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Jan. 20, 2008 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:05:38
Edition 9 - David Icke

The first edition of The Unexplained for 2008 and it is a special with world famous Britishwriter and visionary David Icke.

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Across the UK and around the world on the internet, my webcast and podcast.
My name is Howard Hughes, and this is The Unexplained.
Really good to be here.
Happy New Year.
Let me be the last person to say that to you, but we are now into 2008.
And you know, I have a little rule for myself.
I wonder if you have this too.
But I never make predictions about a new year.
I never say, this is going to be a great year, or this is going to be a year of change, or this is going to be a year of X, Y, or Z. I'm not that foolish.
I don't think I have that kind of sight.
There are people who do make predictions, and some of them are good, and some of them are not.
But I always like to think it's almost a superstition with me, better to just let it come.
Bring it on.
Let's see what happens.
And if we all of us collectively think that it's going to be good, then who knows, it may well be.
Special guest on this show, David Icke, he's coming up in a moment.
I hope you enjoyed the two shows that we put on the website across Christmas.
Those were the shows with Richard C. Hoagland, space expert, a man with a book out at the moment that's doing very well both sides of the Atlantic called Dark Mission to do with NASA conspiracy theories, and also the special we did with James Van Praague, American medium, who is, he tells me, coming to the UK this year.
So let's hope that we can welcome him to a studio or I'll go to him wherever he is in the UK when he gets over here.
I found him fascinating and I know you did too.
Now this show is picking up listeners all over the world.
I've had recent reports from places like New Zealand, Singapore, China, Spain, Sweden, South Africa, did I mention South America, Brazil?
We've had reports from there, Canada and right across the good old United States and of course all over the UK, picking up listeners all the time and I'm very grateful to you.
Now what I need you to do is to contact the show, let me know that you are listening and tell me what you think about it, how it can be improved and what other subjects we might cover on it.
There is a new way to contact the show.
The old email address is not going to work.
So there was a link to a different email address from the one I'm about to give you.
The current email address and the one that I will be using into the foreseeable future is this, unexplainedh at yahoo.co.uk.
That's unexplainedh at yahoo.co.uk.
Please email me.
Good to hear from you wherever you are.
I'm always grateful to get emails.
The website is www.theunexplained.tv.
That's www.theunexplained.tv.
If you found this show through iTunes and you haven't seen the website, I'd be very grateful if you just go across and visit it, see what's there.
There will be more on the website as the year goes by.
What else to say?
David Icke coming up soon.
Oh, just to mention something, the good friend of mine in Liverpool is going to be running in May.
Now, his name is Dave Truman.
David Truman runs a shop that deals with a lot of the stuff we talk about here on The Unexplained up in Liverpool.
And I understand he's doing quite well with it too.
Now, he is holding a conference in Liverpool in May, on the 3rd and 4th of May this year.
And it's called Beyond Knowledge.
It's going to talk about such things as claims, more claims, that the moon missions were all faked, the landings didn't happen, we've heard that a few times before.
And also manipulation of weather and many, many other subjects.
If you want to know more about David Truman's conference, Beyond Knowledge, you can go to beyond-knowledge at urban-myths.co.uk.
That's beyond-knowledge at urban.myths.co.uk.
And if I just hesitated there for half a second, a very weird thing happened.
Probably just coincidence, but as I said those words, a burst of sun illuminated the studio here.
It's been really dull for weeks here, but this burst of sunshine is just really lovely.
It's just coming in right now.
I'm sure it's coincidence.
The telephone number for David Truman, if you want to know more about his conference, by the way, 0151, that's the code for Liverpool in the UK, 708-9859.
0151-708-9859.
If you're calling from outside the UK, the country code is 44.
Special guest now on The Unexplained, and it is my pleasure to welcome back to the programme David Eich on the Isle of Wight.
David, how are you?
I'm very good, and things are going very well.
When you say they're going very well, what are you going to be doing in 2008?
Well, very soon I'm going to go and speak in Japan.
Then after that, I'm doing the Oxford Union.
I'm doing presentations at the Oxford Union, this debating society that goes back to the 1820s.
And then I'm doing the Cambridge Union.
And then I'm going to Italy to speak there.
And then I'm doing a major event at the Brixton Academy in London on the 24th of May to 2,500 people.
And I saw that prompted on your website there.
And apparently you're going to speak non-stop for seven hours?
Well, I'm going to do it in three chunks, yeah.
And there'll be hundreds, like 800 illustrations and various other things.
And it needs that time so that the dots can be connected, so the picture can be seen.
Because one of the greatest blocks on people understanding what is actually going on is the fact that we have a mainstream media that overwhelmingly is not interested in anything that's outside the box anyway.
But even when it is, it's overwhelmingly superficial.
It's like, you know, a minute here, five minutes there.
Nobody gets any time.
I noticed that you recently revised your, or went back to Terry Wogan, that Terry Wogan interview that you did in the UK that was quite hostile to you, what, 16 years ago.
And you went back and did a now and then show with him, and he gave you, I think it was 10 and a half minutes dead, and that was it.
You got 10 minutes.
Yeah, well, a lot of other stuff, because it was recorded, was actually edited out.
But it was quite interesting.
It was a very interesting thing to experience because I went in there the first time in, what, 1991 in total bewilderment at what was happening to me, because very strange things were happening to me.
My mind was opening up, if you like, but it was not yet in a state where it could filter and process all this information that was pouring into my mind, suddenly.
But by the time I did the second interview last year or so, I was completely in my own understanding of what had happened to me and all that stuff.
It was a completely different interview and a completely different energy.
And to be honest, Terry was out of his depths with the subject.
And it's kind of funny, you know, where you people dismiss things who know nothing about it.
I mean, I'm going to go at Terry Wilson, but it is an example which we're talking about.
