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March 21, 2018 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:16:20
Edition 338 - Stanton Friedman & Suzy Hansen

Legendary Ufologist Stanton T. Friedman talks about "retirement" and New Zealand's SuzyHansen on her ET contact...

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Across the UK, across continental North America and around the world on the internet.
By webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Unexplained.
Well, a little bit of a miracle has happened today.
We had snow for about two days here in London, nothing as bad as they have in places like Scotland or Canada or Alaska, but we had snow and people were saying, oh, is it going to affect, you know, the amount of food in the shops?
Could the transport be disrupted?
Well, none of those things happen.
But certainly we had a lot of white stuff around here.
And then in the space of about six hours today, the sun came out and the snow pretty much melted.
Is this the beginning of spring?
Well, all bets are off at the moment.
I'm hoping so.
And that's the end of my weather report for now.
Thank you very much if you've been in touch recently to talk with me about the show and to suggest guests.
You can always get in touch.
And when you do, tell me who you are, where you are, and how you use the show.
You can get in touch through my website, theunexplained.tv.
And thank you very much if you've been in touch recently.
Hearing from a lot of people who are new listeners.
This is a good sign.
Still controversy about Callista.
A lot of you saying, what did you have that person on here for?
And some people are saying, I'm really pleased that you put Callista on.
I guess this is the kind of thing that makes the world go round.
You know, variety is the spice of life.
Mark Sargent, talking about flat Earth on the last edition, polarized the audience.
50% of people getting in touch saying, thank you, Howard.
Mark Sargent speaks for me.
I'm talking about individual emailers here.
When he says that the Earth is flat and the whole thing is a simulation.
Other people getting in touch saying, what have you put Mark Sargent on for?
He's only after publicity and various other things.
So definitely the audience polarized, but this is the unexplained.
And that goes with the territory, I guess.
I hope.
You know, I just, I find it interesting and stimulating to talk to interesting people who have different views and have had experiences that I certainly haven't had.
That goes with the whole territory as well, I suppose.
Guest on this edition, well, actually, there are two of them.
First of all, we hear from Stanton Friedman, the father of modern ufology, who announced within the last week or so that he is not going to be doing the public speaking engagements, the lecture tours, and those sorts of things in future.
He's 84 now, so he's decided to take life a little more easily.
So we'll be hearing from him briefly just to explain that and to let us know what he's going to be up to in future.
You know, Stanton Friedman, of course, the father of modern ufology, the first person to investigate systematically, Roswell, always a knowledgeable and affable and funny man and always a friend of this show.
So, you know, in terms of him not doing all of the lectures and tours and those sorts of things, I can understand why he's not going to do it, but he will be missed, won't he?
So he's on first.
Then we cross to New Zealand.
It isn't often this show gets there.
We talk with Susie Hansen, who is not only a UFO investigator, but also a contactee, an experiencer.
That's a rarity to have those two things in one person.
Tell me what you make of what she says.
A very interesting story and a very interesting set of experiences from Susie Hansen coming soon.
Like I say, if you want to get in touch with me, go to the website of theunexplained.tv designed by Adam from Creative Hotspot in Liverpool and you can do it that way.
If you want to make a guest suggestion, whatever, shoot the breeze, that's fine.
And particularly interested in hearing from people who are new to the show.
Or maybe you've been listening for years, as some people who've recently been in touch have told me.
And only now have you decided to get in touch.
Nice to hear from you whenever.
More great guests coming up in the pipeline, too.
We are in the planning phase at the moment, so keep your guest suggestions coming.
All right, let's start with Stanton Friedman then, the father of modern ufology.
And I spoke to him 24 hours ago about his decision to partially retire, I guess you could say.
This is terrible news for so many people around the world.
Well, hey, aren't I entitled to have so my own life?
I've been doing this for 51 years.
I gave my first lecture, and I'm tired of running around.
My wife wishes I was home more.
Isn't that nice?
And it's my mind isn't as sharp as it once was.
Now, I shouldn't say that publicly, but I am saying it publicly.
So, you know, those of you who are in your 80s probably understand what I'm saying.
Not quite as sharp.
And, you know, after the first 700 lectures, it's not that I have something new to say all the time, because I don't.
And I am not in the mood for writing another book.
There are six out there already.
If they suddenly all fell out, then maybe I'd consider it.
Well, we realize that, you know, there comes a time in a person's life where they have to make some decisions about what they're doing and how they're doing it.
But you know, Stan, that in this field, you are the most credible spokesperson for these things.
You are the man who first investigated Roswell.
And on the event circuit, the lecture circuit, you are absolutely loved.
So, you know, the absence of Stanton Friedman from a lot of big events is going to hurt.
Well, I'm sorry about that, but enough is enough.
Don't you think 51 years is enough?
So where do you, now that you're moving away from doing that, it's a good point, isn't it, to stand back and take an overview of where ufology, as we now call it, and you were one of the people who got that term into use over the years.
Where does ufology stand now?
You said that you've got nothing new to say on the lectures.
You've said it all before, but it's always a powerful case that you put.
Is it true that actually there is nothing new to say?
Well, you know, once you've said there are alien visitors, the evidence is overwhelming.
There's no question we're dealing with a cosmic watergate.
It's time people got in to see if they can dig at it from another direction.
I think not enough people have paid attention to all that has been done and published.
The media sort of ignore it in general, except I must admit that from mid-December on, there was a whole no ball game with the Elizondo and those people.
And suddenly we Found out that they were studying UFOs for, what, five, seven years, I think it was, in secret.
Big surprise, huh?
And do you think that this is going to lead to...
Well, the U.S. government spent $22 million on this program.
We're told it ran for five years, but probably ran for more.
And probably there was another program before that, and there's one after it.
Do you think, though, that it is likely that we are going to get closer to disclosure now in this year?
Because disclosure is almost like we have a saying in the UK, sure, you've got it in Canada too.
It's always jam tomorrow.
It's always going to happen in the future.
We're getting very close to it.
It never happens.
I haven't heard that.
Yeah, I think something's going on.
You have to ask, why did all this happen at the end of December there?
Big article in the New York Times of all places.
Whoever heard of the New York Times writing a serious, sensible article with Wesley Keene as one of the authors.
She's an excellent researcher.
And having people who had fancy job titles, you know, assistant director of this and that sort of thing.
Somebody must have said, okay, or maybe people decide enough is enough and we're going to decide for ourselves.
And heck with the somebody out there who's running the show.
But there was one thing conspicuous by its absence in this big noise in the last couple of months.
And that is Operation Majestic 12.
What we didn't hear was, where did all this stuff go?
You know, there were all these people doing this research, but so where did it go?
And I think it went into Majestic 12.
Some people say you're full of baloney, but I don't know if they use that expression in English.
