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May 16, 2025 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
46:03
20250516_piece-of-sht-andrew-wilson-his-wife-go-to-war-with
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Time Text
Traditional Gender Roles and Money 00:08:18
Are you remotely apprehensive about unleashing Mrs. Wilson on the world like this?
No, but she is the only Wilson on the panel that I claim.
I'm just pointing that out.
Is there anything you do?
I mean, you put the bins out, do you, you know, the trash out?
I mean, what do you do anything?
I don't do shit.
The piece of shit that you're married to.
Yeah, he clearly doesn't.
Oh, there we go.
He's about how he made you.
He doesn't even have to play men.
Clementine, do all lives matter?
You do know what?
All lives do matter.
Thank you.
Thank you.
All lives.
All lives matter.
That's the one terrible thing you found I've ever said you completely agree with.
Clementine, do you hate men?
No, of course I don't hate men.
Why in 2020 did you tweet the coronavirus isn't killing men fast enough?
I tweeted that in 2020 as a misguided tweet.
Apologize to men again.
Do it again.
This is honestly one of the most absurd conversations I've ever had in my life.
White House press secretary Caroline Levitt is really out of the spotlight.
That's her job, after all.
And for what it's worth, she seems to be very good at it.
But a behind-the-scenes photograph posted by a colleague for Mother's Day in America has divided opinion, even among a generally appreciative MAGA base.
16 million people saw this candid snap of Levitt in the White House, seemingly holding her baby son in one arm while, quote, owning the libs, close quotes, with the other.
A lot of those people applauded her as a super mom.
Many others criticized her for aping conservative family values while actually promoting a feminist myth about women who can have it all.
That might seem a bit harsh, but the MAGA movement she's part of has made big inroads in popular culture by promoting the return of traditional gender roles.
Here she is talking about masculinity back in 2023.
A man is someone who stands up for his family, provides for those that he loves, and contributes to his community.
A great example, helping an elderly woman with her groceries, helping a neighbor or a friend, putting others before yourself.
That's the definition of a man.
I'm proud to have so many strong men in my life, two older brothers, a great father.
We love men, we need men, and as women, Jen, we should not be afraid to say that.
Well, there's undeniably been a huge backlash to the whole era of demoralizing all men as miniature Harvey Weinsteins with ambitions that are wickedly patriarchal.
Coincidentally, you can read about how that's going on in my upcoming new book, Woke is Dead.
Has there ever been a better time for a book called Woke is Dead?
But where does the renaissance of masculine men leave the women?
We thought it was a very good idea.
Andrew Wilson was extolling the virtues of a more limited female role in a previous debate on Uncensored when a shocked Emily Austin said this.
Are you married?
How do you make a married with many children?
Is your wife happy?
Are you married with children?
Oh, she's she's ecstatic.
No, I'm 23.
I'm a boss lady girl, which seems to be driving you crazy.
Working out for the right guy to be aware of.
The only thing you have, you have no arguments.
You just try to assault me personally.
Well, Andrew Wilson's apparently ecstatic wife, Rachel, got in touch on X and told me she'd like to participate in our next debate.
And so she will.
She'll be joining us alongside an all-new panel of boss lady girls.
Well, joining me now is the host of Crucible, Andrew Wilson, Andrew's wife and author of Occult Feminism, The Secret History of Women's Liberation, Rachel Wilson, Emily Wilson, no relation from Emily Saves America, and the feminist writer and author of I Don't, The Case Against Marriage, Clementine Ford.
So welcome to all of you.
Andrew, great to have you back on Uncensored.
Are you remotely apprehensive about unleashing Mrs. Wilson on the world like this?
No, but she is the only Wilson on the panel that I claim.
I'm just pointing it out.
Everyone seems to be either called Wilson or Emily in this debate in this two-header.
Rachel, welcome to Uncensored.
You reached out to me on X and very boldly said, if you want to debate this properly, get me on.
You're here.
How are you feeling about this?
Well, thank you for having me, Piers.
And thank you, Andrew, for unchaining me from the stove just long enough to appear today.
I got a day pass from the Patriarch.
Patriarchy is benevolent.
So true.
Yeah.
So I'm very happy to be here.
People love to attack my husband via me.
I'm like the favorite way to do that.
So I thought, why not come on and talk to people myself?
So look, Rachel, let's just cut to the quick.
A lot of Andrew's critics, not me, a lot of his critics say that he's an obvious, blatant misogynist.
He thinks all women should be, you know, kept at home, working away on the stove, the housework, whatever it may be, and know their place in life.
You are actually married to him.
You've been subject to mockery inadvertently through the last debate we had about this for having him to endure being his wife.
What is it like being married to Andrew Wilson?
Well, it's pretty awesome.
I mean, he's hilarious.
He's a really smart guy.
He's very charming.
And most of all, he's a great dad and a great husband.
And I share his worldview.
So I would agree.
