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Nov. 24, 2019 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:13:25
Edition 420 - Whitley Strieber

The return of world-famous author/contactee/visionary Whitley Strieber on his latest book "A New World" and his after-death contact with his life-partner Anne...

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Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes, and this is the return of the unexplained.
Thank you very much for all of your communications.
If your email to me through the website theunexplained.tv requires a response, then I will endeavor to get one straight back to you.
And if I haven't, then please remind me, these are interesting and difficult times at the moment, but I do check my email.
I do see each and every one that comes in, and I take on board everything that you say.
Whether you're telling me that you love the show or whether you're telling me about things that need to be improved, I'm listening, I'm looking, and I'm aware.
If you've sent me a donation to the show recently through the website theunexplained.tv, thank you for doing it.
And as we come to the end of this year, if you haven't, then I would ask you, if you can, to please consider making a donation for the continuing operation of The Unexplained.
A donation for the operation.
I didn't even try and make that rhyme.
The guest on this edition, a return visit with Whitley Streeber, author, visionary, some say, and very, very interesting man.
Contactee, I guess, above all else.
We'll be talking with him about his brand new book, His New Research and His Life Now.
Just to say this, before we get to the US and talk with Whitley, this has been a particularly difficult couple of weeks for me.
I mentioned this on my Facebook page, The Unexplained With Howard Hughes, the official one that is now up and running.
And thank you very much if you responded to that.
I was explaining how I have had a return of tinnitus.
Now, a lot of my listeners, I know because you tell me, have this situation ringing in the ears, sometimes accompanied, as it is for me at the moment, with pain on hearing some loud sounds or sounds of a particular frequency.
So if I hear, I don't know, carrier bag from a supermarket, a plastic one, scrunching, then that sounds like broken glass to me at the moment.
It's very worrying, very frightening, and I'm trying really hard to carry on and not let it depress me.
But, you know, I had tinnitus, as you might remember, about six years ago, and spent years dealing with it, living with it and adjusting to it.
And unfortunately, after what they call a feedback accident with a pair of headphones, just a little sharp burst, one second, I think it was, of loud sound, I threw the headphones off my head, but too late.
I had the ringing in the ears back worse.
And this is where I'm at.
So if you have any thoughts and suggestions, bioflavonoids, whatever they may be, or your own story of how you've beaten this, believe me at the moment, I'd love to know that, because it is my personal challenge, and you know that I love doing this, and I've been a broadcaster all of my life.
So something that means that I can't do what I do as well as I supposedly can do it is a bit of an issue for me and a bit of a worry.
And if you have Tinnitus, I know what you're going through, and I know that there are many people in this world who suffer with it, including Barbara Streisand, I understand, Chris Martin from Cold Play.
William Shatner apparently acquired Tinnitus after an explosion on the set of Star Trek.
So it affects a lot of people and they acquire it in different ways, whether it's an infection that causes it, a sudden noise like it was with me and an infection at the beginning, six years ago, or other circumstances like continued exposure to loud noise, perhaps at work or something, all the different ways.
But the result is the same.
And they say there is no cure.
We just have to get on with it and find our own way through.
So if you have any suggestions, I would love to hear from you.
All right.
Enough of this.
Let's get to Whitley Streeber in the United States.
We have a lot to talk about, including his new book, and I want to catch up with him.
Whitley, thank you very much for coming back on my show.
Well, thank you for having me, and I'm glad to be back on the show.
It's been a while, and I'm excited.
It has been a while.
And if you don't mind, apart from talking about the new book, which will make up the bulk of this conversation, Whitley, I just want to talk about a couple of things to do with you, if that's okay.
First of all, the one thing I haven't done, which is very remiss of me, is just to kind of remind listeners who Wickley Striber is and how Wickley Striber might describe himself.
Now, I came up with three words for starters, and you might think that none of them really fits properly, but author's one of them.
Well, that's for sure.
Contacty, I thought, and visionary.
Would you see yourself that way?
Well, I've ended up being those things.
It's not what I started out to do.
Let me put it that way.
I discovered that I was a visionary after the things that I predicted started to come true.
I was surprised in the middle of the night by a bizarre experience and ended up so-called contactee.
So, you know, I've been kind of coming up from behind in my life, I guess would be the best way of putting it.
If you had had life the way that you wanted it, the way that you were heading for, how would you have ended up now?
What would you have been doing if those things hadn't happened?
I had started out writing horror novels, and I had graduated from that into more serious fiction.
And I was hoping that I would become a literary novelist and live a quiet, introspective life, the life I dreamed of, which was very much of a family life with my family and friends and not a lot of public exposure.
Instead, the exact opposite has happened.
And we've talked on other shows about the initial contact experiences.
I mean, that is now all more than three decades ago when all of this began, isn't it?
Three decades, 30 years.
It began in late 1985.
And just to remind those who haven't heard those shows, just to give them a little taste of that, how did all of This dawn on you first?
What were the first inklings that something that is beyond the norm was going on?
Well, it wasn't exactly an inkling.
I woke up in the middle of the night in a room full of very peculiar-looking creatures, so much so that I assumed at first that it was a nightmare.
And I tried to wake up again, and I could not do so.
In other words, I was trapped in the nightmare.
And were you aware at the time?
This is a weird question to ask, but those of us, and I do have regular, what I would call nightmares, things that I wake up scared from.
Were you aware while you were going through it that it was a nightmare?
Or were you aware when you came out of it that it was something not good?
I had, at first I thought it was a nightmare, but I could not wake up.
And gradually, I realized that I was actually here.
I was not in my bed.
I could not make my bed come up around me again because it wasn't there.
I was actually here in this place, in this strange little room full of what appeared to me to be giant insects.
