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Dec. 23, 2013 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:07:10
Edition 137 - End Of Year Show

A year-end trip to “Ouija-lady” Karen Dahlman plus never-aired audio from a 1940s Liverpoolspirit investigator…

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Across the UK, across continental North America and around the world, on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is the last unexplained of 2013.
Thank you very much for your ongoing support through what has been, for an awful lot of us, a very trying year, one way or another.
Many tests to face.
Not only publicly, with public figures, have we lost a lot of important people, most recently, of course, Nelson Mandela.
And in the world of entertainment, well, you can count the celebrities we've lost this year, people like Andy Williams, who, of course, is very famous at Christmastime for his Christmas songs and his Christmas shows.
But so many people we've lost during this year.
And in our own lives, I know a lot of you are mourning the passing of people.
I myself here in London, I've lost three of my neighbors very close to where I live.
And that has been sad.
Very.
And the greatest blow to me over this year, the loss of my dear father, the original Liverpool good cop, a fine man who influenced me enormously and was always there for me, above and beyond what you would expect from any parent.
My dad was a wonderful man.
And this Christmas, I miss him enormously, which is why around Christmas time and into the new year, I just want to have a little period of being quiet so I can reflect on the lives of my parents, because this is the first Christmas that I will be without both parents.
But a lot of us have faced these things.
Now, I wanted to try and achieve a few things on this show.
I wanted to look into 2014 and see how we can maybe try to make it better.
I don't do, let me say this right up front, I don't do predictions.
I remember once going on the radio and saying, what a great year this is going to be.
And it was far from that.
So I simply never, ever, ever predict anything for a new year.
But this is not prediction.
This is talking about shaping and using your own creativity to maybe craft a better you and a better new year.
Let's see if we can do that.
We're going to talk to Karen Dallman in California.
She was on here last talking about her work over 40 years with the Ouija board.
She's had a lot of success over this year of 2013, so we'll catch up with her about that.
And talk about harnessing your own creativity.
I think this is a good time to do that as we step out of one year and into another.
With everything that that might hold one way or another.
The other thing I'd like to do is to look back and to look back at somebody I spoke to a long time ago.
When I was a student broadcaster, and I know I've mentioned this before on The Unexplained, I put together a documentary called Sight Unseen.
Now, Sight Unseen was about life after death, and to a certain extent, ghosts.
I spoke with people like Alan Gould at the University of Nottingham, who is still researching these things.
And one of the people I met in Liverpool was an amazing lady who'd been a deputy headmistress of a school in Liverpool.
Her name, Lola McNaught.
I've never, ever forgotten that name.
Very well spoken, highly intelligent, and somebody who told me all about the golden age of medium ship in Liverpool in the 30s, 40s, and 50s.
Now, Lola McNaught was well into her 70s when I spoke to her.
She would probably be 100 now.
I don't know whether she's still with us.
I'm assuming she may not be.
If she is, I wish her well.
And if she isn't, then I hope she'd approve of me letting you hear the raw material of this interview now.
The interview I found when I was going through miles and miles and miles of tape at my dad's home when we were doing a clearance there, when we were trying to clear it out.
And I threw away a lot of items, but this is one of the many items that I kept.
So we'll hear from Lola McNaught after we've heard from Karen Dorman in California.
Just a few thank yous.
Thank you to Adam Cornwell at Creative Hotspot for creating the website, www.theunexplained.tv, that you see before you, and also for getting the show out to you.
Thanks very much, Adam, for all of your help and support.
Martin, thank you for the theme tune.
I hope 2014 is going to be good for you.
And above all, to you, thank you for your support and all the good things you have said in your emails.
If you want to contact me or make a donation to the show, donations gratefully received and much needed.
www.theunexplained.tv.
Just very quickly to say, you may not hear this show for a few days after I've recorded it because I know that iTunes, and a lot of you use iTunes, are delaying some podcasts.
I think they're having a break for putting new podcasts on there.
But you will find this on my website directly.
But if you use iTunes, you may not get it until the very back end of December.
Let's see how that goes.
Okay, let's do the business now.
Let's get into it.
Let's get to Karen Dolman, first of all, in California and say, Karen, nice to have you back on The Unexplained.
Well, thank you for having me.
I'm so happy to be here, Howard.
Oh, Karen, I don't know about you and your life, but this year, with all its highs and its deep lows, has raced by.
You and I spoke in February 2013.
It is now nearly Christmas as we record this.
Where did it go?
I don't know.
It was amazing.
It just flew by, like you said.
And this last year, I think for many people, has been really a trying year.
It's been kind of a lot of trials and tribulations, ups and downs.
And then it just flew by.
And all of a sudden, next thing you know, we were here at Christmas.
I mean, I feel like we skipped over somehow Halloween and Thanksgiving so quickly.
I'm not sure.
But here we are at the end of the year.
It's amazing.
And a lot of traumas.
I was sharing with my listeners some stuff that they know anyway, that, you know, I lost my father this year, and you know about that because we had some conversations not for broadcast about that.
I lost three of my neighbors this year.
I don't know if I ever told you that.
Three of them.
You know, I had Peter who lived next door to me, who was in his 70s, wiry and fit and tennis playing.
And we lost him.
And then there was Penny, who was a lady who used to work for the BBC television as a PA, they called them, almost like an assistant producer.
A very warm but very strong lady.
We lost her and another neighbor we lost as well.
So what a year this has been for so many of us.
You know, and I've heard that from a lot of people.
There's been a lot of deaths, a lot of deaths that I've heard about and just a lot of changes for people too.
And of course, for over here, it's because of the economy in the United States and other reasons.
But yeah, it's been a tough year.
And I think a lot of people agree with me on that.
And some of my spirit friends have told me some things about that as well.
Okay, well, don't leave me there dangling.
What sorts of things have they told you?
Let's get into it right now.
Okay, let's jump in.
So they were talking a lot about October and November as being really tough months.
And right there, that's that Halloween Thanksgiving thing I talked about.
We kind of all flew through.
I think a lot of us may not have noticed all those holidays because there was so much going on in everybody's lives.
And the spirits that talked about that said it's really a tough time right now.
People are really changing, transforming, and the toughness that they see is really what's going on.
It's just forcing them to be in a different position in their life, to think differently, to live differently, to feel differently.
And all these changes are for a reason, but yet it doesn't always make it easier when you're in the midst of them.
So I got a lot of messages on that during October and November.
And then they also said that December would be a lot more refreshing for people, yet there's a lot of sadness in people's hearts.
And in fact, I have a message that they just gave to me.
Oh, I think it was last week.
Yeah.
And the message goes like this.
It was from my friend, my spirit guide, Healing Spirit, and I talk about him in the book a lot.
He said there's open hearts for the families during this time of year.
He says, Healing Spirit is feeling so much sadness for so many.
And he goes, it's because the families are missing their loved ones.
He says, not all families heal after losing someone.
He says, they said these are very hard times, but they're going to have to work with themselves to heal that.
So there's a lot of healing going on, and it's been going on this whole year.
