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May 24, 2024 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
36:29
20240524_trans-teen-wins-oregon-state-200-meter-title
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Time Text
Biological Sex In Sports 00:14:38
Leonor Messi puts his hand up and says, actually, I'm feeling like a woman today.
You play him in the American women's national team, Francesca.
Yes or no?
Yes, yes, right now.
Hell yeah, are you kidding me?
They are useful idiots like you that are validating a scientific nonsense.
There's no such thing as gender identity.
Esther, you're the only thing making anyone angry or incensed right now, so you're causing me a mental health issue.
Your guests sit here and talk about trans women about trans rights, but then they dismiss Caitlin Jenner.
Girl, don't have a Beyoncé album.
I want to talk about that.
Teenage runner Aiden Gallagher became the Oregon girls' 200-meter state champion last week, posting one of the fastest times in the state's history with a remarkable display of power and stamina.
But as Aiden crossed the finish line, something, well, pretty unusual happened.
Instead of joyous cheering and adulation, many of the watching spectators loudly booed.
We find a survival story.
Well, the same thing happened when Gallagher received a gold medal on the podium, but the runner-up was loudly cheered when she received her silver.
And there's an explanation for all this.
Gallagher is a transgender athlete who was born a biological male and therefore has a vastly superior physiology to show for it.
And as far or video clips from the race show, Gallagher towered over many of the competing girls, displaying greater height, power, and speed that frankly made a mockery of any pretense to fairness or equality.
The reaction of the crowd is a small moment in the grand scheme of things, but it might prove to be extremely significant.
A couple of years ago, it would have been very different.
This would have been held as he led his progressive symbolic victory for inclusivity and tolerance.
But now mainstream opinion is finally waking up to what is honestly insane.
What athletics has banned trans athletes who've been through male puberty from competing against women.
But the state-level bureaucrats and miles behind the Oregon authorities say they define a woman based on their consistently asserted gender identity.
But honestly, that's just disingenuous bullshit.
Yes, trans people deserve the same rights and respect as everybody else.
They should have fairness and equality.
They should have the same human rights as me.
But you can't consistently assert the massive physical differences that come from being born male or female and compete in sport.
Those rights cannot come at the expense of women's rights to fairness and equality in their own sport.
Now, for years, anyone prepared to speak up about this, like me, was instantly shamed and vilified as a transphobe.
But the reaction of the crowd in Oregon, which is actually, excuse, more liberal than conservative, shows the silent majority might finally be fighting back and letting their feelings be heard loud and clear.
Well, joining me to debate this and more, our comedian and podcaster James Barr, uncensored contributor Esther Kraken, outkick host Tony Lehran, and the host of the Habituation Room podcast, Francesca Fiorantini.
So welcome to all of you.
Tommy, let me start with you.
I watched a video of this as a father of a 12-year-old girl who loves a bit of sport, and honestly, my heart just sank.
But when I heard the booing, I was thrilled, not because the athlete was being booed, I felt awful for the trans athlete, but because I finally felt that the silent majority were finding their voice.
What did you think?
Yeah, I also think that it's big that this happened in a place like Oregon.
Oregon is not conservative, maybe certain parts, but certainly the majority of Oregon is certainly more on the left side.
So I think the fact that the crowd is saying, hey, this is unacceptable, that's a big moment.
But we just have to stop denying this, peers.
I mean, the silent majority, and I would agree that the majority, actually, the more vocal majority now, is saying that this is absolutely ludicrous.
And listen, I think we need to stop talking about biological men competing against biological women in women's sports.
This is a trans person, a trans woman competing against actual women.
Stop dismissing women by calling us biological women.
We are just women.
So I want to put that out there first.
Why are we constantly, and when I say we, why is popular culture constantly asserting that trans people, their feelings, their emotions, their inclusion is more important than the majority of women who just want to have fairness, want to compete, want to have achievements, accomplishments, and opportunities.
Why do their feelings matter more than the feelings of the women that they're competing against?
It's ridiculous.
We keep coddling and cow-cowing to this madness.
I hope we're seeing the end of it.
And I think within the next couple of years, we will.
Yeah, I mean, I'm amazed that every woman, frankly, doesn't agree with you because the unfairness and inequality is so obvious.
But Francesca, I can see you actually going berserk here with indignation.
So presumably you don't agree.
