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May 8, 1996 - Art Bell

02:46:39

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Hector Armstrong - Chupacabra - Open Lines

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		Welcome to Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
unidentified		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		From the high desert and the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening and good morning across all these many time zones, from the Tahitian and Hawaiian Islands, all the way east across this great land, to the Caribbean and the U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north to the bulb worldwide on the internet.
		This is Coast to Post a.m.
		I'm Art Bell.
		Well, well, well, we're going to get in lots of trouble tonight, I suppose.
		I've got a lot of unique guests coming up, and I just have a surprise guest for you tonight.
unidentified		Subject of Chupacabra.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I've got a million faxes and emails here.
		Dear Art, we saw a report about the Goatsucker or Chupacabra on our local NBC Channel 4 news today out of Los Angeles.
		The news anchors, Ken and Barbie, did not seem amused.
		Looks like some fairly serious stuff.
		See you on the radio, regards, Bill.
		Or here we go again right now, 6.20 p.m.
		CBS Affiliate Channel 2.
		There is a long report about the Chupacapras saying that there have been accounts all over the outskirts of Los Angeles now where dead animals like chickens and rabbits have been showing up by the dozens with two puncture marks in various parts of their bodies.
		No blood on the ground.
		In fact, no blood.
		No signs of struggle.
		My skin is crawling.
		This is getting a little too close to home.
		That's from an archaeologist in Los Angeles.
		Or Art just got done watching the 6 o'clock news on Channel 2.
		CBS did a long-term segment on Chupacapra or the goat sucker.
		They showed dead goats, chickens, other various animals.
		This story from Mexico City.
		Reuters, a giant bat-like creature is terrorizing a village in a northern Mexican state where goats are found dead daily with their blood sucked dry.
		Poor farmers from a village there have formed nighttime vigilante squads to track down the flying beast that has been dubbed the goatsucker.
		We are telling people to keep the women and children locked up and inside at night.
		This is real.
		There's something out there.
		It may be very old.
		It may be very new.
		I really couldn't tell you, but I can just tell you that it certainly is out there.
		So coming up in just a couple of moments, a few moments, I've got Hector, or Tito as you wish, Armstrong, who is from Puerto Rico.
		He just happens to be the guy who operates the Chupacabra web page on the internet.
		Also happens to be studying this whole thing, is at Princeton University in New Jersey, and is as much of an expert as you're going to find these days on Chupacabra, which is some kind of horrible new animal.
		Here somehow, unimaginably, either something new, something from somebody's lab, something created, or something that has come through the veils.
		The openings to elsewhere.
		We don't know.
		But we're going to talk about it.
		And by the way, that is the very topic that is going to be discussed on America Online's Periscope, in their Periscope area.
		If you'd like to join in on the discussion, here's how you do it.
		You get on America Online quick as you can because it will fill quickly.
		Matter of fact, I better get on quickly or there won't be room for me.
		And then you go to Keyword on AOL.
		Just click on Keyword and enter the word periscope.
		P-A-R-A-S-C-O-P-E Periscope.
		And then the chat area called the Grassy Knoll.
		Grassy Knoll.
		Grassy Knoll.
		What a name for a chat area.
		Yesterday, by the way, resulted in the first cloning of that chat room.
		It was so many people in there, it automatically cloned itself.
		So I would hurry and get in there.
		The discussion will be, no doubt, about Chupacabra.
		This creature that is now all over our news.
		First in Puerto Rico, then Mexico, then South America, Central America, Mexico, and now Chupacabra looks as though it has landed right here in the good old USA.
		So in just a moment, we're going to go all the way to Princeton University, and we're going to talk to Hector Armstrong, who is from Puerto Rico and knows about the chupacabra.
		And by the way, if you want to go up to my webpage, there is a link to Hector's chupacabra page.
		And you can read all about the chupacabra and see a drawing of it.
		ugly, ugly sucker that it is.
unidentified		Pewds Screams
art bell ▲ ● ▼		To Princeton University in New Jersey we go.
		And to Hector or Tito Armstrong.
		Hector, welcome to the program.
unidentified		Thank you very much, Art.
unidentified		How are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just fine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What would you prefer to be called, Hector or Tito?
unidentified		Actually, I'll go by my nickname, which is Tito.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Tito.
		All right, Tito.
		Welcome to the program.
		You are from Puerto Rico, right?
		Yes, that's correct.
		How long have you been up here going to school?
unidentified		Basically, I'm a class of 1996, which means I was here since 1990, basically.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Quite a while, then.
unidentified		Yeah, definitely.
unidentified		Four years in the U.S. All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What, if I might ask, I guess because of where you're from, but what got you interested in Chupacabra?
unidentified		Well, some friends of mine went home for break last year in October, and I hadn't been home for a long time.
		And they told me that the new thing in Puerto Rico was the Chupacabra.
		It's something that everybody was talking about.
		It was something that was on the news.
		It was like the latest thing in Puerto Rico.
		So that basically got me informed about it.
		I had not heard about it before.
		And it got me very interested in the subject because everyone was talking about it, basically.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		There are a lot of people in my audience that don't have computers, Hector, and they can't go to your home page.
		So let's begin this way.
		What the hell is this thing?
		And what does it look like?
		Can you describe it as best you can without being able to show people a picture?
		If you just close your eyes and describe it, what does this creature look like?
unidentified		Okay, well, according to most eyewitness accounts or most reports, this creature supposedly has the shape of a small kangaroo, but it's sort of reptilian in nature with two large red eyes.
		And so basically it would look like a cross between a small kangaroo and a small dinosaur.
		That's I think the best way to describe it.
		And it has allegedly some spines growing out of its back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I was going to ask you about that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It looks scaly on its back.
unidentified		Exactly, yes.
		And then it basically looks very like typically gray alien in nature with regards to its head.
		And then the body then looks sort of like kangarooish with a tail at the end.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can this thing fly?
unidentified		Allegedly it can.
		I mean there have been some reports that it can fly.
		But I mean obviously due to the nature of this, that hasn't been confirmed in any way yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		All right.
		It began, I guess, in Puerto Rico, or at least the first reports were there.
		Then I began to hear reports about South America.
		Then I started to hear reports about Mexico.
		And in the last couple days, suddenly Los Angeles, even Oregon, the U.S. West Coast.
		How can this thing be spreading so quickly?
unidentified		Well, I mean, I think the most logical thing to assume is that this sort of thing has been going on already for a while.
unidentified		And it's only because of the exposure of the Chupacabra or the name Chupacabra in Puerto Rico that people started to link the name to these sort of happenings that have been going on for a while.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, now wait a minute.
		I'm not sure about that, Hector.
		Or Tito.
		I'm sorry.
		We'll call you Tito.
		Tito, because I watch the news very carefully for things like this.
		And we have not been getting reports other than an occasional cattle mutilation of chickens and goats with the blood drained from their bodies and two marks on the outside and four marks on the inside.
		We've not been getting those reports.
		This is fairly recent.
unidentified		Okay, well, then that means that definitely something stranger is going on.
unidentified		I mean, my explanation would sound logical, but I guess that if we haven't been hearing about stuff like that, then this is even more mysterious than we previously had thought.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		Which is very interesting indeed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It is, and it seems to be spreading quickly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If you had to make a guess, or maybe I had to ask you, Tito, what is the best guess about where this thing comes from?
unidentified		The best guess?
		That's very hard to say.
		I mean, theories, people have been sending me theories ever since I put the web page on, and they range from very out there to very mainstream explanations.
		I would hesitate to hazard a guess, but basically the consensus, if there is any, seems to be that this is something that is not native to the Earth.
		I mean, however strange that sounds.
		I think regarding everything that's been going on, that's our best bet.
		And then if we go from there, then I mean, then we go from there.
		But this is definitely something that hasn't been seen before.
		And everything about it, even its attacks, the way it does this, samples that have been collected of the creature itself point to something that hasn't been seen, that is not native to the Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Not native to the Earth.
unidentified		Which I mean, by that I mean that, for example, the chemical composition of blood samples taken have not been able to be classified in any way.
		And even the way that this creature attacks animals hasn't been seen before.
		So that's basically what I mean by this.
		It is something totally new.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the theories I get, Tito, are that it may have come through a veil, through an opening from another dimension.
		It may be something new.
		Maybe it's something from one of our labs.
		You know, we're doing a lot of genetic tampering about these days.
		So you think, though, that it comes from off-world?
unidentified		Well, I mean, basically, one of the major theories is, of course, related To the alien theory, especially alien cross-breeding experiments.
		That's a pretty popular theory currently.
		And it posits that this creature was created and then somehow either let loose or some other thing in Puerto Rico and elsewhere.
		And then this creature has become a native species to the earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think it began in Puerto Rico?
unidentified		I'm really not so sure.
		I think, I mean, due to the very big exposure it got in Puerto Rico and the many animals that were found, I'd have to hazard a guess that at least this type of creature, this type of chupacabra did start in Puerto Rico.
		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, what seemed to begin as a taste for chicken and goats recently seems to have turned to a taste for humans.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's reports now of human beings being attacked.
unidentified		Uh-huh.
		And if, I mean, if one assumes that this creature is a species and it exhibits normal species characteristics, which it means that it breeds or it, I mean, that there's more than one, then I guess it would be inevitable for it to have more and more contact with human beings and then and interaction or altercation is inevitable then.
		But I don't think that necessarily means that the chupacabra is ready to or is starting to attack humans per se.
		But then again, I mean, I would be on my guard just in case.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I wouldn't want to meet one.
unidentified		Definitely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Another theory that some people have forwarded, there's a story running today about how many thousands of people in the U.S. are dying because of pollution.
		And there have been a million science fiction movies done about creepy, crawly things that come out of swamps, which, by the way, you've got quite a few of down there in Puerto Rico, I guess.
		And could it be some reaction to toxicity released by man?
		Could that have caused, do you suppose, some kind of mutation?
unidentified		That is possible.
unidentified		I mean, however, that would mean that the mutation would have happened over a while because mutations don't usually happen overnight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, unless they've got help.
unidentified		Exactly.
		It's always a possibility.
		I mean, it does happen in nature.
		This is a fact.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, what can you tell me about what happened in Puerto Rico?
		It's all been very sketchy.
		A gal who's on my Dreamland show, Linda Howe, has gone to Puerto Rico and looked for this creature.
		Now, I don't think I would do that.
		I don't want to hunt up this creature and hope it doesn't hunt me up.
		But what has it done in Puerto Rico?
		What is documented?
unidentified		Well, basically, there have been documented cases of basically animals being found, drained of their blood, in Puerto Rico, probably thousands of animals over the past year.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thousands?
unidentified		Yeah, probably the lost thousands.
		There hasn't been an official count, probably because the government doesn't really take this very seriously.
		They're basically keeping their distance, and it's basically been the local people who have taken it upon themselves to basically either be on their guard or try to look for this thing.
		And they have organized a lot of searches for it, and they've come up with nothing so far.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If they should find this thing, Hector, would you think they should try and tranquilize it, if that's possible, or put a bullet through its little brain?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Or, you know, what would you see done with it?
unidentified		Personally, I mean, I would definitely not, I mean, I would definitely study it because due to what it does and what it is, I think it presents a very interesting chance to learn something new.
		I mean, that's putting it mildly.
		This is something that is new and should be studied.
		And if it poses a threat, then I guess people will deal with that when the time comes.
		But I mean, since it's only been attacking animals, I don't think it justifies annihilating it for now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, okay.
		Look, sucking blood, or sucking all the blood from a victim, is a either bat or vampire-like thing.
		And could this be a variation of a bat?
		There are blood-sucking bats, right?
unidentified		Yes, it's totally possible.
		And due to the fact that a lot of people have reported that this thing flies, then that gives credence to that hypothesis.
		However, I mean, the way that vampire bats work, I mean, since they're so small, then they only suck out very little blood out of their victims.
		They definitely don't drain them dry.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's a good point.
unidentified		And especially since there's only been observed maybe two puncture marks in most of the victims, most of the animal victims, then that either means that if it is a bat, it's a very big one, and it's something totally new, and which may exhibit the characteristics of a bat, but couldn't be called a bat per se.
unidentified		But that definitely enters into the whole, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How big do you think this creature is?
unidentified		People have said that this creature is about maybe four feet tall, maybe smaller.
unidentified		That's basically been the consensus out of the many people who have seen this face to face.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If you, with all your interest in chupacabra, had an opportunity to go home to Puerto Rico or even here in the States and come face to face with one, would you do it?
unidentified		Would I I mean if you would, huh?
		Yeah, it sounds like something very, you know, that I would like to do.
		if there had been reports of the chupacabra or a chupacabra-like creature attacking humans, then I'd definitely not consider it.
		But I'll tell you one thing, I wouldn't be alone, and I'll tell you another thing, I wouldn't be totally without any sort of any means of protection.
		Are you a religious person, Tito?
		Not really.
		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There are many religious people who would say this is a manifestation of the devil on earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And certainly some of what it does is pretty devilish.
unidentified		I would guess.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		To put it mildly.
		All right.
		What I would like you to do is hold on.
		We're going to take a break here at the bottom of the hour.
		You're listening to Tito Armstrong, who runs the Chupacabra homepage on the internet and is at Princeton University in New Jersey.
		And we'll get back to him and soon your calls and questions about this brand new creature, something new on our Earth.
		From where?
		That one's open to speculation.
		It will be right back.
unidentified		Thank you.
		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight, featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Top of the morning, everybody.
		Good to be here.
		It's going to be quite an evening.
		We've got Tito Armstrong from Princeton University in New Jersey.
		He runs the Chupacabra homepage.
		And that's what we're talking about.
		Chupacabra.
		It began in Puerto Rico, but recent reports indicate, guess what?
		It's here now.
		So we'll talk more about that in just a moment.