I was talking to him about how the conspiracy worked, and his immediate reaction was, that's preposterous.
And so he says, where's your evidence?
And the moment that I started giving him detailed evidence, he said, no, no, no, no, no.
And ended the interview.
So you can't win with the mainstream.
But I noticed, and people who are listening to this outside the UK won't know quite what we're talking about, but all this stuff is on the internet in the public domain.
You can see it there anyway.
But the guy's name is Terry Wogan, very good broadcaster here, and a nice guy.
He met you at the very beginning of all of this, of your journey.
You were wearing a tracksuit on the show.
Looked as if you were going through some kind of experience.
You looked a bit shocked there.
And he gave you, he'd clearly been told to give you a very hard time.
And that he did.
Yeah, well, and of course he had the audience at that time, the studio audience, I mean, you know, with him, laughing with him.
But what I noticed his second time around when they did this revise it show, this show, Let's Bring It All Up to Date 15 Years On, the audience were actually on your side.
Exactly, and you know, that's so symbolic of what's happened because, you know, I've been saying years ago, in fact, I was saying it to myself, that if what you say has validity, then eventually it will be shown to be so.
So don't shut up just because you get resistance or you get ridiculed or you get condemned or whatever.
Just keep speaking your truth because if it is a truth, then eventually it will be shown to be so.
And if you walk away or shut up just because you meet resistance, then that outcome never happens because you stop.
And all these years of taking abuse and ridicule, and then suddenly from about 2001 with 9-11, but even more so now, it's like an exponential curve, there's just this explosion of interest.
And I'm being invited by both the Oxford Union and the Cambridge Union not to have their usual debates, but to present my information to them.
And these are students at Prestigious Universities.
And they always say when you do the Oxford Union, then you have arrived.
Yeah, and this information has arrived.
I mean, I'm a vehicle for it.
The information has arrived.
People are now opening their minds up to understand things that they would have dismissed a very short time ago.
And the interest is unbelievable.
We've all been accused over the years, and you said it yourself, but we know this.
We've read it, we've seen it.
In the UK, particularly, you've been accused of being nuts.
The only thing I would say to that, and I hear what everybody on this show, I hear what they say, and I view it on its merits, and I let the audience decide.
It's for them to do.
But somebody who is nuts, somebody who is mad, doesn't say the same thing every time you talk to them.
They say different things every time.
Now, you say the same thing.
You're consistent.
Yeah, I'm consistent because I've spent 20 years traveling to more than 40 countries researching what I'm writing and talking about.
I know what I'm talking about because I put the work in.
And every day I learn more.
And this thing about being a nutter and all the rest of it, people can be extremely juvenile and immature when faced with something that's suddenly different.
Now, they could have looked at me when I was having my amazing, strange experiences in 1991 around the Wogan Show, and I didn't know what was happening to me.
And they could have said, you know, this is interesting.
What's happened to this bloke?
He used to introduce the sport and the news.
What's going on here?
This is interesting.
What's happening?
But instead, it was just a new to, and that's all you get.
And so you have the choice then of conceding your right to express yourself to this resistance or to keep going.
And I've kept going.
And what has happened, the key thing that's happened, is that what I was talking about years ago and writing about in the books is now happening.
This is how this Channel 5 documentary came about about 18 months ago called David Ike, Was He Right.
Simply it was the case that I spoke in Belfast in 1994.
There was about 20 people there because, I mean, no one wanted to know in those days.
And among them was an Irish university student who later became a television producer and remembered what I'd said in 94 in that little room and looked at what is happening in the world, particularly since 9-11.
And he could see that the two correlated.
But I was interested, the show title was David Icke, Was He Right, and it wasn't David Icke, is he right?
Did that play upon you?
Did you notice that?
No, I was just interested in getting the information out.
But I take the point with the tense, but it was highly symbolic of the way people are now saying, well, hold on a minute.
We thought he was crazy, and some of the things he says seem to be far out, but hey, it's happening.
And this has transformed everything.
I mean, you know, it's incredible the interest in my work now.
When I look back at my life and I see the chain of events through my life, you know, we get really bewildered and we lose the plot when we judge every step as we're taking the step.
It's only when you look back and you see all the steps fitted together that you realize there is a theme here, there are connections here, and you are where you are today, not despite some of the steps, but because of all of them.
And because of all the ridicule that I received, which in the early 1990s, which was extremely important to me with hindsight, because it cleared me of the fear of what other people think and being kind of emotionally connected to how I'm received.
And that was very, very important when you're dealing with the kind of concepts and information that I am.
You simply would not put it into the public domain and talk about it if you were in any way in fear of what people were going to think of you.
Well, you talked about the steps you've taken, and I would guess the hardest step to take is the first step.
Now, I remember you when I was just coming into broadcasting.
I was a boy broadcaster learning the trade.
You were on the teller.
You were there already wearing a nice suit, good-looking guy, doing a good job, and suddenly you're not doing it anymore.
Yeah, some amazing things happened to me, which blew my mind open and allowed me to see beyond the box that most people live in.
And that transition from in the box to at least in a bigger box, if not out of the box, was a very strange and often painful and bewildering experience until I started to get a grasp on what the heck was going on.
But what I was saying about the ridicule, the ridicule was good for me personally for the reasons I've talked about, but the ridicule also gave me a honeymoon period, if you like, of many years to research this information, to produce a lot of books on this information, because I could not be perceived as a threat when I was such a figure of ridicule.
But what's happened is now there has been this transformation in the perception of me among vast numbers of people, including those that were laughing at me back in the Wogan days.
And now the people who I'm exposing are caught in a bind because the information's there.
I mean, if they did something to me now, in a physical way, it would just give my work tremendous credence.
And the people left behind would be selling enormous amounts of books on the back of the whole thing.
And that information is there, so it would be circulating.