But I think it's time that the real covered-up organization was brought forth.
And I think we can handle it.
Remember that there's been some tremendous development in a whole different direction, and that is we now know that there are planets all over the darn place, about 1.6 planets per star.
That implies in the billions in our galaxy alone, billions, not millions, not thousands, billions.
Secondly, we know, or at least most of us know who've taken the trouble to look at it, that interstellar travel is not the terrible obstacle that we'd like to think it was.
All new developments have been faced with it.
Can't be, it's impossible.
If it were true, I would know about it.
Other kind of silliness.
So we're getting close to the point where people say, oh, big deal, of course there are flying saucers.
And nobody's going to panic.
Nobody's going to do all kinds of terrible things.
And, you know, by this time, if there's stuff to learn from the recovery of crash saucers, it's been learned.
What's another crash?
I mean, it was another saucer in captivity, so to speak.
We don't know what it all means.
We don't know what governments have said to each other.
I mean, let's face it, everybody's watching the sky because they're worried about invasions.
And now we can tell the difference, I think, between alien and earthling.
So isn't it time that we stood up, the government stood up with guts, with courage, and said, okay, here's the way it is, folks.
Now, I think we'd want them to add, okay, here are the number of sashes that have crashed and we've recovered.
Here are the number of pilots who have died chasing them.
You know, other little trivial details like that.
So there's information we haven't received.
After all, we have great detection equipment all over the planet.
Things flying by, things coming in from outer space, things going up and back and forth.
I've never asked you this.
Do you believe that we are firing?
I'm talking about the American Air Force, maybe the Brits, maybe others.
We are firing on craft from somewhere else?
There are many, many reports that we actually have regarded them as hostile.
Well, you know, anybody who violates our airspace is by definition hostile, isn't it true?
I mean, that's what air defense programs are about all over the planet.
That doesn't mean we know what their intent is.
It means we don't like them being there without our permission.
Hey, you guys, stay the heck where you belong.
You know, that's a military attitude, isn't it?
Why do you have perimeter defenses if you don't want to say stay the heck away?
So now the question is, is the planet ready to step forward and say, okay, public, we know that they're visiting.
We don't know what all they want.
They haven't displayed direct nastiness.
It's time we told you that man is not alone.
And there'll be some religious people that get upset by that.
There's no question about that.
But there always would be.
Nothing you're going to do is going to please everybody.
Last question for you tonight, Stanton.
I know you're coming on this show soon to talk in more detail, but on this occasion where it's a bit of a mile marker for you, a milestone in your career where you've decided to stop one major part of your work.
Are you frustrated that you have reached this milestone where you're giving up the lecture circuit effectively and we haven't had disclosure?
Is that a disappointment to you?
No, I really wasn't expecting.
I was hoping, you know, one runs optimistic about all the things you want to happen will happen, but I didn't honestly expect it.
I've seen no signs that the government, whatever that's supposed to mean in different countries, is prepared to make us aware of being earthlings.
And that's where the next step has to be.
It's not just that they're alien visitors, big deal.
The question is, what are we going to do about it?
And how do we feel about it?
And how does it impact our view of ourselves and where we go from here.
One thing I'd like to see, I'm told that the military today is spending a trillion dollars on this planet for what?
To give jobs to guys in the military?
I mean, that's not a good excuse as far as I'm concerned.
So I think if they think there's really a good reason for all that defensiveness, that they ought to tell us about it.
And Stan, if in a year from now, some big conference in Las Vegas maybe or somewhere else, Los Angeles, waved some money at you and said, come on, Stanton, you need to come out of retirement for our event.
Will you do it?
Or is this it?
Well, I can't say.
It depends on my health.
It depends what I wind up doing.
I mean, 84, I'll be 84 in July.
Then it's not exactly the time to start a re-evaluation, a redoing of old things.
Thank you very much.
We'll talk again.
I wanted to get you on in person talking about this.
But, you know, I wish you all the very best for the future, and I know that we'll continue to talk here, but we won't see you on the lecture circuit quite so often.
Have a good afternoon.
Thank you.
Take care.
You too.
The knowledgeable, charming, witty Stanton Friedman, 84 years of age, and a man who started the ball rolling for a lot of us.
I met him, you know, at Capitol Radio in London, I think in 1999.
And he only had about 15 minutes or so, and I only had about 15 minutes or so.
And we really couldn't get into all of the things I wanted to speak with him about.
I'd heard him on the Art Bell show in America.
And I was so thrilled to meet him.
So that was the one occasion where we met, and he was just as charming as ever he's been on the phone when I've interviewed him many times after that.
So Stanton Friedman is now partly retiring, but is still going to be a voice to be heard within ufology.
What an interesting and what a nice man in New Brunswick, Canada.
Let's hear now from Susie Hansen in New Zealand.
Susie Hansen is both UFO investigator and I guess what you could call a contactee.
Susie Hansen, thank you very much for coming on The Unexplained.
You're welcome.
I'm very pleased to be here.
Now talk to me about your location.
I am fascinated by the whole idea of New Zealand because it is the furthest contact that this show has had.
I don't think we've ever hooked up with New Zealand.
Yes, we did hook up once before with New Zealand, but that was an American author.
So this is the first time we're hooking up with a genuine Kiwi in genuine New Zealand.
I'm very excited.
Okay, well, I live in a small city called Tauranga, and it's about two and a half hours southeast of our largest city, Auckland.
So it's in the North Island.
And I live in an area where there's bush and beaches and lots of sea and aquatic activity.
So it's very beautiful and has a very mild climate even in winter.
Your biography tells me that you've had 42 years of experience in researching these things.
That can't be right.
I'm looking at your photograph.
You must have started when you were five.
I started when I was 20 and it's actually 44 years now, Howard.
And my study of both contact and UFO sightings in New Zealand started when I had a catalyst experience on a lonely country road.
And that really catapulted me into the study of both of those areas.
So I really have a foot in both camps, in sighting investigation and in the contact field, which is actually quite unusual worldwide.
There's not a lot of people.
I'm one of the very few actually who have their feet planted firmly in both of those arenas.
I can't think of many.
There are some.
They're not in New Zealand.
I think they're mostly in the United States.
Tell me what this catalyst is.
It's the first time I've heard it put that way.
What was the catalyst experience?
Well, I was travelling on a back country highway in New Zealand through the hills and sheep stations and farmland with a flatmate, a male flatmate.
And we were winding down out of some hills and ahead of us, as we came to the bottom of the hill, we were about to go across a two and a half kilometre strait over a riverbed and some flat land and a long strait ahead of us and a small bridge.
But we got to the bottom of the hill just about to start on this strait and we noticed two lights ahead of us in the sky over the adjacent hills.
