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Oct. 2, 2023 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
46:58
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Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Breakdown of Legal Consequences 00:15:02
Pizza Morgan Uncensored, knife crime and shoplifting are at epidemic levels.
How do we tackle the deadly breakdown in respect for authority?
Bambies on ice because of Snowflakes, Disney's remake of the cartoon classic, could cut its famous death scene because, you guessed it, it's too triggering for sensitive young modern audiences.
But isn't this exactly the kind of pandering that makes everyone so sensitive in the first place?
We'll discuss.
Thus, the superstar powerlifter April Hutchinson faces been kicked out of her sport because she had the audacity to complain about competing with biological men.
Tonight she's speaking out.
She joins me live.
Live from the news building in London, this is Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Well good evening in London.
Welcome to Piers Morgan Uncensored.
We spend a lot of time in this country wringing our hands about American gun violence.
How can this be happening in 2023?
We ask repeatedly, tragedy after tragedy, why does it seem like nothing ever gets done?
Well guns aren't widely available in Britain, but knives are and we increasingly have a deadly and terrifying recurring problem of our own.
Last week 15 year old Eliane Andam was stabbed to death at a bus stop in Croydon, London.
She was just trying to get to school.
Last week there were two other stabbings in that one tiny corner of London and yes clearly the capital has a specific and serious problem with knife crime.
It's not just London.
A 16 year old boy was stabbed to death in Luton last week.
Five teenagers were wounded in two shocking knife attacks there on the same day.
This weekend there was a triple stabbing in Halifax.
Two young people are dead.
One 21, the other just 19.
Two members stabbed to death in Leeds.
Barely a day passes without more of this bloodshed.
And this is the kind of response we get every time.
My number one priority and I think the keys at night is the safety of Londoners.
So it's not just about policing.
It's not just about stop and search.
That's fantastically important.
It's also about wrapping your arms around the kids and putting them on the right track.
The death of anyone through an act of violence is an appalling tragedy.
I want to say how shocked and saddened I am that three people have lost their lives.
Just words, isn't it?
Just word salad, putting arms around them.
Is that going to stop kids stabbing each other?
It's not, is it?
We all know that.
For all the condolences and the talk of getting tough, the fact is that people who want to hurt us no longer fear the consequences if they do.
Police numbers are down, budgets have been slashed.
They've stopped taking everyday crimes even remotely seriously.
When the Home Secretary announced last month that police must investigate all thefts, it was supposed to be a huge innovation.
My question would be, what the hell were they doing before?
Shoplifting is now out of control in Britain.
Store thefts have more than doubled and they're only getting worse.
In America, it's the same issue.
Emboldened by absurd policies on not prosecuting minor offenders, shoplifting, especially of the steaming variety with dozens and dozens of shoplifters entering a store at one time, has become an epidemic.
It's little wonder that Donald Trump got novation over the weekend for saying this.
And we will immediately stop all of the pillaging and theft.
Very simply, if you rob a store, you can fully expect to be shot as you are leaving that store.
I don't think shooting shoplifters is the right response.
I don't think guns are the right response, but there does need to be a response.
We're dealing with a systematic breakdown of fear and respect of authority at the very same time as a failing economy means desperate people are more willing to risk more.
The result is chaos, fear and tragedy.
It's got to stop.
So the question is how?
Joining me now is my PAC, talk-to-view contributor Esther Kracker, the socialist author Grace Blakely, clinical journalist Avisantina, and from the US perspective, the former wrestler of Fox News star Tyrus.
Well, welcome to all of you.
Tyrus, let me start with you.
What is causing all this?
In America, young people invading stores with total impunity because they know there's no real consequence.
Here, we have an endemic now of knife crime, young kids stabbing each other.
America has obviously ongoing huge gun violence problems.
The common theme in all of them is there is a, in my opinion, a smaller and smaller estimation by the people carrying out all this stuff that there will be any real accountability for it.
Well, and you're brilliant as always, but here's the thing.
We got two things in common.
We have knives in England and we have guns in America, two very different violent weapons.
But what we have in common is we have awful people.
We have horrible parenting.
Grandparents are afraid of their grandchildren.
A complete breakdown of our consequences for our children, which starts at home.
We've got the bulldozer parents in America where if a kid does something at school, they want the teacher fired, not the child punished.
So you can see that when they're growing up, and now you have no consequences.
When they are arrested, they're released in America.
If you steal, I think it's like $500 to $900 American, it's not considered a crime anymore.
So that's the biggest problem is that we have to start realizing it's not the weapons and the utilities they use.
If we took knives away in England, they'd probably use trucks and cars or bats.
It's horrible people.
We have awful people in this first world that we, and they have so many things they can do.
They don't have to work hard for anything, and there's no consequences.
These are first world problems coming back to bite us in countries that are successful because in third world countries and things like that, when you steal, when you do horrible things, there are real consequences.
You steal a lot, you lose a hand in some cases.
So just the idea of that will refrain people.
But right now, our kids across the sea in America basically feel they can do whatever they want, and there's no parenting.
It's horrible parenting.
Right.
All right, Grace, I can see a lot of facial expressions going on there.
There have always been horrible people.
You know, it's very easy to look at this situation and say, oh, it's just because we've suddenly been giving birth to loads more horrible people.