So they're trying to do it in other ways by undermining me financially and by undermining me in other ways, which I can't talk about at the moment.
But let's say they ain't going to succeed.
They just ain't going to succeed.
Do you ever feel frightened, David?
Do you feel there in your nice home in the Isle of Wight, which is quite separated from the rest of the mainland UK?
It's a good place to live if you want peace, quiet, and privacy.
But do you ever feel frightened?
No, never.
Because, you know, it's one of the great traits and methods through which we're controlled, perhaps the biggest one, is fear of not surviving.
That's a trait of the reptilian brain, the oldest part of the human brain, what scientists call the R complex.
That's where we get that psychological response from.
They call fight or flight.
When we sense danger, we either hit the guy or run.
It's all our survival mechanisms are in there.
And that's a good thing, because without these natural survival instincts, then we wouldn't survive very long.
But if it can be manipulated and it gets out of hand, then the fear of not surviving becomes a prison.
I mean, fear of death is a major prison.
You give your power away to doctors.
You give your power away to anyone that you think can protect you and make sure you don't die before your time.
So you're telling me you don't much care what happens to you within reason?
What I'm saying is I do not have the fear of not surviving.
I mean, it also goes into fear of not surviving financially.
Am I going to pay the rent at the end of the month?
If you look at humans in all these different areas of their lives, they are invariably in fear of not surviving in some way, shape, or form.
Will this survive?
Will my relationship survive?
Will my job survive?
What would happen to me?
And this is a prison that most people live in.
Once you realize that the body is a biological computer, it's not who we are, it's the vehicle we use to experience this reality.
And we are consciousness, that's the infinite consciousness that goes on after the physical body comes to an end.
There's nothing to survive because at the level of consciousness, we can't do anything but survive because we are in an eternal state of consciousness.
It might take different expressions.
It might be in different dimensions of reality, but it's an eternal state.
The body is something that is the finite level.
And if we identify with the body, then we can get caught in the fear of not surviving because we don't realize that we can't do anything but survive.
And also when you realize that this experience that we're having in this reality is transient and temporary, and whatever is happening to you now, it's not permanent, something it will change because everything's constantly changing, then fear of not surviving financially, fear of not surviving in these daily experience ways, that also starts to fall.
So it all ceases to be important.
Now, do you believe that you can change your own reality, or is it just that you're changing your perception of the reality that you're going through, if you see what I'm saying?
Well, that's a very good point.
I mean, you know, it's not what you're experiencing.
It's the point from which you're observing what you're experiencing.
You know, put it in the simplest way, is the glass half empty or half full?
Some people will see their situation as negative.
Some people see it in another way.
And what happens when you start to expand your consciousness from what I call five sense reality or body consciousness out into the greater expansion of consciousness that we are, and that's what happened after that explosion in my head in the early 90s, then your point of observation moves.
So you don't see the world like everyone else.
And this is people who do that, they're the ones that kind of stand out like a throbbing thumb because people who are in body consciousness, which is the overwhelming majority, although it's changing, it's changing fast, they are perceiving something in a certain way.
Whereas you are looking at the same thing from a completely different point of observation and you're seeing it in a completely different way.
And because the norm is body consciousness reality, You stand out as being, quote, different or a nutter or strange or weird.
But when you look at the day-to-day world, David, that you see around you in the Isle of Wide or wherever you travel, do you see what I see?
Do you see something different?
What do you see?
What's there?
What I see is what it means.
Let me give you an example.
A simple thing like a major event like 9-11.
Large numbers of people, because they have been told the official story and believed it, they see 9-11 in a certain way.
19 hijackers who couldn't fly Cessnas suddenly manifested miraculously the ability to fly wide-body jets in the most incredible extraordinarily skilled way.
And as a result of that, people who accept that story will accept that certain things have to happen to protect people from that happening again, like more and more surveillance and control and invading Afghanistan or whatever.
I am coming from a completely different point of observation of that same event.
I'm saying, as I've been saying from the day it happened, it is an inside job within the borders of the United States, and it was orchestrated to create the excuse for this explosion of Orwellian legislation to take freedom away, to have more and more surveillance, to have more and more controls, to have microchip people.
And notice, you know, Howard, I've been talking about people, the agenda being to microchip people for what, since the early mid-90s.
And people laugh to start with.
I posted a story on my website this week from the Independent newspaper, the London Independent, where it was saying the government are now preparing to have a policy of microchipping, not electronic tagging, around the ankle, microchipping prisoners because there are too many prisoners for too few cells.
The prisons are overcrowded, so we have a problem.
So the solution is we're going to microchip prisoners with microchips under their banks.
That's not a high-tech solution to a problem.
That's not, you know, of course prisoners are deprived of their liberty, but that's not affecting the rest of us, is it?
Well, you know, there's two ways.
The two main ways that we are mass manipulated to accept the Orwellian state unfolding.
One is what I call problem reaction solution.
You create the problem, you blame someone else for it.
You tell the people through an unquestioning, unresearching media the story of that problem you want people to believe.
The people then you want to react by saying something must be done, this can't go on, what are they going to do about it?
And then those who've covertly created the problem then offer the solution to the problem they have created.
Now, this microchipping is being brought in of prisoners because of a problem of prison overcrowding.
Now, the other technique that goes alongside that is what I call the totalitarian tiptoe, which is also extremely relevant to this microchipping of prisoners.
The totalitarian tiptoe operates on the fact that they know from the start, while they stand at A, that they're going to Z in their agenda.
But they know if they go there in great leaps, then the change in society is going to be so great that people are going to look up from the game shows and say, what's going on?
So this thing with prisoners is a stalking horse to get us to somewhere else.
It's a stepping stone.
How it happened, Howard?
It was, first of all, to get microchipping kind of part of society.
They started with microchipping domestic animals.
Now they microchip many other kinds of animals.
