote that that correlated to the star SAIF.
But lo and behold, after Mr. Hunter's research, he realized that actually Robert Baval had it skewed and that rather than Bellatrix correlating to Zaliothalarion and SAIFE to Abu-Ruash,
if you swivel it so that the other shoulder star, which is Betelgeist, and the other knee star, which is a Rigel, correlates to those particular pyramids, then everything falls just beautifully.
Well, this would be, I think, an expression of the mythos, which has Geb and Nut, this is ancient Egyptian mythology, as the sort of the star, the sky goddess was Net, or Nut, excuse me, and Geb was the god of land.
And what had happened was their intercourse was interrupted by the god Shu.
Well, are you aware, and I'm sure you've been listening, with regard to the frequency studies inside the Great Pyramid and the frequency of our very own Earth?
unidentified
It's fascinating.
We have found what I consider pretty hard evidence that the pyramid complex, the Orion complex itself as a unit, not just individual pyramids, were built prior to the Fourth Dynasty.
And I'm being conservative.
I'm not going too far back.
But there's good evidence that we're ready to reveal and disclose to the public through our project.
Well, I've got on my studio camera right now, I've got a picture of your project to get way to Orion.
Well, it's not a book yet.
I guess it's very well done.
It's in a different form.
It's in a pre-book form.
And so they can go up there and see that.
I want to thank you for calling, or allowing me to call you in, Alex, for just a moment.
And thank you very much.
And so there you are, Boris.
The work he's doing, it seems to me, though he ascribes it to mythology, really underscores what you believe to be true about the pyramids if you remove the myth part from what he has discovered.
I mean, I don't pretend to be able to understand what he just said.
Again, I'm a humble documentarian here, and it's over my head, but what I'd like to, what I think we have to encourage is an open discussion of this sort of thing.
And the reason, again, the reason I was silent for two years was because I promised Dr. Shore I'd be silent when it became apparent to me that he was intent on sitting on the information and keeping it proprietary is when I went public because I believe that we should all know about this.
That's why I'm doing this.
I'm doing this work because I believe this is information that if there are enough guys out there, like the gentleman who just called and Larry Hunter and Dick Hoagland and all of the people in Baval who are studying this thing, maybe somewhere there there's an answer that's a practical answer to this cliff we seem to be running towards as a society.
Maybe there's some solution there, some out there.
And that's why I'm doing it.
The horror of these situations is that in order to do a network show, it takes so much money that you always wind up with somebody like a Dr. Shore who has the preponderance of the money in and therefore ultimately can control the project.
The punchline to all the stuff I've been telling you was that when we came back from Egypt and I wanted to basically confront the Antiquities Committee with what we'd found down in that well and of course Dr. Shore didn't want to because his permit had been canceled, we had quite a falling out and he demanded his film back, which he can legally do.
Of course I have an absolute unrestricted and total and exclusive right to market and sell.
So it's your classic cut the baby in half.
You can have the film but there's not much you can do with it and there's nothing I can do with it.
Well here's what I want to do and one of the reasons that I agreed to come on, you know, I mean Art, you've been at the forefront in this thing and a lot of people listen to you, 15 million people listen to you.
I have for the last six weeks since this problem started with Dr. Shore have had two friends who are cameramen who've been prowling around the plateau with small digital cameras and they have in fact been reshooting a lot of the stuff that we captured network quality with Betacam and 16 millimeter Aeroflex.
Actually under their own auspices at the moment because my situation with Dr. Shor until a week ago was quite muddy and I wasn't quite sure where we were going to be but I didn't want this information to die.
And while it was summertime in the doldrums in Egypt, these guys being Egyptian prowled around over there.
They have been up over the king's chamber and have filmed that passageway that was the subject of Dick Hoagland's conversation with you.
And I have never believed that I've always believed that if that was in fact a secret tunnel, why in the world would they give me permission to drag a film crew up there?
As I say, when I asked for permission to go up and film those rooms, nobody said, no, it's too dangerous, or no, you can't go, or no, it's off limits.
They said, sure, you know, you pay your $700 or whatever it is, and up you go.
We, in taking our crew up there, and I have since, this has been reshot on high eight, which is what we're coming to here, but on the first level above the king's chamber, there are four sort of flat chambers.
