Uncensored - Piers Morgan - 20250501_no-way-she-killed-herself-virginia-giuffre-father-
Aired: 2025-05-01
Duration: 46:44


=== Virginia's Faked Photo Investigation (02:55) ===

[00:00:00]  What is it that you've done about this picture to try and, as you put it, investigate?
[00:00:04]  And how did you get access?
[00:00:06]  I posed as a buyer.
[00:00:07]  You're saying the picture was faked.
[00:00:08]  This is 60 centimetres.
[00:00:11]  No one has seen this picture, by the way.
[00:00:13]  Right, which is very interesting.
[00:00:14]  Why did Andrew end up paying a report at $11 million?
[00:00:17]  He didn't have these pictures, did he?
[00:00:19]  Does Prince Andrew know you've got this?
[00:00:21]  I speak to his ex-wife.
[00:00:23]  She knows that I got into the house.
[00:00:24]  You know, you can look up your photographs too.
[00:00:27]  This is real.
[00:00:28]  Miss Hervey is just one of the other aristocratic enablers.
[00:00:31]  Andrew has been touting out.
[00:00:33]  He's too afraid to speak out on his own because he's guilty.
[00:00:35]  It's very sad that she didn't help the family.
[00:00:38]  This father sounded desperate.
[00:00:40]  Well, look, we can clear this up because I'm going to be joined now exclusively by Virginia Dufray's father, Skye Roberts.
[00:00:46]  Tell me about your reaction when you heard that she'd taken her life.
[00:00:49]  First of all, I couldn't even believe it.
[00:00:51]  You know, I think she's strong, very strong.
[00:00:54]  And that's why I don't think she committed suicide.
[00:00:56]  She had too much to live for.
[00:01:00]  Virginia Dufray's tragic suicide has understandably made global headlines all week.
[00:01:05]  On Monday, I interviewed exclusively her lawyer, David Boyes, who said it's time for Prince Andrew to come clean and to apologize.
[00:01:14]  Even if he doesn't remember what happened, I think he needs to recognize that he had, he clearly had, sex with young girls with Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:01:32]  I mean, he may not remember that it was Virginia, but he can't forget the event.
[00:01:38]  And he needs, I think, to just come clean.
[00:01:46]  Well, the Duke's silence has been roundly criticized in the British press, where many saying that Virginia's sad demise is the final nail in the coffin to his delusional dreams of returning to public life.
[00:01:56]  Prince Andrew of course paid many millions of dollars to settle accusations that he sexually assaulted Dufray three times when she was 17 years old after being trafficked by Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:02:07]  Well, despite the payout, he's always emphatically denied it.
[00:02:10]  There are many unanswered questions about Epstein, the source of his wealth, the circumstances of his death, the reasons why so many powerful people kept his sinister secrets and have not been made accountable for any association with him.
[00:02:23]  Perhaps inevitably, many people aren't satisfied with the explanation of Virginia's death either.
[00:02:28]  A lawyer in Australia said this week that there are big question marks.
[00:02:31]  One of my guests tonight has always maintained amid much criticism that there are big question marks over Virginia Dufray's story.
[00:02:39]  And she says she now has new evidence that will support her case.
[00:02:42]  Well, joining me now is Prince Andrew's former girlfriend, Lady Victoria Hervey, royal biographer Tom Bauer, host of The Nerve with Maureen Callahan, Maureen Callan, and also be speaking to lawyer Spencer Coovin, who represented nine of Geoffrey Epstein's victims.

=== Unanswered Questions About Epstein (07:08) ===

[00:02:55]  Okay, well welcome to all of you.
[00:02:58]  Let's start with you, Victoria.
[00:02:59]  You've been resolutely pro Prince Andrew for a long time in this scandal.
[00:03:06]  I have because, you know, so it's been about three and a half years when I actually really started like really investigating, I suppose.
[00:03:16]  And the things that I found out, obviously, like a lot of people that reached out to me from very close circles to Virginia and some of the other girls, they were giving me information because they saw me as someone that could actually bring the information out.
[00:03:32]  The things that I want to concentrate, well, firstly, that, you know, it's a horrible end, what happened to Virginia.
[00:03:38]  Well, let me pick you up on that.
[00:03:40]  Before we get into the other stuff, you know, I was shocked.
[00:03:45]  I mean, you did two posts about Virginia Dufray, one before she died, after she had this supposed accident, which is still very murky about it.
[00:03:54]  Oh, you mean, yeah, but I did a lot of stories on the main post.
[00:03:58]  You posted an image of her smiling with the caption, what is karma, after Virginia Dufrey shared her selfie lying on a hospital bed following what she said was this horror.
[00:04:09]  Okay, but you said, what is karma?
[00:04:11]  And then when...
[00:04:11]  And we posted that, by the way.
[00:04:13]  But when news of her death broke, you tweeted this, we posted on X. Lies catch up with you.
[00:04:19]  There's no way out.
[00:04:20]  Now, putting aside whether you want to believe Virginia Duffray or not, you deleted this one.
[00:04:25]  No, I didn't delete it.
[00:04:26]  People say I deleted it.
[00:04:27]  No, I did not delete it.
[00:04:28]  You've left that up.
[00:04:29]  Yeah.
[00:04:30]  Right.
[00:04:30]  It was on story, so it only lasts for 24 hours.
[00:04:32]  I understand that.
[00:04:33]  Okay.
[00:04:34]  I did not delete it.
[00:04:35]  Why post that at all?
[00:04:36]  I mean, putting aside what you feel about her, it's just taken her life.
[00:04:40]  It was an instant reaction.
[00:04:42]  I was actually, when the news broke, ironically, I was actually at the Daily Mail party in Washington at the British ambassador's residence.
[00:04:50]  And my friend I was with got the alert on her phone.
[00:04:55]  She goes, oh my God, oh my God.
[00:04:56]  She gives me the phone.
[00:04:58]  This was, we were really in shock, actually, to be honest, in the beginning, because the build-up, really, I suppose, like what had happened over the last month, like, I don't really understand why her family didn't, you know, to be alone on a ranch in the middle of nowhere.
[00:05:17]  She told me that she was a little bit more.
[00:05:17]  But you don't know why she did it.