I mean, just, I just, please don't speak for me.
You know what I'm saying?
Like, either of you, please don't speak for me.
Please don't speak for all women.
Just let's get that out of the way right now because I do disagree.
I think about what if your kid, what if your 12-year-old kid was Aiden?
Wouldn't that be incredible?
Wouldn't you be proud of Aiden?
No.
And how much would it be?
No, absolutely not.
Unless, unless that child had not even reached puberty and is, and in the case of my daughter, for example, and someone is trying to convince her that if you just put your hand up and say that you're a boy, you can suddenly compete against a different biological sex.
I'd say it's all mad.
Piers, I really, this is what's crazy about it.
Do you think that that's what's driving trans women to compete as athletes is that they're like, hmm, if I transition to become a woman, I can win a gold medal in a high school track and meet competition.
Now, hang on, Francesca.
I don't care.
That is so absurd to be.
It's the same thing.
Hang on, Francesca.
I don't care.
The reality is they're doing it, right?
And the point is, to me, the answer is obviously.
They're not doing it to win a medal.
They're doing it because that is their idea.
But they're winning medals at the expense of actual women who can't compete with them physically.
It's why your name is a lot of people.
It's why we're separate sexy.
You know what?
Like, I actually Googled this.
Hang on.
Hang on.
I'll come to you.
I'm embarrassed to be a woman when I see women freaking out about trans women.
Wow.
One, one out of so many companies.
Not just one.
Okay.
It's happening swimming with Leah Thomas.
It's happening in all sorts of sports.
Yes, because it makes us look really pathetic, honestly.
It makes us look like losers and whiners.
And guess what?
I'm not a loser or a winer.
You know what I actually want to talk about when it comes to women's sports?
Why is Caitlin Clark being paid 80 times less than her counterpart entering the NBA?
Well, that's quite strange for you.
Women don't want to talk about that.
Hold on, hold on.
Can I ask women no one ever knows, Francesca?
Let me ask you a question.
If I hit you over the head with a bat and I said the plan wasn't to kill you, it's because you had a fly in your head.
Would you still not go to the police for assault?
Does my intention matter?
Because that's exactly what you just was trying to rule gold for.
That's exactly what you want.
That's exactly what you're doing.
Just because trans people are not identifying as trans to basically erode women's sports, that makes it okay that that's exactly what they're doing.
This is you.
I think that's what they're doing.
You feel me?
Trans people report on that earth.
Let me finish.
You know what the issue is with women's sports.
You know what the issue is.
They are useful idiots like you that are validating a scientific nonsense.
There's no such thing as gender identity.
Being trans identifying is a mental illness.
A reality that exists only in your head should not be validated and specifically not at the expense of people that are just going about their business trying to win sporting tournaments or trying to use useful idiots like you that are leading the views of trans people and backwards.
Go to an island where all women think like you and you can compete with all the biological men you want, but do not impose your backward views on the rest of us and have the audacity to call us regressive.
Okay, Francesca, your response my response is this.
Look, I care more about human life and people actually.
I care about the right to privacy.
I care about people surviving and living in this world.
Yes, I do.
You don't seem to care about the right to privacy of biological women not wanting to share their spaces with biological men.
What about them?
What about the number of trans youth in the world?
No, no, hold on, hold on.
Don't play every single day.
What about biological women not wanting to share a bathroom with a biological man?
Talk about that.
Don't say what about, answer that question.
What about them?
Do they not matter?
Look, lady, you can go into every bathroom and pick a fight with every person who you think is in the previous.
That's your problem.
A man goes into a bathroom with an immediate daughter.
Teenager, a teenager being booed.
Guys, let's not bully, okay?
I believe it was Melania Trump who said, be best.
And we know what bullying leads to.
Stephen Miller.
You know what it is.
Okay, but Francesca, I'm going to come to James, because to me, there's conflating two issues.
You can absolutely support trans rights to fairness and equality, as I do and consistently have.
But you can also see that there is obviously a massive problem now getting increasing now in women's sport.
And there's a reason.
And we've had this conversation, James, but you gave a preposterous answer last time.
There's a reason we separate sexes in the Olympics, in the world championships, because otherwise women would never win anything.
Look, I think, so that's why we do it.
It's not because women aren't great athletes.
Women would not.
They're great athletes when competing.