In fact, I would say I would probably be the more bitter misogynist out of the two of us.
If you really had to like pick one, it would probably be me.
Really?
Why do you say that?
I just think that feminism has absolutely destroyed so much of what I hold dear in life.
And it's held me back more than it's helped me.
It's one of the reasons I started looking into the history and investigating it for myself.
And I think it's just created a world where we now have a two-income economy.
And for women like me who do want to prioritize motherhood, it makes it extremely hard.
It just makes it financially difficult.
I face tons of social pressure.
Had my first daughter at 20, wanted to stay home.
Everyone around me, even the so-called Christian conservative women, told me it was a terrible idea.
You can't do that.
You have to bring the baby to daycare.
You're going to put yourself at risk.
You know, your husband's going to hurt you.
You're going to be abused if you don't have your own money and your own career.
And I think it's backwards.
I think it's the most inefficient, stupid thing we've ever come up with.
And that in the future, people look back at the feminist experiment as a goofy time in history where we tried this wild experiment that failed miserably.
And thank God it's over.
Wow.
Okay.
Well, Clementine Ford, I'm sure that you agree with every word of that, don't you?
Firstly, I'm very glad that you're happily married.
It's great.
You know, a lot of women are not happily married and they find it very difficult to leave marriages, particularly because of the financial strain.
So good for you.
I do think that your historical understanding of feminism is extremely skewed.
The idea that somehow we have only created a two-income household because feminism has tried to destroy the world is historically inaccurate in large part.
Well, firstly, you're also talking about feminism from your very, and when I say limited, I'm not trying to insult you, but the limited perspective of feminism in America and the understanding of the economy in America.
It's not taking into account the global reality of the fact that women have always worked, women still continue to work.
Women, for the most part, produce the majority of the world's underpaid, if drastically underpaid labor.
When you talk about a two-income household being somehow instituted by feminism, you're failing to take into account that even in America, you know, the kind of the glamorization of this golden age of marriage in the 1950s to the early 1960s, which the marriage historian Stephanie Coots calls the long decade, this coincided with an increase in women in the workplace.
So it's not as if there was this golden age where women weren't mad, where married women, sorry, weren't working.
For a lot of that, actually, the labor that is required to support the middle class has always been relied on for poor and disenfranchised women, largely in America, black women for a start.
The Myth of Two Sexes 00:06:20
Let me just finish.
Let me just finish.
We don't have to speed things up a little bit.
And the economy, the downturn in the economy, the boom that happened after the Second World War was unsustainable.
It was a wonderful time between around 1940 to 1970 for white working class men in particular.
And then it began to one of the reasons why women had to go into the workforce was because they had to help women support their families.
Okay, I have a question for you, Clementine.
It's a very simple question, but I think it'll be an interesting question to ask you.
What is a woman?
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Yes, I'm not going down the path of debating trans women with you.
Transition.
Ask you what a woman is.
Okay, I'll tell you.
But I know that because this is your tactic.
This is what you do.
What is a woman?
I'll tell you.
I'll tell you what a woman is.
A woman is someone who has at least at one point in her life felt scared of a man.
Sorry?
So, you never want to talk about it.
Hang on, hang on.
You guys never want to say that.
So any man who's ever felt afraid of another man is a woman?
No, That's not what I'm saying.
You know, this is exactly why you're wearing that shirt that says repeal.
You should put the 19th under it.
It's unbelievable.
What are you talking about?
A woman, anybody who has ever at what point been afraid of a man?
It's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.
Do you have an actual argument here?
Would you let me finish speaking or just?
How long is it going to take for you to finish?
How long is it going to take for you to finish?
Yes, do you really just invite people on your show to be interrupted like this?
Well, Clementine, look, all due respect, we did do a bit of research into what you said about me in the past.
So I think I'm entitled to give you.
No, you already know what I think about that question because I've written about you asking that question.
You have.
In fact, you said like all of you.
So why would you ask it again when you know what my audience who have no idea what you're talking about or me?
Like all of the biggest, that's me apparently, currently jumping on the transphobic shuttle to ding-dong station.
Morgan wants you to believe this is about fairness and equality, specifically fairness and equality in women's sports.
That was exactly what it was about.
And the problem is, Clementine, with all due respect to you, the reality is...
I doubt it.
I doubt it's going with duration.
I treat you with perfect respect, but your inability to just simply state what a woman actually is, particularly given two weeks ago in the UK, the Supreme Court made it very clear that a woman is a biological female.
That's it.
It's a scientific fact.
The fact that you can't answer that is part of the problem.
I'd like to, no, the thing is that I would like to know why you, in particular, are so obsessed with this definition of what a woman is.
Firstly, how does it impact you in any way?
Secondly, as a woman, I have a 13-year-old team.
And if my 13-year-old daughter decides she wants to capacity.
You ask me a question.
You ask me a question.
I'm going to answer you.
If you don't want an answer, don't ask me a question.
