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Dec. 25, 2023 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes

56:42

Edition 777 - Guest Catchups

On this edition Steve Bassett from The Paradigm Research Group with a crucial end-of-2023 update on Disclosure, Warren Coates in Northern Ireland on his latest ultra-chilling ghost case and Inspector Roy Teague on the latest research he's done with John Hanson on UK police UAP/UFO reports for the excellent book "Policing The Haunted Skies Volume 2".

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	Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Unexplained.
	Well, I'm hoping that if you're hearing this after Christmas, which you probably will be, I hope you had a good Christmas and are looking forward to your new year preparations.
	And thank you very much for communicating with me in your greetings and good wishes.
	And if you've donated to The Unexplained recently, the online version of the show, thank you very much for doing that.
	Thank you to Adam, my webmaster, for his work on the show through this year.
	What I want to do on this edition is get up to speed with a couple of the items, three in fact, from a recent radio show, so they're kept here for posterity.
	Otherwise, if they were left at the radio station, they would simply be erased over time.
	So I want to document and archive them here, and they're worth hearing again if you've heard them before, and you will be interested, I'm sure, if you're hearing them for the first time.
	Item number one, Steve Bassett, bringing us up to date on the tortuous and complex process of disclosure in the United States.
	Not as easy as some people maybe thought it would be.
	We'll talk about that.
	Item number two, Warren Coates, ghost investigator in Northern Ireland, about, well, in particular, one stunning, amazing, and very chilling case that he's been involved in lately.
	And then the final item is a conversation with Inspector Roy Teague, who's been working with John Hanson for a few of his Haunted Skies books, The Policing the Haunted Skies editions.
	We're up to volume two.
	Volume three is coming soon, so we'll talk about Volume 2 for which I wrote the foreword.
	And it was a great privilege to do that.
	There are some incredible cases in the book that we'll be discussing.
	We'll flesh out the details on them, and I think some of them will be absolutely completely fresh and new to you unless you follow all the newspapers all the time.
	You won't have seen these, and some of them are reports that have specifically been given to Roy and John.
	amazing stuff.
	A couple of them in particular I think you will find So, Roy Teague, the third item on this edition of The Unexplained.
	Just to wish you all the very best for this season, whenever you're hearing this, please stay in touch with me.
	If you want to send me an email, then you can through my website, theunexplained.tv.
	And remember always, my movements will be monitored and diarized to an extent through my Facebook page, the official Facebook page of The Unexplained with Howard Hughes.
	Item number one then, Steve Bassett from the Paradigm Research Group, giving us an update on the process of disclosure, tortuous it's been this year and revelatory.
	The Guardian, newspaper in the United Kingdom, reported a few days ago, if the truth about UFOs is out there, the American government doesn't want you to see it yet.
	Just months after the U.S. Space Agency NASA appointed a research director of unidentified anomalous phenomena and promised more transparency about what it knows, the U.S. Congress has acted to throttle the flow of information that ultimately gets to the public.
	Measures to create a presidential commission to review UFO records and to order the Department of Defense to declassify certain records relating to publicly known sightings of unidentified aerial phenomena were stripped from the sweeping defense policy bill that passed Congress last Thursday with bipartisan support.
	What does all this mean?
	From the Paradigm Research Group, first off on this edition of The Unexplained, here is Steve Bassett.
	This is way more complicated than people who are not paying very close attention can handle.
	This is realpolitik at the highest level.
	Essentially, what just happened is one of the most powerful men in the United States Congress, Chuck Schumer, the Senate majority leader, got into, I guess you could say, a battle with two other members of the Gang of Eight, the chairman of the House Armed Services and Intel Committees,
	Mike Turner, Mike Rogers, over whether or not the government contractors who have been working for decades with U.S. money on non-human technologies, which was confirmed by David Grush back on June the 5th and reconfirmed under oath on July the 26th, whether or not they have the full rights to use that and make money from that technology.
	Now, let's think about that.
	The battle was over whether or not these contractors, how they would make use of the non-human technology they've been working on in classified programs.
	In other words, what's happened here in this, and this is a move by Schumer.
	He put that language, that strong language in the bill specifically to smoke them out, knowing it didn't matter whether it went through or not.
	The essence of what they want to do, which is to bring information forward, still remains in the 11-page final language.
	It's just stripped of all the power to force the action.
	But that doesn't matter.
	Right now in the United States, the presence of non-human tech, the extraterrestrial presence, has been informally confirmed multiple times by Schumer, by Grush, and now by the contractors who put up a fight through their representatives to stop that bill.
	So it's a win.
	And here's what's supposed to happen next.
	Now the stage is set for the Senate Intel Committee to hold a hearing for the many witnesses they've already been interviewing.
	These hearings, which will last about a week, I think, with about 12 to 20 witnesses, will essentially blow the truth embargo to pieces.
	Once that is done, immediately thereafter, the president can passively come forward and confirm what everyone has figured out just from watching the hearings that, yeah, I'm convinced, too, there is an extraterrestrial president.
	But shouldn't that Intel committee hearing have happened as early as last September?
	Gillibrand promised it many months ago, but as you know, history continues to intervene.
	A lot of unpleasant things have happened.
	A lot of distracting things have happened, particularly chaos in the United States Congress.
	We had unprecedented things here.
	We threw a Speaker of the House out the door.
	So these things delayed it.
	And I think logically it made sense to wait until after the fourth tranche of legislation, which is what this is, the fourth, right?
	People are saying, well, oh, this is wrong.
	That's the fourth piece of legislation on this issue in our National Defense Authorization Act.
	Prior to that, there'd never been a single piece of legislation.
	And so the way it can go now is the Senate Intel calls the hearings in January.
	We get disclosure.
	And you know what happens right after that?
	They will resubmit the entire UAP Disclosure Act as a standalone bill.
	And in the post-disclosure world, it will pass easily.
	So that's what's going down.
	This is heavy-duty chess being played by very powerful people.