And it was appalling.
I was absolutely appalling.
It didn't occur to me that I was not a person who thought about aliens or anything like that at all.
And I just didn't know what to make of what was happening.
I was screaming.
I was injured quite severely.
In fact, one of the injuries to my rectum is it left scar tissue that's still there to the day, this day, and it's been made a sort of joke of.
But I was, in fact, raped on that night, and it was horrible.
And we've talked about that before, and that was a very hard thing to go through, of course.
But an even harder thing to actually talk about subsequently.
The laughter that happened afterwards when I went public with this was ghastly because, you know, if you can imagine somebody being laughed at in public for being raped, you can think of what I went through.
So it was a horrible experience.
And afterwards, the next day, I was very distressed and confused.
But all I remembered was seeing an owl.
And the trouble was there couldn't have been an owl in the house.
And over the next few days, the injuries began to hurt.
And I began to have more clear memories of what had happened.
And I thought, my God, I'm going nuts.
This is, I'm having some sort of psychotic situation here.
So I went to my doctor, and he said I had been raped.
And I thought to myself, but these memories are crazy.
You know, I was a controversial author.
I just published a book called War Day, which was loved by a lot of people and a big bestseller, but a lot of people didn't like it so much also.
So, you know, and it was possible, it was a very political book.
And it was possible that someone had attacked me.
I would think that was possible.
We didn't have any.
We were in the country when it happened.
And I guess it, in retrospect, that seems like a far-fetched idea to me now.
But at the time, I couldn't, the idea that something really as strange as it actually was had happened just wasn't in my universe of possibilities.
It just never crossed my mind.
So the doctor had me take an MRI scan and psychological tests and other tests for temporal lobe epilepsy to see if I was capable of producing powerful hallucinations.
None of that panned out.
I was a normal person under a lot of stress according to these tests.
And my brain didn't show any sign of any illness or any epileptiform tissue or anything like that.
So I was left to think maybe it happened as I thought it did, as I remembered it.
And then my brother had sent me a book for Christmas called Science and the UFOs by an English author, Jenny Randalls.
And I read the book just not because I was not because I think it had thought it had anything to do with me, but because he had sent it to me for Christmas.
And I wanted to tell him that I had read the book he had given me.
And about three-quarters of the way through the book, there was this story about a so-called alien abduction.
And I thought, my God, this reads like what happened to me.
And it mentioned a researcher in New York called Bud Hopkins, who lived, turned out a few blocks from us in Manhattan.
So I went to see him, and he was absolutely convinced I was abducted by aliens.
And I wasn't saying anything to him because I thought that this is stupid.
I mean, this is completely ridiculous.
But he wanted me to hypnotize me, and I did not want to be hypnotized by an artist.
He wasn't a professional.
So I said, well, if you want that, you have to find a professional.
And he found Dr. Donald Klein, who was a skilled forensic hypnotist.
And don't let anybody tell you that hypnosis is a mistake or wrong or you shouldn't do it.
It does work in the hands of an expert.
Dr. Klein had solved many cases of hit-and-run accidents and things like that by enabling people to remember details of things like license plates.
So he was the real deal, and he was the head of the New York State Department of Psychiatry, a man with a Sterling professional reputation, to say the least.
And did he make you relive it?
It was remarkable.
It was absolutely remarkable.
And the audio tapes are actually on my website, unknowncountry.com.
People can listen to it now, and it's part of the record.
And there were two hypnosis sessions.
The first one, in the first one, I screamed like a maniac because I was so terrified.
And I this was over an incident that had happened the previous October.
And I was horrified by something that had happened then.
At that point, we had had a big light come over the house at like three or four o'clock in the morning.
We had house guests.
There was a bang.
I thought the house was on fire.
I jumped out of bed.
My little boy started screaming in his bedroom downstairs.
The house guests woke up.
I ran downstairs, but by the time I got there, the light was gone.
Everything was quiet.
So apparently nothing was wrong.
And I just said, I comforted my child and then said to our friends, go ahead and go back to sleep.
So Wickley, to cut a long story, and it is a long story, a lot shorter, you know, this became a part of your life.
Whether you wanted it to, and of course, who would want it to or not, you became somebody who was a contactee and that became part of the years that were to come.
Well, what happened was after the hypnosis with Donald Klein had clarified things, in other words, it sharpened all of my memories, but it didn't change them.
They were there before.
And I thought to myself, and I eventually told my wife what it was about.
And we thought it, you know, even it was a strange experience, it was still a very important one because it was something that was not supposed to be happening to people, and yet it had happened.
And so I decided to write a book about it, thinking it had happened to maybe 50 people or so.
And Bud Hopkins didn't think it would be much more than that.
And I published the book, Communion, and it was explosive.
It burst onto the scene, shot to the top of the bestseller list in all kinds of countries all over the world.
And we started to receive tens and hundreds of thousands of letters from people who had had the same experience.
And it was a hidden reality under the surface of life that we had discovered, completely unknown until then.
But in the days when it started for you, and you hinted at this already, it was very hard for anybody who'd been through anything like this or believed they'd been through anything like this to say it because of ridicule, because people didn't understand it, and because they thought they were alone.
It's only recently...
Yeah, well, of course.
It is still hard for people to come up.
I heard a big broadcaster sneering about me and saying I was crazy just a short time ago.
And how do you react all these years on to that kind of thing?
And it goes on.
I mean, there are a lot of people out there who can't take it, you know.
They just can't take it.
And since they can't take it, they push it off and say, oh, it's nonsense.
And the people who think that this happened to them are crazy.
But it's not nonsense, and it does happen.
And there's lots of evidence.
In my new book, I talk about it.