When I say flat, they're about four feet high.
They're somewhat larger in area than the king's chamber.
And they look more like spaces and baffles in a speaker than they do like chambers.
And then the fifth chamber, Lady Campbell's chamber, I believe it's called, is domed, is peaked.
It has a peaked roof.
And that's where the famous red cartouche is ascribed to, which ascribes the pyramid to Khufu, the famous sort of fake cartouche.
In any event, we went up there and on the first level, running from east to west, let me get this right, running a little bit south of west, was a new tunnel which was being cut parallel to that chamber.
I couldn't imagine for the life of me why they were going parallel to the chamber.
Why they didn't just go down the end of the chamber and start there.
But in any event, and that tunnel in the three trips I made to those rooms got progressively longer.
The stuff they were carving out, the stones and stuff, when we were there originally in the spring of 1996, they were bagging the refuse, the stone and stuff, and they were storing it in the second chamber.
In other words, they were hauling it up a level and storing it in the second chamber, which I thought was bizarre.
But anyway.
And then apparently, recently they've been removing it.
Over the last year, they've progressed to where there is now a 220 wire going up the wall from the king's chamber, from the entrance to the king's chamber, up into this area where they're digging the tunnel.
I got to tell you that Dr. Hawaz has never given me an idea that there was something up there I certainly shouldn't shoot.
And so I question the whole conspiracy and secrecy theory, and that's something Richard and I have always argued about.
But I can only tell you that, yes, it's true.
I have got footage.
And what I am proposing to do is summarize what we've been talking about tonight.
And I am next week going to be editing together a 45-minute documentary, which will not be a network documentary.
We're going to make it do it with high-eight and digital footage, and it will not be a network quality show.
You know, Charlton Hessman is not going to be the narrator.
It'll be professional voice.
And it will basically be a summary of what I've learned in Egypt in the last two years of this expedition with a little of the stuff from the West expedition.
And what I'm trying to do is I'm trying to raise some money to carry this project on.
I'm trying to raise the money to go back and reshoot some of this footage professionally and somehow get this thing on the air in spite of Dr. Shore and his millions.
And what I'm hoping to be able to do is make this tape available.
I'd like to make it available to your listeners.
Basically, for a donation, we have an expense, a cost, a shipping and handling and production cost that runs to about $9.
I mean, it will cost me about $9 a tape to make the tape, duplicate it, and get it shipped out.
So any, and I repeat, any donation in excess of that that anybody cares to make would go to a wonderful cause, and I will be sending out these tapes within 30 days.
We're discussing Egypt, the pyramids, the Sphinx, the shore expedition, and it's kind of a case of finally speaking out after a lot of people have tried to interview Boris for two years.
And he held all of this confidential and didn't talk to anybody.
And Boris, if I understand everything correctly, in frustration over Mr. Shore having part of this and you having part of this and not being able to get it out to the American people, you're going to do, in essence, an end run around Shore and you're going to produce this video independently and distribute it.
But what I'm trying to do is establish two things here.
As I say, I've been at this now since 1991.
And it wasn't the easiest thing in the world getting the mysteries of the Sphinx on the air because a lot of people were not thrilled with the idea that there might have been an earlier date and therefore an earlier civilization.
But it occurs to me if you've got 15 million listeners and we should find some focal point for them and we could create ultimately a data bank, a list of interested people who want to support this sort of expedition.
There are a lot of things we can do.
We've got a 13-show series in the works now that we're talking to one of the cable networks about.
We're going to be seeking some investment for that.
We're going to be taking people from a list.
We've got a whole group of people that are anxious to go on these expeditions, and they do everything From hall boxes to hall lights, and some are investors, and some just come along.
My thought was that if there's a group of people out there that want to see what I've been talking about in Egypt, I'm going to put it on high-eight.
I'm going to put it on a good, professionally done but not network-quality 45-minute tape that will have pictures of that sarcophagus, pictures of the well, pictures of the tunnel up over the Sphinx, and all of the stuff we've been talking about.
We're producing it independently now.
We couldn't, up until like last week, we didn't know where we were with Dr. Shore, and we're still not 100% sure where we are, but we know that the footage is lost to us.