[00:05:18]  She was in a hospital.
[00:05:19]  But you don't know why she did.
[00:05:20]  You don't know why she took her life.
[00:05:22]  I don't, but I know.
[00:05:24]  So you admit that?
[00:05:25]  I admit that I'm not a psychic, but I know things were captured.
[00:05:28]  Did you not think what you tweeted was just on a human level, utterly heartless?
[00:05:33]  You know, it wasn't right.
[00:05:35]  I feel very bad for her children.
[00:05:37]  And I think suicide is something that is, it's a very sad thing.
[00:05:42]  But in dying and in committing suicide, that does not give you an out to lie.
[00:05:51]  But that's a totally different matter.
[00:05:54]  You know, I just feel like you knew she's got three kids.
[00:05:57]  They just lost their mother.
[00:05:59]  It's an appalling tragedy just on a human level.
[00:06:02]  That was a quick reaction.
[00:06:04]  Yeah, but you could have deleted it.
[00:06:05]  You didn't.
[00:06:06]  I didn't because I feel very strongly about this story.
[00:06:08]  Right, but not think that was heartless?
[00:06:12]  What has she done to other people?
[00:06:15]  Tom, your reaction.
[00:06:17]  What's she done to anybody?
[00:06:18]  I mean, she was a victim.
[00:06:20]  She was trafficked by Epstein.
[00:06:22]  Don't use the word trafficking.
[00:06:23]  Trafficking is a very strong word that is not the appropriate word for this.
[00:06:27]  Well, she was used, abused, and utterly destroyed by men who just opened up.
[00:06:34]  No, no, I agree.
[00:06:36]  And the point is that she clearly couldn't survive the horrors of what she lived through.
[00:06:41]  And whether her truth about Prince Andrew, which I'm sure is true, but nevertheless, the point is that you don't get over that sort of dreadful, dreadful treatment by ruthless men and by systems.
[00:06:54]  That was the most terrible thing about this whole story.
[00:06:57]  She had to go through it again and again and again because the men bandaged her.
[00:07:02]  And had been abused when she was like seven or eight years old.
[00:07:04]  Exactly.
[00:07:05]  And so she was treated appallingly.
[00:07:07]  I think my point is, before we get to your other song, which is very interesting, I have no idea if anything you're going to be presenting has any actual merit, but it's interesting to present it and to talk about it.
[00:07:18]  But before we get to that, I just wonder, now you've had time to think about it, she's got these three kids who've been left without...
[00:07:26]  I don't want to keep dwelling on that.
[00:07:27]  But no, I'm just asking...
[00:07:28]  Because you're just trying to...
[00:07:29]  No, no, I'm not trying to do anything.
[00:07:30]  I'm just going to ask.
[00:07:31]  I'm asking one question.
[00:07:32]  Would you like to just apologise?
[00:07:35]  I'm not talking about that right now.
[00:07:37]  I said, I started...
[00:07:38]  Listen to me in one second.
[00:07:40]  I started this conversation and I said, I feel very bad about what happened for her children's sake.
[00:07:46]  Suicide is something that is very serious.
[00:07:48]  I understand.
[00:07:49]  I'm just asking you whether, now you've had time to think about it, given it blew up big online, you know.
[00:07:54]  I wasn't even at the same time.
[00:07:55]  So They were trending in a very bad thing.
[00:07:58]  What did I tell you?
[00:07:59]  I wasn't even looking at the news.
[00:08:01]  I can tell you.
[00:08:01]  But my point is, I think you should apologize for what you posted.
[00:08:05]  I think it was incredibly insensitive and offensive to the family at a time when she'd just taken her life.
[00:08:12]  Would you like to do that?
[00:08:13]  I don't really think the, I mean, her children didn't want to see her, Piers.
[00:08:19]  There's a reason for that.
[00:08:20]  Well, there was a domestic dispute with her.
[00:08:23]  They didn't want anything to do with her.
[00:08:24]  Yeah.
[00:08:25]  Okay, well, you don't know the circumstances behind this.
[00:08:27]  I do know that, as that is a fair thing.
[00:08:29]  So you have no regrets about this.
[00:08:31]  I am not regretting what I said.
[00:08:37]  I said when I first arrived here just now, because I knew, you know, you are News International.
[00:08:42]  You guys are like the enemy.
[00:08:43]  I'm not News International.
[00:08:44]  Do not.
[00:08:44]  I'm not News International.
[00:08:46]  Sorry, just to be clear, since the end of last year, I don't work for anyone.
[00:08:49]  You're in their offices.
[00:08:50]  No, no.
[00:08:51]  I rent these studios.
[00:08:52]  I am my own boss.
[00:08:53]  I own my channel.
[00:08:55]  I'm not owned by anybody else.
[00:08:56]  When I ask you a question, I'm not sure.
[00:08:58]  No, no, News International has nothing to do with Piers Morgan Uncensored now whatsoever, other than I rent the studio and they have a commercial interest in advertiser revenue.
[00:09:07]  There is no involvement in my show whatsoever from News International.
[00:09:11]  So to try and so hard to get the truth out about this, because the trend is...
[00:09:17]  But I'm giving you a platform to talk about what you found.
[00:09:19]  But just before we get to it, I just wanted to give you the chance, having thought about it, do you not just ignore it?
[00:09:26]  I said when I first got here, just know when we started filming, I said I feel terribly for her family and what they are going through.
[00:09:33]  And it's a horrible ending.
[00:09:35]  It's a tragedy.
[00:09:36]  Really, like it is a tragedy.
[00:09:38]  This young girl, she was abused by family friends at age like six or something.
[00:09:45]  Then she went off with this guy, Eppinger, that basically she was used as a prostitute at age 11.
[00:09:53]  Like she had a horrible life.
[00:09:55]  Right.
[00:09:56]  That I agree about.
[00:09:58]  Okay.
[00:09:59]  From tariffs to market turmoil, things are looking pretty rough out there.

=== Questioning Her Testimony And Photos (15:12) ===

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[00:11:09]  Just to set this up, the most damning evidence against Prince Andrew about the claims from Virginia Dufrey was a photograph taken in London with his arm around her when she was 17 years old.