There's at least half a dozen named witnesses who actually had experiences at my cabin in upstate New York and many more witnesses from more recent times because the reason I've written a book is that this started again in 2015 and became a huge part of my life from then on.
It had been present in my life until the late mid-1990s.
And I wrote three books about it, Communion, Transformation, and Breakthrough.
And then it kind of tailed off.
And so I didn't write any more about it.
And then in 2007, rather in 1998, there was one experience, but it was with what appeared to be, to me, a human being.
And I wrote a book about that conversation with this remarkable man called The Key.
Then in 2007, I had some very extraordinary experiences, but it was mostly quiet.
There was no book in it.
So it was there, but it was on the back burner.
But you say in 2015, something kicked it off again.
Well, what kicked it off is this.
My wife passed away in August, and we had made a pact about how to contact each other after death.
I had completely forgotten this pact.
Annie had come out of our office one day in the early 90s when we were getting these thousands and thousands of letters and said, Whitley, this has something to do with what we call death.
It was obvious that alien contact, if part of it at all, was not a huge part of it.
So it was something else.
And it had to do with, like, for example, at our cabin, when the visitors would show up, almost always someone else in the group who wasn't seeing the visitors would see a dead friend or relative.
And this was just a commonplace experience.
And it's also true of the letters that again and again people would say, well, my mother walked in the door and there were these little men with her and stuff like that.
So obviously, it's not the conventional narrative doesn't work all that well here.
Okay, so a different kind of experience from the ones that you'd had before.
Did that make you think or rethink the nature of what you've been going through?
In other words, you know, you'd always believed it was some kind of creatures from some other dimension or another planet.
Did it make you rethink that?
Yeah, I began to think that this was something to do with us.
It might very well have to do with aliens also, but it also is very much involved with us.
But anyway, during that time, Anne and I made a pact together that the first one of us to die, if it was possible to contact this side, would contact not the other one directly, but would contact friends who had no idea that was going to happen.
And we never told a soul about it.
Now, in 2013, Annie got brain cancer, and I was totally engaged in helping her and trying to help her survive until she died in August of 2015.
I have to say, Whitley, that, you know, you and I had a number of conversations during that time.
And the last one was very moving for a whole variety of reasons because you were also looking after her while we were having that conversation.
And my heart went out to you then.
I even suggested, if you want to stop this conversation, Whitley, we can talk another time.
But it was a very, very difficult time for you.
Of course it was.
It was very hard because it was very hard for her too because her body was failing and she was struggling and, you know, she needed everything.
She needed every kind of help she, you know, she could get.
And I was there.
There was no way I would leave Anne's side or leave her to helpers or anything like that.
Anne was my wife, and we were part of each other.
And so the most help she got, she got from me.
And so that happened anyway.
And then the next thing I knew, an hour and a half after she died, I was sitting in the living room in a state of incredible grief.
And a friend called, Belle Fuller, and said, Whitley, I just had the oddest thing happen.
I heard Ann's voice.
She said to call Whitley.
And I had been saying in my head, Annie, if you're still here in any way, please let me know.
I had forgotten about the pact completely.
And so I said, well, Belle, Ann died just an hour and a half ago.
And that was the first of like five or six similar calls from friends, some of whom knew Ann had died and some of whom didn't.
It depended, you know, the next day or so, there were a couple of calls from people who heard her voice and didn't know.
And then later, everybody knew and they were still hearing her.
And she was effectively fulfilling the agreement that you had.
Doing it.
Yeah, absolutely.
And then I remembered about two weeks later, I thought I remembered this conversation we'd had.
And apparently so, because it developed into what Dr. Gary Schwartz, who wrote the forward to the book, considers one of the most well-documented experiences of afterlife contact ever to happen.
That's the book, The Afterlife Revolution.
So this has to do, the reason we started this part of the conversation is the dead are not gone.
It is not true that we live in a completely physical world.
And the visitors, which I call them visitors, are more invested in that level of reality than they are in this one.
But it also suggests to us, doesn't it, that there is a continuum.
So many people through history have talked about this.
Religions have talked about this.
That our lives are a continuum.
Yeah, exactly.
And, you know, we live in a culture that, especially in the Western world, which says that you have no afterlife.
You're only a material being.
And our science backs that up.
And so we've sort of gone soul blind.
We no longer know who we really are.
And there's a tremendous amount of resistance in the community because we lived through in the Western world a thousand year long religious dictatorship that started with the Council of Nicaea and only slowly ended during the Renaissance.
And then came the Enlightenment in the 17th and 18th centuries.
Nobody wants to go back to that.
And the fear is that if we admit the soul exists, then the religious proposition will be reignited and that terrible paw will fall over our society again.
And it's a very scary reality.
But the soul exists, but the religious proposition is not necessarily the one that I personally would choose in understanding the place of my soul in the universe.
So I don't think it's a serious problem, but people are afraid, and especially scientists who have a long history of oppression by religious authorities, starting with, I mean, Giordano Bruno was burned to death, one of the greatest geniuses who ever lived.
Galileo, who darn near was, and many scientists in that era were oppressed, jailed, tortured.
It was a nightmare.
So are you saying, and do you think, that religion has kind of covered up or held back a truth that you are now discovering?
Well, in a way, not exactly that it's covered it up or held it back, but that we don't want to go there.
There's a large part of reality, and I don't believe in the supernatural at all.
It's all part of the natural world, including the soul.
And it's just that there are parts of there are phenomena that we can detect and phenomena that we can't detect.
And the phenomena that we can't detect, we say, don't exist.
And we've been, But that's the history of science.
There was a time when we didn't believe meteors existed.
In 1898, Lord Kelvin published a very authoritative paper proving that heavier-than-air travel was impossible.
