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Aug. 18, 2012 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes

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Edition 89 - Sue Allen

This time we talk with London-based researcher, healer and psychotherapist Sue Allen aboutpsychic attacks – and how to beat them!

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	Across the UK, across continental North America and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Unexplained.
	Thank you for coming back to the show.
	Thank you for the good feedback on my previous show, Edition 88, with Robert Boval about the pyramids and ancient Egypt.
	Had a lot of response about that, including one response from a man who wants to talk with me about a purpose he believes the Great Pyramid was built for.
	So we'll get into that in the future, certainly.
	And thank you very much for your guest suggestions that have come in.
	Lots of them.
	Keep them coming.
	The address for the website, www theunexplained.tv, www.theunexplained.tv.
	There, you can make a donation to the show if you want the work to continue.
	You can send me a message, make a guest suggestion, do whatever you'd like.
	I love to get your feedback.
	And thank you for the nice things you've been saying about the show.
	I'm always open to anything that you have to say, and I can build in things that you suggest into the show, which is one of the great advantages.
	As I know, I keep going on about, but one of the big advantages of doing a show like this that is so small but has such a big reach, there's only me.
	I produce it, pick the guests, do the show, do the recording, do any editing that might be needed, put it together, get it out there, and that's it.
	It's a one-stop shop.
	It's just me and Adam Cornwell who gets the show out to you and has devised our great website.tv.
	Please keep your email coming.
	This time round, we're going to talk about a subject that is not an easy one to talk about, but it is something that we need to be getting into.
	And really, we have needed to be getting into this for years.
	We're going to talk about subjects including spirit release, psychic attack, witchcraft, curses, spirit attachment, possession, retrieval of souls, soul rescue, and exorcism.
	There are those who believe that there are spirits in this world or around this world that can connect with people, perhaps if they're vulnerable at times in their lives, and do them untold harm.
	Also, there are those who believe that people with ill intention who want to get their own way can perform psychic attacks on others.
	There are those who genuinely believe this stuff happens, and a lot of these people are not in third world countries where magic is widely practiced.
	They're right here in big cities like this one, or maybe the one that you live in.
	The person I'm going to talk to is Sue Allen.
	She's somebody who works with these things.
	She's based in London.
	She's been involved with the College of Psychic Studies here and has a new book out called Spirit Release.
	So let's get on to her right now.
	As I speak to you, the Olympic Games have ended and the world is heading back to its respective haunts, if you pardon the expression, after a fantastic closing ceremony.
	And, you know, I would just like to say on behalf of myself and everybody that I know, we've all been massively impressed by London's ability to pull together and put on a great show.
	And we're all looking forward to the next Olympics in Brazil.
	But it's been an amazing two weeks here.
	And now it's over.
	And we're looking forward to the Paralympics.
	All right, let's get on to Sue Allen now, the author of the book Spirit Release.
	She's here in London.
	Sue, thank you for coming on The Unexplained.
	Thank you for having me.
	Well, great pleasure to be doing this, Sue.
	The last couple of shows I've done, I've done across continents with people in America.
	Or indeed, the last one was with a guy in southern Spain, Robert Boval.
	Now, this one's a little bit closer to home, south London, just a few miles away from where I live.
	So hopefully we're going to get a good connection soon.
	We can have a good conversation here.
	I'm hopeful.
	All right, now we're talking about a very, very serious subject.
	And it is one that I, not for any particular reason, haven't touched on on either the radio version of this show or this online show.
	Not for any reason.
	There's no conspiracy about it.
	But it is a very difficult topic to cover because we're going to be talking about things that people tend not to discuss.
	Things like spiritual psychic attack, witchcraft and that kind of thing.
	And people who are or believe they are in the possession of various things, demons, spirits or whatever.
	Is that a reasonable summation of what we're going to talk about here?
	Yeah, I would say so.
	Okay, and what's your background to be interested in this subject?
	I was born, as many people are, with psychic sensitivities, but in my family, it was very normal.
	So whereas most children, if they're at a young age, they will see something in the house, the parents will often distract them or say, no, no, no, that's not happening.
	Or some people will react with anger, which is obviously a fear response.
	In my family, it was a bit different.
	If I said to my mum, there's a lady in my bedroom, she'd say, oh, is she nice?
	What's she wearing?
	Did she talk to you?
	What did she say?
	So it was very, very normal.
	So I've grown up with all of the different psychic sensitivities of which there are seven.
	And as a child, it was a case of I would see spirits, hear spirits, they would disturb me at night and so on.
	But I didn't know what to do.
	I didn't know how to help them, what they wanted, etc.
	And it was as I grew up that I then had an experience at the age of 21 while I was at teacher training college, which taught me a lot about the heavier end of spirit release.
	And then I went on from there to train as a, I sort of fell into healing as we tend to fall into these subjects.
	So I trained as a healer.
	I did some psychic training just to check that I was doing it okay.
	I trained as a psychotherapist.
	I'm also a medical intuitive.
	And then obviously I've got my teaching background.
	So basically I put all of that together and I started to get people coming to me wanting me to clear them from psychic attack, cords, spirit attachment.
	And I also have a lot of people who ask me to clear their houses, their businesses.
	There's a hotel up in the center of town, which I clear on a very regular basis and so on.
	And why I ended up writing the book was because I was teaching the subject, which as you said yourself, a vast subject.
	And it was all the questions and issues that people were asking me.
	And I thought this would be quite good to get this in a book.
	Two things I just want to ask you about now before we lose them in the mix here.