And, you know, I don't know.
I haven't heard, but I can only guess in my own mind, this is related somehow to that, you know, the Mayan calendar ending, that 2012, stepping into a new beginning.
And it sure felt like that when we hit 2013.
Well, I don't know if it's down to the Mayan calendar, but I just, I think a lot of us sense that something is going on.
And there is some also sense of regeneration.
I mean, they're even telling us here, the government's been telling us for a long time the economy would improve.
And I think most of us didn't believe them.
There are signs that it is improving, but these are still very, very tough times.
Now, I have to ask you about these messages, okay?
Because I've got a lot of very astute listeners, and they are people who will say, Karen Dolman in America is a great presenter of information, but these are just warm words and meaningless platitudes.
They would want some proof as to where you got this stuff and how you know you're getting this stuff from spirit.
Right.
And, you know, and I get those questions, and I think that's a very smart way to respond to this.
Always be skeptical and always question.
And that's the only way we can learn.
You know, I spent many years questioning in the beginning, just where else was coming from.
And to your listeners that don't know about my work, I've been doing the Ouija board for over 40 years now.
And the last book I wrote, The Spirits, a Ouija, four decades of communication, is about my whole odyssey, my journey through the use of the board.
So when people ask me that question, I really tell them, and I was just asked this the other day by one of your listeners, you know, how do we know you're not a fraudster?
And I love that term because I said, you know, you don't know.
I said, all you can really do for yourself, you know, don't take anything, you know, seriously.
You just always look at it objectively.
I said, you got to go within yourself and ask yourself, does this message resonate for you?
Does what I talk about resonate for you?
If it doesn't, then, you know, it's not for you.
Well, listen, I've got your two books here.
I'm sorry to jump in and interrupt.
One of my listeners took me to task about interrupting people, and I'm really sorry to that person.
It's just this news training that I have where you get guests, and I know this is not a news show, but the training never leaves you where somebody's talking and you feel you've got to get in with something because every second is precious.
So forgive me for this, but I've just done something that I do a lot with books.
I quite often open them and see what page they fall open at.
And quite often, what I get is very, very relevant.
So your book fell open, your book, The Spirits of Ouija, Four Decades of Communication.
This is about your story, effectively, using Ouija.
And of course, page 170, if you're familiar with it, which you will be because you wrote it, it's change.
And I quote, you say, it seems that the entire purpose of using Ouija, in my view, is to affect change within myself and others.
Change is the only constant we have in life.
Therefore, count on it.
That's a fact.
So change is flagged up by Ouija, you say, and change is Ouija can be used to detect what the change means.
Ouija can be used to detect what the change means.
It's also to encourage change.
In fact, I use it mostly to encourage change.
And when I say encourage change, it's to grow into my bigger self, my grander self, to help people grow into their greater self.
And you do that through using the board in ways of speaking with guides or communicating with these entities who are, you're there to help you.
They could be your loved ones that passed on.
They could be your guardians, your guides, your angels.
I speak to a little bit of everything.
And they come through to help us, to help us grow and evolve, just like what change is about.
Without change, you don't have evolution and growth.
We were talking about 2013 and all this stuff that's been going on, the turmoil people have been feeling and the loss.
And that, again, that's for a reason of change, is to put us in another level of consciousness.
And this is what I use the Ouija for, to put myself in another level of consciousness.
Because what we do, if I may go on a little bit here, we use kind of like a Socratic method of questioning.
The board does this with me.
My spirit guides do this with me.
Instead of giving me an answer, they'll say, what do you think?
They'll ask me a question back.
Have you thought about trying this?
And what do you think of this?
Now, why are you still doing this?
You're beating your head against the wall.
You're getting nowhere.
Why are you still doing this?
And then I'll answer, but have you thought about this?
And they keep using levels of questions.
And they even encourage me to ask questions back to get to a level of some kind of critical thinking.
And when you do that, you start to go deeper within yourself.
And the people in the room do too.
And the message are always very universal.
Yes, it could be like new age platitudes, but yet it relates to everybody in the room.
And then we have a conversation, a dialogue pursues about that information to see how we ingest it and how it relates to our own Life.
So that is how we get into using it to evolve ourselves, to grow.
That's a fascinating way of doing things.
I remember being a student, and I don't know whether I was, what, 18?
I don't know whether I entirely understood it, but I remember the lecture of putting up on the board at Liverpool University back then, long time ago.
And I was the first member of my family to go to university.
And even I wasn't sure whether I belonged there because people like me just didn't do these things.
But the guy wrote up on the board about you get a thesis, antithesis, in other words, antithesis.
And then from those two things, you get synthesis, where you have the argument, the counter-argument, and then the compromise, where the two meet in the middle.
And that sounds to me like what you're doing with Ouija.
You're asking spirit via this board answers to questions.
Yes, I am.
But I'm also open for a message.
And the message comes through.
And then it's about a dialogue about it.
They will ask me questions and I'll ask them questions.
And they'll ask anybody in the room the same thing.
They may just give a message, but then questions always ensue.
And then they use respond with a question to make us think for ourselves.
They tell me they don't want, there's no answers to give us.
They say all the answers are within you.
They make us go within to get the answers.
So that is what the Socratic method does.
It makes you, like you said, you use the stesis, the antithesis of it, and find the center place, that synergy, the synthesis of it, where you find that commonality of how the two parts come together.
My first book, I talk a lot about this in a chapter called Dualism.
You know, there's nothing, I don't believe in good, bad.
What I believe in is there's love and there's fear.
And out of that, all the other emotions and activities and behaviors come from those two places that we exist within.
And we got to find out those two places are not really opposites.
They're really of the same.
There's a synergy and synthesis between the two.
And when you find yourself in that middle spot, which my spirit guides help me go there with this work, or I do it through journaling, or I do it through, you could do it through psychotherapy, you could do it through hypnosis.
I do it in a lot of different ways.
But getting into that middle spot, you begin to see something, maybe an answer, maybe a resolution.
Something you'll find in that middle spot, which is better than the two that are separate by themselves.
I'm comfortable talking about this now.
I wouldn't have been a few months ago.
But earlier this year, I kind of suggested to you, this was after the loss of my dad, which, look, let me tell you, even at Christmas particularly, you feel this.
As much as you try and think, well, he's in a better place now, it's tough.
And now you did something for me.
You asked the board about my dad because I was very concerned about the way that he passed.
They put him on a thing, you won't know what this is, but it's been in the news here.
The hospital that he was in put him on a thing called the Liverpool Care Pathway.
And this may sound horrendous to you in America.
And certainly, you know, the government and others have now asked questions about this.
But they put him on this thing where they effectively didn't give him water and didn't give him sustenance so that because he was so very sick, I think the, I don't know whether it's the aim of the thing, I don't think we can say that, but nature takes its course and a lot of people die.
And now that process, rightly, I think, is being very seriously questioned.
But I felt very bad after my dad had died about this because we didn't, my sister and I, we didn't know he was on this pathway, you know, until after he'd gone.