[00:11:22]  Doesn't we have a picture of the actual Daily Mail on?
[00:11:24]  Because the scale, well, here it is, but it's right, but with Ghillaine Maxwell in the background, it's a famous, infamous picture now.
[00:11:30]  And the point of the picture being that appeared to have them all in the house in London around the time that this abuse was said to have taken place.
[00:11:39]  Okay, now what is it that you've done about this picture to try and, as you put it, investigate it?
[00:11:45]  Yeah, I just want to set the scene for what happened on this night.
[00:11:48]  So it was actually the coldest week since the 1960s at that point.
[00:11:56]  It had been raining all day.
[00:11:58]  You can look this up in the weather.
[00:12:00]  Freezing.
[00:12:02]  The window wasn't, like, that window would never have been open, number one.
[00:12:06]  They would not have been wearing these clothing.
[00:12:09]  She wears this outfit in San Trapez a couple months later.
[00:12:14]  They were not at Tramp Nightclub.
[00:12:16]  There were no photos of them at Tramp Nightclub.
[00:12:18]  He doesn't drink.
[00:12:20]  Andrew has never carried a wallet in his life.
[00:12:22]  He's got a wallet in his back pocket.
[00:12:24]  There's many pictures of Jeffrey Epstein with the same trousers.
[00:12:29]  Jeffrey did carry a big wallet in his back pocket.
[00:12:33]  So you're saying the picture was faked?
[00:12:35]  There's nothing real about this image, Piers.
[00:12:37]  Like, so we can start with when I did go into the house.
[00:12:42]  So tell me, so when did you first go into this property?
[00:12:45]  A year ago.
[00:12:46]  And how did you get access?
[00:12:48]  I pose as a buyer.
[00:12:50]  So they're selling it?
[00:12:52]  Yeah.
[00:12:52]  Who owns this property?
[00:12:53]  Now it's on the market, but it wasn't on the market.
[00:12:55]  Who is the owner now?
[00:12:57]  I don't know.
[00:12:57]  Has it changed hands a few times?
[00:12:58]  Do we know that?
[00:12:59]  No, so it was sold, it was only sold once.
[00:13:03]  And he's now actually got it on the market.
[00:13:08]  Okay, so we're watching footage of you.
[00:13:10]  You went in with a friend, I think, and this is you walking through the house.
[00:13:15]  Now, what is the significance of what you think you discovered on this trip?
[00:13:20]  Because you've been in there twice before.
[00:13:21]  So you're going to see this landing, which I got photos of, but that's the landing.
[00:13:25]  Like, it's so small, Piers, that you don't, you know, if people would actually be able to get access to that house, literally, I walked up the stairs and we couldn't even find this landing because it's so tiny.
[00:13:38]  Like, you walk up, I was with two people.
[00:13:41]  I was with a photographer friend and another person.
[00:13:45]  And I've known the photographer for 30 years.
[00:13:48]  We did a shoot together when I was about 18.
[00:13:50]  And he's kind of helped me on this project a bit over the last two years, doing some interviews and things with witnesses.
[00:13:58]  When we got up there, it was like this bit here, so he is only five foot.
[00:14:03]  So we're showing pictures here.
[00:14:04]  This is one of your friends who is standing where Andrew is.
[00:14:08]  Yeah, so he's standing there.
[00:14:10]  What's the point you're making?
[00:14:11]  I'm showing the scale.
[00:14:13]  So he's five foot eight, five foot nine at tallest with spiky hair.
[00:14:19]  And he doesn't have a gap between him and the banister like Andrew does.
[00:14:24]  It's like, okay, he's not totally on the side, but he's a lot of a smaller guy than Andrew.
[00:14:31]  You can't fit a man like Andrew and half of Virginia in that space.
[00:14:37]  It's just not possible.
[00:14:38]  Like this, this bit here's only 60.
[00:14:42]  Show that to the camera.
[00:14:44]  So this banister here.
[00:14:46]  Camera three.
[00:14:47]  This is only, this is 60 centimetres only.
[00:14:53]  Do you know what 60 centimetres?
[00:14:55]  If we had a measuring tape to show you how small that is, I mean...
[00:14:58]  So let me ask you a question.
[00:15:00]  They're basically making him out like he's anorexic.
[00:15:02]  Okay, look, I couldn't fit in there with another girl.
[00:15:05]  At the very least, this is actually interesting because I've never seen independent pictures taken of the picture.
[00:15:11]  No one has seen this picture, by the way.
[00:15:13]  Right, which is very interesting, right?
[00:15:14]  Yeah.
[00:15:14]  So my question for you is, if, as you say, it's very easy to at least cast a lot of doubt over this picture, which was the key crux of the evidence against Andrew, why did Andrew end up paying a reported $11 million?
[00:15:28]  Well, he didn't have these pictures, did he?
[00:15:31]  But he could have got them, surely.
[00:15:34]  You know what?
[00:15:34]  I just, I think he was given really, really bad advice.
[00:15:39]  So this here, so this shows the measurements.
[00:15:44]  Show that to the camera again.
[00:15:46]  Actually, like when you zoom in on that, you can actually zoom in and it's 61 inches all the way across.
[00:15:52]  Now that corroborates the information we got on video when we measured.
[00:15:59]  We have the same basis.
[00:16:01]  So your overview is what?
[00:16:04]  My overview is that this is a collage.
[00:16:09]  Also, Virginia says that this part of the photo...
[00:16:14]  Well, she says the photo was done with a throwaway camera.
[00:16:17]  Now, a throwaway camera back in 2001 cannot do this perfect symmetrical...
[00:16:24]  Like, also the flash in the background, that is actually thought to be the light from the pub outside, but this is a collage.
[00:16:33]  So it was this frame, and then they were collaged and basically put in, but their scale is about...
[00:16:40]  Okay, does Prince Andrew know you've got this?
[00:16:44]  He knows that, well, I speak to his ex-wife.
[00:16:48]  Sarah Ferguson.
[00:16:50]  Yeah.
[00:16:51]  And you told her about these pictures.
[00:16:52]  She knows that I got into the house.
[00:16:54]  So Andrew knows that you've been in the house?
[00:16:56]  I suspect so.
