The Unexplained - Howard Hughes - Edition 155 - Richard C. Hoagland Latest

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April 30, 2014 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes

01:04:51

Edition 155 - Richard C. Hoagland Latest

What are the Chinese up to on the Moon right now?

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	Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world, on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes, and this is The Unexplained.
	Thank you for coming back here.
	Thank you for the torrent of emails and the nice things you've been saying and the many, many guest suggestions.
	I have so many emails, and I promise you that in the next edition of this show, I'm going to do a lot of shout-outs.
	One or two of you said, when are you going to do some more shout-outs, Howard?
	Well, in the next show, because we have a special guest on this edition, more about him coming soon.
	It's been a very busy time for me, one way or another.
	I don't know how your life is shaping up, but I had to return to my parents' home, which I think I told you on a previous edition, I thought I visited for the last time before the house clearers move in and the house is sold to its new owner.
	I had to go back to deal with a few things there, to remove a few things, and just make sure a few things were right.
	And it was once again very emotional, and in the very final minutes before my drive back to London, I sat again at the kitchen table and tried to make contact with my parents, just to talk to them, just to tell them how much I love them, and care for them, and appreciate all that they ever did for me.
	And they did over and above what any parents could be expected to do for me.
	They were wonderful, and they will always be in my heart.
	Of course they will.
	And I'm just about to leave, and something says, go and look in a drawer upstairs.
	Just a feeling.
	Not a voice, just a feeling.
	I don't know why.
	I went upstairs, opened a drawer, and at the bottom of that drawer was a tape.
	And I thought, well, that was interesting.
	I'd never seen this here before.
	I wonder what this is doing here.
	But I put it in my pocket, brought it back down to London, and on the tape, and this is a completely true story, is a three decades-old broadcast-quality recording of my parents as they were in life.
	The only recording of its kind to exist.
	And if I hadn't gone to that drawer, I would never have got that tape.
	And I really had forgotten that that tape existed.
	If you'd talked to me about it last week, I'd have said I know nothing about this.
	So I'm really pleased to have that.
	Memento, if that's not too light a word of their lives.
	And I can't explain this to you, but it gives me a kind of comfort.
	And maybe you've been through something similar.
	Just to hear their voices, it almost makes it sound like they're still with me.
	I really hope they are.
	Please keep your emails coming to the show.
	You've made so many guest suggestions, like I say.
	The address to email me at is through the website at www.theunexplained.tv.
	www.theunexplained.tv as ever the website designed and created and maintained by Adam Cornwell, a creative hotspot in Liverpool.
	Now, as I speak these words, Flight MH370, the missing airliner, is still missing.
	And I still am bemused at the fact that all the world's technology and all the world's expertise cannot find this plane.
	How many nations are involved in the search?
	Malaysia?
	China?
	United States?
	UK?
	Australia?
	That's five for starters.
	And they still haven't definitively found wreckage or the plane itself.
	I think it's really odd that in this day and age, we can't do that.
	But like I say, and like I've said before, perhaps by the time you hear this, they will have found the plane.
	I'm not sure.
	On this edition of the show, a return visit for a great guest and an old friend of mine and an old friend of this show, Richard C. Hoagland, we're going to talk about what China may be up to on the surface of the moon.
	And according to Richard, it's a lot more than just driving around in a rover, taking a few pictures and sending home the snapshots.
	It's more than that.
	We'll get to him in just a moment.
	Donations, vitally received.
	Please keep those coming if we're to develop this show.
	And I know that you appreciate what I'm doing here, and I'm really pleased that you do.
	So if you want to make a donation to the show, go to www.theunexplained.tv and follow the PayPal link there.
	Right, let's cross now to Albuquerque, New Mexico.
	It's early in the morning as I'm recording this.
	It's even earlier in the morning.
	In fact, it's only just past midnight in Albuquerque.
	So let's say, Richard Hoagland, welcome back to The Unexplained.
	It's nice to be back.
	Now, you and I, Richard, we exchange emails quite regularly.
	And I can always tell from your emails and how short they are the condition of your work life.
	And I get the feeling that over the last three months or so, you've been pretty frantic and pretty busy.
	I've been pretty busy, and obviously you know why.
	I've been watching the Chinese and astonished at what they have quietly released across the world, across the internet.
	And it has taken months to document and cross the I's, dot the T's, vice versa, to get what is posted tonight on the Enterprise website, which, if I can launch into a slight plug, is enterprisemission.com.
	And everything there is free, unless you want to buy something, and then you can do that if you want to.
	But this is a major paper with almost 100 illustrations.
	I don't know how many references, but it's documenting something extraordinary, which is going to ultimately, I believe, change the world, as I say in the first sentence.
	Now, you have your detractors, and you have people who say Richard Hoagland makes stuff up.
	You have said that before.
	Well, you've said that before on this show.
	What is different about this that will change the world?
	Well, just go look at the images.
	I presume you've done that, and then go and trace back their history, their provenance.
	What we have here is the People's Liberation Army in Beijing, about a week after the unmanned historical soft landing on the moon of a Chinese robot, sent to Earth and then published all across the internet on the official PLA Army website,
	a stunning image of vertical glass ruins miles and miles away south of the Chang, you know, the Chinese lander on the northern part of Mari Embrium.
	And the fact that this data comes from an unimpeachable source like the People's Liberation Army says To me, that this is a very interesting gambit and opening in a whole new geopolitical scenario regarding us, the former Soviet Union, look at what's going on in Russia right now with Putin and the old Chinese communist empire.
	And somehow history is about to realign in ways that are almost unimaginable because what the Chinese have done is pulled out their whole card and basically said to everybody else on the planet, I will see you and raise you one extraterrestrial civilization.
	Now, why is it that we can trust the People's Liberation Army of China more than we can trust NASA and JPL?