Then they informed us properly about what the procedure was.
And it was used in many, many hospitals.
It was a clinical procedure that's now being questioned this year.
But look, this left us in turn one.
And I'm not alone here.
There will be people in England listening to this now who've been through the same thing.
I worried about the way that he passed.
I wanted him to be at peace.
And it was hugely, massively traumatic.
You asked the board about this, and you got back a message.
And I don't know if you remember what it was, but I can tell you what it was.
It was at peace.
Yes.
What I want to ask you about that because it helped me at the time, let me tell you.
How did you get that?
Where was that?
Was that my dad?
Your dad couldn't come through.
He was still healing on the other side.
Who came through was some of the other spirit guys that said, this is a message from his father to give to Howard.
And it was that your father is at peace.
And, you know, when I do the board, since I've been doing it for such a long time, you start to get a feeling.
And I would love to talk more about feelings too, because that's a critical piece of any of the spiritual work you do with going within yourself and learning about life and truths and all those things.
There's a feeling you get when you do the board.
And I've asked my other operators who work the board with me too.
You start to sense different energies coming through because they change the way they move.
They change the intensity.
You might get a warmth through your hands.
You might get a flush through your body.
It's all through feeling.
That's a conduit to everything back out there.
I felt a very calmness come through, a very steady communicator that came through.
And it was one of my guides coming through on your father's behalf who reached out to him and said, he's at peace and he wants his son to know this.
It was very clear and very calm.
And I could feel that peace.
And that's why I knew it was important to give you that message.
And I did not know how your father died.
I did not know about any of this, this stuff you're talking about right now.
I didn't know any of that.
And I didn't want to know any of that because I wanted to see what I would get for you without being clouded or judged, any kind of judgment or anything.
Well, whatever it was and wherever it came from, you know, it was a help at the time.
And, you know, we have to, as broadcasters, retain a healthy skepticism about stuff.
And certainly if you were on broadcast radio, I would have to bring it back to that all the time because by statute, by regulation, we're required to.
We can be a bit more flexible here on the internet, which is one of the great positives.
But you have to be skeptical about it.
But the message fitted for me very, very well.
I'm sure you do this for other people as well.
I do.
But I was just fascinated by the mechanic as to how you got that.
You know, you and I were going to do a show, and we will do a show where we actually do a Ouija session.
I'm not afraid of that.
I know others have backed away from all of this.
I haven't.
I'm going to do it.
I just want to, and we've talked about it, but we're going to do it right.
We're going to do it at the right time.
That's for that.
And that's for both of us.
And I sense this is not the right time.
And this is not a get-out at all.
And, you know, it's got to be the right time and space.
I agree.
And lately.
I agree.
You want to go too.
Well, I've been getting my show back on the road life-wise, you know, these last months.
You know, I had this hearing problem that meant I didn't work for a while.
Recently, I've gone back on the radio.
I've been doing some shifts for the BBC of all places.
I've been commercial radio man all my life, so I've learned a great deal, which has been marvelous for me.
So, you know, when the space is right, we will do this thing and I will probe it journalistically.
I know you would expect that.
I would want that, absolutely.
But I want to do it when I'm in a good space to do that.
And I guess you would.
I'm putting words in your mouth now, Karen.
Sorry.
But I guess that would be the advice you would give to anybody.
I'm not psychic reading right now, I think.
I concur with you.
I concur.
It's got to be the right space for both of us.
And you know, me, I'm eager because I know where I am with trustiness, but I also know it's important that when I do any kind of work with people that are in the room, that they're ready and open and want this.
Because that's when we get the best results.
It's really all about an intention and energy.
And we've got to be in that right spot.
And it's got to be right for your listeners and your show.
It's got to be right for that for you.
And like also, you said health-wise as well.
That's perfect.
And I've got to say that I am not here recommending the use of the Ouija board.
What I would say is that like anything in life, like going on a holiday to Acapulco, like buying yourself a new coat, you have to weigh the pros and cons of it and make a grown-up decision yourself.
So please don't think if you're listening to this now that I'm here advocating this, because I know an awful lot of people, and you know this, Karen, we talked about it last time.
They hear that word Ouija and they freak.
Yeah, and you know what?
I'm not advocating for people to use it either.
I'm just willing to tell my story and how I use it because I think it's been such a misconception about the board that I just felt like it's time to talk about it now.
I mean, I've been doing this secretly for 39 plus years and I finally just came out about it just a year talking about I've been using the board with people.
I mean, in a global way now, or before just people around me that were close to me knew I used it.
And I mean, really, I'm out there with it.
And it's not, it's, it's nothing more than just saying, this is one tool.
And it's not, I don't want everybody to go off and start using Ouija boards because it's a delicate tool.
And when I say that, it's a quick and easy way, but yet it's a very profound way to be in touch with other dimensions.
I'll say other dimensions because there's so many different levels of consciousness you can speak with.
So I like to say multi-dimensions and interdimensions.
And to do this work, if you're going to do it, I say use it in a serious manner.
I know most people use it as a joke in a game and they might go to Hannies and I've done some of those, but I do it in a very different manner as most people.
And I wanted to share that to say this is a tool like any other tool you may use and that it can be used in a whole other light because I was always shocked when everybody said how negative it was.
But yet I also know, again, like you just said, it's not for everybody.
And you're not saying to go use it.
You're not an advocate of it.
And I'm not saying go use it either unless you're going to use it.
I'm going to tell you some great things I've learned along the way of how to use it in profound ways.
And that's the only way I want to use it.
And so when I get messages, you know, back to your original question, how do we know this is real or not?
And, you know, somebody's skeptical and that's great.
If it feels good and like, again, it resonates with you and it's helping somebody, like you said, your father's message, the message I got for you, if your father helped you at a time when you needed it, then you know what?
It's worth it.
It's worth it.
Now, I know myself, it's coming from some other dimensions and consciousness that I'm connected to and it's connected to me.
And I'm just bringing that in and down and giving it as a message.
So I know that myself, but not everybody else knows that.
And they don't have to believe that.
But yet when people come and they hear the messages, they get very pertinent when they start asking their questions to the people.
And it really says, hey, look at yourself now.
And then they go, wow, how'd you know?
I go, it's not me knowing.
I said, it's everybody coming through to talk to you for you for your personal message that's going to relate to you.
And so there's always something that comes through that helps that person.
And if it's a healing moment like that, then I say, yes, I'm going to continue to do it.
Now, we have to say to people listening to this right now, the reason I haven't gone right back to basics and explained what is a Ouija board, what does it look like, all the rest of it, I referenced the original show that I did with Karen that I think was something like 103, 104 maybe.
Have a look at the back catalog.
I should know this sort of stuff, shouldn't I?
Really?
Was it 108 maybe?
Yeah, 108.
Yes, it was 108.
Is that right?
I think it was show 108, yeah, because it's a good number.
A number which I just happen to have forgotten.
It's been a long day.
But if you want to know about the basics of all of this, then go back to that.
Something I don't think we talked about the first time round.
