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Sept. 14, 2019 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes

01:03:47

Edition 411 - Drs J J And Desiree Hurtak

Much-requested guests Drs J J and Desiree Hurtak - consciousness,other dimensions,reality... And how is modern science changing?...

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	Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Return of the Unexplained.
	Well, those hot and steamy days of summer seem to be in the rearview mirror now.
	But who knows, by the time we get to October, we could have a heat wave, an Indian summer here, so all bets remain off, I think.
	But I think we've left behind us now the searing 30-plus degree temperatures that we've had for a large part of the summer.
	And, you know, they've affected a large part of Europe, too.
	I think this was the summer when France got to about 43 or 44 degrees, which I think is well into the hundreds Fahrenheit, which is astonishing in this part of the world at this time of year.
	But winter is now on the horizon.
	We'll see what that brings.
	Thank you very much if you've emailed recently.
	Don't forget when you do email me, tell me who you are, where you are, and how you use the show.
	You can email me through the website, theunexplained.tv, designed and created by Adam from Creative Hotspot in Liverpool, and you can make a guest suggestion or tell me what you think of the show there.
	Go to the website, theunexplained.tv, and when you're there, if you'd like to think about leaving a donation for the show to allow this work to continue, and if you have donated recently, thank you very much indeed.
	We've got about 430 hours of material on the website now, which is astonishing.
	Built up over a total of 13 years and all completely independent.
	Now, the guests on this show, I rather like this too, are people that it's very hard to pigeonhole.
	You know, that life, the world and society attempts to put everybody into a little box.
	So, you know, this person is a journalist and that person is a carpenter.
	Well, Dr. J.J. Hurtak and Dr. Desiree Hertak are described on their own website as social scientists, world explorers and futurists.
	They're founders of the Academy for Future Science, an international non-governmental organization that works to bring cooperation between science and consciousness.
	So it is that confluence of disciplines that interested me.
	You know, the fact that more and more science seems to be, whether it wants to or not, moving towards some of the things that we talk about here on the unexplained routinely.
	So I think that they occupy that frontier.
	But the kinds of things they talk about and have explored include ancient Egypt, the nature of consciousness and time, space law, which I think is one of Dr. J.J. Hertak's fields, which I need to talk with him about, and many, many other things.
	So I think they're going to be fascinating people to speak with, and you've been asking me to get them on this show for the last two or three years.
	So the guests on this edition, Dr. J.J. Hertak and Dr. Desiree Hertak in California, USA.
	Thank you very much, like I say, for your communications.
	Please keep those coming.
	Tell me what you think of the show.
	And don't forget, of course, to check out the official Unexplained Facebook page and let me know what you think about that.
	And if you want to message me, please don't do it through Facebook Messenger.
	Please go to the website, theunexplained.tv and email me through there.
	And then I will get to see your message.
	Okay, Dr. J.J. Hertak and Dr. Desiree Hertak in California.
	Hope they can hear me.
	Thank you very much for coming on my show.
	It's a pleasure.
	We want to bring you up to date regarding research and consciousness and the quantum mind, the fantastic world of discovery we're living in right now and some of our publications.
	Yeah, right.
	And Desiree as well, nice to have you there.
	I know that you're both normally in California, but you're in New York at the moment, yeah?
	Yes, we love New York, but we love California, and we even love London and all over the world.
	We spend a lot of time there, and we go to conferences all the time in London.
	A great place to be.
	Yeah, no, it's my British listeners, I think, mostly who suggested that I get you on, and I found out about you.
	And I thought, yeah, let's do it.
	And you had a gap in your diary, so here we are.
	You seem, both of you, to span two worlds.
	And there are two worlds that seem to be not colliding, but coalescing at the moment.
	Science and what used to be regarded as alternative knowledge and thought, and that is discussions of consciousness, out-of-the-body experiences, NEs, all those sorts of things.
	They seem to be converging.
	And I don't know what you both think about this, in a way that they have not before.
	Right.
	So we're actually the Academy for Future Science.
	So that should give your listeners some sort of idea that we're looking at the future.
	And you're right.
	I mean, science has been very limited in the past, but it's expanding now and expanding in areas of consciousness and an understanding of multi-dimensions, which is something that no one would have heard of.
	In fact, way in the past, actually, I shouldn't say way in the past, but in the 1980s, if you had said to an astrophysicist that there were other planets around suns, they would have said you were nuts.
	And now they've found, you know, millions, practically.
	If you've ever looked at those charts now, they're all over the place.
	In fact, most astrophysicists would say there's at least seven planets around almost every sun we see.
	And there's also what they call rogue planets, which means planets that aren't going around suns.
	So this is why we've called ourselves the Academy for Future Science, because science, in our definition, is science guided by consciousness.
	It's not science of Roger Bacon and the old paradigms where you have to have replication on a statistical basis.
	But we're looking at the greater impact of consciousness studies that have been looked at very carefully by some of the best minds on our planet, including those at Stanford Research Institute, where we have worked with Russell Tarr, Carol Pudoff, and a famous female physicist by the name of Elizabeth Rauscher.
	Stanford did a lot of research on things like remote viewing and those sorts of things.
	I know Uri Geller did some research there, didn't he, or was part of some research there.
	Is that the kind of thing that you've both been doing?
	Yes, and of course, Uri is a good friend.
	We respect him.
	We work with him in the past, and we really feel he's an accurate guy.
	He knows how to bend a fork and spoon.
	He can fix a watch, and he seems to have a higher connection in a general sense.
	But yes, Russell Targ recently released the data of Uri Geller at Stanford Research Institute.
	I think you can even find this on the internet, where sealed Envelopes, he was able to draw what was inside before anyone even in the room knew what was there.
	So he's an amazing character.
	Elizabeth Rauscher did similar things, and that was the work also with Ingo Swan and Pat Price, who even did military investigations from remote viewing.
	We published this in a new book called Mind Dynamics in Space and Time, a physicist exploration of the nature and properties of consciousness.
	So that you can order from our Academy for Future Science here in the United States or through Amazon.
	It's really the real X-Files, all of the $20 million the U.S. government spent looking at the powers of the mind that can travel around the world, can see through space, time relationships, and come up with unbelievable diagnosis of subjects if the person has proper education of consciousness elevation.
	I can say one of the most interesting things was actually during the time of our president Jimmy Carter, who was a really nice guy.
	And someone asked him, what was strange, anything strange happened during your administration?
	He goes, well, there was one thing.
	There was like a Russian airplane that the guy was defecting, and he only made it as far as Africa.