	Well, it's, I mean, you have to look at context.
	What is being communicated here?
	The fact that on this data, which is digital, which is amenable to digital analyses, after a week of executable releases, which you could do nothing with, they appeared to be totally designed to obscure and obfuscate and to hide and to conceal what the Chang lander and rover were really seeing.
	About a week after that, nonsense, suddenly you have a crystal clear digital image, the right size, full size, of what the cameras on the spacecraft can take.
	And on it, lo and behold, you see the identical geometry and glass structures that we saw, we've been now seeing since the 1990s on NASA data and films taken by the Apollo astronauts during the Apollo program almost a half century ago.
	And this material of a stunning truth from a source that has zero reason to make this up.
	I mean, what would they possibly gain by making this up and looking like laughing stocks to the rest of the world?
	That's a question I can't answer.
	But there again, I can't really answer the question that I think we should start with.
	And that is, why is China interested in the moon and space?
	What's in it for them?
	Well, we all are at a level beyond the public conversation.
	I mean, why did Kennedy, you know, suddenly in an emergency mode, spend every resource of this government back in the early 1960s to send Americans to the moon and bring them safely back to Earth within 10 years?
	Well, what was it Kennedy thought was so crucial that not only did he want to go there, he wanted to go there first, and then as part of a larger geopolitical strategy, he spent years cajoling and importuning and imploring Khrushchev, his counterpart as head of the Communist Party of the old Soviet Union, to basically go to the moon together with the United States.
	And why did Kennedy then, 12 days after Khrushchev said yes, why was Kennedy killed and Khrushchev put under house arrest?
	Obviously, there's something on the moon that the human race desperately needs and which the Chinese now have decided to openly, publicly faunt to those that know what they're seeing that they're going to go and get.
	Now, we know that the moon is hollow because we've tested it in the last decade or so.
	No, we don't know the moon is hollow.
	We don't?
	What we know is that when you hit the moon with something, like an infalling meteor or a rock or a spacecraft, it rings, meaning it vibrates, for periods of up to an hour.
	That does not translate to the moon is hollow.
	That interpretation has been foisted on the public by people who don't know acoustics and don't know what they're talking about.
	In fact, in our model, the things that are ringing, that are vibrating long after there's an impact on the moon's surface, are the same glass domes and structures sticking up several miles like an ancient eroded trestle that the Chinese have now photographed in color with their CCD cameras and sent back to Earth to be published on their Chinese Army websites.
	They're one and the same.
	The Apollo seismic data show that they vibrate when you hit them, as you would expect.
	And in fact, the seismic data is another extraordinary confirmation, a scientific confirmation of the existence of these ancient glass-like lunar domes.
	So it's rather like having a great big glass bowl on the middle of your dinner table.
	You smack that glass bowl, and it will resound and reverberate, and it will carry those reverberations down through the table.
	In essence, yes.
	Okay, well, look, what appears in those pictures doesn't look right.
	It looks anomalous, and I want to talk about that in some detail in a moment.
	I want to talk about that in some detail, Richard, in a moment.
	But I want to talk about the mission.
	Tell me about the specifics of the mission, why they were going there, what they were using, and then we'll get on to the subject, which is fascinating in itself from your paper, of the landing site that was changed at the last minute.
	Oh, yes.
	Well, the reason the Chinese are going to the moon is because as the third industrial superpower on the planet and coming up very strong after the U.S. and the former Soviet Union, they had not landed anything on the moon.
	In past years, going back to 2005 and 2007, they put unmanned spacecraft around the moon in orbit, just like we did back in the 60s.
	And they photographed several regions with extraordinary fidelity and resolution.
	And they were preparing, they said, they admitted in public years ago, that they were going to send an unmanned probe and a rover to be followed by another unmanned probe and a rover to doubly test the technology leading up to an unmanned probe and a return,
	robotic return to Earth of samples from the moon to Chinese laboratories, just like the United States, you know, sent astronauts and they brought home moon rocks, and the Russians sent Lunakhods and they fired home samples by means of those robotic missions.
	So the Chinese, at one level, were geopolitically evening the playing field and joining a very Exclusive club, that is, nations that have actually landed something on the surface of our nearest satellite.
	But as you can tell from how I wrote the paper, I was suspicious that there were hidden aspects and hidden agendas to this mission even before they launched in early December because of some things that appeared on one of the Chinese media websites that officially was the website of record for the Chang mission.
	Because lo and behold, on that website, there were several prominent examples of a geometric form that we all learn in high school geometry called a tetrahedron, which has nothing to do with lunar missions or lunar engineering or lunar science,
	but everything to do with our work relating to a hidden physics called hyperdimensional physics and how energy upwellings appear on various planets at key angles, particularly one 19.5 degrees.
	And also the tetrahedron can explain why, well, there are those who say it does, can explain why the pyramids are shaped as they're shaped.
	Well, mathematically, remember, the pyramids are not shaped on Earth like tetrahedrons.
	They are four-sided, four-cornered pyramids.
	But mathematically, they contain elements of tetrahedral geometry if you really get down in the weeds.
	Anyway, this was all a supposition that the Chinese had some kind of a secret agenda involving the physics of the solar system until they landed on December 14th of last year, 2013.
	And when they landed, they landed suddenly at a place they had never agreed or announced they were going to land at 19.5 west, which of course is that key angle of a circumscribed tetrahedron.
	So that's kind of a redundant aspect of the message.
	So the Chinese obviously were sending to whoever was carefully watching, including the West, you know, the Western powers, the Western governments, you know, not China, but the United States, Europe, India, Japan, the other nations that have gone to the moon, even Russia, that they knew the deepest secrets that we have been investigating outside of NASA for decades.
	And that, of course, really made us sit up and take notice because what could there have been in terms of something ancient on that piece of real estate?
