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Jan. 4, 2021 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:04:05
Edition 508 - Susan Plunket

Susan Plunket is a Greenwich Village, New York-based psychologist analyses dreams - among many other things - and believes we are - and she is - guided by higher dimensional beings...

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Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes, and this is The Unexplained.
Look, I can't be sure which side of Christmas and the new year you're going to be hearing this edition of The Unexplained.
I'm going to presume it's just before Christmas.
So hopefully the words that I'm about to say are going to be relevant, depending on where you are and who you are.
I'd just like to say that I hope that the holidays are going to be kind to you in spite of all the stuff that the world has been through in this year of 2020.
The UK seems to be in the middle of it all, seems to be one of the worst affected by it all.
So I hope that if you're in the UK, if you're in the United States, where you have your own issues, I hope that you've been able to grab some peace and some time and some joy in this holiday period.
Thank you very much for all of your emails.
And also, thank you very much if you've made a donation to the online version of this show.
Gratefully received.
And, you know, I couldn't do any of it without your contributions.
So please, if you are able to make a donation to The Unexplained to keep it going into 2021, then please do.
Please know that whatever happens to the radio version of The Unexplained, the online version will always be here.
And this website, theunexplained.tv, will, for as long as I can afford to run it, continue to exist.
Thank you for all of the nice things you've said, not only recently in your emails, but also through this year.
Your comments and your suggestions have kept me going through what has been for all of us a really tough year.
If you want to get in touch with me, please go to the website theunexplained.tv and you can follow the link and send me an email from there.
And my year-end thanks to Adam Cornwell, of course, my webmaster for his hard work, and also to Haley for booking the guests, including the guest you're about to hear.
But more about her in a moment.
I was hoping to do recently another listener stories special on the radio show.
And I'd asked you some while ago, you might remember this, to send in stories that you might have.
And I narrowed it down to 12 or 14 stories that we were going to use on air.
Some of them exceptionally good.
The problem was that when we got round to contacting the people who'd sent the stories, very few of them responded or they responded negatively.
In other words, they said, well, we did think we wanted to come on and talk about this on the air.
We've decided not to.
So unfortunately, I've had to abandon plans for the next edition of Listener Stories on the Unexplained.
But if you have a listener story or you've already sent me a listener story and you'd like to go ahead with it, bearing in mind you're only talking to me when you come on the radio.
There's nothing to be scared of.
It's only me.
So go to the website, theunexplained.tv, and if you can title your email, Listener Story.
And then we might be able to get together a listener story special on the radio show that I might put here online sometime earlier the new year.
But at the moment, like I say, we were hoping to do it during December, and we've had to abandon that plan just because I think people are busy or they've decided they don't want to do it.
But we'll see where we are then.
Okay, thank you for that.
Now, the guest on this edition of the show, something different and something I think that is tremendously fascinating.
Susan Plunkett is a New York-based writer and psychologist in private practice in NYC.
She received her doctorate at the New School for Social Research in 1989.
Her first book, When Every Breath Becomes a Prayer, reflects her interests in Jungian dream analysis and people who've had an experience of the numinous as a result of emotional pain.
Her life is informed by the belief that it's our attitude towards our suffering that determines our growth.
Now, I've had people try to tell me that for an awful long time.
So it's going to be an interesting conversation, I think.
We'll get across to New York in just a moment.
We'll talk about dreams.
We'll talk about past lives.
And maybe one or two things that we don't normally address here on The Unexplained.
We are keenly looking for new guests.
So if you have a suggestion, go to the website theunexplained.tv, send me an email and market guest suggestion.
And if you've done that recently, thank you very much.
And if you've donated to the show recently or during this last year or so, thank you very much from the bottom of my heart.
Okay, let's cross to New York City now.
Susan Plunkett is there.
Susan, thank you for coming on my show.
I'm delighted, Howard, to be on your show.
Now, listen, I've talked to people in some pretty hallowed locations over the years, people who've been in almost in jungles, but certainly in forests and big city centers and stuff like that.
But you are actually speaking to me from one of the most exciting locations in the world in my book.
You're on Fifth Avenue, New York, right?
Right.
And I agree with you.
It is one of the most exciting locations in the world.
I love it here.
And what's it like at the moment, though?
Because I've been shown photographs of Fifth Avenue, an area that I know pretty well.
And during the whole situation that we've been through this year, pretty quiet.
Pretty quiet for there.
Yeah, it's perked up a little.
I don't know if it's the holiday season, but it's perked up a bit.
At the moment, it's kind of gray, like we're waiting for the storm that's coming.
Because I guess from the Rockies, it's coming snow.
And then everybody will be out.
They will be wearing skis on Fifth Avenue.
They will be pulling sleds down Fifth Avenue.
And the cars will be buried in snow.
Snow tires.
At least I'm hoping for that.
They'll have snow tires.
I remember snow tires.
Okay.
Now, this is going to be a very interesting conversation, I think, that we're going to range over a lot of topics within.
Your biography tells me that you're a writer and a psychologist.
And I wonder why a psychologist, and I'm sure in New York there is plenty of trade, plenty of business to keep you going in standard psychology.
Why do you get involved in the areas that you get involved in, which include dreams, past lives, extraterrestrials and that kind of thing?
How come you've gone down that route?
That's an interesting question.
Thank you for that.
I thought when I was younger that I was just a psychologist, A Jungian psychologist, which is already a little not centered in mainstream psychology because Jung was very spiritual and he was very himself interested in the unconscious, in unidentified flying objects, in the I Ching, in tarot.