	And I guess the guy jumped out, but the plane kept going a little bit longer.
	And we needed, the U.S. government, that is, needed to find the jet before the Russians found it because we wanted the whole data and the black box and whatever else we could get from it.
	So they actually asked psychics connected with this SRI team in California.
	And the data came back exactly where to go where there's a river and, you know.
	The longitudinal and latitudinal matrix.
	And of course, the Americans were there on the spot to recover the black box and all of the code systems.
	This is just a small illustration that Jimmy Carter, our president, accidentally released a newscast.
	So we were able to find it before the Russians, who had no information either.
	I mean, satellites at that time, I think it was in the 60s, you know, didn't have that kind of data.
	Both of you, the United States, didn't it say in the 1990s it discontinued its remote viewing research?
	It's not being done now.
	Do you think that's wrong?
	It was done because of other situations, apparently in priorities of the paraphysical field of investigation, but it was still continued indirectly.
	And you might say that our work that was done in the 70s, 80s, and 90s is a continuation of some of that, where we worked with Andrei Puharich, who was a noted physicist, consultant with the U.S. Army, looking at archaeological targets.
	And so the shift has been away from military targets to areas of social science, archaeology, and even remote healing or distant healing.
	And I have to say that one event regarding the plane, it wasn't like a government person.
	I mean, she wasn't like military or working within the government.
	There was payments to these studies done by the CIA and other places like that.
	And so it was easy to call these people up and say, what do you see?
	But, you know, a lot of this did go black budget for a long time.
	And I think maybe at a certain point that stopped, hopefully because of, you know, some of the Cold War kind of ended in the 90s and there wasn't the need.
	Who knows what's going on now?
	I mean, you really know.
	I don't know whether you both know Major Ed Dames.
	I've known him for 20 years.
	What do you think of his work?
	Well, we like Ed.
	Actually, we do know him as well.
	He's a great guy.
	We don't always think he came up with the kill shock.
	He's a little bit more dramatic, I think, than most of the traditional remote viewers.
	We do think the planet's in trouble when you look at the climate situation that's going on all over the world.
	You know, people right now, and I know I don't want to date it, are having problems with Brazil, but there's also Bolivia, there's Africa, there's Siberia, and in the past, there was also Canada.
	So, and the southwest of our country is a real major Tinderbox as well.
	So, you know, he's right in terms of the fact that there's a lot of energy building in the wrong direction climate-wise on this planet and environmentally.
	I mean, as you say, is the kill shot.
	Yeah.
	Well, the kill shot, we do feel the planet is going into an odd place in space.
	Whether we get that kill shock that he's talked about, you know, we don't want to go there.
	We do feel that even just going into different areas of space, because the planet is constantly going through this helical orbit, if some of you have seen that throughout space, that in actuality, certain areas of space will throw our climate into imbalance.
	And we think that's probably bad enough.
	But one of the locations that Dames mentions in his Kill Shop documentary was an area off the coast of Yucatan where Canadian, Cuban, and American underwater divers found underwater ruins suggesting that at one point that area was above the sea level that sunk suddenly.
	So he's accurate in some of the geological locations he refers to in that documentary.
	And of course, he said for many years, for as long as I've been talking with him about this, and that is probably most of the 20 years that I've known him, he's always said that there are going to be precursor events and that we needed to look for the precursor events before, if the killshot happens, before the killshot occurs.
	Exactly right.
	This is what is called predetermined statistical distribution of quantum processes or evaluations of future events before they happen.
	And so we've been able to work also with Russell Targ and Harold Pudoff.
	And Russell has just released a movie called Third Eye Spies.
	You can see it on Amazon Prime.
	Which goes into all of these very interesting curvatures of how the human mind can, under certain circumstances, see things around the corner or actually see several days in advance of quantum changes.
	In fact, Russell's work right now is to try to see how far really in advance can precognition work.
	And we've actually had experiences of up to six to nine months in advance where things have been seen.
	Now, of course, Ed is predicting way into the future.
	But the question is, and this is brought up also with our work with Elizabeth Rauscher, is can we make a change?
	Can there be some change of reality?
	And we believe consciousness can make a change, even though time is like a river, especially when you work in the eighth dimension.
	So that's going beyond the fourth dimension, which Einstein called time, that we actually have the ability to change those realities.
	Now, most people Don't bother.
	Most people don't have their higher sense going and can make a difference.
	But collectively, as a conscious species, you know, we could create something to neutralize some of these problems.
	I mean, we can even do that with the environment.
	You know, how do we neutralize problems by our own understanding of them?
	All right.
	I watched a video today of you both where you said a lot of these things and you said that it is possible perhaps to see more clearly in the near term than it is to see in the long term.
	I think a lot of people will be surprised though that they might accept that you can see and you can see clearly in the near term.
	I think they'd be very surprised to know that you could actually get the key to unlocking change.
	So if something bad is coming down the track, actually you can engineer it so that it doesn't or it happens in a different way.
	Well, this is the idealistic overview that you're presenting, that there is new neuropsychological and physiological information suggesting that this happens outside the circuitry of the brain, that we are connected with an information process of a global mind.
	And what we're doing is tapping into this global mind as individuals who have the psychic or consciousness ability and pulling forth data that gives us insights, possibly even several weeks ahead of the event, suggesting that there are several alternatives that we as humans can be part of.
	Right, and this goes back to some of the work of Stuart Hameroff and Rogers Penrose, who I believe is British, that, you know, they say that interesting thing is that consciousness does not necessarily originate in the brain.
	And this is a moving view.
	One of the people who came to Stuart's annual conference is Deepak Chopra, and he clearly sees in this direction as well, that consciousness is really more of a field, and we are biotransducers receiving the information of consciousness.
	Now, if you're, you know, like negative thoughts, you'll pick up on negative thoughts.
	If you want positive solutions, you can pick up on positive solutions.
	We actually do live in Silicon Valley, and we've worked with scientists who amazingly get these ideas in their brains.
	They don't know where from, that give them solutions to major problems.
	So we just have to be open and we have to be able to implement them.
	I mean, we feel that there's good energy technologies that have never been implemented, even though the ideas are there.
	So it's a matter of making that difference.
	So there is this concept.
	It may sound crazy, but it is a possibility.
	I know that in my own life, for example, and this is maybe trivial, but it's the only experience that I've got.
	Most of the things that I have sincerely and dearly wanted, even if they seemed unlikely to achieve, they have come my way.
	And I'm talking achievement things, material things.