Here's my answer to your question.
I have a 13-year-old.
I have a 13-year-old daughter.
Have seven nieces, right?
And some of them are very answer your question.
Some of them are very good at sport, right?
The idea that they would one day have their dream of potentially an Olympic place or a Team GB place, whatever it may be, a world championship place, taken from them by a biological male, I think is completely outrageous.
And by the way, so does most of the world now, which is why there's been a reversing, screeching U-turn on this particular subject.
But I come back to my question to you: your inability to say what a woman is, and yet here you are lecturing women on how they should behave as women is completely perverse.
I think that reducing women specifically to your biological deciding is it's called science.
It's their chromosomes.
You have different chromosomes to me.
It's not me saying that.
I'm not writing the science.
I'm not the first person.
I'm sure I'm not the first person to tell you about intersex people.
So how do you talk about intersex people?
No, no, no.
This is all wrong anyway.
Intersex is not a third sex.
How do you define?
It's not a third sex.
That's ridiculous.
There is no third sex.
There's two sexes, male, female, categorized scientifically.
Intersex is not a third sex.
Anybody can look that up in five seconds.
Total lie.
How did you not know that, by the way?
How did you not know intersex is not a third sex?
I didn't say that intersex with a third with a third sex.
You did.
And intersex people have intersex people can have a mixture of chromosomes.
So if you present it.
Are you saying they're a third sex or aren't you?
If you present to the world as if they're not a third sex, then there's you have no argument here.
Do you understand that?
If he's what he's saying is what is objective with trans women.
Why are you so obsessed with it?
Why are you so obsessed with defining that?
Let me answer the question.
Let me start.
First start.
Yeah.
No one has interrupted me.
Let me speak first.
You just asked a question.
Let me speak.
You can't keep asking questions.
Clementine, and then refusing to allow people to answer.
If you don't want to answer the question, don't ask a question.
The truth about the obsession.
The problem is, the problem is, feminists in particular, I've noticed, feminists have latched on over the last few years to this idea that if anybody raised any concerns about the way the trans lobby was trying to make things unequal, unfair, and unsafe for actual women, then they were immediately transphobic.
I kept saying, I want trans people to have the exact same rights to fairness, equality, and safety as me or you.
Misinterpreting the Video Message 00:06:49
However, what was happening was women's rights were being eroded so that things were not fair.
They weren't equal and they weren't safe.
And we saw absolute parodies of this in the Olympics, in the boxing ring, where people who have been banned from the world championships because they apparently reported positive for male chromosomes were getting in the ring and beating women up in the ring.
And so a woman's going to die if this was allowed to carry on.
So now people have stopped it.
Now sporting bodies around the world have stopped it.
But you, Clementine, I say this respectfully, are still flying the flag for this bullshit.
And you can't even say what a woman is.
And I just find the fact that you want to lecture women like Rachel on how they should be as a woman is completely perverse, given you don't even know or don't want to say what I'm saying to Rachel.
I haven't said anything to Rachel.
I've never met Rachel before in my life until today.
You responded to what she said about the role of a woman.
I wasn't lecturing her.
I wasn't lecturing her.
Well, it sounded like you're lecturing to me.
Let me bring in Emily.
Let me bring in Emily.
Let me bring in Emily if you're waiting patients.
Let me bring in Emily.
You wanted to divert it to talk about trans women because that's clearly you banged on about trans women.
I just said to you, if you don't know what a woman is, we've got to go.
You asked the question.
No, I just wrong about the economic history.
She's the one looking at it through an economic prism that's extremely narrow.
She's using feminist standpoint theory to try to tell us what the history of economics is.
She can't explain to us why.
Let her finish, lady.
Let her finish, lady.
You talk plenty, lady.
You talk plenty later.
Through all of Western history, we were able to raise a family like a janitor could raise a family with four children on his income up until 1970.
And what happened in 1970?
We pushed women into the workforce in huge numbers and we practically doubled the workforce overnight by pushing mothers and women into the workforce.
This happened right alongside the creation of gender studies as an academic discipline.
And now we are in a situation where we don't have a family economy.
We have an individual income economy, which means most people can't raise a family without both parents working.
Okay, let me bring in Emily.
He's been waiting very patiently.
Emily, good to see you again.
Now, you started a kind of MAGA civil war when you railed against women who want to be a trad wife.
You posted a TikTok video, which caused a lot of mayhem.
Let's take a look at this.
I'm sorry.
I hate to call out my own party, but the young girls on the right promoting this like trad wife bullshit.
I just want to make sourdough for my husband.
That's great.
I'm all for it.
I promote traditional values.
I understand.
I have been working since I was very young.
I don't really plan on stopping working.
I suggest you find a hobby that makes you money.
But you guys, guess what?
Guess what, baby girl?
That lifestyle working out, a mana provider.
You just get to sit at home, bake bread every day, slim to none.