	One of them said that you had an experience when you were 21 that taught you about the heavier end of spirit release.
	I think I know what you were talking about there, but just explain.
	Okay, there is a vast spectrum of spirit release.
	So you can get anything from little old lady who's died and really doesn't understand that she's died, doesn't know where she is, and to reunite her with her loved ones is a really quick, simple and very joyous experience.
	That sounds like an exorcism.
	I tend not to call it exorcism.
	I tend to call it spirit release.
	Some people will call it spirit rescue.
	Exorcism is something that has been created by the Catholic Church and the basis of exorcism is the belief that all spirits are evil and if the person has a spirit attached to them that they have done something wrong, that they have done something bad.
	Understood.
	So what was the experience that you had when you were so young that turned you in this direction?
	When I was 21, I was at college and a friend of mine was studying religious studies.
	She went to the library.
	She got a book on St. Augustine.
	There are two St. Augustines.
	She brought the book back into her room.
	She was in my room.
	We had a cup of coffee.
	She went into her room.
	She turned back to me and said, can I borrow whatever it was?
	She turned back, which was literally two, three seconds.
	And the whole room had been trashed.
	Everything had been piled in the center of the room with this book on top.
	And from there, we had three months of horrendous experiences from the spirit that had come attached to this book.
	We called in a Catholic priest who spent all of five minutes in my room before he ran out and refused ever to come back again.
	Really?
	So I learned from there that how to deal or how to start to deal with some of these spirits.
	So you dealt with that situation with that poor girl.
	I mean, to me, it sounded like a poltergeist thing, but whatever it was that was adhering to that book or around that book or around her at that time, you were able to free her?
	Eventually, yes.
	It took me three months because what I needed to learn was that I was in control.
	To give you an example, what actually clinched it for me was there was a time where I was 21, I was writing an essay.
	And when I was a student, I didn't exactly do things in the right time.
	So I was running towards a deadline.
	And this spirit kept taking cigarettes, matches, pens, papers, etc, etc.
	And it just kept on and on and on and on.
	And in the end, it started saying to me, open the window, open the window.
	And in the end, I said to it, you want the window open?
	You open the window.
	And there was silence.
	And suddenly I realized it couldn't open the window.
	It needed me.
	And that by me reacting to it with anger, which was my normal response at the time, I was feeding it.
	Every time I responded, then I was feeding it energy, which is obviously what it wanted.
	So that was a bit of a test for you.
	It was asking you to open the window to see if it could exercise its will over you.
	And once it had done that, then you'd fed it because it's a power relationship.
	And presumably, if you'd allowed that to happen and continue, a cycle would have developed.
	Yes.
	And it gets closer linked in to me, etc., etc.
	So what I learned from that is A, not to be frightened of anything, not to react with anger to anything, that actually, if you react with calm, compassion, etc, etc., that you can actually deal with spirits much more easily.
	And therefore, when we get psychic attack or spirit release issues with people, it's often about an imbalance and that they go into fear.
	Obviously, if somebody's doing something dreadful or you've got something talking to you, the immediate human response is to go into fear.
	But in actual fact, it's the wrong reaction to go into because it's the fear that gives it the energy.
	But you can understand why people do get afraid because it's so outside the normal experience of the vast majority of people.
	Yeah, completely.
	So this is the way to deal with this.
	The other thing I didn't want to lose before we get back on track is that you're a psychotherapist.
	Now, I would have thought the science and rationality of psychotherapy would be completely at opposite directions, completely at variance with the other stuff you're doing.
	You would think, wouldn't you?
	But actually, I've always been somebody who's been absolutely fascinated with people, the mind, how they work, etc.
	And I had 25 years in social work and then trained as a psychotherapist.
	And what I and a lot of psychotherapists, and also there's now a form of therapy that's coming through called spiritual counseling, because a lot of people are realizing that when they're doing their therapeutic interventions from psychiatrists through psychologists, psychotherapists, counselors, etc.
	Sometimes they're realizing that what they're trying to deal with with the client is something that isn't actually the client and it's external to the client.
	So actually the two work very well together.
	And in certain conversations with spirits, it's actually very useful to have a counseling or a psychotherapeutic background because you end up counseling not only the spirit, but also the person who the spirit is with.
	I think we know from reading the newspapers, Sue, that there are a lot of very disturbed people in this world.
	How can you separate, or the professionals that you work with, how can they separate the people who are genuinely, deeply mentally disturbed, of whom, you know, as we've said, there are quite a few in this world, from those who are genuinely possessed by something?
	There would seem to be a danger in making the wrong decision about what it is.
	Absolutely.
	So how do you know the difference?
	There are very specific differences.
	I think it's harder for me to say.
	People always ask me this question.
	I spent, as I said, 25 years in social services.
	And part of what I learned during that 25 years was I worked with a range of people, including those with mental health.
	People with a mental health energetically feel very different to somebody who is exhibiting similar behaviors but has an external energy attached.
	So to me it's an energetic connection.
	There's also various signs and symptoms.
