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March 1, 2020 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:11:44
Edition 433 - Diane Tessman

Author, researcher and "experiencer" Diane Tessman who thinks "ET" may really be evolved humans from a future time...

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Across the UK, across continental North America and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Return of the Unexplained.
Well, if you think I sound a bit jolly, I probably do because we have spring on the way and we're leaving behind what has been a rotten winter with storms and flooding and all sorts of things here and even snow at the back end of February.
So it delivered everything.
And if you bear in mind that a year ago, there was one day when the temperature hit 22 degrees Celsius, which is about 72 Fahrenheit.
And I remember going out cycling, thinking, I like this.
It was a February day, and we had beautiful sunshine.
Not this year.
So who knows what the spring and summer will hold?
We'll find out, I guess.
And if you've been affected by the flooding, my thoughts are with you.
That includes my sister in Worcestershire.
Hope she's okay.
Okay.
I want to do some shout-outs before we get to the guest on this edition of the show, who is Diane Tessman, researcher and abductee.
The book that she's written is called Future Humans and UFOs.
One of the ideas in it is that those who we think are driving UFOs may be us coming back here from the future.
I've had that thought before.
Maybe you have.
Diane Tessman talks a lot about this in her book.
We'll be speaking with her from the United States coming very soon.
Thank you very much to Adam at Creative Hotspot in Liverpool for his hard work on the podcast.
As ever, thank you, Adam.
And let's do those shout-outs then.
And there is one story that I would like to tell you that was sent in by listener Colin from Colin and Liz.
It's quite a long story, but I think you will understand why I am telling it once I've told it.
And then we'll get to Diane Tessman, the guest on this edition.
Shout-outs first.
Dan got in touch.
Thank you, Dan.
Wants me to talk again about the Dorothy Kilgallen case.
Dorothy Kilgallen, the investigative reporter, of course, who got very close to what may have been the truth about the assassination of JFK and was herself assassinated.
I interviewed Mark Shaw, an author about this a couple of years ago, but I need to revisit this.
Thank you, Dan.
I had one listener, I think it was Simon, who asked me for some tips on doing a podcast.
How do you do it?
Well, I think, Simon, the best thing that you can do is be yourself, really.
Don't worry too much about the technology.
You know, do the best you can.
And the more that you do it and the more that you speak, the better you will get.
But, you know, the main thing, and it's the hardest thing of all, for years, I was trying to be Mr. Announcer on the radio.
You know, you can only be yourself.
I'm a flawed individual, but perhaps I have my good points, I don't know.
And I think you can only be that.
If you try and be something else, then you're going to have problems, is the only tip that I would give, but maybe the best one.
Stephen Coventry says just wanted to confirm something that John Hansen, the last guest, spoke about during that episode.
John is the first person I've ever heard confirm that some sightings reported to the Ministry of Defense here, that's UFO sightings, were not amongst the files that have been ever released to the public.
In my own experience, a number of people I've spoken to have said, well, I checked for the report.
When the files were released, it wasn't there.
How interesting, Steve.
Thank you.
Shout out for Lance Greathouse.
Lance, nice to hear from you.
Thank you for connecting.
Lance Greathouse.
Kim in Ohio.
Nice to hear from you, Kim.
Amanda in Kansas City.
Good to hear from you, Amanda.
Steve in Southeast London.
Thank you for getting in touch.
Daniel in Tamworth, Ditto.
And Karen in Stockport.
Thank you very much.
Okay, the story that I wanted to tell you before we get to our guest, Diane Tessman, is this one.
It comes from Colin and from Liz.
Colin writes this.
Colin says, I've always been told from an early age that the number 13 is unlucky.
This was to prove right, but has also, on the other hand, given me comfort.
I would always fear the days with 13 in them, the obvious being Friday the 13th.
I would, as a child, always make sure that when turning a light switch on and off, I would do this more than 13 times.
It would drive my parents mad.
This was a bad superstition and a habit.
It went on for years, and it started to bug me, but I couldn't help it.
Though I thought that if I didn't do this, it would bring me bad luck.
Fast forward then to 2002, when I met my wife, which was April the 13th.
I thought, no, this will never last, but it has been proved wrong, and we're still together, with two beautiful boys that we've had together, and caring and loving stepdaughter and son that I brought up.
We moved into our house, the first house together, which was number 76, which is 7 plus 6 equals 13.
Then in 2003, May the 30th, I lost my daughter, Elizabeth, to meningitis.
At that time, she was 13.
The week before, my daughter sang me my song that we had together, Daddy, Please Don't Cry, by Elvis Presley.
But as you can imagine, every time she did, I would cry.
Obviously, losing a child rips you apart, says Colin, and I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.
I had to make the funeral arrangements, and I sat down with the funeral director.
They told me that the only date that they had was June the 13th, a Friday.
They said I could have another day if I didn't like it, but I said, no, go ahead, I'm going through the worst thing that a parent could go through, so bring it on.
The funeral that I gave her was for a princess.
White horses with a white carriage and white coffin.
If I couldn't give her a wedding, then she would have the best funeral.
The funeral was perfect, and all her friends came to say goodbye.
Two weeks before Liz passed, we were driving in my car, and the song, Murder in the Dance Floor, came on the radio by Sophie Ellis Bexter.
She then said, this was the song that I want you to play at my funeral.
I said, what sort of thing is that to say at 13?
Needless to say, she had her wish, and the priest who held the service said this was the first time that a song had been played at a funeral with the word murder in it.
The next months were really tough on myself and my wife.
We decided to book a holiday, just the two of us.
The date, the 13th of August.
We arrived at the airport and checked in and was told that our gate was 13.
We boarded the plane.
We sat in row 13 and seats 13 and 14.
The plane took off and got to altitude, and this was in the days when they gave you free headphones.
The seat belt light went out, and then I plugged my headphones into the socket, and then went straight to channel 13.
