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June 28, 2023 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
47:03
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Why Ordinary People Protest 00:08:40
I'm Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Tonight, just up oil fanatics target the first Ashes test at Lourdes, only to be hit for six by England's Johnny Birstow.
Piers Morgan uncensored at an eyewitness report at the scene of a drama, me.
And tonight I'll ask a couple of ecozalots, sort of the hell they're playing at.
Presidential candidate Larry Elder says he's a black Donald Trump without the controversy.
But he's got some pretty controversial views of his own, which I'll put to him when he joins me live.
Bust the legendary New York pizza slice faces extinction in a crackdown on wood-fired ovens that's got even Elon Musk fuming.
Can the pizza bang clear the smog in the big smoke?
Or should they just forget about it?
Live from the news building in London, this is Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Good evening from London.
Welcome to Piers Morgan Uncensored.
I was at Lourdes Cricket Ground today, the home of cricket, the finest stadium for any sport in the world with the longest and finest history.
And I was there to witness a masterclass.
England's Johnny Birstow displayed his poise, his strength, his discipline and dexterity in a world-class performance that thrilled supporters from both sides and won plaudits across the globe.
And for those viewing in the United States, worried at this stage this show may all be about cricket, you might be relieved to know it had nothing to do with the actual game.
Someone invaded the pitch.
Terry Alderman did his shoulder in.
Bestow just waving into the dressing room.
Maybe it's his gear.
Tremendous stuff.
Johnny then turfed him over the railing at the end like a piece of rubbish, which is exactly what he should have done.
Well, three just up oil protesters rushed the pitch, dead set on ruining the test match that they've, as they've ruined so many other national events in the last year or so.
They were arrested.
Groundsman scrubbed their orange powder, which fortunately wasn't put on the pitch itself, or it could have wrecked the play for the entire day.
So play was able to resume after just 20 minutes.
Anyone who knows a cricket will tell you that a spot of light drizzle in a neighbouring village could suspend a test match longer than that.
So the joke in the end was on them.
But what's most impressive about this spectacle is that in one fell swoop, Johnny Birstow, triumph where countless police officers and irritated bystanders have failed.
Let's take a look at an action replay.
On come the protesters with their orange powder and their t-shirts, determined to wreck things.
But no, there's no stop the oil.
There's just this.
Lift and shift.
The Indian wicketkeeper ferrying off the protester pathetically like he's an ironing board and dumping him like a garbage sack to use the American vernacular when he gets to the end.
I was there cheering on Johnny Birstow and indeed the England captain Ben Stokes who also apprehended one of the protesters and some of the Australian players did too.
There was a general feeling in the ground I have to say from every player and every spectator.
We're just done with these clowns.
We're done with them.
They are spoilt little brats, attention seeking.
Nobody cares anymore about the message because they were listening.
We've all just grown not just weary but angry at the just stop oil protesters constantly causing chaos for chaos's sake, wrecking things that the rest of us enjoy or just going about our normal lives.
They've blocked roads.
They've thrown soup over priceless artworks.
They've trashed the Chelsea Flower Show.
They've bolted themselves to the goalpost at a Premier League football match.
They've wrecked the World Snooker Championship.
We've all seen this stuff and just put up with it because it's the British way isn't it?
Just let these people do this because they're protesters.
But the solution was staring us in the face all along.
It was Johnny Bestow.
And the serious point here is that these protests have now become completely self-defeating.
Many people back the principle of their cause, but not one single person at Laws Today or at any of the things that they've been doing this stuff at have turned around afterwards and gone, you know what?
They've really got a point, these people, and I must join their protest.
After seeing them throw paint on the picture of the test match, I'm not racing to be behind Just Stop Oil.
I'm racing to loathe and detest them for wrecking a day that I love.
Even one of this movement's founding fathers has now come around to my way of thinking about this.
Trevor Nielsen has spent a fortune funding climate action groups like Just Stop Oil.
Now, in an interview at the weekend, he said this, it's disruption for the sake of disruption.
Working people that are trying to get to their job, get their kid dropped off of school, survive a brutal cost of living crisis in the UK.
Having a pink-head tattooed and pierced protester standing in front of their car so that their kid is late for their test that day, that doesn't encourage them to join the movement.
It's just performative.
It's not accomplishing anything.
I absolutely believe it's now become counterproductive.
That's the guy who's been helping to fund Just Stop Oil, saying exactly what I and many others have been saying.
Just Stop Oil should change their main to stop being utter prats.
Well, joining me now as environmental campaigner Donica McCarthy, Just Stop Oil spokesperson Chloe Naldret and the former England test cricket legend Sir Jeffrey Boycott.
So welcome to all of you.
Well let me start with Chloe Naldret.
Chloe, even the people who are funding you, even the millionaires behind a lot of this stuff, they're sick of it.
They're sick of the performative stuff, the attention seeking, the wrecking of stuff that other people enjoy.
They recognise none of it is turning anyone's opinion.
They're as sick of it as I am.
Why do you all keep doing this?
Well, thanks for having me on today, Piers.