	In other words, was there something that they were going there specifically to examine, to look at in close-up, to maybe decode something left on the moon for human beings in some previous epoch of civilization?
	So we were eagerly awaiting these first images.
	And as you know from the images I reproduced in this paper, lo and behold, located about 130 feet west of the lander, there is this little house-size pyramid complete with an apex and slanted sides and a square base.
	And it's not very far away.
	And in fact, it was announced as a destination of the rover when the mission went into its first hibernation period at the end of the first two weeks.
	And it does look peculiar in that.
	Something of that size and that shape doesn't really fit in the landscape.
	Everything else has been ground and gnarled down.
	But this thing stands there proudly like the Statue of Liberty.
	If you had a piece of impact debris, a rock, you know, thrown out of the crater that they're sitting on the edge of, it would have a bizarre shape, a twisted shape.
	It wouldn't have a perfect symmetrical pyramidal shape sitting on its bottom with the apex, you know, the point, sticking up toward the stars.
	So it looked to me like there is this cairn, some ancient thing, beacon, you know, latitude, longitude, marker, whatever you want to call it, left by some previous race, some previous civilization.
	And the reason the Chinese went there is because they somehow knew it, and they knew if they went there, they might find out something that would give them an edge on all of Western civilization.
	Richard, how could they have known that something like that was there?
	How would they know?
	Yeah, how would they know?
	Two possibilities.
	One is ancient, ancient, ancient records from the time when the human race was spread all around the solar system in our model and, you know, was freely flying between the moon and Earth and Mars and Venus and the satellites of Jupiter, and there was a stunningly vibrant interplanetary civilization.
	Then some catastrophe happened and everybody was forced to retreat just to the Earth.
	And we only have the ideas of living on other planets as part of myths and mythologies and ancient legends.
	Like in the Indian Vedas, there's discussions of flying craft, extraterrestrial kind of spaceships, going to the moon, stuff like that, as well as in the Chinese culture.
	There's a whole mythology around Chang, the Chinese goddess of the moon, and her pet jade rabbit, her sole companion in her isolation on the moon, in her moon palace.
	And when you begin to look deeper into the Chinese mythologies, it's pretty evident that if you actually had access to the stuff that's sacred and kept secret by the priesthoods, that it was not been made public, there could be even further information detailing numbers and latitudes and things that might be retrieved and things that China could conceivably think of as part of their incredible, grand, ancient celestial heritage.
	I mean, they do call themselves the kingdom of heaven, right?
	But what would be in it for them to prove that this thing is one thing to know that a thing is there and they can do measurements and all the Rest of it.
	But to actually go there, spend a lot of money going there, take pictures of it, prove it's actually there, even if it is so, what do they get out of it?
	Well, normally when people build time capsules or cairns here on Earth, it is to do two things.
	One is to say so-and-so was here, so you make a marker in time.
	And the other, sometimes they leave stuff, valuable stuff, for whomever will find the cairn or find the time capsule.
	Just suppose that this cairn, this little pyramid, sitting there in 1905 West, that the Chinese literally almost landed on top of, you can see it as you look at the video of the vertical descent, which you can find on Google,
	just, you know, Google Chinese unmanned landing video, and it'll show you several exquisite, very high-resolution views that the Chinese sent back to Earth as kind of like live television as their robot arced over and landed all by itself under computer control in this northern region of Mariambrium, just right next door.
	They could almost reach out and touch this little pyramid.
	Suppose the pyramid was to mark a place where important, vital things were stored by a previous civilization for their descendants when they would be able to get back to the moon, develop a technology to get back to the moon, land at a specific place, and find something that was left for them.
	In other words, were the Chinese sending a robot to go and find something specifically left in Chinese mythology, as they interpret it, for the Chinese.
	And do you think they'd have been able to keep this mission and its real purpose a secret?
	It's very hard for us in the West to keep things truly secret.
	They absolutely were totally successful.
	If it hadn't been for the little tetrahedral symbols on the website, when they suddenly changed their plan totally and without any warning landed at 19.5 that Saturday morning in last December, they surprised everybody.
	If you go and look at the web pages that were devoted to covering the Chinese landing, nobody but nobody but nobody expected them to go where they went.
	And there's a lot of explanation on the web trying to figure out, in hindsight, why the Chinese suddenly decided to land at this place, which is geologically not where they said they were going to land years and months ago.
	So this was all subterfuge.
	It was all subterfuge.
	It's like if I was buying you a birthday present, I would say, I'm going to go and watch a football match, and actually I'd go and buy you a birthday present, but you'd think I was at the football match.
	Yep.
	That's what appears to have been done here.
	Now, normally, we wouldn't, normal folks, meaning most folks watching these space missions who don't understand these numbers, they would not realize from the numbers themselves that there was something really amazingly cool about this site.
	And what's interesting is that when the Chinese released their first panorama of the landing site, panorama meaning a 360 image all the way around, it was of abominable quality.
	I mean, you've seen it in the paper.
	Would you release that to anybody professionally?
	Well, it looked to me like, you know, the original Polaroid photographs, the black and white ones you had to pull out of the camera and then treat with chemicals, and then they'd fade.
	Yeah.
	And furthermore, it was shot on a screen in Beijing, and the Chinese media were forbidden to have access to original digital versions of it.
	It was a copy of a copy of a copy shot with a TV camera off of TV projection screen.
	And as you've always explained to me, that is precisely what happened with Apollo 11.
	We got pictures of pictures of pictures.
	Exactly.
	Excellent history there.
	So, bottom line, yeah, the Chinese had a mixed message around their mission.
	They had a secret agenda.
	The secret agenda, based on the imagery they've now released, clearly says look for ET artifacts, both recent, meaning the last few tens of thousands of years, and very ancient, meaning millions of years old.