My jaw dropped, says Colin.
Playing on the channel was Daddy, please don't cry.
I said to my wife, listen to channel 13.
She was just as amazed as I was.
Then I turned round and I looked out of the window, and at this time we'd just come above the cloud.
I was looking out of the window, thinking there must be some sort of tornado happening, because in the clouds, there was a swirling-shaped cloud formed in front of me, which looked like an apple core.
Then all of a sudden, the cloud turned into three angels in a circle, all with their arms stretched out, holding hands, and there were wings meeting at the top, touching together.
I couldn't believe my eyes.
I grabbed my wife out of her chair, but when her face got to the window, the angels vaporized like steam from a kettle.
I suppose this was only for my eyes, and now looking back on it, I was truly blessed.
I thought I'd share this with you, Howard, because it gave me comfort over the years and to realize that this isn't it.
There is another life after this.
Today is my daughter's 30th birthday, 23rd of February.
So I thought I'd send you this to mark her day.
Colin, thank you for that.
The story means a lot, and I think I've told you in an email that I sent back to you that I've never believed that this life that we live is random in any way.
And sometimes terrible things happen, sometimes good things happen, and I think a lot of it is just not happenstance.
I think, you know, there is some kind of scheme.
But I think I'm probably going to spend the rest of my life working out exactly what that scheme might be.
Thank you for sharing that story.
And that was from Colin and from Liz, regular listeners to The Unexplained who gave me permission to tell that story.
And I hope I did it justice, Colin.
Right, let's get to the guest on this edition.
It is Diane Tessman in the U.S., talking about the idea that UFOs and the beings within them maybe are us from the future.
Diane Tessman, thank you for coming on my show.
Oh, I'm pleased to be here.
Now, Diane, I have to confess, other than things that I've read on the net, and of course the book that I've looked at today, I know absolutely zero about you.
So why don't you tell me your story?
I got a couple of descriptive words off the internet.
Counselor was one of them.
Abductee was another.
But beyond those two words, I don't know anything.
Well, when I was very young, I had two UFO encounters.
They can be called abductions, actually.
And I grew up in Iowa until my parents moved to Florida.
I taught school, English as a second language for 11 years in St. Thomas, Virgin Islands, and then in Florida.
Moved to Southern California and couldn't get into teaching.
I didn't have my master's degree, and they required one.
And also there was a recession on, so they weren't hiring.
And I started a spiritual newsletter called the Star Network Heartline that echoed back to my encounters.
My childhood encounters were positives for me, although they totally changed my life.
We're going to talk about those towards the end of that, but I understand that one of them was, you believe one of them was a healing encounter.
Yes, there is that involved.
Also, a tissue sample was taken.
I'm missing a membrane in my mouth.
It took me years to figure that out because you don't know what you're missing until you figure it out.
But I started the spiritual newsletter in the early 80s and it caught on.
Those were the days of the new age as well.
And I've been doing that ever since.
So I worked on the spiritual side of the UFO question with messages not so much for individuals, but warning of climate change.
Many, many years ago, the messages I received were about coming climate change, which is unfortunately unfolding.
But I also had an objective side because I was with MUFON as before I moved to California.
I was state section director of Florida for two years and also with APRO, which isn't around anymore, but it always has had a good reputation for investigations.
It was Coral and Jim Lorenzen were APRO.
Boy, if you were working with MUFON in Florida, I guess you were kept busy.
I was, although as state section director, I was also teaching.
So I assigned other investigators.
And I was only there two years.
But yes, I had some interesting cases.
One where a car's magnetic electromagnetism was changed to go the opposite, to the opposite pole.
I always remember that case.
So then my daughter and I moved from Florida, moved to Ireland, and I was there for five years and looked into Celt shamanism and Irish folk medicine and just fell in love with Ireland.
So beautiful.
That was in 1990 to 95.
And the countryside, I lived in Kilkenny in the countryside in an old cabin and just loved it.
Moved back after five years to the high desert of California, Joshua Tree.
And that was where George Van Tassel back, I was not a part of it, but there's the, his echoes are still there in the 50s and 60s.
George Van Tassel gathered huge numbers of people looking for the ETs to land and he gave messages.
They met out in the desert at Giant Rock.
And so I lived there for two years and absorbed that energy.
And then I bought 10 acres sight unseen in my native Iowa.
I had never been back.
Somebody told me the other day, I don't say Iowa, right, because Iowa, but in Iowa, we say Iowa.
Iowa.
Okay.
And there's been calling it Iowa.
Yeah, that's correct.
So I've run the Star Network Animal Sanctuary, mostly cats.
I have 51 cats that are not out in the cold weather.
And I spay vaccinate.
This county has no shelter, which is ridiculous for animals.
So I'm pretty much it.
And I started that, and that's been going for 23 years.
And it survives on the donations and subscription fees and counseling fees that I'm still active in working on the subjective side of things.
So are we likely to be interrupted by meowing, howling, and barking?
Yes.
Well, they're my favorite kind of interviews.
All right, then.
So you're coming at all of this then from the spiritual perspective and not the scientific perspective.
Well, no, that's my new book is scientific.
That's what I was going to say.
The book is full of science.
Yes, science speculation and logic, really.
Reason I've kind of re-examined the whole UFO field because I've never been totally settled on the fact that it's extraterrestrials that are in our skies.
Right.
Okay.
Well, in the introduction, let's start here then, if we may.
Sorry to jump in there.
You say these words.
I do not deny that there are probably thousands of advanced extraterrestrial races in the galaxy and that some may visit Earth.
However, I think we've ignored what is right before our eyes.
Our children's children are the occupants in most or all of unidentified flying objects.
So our children's, children's, children are what we're talking about.
Are what we see in UFOs.
That term is from the Moody Blues tip to the UK there.
They had an album, Our Children's, Children's Children.
Yeah, our progeny are, I believe, in most or all of the UFOs.