We just assumed it was a helicopter or an agricultural aircraft coming into land because it was late afternoon, about 4.30, brilliant sunshine in autumn.
Paddocks looked golden and beautiful.
The lights flicked out and we thought, oh well, it's changed direction so we can no longer see the headlights on the plane.
But then the lights appeared next to us adjacent on the adjacent hills and that gave us a real fright.
At that point in time my mind immediately sprang to the idea it must be a UFO because my family and I had seen a UFO when I was eight years old.
However my flatmate was a scientist, had a science degree and didn't believe in that sort of thing so he clung to the idea it was a fast-moving helicopter.
How a helicopter could instantaneously cover many kilometres I don't know but it clicked out again, reappeared further along and then clicked out altogether and we couldn't find it anywhere else in the sky.
In the meantime, the car had basically, we'd brought it to a halt basically, and we looked around, couldn't see anything, thought, well, that was a strange experience, let's get going.
I think we got into about second gear and my flatmate said, oh my God, whatever it is, it's coming up behind us.
And within a matter of seconds, this massive ball of light, wider than the road, came over our car.
It illuminated everything around us so that I could only just see outside of the car.
In fact, it was so blazingly white.
And it was accompanied by a really deep, granching, grinding, humming kind of a sound.
sound and the last thing I remember is taking quite some time it seemed almost like slow motion to turn my head to look at my flatmate and saw that he was no longer actually driving the car he had his hands flopped to his lap his head was leaning against the door jam his eyes were shut and and I felt the car being lifted off the road you get that feeling in your stomach as a car as an aircraft leaves the tarmac.
So it was that kind of feeling as the car left the road, and there was a feeling of flotation.
And then I must have blacked out from the noise and the bright light, and probably the trauma of it all.
The next thing we recalled was there was like a loud banging noise that seemed to wake us up.
The headlights of the car came on, the engine came on, and we hit the road and it was pitch black.
We were in a state of terror, trauma, fear, not knowing what had happened, not knowing where the time had gone, not knowing where we were until we recognised the bridge we were about to cross.
So we were at the far end of the 2.5k straight.
And we argued all the way home as to what had happened.
He clung to his idea that we'd seen a helicopter and that there was nothing out of the norm, but he could not explain, of course, why it was now dark.
And had he had the same experience, Susie?
Yes, he was in the car with me.
Right, no, I'm saying, but had he felt the same thing that you've been plucked into this thing and then plonked back down?
Yes, he did, but he was in total denial of the fact that it could have been a UFO.
He couldn't accept that.
So because he didn't have an answer for it and didn't know what had happened, he preferred to argue and try to silence me rather than actually face what had happened and discuss it.
He eventually left our flat because I kept badgering him with questions and wanting to know what he thought about it.
And he eventually left the flat and I was left in this limbo land for quite some time, quite a few years, when more experiences occurred and until I finally began to put two and two together and some books from the States began coming into our country about contact with ETs and UFOs that could lift cars off the ground, etc.
And I began to re-look at some of the things that had happened in my childhood and reframe them into a different box.
So it wasn't as if you'd been primed for it.
You only discovered this information later and that helped you to make sense of it.
It must have been when you can't understand a thing that's happening to you, it's almost like a child having an experience that an adult will be able to rationalize.
Same for you really in the car.
That's right.
People handle these things differently.
Your partner at the time, the guy in the car with you, he was trying to compute it as you were.
But it still must have been for both of you, by the sounds of that, traumatic.
Yes, it was.
And looking back, I can see indicators of like causing a post-traumatic stress because whenever I thought about the incident, my armpits would prickle, I'd start to perspire, my hands would become clammy, my heart would race, my mouth would go dry, I'd end up feeling angry and get a headache and all of those kinds of indicators of trauma and stress that were caused by this incident.
And in the following years, there were a few more similar incidents of missing time that I couldn't explain.
And as you've rightly said, there was nothing in New Zealand in those days to explain this.
And you were really on your own for quite a few years until I began to meet one or two other people who'd experienced something similar.
And to actually hear some corroborative evidence from other people in the communities I was living in who'd seen strange lights around the time that these incidents happened to me of missing time.
They'd seen strange lights in the area, over the village, or over the area surrounding it.
And so that to me was at least some kind of confirmation in my mind that something unusual was happening.
But it was quite a few years before I first read David Jacobs' book and Bud Hopkins and John Mack and those other people of that time.
That was quite a few years later in the 80s and 90s they were putting those books out and this happened to me in 1975.
And what were you, were you a student then?
What were you doing with your life?
No, I was actually in my first year of teaching at a primary school in a city called Hastings.
So a responsible job, responsible person.
It's not like you weren't a hippie at the time.
No, definitely not, far from it.
So I don't know, did you talk to people about this?
No, there was no one to talk to.
So you really internalised all of this and you had to cope with it and lead a normal life of going to school each day and teaching 28 children and carrying on with your family life and extended family and other community things that you were involved in.
And it wasn't for a very long time before I really spoke to someone.
I think it was something like 18 or 19 years later when I finally spoke to someone in the UFO field in New Zealand.
Because where I was living, there were no UFO groups at that time.
There were other UFO groups I later found out throughout New Zealand, but not where I was living.
So I really was on my own with this.
And the idea of having hypnotherapy, of having hypnotic regression for this, you know, those ideas were only just beginning to dawn in the US.
So they hadn't spread to countries like my country or your country, I guess, by then.
No, I didn't really hear about that sort of thing until the 90s.
And so in the interim, over, you know, a couple of decades or more, I actually had huge, extensive memory that developed over time of actually being in a craft in unusual rooms with all kinds of activities taking place, which I documented, fortunately, at the time.
And in 1997, sort of word had started getting around in New Zealand amongst UFO groups that there was this lady who'd had these experiences.
And I was asked to speak at a UFO conference, international UFO conference in New Zealand in 1997.
And that was only the second time I'd publicly spoken about it.
I'd spoken to a small UFO group in the city of Taurunga, where I now live, Just slightly before then, but 1997 was when I first went public at an international conference.
So 22 years had elapsed since the experience.
How had it left you?
You know, there must have been, as you said, that for a while there was a feeling of almost post-traumatic stress to do with it.
You know, how had you rationalized it in those 22 years to the point where you were able to speak about it?
Yes, well, so much happened in those 22 years, but I think the thing that I kept falling back on was the very stunning UFO sighting that I'd had with my family and neighbours as a child of eight.
And that really brought home to me very firmly and clearly as an eight-year-old child that what we were seeing in the sky was not something from this planet.
It had to be from somewhere else because of its characteristics.
So even at the age of eight, I was an intelligent child and I was beginning to analyse the characteristics such as I have done for many years as a sighting investigator.