	Now, I've done something recently I want your listeners to know about.
	I've set up an activist project called ShiftStorm.com.
	I mean,.org.
	ShiftStorm.org.
	Don't forget the F. You go there, and here's what you find out.
	Anybody in the world who has a Twitter account can Twitter tag or tweet tag these three important members of our Senate, Senator Schumer, Senator Rubio, and Senator Warner.
	They all have Twitter accounts.
	All the members have Twitter accounts, frankly.
	You can't direct message them.
	They don't do that, but you can tag them.
	And what do I mean?
	You simply go at Senator Schumer, Senator Rubio, whatever.
	We love the legislation.
	We love what you've been doing.
	You're doing a great job.
	But now we must have those hearings you promised.
	We want the Senate Intel hearings.
	Please hold those hearings.
	It was all coming down the track, Steve.
	And here I am jumping in.
	Sorry for that.
	But if it was all coming down the track, why do people need to do that if we're getting disclosure anyway?
	No, first we have to get the hearings.
	And again, it's not easy.
	You can see that what is being done is so complicated.
	Ending this truth embargo is an incredibly complicated thing.
	The process has been underway for six years, seriously, for three years.
	There's just so many implications that it's just not easy to do.
	This is a political thing happening here.
	And so my goal through shiftstorm.org is to see if we can get 100,000 Twitter, tagged Twitter messages into each of the notifications box of all three of these senators.
	I assure you, that will help them make the decision.
	Let's get this done.
	And it's fun, right?
	And so, hey, anybody can do this.
	So can we get 100,000 tagged messages into Senator Schumer, Rubio, and Warner?
	You bet we can.
	And they can come from the UK.
	They can come from Bangladesh.
	It doesn't matter.
	Send the tagged message, tag them.
	Please hold these hearings in January.
	Send as many as you want.
	Just change the message.
	In other words, you can send the same message to all three, but don't send repeatedly the same message to the same member, but change the wording.
	Send 20.
	Just change the wording around.
	That is what's going on now.
	I hear what you say.
	Now, look, you know that not everybody is massively impressed with the process.
	And I've had one message here among many, who many of the people are fascinated who are messaging me and very much up for the process of disclosure, as indeed am I. But some people are losing patience with it all.
	And Louis said, and I don't know whether you're going to be listening tonight, Louis, but here's what you said.
	Steve will say what he always says, disclosure is coming.
	It's so close now.
	It's the same every time.
	What have you to tell Louis?
	What I have to tell Louis is that this is a process that's been going on for 76 years.
	Most of the activism has occurred in the last 26 years.
	I've been in it that long, and nothing, nothing remotely like what is happening now has ever happened before.
	Four pieces of legislation in our National Defense Act, right?
	One attempt to go completely throw the long bomb touchdown pass that got pushed back.
	You've got all 12 members of the Senate Intel Committee have signed letters to Arrow in the White House saying that we want to get this done.
	You've had members of the Senate Intel Committee saying we want hearings.
	All kinds of witnesses have been briefed.
	You've had somebody come forward and confirm we have non-human tech that's been confirmed several other times and the bodies that came with that tech.
	So yeah, sure, I've been optimistic in the past.
	If you're an activist, you don't get people to jump onto an issue and commit to it by telling them there's a chance, no chance in hell it's going to happen.
	You try to keep them on board, optimistic, and hopeful.
	That's the way activism works.
	So in the interest of fairness, Steve, in the interest of fairness, we have to say that at the beginning of this year, did any of us anticipate that somebody like Grush or the other people who appeared in front of those hearings in the summertime, would we ever have anticipated that a session or sessions of that kind would happen?
	And I think the answer inevitably, if you look back 12 months, would be no.
	So we have, in fact, and I have to look at these things impartially, but we have come a long way.
	Oh, God, yes.
	No, Grushen was not supposed to happen.
	That was not part of the general overall plan.
	He really caused some real problems, though he's still a national hero and I want him to get the Medal of Freedom.
	The point is that human tech and non-human tech and non-human remains was not supposed to be in play yet.
	That was supposed to come up at the Senate Intel hearings, but he came forward for his reasons.
	That accelerated the situation, but created a problem from Schumer.
	Schumer took 39 days to decide what to do.
	And he and Mike Rounds put together an additional 50 pages of legislation to the bill that was already submitted by the Senate.
	And in that is when he popped the issue of subpoena power, the highest level clearances, the UAP review board, and most importantly, eminent domain.
	And the eminent domain inclusion was specifically done to smoke the government contractors out.
	He knew that they could not let that go.
	They've been able to sit it out all along, but not now.
	And they were going to have to fight back by getting to their intermediaries to get in touch with the conferee members of the House and Senate and say, fight to get that taken out, which means they've come out of cover.
	They've basically shown themselves.
	Even if we don't know their names, it doesn't matter.
	And so what Schumer was able to do was to actually get the defense industry To confirm what Grush had already said.
	And so now the only thing left to do is for the Senate to bring in the many witnesses that want to come forward, hold a very public, extraordinarily powerful hearing so the president can come out and confirm it.
	Grush coming forward was not enough for President Biden to come forward.
	Well, I've listened to David Grush.
	That's pretty impressive.
	We have ETs here.
	No, it's going to take something of the magnitude of the Senate hearing and where 10, 12, 20 former military people are going to testify to things even as powerful as Grush, right?
	And that testimony, which will be watched by hundreds of millions of people, blows up the truth embargo, ends it finally.
	And so the president can come forward and confirm it.
	That is the way this was planned all along, and it's still happening.
	And then, as I said, Schumer will probably still get the bill he wanted, but in the post-disclosure world, because we need those things to deal with the massive disclosure process that that bill represents, which is essentially getting everything over time the U.S. government has in its secret programs and files completely out from under that secrecy, vetted, given to the public, and then put in the archives.
	Now, some stuff will come out sooner than others.
	Some might be postponed, but all of that's part of the bill.
	It explains all of that.
	It's completely transparent.