	I've had to do a bit of work towards them.
	Of course I have.
	But if I've been sincere in my desire for them, then somehow fate molds itself into making those things happen.
	So what you're talking about is not as crazy as some people might assume.
	No, in fact, the American Brit, my good friend there, Lynn McTaggart, talks a lot about intention.
	And really, you have to have the intention.
	I think you do, Howard.
	You know, you have the intention of what you see, what you want, how you can get there, you know, some practical realities.
	Because if you don't put that into motion in your mind, you're not calling forth, if I can put it that way, the reality of how you can move into that scenario.
	And many people, if nothing else, are finding synchronicities in their lives right now.
	And to some people, it amazes them.
	You know, they go into a building and they see a friend.
	I was just actually at a store.
	I hadn't gone the whole month I've been here in New York.
	And I was checking out.
	It was Whole Foods, if people know that store.
	And I saw my girlfriend that I was supposed to be seeing and I totally forgot about.
	So, I mean, these things just synchronicity happen.
	She had only been there like, she doesn't go that often either.
	She's a European, and here's a big city of New York.
	Yeah.
	So, I mean, it's like you need to be aware.
	You need to listen, I often say, to that still small voice.
	And as Lynn says, you need to have a bit of that intention.
	And it should be a pure positive intention.
	It shouldn't be negative thoughts.
	But there is a problem with this, isn't there, Desiree?
	And the problem is this.
	That if everybody, most people on this planet want the best for themselves and the people around them.
	There are very few truly evil people, although I believe there are some.
	So if that is the case, if everybody's moving towards good things and programming with their minds that way, how come more good things don't happen?
	And how come bad things do happen?
	Well, we feel in nature, there's a drive towards also self-will, the individual being on top of the collective.
	And that just seems to be the nature of this planet.
	Now, we can talk about other levels of intelligence because what I was saying, in addition to the local consciousness field, we feel there's a cosmic consciousness field.
	So in that cosmic consciousness field are also other thoughts and other realities.
	And if you're into power games, you'll attract that energy.
	Exactly.
	We are sort of in an interplay between micro and macro structures, the individual consciousness with a small C and the macro with a large C of the global mind.
	And often sometimes the disruptions of the sociological, the political, and the economic interfere with the way the mind constructs its reality game.
	Often unfair competition or immature personalities get in the way of a whole construct, and so that can cascade into negative events.
	So you're saying that if the negative personality that you've hinted at there has a really strong will, then they can affect the train of events.
	Yeah, we all have free will.
	We all have choices that we make literally moment by moment.
	And so we really need as a collective whole, and I think young people are starting to see this, to not be in fear as much and not to seek individual power as to seek a collective good.
	And this is really what we'll say the ancient sages, religious teachers have talked about, because otherwise we end up in this individual consciousness mindset that only looks for ourselves.
	And therefore, you bring chaos into the system.
	Now, you were saying that consciousness, and a lot of people are coming to this view, is not just something that is a Construct of our brain within us, all of us individually, but is something broader than that.
	And I had this picture as you were talking about that in my mind, and I thought of a San Francisco cable car.
	And, you know, you're born into this world, you are the cable car, and you connect to the power lines that give it the power to move.
	That then is consciousness, is it?
	Yes, that's a conscious, well, I'll call it a vehicle of consciousness because we're not limited to the cable car of the mental construct or mental picture, but all vehicles of motion essentially can be used.
	This has been the quandary of the traditional areas of psychology and neurophysiology.
	Is consciousness within the wetware of the brain or is it somehow spatialized in what some would call the lightwear of the global mind?
	In other words, all of our mental thoughts, our flickers, our, shall we say, our fiery mechanisms are all interconnected in a liquid brain process.
	So I like what you said because if we are the cable car, our brain is the cable car, everything we see around us, we're taking in.
	And, you know, we may prefer the cute girl on the street, so we'll bring her into our brain versus the, you know, little kid or something like that.
	So this is really how our brain works.
	And in fact, what's really even more profound is the Hawaiians, some of their ancient tradition, and they lived on a very small island, said that anything and everyone you come in contact with is really also part of what you're attracting to yourself.
	When you talk about intention, you're attracting that.
	Even if you bump into someone on the street, even if, I hate to say it, if someone robs you on a negative level, you know, that maybe you needed to help that person out in that way, or in some cases needed to, maybe the police later on find the situation and get it back to you.
	And they found him and you've like put parts of the energy into that to stop this person from doing it.
	So it's amazing how we are empowered.
	And I think that's something that the planet doesn't really tell us.
	We are empowered to make the right choices.
	If we want to.
	I can remember, listen, I very much resonate with what you're saying, even if it will sound to some of my listeners unlikely.
	I do resonate.
	Back in the 1980s, my sister lived in London, and I was still in Liverpool growing up.
	My big sister was down in London.
	And now, of course, I'm in London and she's not in London.
	But she used to do all the cool stuff and get involved in all sorts of things.
	I remember her once being into mind control.
	Now, I'm not talking about the sinister, you know, MK Ultra style mind control.
	I'm talking about trying to influence events to your good and to other people's good.
	And I remember there was this book about one particular method of controlling your thoughts and making things happen for you.
	And she bought me a copy of the book.
	And she went on all the courses and spent all the money learning the thing.
	And it worked to an extent for her.
	I just read the book and tried it out.
	And I didn't take it very seriously.
	And things really did, and I swear that this is the case, really did begin to move and change.
	What held it back for me, though, and I suspect this is the problem with the human condition, Desiree, is the problem is we entertain doubt.
	And once you entertain doubt in a thing, then you negate it, I think.
	Now, look, that sounds like I'm preaching here, but that's just my experience of the power of the mind.
	You know, you mentioned Uri Gella.
	I've known Uri Gella for 20 years, and every time we speak, that is one of the main themes that he wants to talk about.
	How powerful is your mind?
	I was going to bring up Uri, because one of the things he says when you want to bend and fork a spoon, and people do this all over the world now because of him, he says, bend, bend, bend.
	You're putting your energy into that or, you know, or start working in terms of the watch.
	So you have to put your energy into it.
	Now, the key thing is, do you do it for negative or positive reasons?
	I think the BBC did a great television documentary on Uri where he was even working, we'll say, against the Russian forces where they were carrying briefcases and he was erasing things in their briefcases or he was even thinking into the mind.
	Yes, he's told me that story, yes, yeah.
	Yeah, certain things.
	Even he, one of the things he refused to do because he thought it would maybe eventually lead to harming people.
	But, you know, you test people out on various levels.