That obviously isn't the case.
If we look at this, you know, just objectively, if we look at the facts, if we look at the statistics, the studies on what causes violent crime, the single biggest predictor across the board of levels of violent crime across time and space is inequality.
Why?
It's not just because people are poorer and they want, you know, to access more stuff.
That is a problem.
It's because in a society that denies, particularly young men, access to advancement, then violent crime becomes something of a status symbol.
This is borne out across sociological studies across time and space.
It becomes, you know, there's an incentive to kind of steal, kill someone to steal their trainers because it becomes a status symbol.
I actually haven't got that reference for advancement for young.
I mean, Tara touched on a point saying that in third world countries, you don't necessarily have this problem because there are actual social consequences, which I think is an important point he touched on.
When I was a kid growing up in Ghana, if you stole something in our neighborhood, it doesn't matter who finds out, whether it's your neighbor or someone else, once your family gets to know, there will be consequences.
Sometimes your neighbor might discipline you.
The issue here is a breakdown of legal and social consequences.
And that's what we're missing.
There has to be ostracization and actual social consequences for stealing, but there also has to be legal penalties, real ones.
I agree.
I mean, I've got to say, I've come around.
I mean, Tara's talked about third world countries.
You look at someone like Singapore or Hong Kong.
I've walked the streets of these places at midnight, right?
You just don't get this kind of stuff there because the penalties, if you do, are severe.
And I keep being told by the wishy-washy brigade, Ava, look, you know, you can't be too tough on these kids.
You've got to be...
Actually, why?
Why don't we just say, right, the next time a young kid is caught with a knife on the street, they get 10 years in prison.
I can tell you, it would soon stop.
And it may sound like I'm morphed into a right-wing heckbanger.
Assure you, most people in this country would share that sentiment.
So, why aren't we doing tougher things like that?
Well, I don't know.
The extreme of your argument is we turn into Saudi Arabia and then we just throw away anyone who might, you know, look like they're committing a crime or then we execute them.
I'm not saying that, I'm talking about people carrying a knife with intent to use it, not for cutting up their channels.
Your point there about 10 years, well, we've got a prison system at the moment that doesn't work, it doesn't rehabilitate people.
And at the moment, we are turfing people out.
Sorry, we're throwing them into prison and they're coming up the other side and they are not rehabilitating.
They are going back to commit more crime.
How are you going to stop the kids stabbing people?
I think it goes back to what Grace is.
I think it's a social issue.
I think that we've got to really tackle inequality.
You know, we've got to look at this long term rather than thinking, what's the short-term solution, throw everyone like, you know, lock everyone up and throw away the key.
Hang on, hang on.
Okay, hang on.
I'll come to a question.
Before we look, inequality seems to me, with great respect, one of those vacuous generic terms, like a sort of catch-all excuse for what is going on here.
I know lots of kids who come from poor backgrounds who do not go around stabbing people because their parents, and this can apply, by the way, to lower class people, to middle-class people, to so-called upper-class people.
I went to a fee-paying school until I was 13, then state comprehensive school.
I've seen all manner of people, right?
And parents.
The common theme of kids that behaved well, or at least felt shame and accountability if they were caught doing bad things, was strong parenting.
Teachers, yes, and authority, yes, but actually strong parenting.
I've just explained to you the mechanism through which inequality affects violent crime.
It's not about equality.
You can say, for example, you know, not everyone, not every kid who's been in institutional care is going to end up on the streets.
But we know, statistically speaking, that children who've been in institutional care are much more likely to end up on the streets.
What I'm saying is there is a clear and causal link between the things that happen to you as a child that accounts for things like whether or not you're in a strong community, whether or not you're in a strong family, but also what happens to you.
I would say things like successive governments, Labour and Conservatives selling off playing fields by the dozen.
Absolutely.
Cutting back on sport, cutting back.
I did a documentary on hoodies, right?
Kids that wear hoodies and commit a lot of crime.
And a lot of these kids, when I interviewed them, said, well, there are no youth clubs anymore, right?
They just shut them all down.
Totally.
So there's nothing else to do.
They get bored.
So it's also the internet, isn't it?
Like, I don't want to sound like some sort of draconian figure, but you know, it is the rise of social media.
And if you are in an algorithm and you're on TikTok or Instagram that is promoting violence to you, you do sit in an echo channel.
Let me bring in Tara.
You've been listening to this, Tara.
So I think you want to add some more on this.
Hey, let me just say that.
Let me say this again.
She has absolutely no idea what she's talking about with all due respect.
Which one?
Because it could have been one of you.
I think you're talking about me.
You've got to narrow it down here.
The feeling's neutral.
It's the community.
That's what has broken down.
They're spoiled.
Everyone spends all their time on social media and Facebooks and they say, oh, it's inequality.
I grew up in Lynn, Massachusetts, ghetto slum, USA.
But you know what?
We had strong families and parents and we're poor, but we didn't act poor.
We worked hard, we paid our dues, and we got things together.
Now, everyone makes excuses.
If your kid's bad, he's not a bad child.
You're not a bad parent.
He has something wrong with him that you can't correct.
So it has nothing to do with inequality.
That's just a good answer from first world virtue signaling elites to say, because you can't fix that.