	I know psychiatrists etc in this field and I've actually been called in to psychiatric hospitals to carry out assessments on people who they think, who the doctors, nurses, etc.
	picked up actually I think there's something and in addition to and I think sometimes you can have somebody with a mental health issue who then gains a spirit attachment because because of their vulnerability they're in um higher level probability if they're in a mental health hospital there's more of them around etc but you can also have people who are basically okay have a spirit attachment which causes a
	psychotic breakdown and then you get this chicken and egg where you're trying to release the spirit um and so on the hot the doctors are coming in from their point of view and perhaps giving medication etc to stop the voices to stop the various manifestations but yes it's very very clear that you have to get it right if you've got somebody with for instance what used to be called multiple personality personality disorder which is now dissociative identity disorder the
	aim of that is to integrate the alters the parts of the personality which have been split off and become separate um personalities characteristics etc with spirit release what we're aiming to do is to try to find out what isn't part of the person and to release it now you can't get that wrong you can't try to integrate a spirit into the person that person into the main alter into the main personality or
	try to release one of the alter personalities if it's somebody with multiple personality disorder so yes it does take years and years of training experience etc to be able to tell the difference i think the only way to talk about this if you don't mind is to kind of take a case study we don't have to name any names of course or say anything that would identify anybody but just give me an idea of somebody who perhaps recently has come to you who's felt that they've been taken
	over or their lives have been derailed by something that they've picked up it almost like i've got this vision in my head of of a supertanker going along its journey and we'll call that journey life and as the supertanker goes along it um it gathers barnacles and it almost feels to me like what you're talking about is some kind of psychic barnacle attaching or accreting to a person um that's that's how it sounds to me but when somebody presents themselves to you just give me an example of the way that that would happen
	um it can happen in various instances sometimes the family will bring them along and say we're not sure if this is mental health or if it's spiritual etc i'll give you a very interesting case that i worked with for many years um we'll call him john he came to me having gone on the basic story was that he was studying a crystal healing course he had been given a crystal
	to take home by his tutor he took it home when he worked with it he didn't realize that there was actually something inside or even attached to the crystal it caused a it attached to him from the crystal it caused a psychotic breakdown he ended up being removed from home in the middle of the night by the police and taken into a psychiatric hospital where he stayed for two or three weeks under section and
	on medication now presumably other people you and i perhaps could own that crystal and not be affected by whatever we think might have been attached to it but because this person was as we said before particularly susceptible or vulnerable they were affected yes okay what happened then um he ended up being obviously given medication etc etc the consultant psychiatrist at the end of his two or three week in stay decided
	to discharge him home still on the medication he was seeing the consultant psychiatrist he was seeing a um his gp and then at some point he decided he found me on the internet and he decided to come and see me and we set it up as psychotherapy initially but he knew my background in spirit release he obviously didn't have a spirit with him at that time but from what he told me i thought yes it's perfectly possible that you know this
	has happened and it's caused a psychotic breakdown what we did over a period of about two years was i worked with him psychotherapeutically his consultant psychiatrists worked with him in terms of his mental health and the gp also and what they were trying to do was to reduce his medication while i was helping to get him to a point where a reduction in medication would work because obviously having had such a terrifying experience as a
	psychotic breakdown and what had happened to him he didn't want to come off the medication because his thought was if i come off the medication if i stop taking the sleeping pills then maybe this is going to happen to me again and if it happens to me again i don't think i'm going to survive and do you believe as a lot of people seem to believe from what i'm reading that um alcohol or drugs medication of any kind can actually open doors to things that you don't want doors opening to yeah absolutely alcohol and
	drugs actually opens you up expands your energy field as does you know various other things so having a glass of wine in a wine bar i always say to students after this workshop if you go to the wine bar with
	with friends and you start talking about this just be aware that you will expand your energy very naturally and you will open up and therefore if there's anything around you are far more susceptible so my ethos with everything is that everybody has to take responsibility For their own energy management, by which I mean they need to work on their grounding, their protection, etc., etc.
	Because spirits who are earthbound sometimes become earthbound because they are addicted to drink, drugs, anything else.
	And therefore, when they die, they don't want to leave because they still want to have that alcohol and drugs, etc.
	So they will either find somebody who is already using, or in rare instances, what they will do is that they will attach to somebody who they then impress to use.
	So somebody who's passed on and they have a severe drink or drug problem, they actually take that beyond the grave?
	Yes.
	If they choose to.
	But they're given a choice.
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	We create our own reality when we're alive and also when we pass.
	That's interesting because a lot of things that you read and a lot of things you hear suggest that when you go, you get the chance to put everything right and you reunite with your relatives and everything is okay again.
	Yeah.
	Not so.
	It's one option.
	It's an option, but it's not.
	It's one option.
	Right.
	So it's one of those things in the drop-down menu when you go.
	I've no idea.
	Yeah.
	So there are people who decide that they're going to stay because something is unresolved.
	They don't believe in life after death.
	They don't want to meet Auntie Mabel.
	They don't want to do whatever.
	And so they hang around where they are.
	And if somebody is very, very obsessed with the need to have a drink or the need to have the cigarette, etc., they're more likely to stay around in places where they can get those.
	And they'll actually do it vicariously through somebody else, somebody they don't even know, but just somebody who's vulnerable.
	Yeah, I stopped going to pubs many, many years ago because I would sit in a pub and I would watch people sat at the bar getting more and more drunk and I could see the earthbound spirit just waiting.
	And when the person was drunk enough, the earthbound spirit would literally just walk in.
	I'm a big fan of a guy, sadly, who's not with us anymore, but an American Irish priest.
	You might have heard of this man.
	He wrote a number of books and certainly was very well known.
	You may well not have heard of him.
	Father Malachi Martin in America.
	And he's a man who used to do exorcisms, but also worked in the fields that you work in.
	And he used to say, and the Catholic Church was very much again a lot of the stuff that he was saying, but he used to say, there is definitely, and I am here to tell you, evil in this world.
	Evil stalks this world.
	And there are things that we can do about that if we are aware of it.
	But some of the stories that he used to tell were terribly, terribly frightening about the power of these entities, what they could do, and the havoc that they could wreak in people's lives.