What are quick?
Because people physically born unfortunately.
Listen, I have so much to say.
I want to explode.
Firstly, Esther, you're the only thing making anyone angry or incensed right now.
So you're causing me a mental health issue.
So really, if there's a mental illness, exactly.
You're your friend.
You're probably going to take a pill.
You can all be mentally unwell together.
From my life.
Going back to the state here, like most of the female winners in this sport, they are hitting around 22 to 24 seconds, which is exactly what the gold medalists won here.
And then also following up with what you said.
What's your point?
What's your point?
My point is this is normal for a woman.
No, no, no.
This is a normal speed for a woman.
No in a race.
But let's get back to what you're saying.
You're talking about women's safety in changing rooms.
Let me finish, please.
You're talking about women's safety in changing rooms.
That's what Esther brought this conversation down to.
But what I do know about is that one in three women in America are abused violently in their lifetime.
And in every single day in America, 13,000 women are a victim.
Why are we talking about one trans woman being in a changing room?
How dare you, a man, say anything about women feeling unsafe with biological men?
No, you can't, because you're not a woman.
You have never had a period.
You've never been a woman in a woman's tenet.
So don't even mention.
I'm not picking on one.
I'm not picking on that.
I'm talking about the fact that women around the world are being affected because we are validating a science.
You're shouting at biological men.
Your words.
Why am I, and I, and you're allowed to talk about biological men, so why am I not allowed to talk about women?
Hang on.
So am I. Hang on.
Hang on.
We are conflating various issues here.
So let's get back to the actual issue we want to debate, which is the issue of this young somophore, Aiden Gallagher.
I come back to Tommy here.
You know, I know this debate always inspires everyone to get very angry and there's lots of allegations of transphobia and so on.
I really think they're missing the central point.
There is a reason we separate sexes in sport.
And the reason, like I said, when the Olympics are in Paris later this summer, if you allowed women and men to compete in a generalized way, then women would win almost no medals.
Literally, other than one or two events, possibly equestrian, possibly archery.
There are very few things which anything that involves power or stamina or speed or snow.
Piers, can I ask you a question really quickly?
Yes.
Because have you ever undergone any kind of like hormone replacement therapy?
Oh, you mean you mean chopped off his penis?
Because that's what happened.
Hang on.
I'm not talking to you, Esther.
Hang on.
I'm talking to Piers.
Yeah.
Because actually, the body does undergo an incredible amount of toil.
But it doesn't do, Francesca.
I've heard this on.
Hang on.
It doesn't change your body mass.
No.
No, it doesn't.
It does.
No, it doesn't.
It absolutely can change your body mass.
It doesn't.
You remain as muscular.
You don't know this?
Talk to someone like Caitlin Jenner.
Who was as a man was the decathlon gold medal winner for the United States of America.
And was then, when she took up golf, having transitioned, was told she could tee off from the women's tees, right?
The women's tees are 50 yards further ahead than the men's.
And she said she was winning every tournament.
Asking Caitlin Jenner for any advice or practical information is like asking you, Piers, for how to get a six-pack.
Like, what are we doing?
Actually, I've got quite an impressive growing six-pack as my Instagram favorite.
The point is, it undergoes a lot of change.
Then it comes to Tommy.
It's incredibly difficult.
I want to point this out.
Tommy.
Piers, I want to point this out because your guests here, I mean, talk about the snake eating its own tail.
They're sitting there talking about trans rights and affirming transgender ideology, but then they're saying that Caitlin Jenner, who is probably the most famous trans person, that doesn't count because Caitlin Jenner is not only a Republican, but Caitlin Jenner also calls out biological men competing in women's sports.
So your guests sit here and they cry, who cares about trans rights, but then they dismiss Caitlin Jenner.
It's amazing.
These are also the same people who claim to be feminists, but also don't care about actual women being robbed of opportunities.
That's why liberalism is a disease.
And you can just let these people talk and they argue with themselves, Piers.
The point is, if Aiden Gallagher competed according to their biological sex, they would not be succeeding.
They wouldn't be winning state championships.
They would actually not even be qualifying for the finals.
That is the point everyone's missing.
Why do you care about women's integrity of women's sport?
But you don't...
Have you done a segment on Caitlin Clark and pay disparity?
Have you done a segment?
Where were you when the U.S. women's money was?