You know, the golden age of science and technology is here.
Most people may not really stop and think about it, but computer science, they say in five years, it will have moved ahead 200 years.
Astronomy, the new telescopes that see Earth-like planets way out of the solar system, quantum physics, bioanthropology, neuroscience.
I think that we're the forefathers and foremothers who laid this foundation and that our descendants are using it, have it.
And I don't want to say that the future humans are gods.
No, they're flawed.
And I'm not trying to replace ETs with any, you know, for anybody.
But it's the case that I am making that as flawed as we are, the future, the UFO occupants are flawed too, in that they abduct people.
That's wrong.
But humans will abduct other humans.
When you look at our history, we've committed genocide, we've enslaved, we've chased natives off of their land.
And so people are always involved with thinking how terrible abductions are, and they are, they're inhumane.
But that doesn't leave the future humans out of the picture.
In fact, it seems rather likely they would also probably use our DNA or other tissue samples from us more than ETs would.
And you're saying that they're doing these things, and we'll get into that a little later in the conversation.
But you're saying they're doing these things out of a necessity, and we'll talk about what that necessity is.
I don't know whether you're going to like this, but I'm going to quote bits of your book back at you.
If you don't mind.
One of the things you say, and I love the questions you pose in the book.
It's a long book, and there's a lot in it.
And it darts all over the place.
But you say, what if with advanced science and technology, humans in the future find a way to drill through the layers of time?
They might have found the shortcut, folding that inscrutable commodity that we call time.
In other words, and more and more people are suggesting this, and I have a sneaking suspicion this may be one of the explanations for what we call UFOs, that a version of ourselves, having been through the experiences that we are currently going through, and you talked about this huge white heat of technology that we're experiencing now, the fact that we're beginning to harmonize ourselves with artificial intelligence and robotics and all of these things.
They've been through all of this and they found a way to get back to us, which I think is a fascinating concept and is one that people should not dismiss.
I agree.
And, you know, somebody will always say, well, Einstein said traveling back in time is impossible, so that's that.
And he never said that.
Toward the end of his life, he had trouble with unifying the field, which involves gravity.
And maybe that is involved in time travel.
But it was hard.
It's difficult.
But, you know, we've always been able to come up as a species with answers from fire to the airplane.
And in my book, Chapter 4, I present Jack Sarfati, who's respected as a very brilliant physicist, who does have a good idea, perhaps.
You know, it may not, well, more than an idea.
He's got an equation and explains it.
But even if he's not right, I think we'll get the key to traveling back in time.
You know, it may not be, people say, well, you open a wormhole and then it's hard to close it again.
And it may not even involve anything like that.
There may be, you've got to consider quantum computers and all of this because they are online now, but they're not at the height of their powers or Their development, but they do exist and they are working.
Google's got one.
And you say something in the book that also speaks to me, and that is that we've got to be honest about it.
If we look back through history, if we look at ourselves now, the things that we talk about wanting, the things that we want to achieve, we have a habit of achieving them because we want them, which is not something that is scientific.
That is something that is more almost metaphysical, but it's something to do with almost, I don't know, one of those things.
You read these books like, I don't know, what was the big one a few years ago, The Secret, where you program for the things that you want and hey, lo and behold, they come to you.
Now, those things have happened to me throughout my life.
And people can say, well, oh, that's coincidence and all the rest of it.
And I've always thought, no, it's not coincidence.
There's something else at work.
I just don't know what it is.
You've suggested in the book that if we think about these things, like getting to Mars or whatever the aim may be, those things will be brought to us.
Yes, I've had the same experience in life to the point that I can't say it's coincidence.
And when you look at us as a species, look at the power we must have because we have created, I mean, 100 years ago, the farmer in the field would have said, well, there's no horse that's been made that can go from Los Angeles to New York in an hour or three hours.
You know, you're just telling, there is no horse that'll do that.
So we look at things like Arthur C. Clarke said, it's the level that created the, it always looks like magic to the people that are perceiving it, but the advanced intelligence knows that it's technology,
which is kind of a theme throughout my book, even to the point of, you know, ETs are supposed to have this ability to teleport or to read your mind.
And we kind of subjugate ourselves at their feet, in a sense.
We don't have any confidence left in us.
And I think it's part of what's wrong with the world, quite frankly.
I think the human race needs to reach out, extend itself where it explores, and that we do create with our minds.
We dream, we tinker with it, we create, and it happens.
That's always been the case, unfortunately, all the way to nuclear bombs and nuclear energy.
But it is impossible, I think, and I don't think the book has an explanation unless I missed it, as to how that may work.
But I think it is a factor.
Now, you ask, well, you rather give seven, you call them logical reasons why UFO occupants are future humans.
And if you don't mind, and if you've got them to hand, I want to just go through those.
Reason number one is the question, who needs a prime directive?
You know, Star Trek had the prime directive that you can go wherever you want, as long as you don't interfere with the natives there.
And you say it is probable that future humans are not allowed to make their identity known to unknowing 21st century primitive folk.
How so?
To me, there's a much better motive for not making your identity known if you're a future human than if you're an ET, because ETs would probably just say, well, we're observing, hello, and they move on.
So you've got to believe that an ET loves us so much that they've hung around all these years since 1947 or possibly even back into our history, like the ancient astronaut idea.
But for humans, it would be such a huge thing, for lack of a better word, if we became aware, if the current people had become aware that these are future humans, there would be, for one thing, people would follow them very easily.
They would have the cure for cancer most likely, for other diseases.
And apparently, they have the ethics not to tell grandpa or their ancestors that they are who is in our skies.
They also probably have self-serving reasons because we always do as a species.
We're self-serving.
But if they have any element, any scintilla of humanity about them, one of the things about us is that we are flawed and they are flawed.
You've already said that.
Does it not surprise you that if they've all agreed that they won't interfere with the natives, they won't let us know that it's them?