[00:16:58]  And do they share your view that they think this is materially interesting evidence that may support his version?
[00:17:05]  Anyone that sees this would think this is pretty interesting.
[00:17:08]  Tom, before we go to Maureen, what's your immediate reaction?
[00:17:11]  The point is, where do these photographs originally come from?
[00:17:14]  And as I recall, it was the Daily Mail journalist who found.
[00:17:18]  No, no, no.
[00:17:19]  I got given these.
[00:17:21]  Hold on.
[00:17:22]  These are my photos.
[00:17:23]  You mean the original picture?
[00:17:24]  Oh, okay.
[00:17:25]  So this is the other thing, right?
[00:17:26]  So Virginia's photo, it was actually verified that actually the FBI never received a hard copy.
[00:17:36]  They only got a copy put on a disc, so they never got to see the back of it.
[00:17:44]  Okay, Tom, just as a journalist, do you find this intriguing?
[00:17:48]  Do you find it incredible?
[00:17:50]  As I understand the story, the original photograph.
[00:17:53]  They would have really short legs.
[00:17:55]  They would have no legs.
[00:17:57]  You know, you can mock up your photographs too.
[00:18:01]  The point is that photographs clearly can be mocked up.
[00:18:04]  This is real.
[00:18:04]  This girl's 5'2.
[00:18:06]  That's on financial.
[00:18:07]  Yeah.
[00:18:10]  She had the photograph and she gave it to the journalist unsolicited.
[00:18:15]  The journalist turned up at her door.
[00:18:17]  It wasn't an FBI source.
[00:18:19]  It was her photograph.
[00:18:21]  And I believe it to be true.
[00:18:23]  I don't believe...
[00:18:24]  It's sweet.
[00:18:25]  It's sweet that you believe that.
[00:18:26]  I believe it because I just don't see who would have the motive to construct.
[00:18:31]  That's what we all want to know.
[00:18:32]  Well, you want to know because you don't believe it's true.
[00:18:35]  I don't want to know because I just don't believe that there's anybody.
[00:18:37]  I don't want to know who put Jeffrey in.
[00:18:40]  Let me just speak one second.
[00:18:41]  Sorry, sorry.
[00:18:42]  There's nobody who has the motive, in my view, to originally put in these three people as a collage because what would be the purpose?
[00:18:51]  Also, her lawyer, David Boyd, said he was skeptical when he first met her, just because he's a lawyer and always is, but he made her take a polygraph and she passed with flying colours.
[00:18:59]  Well, that possibly is.
[00:19:01]  But that is also possible because she's gone through so much trauma.
[00:19:06]  Okay, all right.
[00:19:06]  Let me bring in the others.
[00:19:07]  Maureen Callan, what's your reaction to this?
[00:19:10]  I mean, this is a story that is, because of the nature of Virginia Dufray's tragic suicide, this is not going to go away, the speculation around all this.
[00:19:19]  Do you believe Virginia Dufray?
[00:19:21]  I mean, her own testimony against other men was questioned.
[00:19:25]  You know, Alan Dershowitz, the American lawyer, challenged her and got her to admit that she was mistaken in identifying him as one of the people that abused her, which seems not irrelevant to all this.
[00:19:38]  But where do you sit with Virginia Dufray in totality here?
[00:19:43]  Yeah, I believe her when it comes to Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:19:45]  That was an incredibly rich, powerful, connected man who could have had her harmed.
[00:19:50]  So the danger to her far outweighed, you know, the price of staying quiet.
[00:19:57]  But to this new theory, Piers, that your guest is promulgating.
[00:20:02]  Yeah, and the moon landing was staged and the Hunter Biden laptop is a fake.
[00:20:07]  Come on.
[00:20:08]  That photo had to be examined by newsrooms and lawyers up and down before it would ever be published.
[00:20:15]  Secondly, to this amateur photo and video that's been taken, do we know if the house has ever been renovated?
[00:20:21]  Do we know the exact height?
[00:20:24]  This is all the same.
[00:20:25]  This is an original light.
[00:20:28]  Not just a strange photo.
[00:20:32]  You would have to know the exact dimensions of each person's body.
[00:20:35]  We don't know what kind of camera was used.
[00:20:37]  We don't know what kind of lens was used.
[00:20:39]  We don't know the light.
[00:20:41]  There are a million, please, would you?
[00:20:44]  There are a million variables that go into something like that.
[00:20:48]  It is a very heavy lift.
[00:20:50]  And by the way, if this theory really has legs, if it's true, I don't understand why Prince Andrew isn't hopping on the phone right now with you.
[00:20:57]  He's not going to be saying anything.
[00:21:00]  But he does beg the question, why wouldn't he?
[00:21:02]  Because he got screwed last time.
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[00:21:57]  Okay, let me bring in, let me bring in Spencer Coopin.
[00:22:00]  You've represented nine of Epstein's victims.
[00:22:02]  What's your reaction to what we've been shown here tonight?
[00:22:06]  You know, it's truly sad.
[00:22:08]  Ms. Hervey is just one of the other aristocratic enablers that Andrew has been touting out to speak for him because he's too afraid to speak out on his own.
[00:22:18]  And he's too afraid to speak out on his own because he's guilty.
[00:22:21]  And that's the problem.
[00:22:23]  He paid because he knew that there was evidence that he was not only in the photograph, but he was also on Jeffrey Epstein's private island.
[00:22:32]  How about that?
[00:22:33]  Where is the proof that he wasn't on the private island with naked women, young girls?
[00:22:37]  Where's the proof that he wasn't in the Manhattan home with one of my clients for a party at that home after Jeffrey Epstein had already been admittedly a pedophile and caught and placed in jail?
[00:22:50]  Where is that evidence?
[00:22:51]  I think we need to remember the things that Virginia put in her original little book.
[00:22:57]  And then she said, oh, they're not true.
[00:23:00]  So remember Virginia's story about the ranch with Andrew?
[00:23:03]  She went into explicit detail talking about going horse riding.
[00:23:08]  The thing about Virginia, it's not like a small story.
[00:23:11]  It's a very elaborate story.
[00:23:13]  And then she basically admitted under oath that actually she made that up.
[00:23:19]  So I know that you want to defend your royal friend.