He doesn't need to be a bad person.
You have no idea.
Francesca, you have no idea, Ashie.
Shut up.
You have no idea what I've said about women's.
What about when the women's national team wins in the United States, right?
They've won like four times at this point.
Context Matters For Speech 00:11:19
And what happens?
Oh, Megan Rapino, who is both a lesbian and also like one time knelt during the national anthem, she's not a real patriot.
They freak out.
Donald Trump tweets about her.
No, you know, you're missing Megan Rapino.
Megan Rapino is a very, very good football player, but also incredibly irritating.
And I noticed that when she retired, it was only then she said that she wanted trans women to be playing in the American women's national team.
In other words, when it wasn't possible for that person to take her position.
Because here's a scenario for you.
Leonor Messi puts his hand up and says, actually, I'm feeling like a woman today.
You play him in the American women's national team, Francesca.
Yes or no?
Lionel Messi had to undergo an incredible incredible.
He had to undergo an incredible amount of treatment when he was young.
He had a bunch of like mess in and in order for him to be able to do that.
He had a growth spurt.
I'm a big Messi fan, so but let me just answer my question.
Would you allow him, if he said, I'm a woman, to play in the American women's team?
Yes, yes, yes, right now.
Hell yeah, are you kidding me?
Messi on the U.S. women's national team?
Hell yeah.
Would you allow Usain Bolt to do that and be in the sprinting scene?
Because that would mean they're a trans woman.
They identify as women.
I get it.
I get it.
So just to be clear, you'd let Leonore Messi play in the women's national football team and destroy women's football forever.
You'd let Usain.
It would be very difficult to get a ticket, which would be suck.
I want to do a little checklist here.
You'd let Usain Bolt compete as a sprinter in the American women's Olympic team.
Yes.
Okay.
You would let Floyd Mayweather compete as a boxer in the women's American boxing team.
Yeah, you have to be like the heavyweight.
I completely agree.
Lunacy.
I agree with Francesca.
And I go to the first time.
They would have to transition.
Immunity.
I always say that you want to be a penguin.
I would let you live at London Zoo in a cage like the rest of the world.
You know what?
I'd be a very popular exhibit.
I would.
Here's the problem.
And he's so delusional.
The idea you would let Usain Bolt say, I'm a woman, and compete against women on a racetrack when no man can compete with him, right?
It's utterly ridiculous.
I'm just convinced that they don't actually believe this, but the logical conclusion of their ludicrous arguments facilitates the need to actually say these things.
Also, this is a testament to the poor quality of public education in both the US and the UK, that you both don't understand the basic economics of how sports entertainment works.
If there are not enough bums on seats, you don't get paid enough.
That's literally it.
So sitting there outrage about the fact that some female players don't make as much as some male athletes, guess what?
Go and buy the tickets to their games and start boosting up their viewing figures and then maybe we'll get to the point.
Caitlin has more views.
Look at the revenue for the Women's World Cup and compare it to the men's World Cup.
They are light years away.
Can I say what I'm saying?
Lynn Clark was the most watched, most watched women's college player ever.
The ratings were through the roof.
She's getting sponsored.
Compare it to the average male college viewership.
Okay, we're going to be able to do that.
She had more views than them.
We are moving on to a different issue.
I want to talk about Harrison Butker first.
Tommy, I want to come to you on this.
Let's just play a clip.
This is a guy who's a Kansas City Chiefs star.
He made a commencement speech at Benedictine College in which he told women they should aspire to be homemakers.
Take a look.
I think it is you, the women, who have had the most diabolical lies told to you.
How many of you are sitting here now, about to cross this stage, and are thinking about all the promotions and titles you are going to get in your career?
Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world, but I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world.
Not the deadly sin sort of pride that has an entire month dedicated to it, but the true God-centered pride.
Be unapologetic in your masculinity, fighting against the cultural emasculation of men.
Now, Tommy, this created a huge Fiori, of course.
The Kansas City, well, the NFL, I think, threw him under a bus immediately, so they were outraged.
It wasn't their opinions and so on.
But there's been a lot of surprising voices of support.
Bill Maher, for example, a liberal, came out and basically supported his right to say this.
It's obviously religiously motivated what he said.
What did you make of what he came out with?
Listen, I don't agree with everything that he said, but I also think a lot of people are taking it out of context.