So he was a very spiritual, he had a very spiritual take on psychology.
So that was my starting point working in private practice.
And of course, all-depth psychology focuses on dreams.
And Jung, in particular, felt that dreams could see around corners into the future, that dreams could help us see through the veil of forgetting, which keeps us from remembering our past lives in other galaxies even, or on Earth.
So he really valued dreams as I do.
And so I was already working along like that.
And as a young psychologist, 30 years ago, sometimes I would be sitting with a client and I would get an idea that I knew wasn't my own.
It just kind of dropped in, like dropped from heaven unasked.
And I knew it was to help this person that I was sitting with.
And so I would relay the information or insight.
Do you think you're psychic?
I think everybody's psychic.
It's just a matter if you want to develop it, trust it, listen to it.
But in those days, I only used it with clients because I think I was afraid of it.
And then in 2010, I was speaking to a channel who's now crossed over, an older man in his 90s.
And he said, you know, you're a channel yourself.
Why aren't you channeling?
And I said, because I'm afraid.
I don't want any dark information or dark energy coming through.
And I let it go for another five years.
And in 2015, I was speaking to an intuitive, a healer, a shaman.
And she said, she was in Minnesota.
She said, it's 10 below zero here.
And I'm burning up because your guides and my guides are saying you have to write.
You think your mission is to be a therapist.
You can do that.
But your real mission on Earth is to be a writer.
And you're to be a scribe for those sitting in the formless realm that have been trying to get a message to Earth through you.
Are you going to let them?
And I was like, I can't.
I'm raising my daughter.
I've got a dog and two cats.
I've got a husband.
At that time, I had a husband.
I'm running my practice.
I don't have time to write.
But I was afraid and I was resisting.
But a month went by and I couldn't stop thinking about it.
So I sat down and it just started coming through me.
And I've been writing ever since.
And a couple years after that, I was speaking to another shaman, the daughter of an Australian Aborigine.
And she said, your book is supposed to be a trilogy.
I said, how do you know I'm writing a book?
She said, come on.
I said, okay, so now it's a trilogy.
So to date, last year, the first one came out, Mission from Venus.
On December 11th, which is a couple days ago, the second one called The Wanderers on Earth was released in the UK.
It will be released in the US January 1st.
And I'm currently writing the third one.
So that's how I went from psychologist to author, although I still am a psychologist to make a living.
Those books don't make you much of a living.
I just write them because even though they're channeled, it's grounding for me.
I don't know if that can make sense.
Well, I think all of us in what we do, I think we get some degree of therapy from, you know, sorry, I'm sounding like you're a therapist now, but we get some degree of therapy from the things we do.
I certainly get benefit from what I do, the business of communication.
So yeah, I get that.
But Mission from Venus, just to center on that for a moment, that's science fiction, isn't it?
But if you believe that you're channeling something external, and we'll talk about what that is, why did you have to write that as science fiction?
Because the second shaman told me to put it in story form, because she said, just like Harry Potter, just like Lord of the Rings, all of these fantasy fiction works, Star Wars, they really have a lot of truth in them, but they reach much more people.
And their message of dark versus light or good and evil or unity can get through in story form better.
So just make it in story form.
So that's what I've done.
And of course, we know, and you mentioned Star Wars, but there are many other examples, including Star Trek, but all kinds of series, all kinds of books and movies.
You know, they say that they're seeded with ideas, ideas that later become seen to be and viewed to be fact.
But I'm just looking at the description of the book, Mission from Venus.
It says it explores a world of fifth and sixth dimensional beings who are training on Venus to incarnate on Earth, to awaken humans to their divine powers and prevent the Dark Lords of Orion from enslaving them and harvesting Earth for the dark side.
How much of that do you think is true?
I don't know if this—I think it's all true.
I don't know in the exact details if it's the Dark Lords from Orion, but that was what came to me from the Council to use as the adversary.
From the Council?
Yeah, apparently, because that's been verified to me.
I was talking to another person doing an interview and she said, Oh, I see the council.
I said, you mean the council that I'm a scribe for?
She said, yeah, I see them.
I said, no one's ever, I never told anyone it was a council.
She said, well, I see them.
I'm psychic Zeus.
I said, well, great.
There's verification.
So I receive information from several beings, but mainly from a council in the formless realm that apparently I sat with before I incarnated and agreed to this mission to be a scribe, but then didn't take it up until I was 60.
So I was a little bit of a late bloomer and a slow starter, I'm sure, as far as the council was concerned.
But they download things during my sleep, but also they can be very specific.
Like I'll be typing and I'll type one word and then I'll hear a synonym for that word and I know that I'm supposed to change it, that they want that other word.
But usually they're not so specific.
They let me, I don't know how much they let me or whether I'm just doing everything they say.
But I love the characters that they've given me or I've created because although on Venus apparently there were thousands of fifth and sixth dimensional beings who answered the call that went out across the universe to help Earth.
Sounds like you've got the police outside.
Yeah, you can hear that.
That's Fifth Avenue.
That's okay.
It's just like I'm amazed we haven't heard more sounds from Fifth Avenue.
So look, you believe that you are connected when you're doing your writings to something beyond us.
Now, that is going to sound pretty out there for a lot of people listening to this.
How do you know this?
I know it not only, mostly I trust it because of other shamans and intuitives, multiple, maybe five or six or seven at this point, have told me that's what's happening.