Basically, to lay things out for people, there is this existing footage shot under the Shore auspices that you shot that I guess there are lawsuits and counter lawsuits, and this thing is going to be hung up forever, and the baby is going to get torn in half.
Nobody can use either half, so here you go around all of it and try to produce it anyway, and you are then soliciting people who are interested in supporting you in this effort.
And I'm making this pledge that every penny that we dig in will go towards the production of this tape and getting into that room one way or another in Egypt.
We are working on a not-for-profit foundation, but I think it's a long time in the doing, and it's quite expensive to do.
So what I'd like to do is break it up into bite-sized chunks.
I'd like to just solicit donations from people, in return for which I'm going to send them this tape.
I'm putting it out there that the shipping and handling is about $5, and the cost of actually producing the tape, our cost is about $4.
So, you know, if people can part with $20 or more, hallelujah.
I mean, whatever they can send us will go towards this project.
And I will establish a list.
I would like to have a newsletter.
I would like to feel that we can get a newsletter out.
I would like to feel elementally will have a website.
I'd like to feel that we could put together a group of interested people, people who would like to get this information out there, and people who would like to support guys like Larry Hutter and Richard Togland and the people that are doing this kind of work, so that when we do have trips or we have investment opportunities, as in a specific network project or something, we'd have a list of people to go to and say, hey, you see the institute, would you like to be involved?
Sure.
I don't know any other way to do it.
I don't know any other way that we're ever going to combat the big money interests, the people that are stifling this information, other than a whole bunch of little people banding together.
It says, Fox shall have complete prior business and creative control and approval over all elements of each program ordered hereunder, including without limitation.
The script development, the material, all versions thereof, titles of the program, casting, producer, director, composer, host, writer, story editor, replacements for any such personnel, music, use and selection of film clips, still photographs, and it goes on for a paragraph.
And the other network basically was interested, and I'll tell you how that played out.
On August, I think, 14th, but I'm maybe wrong on the date, I went down to Virginia Beach to the Education Foundation where Dr. Hawaz and Dr. Shore were speaking.
And I confronted Dr. Hawaz and I said, look, I've got to deal with a major network that they're interested if you will help us open this tunnel.
And he said, what if the tunnel is empty?
Or what if there's no tunnel?
I said, Zahi, I'll take that chance.
It doesn't matter.
If you'll go down there and dig and allow us to film it, I believe that we can put a show on that will be very good for Egypt and it'll put all these rumors to rest once and for all.
He said to me in front of three witnesses, Boris, if you and Dr. Shor can resolve your differences, I'll help you.
Dr. Shore was not interested in talking.
Dr. Hawaz tried him.
He called me up.
He said, you know, Dr. Shore doesn't want to talk about it.
He feels the thing is his.
He wants you to get out of the project.
Now, I don't know how true that is.
I don't know at firsthand that that happened, but I can tell you that Zahi Hawaz, for all of what people say about him, has always been very fair with me.
Regarding Baval and Hancock, there was something about Dr. Hawass allegedly saying that if they showed up at Giza, he would have them thrown in a deep pit, beheaded.
Look, when I got down to Virginia Beach, I walked into a hotel which will remain nameless, and there was a table, a round table, at which sat Dr. Shore, Dr. Jehoda, Zahi Hawaz, Robert Boval and his wife, and a couple of other people.
And they all seemed cordial enough to me.
Now, I've known Zahi a long time.
I'm sure Zahi has a temper.
We all do.
So do I. But I absolutely would never believe that story because that's just not the kind of, that's not the kind of thing he would say in my knowledge of the man.
I mean, I don't think there's any love loss there.
I don't think he's a big fan of Vivald's.
I don't think he's a big fan, for that matter, of what we're doing.
But the comment is, or the myth perhaps is that Dr. Hawass will allow teams to come over, the Shore team, the University of Florida Hopes, and others, and do a lot of hard work with X-ray, with ultrasound, all the rest of it, and identify interesting areas to probe.
And then just when it gets to the point where they're ready to actually do a dig or confirm what they found through X-ray or ultrasound, then Hawai says, see you later, you're out of here, and proceeds himself.
Well, I tell you what, I know that that's the rap, okay?
And I am not going to dodge the question.
I'm looking for a correct way to answer it.
I'd say this to you.