He's a Catholic speaking to other Catholics.
So you have to put that in context.
He's not speaking to people at a pride parade.
He's speaking to Catholics who hold traditional Catholic views.
And there's nothing wrong with him expressing his opinions.
We can disagree with them.
But I would also like to point out that when he's giving this commencement speech as a Catholic to Catholics, he's not like some of the other athletes who want to kneel at an actual football game or who want to force fellow athletes to wear rainbows when they're going to compete at their sport.
He's giving a commencement speech to Catholics.
So the left really needs to decide, do they want athletes to take a stand or not?
Because we are told that Colin Kaepernick and others, LeBron James, Megan Rapino, they should be hailed for their political speech.
But then Harrison Bucker, who gives a speech, a commencement speech to fellow Catholics, all of a sudden, that's a bridge too far.
Okay, James, James.
James, you're a spot.
I mean, he talked about Catholic pride.
Really?
Pride in God.
I think it's actually the most shocking part of that was the fact that he mentioned Taylor Swift and called her his teammate's girlfriend.
That is so offensive.
Why?
So offensive.
He said that, well, she has a name.
She's one of the most successful women on the planet.
Obviously, Jokes.
He was talking about how you're only focusing on having kids.
One brigade can never laugh.
When do you all get together?
Do you ever tell Jokes?
Do you know what?
You're supposed to be a comedian.
Maybe Arsenal should take his advice and just sit at home and get married and not play football because clearly they don't have to be able to do that.
But that's not fundamentally.
Why is he, as Tommy said, why is he not allowed to have those views?
There are many women who sit at home, by the way, doing a much harder job than anyone sitting here.
Because he has a responsibility.
Sitting at home, bringing up children is a hard, hard job.
Very.
Why do we denigrate it by saying that's all you're going to do?
Why are you denigrating it?
But how dare you tell anyone what they should be doing?
It's not an opinion if you're telling people what they should be doing.
You're allowed to give them advice.
Don't tell me what to do.
But Tommy's point is right.
He is allowed an opinion.
But what you're missing is that this opinion is being broadcast to millions of people.
James, would you have had a problem if he said go out there and be boss babes, girls, and be CEOs and all of that?
No.
You only have a problem because you disagreed with his science.
I think one of the interesting things he said is that many women would look forward to their promotions and all of that, but they'd look forward to being mothers more.
Because actually, many women don't have great careers.
Most women don't get to be CEOs.
They don't get to be business owners.
They usually become administrators.
No, but the point is, we've glamorized this whole idea of women in the workforce as in, go be boss babe and, do you know, own Facebook and all of that, and the vast majority, the overwhelming majority of women are overworked underpaid, doing unglamorous jobs, and somehow that's seen as something to be glorified as being a boss baby.
But what it also comes back to, there's also this whole idea of the of what activism is allowed and not.
How should people be forced to do it.
For instance, there's a football player, uh who plays for Monaco in France and he's from Mali uh, in Africa.
He's called Muhammad Kamara and he and the whole team were told to wear Lgbtq and the rest of it uh pride badges uh, for a game, and he refused, right.
And the French sports minister has now said he will be facing the strongest sanctions against him and his club for refusing to wear an LGBT pride badge.
Now James again, I simply say this, why the hell should he have to?
If his conviction is from a country, by the way, which is a place where they do not believe that homosexuality is anything but a sin?
I don't agree with that.
You don't agree with that obviously, but that's where he comes From, his religious conviction, tells him that he's not being homophobic, he's not saying homophobic things, he just doesn't want to wear an LGBT pride badge while he's playing football.
Why the hell should he?
Well, LGBT and the rest of it, did you say?
Yeah, you want to know what the rest of the letters are there?
Even you don't know.
Go on, man.
LGBTQ FU.
Now, back to what he was saying.
Let's have a conversation about you actually can't remember the rest of the digital.
Nobody can.
Let's have a conversation about it.
He also covered up a sign that said no homophobia in French.
So, you know, why should he have to say that?
So, on one hand, I'm like, cool, if you don't want to wear the rainbow flag, that's a bit awkward.
But if you don't want to wear a flag that says no homophobia, why should he have to?
So, what are you pro-homophobia?
No, it doesn't mean if you don't want to, if you don't want to support it, no homophobia just means no bullying, it means human rights.