So I could examine the characteristics and talk to my parents and neighbours about what we were seeing and very firmly made up my mind that this was being flown by someone from somewhere else.
So when I had this experience at the age of 20, that helped me to rationalize it in a way in that I was convinced it was from somewhere else and therefore all of its characteristics would be unusual, would be frightening, would be confronting and that I would get through this.
But I had this burning desire to start finding out more about it and to help to explain what had happened to me.
So during those years I had all kinds of further contact experiences.
I went through the stage of losing the fear and realizing that these were actually positive experiences, that I was learning things on a craft, that I was having healing and positive experiences, that I seemed to be a part of something.
And as I accepted this more and more, the memories became clearer so that going from a position of only remembering small parts of the experience or the beginning or the end or a bit in the middle, I went on to have full memory, conscious memory of full experiences on the craft and to be able to document them and detail them.
And that's what I also speak about today is the ongoing research I'm doing into some of those experiences with technology and consciousness and telepathy and the activities that take place on the craft with humans and why they're taking place.
So there's this much broader picture has opened out over the years.
And recently in February when I spoke at the International UFO Congress in Phoenix, Arizona in the States, they particularly asked me to give my full speech on the technology that I have observed and used on craft and the research I've done into corroborative evidence of this from other experiences, but also from science and scientists.
And I've got a lot of scientific backing behind me now, although those scientists don't necessarily want to have their names divulged.
There is a diverse group of scientists who are supporting my research.
Okay.
Going back to the first, actually the second experience, but this second experience was the abduction experience at age 20.
And memories of this dripped back into your consciousness.
And then subsequent experiences, what were they like?
Were they all the same?
Was it the same kind of craft?
What kind of creatures, if there were creatures, were you dealing with and what were they doing with you?
Well, the entities that I've had most of my contact with are a species of grey, a positive species of grey, but I have also seen a number of other mixed species on the craft.
I've seen human-like species which might be described as looking like Nordics, very tall and very elegant-looking, human-like beings.
But I've also seen the very common mantis kind of entity as well.
But largely, it's been various species, various grades, I call it, of greys, ranging from those who are very quite smooth-skinned to those that have dappled skin to those that have very wrinkled skin.
So there's a whole variety of them out there that look quite different.
But yes, the memories started coming in and those memories, as I said, got more extensive over the years.
Right.
And when you were on board the craft, what was the craft like and what sorts of No, they weren't experimenting on me.
And as I explain in my book, The Dual Soul Connection, there's this very large agenda going on to help us to help ourselves rather than an ET species coming in and taking over and giving us orders.
We're not very popular because of the state of our planet and the impact that this could have on other species out there if we blow ourselves up.
So there's this natural interest of other species in our vicinity and the galaxy coming to see what's happening on this planet.
I've been taken on board a variety of craft in the same way that we have a whole variety of vehicles that could go on our roads, ranging from cranes on wheels to cars to trucks, etc.
There's a whole range of craft that are used for different reasons.
But I'll give you an example of one very unusual craft I've been on and that was a massive, I could see it on the what I call the window screen on the smaller craft I was in as we approached it and it was a massive satin or walnut shaped craft with a big flange around the middle and this was multi-storied,
it was like a big spherical city with and the flange around the middle was actually the hangar that went right around the craft with openings into the interior of the craft that you could walk through.
But the hangar was huge and one piece of technology that I note from that experience is that the roof of the hangar from the outside looked metallic or could look see-through and from the inside this particular metal or alloy you Could see through it, so you could see the night sky through the roof of the hangar.
And it wouldn't surprise me if this kind of technology comes out in our own technology eventually.
So, some years, quite a few years later, actually, that was in the 80s, and more recently, I think it was about 2015 when I was researching a speech overseas in Denmark, I came across the 1986 experience of Captain Terry Uchi, who was a Japanese pilot approaching an airport in Alaska, and he and his crew saw a similar craft, and that's been well documented by Dr. Bruce McAbee.
So, this was great confirmation or corroboration to me that I hadn't imagined what this craft looked like, that actually someone else, and a very credible witness being an airline pilot, had seen something similar.
Okay, the actual abduction experience, the first time you were in a car and you saw this enormous, great, brilliant light that got larger, it moved faster than anything reasonably could, and then you had missing time and all the rest of it.
What was the typical MO, modus operandi, for them, you know, aggregating them as a bunch of aliens, whatever they might be, for them acquiring you for the latest experience?
Did it always happen in the same way?
No, it hasn't always happened in the same way, but I'll answer the first part first.
Firstly, I don't call my experiences abductions.
At the beginning of this, when I first saw books coming out of the States which referred to abduction, the stories being told in those books by David Jacobs, etc., were very frightening.
They were negative.
People were having needles put into them and all kinds of things.
And people were in a state of real trauma about what was taking board on a craft.
My trauma stemmed from the fact that I was facing something unusual and I had to learn to deal with it.
My trauma did not stem from maybe what was happening on the craft.
So over time, as I began to examine my experiences and realize that they were positive, that I was learning things, that I was doing interesting things, I called it contact rather than an abduction.
Because as I explain in my book, there's these programs being run with humans by these ETs to educate us and raise our evolutionary rate on the planet with a view to future contact with other species.
So we're going through an accelerated time at the moment where everything on the planet on every level is in acceleration.
And I think if we look around ourselves at the news on TV every night, we can see that happening.
So in this particular experience, I learnt many years later that the reason I'd been taken on board craft on that lonely country road was because four months earlier, before I began my first year of teaching, I'd had a horrific car accident and I'd sustained some spinal injuries, balance injuries, and musculoskeletal injuries.
And I was really struggling in my first year of teaching with intense chronic pain, massive headaches.
I'd had three fractured vertebra, two in my neck, and I was lucky that I didn't end up in a wheelchair, unable to walk.
So I was taken on board, I found out many years later, because they were doing some work on me and they put an implant in my ear, which assisted with the balance problem I was having and the headaches.
And I was given some kind of healing with some technology.
How did you know there was an implant in your ear, Susie?
How did you know there was an implant there?
They told me, and in later years, they changed the implant.
They took it out, and I had conscious memory of that experience where they put this thing over my ear technology and they took out an implant that looked like a small slither of glass and they put in another one.
They kind of updated it.
And has that ever been pictured, X-rayed, photographed?
No, I've never had an X-ray or a scan of any kind in that area.
So how are you convinced that it's there and that it wasn't a dream?
You know, there are people who say these things that, you know, it's a dream.
Yes, well, I guess the proof is in the pudding that before I ever found out that I had this implant put in there, I had an improvement in my health after that incident.
So I was stressed by and traumatized by what had happened in terms of the car being lifted off the road and having some missing time.
But in fact, I'd been constantly up at the physiotherapy department at the local hospital.