	And in that landing site, they were able to find examples of both.
	And they've sent the images back to Earth.
	And the Chinese government on many different websites, including from the Chinese Academy of Sciences, has published images which when you put them in a computer and you brighten them up just a bit, lo and behold, these incredibly ancient,
	you know, shattered glass spires, these skyscrapers on the moon, covered with what look like glittering windows or window glass or lights, appear on the not-too-distant horizon in the northeast portion of the panorama.
	And that imagery is available now all over the world from official Chinese websites.
	Assuming this is glass, and it certainly looks like it from the pictures, could it not have been naturally created?
	If you have silica and heat on Earth, you create glass.
	Well, if in the formation of the moon you had heat and silica, you get something like it.
	Except it wouldn't be sticking up as spires with geometry, as you see in that third photograph down in the paper.
	No, this stuff is shattered.
	This stuff looks shattered.
	It does.
	It looks as if it's been broken up with a toffee hammer.
	But it's still standing up.
	Which means it has to have some stern dark gridwork to hold the glass, which is made of stern stuff and under the one-sixth gravity of the moon, can still hold these pieces in a vertical geometry.
	If you look carefully, you can see that the tops of these things on that third image have been broken off.
	They've been shattered.
	They've been pulverized so that the tops end in wispy extensions like they have been whittled down and whittled down and whittled down by micrometeorite abrasion.
	And that takes millions of years to do that much damage to structures that big, because we're looking at things that are miles away and miles tall.
	There's nothing about this which is trivial.
	This is huge.
	And for the Chinese to put this out there to where anybody in public can download the images and realize what's there is a stunning geopolitical development, leading, in the best scenario, to full disclosure of the real history of the human species.
	Why do you think they put the tetrahedron on the website?
	Was it to give a little nod to people like you?
	You know, those in the know are going to know what this is.
	I don't think it was a nod.
	I think it's a code.
	Remember, for most people who don't know a code, when you see symbols, you just ignore them or you accept them as part of the landscape.
	Oh, that's somebody having artistic fun, or that's somebody with a certain mindset, or that's somebody with a brand plug, some kind of a brand name.
	What we don't realize is before these symbols, and there's tons of them all over all media, were used by corporations to sell things, many of them had an arcane and esoteric symbolism, a purpose, far beyond their use in corporate commerce.
	So when I saw the tetrahedron on the Chinese lunar website, I instantly, as probably one of a relative small number of people on the planet who were following this work and doing it for the last 30, 40 years, I instantly realized what the Chinese may be trying to tell someone else who also understands the same symbology.
	In other words, you could have a thousand people look at that website and how many would recognize a tetrahedron, two of them in fact, and what it might mean.
	Do you believe that there is a race amongst the Indians, the Chinese, the Japanese, and of course the U.S. to unlock the secrets of the moon and to get them first?
	I think we have a 50-year head start because of Apollo and because of the back engineering.
	When the guys brought the stuff back to labs, you know, they probably did amazing research and analysis.
	And some of the major developments we're seeing in technology and aerospace and materials may in fact have come from the back engineering of lunar materials from this civilization that Apollo brought back under the highest government DX priority that Kennedy could stamp on the program.
	We got there first.
	Now the only other nation which has access to what we found is the Russians, but they never sent men so they could bring big stuff home.
	They had to only sample powders because their robots could only drill into the regolith and store, you know, a few grams of granular material.
	But the Russians, when they published their results on their lunar analyses, they're the ones that keep announcing that they found the fossils and desiccated remains of living bacterial organisms in their lunar soil.
	Well, that's a kind of a dead giveaway, Howard, that they're looking at what used to be living soil with living microorganisms that were used to keep people alive in farms and in wilderness areas with trees and grass and living ecosystems under those domes.
	In other words, the Russians went right for the analysis at the micro level of what an ancient civilization on the moon would inevitably have left behind if you knew what you were looking at.
	So cutting to the chase, scientists today are talking about going to the moon, living under domes, exploring it, exploiting the mineral wealth there, cultivating crops, people raising families, all the rest of it.
	All that's been done before.
	That's what the data says.
	We just don't know exactly who was living in these structures or exactly how ancient they are.
	My guess is we're looking at things that are millions of years old, but the pyramid, the little Karen pyramid sitting to the southwest, that appears to be much younger, much, much, much younger, maybe only a few thousand years old, and to have been built by a culture that could build something that small easily, but wouldn't have a clue as to how to build even the smallest of those glass structures seen on the farther horizon.
	So we're clearly looking at two, not limited just to two, we're looking at, in this example, two very radically different and temporally separated civilizations.
	Some remote viewers, and I don't know what you make of remote viewing as a technology, but some remote viewers are saying...
	Yes, yeah, yeah.
	Like Ingo's fan.
	Of that ilk.
	Are saying that ancient Egypt, as many people have said, was a civilization connected very much to something or someone out in space.
	Do we think the object there that's thousands of years old and so big and so different might have been put there by the people who put the pyramids where they are?
	That's an interesting question, Howard, because in Egyptian legend and mythology, the god of wisdom, Thoth, or Tahoti, as he's pronounced in some cultures, comes from the moon.
	And he instructs in the mythologies earthly beings, Egyptians, on how to build pyramids.
	And the pyramids are used to store things, to store knowledge, to store treasure, to store, you know, pharaohs in other mythologies.
	But their purpose is to preserve, and their connection is to the moon, to the God of the moon, to Hode, who if in fact the earthly pyramids were copies of a method of preserving that was first put in place on the moon by a previous earthly human culture that came and went tens of thousands of years ago as civilizations ebb and flow across the earth.
	Yeah, I can see that all as being very logical.
	And of course, all we're missing is data, which means we all have to go back.
	We can't let the Chinese do this by themselves.
	So what is the plan, do you think, in the U.S.?