Everyone's going to be able to do that.
I'm going to say that's probably a load of work.
I'm going to say, Tara, probably long overdue that Grace Blake was not.
That band had some form of inequality.
It's ridiculous.
I agree with you.
And it's high time.
It's being raised by lazy people.
I agree.
It's high time Grace Blakey was called a first world elite as well.
I've been waiting for that taunt.
Look, I agree with Tara.
It's so easy.
Simply saying it's inequality.
It's so much easier to say, lock them up, throw away the queen.
Look how tough I am in my society.
Cut your hand if you change.
That should be easy and exciting.
How do you explain?
I'm changing it.
How do you explain, if it's all about inequality, that so many people who have very little in life in this country do not commit these crimes?
Because it is about a whole set of factors that determine, you know, the way in which you were raised and then the kind of characteristic you have in your group.
Look, again, it's the same thing.
It's what I just said.
You know that children who grew up in institutional care are much more likely to then go out onto the streets, end up on the streets, end up homeless, end up taking drugs, end up interacting with the criminal justice system.
That isn't to say that every kid who has a, you know, who is in institutional care is going to end up that way.
But we know that if you don't experience that, community supports, the biggest point here is culture, because I can paint two different pictures here.
If we look at the black community in the UK, you actually look at the sort of the rates of criminality amongst black African children compared to black Caribbean children, and there's a huge disparity.
And one of the biggest reasons is because of culture, because some kids in one particular group grow up with church-going families with strong values.
You know, if you go and carry a knife around and your Nigerian mother finds you, you will probably get slapped across the face.
And you have the other side of the spectrum that don't actually have that.
And you can see huge disparities there.
So it actually comes down to culture.
I don't disagree with you, but the question is, how do we then build supportive cultures?
You are evil.
You have to actually build that thing in communities.
I agree.
We've just said the same thing.
But you have to penalize criminality in a very severe way.
There is no reason why someone should be able to carry a knife around.
But what happens when they get a slap on prisoners?
What's happening when they come out the other side and they find themselves homeless and they don't have any money?
They're not going to carry around a knife then, aren't they?
No, but you are going to commit another crime.
I mean, in the US, you can get literally shot or asphyxiated just for failing to vote for police cars.
You can.
You know what worries me about the knife crime?
It's getting worse here and they're acting with more impunity and more kids are carrying knives.
So at some point, we've got as a society, yes, we can lecture the Americans about their gun violence, and I've done that many times.
And it's not gun violence, it's police violence.
I think it's nuts they don't do more.
I also think it's nuts we don't do more about knife violence here.
I mean, look, the Americans literally give police forces so much money.
They give them like assault rifles, these massive weapons, you know, weapons that are used in literal states of war, and yet that isn't solving the problem.
But they're not.
All right, let's move on to another act of uncontrollable violence.
So Bambi is being redone.
And it's after the break, apparently.
We're going to talk about Bambi and why the death scene, Bambi's mum cops it, is now being written out because you guessed it, people are going to get triggered.
Little sensitive snowface can't deal with an actual death.
God help them.
What would they do in the real world when people actually die for real?
Anyway, we'll debate that after the break.
Why Bambi's Death Scene Was Cut 00:14:50
We're joined again by Jordan Peterson.
I get a sense of somebody quite angry with the state of the world.
I'm absolutely appalled that the globalist utopian elitists would sacrifice the poor to save the planet.
This war on the patriarchy.
What are your thoughts on that?
Females who are anti-social use reputation savaging, bullying and exclusion to gain their narcissistic pathway forward.
How do you feel about that influence that you have?
You better be careful.
We're coming for your children there, buddy.
Let's just get it on the table.
Do you believe in God?
I don't think that's anybody's business.
For some reason, you're reluctant to say.
It's too complicated an issue to be dealt with like that.
Now, you did it again.
You got me again.
God.
What could be worse than dying?
Being a prison guard at Auschwitz.
How much sex is optimum?
Depends on how the date goes, man.
You should know that.
This is so interesting.
Maybe it's worth sticking around for and trudging through the misery just to see how it ends.
Welcome back to Petersburg and I said, So that is a brilliant interview with Jordan Peterson.
It was a year ago.
I first interviewed him, but it airs tomorrow night and Wednesday night.
It's a double header.
The first half is me and Jordan one-on-one.
You just saw some of the clips from that.
It's fantastic.
with the most brilliant mind really and fascinating mind and a challenging mind.
So whatever you think of him, tune in and you'll be surprised.
And then his daughter joins.
She's become a huge star as well, Michaela.
And part two on Wednesday night will be the two of them together.
And what's really interesting about that is the way they interact with each other.
So a two-parter, the Petersons, two of the most famous and influential people in the world right now.
And on Thursday, another surprise, and we'll tease that a little later in the program.
Well, Disney's Bambi is latest victim of the woke war on culture, a screenwriter hired to remake the classics, says the movie's most famous scene in which Bambi's mother sadly dies could be scrapped as this triggering for modern day parents and their children.
She elaborated in this interview with Kaleido.
What's interesting about Bambi to me is it absolutely is a classic.
It's such a gorgeous film.
It's a little bit different tempo than I think modern audiences are used to.