I'd been having treatment after school every day and they were putting hot packs on me and then suddenly things began to improve and this surprised the head physiotherapist who took me aside and said, well look, I think you don't need to come back.
I don't understand it, but you seem to have turned some corner all of a sudden.
And so there was this improvement and I was able to carry out the rest of that that year because this happened in March, in August, about the time that we are in New Zealand at the moment.
And my health rapidly improved after that, which was quite phenomenal considering the injuries I sustained and the short amount of time since the accident.
It's a stunning story.
Did you...
I don't know whether you were speaking to them or whether they were speaking to you, whether it was a dialogue.
I'm guessing you would have done what most of us would have done on a number of those occasions and asked, why me?
Why have you got me here?
I know they were doing work, as you said, on your physical issues, but you'd had an experience when you were eight.
There was another one at 20 and there were subsequent ones.
So the pattern is emerging that you'd been picked in some way.
Yes, I wouldn't term it in that way.
I'd say that from what I've discovered over the years, I would say that and what I've been told by these entities, that they outlined to me That I volunteered to do this before I came into the planet.
That there's thousands and thousands of souls who've incarnated on the planet who have volunteered to come and do particular work on the planet at this time of our evolution and our environmental state.
And in my book, I outline these three waves of volunteers coming into the planet over a period of 100 or more years and the purpose of this and the programs that are being run for a variety of reasons to train people and educate people and get people moving in their tasks or the things that they're here to achieve in this life.
And why did they ever explain to you why they don't make themselves more widely visible?
Why they don't go to the United Nations, for example, why they have to pick people up off lonely country roads?
Well, they have actually made themselves very visible for very many years, and I think this goes way back in history too, but we sort of won't get into the historic aspect of it.
But there's plenty of evidence throughout history of people seeing unusual things in the sky and objects which sound very similar, like descriptions of craft and contacts have taken place throughout history.
But if we're looking more at the modern age, I think the attitude, we're quite a war-like species on humans.
We've constantly got a war going somewhere on our planet.
We don't work very well together as cohesive groups on the planet.
So we're very much, we're still a planetary, we're not even yet a planetary civilization because we're divided.
We haven't become a planetary representative, if I can put it that way.
But we're trying to become interplanetary.
So we're wanting to do forays out into space to the moon and to Mars and probably use those as jump-off points to somewhere else.
And I think there's a great deal of concern about this, that we haven't yet cleaned up our act on our own planet.
So whatever we take with us out into space will be a mirror reflection of what's happening here.
And the USA doesn't want that.
I understand.
That's one of the reasons.
But of course, we have nuclear capability.
And Robert Salas, who's a US speaker, very well known, is a very good friend of mine.
And of course, he was involved in the 1967 Malmstrom Air Force Base incident where a craft came in and shut down the Minuteman missiles that were being tested.
And of course, this has happened at other bases, and it's a big message to us.
I think if they showed themselves, what would our reaction be?
We'd probably send jets up to chase them, shoot them down, or whatever.
Well, the word is we might already be doing that.
Yes, exactly.
But I think the way that they are doing things is just taking members of the public on board their craft and familiarising them with this form of contact.
And the programmes that I outline in the agenda in Ayatlana, my book, really lays this out quite clearly as to how they're going about this and why.
Because to be confronted by, you know, people say, oh, well, why don't they come and show themselves?
Well, I think anyone who stood in front of an alien entity and has conscious memory of it would be able to say because they are overwhelmingly powerful in terms of their mind, their consciousness, how they convey things.
And unless you've been used to that from early childhood, as I have discovered I have been, then it's going to be very confronting.
And so a long period of time, I believe, has to take place to familiarise the planet with the idea that they're there, that they look strange, they look different to us, they operate differently, they communicate differently.
And if we were to become in contact with their phenomenal technology, it would blow our minds.
And everything on this planet would have to change if we were to adopt that technology.
We would have to go through an exceptionally steep learning curve that a lot of people couldn't cope with.
But they could step in and help us, though, couldn't they?
Couldn't they?
This is what they're doing through these programs and the agenda that I outline in my book.
They've been doing this over a long period of time, taking people like me and others on board craft, leaking information on technology to scientists, etc.
And so, for example, the talk I gave recently at the UFO Congress was about technology I was seen on a craft, you know, 30, 40 years ago, which is now appearing within the last 10 years appearing in our own technology.
So how come we are developing the same sort of technology, but less sophisticated than what they've got?
And can you give me some examples of that technology?
Why aren't we developing something different to them?
Can you give me examples?
Yes, certainly.
For example, back in the 70s on a craft, I saw a handheld unit being used by a grey that he was scanning my body with.
And he told me I couldn't see what was on the screen he was looking at, but he told me that this implement, with this implement, he could look into my body.
And I didn't really sort of think at the time what he meant by that, but he was taking scans of my body which were going to be stored on a computer, etc.
But he said he could see into my body.
And then some years later, I'd been very ill at that stage, and I was taken on board a craft, put on a table, and they had a ceiling-mounted version of it, not a handheld.
It was much bigger.
And they shone this beam of something down onto me.
I wouldn't call it strictly light, and I wouldn't call it strictly energy either.
It was something in between.
And they said to me to raise myself up on my elbows and have a look.
And I looked down, raised myself up and looked at my abdomen.
And I could see nothing.
Within the circle that it created, I could only see my bones.
So, my nightgown had disappeared, all the muscle and tissue, and fat, and anything, organs couldn't be seen.
It was only the skeleton.
Then they touched a screen, and I could see my organs.
They touched a screen, I could see the vascular system, etc.
Now, this technology has only just been developed in our own technology.
I think the first time it came out was 2007, a handheld piece of apparatus called a vein viewer.
People can Google that and have a look.
And it shows, it shines onto your skin and it absorbs uses near-infrared light to reflect off the hemoglobin in your blood, and so they can see into your body to where your veins are.
And when I spoke about this at the Congress, I presented information given to me by an experiencer I met when I was speaking in Canada who has also seen this and had documentation of when he first publicised it back in the 80s, and he saw it in the 70s.
So, two independent people, you two and this other experience of both sorts of people.
Don't know each other, never met before.
And he stood up at an experience session at the conference I was at and started speaking about it.
So, I rushed up to him afterwards and recorded him talking about it on my phone.
And he has since done some speeches about it on YouTube with Grant Cameron, as I have.
And so, I presented this at the conference, and immediately afterwards, I was approached by an oncology specialist in the States who was at the conference, who came up to me and said, We've got the beginnings of this technology at our hospital, and I will share some images and information about it with you.
So, we're only just developing something that this other experiencer, Steve Boucher, and I saw back in the 70s.