	Well, I think very quietly, for a very long time, this president, Obama, who so many people throw so much scorn and vituperation upon for reasons that, frankly to me, don't make any sense, because he's certainly no worse than most of them, and he's a lot better than a lot of them in terms of U.S. presidents.
	I think it's been his plan all along that this was going to take place.
	I think he was tipped and given a heads up.
	And in fact, the reason that NASA is quietly building, at the behest of this administration, the largest rocket called the Space Launch System, SLS, which is bigger or as big as the Saturn V,
	and the Orion much more voluminous spacecraft, which is supposed to fly on the SLS in about 2017, ushering in a new era of manned U.S. space capability that would allow U.S. astronauts not only to go into Earth orbit,
	but also go back to the moon, that system could easily be adopted to take six astronauts from different nations, from China, from Japan, from India, from Brazil, from the European Union,
	from Russia, and send a series of united expeditions representing the advanced cultures of this planet together to the moon to find out what the Chinese have now disclosed.
	And you think that's a likelihood?
	It's a possibility.
	Tonight, I would say it's 50-50.
	Remember, something like 50 years ago, John Kennedy proposed to Khrushchev, the head of the evil empire, the head of the whole Soviet Union, that the Soviet Union and the U.S. go to the moon together, and Khrushchev ultimately accepted.
	So why would, in a modern era with social media and a tremendous ferment by people all over the world, that this be explored by all mankind, for all mankind?
	Why couldn't we tinker some kind of cooperation together when the alternative would be a very expensive, very costly, very time-consuming, and very destructive race between nations that were all going to get together when they get there anyway, just like the Antarctic?
	I mean, they're not going to devolve into a shooting war over stuff on the moon.
	So if they did it together, it would be much better for a lot of them than if they tried to do it separately.
	Because if they did it separately, the nations that really couldn't compete would take second best.
	And the guys like us and the Chinese and the Russians who have been doing this for a while, they would come back with the first prize.
	So I think it's in everybody's interest to think about doing this together.
	And that's what I'm going to propose officially in a formal venue probably sometime in the next few months.
	Robin and I have been invited to visit Russia and for me to give a speech and to be given an award by the Russian Writers' Union.
	And because of what Putin has been doing with the Crimea and the Ukraine, I have been thinking a lot as to the pros and cons.
	And I think I've decided that I'm going to go ahead with the invitation and go to Russia and basically announce not only these results, but also lay out the idea of a joint expedition that would involve all of the major space powers to go and basically begin to explore this on behalf of everybody who lives on this planet and share the benefits of the stunning material science, technology, libraries.
	Can you imagine if that cairn is a carefully prepared library with discs or crystals or something that records the more ancient lunar civilization that those guys found in some other archive?
	And so they left it in one place so that their descendants could come and get it, bring it home, and then begin to make use of it.
	I mean, there is no limit to what's possible given what the Chinese have now confirmed.
	Richard, the Russians have always been much more accepting of you and your research.
	I know you've done other things in Russia.
	They like you out there.
	They do.
	The Russian television network did 120 million viewer documentary on our work a couple years ago.
	They've sent crews here who spent days at Enterprise, you know, interviewing me and talking and looking at our archives and filming in various locations around New Mexico for local color.
	There was a crew which came here a couple years ago to film me on the top of the Sandia measuring the hyperdimensional physics of this total solar eclipse that crossed Albuquerque then.
	And we've also had a lot of magazine coverage, including a couple of cover stories in a couple of their major magazines put out by ItAR-TASS, which is the official Russian news agency.
	So yeah, I think that if I were to go to Russia in answer to this invitation and to lay out how we all could go and benefit from this extraordinary discovery together, because remember, the Chinese have not discovered this.
	The Chinese have just made it public after the U.S. discovered it and the Russians decades ago.
	So it's not like we're cutting into anybody's turf.
	This data, this knowledge, this heritage belongs to all of humankind, and it's up to those of us that understand this to basically make the case while the situation is extraordinarily fluid.
	A lot of my U.S. listeners, and I'm sure some of my British listeners as well, will be a little depressed that you cannot hold that news conference, and it's easier for you to hold that news conference and make your announcement in Moscow than it might be in Washington, D.C. or London.
	It seems, I mean, we've had a standing invitation to go and do something in Moscow for years, and this time they're willing to pay the freight and bring us over and Put us up.
	And apparently, this conference is partially supported.
	This is the pre-Ukraine situation, by the U.S. Embassy, which tells me that maybe somebody is being really smart and realizes that if this idea is enunciated on Russian soil, it will be easier to, shall we say, bring certain political people in line here and have them go along with it.
	That's fascinating.
	The Chinese dimension.
	The Chinese dimension.
	I mean, I know you work by yourself in Albuquerque, but you are connected to the outside world and the scientific community.
	Has anybody in China even tacitly confirmed or even gone a step towards confirming any of the stuff you're saying here?
	Well, one indicator that I've been looking for, because Howard, as much as I love you, you're not the first guy that I've told this to.
	That was George and Dorian Coast to Coast the other night.
	I'll forgive you.
	And as part of the Coast Show, which I did coincident with publishing the paper on the Enterprise Mission website, I warned people when you go and you download these images of these ancient ruins in our paper, download and store the entire website just in case somebody in China wakes up and says, holy cow, we didn't mean to do that.
	And they went and they change everything.
	Well, I was on coast the 22nd.
	Tonight, we are speaking on the 29th.
	And so far, there has been no change of the data on the official Chinese websites.
	It's the same data tonight that it was almost two weeks ago.
	And that is, to me, a very good sign because it means that they're basically wanting us to be part of the disclosure process.
	And by us, I mean Western researchers, Western journalists, Western net people to spread the word.