But there's always somebody who will break ranks, isn't there?
And nobody has.
No, certainly there have been abductions that kind of went wrong.
I think they try to scare people so that you don't really examine the abduction, whether there are future humans or ETs.
All the cold examination and all is probably quite on purpose.
But I think there'll come a point where we're ready to know, or it may be such a crisis that we must know that they are from a future time.
And of course, time, once you step out of time, but anyway, different phases of time would be where they're from.
Some would be from less far in advance than others.
But there may come a point, and I think there's a drip-drip of disclosure even now.
But up until now, no, it would just, you know, there's a concept called the Novikov loop that Jack Sarfati introduced me to that says whatever you can't change the future.
If you come back in time, what happens will always happen.
So, possibly, there's things that we don't quite understand, but that they're marching along to what they know is our history.
And that would be another reason for the prime directive.
It shows a little bit of ethics on their part, I think.
Okay, reason two, I didn't quite understand.
You asked the question, who needs human DNA?
What humans do is supposed to be the answer to that.
Right, no, no, I kind of worked that out.
But so that's what they're coming part of.
The reason that they're coming here is they want a bit of our DNA.
Yeah, and I go into that more in the book.
I've got Dr. Michael Masters with a chapter.
He's an evolutionary anthropologist.
And he wrote his own book on believing it's time travelers called Identified Flying Objects.
And he goes into the fact that the way most humanoids look that have been seen, the UFO occupants, is a very close match to how we will evolve in the future, according to his academic appraisal.
And when you think about it, we probably have more in common with an earthworm, their DNA, than we would with an ET that they could take and use our DNA.
An ET coming from the vast, vast distances of space.
I think sometimes we don't stop and realize how vast it is.
I mean, Star Trek would go from one star system to another maybe in a day, or it could up the warp and get there in half a day.
Well, even at warp speed, it would take, what, scores of years, hundreds, thousands of years to get to most.
So it makes sense that they do seem interested in tissue samples, DNA.
And of course, we've gone ahead in thinking and think, well, ETs are making hybrid babies with humans, but that isn't very scientific.
I've always, I'm tolerant of that, and I don't like to put down anybody on a spiritual level.
But my scientist in me says that's awfully unlikely.
I think, didn't you also suggest in the book that they would need our DNA because they have evolved to such an extent and they've harmonized with technology to an extent that they have lost some of the humanity, some of the capabilities that we've got.
In other words, they may be advanced of us in the way that they operate, but they may be weaker than us, and that's why they need bits of our DNA.
Well, our evolution seems to be going in the direction of our muscles atrophying.
After all, the Neanderthals had bigger muscles than we do.
The occupants that have been found in crashes are said to have sort of opaque white skin, not pink, not like Caucasian, but actually white.
They're said to have atrophied digestive tracts.
This is from Leonard Stringfield's work of autopsies, not the fake autopsy that happened fairly recently, but way back in the 60s and 70s.
Atrophied genitals and digestive tract.
And of course, all this kind of points, here we sit at the computer.
I do it myself so much of the day.
And as the years stretch forward, it's not unlikely that we are going in that direction.
A larger head is always reported for the ETs, quote unquote ET.
So, yeah, they.
So maybe they've got to a stage is what we're thinking here.
And I think it makes some sense that they've got to a stage where they need to get back some of the essential humanness, humanity, that is missing because they've evolved to such an extent and they've harmonized with the machine.
They've become the machine.
So they've got to come back and get some of us that they've lost.
That makes sense to me.
Seven logical reasons why UFO occupants are future humans.
Reason number three, UFO occupants are almost always humanoid in appearance.
That makes sense too.
Yes.
I've got a list back from the 50s and 60s and 70s that Richard Hall composed.
I knew Richard Hall.
I actually dated him.
He was much older, but he was the MUFON Journal director, Mufon Journal guy for years.
And he worked with NICAP and he compiled UFO evidence that's sort of a landmark.
And this list that he compiled, just one case after another where in the 50s, 60s, 70s, the UFO occupants would be glimpsed getting out of their saucers or perhaps the person was abducted.
And one after another, it just goes down the list.
Humanoid or a tall human, a regular human.
And you can only find one or two where somebody says, well, it was a terrible hairy monster with, you know, with 10 arms.
It's very unusual.
And you do have to wonder if those were accurate cases.
But again, the humanoid gets into Michael Master's work with the direction we're going in.
People like Betty Hill reported little gray-colored, gray-colored little man is reported.
Okay, reason number four, gray aliens or gray humans.
In other words, the grays look a bit like us, and the reason they look a bit like us is that they are part of us.
Now, I always had this feeling that maybe the grays were almost robotic in nature, that from the way that they're described, they almost seem to be like worker bees.
Possibly.
I'm not convinced of that.
I think that there are instructions not to have much interaction with abductors, with abductees.
But on the other hand, artificial intelligence is coming in so quickly that perhaps they are artificial intelligence, but they would have been created by human programmers, I assume, rather than alien programmers.
Right.
So if you're programming something and you are of a humanoid appearance and that is your demeanor and that's what you are, then you're going to make something that looks like you.
Yes, yes.
And there is such a thing as conscious AI.
I know Jack Sarfati is interested in it, where one day artificial intelligence may become conscious and then they're pretty much like us.
So that could be also, I know the being that I met had amber colored eyes that weren't human to my knowledge.
They just don't, they're not hazel.
They were amber, almost translucent, amber colored.
But outside of that, he was a normally tall human.
And my spidey sense told me he was human.
I wasn't even scared.
And they may have given me something not to be scared.
But yeah, the human, it's always humanoid.
And the fact that would develop on a far distant planet is pretty unlikely.
I know somebody has said, well, there was an ancient group of people called the preservers, I believe it is, that traveled around and seated humanoids.
But that's a science fiction scenario.
There's no proof of that.
And the fact is that ETs would not develop as we have.