And a few years later, the Wright brothers flew.
So, you know, science has a history.
Voltaire, when shown fossils, said they were merely fish bones thrown aside by travelers.
And science has a history of denying phenomena that it does not yet understand.
And that's happening now.
And it's doubly true now because there's a lot of fear that we will go back to a religious dictatorship if we admit the existence of the soul.
But it is going to happen.
And we're not going to go back to a religious dictatorship at all.
We're going to be fine with it.
And we will discover methods of detecting or penetrating our ability to see into this level of reality on a sustainable basis.
So there you are.
You're, of course, going through the grief of the loss of Anne, your partner, your friend, your wife for all of those years, a collaborator in your work for all of that time.
And other people around you are phoning you up and saying, we've had contact with Annie.
She's appeared to us.
You know, what sorts of things were they telling you?
I think we need to get that together.
If we talk to her, they would say to her, give an example.
My kids took me out to Palm Springs, which is a town near in the desert near Los Angeles.
It's a very pleasant, lovely place.
And there are some mountains nearby.
And we were up in the mountains, and they were hiking.
And I was sitting on a bench.
And I was thinking, Annie, please contact me because I hadn't had direct contact with her yet.
And I had heard from three or four people at the time.
And then as I was asking her this, my cell phone rang.
And I was in cell phone coverage, Erie.
There was nothing unusual about that.
My cell phone rang, and it was Claire Henry, a friend from Nashville, who said, Whitley, I just heard Ann's voice in my ear as clear as a bell saying, call Whitley.
And then I remembered the pact.
And I thought, she's doing it.
And that was when a whole nother level of my life started because now I knew and I understood.
And it was wonderful, a wonderful experience.
And did it help to assuage to some extent your grief that you obviously would have been going through at that time?
It did.
It made me feel a sense of comfort for sure.
And it developed very much into a real relationship.
Annie may be dead physically, but she's not dead spiritually at all.
Her soul is still very much alive and very much a part of my life.
Well, look, the realization to you and the way that you must have felt, you must have thought this is such a wonderful thing.
And here is Annie coming back to tell my friends first and now to tell me that she's here or she's in a different dimension, but she hasn't gone away completely.
It is the answer to one of those ultimate questions.
But then, you know, you're a human being.
If it was me, then I would want to start asking questions, questions, questions.
Where are you?
What's it like?
How did you get there?
Oh, yeah.
I asked all those questions and the book Afterlife Revolution is the response because we essentially wrote it together as collaborators after Anne had died.
We collaborated across the barrier between the worlds.
And it's a real collaboration because she said things that were so beautiful and so insightful that I, you know, there's a verisimilitude about it that's undeniable in my opinion.
Of course, people do deny it.
I mean, they don't want, for reasons I've just outlined, a lot of people are terrified of the idea that the soul is real.
And there are people whose lives have been such that they don't want the soul to be real, too.
What did she tell you about where she was?
Not much.
That wasn't so much part of it.
It wasn't informational in that sense.
Like she would say, I would ask her questions about life and what we need to do and what a really good life aim is.
And an answer would be something like, enlightenment is what happens to us when there is nothing left of us but love.
And, you know, that's a very powerful statement because it gives you a life aim.
You'll never reach it.
At least I don't expect to, because I'm too ornery.
But it was beautiful.
She didn't tell me anything about it being sort of the world of the dead.
I did see some things from time to time, but she didn't describe it.
She was very focused on the relationship, much more than describing where she was.
And I'm not so sure that that even makes sense.
I mean, I know that there are a lot of stories of heaven and this and that, as if it was another physical place that for some strange reason we can't see.
And she would always say, I'm here, I'm right here.
And one of the first things I heard her say once we'd gotten into communication with me was, it looks like you're all intentionally ignoring us, which is a very interesting statement.
And I try not to, I try not to intentionally ignore her at all.
I try to make sure that she is very much part of my life.
And was she, do you think, indicating what has been suggested by some people in the past, that by closing ourselves down in this modern world, by refusing to accept certain realities that past civilizations regarded as commonplace and happenstance and day-to-day, that we were tuning out something of ourselves, perhaps?
Yeah, well, we're cheating ourselves out of a full life, that's for sure.
Because I think of my life as it was before this all started to happen to me, it was like a beggar's life compared to what it is now.
I lead an incredibly rich, extraordinary life.
I have the visitors in my life.
I have my own dead wife in my life.
I have many other dead people in my life.
I have a very rich, complex relationship with another level of reality.
And then last summer, I was on the Lakota Sioux Indian Reservation in South Dakota, and this is in A New World, in a chapter called The Fields of Aspodel.
I was riding in a car.
It's a big reservation.
It's the size of Rhode Island, and it's just one place.
Very poor place.
The people have been really oppressed, and they've been treated very badly.
And I was riding in a car because it was a long, there were a lot of long journeys to take to go from place to place there.
And I closed my eyes waiting, you know, because we had a half hour or so more to drive.
And to my amazement, I saw a completely different world superimposed on this world when my eyes were closed.
It was like putting on a virtual reality headset.
It was very similar to this world, but not this world.
For example, we were on a graded road, and in the other level of reality, the road was not graded.
It was an older road, and it followed the contours of the land, with the result that when it went off down a hill, it felt like the car, which was still on the graded road, was flying.
And this didn't go on for a few minutes.
It went on for days.
Every time I closed my eyes, I saw this other world.
I could lean down and look at the roadsides or anywhere that I was and see a different version in great detail of the flowers and stones and so on and so forth.
And when I opened my eyes, it was all different.
It was just absolutely amazing.
Right.
So were you getting the impression that it was a little bit like the old eight-track cartridges?
Sorry to interrupt.