	I mean, this is the most elegant way to ensure ultimate disclosure because if you put this data out there and it is copied and copied and copied and copied and people write blogs about it and they copy the images and then they write Twitter accounts and post the images and then they send it on to Facebook and it all conglomerates to millions of downloads and millions of shares,
	there's no possible way that the sensors, be they in China or in Moscow or in Washington, could put this genie back in the bottle.
	It's a brilliant strategy of disclosure at the grassroots net roots level.
	And of course, if the Chinese do get to all of this first, if they do get their hands on all of it first.
	Well, they already have.
	Well, that puts them in a very, very, very powerful position.
	No one else is ever going to be as powerful.
	Hang on, Howard, except for one thing.
	They have never done this before.
	We have done this a lot.
	We are quietly working on technologies to take human beings there to the moon in a massive expedition that would allow the most incredible exploration of ruins and libraries and heritage and the connection to the human race and all of that.
	But the Chinese would have to invent all of that from scratch.
	So if we were to get the bit in our teeth, like after Sputnik, where we were shocked that the Russians, you know, got ahead of the vaunted, mighty United States, and then we basically got to the moon ahead of the Russians because we decided it was in our interest to,
	well, if that's the situation the Chinese are inadvertently setting up, all they're going to do is guarantee that NASA will have another space program again worthy of the name, that there will be private echelons for people like Elon Musk and Bezos and the others that are doing the private space thing with like Falcon and the All Blue Origins and the other private spacecraft.
	And there's going to be one heck of a land rush, kind of like the 1800s land rush from Kansas when they open the federal lands to the west to Homesteading.
	There's going to be an incredible race by all different nations and cultures and technologies to get to the moon, to find the astonishing, stunning technological prizes waiting for whoever can get there and bring the stuff back.
	And as an Apollo veteran, which you are, you're very patriotic about all this stuff.
	Your money's on America to do this first, not the Chinese.
	Absolutely.
	And I think Obama's quietly been planning this for a very long time.
	And that's why the Chinese, when they landed on the moon, they landed at 19.5 west.
	What you don't know, and I'm going to tell you now, is the other coordinate, because remember, you have to have two sets of coordinates to have a position on a sphere in space.
	Latitude and longitude.
	19.5 west by 44 north.
	And who is 44 in this equation?
	Tell me.
	Barack Hussein Obama is the 44th President of the United States.
	This is a direct message to him to do what he was elected to do, even if most people don't realize that's what he was elected to do.
	And if this is symbology being used at him, do you think the people around who have picked this up?
	Some have, most haven't.
	I find in my conversations with people about symbology, it's almost like discussing someone's religion or, you know, the sex of the person that they're sleeping with.
	I mean, we have certain taboo subjects in our culture.
	Trying to discuss symbolism seriously as a tool of international intrigue and secret society power manipulation and an ultimate inside conversation as to plans and goals really falls on deaf ears with most people, but not everybody.
	So I'm only talking to those people that understand the incredible non-coincidental power of this symbolism and realize, coupled with the actual images of ancient glass ruins, that life has changed and it's never going to be the same and you only have so many minutes or days Or hours or weeks or months until this hits the mainstream and everything is up for grabs.
	Sounds to me like at this stage in your work, Dick, you're tying all this stuff together.
	The hyperdimensional physics, the torsion field theory, the face on Mars, all your other work is all coming together.
	Because geometrically, there are connections in all of that.
	It's all coming together.
	Is that how you feel?
	Well, this has been going on for quite a while.
	Remember back in 1997 when NASA sent the first little rover to Mars?
	A rover called Sojourner?
	That it was about the size of a microwave oven and had a couple of instruments and a camera.
	And they landed it remotely by means of computers and it crundled around for like a year or so.
	And then it died for lack of some part whatever.
	But it was successful for about a year.
	Do you remember where on Mars NASA landed the Sojourner rover?
	19.5.
	19.5.
	Yes.
	And they sent the darn spacecraft to Mars in a tetrahedral box.
	If you Google Sojourner rover, you will find so many similarities with what the Chinese have done that NASA did decades ago with Mars.
	It's like there's two groups.
	There's an in-group that know what all this means and why it's important and why it's powerful.
	And then there's everybody else that think it's just science and think that just engineering priorities and discussions and decisions hold sway.
	No, there is a huge symbolic ritual component because the numbers mean something in a much larger context.
	When I say to people that know 19.5, they know that is a code for unlimited energy, unlimited resources, unlimited human potential, biology, lifespan, a total radical change in our way of thinking about living on a planet, living in three space.
	They realize that that simple phrase, 19.5, carries with it inherently all of these other implications if the technology behind that number is ever put to use.
	That's what the Chinese have told everybody that knows, certainly those in the power structure that have far more influence on these matters in the West than I do.
	But I intend to publicly lay out and interpret what the Chinese have done for those people in the middle that may want to learn a thing or two.
	And then when you've done that, what do you do?
	Well, if life was fair, if history was fair, nothing's fair.
	And there's ultimately a political decision coming out of Washington to basically put more money into the SLS program and to formally invite China and India and Russia, et cetera, to basically go to the moon together, I would like to be invited to the party.
	I would like to have access to that data and those images and those results so we could continue our independent analysis, kind of like a watchdog, a public watchdog, on what the official government spin and perspective on this could be and would be and maybe will be.
	I don't think that's asking too much, given that it's supposed to be ultimately, if this joint mission were to come off on behalf of all mankind, and the last time I looked, I'm a member of mankind.
	Okay.
	And do you realistically think that they're going to give Richard C. Hoagland the chance?
	Because don't forget, and you know this just as well as I do, there are people who think that you are consistently and completely wrong.
	Well, we know, we know.
	Yeah, the only way that you confront those people is by demonstrating that you're actually right.