And then they started microchipping as they have clothing and stuff.
And then they started to talk about microchipping Alzheimer patients so that they could be found if they were missing.
And then it was microchipping of prisoners.
And it's just picking it off until it's microchipping of people.
People go on about identity cards.
Oh, we mustn't have identity cards.
It's Big Brother.
Well, I'm afraid identity cards are a stepping stone on the totalitarian tiptoe.
What they're really heading towards is microchipping.
And as I have written in my books, you know, I met a CIA scientist in 1997 who told me about all this.
He was someone who had a patch on his chest, a patch they call them in the CIA.
And he has been manipulated, his body has been manipulated to need a drug to survive or he starts to die a painful death.
And the drug is in this patch.
It's like a see-through shampoo sachet stuck to his chest.
And it has to be replaced every 72 hours.
And if he doesn't do it, do what they tell him and use his scientific genius to advance this agenda I'm exposing, then they don't replace the patch and he starts to die.
And he's tried it.
And we found out they meant what they said.
But he told me when we had this meeting through a third party that arranged it, that in 1997 that the idea was to have a microchip population, which I knew about.
But what he said was that people think that it's just about electronic tagging.
It is not.
He said it's not even primarily the message going from the chip to the computer that you need to worry about, but the message is coming the other way.
He was saying that once you have a chip under your skin, then from a distance, they can manipulate you emotionally, mentally, and physically, including taking you out.
So this brings us right into the global conspiracy, which is what you're talking about at the moment.
And that is, these things are put there to get control.
What do we want control for?
Because we want global government.
The question is, who are we?
Who are the people who are doing this?
Well, there are many levels, many levels to this.
And, you know, I've had to understand, research so many different subjects before you can even understand the dots, never mind, fit them together.
But when you do, you know, there's many, many levels to this.
But if we keep it within, if you like, the five cents level, there were bloodlines from the ancient world.
They were all over the world, really, but particularly in terms of Control today.
They came out of Sumer and Babylon and that area of the world, which today, of course, is Iraq, Mesopotamia, the land between two rivers.
And the invasion of Iraq and the occupation of Iraq at this time is not just about oil.
Yes, on one level they benefit that way, but it's not just about oil.
That area of land is extremely important historically and ritualistically to this network of bloodlines, because that's certainly from that point in history, a few thousand years BC, is where they came out of.
They expanded out through the Babylonian Empire and to Egypt and all the other places, and then they, over the centuries, eventually became the Roman Empire, where they created the Christian Church and expanded that empire up into northern Europe.
These bloodlines were interbreeding with other, quote, blue bloodlines, which had a particular DNA, and they became the aristocracy and royal families of Europe.
When the people eventually started resisting the in-your-face dictatorship of control by royal inheritance, these bloodlines moved into what I call today the dark suit professions, into politics, into business, banking, military control, etc., etc.
And through the empires of Europe, the colonial empires of Europe, particularly the British, the French two, and others, they expanded their power across the world and they took with them both this bloodline and, which always goes with it, the secret society network which manipulates this bloodline into the positions of power or the agents of this bloodline anyway.
And then there's two types of control.
There's a dictatorship you can see and understand.
That's like fascism, communism, apartheid.
And they have a finite life.
It might go on for quite a while.
But they have a finite life because eventually the desire for freedom will resist that dictatorship that they clearly know exists and is controlling them.
But the greatest form of dictatorship is the dictatorship you can't see.
It's the prison without the bars because you just sit there in the cell, not realizing you're in one.
And so what happened when these colonial powers apparently withdrew and gave independence to these former colonies is they left out in those countries the bloodline and the secret society network, and they've gone on controlling those countries ever since.
And the structure, and this is how they can manipulate globally, the structure of this network is literally like a transnational corporation.
You have your headquarters, which is overwhelmingly in Europe.
Not European governments, but the Secret Society Network Center in Europe, which is there for historical reasons.
And they dictate from that central point the global agenda to manipulate the world towards this global Orwellian state.
And in each country, they have their subsidiaries, which are these networks whose job it is to manipulate their sphere of influence, their country, United States, Britain, whatever it is, to introduce the changes that are dictated from the center.
And this is why you find things changing in different countries at the same time.
And even some of the legislation uses the same wording.
It's orchestrated.
And so something like the war on terror, something like the ludicrous explanation of global warming, is orchestrated from the center and pushed through all these different countries.
I'm just going to take you on a cold attack there, or rather just a little detour there.
The ludicrous explanation of global warming.
Well, what is global warming then, if it isn't what we've been told it is?
It's the sun.
In the new book, The David Guide to the Global Conspiracy, I have a chapter called The CarbonCon, where I'm quoting leading scientists in their field.
I mean, real top people in the various fields relevant to this.
And they don't get the platform to say what they have established.
Well, there are people in the UK who are saying this.
I know a guy you might know him too called Piers Corbyn.com.
Yeah, I've come across him.
But what happens is that the scientists who sing from the song sheet, they're the ones that overwhelmingly get the public platform.
And then they put up this man who, if he's involved in it, it's a scam, called Al Gore.
And of course, they manipulate the fact that his ludicrous documentary gets the Oscar and he gets the Nobel Peace Prize to heighten the profile of the whole thing.
About 800 years ago, they had what has been termed by scientists the medieval warm period when the temperature was higher than it is today.
Well, where were the Turbochunch charged hand carts?
Where were the factories?
Where was the carbon dioxide?
And then what followed that was what they call the Little Ice Age.
And that's when the Thames used to freeze over and used to have ice fairs on the Thames.
And you can still see depictions of it in some Christmas cards.
So what's happening is to do with the sun it in the normal way of things.
Why are we being, as you say, lied to about it?
Well, this is the interesting point, because what I'm saying can be shown to be true.
I mean, I've put the graphs in the book.