		Also, I want to remind you, there is a chat going on if you are a computer person, underway right now on America Online in a place called the Periscope area.
		It's an area, really.
		You go and just hit keyword Periscope.
		P-A-R-A-S-C-O-P-E Periscope.
		Type that in for a keyword.
		And then go to the Grassy Knoll chat room.
		you'll find me in there right now a lot of other people talking about chupacabra the Now, it's back to Princeton University in New Jersey and Tito Armstrong, who runs the Chupacabra homepage.
		And Tito, are you there?
unidentified		Yes, I am.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		One of the people on the chat room that I'm in right now, Tito, wanted me to tell you, and I should not have forgotten this, there have been ongoing UFO reports in and around Mexico City for about the last year, Tito, and this is really serious.
		I mean, with hundreds of thousands of people seeing these craft almost now, so frequently, to the point where they take it in stride in Mexico City.
		Do you think there might be some kind of relationship between all this UFO activity, and you've had a fair amount down in Puerto Rico, too.
		Yes, and the appearance of Chupacabra?
unidentified		I mean, one would think, just because of the sheer volume of sightings, that there has to be a link.
		So, I mean, my best guess, or my only guess, would be that, yeah, there has to be a link.
		But, I mean, that begets the question, exactly, what is this link?
		Because we we only have that evidence of sightings and that the chupacabra exists and and is on the rampage.
		We don't have anything else yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Um, so I I would hesitate to to I don't suppose we know a thing about chupacabra's sexual habits, do we?
unidentified		Um no.
		Just that uh that there has to be more than one if it if it is indeed a real creature.
		That's basically and then if there is more than one, then that means that it's I mean it exhibits normal and I mean with what you could call animal characteristics, and that it mates and it uh reproduces.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Um I can't think that a lot of us would like a lot of these around.
		I mean, first of all, four feet.
		I mean you can deal with a bat, the stories of bats that suck blood, and that's one thing.
		But when you start talking about something four feet tall, it's going to have a big appetite.
unidentified		Exactly.
		And it's it's I mean the one concrete true fact of this whole thing is that it's this I mean whatever it is it's it's hurting people economically.
		So I mean and the way things work in in this country and elsewhere that that basically is reason enough to get rid of these things.
		I mean if that's good or bad I don't know but I mean I don't know either.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean wolves you remember wolves they hurt they hurt farmers economically and would kill farm animals.
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And they thought at first they should be eradicated from the face of the earth because they were killing farm animals.
		But now they're taking wolves back into Yellowstone and trying to repopulate to the astonishment of some farmers out there trying to repopulate Yellowstone with gray wolves.
		So I wonder in this modern day and age of politically correct everything if chupacabra might not be listed as an endangered species.
unidentified		Who is to say?
		I mean if if the chupacabra exhibits the characteristics that people say it does, then I guess keeping it under control would be nearly impossible if that were true.
		And that makes it a lot difficult for it to follow the example of the wolf.
		But then again, I mean, it is way too early to speculate on that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You would rather see it studied, I take it, than eradicated.
unidentified		At least, well, yes, at first.
		I mean, I think it would sound stupid for me to say, yeah, we should eradicate this.
		I mean, without gaining as much insight as we can as to what it is or what does it do and why does it do what it do.
		So, I mean, I definitely take the line that this thing should be studied.
		Where should you from in Puerto Rico?
		I'm from a city called Ponce, which is on the south coast of Puerto Rico.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where has a lot of the action when it began in Puerto Rico, did it begin at one part of the island, or did it sort of spread everywhere?
unidentified		I'm not sure.
		I mean, the only thing that I can say is that it started in rural areas, possibly to the north, north-northwest of the island.
		But it definitely was not limited to that area.
		It either spread or was there already.
		So this is definitely not something that was localized in Puerto Rico, even though it's a very small island.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, look, we've got a link on our webpage over to your webpage.
		So people can very easily jump over there.
		Let me ask you this.
		What's on your homepage that people can see?
unidentified		I have various articles from many magazines and some newspapers that detail what the whole Chupacabra phenomenon from the beginning, from when it became very, very prevalent in the news.
		I have an article, for example, from a magazine called Strange Magazine, and I have an article from various other internet resources that pretty much sum up what the Chupacabra is and what people have been seeing and what has been the result, which is animals being found with their blood drained.
		And that's one part of the page.
		Another part of the page deals with just the chupacabra as a cultural phenomenon, the way people have been commercializing this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I think you can get a chupacabra t-shirt now, right?
unidentified		Yeah, actually, I own one.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you do?
unidentified		Yeah, my grandmother sent me one from Puerto Rico.
unidentified		Apparently, they're selling very well there and in New York, is what I've been hearing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		When I first heard about this, I thought urban or even suburban legend, you know, sort of a myth.
		it sounds like a mythical creature but uh...
		now the reports are getting too numerous many too many reports to believe that i think something's so it's Either we have this urban-suburban legend that is growing by leaps and bounds, or the chupacabra is growing by leaps and bounds because one little chupacabra certainly could not there's no way that it could spread from Puerto Rico to South America,
		Central America, North America now, all the way up to Oregon, for heaven's sakes.
		They've got to be out there doing a bit of breeding.
		Do we know anything about its habitat?
		In other words, at first it sounded like a warm or tropical area, semi-tropic area inhabited, but now it's spreading north into temperate zones, and that's a little frightening.
unidentified		Yeah, I mean, I guess you could speculate all day on its habits.
		I mean, just from the evidence we have, I think we can draw a few conclusions in that it's not very basically limited to climates such as Puerto Rico.
		And we may even speculate that the Chupacabras or Chupacabras-like creature moves to find either food, I mean, just like any other animal.
		Do we know?
		I've been hearing right now that reports from Puerto Rico have been slowly decreasing in the past few weeks, while reports from Mexico have been increasing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
unidentified		And also in the U.S. as well.
unidentified		So that may be another piece of evidence, another clue as to what this creature is all about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do we know anything about, for example, is it, do you think, a nocturnal beast?
unidentified		Just from what people have been telling me through email, it seems to be mainly nocturnal, but definitely not limited to this.
		There's one report in one of the magazine articles in the page about a sighting which was the chipacabra was witnessed by a woman in Puerto Rico in broad daylight.
		So it says what it's described in articles, it's mostly described as diurnal, which means that it's seen both day and night.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Great.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Has anybody yet managed to take a photograph?
unidentified		Not that I would see.
		I mean, basically, I mean, the way the O Chupacabra has been moving throughout the Internet is that people exchange information very rapidly.
		And if someone had taken a photograph, then I would imagine that by now I would have got my hands on it.
		People have not.
		It's only been limited to people sketching the Chupacabra and basically either doing an animation or doing a computer image of it, which is, for example, the image that I have on my page at the beginning.
		That would be an artist rendering of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I can just tell you I would pick up and run.
		You wanted to talk a little bit, too, about the cultural aspect of this.
		So give me your best shot there.
unidentified		Well, basically, you touched upon it earlier when you were talking about the Chupacabras as a myth.
		I find the subject to be as interesting or maybe even more interesting than the whole mystery of the Chupacabras, the creature.
		I think that the way especially Puerto Ricans have reacted to this and then Mexicans and Americans and South Americans have reacted to this points to the fact that of the creation of a new type of folkloric beast or similar to say for example a leprechaun in Ireland.
		This has become a part of Puerto Rican culture for good or for worse right now.
		And it's also been given life in the commercial sphere due to the t-shirts and there's been a couple songs written on it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Songs?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Chupa Campra songs?
unidentified		Yeah, in a genre called merengue, which is a type of lad music.
		There's been a couple songs written about that and they've been hits in Puerto Rico.
		So that's another piece of the cultural puzzle of it.
		And then, I mean, obviously the t-shirts, there's a report, for example, of a restaurant being named after it in Miami.
		And another interesting thing is that the whole blood-sucking motif of the chupacabra has been used in political commentary in Mexico.
		So the word chupacabra is now being used to describe politicians.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Instead of politicians, chupacabras, huh?
unidentified		Yes, and some politicians have been likened to a chupacabra, like sucking the blood out of people.
unidentified		So, I mean, it's pretty much very rapidly becoming a part of the vernacular.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, let me tell you what bothers me, Tito.
		As long as this beast is hitting goats and chickens and things like that, we can almost dispassionately discuss it.
		But they had pictures of a man in Mexico City or near it who was attacked, who had two giant bite marks and had a lot of his blood sucked.
		And so it's beginning to attack human beings.
unidentified		Yeah, I think you're exactly right.
unidentified		And if it happens that it starts attacking humans, then this will turn very seriously basically overnight, and it won't seem as funny anymore.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, we're a great source of quite a bit of blood.
		The human being carries a lot of blood.
		And would a creature, I guess a bat, get sustenance from blood?
		Is blood a, you know, lack of a better phrase, is it a life giver?
		Would it sustain a creature of that size?
		Could it live on blood alone?
unidentified		Well, I have a couple sources in Puerto Rico who are telling me that this creature does not like human blood.
		How this person got this information, I really can't say because I don't know.
		I know this person personally, and I trust his judgment.
		So this is what he's saying.
		And besides that, people who have been emailing me, some people who seem to have some sort of information, which I don't know how they got it, they say that this is not the case.
		However, I mean, obviously, you have to take this with a grain of salt.
		So I really can tell you, until we see this creature attacking humans, then we can assume that it's going to continue to do this.
		And hopefully the Man in Mexico City incident is an isolated event.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hopefully.
		But, you know, these reports, I'm quite shocked that the major networks are reporting on this in Los Angeles and elsewhere.
		And they're treating it not like the UFO stories, where, you know, frequently at the end of the newscast, they all have a little laugh and so forth.
		They're not laughing.
unidentified		You mean they're treating it seriously?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, that's right.
unidentified		Yeah, that is very surprising.
		I think in some ways it's unprecedented.
		And that definitely is another piece of evidence that since something serious is going on, what that is, then we don't really know for sure, but that definitely something, I mean, that this is something seriously.
		And it shouldn't be totally dismissed.
		I mean, you know, obviously because of the lack of evidence, this shouldn't be taken totally seriously, but we should be looking for, you know, to find answers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's take a couple of calls before the top of the hour, Tito, and see what people have to say.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Tito Armstrong about the La Chupacabra.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hello, Tito.
		Hello.
		With the chupacabra, do you think there's any No, I did.
		Oh, you did, I?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I said, well, obviously a religious person is going to think this thing, the way it looks and the way it operates, is from down under.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I don't mean Australia.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		Do you think there's any correlation between that and Howard Stern and Baba Bui?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, without a doubt, sir.
unidentified		Tito, what about you?
unidentified		Without a doubt.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's unanimous.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In your ear, sir.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Tito Armstrong.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
		Yes.
		This is Bill from Reno.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Bill.
unidentified		I believe this Chippen-Macabra thing Yes, I believe it to be older than we are.
unidentified		This is more than likely a survivor of the Great Extinction living underground.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, now there's something I hadn't thought of, Tito, that this thing may have come from a subterranean location.
unidentified		Uh-huh.
		Well, I've been hearing about the subterranean motif linked to the Chipacabra, and so some people have said it.
		I mean, I don't know.
		I don't know, I mean, obviously no evidence at all, but I mean, that's just one of the many, many, many, many, many theories out there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I mean, it's It may have been around for a very long time.
unidentified		Well, I think it fits in really well as far as all these earthquakes and whatnot.
unidentified		The tunnels are opening.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's true.
unidentified		Like down in Mexico or South Puerto Rico, and then up in Portland.
unidentified		seems pretty strange that they haven't been sighted between the two areas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's a good point.
		Also, I've got a message here that I want to ask you about, Tito.
		From the chat room, it says, please ask more about the blood that was studied from the animal carcasses.
		You mentioned that it was an unknown blood type.
unidentified		Yeah, um, there there have been some reports about that uh this this blood was analyzed in a lab.
		And uh for example, um one of the things that that was found is that the iron content of it was um there was no correlation between that type of iron content and uh any other type of blood that that's been found in animals or humans.
		Yeah, it it is very odd.
		I mean I I really cannot confirm this report at all, but if if this is true, then I mean, then that's that's uh the um that's that's a piece of the puzzle right there, I mean, from from scientific inv investigation of this and not just any claim of some person who claims to have seen this.
		If this is true, then then it it could be actual evidence pointing out that this is uh something new.
		I mean uh a creature that uh is not that I mean would that has no that is needed to assert or or a as as you said uh a mutation of some sort.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'll say this much.
		Whatever it is it seems to me that we've got to get one and study it and we've got to find out what its sexual habits are like and whether it's uh multiplying.
		One can only imagine with all the reports across this many miles that it is multiplying rapidly.
		And you've got to wonder how we should react to it.
		In other words, whether it is something new, even though horrible to us, normal, and it should be here, or whether we should as a civilization decide we are going to eradicate it.
		But before we do either one or make a decision, we've got to know more about it, which means we've got to get our hands on one.
unidentified		Exactly.
		I mean, it's and I guess this is time to bring up the government cover-up angle, which is alive and well with the chupacabras, as it as it seems to be with a lot of things nowadays.
		Some people have said that the government has captured a couple of these creatures.
		Oh.
		And I mean, and this is obviously unconfirmed, and I have no way of knowing this is true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It it's just something someone said probably at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, no doubt.
unidentified		Uh-huh, could be.
		And that they are studying this right now.
		And then I think it would if I was a government official, then it would be logical for me to get this to keep this quiet, at least for the time being.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Until you figured out what you were dealing with.
unidentified		Exactly.
		And basically the same philosophy that people have been saying that the government hasn't been forthcoming about U.S. laws is that they want to avoid a panic.
		So if I was them and I had a creature, then I would definitely keep it quiet for now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Tito, hold on.
		We're going to take a break here at the top of the hour.
		My guest is Tito Armstrong, the subject, an unusual one, La Chubacabra, which now is making its debut appearance here in the U.S. So it's worth listening to.