And also because I had that early feeling when I was a young psychologist that there were things coming to me that were not mine, that were not thought up or downloaded specifically by my own personal brain.
So I can kind of feel the difference between what's me and what's coming to me.
And now that I'm not afraid of it anymore, as I was for most of my life, I just let it come through me.
And we kind of have an agreement that I only get information during my sleep or when I'm at the computer working on the books, so that I'm not getting it or it's not coming into my life in other ways.
I think we've made that agreement somehow.
Are they what we would call alien beings or are they, as far as you're aware, spirits?
I think that they are in the formless realm, so they would be spirits.
They're in the formless realm.
I don't know if they've ever been human or on what planet that they have incarnated if they did.
I don't know that much about them other than that they're a council and that I have known them in many lifetimes and they have known me and that I should trust them.
But I see them as ovals of light.
I don't see them in humanoid form or extraterrestrial form.
I just see them as ovals of light.
So they're pure energy.
Yeah, they're energy.
They're energy.
That's what they look like to me, and that's what they feel like.
And they seem to have no agenda other than please get this message out, which is basically the message that I'm taking three books to say.
It could be said in a sentence.
We are all one.
All humans are one.
And you don't understand that.
We don't understand that in the third dimension because we live in dualism, rich and poor, high and low, right and wrong, old and young.
But Earth is moving into the fourth dimension, and that's a dimension of unity.
And we need to understand that we are all connected, we are all one being, that in fact the entire universe is one being.
We are all just different points of light in this one great being.
And when we work together, life is more joyful for all of us.
So that we need to move to the fourth dimension, every being needs to put down judgment, judgment of others who don't think or feel as they do.
We all need to be accepting that there are different points of light and different parts of this one beautiful organism that is our universe and of which each human is a point of light and fully divine.
Why don't they come here?
Sorry to jump in.
Why don't they come here themselves and tell us that?
Why do they have to do this covert method of getting that message across?
Why do they have to go through a third party, i.e.
yourself?
Because that's a very good question with a very clear answer.
Because Earth is quarantined.
There's a veil of forgetting around Earth.
There are many other third-dimensional planets in galaxies which support life.
But Earth was experimental in that everyone incarnating here must pass through the veil of forgetting and no longer know that they have lived many, many lifetimes.
They may discover it through their dreams or past life regression or life between life regression.
But the agreement to incarnate is here.
You come in, you have no knowledge of who you were, and you must try to wake up in the third dimension.
And no one is supposed to slip through the quarantine, no matter how high a dimensional Being they are without incarnating.
So, those in the formless realm would have to incarnate as human.
And when you incarnate as human, you no longer know your past.
And the risk is that you might not wake up in the third dimension.
And if you don't wake up and remember that you say are a higher dimensional being, you could be trapped incarnating in the third dimension in various galaxies or on Earth for millions of years.
So it's very risky for fifth and sixth dimensional beings to incarnate on Earth because they might not wake up.
So you and I, and all of us human beings here on Earth, we're part of this experiment.
I mean, it sounds like a pretty lousy experiment to me then.
We come here, we're kept in the dark, we don't know who we really are, we don't know what we can really do for somebody else's experiment.
No, we volunteered.
Just like the wanderers are volunteering in my work, I believe every soul on earth is an incredibly brave and adventurous wanderer who agreed to do this to see if they could wake up.
Because the only thing we have to wake up to is our own divinity and the fact of unity, that we're all one.
And it is possible to wake up to that.
And nobody's forced to come here.
In fact, people want to come here.
People want the opportunity because if you wake up in this heaviness of the third dimension, you are furthered on your journey back to source, immensely furthered.
So it's a great gift to have a human life.
It's a precious thing to have a human life and an opportunity to wake up.
And it's not really that hard.
So this is a rite of, I've got to get this clear.
This life that you and I are living, and believe me, Susan, I frequently, especially this year, am asking questions like, what is the point of it?
So the point of it is, it's almost like going through a rite of passage or initiation then.
Right.
The point of it is to wake up and understand that you, me, and everyone listening is part of the whole.
We're all part of this great unity.
We're all part of the universe, which is one being.
All the galaxies, all the stars, all the planets, every being on Earth.
We are all divine.
And the minute we wake up and know that, we're free.
Ever since I've released.
Free to do what?
If we get released, and here I am jumping in again, sorry.
If we get released in that way, what exactly are we free to do?
To be joyful.
To be absolutely, utterly joyful without worries, without anxiety, knowing that we are divine beings, knowing that the happiness of every being is ultimately, completely, absolutely assured.
If we just wake up, and right now is particularly important because Earth herself is moving into the fourth dimension.
Her heart chakra, which I believe to be Glastonbury, I believe Glastonbury in the UK is the heart chakra of the planet, just as Uluru, that largest rock in the world in the center of Australia, is the solar plexus chakra.
And Earth as a being is moving into the fourth dimension, which is the consciousness of unity, and all are one.
And that's the task for each of us, to get that same consciousness that Mother Earth has.
And why is, just explain to me why it's good to get there.
Because you're so much more joyful, because you can tolerate temporary suffering if you understand that there's a divine plan.
And the plan is for everyone to be loved.
Everyone is loved.
They just forget it.
They just don't remember how much they are loved.
Okay, sounds like we get a pretty rotten deal down here then.
No, we got the opportunity to come here to this beautiful, beautiful planet to just play and have our experiments and yes, suffer.