And I also think there's a treatment of the, not to spoil the plot, but there's a treatment of the mom dying that I think some kids, some parents these days are more sensitive about than they were in the past.
And I think that's one of the reasons that they haven't shown it to their children.
But our take on it was, did give a little bit more of a scope to it.
And I just think that to be able to bring it to life for kids these days in a way that maybe they relate to a little bit more would be of service to the original.
How's she going to feel when I order venison for my dinner tonight?
Children are facing an epidemic of anxiety, apparently.
Maybe because we feel the need to protect them so ridiculously much all the time.
Now from Bambi to discuss this, I'm joined by our kick host Tommy Lennon, the author of the case for cancel culture, Ernest Owens.
Well, welcome to both of you from across the pond.
All right, Ernest, you've defended the indefensible a few times on this program, but come on.
For goodness sake, we're going to try and airbrush the reality of Bambi's mom getting slotted.
What's the matter with you?
Well, there's nothing wrong with me.
I think that the reality is that as society evolves, we should also think about, you know, the impact.
You know, we are in a different type of world now.
You know, there's a lot of violence on TV.
There's a lot of grotesqueness.
And I think that this classic film should be seen with a different perspective for kids.
I think that the death scene isn't necessarily the thing that they should be fixated on.
I think there's something to be said about how children deal with death and death scenes compared to adults like you and I.
And I think that this is a very smart move.
I think it's a move that is considerate.
I think that it shows progress.
And I think, to be honest, I think some parents would rather have that conversation with their children in the privacy of their home rather than having these films.
You know, kind of traumatized.
Ernest, what's next?
You're going to remake Jewels and make sure this shark doesn't eat anyone?
In case someone's triggered and can't go swimming?
It's nuts.
Tommy, this is just nuts, isn't it?
It's nuts.
And I would also like to say, I wish they would stop remaking Disney classics.
We talked about this, I think, a couple months back, this remake, the Snow White, they have to make it for woke audiences.
Does Disney really not have any other ideas?
Can they not come up with anything new that they have to remake all the classics?
So that's my first point on it.
And second of all, I believe in protecting children.
I just find it quite interesting that the same woke liberals that are worried about this hunting scene in Bambi have no problem exposing children to gay porn and LGBTQ themes, telling them that they are born in the wrong body, encouraging them to be non-binary.
I mean, really, I'm waiting for this Bambi remake to have Bambi as a trans deer or maybe the mother died from climate change.
So again, the things that the left and the liberals are triggered by always astounds me.
I think that there are far worse things you can expose children to that the left is exposing children to than a hunting scene that's actually a reality of life, especially here in the United States with a lot of hunters, love it or hate it.
That is a fact of where we are in this country and I think in many places around the world.
Do you know what, Ernest?
I think you've been persuaded by that argument.
I can see you nodding away furiously.
I think this is ridiculously homophobic and transphobic.
I think for starters, I'm gay and me being here talking isn't exposing children to anything.
But if I was to pull out a gun as a hunter and shoot a deer for kids to see, I think that's going to cause more harm to a child than just me just basically existing.
Ernest.
I think it's ridiculous to make that conflation between gay porn to a deer being killed when in reality, no one is actually promoting gay porn.
No one from the left is encouraging that for children.
And to conflate those things in that way is intellectually dishonest and immature and problematic.
Ernest, we literally had Snow White and the Seven Dwarves redone recently and they airbrushed all the dwarves out of the movie.
Right?
Because apparently they want to be inclusive.
The people they didn't include were the actual dwarves who then now are out of work.
This is what it's like.
You know what you could do?
You could, rather than whining about new things, you can just go and stay stuck in 1939 and watch the Disney animated film with the business.
I would love to.
You could do that.
I would love to.
And other people can watch and other people can.
I would love to.
And then I can watch my Disney films.
But Ernest, then I can watch my Disney films without people like you ruining them.
Right?
And trying to pretend that some kids can't watch.
Can't watch Bambi's mom being killed.
Piers, I hear that.
Piers, I miss the old Piers Morgan.
I used to interview Beyonce and hang out with the liberals in Hollywood and be nice.
But now I have this new Pierce when it's unleashed.
And guess what?
There's value in both for some people.
No, I'm one of them.
I'm one Ernest.
I'm one of these ostracized liberals where I used to think I was liberal, and then the woke left came along.
And I realized, actually, by their yardstick, I'm right of Attila the Hun.
Because I think everything they do wrecks society.
I really do.
And when you go back and remake a Disney classic and you presume that kids can't deal with the death of a deer, you're probably not a dead death.
I think you've all gone mad.
But Piers, you're...
No, Piers, you're proving my point.
Things evolve, right?
And so there's a new version of you that you think has evolved.
And this creator who's creating the Bambi film thinks this can evolve.
And there's going to be people that say, I miss the old show.
Ernest, you're missing the point.
I don't want the old show, the CNA days.
No, I think that's the point.
We can let two things exist.
Just to be clear, I haven't evolved at all.
I'm exactly the same as I always was.
It's just the people I used to agree with have broadly gone mad.
Tommy, the problem with this is it's a real slippery slope, I think.
Once you start going after every classic, it's a bit like every historical figure.
They're all flawed.