I think it's part of the digital connection that we have here that's putting some delay in there.
But you remember those old eight-track cartridges loops of tape?
It would be the same piece of tape, but you could jump between tracks on it.
You could jump to some more music on another track, and then another track, and then another track.
Was it indicating to you that you could stay in the same place, same piece of tape, but be somewhere else?
Well, of course, I tried hard to get into the physically into the other world, but it did not happen.
But it's there.
I think there's a parallel universe here, and that opens up a whole nother level of possibilities about what's going on here.
I think that one of the things that has happened in our world is in the, say, the mid-15th century, in the West, we saw the world was Earth-centric and man-centric.
Earth was at the center of the universe insofar as we could see it.
The sun was rotating around the earth.
And man was the greatest achievement of God.
That was our reality.
Now we know physically that we are on a little tiny planet that's hardly even a speck of dust out in the middle of nowhere orbiting a galaxy behind a star which we call the sun, which is very much like trillions upon trillions of other stars in trillions upon trillions upon trillions of other galaxies.
So we're not exactly at the center of the universe anymore.
But it is going to turn out that we are even smaller than we thought because there is this other universe and maybe many other universes, both physical and in some kind of parallel dimensional state.
And we are only a tiny part of all of that.
Do you think that we're becoming aware of this because somebody wants us to become aware of it?
Yeah, In a New World, I talk about the mirror universe and I show how not only is it a scientific possibility, there are experiments going on right now that could prove its existence if they work.
So it's a really serious scientific possibility.
And I think I saw the darn thing and I think it was something close to a miracle that I did.
And I lived with that vision for days.
It was the single most extraordinary experience of a life that has had a lot of extraordinary experiences in it.
I think that's absolutely for certain it has.
What do you think is the synergy then between the visitors, aliens they may be, whatever they may be That have been with you for a big chunk of your life.
Those who've departed, like Anne, your wife, who's somewhere else now, you believe, and yourself and ourselves here, do you think all of those things are connected in some kind of big circle?
Absolutely.
It's all connected.
The visitors' primary place of residence is the same level of reality that our dead live on.
And I think that there is a synergy there that's probably been going on throughout all of our history that we simply haven't seen correctly.
And do you think that could explain what we call ghosts and aliens and a lot of the things that people regard as the paranormal?
Ghosts, aliens, gods, sylphs, fairy folk, all of that.
That's all a response to this other mysterious level of reality.
And what we have a tendency to do is we want to connect the dots, and we want to do that based on whatever our level of understanding is at a given moment in history.
So what were fairy folk 100 years ago are now aliens.
But it's all the same phenomena.
And I don't even know the degree to which they are differentiated.
In other words, I'm not even sure that they have individuality like we do.
And I'm not sure that they have a significance that is as profound as the significance of a physical being.
I think our dead, for example, once you die, I know this, you can no longer change anything in your life, which is why it is so important to live an examined life so that when you do die, you don't have things hanging that you can't change.
I've seen people in that state many times where they have passed on and know now that they should have changed things and they can't.
And it's not a good state.
It's not a pleasant way to be.
So where does that leave us then?
Are we some kind of experiment?
Are we here to be observed?
What's the point of humanity?
We're the foundation.
It all starts here.
The journey of a soul starts in the physical world.
And where that soul may come from, I don't know.
But this is where we start.
And this is where we...
This is the...
You either ascend from here or you don't.
How does that work?
I mean, if you choose not to ascend from here, what happens to you?
If you live a life, a good life, of a life of love, compassion, and humility, and really understand those things and what they are and how they connect with your relationship with other people.
You don't need to believe in God.
You don't need to believe in religious rituals.
You don't need to believe in anything.
You don't even need to believe in the soul.
But if you live that way, then when you die, you have some insurance.
Your soul will be fine and it will grow into whatever it will grow into in the next life.
And you'll go on and maybe recur here.
I mean, I think reincarnation is quite real, and it happens a lot.
Not always, but a lot.
So, and there are other levels of complexity involved as well, because I'm not sure that every person is a separate soul.
It may be that some big souls deploy more than one body at a time.
It's just, it's all, I have inklings that it is all very different from what we have told ourselves in the past and that it is in many ways much more wonderful.
The problem is, of course, Whitley, and one of, when I mentioned on my Facebook page that you were coming on, I got a lot of great response, people who couldn't wait to hear you on this.
People like Libby and Mike and Robin and Kerry and Richie and Lonnie and Kerry and Amiga and Rob, just some of the many, many, many people.
And one or two messages from people saying, the problem with all of this, and Whitley Strieber is one of those people, was what this person whose name I forget now said, is that none of it you can prove.
There are no concrete forms of proof for any of this.
Well, that is a way of looking at it that is not fully invested in reality, quite frankly, because there's a lot of stuff.
You know, in this country, and I would presume it's also true in the UK, although I don't know for sure, there is a large amount of material that has been left that has been under study for years,
and a lot of that has been bled out of the discoveries made from those materials have been bled out into the public space, but very carefully so that the visitors, so that the secret of where it actually came from isn't revealed.
I know some of the people who work in that area very, very well.
And I can't tell you their names, and I can't tell you anything about them because that's all classified.
But some of them are dear friends, and I've known them for years.
And they've been doing this for years to the benefit of mankind.
And why it is all kept so secret is a very complex issue.
It has been discussed in the halls of politics a number of times over the past few years, most notably during the second Bush administration.
And there are a Lot of reasons why there has not been a level of disclosure until now, and now there has been a bit.
There have been some videos released by the United States Navy, which they have admitted, quite frankly, are unknowns.
And there's probably going to be more of that in the future.