I would say none that that's going to work out for you or quite literally anyone you know.
You're actually setting yourself up for failure because it could not be easier if that's what you're going to pursue to be trapped by a man.
Okay.
Also, let's bring some other things to the table besides sourdough.
Let's let's have guys want to be mentally stimulated as well as physical, okay?
But I'm just like, please, you guys are too young to be promoting this.
And also, by the way, it's cringe.
You guys are cringe, okay?
Now, Emily, are you standing proudly by that TikTok?
Um, thank you guys for laughing.
Uh, that is supposed to be the point of a lot of my videos.
I don't take things too seriously.
I usually say things like this and don't think anything of it.
Um, I do want to point out in the video, I did start it by being like, Look, I love stay-at-home moms, I support them, I promote conservative values.
Um, I think the issue with the video is a lot of people just took the video and then gave their own meaning.
The group I was specifically bashing on was the young girls in their 20s that promote like traditional lifestyles online.
That we all know in the right-wing community absolutely do not live these lifestyles, and it's just a bit over the top.
It's kind of more cosplay than anything.
So, of course, I support moms that do that.
I just don't support the girls pretending to do it, I guess, if that kind of makes sense.
I'm not sure it does.
Andrew, does it make sense to you?
Well, I mean, she's right in a sense that there's a lot of LARPing that goes on on the right with the supposed traditional movement, which she's absolutely right isn't living the traditional lifestyle.
However, it's still a counterintuitive message to put out there that, oh, you're going to be trapped by your husband and his income.
It's like, good.
Don't you want to be in a relationship with your husband and have access to his income?
Like, what's the problem here?
That would be the values you're trying to move towards, right?
So, ultimately, it's a contradicting message.
I understand why you got a bunch of garbage for it.
It is a good idea, I think, to point out the LARP.
A good idea to point out how much faux traditionalism is on the right because it's a way for them to peddle sex.
And that's exactly what they're doing.
You see them in skimpy outfits doing exactly that.
Totally fair.
But on the other hand, you absolutely should not be putting out a message which ridicules women for wanting to be stay-at-home moms and actually live some type of lifestyle, which is conducive to their children and family.
That's silly.
Let's play at this stage.
I mean, also, trapped is just the wrong word to use, but overall, my message, I stand by.
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Hey, I want to play because I think it fits in well here.
The Caroline Levitt clip.
This is where she's working with her baby.
I'll just show the picture of her working at the White House with a baby in one hand and helping to run the country with the other.
Now, when I first saw that picture, I thought, wow, that's a pretty extraordinary, powerful image of a young woman who's very young to be doing the incredibly important job she does.
She does it, I think, extraordinarily well.
And she's a mother and she's feeding her son whilst doing this at the same time.
Rachel, when you saw that image, it got a lot of blowback, good and bad.
You know, some people loved it, some people hated it.
What did you think about it?
Well, I actually tweeted about this too, because although I'm a big fan of Caroline as a person, I think she's great, she's smart, she's lovely.
Motherhood Is Not Part-Time Work 00:14:33
I don't understand this compulsion, especially in the Trump administration, but on the right in general, where we're supposed to be conservatives, where we are pushing mothers to work.
Trump has been a huge proponent of hiring women, getting women back to work as soon as possible after having the baby.
And I think this is a huge mistake because, number one, what are we conserving?
If we're not conserving the traditional family and traditional gender roles and motherhood in the middle of a birth rate crisis, what are we conserving as conservatives?
Just like lower taxes?
I mean, this should be a core issue for us on the right to say, no, motherhood is not a part-time gig that you do on the side.
You don't, you know, ship your baby off to daycare where they're spending three times as much time with a low-wage daycare worker as they are with mom while you go and do your career.
There's plenty of life to live after raising kids.
I think after you've done that, if you want to venture out and do a few more things, once you have the empty nest, I think that's okay.
But pushing mothers to work is one of the key things that's tearing apart the fabric of society because we're not raising our own children.
We're not passing down our values to them.
We're sending them to daycare and we're sending them to state-run schools.
And that's who they're being raised by.
All right, Clementine, your response to that.
Do you work, Rachel?
No.
You don't make any money from your podcasting?
I make some money, but I do maybe.
You do do some form of paid employment.
Yes.
First of all, my children are grown up now.
I'm 44 years old.
So I had my first one at 20.
They're grown up.
They're moved out.
But I work still very, very part-time, maybe a couple hours a week at most.
But do you have a lot of people?
Because my primary responsibility is to my husband.
So do you have, you've got five children, right?
Is that correct?
And they're all grown up and all moved out, or you've still got some young children.
The youngest one.
The youngest one is a lot of people.
And by the way, just make an argument from hippocampus.
Can I just ask you?
Can I just ask you, do you find, even with the small amount of part-time work that you do, which you do get paid for, do you find satisfaction from that?
Do you get satisfaction from that work?
It's not the money because Andrew makes far more than I make.