[00:23:23]  I get that.
[00:23:23]  But the reality is he was around a pedophile who was raping young girls.
[00:23:31]  And regardless of whether or not the photo is fake or not, he's a bad choice in friends.
[00:23:37]  Yeah, but it's very bad.
[00:23:39]  It's not regardless if the photo is real or not, because that's the only thing that they've tried to pin on him.
[00:23:46]  No excuse.
[00:23:47]  He does not have evidence.
[00:23:49]  He stayed with Epstein.
[00:23:50]  He just invasively.
[00:23:53]  He stayed with him for four days in Manhattan with a lot of women coming and going after.
[00:23:59]  Wait a minute, after Epstein was a convicted paedophile, as Spencer just said, right?
[00:24:06]  Years afterwards.
[00:24:07]  So he was a convicted paedophile and Prince Andrew, for reasons that remain completely inexplicable and which he couldn't explain to Emily Maitlis in that infamous Newsnight interview for the BBC, he flew to New York.
[00:24:19]  He was seen in Central Park walking with his mate.
[00:24:22]  He spent four days at Epstein's house.
[00:24:25]  No, I believe that he was in the city.
[00:24:26]  Women were seen coming and going the entire time.
[00:24:28]  And he knew by then that his great buddy was a convicted person.
[00:24:32]  By the way, so those photos of the girls coming out the house, now, they didn't come out for many, many years.
[00:24:39]  So I don't even believe they were during that time.
[00:24:42]  Do you believe anything that you found?
[00:24:45]  A lot of the girls did not tell the truth.
[00:24:48]  Who is the great conspirator?
[00:24:49]  Who's organizing this conspiracy of yours?
[00:24:53]  It's the intelligence three-letter word agencies that are wrapped up in this that I'm not going to go into right now because I would rather stay alive.
[00:25:01]  But what I'm saying is...
[00:25:04]  Victoria, do you not have any qualms about Virginia's family hearing you just dismiss everything about her as I think Robert Dufray would agree with me?

=== Prince Andrew's Settlement Deal (10:38) ===

[00:25:16]  What about her father, for example?
[00:25:18]  She was estranged from her mother and her father.
[00:25:20]  She didn't estrange her father.
[00:25:22]  She was.
[00:25:23]  Look, she's earned 30 million, right?
[00:25:26]  That is what she's worth.
[00:25:28]  Her father, he came out a month ago saying he's basically on the doll, like, and he couldn't even afford a flight to Australia to see her.
[00:25:38]  Why would you say that in such a disparaging manner if that's the case?
[00:25:41]  It's very sad.
[00:25:43]  It's very sad that obviously, you know, she didn't help the family, right?
[00:25:48]  I mean, this father sounded desperate.
[00:25:51]  Well, look, we can clear this up because I'm going to be joined now exclusively by Virginia Duffray's father, Skye Roberts, who's giving his first interview on camera about this.
[00:26:02]  Mr. Roberts, thank you very much indeed for joining me on Uncensored.
[00:26:06]  And my deepest sympathies to you and your entire family over what has happened to Virginia.
[00:26:12]  Thank you.
[00:26:14]  It's an awful tragedy and it ends a life of tragedy in many ways for your daughter.
[00:26:19]  First of all, tell me about your reaction when you heard that she'd taken her life.
[00:26:26]  Well, first of all, I couldn't even believe it.
[00:26:31]  I mean, I started crying right away.
[00:26:34]  I'm still crying.
[00:26:36]  I can't believe that this is happening.
[00:26:40]  It just, it's impossible.
[00:26:42]  And then for them to say that she committed suicide, there's no way that she did.
[00:26:47]  Somebody got to her.
[00:26:48]  Let me just ask you, Mr. Roberts, how much contact did you have with Virginia in recent years?
[00:26:56]  Not a lot.
[00:26:58]  I haven't spoken to her in years, but I think that she basically liked to try to protect me because she knew a lot of things about a lot of powerful people.
[00:27:08]  And to me, she's just protecting me that I don't get involved in any of it.
[00:27:13]  Like I say, when she was here, we were together all the time and doing a lot of things together.
[00:27:19]  She was on her own to go against Jeffrey Epstein, Glene Maxwell, Prince Andrew.
[00:27:25]  She was on her own this whole time.
[00:27:28]  You know, I'm not saying it's a way to earn money or anything, but she's just trying to make these people pay for what they did.
[00:27:36]  Did she ever talk to you about Prince Andrew before it became public knowledge?
[00:27:42]  Yes.
[00:27:43]  Yes.
[00:27:45]  She was there in London with Prince Andrew and Miss Maxwell.
[00:27:50]  Because one of my other guests here in the studio in London has produced photographs from the property where that famous infamous picture was taken of Virginia with Prince Andrew and Ghillaine Maxwell in the background and says that it proves to her that the picture must have been faked in some way.
[00:28:10]  But do you have any doubt that Virginia was there at the time and had sex with Prince Andrew?
[00:28:16]  Personally, I don't have proof of it, but she Virginia sent the original picture.
[00:28:23]  So I know it wasn't faked, but the original picture of Prince Andrew and her with Ghelaine Maxwell in the background.
[00:28:31]  So I know that's true that she did, she was there with him.
[00:28:35]  She, sorry, she showed you that picture, did you say?
[00:28:39]  Yes.
[00:28:41]  My mom had an 8x10.
[00:28:43]  And when did she first show you that?
[00:28:47]  Many years ago when it happened.
[00:28:49]  But before it became public knowledge?
[00:28:52]  Yes.
[00:28:53]  I knew nothing about it.
[00:28:54]  I mean, I didn't even know she was, you know, doing all these things for Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:29:01]  How did you feel when you discovered that?
[00:29:04]  Oh, I was really angry with Jeffrey Epstein because she had told me later on that, you know, he had threatened that if she had said anything, that he had the power to do anything he wanted to to her family.
[00:29:23]  I mean, I met Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:29:25]  I wouldn't let her go to work for him unless I met him.
[00:29:28]  But he seemed like a normal person.
[00:29:31]  I mean, he came out.
[00:29:31]  I went to his mansion and he came out in jeans and a t-shirt and just acted like a regular person.