		Anybody want to make a blood donation?
		A lot of calls when we come back.
unidentified		A lot of calls when we come back.
		A lot of calls when we come back.
		Welcome to Armstrong.
		Somewhere in 5.1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, everybody.
		We just did two hours on Chupa Copper.
		You know me, I like doing different stuff.
		We have Geno Armstrong here from Princeton, New Jersey, who operates the webpage that deals exclusively with Chupa Copper.
		If you want to know more about it, go to my webpage and jump to the Chupa Copper page.
		That jump is there for you now.
		My webpage is www.artbell.com.
		All right, it's off into the world of open line talk radio, and I'll outline some of what we're going to do here in a few moments.
		I want to let everybody know, Vidian is on.
		We just brought the Vidian program up, so if anybody wants to call and see me do my thing, now is the time.
		Off into news here in a moment.
		Credible sources in the U.S. forecast that unless present federal law is changed quickly, the next generation in America is going to pay more than 80%.
		80% of their income in taxes.
		Try and imagine that.
		I think there'll be a revolution first.
		That means you and everybody in America will depend on government for everything over your 20% allowance.
		It is going to happen here unless we stop it.
		Bad news is we're going to have to stop it.
		Do it ourselves.
		In case you haven't noticed, government gets its power and your money by convincing you it's acting in your interest.
		You know, I'm from the government here to help you.
		That's how we got into all this.
		Good news is we can absolutely force Washington back on track.
		It's all in the Sentinel strategy from the American Sentinel Group.
		The information you're going to have to have to light a fire under Washington's butt.
		For a limited time only, it's $19.95.
		Call 1-800-219-8787 and ask for the Sentinel Strategy.
		It's your call.
		The number is 1-800-219-8787.
		Have MasterCard or Visa ready.
		Write it down.
		Call it now.
		1-800-219-8787.
		And one more note on Chupacabra.
		Dear Art, I've seen the website, and you have not seen the look of terror as the victims were overlooking their herd of goats.
		Somebody needs to interview these people.
		It was a full-blown news story on KMOL in San Antonio.
		Art?
		Not, it is bear.
		He says, Bear County.
		Bear County is what it is.
		It is real.
		How come Linda Moulton Howe hasn't been here by now?
		These people knew the deal.
		Well, I would imagine Linda Moulton Howe will make it down there if that's going to be a center of activity for Chupacabra.
		I wanted to tell you about some guests that I'm working on.
		I have booked the attorney from the O.J. Simpson trial, Gerald Ullman, who's written a new book called Lessons from the Trial.
		He'll be here June 3rd.
		I'm going to book and have been talking with Jerry Pornell, Dr. Jerry Pornell.
		He wrote, co-wrote actually, a book called Lucifer's Hammer, which I have been a big fan of for a very, very long time.
		And also I have been talking with, though I have not booked because he's a busy man, Tom Clancy.
		I talked to Tom Clancy back and forth with a few email messages early this morning, after the program, yesterday morning actually now.
		And so I even know the title of his new book, but I can't tell.
		And so, indeed, at some point here, we're going to have Tom Clancy on.
		And I'm really, really looking forward to that.
		I've wanted to interview Tom Clancy for a long time.
		So that's a little bit of what's coming up.
		Now, this was mentioned on yesterday's show late in the program, and it appears to be true.
		Art, sorry to fill up your mailbox with email, but this new Pepsi drink story is true.
		There's a new Pepsi drink.
		Now, it's a pretty strange story.
		It apparently uses some kind of Brazilian berry.
		While many Brazilians consider the grana berry, I think it is, to be a sexual stimulant, PepsiCo is making no claims like that.
		It is a new soft drink made with the exotic Amazon fruit.
	Let's just say people are drawn to the berry by its powerful image and mystery, said Brad Shaw, spokesman for Pepsi at headquarters in Summers, New York.
	PepsiCo said Monday it is expanding the test marketing of Josta, that's J-O-S-T-A, a carbonated beverage made with this berry that contains caffeine.
	And they say, they say it is a sexual stimulant.
	Now, they may not be Pepsi, they are not making that claim, but everybody else is saying it.
	And I think instead of calling it jasta, they should call it love potion number nine.
	I don't know if they're going to do that, but I think they ought to.
	The news from Washington, such as it is, really isn't much.
	The big thing today is the fight over the gas tax.
	It's kind of dumb.
	The president had a news conference.
	Bob Dole had a news conference.
	The president said he wanted two good clean bills.
	A temporary repeal of the 4.3 cent gas tax.
	Temporary, through that wording.
	And a hike in the minimum wage.
	He'd want that to be permanent.
	Bob Dole said, well, okay, let's do it.
	But we'll have three clean bills.
	We'll have the repeal of the gas tax.
	I think Bob Dole wants it to be permanent.
	Yes, we'll have a hike in the minimum wage.
	And number three, a union labor act, also clean, called the Team Act.
	Well, late in the day, President said he'd veto number three.
	And Bob Dole said, una momento, you're going to veto that?
	Well, then we're back to square one.
	Look, folks, it's what I told you a long time ago about gas prices, and NBC did a big deal on it yesterday.
	They finally admitted the truth about it all.
	Gas prices are about to fall anyway.
	What the president's going to do with one day's supply injected into the system is the only way you'd really affect anything because you're affecting supply and demand.
	But, you know, it's kind of like spitting in the ocean.
	It's good old-fashioned supply and demand that's really going to cure this, and it is being cured.
	Foreign oil imports are up.
	Refinery output is up.
	Inventories are up.
	Wholesale gas in the last week went from 77 to 68 cents.
	More importantly, crude oil has fallen $4 per barrel since February.
	So all of this is going to be apparent at the pump soon.
	Prices should fall by about the middle of this month.
	So that you might know what other nations pay for their gas.
	In the U.S. now, we have an average of $1.46 per gallon.
	Britain, $299.
	Japan, $390.
	And in the Netherlands, if you want to tool about, it will cost you $4.43 a gallon.
	So the whole thing, the political manipulation of this is exactly that political manipulation, and it's ridiculous.
	Supply and demand is what is either going to cure or kill all of this.
	Anyway, it's a useless argument.
	And what is of interest is the recent Harris poll that shows Bill Clinton 31 points ahead of Bob Dole.
	And the obvious question is, is there any way, any way that you can see that Bob Dole could possibly, in any way, beat Bill Clinton?
	If there is, if you know of any way, I would certainly be interested in knowing about it.
	And by the way, one of the reasons that I want to bring the author, the co-author of Lucifer's Hammer in is I'm beginning to get word of an asteroid that is out there.
	And I'll try and dig out what information I have on it.
	We've done a couple of what-if shows regarding asteroids.
	And yesterday morning, coincidentally, I sat down and watched something.
	I wonder how many of you recall a movie called Without Warning.
	Without Warning.
	I thought that's one of the best things a network ever put together.
	And I sat down and watched Without Warning again.
	It is one chilling movie.
	I don't think you can get a copy of it.
	I think it was CBS that ran it, and they ran it one time only.
	It was, when was that?
	Was it Halloween?
	I think it was Halloween.
	They did it on the anniversary, on Halloween.
	And what a frightening movie that was about a comet headed toward Earth.
	And I wouldn't want to spoil it for anybody who's not seen it yet, but it had a remarkable ending to it.
	All right, what we're going to do is open line talk radio.
	Kvorkian has struck again in Michigan, and he'll probably end up going on trial once again.
	There is a guy I'd like to interview, Kvorkian.
	I'd love to interview Kvorkian.
	Anybody knows how to get hold of Kvorkian?
	By all means, get hold of him and tell him I want to interview him.
	The Whitewater testimony continues.
	The U.S. is threatening China with sanctions because they keep copying our software, and it's never-ending.
	There's a new report out today saying pollution kills, ooh, what a surprise, 64,000 Americans meeting their early grave due to pollution.
	Maybe that's where the chupacabra came from.
	Who knows?
	The Court of Appeals has rejected our president's attempt to further delay the Paula Jones case.
	The president presently has until May 16th to file a petition with the U.S. Supreme Court to get all this stopped.
	Otherwise, the president goes to trial, via civil trial.
	And yesterday we talked a bit about drugs, and I said I didn't say that we should do it.
	I started something really big.
	I didn't say that we should do it.
	Are you listening to me now?
	I said that it would work, that the government or anybody else could, in effect, interdict some drugs, hardcore drugs, you know, crack cocaine, perhaps, heroin, that sort of thing, and covertly poison those drugs.
	And the net effect would be people would stop using them.
	Well, not all people.
	It's true, the hardcore addicts would continue to use those drugs.
	Of course, they'd be dropping dead, so they wouldn't be back for more.
	And everybody who was using them socially would go, uh-uh, I don't want any of that stuff, thank you.
	So, you know, that caused all hell to break loose here on the program yesterday when I said that they called it and said, but that'd be murder.
	Well, in a war, people die.
	In a war, when people die, they don't call it murder.
	Would it be in this case?
unidentified		well i suppose technically so you Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Anything is fair a game for talk radio here.
		Anything at all you want to talk about, let's rock.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, how you doing?
unidentified		This is Rafael from Bakersfield.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, Rafael.
unidentified		Yeah, I'm listening to you through 840 KVEG.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
unidentified		I'm buckling in the Bakersfield station because they don't give you the Dreamland complete.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I see.
unidentified		I'm telling everybody in Bakersfield, watch it on 840.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, you don't watch.
		We're not on television, Rafael.
		We're radio, so you've got to listen to it on 840.
		Or, of course, KNZR in Baker's C. All right.
unidentified		Anyway, I want to talk about the drug.
unidentified		Remember, about 15 years ago, marijuana was contaminated with phenomenal.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Paraquat.
		Paraquat.
		It was called Paraquat.
unidentified		Paraquat, yeah.
unidentified		That didn't stop it at all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But that also didn't kill people.
unidentified		Well, made them very sick, though.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Made them sick.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was a big difference.
unidentified		Yeah.
		Another thing I want to tell you about is about, you talk about the character of Clinton all the time.
		Well, I don't know if you remember Reagan.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I remember Reagan.
unidentified		Reagan, yeah.
unidentified		I mean, he was married to Jane Wyman.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
unidentified		You know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
unidentified		And he got Nancy Wilson impregnated.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		I mean, you know, being a married man.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But I mean, he did marry her, right?
unidentified		Well, after that, but talk about character, man.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He married her, though?
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		You are nothing to chupacabra.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He did the honorable thing.
		That's quite a jump.
		Now we're going to talk about chupacabra, all right?
unidentified		Well, I have a lot of things.
unidentified		you should read the latest Roswell letter too Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you're right, I should.
unidentified		Yeah, chubacabra.
unidentified		You know, chubacabra, what it is?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What is it?
unidentified		It's the ghost of British Nixon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Ghost of British Nixon.
		You know, you joke.
		People are joking, but this animal, this creature, this thing is real.
		Moreover, it's here.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		I had a comment about the chupacabra.
		Yes.
		as I listened, I'm calling from Boulder City, Nevada.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		As I listened to your program tonight, about it's the first time I've ever heard of them.
unidentified		Um I it seems to draw a lot of parallels to another elusive creature, the Sasquatch.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah.
unidentified		Um something that you know people have seen have evidence of its being that have never caught.
		And I have a feeling that's going to be the same thing with the tupacabra.
		It's been around so long that nobody's ever going to catch it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you never know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, maybe the dumb thing will run into a boxed alley or something one of these days, and they'll get it.
unidentified		Yeah, that's kind of like Sasquatch.
unidentified		You think you'd jump out, like the movie Harry and the Henderson.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know what I don't like about this?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, anything that could run, say, 65 miles an hour, if you were within sight of it and it decided that it wanted you, it would have you.
unidentified		Yeah.
		Yeah.
		Just imagine if a Sasquatch was a meat eater.
		Maybe it is.
		Imagine if it ate people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, meat's bad enough, but this blood thing.
unidentified		Yeah, it's kind of gruesome.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yuck.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
		Thank you very much, and watch your neck.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello?
unidentified		Hi, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, hello.
unidentified		Yeah, hi.
		I was calling to talk about the chupacabra.
		I tried desperately to get through before I really wanted to talk to Tito.
		First of all, I'm in Washington.
		My name's Sean.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		And what I wanted to talk to him about is I spent some time down in Peru in a little village called Yushintaida.
		And the shaman down there, which is really unusual, he had a pipe carved out of this creature.
		And the first time I saw the creature, I said, I asked him, through the translator, I said, what is that?
		And he explained to me through the translator that that was the spirit that protected the village.
		And that creature that was carved was a winged creature.
		And what was most amazing about it is they had put these two huge red-orange beads in the creature as eyes.
		It had wings, big, huge ears.
		And I asked him, have you seen this creature?
		And he said many times.
		And he told everyone at night, he said, if you see this creature, do not follow it into the jungle.
		It's very, very bad, but it is a protector.
		And what they believe, and I wanted to ask Tito if he had had any reports about this at all, is that it came from the spirit world.
		And it was a protector.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		However, they believed...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you want to hold on?
unidentified		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Stay where you are.
		We'll bring you back after the break.
		It's our nickel.
		These are the settler companies.
unidentified		All the time you've given me.
		conscience I guess.
		If I was walking in your shoes I wouldn't worry none.
		But you and your friends don't worry about me.
		Captain flowers on the wall.
		That don't bother me at all.
		Playing solitary to do with the deck of 51.
		Smoking cigarettes and watching captains dangerous.
		Now don't tell me I've nothing to do.
		Last night I dressed in tails.
		It's all the time three times like the swinger down.
		Please don't give a fuck with me.
		I'll let it go in front.
		You can always find me bigger than having quite a time.
		Countless flowers on the wall that don't bother me at all.
		Playin'solitaire till dawn with a deck of 51.