And if you don't want to say that, then what the hell are you going to do?
I'm going to be honest.
I wouldn't wear an LGBT pride badge.
But do you support homophobia?
No, right.
But this is, this is, Piers, it is, it is a private company.
I mean, it is a football team, right?
That's their prerogative.
This is not an exciting implementing this.
Yeah, I mean, right.
So, I don't know why you're getting so upset and also there's like a weird because they're going to sanction him.
Okay.
Well, they should.
Okay, you think it's okay.
Then he can go play somewhere where they don't make up.
No, Tommy, let me bring you in for some common sense as usual.
No, but I thought we were talking about Harrison Butker.
I didn't get any bite of the butker apple here.
Well, have a bite of the butker apple.
Go on.
We'll tell you.
What we're going to say so we can just summarize that.
Yes.
Girl, don't you have a Beyoncé album to talk about best?
Because it's a good idea.
She's in a cowboy outfit.
Oh, she got an American flag on.
She thinks she's a country singer.
I'm sure you've got a few of them.
Maybe you've said anything about that, but whatever.
Yeah, that's why.
Please don't interrupt me when I'm rather obsessed with my work, so I appreciate it.
Piers, I'd like to get back to the point at hand.
Yes.
So I'm sorry, were you talking about that?
No, you're not.
Francesca, can you let another woman speak, please?
Yeah.
No.
So much for being here.
I'm not going to because you talked about Harrison.
Now I'm going to talk about Harris.
Harrison Butker's mom is a physicist who works in an oncology department.
All this is, is a bunch of mommy issues that he laid out at a bunch of female graduates who are trying to celebrate this incredible achievement.
And he tells them that they have been told a diabolical lie.
I mean, that is absolutely disrespectful and degrading to talk about women's rights.
They've just achieved this.
And the other thing is, the rest of his speech was about, oh, what happened to the Catholics and all the good Catholicism?
And where have we gone a ride?
Why don't we respect priests anymore?
Gee, I wonder why we don't respect priests anymore.
Can anyone think of what's happened to the priesthood in the last 20, 30, 40, 50 years?
Anyone?
No?
Yeah.
Yeah, I can.
Yeah, there have been a lot of priests have been exposed as Peter Farz, and it's completely outrageous.
I say that as a Catholic who's as appalled by it as you are.
Tommy, I want to bring you in though.
We've allowed you to have your buttka bite.
Uniforms And Forced Pride 00:03:42
Let's bring Tommy back into this Monaco player because I just reminded me, there's a Northern Irish footballer, and he refuses every year to wear a poppy, which is one of the red poppies that we wear in our country to salute the work of the armed forces.
And it's something we do on Remembrance Sunday over here.
Now, the reason he doesn't wear it, it turned out, is that it represents all the military operations by the British Armed Forces.
And he comes from a certain part of Northern Ireland where the British parachute regiment killed a lot of civilians and it became known as Bloody Sunday.
You two wrote a song about it.
It became a hugely contentious thing.
He comes from literally the very street where families of those who were killed live.
So the idea that he would wear a poppy saluting the British Armed Forces would obviously not go down well with his own streets.
It's a false equivalence.
No, no, it's not false equipment.
How many quicker people are going to be?
I mean, let me finish.
Let him finish.
Who's a Tommy?
So my point is, I don't feel everyone here feels he should be compelled to wear it.
I don't.
And I don't think this Monaco player should be compelled to wear it.
If you start spewing homophobic stuff, different issue.
Take him to task.
He's not.
He's just saying, I don't want to wear a patch, thanks.
Right.
I don't think that athletes should be forced to wear anything outside of their actual uniform and that they should be expected to do anything beyond playing the game that they're there to play.
What I don't understand about this forced pride on everybody.
Why are we forced to celebrate who you want to sleep with?
It makes no sense.
If you're playing soccer, football, volleyball, why do I care who you sleep with?
If you are proud of yourself, which is what pride means, then why do I have to celebrate your sexuality?
Why does your teammate have to celebrate your sexuality?
Why does an entire team and organization have to celebrate?
And by the way, hang on, hang on.
If Tommy and I wore badges...
Hang on, Francesca, I'll come to you.
If Tommy and I wore patches today, saying, straight and proud of it, imagine how enraged people like James Barr would be.