You just said that you take the board to hauntings.
What happens when you do?
What sorts of things have happened?
Well, you know, when I go into a space that's supposedly haunted with, you know, poltergeist activity or they see spirits or they sense something's there, when I go in, I go right to the room where I sense the energy myself.
Doing this work has really helped me develop some of my abilities of intuition, although I always have been very intuitive.
It's just the work I'm doing now is a whole nother level.
So it's really helped me grow in many ways.
So when I go into a room or a house, I can sense the energy and go right to the spot.
Now, what I want to say, to everybody listening, when I go in, I do my best not to be intrusive, although I am coming into a spot where there's some kind of energy that's stuck there possibly doing things in that house.
It is slightly intrusive because I'm going into their space.
However, I will never push them like, show yourself, show yourself.
What I want to do is say, do you have a message here?
What would you like to communicate?
And that's when something will come through.
And it comes through usually a very benign way.
I've never experienced, although there's been a lot of activity in homes, nothing malevolent.
It's always been benevolent.
It's always been having a message and there's a reason why they're still there.
Or I've had experiences where they're not even aware they're dead or stuck and they're just like, where am I?
And I write about some of these examples in my book.
And I write about a few of the different places I went into that had some ghost and poltergeist activity.
And I've been called into a high-profile one not too long ago.
And I don't want to say too much.
So you have to go read the book about it because I'm going to give it away.
But it is a high-profile one.
Give me a flavor.
Give me a flavor.
Let's just say it happened in Beverly Hills in the mountains.
Very famous case that happened back in the late 60s.
And that's all I'm going to say.
Very big case.
And anyway, I went in there and I got some incredible messages.
And this place is definitely haunted with just many different energies.
And I was able to go right into the ones that we wanted to communicate with.
It was a murder.
It was a murder.
I'll say that too.
It was a murder scene.
And so I was able to communicate with them.
And there's a message they have.
And then they're going to stick around until the message is heard.
Could you use this?
Maybe you did in that case and you're going to tell me to read the book, but could you use it as a detection tool then?
If there'd been a murder somewhere, could you take the board in there and try and find out who'd done it?
You could definitely go in and try that.
I've never been called into do something like that, but you could.
Absolutely.
Or you can hear, you know, if they don't know who did it, if it'll say it was some kind of, they're not sure they don't recognize the person or something, they would at least tell you their message.
Or they could still be, like I said, stuck and not even realizing they're dead.
But yeah, you'd get some communication if they wanted to communicate.
And if they couldn't, I bring my guides with me.
I should say they just go with me everywhere.
I shouldn't say I bring them.
I always ask them if they're willing to go into the space with me because they have to be there with me.
I won't do it by myself because they'll be on the other side kind of moderating and making sure everything's safe.
Very, very important then, like we said last time around, that you're very, very grounded.
A lot of people I talk to about spirits and hauntings and apparitions and all the rest of it, they, of course, will tell you that there's an awful lot of crap out there.
In other words, there's an awful lot of bad stuff out there.
You seem to be so focused that you cut through and you tune in on the right frequency.
You avoid the bad frequencies and you hit the sweet spot.
Well, you're talking, yeah, you're talking about like entity, energy, entities that are negative and stuff like that, right?
That do malicious stuff.
You know, yes, that's true.
And, you know, gosh, this is a tough one to answer because I know everybody has their opinion about it.
And I guess all I can do is give you my opinion, which is not right or wrong.
You know, I'm just going to give you my opinion.
I don't believe in bad per se, like bad evil.
I believe in bad behavior.
I believe in negative behavior.
I believe in evil behavior.
Do I believe that evil exists?
No.
But does evil behavior exist?
Absolutely.
And when people do evil things, that's horrific.
And that's what happens is the energy of that horrific evilness, like a Hitler or something, let's just go that level.
That's an energy that actually sticks around.
You can feel it.
You go to those prison camps.
You can still walk through them and feel that energy.
I went to Dachau and I could feel that.
Did you take the board to Dachau?
No, I didn't.
I did not.
I just that I would not.
Just this such respect of that place.
You know what I mean?
Well, I was going to say that if anybody tried something like that, I can imagine there being quite an outcry.
But bad things leave an imprint.
Yeah, no, people aren't comfortable with the board, right?
I wouldn't do that.
And, you know, Howard, the other thing is you could be, I could be anywhere and speak to pretty much any spirit that wants to come through.
And that's so, as I think I told you before in the other show, I'm almost certainly talked about this.
I can like your higher self.
I can ask questions of your higher self.
And if your higher self wants to answer, it'll come through.
I do that quite a bit, actually, do long distance readings with the board.
Really?
Yes, really.
Yeah, really.
It's quite crazy.
It's something I've learned over the years.
In the beginning, that's what I'm trying to talk about with the board.
It's just people use it as a tool to talk to ghosts.
There's so much more you can do with it.
So when I go into haunting, too, I do so much more with it than just trying to talk to the ghost.
I try to help the spirit to speak to me.
And then when you start, when it has a chance to speak, it can get some kind of closure or resolution of possibly why it stuck or what happened to it.
I've done that so many times.
So that's probably why I don't get that evil behavior that might be affixed to them or aligned with that energy.
Because I go right to where they're hurt, right to where their pain is, right to where their fear is, right to where they lost the light and lost the love.
That's key.
And when you go into those spaces with people, energies, entities, ghosts, you allow them to be heard.
You see what I'm saying?
I hear them from that space of pain or woundedness or that stuckness.
And that's how I do therapy.
I mean, I'm basically kind of using my techniques I've learned as a psycho art therapist to go out and do this work.
And so I do it the same way when I work with the spirits on the other side.
So with back to evil, it's usually bad behavior.
It's a negative energy that's stuck around.
Is evil itself?
No.
But it comes from the personality which created this evil-like energy and behavior.
And I always talk about it in this light.
I say there's the light and there's the dark, and they're both are actually together on the same side, the different sides of the same coin kind of thing.
And you can't have one without the other.
So are they, well, you just said it, are they balanced, Karen?
In other words, if somebody does something really bad, I'd like to believe that the law of karma operates and bad people get their comeuppance.
Well, this is what I hear.
Yes, when there's some bad things that happen, they go to the other side and they pass over and they start their, they don't call it death.
They call it their new life.
When they start their new life on the other side, they're learning.
They're in training.
They're going to be working with other energies that help them heal to look at themselves.
And there's a light.
The light shine in, it's like shining light, bright flashlight into the person saying, okay, look at this now.
And it's never done in meanness.
It's always done as a way to help them evolve.
Everything is about evolution.
Everything is always changing.
Again, let's go back to that statement.
It's a constant.
Change is a constant.
Everything is always changing.
And that's physics too.
Everything is always changing form.
And so their form of their behavior is changing too.
There's always a light.
And this is what I've learned, you know, working with people as I told you before the last interview we had that were hardcore multiple personality disorders, dissociative identity disorders, it's called now.
Heavy-duty trauma is my clientele.
A lot of them had split alters inside of them, like personalities, like Sybil, right?