So, this is a kind of thing that is possibly being provided to us, leaked to us, given to us by the ETs, and we're developing it.
But we cannot yet put the consciousness aspect into this technology.
That's why our versions of it are less sophisticated.
They will be more sophisticated in the future, but it's as if there is this familiarization process taking place to get us used to using this kind of technology, and it will slowly increase up to where the ETs have got the level that they have got.
So, this seems to be a two-step process.
They are drip feeding this information and these experiences out to particular chosen people, including you and, as you said, this other person that you met and your flatmate, of course, who was with you on that first experience.
And they're doing this for a couple of reasons.
Yes, they have some degree of our best interests at heart.
They don't want us to completely ruin ourselves.
But also, it's not entirely altruistic.
They don't want us taking our bad habits out into space, which is currently where we're headed.
Yes, and Michio Kaku, the theoretical physicist who's very well known, he talks about this.
He outlines what I referred to before as the planetary civilization, which we haven't even become yet, so we're still in kindergarten.
Then the planetary, then the interplanetary, you know, and so it goes on.
The universal civilization, we haven't got anywhere near that yet.
And we are a danger unless we can clean up our own act on the planet and get on together and stop the wars, then we're not going to progress any further.
In fact, I believe we won't be allowed to progress any further if we're a danger to other species.
Is this what happened to previous civilizations?
There's a lot of talk, a lot of speculation that previous ancient civilizations like the Egyptians and the Mayans and maybe people who preceded them had contact with extraterrestrial beings.
Of course, those civilizations died out in their different ways.
Is there any hint from what you've learned from them that those people were stopped because they started making the kinds of mistakes that we're making?
Well, a lot of people claim they've been told that by the ETs.
I haven't been told that at all, but I do from looking at history and what has come forward and the fact that scientists have found parts of deserts that have been basically turned, have glass in them because there's clearly been a nuclear explosion in the past,
then I would say that there's every indication that there's been more advanced versions of us in the past, but we've botched it, we've done something wrong, and maybe there's been intervention from other species to say, well, you can't do this, sorry, but we're not going to let you do this.
And maybe we're reaching that point again now, but maybe they're going to approach it differently because they don't want our civilization to be destroyed.
They actually want us to clean up our act.
Well, it sounds like we're on borrowed time.
Can I just wind you back briefly?
Your flatmate.
What became of him?
Well, he left the flat.
I lost contact with him.
And some years later, I heard that he'd actually been killed in a bus accident when had become a teacher by then, science teacher, and he was killed in a bus accident with a group that he was taking on a trip.
Well, that's very sad.
And you had no contact with him up to that point?
No, no.
Okay, because together, you would have made a tremendous, you'd have been a Betty and Barney Hill style story together.
Yes, I think so, yes.
So you've got to do this by yourself, and it's a lonely road.
You're a teacher.
You taught at that time and through this entire period.
Did it conflict with your teaching?
I mean, were you able to talk about this?
Because I know that certainly here in the UK, maybe if we look back, people are more enlightened these days.
But if we go back only 20 years, 30 years, if somebody'd come out with a story like that and they were in a position of responsibility over children, I think the authorities in charge would start to ask questions.
Yes, that's correct.
And I never ever talked about any of my experiences publicly or even to in the community at all.
I had a few selected friends who I trusted their confidentiality that I talked to, Discussed it with, but no, I never did any public speaking while I was teaching and while I was bringing my children up.
It wasn't until I had actually left teaching that I spoke publicly at the 1997 conference.
So I always believed that I'm here to lead a normal life, as normal as possible.
And I was able to keep those two lives separate.
And I think back in the 90s when David Jacobs' book Secret Life came out, I ordered a copy when I finally heard about it.
I ordered a copy from the States.
And when it arrived and I unwrapped it, there was the cover of this little figure standing in a doorway with brilliant light shining on it from outside and the words Secret Life.
And I just broke down and cried because I realised that that's what I'd been doing, that my close friends and workmates, etc., had no idea at all of this other life that I was leading, these other things that were happening to me.
I didn't talk about it.
And I realised how stressful that had been.
It just all poured out when I saw that image and the name of the book that, yes, that's what I've been doing.
I've been having forced to lead two lives because this would be so unacceptable to society in New Zealand in those days.
But now much more acceptable people say these things.
Of course, there is still an awful lot of skepticism.
I'm sure some of the people listening to you now will say, well, you're clearly deluded.
Maybe the accident you had left you with some hallucinations and, you know, your brain was jarred and your mind is, we know that the human mind is a very powerful thing, is playing tricks on you.
Yes, well, fortunately, I didn't have any head injuries in the accident.
But yes, well, people will always say that if they don't understand the subject or have done no research in it.
But fortunately for me, I've documented it over the years and I've got my own handwritten documentation from way back recording what I've experienced and recalled.
But also I've got speech DVDs from way back, from 1997, showing all of this technology that I'm talking about, which has now come out in our own technology.
So how would I, a housewife and teacher in New Zealand, far away from the rest of the world, know about all of this technology, how it functions, what it's used for, having seen it and used it on a craft, and then 30 or 40 years later, it turns up in our own technology.
You know, and the amount of people I have met around the world, other experiences and abductees who are able to describe very, very refined, very particular, very specific things that I have also seen on craft.
Not only that, Howard, I also have a lot of other corroborative evidence in terms of people who've seen lights over my house or near my house late at night.
I've got circles that appeared in the mud, in the mud flats of the beachside community I was living in the day after I'd been taken on board a craft and had memory of how I was taken out of the house and down to the craft, which matched the appearance of these circles in the mud from where the pod feet of the craft had gone into the mud.
So people had seen the circles but they hadn't seen the actual craft.
They'd seen lights.
That's right.
Yes, they'd seen the circles but I had told a friend of mine about the incident and then she contacted me and said you need to go down to the estuary because exactly where you've described that this happened, there's these three big equilateral circles in the mud and there were people down there, some of the old retired chaps were down there with picks trying to pick holes in them.
They were baked hard.
They couldn't break the mud up at all.
So, you know, this is corroborative evidence of a kind, I guess.
How else would that have happened?
And you're not awestruck, frightened, disturbed by this.
You talk about it in a very matter-of-fact way, and I understand why you would, because it's been a part of your life for a very long time.
But still, you know, you're a human being, and so am I. If it happened to me, I would still on some level feel disturbed within.
Well, I did for a long time, Howard.
For many years, I felt quite disturbed about it, what is happening, etc.
I mean, it probably took me about 15 years to really come to terms with it and begin to understand.
And when I sort of turned that corner and realised at one point in one experience, realised that these entities were actually the ones that I recalled from childhood, that I used to see at night, that used to talk to me, that my mother and other people convinced were either guardian angels or the spirits of family members who'd passed on visiting me or an imaginary friend.