It said no homophobia.
It didn't say, oh, I'm proud of you for sleeping with you.
No, it was also an LGBT pride.
Yes, but the real problem here is that he covered up no homophobia.
He doesn't want to vote at all.
He was wearing it on the uniform.
It was part of the uniform.
It was on the uniform.
He's covered.
He wants to be seen wearing it.
Well, that is a real problem because the team are celebrating.
Let's bring in Francesca.
Bring in Francesca.
He's trying to stamp out homophobia in sports.
That's really important.
Francesca.
I think that's a really important point that James brought up.
Like, it's like we are obviously missing the force for the trees here, that there is a broader problem of homophobia, but let's leave that aside.
Tommy said, and I do agree, you know, that athletes shouldn't have to be required to do anything other than play the sport.
So what about the national anthem?
Can athletes sit or kneel for the national anthem?
Because last I remembered, the right freaks out.
You can do every time they do that, but people are going to criticize you for it.
Yeah.
You can do whatever you want.
Athletes can do whatever they want.
If Colin Kaepernick wants to sit or kneel or do whatever he wants, he's more than willing to do it.
But we're talking about a separate issue here.
The national anthem is literally the same thing as personalized.
It's being required.
It's being required.
And if you say you shouldn't be required to do anything you don't want to do, that's the same thing.
Look, there was a player on the Mets, right?
Forgetting his name right now, but he was from Vieques, Puerto Rico.
And he would never stand for the national anthem.
Why?
Because Vieques is a U.S. military base that bombed that corner of Puerto Rico time and time again.
There's incredible toxins in the water, and he wouldn't stand for it.
And then eventually part of the contract was, you better stand for this or we're going to boot you off the team.
Athletes Versus The Anthem 00:02:12
So he did.
He started doing it, right?
That's what I'm saying.
It's every single individual club's decision, as well as that player's decision.
All right.
Let's move on to two very quick things.
I want to just get a quick reaction from all of you to two things.
One, Tommy, is Trump going to get convicted and will he win the election?
Whatever happens.
So I believe if there's any shred of democracy and constitutionality left in my country, I don't believe he will be convicted.
Even if he is, it's going to be overturned on appeal.
This whole thing is a sham.
It's a crimeless crime to begin with.
And I do believe that if it is between Joe Biden and Donald Trump, Donald Trump will win the election in November.
I still don't think Joe is going to be the nominee.
I think it's going to be Gavin Newsom.
But if it is Joe versus Trump, I'm pretty confident Trump is going to win.
Okay.
Esther, is he going to get convicted?
I don't think he'll get convicted.
I don't think the cases are strong enough.
But I...
And will he win?
I'm slightly convinced that he will win.
I mean, for me, the math still isn't adding up, but I don't think he's going to be.
Well, he's ahead in almost every swing.
Yes, but I think two weeks before the election is when you can really gauge how people feel.
I think once out is not enough.
All right, James?
I think the question: will Trump be convicted for a crime and will he win the election is a terrifying question.
Yeah, but those two questions should not ever be asked to each other.
I can't understand how that's happened.
Can you answer the question?
Well, I can't because I don't understand the American legal system at all.
I would hope that he was arrested for a lot of the things that were incredibly wrong, including inciting an actual riot on the Capitol.
Okay.
Well, thank you for your constructive thoughts.
No one.
Francesca.
Will Trump be convicted?
And either way, will he win the election?
Whoo, I like this.
He will be convicted because the evidence is glaring.
And, you know, we all know that David Pecker refused to pay his bills anymore.
And so Trump was like, damn it, now I've got to do financial crimes to pay off this woman I slept with.
So that's what he's thinking.
I thought you liberals didn't care who people slept with.
I know about those porn.
I literally don't care.
Have pride in your sexuality.
Doesn't that extend to porn stars?
Will Trump Be Convicted 00:04:36
So love is love.
I don't know if that extends to Donald Trump.
People pay off people all the time in America.
Why shouldn't Trump be able to pay off a porn star?
Even if he didn't.
I'm the one that wrote the campaign finance law.
I didn't write the campaign finance law.
Okay, Libs.
The left didn't get together and was like, ooh, I know what we'll do.
We'll write campaign finance law.
If Hunter Biden did it, you'd be flying a flag saying free Hunter.
Yeah.
I thought besides what was real work.