Certainly, I don't know that a lot of this started when Gantenbrink sent his camera up into that little room and found that thing, and then Ganttenbrink got thrown out.
I don't know Gantenbrink.
I understand, and I understood this from Baval, that he was not the easiest guy in the world to get along with, and there was a lot of ego there.
Now, there is without question a lot of ego in Egypt.
I used to say that Egypt should have been named Ego Egypt or something like that because it is without question.
There are a lot of agendas on that plateau.
I would not deny that.
But I don't think that Dr. Hawaz is basically deliberately sort of allowing people to spend their money and then throwing them out.
I believe that the monuments are sovereign to Egypt, and I believe that they have over the years been ripped off by foreign archaeologists who had the money and the know-how to mount the expeditions and take all the artifacts.
All the artifacts of Egypt are in the British Museum and in Louvre and all over the world.
But I do believe that it's a legacy for the world, and I don't think the Egyptians would deny that.
And my problem is that I haven't seen, since I started in Egypt, a single one of these expeditions which went to the Antiquities Department and said to them, look, we'd like to work with you on this.
We'd like you to name a team of Egyptian archaeologists to work with our scientists to develop some theories about the Sphinx.
Certainly John West didn't do that, and most certainly neither did Dr. Shore.
I'm the documentarian, but that's what I would have done.
And when I went to Dr. Hawaz, when this whole thing came apart in February, and I said, look, Zahi, why don't you open the tunnel and just let us film it?
And we'll give Dr. Short credit, you know, for the scientific work that he did.
And Zahi was quite receptive to that idea.
Well, you know, if I come out to Nevada and I'm a delegation from the sovereign nation of Turkey, for instance, and I walk in and say, I'm going to dig here, and you guys just stand back out of the way, and I think we find is ours, I wonder how it would be received.
I'm not trying to dodge the question, but I think, yes, it is a sovereign nation, and the stuff is theirs.
And it's their history and their background and their ethos that we're dealing with.
Yes, I think that it belongs to the world, and I have not seen a single instance of the government standing in the way of a legitimate effort to bring this stuff to the world.
What happens is that the people that mount these expeditions, as happened with Dr. Shore, as I think happened with the John West expedition, is the egos get involved.
All right, let me take you back to the Shore expedition.
How much interest did Dr. Shore show on items inside the Great Pyramid as opposed to outside, you know, the Sphinx, the tunnel, and chamber, and so forth?
Well, because Dr. Shore is, I believe, interested in one thing and one thing only, and that's discovering, and that's proving that Edward Casey was right and that there is a chamber under the Sphinx.
I think he's obsessed with it.
and i think that whatever the man's inconsistencies have been there due to the fact that he is obsessive about getting into that room do you think he Now, what do you think Dr. Shura will do?
I think that he will go to Dr. Hawaz and say, all right, I've gotten rid of Boris, and now we're going to go to the room.
And I think that's a hard question for me to answer because I think what he did is irrational.
I think that we had This thing, you know, swimming towards the boat, as they say, and then you know, it became a question of who was the boss and who was in charge of what, and, you know, was I acting without his permission and did I need his permission in the film and so forth.
And it became a struggle of will.
And I said, look, you know, I'm not working for you.
I'm making a film.
And in the end, I have a responsibility to my shareholders to make a successful film.
So what do I think he's going to do?
I don't know.
I know what I'm going to do.
I'm going to try and get this news out to as many people as will.
I think Zahi will say, you guys settle your own problems.
Because I'm going to do whatever the court suggests I do.
And yes, I may get cut off, but I believe this.
I think if I can get several thousand of these tapes out there, and among the several thousand people who buy them, there are a couple of editors, or there's some people who have influence with a senator, or there are some people who would like to seriously get interested in this thing.
I think we can put a team together and go to Egypt and sit down with Zahi and say, look, this is going to be good for Egypt.
We want you to open the tunnel.
We want you to do the work.
We'll give you the rights to Egypt for nothing.
We'll give you the cassettes in Egypt for nothing.
You know, I've got nothing to gain and nothing to hide.
And the only thing that we can lose here is a lot of precious information.
I respected Dr. Shore's confidence for two years.