		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight, featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It certainly is.
		And I've got a little information for you here.
		Remember I told you I'm pursuing Dr. Jerry Parnell, co-author of Lucifer's Hammer?
		Let me tell you one of the reasons why.
		I got this delivered to me on the internet today.
		Astronomers are keeping a watchful eye on Macholtz II, a comet discovered to be racing toward the sun by an American scientist last month.
		Shortly after the comet was discovered, observers reported the comet had broken up in a manner similar to comet Shoemaker-Levy 9 before its impact with Jupiter in July.
		There is some concern the fragments of Comet Markols II could impact the Earth in the future.
		Five fragments have been spotted thus far.
		All are headed for Earth's orbit.
		However, astronomers warn it is extremely difficult to predict the long-term behavior of the comet fragments and advise the comet will be monitored closely.
		That was from Dr. Byron Weeks, who signs it, Let a Smile Be Your Umbrella.
		West of the Rockies, you're back on the air again.
		Hi.
unidentified		Yeah, hi, Art.
		Anyway, I was speaking to you about, I didn't catch the first part of what Tito said, but what I was curious about was whether or not, because I actually have, I brought home with me, because I was so amazed at this creature, because the shaman had said that he had physically seen the creature and that it was the protector of the village.
		I have a staff with a carving of this creature on it with the big orange eyes in it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow.
unidentified		And I was wondering, what they believe is it's from the spirit world, but they believe that it comes from Middle Earth.
		And what I was wondering was whether Tito had spoke at all about if there had been any knowledge or anyone to come forth saying that it was the possibility or if he had any reports.
		I know they'd be obviously a lot more difficult.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		As in from the earth.
unidentified		Not from the earth, but from the spirit world itself.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, yes, yes.
		All right.
		Look, we had a man who was the state director for MUFON in Florida, presently in Los Angeles, who I brought on the program.
		He said there was a report of somebody who had literally seen the earth open.
		Strange, I know it sounds strange.
		But this might indeed be the source of these creatures.
		Might be.
		I don't know.
		I have no way of knowing.
unidentified		I have no way of knowing.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, back to it we go.
		Frankly, I am not surprised by reports of the chupacabra.
		I'm not surprised that these kinds of things are going on.
		Somehow, it all fits in, doesn't it?
		I'm not sure how, but it all fits in with what's going on in the world today.
		It just sort of fits in.
		New diseases, new creatures, new things just about every day.
		Maybe it's always been that way.
		I don't know.
		But it does seem to be accelerating, doesn't it?
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Barbie from Mace, Arizona.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Barbie.
unidentified		And I wanted to let you know about that odd soda that you guys have been talking about.
		You mean love potion number nine?
		I wouldn't exactly call it that.
		That's piranha that they put in that, which is a really high caffeine herb from South America.
		It is not an aphrodisiac.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, dear, would you turn your radio off for us, please?
unidentified		Oh, I'm sorry, I missed one.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You mean you have multiple radios on?
unidentified		Got to be able to hear you.
unidentified		I can only hear the one in the bedroom in the bedroom.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I see.
		All right.
		Well, you say it is not an aphrodisiac.
unidentified		It's not an aphrodisiac.
unidentified		Actually, it's an adrenal stimulant.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, maybe that is, for some, an aphrodisiac.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And maybe if people think it's an aphrodisiac, it is.
unidentified		You're right.
unidentified		There is a psychological factor to it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
unidentified		But that's what it is.
		It's Guana, and it's an herb from South America, which is like caffeine.
		It is caffeine.
		That's basically what it is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Caffeine is thought by many to be a stimulant, an aphrodisiac.
		So maybe in that loose sense, they're classing it there.
		Anyway, it's bound to be popular.
unidentified		Have you had any?
unidentified		I've used Guarana before in conjunction with a diet, but didn't do anything for me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A diet, huh?
unidentified		Sure.
		It's like caffeine.
		It stimulates your nervous system and it depresses your appetite.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, thank you very much.
		It seems anything that would do that water could be said to have aphrodisiac qualities to it.
		I think that'll change the name.
		Hey, PepsiCo, change the name.
		You know, if you're going to stick your neck out, go out all the way.
		Call it Love Potion Number 9.
		It'll sell like crazy.
		Wild card line, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Yes, you've got the shadow here from Citrus Heights.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Shadow.
unidentified		Yeah, I want to ask you three things.
		First of all, could you play the cat sound effect you got?
		I'm recording your show, and I'd like to play it back for my parents' cat.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		For your parents' cat?
unidentified		Uh-huh, sure.
		The other thing I want to say, I got an idea for a good guest host.
		Wouldn't you say you're on vacation or something?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Say I am, yes.
unidentified		Yeah, have you heard of Ray Cara Farrell?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I've heard of Ray.
		I thought you might.
		Are you kidding?
unidentified		Am I kidding?
		Of course I'm kidding.
		I just had to sort it because I know most of your listeners have never heard of him, and of course us on the West Coast have heard of him.
		So I thought I'd throw that out just to see what your reaction would be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		my reaction is that my audience would lynch me when i got back in the country that that you know Ray's actually a very nice guy, but I don't think he'd precisely fit in, you know?
unidentified		Oh, anyway, I just want to say hello to everyone working for Premium Security.
unidentified		That's the company I work for.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Premium Security, huh?
unidentified		Yep.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, you got in your plug.
unidentified		Okay, bye.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thanks.
		Bye.
		Ray's a good guy, actually.
		Ray is every inch the liberal on in San Francisco.
		And I've listened to Ray for years.
		It's the only radio I ever kicked.
		Once I kicked a radio listening to Ray.
		It was a horrible thing to do.
		I regret it to this day.
		He's something else.
		Anyway, by request, here it comes.
		Get any cats you have off your lap.
		I hereby warn you get them off your lap, or they're going to do a peel-out on your lap that you're not going to like one bit, because here comes the...
		So good.
		Even my cats, who have heard it now a million times, react the same way every time they hear it.
		They go absolutely nuts.
		I am convinced the following is a real true sound of a cat getting its tail stepped on.
		And you've got to see the expression on your cat.
		Dogs like it, dogs like it.
		They seem to enjoy it when the sound, you know, it's obviously a cat in great distress.
		I really suspect a tail being crunched or something.
		I don't know.
		I don't know how they got it, but I bet that's how they got it.
		Anyway, check this out.
		Turn the volume up and watch your cat's face.
		Here it comes.
		Absolutely guaranteed.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello, Miss Vell.
		Hi.
		I had a kind of a folklore story from the Philippines.
		It has to do kind of with the Chuca Cabra type thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Over in the Philippines, they have what's called the Mononangal.
		Have you ever heard of it?
		No, I haven't.
		It's kind of a vampire-like creature where it at night leaves the lower half of its body in the room, flies out the window, go around the land taking young children.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		Anyway, I heard about this down at language school in psychological operations for the Army.
		And they talked about how the CIA back, I don't know, I think it was in the 70s, used to do, they used to grab people, the rebels.
		They grab one of the guys and take him off and kill him, drain out his blood and leave him.
		That's kind of a psychological type thing.
		So I don't know how much truth there is to it, but it's kind of an interesting story.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		they finished the folklore and that he said it's like that The problem is, at the moment, it's not.
unidentified		That's true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I don't want to see one of these things.
		I don't want to meet one of them.
		I wouldn't try to catch one.
		And if I saw one, you know, I'd run.
unidentified		Turn tail.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you've got a turntail.
		That's right.
		All right.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		But I'm just not surprised.
		A new animal?
		An old animal?
		An animal from down under?
		And I'm not talking about Australia.
		I don't know.
		Something's here, though.
		Knocking at the door.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		I'm Mr. Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Caller.
unidentified		How you doing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing.
unidentified		This is Leonard from the Tan and Don and I'm in Alma River calling you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bear County, right?
unidentified		You get there.
unidentified		B-E-X-A-R, but it's pronounced B-E-A-R.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I finally got that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Believe me, I made that mistake once, and I got 10,000 faxes from Bear County.
unidentified		I've been signed for a couple hours now to get it home with you.
		A little footnote on the Chickacubra?
		Yes.
		Just been there before.
		Back in the late 60s, it was caused a...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The size of a small airplane?
unidentified		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		great Sir, I haven't been home in about months, months and a half on the trip driver.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, so you're not in San Antonio now?
unidentified		Well, I'm from all over the United States.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you now?
unidentified		I'm in Amarillo.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Amarillo?
		Yes, sir.
		Okay.
		Well, all right, thank you very much.
		Yes, there are, I can tell you, I was asking because I already knew, there are a lot of stories running now about Chipcabra in San Antonio.
		And if you look at a map, if you look carefully at a map and look where San Antonio is, it's no big surprise.
		Look at Mexico, look at San Antonio, and look at the southern U.S. border and California.
		I don't know about this all the reports we're getting right now from Oregon, but it makes sense that it would be hitting in the border areas first.
		And bear in mind, there is a story from Mexico City.
		It was on Mexican television.
		Network showing a man who had been unfortunately attacked by a troop of Cabra.
		So it's getting fairly serious.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Deborah in Columbia, South Carolina.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Deborah.
unidentified		I was thinking about your recent show on the Philadelphia experiment and the cloaking process that the gentleman said he could reproduce.
		And it reminded me of the chupacabra being able to appear and disappear.
		And I wonder if during these experiments they've maybe opened some kind of door and let something in they didn't know about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's entirely possible.
unidentified		Well, thanks, Artisher.
unidentified		Enjoy your show.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
		Take care.
		Sure.
		Who knows?
		It is absolutely open to speculation at this point.
		Where it's from, whether it's something old, something new, something from somebody's lab.
		You name it.
		It's open for speculation right now.
		The only thing that seems fairly sure is that there is something here.
unidentified		Something has arrived.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Figures would be something like this, huh?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Ben from Seattle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Ben.
unidentified		I've just got a quick question.
		I'm curious.
		The guest you had on earlier, Tito Armstrong.
		Right, Armstrong.
		He mentioned that there were some hit songs in Puerto Rico.
		Well, as a matter of fact, Chupacabra?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		As a matter of fact, if you go to his webpage, I believe you can download one of them.
unidentified		Okay.
		I was curious if I could access one of those.
		I don't have a computer myself, but I have some friends who do.
		So maybe I'll look for that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Talk to your friends.
unidentified		I will do that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Thanks a lot.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		See you later.
unidentified		Oh, chupacabra.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can't do that at all.
		East of the Rockies?
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Yes.
		Hello, Mr. Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Excellent program there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I try to do programs that other people don't do.
		You know, people say I'm nuts.
		Maybe I am.
unidentified		Okay, I'll try to run through the quick list here.
		Matter of fact, last week I heard Stanton Friedman on a Florida radio program that there was a UFO crash in Brazil somewhere to...
		No.
		Wrong.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wrong, wrong.
unidentified		Wrong.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Stanton is going down to a conference in Brazil.
		well no her program there was maybe you were in the middle or somewhere there about further south america for the rumor was that it was a u_-f_o_ crash from what i heard from stanley's not true uh...
		if it grew out of the fact that he is going to a conference in brazil okay well i did but well what they talked about was that that there there was two bodies one who had passed away then one was taken in the united states and then possible the chupacabra there are you know the uh...
unidentified		alien connections are we say some sort of hybrid uh...
		well you know uh...
		yet there is a lady talked about opening that window shall we say yes the uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		well what do you think i let me ask you what you think do you think this chupacabra thing is real or do you think it is just some growing myth well i would not be surprised if it were real simply is that there information you gather from different sources uh...
unidentified		the uh...
		that they have the wild man in russia they call it they use observed at the speeds of forty five miles an hour uh...
		uh...
		it was you know the matter of fact i was i i got a i got a kick out of both out in the garage uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		moving things around i've got to get a car in our restoration vehicle and i heard the the person call up about the raptors and i thought finally you know i mean that sort of speed something with that sort of potential sounds like a raptor doesn't it well it would be to have that sort of speed it you know uh...
unidentified		the archaeopteryx was the uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		you know sort of the forefront of the the bird shall we say nowadays uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		present day or the it's enough to make a person agoraphobic well coming it would certainly uh...
unidentified		the acquired data growth and park with your dog and then uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		one of these things fly down and scoop your dog up and he's gone you know so i don't know the plan to play a little bit like a light in the plane of barks disappearing into the sunset yes in san francisco art all hell broke loose today the headlines screamed congress assails same sex marriage and families intact and city blasts
		policy and such regarding a bill introduced to define marriage as one man one woman bill introduced to define marriage as one man one woman when my faxer says are people going to decide that they need to speak up or are we in an era where families are to become non-existent marriage is a biblical
		term in states where same-sex marriages proposed the statutes force churches and synagogues to fall under the political strong arm of having to perform such marriages if union with a term it will almost be different but know the term marriage is used in all cases to one make folks feel normal adoption is next because when marriage doesn't do it maybe kids will to eliminate the objections
		of uh...
		the bible and quran and such uh...
		bleeding churches synagogues and temples and three paved the way for the port formation of an official religion in violation of the first amendment but who cares under a world government come on folks wake up art in san francisco well how do you guys feel about that
		marriage be defined by law as one man one woman west of the rockies you're on the air bill that's me hey john from sacramento hello john how you doing i'm doing the show yes just wanted to say uh that was it huh i think that was his attempt at gabriel's horn wasn't a very good one was it that was more like Tim's horn or something.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Yes, who's this, Liz?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Who are you calling?
unidentified		I'm trying to get a hold of Art Bill.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well then, this is your lucky day.
unidentified		Oh, finally.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, where are you?
unidentified		Leavenworth, Kansas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Leavenworth.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		Yes, I'm calling about the Chupacabras.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Because my parents reside in Puerto Rico.
unidentified		And I had heard about this a long, long time ago when it first came out in the news.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		And it was brought out by the mayor of the town where this creature first appeared.
unidentified		It's called Canovanas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh.
unidentified		And it's a very small town almost at the foot of the El Junque National Forest.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		And when he first brought it out, you know, and called the news and the law enforcement, everybody was like making fun of him.