But in the bigger picture, it's about our own growth and our own journey back to source.
We have to go through the dimensions, the third, the fourth, the fifth, the sixth, the seventh, and then the next octave of the first, second.
And, you know, I don't know how many octaves there is.
They've never talked to me about anything beyond the seventh dimension and the first octave.
But once you get even into the fourth dimension, there are a lot of people here right now on the planet that are really full of love.
There are people full of fear, but that's the big dichotomy on earth right now.
Are you going to go with fear?
Are you going to go with love?
And the more people that go with love, the better and better things will get.
They have told me that in 200 to 300 years, there will be paradise on earth.
Absolute paradise on earth, because everyone incarnate here will have fourth-dimensional consciousness.
Those people that don't want to have fourth-dimensional consciousness, that want to stay in duality of us versus them or love versus fear, will incarnate someone else when they die.
Right.
So the future is going to be really good.
Really good.
But we've just got to get there.
And what are they doing then to help us to prevent us from destroying this planet?
They've sent 80 million wanderers.
They have sent 80 million wanderers from the fifth dimension to incarnate as human.
They have told me that there are 80 million higher dimensional beings incarnate, born as human infants.
So, Susan, you're saying that there are 80 million across, that's a big number across this planet, who have come from there, incarnated.
They know who these people know who they are, and they've come to help us?
Yes.
They don't know when they're first born because, like, like you and me, they had to go through the veil of forgetting.
And though then they had to wake up.
For example, I believe that Tesla was a wanderer.
I believe Benjamin Franklin was a wanderer.
Jesus, Buddha, Muhammad, I think they were all wanderers from higher dimensions who came with messages of love.
Like Tesla wanted to give electricity to everyone for free.
And indeed, they said the theory about Tesla is that he was silenced for that reason, because he believed it should be a universal good.
Yes.
So if you ever meet anybody who's talking to you about universal good, love for all beings as one, they may be a wanderer.
And they're spread in every country on the globe.
And when they wake up and realize, because as they grow, apparently, they feel that they may be a little different.
And eventually, hopefully they all wake up and deliver their message.
And that's what the book is about.
They're training on Venus, a new group of them, and they're born as infants.
And at the end of the first book, they're all born.
One is born in Moscow, one is born in London, one is born in Dublin, New York, Cairo, Mumbai, Tehran.
They're born all over the globe.
And they have to wake up.
And they start to have inklings as children that they've been under attack because the Dark Lords are trying to kill them before they can wake up.
So they all get, and their parents realize this kid is different from our other kids.
Okay, now hang on.
I'm losing you here.
This is in the fiction.
Yeah, this is in the story.
So this is not really happening?
I believe they told me there are literally 80 million wanderers incarnate on Earth, that it is really happening.
The story that I'm writing follows only eight of the 80 million, because that's the way I'm doing it, because how could I follow 80 million?
So yeah, no, the formless realm has told me there are 80 million higher dimensional beings who believe in unity and love and goodness for all beings, as did Tesla, currently, now, in 2020, incarnate on Earth.
Okay.
Now, 80 million.
That's a lot of people.
It's a lot, but it's not a lot when you consider the almost 8 billion people we have here.
So they're just in among us.
Well, if you do the math, I mean, it's a significant number.
I suppose I would ask this question, and I would like mankind to be saved from itself sometime pretty soon, if that's okay with you.
That would be a very nice thing, because I see a lot of stuff in this world now that makes me despair, literally.
So I wonder if they are so gifted, and if they're here, 80 million of them, why are they not stepping in now when we have political instability worldwide?
We have, we know, disease across the world, we have a climate issue, we have a zillion things to deal with, all of which, from what you say, they're equipped to help us fix.
Why aren't they doing it?
They are working.
They are stepping in.
They are keeping us from succumbing to despair.
Don't succumb to despair, Howard.
It's all going to be fine.
And they are helping.
They are helping in the ways that they can without drawing too much attention to themselves.
Because the planet will be saved.
Mother Earth will be saved.
And humanity will be saved.
That message has come across really clearly.
And they are working.
They are not flashy.
They are just in human bodies.
They are the person who smiles at you, the person who reassures you, the person who writes the postcard, the people who get out the vote, not for one party or the other, for all beings, the people who create cures for cancer.
They are hidden doing their work even as we're talking right now.
Okay, but they don't reveal themselves.
They don't say, well, actually, I've just done this great thing, and the reason I've done it is I'm this.
No, they don't reveal themselves because they don't think they've done anything great, because they think everyone is great.
They think that we are all divine because we are.
And they think everyone can do just what they can do if they allow themselves.
Everyone is intuitive.
Everyone is creative.
Everyone is divine.
So they are here and they are working.
And the tide is turning.
The tide has already turned.
And I think, you know, we have this big event coming up on the 21st when Saturn and Jupiter will look in the southwestern sky as if they are one bright star, which is again a message of unity.
And I don't know much astrology, but astrologers say that Saturn sweeps out the old and Jupiter supports the new.
So hopefully we are having a sweeping out of things we no longer need and a support of love.
And when you die and when I die and when everybody dies, do we go back to this wonderful place and do we remember what we've forgotten?
Yes.
And people can go there now if they want.
I did.
My younger sister died of bladder cancer and I really missed her.
This was about eight or nine years ago.
And I found a psychologist who had studied with Michael Newton, who was a life between life regression therapist, who accidentally discovered life between life regression when his patients who were just doing regular life regression instead hopped into the formless place where they were just light.