[00:29:39]  So I had no idea.
[00:29:41]  I mean, you don't know who you're talking to, you know.
[00:29:46]  I'm just still upset about this thing.
[00:29:48]  Virginia never told you about the abuse that she was enduring?
[00:29:52]  No, never.
[00:29:55]  Nothing, I think.
[00:29:58]  I don't know.
[00:29:59]  Like I say, if she was to say something.
[00:30:00]  It was a composite image.
[00:30:02]  There was no.
[00:30:03]  But the point is, Mr. Roberts is saying...
[00:30:05]  No, but hang on.
[00:30:07]  He's saying, Victoria, very clearly that she showed him the picture.
[00:30:10]  A picture.
[00:30:11]  Before it was made public knowledge, before the mail got it.
[00:30:14]  Which I think is a significant statement by her father.
[00:30:17]  Can I ask you?
[00:30:18]  Does he really remember dates?
[00:30:20]  Mr. Roberts, can I ask you in relation to Prince Andrew, when it was revealed that he was not going to have his day in court, as he kept saying he wanted, with Virginia, and that he was actually going to instead pay her a very large check, many millions of dollars, did you have any conversation with her about that?
[00:30:38]  Or was that after you had become estranged?
[00:30:42]  Hey, I'm Caitlin Becker, the host of the New York Postcast, and I've got exactly what you need to start your weekdays.
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[00:31:12]  That was probably after, I think.
[00:31:15]  But I mean, to me and everybody here, I mean, it kind of admits guilt when you do that, when you pay somebody off like that.
[00:31:23]  Just, you know, when Jeffrey Epstein paid, when Maxwell paid, it's admitting guilt.
[00:31:29]  I mean, why would he spend 12 or 15 million to give to her?
[00:31:35]  What's your view of Prince Andrew?
[00:31:37]  It's gone that way.
[00:31:39]  Well, yeah, I don't care for him at all.
[00:31:42]  I mean, he's, I guess, a powerful, you know, royal figure, and they just think he can do what he wants to do.
[00:31:50]  And to people like my guest, Victoria Hervey, here, who do not believe that your daughter told the truth.
[00:31:57]  I'm really sorry for what your family has gone through, and I'm sorry that you were estranged from her.
[00:32:03]  And I feel like she should have, you know, helped you out and other family members more.
[00:32:11]  Well, I never asked for any help from her.
[00:32:13]  I am happy the way I am.
[00:32:15]  Yeah, I don't have a lot of money.
[00:32:17]  I'm on Social Security, but I'm happy.
[00:32:20]  Yeah, but I feel like it would have been nice if her or someone could have got your flight so at least you could have seen her recently.
[00:32:29]  Well, I didn't know until recently that they were living in separate houses.
[00:32:36]  If I'd have known they were living in separate houses, I do.
[00:32:39]  I have means.
[00:32:40]  I can get the money if I need it.
[00:32:42]  I can borrow it and get to Australia.
[00:32:45]  And if I'd have known that they were living in separate houses, I would have been there because I just couldn't go there with her husband there because I know how that ends every time.
[00:32:56]  Like I say, I'd been there probably four or five times and every time it ended bad with him.
[00:33:04]  So I know I couldn't go there as long as they were living together.
[00:33:08]  And now I just found out, you know, that they were, she was living at a farm and he's living at their beachside, you know, the home that they have there.
[00:33:19]  It must have been lonely for her.
[00:33:22]  Mr. Roberts.
[00:33:23]  Mr. Roberts, how would you like your daughter to be remembered?
[00:33:28]  There's so much being written about her at the moment, but how would you like her to be remembered?
[00:33:33]  As someone who actually got out of a bad situation and made a good situation out of it, that she was helping a lot of other young girls that were feeling the pain of what goes on with people like that.
[00:33:50]  You see it every day.
[00:33:51]  I mean, with the illegals and everything else that's been in our country.
[00:33:55]  And, you know, I think she's strong, very strong.
[00:33:59]  And that's why I don't think she committed suicide.
[00:34:02]  She had too much to live for.
[00:34:03]  She had her foundation.
[00:34:07]  And to those who...
[00:34:08]  She wanted to be remembered as a very strong-wheeled person that...
[00:34:15]  And to those, Mr. Roberts, who doubt her word and think she was lying, what do you say to them?
[00:34:23]  People think she was lying.
[00:34:26]  Yeah, some people do, including one of my guests.
[00:34:29]  I feel terribly like you're obviously seeing Skye here, but I do remember, Skye, you said to actually, I think it might have been Piers Morgan or it was a breakfast show where you said that she told good stories, like she basically had lied a lot in her life, so you didn't believe everything she told you.
[00:34:48]  I don't think I ever said that.
[00:34:50]  I know I was Good Morning Britain.
[00:34:52]  Yeah, there's good money.
[00:34:53]  Yes, I was on Good Morning Britain, but I believed everything she said.
[00:34:57]  I mean, she was my daughter.
[00:34:59]  And yeah, I know kids lie, you know, most kids do.
[00:35:04]  But you usually can tell.
[00:35:05]  I could never lie to my father ever.
[00:35:07]  And she knew that.
[00:35:08]  And I told her, never lie to me.
[00:35:10]  Never say anything that you can't say to me.
[00:35:13]  You know, just tell me the truth.
[00:35:16]  You know, well, Mr. Roberts, listen, I really appreciate you coming on the program tonight.
[00:35:24]  And you said a lot of things, and it'll raise a lot of questions.
[00:35:28]  But I really appreciate it.
[00:35:29]  And I have to remember, you're a father who's lost a daughter.
[00:35:32]  And as a father of a daughter myself, it's an unimaginable loss, notwithstanding the complexities of your relationship over the years.
[00:35:41]  So I just want to extend again on behalf of everyone here our deepest condolences to you.
[00:35:46]  Thank you very much.
[00:35:48]  Thank you for your time.
[00:35:48]  Thanks for saying that.
[00:35:50]  Thank you.
[00:35:52]  Let me bring Maureen back on this.

=== Interview With A Grieving Father (02:50) ===

[00:35:54]  I mean, that was a very shocking, powerful, moving interview with her father, but clearly, the whole family dynamic is complicated.