There is a phenomenon on the sun called sunspot activity.
These massive explosions of energy from the sun, which are projections out into the solar system, which eventually come to the Earth and affect our temperature.
When there's an increase in sunspot activity, clearly there's an increase in the projections of solar energy coming into the solar system and to the Earth.
And from the Little Ice Age, when you had the Thames freezing over, sunspot activity started to increase.
It increased until 1940 and then fell until 1975.
Earth temperature increased until 1940, fell from 1940 to 1975 to the point where the BBC were doing documentaries In the 70s, about the dangers of a coming ice age.
That's only a few decades ago.
Yep, no, I remember that, but I still don't understand why it is necessary to lie to people about the cause of this.
Well, I'll come to that in 20 seconds.
Just to finish the point, the sunspot activity increased from 1975 to the present day, and so has the temperature.
Now, why?
Because if you want to create a centralized global dictatorship, you need laws that everyone can or has to obey.
This is why the buzzword today in this whole area is international law.
You hear it on the news all the time.
We must have international law.
The other thing that they do is we must have global coordination of regulations regarding health foods and all this other stuff.
And it's all orchestrating legislation which everyone on the planet has to obey.
So this is just, from what you're saying, this is just like the microchips.
If these laws about global warming and emission standards and stuff, they're a stalking horse, you say, for something else.
Yes, it's problem, reaction, solution.
I go into it in great detail in this chapter in the book.
It's devastating because I'm quoting absolutely cutting-edge scientists in their field.
Well, then they have to be believed.
Nothing can be, as it seems.
Nothing our government tells us, nothing any government tells us, can be taken on face value because from what you're saying, there's a hidden agenda behind everything.
Well, not necessarily behind everything, but behind most things.
I mean, you know, it was interesting that one of the people that was a frontman for this network during the Second World War was Franklin Roosevelt.
And one of the few things he said that was actually true once was, nothing happens by accident.
If it happens in politics, it's because it's meant to happen.
It is orchestrated.
And the random nature of things is just for public consumption in terms of the way they orchestrate politics and all this.
The agenda is to centralize global power.
To do that, they need the excuse to do it.
And so all the time, they are coming up with reasons to centralize power on a global level or get closer and closer to it.
This is what the European Union and all this other stuff is about.
And to find excuses for international law and global legislation.
Well, as we record these words, one of the big stories over the last 48 hours or so has been reports in the UK that there is an al-Qaeda branch supposedly launched here with its own website and its own contacts and all the rest of it.
I instantly thought of you when I saw that report because I thought, well, you're going to believe there's something else in that.
Well, are there people who are trying to manipulate terrorism if it's only in their own mind on the internet?
Yes.
Was 9-11 orchestrated by these people?
Absolutely not.
And of course, al-Qaeda is a word meaning the base.
Just before he died of his heart attack, Robin Cook, the former British Foreign Secretary rather, went public in the Guardian newspaper with an article in which he said publicly, which I'd already written in my books a year or so before,
that al-Qaeda is called the base or the database because it came from a CIA database of the Mujahideen people in Afghanistan who were brought together by the American authorities to fight against the Russians when the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan.
And it was then that the Saudi royal family and the American authorities brought into Afghanistan Osama bin Laden.
And this whole thing came out of the orchestration by the CIA.
They had training camps in Pakistan and Afghanistan.
The CIA and British intelligence and people like the SAS used to be some of the training instructors, training people to be terrorists to produce terror events against the Soviets in Afghanistan.
This whole thing came out of that.
And so, you know, this idea that this al-Qaeda is this kind of all-powerful kind of terrorist group, it's not.
One good thing the BBC did do a few years ago, maybe 18 months ago, was a series on BBC Two.
I think it was called Manufacturing Nightmares or something like that, along those lines.
And they showed in that program there is no al-Qaeda in terms of what the authorities and the governments are telling us exists.
And it's interesting.
In Orwell's book, 1984, there is a terrorist group alleged by the government dictatorship in the story, led by a man called Emmanuel Goldstein, who was Orwell's Osama bin Laden.
And, you know, again, it was nothing like what the authorities said.
Did this so-called terrorist group have the power that the government said?
If you're going to unite people behind your policy, you have to produce a bogeyman to frighten them.
But of course, it isn't only you who's saying that.
There are people in America like Alex Jones, who I'm sure you know, who say exactly that.
What you do is you create some kind of straw man, bogeyman, whatever it is, call it al-Qaeda, call it whatever, and you make the people afraid of it so that you can then control the people.
Yes, exactly.
And the point you made about the Internet is very interesting because the Internet is a genie.
There are many, many benefits of the Internet.
Because, of course, it's possible because of military technology.
The Internet came into being because those in the power structure wanted it to come into being.
And there are so many benefits.
You can track people.
I mean, you can track people's communication so easily.
You can track their surfing likes and dislikes so that you can...
But a lot of People innocently use the internet, just to briefly go onto this subject.
Yeah, they use the internet wherever they are, thinking, of course, whatever they do is completely private and not realizing that their steps can be traced if people want to trace their steps very, very simply.
You're absolutely right on that.
And it's lulled people into a false sense of security.
So is the internet not this great thing, do you think, David, that I've always seen as a liberating thing?
It's allowing me, for example, to approach people directly with this show.
You're saying it's another tool for control.
Well, what I'm saying is, it's like I said a few minutes ago, it's a genie.
You've got the downside of it, the upside of it for those that wish to control us and trackers, which is that they can follow communications very easily.
But the downside, the genie for them, is the free flow of information and the free flow of communication.
There is no way in the world that we, certainly I, would have got to the level of communication of this information that I have now without the internet.
Absolutely no way.
So what they're doing now is trying to find excuses to keep the upside for them, being able to track people easily, but destroy and suppress the downside for them, which is the free flow of information that they don't want people to know about.