	I'm just wondering whether you've come across that sort of thing, that degree of havoc.
	Yes, I have come across some of the heavier end.
	I tend not to try to deal with a lot of it because it is very wearing.
	Some of the people who've written books are that heavy end, some of the films that have been shown of live exorcisms, etc., usually by priests, the priests end up either dead or very, very unwell.
	So it isn't an area that you go into lightly.
	I have dealt with some very, very heavy end.
	And as I said, because of my first experience at 21, I don't have fear.
	I might have surprise, but I don't go into fear.
	So I don't, I'm less open to responding in fear through those things.
	I'm the type of person who can have a nightmare with something and I will laugh and I will laugh at horror films these days because I've worked on my fear limits.
	Presumably this is information that most people could do with knowing about at least so that if they find themselves in a vulnerable position, they will not allow themselves to be manipulated by whatever might be out there.
	There are certain levels or heavier ends or certain techniques which I wouldn't want everybody to know because there is danger in dabbling in stuff.
	I mean I've had people come to me and they very helpfully removed a spirit from a client, but then they're stuck with it.
	They haven't been able to remove it properly.
	So, you know, you don't want people dabbling in stuff that they don't know enough about.
	You said you were a healer.
	That almost sounds like healing.
	I have to say, I have been to a couple of healers in my time and with varying results, some of them very good, I have to say.
	But when they finish, they cleanse themselves of whatever it is that you had.
	Otherwise, they take it with them.
	That's right.
	I mean, there was a story that happened to me, and this is obviously something that I don't tend to talk about, but I went on an outside broadcast in Italy, and one of the members of the team was, unbeknown to me, a healer or training to be a healer.
	I twisted my ankle, and that would have put me in a very disadvantaged position for that entire week.
	And he said, okay, let me do this.
	And I said, are you mad or what?
	He said, just lie down on that deck chair.
	And I put my foot out and he did this healing thing.
	And at the end of it, he went through a little ceremony, I suppose you could call it, where he washed his hands metaphorically in the air and said, okay, off you go.
	I was okay after that.
	I'm not going to name him, but I was all right.
	Brilliant.
	So it works throughout the psychic realm by the looks of it, that principle.
	Yeah.
	See, healing to me has also a very wide definition.
	Healing can be standing next to somebody at a bus stop and just having a two-minute conversation and they haven't spoken to somebody all week.
	That to me can be healing.
	So healing to me encompasses healing the physical, the emotional, the mental, the spiritual.
	It encompasses medical intuition, which I do.
	It encompasses, you know, spirit release, psychic attack, decoding.
	It's a very, very wide area.
	And there are some healers who have been trained very well in what they do is that we ground, we attune, we ask for permission, we ask for protection for us and for the client.
	And then we do a piece of work.
	And then afterwards, we make sure that us and the client are cleansed.
	We're grounded.
	We're closed down and we're protected.
	Not all healers do that.
	And that's when they get into difficulties.
	When you're asking for protection, where are you asking for protection from?
	From spirit, from universal consciousness, from God, from whoever it is that you see as your guardian angels.
	I want to talk about psychic attack in a moment, but you talked about chord connection.
	What's that?
	You can have energetic connections between us, other people, animals, places, houses, objects, etc.
	A lot of the chords, or some of the chords that we have are very positive.
	So if you look at parents and a new child, they will often have chords between the parents to the new child, to each of the seven main chakras, and that helps to keep that child safe.
	So the parents are very, very tuned in as to when that child is distressed, it's in pain, it needs feeding, and often parents will say to you, I woke up just before the child started to cry.
	So that is a very positive attachment.
	You also have positive attachments between lovers, sexual partners, etc., etc.
	The problem is that you can also get lots of negative calls.
	So people call to us in order to basically control us.
	So they might call to you to try to control your behavior or your responses or your decisions, or the agenda might be, stay with me, don't leave me.
	There's all sorts of hidden agendas in codings.
	So the aim with a healer, with a decalding, is to find the negative cords and detach those negative chords, give healing to both sides.
	And then, you know, the two people can be individuals and make their own decisions, et cetera, rather than being tied into each other and not being able to think to themselves sometimes.
	Does that connect to this feeling that some of us have from time to time that there are some people that you come across in this world and they are, I'm trying to think of a better word than drainers, but they drain you.
	They seem to drain you of your energy.
	You've only got to be around them for a moment.
	You've only got to talk to them for five minutes and you feel as if they've connected something into you and whatever you had going for you on that particular day, it's sort of running down the drain.
	That's the one.
	They're called psychic vampires.
	I've known a few of those.
	It's a fascinating area.
	Of course, a lot of people will say it's the biggest load of old hokeum, but perhaps they haven't been affected by it.
	The most serious aspect of this, and the one that I really, it swung me really to talk to you here when I got the news release about your book, psychic attack.
	Now, I'll tell you another quick story.
	It is going to be a quick story.
	It's a London story, but it's to do with a lot of years ago when I was having one of the periods in my career, and I've had a few, where things haven't been going so fantastically.
	You know, that's just one of the prices we pay for what we do.
	We have a lot of fun doing what we're doing, but those of us who are in the media will know, unless they live completely charmed lives, and there are one or two of those as well.
	But most of us have our ups and our downs.
	So in my 20s, I was having my first major down, and it was all to do with a bunch of people I'd stopped working with.
	I didn't like them.
	I don't think they thought much of me.
	But I went into a very difficult period after that.
	And we're not just talking about being sort of becalmed professionally.