		Saying, well, he's just trying to call attention to himself.
		But he persisted with the information that this is really going on.
		And then I think there was an interview in one of the Univición Spanish shows, Cristina.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you believe the chupacabra is very real, I take it.
unidentified		I think so, because when my parents sent me the newspapers from Puerto Rico, and they had pictures of the animals with these wounds on their neck.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		And, I mean, the story was all over the place.
unidentified		And in this Cristina show in Univision, they interviewed one of the veterinarians that looked at the animals.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, dear, I've got a break coming up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can you hold?
unidentified		Sure, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, we'll hold you through the news and come right back to you.
		Super cover.
		Animals coming across.
unidentified		Bloodsuckers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Strange times.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Cursed to live in strange times, folks.
unidentified		No due to wind, the sun, and the rain.
		Come on, baby.
		Baby, take my hand.
		We'll be able to fly.
		Baby, I'm your man.
		Reviewer Radio Network presents Artfell somewhere in time.
		Tonight's program originally aired May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Batten down the hatches, everybody.
		I'm about to change the subject, and it's going to get very serious.
		Well, I guess the chupacabra is very serious in its own way, but I've got a story here that's going to curl your hair, so get ready.
unidentified		you you Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let us finish up with this young lady.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry, where were you?
unidentified		Leavenworth, Kansas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Home of the famous prison.
unidentified		Yep.
unidentified		Got it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That is what Leavenworth is famous for, right?
unidentified		That's true.
unidentified		And a couple of other prisons are on this place called Prison Town.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Prison Town, huh?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, anyway, on La Chupacabra.
unidentified		Yes, going back to the Chupacabras.
unidentified		Yeah, this animal first appeared in Puerto Rico, and lately it's been appearing all over the place, but it's also been all over the island, too, in different towns, different, you know, like west coast, east coast, southern coast of the island.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And it's getting pretty weird.
		At first, you know, I was skeptical too, you know, you know, this is just publicity, whatever.
		But then I watched Unsolved Mysteries, and they had sent a crew down there, too, to look into it.
		And some other people that are related to like to UFOs and things like that also went down there to look into it, but nothing has come out.
		No one has come up with anything real about, you know, what's going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Even our Linda Howell from Dreamland has gone down there and interviewed people who have seen this damn thing.
		And so I, too, have come around.
		I first thought myth, weird, odd, and so forth and so on.
		But now the reports appear to be everywhere.
unidentified		Right, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So we've got it here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you originally from Puerto Rico?
unidentified		Yes, I am.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I can tell by the way you say chupacabra so well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let me hear you say it one more time.
unidentified		Chupacabra.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, cute.
unidentified		All right.
unidentified		And the way it's got its name is because the first animals that were dead were goats, and the farmer union just named the animal Mr. Chupacabra.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, let's hope it doesn't acquire a taste for little Puerto Rican girls.
unidentified		I hope not.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'll see you later.
unidentified		Okay, I love your show.
		Thank you.
		Carry on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take care.
		Carry on.
		Well, carry on in a moment is going to be some pretty serious stuff.
		This comes under the category of I told you so, I guess.
		It comes to me from KONA, our affiliate in Tri-Cities, Washington.
		Thank you, Fred.
		It is an Associated Press story.
		And Fred writes to me, Art, a little something this morning to brighten your day.
		Associated Press, folks, in case you want to know where it's from.
		Oregon News.
		Members of the Eastern Oregon Militia say they are prepared to declare war.
		I said, declare war on the U.S. military if the Freeman standoff in Montana should turn violent.
		Walt Hase, that's H-A-S-S-E-Y, who describes himself as legal advisor to the militia, says there are no civilian targets.
		He says the targets are going to be the military.
		The FBI going on here issued a nationwide alert to law enforcement agencies on April 23rd, warning of a militia war plan.
		I told you about that.
		Hasse says the Eastern Oregon militia has a plan called Operation Clean Sweep to defend the Freemen and protect their rights.
		Hasse warns, if federal agents storm in and people are killed in Montana, there's going to be retribution.
		He says military members won't have to go to Montana.
		He says there are military targets in other states.
		At the same time, he says the public has nothing to fear.
		He says the militia is not involved in terrorism.
		So the Oregon militia, according to this story, has plans to go to war against the U.S. military if the Freemen are attacked.
		I would like to talk to somebody, maybe this man Massey or a member of the Oregon militia.
		So I am hereby setting aside a line for somebody in the Oregon militia or this man Massey to call the program.
		Everybody else, stop calling my first-time caller line, all right?
		I'm going to try, ever hopeful, to hold this line open only for members of the Eastern Oregon Militia or this Massey fellow who appears to be a spokesman for them.
		And as I said, I'll tell you what, this comes under the category of, I told you So, I told you so.
		Anyway, that number open right now is area code 702-727-1222.
		Please call right now: 702-727-1222.
		If you're in the Eastern Oregon Militia or if you're this massey fellow, or if you know about this, what do you suppose is going to happen if militias begin declaring war on the U.S. military?
		If they begin attacking, forget civilian targets, if they begin attacking military targets in the U.S., and I've got a list here in that warning.
		So now, this certainly comes under the category of here we go again.
		The story I read you was Associated Press.
		Cursed to live in interesting times, huh?
		No wonder LeTupacabra is here.
		If you suffer from headaches, neck aches, low back discomfort, rheumatism, bursitis, joint pain, if you bent your thumb back the way I did, what an abysmal injury that was.
		I hurt myself.
unidentified		I really, really hurt myself.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I had pain that can only be described as the worst pain you would have when you have a toothache.
		I mean sharp, jabbing pain.
		You wouldn't think your thumb could hurt that way, but I'll tell you what, it can.
		I used Laprina on it, and it took that pain from a sharp, hurting, jabbing pain right down to a dull ache, and that was an amazing, absolutely amazing transition.
		This is liquid aspirin.
unidentified		It's real aspirin in a bottle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, actually, in a spray bottle, soon to be in a roll-on.
		But right now, a spray bottle, all you do is go, spray it on, rub it in a little bit, and the pain's gone like that.
		You see, I can snap my finger at my thumb, and, you know, I can do that again, thanks to Laprina.
		Health naturally sells it, and you just have got to get yourself some.
		It belongs in your medicine cabinet.
		Whoever told you you've got to take aspirin by mouth, I guess just didn't know about Laprina.
		The number to call to order is 1-800-308-4565.
		1-800-308-4565.
		What we're going to do again, I mean this, if you're calling my first-time caller line, hang up.
		You'll be wasting your money unless you are a member of the Eastern Oregon militia or you are a man named Massey who is the spokesman for them.
		We're going to set up a little discussion here, I think.
		This is really serious stuff.
		Can you do that?
		can you threaten to attack the military?
		That's not exactly...
		It's awfully damn close, isn't it?
		So if you're in the militia, you call me at area code 702-727-1222, and we'll get a bit of a discussion going here.
		Here we go.
		This is somebody who we are going to identify only as Jay.
		That's not his real name.
		He is in Oregon, is that right?
		Somewhere in Oregon, not to be identified where, right, Jay?
unidentified		That's true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Jay, are you a member of the militia?
unidentified		That's true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, did you hear the story I just read from the Associated Press?
unidentified		I heard the story that you just read.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you know that to be roughly accurate?
unidentified		I know that to be roughly accurate, and I also know that Oregon is not the only person involved in this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I've been hearing about this now for some days, Jay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the plan would be then if the Freemen are attacked, the Oregon militia, or at least that part of it, and other militias across the country unnamed, will attack military targets.
unidentified		This is true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you want to give me your reasoning for doing that?
unidentified		Simply because the government is overstepping its boundaries here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I take it you sympathize with the Freemen's plight.
unidentified		I sympathize with all militias and all militias and the Freemen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you worry at all, Jay, that were you to begin attacking the military, there would virtually be a war?
unidentified		You know, I don't want to talk on this line too long because I'm afraid I'm going to be traced.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, you won't be traced, not by me.
		I promise you.
		We've got no caller ID here, despite my jokes, and you're not going to be traced.
		You're not going to be traced.
		Look, this is in the major media now anyway.
		Here it is in the Associated Press, Jay, so it's not like it's a big secret anymore.
		Once it hits the AP, it's out.
unidentified		Craig, but they don't know our agenda.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, tell me, what is your agenda?
unidentified		We're sick of being limited by government.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think it's realistic, Jay, to imagine that you can have an effect on the U.S. military, that you can have an effect on U.S. policy by attacking hard targets, military targets?
unidentified		I don't know.
unidentified		I seriously don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Don't you think it would be suicidal?
unidentified		I probably.
unidentified		But the Afghanistan has held a hell of a force against Russia.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They did.
		It's true.
		Can you tell me or us, all of us, it's not just you say the Eastern Oregon militia.
unidentified		art um...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		i go off the line call you back at a different number i'd be you know your chances of getting through a slim and none but i've heard i I understand.
		All right.
		Yes, you may.
unidentified		Thank you.
unidentified		take care Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, I don't know what to say to that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Except, I guess I've been expecting it.
unidentified		you know how serious is this?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you ready for this?
		Are we ready for this?
		Do the people who are about ready to do this understand what they're going to be doing?
unidentified		God help us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		On my first time caller line, you're on the air.
		Yes, now you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello.
		Calling from LaGrand, Oregon.
		My name's DJ.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		DJ, huh?
unidentified		That's right.
		All right.
		I'm 20 years old, and I just got off work.
		I listen to you all the time.
		Great show.
		I'm scared.
		I live in the town of LaGrand.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're Eastern Oregon, aren't you?
unidentified		Eastern Oregon.
		That's the paper you read.
		Yeah.
		That's our local paper.
		So, you know, this hits home definitely.
		I'm not in a position where I would, you know, I'm not concerned about this yet.
		And I don't really...
		No, it wasn't their nickname.
		It was their motto.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's their motto?
unidentified		It was Liberator of the Oppressed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Liberator of the Oppressed, huh?
unidentified		Yes.
unidentified		Liberator of the Oppressed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I guess they were referring to the free men and people like the Freemen who were having problems with the IRS and government agencies, that kind of thing.
unidentified		I suppose so.
		Only, you know, at this point in time, I really don't see who is so oppressed.
		We have it pretty good here in our country, and I think people need to take a step back and look around and really understand.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Man, I'm telling you, this is dangerous.
unidentified		This is very dangerous, Art.
		It scares me.
		It really does.
		But I have to take a position myself that says I'm not going to get too excited about anything until they come to my front door and kick it down and come inside and hurt me or my family or take things away from us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know what?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		By then, it's kind of too late.
unidentified		Well, you know, Art, you're right.
unidentified		But I think if I did anything else, I would be taking an offensive position, and that's not right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hear you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take care.
		Yeah, I understand what he says.
		In other words, become proactive at this point.
		You're becoming offensive.
		You're going into an offensive posture, and most people are like that man.
		I mean, they're not going to do anything until somebody ends up at their door, huh?
		Oh, my God.
		Well, I'm shocked and I'm saddened, but I'm afraid I'm not surprised.
		I really did expect this sort of thing, and I knew in my heart that it was going on below the surface.
		You know, I've been getting vibes of this now for months, so I knew it was going on.
		This is, you know, this is insurrection, folks.
		This is insurrection.
		Pure D. You may not say the words, overthrow the government, but I'll tell you what, if you begin attacking military installations, there's going to be a war.
		And I'll tell you the funny thing about wars, you know, I've been in them.
		I know a little about war.
		And that is, once they start, they're a hell of a lot easier to start than they are to stop.
		When blood flows, look at Ireland.
		Look at the Middle East.
		Look at Somalia.
		Look anywhere you want to look where civil wars have raged for years.
		They sustain themselves no matter what it is that begins a war.
		Momentum and bloodletting and retaliation, all these things keep it going.
		It's a hell of a lot easier to get going and keep going than it is to stop once it's started, believe me.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
unidentified		This is Jay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, well, you made it back.
unidentified		I made it back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, good.
		Jay, you know, this scares the hell out of me.
		I mean, doesn't it scare you guys?
unidentified		If I, I'll tell you what, our ancestors from the Revolutionary War, did it scare them to establish freedom in this country?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, I'm sure it did.
		And a lot of them were hung.
		A lot of the people who signed the Declaration of Independence swung from trees and had their lives ruined.
unidentified		Sir, we're ready to have this done.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I can tell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I can hear that in your voice, and I can read it in this story that I just got.
unidentified		My rights have been violated, sir.
		My rights have been violated.
		You're going to tell me what kind of weapon I can own?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well.
unidentified		You're going to tell me what I can and I cannot say in public.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What do you want to own, Jay?
		What kind of weapon do you want to own?
		That you can't, that is.
unidentified		Sir, I have been limited to the amount of rounds I can carry in my firearm.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I tell you what I'm going to do, Jay.
		I'm coming up on a break.
		It's the bottom of the hour.
		I assume that you're on a phone now that you're fairly comfortable with, right?
unidentified		I'm on a phone that I am sure that they have the technology to trace.
		I don't want to sit too long And be traced, if it is possible for me to be traced.
		Not that I distrust you, Art, because I listen to your program every day.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, well, look, what I'd like to do is set up a debate between you and anybody else, somebody else.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you willing to go for that?
unidentified		If I can be sworn to that I am not traced.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm swearing to you that I certainly will not trace your line, and I wouldn't be part of anything that would.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So as far as I know, you're perfectly safe.
unidentified		If I'm perfectly safe, I'm willing to debate anybody on this subject.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, then I'll find somebody for you.
		In the meantime, you're not going to hear anything during the break.
		I'll just keep you on hold.