And until he pulled the rug out from under me and tried to overwhelm me with dollars and high-priced firm of attorneys and the whole rest of it, I kept the peace and I didn't speak out at all.
I never said a word.
When I saw this thing basically going into a closet forever, I'm sitting here looking at an order from a judge saying the next hearing on this issue will be in March of 1998.
Well, it's interesting, perhaps, and we'll get going with that.
Just a brief sarcophagus for you, perhaps.
When I was 15, I went to Israel, and when I was there, we played A game of hide and seek.
They sent me down into this deep cave in this coastal city.
Lo and behold, I found myself surrounded by these sterling white sarcophagi.
And I climbed into one, and strangely enough, it seemed to be a perfect fit.
And after a few moments, I seemed to slip into some kind of altered state of consciousness that I came out of several minutes later when they came and found me.
But that story that you told about the sarcophagus and laying inside of it definitely rings true.
And I think there's something very solid about that.
And I think people can maybe look for those sorts of experiences in their own lives and see what they get out of that.
But I certainly hope we can correspond.
And any video and other audio that you do have, we can send that out streaming over the Internet.
And we'll be able to get it in front of a lot of people.
And maybe we won't spam, but we'll maybe target some senators and some people that you'd like to get it in front of.
In understanding the nature of your experience in the pyramid on that rainy night, in essence you physically bilocated.
Okay, possibly their access to eternal life was this bilocation process, holding the life energy or soul in the secondary position long enough for the physical body in the pyramid to cease its life function and die.
The soul now physically bilocated would no longer be subject to the aging process theoretically, I think.
And my last thing, and thank you, Art, for the time.
The process of the pyramid's construction, specifically the method used to transport that many stones of such enormous size, has got to be a method unknown to us because we can't duplicate it.
Well also during their transport, they would have made, had they been transported across land, they would have made grooves and roads that would still be visible to us to this day, I would think.
Well, I remember, as most of you must, the Ten Commandments where Godzilli of slaves were being whipped and these giant stones were being moved with rollers and all the rest of it.
You don't think that's the way it happened, Boris?
I have an apartment in Egypt with a view of the pyramid, and I had nine wonderful, industrious Egyptian workers in that five-room apartment one day working.
And I'll tell you categorically that if there had been ten, it would have been a catastrophe.
But the thought of thousands of people hooked to one block all pulling at the same time, it just didn't happen.
And then even if you could imagine that occurring, and I remember in the Ten Commandments slaves getting rolled under the stones and all the rest of it, but then once they got it there, they never did bother to quite show us how they got it up there.
I haven't got the information necessary to refute all that stuff.
But I have to tell you that this whole conspiracy thing, the whole idea of secrecy, my question is why?
If there was an advanced society and they could do amazing things and transcend dimensions and do all the things that Michael is going to talk about on Wednesday, why?
Why would there be secrecy?
Why is there this kind of religious cabal that prevents us from expanding our awareness of the universe we live in?
Well, let's for a second again talk about the Hall of Records.
Let us assume, for the sake of conversation, there is a Hall of Records beneath the Sphinx somewhere in this chamber that tells us all about a previous earlier civilization.
Maybe even is some sort of last attempt on the part of that civilization to record what occurred so it might not occur again.
Because after all, if there was a previous civilization, they're not around anymore.
And so they might have tried to put a sort of a time capsule for the future to tell whoever might come next what not to do.
So if that's true and if that's actually found by Egyptian authorities or by whoever, do you think that information really would immediately be made public?
Or do you think that somebody would fold it far away?
Now, what I feel is this, that if in fact there was a hall of records, if I were the Egyptian government and some guy with a seismograph had turned up a room 15 feet or 30 feet below the surface in my plateau, and I knew absolutely for a fact that I could drill a high-speed diamond drill hole through limestone and find out what's in there without anybody being the wiser, I would do it.
Now, they haven't done it, or they don't admit to doing it, or for whatever reason they're not giving out the information, but it is their plateau.
It may be, or it may be down two or three layers below.
We had a very wonderful Israeli psychic there with us named Zev Coleman, and he felt that there were two layers, two strata of rooms below the room that we were identifying.
And the problem with the seismic stuff is it only bounces back once.
So you have to go down to the next level to find out what's at the level below it.