	It was as if there was, it almost felt like it was organized.
	I know this sounds crazy, but I was starting to get interested in this field.
	And somebody suggested to me, and I was very, very skeptical and a little bit afraid, I have to say, go and see this woman in North London.
	So I can't even remember what part of North London it was, but I got the train to Kilburn or Kensal Rice, somewhere like that.
	Got off the train, went to this terraced house and met this very nice old lady at the front door who had a lovely aura around her, I felt.
	There was a very good feeling in the house.
	And she ushered me into the front room where there was a great big fish tank, I remember.
	I don't remember much about this place apart from the little sofa covered in corduroy and the fish tank in the corner.
	And I stood up and it didn't take very long.
	And she said, oh, yes, there are things there.
	And I thought, oh, yeah, okay.
	And she told me to close my eyes, put her hands on my head.
	And I can't remember this lady's name at all, sadly, but she put her hands on my head and my eyes were closed.
	And I saw a brilliant circle of white light inside my closed eyes, brilliant like a lightsaber going all around my head.
	And it took about five minutes.
	And after that, she said, okay, it's done.
	Now, from that day to this, I have no idea what was done, but I have a feeling it's what we're going to talk about.
	She felt that I was under some kind of psychic attack or something.
	There was something there that she needed to dump.
	And that was how she did it.
	Yes.
	And that bright light that you see is like sitting under a spotlight where somebody's turned the spotlight directly on you.
	And you think, my God, where's that light coming from?
	Well, there was no rational basis for it because the room was darkened.
	She had the lights down.
	She didn't have a torch.
	And in any case, how could she have made a halo of light inside my closed eyes?
	Impossible.
	Yep, that's healing.
	And from that day to this, and I must have been 23, maybe 24 at that time, I can't rationalize what it was.
	I think it did some good, but I can't possibly tell you on what level it did good.
	I just, you know, have a good feeling about it.
	And do I remember who she is?
	No.
	Can I even remember where that house was?
	No.
	But it was an experience that I had very early on.
	Brilliant.
	But that's the kind of stuff that happens.
	Psychic attack, though, very serious stuff.
	Because this is to do with people who have a certain amount of knowledge from what I read and they direct it towards a victim.
	Yes.
	You can also get, again, there's a wide spectrum of psychic attack.
	So you can have unintentional psychic attack where somebody gets really, really angry because you've irritated them in some way.
	And then they start talking about you and thinking about you.
	And without any intention, unconsciously, they send that attack to you.
	So you start to feel perhaps sick or dizzy or get a headache or a pain between the shoulder blades is the classic one.
	You've heard of the knife in the back.
	And then you've got in the middle of the spectrum, you've got people who know a bit and they dabble and they do things.
	And then you've got the heavy end of the spectrum where you've got the paid professional who's very, very skilled at what they do and they can carry out very serious psychic attacks where they can ultimately kill people.
	Is this the kind of stuff that happens in nice safe cities like London?
	I always used to think it was the kind of stuff that happened if it did happen in places like Haiti.
	Is it happening in our nice urban environment?
	Oh yeah, I think it's becoming more prevalent and more people are understanding it and being aware of it.
	And there's also lots of books around.
	I mean not only mine, but you go into sort of favourite bookshops and you will find books around teenage witchcraft and how to make somebody love you and all of that.
	And it's all about manipulation, working with energy, using your intention in negative ways.
	That to me is a psychic attack.
	Well, it's a local bookstore not far from where I live.
	And occasionally I look at the books on these things and they have an entire section on this kind of thing, like how to attract good health, how to attract the lover of your dreams and all that stuff.
	And I always think when I look at these books, and some of them are very highly colored and they look very enticing, what's the downside?
	If you start to mess with this stuff and you don't understand it, can there be a downside to playing?
	Absolutely.
	I mean, I had, I'll give you a quick example.
	I had a lady come to me and she had had a relationship with a man they had slit up.
	He then, several months later, he kept saying to her, I want to come back.
	No, no, I don't want you back.
	We've separated.
	We're going our separate ways, etc.
	Several months later, it was her birthday and he delivered to her a bracelet, put it on her wrist and said, there you go, it's a birthday present.
	And from that time, all she could think about was him.
	And in the end, somebody said to her, look, he's done something to that bracelet.
	Every time she took it off, she was impelled to go and put it back on her arm.
	She came to me.
	I took the bracelet and he had programmed it to try to get her back.
	So I basically cleansed the bracelet, deprogrammed it, etc.
	and said to her, you've got a choice.
	You can wear it now as an ordinary bracelet or you can just let go of it and I think I would be inclined to bin it.
	Yes, exactly.
	And some people are very inclined to bin these things.
	So people can use objects to get at you, but a lot of people, they will use, particularly in families, they will use photographs, they will use food, they will have access to your clothing, to your house, etc., etc.
	So they can do all sorts of things.
	But isn't it true, certainly you keep hearing this, don't you, that this stuff only affects you if you allow it to?
	Yes, there is that.
	There is always a two-way process.
	You know, in order to play ball, one of you's got to throw it and one of you's got to catch it.
	And you have a choice as to whether you're going to take part.
	At some levels, there are issues of with a paid professional, you're probably not going to have much choice or power in the matter.
	So you probably need to see a professional.
	But with a lot of people, if somebody is attacking you, what you've got to do is not attack them back, but actually manage your own energy.
	So if your protection is good enough, you decoured, you're grounded enough, you don't give them any thoughts or attention, often that attacker won't be able to get to you.
	So yes, it is a two-way thing.