What you've just done, beautiful summary of the actions that we've been doing over the last year, of course, has looked a lot at how we protest, but you haven't mentioned a word about why.
Why is it that a bunch of really ordinary, community-minded, law-abiding people are taking this kind of action?
And the answer is because we're in a climate emergency and our government is not taking it seriously.
This action at Lords Today isn't the biggest climate story of the day.
The biggest climate story of the day is the fact that the government's own climate change committee, which is headed by the Conservative peer Lord Devon, has found that the government's net zero strategy is failing on every single one of its targets.
That means they're not keeping us safe now and they are.
You know what?
Come on shows like this and debate that.
I'll invite you on to have a proper debate about doing these activities.
No, it's not the only way you get on.
That's a complete myth.
There have been regular debates on shows like mine that don't involve a reaction to the kind of ridiculous nonsense we saw today.
The truth is, you've become a group of wreckers.
You're just like wrecking things for the sake of wrecking.
Nobody is coming along to your cause because of these stupid stunts.
We all think you're a bunch of puerile, spoilt brats who are just going out of their way to cause other people inconvenience and ruin their fun.
That is the reality.
You might well have seriously.
Hang on, let me finish.
Hang on.
You might well have a serious point to make or many serious points to make.
I might well agree with some of those points.
I probably do.
But you know what?
The more of these things you do are things that I enjoy and my friends enjoy and my family enjoys and other people with their friends and families enjoy.
The more families that you stop getting to work or getting their kids to school for important exams or getting to funerals or whatever it may be, the more you do that, the more we hate you and the more we don't want to have anything to do with you or give you a platform to talk about the stuff that actually is more important, as you rightly say.
Why don't you just stop the stupid stunts?
Stop wrecking people's lives.
This won't stay in the news and it won't stay in the conversation.
And perhaps what we're doing by interrupting the things that you need to do that are important to you, that you love, is we're making you think about everything that the people are doing.
No, you're making me think you're a bonchamoron.
Lord Debbie said today.
You're not, Chloe.
Lord Debon said today.
Chloe, you're not making me think about your cause.
Nobody at Lords today was thinking, this is about climate change.
The Rugby Protests Comparison 00:15:59
We saw the orange powder.
The whole crowd started booing.
And fortunately, England's wicket keeper, Johnny Bears.
Actually, no, I'm going to cut you off.
I'm going to go to Sir Jeffrey Boycott.
Geoffrey, you're a cricket legend.
You know, I remember back in the 70s, a pitch being dug up at Headingley, which wrecked a test match in a different kind of protest.
But this series of attacks on stuff that most Britons just like watching.
The snooker, the cricket, the Chelsea Flower Show.
What do you make of it?
Does it convince you that you should take this kind of thing seriously?
No, I watched it today and I just started laughing.
I thought the England players did well with the Aussie batsman.
They made a barrier at one end for one of them so they couldn't get through.
And then the staff came on and grabbed him and rugby tackled him.
Johnny picked up the other one and the orange powder, it actually went on the ground about eight or nine, ten yards away from the pitch.
So it didn't do any damage whatsoever.
And I just laughed.
I thought it was foolish.
I just thought it was stupid.
There's a serious point to this, Geoffrey, which is that had they actually got to the wicket itself, you know, these wickets in a test match at Lourdes on day one of a five-day match, they're pretty sacred pieces of land, right?
If they got there and begun to do actual damage to the wicket, sprayed their paint everywhere, actually it could have wrecked the entire test match.
Yes, and everybody's got tickets for tomorrow, Saturday, whatever, whatever day.
All the refunding, their absolute few days at the cricket would be spoiled.
That's what happened with the George Davies.
That's what it was in 75.
It was some people got in through the night.
They didn't have security guards then or dogs, you know, through the night to stop that.
And they dug up the pitch and they painted it.
And it was all about freeing George Davies, who was in jail at the time.
They supposedly thought he was wrongly put in jail.
And when Tony Gregg and Ian Chappell, the two captains, were walking up, come to the ground early because there's been a problem, Gregg was smart enough to say to Ian Chappell, can we cut a fresh pitch for you?
And we play on that.
Chappelle said, whoa, we're not stupid.
Because as you know, and any cricket lover knows, these pitches that they actually bat on are being prepared and rolled and made flat and pancake so that you get a fairly true bounce.
If you play on a freshly mown pitch, the ball zips all over the course and Australia would have lost.
So the whole intention match was abandoned.
Yeah, that's right, it was.
And the whole integrity of an international cricket match, say the ashes like this, is reliant on the pitch and the integrity of that pitch.
That's why it may look like a puerile stunt.
Actually, if they got to where they were trying to get to, and who knows what they had planned for when they got on the wicket, they could have wrecked the Lord's Test match.
And I come back again, Geoffrey, to this sense that I have that the British public are not getting moved one iota to support this cause the more that they do this kind of thing to stuff that we all enjoy.
Well, if they'd have got to the pitch and ruined it in some way, then they might have been hell on.
They might not have got out of the ground in one piece.
That's not to say that's right, but people would have been angry that the game was ruined and ruined for the next few days.