I make a very, very tiny amount of money off of, you know, my book and a couple of appearances here and there, might sell a few books.
It's practically nothing.
If I was doing it for the money, it'd be a waste of even a couple of hours.
But what I would say to that is, we're not against women doing other things.
So if you look at the Bible and the Proverbs 31 woman, she does a lot of things.
She's out buying land.
She's making decisions.
She's doing all kinds of things.
The difference is that she's doing them under the purview of the guidance and leadership of her husband and for her family, not for a corporation, not for her own glory, not for her own ambition.
A lot of that depends on whether or not you, whether or not you have faith in the Bible, which obviously not everyone does.
But the reason I ask you those questions wasn't because I was trying to set you up or anything like that.
It doesn't surprise me that you would get some satisfaction.
To me, the point of the question wasn't about the money.
It's about the work.
It's about the passion that you put into it.
And the reason I ask was because a multi-year study done by Adrianne Freck and Sarah Damasque found that the mental health of women who worked full-time after the birth of their first child was significantly higher than those who didn't have paid work at all.
So I think that taking into account the fact that for a lot of women, and this is also what Betty Fredan found when she wrote The Feminine Mystique, that and Stephanie Kootz backed this up as well in her book, The Way We Never Were, which is a history of a situation, but are you married?
Do you have kids?
What's your deal?
I've got a kid.
I'm not married.
Okay, but you have a single mother.
Okay.
And I have a very excellent relationship with my son's father.
We co-parent together very well, but we're not married.
We don't live together.
I certainly have found since having a child, I mean, I've always worked anyway, but I've been working since I was 13 years old, but I've always found that work for me is very satisfying.
And what I'm saying is that these are the findings of multiple historians, anthropologists, scientists that are die-hard feminists who are only investigating this from a feminist point of view.
They're already sold on the ideology and what they do.
Stephanie Kitty is a world-renowned historian.
She's not specifically a feminist.
She's a world-renowned historian.
And these were her findings as well.
So you cannot deny the reality.
It's what you're saying.
Did I say that women can't deny that?
We're not saying women can never leave the house.
We're not saying you can't have a woman's wife.
It's a life that you find.
You're suggesting that the primary role for a woman and that, you know, in your faith, I'm not going to discredit that, but your faith in God says that this is what you believe God says that you should be doing, but the primary role for a woman is that she should be staying at home, that she should be devoted to her husband.
She should be devoted to her children.
The facts do not back that up.
The facts of familial satisfaction don't back that up.
Hang on.
Sorry, Clementine.
I think you've chosen the wrong moment to say that.
You've clearly got a woman here on the panel where the facts completely back that up.
She's had a lot of kids.
She's very happily married.
She knew that there would be exceptions to the rule, but statistically speaking, that's completely untrue.
Statistically speaking, that this one survey is going to tell us something.
First of all, we have two.
It was a multi-year one.
It was a multi-year study.
Let me ask you, Clementine.
Let me ask Clementine.
When you were, were you married or not?
I can't remember what you said.
Were you married?
No, I've never been.
Okay.
But when you were with your partner before you broke it, who did the household chores and stuff like that?
I mean, how did you delineate that as a feminist?
It was a struggle because even in lots of supposedly egalitarian households, you know, again, the data backs up that women, even women who make more money than their partners or their spouses tend to do more unpaid domestic labor.
This is the this is who did most of the people.
Who did most of the domestic chews?
In my house.
Yeah.
Me.
You did.
Me.
Okay.
And Rachel, who does most of them in your house?
So that's the reality for the most part.
Rachel, who does the most, who does, who does the domestic stuff in your house, Rachel?
I do absolutely all of it.
And the thing I want to say to you.
So you're very similar.
I mean, it seems to me you're both.
I care far less about women's fulfillment in careers than I care about children and how they're being raised.
And I want her to justify to me why we should be paying low-wage daycare workers to raise our children rather than doing it ourselves.
How does it make sense to take your duty of motherhood and simply put it on a different random woman?
How does that system make sense?
Why shouldn't you, if you would like to stay at home and raise your children, that's totally fine?
You're not answering the question.
But for the children, it's a question of choice.
It's a question of choice.
It's actually not worse.
It's not worse to be raised by working mothers.
That's also the facts back that up.
There is no suggestion to suggest women who work raise children who are less happy.
That is not true.
There are no facts on planet Earth that back up that single mother households have better outcomes.
That's one.
Do they specifically mention that they're not going to be able to do that?
That's what you bring up your ladies.
You bring your children.
If you outsource the raising of your children, you're already making yourself a single mother, just so you know.
Here's what's going on.
Just so that you understand.
Are you a single father because your wife raises your children for you?
Lady.
Lady.
Excuse me.
Don't call me lady.
Can you tell me, Lady?
Can anybody finish a point?
Can anybody finish a point?
I don't know.
Do you have a point?