When I had this realization and began to tie everything together and reassess everything that had taken place throughout my life up to that point, it was then that on one occasion I was standing in the hallway about to leave the house with three greys and one of my children and they realized I was understanding I'd slipped out of the altered state they put you in for transportation which just speeds everything up.
I slipped out of it and I was listening to them telepathically communicating with each other and what they were saying and I chipped in and asked questions and they realized that I was standing there not afraid, not screaming or panicking, that I was communicating with them and they said it's time for you to remember more.
And from that time on I began remembering very extensively what was happening on the craft and the equipment and technology I was using and as I said that's now coming into play with it coming out in our own technology which is corroborative evidence for me.
You said you were in the hallway with three greys and a child, is that right?
Yes, one of my children.
And so did your child saw the greys then?
No, he was in an altered state.
I slipped out of that altered state.
But one of my children, both of my children, started off being taken on board craft with me, and then one was not taken anymore, and the other one was.
And he has no conscious memory of what took place, but he does have some isolated memories of the beginnings and ends of those incidents.
Boy, what are you going to do about that in the future?
What am I going to do?
Did you say, or what is he going to do?
Well, are you going to assist him to recall what happened?
What are you going to do?
Or are you just going to let this occur naturally?
If he remembers more, he'll remember more.
Yes, I've always allowed my children to be children.
I've never foisted my experiences or things like that on them.
They have been with me on occasions when we have actually seen UFOs.
So they know that they have seen them.
They were not misidentified aircraft or natural phenomenon or anything like that.
They were definitely something else.
But I've let my kids be kids and I've never led them to believe they're special or anything else.
And unfortunately, Howard, I see a lot of this happening worldwide where parents who allege to have had contact are schooling their kids up and the kids are spouting all sorts of information.
And I feel that they've lost something in their childhood.
I think that these things need to occur naturally.
The ETs have always talked to me about the issue of timing.
There's a time that is right, that is part of the bigger plan when things take place.
And we all see evidence of that in our own lives.
When we look back on our lives, we see, oh, if I hadn't done this, that wouldn't have happened.
That kind of thing.
It's part of our natural lives.
There's a right time for everything.
But, and I'm sorry to interrupt because I think it's important.
I mean, how much of this did you talk with your children about?
You know, did you say you didn't say anything to them?
Nothing.
They were with me when we saw UFOs, but they were never ever told right from early childhood anything about the experiences and what was happening to me.
I did not discuss.
I didn't say Vats and Abelian Kraft, darling.
I've actually been visiting those for years.
The terminology UFO was used, which was all around in their video games and stuff that kids at that age were playing anyway.
And they were watching that sort of thing on TV.
But no, I made up my mind very early on that I wanted my children to be children and not to be coloured by anything that was occurring to me because I was still at that stage when they were young children.
I was still making sense of it myself.
And I'm a teacher, so I know the impact that things can have on children and how it can affect their learning, their self-esteem, their image of themselves and the way they see the world.
So we talked about things that they saw on television, etc., but we didn't talk about my experiences.
And in fact, I've got one son who's never looked at a single speech video of mine.
He's seen me interviewed on television and he's got upset if the critics, the skeptics have had a go at me.
But he's never read my book and he's never looked at my speeches because it's just not in his life.
It's not in his reality.
Sounds very healthy to me.
What do your neighbours and your friends and your colleagues make of you then?
Do you notice some people are a little reticent if this subject comes up?
How do you get through life in that way?
Well, I don't go around talking about it.
I see a lot of people who go around shoving the subject down other people's throats and making themselves unpopular.
I don't do that.
I just lead my life.
I believe I'm a respected member of my community.
I've been involved in community activities with children and athletics and sports and all kinds of things for years.
And I've worked in a number of voluntary positions with police and hospice, with cancer patients, etc.
So I try to give back to my community.
But I don't go around talking about it.
I have to do it.
So you've got a balanced life then, by the side.
Yeah, I have a best friend who knows I do this, who knows I go overseas and travel and talk about it.
When I come back, she says, all she says to me is, how did your trip go?
I say good.
She says, how did your speech go?
I say, oh, really good.
And she goes, oh, that's good.
And that's the end of the conversation.
She's got nothing more to say, and that's fine by me.
When people are ready or want to talk about these things, they will.
Yeah.
Now, something I should have asked you 20 minutes ago and actually didn't.
So let's ask it now.
When you've come into contact with aliens, for want of a better word, of different species, did they give you any kind of indication as to where they are from?
And, you know, our efforts to get out into space going to Mars and various other places relative to where they're from, you know, how are we doing?
Are they from much further away than that?
Did they give you an idea?
Yes, much further away from that.
And in fact, I've asked, well, what planet do you come from?
And they say, there is no point.
We don't have a name for it as you might give a name.
So we can't give you a name.
And even if we did, you wouldn't even know where it is because you haven't discovered it exists yet.
So these are the kinds of answers I've given in almost a frustrated way.
They say, well, you know, what's the point?
Because you don't know where this is or anything about it anyway.
So, but the Greys have told me, and this has been told to me by a number of experiencers worldwide who've been told the same thing.
They said they no longer have a planetary base.
They have huge craft-like cities and they live and produce everything they want on there.
There may be times when they visit other planets where they've got established communities, but they travel and they meet the needs of other developing civilizations.
And we happen to be one of those developing civilizations at this point in time that they have been called to assist with and are assisting us with our evolution.
Is there any kind of cosmic war going on over us?
In other words, you know, they're doing us a favor, they're trying to look after us, but are there less well-motivated species?
Well, I hear a lot of this from conspiracy theorists that there's this massive war going on out there in space over our planet because we're so special.
I don't consider that we're necessarily so special.
I think that's an image of ourselves we've developed over the many years of believing that there's no one else out there in the universe except us.
And I think we have a lot of unlearning to do to realize that that isn't the case.
And even scientists are now saying that there is undoubtedly massive, diverse forms of life out there.
They now acknowledge that.
So I think we're only in the very beginning stages of coming to terms with that.
We haven't even begun to talk about your investigations.
And we'll get more into that, I think, in another edition of this show if you want to come back on here.
But I'll say this.
You are an investigator as well as an experiencer.
And that is unusual, as you rightly said.
Does that make it difficult to investigate people's claims because of what you've been through?
Aren't you going to believe every report that you get?
Absolutely not.
Kiwis, New Zealanders are actually very cautious people.
And a lot of my research friends overseas say I'm too cautious and too careful and too sceptical.
Well, that's a good thing in my mind because healthy scepticism in terms of constructively looking at something is a good quality to have if you're a UFO sighting investigator.
No, I don't necessarily believe everything that I'm told because I analyze the characteristics, etc., as do my colleagues.