	And so we practically won.
	We're practically at the finish line.
	What we don't want is somebody to rush out of the spectators and tackle us.
	And what do I mean by that?
	And why we need to get the hearing in January so the president can confirm in January is because at any time something really bad will happen.
	Do I have to say this?
	Somebody fires off a tactical nuke.
	The terrorist organizations in the world, which have now declared war on everybody American, I get it, could do something even worse than 9-11.
	Right.
	So you're saying that as always happens with anything political, events, as they say in the United Kingdom, events, dear boy, but events could circumvent or rather hijack the process.
	And we don't know about that.
	But you are saying, and we've only got seconds to go now, Steve, you are saying that you think January is the month we need to be watching.
	Before the election.
	It's got to happen before the primary season gets underway in the U.S. and the political a year from hell begins so that this issue is fully in play.
	It's as logical as it could be.
	And so that's why I'm pushing for January.
	And that web address, again, it's shiftstorm.org.
	Yep.
	That is correct.
	So according to Steve, January is the month to watch for.
	And you know that I will be doing that here on the podcast and, of course, on the radio show.
	Okay, next item.
	Ghosts will be talking about one of my favorite guests, Warren Coates, ghost investigator in Northern Ireland, with, well, some details about an amazing case he's been involved in.
	This is Warren Coates.
	Warren, thank you very much for coming on.
	How are you?
	Not too bad, Harley.
	How are you getting yourself?
	You're going to be okay?
	Yes, I think so.
	You know, I'm getting there slowly but surely.
	How has this year been for you?
	It hasn't been too bad so far.
	Obviously, the past couple of years of COVID sort of hit the part of normal world on its head sort of thing.
	But the past year especially, we've been had a couple of sort of quite in-depth cases, a couple which sort of, you know, one, we're going back to in a new year, which definitely sort of, you know, put us back on the field again, if you know what I mean.
	One of the things that I know that you've been doing lately is a place called Saint Field, which is just outside Belfast.
	This was something that you did very recently.
	And apparently the nature of what's been experienced there is pretty spectacular.
	It is.
	Now, the Saint Field one, it is built.
	There's 1798 rebellion.
	Obviously, there's a lot.
	So there was a battle carried out.
	Well, there's a couple of skirmishes and then a major battle in sort of Saint Field.
	And, you know, just down the way from it, so there's an awful lot of quite bloody history in the place.
	We first got a phone call about this house about four or five years ago.
	And the people were very hesitant and sort of just basically obviously didn't want their house to be basically sort of labeled as haunted.
	But this year we did get out to it and the people were lovely.
	The kind of things that people are experiencing, you know, is from full operations seen in front of them to like shouting and basically what sounds like shouting and screaming in their back garden and the sound of horses when there's nothing there.
	Now, it's quite a big garden, quite a big house.
	But the kind of things we experienced there, we were in there for a few weeks doing a bit of an investigation and then they're away to Australia.
	So once we come back, we're going to conduct a rest.
	But it was very, very active premises.
	Now, this place is a couple of hundred years old.
	And the things that you've seen there, do you think that they reflect its history?
	Things like tall, dark figures seen in the garden, apparently in the house, terrible smell in the garage area, lights floating in the house, all singing, all dancing, all kinds of things.
	It is.
	Now, where the house is built, about two doors down from it, there used to be a coach house, a coaching house.
	So obviously the coaching horses and all people coming up with us sort of stopped off there.
	And it was like a bit of an old inn as well.
	The floating lights we experienced the first night we were there.
	And I mean, to me, that was quite, it was quite an in-your-face thing because we had first got out of the car and we went in.
	It was just me and one of the other members that went in to speak to the owners of the house, you know, get the feel of the place, check if it was a genuine sort of activity in the house, and then arrange to go back and do a further investigation.
	And we walked down, the guy had said about the back garden.
	He just let us walk about.
	We walked out the back garden.
	There was an old stable block at the very, very bottom of the garden.
	And just when we walked out, I seen the lights, myself and the other member of the group seen the lights.
	And it looked like somebody just walking with a torch, you know, just down and walking into where one of the bottom stable was.
	So we never thought anything about it.
	Walked on down.
	Again, it was about half four or five, so it was quite dark.
	And walked on down and we sort of chatted and went into the room, expecting there to be somebody in this room with a torch.
	Nobody, nothing at all.
	And we had mentioned the guy that says, This is I see now this is about to influence your mind in any way, so I don't want to say anything to you.
	But the whole we've done a bit of research, and the research which sort of came across so far was, as I say, there's St. Field and Ball and the Hench and both of them towns.
	There was been sort of basically battles and sort of skirmishes sort of happened on.
	And where this house was, we believe, now we're trying to get it researched by the historians to find out for sure before we sort of go too far on it.
	But we think there was at least two, maybe three hangings just outside basically where the house was.
	So yeah, an awful lot of history.
	So far, say we've experienced doors closing right in front of us when there's no breeze.
	Like I actually said about the Sue voices and all us here, we've heard disembodied voices.
	We've got a couple of really good AVP electronic voice fun animals, so it's where you pick something up on like a recording.
	So yeah, very, very good.
	Now, the family are quite happy.
	I mean, they renovated the house a few years ago.
	And before they had moved in, the family was there beforehand.
	It had actually done a good bit of renovation as well.
	But the house is just built on a very old footstep of something that's a lot older.
	Right.
	And what about the full-body apparitions?
	There's something that you haven't seen but have been reported, yeah?
	That's right.
	The full-body apparitions to say is I would take it, we don't think the family story messing us about or anything because the young son, which is 15, I think he's 15, he's experienced it as well.
	And it's of a very, very, quite a tall male figure and dressed in dark clothes.
	And first of all, they thought he was leading on like a walking stick.
	But the sailors, he's holding something.
	But what the father knows, because the father, they've actually had trouble with their alarm system.
	Now, on their CCTV, their CCTV just doesn't seem to bring anything up.
	There's nothing caught on it visual.