	So we all are tested, I think, every day as to how we're going to use our energy.
	Do we use it to help the kid on the street with the dime of the nickel that they want or whatever we can do in our personal lives, helping the ecology?
	Do we throw things into the garbage or do we separate it into different things?
	It's all part of who we are, every choice we make.
	Really, what's interesting, and I'll just go one more step further on this, it seems to be recorded in a certain type of energy.
	And if you've talked to anybody like Eminem Alexander from Harvard University.
	Yeah, who had the near-death experience, he said, and many others like Daniel Brinkley, that when you die, actually, the entire life review is brought before you.
	And not only from your perspective, like, oh, I know why I did that, but from the other person's perspective.
	So if you, you know, say something bad to your spouse or to your kid, you know, you feel what they felt at the time of your life review.
	And you have to bring into balance any of the uncaring, less than thoughtful acts, maybe even cruel acts that you've participated in during your life.
	You're going to feel them, they say, at that stage as you review your own life, as you pass from this state to whatever comes next.
	That's right.
	And this is why this time is so exciting with these new discoveries and science that are moving us more towards the consciousness side of our evolutionary process.
	We have these gifts of mental remote viewing, remote mind extension, of communication, remote healing.
	All of these powers that were historically called by the mystics the power of a spirit or a divine spirit are now bringing science and what we will call spiritual or consciousness philosophy closer together.
	So the exoteric and the esoteric are combining to those levels of positive investigation.
	And hopefully we can incubate a whole new approach to the problems of Mother Earth.
	But JJ, the problem with all of that is, isn't it, that because these things are by Definition in the truest sense of the word, they are nebulous.
	They're out there, they're floating, they're not fixed, they're not concrete, they're hard to access.
	Some days you might be able to access them, you know, you might have good luck on one particular day, and the next day, for reasons that you can't work out, your luck is not as good.
	Um, it's it's similar to that, isn't it?
	Until you're able to, I mean, look, it's quite hot where I'm recording this.
	I've just opened a can of Diet Pepsi.
	Now, if these things can be reduced to the level of simplicity of opening a can of Pepsi, then people will be able to understand and to use them.
	The problem is at the moment, it is so nebulous, it's hard for people to understand.
	Well, we are still growing into the science of understanding, and there's some research even with the brain that we're not just working in our neurons with chemistry, but also with light energy, and we would throw in with consciousness energy.
	And there's a blue brain project down in Switzerland that says that our brain is even functioning on multi-dimensions.
	But what I wanted to bring out with the can of soda is we were good friends with Dr. Emoto from Japan, and he showed the water molecule.
	And he's, you know, our body is like 65, 70 percent of water, depending on our age.
	And if you put positive thoughts into our bodies, we're actually really enhancing the water.
	You can see the beauty in the water.
	And I think it actually comes to even healing ourselves.
	And a lot of people like to say, well, if you have cancer, it's because you have this kind of consciousness or that kind of consciousness.
	But in a sense, some of that is right.
	If we're constantly bringing in the negativity, we're actually really affecting our entire system.
	And we know now that our DNA is constantly going through changes, and there's a huge system of repair in our body every day.
	So if we put positive thoughts towards the repair, towards the energy in our system, we're actually healing our bodies.
	That doesn't mean everyone's going to be perfectly well, but it does help.
	We were just at a conference in Switzerland, an interlocking on the science of consciousness, and all of these great minds, including Sir Roger Penbrose and others from most of the countries of the world, began to reorganize the blueprint of evolution around consciousness expansion.
	So what was forbidden science 20 years ago is now becoming more and more acceptable.
	We're pushing the envelope towards realizing we're all connected through consciousness.
	And if we can build upon this as a model, this can affect the spin-offs in sociology, psychology, and even political science.
	So if we can go back for a minute to remote viewing, what that really means, you know, I could be sitting here and I wonder where my husband is.
	Okay.
	I mean, of course, he's next to me now, but say I'm wondering.
	If you remote view, you can actually see where he is.
	You can actually tell where he is.
	You can tune into that.
	That's what they showed at Stanford Research Institute.
	And Desiree, can you do it?
	Because I've tried.
	I've had experiences where I have perceived things in locations where I am not resident, but I can't do it systematically.
	Can you?
	Well, we developed it.
	Elizabeth Rauscher was great.
	We worked with her mainly.
	We were the outbound target, and she was the one that was writing where we were.
	But I say, even with your cell phone, before you pick it up when it's ringing, think of who it is.
	And that starts developing your consciousness.
	Most of the time, Rupert Childreck's great at doing the research on this.
	Especially with families, you can almost always tell when your family member is calling.
	And we have many friends where I may say, oh, it's too late to call him.
	And all of a sudden, within one minute, he calls.
	I was visualizing James Wales with you in a studio just a few minutes before I picked up the phone to talk to you.
	Now, isn't that strange?
	Because, you know, James Wales a great British broadcaster.
	And, you know, he's been around for many, many years.
	And I've known him for many, many years.
	And on Friday night, and today is Wednesday, but on last Friday night, I actually had to do the program on radio that followed him.
	And we had a nice chat both on and off air.
	So it's strange that you visualized him.
	Right.
	And I'm just saying this in a nice way.
	We connect also with many physicists and people involved in the space program.
	We had the opportunity to work with Astron Mitchell, who arranged for two studies when he was in outer space with two human targets in the United States, where he could send symbols and even some mathematical number series to these two American subjects and showed, to the chagrin of NASA, that one can communicate from outer space without technology.
	So this is a whole new, shall we say, dynamic that's influencing the other disciplines of science, education, medicine.
	We are moving very rapidly into an awareness that we are multidimensional human beings waking up in a vast and awesome universe.
	And yet and yet and yet, both of you, I will try experiments sometimes for a laugh on radio, just as a light-hearted thing.
	And I will perhaps hold an image in my hand or I'll hold an object in my hand and I will ask my radio listener, okay, if all of this stuff is so, do you know what this is?
	And usually we have very, very low results.
	We have one or two people who might be quite close maybe to it.
	And most of the other people getting in touch are nowhere near.
	So how come that is so?
	Well, you do have to develop it.
	That's what I said.
	Some people are a little bit more natural with it.
	But even with Russell and the SRI group with Hal Pudoff, they found a few good people.
	It's certain, you know, it's interesting.
	Pat Price would actually put on his glasses to remote view.
	Of course, he's not seeing anything locally, but that was just the way he did it.
	Uri Geller makes a little television screen in his head.