I mean, that doesn't, and you do, in the book, you don't rule out that there may be other forms of life out there, but we're talking about those that we see and that look a little bit like us, as if we've evolved in some way.
You know, humanoid beings that may be eight feet tall in silver or whatever they might be, they're a bit like us.
And you're saying that's the reason.
I want to skip ahead here, only for time reasons, to reason number seven.
And that ties into a large part of the rest of your book, where you talk about not only nuclear power, but also nuclear weapons, a great interest that these beings have in all things nuclear.
And we know that because of the incidents where nuclear missiles, nuclear bases have effectively been shut down.
There was one memorable case I'm sure you'll know.
I think it was in 1966 where a base was shut down and people saw it.
They were scared by it.
Nobody knew what to do when the missiles were effectively shut down.
But there have been other cases too.
They appear to have a tremendous interest in nuclear power plants and nuclear weaponry.
They do.
Yes.
That was Captain Robert Salas who reported the Maelstrom Air Force Base missiles.
I think it was in 66 or 67.
I've spoken to him, and he describes very vividly, it wasn't panic because they were trained military people, but it was pandemonium.
Yes, and then Minot, M-I-N-O-T Air Force Base, was shut down the next year, and that's where the warheads actually were.
I believe SALAS was at the place where the computer or whatever they had there, the control mechanism, was and they lost all of their warheads off and on.
And when the UFOs flew over, turned them off, turned them on, turned them off.
And then at a mine at Air Force Base, Captain David Schindle reported that 10 ICBM warheads, the literal warheads, were switched to the off position and could not be launched.
And these cases are very well documented.
And the people who say these things, like Robert Salas, are not people, they're not people who would have any reason to make stuff up.
It was a very convincing story that the man told when I spoke with him.
The interest in all things nuclear then, is that because they realize that we now have the potential to destroy ourselves with nuclear power, or because they want something of that technology that they've lost along the way?
I think they would have the technology since they can do what they do with traveling back in time and all.
I think it gets rather complex, but I think that they may have been hurt by our nonchalance with nuclear energy.
Possibly there is an upcoming nuclear war that the human genome was damaged in, which could account for the genetic differences with us, the very small genetic difference.
You know, we've buried atomic waste, radioactive waste, in Mother Earth all these years.
The storage gets full.
We don't know where to put it.
There is temporary storage made.
And of course, that stuff lasts 1,000 years.
It can last a half-life of 100,000 years as an example.
I looked this up, researched it.
It could last even longer, or some can last shorter.
Okay, so why the interest is there then?
They realize we have this tremendous potential that they may feel that we are misusing, but they haven't stopped us from doing it, have they?
No, and not that we know of.
Of course, you never know what you don't know.
So have they ever stopped a nuclear war?
We don't know, but that's just congesture.
And there are those who say that they might have.
I understand what you're saying.
Do you think that, and this is not in the book, but do you think that if what we call aliens are future humans, do you think that they may be responsible for those cases that these days we call the Mandela effect, where people have different recollections of things that they're sure happened?
Like there are people who will tell you that they have a recollection that Nelson Mandela died on Robin Island in that awful prison in South Africa, but we know that he came out and he liberated his country.
But there are people who have a different memory.
Do you think that some of what we call the Mandela effect is perhaps down to these visiting future humans changing things?
It well could be.
And that gets into the intricacies of time.
And nobody's really equipped to know that at this point.
Even Dr. Sarfati wouldn't be sure because can you create alternate timelines?
Some physicists might say you might create them, but that would be the many worlds theory.
But you can't actually put yourself into an alternate timeline.
You're still locked in your rig.
That's the Novokov.
You're still locked in the Novikov loop.
So it would be other you's going on.
I do think that our climate change crisis plays a part in this.
So I'll just look at it from my simple point of view rather than trying to, they would know how time works more than any of us do.
But, you know, nuclear power plants are always built, almost always, along water, whether it's a river or the ocean because they intake water.
Okay, the oceans are rising.
There are torrential rains.
I just heard there that the UK had some bad storms.
This area, the central U.S. has F5 tornadoes.
F5 used to be unheard of.
So the climate change, you know, it's their Earth too.
I sound like Greta.
We have done a lot to Earth in our generations, really since 1947, that would affect our descendants.
And most people don't even think of that.
They love their grandchildren, but we don't think of ourselves as a species.
And I think we've gotten less that way.
You know, when Buzz and Neil went to the moon, the whole world stopped and looked at the TVs and cheered.
And we've kind of lost that can-do attitude.
We've gotten bogged down in kind of a mini-dark age, I think.
And part of the purpose of my book is to kind of try to overcome that as much as it is to sell the fact that I do think that future humans are visiting us.
Okay.
You talk, which makes it very contemporary.
You're not just referencing things that happened years ago.
You talk about something that is much in the news at the moment, the USS Nimitz Tic-Tac UFO case, and the fact that even the captain of that vessel has spoken within the last week or two, basically saying we have to be mindful of UAPs, they call them, unidentified aerial phenomena.
Effectively, we have to protect ourselves or be on the lookout for these things, which is interesting that he would reference those things if the quotes in the papers are correct.
You say about the Nimitz case on the Tic Tac UFO.
It seems obvious the unknown visitors wanted to be seen and documented, or at least they did not care if they were.
How so?
The Navy did maneuvers in that area between San Diego and Tijuana out in the Pacific every year.
And before the jet pilots went up, the radar operators reported battalions, I think they said units of these Tic-Tac vessels that were spotted on radar.
And, you know, when the jet pilots were sent up to check it out, there they were.
Apparently, quite a few of them.
They did barrel rolls and I think Fraver said that he was chasing one of them and he looked around and it was behind him.
And to me, doing, I guess, what might be called profiling, that they, who was in the Tic Tac acted like the jet pilots.
I know Fraver said, man, I'd like to fly one of those.