As far as physical evidence is concerned, back in the 90s, Dr. Roger Lear began removing strange little objects from people's bodies.
And it wasn't obvious that these objects were anything unusual.
I arranged for the Southwest Research Laboratory in San Antonio, Texas, which was founded by a friend of my family's, to study these.
Their head of material science, William Mallow, studied these objects.
And what we found there were these objects that people who had had close encounter experiences found in their bodies and then were extracted were encased in epidermis, almost all of them.
And that is not possible because when a foreign object naturally goes into the body, the body will deposit calcium around it, a shield of calcium around it.
So these implants were effectively covered in skin?
Well, they were covered in the layer of skin just below the outer layer.
And we could usually find little scars on the individual where there was an indentation where that obviously had been taken out.
Because the body can't produce epidermis inside deep muscle tissue.
It does not have the genetic encoding to do that.
So these things are what we call alien implants.
What are these things for, do you think?
Well, that was the problem.
We couldn't find anything unusual about them.
They just appeared to be little pieces of meteoric iron.
One of them was quite unusual, though.
There was one that was not.
It was a piece of some kind of glassy substance that we could never really identify.
But one of the pieces of meteoric iron, while it was in situ in the individual, had been emitting a low frequency, a low-level FM signal, not a very strong signal, but it was there.
So while before it was taken out of the man, we recorded the signal.
It was then brought, the object was brought to Southwest Research.
We examined it under the scanning electron microscope, hoping to see some kind of crystalline structure that would explain its ability to emit a radio frequency.
We didn't see anything like that.
It was just another unremarkable piece of nickel iron, meteoric iron.
And so we decided to put it under X-ray diffraction, which would cycle X-rays on it again and again and again and perhaps pick up some underlying structure that would explain its ability to emit an FM signal.
When we put it in the diffractor, it returned a signal once, and then it became X-ray invisible.
It no longer had any X-ray presence at all.
So we took it back, examined it again under the SEM.
It was still pure nickel iron, just exactly the same profile it had had before.
We put it back in the X-ray diffractor.
We left it in for 36 hours.
Not one pass returned a signal.
It had indeed become X-ray invisible.
In other words, this seemingly innocuous object had been emitting an FM signal, and then when we tried to see into it and understand what might be under the surface, it simply became invisible to X-rays.
Now, what I am talking about is a level of technology so advanced that we can't even begin to understand how it works.
Here's another story for those who think there is no evidence because they haven't studied this very carefully.
I have here in my office a piece of magnesium and bisimuth layering.
It's layered magnesium and bisimuth in layers.
We have studied this and it is also going to be under study.
Another piece of it is going to be under study again soon, not my piece.
And the thing about it that is so absolutely remarkable is that there is nothing, there is no nothing that causes the layers of bismuth and magnesium to adhere together.
It's just empty space between them.
You can see that very clearly in a microscopic scan.
There's no bonding agent.
There's nothing there at all.
It's just empty.
It's just blank.
And how did you acquire this?
Ah, that's a long story.
And I'm not going to tell the whole thing.
Just say this.
I'm going to say I got it from someone who obtained it from a donation site from which we have gotten much material over the years.
And in my book, I talk about the donation site extensively as a source of knowledge and material that has been revolutionizing the human experience for a long time under the surface.
And also why the donation site is a warning.
And it is definitely placed in such a way that it is intended to be a warning as well as a gift.
So something you think from another dimension left that here for us to find and learn from it?
Oh, yes.
There's no question about it.
They did.
It was definitely left here intentionally, the donation site.
Now, the first crash site, which is the Roswell site, I don't know whether it was an accidental crash or not.
But we did get a lot from that.
And as it happens, my uncle Mickey Edward Streeber, Colonel Edward Strieber, was involved in the analysis of the debris when it was brought to Wright Field in 1947 from Roswell with a stop in Dallas.
And this was really remarkable material.
We still have it, and it's still remarkable.
We still don't fully understand how it works.
They also brought biological material.
And my uncle and General Arthur Exhon, who was the commandant of Wright-Pat, became Wright-Patterson for a long time, and also had worked on this directly from 1947 until 1963, worked on these materials and on the biological analysis, they both talked to me about this and gave me a lot of information about it after I published Communion.
And I said to my uncle, I said, this must be deeply classified.
And he said, well, it is, but we've been ordered to tell you this, and so we're telling you.
And I tried to get documentation, and he said, we're not going to go that far.
So I wrote a book about it called Majestic, which is fictionalized, but it's all a true story, every word of it.
And not every word of Majestic.
There's some fiction in it, obviously.
But a lot of Majestic is a true story based on what they told me.
So to say that there is no physical evidence is only to say that you have been lied to and deceived for a long time.
And the reason is that the visitors are not ready for us to engage directly with them because the gulf between us is too great.
And as I point out in A New World, there was a paper written by, I'm holding it in my hand right now, by TBH Kuiper and Michael Mark Morris, excuse me, in the magazine Science in April of 1977 that lays out correctly why an extraterrestrial civilization,
if they came here, would hide themselves for a long time.
It is because it would disempower our entire culture if we ended up seeing on a general basis the absolutely remarkable technologies that they have.
And anyone from Britain who knows about the history of the British Empire knows that country, nation after nation was disempowered by the technology that the British brought with them as they moved around the world.
And these ancient cultures lost force in the minds of the people in the culture because who cares about my gods when the British have all of this wonderful technology?
So you say the aliens or those from another dimension, whatever they are, are mindful of that.
And that's why they're playing a cat and mouse game with us.
There must be an end game to all of this.
They must have a plan or do they?
Well, I think so, because the book is intended.
I wrote the book, and I'll be very honest with all of you, in direct contact with them that started in February of 2016.