There's no American president in history who won't be cancelled by this yardstick.
There's no founding father that won't be cancelled.
There is no film that won'tce.
They're dead.
Hang on, Ernest.
They're dead.
Hang on, Ernest.
This is the fictional film.
It doesn't matter.
Bambi's mother's dead, Ernest.
Wake up.
Tommy.
Tommy, this is for Tommy.
They're dead.
This is for Tommy.
I know they're dead.
So is Bambi's mum.
And she should stay dead.
Every time you watch the movie, Tommy.
I also think, I also.
Tommy.
I think that there are more problematic things to have to explain to children besides the death of animals.
I think that that is the circle of life.
I think we learned that in The Lion King.
We learned that from a lot of Disney classics.
But, you know, in the last segment, you were talking about the looting and the rioting and the shoplifting.
Kids are exposed to that every single day, certainly in the United States.
And I don't hear liberals worried about them being exposed to that.
They call that justice, right?
But they're worried about a scene in which Bambi's mom dies.
I mean, the priorities, again, to me, are so astounding.
Yeah, I completely agree.
Ernest Rawson.
The reach is to me outstanding.
The reach.
The reach.
You're conflating looters to people who don't want a Bambi scene.
Like, this is a reach.
You should be stressed.
Let's leave it on a reach.
Ernest, always good to catch up with you.
Tommy, great to see you too.
Thank you both very much indeed.
All right.
You were sort of convulsing the three of you about this debate.
But Ava, at the heart of this debate lies my basic belief that we are covering our kids in so much cotton wool, they are woefully ill-prepared for the real world.
And I'll explain why.
When we brought in participation prizes for Sports Day, right?
All that means is kids do not learn what losing involves, what not winning involves.
You don't get participation prizes in the real world.
You win, you lose, you lose a job, you get a job, whatever.
There's no reality to this.
Now all the films are being sanitized because apparently kids can't deal with these.
I'm fine.
I watched all these films.
It didn't turn me into some corrupted mass murderer or make me flake out.
It just, it was a film that had that sad moment.
And your heart goes like that when you watch it.
What's wrong with allowing kids to watch the reality?
Well, I don't agree with your first bit because we actually do have participation prizes in life.
And that is just, you know, not being pets not being number one.
At not all times are you number one.
I can tell you in this game you don't.
In the media you don't.
No one gives you a prize for coming eighth.
Well, last.
Maybe I would like one.
No, no.
But the British press awards, for example, no newspaper gets an award for coming last.
But can I say on your second point there, you know, we actually already did soften these fairy tales.
You know, these all originate from Grimm's fairy tales.
I like Grimmsyn.
But hang on, but you look at The Little Mermaid, and that was Hans Christian Anderson.
And it was a really gruesome tale.
You know, we already did soften them down.
I like gruesome tales.
Yeah, but we already did soften them down.
So now when we're talking about it.
My daughter, look, Grace, my daughter's nearly 12.
She writes like really quite full-on gruesome stuff, right?
And it's fascinating.
You've got a very creative mind, very Febri mind, very all over the place.
But she writes really riveting things.
But it's often based on fantastical stuff, right?
This is what we all grew up with.
I just want to say, why are we trying to pretend the real world is at Disney is a marketing genius?
Because they are in the news every week, every month.
We've remade this show and the character is a different race, or we're cutting this scene, and it's going to really annoy Piers Morgan.
And it's going to be all over his show for weeks and weeks and weeks and weeks.
And even though he hates it, Piers Morgan is going to go to the cinema and he's going to watch that film.
And everyone who watches his show is going to watch that show.
It's going to know that Batman's coming out again.
Look, and it's going to make us tons and tons of tons.
If I can't watch Bambi's mother being killed, I'm not going to watch it.
A horror story.
Look, I wasn't a fan of like Snow Beige and the seven genderless widgets or whatever it turned out to be.
But, but, but, but I do think the overarching point is make new stories for the love of God.
Stop remaking them and just making them, you know, yellow and green and having some one-legged Chinese trans person or whatever.
Just make new stories.
And it's interesting to me.
But Ernest was convinced that I have evolved to a new place on this stuff, right?
I haven't.
I'm exactly the same person I've always been.
But the sort of the world that I thought the liberal world was about has changed so dramatically.
This woke stuff is completely mad most of the time.
I don't agree.
I don't think you would have read your children, The Grimm's fairy tales.
Yes, of course I would.
You would have gone for the nice softener.
Of course I would.
You would have gone for the knife because you'd like the soft version of the business.
And my kids, if we play sport, we play to win, right?
I've never given them an inch.
Now, the older ones beat me.
Okay, good.
So they've learned the joy of beating their dad because I didn't let them ever win when they were kids.
I'd rather beat them 10-0 and let them win or score a goal.
I mean, part of the problem with what we were discussing before, this whole knife crime epidemic, is actually we do have this society that consistently tells people they're either winners or losers based on how much money they earn, based on whether or not they have a good car.
And there are the same people who end up consistently on top as winners, the same people who end up consistently on top as losers.
And the people who feel like they are losers because there are no paths for them to change their lives or to change anything about themselves end up basically taking their revenge either on themselves or on the rest of society.
That is what you have when you have a society that is structured basically by telling people you're worth something and you're not worried about it.