	But once this, anytime they've had sort of problems with it, the CCTV does seem to go crazy.
	But they've experienced this figure and it said, it looks like it's carrying something.
	And what they think it is, is maybe like a whip or something because it was a coach horse, like a coaching house.
	They believe it was maybe somebody, maybe one of the coach drivers or something that got there with a horse.
	But yeah, it's a lot of history.
	So we were there, you know, within 10 minutes.
	We were experiencing things which, you know, there's times we'll go out to your house or a haunted, supposedly haunted location, and we'll sit there the whole night and experience nothing.
	Whereas this place says straight away, as soon as you walked into it, we always say to people, say, walking into your room or has been an argument.
	You know, everybody says, people say to you, okay, you might come pick anything they got up.
	I am no good at that.
	And you go, but if you walk in your room where it's being an argument, you're going to pick up that energy straight away.
	And it's a sexy wife spirit.
	You know, you'll pick spirit up in different ways, but you will feel the difference in the energy.
	Honestly, Smith, as soon as you walk in this room, this house, in fact, as soon as you walk into the garden, you just know there's something there.
	And you get the impression, Warren, that what is appearing and what is manifesting is repeating over and over again, unaware of people like you who go there to investigate it, or is it presenting for you and aware of you?
	Definitely, I would say some of it would be just like with the stone brickwork theory, where as you say, it's just been activated every sort of like an anniversary ghost or something earlier, where it's appearing, you know, all the time, doing the sexium things on this place as well, which is something, again, we haven't experienced.
	But now, one thing I'll say about the husband and wife, the husband used to be a minister.
	He's a retired minister, which means the whole thing, you know, we take even more for gospel sort of thing.
	But what he was saying was there's one of the figures which is seen on quite a regular basis.
	Now, they've reported basically whenever they've been there, say a few years, and they've experienced basically partnering activity since they first moved in.
	And there's this one energy, that's one sort of male energy, which basically walks up the main sort of driveway towards the house.
	But where they've got the driveway, now, whenever you're driving up the driveway, it sort of sweeps around slightly to the right.
	And then you go sort of left and go around, you park around the back of the house.
	But where the spur energy is seen walking up, it isn't on, it's slightly off the driveway, but it walks up and goes to the left.
	But apparently, this is the way the original way would have been.
	You said that you wanted to go back.
	If you go back, what other sorts of investigations on that site, which is so replete with stuff, could you be doing?
	Well, as I say, because the owner of the site, he's a sort of retired minister, he's wanting to get a minister to come out to do a clearing, a bit of a blessing on the house, on the site.
	Not an exorcism.
	But it's still, yeah, that's it.
	Now he's still more than happy, obviously, for us to come out as well.
	So what we plan to do, they're back in, I think it's the first week in February, their home.
	And what we're planning to do then is they're letting us basically take a lot of our equipment.
	And I'm not a great believer in the equipment, how it is, as you know, you know, I mean, I would rather work with Spirit.
	But Lendlist take a lot of our equipment and they set up the equipment, sort of night fishing camcorders, full-spectrum camcorders, everything we have to see if we are lucky enough to record or sort of tape anything.
	But Lendos do our thing first before they get the member of the clergy in.
	But they're working 100% with us.
	So we're basically happy to see what we do find.
	You know, we're hopefully want the experience of full operation.
	You know, obviously the gold sort of treasure chest at the bottom of the rainbow sort of thing.
	Every paranormal wants to experience that.
	We'd love to see that.
	This figure say that walks up the driveway, NPSA, looks at people and watches, it shows is an intelligence there.
	So we'd really love to find out.
	We'd really love to sort of contact that as well.
	So it's way until the end of February or sort of middle of the end of February now.
	You know, you're sort of all geared up and all keyed up to go out and do it.
	But unfortunately, you have to wait with your time, wait your turn sort of thing.
	What do they say, Warren?
	Good things come to those who wait.
	Hey, listen, I've forgotten.
	Have you got a website or anything people can check out?
	We do.
	We're actually getting a website under construction at the moment.
	So we are because we had one there, but it's just not sort of it keeps sort of clopsing on us.
	We're just through Facebook at the moment, so it's Warren Coats or else if Goody, Nipra's Irish Ghosts and Legends.
	Nippers.
	Nipra, N-I-P-R-A.
	So Northern Iron Power and Normal Research Association.
	Not the Research Association.
	Got it.
	Nipra.
	Warren, listen, thank you very much indeed.
	And happy holidays, as they say in the U.S. Happy Christmas and Happy New Year, as we say over here.
	Thank you very much.
	Same to yourself.
	Good speaking to you again.
	What did you think about that?
	My thanks to Warren Coates.
	One of these days, I'm going to get to visit Northern Ireland and take a look at some of those places.
	I got to the south of Ireland when I worked in Dublin for Radio Nova years ago.
	Never got to the north.
	Got to do that, I think.
	Thanks, Warren Coates.
	We'll speak again soon.
	Last item on this edition of The Unexplained, Inspector Roy Teague, and some details about Volume 2 of the book Policing the Haunted Skies that he's produced with John Hansen.
	There are some stunning, amazing, remarkable cases in this reported by serving and now retired police officers in various parts of the United Kingdom.
	I wasn't ready for some of these details.
	So, you know, sit back, relax and take these in.
	And my thanks very much to Inspector Roy Teague for joining me on the show.
	Here he is.
	I believe that police officers, police operatives, because they're trained to observe and report, you know, my father had a little typewriter.
	He'd be typing up some of his reports at home, taught me to type, which is why I became a journalist, I think.
	But, you know, they are people who are used to observing closely, carefully, and then notating what they have seen.
	So a book and a series of stories, a series of recollections of police observations of UAP stroke UFOs is going to be something that's full of detail and full of interest.
	That is where John Hansen and Inspector Roy Teague come in, Policing the Haunted Skies.
	There was one book, now there's another, and Roy Teague is online to us now.
	How are you, Roy?