And it seemed that they were playing a cat and mouse game.
The Tic Tacs wanted them to know that their technology was superior.
They won the game.
But they reacted like humans.
There's also, it's the idea that whales migrate there at that time.
And were the Tic Tacs so interested in monitoring the whales that they just didn't care about the Navy.
But they could, with their technology, they could have hidden and come back again later.
And I always say ETs might that ETs would either leave so as not to confront Tic Tacs or perhaps they would shoot and there was no violence, nobody shot.
So to me, this was just so human of the Tic Tacs.
Now they might be run by an intelligence system, rather a human, your head would explode if you dove from 80,000 feet to right over the water, as is described with Tic-Tac behavior.
So they could be artificial intelligence humans, or it could be a system of artificial intelligence.
But again, it had a human element of behavior.
Of course, another explanation might be, and neither of us knows this definitively, that somebody somewhere on this earth has that superior technology and was trying it out, taking it for a spin.
Yes, the Question: I know the Navy has said they don't know.
It's not, there's no unknown project that they know of.
I don't have the quote right in front of me, but the Navy seemed to admit for the first time that they were baffled.
And when you get experienced pilots, and the footage shows this, saying, I've never seen anything of this kind, and when they are clearly, the audio recording shows they're shocked, something is going on.
We've referenced time travel, and you mentioned Dr. Jack Safati, who you've spoken with and quote extensively in the book.
He talks about ways of potentially achieving time travel, including the low-power warp drive idea and the folding of space-time.
Yes, and I'm just getting there because this is the chapter I can't quote without looking because of the physics.
Yes, he's been, he's now in his early 80s, and he's a remarkable man.
He has put, he had experiences himself encounters, or not encounters, he had strange phone calls when he was 13 years old.
And they said that he'd be, he could choose to be a special group of young people if he would.
And he got, he only remembers one phone call from a cold computer voice.
His mother remembered many phone calls.
In fact, she told them to leave her Jackie alone because they kept calling for a period of time.
He became, he was a member of the hippies who saved physics back in the 70s.
They started the idea of the Tao of physics that I remember reading and other books about consciousness, the roots of consciousness.
So Jax, low power warp, yeah, okay, well, Star Trek, the Enterprise folds space technically.
It really doesn't move.
But to fold space, you need a huge amount of energy.
In fact, you need so much energy that it has to do with a Jupiter full of energy.
Jack says we would need a Jupiter size amount of energy.
Literally, I think.
But he has found a way around it, he feels, low power warp.
So, okay, it's hard to fold space.
You need a whole lot of energy.
But he has found if we reduce the speed of light inside the metamaterial, which is a new, we have discovered it supposedly in the skins of crash saucers, but metamaterial is already used for cloaking.
Okay, we just lost you fractionally there.
You said metamaterial is used by the military for cloaking, you say.
Cloaking, yeah, it's already used, but this would be, I guess, a superior metamaterial or a more highly developed.
But metamaterials are being, are part of this big science explosion that's happening.
So it has an electromagnetic, it has to do with superposition in physics, and it will nullify gravity.
It'll make a zero gravity bubble around the craft for a very small amount of energy.
He says, possibly as small as a AAA battery.
My dog is growling back there.
And barking.
Barking.
Sounds like he heard something he liked.
He's probably looking for the delivery man.
Let's hope the delivery man holds off 20 minutes or so.
You talk, listen, a lot about, and I'm sorry to move you on here.
I just want to make sure we get as much in as we can within this hour we're speaking.
You talk a lot about abductions because you had two, you say yourself.
And you go into the Betty and Barney Hill case and other cases that have been well documented.
One I hadn't heard about, and you talk about this one a lot in the book, is the case of somebody called Betty Andreason in 1966.
I'll just read a little bit from the book.
On the night of Jan 25, 67, Betty Andreason was in the kitchen with her seven children and her parents were in the living room.
They lived in South Ashburnham, Massachusetts.
One of the groups seemed to be the leader.
This is the aliens that they came into contact with, whatever they were.
He was about five foot tall.
The others were about a foot shorter than that.
All of them had pear-shaped heads, wide eyes, small ears and noses.
Their mouths were slits.
They never moved.
They seemed to be wearing a kind of blue uniform with a wide belt.
It's a fascinating case that I'd never heard of before.
But where does this sit then in your theory of abduction?
What is this case telling us?
Yeah, you know, I first read of it when I was teaching school.
Raymond Fowler, that goes back quite a few years.
He wrote a whole book on it and then did several other books, I think, with Betty.
Yeah, it's kind of a classic abduction case.
Betty was worried about her children when these little beings showed up in their house and obviously wanted Betty to go with them.
And so they seem to have put the family in a stasis field.
But Betty was worried about her 11-year-old daughter in particularly.
And that's a fascinating part of the story, isn't it?
Because she was so worried about her 11-year-old daughter that they were concerned enough about her concern that they actually freed the 11-year-old daughter for a moment from the stasis, from the suspended animation.
Yeah, which is an interesting, there's quite a few interesting aspects to this.
Then they did take Betty, and she had a physical examination, subjected to the effects of strange equipment.
She believes they inserted something like a small BB.
And I have suggested that a nano chip is even smaller than a BB, but in her terms, that's what you'd think of if something was being inserted.
I think.
I mean, advanced technology, the nano technology is just incredible.
And I've got a chapter that tries To go into that.
So her abductors returned her to her home four hours later.
One of them had stayed in the house to watch the family members.
That was astonishing.
I've never heard that before in any abduction case, and I've seen lots.
You've seen more than me, but I've never heard of a babysitter being left behind.
Well, you know, I think I have, this is just a theory, that the cases from the 50s and 60s have a different, either a different group of future humans or ETs, or something changed.
I know we became more, the current be more hostile with movies and just fractionally lost you there.
You said something's currently more hostile?
No, I think it became colder and more scary as more humans claimed to be abducted.