I mean, this is in ashes.
There isn't anything bigger in cricket, and there isn't a ground better in the world than Lord's, the mecca of cricket.
So it wouldn't have gone down well, and I felt at the time.
That's why I laughed and thought this is silly.
This is negative.
This is not going to do you any good because the people are across.
They're going to be mad as hell if you ruin it.
I completely agree.
Let me come to you then, Donegal.
I've always felt you're a more reasonable talker about this kind of thing.
I know you've had a long-time commitment to it.
I want to read you again what Trevor Nielsen said to the Sunday Times at the weekend, because it was really interesting.
He said, I absolutely believe this kind of thing has become now counterproductive.
I just feel like it has to be said by somebody that was involved in the beginning of what it's become.
This is going to require an immensely difficult navigation of the middle.
And the activists are ostracizing the exact people they need to engage.
They're creating an excuse for people to stay on the sidelines.
Blocking bridges is a lot easier than building bridges.
And that is what we need to do if we're going to succeed.
Now, I read that and I thought, good on you.
Good on you for not being intransigent.
Good on you for recognizing what I've been saying repeatedly and others, which is it's not the cause itself that is causing all the friction and the problem.
It is the methodology of forcing people to come along the road with this cause.
And if you change the methodology, you might well bring more people with you.
Do you accept that?
No, I don't, because what he's actually saying is contradicting what has happened in protest movements over the centuries.
What has happened?
Tell me one movement that's involved systematic wrecking of things that British people enjoy doing.
I think if you take a step back and you look at the protests at the desktop all of them, they've been minor things.
But they're not minor, though.
They are.
10 minutes with a bit of dust is minor.
However, the really interesting thing about today's protest is what it brought attention to in the media.
The media this afternoon is talking about who is sponsoring the cricket match today.
It's JP Morgan.
JP Morgan is the world's largest funder of fossil fuel destruction.
I've not heard anybody talking about JP Morgan.
It's in the BBC.
It's in the Guardian.
Honestly, I was at Lords.
I was at Lord's until six o'clock.
Nobody was talking about JP Morgan or any involvement they may have in fossil fuels.
It's not in the media today, it's afterwards.
Honestly, I've not seen a word.
Read the reports in the BBC, read the Portland Guards.
What they're talking about is JP Morgan is the world's largest bank.
£454 billion invested in fossil fuels since Paris.
And they're sponsoring today.
So I think it's a really important part of the project.
It reminds me of the rugby protests.
I don't agree with the apartheid.
That's the same reaction.
And people like you reacted to the rugby protection.
You don't know anything about what I thought about those protests.
No, responding to the prototype.
Here's my talk.
I would have people like you on to debate the serious issues.
Absolutely.
We do that every night on this show.
We had a very serious debate last night about racism in Britain, for example.
The people involved in that debate haven't spent the last few months running around wrecking everything.
They're not a wrecking machine.
They want to have a debate which actually leads to proper change.
That's what I would like to see with your cause.
But Just Stop Oil.
Everyone now associates Just Stop Oil with just a bunch of morons wrecking people's lives.
That's what people like you call them.
I would actually call them heroes because they're not going to be able to get them.
What's heroic about running on the cricket pitch?
Exactly.
Exactly what said about the rugby protests and the apartheid era.
Let's remember what's happening with the cricket world.
You talk about the sacredness of the sport and the sacredness of the cricket pitch.
Look at the cricketing world.
Caribbean destroyed by hurricanes.
Pakistan destroyed by floods.
India extreme heat.
What those cricketers are doing today is taking the side on the wrong side.
They're acting on the wrong side of the world.
You're saying that cricketers should have stood up and stood beside this just stop oil.
That'd be ridiculous.
No funding for new fossil fuels.
Darryl, this is where you lose me.
There's a serious debate to be had about what's been going on in the world's countries.
I get it.
I believe climate change is real.
I believe it's dangerous.
I believe in the core inherent essence of your protests, right?
I just hate the methodology.
And so, I can tell you do 99% of this country.
They can't stand it.
And I can say back to you, I've been involved in this for 30 years.
I spent 10 years local campaigning, 10 years in politics.
Deputy Chair of the Liberal Democrat.
I've done campaigning.
I've done petitions.
I've done marches.
And now you're reduced to chucking paint around.
No, I haven't chucked paint around.
You're supporting them.
I'm actually supporting it because nothing else has worked.
So please tell me.
We've tried politics.
Actually, you say nothing else has worked.
What can work?
The UK has one of the best records in the world in measures to combat climate change.
That is an irrefutable fact.
And if you deny that, you are actually denying the very thing that you accuse other people of doing, which is reality.
There are two things.
Britain is better than the world in most countries in reducing the carbon emissions of our electricity system.
Everything else, we're disastrous.
And the most important thing about Britain, which links to today's protests, and JP Morgan Bank, is we're one of the largest funders of new fossil fuels globally.
Okay, question for you.
Why don't you go to China and India and Russia and pull these stunts there?
Why is it only the safe places like the UK that just stop oil, chuck this stuff around at major sporting events and things that people love?