And that one that was the meanest one inside was the one that took the most pain and protected that person when it was a child being abused.
It was the one that had the most pain.
So when I look at That bad behavior, as that's the one that feels the most pain and is furthest away from seeing the light, I help it find its light within because everything has a light within.
We always do.
So there's a light within.
And if you could start finding that, then there's always a message.
And then you hear the message, and there's always, that's when healing comes out.
That's when healing starts happening.
Like the message I gave you from your father, it's a lighter level.
Message that people come to my circles, open message circles, and they get a message about their loved ones.
A lot of people want to talk to their loved ones, especially this time of year, as we discussed.
So it's that finding that message that this part has, this negative energy.
And then when you can start working with that and hear the message, it actually helps them, again, like I said, have closure and find that light within.
The light never goes away.
They just turn their back to it.
That's what happens.
Now, Karen, you're not a priestess before people go away with this thought.
This isn't your full-time gig, although it's becoming more.
You're a business person.
You're in a completely different field of technology.
And that's what you do.
You run a company, in fact, a couple of companies.
That's true.
Have you ever used Ouija to further your career ambitions in your business?
Absolutely not.
Absolutely not.
Why?
Well, you know, first of all, I don't ask, it's for business.
It's really, for me, it's you really got to have your smarts about you, your wit about you, and you got to know when to fold and when to hold them and show them, right?
You've got to really know your draw.
I got to rely on myself for that.
What does happen, though, is I get messages about, you know, I see this business really growing or I see this happening or maybe this client might contact you.
I don't like to go with future stuff.
I don't like to go for the, for those kind of answers or those kind of comments because they always change.
For me in business, I got to be solid and I am solid in business.
And, you know, I work for a high-tech company.
I have a couple that I run and own.
And that's what I do, like you said.
And it's a very, you know, it's very grounded.
It's a very man-oriented, grounded, you know, it's straight facts.
And you don't get into this other stuff.
So this stuff has been underground for a lot of reasons because of those businesses I'm in.
But I'm at a point now where this stuff needs to come out and start sharing it.
But yet I don't intermix the two.
So it's, this one's very, this is more like a avocation.
It's a very important piece of what I like to do.
It's not a full-time thing.
I would say if I had to cut my life into like a pie, this might be an eighth of it because I like to write my books and do the shows.
And I like to do my open message circles because I see the healing.
This is the part of me that still gets to be the therapist that gets to use my training all those years and all those years I put into having a private practice.
This is that part of me that gets to do it now, not just with people, but also non-physical beings.
And that to me is really exciting because it allows me to see that there's so much more beyond our normal senses we have.
There's so much more to the world.
And so that just, that's a part that just sparks me.
Although this other part of my life is there's so much more.
There's so much more I'm doing outside of this circle.
And you've never been tempted in business where, you know, we know, I know the radio industry and there are many, many, many, many really good, talented, well-motivated, nice people in broadcasting.
There are some people who are not so nice.
We have our fair share of black hats in the industry.
It has to be said.
And I don't think that's going to come as any great surprise to my friends in radio who are listening to this right now.
You know, there are one or two that they're best steered clear of.
You've never been tempted in your business to use the board to ask, I'm going to do a deal with that guy.
Is he on the level?
Actually, they come forward and tell me.
They don't even have to ask.
They come forward and tell me.
It's really amazing.
So if they know I'm working on something, they know I'm working.
When I say they, okay, I'm talking about my spirit guides and friends on the other side that I've been working with for years.
And four of them I've been working with for 20 years.
So they just know me.
And so they, I don't have to ask.
They'll come forward and say, yeah, you got to, you might want to look at this person a little closer.
They've said things like that.
They do.
Wow.
Well, that's useful.
I wish I'd had that over these years.
Let me tell you.
Now, this is a two-powder.
We talked a lot about Ouija last time.
I want to talk about stuff that you deal with in your other book, which is the spirit of creativity, embodying your soul's passion.
Why are we doing that now?
Because it's the gateway to a new year.
And so I thought, okay, what can I do that's worthwhile in my last show of 2013?
And I thought, let's give people a few tips and tricks, if we can, towards creating a better future for themselves.
And your book, this book, fell open at page 118, chapter 7, the start thereof.
I didn't ask it to do that.
It just did it.
Creative communication.
And you say here, the time has come for us to own our voice.
This means communicating who we truly are.
Expressing our soul's calling is paramount.
Now, that was where the book opened, and that seems to make a lot of sense.
That's beautiful.
That's perfect.
And that's exactly what we're here to talk about.
I mean, that is the work that I do on the board.
Now, I want to, before I say too much about that book, that book came out of my work as a therapist in private practice for a decade.
And when I wrote that book, I actually wrote it in 1995, six, and then in 1997, I put it aside and I never published it until just November 2012.
So that book is a timeless book.
It was written many years ago, 16, 17 years ago, and it came out and it still is, it works today.
And I love the fact that it's like that.
But when I wrote that book, I wrote it based on experiences and things I was learning about life through my work with people.
Pretty intense diagnoses, and then work I was doing on myself as well.
And then I worked with the Ouija board.
I was using the board a lot back then.
And it talked to me about this book and said, you know, we're going to help you write this.
It's going to be your words, but we're going to give you some ideas and things to talk about.
And because to write a book the first time is very daunting.
It was very overwhelming, actually, to try to write a book.
And having that extra help was really awesome.
Now it's pretty easy to write a book.
It's not easy, easy, but it flows a lot.
You have an idea of how to do it once you do it.
So anyway, that book and what you just said about the time for our have our voice, that book is all about how to find your inner voice.
That book talks to about owning that internal part of yourself, that spark within you, that is that divine connection back to source.
Now, I'm not talking about religion now, and I'm going to be clear about that.
This is about your spiritual connection back to source and that it's never really gone.
It's always there.
We have to open to it.
And when we open to that, there's that part of us, that soul, that soul of us, our soul that can start expressing itself in this personality and this incarnation as it was meant to express itself living here now.
We're in the physical form to experience physical things.
We're not here to be up in the clouds floating airy fairy.
And some of the stuff I'm talking about might sound like it.
The idea of though, of any kind of work you do, when you go within and you begin to listen to this inner voice, what you begin to find is your own creative spark.
And this creative spark is what allows you to do those things in your life that you're supposed to do.
And I say supposed to, it means those beautiful gifts and talents and abilities and capabilities you came into the world with and that you know you want to do.
But because of, you know, the family and relationships and career and money and bills, you can't find the time to do it.
And the biggest thing for most people, and I'm along there with them myself, you know, I'm standing in the ranks of people here myself.
How do we put this?
The problem is that your inner voice can be a very good thing and it can be a real guide, but it can also be the thing that says, you can't do that.
You don't know how to.
You're not good enough.
That's not your real inner voice.
That's your fears.
That's fear speaking now.
That is the part of you that's lost that light inside, that love to love yourself or feeling worthy of it.
See, people get that confused with their real true inner self.
That's an inner voice.