	So you all have to develop, you know, the best ways to do this.
	We do have a friend, Alan Steinfeld, who has done several times on air, so to speak, with Russell Targ and has gotten it right.
	So even the airways, I mean, it does come across, you just have to be sensitive enough to do that kind of thing.
	I want to mention, though, when we get into consciousness realities, Dr. Kirchak said we lived in a vast and awesome universe.
	I want to emphasize a little bit more that the fact is that we are not alone in this universe, that there are other thought forms coming into our reality.
	Some of them can be extraterrestrial, and some of them can be beyond that.
	We will call them ultraterrestrial.
	So we don't live into this just ourselves reality.
	And I think that's important also when we talk about consciousness, how vast the reality of a universal mind really is.
	And are some of these entities, If you want to call them that, are they able to interfere with our consciousness?
	Well, on some levels, yes.
	And some levels, there seems to be a universal law that other evolutionary systems in the universe do not interfere with planetary societies.
	But we do have good evidence, declassified evidence from military sources, that several mishaps with Russian and American missiles were deflected by what we call the extraterrestrial friends or powers that were able to put certain vibratory systems on these breakaway objects.
	And in short, we are being trained, I believe, at this time to bootstrap a consciousness that will lead to an awareness that we are ready to graduate as planetary citizens into the fastness of the cosmos.
	When this happens, in our logic, we will shift from humankind to what I call space kind, K-I-N-D, with unbelievable powers of the mind that these cosmic friends seem to now have and use.
	But I personally think some of the precognition that I have, actually, and we're not into channeling, that's a whole different reality, but basically come from those in higher spaces that want to give insights to people.
	So Ed Dames, you know, where does he get that?
	He remote views into that future reality.
	Is it just Ed Dames remote viewing there, or is there some energies that are also trying to direct him to be aware of certain circumstances?
	We believe actually the latter helps in many cases, especially when you're talking about future scenarios.
	Well, listen, I have to be, and my training is in hard news here.
	That's my background.
	And so I have to be a professional skeptic.
	I have to stand in the middle.
	But I have to tell you that in the last couple of years, and one of these things was very recent, I've actually been in a situation where life has not been great, circumstances have changed, and I have asked for a miracle.
	I've just asked whatever is out there.
	I don't know what to do next.
	You've got to bring me a miracle.
	And on both of those occasions, one of them happened six years ago, one of them happened in July, I have been delivered a miracle not two weeks from now, two months from now, but like half an hour from now.
	And, you know, I am convinced, but then some of my listeners will be saying, well, you're just a big silly fool, Howard, aren't you?
	And very gullible.
	I am convinced that somehow, in my own naive way, I was able to access something, but I'm not sure what.
	What do you think of that?
	Well, what a miracle is, in a certain sense, is you're open to positive change.
	That's really what it is.
	And, you know, you probably couldn't even have thought, you know, we talked about intention and that's a positive thing, but you probably couldn't even have thought what that miracle could be.
	So when you say I'm open to a miracle, you're open to anything that's positive happening in your life, things that were beyond your own norm.
	Now, we feel we actually do extend a bit into, as I was mentioning with the Blue Brain Project, the eighth dimension.
	And there's realities out there.
	Roger Pedros talks about this as Stuart Hameroff.
	There's all these possibilities out there in cosmic space.
	And we orchestrate one usually coming to us.
	That's what our thoughts are on a moment-by-moment basis.
	We're constantly having the myriads.
	This is quantum physics as well.
	Myriads of possibilities out there.
	We choose one of those.
	In a sense, your miracle was saying, choose for me or give me the best of those possibilities.
	And I'm open to that.
	And I think these things do happen to everybody if we're open.
	We have to be open, though.
	Yeah, and I think it involves this clearing of the decks that I think we hinted at before.
	I mean, look, this is just me, you know, shooting ideas out there.
	And these are things that are based on the reality of my life.
	That's why I'm doing this show.
	But at the stage where I asked for the miracle, I had no ideas of my own.
	And I was willing to put the thought out there and then forget all about it, which I think is essential.
	You mustn't worry the thought.
	So that is exactly what I did on both occasions.
	And I can tell you that on both occasions, I got emails six years ago and last month, July, it's August as we record this, the end of August.
	On both occasions, I got emails that answered my dilemma.
	Now, either that's just incredible coincidence, which it may well be, or as I suspect, there may well be something else at work.
	And what I thought on both of those occasions is if I could systematically tap into that, if I could do it scientifically, if I could do it repeatedly, then I'd be king of the world.
	Well, this is called synchronicity and simultaneous broadcasting, that you're linked up with the events that come through in a marvelous way.
	It's hard for the average person to accept the possibility that miracles can happen.
	But, you know, everything in life, the human heartbeat, is a miracle.
	We're living in a stream of consciousness, which allows us to draw more information through the filters of the mind once we put a positive vibration forward.
	People ask me, what's the difference between those that you work with who have these gifts of parapsychology, paraphysical, remote sensing abilities from the average person?
	I said it's the positive thinking.
	They have decided to be part of that 2% of humanity that desires to always think positively under all circumstances and thus negate the undertoll or the negative spiral that invariably comes into consciousness under most circumstances.
	And I would just say, the interesting thing is, was all that possibility just waiting for you to be open to receive the miracle?
	And many people, you know, that's more of a spiritual side to things that it was waiting for you to ask.
	Well, I think it was part of the chain, wasn't it?
	Because in both of those cases, and they were to do with work situations, it was when one thing came to an end and I had to be open to something else coming along.
	And I think my fear, and this goes for so many people in this day and age, but it was my fear, our fear, that kept me trapped in doing something that was probably past itself by date, wasn't good for me.
	And when it ended, it was a good thing.
	That's when I asked for my miracle on both occasions.
	And that's when I think I got it.
	Makes sense.
	Also with miracles, the thing is that it happens also when you're willing to reach out to help others to move into a greater.
	I'll say uncensored.
	you said you're in mainstream media, which is great, but you know, a lot of this could never be said on mainstream media.
	Talk to Rupert Sheldrake if you want to know more about that, and I'm sure you have.
	But the bottom line is that you're willing to help a greater wisdom being brought to humanity.
	And so as soon as you're open to doing that, things do fall into reality, and you had to be open first.
	And I think we have to just note the trivial times when these things maybe happen in our lives.
	A few nights ago, a producer of mine, a friend of mine, Haley, was booked to go on a plane.
	And there was an industrial dispute threatening to have that flight canceled and ruin her holiday.
	And this was, we'd finished a radio show.