Let me tell you why.
Because there's a moral cowardice at the heart of what you do.
It's a bit like Greta Thunberg.
Greta Thunberg, you never see her in Beijing ranting away about the Chinese government.
Even though the worst polluters in the world are the Chinese.
So the people causing the real damage on pollution, none of your protesters have the gumption or the moral guts to go and wreck the lives of those people in those countries because you know what would happen.
You pick on the easy places who are doing the most to try and combat it.
Hang on.
And in the process, you piss off the entire country.
And I don't get the statement.
Do you accept the point that Britain is responsible for 15% of new funding of fossil fuels globally?
And secondly, we're responsible for over 50% of the world.
Tell you what I do accept fossil fuels.
Is that true or not?
Here's what I accept.
Do you accept that's true?
Here's what I accept.
I'm not going to quibble individual stats because I haven't got anything.
It's a really important stat.
Hang on.
I haven't got that information in front of me.
What I would say is, as a broad brushstroke, it is undeniable that the UK is doing more than most countries in the world of the prosperous countries is doing more to combat climate change than most others.
That is a fact.
What I'm agreeing with you is that we're doing more on our electricity, our own 1%.
But the City of London and all corporations are funding 50% of the advice.
Here's my advice.
So we have to protest.
Here's my advice.
No, you don't.
It's a center of the fossil fuel.
Come on shows like this and make your argument.
Don't go and wreck people's.
Can you please invite us on with Morgan and Barclays and Shell?
Let me go to the final word to Sir Jeffrey Boycott, if you're still there, Geoffrey.
I want to light the load, Jeffrey, and just ask you, are we going to win the ashes?
No.
I don't think so.
I think we should have won it, Edgebuston.
We win the game for 90% of the time, yet we lost it.
That's silly.
That is silly.
And that's enough to cry.
You know, when you're winning a game 90% of the time and you lose, Australia is a good team.
All right, here's what I'm going to do, Jeffrey.
Will you accept a £100 bet?
Because I say England will win the ashes.
I only bet when I'm batty.
So, Jeffrey, it's a great honour and pleasure to have you on the show.
I think it's your first appearance on Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Please come back again.
I miss you on the airwaves.
Still a legend, still as sharp as ever.
Great to see you.
And thank you to my two Just Stop Oil contributors.
Uncensored next, a controversial Jewish comedian, Roseanne Barr, is under fire again, this time for appearing to deny the Holocaust.
But was that what she was really doing?
Are free speech and sarcasm any excuse for what looks like anti-Semitism?
Or was she really being just literally sarcastic?
We'll debate that next.
Welcome back to Piers Morgan Uncensored and welcome to my PAC.
Talk-to-view contributor, Esther Cracker and Associate Editor of Daily Mirror, Kevin McGuire.
Kevin, just stop oil.
Just stop.
Stop.
Stop.
I believe in the cause.
I think it's a noble cause.
We've got to get off carbon fuels, save the planet.
But I do believe it's counterproductive.
As Trevor Nilson, I think his name is, multi-millionaire American who started funding.
Put lots of money into it.
It's all become performative and people aren't talking about the issue.
They're talking anger.
Well, today was the first time, Esther, I've been at one of these events as it happened, right?
So it was the start of the Lord's Test match, The Ashes.
It's the biggest event in world cricket.
It's the most important tournament.
And it's honestly my favourite day of the year, actually, in terms of sport, right?
I love it, even more than football.
And the crowd was buzzing.
It's been an exciting series so far.
The players come out.
They've been out there for about five, ten minutes.
And then we knew immediately what it was.
Right?
Three idiots coming on, throwing the orange powder.
It's just stop oil.
And the reaction of the crowd was nobody was like, go on, go on.
I'm behind you.
Which with every protest, there's normally some people going, go on.
Everyone was like, oh, for God's sake.
Not them again.
No, but you know what?
A bit like that woman in the Boris Johnson clip.
I'll not, you know, like that.
And that was the reaction of the entire crowd.
So this idea that this protest is somehow changing minds, it's for the birds.
Well, I mean, the people that should be most incensed by Just Stop Oil are people that are passionate about the environment.
You know, people that are true environmentalists, because you don't want to turn the public against your cause.
And when they make a mockery of a genuine message, things something that people are very passionate about, I think it's really disappointing.
I will caution, though, in protests that have been unpopular in the past, but prove right in the long run.
Emily Wilde and Davidson tried to pin a suffragette banner to the King's horse.
Yeah.
Derby, I think it was in 1935.
I think they were killed.
But that was a right.
She got moving towards, I mean, this is net zero is a massive political agenda.
We are moving towards what they want anyway.
But the suffragettes were booed by the crowd.
I remember the Daily Mirror led on, you know, protester disrupts Derby.
It wasn't a noble cause, you know?
Or you think of the Springboks tours in the early 1970s of Parliament Africa.
Matches were disrupted by protesters going on the pitch.
The fans all booed them, but they were right.
And in the end, they stopped the tours.
And that contributed to the downfall of white supremacy in South Africa.