Most Christians believe, I think, that modern civilization is about 6,000 years old.
unidentified
Well, yeah, that would be Usher's chronology.
But I'm just saying the Institute for Christian Research, which believes in a 10,000-year time period, does say the further back you go in time, the more advanced the civilization gets.
And the theory being, you know, God created us advanced to begin with, and we degraded.
Mike, I have questions that are related to one another.
If it is not a secret society that has been limiting access to the pyramids and the things, what are the delimiting factors?
And does the notion of digging, is that a significant factor?
and does that account for your decision to look at or examine what is out, available, and up, I guess, up on top of everything as far as your expedition?
And how do you exactly intend to expand the types of eyes?
Okay, the digging, it is very complicated to get an excavation permit in Egypt.
It has to be done through an institution of higher learning.
It's very costly.
It's very complicated.
They're very and understandably so careful about their artifacts and it's not a simple process to get the right to dig.
That's one of the reasons why we went to a more sophisticated means of looking under the ground.
Now I didn't just decide to look above the ground because they wouldn't let me dig.
I've just became convinced through my exposure over nine years, and again I have no PhDs.
I'm not an educated person in any specific sense of the word in Egypt.
But just the experience of being there and being confronted with these things and examining the mathematics and the astronomy and the sonics and all of the different aspects of this, it's just become apparent that it's fascinating.
And it's a lot more interesting to me than digging under the ground and finding some sort of a tablet that says, you know, this is what Atlantis was all about, which nobody's going to believe anyway for 20 years.
unidentified
Then following to that question, if you are trying to involve persons who might have other views, have you considered the fact that even when you look at the stars, especially along the equator and where you're seeking to look is not that far,
that there's almost millions of stars compared to what we might see in this hemisphere, and that there are different configurations, therefore the myth systems and the science would be different and growing out of a different conceptual framework.
As I say, I'm not the astronomer, and frankly, I've just read with great interest everything that's been written like this.
I think Baval's stuff is phenomenal and would have included it in our film if he had not had the break with Shor.
And I think that there are so many different logical explanations for things about the pyramid that it's all the more reason to have a serious look at it with all of the scientific disciplines.
Well, I didn't actually see it, but a guy named Gantenbrink, a very brilliant German guy, invented a robotic device that took a camera up that air shaft and photographed a small door with hinges at the end of it.
Now, Richard believes, Richard Hoagland believes, that there's a room on the other side of it with a scribe sitting there, a statue of a scribe staring at Orion.
My own feeling is that if Tom Danley is correct and the pyramid is a giant sonic device, that perhaps that door was there so that if the pharaoh had too much or not enough or whatever, you could shut the door and turn off the vibration.
This is exactly what I was hoping would happen, Art, is that we would connect some people who are interested and maybe give them a way to express some of this stuff.
You know, I mean, she's in Mexico.
She may be able to come to one of our expedition sites.
You know, that's a, well, actually, the question goes deeper.
It's a good question.
But the information that might be discovered, should they come upon the Hall of Records, would tip over so many paradigms, Boris, that I've always wondered if it really would ever get released.
If we put together a group of people and we go over there and have an opening, which I think ultimately with enough pressure, enough people, can make this happen, and everybody's standing there and Dr. Hawaz or whoever goes into that tunnel and there's a camera looking over his shoulder, going to be hard put to keep that out of the press.
I mean, the cameras are everywhere today, and the press is everywhere, and we're living in an electronic age where you can take a camera the size of your palm, the palm of your hand, and record images with it that you can broadcast around the world.
And you know, Carla, the thing about this that's important is right now we're talking to maybe 15 million people, or however many people are listening.
One referring to the recently discovered Japanese pyramids recently discovered.
And one I'll just start with the first question.
Boris, do you think when we finally get to Mars and reach the area, the face of Sidonia, we might just discover a city of petrified semi-extraterrestrial technology and machinery that may be tied directly or indirectly to our pyramids here?
I can tell you that I'm planning to be in Japan this winter in connection with the Winter Olympic Games.
And I'm going to go to a place called Motoise, where there is supposed to be a pyramid that's been camouflaged by trees and dirt, but apparently it is a pyramid.
And I'm going to go and investigate that.
And I just heard the story.
I've heard it thirdhand, and I'm trying to get information.