So in your world, everyone's a winner.
Even if they're lazy, work shy, don't put the shift in, they're still winning.
No, my world is a world in which people are different and cannot be compared by weird little league tables that tell you if you have more money, then you're a better person.
I think money has got anything to do with it.
But it does.
You know, we live in an incredibly material.
There are, for example, there are brilliant nurses where money is not worth it.
And they get paid nothing because we don't value them.
Money tells them that what they're doing isn't worth it.
Money is not a comparative thing in the hospitals.
It's about how good you are as a woman.
Why do you think people like Andrew Tate are up there being like, oh, I have loads of guns and loads of Range Rovers and loads of women, that makes me a good man?
Andrew Tate has become hugely popular with young men because he is out there.
You have status anxiety.
He is out there, for better or worse, and I think there are equal doses of both of him.
For better or worse, he is a voice defending young men when actually every other voice out at the moment attacks.
Andrew Tate is a voice speaking to men with status anxiety, telling them, society tells you you're a loser because you can't get a job and you don't have any money.
Buy a load of guns, abuse women, get a Range Rover, and then you'll be worth something.
And that's so dumb.
All right.
Like, that's not how you create good men.
I don't need the participation medal.
That's just what I mean.
I think they'll need it, you know.
You're not going to get one, either.
I think there's a lot of inequality in society.
I think there'll always be winners and losers, and I think it's the way we handle it.
To say that actually we need a society that doesn't have winners or losers is not that we need a society that don't have winners or losers.
The Unfairness of Trans Athlete Policies 00:09:51
It's not likely the case.
Unfortunately, I now win because I get to stay on the show.
You three lose because you're being removed.
And yet you'll invite us back anyway.
Exactly.
Against my better judgment, yes, I will.
Lovely to see you all.
And says the next powerlifter, April Hutchinson, faces losing her career for speaking out on trans competitors in women's sport, powerlifting.
She's live in the studio next.
Will I get a better interview roughing you up a bit?
Will I get the real Zlatan then?
You want to play with fire?
I will bring you fire, but I will burn you.
When I say I am God, you think I'm joking or not?
You tell me.
I'm not joking.
I can see you playing a Bond villain.
I will smash James Bond.
I'm very expensive.
I don't work for free.
Pep Guardiola, you called him a coward with no balls.
You said when you buy me, you're buying a Ferrari.
I bring my f ⁇ ing Ferrari.
When you score a goal, is it better than sex?
Sex is better.
Whoever thinks different, he has a problem with his sex.
He should get help.
Why have you never asked your partner, Elena, to marry you?
I have.
Amina Riola, who died last year.
It was a big loss because he was not only agent for me.
He was everything.
I still miss him.
We're all missing.
There's only one thing you got wrong.
I didn't go to Arsenal.
I don't do trials.
No, no, you don't understand.
I don't do trials.
I'm the best.
His own stands for f the rest.
Talk about it, too.
One says that is an unmissable exclusive interview.
Zlatan Ibrahimovich, one of the most charismatic and best strikers that football has ever seen, retired several months ago.
This is his first big interview since then.
Two hours together, and we'll run the highlights of that in a special on Thursday night, and then the whole thing will be available after that.
It is a riveting watch.
What a character.
Well, a week ago, I interviewed two former angling stars who quit the England women's team over a transgender teammate they thought had an unfair advantage.
The sports international governing body has now ruled that male-born competitors cannot take on women because their physical power gives them an unfair advantage.
So, some common sense, again, prevailing in the world of women's sport.
But the fight continues in many other women's sports.
Canadian powerlifter April Hutchinson has taken a stand against trans women in her sport, facing a backlash for doing so.
Well, now a video has emerged of her rival, Anne Andrews, a male-to-female trans athlete who holds the women's record in Canada, appearing to mock women for being weak.
Why is women's bench so bad?
I mean, not compared to me.
We all know that I'm a tranny freak, so that doesn't count.
And no, we're not talking about Mackenzie Lee.
She's got little T-Rex arms and she's like 400 pounds of chest muscle, apparently.
I mean, standard bench in powerlifting competition for women.
I literally don't understand why it's so bad.
Well, Team Canada powerlifter April Hutchinson joins me now.
Well, welcome to Piers Women Says.
Thank you for coming to the studio.
Anne Andrews, who is a biological male who's transgendered, currently holds four of the five provincial records, the highest deadlift of all ages in Canada.
If Anne Andrews competed with males, then she would place around 6,000.
There, right there, is the inequality, the unfairness that we're seeing in many sports, but particularly a sport like yours.
Yeah, so you have powerlifting, which is a pure strength sport.
Males have an advantage of 60 to 70% advantage over females.
You hear Anne talking about the bench press.
Why is bench press so weak for females?
We're not designed for bench press.
We don't have the right muscle mass for a bench press.
So therefore, we will be weaker.
When you hear her mocking really the whole situation, how does that make you feel?
I mean, the whole thing is disgusting.
It's disgraceful.
It's disheartening.
It's even more disheartening that the Federation allows this to happen.
I am the one being punished for speaking truth, yet he can mock females and say, you know, call me a bigot, incite hate, and nothing's being done about that.
But I'm the one being silenced by my federation.