		Stand by, Jay.
unidentified		Sir, may I pick you up here?
		Hold on.
		I don't get basketball, but it's not enough.
		I don't get asked, there's no way you can.
		Yes, tell me how you call me Yes, tell me how you call me You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an on-core presentation of Coast to Coast AM from May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, everybody.
		This should be a classic.
		I've got Jay, who says he's a member of the Eastern Oregon Militia.
		And I'm going to bring him up on one line.
		Jay, are you there?
unidentified		Hello, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		And I have for you a debate partner, Jay, the Liberals, Liberal from Southern California.
		His name is Charlie.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And you both know what the topic is.
		You both know who the other person is.
		The air is yours.
unidentified		Sure.
		Why don't you go first?
		I don't have to go first.
		know my position yeah your position is the uh...
		Let me put it this way.
		Would you say that the act in Oklahoma, was that an act of terrorism, in your opinion?
		I think that was an act of terrorism.
		Yes, sir, I do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Uh-huh.
unidentified		Well, then, why wouldn't you say this is why wouldn't you say what you're endorsing is an act of terrorism?
		I'm being violated by the government, sir.
		You're being violated by the government.
		Do you understand that when you talk about the people who work for the government, I work for the government, I work for the...
		You know something?
		I'm really getting sick and tired of morons like yourself talking about, oh, you know something?
		I should own whatever kind of weapon I want to own, and if I can't, I'm going to go out and kill some kind of police officer so that I can do that.
		Who do you think?
		Sir, did I ever say I was going to kill a police officer?
		Did I?
		Who do you think you are?
		Did I?
		Did I ever say I was going to go out and kill a police officer?
		Did I ever say I was going to kill anybody?
		Well, you declared war.
		No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
		Did I say that?
		Haven't you declared war?
		I don't know.
		Did I say I was going to kill anybody?
		See, you're just like Bill Clinton.
		You twist my words to mean what you want them to mean.
		You're just like the media.
		You want to twist my words to make them mean what you want to do.
		You want to come in with me.
		But in most wars, people get killed, don't they?
		Do they?
		Yeah, in wars, people do get killed.
		Well, then, if you declare war on somebody, that means you're going to kill them, don't it?
		Did I say I declared war?
		Did I say we declared war?
		No, I did not.
		Aren't you?
		Oh, so they have declared war on you.
		Is that right?
		You bend my words whichever way you want to bend them.
		Just like your man sitting in Washington bends my words.
		So under no circumstances will you pick up a gun and actively go out and kill federal police officers.
		Is that correct?
		I will not go out and kill federal police officers.
		I will not.
		Okay.
		And then thirdly...
		Well, then what the heck do you guys, why don't you guys have any respect for authority then?
		I have respect for authority, but I also have respect for my United States Constitution, sir.
		Oh, you have respect for your United States Constitution?
		Yes, I do.
		Uh-huh.
		Let me tell you something.
		You look at those jerks in Montana, they don't have any respect for the Constitution.
		What they have respect for is themselves, and that's what you have to understand.
		They have respect for the mighty dollar and for getting as much as they can get and basically screwing over the people, their neighbors.
		And that's why their neighbors can't stand them.
		That's what the problem is there.
		In Southern California, where do you live?
		Where do I live?
		Yes, sir.
		In Riverside.
		Riverside.
		So you're making pretty good money.
		Yeah, I work two decent jobs.
		Yeah, I'm making pretty good money, yes.
		So you don't have to worry about them taking 30% of your money out of your pocket, do you?
		Well, who is them?
	The United States government.
	What is this thing you're talking about?
	We elect officials who set tax rates.
	If you don't like the tax rates, then elect somebody else to change them.
	I try to.
	Well, maybe if you didn't belong to the extremist moron party and you joined the Republican Party, maybe you could do things in a straight and normal way.
	Sir, that is the typical response I expect from a liberal.
	The typical response from an extremist like yourself is this.
	I can't call my extremists.
	No, no, no.
	This is what the tax rates are too high.
	They're trying to take my guns.
	So obviously, I don't have any power, so I need to get all my guns, and we need to get together and form this little army.
	And if anybody, we feel anybody's messing up with us, we're going to go out and kill them.
	Sir, do you believe in your religion?
	Or do you have a religion?
	Do I have a religion?
	Yes, sir.
	I tend to lead toward agnostic.
	Okay, you lead towards agnostic.
	So you have absolutely no belief in what our forefathers did to establish this good country, right?
	What the hell does...
	I want you to answer my question, sir.
	What the hell does some sort of weird Baptist religion have to do with what?
	You're stereotyping me as a Baptist from the beginning, right?
	Is that what you're going to call me as a Baptist?
	I don't remember anyone.
	What religion is that?
	It sounds to me like there's a little bit of prejudice there.
	No, what was Jefferson?
	What religion was Thomas Jefferson?
	What religion was Thomas Jefferson, sir?
	You know, you should know.
	You're the genius.
	You tell me.
	You seem to be the genius.
	He wasn't a Bible.
	You tell me what religion was Thomas Jefferson?
	He was a deist.
	He wasn't a theist, excuse me.
	He wasn't a right-king extremist Christian.
	Was he a theologian?
	Did you know that?
	Was he a theologian?
	Was he a theologian?
	Yes, sir.
	I don't believe that.
	What religion do theologians belong to?
	I'm done with this man because he actually has that freedom of money.
	Let me just say, here's the problem.
	You should not go around saying, this is a problem that I have with you.
	And number one, you should not be telling me what I have to say because I have freedom of speech, sir.
	You have freedom.
	You have...
	You do not have freedom to threaten.
	I'm not threatening anybody.
	Oh, come on, come on.
	You don't belong to a militia, don't you?
	Don't you belong to a militia?
	I belong to a militia.
	Why?
	Because I believe in what I believe in.
	You belong to the people.
	I belong because you belong in.
	To the Liberal Democratic Party.
	Wait, answer my question, sir.
	Why do you belong to the Liberal Democrat Party?
	Because they back what you believe in, right?
	I'm backing what I believe in.
	The Liberal Democratic Party doesn't, we don't feel that we need to carry around guns and ammunition because we think the system works.
	And obviously, you don't think the system works, do you?
	You think that the system works.
	So if you're calling 911 right now because a man is breaking into your house with a gun, you are going to be saved, right?
	There's nobody going to kill you.
	And what you're basically saying is you do not feel that the system works.
	Therefore, it is necessary for you to go out and get some weapons and get some guns to protect yourself against the quote-unquote federal system.
	Isn't that correct?
	What I'm protecting myself is against a socialist system which this president and his administration have set up and which they are pushing.
	And which liberals like yourself want?
	Let me ask you a question.
	Under what circumstances would you actually use that gun to quote-unquote defend yourself against the federal government?
	For this kind of thing, give me the exact circumstance so I'll know.
	I'm going to protect myself under anything which is deemed unconstitutional by my party.
	Uh-huh.
	And so and so if some guys in your group tell you that the government did something constitutional, you're going to get your gun and take action.
	Is that correct?
	Sir, I've got my own mind.
	I can make up my own mind.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, hold it.
		Gentlemen, hold it a second.
		The story I've got here, the Associated Press story, says that if the Freemen are attacked, if blood flows in Montana, that the Eastern Montana militia will attack military targets.
unidentified		Eastern Oregon, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Eastern Oregon.
		Will attack military targets.
		Is that correct?
unidentified		That is not the only militia that's involved in this, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I understand, but that is basically a correct statement.
unidentified		That is a correct statement.
		Do you agree with that action?
		If that action is taken, would you agree with it?
		If that action is taken, I will do whatever I can to preserve what rights I have.
		Well, you know, that's a vic.
		You know something?
		You don't even have the nerve to sit there.
		Hold it a second.
		You don't even have the nerve to sit there and say, you know what?
		If they take that action, you're damn straight, Art.
		I'm going to get my gun and I'm going to go out and I'm going to kill somebody and do whatever I have to do.
		You're damn straight.
		You're damn straight.
		Oh, I finally squeezed that out of you.
		You are damn straight.
		You've never asked me that question.
		You are damn straight.
		Uh-huh.
		And you don't consider yourself a terrorist.
		I do not consider myself a terrorist.
		I consider myself a rebel.
		Uh-huh.
		And you being a rebel, you're going to get your gun and you're going to go out and kill some FBI agents.
		Is that what you're going to do?
		In 1776, John Hancock was a liberal or was a rebel.
		He established what you're living under today.
		He established what you're living under today.
		He was a rebel.
		Let me tell you something, and you get this through your thick skull.
		If you pick up a gun and you go after federal police officers, A, you're going to get your butt killed and you deserve to get killed.
		Just like the Afghanistan did.
		But listen to this.
		Just like the Afghanistans did, right, though.
		What you are is a criminal, pure and simple.
		I've never committed a criminal act in my life.
		And then you can wrap it around.
		You can say, oh, Thomas Jefferson, and how about the Constitution?
		Don't give me that crap.
		Common sense tells me when you kill innocent people.
		I've told you how I believe.
		Common sense tells me when you kill innocent people, you are a criminal.
		Period.
		And you just went through saying, you've Didn't you say that?
		I said that I would do what I've been asked to do to military posts.
		I never said I would kill anybody.
		Well, you just said a second ago that if they give the word, you're going to go after the police.
		Do you want to ask somebody else here or what?
		Are you confused or something?
		I'm not confused.
		I just know that I'm beating a dead horse right here.
		Are you confused?
		You're going to twist my words.
		You're going to make me say what you want me to say.
		Just like you said.
		No, no, no, no, no.
		I really let me finish.
		Everybody, Bill Clinton, sitting in that damn White House right now is doing to me.
		He is restricting my freedoms.
		He is restricting the freedoms of every American-born person in this country.
		Okay, it's Bill Clinton's fault.
		Bill Clinton's too liberal.
		I understand all that.
		all i want to know and i really honestly want to know this if these guys in uh...
		in montana viciously killed in you know they burned down the building and it's terrible and they give any and they don't want to go to a massacre for uh...
	or i'm just i'm i'm just asking you where you're going to do Were the people in Waco massacred?
	Were they massacred?
	No, not in my opinion.
	But in your opinion, all I want to know is a yes or no.
	If these people in Montene are, in your opinion, massacred, are you going to pick up your gun and take action?
	I'm telling you, I will do what my commander tells me to do.
	And if your commander tells you to go out and pick up your guns.
	I'm telling you, sir, and I'll leave it at this.
	What my commander tells me to do, I will do.
	And that's what the, and if your commander tells me.
	That's about a vine.
	I've told you my bottom line.
	That's your bottom line.
	You know what your bottom line is?
	I am done, sir.
	Your bottom line is that basically you will go out and kill anyone that you have to kill.
	If it's gotten to that point, you're just going to get yourself killed and a bunch of innocent people killed, period.
	I got five words.
	you're looking at a revolution well you're looking I'm talking to this person, Art.
	Let me tell you something.
	You're looking at a group of nut cases, a small group of nut cases that are going to go out, get themselves killed.
	They're not going to accomplish anything.
	And they're going to make people who are honest, on the right, people like Arthur, who are on the right, look extreme.
	And everybody, you know something?
	The right, the political spectrum is going to be severely hurt by extremists like yourself.
	Which I think is good, but I think it's unfortunate that people like yourself go out and do that kind of thing.
	But it's got to happen, I guess.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you're saying, Jay, this is going to be a revolution.
unidentified		That's what you're looking at, sir, yes.
		I'm done talking to Charlie.
		I will answer any questions you have to say.
		But if that man is not just there and he's going to call me what his party is accusing everybody else of, I'm too talking to the man.
		If he can talk to me, if he can talk to me civilly and he can debate the issue without calling me an extremist, without calling me a fascist, without calling me whatever he wants to do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, I'll tell you what, let's do.
		Let's reduce it to this.
		Let's talk about the Freemen in Montana.
		Jay, I really would like to hear from you why you think the Freemen need to be defended if necessary with arms and or attacks on the military or a revolution or whatever.
		Why is their protection justified, Jay?
unidentified		Sir, they have not been convicted of any crime.
		If I remember right in the Constitution of the United States, it says that you are innocent until proven guilty.
		The mainstream media and other programs have these people deemed guilty without ever going to trial.
		Mr. O.J. Simpson got to have his trial.
		Well, you're leaving out.
		Sir, I'm not talking to you.
		I'm talking to Mr. Art Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		All right.
		I will allow Charlie to respond.
		We'll try to keep it civil.
		Charlie, try not to call names and just say that.
unidentified		Okay, the part that he's leaving out, had O.J. Simpson locked himself out, locked himself in a building and put up a gun and said, you know what, you guys are not going to arrest me.
		Period.
		You know what would have happened to O.J. Simpson?
		O.J. Simpson would have probably gotten killed.
		Thing is, is that these guys have not been convicted of anything?
		Let me make my point.
		And you refuse to be arrested.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, Charlie.
unidentified		Do you believe that O.J. Simpson was guilty or not guilty?
unidentified		He gave himself to trial.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Charlie, answer his question, Charlie.
unidentified		O.J. Simpson was found not guilty.
		I want to know what you believe, sir.
		I think he was guilty as hell.
		So he's walking free when he committed a heinous crime, as he did.
		O.J. Simpson, this is a key point.
		This is a key point.
		It's very, very important.
		O.J. Simpson gave himself up to the police.
		He decided, you know what?
		So if I give myself up to the police, no matter who the hell I've killed, I'm free to go as I wish because I've given myself up to the police, right, sir?
		Well, the problem with those guys have those guys given themselves up to the police.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Charlie, answer his question.
unidentified		Which is what?
		So if I go out and I kill as many military people as I possibly can, if I give myself up to police, I'm free to go, just like O.J. Simpson was.
		No, if you give yourself up to police, then there's a trial.
		You'll probably find your butt guilty and you'll probably get the death penalty.