Are only you allowed to?
I'm trying to make one.
You don't seem to be making a point, Andrew.
If you outsource your children's raising to strangers, answer Rachel's question and tell her how that makes more sense than having the child raised by their own biological mother.
Actually answer.
Well, in my case, it makes more sense because I need to make money to pay my bills to raise my child.
What if you depended on your husband's income?
Do you see the problem of how we finish?
Now it's my turn to finish.
But actually, again, if you knew what you were talking about, if you actually read anything about the data on these things, rather than just reaching into your gut for a feeling that feels so good.
The data that shows us that if you outsource that.
The data shows that there was a father.
The data shows that it's not a problem.
Let me bring Emily in.
Again, Emily's been...
Hang on.
There's no statistical data to support the fact that children raised by mothers who work are less happy than children raised by mothers.
Yes, there is.
I would never try and stop Rachel.
That's her choice.
That's the choice to do that.
There is so much.
It's not true because that's her choice.
Let me bring Emily.
Let me bring Emily in.
Emily was trying to say.
You don't want your daughters and you don't want your daughters and your nieces being forced to stay at home to raise families.
I don't want to.
I don't want my kids to be forced to do anything.
No, Emily, you wanted to say something?
Yeah.
Yeah, no, I mean, look, I'm not going to argue data with either of you guys.
I'm sure you know more than me, but I can say that my father is my hero and the most important person in my life.
And I didn't, if I didn't have him and he wasn't in the household, I don't know where I would be today.
And my girlfriends who were raised without fathers in the household, I do see them struggle in different ways when it comes to dating and all these different things.
And it's funny because it's like he does, they do make a point.
Like, if there was a father in the household supporting you, I think a lot of these issues wouldn't be what they are.
So I think there's points to both of these things.
Okay, let me ask Andrew.
Andrew, but supporting in what way?
Is your name, Andrew?
Anyway, go ahead, Piers.
Yo, Andrew, I was going to ask Andrew.
When Rachel said that she does all domestic chores, is there anything you do?
I mean, do you put the bins out?
Do you, you know, the trash out?
I mean, what do you do anything?
I don't do shit.
That's what I got to like.
You see a little yard work.
But not only that.
If something is yard work, that's about it.
Yeah, cars need repairs, something like that.
But I'm not going to do household chores.
That's what I got married for.
I don't want to do household chores.
Not only that, on top of that, let's just point a couple things out.
She's absolutely wrong.
Here's what the stats actually say: that if a child is raised in a two-parent household, they're going to have way better outcomes.
And if they have a present mother who's more present with them, they're going to have way better outcomes.
Every single data point backs this up.
The outsourcing of children to public school, especially for eight hours a day, is absurd.
Stop.
Let me finish the point.
Let me finish the point and then you can.
Let me finish the point.
I've got to say seven times.
Somebody doesn't like being interrupted.
You interrupt.
It's amazing that you won't let me finish the point.
I got to change the point.
Your producer, Piers, telling me to interrupt if I disagreed with anyone.
Yeah, yeah.
So take it up.
I think what's changed since that text message is you've made a point of objecting to being interrupted.
So I know that you can do that.
And yet I keep interrupting.
And then keep interrupting.
So that's just the state of play.
Why don't you practice what you preach?
And don't interrupt Andrew when he's trying to finish his point.
Yeah.
So look, I've just finished the point.
Would he make a point?
He hasn't made one.
Yeah, I just did.
I made multiple points.
All the data points.
Well, he's made the point that he doesn't respect his wife.
He's still not his lady.
He must have been a woman.
Stop talking.
He didn't want to do anything.
He can't stop talking, lady.
This is why it should say the 19th under that shirt.
You cannot even be quiet long enough to hear a counterpoint.
Here's the counterpoints.
The data you're citing, you don't have any when it comes to outcomes for children when it comes to outsourcing their raising.
None.
None.
Incorrect.
Show me any that shows that you sending your kids to the city.
Which data are you sending to?
Would you stop so that I can finish?
No, no, tell me.
Tell me.
I'm trying to at least.
Yes.
Yeah.
Okay.
Here's the thing.
One more time.
All data points to the fact that if you outsource the raising of your children, especially when you're in the chat.
You don't say all data.
You actually have to cite it.
Cite any data that shows.
Don't say that.
Cite any data ever that shows that you outsourcing the care of your child is good for the child.
Anything nothing.
And Stephanie Koontz doesn't say that.
You're lying.
Do you even know who Stephanie Koontz is?
Yes.
Do you mean the feminist writer?
Stephanie Koontz is.
The feminist writer.
See, you clearly don't even know what you're talking about.
I can tell you.
You're not even interested.
You're not even interested enough in the topic.
I'm sorry.
You're not even interested enough to restore yourself.
I'm sorry.
Who's talking to Koontz?
Let's make sure we got it right.
Who's Stephanie Koontz?