So then he began regressing people to the place they went after their last death.
So it's a great thing if you want to do it.
It was an eight-hour procedure, four hours and four hours.
And I went to that realm where we go when we die, and it is so full of love.
I was laying, my physical body was here in the third dimension, apparently tears just flowing down my eyes the whole time.
And over there, all communication was telepathic.
And it was just a realm of such exquisite love and light.
And I did contact my sister and also my father.
And I just didn't want to come back.
But the psychologist, like, as it were, had a hold on a cord of me.
And he was bothering me all the time, asking me, what do you look like?
What's your name over there?
And I didn't want to talk to him because I was communicating telepathically.
But he said, what's your name?
I said, Sonon.
I never heard that word before, but it is now one of the characters in my book.
And, oh, I thought I got rid of that phone, but it'll stop now.
And he said, what do you look like?
What do you look like over there?
And I looked down and I was an oval of blue light.
No head, no hands, nothing, just an oval of blue light.
And my name was Sonam.
And I guess that's my forever name, my soul's name or my spirit's name.
In this life, my name is Susan, but that's just temporary.
I'm just Susan Plunkett for this man of years.
And even when I dream, I don't, that's not my name.
And sometimes I dream of people I know in this life and their name is something else in my dreams because we're on a different planet.
And as a qualified psychologist, you're absolutely sure that what you experienced was not under hypnosis, some kind of artifact of your mind?
No, I don't think so because I had a little experience right after that because he, the psychologist who was leading me, taped it so that I could listen to it again.
And so a few weeks after that, I was listening to it again under headphones, just lying on my yoga mat.
And I thought I was just listening to it without anything.
But my daughter walked into the room and she wanted to ask me something.
So she touched my leg and I jumped three feet into the air just because I wasn't in my body.
I had just left it lying there.
And so she shocked me when she touched it.
And that's when I realized, oh, wow, I went back over there.
And there was just too much detail in the telepathic communications between my father and I and between my sister and I for me not to know that I was really there.
For example, when my father was dying, he was older, he was 88.
He was so cold, going through those stages.
And I put some cashmere socks on his feet.
No one knew that but me and him.
But when I was over there, he said, thank you for putting those cashmere socks on my feet when I was dying.
I was so cold.
So no one knew that but me and him.
And there were other things that no one could have known.
But you knew them anyway before you went into that hypnotic session.
That's true.
I hadn't thought of it that way.
But in fact, I've really felt I was speaking to him.
So.
And have you ever, when you've been doing these explorations, you know, I have a lot of people here who are rightly skeptical.
And they would say, well, the one thing that I would like then, if there is another dimension out there and it's there for our benefit, it wants us to know that our natural state is love and everything's going to be all right.
I would ask them for some kind of information that I don't know that I could go and look up somewhere and discover, oh, yes, that's a fact.
I would ask them to give me something that I could bring back or maybe tell me, I don't know, a trivial example, the winner of the state lottery or something like that, you know, the winning numbers of the state lottery, something tangible that would finally nail any doubts that I might have.
That's an interesting thing.
It never occurred to me to do that.
But I can understand that, I guess because I'm not skeptical, maybe it's because I'm what people would call naive, that I just believe so easily.
But I suppose I could ask them for something.
But there are already, I think, examples of that.
For example, long before the Explorer space vehicles photographed rings around some of the planets that we didn't know had rings, not Saturn, but I think it's that guy that had the near-death experience.
So that neurosurgeon, Eben Alexander, he writes that people journeying out of body have reported things that were later scientifically found to be true.
And I think also some of the experimenters, whether it was Benjamin Franklin or Alexander Grand Bell or Tesla, wrote about things, created things well before their time, which also suggests to me that information is flowing in from beings that want to help us and that love us because we are part of them.
I think you believe or you want proof or you totally are a non-believer and it's all okay.
We all are just where we are.
Okay, well, you see, this is interesting for you to say that because I think that I'm somewhere between the two.
I can't be a complete, I believe all of this stuff.
And I don't want to be a total skeptic and non-believer because I do think there is more in heaven And earth than we see.
And I've had my own proof of that, but not in the spectacular ways that you have.
So I think there is a middle ground, but maybe we could disagree on that.
You've done a lot of work about dreams, and a lot of us believe that dreams are just there to, I don't know, they're a kind of washing machine for all of our experiences through the day.
They help us make sense of it all and then wake up to face another day.
Do you think there's an awful lot more to dreams than that?
I do.
I mean, I know some people think dreams are just the result of the sausage you ate for dinner.
And that's okay if they want to think that, if that works for them.
But for myself, dreams see you around corners and into the future.
And nowadays, Jungians do not talk about dreams the way Jung talked about them.
They talked about dreams, yes, as the collective unconscious or the unconscious, but Jung spoke about dreams coming actually from the divine and spoke about the unconscious as not a neural net, which it also is, but as God.
And so we can get any kind of information we need through that.
I had an intense experience around 9-11.
Of course, I live in Greenwich Village.
And so I saw, I was walking my daughter, she was in first grade, to school when the first plane hit.
But I had been hearing from my patients for two months dreams about the World Trade Centers collapsing or people covered with ashes.
And then I saw it.
I saw them coming up Sixth Avenue, walking, covered by...
And it wasn't only in New York.
I was doing an interview with another person like you on an American show, Coast to Coast, with an interviewer named George, George Norrie.