Some of those abductions, I frankly doubt, but I'm not picking out any that.
But it seemed like the early 50s, I know mine was in the early 50s and Betty, I think, was early 60s.
She was treated fairly humanely, only they went ahead with whatever it was they were going to do.
And I think that later abduction and the whole scene has become more hysterical and more negative.
I mean, there's been a lot of movies about evil aliens and whatnot.
Back in the early 70s, there was Starman, there was Close Encounters came along, and then of course E.T. was maybe over the top.
But Betty belonged to that time that I did as well in the 50s, where it really wasn't, it was just crazy.
It was bizarre.
It was life-changing.
But Betty had always been a religious person, and she made it into a spiritual plus for her.
She wrote books.
She showed her, she did sketching of, she felt she knew these beings when she was a child as well.
She started to remember.
And yeah, the earlier ones, it's called the Golden Ages of Adduction or the Golden Age of Adductions and seems a little more humane.
Okay.
Did they say, because they do seem to have been in the way that they treated the family, they do seem to have been very gentle in the way that they did this.
We don't know the purpose of this abduction claimed, but they do seem to have been gentle in the way that they did it, in particular, leaving a babysitter there to look after the family while she was away.
Anything that you've read or heard about her, or maybe she told somebody that you know, whatever, that suggested that she was told that they were from the future and not from Alpha Centauri?
No, I don't think she...
And no, I came to that speculation because of the description of the little beings.
And it just seemed logical that in my whole premise that those are human connected.
Your own abduction experiences, you write extensively about those in the book.
The one that spoke to me most, or the aspect that spoke to me most, was about your contact with one that you call the special one.
And you refer to this being as an enhanced human.
Talk to me about that.
I called him my special one, which sounds very sentimental, but he didn't give me his name.
And I only interacted.
They made it so.
I only interacted with him.
In hypnosis, I remembered two entities, both small humans.
One was more insect-like facially.
It looked like an Iowa grasshopper in the face.
I wasn't scared of it, but they were just in the background.
The being I interacted with, I found myself, I was outside playing with Pat the dog on an Iowa November evening, and I found myself in this big area sitting on a park bench, the park benches in town, and in sort of a terrarium area.
I never saw the ship from the outside.
I assume it was a ship.
I lost you very slightly there.
You were sitting, you were on a park bench, then you were on a ship.
Yeah, I assume it was a ship.
I was sitting in a large area, but it was a terrarium.
There were a few plants, and there was a big kind of hologram across the corridor that I looked at.
It reminded me of when the movie theater used to flash different colors up on the curtain before the show started.
It flashed different pastel colors.
And this being sat about a foot away from me.
He was probably shorter than my dad, who was six feet.
He was probably 30 years old.
And I've described him as possibly an enhanced human.
And I've said that for years, but I didn't know what I meant.
But recently I've decided there was probably an artificial intelligence aspect shown by his eyes.
And, you know, somebody will say Data had Next Generation Star Trek had gold eyes.
Well, I have no particular love or hang up on Data.
And I said this before Next Generation was ever created.
But it would be kind of like that, human except Different eyes and not a military haircut, just casual hair.
And that he spoke to me either in telepathy or with words.
I really don't know which.
And I have a few conscious memories, the details that are related, like a uniform or what was this area more like where the windows, things like that were bought up in hypnosis with Dr. Leo Sprinkle, who's still a good friend.
He's kind of an icon of ufology.
But I have a few conscious memories sitting on the bench, and he said, we are from your future.
Okay, I do base, I admit emotionally to basing my curiosity on that, but I also admit he could have been lying.
He could, for all, he could have been a shapeshifter or something, but I don't feel he was.
I think he was what he seemed to be, and I've researched it for years.
I've investigated.
It's nothing that I believe blindly, but I think maybe he set even today in motion.
And I know Dr. Sarfati would probably agree, and other people who have had experiences, you watch it unfold and you understand what it was all about.
Now, they may well have been from the future.
Why did they want to communicate with you?
Did they tell you?
Did you ask them?
No, I didn't.
I was a little kid, but I did take it all in.
I was a smart little kid and I was used to being kind of an only an observer.
I wasn't real active, but I was sitting there thinking and taking it all in.
And did you tell your folks?
No.
I did.
Now, as time went on, they knew I was extremely interested in UFOs.
When I was nine years old, I started fooling around with makeup, just playing with it.
And I noticed I had a scar on the outside of between my nose and my upper lip down that line of symmetry.
And I asked them, they were very involved parents.
I said, well, what happened to me?
Did I hit my mouth on the tricycle or something?
And they said, no, you never had, we don't know.
And I said, well, did I have a little deformity when I was born that might have been, no, no, nothing like that.
So you think they did that?
I think, well, I am missing, you know, there's a membrane there inside your mouth.
I realized years later, it wasn't, the outside wasn't it.
They had taken the membrane on the, something happened.
Somebody stole the membrane on the inside of my mouth there.
It's not, they will, I've researched this, they will slice that.
Doctors will, so a baby can suckle better.
But that never happened to my mother's knowledge.
I was breastfed.
So it's a mystery.
The appearance of that is a mystery, and you're tracing it back to what you say happened to you.
Yeah, and that's it.
You know, but I've got some skeptical listeners here.
Sorry to interrupt here.
We're just, you know, we're coming up.
Time is always pressing on these things.
It's the one thing that limits us.
You know, I have skeptical listeners who will say, you were a child and you dreamt this.
Well, somebody took the man.
That's what I was going to say.
It's really gone.
It's not just sliced.
It's not there all the way up to the very, you know, you can't feel up there your nose or interferes with feeling.
And it's just totally slick gone.
So somebody took it.
But I'm the first to say there could be a logical explanation.
I suppose it would be when I was born that my parents weren't advised of because they had no memory like when I was two or three.
And mom was very skeptical and she would have been happy to burst my bubble.