So I am, I think they're counterproductive now, just stop oil.
But there is a little bit in the back of my head.
I think there's a false diacon.
Others have been said to be counterproductive in the past.
No, I think you're comparing it to things that are not relevant.
The examples you've given were people fighting for rights that have been deprived of them.
They're not fighting for rights for people that are, they're not fighting for.
Seven of the planet is quite a big thing.
No, they're arguing for something that hasn't been taken away from us, right?
If you're a suffragette and you're arguing for the right to vote, that's something that you have a legal, you should have a legal right to.
For you to tell us to try and pressure the public to stop using oil, which we're trying to do anyway, that is completely different.
They are fighting to end the destruction of the planet.
Which will hit Britain, but it will hit a lot of poorer countries.
Well, we live in a democracy.
And we do.
My frustration with him is the guy who is at the desk here, I've talked to him a few times.
He's obviously, he's committed to this.
He believes in it passionately.
He's very well informed.
He's very intelligent.
I would love to have a normal debate with him, but every time we wheel him out, it's because these clowns have done something stupid again.
And, all right, you might say, well, okay, it gets him on, but we don't get him on.
He doesn't really air the proper arguments.
We're not really getting anywhere.
It's more a defensive thing about why he thinks they should carry on doing it.
I think if they got out and about and they talked to people, wider people, I would think they'd find there's a hostility growing.
And it's rather like the blocking roads.
Now, if you're frustrating people going to work or going to see their family, going to hospitals, whatever it is.
Okay, you're not going to get in the back here.
Is Pride Month Too Long 00:02:15
Let's see if people have persuaded me that we should have a month-long pride celebration.
This is London Zoo with the animals celebrating Pride.
We've got some footage of this, I think.
Funny.
And I want to make it crystal clear.
I support pride, okay?
I'm proud of Pride.
I have always campaigned, you know, as a broadcaster for equal rights for all gay people and for trans people and for every other one of those letters that increases by the week.
But do we really need this?
Yeah.
Do we?
Yeah.
Look, look, I love London Zoo.
Animals at London Zoo.
Virtue signalling.
I take my grandkids.
That's something they know nothing about.
I take my grandkids to London Zoo all the time.
They always try and get you engaged in other ways.
Are you going to be against Easter egg hunts, London Zoo, or Christmas celebrations?
Later in the week, they're going to have a lot of information on conservation.
Here's the point.
Here's an awesome...
Why do only the LGBTQ1I, I can't remember the rest of it, but why does only that group of communities get a whole month?
Yeah, right.
Well, this is the thing.
I'm sorry.
I dread Pride Month.
I think it doesn't need to be a whole month.
It can just be a weekend.
I don't see why we need to have 30 whole days of this celebration.
I think this would be over the top.
So why does absolutely everything have to be the rainbow?
Why?
Yeah, but there's Black History Month.
Now, maybe London Zoo don't do anything with that.
Now they might.
Black History Month.
You don't go around everywhere and everywhere is a sea of black.
What would you do for Black Black?
Paint everything black.
Maybe it should.
What would you do on Black History?
Literally paint everything black.
It's not been commercialized in the same way because it actually means something.
Maybe it will down the planet.
Why don't we have Veterans Month?
Yeah, you could have.
Why don't we?
If you propose it.
Why don't we?
Well, people have proposed it.
Well, people have to get it.
In other words, why do veterans who serve their country who get wounded, why don't we have a month for them?
Cancelled Without Context 00:03:41
Yep.
And that's a legitimate question.
Rather than on Forces Day.
Well, why not have Armed Forces month?
Maybe a political party or the government or veterans themselves could campaign for it.
Because why do we have pride?
We have pride because gay people who used to suffer appalling bigotry and discrimination.
To some extent, young people, they don't need pride because they're not...
Everything's moved on.
Young people don't really get this whole sexuality thing.
I mean, they're done.
I mean, for my generation, it just feels like overkill.
Don't be told for a month you've got to let people be equal.
They feel it.
But it's kind of moved.
Once it was defiance, now it's become more of a celebration.
All right.
Roseanne Barris, this is quite interesting.
So she's in the middle of a huge furoori in America.
Obviously a controversial comedian in many ways.
She's been cancelled and so on.
She made a comeback and she said this.
And nobody died in the Holocaust either.
That's the truth.
Yeah.
It should happen.
Six million Jews should die right now because they cause all the problems in the world, but it never happened.
But it never happened.
Right.
So on the face of it, utterly shocking.
What is she doing?
She's denying the Holocaust.
She's saying six million Jews should be killed.
The host is laughing.
They should be cancelled.
There's just one problem.
That was a severely edited clip of a satirical, much longer version in which she was actually being heavily sarcastic and talking about the modern scourge where false information, lies, are mandated to be accepted by the public by the force of social media and so on.
That certain lies.
Now, it may have been a strange way to go about making your point, but you've got to show it in context.
She can't be cancelled for something which is inherently not an accurate reflection of what she was doing.
I agree.
She's Jewish.
100% Jewish, as she said.
She obviously doesn't deny the Holocaust.