Stephanie Koontz is an historian, a world-renowned historian into marriage and the structure of the world.
And isn't a feminist, right?
Isn't a feminist?
I just want to make sure we're clear.
I have no idea if she's a feminist or not.
I know that she's an historian.
Why would you try to make a refutation about what I'm saying?
Clearly, you don't know enough about the topic.
It's silly.
I'm only allowed to refer to her feminists.
I'm not allowed to reference historians.
You have a historian.
You're clearly only allowed to reference her.
If you have a historian who's also a feminist, they're biased, right?
Let me ask you, Clementine.
Clementine, let me ask you.
I'm so obsessed with whether or not she's a feminist.
Clementine, let me ask you a question because it would promote bias.
It would be biased.
Let me try and answer, ask a question here.
Clementine, do you hate men?
No, of course I don't hate men.
What an absurd, reductive question.
Well, why did you tweet?
Hang on, because I'm about to follow.
I hate you.
Why in 2020 did you tweet the coronavirus isn't killing men fast enough?
I tweeted that in 2020 as a misguided tweet, but it was actually much of a part of a long coronavirus isn't killing men fast enough.
You say you don't hate men.
Apologize for it, Piers.
You thought a deadly pandemic virus wasn't killing men fast enough.
Apologize to men again.
Do You Hate Men 00:08:27
Do it again.
You haven't apologized to me for saying that you want me to die from the coronavirus.
I would have to consider you a man to apologize you for that.
Say you're sorry.
Say you don't even know what a woman is.
Andrew, I would like to apologize to me because I do not appreciate her saying that my own husband does not respect me.
Of course he respects me.
He respects me as a mother and as a wife.
He treats me like gold.
Who the hell are you to tell me if he respects me or not?
You wouldn't have to get paid for this if you had a husband.
I didn't say that he.
Where did I you did?
You said he clearly doesn't respect you.
You did say that.
I heard you say you mean the piece of shit that you're married to.
Yeah, he clearly doesn't respect you.
He's about how he married you.
He doesn't do any piece of shit because that's why you marry a panel.
That would be you.
That's why you're the one.
Listen, let's get back to the topic here.
You're the one who is not a topic between the topics that we were.
I would genuinely like to say that.
Hang on, time out.
Time out.
I would genuinely like to know.
You said it was misguided to say the coronavirus wasn't killing men fast enough.
Why is that?
That was a terrible thing to say.
It was a terrible thing to say.
No, I understand it's a good question.
I said that the time.
Let me finish my question.
I do understand it's a terrible thing to say.
My question, my bemuse went, why would you say that?
Because I was really frustrated with the articles that I was reading about how the pandemic was derailing women's workplace.
It was derailing women's economic trajectories.
And there was a specific article that I had read about a woman who had founded her own company.
She was the CEO of it.
Her husband had taken a sabbatical prior to the pandemic.
And within two days of childcare closing down, he said, I can't take care of the four-year-old.
And she quit her job to go home and look after the kid.
Something got to do with you wanting more men to be killed.
So that's one thing.
If you're going to ask me the question, then let me finish.
You know what, Clementine?
When you tweet, literally, coronavirus isn't killing men fast enough.
I think I'm entitled to push you a little bit more than it was a bit misguided.
You're literally calling for the mass culling of men while simultaneously pretending you don't hate men.
Come on, you know, you know that.
Don't be disingenuous.
You know that that's not what I was calling for.
You know that's a menu.
Coronavirus isn't killing men fast enough.
It was a blip tweet.
And you know that I also apologized for it shortly after that.
You know that I was sincere in my apologies.
You didn't apologize to me.
I was making it out five years later.
Can you apologize to Andrew, please?
Well, you apologize to me for saying you wanted me to die.
I would not apologize to you if I did something to you, let alone for doing nothing to you.
Andrews, you wouldn't apologize.
Was that the only time Clementine?
Hang on, I've got a follow-up.
I have a follow-up.
Clementine, was that the only time you've tweeted that you want all men to be killed?
Yes, why don't you just say what you want to say?
No, I'm just asking a question.
Have you tweeted previously?
I have tweeted prior to that.
All men as a joke.
As a joke, right?
I have.
As a joke.
So you quite regularly think it's funny to say that men should be killed.
No, I don't quite regularly.
There's two examples that you can think of.
You don't hate men, but you just tweeted.
I put it to you.
Oh, hang on.
I've also said that.
I put it to you.
You probably do hate men.
You want to be fired into the sun.
I've also said that men should be fired into the sun.
Tell me, at what point do you think it's very clearly glib?
And yes, I have apologized for them very, but very clearly glib tweets from a time as well where Twitter was such a toxic.
I don't tweet anymore.
It's a bad place for everybody.
At what point did those things be accepted as glib, misguided, regrettable, deeply apologetic for them now?
Yeah.
Remarks that you would never say again.
You don't sound very apologetic.
I think you should just admit that you don't like men.