And he told me that his daughter called him up the week before 9-11 and said, Dad, and they're in St. Louis, Dad, I dreamt last night that there was a huge crash of a building and many people jumped out of it.
And the ones on the ground were covered with ash.
What does this mean, seeing people covered with ash?
And he didn't know.
But then after, they all knew.
Well, listen, I believe, and it's just a belief that I have, that dreams can be precognitive.
At the time of 9-11, I was working on the biggest radio station in London.
We had 3 million listeners, and I was the guy doing the news there.
And three nights before 9-11, I ended up going to Ground Zero as a broadcaster, journalist to report there.
But I had a dream about a plane sliding out of the sky and slamming in.
It was a very traumatic dream.
I woke up in a terrible state after it.
I didn't know what it meant.
But I saw this jet plane literally slide down into a field and crash in precisely the way that the plane sadly crashed and ended in Pennsylvania.
So I think dreams can be precognitive.
I just don't understand how that happens.
Well, as a psychologist, I believe it happens because when you're in the unconscious, which is in a different state from the conscious, there is no time.
So you can slip time.
You can remember the future as well as the past because physicists tell us that there actually isn't time.
We just line everything up in a linear way so that our heads don't explode because otherwise everything would manifest at once.
But when you are asleep and you're in the unconscious state, and very often we've left our body, you don't have to, but many of us do astral travel.
You can astral travel.
And you can travel to any point in time you want because it's all happening at once.
And when something is dramatic, sometimes the soul is drawn there.
So I believe you actually saw some version of that because in your unconscious state, you were not bound by time as no one is bound by time in the unconscious.
The rules are completely different.
So in other words, what I saw was in a state when those events had already happened because all things exist all the time.
Exactly.
And it's the same with George Norrie's daughter.
She had seen what had already happened.
I think a lot of people had that experience.
And you tell me that you had a lot of clients around that time who came to you and they similarly had had precognition.
Yes.
They were dreaming.
Yeah, they were having nightmares, terrible nightmares.
I can't imagine what it was like to be in Greenwich Village then.
I broadcast on the second anniversary of 9-11 from an apartment.
A London radio station had a New York correspondent.
His name Alan Cappa.
Sadly, no longer with us.
Oh, Alan Cappa.
Well, there you go, Susan.
He would have been one of your neighbors, yeah.
He was my neighbor and my dear friend.
Well, isn't that how strange is that, Susan?
I know Alan.
I know Muriel.
I know Alan's children.
Not all nine of them.
I know mostly his daughters.
I love Alan Kappa, and you sound a bit like him.
Well, I actually did part of the broadcast from Alan's apartment, and he took me onto the roof of the apartment in Greenwich Village.
And of course, from the roofs of those apartments in Greenwich Village, most people can get a clear line of sight to what would have been the World Trade Center, the Twin Towers.
Yes.
Yes, you had to walk up five flights to get onto his roof.
He lived half a block away from me.
I live on the corner of 9th and 5th.
He lived on 9th between 5th and 6th.
I loved Alan.
I saw him a week before he died, and his mind was just as sharp as anything.
And he told me Trump was going to win.
He was an amazing man, absolutely.
And it was a real privilege to be with.
I mean, this is, you know, we're not talking the unexplained here.
We're talking about New York experiences.
But I can remember after being on air For I think pretty much with just little naps of 15 minutes here and there.
I was awake for three days on the second anniversary.
I did the same thing on the first anniversary of 9-11.
And the last thing I had to do was to broadcast live back to London, breakfast time in London, on the Nick Ferrari show in London.
I had to broadcast live out of Alan Capper's apartment.
And it was like 3 a.m. in New York, and it was like 8 a.m. or whatever it was in London.
And I can remember just ad-libbing so much stuff, even though I'd had no sleep for days.
And then I came out of the apartment, and of course it was September.
It was very warm.
It was very tropical and balmy.
And I just hailed a yellow taxi.
There was only one cab driving past, and I asked him to take me back to the Hilton overlooking Ground Zero, which is where I was staying.
And I just thought, what an incredible New York experience I've just had.
It was moving and humbling and exciting and all of those things all at once.
But sorry, that's a big deviation.
But how strange that you knew Alan Kappa?
I knew that apartment so well.
That was such a tiny apartment, too, that you guys were working in.
And a beautiful, it was a beautiful little jewel of an apartment.
And he was a diamond of a man.
And I still miss him.
Yes.
Yeah.
Well, he's much missed on the airwaves in London.
The dreams then.
When I have a dream, I'm often surprised.
And not everybody dreams in the same way.
I dream in three dimensions, full color.
And I frequently, even, and especially during these awful months of lockdown, I have vivid dreams.
Sometimes they're connected with work and things going wrong, but sometimes I'm having situations to deal with and I'm meeting people that I've never seen before.
But I'm having contact with them.
You know, I'm shaking hands with people, you know, in the days when you could still do that.
And I'm looking into people's eyes and I'm talking with them and I know them and yet I have never seen them before.
And I always think, well, that's my mind playing tricks on me.
You might say there's something more to that.
I would say that's all going on simultaneously in another dimension because we're existing in many dimensions at one time.
We're not just existing in our third dimension.
Those are people, that's you in another dimension and the people you know in another dimension.
Just like in the book, Mission from Venus, those higher dimensional beings are training on Venus in the sixth dimension.
Whereas on Earth, we only perceive Venus in the third dimension, which has got an atmosphere of sulfuric acid where no one could be.