		But you gave yourself up to police.
		The guys in Montana.
		There's a double standard here when it comes to people that stand on the way that I stand and the way that Charlie wants to see that they stand.
		All I want to see is these guys.
		You know what these guys are.
		Somebody was guilty, correct, sir?
		No, let's say they're innocent.
		Let's say the guys in Montana.
		If he was innocent, sir.
		Let's say the guys in Montana are innocent.
		Let's say they're all innocent, okay?
		all we're asking is that the guys in montana give themselves up and go to trial if you refuse to give yourself up and you're pointing down the top You can't do it until they give themselves up.
		Why don't they give themselves up?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, that's a fair question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Jay, they could give themselves up, and surely they would get a trial, correct?
unidentified		Correct.
		But whose jury would they have?
		Would they have a jury of people that think like-minded As me, as O.J. Simpson did, or would they have people that are not like-minded like myself, like Charlie?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, they don't trust the jury system, Charlie.
unidentified		Oh, I don't know.
		Maybe, maybe Jeff Dahmer should have gotten a whole bunch of people.
		Don't even compare this movement to Jeffrey Dahmer, who slaughtered children and raped children.
		Don't even compare him.
		This is not even fair.
		All you want to do is shoot police officers.
		that's what we don't do you get a repair let me tell you something when it comes to a child who is innocent who is under ten years old is being raped and slaughtered by a man I am not raping and spurting anybody.
		I see.
		You can be only killing innocent police officers when you get the word from up above that it's okay.
		You go out and blast.
		At least I say this for Jeffrey Dahmer.
		He was crazy.
		You're not crazy.
		You're just going to get the word to go out and blast police officers, aren't you?
		You have absolutely no idea.
		Oh, you keep it.
		You have absolutely no idea.
		You keep in your mind.
		What the hell you want to keep in your mind, sir?
		You just said that you'll do whatever your commander tells you to do.
		Now, that's what you just said.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, you two.
		All right, you two.
		We're going to hold it right there.
		And I wanted to give everybody an idea of what's going on out there.
		And I think they've got that idea.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		We'll be right back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, that about does it for this half hour.
		And I'm not sure where you'd go after all that anyway.
		So we'll be back in most markets in a moment.
		And you can react to what you've just heard if you wish.
		cursed to live in interesting times, right?
unidentified		Thank you.
		Welcome to Arch Bell Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The things that happen in the middle of the night, huh?
		Good morning, everybody.
		The largest live overnight talk show in America, in fact, the world.
unidentified		This is Coast to Coast AM.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good to be here.
		If you don't have a chill running down your spine, and if the hair in the back of your neck isn't standing up, then you don't have a spine and you don't have hair.
		god are we in trouble So that you understand what we're talking about this morning, I'm going to kind of update you here.
		Associated Press story cleared the wire, I don't know, about an hour ago.
		Associated Press, members of the Eastern Oregon militia say they're now prepared to declare war on the U.S. military if the Freeman standoff in Montana turns violent.
		Walt Hassey, who describes himself as legal advisor to the militia, says there are no civilian targets.
		He says the targets will be military.
		The FBI issued a nationwide alert to law enforcement agencies on April 23rd, warning of a militia, quote, war plan, end quote.
		Hassie says the Eastern Oregon militia has a plan called Operation Clean Sweep to defend the Freemen, protect their rights.
		Hassie warns if federal agents storm in and people are killed in Montana, there's going to be retribution.
		He says militia members won't have to go to Montana.
		He says there are military targets in other states.
		At the same time, he says the public has nothing to fear says the militia is not involved in terrorism.
		Now, from the Herald and News, Klamath Falls, Oregon, Sunday, May 5th, I have that FBI bulletin.
		And it reads as follows.
		The alleged militia war warning that prompted the FBI to issue an alert to law enforcement agencies contained a suggested list of targets of opportunity, including federal satellite uplinks and communication centers,
		military fuel depots, military and law enforcement storage facilities and aircraft on the ground, law enforcement communication centers, troop equipping and staging centers, internal revenue service record facilities,
		senior federal law enforcement officials, federal reserve board governors, media installations that are, quote, not providing the people with what's really going on, end quote, lists ABC, CBS, CNN, and NBC.
		Continuing, the militia plan concludes, quote, these are just ideas.
		There are many other targets of opportunity, things that must, in fact, be protected on the list of things to be protected, loyal federal, state, and local officials.
		We need them, it says, when this is all over.
		Secure public water, sewer, and power facilities.
		Things that would otherwise disrupt the civilian population.
		Move to protect outspoken members of the community.
		It also calls for seizing jails and sweeping civilian gun stores and confiscating weapons.
		minute as at the end be sure to leave a receipt for what you take A couple of facts is, dear art, on tonight's local news.
		It was reported that here in central Illinois, a group of 30 militia members calling themselves Freeman Sympathizers have filed liens on the properties of several local government officials.
		They claim this is going on all around the country, unknown to the officials involved, until a check is done on the property for such purposes as loans.
		As soon as the militia members try to call in liens, the police will attempt to arrest them.
		Liberals sue in Illinois, or the same militia wake up.
		Hiart, if the militia showed any hint of intelligence, they would realize the futility of their beliefs.
		This is obvious by looking at both outcomes of militia activity against the U.S. military.
		One, if the militia engages the military in the U.S., they'll more than likely be crushed.
		Two, should, by some fluke, they get the upper hand on the U.S. military, it would leave this country wide open for attacks from other nations.
		It would be a feeding frenzy between every nation that's ever been hostile to the U.S. The militia would be incapable of defending the U.S. from foreign military aggression.
		Either way, America loses.
		If the militia wants to make America work, they'd better learn to have their revolution in the voting booth, not in the streets of America.
		Well, that's what I've been warning right along.
		Don't you understand?
		If this occurs, if a war, an insurrection begins, we all lose.
		One way or the other, we lose.
		If the government wins, we lose.
		If the militia, unlikely, wins, we lose.
		If there's ongoing conflict, we lose.
		If there's a war and there's retribution that begins from both sides, we lose.
		If this begins, you try and figure a way that we win, because I can't.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Good morning, Art.
		This is Gary in Phoenix.
		Hello, Gary.
		This is, well, listening to that militia member, it shows exactly how ridiculous their thinking is.
		Just like your facts just said, if they're so grounded in the Constitution, then why aren't they taking the legal constitutional means to change the system that they don't like?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you heard the militia guy say, well, I tried that, and it didn't work.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, the people he voted for didn't get elected, and so as far as he's concerned, then, the system does not work.
unidentified		Well, if they have so many supporters around the country, it seems like with all their latest actions that they should be getting enough support now to get their people in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you would think so, wouldn't you?
		But I guess finally, you know, when you form these groups, there's a certain cycle of life to these groups, I think.
		And they form, and they originally start out to be constitutional, and they're going to go out and get involved in the community, and blah, blah, blah, blah.
		After a while, things aren't going their way.
		They get more and more frustrated and cynical and paranoid.
		And pretty soon, the conclusion inevitably is the system does not work.
		Ergo, it's got to be overturned.
unidentified		Right.
		Well, and, you know, when you listen, and it sickens me to have to agree with Charlie, but I totally agreed with Charlie.
		When you listen to their reasoning, and then when you try to hit him up on any solid issue to try to get him to answer, all he did was sit there and yell back at Charlie.
		You know, and I don't know, even the lady that you had on last night that debated on this issue, she just, her view of reality seems so off-base that, I mean, at first, when this all started, I actually did, like most of the American public, I felt some sympathy towards these guys and thought, okay, they're trying to draw public attention.
		They're trying to not let happen to them what happened to the people in Waco.
		Well, once they got their attention, then they could have come out under the protection of the media and the whole nation watching them.
		Now they're just letting this go on and on.
		And, you know, I think this is going to set a dangerous precedent in this country.
		If we keep letting groups like this hold the federal government hostage and at bay like this, you know, we're going to end this tomorrow Or the next day.
		The next one is going to be next week.
		And how long are we going to let this go on?
		I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My sense is, from what I'm hearing this morning and reading, it can't go on much longer.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And if the federal government allows this to go on very much longer, I can clearly see what's going to happen.
unidentified		Right.
		Well, you know, I think, you know, I am really, really against any kind of regulation, against any kind of group meeting.
		You know, we have the right to assembly and all that.
		But these groups, I think they're quickly moving to being classified as subversive groups.
		I mean, they are actually disrupting, you know, the way that our country is operating.
		I mean, you know, now we're trying to be careful about what the federal government says because they're worried about setting one of these groups off.
		That's real dangerous.
		we're starting to look like a third world country where we're worried about all those ragtag groups that we have to worry about what we're going to say because they may rise up against us.
		That's not the America that I grew up in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What would you do?
unidentified		Well, you know, actually, I think with what we learned from Waco, where, you know, we can't go in there with tanks, okay?
		We need to tell these guys, we need to bring whoever we need to bring in there.
		If it needs to be Janet Reno walking up the front walk of this place saying, look, it's over.
		Let's sit right here.
		Let's talk about it.
		Let's have media cameras.
		Whatever you guys want.
		Let's end this thing.
		You know, I don't think we need to go in with guns ablaze and we know, we've already seen that doesn't work.
		Everybody on both sides is going to get hurt.
		We need to sit down with these people.
		They're obviously looking for attention and cover.
		They don't want to be, they don't want to turn into another Waco.
		So go in with Dan Rather, whoever they want to go in, and let it all be open.
		I think that's the only way that we're going to end this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, as you know, Bogritz went in, tried to mediate.
		He finally ended up in discussing, look, this is going to end badly.
		These people have an ideology that's pretty close to those folks down in Waco.
		They're not going to give up.
		They are prepared to shoot.
		And once the bullets start flying on this one, I don't see how we're going to get it stopped.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		Well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is scary stuff.
unidentified		Yes, it is.
		And I hope that we somehow, through this, can be a learning process.
		And the militias and the federal government can learn how to work together on this because, like I said, I don't want this to set a precedent where every month it's the latest militia group hold up somewhere.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you very much for the call.
unidentified		Okay, have a good night.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take care.
		I'd rather deal with a loose pack of chupacabras.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		This is Jim.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Jim.
unidentified		I have a couple of comments I'd like to include for you that really fit in with your discussion with the militia discussion.
		And also I'd like to point out an advertisement that you do, which is regards to the currency trades and other things.
		The reason why that problem exists is actually embedded in a Senate report that many people need to read.
		And that Senate report is 93549.
		It specifically was done in 1973.
		And it is the Emergency Powers Statutes.
		And it specifically talks about what's happened since 1933.
		And that is the real issue of what is needing to be understood of what had happened to this country.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You think it's worth having a civil war about, sir?
unidentified		No, it's not.
		The war was already declared in 1933 by FDR.
		We were all declared enemies, number one, because the wording in the Trading with the Enemy Act was changed and adopted and conformed to the suggestions of the bankers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The bankers.
unidentified		That's correct.
		And it's in the Senate report.
		There are no hidden things that are out there about this process.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So since 1933, you would maintain, we have been, in effect, at war with our government.
unidentified		We are in a declared status of national emergency.
unidentified		And that is exactly what is enforced through to today.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I understand exactly what you're saying, but and I've heard it many times from many people.
		But if you think that what you just said justifies attacks on the military or justifies people doing what the free men are doing,
		so-called freemen, not free, justifies issuing liens and writing hot checks and all the rest of it, and that kind of illegal, obviously illegal activity.
		Then I think you're cracked.
		And I think you don't understand what it is that you're about to bring on.
		Oh, well, a state of emergency has existed since 1933.
		You start attacking the military in this country, and you're going to see a state of emergency.
		You're going to bring on exactly what you say you fear overnight.
		Really want that to happen?
		Well, I would say everybody involved in this better take a big, damn deep breath.
		Think really hard about what they're doing.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
		God, I'm glad to get through tonight.
		There's about four sentences for the militia guys up there in Oregon that they ought to take to heart.
		Number one is the government can engineer a group to do almost anything it wants to do.
		We can derail Chilean governments and military groups in Chile and Panama and the fact that somebody is steering them towards attacking our military to me means that somebody's probably steering them that way.
		Number two is in the Western militia of Washington They had a guy in there who was working himself near the top.
		He was number four in the militia.
		They happened to have access to a policeman who checked his fingerprints.
		Turned out he was the full-time Fed agent and he was advocating action.
		They threw him out.
		Three weeks later he showed up in a Kentucky militia and he's still a full-time Fed agent.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah well I'm sure I'm sure that's going on.
		I'm sure the Feds have agents in there spying and I'm sure the militias are spying back and they're all getting a little more paranoid about each other and I think this whole thing's getting close to coming down and I don't like it at all.
		I don't think that the government is trying to bring this on.
		I'm not saying that there aren't agents that are part of sting operations that seem to be encouraging it all because I'm sure that is going on.
		But as far as really trying to bring this whole thing to a head so they can have a state of emergency so that they can have martial law, no, I don't think they want that.
		It would cripple the economy of this country.
		And you know what people say?
		I'm going to hold you over for the break.
		People, just stay right there.
		People think the government wants to bring this on.
		I don't think so.
		Follow the money trail.
		If we start having a revolution in this country, our economy is going to hell.
		Nobody benefits from that.
unidentified		The End
		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight, featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from May 8th, 1996.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'll sir, you're back on the air.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you for holding on.
unidentified		Yes, sir, Art.
		We can beat Clinton at the ballot box.
		I tell you, 10 days before the last election, when the news media was saying we were only going to get five or ten seats, I worked strongly with the Republican Party.
		We had a scientific study done nationwide.
		We kept it a secret, but we knew we could win both houses 10 days before the election.
		Jimmy the Greek, before he died in the April newsletter, the Financial Strategic Investment Letter, was given 8 to 5 odds that Clinton would be forced out of office before the election.