I think it's the problem comes when you keep on.
I don't like you very much, Piers.
I don't care if you like me or not.
You spray gummed me in public.
I couldn't give a damn.
Why do I have to sit here and admit to you that I don't like men?
What are you hoping for?
I just asked you if you do or not.
You said you don't hate me.
You said that I did.
You spend all your time wanting us to be good.
You don't hate me.
Hang on.
You're just going to shoot them in the sun.
That's all.
You don't like me.
You think Andrew's a piece of shit.
So that's every single man involved in this debate.
Every man in this debate, Clementine, you shouldn't be giving advice on this debate.
Emily, Emily, what was that?
I hate.
I hate that.
I'm just saying, if you live a life where you've been unsuccessful in relationships, whether it's friendship, love, marriage, whatever it is, I think you're probably the last person in the position to be giving advice what women should do with men.
I mean, I don't feel any animosity.
Well, how do you know when it comes to human beings?
I'm successful in friendships and relationships.
That's a very single mom.
That's a very odd.
Well, being a single mother doesn't mean that I'm unsuccessful in relationships.
I already said before that I have a very beautiful co-parenting relationship with my son's father.
He lives in the same apartment building as us.
We're deeply close friends.
I don't understand why you think that that is.
I'm not bitter towards men at all.
I'm annoyed at the expectation that some men have, some men on this panel have, that women should do everything for them.
I'm certainly angry at the fact that in the UK.
I think Women Drew does everything.
I mean, I think everything I find in my boyfriend, I'm angry that in the UK, a woman is killed every three days by a man.
I'm angry that in America, three women are killed every day.
Well, I don't think I follow an immigration issue.
That's kind of a different thing.
How many men are killed every moment?
One woman is killed every 10 minutes by an eye.
I'm an angry baby.
There's lots of things that I'm angry about.
And I'm angry.
How many babies do you guys kill?
One in three girls over the age of 15 will experience sexual violence in her life.
I'm very angry.
I'm angry about rape and sexual assault.
I'm angry about the fact that the most dangerous person to a woman is a man that she knows.
I'm angry about all of these things.
Yes, but that doesn't mean that I hate men.
That doesn't mean that I don't shoot them into the sun.
I don't have data to prove it.
For men's greatness with women and with children.
You want to shoot men into the sun.
You want them killed by coronavirus.
And you want all of us dead.
And you hate both the men on the panel.
Other than that, you love men.
You love them.
You love them.
They're great.
Even though they're not.
My thing is, I can't you admit that you at least like men enough that they gave you a beautiful child you're super grateful of.
I mean, that's a positive.
This is honestly one of the most absurd conversations I've ever had in my life.
I've just hate men.
I've just sat here and explained that I have a wonderful relationship with my son's father.
I've just sat here and said, you know, that I've apologized for these things that I've said in the past.
We've all said terrible things.
Piers, you've said terrible things on Twitter.
We've all said terrible things.
Hang on.
What have I said?
What have I said?
Name one.
Oh, Piers, do you want me to look them up right now?
Okay, let me just give me a second.
Tell me a terrible thing I said on Twitter.
Piers Morgan.
While she's looking, can I refute her fake statistics that she just gave?
Because I hear from you.
Piers Morgan's terrible opinions.
There we go.
I'll look at that.
Give me a terrible opinion.
Rachel, I thought you were talking while I'm just scrolling through the internet.
We can all wait, Clementine.
The clock is ticking, though.
I mean, find one terrible thing that I've tweeted.
I think that all lives matter was pretty bad.
You think all lives matter?
It's a bit better than men should be dying faster.
Let's just compare all lives matter against more men should die faster.
All lives matter is a rejection of Black Lives Matter.
I didn't reject Black Lives Matter.
I didn't reject Black Lives Matter.
I didn't reject the.
I didn't reject Black Lives Matter.
Rejecting All Lives Matter 00:01:34
Don't lie.
No, but you do.
No, I didn't.
No, I didn't respond.
You see, this is the trouble.
You say that I've said terrible things.
When you try and find them, you don't have any.
I'm looking at it right here, Piers.
All lives matter.
He didn't say white lives matter.
He said all lives matter, which is true in any decentralization.
Do you not think all lives matter, Clementine?
That's absolutely ridiculous.
Clementine, do all lives matter?
I think that all lives deserve respect.
Do they matter?
Do all lives matter, Clementine?
You do know what?
All lives do matter.
Thank you.
Thank you.
All lives.
You completely agree with...
I'm not giving the delightful note where you agree with the one terrible thing that I've ever apparently said.
We will leave this compelling debate.
Thank you all very much indeed.
I've got to say, Rachel, you derailed.
I think, Rachel, it's lovely to see a very happily married couple who genuinely like each other.
So thank you for coming on, Uncensored.
And in your case, Clementine, I hope you find a man like Andrew to take care of you.
Thank you all very much.
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