So I have a nationwide network in New Zealand called UFocus NZ Research Network.
We've got a website with a huge database of sightings, not all of which are on the website, of course.
We now have over 10,000 sightings from within New Zealand.
And so I don't find any conflict of interest in being an experiencer and investigating UFO sightings because we're focusing on quite different things.
But the advantage for me is that many UFO sightings in New Zealand have turned out to be a contact has taken place, and there's quite a number of incidents like that, including an Auckland neuroscientist who had a sighting which turned into a contact.
So when it comes to those kinds of sightings, then my other experience is actually quite useful.
And that person, did that person have similar experiences to yours?
No, but he had a sighting north of Auckland and late at night when he was fishing.
This is a neuroscientist.
He went straight into analytical scientific phase where he began analysing the height, the width.
He really was quite calm about it and very cool and collected and analytical, which was great because we got all this good data from him.
But he described the entities that he saw on the beach.
He described the craft, what it did, how it changed its light configurations.
And what he was describing matched other sightings that were coming in from other people around New Zealand at the time in terms of characteristics.
And we had three hunters out in the back blocks who saw, who were able to give the absolutely identical description to what the scientist gave of the craft.
And a contact nearly took place with them.
They saw the entity.
They shone a hunting spotlight on it and were able to describe it.
So we've got these matching corroborative details coming from the scientist and the hunters.
Boy, I mean, that story sounds right out of the Travis Walton chronicles.
Yes, that's right.
Does it make you feel better?
As time went on, did it make you feel better that more details of sightings and experiences came out?
I mean, I noticed the most famous, apparently, case of a sighting was in 1978 at Kaikura.
It's the one that made international headlines.
Yours was in, your first was in 1975.
As reports started to come out, did that make you feel a little more comfortable with it all?
Well, it's interesting to note that at the time that I had my first experience in 1975, I didn't even know about any of the other kinds of contacts that had taken place in New Zealand prior to that.
We have had the earliest one we've got on our archive is 1952.
But in the 60s, I now know that there were a number of such contacts happening.
So, yeah, it's very interesting that these things have come out and that you focus NZ.
We often revisit some sightings where we might suspect a contact has taken place.
And it's interesting to note that you do a follow-up, you know, and say, how are you getting on?
You know, have you had any further sightings since that sighting you reported to us?
And how's everything going?
Anything you want to talk to us about?
And maybe two or three or four or more years has gone by and they say, well, actually, I'd like to tell you something that I didn't tell you at the time because I was too scared.
And you say, oh, yes.
And what is that?
And out comes some kind of communication or contact that took place at the time that they were too afraid to talk about.
Among the things that I read when doing some research for this conversation, which I've greatly enjoyed, Susie, there is something called the alien temporal doorway, if I'm putting that correctly, which is said to be in or around New Zealand.
What is that?
Well, I've never heard of that.
Sorry, Howard.
No, it's supposed to be some kind of portal that is there.
I mean, among the other things, actually, that are reported, there's a volcano there.
Is it Taupo or Topo?
I think it's Taupo, isn't it?
Taupo.
Topo, the volcano.
Apparently, there's been all sorts of strangeness that has occurred around that, and there are claims That the thing was built by aliens.
Well, I've never heard that either, but certainly around Mount Ruapehu and the Central North Island volcanoes, we have had a lot of sightings that have taken place around there, which are documented on our website.
And one of the things that we do with UFOs NZ is that we document, in particular, in cooperation with Chile, which is another country that has a lot of volcanic activity like us.
We study the amount of sightings that happen around the time of volcanic eruptions or seismic activity.
So, for example, 10 days before the big New Zealand earthquakes around 2010-2011 that happened in Christchurch in the South Island, 10 days beforehand, we started getting reports of configurations of lights, etc., coming in from that area.
We have never publicised those on a website even to this day because people in that area are still suffering.
They're still not back in their homes.
There's all sorts of things going on with the rebuild down there.
And wasn't there a small quake quite recently in the same sort of area?
Yes, yes, there was around Kaikoura.
So we felt that people had enough to deal with without us introducing the idea that there were aliens in the sky watching what was happening.
But there is certainly a great history in Iceland, New Zealand, and Chile in particular, the really volcanic countries, of sightings occurring prior to, during and shortly after times of seismic activity and volcanoes.
The nearest I've ever been to New Zealand was beautiful Maui, Hawaii, which is, you know, there is a great Pacific bond.
The peoples of the Pacific, you know, have great similarities and connections.
The Maori people of New Zealand, how do they react to the stories that you tell of what has happened to you?
Is it easier to talk to Maori people about these things because their culture, I presume, is more accepting of such things?
Well, yes, in some ways it is certainly easier, I think, looking at the whole spiritual aspect of the contacts that I outline in my book.
Indigenous people often understand that very well.
And certainly Maori have, in their oral history and even in some of their carved history, they talk about how the sky people came down and brought them three baskets of knowledge, taught them things, bought them implements, etc.
So there is this whole history of the spiritual realm and what seems to be the space realm as well.
And an example of that is that ancient Māori knew that there were seven stars in the Pleiades system long before, and there's only six visible with the naked eye, long before telescopes were invented to tell us that there were seven.
Right.
So, you know, there is knowledge there.
There's a knowledge base there in New Zealand.
Well, Susie, amazing really to be somebody who's experienced these things you say, and also somebody who researches these things.
That's a very difficult act to pull off.
I've greatly enjoyed our conversation.
I hope you have too.
It's only fair that I let you mention the book and also your website, any contact details, anything you want to say.
It's fine.
Okay, thank you, Howard.
Well, my book is The Dual Soul Connection, The Alien Agenda for Human Advancement.
It's available in both Kindle and paperback versions on Amazon.
It's available from me personally if you want the one that's got coloured images.
And shortly it'll be available on Barnes and Noble as well.
And my websites are www.ufocusnz, all one word, UFO C-U-S-N-Z, dot org.nz, that's the siting website.
And my contact website, which I'm still working on and building, is www.communicatorlink.com.
And I can be contacted through either of those websites.
Well, I've never experienced aliens or exotic technology, but I think it's amazing that we can speak.
It's evening time, coming up to night time in London, and your day has begun.
It's tomorrow for you.
And that's time travel in a way.
I still think that's amazing we can talk like this.
I've enjoyed this, Susie, and I hope we talk again.
Thank you, Howard.
So have I. Yes, you're very welcome.
Thank you.
Susie Hansen, and before that, the great Stanton Friedman.
More great guests in the pipeline here at The Unexplained.
So until next, we meet.
My name is Howard Hughes.
I am in London.
This has been The Unexplained.
And please, stay safe, stay calm.
And above all, please stay in touch.
Thanks very much.
Take care.
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