	I'm absolutely brilliant.
	How are you, Howard?
	And thanks for having me on the show.
	I'm getting there remarkably rapidly.
	I can't believe it's the back end of the year now.
	Talk to me, Roy, about the collaboration that you have with John Hansen.
	Yeah, so my good friend John Hansen and I, we met about four years ago at Woodbridge at a conference, and he's a 27-year veteran of West Midlands Police, the same force that I'm in.
	And we just got chatting and clear up the conference because we're like-minded people, and it was a UFO conference.
	And we just got talking, and we're obviously interested in this sphere of phenomena.
	And we just decided there and then, as we're both, you know, John's next police officer I'm currently serving to get together.
	And nobody had ever done a book before collating police officer-only accounts of UFO sites.
	So we had a chat and we thought, why don't we do that?
	That's just something different.
	We got a good head start because of our occupations.
	And that is how everything started for John and I. As I said, recalling my father's service in the police.
	My father's no longer with us and we're talking about a previous era here.
	But I think in these terms, this hasn't changed.
	My father had experiences.
	He experienced ghosts when he was on duty.
	And I don't think he would have told many of his colleagues about these things for the simple reason that you would face ridicule and it might actually affect your career.
	At one point in history, there were times when police officers didn't want to talk about these things because it might cause their sanity and their credibility to be questioned.
	Have those times changed?
	A little bit, yes.
	However, I wouldn't say they've changed dramatically.
	So police officers are still very afraid of the stigma that's attached to the UFO subject or UAP as the trendy term is now.
	People are afraid of ridicule.
	They're afraid of what the police, the organisation will think about them, because would this bring negative public perception against the police?
	So if the officer starts, if he said he or she a senior UFO and then later on go to court, you might have the defence solicitor say, oh, aren't you the chap that sees UFOs behind every cloud?
	It might affect your promotion, your lateral movement within the organisation.
	So people are very loath in the police to come forward and give tales of UFOs they may have seen or paranormal occurrences or anything like that.
	So it's still with us, unfortunately.
	Alan Godfrey, the man who had the experience of something above his car in Todmoden on the Lancashire-Yorkshire border, very, very famous case.
	Alan Godfrey's a lovely man, might even be listening tonight.
	I think he's 80-odd now, but this was 1980 when this happened.
	You know, he went through a terrible time back then.
	And, you know, it is something, in fact, at the beginning of the book, and I'll quote John in the introduction to the book, a warning to my fellow police officers, to my brothers and sisters on the thin blue line, if you decide to become involved in the publication of a book involving this subject matter, be prepared for the consequences and the repercussions.
	I found this out less than an hour after the release of my first police UFO witness appeal via my local forces in the Police Federation magazine.
	Later, when the press got involved, it got a little more intense.
	So, you know, you have to do this with caution.
	Yes, that is actually my quote in my footwear, to be fair.
	And yeah, that does happen.
	Well aware of our Anne Godfrey.
	I've met him on a couple of occasions.
	Lovely guy.
	Well aware of his story.
	And he did have a very hard time back in the 80s, some, you know, 20, sorry, 43 years ago.
	If his accounts are as described, and I've got no reason to think that they aren't.
	But yeah, he had a terrible time from professional standards, from senior officers, and eventually he just resigned because it wasn't worth the grief he got through staying in the police after he'd appeared on national telly to say that he'd been subject to a possible UFO experience and an abduction.
	You know, it's a fascinating story.
	He wrote a book about it.
	And like you say, he is a lovely man, and it's an amazing story.
	Now, this book, the second edition of Policing the Haunted Skies, has not only some new cases, I think, but also follow-ups on cases you've already done, right?
	That is correct, yes.
	Okay.
	Well, if you sent me a list of cases, and I looked at the book today, there must be a couple of hundred at least in there.
	How many?
	I would suggest that in volume one, there's probably about 400, 500, and the same in volume two.
	We only intended how to do one book, and each chapter was going to be a separate police force.
	It was going to start with Avon and Somerset.
	It was going to finish with Wilkshire, the last police force.
	But we've got so many sightings that we had to stop volume one at the Met, and then Volume two carries on from the Met, and we've had to stop that at Thames Valley Police.
	And then Volume 3 will be after Thames Valley Police and onwards because we've had so many sightings from police officers who've been brave enough to come out and tell us about their experiences.
	That's really astonishing, isn't it, in this day and age?
	So you're talking about by the time you get to volume three, you're going to have, what, 800, 900 going on for 1,000?
	Yeah, probably even more than that.
	I mean, a lot of the officers have chosen to be anonymous.
	I'd say probably 15, 20%.
	But, you know, I've noticed that the ones that haven't, that are talking in the main have retired, so they're safe because the careers have come to an end, which is a shame, really, that they haven't got the confidence to speak up whilst currently serving.
	But unfortunately, that's just the way they feel.
	And I guess they think they're going to be ridiculed, so they've waited until they've retired to come on out.
	For all those reasons we discussed.
	All right, let's get into the cases.
	I've got the same list that you've got.
	And help me through these with the detail.
	But helicopter, London, UFO 1 barrel incident, 1979.
	PC Williams Humphrey Bishop.
	Yeah, well, my co-author got this one before I met him.
	So this one's down to John Anson, like I say, a fantastic investigator.
	Now, he bumped into William Humphrey Bishop, who's a police constable in the Met, and he was an air observer on the helicopter.
	And it's 1979, it's July.
	It's near the MI6 building above the Thames, obviously London.
	It's 20 past one.
	And just to point out that William Bishop was a holder of a pilot's license and proofs in the RAF.
	So he's got a good, you know, he's got a good knowledge of aerial sort of incidents and the mechanics of how things should fly and all the rest of it.
	So they're dispatched to Robbery in Progress near Heathrow Airport.
	And it was the pilot has then seen a silver grey, what he describes as a barrel-type object in the sky.
	They're looking at it, they can't quite believe it.