	In this case, the Chinese have done me a huge favor, me personally, because they have basically proclaimed to the world that for the 30 years that I've been describing and laying out on imagery from NASA, these ancient ruins, they have now come along with a different political philosophy, a different technology, a different landing site, different everything, and in essence said on their official websites, my gosh, look at that.
	Hoagland's right.
	What you need is an invitation to Beijing, I think.
	Look, anything is possible once this reaches the kind of viral level, which is one of the reasons I wanted to do your show.
	Because I want people to log on to EnterpriseMission.com, download the paper, download the Chinese imagery, download the Chinese websites which are hosting this imagery, save everything, and wait till there's this extraordinary event,
	which is that someone somewhere sometime in the not-too-distant future, I think we're looking at months, not years, are going to basically announce what the Chinese have deftly done and posted but have not announced yet, that we are not alone, that we are heir to something extraordinary right next door, accessible to all the current space technology which is being built and funded.
	When the Congress realizes that it's either get there or be square, that the Chinese will have their hands on this toy, don't you think that there will be a united cross-the-aisles effort on the part of both Democrats and Republicans to fund NASA to a level where it actually can compete successfully?
	Because at this point, all you need to do to accelerate the time of the next U.S. landing and exploration of these ruins is to simply turn on the money machine and give NASA a few more billion dollars to fund more test flights, more development, more spacecraft, more rockets, so they can do basically what Kennedy wanted to do with Khrushchev 50 years ago.
	As far as you know, is anybody else in the U.S. scientifically looking at the data in the way that you're looking at it?
	Well, before I published, I actually sent copies of the paper around to the kind of kitchen cabinet of experts, you know, physicists and opticians and other scientists that are loosely part of Enterprise.
	And I got back some extraordinarily positive remarks and comments.
	I asked one of my colleagues, I said, was I too hard on the Chinese in the paper?
	And they said no, that was one of my concerns.
	But in terms of seeing the data, I had one of my friends in Britain, who you don't know, but maybe someday you might want to meet.
	He is a city manager.
	He's an engineer who is in a reasonably important governmental position in a medium-sized town in Britain.
	Really?
	And he has been watching our work and fighting with us his discoveries and vice versa for decades.
	Well, he sent me this morning an email basically saying he had done everything I'd recommended, gone to the Chinese Army website, downloaded the image, put it through several programs, done the brightening, done the equalization, and lo and behold, the darn glass ruins are there.
	I mean, you can't ask more of science than independent replication.
	So, yeah, I'm getting incredible positive support by people that know what they're doing and have followed our work for decades that, in fact, we have really got them by the short hairs this time because you cannot argue against this data.
	It is bulletproof.
	It is real.
	And it's independent.
	Trouble is that you are always going to be, to some extent, Richard, in the coattails of any government's black ops budgets, their scientific establishment, all the rest of it.
	They will always have more resources to throw at things than you've got.
	So you'll always, by definition, going to be behind them.
	Is that hanging on?
	But that's why you also in this game want to, shall we say, get to know some new friends.
	Like, one of the people that I'm looking to actually meet now and brief on this in person is Elon Musk.
	Do you know the name?
	I do.
	The explorer, the man who was going to put his money where his mouth is and get out of here.
	He's put billions of dollars into his private rocket company, SpaceX.
	He has a contract with NASA to do one of the unmanned spacecraft refurbishments to and from the space station.
	He is building a human version of the capsule he uses to send equipment and supplies to ISIS called the Dragon capsule.
	And he is building a rocket which could, in the private realm, compete very successfully with NASA's government-developed space launch system.
	He looks very serious.
	Let me tell you, I tried to contact him.
	I tried a couple of times to contact him through his press contacts.
	Didn't get any response.
	So I hope you've done better than I've done.
	Well, I've actually talked to him, not about this, about his previous missions, and I have third parties that can intervene.
	Now that I have something seriously interesting to show him, I don't know whether it's going to be hard or not.
	But that's one of, you know, if I don't get to him, I'll get to some of the other private space guys.
	And this will then go viral through the community, as all this stuff does.
	And in the middle of the night, he will look at these images and realize the Chinese are whisker away from taking a toy for their own that actually deserves to belong to a lot more people.
	And Elon Musk has the capabilities of sending a private unmanned mission or a manned mission someday to the moon to bring home and retrieve some of these things.
	And then, of course, everything's up for grab.
	So we are standing, I think, Howard, at the fulcrum of history.
	We are standing at a waypoint where things can either get very, very, very worse for the human race.
	Look at all the conflicts, look at all the contradictions, look at all the greed and the incredible disparagement of the environment and the pushing ahead with energy policies that are not going to bode well for the longevity of the human race.
	And then you contrast that with the potentials for stunning development and progress and leaping centuries, if not millennia, forward, if we were to invite and to undertake together the proper exploration of what's in our own backyard.
	To me, it's a no-brainer.
	And I'm forward to launching this campaign.
	As I said, I've got an invitation to go to Russia to talk about whatever I want.
	And I have a feeling this is what I'm going to talk about.
	I think you need to make contact with a man called Max Kaiser.
	He's been on this show.
	He's on Russia Today, RT Television.
	You might find him somebody interesting.
	Okay.
	I can send you his email.
	I'll send you his, he's got an email address that I can send to you if you want to.
	The other person I think you should be in contact with, as well as Mr. Musk, is Richard Branson here.
	Richard Branson is an entrepreneur, as you know, airline owner, everything owner, very clever guy, and also, from my experience, somebody who is open to new ideas.
	That's an excellent idea.
	I think he would at least listen to, from what I've heard about him and from colleagues who've had contact with him, I think he would listen.
	I happen to know from certain sources that Richard Branson, for some years, has been very interested in alternative space propulsion technologies, and I'll just leave it there.
	Okay, well, I can see good things happening.
	You have a mountain to climb, though, with popular public opinion.