And I think they do have an end game.
And I think that the end game is that they are going to emerge in the context of an environmental collapse on planet Earth.
And that they are hopefully going to help us survive.
But it's not going to be a fun thing and a pleasant thing, because I think that they are...
My impression is that they are...
And I think they are definitely out there or here.
They're not going to be happy because we are forcing them to emerge in order to save us.
And they will do that.
But what about the process of death and dying and how we will cross over to this other dimension or wherever it might be?
We're going to be, if we destroy this planet that we're on here, what we believe is this planet here, then we're going to be with them anyway, aren't we?
If you see what I'm saying, the ultimate end of it all is that we will end up with them.
This is the place of change.
This is where you can change.
When you're in the other state, you can't change anymore.
So you don't want that.
You don't want to have no further access to the physical world and life in the stream of time.
Because if you don't have that, then you're stuck.
You're stuck with what you are.
And if you don't like what you are and you're not satisfied with yourself, you can't do anything about that anymore.
So the physical level is terribly, terribly important to the evolution of a conscious entity.
Without that, we can't do this.
And that's why we come back.
We come back again and again to re-energize ourselves and to create better, stronger, more joyous souls.
So what are they, through you and through the book, telling us to do now?
Well, the first thing that we need is climate change leadership.
And in the United States, we're dealing with a president who just doesn't believe it or chooses not to believe it because his so-called base is scared.
And you look at Brazil and look at India and look at Russia.
A lot of big countries are lacking leadership.
This is not so true in Europe.
For the most part, in Europe, there is leadership.
The Germans, Britain, to a great extent, the French are, the Belgians are, the Dutch, the Danes are, the Swedes, the Norwegians are all Trying hard to lead the way in saving our climate.
And in the United States, many states, California and New York, and other states are also in this, in making this effort.
But there is no effective planetary leadership at all.
And I think we're going to lose a lot.
I don't think, I hope we don't lose everything, but I think our planet is going to inform us very forcefully sooner or later that ignoring this problem is a mistake.
But if they are cognizant of some kind of catastrophe coming and science is suggesting something along those lines, gradually or perhaps suddenly, why don't they use their superior powers now and intervene meaningfully?
Well, they may be doing that.
I don't know.
There's something that's strange is happening to the sun right now.
The solar output has been dropping.
We're going through a period of quiet sun, and it's a terribly convenient one because it means that the full effects of global warming will be spread out over a longer period of time, apparently.
But we know nothing about how this, and next to nothing about how the sun works, so it could change at any time.
But, you know, we went through from the 14th to the 19th century something called the Little Ice Age when the sun was very quiet.
And then it blew off a huge flare that was called the Carrington event in the UK that caused all the telegraph lines in 1853 to explode, causing a generalized upset.
And if that happened today, by the way, we would be over.
But in any case, that happened.
And then shortly after that, the sun began to emit more energy again.
So, you know, it could be that they did something to the sun that reduced its energy output, or maybe that's just chance.
I have no idea.
But if things are going to happen inspired by the sun, and that's happened in the past, then where does that tie into the climate change narrative that says that we, by our actions, are destroying this earth?
Well, we are emitting so much carbon dioxide that the planet can't keep up with it.
In other words, we're emitting so much carbon dioxide that Earth's ecosystems can't absorb it fast enough, and the planet is becoming more and more polluted, the atmosphere, with carbon dioxide, which is a greenhouse gas, and it's causing heat to not be radiated out into space the way it should.
And so the result is the planet is getting warmer.
That's why Venice has had this terrible floods recently and why there are so many climate upheavals in Iraq.
Well, as we record this, there are fires everywhere.
The UK has got more rain than we're used to at this time of year.
So all of those things are happening.
You know, that's just the way things are now.
There are people who email me all the time and say, this is just part of the natural way of things, nothing to see here.
And people who say that we need to sit up and take notice because the science is telling us very clearly, as we hear every day, that we have to do something.
So is the message of the new book, a new world, that this is the situation we're in and that they want us to do something about it or that they are coming here to take it out of our hands?
Well, I think if that happens, that we will not have, it will not be a good experience for us at all.
If we don't do this, if we don't take care of ourselves, I'm not sure they would take care of us.
I think they might let us go.
And there's good reason for that that I go into in the book.
It's not to punish us at all.
It's that we would not be of any value to them if we were like supplicants and instead of being an independent supplier.
So they want us to work out our own solutions to this.
What are they doing to help?
Are they working behind the scenes, do you believe?
Well, you know, I wish I knew the answer to that question.
I don't see why that wouldn't happen.
And it might be happening, but I don't have any personal evidence of it.
Okay, so if I was to ask you what is the central theme or thesis of the book, how would you sum it up for anybody you might ask?
I'm not.
How would I sum it up?
If it's possible.
It's hard to do that.
They are here.
They are definitely here.
Then they is a very complicated, very different presence than we are used to thinking about.
We think kind of in a, we now think, we used to think fairy folk and other things, but now we think human and alien.
But this is much bigger than that.
They, if you include us in it, what we are really looking at here is a much larger vision not only of the world around us, but also of mankind.
That is the bottom line here.
Right.
So we need to be thinking differently about who we are.
Yeah, that's absolutely right.
That's one of the main themes of my book.
Gee.
And how's it doing so far, Wigley?
I know you're doing a lot of interviews about it.
Yes, absolutely.
Well, the book's selling pretty well.
And there has been books selling well.
And there have been some good reviews on Amazon and some good reviews in the press that I know are coming.
They haven't been published yet.
And some authors who I know have been very nice to me about The book, and the book's going to do its job.
It will do its job.
I don't really think about that much.
I just try to do what I can.
Do you think there's a movie in this one?