She's on the record many times talking about horrors of Holocaust.
Yeah, she can be incredibly offensive as she was when she was cancelled from a TV show because she compared a black woman in the Obama administration to an ape.
But here, where I thought she was particularly ill-judged, is she was basically saying there was election fraud and that it's a mandated truth that there was no election fraud when Biden beat Trump.
Now, you can query that, but don't then bring in the Holocaust to that.
Now, I know she was being sarcastic.
Well, I think she was incredibly, yeah, you're right.
It's very poor satire.
I think what she is showing, though, in the wider context of this, is the fact that there are people that picked up on it and just got outraged and they didn't contextualize it for their audience.
And she's making the case.
And the Colonel McGowan coming under fire, the people who've led that, who got big followers, and they're now putting out the whole thing, oh, by the way, this is the full concept.
Exactly.
Which actually, when you watch it, we haven't got time to play the full content.
But when you do, it's crystal clear she is being sarcastic.
She doesn't mean what she said there.
Absolutely.
She actually means the opposite.
Now, you may not agree with the other point she's making, but this is what I think one of the dangers of social media really is, is that something like that gets taken out of context.
And before you know it, it's gone worldwide, you know, via YouTube, via Twitter, via Facebook, via Instagram.
Everyone's outraged.
And most people won't ever see the in-context piece.
They will just think Roseanne Barr has denied the Holocaust.
Before you know it, boom, she's cancelled.
I mean, this is the insane world we now live in.
Yeah, but it is fact there was a Holocaust, but it is also fact the election wasn't stolen in the US.
Now, for her to then mix the two.
President Losing Control 00:07:19
Try and compare the two.
I mean, it's a poorly done compassion.
But you're right.
She's not.
Nothing.
But you bet.
If you look at social media, it's a wash because Roseanne Barr denies the Holocaust.
And that is a problem for modern society.
Anyway, Pat, great to see you both.
Thank you very much indeed.
I won't ask you for your view of the ashes because I don't think either of you.
Do you like cricket?
I love cricket.
The last three days of the oval.
I'm literally obsessed with the ashes, obsessed with cricket.
By myself, it's a lonely old world out there.
Lords is the best ground.
But in a way, although the root took those two wickets at the end, I was thinking maybe it was a shame to me.
I actually sat with the girl.
I would have got the wicket and delayed.
I was actually sitting today with Andrei Shevchenko, who's actually got a massive game, the football legend.
We've got a massive football match, charity game for Ukraine, coming up on August the 5th.
It was the one that I interviewed Alexander Zinchenko, the Arsenal player about.
The two of them are captaining teams.
August the 5th, Sanford Bridge, an amazing cause.
Game for Ukraine.
Thank you both very much.
Thank you.
It says the next presidential candidate, Larry Elder, has been called a black Donald Trump without the controversies.
He's been a bit controversial, so I'll put him to the test next.
Well, with former President Donald Trump's legal woes mounting, perhaps it's small wonder that no fewer than 12 Republicans so far have lined up to challenge him for the presidential nomination.
We'll hear from one in a moment, but Democrats, of course, have a Biden-shaped problem of their own.
Here is the leader of the free world forgetting which war he was talking about earlier today.
Has Vladimir Putin been weakened by recent events?
It's hard to tell, but he's clearly losing the war in Iraq.
He's losing the war at home.
And he has become a bit of a fly around the world.
Okay, well, it's not a war in Iraq, obviously.
It's a war in Ukraine.
You'd think the President of the United States might know that, but this is the same President of the United States who has made a habit lately of both verbal and physical gaffes.
Let's take a look.
All right.
God save the Queen, man.
Has Vladimir Putin been weakened by recent events?
It's hard to tell, but he's clearly losing the war in Iraq.
He's losing the war at home.
So all that has happened quite recently.
I'm joined now by Larry Elder, one of the 12 Republican presidential hopefuls.
Larry, great to talk to you again.
It's been quite a while.
I think the last time I talked to you, you were calling me a stupid idiot live on air.
So I hope we can have a more civilized conversation.
And vice versa, I might add.
It's great to see you.
And congratulations on your bid to be president.
Let's talk about President Biden first.
It seems to me barely a day goes by now without some new embarrassment, either involving his physical mobility with him falling over and tripping and so on, or perhaps more worryingly, the constant verbal gaffes.
And sometimes they're trivial, like when he said, God save the Queen, man, appearing to forget the Queen died nine months ago and he was at the funeral.
But sometimes today, when he's talking about the Ukraine war, to actually mistake it for the Iraq war.
You know, last year he was kind of rewriting American foreign policy with Taiwan and so on with his missteps, which has to be corrected by the White House.
If you put it all together, I wrote a column for the New York Post about this, which resonated quite big yesterday, that you put it all together, there's a clear suggestion here that the President of the United States is not in full control of his faculties.
I agree with you.
And as you pointed out, some of these are kind of trivial.
Some of them can be written off as gaffes, but some of them cannot.
For example, he was recently at Howard University, and he said the biggest threat to the American homeland was white supremacy.