	I'm not talking about people like me, because I love all of this stuff.
	And the people who listen to Coast to Coast AM and the States, you know, they're on your side.
	But there are tens of millions of people who just don't get it.
	What are you going to do about them?
	Well, do you remember, of course you don't remember because you're not that old, and neither am I, but there is a little bit of history between the United States and England, between the Crown and the colonies.
	And remember when we kind of broke away?
	Do you know how many people actually wanted to leave England and set up their own country?
	Quite a few, I'd have thought.
	2%.
	2%.
	Okay.
	2%.
	All it takes, Howard, is 2% to Change the world, and I can reach 2% not even breaking a sweat.
	And what are you going to be working on next?
	I know you're having the news conference.
	Are you going to concentrate on the moon from now on?
	Are you going back to Mars?
	Are we talking Saturn?
	There's a lot of stuff going on.
	I mean, we've got the Horizons mission, New Horizons, which is going to Pluto, going to fly by in July of next year that I've been asked to write something about for a special volume dedicated to the upcoming exploration of Pluto.
	I'm looking, I'm talking with some folks about television, my own television show, which will allow me to do the visual history in exquisite detail in the way that I like to produce things.
	I'm still running around the world with Robin doing these on-site ancient archaeological measurements that allow us to actually measure the torsion field effect on pyramids here on Earth, which, by the way, when I write part two of the China piece,
	I'm going to put in some evidence we have that the Chinese landed next to this little pyramid because they also wanted to measure the hyperdimensional effects of the pyramid during the total solar eclipse that the two spacecraft were able to witness on the morning of April 15th, which is a few days ago.
	So there's a lot to do regarding many missions, many potential revelations, what's going on with Mars, with NASA's Curiosity mission, which is revealing more and more stunning, blatant artifacts every day.
	And they're being jpegged and obscured by noise inserted deliberately in the pictures less and less.
	So they're more and more blatant for people that don't do this for a living and kind of like the need to see overwhelming evidence.
	So a lot of this, I think, is all heading in the same direction.
	So that's why I think it will not be very long now, months, not years, but months maybe until we have some kind of official indications that our analysis is right.
	And again, what people need to do is go to EnterpriseMission.com, go to the first banner, what the Chinese have really discovered on the moon, click on that link, go to the paper, download the Chinese images, download the Chinese websites, and then stand back and watch the fun because it's going to be a lot of fun.
	And as a great man once said, and I hope we'll say again, want to take a ride?
	I think that's going to be a hell of a ride.
	Just very quickly, I wanted to ask you about this.
	About a week or two back, there was another tremendous space announcement.
	We were told that there was a very Earth-like planet that's just been discovered so far away we can only just see that place.
	What did you make of that?
	Well, I think it's coordination.
	Look, Brookings said decades ago, Brookings was this secret NASA report that basically told NASA they couldn't tell the public the truth about ancient ruins or civilizations because they would freak out and destroy civilization.
	So they had to acclimate them through media.
	I think the Earth, you know, the Kepler mission has found Earth's cousin 500 light years away.
	I mean, I saw more stories approaching that from different angles in the period of about a week around the Chinese conversations I had with George on Coast.
	I think the two are related.
	I think there is a general groundswell of stories being fed to media to get people more and more thinking about we're not low.
	We're not the only ones.
	There's now another Earth out there.
	Well, if there's another Earth, there could be other Earth-like people.
	See where that goes.
	Amazing, though.
	And I just hope I'm sure you feel the same, but I would love that discovery to be made in my lifetime before I have to shuttle off or even shuttle off.
	That was a Freudian slip.
	Shuttle off this mortal coil.
	I don't think you have to worry, Howard.
	I think it's going to happen where we all can watch and maybe, if we're really lucky, effectively participate.
	Well, the little boy who used to buy space comics and who used to watch Thunderbirds and who used to love every space serial.
	I mean, the first one for me when I was a kid, and this is dating me, was Fireball XL5 that was made right here in the UK.
	Oh my God.
	I remember that.
	It was Thunderbirds.
	And Thunderbirds, all made by Gerry Anderson, not 20 miles, 15 miles from where I'm sitting right now.
	And of course, we lost Jerry Anderson quite recently.
	But, you know, I've been fascinated since I was a boy, as you have.
	I would love to see this happen.
	One stop shop for all this information is Enterprisemission.com, right?
	That's it.
	Enterprisemission.com.
	Lovely to talk to you, Richard.
	Give my best to Robin.
	And when you go to Moscow, if you get time, let's talk again.
	Let's see how they receive you there.
	Have fun, and we'll talk soon.
	Take care, Richard.
	All the very best.
	As ever, with Richard and all of our guests, you make up your mind, but please tell me what you think.
	If you've got feedback on this show, let me have it.
	Go to www.theonexplained.tv.
	That's the website address.
	And you can send me an email from there or indeed make a donation to the show.
	On the next edition, I'm hoping we're going to be able to have a special about space junk.
	It really intrigues me, this subject, all the stuff we've put into space over the years.
	What happens to it?
	And is any of it a hazard?
	If you saw the movie Gravity, you will understand that perhaps it might be.
	I'm going to be talking with one of the world's leading experts on space junk and what to do about it, hopefully, in the next edition of this show.
	So stay here for that.
	And many other good guests coming soon as well.
	Thank you very much to Adam Cornwell at Creative Hotspot in Liverpool for getting the show out to you, maintaining the website and doing top work as ever.
	Thank you to Martin for the theme tune.
	Get in touch, Martin.
	We'd like to hear from you.
	And above all, thank you to you for keeping the faith with me and for supporting me through these times at The Unexplained.
	Until next we meet, stay safe, stay calm, and stay in touch.
	My name is Howard Hughes.
	This has been The Unexplained and I will return here soon.

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