That's like what you learned growing up, or that's your fear of what a teacher told you or a parent told you or all those things that happen to us in life.
And so we have to uncover and work through that.
You know, I say you go through that.
You have to go into the muck and mire is what I talk about in that book.
You have to go into the emotions and the feelings and into those voices that say, oh, you cannot do this.
Are you kidding me?
You could never write that book or you could never be on that show or you could not be on the BBC Howard, you know, things like that.
That's that voice that's.
I think there are still people who would say that.
I doubt that.
I know your listeners and they think you're the best and you are.
So I doubt that.
But there's that, that we do have fears.
That is not your inner voice.
You have to get beyond that fear.
And the only way to get beyond it is to listen to it, hear it, hear it, and find out where it is in your body and then ask what its message is.
Hear the message.
Again, this is how I do Ouija.
This is how I do all the work I do.
If you don't, you can't avoid.
We can't avoid and tuck it under the carpet.
We can't avoid anything that we're feeling in our body.
If we avoid that, it comes up as stress.
It comes up in other ways.
It come up in an illness.
It can come up in fear saying you can't do this.
And you got to get underneath that and through it.
And the only way is to get into that muck and mire.
And I was mentioning a little earlier, maybe 15 minutes ago, about the feelings and emotions.
And I want to say this to the listeners, and this is really poignant for this time of the year, as the message I said that the spirits gave me, healing spirit gave me about our hearts are open this time of year, because it's all about being with family and friends and rejoicing and, you know, peace and love and all those beautiful things.
And a lot of people's hearts are open, but they hurt.
And so when your heart is hurting like that, and your heart is your connection back to everything as well.
It's like this, it's this opening where you can receive information as well as give it.
And so when your heart is hurting, you go into that hurt space and you treat it as if it is a child and say, what is it you need?
What is it you need to say?
And you allow that part of you to speak.
You might journal it.
You might speak it out loud.
That's how you start getting into these feelings.
And the feelings is really your body is your conduit.
It's your conduit to your divine source.
It's your conduit to your spark of creativity.
It's your conduit back to divinity.
When you can get into and be open in your conduit, your body, meaning we all have feelings, you're going to have them and emotions and they're going to pass through.
And we all have this self-negative talk.
And if you learn that this too shall pass, and even though it hairs negative, it's something from outside.
It really wasn't what you truly were inside.
And if you can somehow allow that shift out and know this will pass, then you can really start to get into that center spot, which is your inner voice.
What about manifesting?
Those feelings.
I've always thought of that.
I'm sorry, Howard.
I'm sorry to jump in there, but I've always kind of thought, and a lot of people have told me, but I think I was there before they told me.
I've been doing this for years.
It is possible if you are positive to manifest what you want.
And the things not necessarily, you know, what you want can sometimes be not what you need.
I'm talking about manifest what you want and what is right for you.
I've been able to do that at times in my life.
But what's frustrated me is when I've wanted to do that thing to order and make that happen on a routine, bang, bang, bang, regular basis.
I can't do that.
But at times in my life, and I'm not alone, I know people who've done this too.
I have been able to program for the thing that I've wanted most.
And most of those things, one way or another, sometimes very circuitously, you know, your big round route.
But they've come to me.
But I don't understand how.
Are you into all of that?
Oh, absolutely.
But I'm into it on a level of don't forget there's always that other side.
There's two sides of the coin.
So I hate to say everything's just all positive and good.
And you can't just think yourself into something.
And I think, think, I'm going to say think here.
It's really about feeling.
And that's what I'm getting at.
It's that stuff works, the positive thinking, but you can't do it by ignoring what's also inside of you that hurts.
And so if you can get that in conjunction and blend them together again, let's go back to that synthesis again, what we talked about in the beginning.
If you can blend it in conjunction, then you can affect greater change in your life.
If you live all in the positive, you're denying your shadow self.
You're denying that other experience of yourself that actually was that part in you, that hurt that was protecting you for however it protected you.
Now it's the negative self-talk in your head.
So I would say it doesn't always work for all of us because we're not always aware of all these things that are going on.
But if we can get into our feeling center and know that it's not about getting that negative thought out, it's about feeling yourself through it and then feel, get to the point where you do feel happy and joy.
And you have to practice these things.
And then you can start.
That's where you create from.
You don't create from thinking or thought, or thought might be the seed.
You put it in your body and you feel it through your heart.
When we can do that and feel and feel through our heart, we can affect great change in your life.
Not only can we affect things externally, like you're talking about, you begin to magnetize and draw things to you because of the coherent value of your heart that your heart's resonating at.
It's a coherence.
And everything else around you starts realigning like magnetically with the frequency to match that coherence of your heart that's in balance.
And it doesn't stay there all the time.
This is work we have to do all the time.
Again, change is constant.
We're always changing.
Each time we change, we have to tune our frequency, but never at the expense of outcasting a part of ourself that was also part of our experience.
So again, it's not about thinking, it's feeling.
It's about feeling all your feelings.
And then you open yourself up to the grandness in life.
I mean, your highs in life are as great as your lows.
I'm not saying we should be a glutton for punishment or pain.
I'm just saying that's a part of life.
And so I find that when I can create things, I'm more in tune with that part of myself, the part of me that might have the fear or the unworthiness.
And when I'm more in tune with that and work with it and listen to it and bring it back into the light with the rest of me, then I find that I can do, I can affect greater change.
So I think what you just said, and I know this is part of psychotherapy as well, isn't it, that if there's something you want to achieve in 2014, if you're a normal mortal person and not Richard Branson or somebody who's massively driven, if you're not Donald Trump or whoever, if you're just an ordinary Joe like you or me, then you have to first of all understand what it is that's stopping you.
And when you've understood it, then you can transcend it.
The bit that's hard to me sounds like the understanding it.
Yes, that's the hardest part because we don't always want to look at that part that hurts.
So I just say anytime people, you have a feeling and you don't quite know where it came from, just acknowledge it.
And the biggest thing that I can recommend anybody to do, if you really want to get into this true self, when I'm talking about your divine inner spark that allows you to be very creative in life, and this is exactly what my first book is all about, is I would say journal.
Journaling is one of the most important things you can do.
And I don't mean sit down every day, dear diary.
I mean you get a thought, then you go, where did that come from?
And you write it down and you go, why am I feeling so down today?
Why am I feeling melancholy?
And you write that down.
You don't go, I feel melancholy because my dog died two weeks ago.
You go, melancholy, where do I feel that in my body?
Oh, it hurts in my chest.
Oh, it makes my heart constrict.
Well, that reminds me of that time when my father, you know, you just go in this whole, you just follow it and then you put it away.
You just got to, if you acknowledge and just allow those parts of yourself, the different parts of the different feelings to come together again in synthesis, that's when, again, you can get right into what it is and who you are and where you're going for 2014.
And you do that through listening to yourself.
And that's how you find out.
That's how you hear it.
You've got to spend time with this.
It's not an easy thing to do.
It isn't easy.
When you talk about here in this book, soul intent, what does your soul intend for you?