But simultaneously, Venus is also habitable and beautiful, just as simultaneously you are talking to me in the third dimension, but your fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh dimensional selves know there are no other people and are having other lives, which are...
So those experiences are real that you're having, and you know those people.
Trouble is, it's impossible in this life to prove it.
True, true.
So just enjoy it.
And we don't have to prove anything.
I mean, I think we each make a choice to come from love or to come from fear.
And part of coming from love for me is loving my life.
God knows Alan loved his life and food and beautiful clothes and beautiful women.
I mean, just all of it is love.
I love writing and I happen to now love, you know, fantasy fiction and science fiction.
So we don't have to really prove anything.
You can, and that's why these books are stories instead of, you know, I'm not writing fact science books.
I'm writing stories for people to consider.
And even if you don't believe it literally, it affects you.
Even what we don't know, even if you don't believe your dream where you're shaking hands with people you've never met and talking to them, it is actually happening, say, in the fourth dimension or the fifth dimension, you don't have to believe it.
It's still affecting you.
It's still shaping you.
We wake up from dreams and we carry part of them with us through the day.
And if it's a really good dream, you might carry it around in your pocket like a jewel and take it out once in a while and think of it again and think of the beautiful feeling you had in it.
Or if it's curious, you might wonder about it.
And even uninterpreted, dreams affect us.
So dream as much as you can.
And the more you remember your dreams, this goes for every one of us, the more attention you're paying to your unconscious.
And the more dreams you will be able to remember.
Because when you do the unconscious the honor of struggling to remember your dreams or trying to remember them, it helps you and it gives you more dreams and it opens more doors in your dream life.
So.
Is it possible to problem solve through dreams?
If I somehow was able to take to bed with me at night, you know, I've got a mountain of problems, but not as much as some people have got.
But I've got a lot of things that I've got to deal with.
You know, they're mostly connected with work and surviving and making a living and stuff like that.
That's most of my problems.
If I was disciplined, do you think I could take those issues into my dreams and actually fix them?
Yes, and I think everyone can.
The way to do that, according to Jung, was before you sleep, ask your unconscious, which is really asking the divine, but ask your unconscious for the gift of a dream to illuminate a solution for you.
And then you've got to remember it when you wake up because everyone has five or six dreams over a course of seven, eight hours sleep.
But we rarely remember our dreams because it takes discipline and because the ego doesn't see the point of them.
But the self does see the point of them.
So yes, I often go to bed and ask myself, I would really like the gift of a dream to tell me what to do about this situation or how should I handle this?
Because there's no one better to ask.
Jung called it your million-year-old man.
He said, if you could talk to the wisest person you've ever met who knows you better than anyone else, your million-year-old man, and ask them anything you wanted, would you do it?
Most people say, yeah, bring it on.
And he said, well, you can.
Every night in your dreams, that person speaks to you.
That divinity speaks to you.
But who listens?
Not everybody.
Crazy question, and not really connected with dreams or what we've been talking about, but sort of connected.
A lot of us see our departed relatives, my mother and father, you know, huge void in my life they left.
And in this life, you know, that's a hurt that's never going to heal.
I wonder why, you know, if everything is cosmically worked out the way that you say it is, why is it that we have to lose the people who are close to us?
What's the point of that?
Why must that happen?
Because we have to understand that there is no separation because those people can visit us and they usually do it in a dream because it's less frightening for us.
If suddenly they walked into your recording studio, which they could do, or they walked into your living room, you would be like, ah, ah.
But they weave into our dreams, particularly after they first pass over, cross over, because they want us to know that they are still there, that there is no death.
They want to show us that.
We have different experiences in each lifetime to trying to wake up to the fact that we're all connected.
And one lifetime, your mother and father are your mother and father.
In the next lifetime, they're your best friends or your children because we incarnate in soul groups with the same people again and again.
And we grow from suffering.
It's unfair.
I'm sure most people feel that it's unfair, but suffering is a catalyst for awakening.
And we all agree to the conditions before we incarnate.
And we even agree to certain illnesses that we might have or certain struggles that we might have.
And certainly we all agree to die and to lose those we love as part, because when we're in the in-between place, we say, yeah, yeah, I want to wake up.
Pile that on my plate.
Yeah, I'll take that.
I'll take that.
Then we get here, we think, oh my God, am I Job?
What did I, you know, not realizing we and our higher self planned it all before we came.
So are you saying that, I mean, look, in my conscious self right now, if I was to go to another place and they were thinking about sending me back here, and I really don't want to come back, but if they were thinking about sending me back here, as I am now, I would say to them, I want to come back, but please make it better than this time.
Are you saying that I actually, for my cosmic growth, for my long-term million-year growth, I might actually ask for challenges next time around, which thinking about it now, I don't want any more challenges.
Or you might say, look, I want to rest.
Let me have my next life on Venus in the sixth dimension.
And I just want it to be all about harmony and love and creativity and communication with no challenges.
You and your higher self will work that out before you incarnate.
But the thing is, we always want to be evolving closer and closer to source.
And we do that by taking challenges.
But nobody forced anybody to come here.
Nobody's sending us back here.
My understanding, there's a line to get in here.
So yeah, you can go.
Maybe you're going to be in the sixth dimension.
Maybe you'll come back to Earth in the fifth dimension, which will be paradise, another golden age.
So you aren't ever going to be forced back to a place you don't want to be.
Well, next time around, I'd rather like to be on whatever dimensional planet is, the sort of West In Maui of the next existence, if that's okay.