	And a lot of attackers will often give themselves away because they will come to the person that they're attacking and they'll go, how are you?
	Are you okay?
	Or what about those terrible headaches that you were having?
	Are you still having them?
	So the best thing to say to an attacker is, oh, no, I'm absolutely fine.
	I'm better than I normally am.
	I'll bear that in mind.
	There was somebody who once told me, in fact, a couple of people have told me over the years that the entertainment industry, I've never actually personally seen it.
	I don't think I have.
	You know, there are one or two people who you think, how do they get to where they get?
	But the entertainment industry is supposed to be full of this stuff that there are many people at senior levels on the quiet using this kind of stuff for good or ill.
	Do you believe that?
	Yes, because basically psychic attack comes from jealousy, from competition.
	And some of the techniques, I used to teach people one technique, which was how to stop somebody attacking them, but it can be used in reverse, as I then discovered, in that what you do is that if you think somebody's attacking you, you write their name on a piece of paper, you put it in a container with water in it and freeze it.
	And what that does is it stops the action.
	It doesn't harm the person, but it stops the action.
	Now, what somebody did was they took that away and then got their competitor in business, their business competitor's flyer.
	They froze that and put that in the freezer.
	Their competitor's business stopped.
	It crashed.
	So therefore, they took them out of business.
	That must have some consequence on the person who does it.
	If you assume that works and you don't think it's a load of hocus pocus, if you assume that that works, if you stop somebody's business in that way, it's got to have some comeback on you, hasn't it?
	Yes.
	Karmically, it will come back at you, whether in this lifetime or in another lifetime.
	But often when you speak to people who carry out psychic attack, which part of my work is to find out if somebody's under attack, what the nature of the attack, what's been done, etc., and by who.
	And sometimes I will tune in to who, and then I will often have a higher self to higher self conversation.
	And often I will point out to them, you do realise, don't you, that this is going to come back at you at some point.
	Some people are really not interested in that because what they're more interested in is the quick gain, the quick response.
	So if you say to somebody, oh, karmically, this is going to come back and get you at some point, they'll go, oh, well, I don't have to worry about that now.
	But yes, karmically, it's going to come back.
	Do you believe that there are people who could sell their souls to the devil to make Fausty impact?
	I have known people who have said that they have done that and what they've ended up doing is working with some heavy end demons in order to get their way.
	What tends to happen is sometimes that that demon will actually turn back on them.
	Some people who carry out psychic attack continue to do so and they will often get very serious illnesses, etc.
	and basically kill themselves Because they're pulling all of that negative energy into themselves.
	So to be an attacker is not a safe thing to do either.
	And anybody who thinks this might be a way to get on, give that a whole lot more thought, yeah?
	Oh, yeah, absolutely.
	What about witchcraft?
	I used to know a witch in London, very famous one, made a career out of writing books about witchcraft.
	And she believed, and still believes, it's a very positive thing.
	Yeah.
	Many healers have actually been stoned to death or burnt to death as witches in past lives.
	The traditional form of witch is actually a healer.
	It's somebody who deals with herbs.
	It's somebody who deals with light.
	It's somebody who deals with the good side.
	Witchcraft in terms of psychic attack, spirit release is not the good side.
	It's just like with voodoo practitioners.
	Voodoo is a religion.
	Voodoo is very positive.
	Can be used very, very positively in terms of healers, etc.
	But there are also healers who take the voodoo knowledge and then turn it into the negative.
	So you're talking about a wide spectrum of witchcraft.
	Witchcraft, to me, is something that I have discovered across the world in various countries.
	And some witches, as we say, are very good, very beneficial, they're good intentioned, and some aren't.
	Okay.
	Is it something that, bearing in mind there are so many books in the big retailers about it?
	Is it something that you would recommend people to read into?
	Or is it one of those things that really is best left alone?
	Or does that depend on your character?
	If you're the kind of person who gets too intense about things, maybe you should leave it alone.
	It depends on your intention, I think.
	If you, it's like the, you know, make somebody love you books.
	If the make somebody love you is about working on yourself in order that you love yourself more and therefore you're more likely to attract people to you that because you love yourself are going to love you, that's okay.
	But if your intention is, I want that person there to love me and therefore I want to manipulate them and control them and want to demand a certain behavior from them, then that is a negative intention and that's where the negative witchcraft will come in.
	So if people are doing spells in order to control or manipulate another person, I would say that's not good.
	And from what we said before, that's going to come back karmically somewhere down the track and get you.
	It's going to bite you on the bum.
	Yeah.
	I knew something.
	This is something I've got to ask you because it's baffled me these last five or six years.
	I knew somebody once who, for a period of time, really believed, didn't just believe it, he lived it, believed that he'd been taken over by an alien.
	And this alien had a three-letter name.
	His personality changed over that period and he wanted to be referred to by this three-letter name, which I won't say here because it identifies the person to people who know him.
	And it was something that happened, I think it was over a period of weeks, maybe a couple of months.
	And he genuinely, and this is, we're talking about somebody rational here who has, you know, public standing and all the rest of it.
	However, he really did believe that he'd been taken over and he became somebody different for a period.
	do you think happened there?
	Okay it could be that he was right that there was something that took over He believed it was an extraterrestrial.
	Okay, well, extraterrestrials do that just the same as humans do.
	So it's possible that that happened.
	The fact that it came suddenly and hopefully ended suddenly if somebody removed it could indicate that there was something external to him that was causing him to behave in that way and was trying to overtake.
	However, you can also have periods of a psychotic breakdown where he may well have had a short-term psychotic breakdown where he thought that that was happening where it wasn't.