She knew she didn't like my, she didn't believe in ghosts.
She didn't like my interest in UFOs.
So, but I still have, you know, I would still have the abduction as much as anybody does.
But and they're always question and in doubt, and that's a good thing because humans can fantasize.
But with me, there is this possible evidence or would-be evidence.
Well, it certainly sets up a whole load of questions.
Now, a lot of people that I've spoken with over the years, it seems to be fairly common, who had experiences of contact or abduction in childhood continued through life to have those experiences.
Did you?
I had one year of really strange stuff happening, but off and on, stop it, you guys.
Then we just have to explain that's the dogs and cats.
Off and on, I have synchronicities and little odd things.
I think everybody probably does, but don't make a big deal of it or don't really realize it.
I mean, I suppose I'm always looking for it.
But I did have one strange year when there were, in 1979, I was an adult.
I was a school teacher.
I was raising my daughter myself and living with my parents in St. Petersburg, Florida.
It was one block from Tampa Bay.
And over Tampa Bay is a big long Skyway bridge that goes to Bradenton, Florida.
And it's a very high bridge with two spans for each lane of traffic.
And so, 1979, there were beeps in the TV set.
At first they came five minutes before the hour.
My daughter and I noticed.
And then they just became more random.
And then the wall beeped, the lamps beeped, the clothes dryer beeped, the hair dryer beeped, a ceiling fixture beeped, and there's nothing that'll beep in the wall.
How did that happen?
So I took a cassette recorder on batteries half a block away and it beeped.
And I also had a very spectacular UF, if we're short on time, I won't go into details, but a UFO sighting that was really the best one of my life.
My daughter and I and a group of people in this park overlooking Tampa Bay watched two big spheres for a number of hours.
They didn't move.
So it wasn't a rocket test.
It wasn't a Chinese lantern.
But what happened was on May 9th, 1980, the beeps had been going on for about a year.
Our smoke alarm began to beep as I was getting my daughter ready for school.
And I raced around to check for fire and realized it was not the fire warning, but a battery low, not a battery low signal either.
Sounded like Moore's code.
Dad was trying to remember Moore's code when we heard on the television news a few minutes later that a barge had just rammed one span of the Skyway Bridge at 735, which had just, you know, happened.
That was an enormous accident, wasn't it?
That was a terrible tragedy, I remember.
35 people died.
A Greyhound bus went over.
I remember that, yeah.
And so, you know, were the beeps predicting the catastrophe for a year?
I don't know if it was related, but the beeps eased off then.
They stopped, not all at one time, but they just didn't happen as much.
And then they were gone.
And I was searching for meaning, and I wondered if the life energy of the victims, because it was a tall bridge, it would take a few seconds to hit the water.
If maybe their energy somehow set off my smoke alarm, I'm not sure.
That's just a theory.
I mean, it's an interesting theory, but of course it's one that's going to be, I would think, impossible to prove.
But I do know that that story was an incredible and terribly, a terrible tragedy.
It was a confluence of events that led, as you said, to 35 people dying.
And of course, they made improvements to the bridge subsequently, didn't they, when they rebuilt it to make sure that that could never happen again.
Right.
And it was very near my house, you see.
I was one block away.
One block away.
Sorry, your internet faded.
Listen, I think we're going to have to wrap it there because your internet's been in and out while we've been having this conversation.
But we've understood what you've said.
The title of the book, now it's Future Humans and the UFOs, Time for New Thinking.
So just as we leave this, I wonder if you would like to leave my listener with just a sentence or two about what their new thinking should be in the light of what you've said.
What should they now be thinking?
Well, even more than accepting my theory, which to me is logical and has the motives for it being future humans, but even more than accepting my theory, that's up to you, or even considering it, I think that we as a species have never been truly free.
We've had religions, tyrants, political systems, money system, war, the aftermath of war, and I think we've lost the connection to our amazing potential.
We either go on or we don't.
And if we go on, we're going to continue to explore and discover and develop science and technology.
We've got a deficit in the spiritual department, but I think we can find it if we can make the bridge.
You know, we feel a connection to our ancestors.
Maybe, you know, they overcame hardship and that inspires us.
Well, I think there's a bridge to the future as well, not just one grandchild, but to the species children of the future.
And that's really the message that I want to get out most to find ourselves of worth again.
Okay, one final question.
Thank you for doing this.
Why don't they, if they're coming back here, why don't they come and help us, actively help us to solve the problems that they may well have worked out themselves?
Is it only down to the Prime Directive that they don't do that?
I think there is a point that maybe it's just a hope that they will.
And I think we're approaching it.
Time travel is growing in popularity with the Tic Tacs.
They seem to somehow make that one of the suspicious answers, possible answers to the puzzle.
And I think we're even this book in a small way, once a species steps out of time, it's a huge, it's the biggest thing that ever happens to a group of individuals, or to a world.
So it's a huge step, and I think we're approaching it.
And so maybe we will be going back in time to try and gather some lessons from the people who came before us.
I think we could maybe in some circumstances use those lessons.
Diane, thank you for that.
If people listening to this now, maybe they want to give you some feedback, make a connection with you, or just check out your work, is there like a place on the web that you have where they can go and make contact with you, et cetera?
The book, Future Humans in the UFOs, is on Amazon, Kindle, paperback.
And I have a website, earthchangepredictions.com, and there's a contact path there, and I'd love to hear from them.
Diane Tessman in Iowa, or Iowa, thank you for your time.
You're welcome.
You've been hearing Diane Tessman, your thoughts on her welcome.
Please go to my website, theunexplained.tv.
If you'd like to send me a message, please go to the website, follow the link from there.
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And if you've made that donation recently, Thank you from the bottom of my heart.
We have more great guests in the pipeline here at the Unexplained Online, so until next we meet.
My name is Howard Hughes.
I am in London, and please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm, and above all, stay in touch.
Thank you very much.
Take care.
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