	And bear in mind, this is 1979, before people had drones and remote control things up in the sky and all the rest of it.
	And then a second one's appeared.
	The radioed air dispatch told them what they've seen and they were told to immediately return to the Battersea helipad stroke airport and not to investigate the matter any further.
	And that's kind of weird because isn't that what we're supposed to do?
	The police investigate things.
	And also, didn't they have a robbery to attend?
	But no, they were told to go straight back.
	And guess what?
	Curiosity got the better of them and they ended up in what can only be described as an air pursuit of this UFO that ended up stopping over the A4 stroke M4 junction.
	And it was at that point the pilot got nervous and said, well, if this thing hits the rotors, we're all dead men.
	So what they've done is they've backed off, at which point the UFO shot off towards Heathrow.
	They've chased it again.
	And it's gone down to Brondesbury railway station, just above the tracks, ground level, stopped near a man walking his dog who absolutely unbelievably didn't see it because it's behind him, very pantomimes, but there you go.
	And then as they're looking at this thing, it shoots off into the sky at thousands of miles an hour from naught to whatever, thousands of miles an hour in the blink of an eye.
	Now, we don't have anything, Howard, now in 2023 that can do that, let alone 1979.
	So for me, if the incident as was described, that to me is absolutely 100%.
	And I'm going to stick my neck out.
	And I know I'm still serving.
	But the truth is the truth.
	And the police are seekers of the truth.
	That is non-human tech.
	We don't have it.
	That's non-human tech out for an absolute.
	And look, because it covered such a big area, that incident must have been seen by a lot of people, perhaps many of whom have not spoken, you know, between 1979 and now.
	Well, that's quite possible.
	And just to further add, when they go back and land, our witness, basically, William, is grounded, told not to speak to no one, and he's not going to fly again as an air observer.
	He comes to work the next day, thinking he'll be doing desk duties, and there's a note in his pigeonhole, and it says, ring this number.
	So he rings the number and he's invited to an address in Croydon, where he's interviewed by, guess what?
	The RAF and a couple of other people, sort of dodgy-looking people in suits in dark corners of a room.
	He gives the accounts, but only on the proviso, they'll get him reinstated in his role.
	They agree to do so.
	He gives his account.
	And just before he leaves, he turns around and says to the RAF officer, just for my sanity, what did I see?
	And the RAF officer turns around and said, we believe you've seen a drone from a much larger craft higher up in the atmosphere that we can't get to.
	So they'll never admit to saying that.
	They'll never prove, it'll never be proven to have said that.
	And of course, he gets to work and much to the annoyance of his inspector who grounded him, he is reinstated into his role.
	So off the point.
	How do you, I'm sorry to jump in here, but I'm so spellbound by this story.
	How do you continue having had that experience, having been warned off like that, having then been told on the QT that actually, yes, this was something like a mothership and something that came from the mothership?
	I don't know, having had your eyes opened like that, I don't know what your service beyond that point would be like.
	How did he manage in the years that followed that?
	I guess he probably thought, well, whatever the answer, what can he do about it?
	He's still got to, I guess, pay his mortgage, look after his family and work.
	So, I mean, I'd be thrilled to have seen something like that, just in the knowledge in my own mind that we really, really aren't alone out there and the universe has got, you know, other life in it, even if it's superior in technology to our own.
	So, I mean, yeah, how do you carry on?
	But it is what it is.
	And the human spirit, you just carry on knowing that, you know, there's other life forms in the university, and it's an awesome thing, mate.
	Something that heads out to the massively busy.
	It was then, it certainly is now, junction of the A4 and the M4, which is out kind of slough way as you go west of London.
	You know, it's always busy night and day.
	It is.
	That's astonishing.
	And then doubles back to Bronsbury, to a railway station and is above the track or near a railway station and hovers above the track.
	Yeah, that is exactly according to William what happened.
	And it doesn't end there, Howard, because, and I would like to thank you for this.
	When I was on your show, I was only on for about three or four minutes last time.
	You may remember it last year.
	And as a result of just being on your show, I had about 15 or 20 calls from police officers.
	And one of them is connected to the incident I've just told you about.
	And what happened was he was well aware of William Humphrey Bishop's account.
	And he had his own in 1997 on July 5th, some 18 years later.
	Now, he didn't say anything because of the ridicule that William had suffered for 18 years.
	And he gave me and he gave me the name of a corroborating witness.
	And if I could, this story is even more astonishing than the one, in my opinion, by William Bishop.
	And would you allow it to be?
	Is this another helicopter story?
	Yes, it is.
	It's number two on the list, but it is coming.
	Let's hear it, yeah.
	Thank you so much.
	And this is absolutely fantastic.
	So you've got PC Paul Hammond.
	Now, he was in the police for 30 years.
	He's a very experienced air observer.
	He's attended thousands of incidents.
	And he's actually been on helicopter twice when he said road to failure and the helicopter's crash.
	So he is well versed in all matters of aerial policing.
	And he's on the helicopter.
	Obviously, you've got the pilot.
	And also, there was a warrant officer on the aircraft with him who was on an attachment from the army.
	And that was a Sergeant Major David Frampton.
	And he was a glider pilot.
	So again, very knowledgeable of all matters when it comes to flying.
	Now, they are above a parade.
	Again, it's near the Thames, near the MI6 building.
	And some of the crowd are firing a pair of fireworks into the air, these big chamulis.
	Not at the helicopter, but the pilot says, well, if one of those comes near us, he could damage the aircraft.
	So he banks the aircraft over to the left.
	And as he does so, that's when they all see it.
	And they have described it as a, I guess, a dart-shaped craft, which is almost like, you know, you make the paper airplanes at school.
	It was like that, just stationary in the sky, making no noise, not hovering, about 50 feet in length.
	And it's clearly there.
	It's not a drone.
	They don't know what it is.
	So they end up going around it in a kind of Mexican standoff, but this thing doesn't move.
	They radio the airport and say, what's this up in the sky?
	And the airport say, there's nothing up there.