Does that mean we're all pre-programmed?
Well, you know, there's certain things that we come in the world to do.
Absolutely.
Pre-programmed?
I think there's a propensity to do certain things.
And we do come in with certain skills and gifts and talents and abilities.
And when you know something that you just love to do and excites you, and I mean, you and radio, Howard, that excites you.
You're passionate about it.
It shows through your programs.
All your listeners know this.
We all know it.
You know it.
That is one of your gifts and talents, obviously.
And you're doing it.
See, not everybody can find that.
And so you find it because you do come with these propensities.
You come with these movements in you to maybe express that.
But you know, the one thing, the one question I, and again, I know me best, so I can only talk about me.
So forgive me.
I know I'm talking about me.
We're going to move.
In 30 seconds, we'll be off me.
But I can't tell you, I love reaching people and I love reaching people this way because I have complete control over it.
I don't have anybody telling me what to do.
I can do my own thing and follow my heart.
And that's what I'm doing.
But I don't understand and never have why.
I don't know why.
I know I want to do this.
But somebody's asked me before, many people have asked me before, why do you want to do this?
I can't tell them.
I am just drawn to it.
Like it's an imperative.
It's something I have to do.
It's like the unexplained, taking it online, doing this.
I know I've got to do it, but I can't tell you why.
That bugs me, Karen.
And I'm sure that is a metaphor for experiences that a lot of you listening to this right now are having too.
Let me ask you why that bothers you.
Why does it bother me?
Because I am a rational guy.
I'm an investigator.
I want to know the answer to everything.
And it's the one question that I can't answer.
And the only reason I'm talking about this at this time of year and me as an example is that I think this is a commonality that I have with, and we all have with each other.
A lot of us do stuff and we don't know what drives us to be a singer or a train driver or a global explorer or whatever or a person who studies penguins, which we just don't know.
Or a Ouija board user.
You know, I don't think you have to know why.
I don't think we have to.
Life is mystery.
That's the beauty of life.
And we don't have to always know why.
You know, and maybe knowing why would ruin it for you.
Maybe it's, maybe it's just you, what's nice is that you're trusting that intuition, that passion, that inner desire, that spark of creativity within you, and you're expressing it and it's working and you love it and everybody else loves it too.
And you don't need to know why.
I think we need to let that go sometimes.
And that's that part of us in our brain.
That's our thinking again.
That is thinking that gets us stuck.
The feeling of, though, as you shared, you do it.
And you can explore things and talk about it and share with others and people can learn from it and also share with you.
And there's so much.
And that's a feeling.
That's the heart.
See?
So it's a heart versus your brain.
They work together.
But I think if we can go more into our heart space, more into our body space, as opposed to thinking it out, why, how, it gets us stuck.
Now, if I throw in the Ouija board here, it gets people stuck trying to use the Ouija board.
They get too much into the brain.
You have to relax.
I always say, you have to get into your body.
And that's a hard thing for people to do.
A lot of people avoid getting in their bodies because they don't like it or they, it's this or that or it hurts or it's painful or whatever it is, or I feel things.
That's the key.
You've got to get back in your body.
And that's why we do things.
It's passion from our heart and our body.
I'm just going to go with that.
And it's the great mystery of life.
And I don't care if you don't know why.
You don't need to know why.
Let me run a story past you just as we draw this to a conclusion.
I just want to, right off the bat, we haven't discussed this.
I just want to get your thoughts about this one, okay?
Maybe you've heard things like this before.
I got an amazing email, and I hope I'm summarizing this properly.
I'm not going to name any names at this stage because I don't know whether they would want to do this.
But about a minute or two before we started recording this and we connected, I got this email.
I'm getting listener emails, more of them all the time, and I'm very grateful for them.
Oh, good.
This is the story of a man and his mother.
And he gets a call from a care home, we'd call it over here, saying that they'd had a call from this woman saying that she was lost and didn't know where to go.
Now, this woman is this man's mother, and she died sometime before.
And the care home was not a care home that she was registered at, but this woman had phoned there, and they'd passed the message on to him.
I hope this summarizes it properly.
I only had time to scan the email.
That's amazing.
I would love to think that there was the possibility, you occasionally hear these stories, that people come back somehow.
Yes, they do a lot through phones.
Because that's a frequency.
They come through phones a lot.
And that's why EVPs work.
You can record it.
They come through electronics for that reason.
It's a frequency.
And that's how they work.
That's how they work with me.
It's through a frequency.
So the phone thing can really happen.
Oh, yeah.
I've heard many stories.
And I've never experienced it.
I can only say that I've heard the stories.
But they tell me how they communicate with me is it's through a frequency and they match my vibration.
That's why, again, it goes back to your intent, the energy you have around you to do this work.
Any kind of work when you start going to other dimensions, it's the energy you have around you that you attract to you.
That's important.
And that phone, she was able to use that tool because there was energy there, the frequency of it to come through.
She's trying to reach out and let her son know she still exists.
When they die, they don't die.
They just change forms.
They have a new life and they exist.
And that's a beautiful story, actually, that your listener shared with you.
Well, I don't know if I've summarized it properly, but the gist of it moved me before we did this.
It's amazing.
And I'd like to know more about it.
So hopefully we'll find out.
Now, Karen Dolman, the floor is yours.
This is your show, not mine.
Anything that you haven't said, anything that you've got planned for 2014, anything you want to get out there now, this is your chance to do it.
Well, you know, for me, I always, at this time of year, I always look at what are my goals.
And goals sound so, you know, brainy, but it's not that.
I sit down and write down my intentions for the new year.
I always write them down around this, right around this cusp of going into the new year and maybe a little after.
And then I do like a prayer about it.
Put them away.
Don't look at them until half year.
And I find that when I put the energy out there, the intention for it, allow it to go to the universe.
Don't know why or how it's going to happen.
The mystery of the universe, the magic of the universe somehow allows that to come.
Many things come through that.
And that's a great way to step into 2014.
Now, one of my goals for 2014 is I am working on another book.
It's a book I kind of set aside.
I've been working on this year to write this Ouija book because the Ouija book was really needed because everybody was asking for how do I do this stuff?
And that's why I wrote Ouija pretty much 101.
So I'm writing another book on this transformation, this alchemical transformation that occurs within specifically women as we evolve in life.
The idea is that as we learn to know, again, this power within ourselves, we go through many different stages in life and we can call those positive, negative, or whatever.
But there's a way we can transform and help us through those stages to really find our true marriage of the sacred marriage of the king and queen within.
So I'm talking about alchemy here, and I'm also going to be getting into some sacred geometry along with some symbols that are related to it.
This is work that I've done.
I learned some of the stuff from the Ouija board.
It's some of the work they've worked with me on to help me transfer some of my energy and learn to focus it in different directions.
And so I'm going to be using that and going into this work more.
It's work that I do with a lot of women friends and women's groups.
And it's based on everything I've written so far and also my back work as a therapist, as well as my work as a business owner.
I'm putting it all together in this book to really make it a culmination.