	There could be all sorts of reasons and rationales for that.
	And it takes somebody like you to go in there and see what's going on.
	In cases like that, what should people around a person in a situation like that do?
	I think they need to get specialist help.
	I think, as I said earlier, sometimes I get families, friends bring somebody to me with exactly that sort of scenario and say, we're not sure what's going on.
	Can you assess this person?
	Can you tune in and tell us?
	I very quickly can tell if somebody has a spirit or whatever with them.
	So it's a case of if I tune in and I go, oh, yes, there is something here.
	Let's remove it.
	Then that's one option.
	If I say, no, I can't find anything here.
	I can't find anything that's visiting, stayed at home, stayed in the car, et cetera, et cetera.
	Then I would say to them, I think this person needs to see a doctor.
	Okay.
	You would know how far to take it.
	Yes.
	What about possession?
	I'm a big fan of The Exorcist.
	Watch that movie many, many times.
	Can that kind of thing really happen?
	Yes.
	And have you come across anything like that?
	I've come across possession.
	You don't get possession very, very often.
	It's actually very, very rare.
	So people talk about I'm possessed when actually they're not.
	But you can get it.
	There are well-documented cases, etc.
	around the world where that has happened and something has taken over.
	There are ways of getting a spirit that is in the body out.
	And again, it is not for the faint-hearted.
	It is for somebody who really knows what they're doing, very experienced and very, very supported by their spirit team.
	Well, there is something that you say that you do, a soul retrieval, soul rescue.
	Presumably, that's what you'd have to do for somebody who was possessed.
	You'd have to rescue their soul.
	You'd have to, in terms of the prioris you order, what you do is that you clear any attachment or any possession first, and then you may well have to go and do a soul rescue or a soul retrieval for the person.
	Because under trauma, what happens is that sometimes a part of you will split off and it can happen in different levels of trauma.
	So I've known people who have had a car accident and part of them has split off and it's a case of that part will stay attached to them but outside of the body.
	And what happens is that it will stay in that traumatized state.
	So you have to give healing to that traumatized part and then when it's ready and it's healed and the person's ready, you have to bring it back.
	So you integrate it within the whole again.
	You're talking about an actual physical body part.
	No, no, no.
	You're talking about something psychic, a part of their psyche, a part of their...
	Yeah, it's a fragmented part of their psyche, if you like.
	And that can happen in something traumatic like a car crash.
	Yes.
	But I've also known it with people who've come and it's a case of you look back and when they were little, so when they were two or three, they fell off their bike and ended up in hospital.
	But the shock and the surprise of that and the pain of it actually caused that person to lose a part of them.
	So they fragmented.
	So you have to do a soul retrieval to bring it back.
	And can that happen with any traumatic event, like maybe the death of a loved one?
	Yep.
	Because we all react to trauma very differently because we're all individuals.
	So therefore, what's traumatic to one person is not traumatic to another person.
	What about deliverance?
	One of the lists of topics for your book, Spirit Release, is deliverance.
	What's the difference between what you've just talked with me about and deliverance?
	Okay, deliverance is there are certain churches now coming up in this country and around the world that call what they do rather than exorcism or spirit release or spirit rescue, they call it deliverance.
	And what they will do is it's usually a group setting where they will have the person who is under the influence of a spirit or spirits and that they will say lots of prayers and so on and so on.
	And the group will work to actually release the spirits from that person.
	And just one thing that I've been reading into recently, I don't know whether it's something that you've ever come across, maybe you have, in London, certainly cults, they seem to be on the rise and they have ways of, it seems to me, of grabbing hold of people and keeping them attuned that are very, very like these things we've just been talking about.
	Exactly.
	Cults to me, I dealt with a lady once years and years ago and she'd escaped from a cult that she'd been in for 15 years and initially she didn't realize it was a cult and she got out of it and then these people just kept on and on and on coming at her and when I looked at her she was the worst case of negative cords I have ever seen.
	She must have had about 150 cords attached to her from all the different cult members and basically what we did was I got a guillotine visualized a guillotine, cut all these different cords and the cult just went away and left her alone.
	Now did that work and all of these things but did that work because it actually physically did work or did it work because the person you were doing it to believed it was working and you believed it was working too otherwise you wouldn't have been doing it?
	In other words, is this all psychology really?
	Well, I suppose in some cases it might help if somebody believes it, but I've had several, many people over the years who have not believed a jot in what I do, and they've been sent by somebody who said, you must go and see her.
	And it doesn't matter to me if they believe it or not, but the truth is in the results afterwards.
	If somebody then says to me, it's all gone, it's all stopped, I feel completely different, you know that it's worked.
	And it's a bit like when you work with animals or children, they get better, they don't have to believe in it, they don't even have to understand it, they get better because of the energetic work that you've done.
	Something I should have picked up on before, I was amazed, very surprised, very interested that orthodox medicine, you would think that they couldn't or wouldn't do this, but they actually send people to you.
	And that's what you were saying right at the top of our conversation.