Final question.
Here's a final question.
I hope he wins.
I hope he wins the presidency for your sake, Piers.
So you can have some sort of spot on the administration.
I don't know what you want to do.
Maybe you want to be sort of, you know, ambassador or something.
I don't know.
Whatever.
Actually, now you're talking.
Maybe you should be the one who's going to be.
Actually, the embassy here is really nice.
I wouldn't mind that.
Yeah.
Trump's American ambassador to the UK.
Great idea.
Very quickly, because I know Tommy, you've got to go.
This extraordinary story about Graceland, Elvis Presley's home, where he lived for many years, where he's buried along with most of his family, including Lisa Marie, his daughter who sadly died last year, his parents, his grandmother, Lisa Marie's brother, who sadly shot himself and so on.
It's at the center of this huge legal row where some investment firm has come forward and said, Lisa Marie reneged on a debt of three million pounds, three and a half million dollars.
And as a result, they are now selling Graceland.
And Riley, who is the granddaughter, the actress, Riley Goff, hasn't it?
She has come out and said she's got an interim order preventing it happening.
They're back in court later today.
A, it's extraordinary and all part of the Elvis circus.
But my question is this.
Would you ever want to be buried in the grounds of your own house seeing what's happened here?
Because what happens if somebody comes along and says, we're selling your house?
Tommy.
Yeah, I mean, I live here in Tennessee.
So this is obviously close to my heart and being in Nashville and Memphis, just down the road.
Elvis is the king.
I would never want to be buried at my home for that reason.
But there is good news in this.
I believe that the sale has, at least for now, been halted.
So we all rejoice here in Tennessee and for Elvis the King.
I mean, that was awesome.
Why would anyone want to buy it?
Well, James, let's ask your opinion.
Assuming you have one.
Elvis met his wife when she was 14.
I think that's absolutely disgusting.
What's it got to do with it?
It's got a lot to do with it.
I'd burn the place down or turn it into a women's women's safety.
She made it clear to me.
Women's safety refugee.
So you're accusing her of what?
Because I interviewed her last year and she was emphatic.
There was no sex between them until she was a lawful court.
Cool, cool.
So what's your problem?
No, no worries though.
Awesome.
Good job.
What's your problem?
Awesome.
What's your problem?
No problem.
Well, he wasn't allowed to meet me.
He says it's okay.
Wasn't allowed to meet her.
Piers, do you think it's okay to marry a 14-year-old?
You did marry a 14-year-old.
Okay, but if you met a 14-year-old, you didn't marry that 14-year-old when you were 10 years old.
Did you not think that she was a motherfucker?
She's 14.
Sorry, Tommy?
What was that, Tommy?
He also, he doesn't believe you should get married at 14, but you can take puberty blockers and cut off body.
I'm actually putting words in my mouth, Tommy.
I've been doing it a lot today, and I don't appreciate that.
She's not wrong.
I haven't ever commented.
She's not wrong.
I haven't commented on that.
But it's interesting that you don't want to talk about women here, in your words.
I love a woman talking about that.
I love a bit of...
Let's just change the subject.
I do love a bit of blonde on blonde action, I gotta say.
Esther, Esther, finally to you.
Would you go?
I mean, it's an interesting thing.
I was talking to my mother about this because all of our family pets are buried in our garden, right?
And if one day we ever wanted to sell the house, what about that?
Like, you've got these spirits of these people.
Because you can never sell it.
And I was like, why would anyone even want to own that property?
I don't want to be buried in the body.
But if Elvis is in the garden, a lot of people would want to own that.
No, I don't want to be buried.
No, that's absolutely wrong.
You get the bones.
You get the bones.
You get to reanimate that.
That's something that dog is coming in.
That's digging.
You know what, Francesca?
To quote the famous phrase and to end this debate, don't be cruel.
Okay?
Boom.
Thank you all very much indeed for your time.
It was as animated as I expected.
Well, it's only because you're too young.
You're actually all too young to know that don't be cruel was one of Elvis Presley's biggest hits.
But not too young.
And that makes me sad that I'm the only person on this panel old enough to actually remember anything he ever sang.
I'm sad about that.
I feel very old suddenly.
But anyway, don't be a, you're nothing but a hound dog.
Boom.
Thank you all.
Thank you all very much.
I appreciate it.
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