[00:36:05]  We knew that and very sad.
[00:36:07]  What did you make of that?
[00:36:09]  I really appreciated how he asserted his dignity when it came to whether he could afford to fly to Australia.
[00:36:17]  I also think that we all need to keep in mind that with people who have been historic victims of childhood sexual abuse, as Virginia clearly was, of course, her relationship with her father would have been complicated because nobody was clearly around to protect her.
[00:36:35]  This is just my opinion.
[00:36:37]  And when somebody does suffer this kind of abuse throughout the bulk of their life, some stories won't add up.
[00:36:44]  Some stories won't track.
[00:36:45]  We saw this really brilliantly executed in the Harvey Weinstein trial in New York, when some of these sexual assault victims took the stand and had to explain why after they alleged that Harvey had raped them, they sent emails, which were submitted in court as evidence to Harvey from them saying, would love to see you again.
[00:37:08]  Come and meet my mother.
[00:37:10]  And we had an expert take the stand and explain why and how it is that survivors of sexual assault and rape will do that.
[00:37:17]  It's part of regaining control.
[00:37:20]  This is a very complicated kind of personality and thought process that we're talking about here.
[00:37:26]  There is no one size fits all description of how a survivor should act or behave and why some stories or memories may be fungible.
[00:37:37]  Spencer, would you attest to that as well?
[00:37:40]  I mean, you've represented many victims of Epstein.
[00:37:43]  Would you concur with what Maureen just said?
[00:37:46]  I absolutely would.
[00:37:47]  And not only that, but I would add there was a huge pressure campaign on these victims back when the original prosecution was taking place.
[00:37:56]  I represented the first victim that came forward to the Palm Beach Police Department and started this investigation in Palm Beach, which then steamrolled into everything we now see many years later.
[00:38:08]  And Jeffrey Epstein had people, investigators, showing up outside of their homes in black SUVs, showing up at their work, investigators questioning their family members, their boyfriends, their spouses at the time, asking about sexual positions that they wanted to be in.
[00:38:28]  It was a huge amount of pressure exerted on these victims.
[00:38:31]  So for someone like Virginia to not only come forward, but to stay fast and stay true throughout these years, she was a great and incredible, incredible source of strength to all the victims that were out there.

=== Royal Family Court Documents (06:30) ===

[00:38:45]  Tom, extraordinary interview with her father.
[00:38:49]  I did interview him once before on Good Morning Britain.
[00:38:52]  I think when Epstein died.
[00:38:55]  What did you make of what he said?
[00:38:57]  Well, he's a tragic figure.
[00:38:59]  I mean, he lost a daughter and he clearly feels some responsibility.
[00:39:03]  I mean, that's his fatherhood.
[00:39:06]  He should have been looking after his daughter.
[00:39:08]  I believe him, that he got the photograph before it was made public.
[00:39:12]  I thought that was a sensation.
[00:39:14]  I don't think he really needs to pay for it.
[00:39:15]  Let me just say one thing without interrupting me.
[00:39:18]  I think that was a sensational disclosure.
[00:39:21]  Well, we don't.
[00:39:21]  And I believe him.
[00:39:23]  I believe that she would send these sort of photographs because at the time, to have met Prince Andrew was an astonishing achievement for her.
[00:39:32]  But who made the composite?
[00:39:34]  Just tell us who made it.
[00:39:35]  I can't tell you his name.
[00:39:36]  Well, that's ridiculous, you know.
[00:39:38]  I mean, if you can't tell us, then you'll just have one of them.
[00:39:42]  Hey, Mike Baker here, host of the President's Daily Brief podcast.
[00:39:45]  If you want straight talk on national security, foreign policy, and the biggest global stories going on of the day, this is the show for you.
[00:39:52]  We publish twice a day, Monday through Friday, once in the morning, again in the afternoon, and on the weekend.
[00:39:57]  We go logger with the PDB Situation Report with excellent guests, including national security insiders and foreign policy experts.
[00:40:05]  Check us out on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcast.
[00:40:08]  Also on our YouTube channel at President's Daily Brief.
[00:40:12]  But you know, if you're a motherfucker, we had this argument two years ago.
[00:40:15]  What is the motive?
[00:40:16]  Because I want this guy to stay alive.
[00:40:18]  But who is the lying in this case?
[00:40:20]  What is the motive of the person who, in your view, falsified this photograph?
[00:40:25]  Oh, well, they were taking down the royal family, weren't they?
[00:40:28]  Who were?
[00:40:30]  Maybe Israel.
[00:40:32]  Who knows?
[00:40:33]  Israel?
[00:40:34]  Godness me.
[00:40:35]  Come on.
[00:40:35]  What do you mean, who knows?
[00:40:36]  I mean, you're putting forward all these photographs.
[00:40:38]  You've got no.
[00:40:39]  This is real.
[00:40:40]  No, it's not.
[00:40:41]  This is all false.
[00:40:41]  Okay, all right.
[00:40:42]  We'll make it.
[00:40:42]  Go back to Ben yourself.
[00:40:44]  Why would Israel be taking down the British Royal Family?
[00:40:46]  Tell me that.
[00:40:48]  Will you tell us?
[00:40:49]  You're not.
[00:40:50]  This is a fact.
[00:40:51]  You raised it that Israel is behind.
[00:40:53]  You're not calm down on that.
[00:40:54]  Look, just a lot of people.
[00:40:57]  Why would Israel be trying to pop a picture to shame the Royal Family?
[00:41:01]  I don't know because I'm not talking about those agencies right now.
[00:41:07]  I made that clear.
[00:41:09]  What I have...
[00:41:10]  You just said it was Israel.
[00:41:11]  Without talking about that, I want to talk about that.
[00:41:14]  What is the genesis of your conspiracy theory?
[00:41:18]  Just stop.
[00:41:18]  This isn't a conspiracy.
[00:41:19]  These people do not fit in that space.
[00:41:22]  I've measured it.
[00:41:23]  They do not physically fit.
[00:41:25]  This guy on the left is five foot eight, five foot nine at highest with his hair.
[00:41:30]  And he's higher up in the door frame than Andrew is.