I mean, my goodness, the Anti-Defamation League Pierce keeps track of how many people are killed by extremists, no matter the color of the extremists.
And last year, there were 25.
However, in 2020, there were 11, nearly 11,000 black homicide victims, almost all killed by other black people.
To my knowledge, none killed by a so-called white supremacist.
So this is a kind of lie that infects America, that really hurts this country.
And that is one of the reasons I'm running.
Not only that, Joe Biden is opposed to school choice.
Pierce, there is an absolute crisis in urban America, as to our government schools.
Chicago, 53 government schools where 0%, I kid you not, 0% of the kids can do math at grade level.
Baltimore, 13 public high schools, 0% of the kids can do math at grade level, another half a dozen where only 1% can.
That's half of all the public high schools in Baltimore, all located in the inner city.
And this lie that Biden and the others push about America being systemically racist has murderous consequences.
But Larry, let me put this.
Currently, you're polling 1% on the Democrat side, right?
So let's be honest, it's highly unlikely you are going to be the next president of the United States.
Doesn't mean you shouldn't be running and you can't make all these points, but we both know it's highly unlikely.
It's going to likely be either Joe Biden, who said he is running, and if he's the incumbent president, that means he'll run unless something extraordinary was to happen.
And on the Republican side, Donald Trump, obviously, is way ahead, right?
On your side.
So what is going to happen here?
I mean, if Donald Trump wins the Republican nomination, many people think he can't win a national election against somebody who most people think is completely out of it.
Isn't it sensible for the Republicans to find a candidate that actually is not Donald Trump, who would probably have a very easy time beating Joe Biden?
Shockingly, Pierce, I agree with you.
I believe that there are so many swing voters in swing states who would not vote for Donald Trump if the man walked on water.
In fact, if he did, they'd accuse him of not being able to swim.
Now, I think at some point, as did the Democrats back in 2020, Republican voters are going to realize they need to coalesce behind somebody whose last name is other than Trump, but for whom a sufficient number of swing voters can vote so that we can win in November 2024.
And I want to get up there in that debate stage in Milwaukee.
I need 40,000 individual donors.
You can give as little as $1 to get me up there in that debate stage.
At the very least, you'll get a America first candidate, a Make America Great Again candidate, who will talk about the lie of systemic racism, talk about the vital need for school choice in America and the 10,000-pound elephant in the room that nobody's talking about, and that is the epidemic of fatherlessness.
70% of black kids enter the world today without a father in the home, married to the mother, up from 25% back in 1965.
You can't tell me America is more racist today than it was in 1965.
What's happened?
It's the welfare state that the left pushed beginning in the 60s that has incentivized women to marry the government and incentivized men to abandon their financial and moral responsibility.
At the very least, if I can put these issues front and center, I will feel that I've done a service to my party, and more importantly, Pierce, I will feel that I've done a service to my country.
Yeah, well, you know what?
I actually agree with you.
I think it's absolutely right that people like you should run and you should raise the issues which are important.
So we're both agreeing.
I agree with you and you agree with me.
Love is in the air.
Let's not get too hasty here, Larry.
Pizza Man Faces Penalties 00:09:07
But on a final point, should Donald Trump even be allowed?
I mean, obviously he's allowed to legally, but should he be allowed to run as a candidate for president now that he's got two indictments and is likely to face at least one, maybe two more?
I would put that question to you.
Should Joe Biden be allowed to run?
It is obvious that he's got major, major trouble.
We know from these whistleblowers from the IRS that the investigation was roadblocked.
We've got evidence that Joe Biden was on the take for maybe $5 million for policy decisions in favor of Ukraine and Barisma.
As far as I know, he isn't even being prosecuted.
There's a two-tiered system of justice in this country, and I don't see why Donald Trump should be held accountable when Hillary and Joe Biden are not.
Well, I think they should all be held accountable, but they should all be treated equally, and they should all be treated exactly the same way.
And on that point, I agree with you.
Larry, good to talk to you.
Let's end it before we ruin it and start abusing each other.
It's great to have you back on the show.
And we'll talk again another time.
Good luck to you.
And thank you for not calling me the blackface of white supremacy, as did the Los Angeles Times.
Any day when I'm not called that is a good day.
I'm just going to stick to calling you Larry.
I think it's a lot safer.
Thank you, sir.
I appreciate it.
Take care, Larry Elder.
Good to talk to you.
Well, on sense of next, a legendary New York pizza slice is under threat amid a crackdown on wood-fired ovens that's enraged everyone right up to Elon Musk.
The city says it will clear the polluted air.
The citizens say, save our slice.
That debate is next.
New Yorkers are being asked to choose between planet and pizza.
City Hall could force pizzerias to install emissions control devices on their coal and wood-fired ovens to improve air quality.
Critics say that will cost a lot of dough, boom, boom, and may even ruin the flavor of the legendary New York slice.
This has enraged locals.
Give us pizza!
Or give us death!
One man turned up at the mayor's office to throw pizzas over the fence in protest, shouting, give us pizza or give us death.
The famous pizza reviewer Dave Portnoy has vented his rage.