	It was one o'clock in the morning.
	It was after one o'clock in the morning.
	And I was completely calm about that situation.
	She was a little worried about it.
	And I just said, Haley, it's okay.
	You're going to be told that the flight is going to go.
	It'll be fine.
	And I told her later, she emailed me.
	I think it was the next morning.
	And I said, Haley, I just, I get this feeling.
	It's going to be all right.
	The next day, she emails me to say, they've told me the plane is going.
	It's all okay.
	Fantastic.
	Well, you know, all of us can do this.
	I don't know what book you read in the 60s or 70s.
	Well, I can tell, I don't think it's a state secret.
	It actually was, and I had these people on my radio show years ago.
	It was a book that used to be, probably still is, very popular in America, and to some extent in this country, the Silver Mind Control Method, S-I-L-V-A.
	You might have heard of it.
	Yes, actually, a friend of ours in Poland is the main spokesperson for that.
	And so we're very familiar.
	Well, I've got to say, just in the interests of my journalistic integrity here, I'm not here to sell that.
	What happened to me may have been a coincidence.
	But I have to say that my sister took the courses that she paid for.
	And the way that they do it is, well, the way that they did it back then is that you take the courses, you pay for them, and you can repeat them without paying, you know, ad infinitum in the end if you need to do it again.
	But I just got the book.
	I got the book.
	I read the book and I tried it out.
	That's all I did.
	Well, the whole idea is training your mind.
	And if someone often asks us, well, where can we be trained in remote viewing?
	Well, I'll tell you, the key to remote viewing is you need to clear your mind.
	That's why I like that miracle idea.
	You clear your mind and then you be careful that you're not putting in some physical things like you're trying to be too logical.
	So you completely clear your mind.
	It's got to be empty.
	It's got to be without preconception.
	And I think that is the difficulty.
	And it's certainly the difficulty for me.
	I know people who are enormously positive.
	And sometimes people like that can be a little annoying sometimes because they're so relentlessly positive.
	And you think, how can you be that positive?
	I've got to say that I'm one of those people.
	And partly because I work in a creative industry, I have ups and downs.
	So I cannot be relentlessly positive about stuff.
	It is just an impossibility.
	I try to be as positive as I can be.
	And I think if you were to cut me open, you'd find inside, you know, the substratum running right the way through me is positivity.
	But like most people in humanity, I have negative times.
	Right.
	I think meditation is a key thing.
	And what I think meditation teaches you is to not necessarily go too far into the, oh, everything's great and everything is negative, but keep that balance because the world is duality.
	So you're always going to have the ups and downs.
	Remember the old biorhythms things?
	You could do the little chart and it said like today's going to be positive, tomorrow's going to be negative, you know, so you like watch for that.
	But that's the planet.
	The planet is going into positive.
	You'll never have, I mean, maybe people are always positive, some of your friends, but there will always be downsides that they can ignore if they want to, but there's still downsides.
	We're in a world of duality.
	So it's important to have that meditative state, that clearing of the mind.
	That's the healing also of the body, because you're bringing in a peacefulness, an energy that is really positive, and it allows you to see more clearly other realities.
	Okay, now we've said very crucially, very importantly, perhaps the most important thing we've said in this conversation, and this conversation is only really by way of introduction to you both after all these years of wanting to know about you.
	Now I do.
	The difficulty of what is consciousness?
	How do you define consciousness?
	If we accept, and some scientists are coming to that view, a lot of people, including myself, are coming to that view, that consciousness is something external to us that we plug into and that survives beyond our physical life, then what is it?
	Is it an electrical force?
	Is it something that exists in that eighth dimension?
	What do you believe at the moment is consciousness?
	Well, a lot of scientists have said consciousness is simply the flow of sodium ions or the electrification of the chemical matrix within our wetware.
	We see consciousness, though, as a primal force out of which both the material universe comes as well as the mental.
	It's a consciousness with a capital C. It is the field of operation for all life.
	And that is difficult to grasp without expanding one's view of the universe and seeing that we are just, shall we say, human participants in orchestration of life on many levels.
	When you say it's the field of operation of all life, you lost me slightly.
	Well, in a certain sense, and Dr. Tech's written some, he had a book called The Book of Knowledge, The Keys of Enoch, and now in recent times, he's been coming out with once a year additional keys to that.
	One aspect to it all is the fact that even the mathematics, like the Fibonacci series that you see in plants and in the spiral of nature, is all part of a consciousness force of nature.
	So consciousness is the primal force manifestation into either the eighth dimension or the third or the fourth dimension is all from that consciousness field.
	So it's far out for many people, but I think we're moving into that direction and we're starting to play with consciousness.
	That's what remote viewing is.
	We're playing with the consciousness field and we're starting to realize it really does exist.
	So does this definition of consciousness mean that when we cease to live our, well, they used to say three score years and 10, that doesn't really compute these days because people live 80, 90, 100 and plus, and they're going to be living even longer.
	But once we've lived out our physical time here, does that mean that the consciousness that I now think that I'm tapping into and that part of consciousness which is me will continue?
	Yes, and in our research, if consciousness prepares itself for a life extension, somehow the vibratory nature continues.
	Years ago, I was part of a think tank called the Center for Democratic Institutions with Robert Hodgins, a great scholar from the University of Chicago.
	And one of the questions that these scholars entertained was the fact, does consciousness survive the mortal existence or does it not?
	Are the Eastern philosophers from India, China, and ancient areas of the Far East correct in saying that there's a vibratory pattern of life that continues even though we're not in the physical form?
	And our research has suggested, in dialogue with those who've gone beyond the physical state, that some form of consciousness does survive for those who are mentally and artistically able to construct a consciousness vehicle that continues.
	Right, so we feel we actually become part of the consciousness field.
	Now, the Easterners, the Eastern philosophers, say you become into the consciousness field, so like you lose your individuality.
	But we don't believe that.
	If you look at Proof of Heaven, Eben Alexander, you can see that there's other experiences, other layers, other levels that we actually move into.
	In fact, Dr. Hirtak says there's very little difference between being here and being on some of those other levels.
	It's almost like a quick transition.
	Although we emphasize that it's important to be here now.
	And that's something, of course, Ram Das said in the 60s, if you remember those books, because we are here for a purpose, and we need to fulfill that purpose while we're here.
	If we jump too quickly into other realities, we'll just be thrown back here instead.
	Is that what a lot of people over here call mindfulness?
	That's right.
	That's a great term, yes.
	But yes, but we feel when we go into those other levels, we're individuals in a certain sense in that reality.