		And that went nationwide.
		So I encourage these people to put on their good suits, go door-to-door, get people signed up for the conservative cause, and get them down there to vote because we still have a lot more on our side than what the news media is putting out.
		But don't fall into the trap of making any rash judgment.
		Wait till after the election because I don't think he's going to make it there.
		There's 40 to 60 more people going to be indicted in Whitewater, and one of them is getting ready to talk in the next week or two.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That may well be the case, my friend.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		I'm glad you got to say what you wanted to.
		That may well be.
		Right now it looks a little bleak.
		I don't know about any secret surveys.
		I know about the public ones showing the president with about a 31.2 lead overboard.
		And should anything near that be maintained, which it will not coming into the election, I mean there's going to be closure.
		Not nearly enough, probably, but it's going to close, of course, as we head toward the election day.
unidentified		But I'll tell you good.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And if the margin is big enough, it may well be that Mr. Clinton will bring with him Liberals into the House for a majority there.
		That's entirely possible.
		Less likely the Senate, but entirely possible.
		well let's take care of a little bit of business right now and get them and we'll go roaring to the top of the hour Here we go again.
		First time caller line.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hello, Art Bob from Santhane.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Bob.
unidentified		How are you this evening?
unidentified		A little worried?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Uh, yeah.
unidentified		Well, you know, I think that the country has a lot to worry about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, me too.
unidentified		I think that these people are serious, and I think they exist throughout the country.
		And it's actually my belief that there may be random acts of kindness starting to happen all over the country.
		As a matter of fact, I believe that those acts may have already started to occur and the government is trying to keep it out of the paper.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that would be understandable.
unidentified		You know, I know that your program has offered a forum for debate, and I think that the most important thing is that the government offer a forum for debate and allow this thing to be publicized and televised.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know.
		I don't know.
		I mean, if I were in the government or a spokesman and I knew that there had been some attacks on military installations or what have you, I would be hard-pressed to know whether I'd be better off publicizing it or keeping it quiet.
		It seems to me like there's a lot of people on edge just waiting for the first shot heard round the country, you know.
		So I'm not sure which is right.
unidentified		Well, you know, the people in Waco, at that trial, the jury, poor woman, she cried and said that the wrong people were on trial there, and then the judge threw 40 years at the people that were on trial.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know, but what's going on in Montana is not Waco.
unidentified		Well, you know, there is a cord of similarity between the three groups, Weaver, Waco, Andy Spreeman.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's standoffs.
		That's the similarity.
		Beyond that, I don't see that the people at Waco, nor do I see that what occurred up at Ruby Ridge, it's not the same.
		I mean, here we've got people that are clearly, simply, in my opinion, thugs violating the law and writing hot checks and scheming and trying to do by sleight of hand what they couldn't do with sweat of the brow.
unidentified		Well, what they're doing is much the same as what the government has done with sleight of hand and what's called sophistry in language and legalese.
		Another thing is all three groups...
		Well, you know, it comes to a point where you have a decision to make as whether you want to submit to this administration's tyranny or the next one's.
		You know, what are the choices?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Tyranny.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Tyranny, huh?
unidentified		Well, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's tyranny.
		Look, I know tyranny.
		I've seen tyranny around the world.
		I've been to nations where there's real tyranny.
		There is a government here.
		Yes, there are regulations and laws.
		And yes, I understand they make people feel oppressed.
		And sometimes the IRS goes too far and the BATF runs in on somebody and does something they shouldn't have done.
		But it's not real tyranny, sir.
		Not the way it is in the rest of the world.
unidentified		Well, Art, this isn't the rest of the world.
unidentified		This is America.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's right.
unidentified		And America stands for freedom.
unidentified		And then when the politicians deprive people of their freedom by trickery and by using the court system as something to browbeat the people with, it becomes tyranny.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think that intelligent people should sit down and look at relative levels of tyranny or oppression or lack of freedom before they decide they're going to turn it all over.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Because I'm telling you right now, on the other side of whatever happens, it ain't going to be pretty.
unidentified		Well, you know, one last thing, Art.
		These people teach that we're living in Babylon.
		And they're not talking about the nation of Babylon.
		They're talking about the system of Babylon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
unidentified		And it appears that we might be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
unidentified		We need to change it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I sure don't agree with you, at least in with respect to the manner of that change.
		Oh, God, this is frightening.
		Well, you know, nothing's forever.
		Maybe that applies to America, too.
		Nothing's forever.
		Why do we think that we deserve to go on if this is what it's been reduced to?
		Maybe we don't.
		We've been lucky, huh?
		We've had it for a while.
		But I think it's about to slip through our hands.
		That's what I think.
		But it's been good.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		How you doing, Art?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing.
unidentified		Real good.
		You know, people don't realize sometimes what a little anger over injustice can cause.
		In other words, what I'm saying is, you take the people in Oregon, that one guy Saturday was talking about his rights have been violated because of the restriction on his guns.
		But those restrictions on guns does not mean you need to die over that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, what comes to my mind is you don't know what you've got till it's gone.
unidentified		That's right.
		You know, I was in the military.
		I've been to 27 different countries, just like you were.
		You've been to a lot of different countries, and we've seen where you don't have the freedom that we have in the United States.
		You know, we might disagree with the government in power at that time.
		That's why we have elections.
		And, of course, we have Republicans and Democrats, and sometimes it's dependent on the elections.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I asked them, well, what about the vote?
		Well, I tried that.
		Well, my candidate didn't get elected.
		So it's like, I give up.
		You know, the only way we're going to change this is barrel of gun.
unidentified		That's true.
		And that's sometimes what people think about, but they don't really think about sometimes people will do anything or make any excuse to have a little battle or a little fight and try to act like they're more powerful than what they are.
		Just like our games, we have.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Little battles, little fights have a way of becoming big ones.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And right now, everything's supercharged.
unidentified		Well, that's true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The government's supercharged, FBI, BATF, everybody's sitting on eggs, you know.
		And these militia people, they're sitting on eggs.
		Everybody's sitting on the fence.
		One shot, the wrong shot, the wrong place.
		Easy to get started, hard to stop.
unidentified		That's true.
		That's very true, sir.
		I Thank you very much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Oh, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Yeah, hi.
		Kevin from Kansas City.
		Yes, sir.
		You guys have already gone off the air here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, about 15, 20 minutes ago.
unidentified		Yeah, well, I'm glad to finally get in.
unidentified		Yeah, calling about the Oregon terrorist group.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		Well, I don't give them too much of a chance.
unidentified		There's been small pockets of rebellions throughout our history, and all of them have been crushed nearly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but here he said, now you can either choose to believe it or not believe it, but he said, we're not the only ones.
		There are groups, similar groups, ready all over the country.
		Now, that may easily be an exaggeration, but it doesn't take much, and a lot of revolutions have begun with very small groups, numerically, percentage-wise, very small groups.
unidentified		Well, they say that they're not going to attack civilian targets, but that's what I say, too.
		First chance they get.
		I mean, these people in Montana or whatever, you know, they've been given this long to just give up.
		They haven't.
		And Bo Brice, I think, is also...
		Yeah, part of the militia movement, if memory serves me correctly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well.
unidentified		And if he can't get them to surrender, then, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, actually, if you recall his words when he came out, at one point he just gave up.
		He said, it's not going to work.
		It's going to end badly.
		These people's ideology is very close in many ways to that of the people in Waco.
		In other words, it's going to end in fire and death.
unidentified		Yep.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And maybe that is the way it's going to end.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And if it ends that way, then apparently there's all these people who are ready to step in and start attacking military targets.
unidentified		Well, I've read some militia material, and all the, from what I understand, and if any militia members are still up and listening and can confirm this or not, any citizen can call a militia.
		Now, if this is true, then the people in the surrounding town, all they have to do is say, hey, we're forming a militia.
		Now, if these fringe groups want to say, well, hey, you know, they formed a militia, went in, and took it, so then we're going to declare war on the government, then, you know, hey, go for it.
		But you're just going to get your tails blown off.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
		I appreciate it.
		Boy, I'll tell you, this wears you down.
		I feel worn down after this show this morning.
		Worn down.
		Discouraged.
		It's like you see it coming.
		I used to live in Amarillo, Texas.
		In the Panahilla, Texas, up in the middle of the Panah.
		Amarillo Air Force Base.
		And we used to have these storms in Amarillo.
		And you would look up and there'd be a blue sky.
		And then to the horizon, there'd be clouds that would build to 50,000, 60,000 feet.
		And there'd be a storm front headed toward you.
		And ahead of this storm front, there would be a solid red wall.
		It was terrifying.
		Many times they sprouted tornadoes, you know, I used to chase the damn things.
		But I feel like one of those solid red walls is headed at us right now, and I've got about as much chance to stop it as I did in Amarillo.
		It's one of those things that you sit back, it's like a spectator sport, you know, you sit back and you watch it, and it will inevitably reach you and come sweeping across you, and you've got about as much chance of stopping what's about to occur as you do one of those red walls.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		I'm a first-time caller.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
		Turn your radio.
		Okay, first time callers.
unidentified		Turn your radio off.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off.
unidentified		It's off.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, good.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We don't screen calls.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're on the air.
unidentified		Okay, Art.
		This is Jim.
		I'm Spokane.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Jim.
unidentified		And I'm a first-time caller.
		I really don't want to talk about the issues that have been discussed tonight.
		I would like to just make a comment or two about the so-called debate that you had.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that is the issue we're talking about.
unidentified		Well, you know, whether the militia has a proper stand or, you know, I really am unoppioned about that.
unidentified		The one thing I think we could have done for this fellow, Jay, in Legrand, tonight was to, if nothing else, had you talk with him or had a reasonable person debate him.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Jay didn't say he was in Legrand.
unidentified		He said he belonged to that group.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, he was calling from an unidentified point in Oregon.
unidentified		Exactly.
unidentified		To me, though, he sounded like a very reasonable man and certainly didn't.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Reasonable?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's reasonable?
unidentified		What's reasonable?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Excuse me.
		All right, fine.
		The name-calling aside.
unidentified		The name-calling is the primary thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, it isn't.
unidentified		Nothing was.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, it isn't.
		No, no, no.
		No, it isn't the primary thing.
		The primary thing is a plan to attack the military.
unidentified		Well, if you're going to have a debate, name-calling certainly doesn't get you to first base.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Look, why don't you forget the name-calling and worry about what's really important?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's really important is this group out there that says if the free men are moved on, they're going to begin attacking military targets.
unidentified		Exactly.
		But what you tried to arrange tonight was someone to debate this fella.
		And we certainly didn't have that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're worried about peanuts.
unidentified		I'm not worried about peanuts.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the elephant's about to step on you, and you're worried about peanuts.
unidentified		I realize how disastrous this could be.
unidentified		But the thing of it is, is that if we want to have a debate and listen and find out more about their position and find out what makes it happen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Look, look, look, look, look.
		I don't control these debates.
		I have a situation where I stand back and I let people go at each other on the air.
		I'm not changing it.
		So if you're bitching about the fact that they were calling each other names or that Charlie called them names, you're wasting airtime.
unidentified		Well, I think that you wasted airtime having that debate.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, goodbye.
		I don't care what you think.
		You know, I don't give a rat's behind what you think.
		I conduct my show the way I conduct it.
		And I give people airtime to flat go at it.
		All right?
		If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen or in your case, turn off the radio.
		I don't care.
		I conduct this program the way I conduct it so that things are heard here that aren't heard elsewhere.
		If you don't like that, go elsewhere.
		And I presume that's exactly what you'll do.
		Don't let the door hit you in the butt.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Slick Willie from Berkeley.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Well, I'm not, well, it's my little nickname out here.
		Anyways, just because the militias say they're going to attack military targets, it doesn't mean that they're actually going to attack the military.
		They might consider any federal officer building out there a military target.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I've got a list.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I read it.
unidentified		Oh, I missed it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You missed it, huh?
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, all right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's see what you think about a couple of the items, all right?
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The list includes federal satellite uplinks, telecommunications centers, military fuel depots, military and law enforcement storage facilities, aircraft on the ground, law enforcement communication centers, troop equipping and staging centers, internal revenue records facilities, senior federal law enforcement officials, federal reserve board governors, and media installations.
unidentified		Media?
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Media.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		ABC, CBS, CNN, NBC, media.
unidentified		Yeah, they're really kind of losing it out there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They are.
unidentified		And I don't know.
		I just really don't understand why these people, oh, they're going to defend these...
		Sorry.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's all right.
unidentified		These people out here in...
unidentified		Yeah, I have a cat.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How many?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, just one?
unidentified		Just one cat.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
		Yeah.
		Turn your radio up for a minute.
		I never tell people to turn radios up.
		Can you turn yours up?
unidentified		Yeah, wait.
unidentified		Let me capture the cat really quick.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, don't catch a cat.
		Don't catch a cat.
		Just turn the radio up.
unidentified		The radio's in the other room.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh.
unidentified		Hold on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's too bad.
		All right.
		Well, I'll hold.
unidentified		Okay, I'm right there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, you got your radio up?
unidentified		Yep, got it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, well.
		Now, let your cat hear that.
		Hold your radio up.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take a couple seconds here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I can't hear your radio.
unidentified		You can't hear it?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
unidentified		Oh.
		The cat ran into a little, we got a little cage out here with a little bedding in there.
		One of those little carriers?
		Yeah.
		Oh, well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, well.
		Normally, that sound will drive a cat to the edge of madness.
		Listen, I'm afraid the program's over, and frankly, it's just as well that it is.
		I'm going to give you the honors from Berkeley.
		Of all places, you get the honors tonight.
		You know what they are?
unidentified		Good night, America.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's it.
unidentified		Yeah, in more ways than one.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, all right.
		Thank you all.
		We'll do this again tomorrow morning when I've had a chance to recover from the high desert where people still have time to think.

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