If there's a message in it, do you think there might be a movie in this, or would that dilute the message?
There's a network making a TV series about my life now.
And I don't think that I think the right, I'm not sure if there would be a movie in it.
Sure.
There could be a documentary, especially would be in it.
But it's complicated with this series going on.
Let me put it that way.
Right, right.
And of course, any movie that was made out of this would have to depart from the traditional Hollywood narrative that space aliens are coming here.
And as you've just said, you've said it a number of times in this conversation, what we have thought were space aliens may be much more complicated than that.
They're not just travelers from another star system.
Well, some of it probably does have to do with aliens, but not all of it by any means.
Gee, it is complicated.
I promised a couple of my listeners that I would ask you questions on their behalf.
There are two.
Gary asks, were you disappointed when Communion became a movie?
Were you disappointed seeing it as a movie?
Well, I'm the author of the book.
Not many authors are happy about the movies made from their books, but it was okay.
Okay.
Well, that's for you, Gary.
And for Allison, Allison says, how have your emotions been affected by all of your experiences with contact, with aliens or whatever, and whether you now feel, as a result of that and after all you've been through, stronger emotionally?
Well, they've been affected in a huge way.
I got a lot of lessons from the very beginning from the visitors.
The first lesson was a very powerful lesson in humility.
And I have learned from them the importance of leading an examined life and living out of love, compassion, and humility.
And that never leaves me for a moment.
I never, that's how I try to live as best I can.
And as far as emotions are concerned, my emotional life is incredibly rich because I have a lot of emotional experiences in my relationship with them that we generally don't have.
In other words, there's a whole new level of emotional experience and having the knowledge that the soul actually does exist and we do persist in some way, it changes everything about the way you live.
You come to care very much about the condition of your soul and your fear of death disappears.
Like my wife, I mean, she wasn't afraid of dying at all.
She was ahead of me in all of this.
And she lived in an incredible state of emotional richness and died in peace.
So, and very consciously.
She was quite conscious.
She died consciously.
I don't want this question to sound really crass at all, but are you in contact with her now, like today?
It's not.
I have a lot of trouble with stuff that they call channeling.
I don't trust my ability to do that.
So when Anne does show up in my life, it has to be pretty overt, and it does not happen often.
She did show up about a week and a half ago.
And in the middle of the night, I suddenly found myself hearing her talking.
And I wrote it all down and put it into a diary entry on unknowncountry.com.
And I can read that diary.
It is really quite beautiful.
Quite a beautiful, lovely thing.
Let me see if I can find it.
Just give me a moment here.
Okay, here it is.
I'll read it.
This is what she said.
Anne is not me, but I am Anne.
We live outside the flow of time and project our consciousness into it in the form of bodies in order to learn and gain new knowledge and to enjoy the experience of the unknown.
I projected Anne.
It is done randomly, except on very rare occasions.
My little one found an extraordinary place in life.
She had quitted herself brilliantly, and now, of all that I am, she is the most precious part.
She has built a bridge of love between me and the one who projected Whitley into the world.
This bridge is eternal.
Well, that is beautiful.
I'm glad you found it.
Yeah, isn't it extraordinary?
That's what she said.
That's the last thing I heard from Anne.
And that kind of says a lot in just a few lines.
Well, it says it talks about life in a completely different and completely new way.
That's not how we think about ourselves on this level at all.
But I think I have a feeling it's true.
And you know what?
I was going to ask you two or three more questions, and I don't think I will now because I don't think we can beat what you've just said.
Whitley, I wish you luck with all of this.
You are a deep thinker.
You're a very hard-working person.
And as I know, and your email inbox tells you every day, you have an awful lot of fans out there because I've been hearing from them today.
So, Whitley, thank you so much.
Thank you.
And I have to apologize for one thing that was very forward of me.
I listened to you speak with Art Bell so many times on the radio.
And he used to just say, we've got to pause it there, Wit.
We've got to get to commercials.
And I called you Wit, which, you know, I apologize for doing that.
And it was just because of those conversations that I heard with you and Art Bell.
You must Miss him.
Oh, I miss him terribly.
He was such a good friend.
We had so much fun together.
When his wife, Mona, was alive, Anne and Mona and Art and I used to pal around together.
We had a hell of a lot of fun.
We really did.
Well, I have very happy memories of listening to you and him on the radio.
That's how I came to learn about you.
And that was 20 years ago or more.
And then in Art's later couple of years, I kind of, at the end of a Skypeline, got to know him.
Not well, but at least I got to speak with him, not on the radio.
And that was good.
And he was an exceptional man, as you say.
Wiggly Striber, thank you so much.
Just remind my listener of the title of the book.
It's a new world.
It should be available on Amazon UK.
And it is available now in paperback and on a Kindle.
And it will be available as an audiobook read by me within probably a week.
Okay.
And the website, if they want to take a look at that for a taster for all of the things that you are and some news about this planet and other planets, then take a look at unknowncountry.com.
Wickly Streeber, thank you so much.
Thank you.
The legendary Wickly Streeber, we will talk again, but your thoughts and views about that conversation will be gratefully received.
Go to the website at theunexplained.tv and you can send me a message from there.
And if you'd like to make a donation for the show as we come to the end of this year, then that, as I say, would be gratefully received.
And thank you if you have done that.
And thank you to Adam for his work on the website.
Okay, more great guests in the pipeline here at The Unexplained.
I think you'll find we've got some really good shows coming up as we come to the end of the year.
So please keep checking back to the website or your usual podcast portal and you'll find them as they appear.
But until next we meet, my name is Howard Hughes.
I am in London.
This has been The Unexplained and please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm.
And above all, please stay in touch.
Thank you very much.
Take care.
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