[00:41:33]  But in answer to Tom's question.
[00:41:35]  He doesn't add up.
[00:41:36]  Who had the motivation to do this?
[00:41:39]  Who is behind Jeffrey Epstein?
[00:41:41]  Like, who is that?
[00:41:42]  We don't know exactly who that is.
[00:41:45]  Who put Jeffrey up to this?
[00:41:47]  Who told him to set Prince Andrew up?
[00:41:49]  Well, nobody said because they were friends.
[00:41:52]  This was very organized.
[00:41:53]  No, they weren't.
[00:41:54]  Why would Prince Andrew give $11 million to a woman he said he never met?
[00:41:57]  He wanted to fight this, okay?
[00:42:01]  He wanted to fight this.
[00:42:02]  He knew he was innocent.
[00:42:04]  The Buckingham Palace would not let him fight it.
[00:42:07]  When have you ever seen a member of the Royal Family in a courtroom in New York?
[00:42:12]  It doesn't happen.
[00:42:14]  Like, that is why the lawyers went after him because he was such a scapegoat.
[00:42:18]  No, they went after him because it never happened.
[00:42:20]  He was killed.
[00:42:21]  Okay, if he was innocent, you must have another speech.
[00:42:26]  It doesn't help your argument by never letting anyone say another word.
[00:42:30]  You know nothing.
[00:42:32]  Why if he was innocent was he such a disaster in his news I interview?
[00:42:36]  Why have you got it so in for him?
[00:42:38]  I haven't got it in.
[00:42:39]  I'm asking you nothing.
[00:42:41]  What he did to me was he brought down the royal family.
[00:42:43]  He besmirched.
[00:42:44]  I'm a monarchist and he destroyed part of the royal family's great reputation.
[00:42:48]  I agree that interview was a bad interview.
[00:42:50]  I agree.
[00:42:51]  And the interview was filled with ridiculous falsehoods.
[00:42:54]  Yeah, no, I agree.
[00:42:55]  You know what I think he should do?
[00:42:56]  I think he should do another interview.
[00:42:58]  No, he would never do another.
[00:43:00]  He should do another one with somebody like me.
[00:43:02]  Well, because he's had time to think about the first one.
[00:43:04]  No.
[00:43:04]  And actually, just talk honestly about it.
[00:43:06]  It's better just to not speak at this point.
[00:43:09]  I don't agree with that.
[00:43:10]  He would just be set up.
[00:43:12]  But another question I have just surrounding the image.
[00:43:17]  So Virginia, when she did her first interview about the image, she said she took the photo for her mother to give to her mother.
[00:43:26]  Now in court documents, the mother admitted that she never saw this photo until it was in the Daily Mail years later.
[00:43:34]  So why do you think that is?
[00:43:36]  But the father said tonight, he saw it.
[00:43:37]  No, but he didn't see what he didn't.
[00:43:40]  He saw it long before it appeared in public.
[00:43:42]  He didn't.
[00:43:42]  He was very vague.
[00:43:44]  No, no, it wasn't before.
[00:43:45]  Guys, stop ganging up on me.
[00:43:47]  I'm giving you the facts.
[00:43:49]  I'm giving you court documents.
[00:43:50]  No, we're talking about what we just saw.
[00:43:52]  He said he literally saw a 10x8.
[00:43:54]  In court documents.
[00:43:55]  He saw the composite image.
[00:43:57]  Of course, the composite was printed.
[00:44:00]  It was photographed three times.
[00:44:02]  Hence, it's all blurry.
[00:44:03]  This isn't even the lines.
[00:44:05]  So Gillen never had a house this colour.
[00:44:07]  Obviously, it was a flash with a throwaway camera does not have a flash that strong.
[00:44:13]  This is the colour of her walls have always been a cream color.
[00:44:17]  Not that.
[00:44:18]  It's like...
[00:44:19]  Well, we don't know if it's been repainted.
[00:44:21]  So just to let you know, like, so that is in court documents, which obviously you guys have not read.
[00:44:28]  The mother clearly states that she was never given the image by Virginia, like Virginia said.
[00:44:34]  Now, he's not sweating there.
[00:44:36]  And this photo was supposed to be after he was sweating all night.
[00:44:40]  There's not like, this is...
[00:44:42]  All right, let me just quickly end by going to our guests in New York.
[00:44:46]  Maureen, do you believe anything that you're hearing here from Victoria?
[00:44:51]  Cheers.
[00:44:51]  I'm so glad you came back to me because I just have to say, I am astonished and appalled at how rude your guest is.
[00:44:57]  She really have to fight to get my...
[00:44:59]  Her logic is so faulty.
[00:45:00]  Her logic is so faulty.
[00:45:02]  And were I Prince Andrew, I would be asking you to exit stage left and stop talking.
[00:45:07]  But we now see further of Prince Andrew's idiocy because he's not shutting this down.
[00:45:14]  I believe it.

=== Prince Andrew's Public Idiotry (01:27) ===

[00:45:16]  Okay.
[00:45:17]  Spencer, if I need to do that, yeah, this is unbelievable.
[00:45:22]  I mean, she's got to retire the tiara and just put on the tinfoil hat at this point.
[00:45:26]  The reality is, is that even if she thinks this photo is fake, she should be the one that is trying to force our attorney general to release the security video cameras that are taken inside the Manhattan home because those security camera videos are still in the custody of the FBI.
[00:45:45]  They were taken into custody in Manhattan, at his home in Palm Beach, and at the island.
[00:45:51]  Release those videos because then we'll truly see that.
[00:45:54]  I believe that Pam Bondi and Cassatt are working actually very hard on this behind the scenes right now.
[00:46:00]  And I agree.
[00:46:03]  The videos will be fascinating.
[00:46:04]  We've got to leave it there.
[00:46:06]  Thank you for coming in, Victoria.
[00:46:07]  Thank you to you, Tom.
[00:46:08]  Thank you, Maureen.
[00:46:09]  And thank you, Spencer.
[00:46:10]  Certainly a fascinating story and tinged, obviously, with a lot of tragedy.
[00:46:14]  But I appreciate you all coming on Uncensored tonight.
[00:46:16]  Thank you.
[00:46:18]  Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent.
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