What is going to happen to you?
Well, most recently, I've been threatened with suspension.
Two weeks ago, I received a letter from my federation stating that you cannot call Anne a biological male.
That goes against the code of ethics, you know, because in their policy, they do ask that we use pronouns.
They don't force you to, but they ask.
Also, but she is a biological male.
I mean, I'm perfectly prepared to call her Anne, her name that she preferred to be called, that's fine.
But she's a biological male, a transgender athlete, who's now destroying female competitors in women's sport.
I mean, to me, again, but particularly in this powerlifting, it's so obvious that if someone would come 6,000 competing against men, but is winning against women, there's the problem.
Exactly.
Now, just recently, the Strongman Corporation in Canada, we spoke out against they had a transgender athlete.
They actually changed their policy to create a separate category.
Right.
So simple.
And that's all we've been asking is for a separate category.
To me, it's very simple.
What should happen is you either compete against your biological sex.
So if you're a trans woman, you would compete against biological males, as most of them have done before in sport, massively less successfully, it should be noted.
Or you have a completely new category.
Easy peasy.
Yeah, you think it'd be that easy.
Yes, because there are far more people now identifying as men or women, different to their biological sex, these categories would be quite well, I would imagine, well stocked with people, right?
There'd be lots of people wanting to do it.
No, exactly.
Well, my federation actually, I think they've gone rogue.
They've done their own thing.
They've created an inclusion policy.
So you could identify as a female tomorrow, Pierce, take all the records, crush it in the women's category, and then go back to being a man the next day.
I mean, that's something Martina Vatilova said very early on.
And she was accused of being a bigot.
One of the biggest LGBTQ advocates probably ever in sport.
She was accused of being bigoted.
And this is the sort of go, this is the sort of, I don't know what you would call it, but it's the instant reaction.
Every time anyone in your position or Martina or whatever, they raise a concern about this obvious unfairness.
I would call it cheating.
I mean, just it's cheating.
To me, it has the same effect as doping, right, in the sense it gives somebody an unfair advantage.
We all know this, but people like you brave enough to put your head over the parapet, you get shot down and called bigoted, transphobic, and so on.
Well, exactly.
I mean, I've been called that word I don't know how many times now.
It's not transphobic to ask for fairness in women's sports.
It's a word they use to silence you.
Well, I'm not going to be silent.
Do you have any problem with transgender people?
No, not at all.
Not at all.
I have a problem with transgender athletes going into women's sports or aka biological men, taking women's podium spots, sponsors.
And you never see it the other way around with trans men.
Exactly, never.
It doesn't happen because trans men actually have an inferior disadvantage when they compete against biological men.
Obviously, because they're biological females.
So there's a reason, I always say there's a reason the Olympics, you split the genders up.
If you didn't, if you made it gender neutral, the next Olympics, women would win about two gold medals if they were lucky in the entire tournament.
Well, there's a reason why there's categories.
I'm in the masters, so I compete between 40 and 50 years old.
There's people from 50 to 60, there's juniors.
Like I could identify as a junior tomorrow and go crush the junior.
Right.
Exactly.
And if you had to compete in your category of 40 to 50 masters against only biological males who identified now as women but have competed in powerlifting in that category, how would you get on?
Oh, well, I think it answers for itself, not well.
I mean, you wouldn't win anything, right?
No, nothing.
So your chances of being able to be successful in your sport are massively eroded simply because people with an unfair physical advantage have come along and decided they want to be you.
Exactly.
And this particular person, and I mean, he's taken records that basically people that have been trained for 10 years haven't even touched a number.
Like a deadlift of 573 pounds is unheard of, especially by a 40-year-old.
Are you going to sue the Federation?
Well, I do have an attorney that's in the works right now.
I do have to respond to their letter of disciplinary, but it is in the works, yes.
And I'm actually raising money right now for legal fees to pay the lawyers.
I think it is ridiculous that people like you are put through this hell for spelling out the bleeding obvious.
I do think it's ridiculous.
And we keep hammering this on this program because I think most right-minded people know how ridiculous it is and how unfair it is.
But thank you for coming in.
I wish you good luck.
And we will keep hammering this drum until common sense prevails in every sport.
Yes, for sure.
And I just want to give you this as a gift because it is Women's History Month in Canada.
So I made this shirt for you.
Keep female sports female.
Let's make this global as well.
You know what?
I will happily endorse that t-shirt because they should be.
And women's rights to fairness and equality should trump stupid allegations of being transphobic.
I've no problem with any trans people.
I wish them all the very best.
I want them to have fairness and equality in their lives.
Absolutely.
But not when it erodes women's rights to fairness and equality.
That is just unfair and unequal.
Thanks for coming in.
Tupac Interviews and Conspiracy Theories 00:07:14
And says the next, the unsolved murder of Tupac Shakur has been the subject of speculation for nearly 30 years.
Police have at last arrested and charged a man for the shooting in Las Vegas in 1996.
Next, I speak to DJ Vlad, a man who may have helped uncover the truth by interviewing the suspect.
Welcome back to Piers Bookman Sensors.
It was a question that gripped the world: who killed Tupac Jakur, the 25-year-old rapper, considered one of the most influential artists of all time, was gunned down in Las Vegas in 1996.