And you are starting to see, but you're going to see more of this process where they find excuses for editing and censoring the Internet to stop terror, to stop terrorists doing this, to stop this, to stop that.
And of course, we have an example of how far it can go in China, where much of the Internet is firewalled off.
I mean, you know, for instance, I get communications all the time from people at work in various workplaces around the world and companies and what have you saying your website's been blocked off.
They've firewalled it off.
We can't get it.
Well, isn't that just about making sure these people are productive and they're not looking at David Icke's website or surfing porn?
Well, not really, because the porn and the rest of it, and the rest of the stuff, they can access, but they can't access my website increasingly.
And you have airports.
Some airports people have tried to get on my website and can't because it's blocked off.
Ironically, one person contacted me.
They tried to get on my website at an airport and they were told that it was a pornography site and therefore they couldn't access it.
David, if I was looking to control people and I was looking to use the internet as one of the tools in my armory to do that, what I might do, certainly in a so-called free world that we have here now, is allow all the information to get out there because in the fog of all that information, how are people ever going to find the truth?
You know what I'm saying?
That if you create that kind of smokescreen with enough information, this is the theory about UFOs that they keep talking about.
UFO files are being opened all over the world.
And one of the reasons it's being claimed that that's being done, if you believe that aliens exist, is to give people so much information that they'll never be able to find the truth in the maze of information.
They'll never have the time.
I absolutely agree with that.
And you can see that when we had two or three or four television channels in Britain, there was a certain amount of information that you could reach and a large audience could be reached by those channels because there was nothing else.
Now we've had this explosion of television channels, of course, and the audience is massively diluted on each channel.
And therefore, it's very much more difficult to get information to a very large number of people like it was before.
However, what has been happening is there are certain groups, whatever you want to call them, people on the internet, who have started to pull this together so in a way that people don't have to go to endless different websites to check out different subjects because the dots are being connected on one website or a few websites and it's starting to have a serious effect in terms of people getting it.
And the authorities don't want that.
And you're going to see more and more excuses to censor the internet and also to control the internet.
I mean, they're talking about legislation in America to have a two-tier internet where the corporations have a certain level of the internet and surfing speed and all the rest of it.
And then there's a second division for everyone else.
So David, when this elite behind all of this with its various spin-off elites that we call our governments, when they get their way, assuming that happens and assuming you're right, for what end is that?
What do they get out of that?
What's in it for them?
Well, you know, why do people, I mean, there are many levels of this, but why do people who have earned more money than they could spend in a hundred lifetimes, why do they get up before dawn every morning to keep going and earning more or to acquire more and more companies, even though they've got more than they even know they own, probably, some of these massive multinational companies.
I will say it's a compulsion and you have to just keep going.
But once you've got control of everybody in the world, that's job done, isn't it?
Well, that's the outcome that they want.
I mean, they don't have complete control yet.
They don't.
The complete control is their goal.
It's not where they're at.
They have enormous control because they've been picking off more and more control in the totalitarian tiptoe for not just decades, but centuries.
And of course, there's a simple equation.
The more power you have, the more centralized power you have, the more power you have to centralize even quicker.
And that's why the process of centralization of control in media ownership, governments, and all the rest of it has got faster and faster and faster.
They want complete control.
You see, we need to understand these people are not balanced.
I call them very clever but stupid.
And cleverness without wisdom is the most destructive force On earth, they have a compulsive desire to control everything, and they have a real problem with any maverick situation that they can't control, or maverick person they can't control.
They feel very, very uneasy.
You're one of those people.
Now, the answer to this problem, I've just, maybe I'm very stupid, or maybe I've just come up with a great idea.
Wouldn't the answer to this problem be for you, David Icke, and people who believe what you believe to stand for political office?
No, because the political office is an irrelevance.
You know, prime ministers and presidents don't dictate policy.
My goodness me.
They are vehicles to bring policy from the shadows into the public arena and into law.
The idea that George Bush runs America, I mean, it's ludicrous.
These people are puppets.
You say it's irrelevant, but you could at least get the point out there.
You could put a flea in their ear, you could put a spoke in their wheel, whatever phrase you want to use, by being part of the system.
The system has never been changed from the inside.
Never.
It's always been changed from the outside by changing people's perception of the system to the point where they insist the system changes.
What happens, I mean, you know, I'll give you an example.
When I joined the Green Party in the 1980s and became a national spokesman, there were people there who were radical, they wanted change, they wanted justice, they wanted fairness, they wanted to change the political system of privilege and all the rest of it and the way it worked.
And now, two of those people have become members of the European Parliament.
And when I see them on television or wherever, they are absolute mirrors of everything they said they opposed before they became members of the European Parliament.
Because, you know, everything, I actually go into this in the new book.
Everything is a vibrational field, whatever it is, a thought, a physical body, a situation.
They're all vibrational fields.
And it's the same principle.
Politics is like the principle of sympathetic resonance, where if you have three violins and they're plucked to a certain note, if you put another violin in there, the predominant note will impose itself on the violin that's playing a different note, and they all come into line.
Sympathetic resonance, they call it.
Well, when people go into politics, they might have the same or a desire for change.
But in the end, the system gets to them.
The system, they might be beating to a different drum, Howard, when they first start, but eventually you'll get the system will beat them into line, will vibrate them into line.
I mean, in the news this week in this country is Peter Hain, right, a government minister.
Peter Hain has gone from being a student radical battling against apartheid and stopping apartheid South African rugby teams and cricket teams playing against others like in Britain, to being an absolutely bog standard system-serving politician.
Isn't that one of those things that goes with age and experience?
In other words, kids, when they're going to college, you know, I was certainly, they tend to be radical and then they mature somewhat and they become a little more conservative down the years, maybe.
Well, they don't mature, Howard.