	You are on your own.
	And well, that's when they get excited because they know they're not.
	Now, as they're looking at this thing through the FLUR, which is the heat camera, the forward-looking infrared, the back of the craft heats up, it then shoots forward and they look up as it shoots forward.
	And this is the bit that is absolutely incredible.
	And I have got a couple of these stories in addition to this.
	As it shoots forward, get this, Howard, a crack, a hole opens up in the sky and the craft, the UFO, the dark UFO, flies into it.
	And then the thing closes up behind it.
	And if it's as described, this is why I don't think we've got non-human tech from extraterrestrial biological entities coming here just from great distances, although I do think we have.
	I think we've got potentially interdimensional craft that can open doorways from one realm of existence to another to disappear.
	I've got to take some commercials, but I just want to remind my listener that the person reporting this and indeed the previous case, these are responsible police officers.
	These are people who've been vetted and trained.
	They're observers.
	They are sober-minded individuals who have a job to do.
	And just imagine the amount of effort and the amount of soul searching you have to do before you tell a story like that.
	Hold that thought, Roy.
	Inspector Roy Teague, we're policing the haunted skies.
	And Roy, what I want to do is to get you back and we'll have another bite at the cherry and do some more of these stories.
	But we talked about two London-based stories to do with helicopter crews, one 1979, one 1997.
	Deeply mysterious.
	Just to cap off the 1997 story here, was the person involved in this, PC Paul Hammond, I think, Sergeant David Frampton, were they debriefed at Croydon or somewhere like the people were, or the person was in 1979?
	Well, that is a great question.
	And I do have the answer, of course.
	And the answer is they weren't debriefed.
	And I'll tell you why they weren't debriefed.
	It was because they had a discussion in the helicopter on the way back.
	And they specifically mentioned what happened to William Humphrey Bishop.
	They were concerned about their careers.
	They were concerned about the pension.
	They were concerned about, you know, labelled as mad, losing the jobs, not being able to feed the families, put food and meat on the table.
	So they elected to remain quiet and tell nobody for the sake of their careers.
	So therefore, the brass never knew because they were never told.
	Boy.
	Well, listen, I completely 100%, you know that my dad was a copper, so I get it even more.
	I get why they did that.
	And don't get the impression, I'm speaking to my listener here, that these things only happen in the London area or, you know, huge, great conurbations.
	And, you know, don't get the impression that they're only things that happened 20, 30 years ago, because there was a case in 2016.
	I remember hearing about this on the Welsh television news.
	2016, South Wales police helicopter crew, they encounter and they film a UFO above the Bristol Channel.
	It's a sphere within a sphere.
	This is an astonishing story, and it's only, what, seven years ago?
	It is, and I'll happy to tell you about that, but just before I do, because my co-author will absolutely murder me if I don't, can I just say, you know, on behalf of myself and John Anderson, we'd like to thank the hundreds of police officers that have come forward to give us their stories.
	And we would like to implore any other police officers who've had any UFO experiences or any paranormal ones to do please get in contact with us.
	Myself at royteague at blueyonder.co.uk, that's royteague at blueyonder.co.uk or my co-author and you can contact John at john dawn1 at sky.com john dawn1 at sky.com and I'd further like to thank Shirley Edwards,
	our librarian from the great British Haunted Skies Archive who really helps us out by cross-referencing the sites from the public with our police ones to bolster the evidence and I'd like to thank Bob Tibbetts, our typesetter and UFO consultant who's done such a great job in arranging the presentation of the book and thanks for letting me say that Howard and now I will crack straight on and I don't know too much about that site other than what was reported in the newspaper because unfortunately it's proved problematic contacting the officers
	concerned although i know they've retired now but you are correct it was a south wales police helicopter crew in 2016 they did film a ufo it was a sphere within a sphere you can google it you can look at the picture and the film online however what i can say and yes you're right that was 2016 um i have done my own research on that and what i can tell you is that in 2009 there was a pc nick barman from hampshire police he was on holiday in malta and he photographed and sent me another ufo and
	guess what harrod it's a sphere within a sphere i've put the two photographs together and it's clearly the same exact type of craft i then delved further california across the pond police helicopter harassed by ufo would you believe it it's a sphere within a sphere that you can watch the footage i've zoomed in i've screenshot it it's the same type of craft switzerland november 2021 identical craft sphere within a sphere filmed by a member of the public and this one if
	anyone's interested there's a great series on netflix called encounters and that footage is shown on episode three at the 45 minute mark to be exact now if you put all of these pictures together which i have i am telling you howard this craft i'm not saying it's the exact same one because you get bmws in wolverhampton or birmingham or the same type of what i'm saying is it's the same make and model and i believe that there are different ufo craft for different purposes the same as we have jets for fighting or
	passenger aircraft to convey people on holiday or crop dusting aircraft i believe that these craft uh these non-human craft they have different tech for different things whether it's research whether they're probes whatever it is and of course i can't say because i don't have the knowledge and perhaps the government don't either i have no idea but they are different non-human tech craft for different purposes that i'm absolutely i can absolutely state unequivocal in my mind is a fact and
	uh thank you for bringing up the the south wells helicopter crew upon because that was on my list yeah but it's the same crap all over the world that keeps popping up and two red spheres within a larger sphere reported by a detective detective constable adrian shaw very famous venue the belfry golf club 1995 um according to the book security officers pursued and were almost struck by a ufo described as i said uh as two large spheres within again a larger
	sphere that is correct and i'll be really quick for this one because i'm amazed very quickly these interviews cover when you're having such a good time mate but yes that is true so basically it was in around about 2000 and the witness can't be sure it's between it's quite a big time gap between 2005 and 10 dc adrian shaw he goes to the belfry golf club investigating a completely separate matter at which point he speaks to a manager who tells him that last the evening before a ufo was caught on cctv and it and it chased two security officers um he
	then um looked and watched CCTV it was as described but the manager didn't want any adverse publicity so nothing was ever released now of course when he heard my appeal you know last year he tell he contacts me DC Adrian Shore tells me the story said guess what I'll go down to Belfry Golf Club don't I Howard?