Apparently, in New York City, some little liberal arts, Ivy League, pink-haired, crazy liberal who's never worked one day in the real world is on an environmental commission.
And they woke up from their little nappy poo, wherever that may be.
Like, I figured out how to save the world today.
Dave's not happy, is it?
Well, even Elon Musk, whose Tesla electric cars are a massive aid in fighting global warming, tweeted, this is utter BS.
It won't make a difference to climate change.
Well, joining me now live from his New York pizza restaurant.
It's Paulie G.
And I'm also joined by the editor of the heated newsletter, Emily Atkin.
Okay, well, look, this is a heated debate in many ways.
Paulie, let me start with you.
I've got some pizza here.
I love pizza.
I love coming to New York and having a slice over there.
I know exactly how it's made.
I like the way it's made.
And I'm with Elon Musk.
I don't think it's going to make any difference, this initiative, to combating climate change.
What is your view, though, as a pizza man in New York who may have to potentially face crippling financial penalties because of this?
Well, small pizzerias, small business owners, are being asked to put these devices on.
I put my device on in 2019.
We were supposed to have this done by January 2020.
That never came through.
But I'm happy that I did because my flu is near an apartment building right next to me.
And the smoke that was coming out when we started the fire or when we threw another log on the fire, you know, was disturbing my neighbors.
And I didn't want to do that.
I didn't want to spend $20,000, but I did.
And I'm glad I did.
But, you know, now businesses after the pandemic, I think you'll find that most small businesses like mine are not doing as well as they did before.
Okay, so this is interesting.
So broadly speaking, Paulie, what you mean is you kind of agree with the principle of this, but the cost may just be too prohibited.
Well, I agree in principle that it's good for air quality in New York.
It's certainly the mayor compared the smoke that comes out of 100 of these ovens to the smoke that came out of the fires in Canada and made it practically impossible to see across the city.
And if that was the case with these 100 ovens, why can we look across and see a beautiful skyline?
Well, that is a good point.
So Emily Atkin, look, we started this show tonight with the Just Stop Oil protests in the UK, which is a similar theme about fossil fuels and the emissions and so on.
Why target pizza slices in New York?
Well, it's interesting.
I'm not really here to talk about the merits of the rule or debate whether it's a good idea or not.
My real thing that I've been trying to put forward is to have people understand that despite how it's been characterized, this rule isn't intended to solve climate change.
I myself took a look at the proposed rule when I saw the first New York Post report about this.
I'm a journalist myself, so I care about the facts.
I'm also a New Yorker and I paid for my college tuition at a SUNY school by working at a pizzeria.
So I care very much about this.
And I didn't see the words climate, carbon, or carbon emission one time.
So I've been very concerned with how this has been described as a rule to solve climate change when it doesn't really appear that that's what it is.
It's a rule to reduce particulate emissions exactly for the neighbors that Paulie was just talking about.
You know, it's interesting.
I had what I thought was regular bad allergy issues, which I thought were hay fever.
And then six months ago, someone pointed out to me that I live in a very heavily polluted part of London, one of the worst in the country in the UK, and advised that I get some air purifying machines in my house and not go out if an air quality app said it was really bad out there.
So I did both things.
And I've had zero allergy problems, really, pretty much in the last six months for the first time in many years.
So I completely sign up to this pollution issue.
The question I guess, Paulie, is can you divorce the two things?
I mean, heavy pollution.
Clearly, many people believe that is a contributory factor to the general issue around climate change, the future of the planet, and so on.
100 pizza ovens that operate part of the day is not going to cause the kind of pollution that we're talking about.
There are many other things that cause that type of pollution.
And, you know, and the government is willing to subsidize efforts to improve that.
And a perfect example is the ferry that's about two blocks from my pizzeria here.
The New York City ferry charges about $4 per ride to people.
And they did a study, and the cost of operating that is over $10 a ride.
So that method of reducing emissions is being subsidized.
They're asking small businesses who, again, thanks to the pandemic, we're really not doing as well as we were.
And costs are going up even on these devices we have to put on.
I spent $20,000 right now.
It's almost $25,000.
But this is an unfunded mandate.
Yeah, it's a lot of money.
Emily, if you were running the country, and let's face it, you probably couldn't do a worse job right now.
But if you were running the country, what would be the main thing you would want to do immediately to achieve what you would like to achieve with the planet?
I mean, if I were running the country, we would certainly have a very different country.
But I generally don't even think about that because I am a journalist, right?
Like, this is my, what I am super passionate about is making sure that we're having fact-based debates.
And I think that this debate in particular has been sort of warped to be about something that it's not, about improving overall air quality in the city, which it's sort of about, but not really about solving climate change, which it's not really about.
Okay.
It's about this very specific specific thing.
Having smoke blowing into your neighbors.
I think you may look at it.
I think we've run out of time.
I was cutting.
I'm sorry.
It's a really interesting debate.
Thank you both for joining me.
I think you're kind of right, actually, both of you.
Which is a strange way to end a debate, but I do.
Thank you both very much.
Whatever you're up to, uh keep it unpolluted and keep it uncensored.
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