They get bounced into the system's version of reality.
So what I'm saying to you, politics is going to change nothing.
People change politics.
Politics doesn't change politics and it doesn't change anything.
But there's good news for you, I think, in something that you just said to me about sympathetic vibration.
If that is the case and this works universally among everybody, then everybody who listens to what you're saying, if they start thinking differently, then they can make the world vibrate differently and it'll all change, won't it?
Spot on, and it is.
I've been a barometer for this because when I started out nearly 20 years ago, no one wanted to know.
I was talking to nobody.
I was putting the chairs out, talking to nobody, putting the chairs back and going back, going home poorer than when I arrived.
And I thought, what's the use?
Now I'm talking to thousands of people when I do my talks and stuff.
And the interest in my website and my books has absolutely economic.
Well, that is undeniably true.
Do you not think this is also part of the fact that people these days, you talked about television channels, there are more of them than we used to have.
Well, that's a small example.
In every field of life now, we probably have, in the Western world, too much choice.
And people are trying to come to terms with it and find an explanation for a world that is becoming increasingly complicated.
Hence, they come to your door.
Well, the reason they come to my stuff is because it makes sense of the world that they live in.
You know, you have to have coordinates, simple coordinates, i.e., where is the world going and what techniques are being used to take the world there?
And when you have those coordinates, the world starts to make sense.
What appears to be bureaucratic incompetence or stupidity or a mistake, when you have those coordinates, you can see that it's actually coldly calculated because of the outcome.
That's what people need to watch.
When there is a problem or an apparent piece of incompetence or whatever, look at the outcome, always the outcome.
What is the outcome of it?
And if the outcome is more centralization of power, more erosion of privacy and more surveillance and control, then that was no mistake and it was no accident.
It was coldly calculated to bring about the excuse to change society in the way I've just described it.
Am I right in thinking that there is hope for all of us, assuming that your initial scenario is right, in that if we all start to just think about ways in which things can be different, they might be?
Well, if you're going to control someone's perception of possibility, you have to control the information they receive about what is possible.
And this is a really, really important point because so many people will reject something, not because it's not possible or it's not true, but because it is outside the idea of what is possible based on the information they've received.
This is why controlling and suppressing so much scientific discovery and understanding that takes us into another greater understanding of even reality and who we are doesn't get taught in the schools and the universities and you don't see it on the mainstream television except extremely rarely because controlling the information about what is possible controls the population's perception of what is possible.
And when you control that, you get people laughing in the face of truth when that truth can be explained and made absolutely credible, but only if people understand that they are missing out on a vast amount of information which would make the apparently fantastic seem perfectly logical.
And what do you make of my friends in places like the United States and South Africa, David, who channel what they call ascended masters forces over and above our heads that we cannot see but have tremendous insight and powers and want to give us information supposedly to save ourselves?
Well, you know, this is a minefield.
Creation is broken up into wavelengths.
This physical world that we think we're experiencing as some kind of infinite world is actually just the frequency range that our five senses can access.
Just like a television tuning into a television channel.
You get BBC1, you switch the channel, you get BBC2.
BBC1, BBC2 are sharing the same space as each other, but they're not interfering with each other because they're on different frequencies.
And then you tune into one or the other and you get that, not the other.
So if you're on Radio 1 and you tune to Radio 2, then you get Radio 2.
But Radio 1 doesn't cease to broadcast just because you've left it on your dial.
It's continuing to exist.
It's just you're not accessing it anymore.
So when we look through our eyes at what we think is space, we are looking at a tiny fraction of what actually exists in that space, just that frequency range that our eyes can access.
And so, yes, there are infinite worlds, what even mainstream science is now calling parallel universes, where other entities, other consciousness exists, and it is possible if you're sensitive enough and free enough of the illusions of the five senses to actually access these other dimensions and bring information into this world from other worlds.
And more and more people are talking about parallel universes and saying this could be the way to access different outcomes in the future or go back to the past or meet aliens from other planets or whatever.
Yeah, well, I mean, you know, when the Chinese have a saying that when all is known and everything is revealed, all that will be left is to have a good laugh.
Because when we realize what the reality of existence is compared with what we perceive it to be within this physical vehicle and this illusory reality, we are just going to be in hysterics.
It's going to be so funny because it's just nothing like what we think we're experiencing.
But the point is about this channeling and accessing other dimensions and information.
Yes, some people can do that and they can access amazingly advanced, profound information that is beyond what exists in this world.
But there's an enormous number of people who claim to be channeling other dimensions and connecting with this being and this hierarchy and the great white brotherhood and all this stuff.
It's all a load of nonsense.
There's not just high-dimensional entities out there in the ether who want to communicate information to help humanity awaken to its true self.
There are entities out there that want to manipulate individuals and humanity in general down another cul-de-sac and mislead them and misdirect them.
So you have to be incredibly discerning with this stuff.
Have you ever encountered, David, entities?
I've seen, I've had strange experiences with people when their eyes have changed into a reptilian form.
Was it you who talked about being in a make-up room before a TV show and you were there with a famous British politician who's no longer with us anymore and he transformed into a reptilian in front of you?
Is that you?
Well, he didn't transform into a reptilian, but he did transform into something very strange.
He was a man called Ted Heath, and funnily enough, Ted Heath was the Prime Minister of Britain from 1970 to 74, and he was the man who signed us into the European Union, as it's become.
And he very much was a front man on a gopher level.
He wasn't high level, but he was a gopher politician for this network I'm talking about.
And when I started my research into this around 1990, his name started to come up when I was researching the political manipulation of Britain.
And so it did in many other areas that were absolutely horrific, which I go into in the book.
But what happened before I was into any of this, I was in the Green Party.
It was 1989, for the one and only time the Green Party had had a big vote in this country in a European election.
And I was invited onto the satellite television news show, Sky News, to comment on the results as they came in.