Now, this is a daunting task.
It's going to be a little more, it's a big book.
There's a lot to it.
So that's one of my big things in 2014.
Okay.
Well, come back and talk about that.
Karen Dolman in California in a place that I've loved all my life and would like to come again to one of these days and feel the warmth and experience a place that I always believed I'd lived before this time around.
Happy holidays, Karen.
Happy holidays to you and to the best 2014 to you, Howard.
And to you too.
Now, stay right there.
Don't go anywhere.
I want to get into this.
Okay, that was Karen.
And as I promised at the beginning of this, the archive recording of Lola McNaught.
Remember, deputy school headmistress, a woman well-spoken, well-educated, but who was much into experiencing the work of mediums and what lies beyond.
Now, I spoke with her when I was very young, back in the 1980s, and she may not be with us anymore, but I wish her well wherever she is.
And these are the words never broadcast before of Lola McNaught sitting in her home in Waterloo, Liverpool, all those years ago.
In the first place, we had difficulty even to book a hall when they thought it was spiritualism.
And we never once attempted to book a hall without using the name of spiritualism and phenomena, clairvoyance, clairaudience, what have you.
We always managed.
We used the common hall that they allowed us to use.
We had to pick up the keys at, well, before five o'clock and put them in the letterbox after the meeting because there was no caretaker there.
Then of course we got our own rooms and we had no more difficulty with that.
We first had rooms in Hackins Hay and a little bit of amusement about that beneath us was a bonded warehouse and people coming in could smell other spirits, not our spirits, could smell spirits from the bonded warehouse.
I can say that at no time do we ever book anyone that we have real doubts about.
We only book people who are recommended to us and by someone that we would give credence to their recommendation.
Now then the whole ethic of spiritualism has risen.
Now we don't take credit for that.
We have just been one of the points that have put forward good mediums and have gradually helped in the making decent the word spiritualism.
What's the nearest thing that you've had to proof?
One of my greatest personal proofs that people who have passed on are able to communicate is something that I rarely mention.
I hesitate to mention it this time.
My mother died when we were on holiday in North Wales and her body was brought to a local undertaker in South Road where her body remained until the funeral.
Now then we came home from North Wales and I had taken the deed box to South Road bank manager and I said may I have my deed box?
No sorry, your mother has died.
I said your mother has died and I want the deeds of the grave.
He said no you can take anything from that box you like but I must see what goes from it.
And so it was rather a difficult situation.
I'd got the deed box and the bank manager turned sideways and threw one leg over the other and I thought that's funny.
He was whistling and I thought, good gracious, what a funny thing for a bank manager to do on an occasion like this.
And I sort of almost bridled a little and I thought, oh, stop it.
It's your trouble.
It's not his.
He's just doing a day's work, you see.
Get on with it.
So I picked up some other papers and I found the paper.
Oh, he picked up a paper and was reading it and it was one of these penny a week insurances and he said, aren't they criminal?
They shouldn't be allowed, etc.
And then the bank manager, you see, I'd had my clear thought.
Oh, how unprofessional.
And he went on with what he was reading and I went on with what I was reading.
The bank manager was whistling the tune that my mother always had sung.
We always sang this for my mother with my mother in our home circle.
I'm not going to mention the tune to you or anyone else because that is private to me.
The bank manager was whistling that tune.
Now it was not Little Brown Jug, but it was in that category.
And he was whistling that tune.
Now at that time I didn't see, but I had the sensation of my mother, oh, above the head and shoulders of the manager and behind him, putting her hands together and saying, for goodness sake, get on with it, child, just as she would normally.
It's all there for you.
What on earth are you worrying about?
It's all there.
So naturally, I stopped almost to speak to mother.
And the bank manager looked at me and he said, oh, I'm sorry, Miss McNaught, what is the matter?
So I said, you're going to think I'm just hysterical.
But I said, my mother is present.
You were whistling her song.
And he said, oh, I beg your pardon.
Was I whistling, Miss McNaught?
I said, you were.
He said, I do beg your pardon.
I hadn't realized I was.
Now then, had it only been that one whistle, I would have thought I was the one that was mistaken.
But perhaps it was his favourite song, too.
I wouldn't know that.
I didn't go into that.
I shouldn't think so.
What he'd been whistling earlier on and had annoyed me, well, yes, it had annoyed me.
I had thought how unprofessional for him to be sitting whistling on an occasion like this.
You see, I'd got that out of my system.
I know he was whistling then.
I was annoyed about it.
It didn't mean anything to me.
Now, that was just the impish thing that my mother would have done to get him to sing her song, which was proof to me that my mother was present.
The other whistle had only annoyed me.
But I couldn't be annoyed when he was whistling my mother's song.
It wasn't in the brown jug, but it was in that category of that period and of that popularity.
And you don't very often hear it.
Proof beyond doubt was that my mother was present in the bank manager's office on a level, not walking on the floor, but on a higher level.
And she was moving backward and forward, to my feeling, thinking, for goodness sake, lass, get on with it.
There's nothing to worry about.
All is well there.
Actually, we knew that mother was going to pass over.
And as we'd gone out in the car to North Wales, there was only mother and I in the car at the time.
And it was a very heavy thunderstorm.
And we drew up and we were talking about things.
And we were talking about passing over and how strange it would be to be in a world beyond and not able to be wholly cognizant in the material world and wouldn't it be strange?
Now that was part of our conversation as we went out and within, I don't know, a week or ten days, she had a heart attack and died in North Wales.
And so this would all be within, well, the 10 to 14 day period.
And it was very soon after my mother had, probably the day after she had passed, that she, I mean, there was no other construction that I could put on it, that the bank manager was rude enough to be sitting there whistling on an occasion like that.
And I thought, oh, come off it.
My brother always called me Topps.
Come off it, Topps.
He's just doing a day's work like anybody else.
Don't be so stupid.
A voice coming back to us from down the decades.
Lola McNaught, in her living room at Waterloo in Liverpool, a long time ago.
Thank you to Lola, and thank you very much to Karen Dorman in California.
We'll catch up with her, I'm sure, very soon.
And I wish her a very good year.
Thank you for your support across 2013, for the nice things that you said about the show.
Please keep your feedback coming at www.theunexplained.tv.
That's my website, and that's where you can go to drop me an email, send me any kind of feedback, a guest suggestion, tell me what you think that I've been doing right with the show, what you think that I may need to fix with the show, whatever.theunexplained.tv.
That's also the place to use the PayPal link and make a donation to the show if you can.
Vital for this independent work to continue.
Thank you very much to Adam Cornwell at Creative Hotspot in Liverpool for his hard work on the show over the year.
Thank you to Martin for the theme tune.
Martin, please be in touch soon.
I wish you a good 2014.
But above all, my gratitude to you for being part of this, The Unexplained.
Please tell your friends about the show and let's step into 2014 and make this thing bigger.
Let's make them all listen.
My name is Howard Hughes.
Merry Christmas.
Happy New Year.
See you soon on the next edition of The Unexplained.
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