Well, on Friday, Duane Keith D. Davis was indicted on one count of murder with a deadly weapon in relation to the killing.
DJ Vlad, a major commentator in the hip-hop industry for years, admitted that the police in Las Vegas asked him to help their investigation after he interviewed Keefe Dee for his own show.
And DJ Vladimir pulled out a gun.
It looked like he was reaching, yeah.
Yeah, it did.
Okay.
Yeah.
Did you actually see a gun?
Oh, shit.
Once you got the reaching, I got the document.
So someone from your car started shooting at Tupac and Shook.
So Orlando Shaku.
I was very cross, Dre.
He leaned over on the window, we rode out of the window, popped him.
It was drawing on my side.
I would have popped him.
You know what I'm saying?
But he was on the other side.
Right.
Well, DJ Vlad joins me now.
DJ, thank you very much indeed for joining the show.
Absolutely.
Thank you for having me.
I know you've studied this case for so long.
And these interviews that you did with Keefe D, they've turned out to be extremely significant in this investigation, leading, in fact, to him being arrested and indicted.
When you heard that news, how did you feel?
Well, I mean, the goal wasn't really to get anyone arrested.
It was really just to get the truth of the matter.
The story about Orlando Anderson killing Tupac, I've known since around 2007.
So this was essentially the worst-kept secret in LA.
Everyone knew about it, but there were no arrests, there was no convictions, there was no anything, there was no actual proof.
So there was a lot of conspiracy theories around it.
So around 2008, when I first heard the Keefe confession tapes that Greg Caden got, you know, then I found out there was a book that was about to come out.
I got a hold of Keefe Dee and his co-writer, and we scheduled an interview and we just went from there.
I mean, he appears to have incriminated himself in this interview, certainly the last one.
Did you believe he was doing that as you interviewed him?
Well, I think that he believed that he had a level of immunity when he did the proffer agreement.
I also, I think at the time, he was saying that he had cancer, so maybe he didn't think he had much time to live.
So he was just kind of letting it loose at that point.
But, you know, it was a little bit crazy that he actually sat down and we did everything.
And when I asked him about it, sometimes he would try to dodge certain questions, but ultimately I used the book as a blueprint.
So whenever a question wouldn't get answered, I said, well, the book said X, Y, and Z.
And then at that point, he kind of went along with what was written in the book.
It's been reported that you have resisted efforts by the police to hand over all the unedited tapes.
Is that true?
And if so, why?
Yeah, it's true.
I mean, ultimately, people that we have on our show, We don't turn around and cooperate against those same people with the police.
For me, just in terms of business-wise and my ethics and so forth, I just feel there's something wrong.
So when Las Vegas police reached out to me multiple times, I just never responded.
I think what they did ultimately want was the raw footage.
That was an email that they sent after a couple of phone calls went unanswered.
Ultimately, if you know the style of our footage, everything that we film gets released.
So I think there's a little bit of a barking up the wrong tree situation.
But maybe they thought there was a gotcha on there in the footage that was unreleased, which I'm not aware of it since everything did get released.
But ultimately, we don't cooperate with the police.
And, you know, we've had situations where police have tried to get footage from us, and we've had our lawyers step in and actually block it.
Are you concerned?
I mean, I've done many interviews, including crime interviews actually over the years.
There's always a certain element of concern as an interviewer when you stray into that kind of territory about repercussions from people involved.
I mean, given there's now been an indictment here, are you worried about repercussions against you?
I don't worry about doing my job.
I've been doing Vlad TV for 15 years now.
We've covered a lot of very serious issues.
We've interviewed like mass murderers like Sammy the Bull and so forth.
So I don't really worry when it comes to doing my job.
My job supersedes any level of concern or fear or anything else like that.
And ultimately, you know, if I ever feel there is a situation where there might be some danger, I always move with armed security.
You're famously a very big fan of Tupacs, as of course millions of people were.
And it remained one of the great mysteries about this.
If it turns out that your interviews have helped lead to solving this mystery, will you feel a sense of closure for Tupac and his family?
Well, I mean, for me, the closure came four years ago when I did the interview.
There was a lot of conspiracy theories when it comes to Tupac.
There was that, you know, Shug had him set up.
There was the government did it.
There was the first responder had a body that he switched.
Tupac is living in Cuba somewhere.
There's a lot of crazy theories out there.
So for me, when I did the interview four years ago and we went through the entire story, really Keefe D's entire life story, but really leading up to what happened from Orlando getting jumped at the mall to the next few steps to them going to Vegas to what happened during the fight to what happened afterwards.
That essentially told the story.
I've been saying for years that I saw the Tupac murder.
When it comes to the family, I've had various family members reach out through people to say they're very happy about it.
But the thing about it is, I know people that were very close to Tupac's mother, Feeni Shakur, and they all told me that while she was alive, she did not care about the police solving this case.
The Shakura family had a very, you know, bad relationship with the police.
We've run out of time.
I'm really sorry.
I'd love to have done more on this.
Thank you very much for a great interview.
I've been following you for a long time, and you're great at what you do.
And I congratulate you on this.
Thank you very much indeed.
Mr. Guy, whatever you're up to.
You've uncensored.
Good night.
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