And I arrived at the studio and I got met by this lady who said, I'll take you to the make-up room.
And I walked in the make-up room and the door was open.
And I walked in, and it seemed to me the room was empty.
And the lady sat me down in a chair, and she said, well, someone will be along in a minute and walked out.
And then as I was looking at the mirror, some movement caught my eye to my right.
And I turned around and there was Ted Heath.
He'd been just interviewed on the program and was waiting to have the makeup taken off before he could leave.
And I looked at him and, you know, being a friendly bloke, I said, all right, mate, how you doing?
And he never said a word to me throughout all of this.
And all he did was turn and look at me.
And his eyes Started at the top of my head and went down to my feet very slowly and then all the way back again to the top of my head.
I can only describe it as scanning me, and then turned around and looked back at the mirror.
And of course, I did this: what's going on?
The point was, however, that while this quote scanning was going on, his eyes turned completely black.
I'm talking the whites, the pupil, the lot turned completely black.
And when you look someone in the eye, we make what we call eye contact.
There's a point where the eye meets the eye.
Not with this guy when he went into black eye mode.
It was like, I described it to my family when I got home.
It was like looking into two black holes.
There was no point where his eyes made contact with me.
I was looking through him.
And did you say anything to him at that time?
Did you say anything?
Did your eyes appear black?
No, no, no, I was not into any of this stuff.
I was a national spokesman for the Green Party, and I was introducing the sport for the BBC.
What did you think had happened?
I had no idea.
But soon afterwards, well, not soon afterwards, but when I started getting into this area of research, I realized what had happened.
Around the world, in all these countries that I've been researching this, I've met a significant number of people who've told me the story of the black-eyed people, people whose eyes turn black.
And I thought, my goodness, I've experienced that.
You know, normally you'd go, what?
But I know, I know what you mean.
I've experienced that.
The thing is, this, we look at the world through our five-sense vision, and it's a tiny frequency range.
Therefore, anything within that frequency range, we can access and see, and it becomes our reality.
Anything outside that frequency range, even fractional, we can't see.
And we have this age-old in every culture theme throughout history of possession, people being possessed by another entity or another consciousness.
And these other entities exist on frequencies beyond human sight.
And sometimes they will come forward into our frequency and then go back out again.
And people will go, did you see that?
That bloke's just changed into something.
Did you see that?
No, what are you talking about?
What have you been on?
No.
Either that the possessing entity comes into this frequency range briefly, or someone with psychic sight can tease out their frequency range of sight more than the norm and also enter that frequency range where they can see an entity around someone else.
Now, when I started researching this, this is the great theme of these bloodlines.
They have a particular DNA that resonates, sympathetic resonance, with these entities that possess them from other dimensions and control their mental-emotional faculties.
And I've come across this all over the world, ancient and modern accounts.
And the bloodlines are, in effect, vehicles with a resonance, the sympathetic resonance with these possessing entities.
So in simple terms, if you can manipulate those bloodlines in positions of power, what you're actually doing, although the population doesn't realize because it's beyond their sight, you're putting these possessing entities in those positions of power.
And sometimes there will be an energetic shift, a distortion, in which you see this transformation between the possessing entity and the other entity.
And people call this shape-shifting, or their eyes will shift.
And what happened with me with Ted Heath was when he was doing that scanning, I was looking through his eyes into some other frequency, some other dimension where the possessing entity of him actually existed.
And that's what I was seeing at that time.
And you swear you hadn't had any of the corporate hospitality there, no wine, nothing like that that might alter your perceptions of what was going on.
Okay, straight out the taxi, straight into the room, and there he was.
And if only I had had that experience, you'd go, well, okay.
But I have not sat in some darkened room smoking a weed, coming to these conclusions.
I've been a journalist, a proper journalist, going out and following the information in more than 40 countries.
And I've had enormous numbers of people in every culture, whether it's black South Africa and the shamans there, or whether it's corporate America.
People in corporate America have told me these same stories and experiences that they've had.
I've talked to insiders like the CIA scientist who told me about the microchips, and he's quite open about it.
Yeah, you know, the whole thing's orchestrated by non-human entities.
And on the inside, they know about this if you're deep enough on the inside.
But you can get a situation, and we saw this with the Iraq war in terms of the British cabinet, where you can actually be around the table with the Prime Minister in his government and still not have a clue what the whole thing, what you're part of.
Well, part of that is in the nature of politics.
David, listen, I always find it of all the hundreds of people in my time that I've talked to for radio, you probably are the person I find it hardest to conclude a conversation with because there's always so much more I want to talk about.
It's a different time to do it.
But at least I hope I've given you a chance that a lot of media outlets don't give you because they've got to do their commercial breaks or they have other imperatives that they have to stick to.
At least I've given you the chance, I hope, to be able to explain what you're all about.
Yeah, it's brilliant, Howard.
Thanks very much.
And you have a website?
What's the website?
DavidEyke.com.
There's a headlines page there where this manipulation, this conspiracy is tracked by the day.
And what would you like to achieve coming out of 2007 into 2008?
I'm going to be looking back at 2008 and the end of this year.
What would you like to say that you have done in this year?
Well, to be even more, indeed greatly more successful in giving people access to this information Not in the sense of this is what you must believe, because I know it all, but here's another view and another explanation of reality, you, yourself, and life and what's going on in the world.
Make of it what you will.
Build it into your own reality, build it into your own paradigm that explains the world.
David, always fascinating to talk to you.
Thank you very much.
David's website is davidike.com.
This website that you're hearing this show through is triww.theunexplained.tv.
If you want to email me, it's unexplainedh at yahoo.co.uk.
My webmaster is Graham Mullins.
He's made all of this possible.
Thank you very much for listening to The Unexplained.
Please email me.
Take care.
Go well.
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