	I went down there and I spoke to a manager and would you believe it was one of the managers who was on duty at the time but he said to me oh no no that was just fireworks and again clearly they didn't want the UFO stigma associated with the very you know the awesome Belfry Golf Club.
	So I said okay and I had a cup of coffee and I went away.
	Well I snuck back two nights later when the manager wasn't there spoke to a member of security and he said you're not going to believe this.
	He said we know about it and two of the staff that were on duty that night are working here and I managed to interview both.
	Now both of them told a slightly different story.
	They said that they pursued the UFO in a golf cart, however fast a golf cart could travel these days, probably about 20 miles an hour.
	But they described it as two large red spheres rotating around each other inside of another red sphere.
	And the reason why that is very, very pertinent is because in the late 1960s, I know we're going back a bit, but David O'Flanagan, a police constable for Tynemouth Borough Police, again, like I say, same craft, different location, he was pursued by a UFO described as two red spheres spinning around each other at thousands of miles an hour within another red sphere.
	And he was pursued in his police car in company with his colleague down the road for about three miles, at which point, as they've rounded a corner, the top of this thing has just missed the blue lights on the top of the car and shot off.
	They've driven down the road probably about another mile, parked up, got out, looked in the sky to see it, they can't see it.
	And they're just thinking, well, that's the end of it.
	And would you believe it?
	They've heard a noise, look to the right, this thing shot out the trees again, just over the heads, just missed the top of the police car.
	Now, when this guy got back and told his inspector, his inspector said, typical inspector, go home and sleep it off.
	And he hadn't been drinking, neither had his colleague, but that, and literally, he never mentioned it anymore because he was afraid of his career, how it would look.
	And he only told that story once he'd retired from the police and he emigrated.
	He's back here now, though, but he emigrated to Spain.
	And you can actually get the story.
	I think it's called, it's Costa del Something or other, but it's a Spanish newspaper.
	He sent me a copy of it and I've took photocopies of it, and that will be in volume three when it comes out.
	So, like I say, sphere in a sphere, same craft.
	And then we've got this double red sphere spinning around another sphere in another sphere.
	So different craft for different things, but very, very fascinating stories.
	But what I can say is this is not man-made.
	They aren't man-made.
	This is non-human tech.
	And I'm absolutely convinced the examples I'm giving you here tonight, live on air, are non-human tech.
	And I'm willing to stick my neck out and speak about it.
	Well, the behavior is certainly the behavior of the craft that we're talking about.
	And the nature of the craft is certainly unknown.
	And, you know, if that's experimental Air Force technology, well, it's pretty damned advanced.
	And I can't see how it can be.
	But, you know, it might be, but that's a bit of a stretch, I suspect.
	Listen, there's one aspect of this that I think is very important.
	It's probably overlooked.
	My dad, when he was in the force, had to deal with things that most people couldn't deal with.
	And I'm sure you have too.
	The accidents, the murders and tragedies.
	He'd have to go there and see it.
	Now, these people who went through these experiences, various, and the risk of ridicule, sometimes having to keep your mouth shut about it, in today's terms, that's a trauma.
	And some of these people, I suspect, probably came away with years of post-traumatic stress disorder.
	But if they'd experienced something bad in an accident, they would be helped.
	But experiencing something like this, no help available, I suspect.
	No, I would say none whatsoever, because it's not proven that it exists.
	So if it's not proven, it exists.
	I think that's probably how the government or the force look at it.
	And also, I think what probably doesn't help is what helps is if you can talk about something and get it off your chest, because you need to talk about these things.
	But that, you're bottling it up, you can't talk about it.
	And I think that probably does just as much harm as the witnessing of the initial incident itself.
	And if you can't talk about it, it really is a shame.
	But I do think things are getting better, and I do think things are improving.
	Just talk to me quickly.
	I worked in the Midlands and I have a very soft spot for it because I had wonderful times there.
	The Dudley Dorito.
	I wonder if you can summarise that in about a minute and a half.
	Yeah, the Dudley Dorito has been seen in sort of Hails Owen, Stairbridge, Wolverhampton, Birmingham.
	And it's called the Dudley Dorito because it's a triangular shaped UFO.
	It's been seen many times in the area over the last 30, 35 years, including by a police officer from the Midlands who was out walking over Dudley Beacon.
	And that officer was called Stephen Fayville.
	And that was in 1986, I believe it was.
	And again, non-human tech, triangular, popped out from behind the clouds.
	He's looking up and it can't believe he's seeing it.
	It's about 50 metres by 50 metres by 50 metres, point to point.
	And then when it jets off, it jets off directly upwards, not forward or any of towards any of the points, straight up and gone within two seconds.
	Again, method of exit from the witness's view denotes to me that's probably non-human tech because we didn't have that back in 86.
	And I don't think we've got it now.
	So that to me, again, method of exit is really important, Howard, how the craft leaves the eyesight of the witness.
	And if it's gone in the blink of an eye like that, we don't have anything that goes from 0 to 1,000 in a second.
	We can build up to it, but we don't have anything that goes at the click of a fingers from 0 to that speed.
	Remarkable research.
	And even though I wrote the forward for the latest edition, and just standing back impartially, I have to say these are terrific books, beautifully produced.
	John Hansen's very humble about them.
	So is Roy.
	But let me tell you, they are great and well worth obtaining, as you will see when you get them.
	You know, no space is wasted in these books.
	It's crammed with detail.
	So thank you to Roy Teague.
	Before that, we had Warren Coates talking about ghosts in Northern Ireland.
	And before that, Steve Bassett on the ongoing saga of disclosure.
	More great guests in the pipeline through 2024 here on The Unexplained.
	So until we meet again, my name is Howard Hughes.
	This has been The Unexplained.
	And please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm.
	And above all, please stay in touch.
	Thank you very much.
	Take care.

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