	So we can construct our reality with different levels of consciousness recall or consciousness memory.
	We can actually create a data plane, DATA plane, an information level that can guide us onto other levels of mental organization and creativity.
	It seems that the whole process of life is to co-create and to understand that we are part of a much larger picture of evolution.
	Does any of that hint that when I cease to be alive here, when you cease to be alive here, that we're coming back?
	I would suggest that there is a new school of thought that suggests some of the consciousness can be recycled or does recycle itself.
	But this is what I would call a slippery slope view of reality.
	What we have here, Howard, are great minds at Stanford University, Stanford Research Institute, various think tanks in Europe that are now accepting the fact that consciousness is the next phase of our evolutionary maturity and that somehow in the future, a lot of these unknown questions or abstract questions will be answered as we become collectively more mature and connected.
	Right, and we have a book called Over Self-Awakening, which maybe we can hold for another program with you if that works, because it shows that actually we're just one manifestation of who we really are being on this planet.
	So when you say, you know, do you leave here and go somewhere else?
	We're already, you know, we'll say non-local beings.
	We're just kind of mentally stuck here.
	And so the idea is let's go into that non-locality and be wherever we need to be and be here as well.
	And the where we need to be, does that include other planets?
	It can be, but it can also be other dimensions, other realities.
	I was involved with research back in the 70s.
	We call them remote viewing of actually seeing artifacts on our sister planet Mars, which I then published.
	I believe I was the first to do this in 1973.
	And as a result, I was shown pictures by some of my colleagues at NASA of the actual pyramids that were found in the Elysium quadrangle on the Martian surface.
	So this was quite a stir.
	You say that friends at NASA showed you things that may be structures on Mars.
	That was from the Mariner 9 probe that took place in 1971.
	And so I was able to see this through remote viewing without the use of technology two years before it was validated.
	Right.
	Okay.
	And what do you think at the moment with so many people?
	I mean, I pick up the newspapers here.
	A couple of times a week, there'll be a story about, I don't know, supermarket trolley or actually the most recent one was mother and child viewed on Mars.
	And if you looked, but, you know, I tend to think that these things are often the effects of pareidolia.
	But if you looked at these things, there was what appeared to be a woman in a cloak and a child on a nearby rock on the surface of Mars.
	But, you know, some of these things may be just trivial.
	They may be just things that we assume we see.
	But being real and serious, do you think that there was a previous civilization and the artifacts and broken remains of that civilization are extant on Mars now?
	Yes, I work with a British journalist by the name of Bill Payne.
	We actually published some of this material on Good Morning Australia back in the early 80s, actual declassified pictures.
	Again, I know there's a little bit of jesting that some commentators would have.
	You know, if you eat a good meal, you're going to see elephants in the sky.
	But Sirius talk does show that we will eventually see, with more declassified information coming out here in the 21st century, the evidences that there were life forms on our sister planets when there were different atmospheres.
	And when we see pictures that are beamed back by NASA from Mars, and we're discovering more all the time about it, and maybe there'll be a revelation one day that there is some form of life there right now.
	But when we see the pictures on some, I don't know how you feel about this, and maybe I'm just crazy, but I look at the pictures, and sometimes I'll take a look at the rubble lying there, and I will think that looks less than random.
	But there's a general feel sometimes about those images that there is something waiting to be discovered there.
	You know, a long time ago, actually, there was more water on Mars than there is on this planet.
	So Mars has gone through a lot of changes.
	It's actually lost its atmosphere, which was the main problem.
	So we do believe, in fact, we've worked with the Zulu shaman Credo Mutua.
	We have a video out called Voice of Africa from him.
	And he talks about that his ancestry, they claim, came from Mars in what was called Merakaiba, which is very similar to the Hebrew word Merkabah.
	With all due respect to your listening audience, I would say this subject really is so important to realize that we are moving into a whole new area of a new astronomy, new astrophysics, of recognizing that the building blocks of civilization, of life itself, are not simply localized on Mother Earth.
	It's all throughout the cosmos.
	And we're beginning to realize the culture shock that at one time and other millenniums, millions of years ago even, there were other life evolutions in operation.
	And we're now beginning to see the blueprint of this in our time.
	And of course, if we discover on Mars or Iapetus or wherever we discover evidence that there has been some kind of, quote, civilization there, and I suspect it's going to be a whenever and not an if, but what do I know?
	Then there's the whole issue of how do you break that news to humanity?
	How do you explain that to people?
	Because once that happens, all of the things that we are and all of the things that we look up to here suddenly become less important, don't they?
	Right.
	And this is the whole situation with Good Morning Australia and some of the other news programs that we did back in the 70s and 80s.
	The world was not prepared really for the culture shock of recognizing that there were other evolutionary systems and that they were extrasolar systems probably that came into our system and did probes just like we're beginning to do probes of the moons of Jupiter, Saturn, and beyond.
	Look, you need a psychology, you need a sociology to go with the space science, and that's the missing link that comes to consciousness.
	Consciousness gives us the ability to see the big picture, to connect evolution of microstructure with macrostructure, humanity on this planet with the possibility of cosmic humanity in the greater cosmos.
	And we don't really have a lot of time to go into this, and we'll talk about this another time, but at least I've made my introduction to you now.
	You've done a lot of research on the Great Pyramid of Giza, and we are now coming to understand that there is much more to what we see in Egypt than we understood when I was a kid at school and we were shown photographs of Tutankhamun's tomb.
	You know, there is an awful lot more to that, and we will have to come to understand that perhaps the ancients had greater abilities than we exhibit now.
	Well, we agree.
	We just came out with a book also available, even in Kindle or whatever e-book, called Giza's Industrial Complexes, which with our friend James Brown, who's a contractor builder.
	And when he went and when we've gone, you know, you can see evidence that water was a critical factor.
	And we've for a long time supported hydrogen energy.
	And all you need is literally now Stanford research, I should say Stanford University scientists are looking at salt water and solar energy to create energy technologies, hydrogen gas, that we can use to drive our vehicles, to power our houses.
	We think that the Egyptians had a primitive form of that that they used, and we've shown evidence of it in this book.
	And then, of course, there is the famous Baghdad battery, the idea that perhaps they were using electric power in ancient Baghdad.
	Yes, we have illustrations in a new book of how these similar situations in Baghdad were seen from a much earlier period in Egypt where they used batteries in parallel phase.
	It doesn't take a rocket scientist, actually an 11th grade school person, man usually, but a girl too, could be developing this technology.