Look, you have a practice.
You are a psychologist.
I never asked you this at the beginning, and I should have.
What do people come to you for?
What do they ask you to do for them?
They come for anxiety, depression, marriage counseling, grief, loss of a parent, loss of a child.
Because I'm working now in private practice, when I was younger, I worked at Bellevue inpatient unit where people were more troubled, more psychotic.
And outpatient, I don't see people that are, if someone comes to me that troubled, I will recommend a situation that can hold them more, like day treatment, you know, five days a week or hospitalization.
So I'm just seeing people like you and me who are suffering and need to work it through.
And how do the things that we've just been talking about connect with your day-to-day work?
Well, I don't think most of my patients know that I'm a writer.
So that doesn't connect to them.
What they do know is that we can choose love or fear, that we all create our lives with our vibration.
And I talk openly with them about their vibration, that if you're vibrating at a beautiful frequency, then you're going to pull beautiful experiences to you.
And so we're all responsible for the energy we give off in the world.
Like we've all known people who could walk into a room and drop the temperature 30 degrees because they're so negative.
I've worked for a few of them.
And then we know the Alan Capricorn.
They walk into the room and the room is brighter.
And we each have that responsibility for ourselves and for all those we come in contact with.
You know, a person who's flying at a really loving vibration can walk into a subway car or a tube car and change everybody in that car.
They can walk down the street and affect people for five blocks around them because their energy is so positive.
And similarly, negative, you know, people who are dark or caught in some darkness, nobody is truly dark.
They get caught in a low vibration and they can drag down everyone they come in contact with or frighten everyone they come in contact.
Mostly the dark vibrations are about fear and therefore often love of power or desire for intense power because they are so afraid.
And the high vibrations, love for all beings as one, basically not desiring anything for oneself that one doesn't desire for all beings is the opposite of fear.
It's like love for all beings as one.
And that's ponderous.
I think there's a lot to be said for that.
And by no means all of these people, but some people that I've known in my professional career, some of the most powerful people have had some of the most deep issues.
Let's put it that way.
So, you know, it seems that sometimes those things go with power.
But let me just say, for the benefit of my friends in the industry, that that by no means goes for everybody.
Yeah, no, it's true.
There are some people who need to amass power because they're so insecure that they only feel good when they have enough guns or enough power to be, you know, calling the shots.
And then there are other people that naturally rise to power through charisma and love.
So, and the same at every level of functioning.
You can have jolly people checking out your groceries or misery guts people checking out your groceries.
But strange things do happen in life.
They really do.
Sometimes there are some listeners who, if I give you little examples of trivial things from my life that happen, you know, they won't like it.
They'll say, I want you just to talk about the core subjects and not to.
And I have to say, this is meant to be a conversation.
When you have a conversation, you talk about all sorts of things.
When did you last have a conversation?
So I was going to tell you a story, and I'm not sure whether I should.
If you're feeling, just addressing my listener now, if you're feeling that way, then tune out now.
But the story that I will tell you about some strange, I mean, it meant a lot to me, and I just thought, who are you?
This is a bizarre story.
I was in a supermarket two weeks ago, and I'm about to buy a plastic, we have to pay for them here, plastic carrier bag to take my food away.
And a guy who's in front of me, he's just been served, hands me a cloth bag.
You know, a very kind of thing you would see in San Francisco.
It's an eco-friendly cloth bag and a nice one.
It's brand new.
And he says, there you go, have that.
You look like you need it.
And I looked at him and I said, I was taken aback.
And I said, oh, thank you so much.
That's so kind of you.
And then I thought, I'll never know.
Who are you?
And why did you do that?
A wanderer.
Well, I wonder on the basis of that experience because it cheered me up.
It certainly left me smiling that day.
But it also left me baffled because I just don't know where that guy came from.
He just disappeared.
He didn't hang around.
I didn't have a chance to engage him in conversation, but it was a very strange.
And in this day and age, in the experiences that we're having in lockdown, et cetera, we analyze the smallest of things.
It was a piece of small change in my life.
It was a tiny, tiny little thing.
But I just thought, who are you and why did you do that?
So there, that maybe ties into the conversation we've just had, Susan.
Now, if people want to see your books, including the one that you're working on at the moment, where would they go?
They can get in the UK.
The first two are both available now.
Every place books are sold.
They can either get it for you or you can order it on barnsandnoble.com, Amazon, or wherever you get your books.
Or they can go, I have a website for the books, which is called missionfromvenus.com.
Or they can go to my website, which is just my name, susanplunket.com.
But my plunket has only one T. Some people have a plunket with two T's.
A lot of British Plunkett have two T's, but you have one.
I have one T. So Susanplunkett.com.
Give my love to New York City, and maybe one of these days I'm going to be able to get on a plane when we can.
And I'm going to see Fifth Avenue again.
And we can walk by Alan's old house.
Oh, wouldn't that be?
I'd love to see Greenwich Village again.
Susan, thank you so much.
Take care.
Thank you for having me.
Bye.
A lot of food for thought there, quite literally.
Susan Plunkett, the guest on this edition of The Unexplained, your thoughts, welcome on this edition.
Go to my website, theunexplained.tv, send me an email, and let me know what you think.
More great guests in the pipeline as we step into 2021 here on The Unexplained.
So until next we meet, my name is Howard Hughes.
This has been The Unexplained Online.
And please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm, and above all, please stay in touch.
Thank you very much.
Take care.
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