If you have anything on that, I'd love to have it.
Yes, and I was wondering, I've heard about something, there's going to be an earthquake in Giza sometime before the spring, and it's supposed to break open the Sphinx and reveal the Hall of Records.
And I was wondering if you could verify any of that.
I've heard that it was a, I think the accepted Egyptological view is that it was a monument to glorify the name and memory of the Pharaoh of Pharaoh Chepha or Khafra.
unidentified
But if the Sphinx was made before the flood, and you say it was underwater at one time, what would happen if you possibly got down below the Sphinx somewhere and you come across a large giant-sized skeleton?
I know that when we first started doing the Sphinx, somebody asked me what I thought the Sphinx was.
And I said, tongue-in-cheek, it later became a cartoon that went all over the United States.
I said the Sphinx is a radiator ornament on a giant sports car.
And when they got done digging it up, they were going to have clamshell fenders and maybe a V350 engine and footprints leading off in the direction of a gas station.
Well, when it was first broken into, it was about 720 A.D. by a Muslim.
And he was just so many pyramid inches away from the doorway.
And had he been, I think it's 286 pyramid inches to the right of where he broke in, he would have pushed on the right stone and found the door.
Now that 286 point some pyramid inches also pertains to the height of the pyramid, the number of days of gestation of a human embryo, and several other things.
And then if you take that, you can go out to Mount Sinai with it, a certain number of that number of miles, and that number of miles in another direction takes you to the Jordan, right where it was crossed by the Israelites.
Then you can take the Egyptian current and go right to the Yucatan, basically.
There's so much stuff.
The boats buried in the pits next to the Great Pyramid actually sailed to this country.
The rock that the sarcophagus and the original capstone, which was found in a socket and is now in the Museum of Egypt in Cairo in a vault, were all each made of the same type of stone that we've done a spectrographic analysis of that can only be found quarried and in that spectrographic specific type in Racine, Wisconsin.
The thing is that, again, I don't think this stuff is buried.
And I think if you look at those pyramids and don't see a tomb, and you have the kind of mind it takes to decipher this sort of stuff, which is not me.
I'm the documentarian.
But all I'm trying to do is get enough people interested so that the people with the specialized education that you need to fathom this sort of thing can figure it out.
And the East-West Shrine Graham, and they basically raise money so that any child that they take care of does not have to pay for the medical treatment they receive.
So they can take care of a child regardless of the income of their family.
What do you think about Lincoln's claim that not the president, but Lincoln who wrote Holy Blood, Holy Grail, his claim that the Masonic Order was founded to preserve the knowledge of where the descendants of Christ were?
unidentified
I think that's probably stretching it a bit.
I think that there was a good book, and at this hour of the morning, the name just escapes me, but they talk about maybe it derived out of the Knights Templar who were destroyed by the Knights Hospital under Philip the Fair back in France in the early 1300s.
And that the reason it was so secret was that they were literally having to protect their lives.
And so they made sure there were lots of rituals as far as modes of recognition and handshakes and everything.
Because literally, there was a writ for their warrant for their arrest.
And if they were captured, at least in France, they were executed.
In most of the other countries, they weren't.
But in some countries, they were.
That was one speculation.
I don't know.
I just think it grew out of the operative masons, and they had their lodges where the operative masons meant.
And as the stonemasonry trade decreased, I just think that they needed to bring in speculative people, people who were not actual masons.
But masonry basically teaches a lesson.
They take a moral application and they tie it to a lesson of a tool like the 24-inch gauge is emblematical of the 24 hours of the day where it's divided into three equal parts for eight hours for devotion to God, eight hours to family, eight hours to your usual vacation.
I mean, that's the type of thing that I've ever grown up with.
So I read some of these books, and I have a whole lot of them in my library about, you know, just these wild things that go on.
I've joined all kinds of organizations that go, gosh, darn it, you know what?
West of the Rockies, you're on there with Bora Said.
unidentified
Hi.
Yes, good morning, gentlemen.
Boris, you know, you may be right with the sonic idea.
I've always had a speculation that moving those large granite pieces on the pyramid could have been done with a harmonic vibration, and once they've got the giant boulder moving, they could, through vibration, they could move it through more physical aspects easier.