	And so it really, it's just a matter of understanding that the ancients really had a greater technology that we're not even using today.
	And we need to do that because we started with environment.
	We need to save the environment.
	I think people have remote viewed the future if we don't use better technology.
	So the Egyptians perfected the saltwater battery.
	And that's the secret to their underground light system that goes way under the Giza Plateau.
	We've been there.
	We're coming out with several documentaries, Howard, on this.
	And again, for your radio audience to the world, if they can pick up a copy of our new book, Giza's Industrial Complex, you'll see unbelievable pictures underground where we've actually mapped out a whole process of how a great civilization was able to tip the scales by using water hydraulics and saltwater batteries.
	And if your audience is a little bit more scientific and want to know about the power of the mind, mind dynamics in space and time, or any of our work, keysofenoch.org, that's our main website, as well as futurescience.org.
	So many things that we have to get to grips with here, and so many things that we have to have more conversations about here.
	You know, the idea that we are not, as people, what we thought we were, we have greater potential.
	Also, the possibility that we are not alone in the cosmos, the almost certainty that we are not alone in the cosmos now.
	And, you know, the idea that the ancients, it wasn't the progression that we think it is, the progression that everything was forward motion and everything gets better and better and better and we are at the apex of all things.
	Actually, we're going to have to come to accept, I suspect at some point quite soon, that we're not and we are just a part of a chain.
	Yes, this is the great dilemma.
	Before World War I, it was thought that Europe was accelerating to the golden age.
	There would be no more wars because intellectual breakthroughs in Britain and Germany and France were so magnificent, and all of a sudden the war comes along and civilization is put back 100 years.
	And even the patent office said, I think it was the turn of the 1900s, said there's no more patents we have at all.
	And that's before quantum physics came about.
	So we have a lot to grow into with consciousness and growing into space because this planet's not going to be around forever feeding us and housing us.
	But it's the harmonic of consciousness, peace and harmony working together.
	What the ancients called Pax et Concordia, peace and harmony without which the fabric of the human mind breaks apart.
	The mental side that is scientific is out of balance with the artistic side, which is in some ways super scientific.
	In the sense, we have to put both sides of the human psyche together, which is why we call ourselves futurist, working with future science, science guided by consciousness.
	That is the key that has been missing.
	That is the key that is the center stage now.
	And that is our work.
	And this is why we're privileged to share this with you as a beacon of light to the world of society.
	And, you know, a lot of things seem to be coming together if you look at things this way.
	And it may not be so, but let's just follow the flow of the train of thought here.
	You've got people like Gerald Salente, who researches economics and the way that the economic system is bullets, bombs, and bankers.
	It's a repeating cycle.
	And he was calling, you know, the first, second time that I interviewed him, for us to understand and embrace art and kindness and all of the things that we've lost.
	You know, so there are moves, I think, in civilization towards beginning to understand that we have greater potential, but we need to learn how to tap into it.
	Otherwise, we are lost.
	Right.
	And young people are actually having their own unique experiences, and then they come to us older people to find out what that really means.
	So I think people are really, the young kids seem to be tapping into that consciousness field.
	There's a theory, we've worked with some Russian scientists that when there's less and less of the magnetic field strength around the planet, which is happening, some of the northern poles are moving into the southern fields and things like that, it seems to open up people's consciousness.
	Now that can lead to chaos or it can lead to a greater awareness.
	And we like to work with that level of greater awareness.
	We call it co-evolution.
	The fact that we can join up our mental efforts, our spiritual energies of the heart, our scientific energies of the higher mind.
	The prospects of unification, of course, are very difficult from one side of the world to the other in terms of the old paradigms.
	But the new breakthroughs in science, art, and music are giving us a realization that we live in a more dynamic energy field of vibrations.
	And if we can take hold of this through humility and open-mindedness, truly some magnificent things can take place.
	One of the things that will surprise you about young people, you know, when I was a kid growing up, there would always be older people who'd say, oh, the young generation, they don't know anything compared with the way that we were.
	And they don't behave like we did.
	They don't dress like we did.
	They're inferior for a whole bunch of reasons.
	But the fact is that the upcoming generation, a lot of them, not all of them, seem to be aware more of the possibilities in the future than perhaps we were.
	And I think that's an encouraging sign.
	I don't see that with all of them, but I do see that with some of them.
	Right.
	So I encourage also your listening audience, we don't have to do it now, but to take a moment out of their lives and to think about the planet.
	Think about places that need to have peace.
	Think about people in their lives that need to have healing and put that energy out because consciousness is a force.
	It's not just a field.
	And really, we can help make a difference.
	Maybe it's not that they're going to get healed by our thinking, but maybe the right doctor will come into their lives.
	Maybe the right person will come into the political arena in that country.
	So, I mean, there's things that we, by putting that energy out there, can help make a difference.
	And if you want to call on higher forces asking for the miracle, that's absolutely accurate and fine to do as well for those that believe in that.
	I think we can really make a difference on the planet.
	And I'm just a guy who, you know, does some news from time to time on the radio and is a broadcaster and is interested in these things.
	And some of this may be true.
	All of it may be true.
	None of it may be true, but it is certainly worth giving our attention to because we may well find as we do our researches that we can achieve much more than we ever thought we could.
	I'd love to think that's the case.
	I agree with your affirmations.
	And I salute you.
	You're part of what I will call the avant-garde of a whole new science of awareness, of positive thinking, and also bringing up the humanitarian aspects of the human experience that we have, cosmic friends and other levels of universal intelligence that we need to know more about.
	And we'll address this in our future programs with you, Howard.
	And it helps to know that we're not alone in the universe.
	I mean, there's a consciousness reality to say, that's what happened.
	I'll just close with this, 2012.
	A lot of people thought it was the end of the planet, but we go, no, there's a whole vastness of reality.
	So we are being helped, we are being watched, we are being also, in some cases, cared for.
	So we are not alone.
	Well, that's a nice thought.
	And I really do hope and I really do pray that that is so.
	And we must talk again.
	Now that you're not just a name to me, I now know what you're about.
	Thank you, Desiree and JJ.
	Bless you and good cheer for all of our dear friends.
	Doctors JJ and Desiree Hertak in California, your thoughts on them and this show at any of my shows, welcome through my website, theunexplained.tv.
	Well, that's it then.
	My name is Howard Hughes.
	This has been The Unexplained.
	We have more guests coming up in the pipeline here.
	I am in London.
	And please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm.
	And above all, please stay in touch.
	Thank you very much.
	Take care.

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