	Sometimes a doctor will see a person,
	they'll suggest you I'm very surprised that that happens I think it's becoming more and more known within the medical profession that there are other ways of looking at things we have on our healing courses medical intuition spirit release I have doctors and nurses coming on the courses I also know if you look at the Spirit Release Foundation which was started many many years ago by Dr. Alan Sanderson he is a consultant
	psychiatrist who does spirit release um there are many doctors around who are now realizing that there is something else along with patient care that they can add i mean obviously the nhs won't pay for somebody so you have to get the person or the family or whatever to pay you for a therapy session with somebody like me but the fact that doctors and nurses are now open to the fact that there are other things that may affect the health of their patient is
	brilliant and we actually have quite a lot of healers now working in hospitals alongside the medical staff well that's fascinating and you know just as a personal view i think that's very positive that we look at life the world and everything in in a different um in a different way i quite often i've had things down the years and you know unorthodox medicine is what's sorted it and all the pills in the world that you have in the cabinet actually haven't helped so maybe we ought to but that's only a personal view and not the view of this website just my personal view um so
	a pleasure to talk to you one quick question uh a regular guest on this show is a lady called helen morrison she's an expert in killers and serial killers particularly when you hear of some of these terrible murder cases that we've had in this country and and in america around the world really like the the multiple serial killer fred west for example but many many others i mean you can go through the litany and name them do you believe that some of those people may be affected by evil spirits bad spirits entities i believe
	that some of them are not all of them i think some of them it's psychological environmental upbringing etc etc but if you read um the book by eugene maury which is about possession his view is that many many people in american prisons have actually been taken over by a spirit.
	They've then done the terrible deed that they're in prison for, and then the spirit has left, which is why a lot of people then go to court going, Well, I don't remember what happened, I don't know what happened, I didn't do that.
	And that's certainly his view that he has cleared an awful lot of prisoners, etc., of their spirits.
	It's just a thought that's often occurred to me because you read of these terrible, terrible cases and you wonder how a human being, somebody who presumably has been through, you know, an upbringing of sorts and an education, how people can do the things that they do.
	And sometimes you think, could there be a third force involved?
	Which could be another area for another book, maybe.
	Yeah, maybe.
	What do you want to achieve?
	This book, Spirit Release, it's coming out now.
	What do you want to achieve with it?
	My aim with the book has always been to educate, to give people information because it is such a big subject and it's such a scary subject.
	And I think there's so many myths and fears around it that my idea is actually if we take the myth and the fear out of it and go, okay, this does happen.
	This can be real for some people, but there are also other ways to look at it, to understand it and to deal with it.
	And if you can give the people the power of, okay, now I recognize what happened to me or is happening to me.
	And I also know that there is help available.
	In your career, and I should have asked you, how many years have you been doing this for?
	A few decades.
	16.
	All right.
	Okay.
	16 professionally.
	All right.
	In the 16 professional years and all the other years that you were doing it, not professionally, if you're saying it, all those years.
	What is the case of which you are proudest?
	There must be one person who's come in in a terrible state, perhaps they've had a psychic attack to deal with or they've had a curse put on them or whatever.
	What are you proudest of?
	A case that you've documented yourself?
	Oh, I think that's a really hard question.
	I thought it might be.
	There's lots and lots of people who come into my head and about, you know, that they've really benefited, their life has changed around.
	I suppose the most extreme was that I had a man come to me for a number of sessions who was working in one of the African countries and he was under severe attack.
	And one time he came to me, he was almost dead.
	The doctors were saying to him, you have three weeks to live.
	And I looked at him and said, this is not physical, this is psychic attack.
	We worked to clear the attack.
	We protected him.
	He's happy.
	He's fine.
	He's fully functional.
	He's working, etc.
	And this is several years later.
	So I think, you know, if you look at all of the little successes and the big successes, actually saving somebody's life to me seems pretty big.
	And did you ever find out who and for what reason in that matter?
	We knew who it was, yes.
	It was people very, very high up in the government and people being employed by people very high up in the government.
	So, yes.
	But always when you work with this stuff, especially when you're dealing with something like that, you have to protect yourself.
	Yes, absolutely.
	You have to protect yourself as well as the client and their family and their property, etc., etc.
	You said to me that you've taken a very almost humorous approach to it sometimes, but a very calm approach to it all.
	Do you ever get scared?
	No.
	Never.
	You've never come across something that you thought maybe this is a challenge too far or this thing is going to do me some harm?
	Not ever.
	Not these days, no, maybe in the very early days.
	I mean, that's certainly that instant when I was 21, that frightened me at times.
	But no, since then, I think because that pushed me to my limits of my fear, these days, no, I don't.
	I tend to, as I said, anything scary happens, my first option is usually to laugh.
	So, no, I don't really get scared.
	I get scared more by living people than I do by the dead ones.
	That, I think, is a fact.
	We can agree on that.
	Sue Alan, a pleasure to talk with you.
	You're based in South London.
	If anybody wants to get in touch with you, I know you've got a website.
	What is it?
	The school website is intuitionandhealing.co.uk.
	Okay, and I'll put a link on that to my website, www.theunexplained.tv, or rather from my website.
	And we'll make it happen from there.
	Sue, Alan, pleased to talk with you and keep up the good work.
	Thank you.
	Thank you very much.
	That's Sue Allen.
	And if you want to know more about her and the work that she does, perhaps you might want to make an appointment with her or read or see more about her.
	Just go to the website www.theunexplained.tv, www.theunexplained.tv.
	And there you'll find a link to her website from mine.
	And my website was devised and is maintained by the great Adam Cornwell at Creative Hotspot in Liverpool.
	Adam, thank you for your hard work.
	Adam gets the show out to you and is an all-round top guy.
	Thank you to Martin for the theme tune.
	And above all, thank you to you for keeping the faith with the unexplained.
	As I say, if you want to send me any thoughts about the show, just get to the website www.theunexplained.tv.
	Let me have your thoughts.
	If you want to make a donation to the show, that would be fantastic.
	And thank you again.
	Go well.
	Take care.

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