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Dec. 5, 2022 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
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The Full Truth About Harry 00:14:58
Tonight on Piers Morgan uncensored.
No one knows the full truth.
We know the full truth.
What they wouldn't know the truth would just smack them around their privileged chops.
Harry and Megan detonate what's left of their royal relationships by releasing two nauseating Netflix trailers.
Tonight revealed that even those are packed full of lies.
So will they now finally be stripped of their remaining titles?
Meanwhile, Donald Trump hosts a secret dinner with Kanye Yeh West, who then goes on to be banned from Twitter after posting a swastika in The Star of David and defending Hitler.
I'll talk to the rabbi who was at Donald Trump's inauguration.
Does he still stand by the former president?
Should he run again?
Plus, England steaming to the quarterfinals of the World Cup is fast becoming one of the most entertaining of all time as football declared victory over the Virtue Signors.
Live from London, this is Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Well good evening from London.
Welcome to Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Harry and Megan, the dreariest couple in the history of planet Earth, famously abandoned their royal duties for a life of privacy.
They left the goldfish bowl of Great Britain for the camouflage of California, remember?
Famously sheltered from the evil British press.
And since then, they've kept an incredibly low profile as they vowed to.
If you excuse the massive book deals, the Silicon Valley startups, the preaching videos about well-being, the podcasts, the speeches and the major network interviews with everyone from Oprah Winfrey to James Corden.
But they've barely been seen or heard at all, have they?
Well on Thursday they'll quietly and apologetically release their $100 million documentary series on Netflix.
There are trailers for this and viewers with sensitive stomachs should look away now.
Why did you want to make this documentary?
No one sees what's happening behind the closed doors.
Utterly nauseating, I mean literally, I literally recoiled while watching it.
The sanctimony, the fake drama, the hammy woe is me that's been going on now for years.
The sombre tickle of the piano keys, the stage black and white photographs of this very ordinary young oppressed couple having what appears to be some tiny semblance of fun in their California mansion as they count all their money.
Incredibly it gets worse.
I had to do everything I could to protect my family.
I mean nothing says protecting your family like doing a reality TV fly-in-the-mole documentary about every aspect of your family life for the delectation of the entire planet, does it, Harry?
Well, a brain pack of paparazzi photographers jostling the space to hound the happy couple.
That's what we just saw, right?
Childhood photographs clearly intended to evoke the tragic death of his mother Diana.
Those photographers we just saw weren't actually interested in Prince Harry at all.
They were at the premiere of a Harry Potter movie five years before Harry even met Megan.
There weren't any royals there at all.
This apparently Snicky Paparazzo lurking above the Sussexes was actually invited there to cover their meeting with Archbishop Tutu in Cape Town.
Another photo used in the promotions shows Harry's outstretched hand apparently shielding the couple from photographers.
The.
It's actually a cropped photo of Harry with ex-girlfriend Chelsea Davy, taken in 2007, and a press scrum shown dashing after the unhappy couple was actually chasing after reality TV star one of their compatriots now, Katie Price, at Crawley Magistrates Court.
Ironically for a couple who've repeatedly sued newspapers for intrusion and inaccuracy, they've just put a lot of whoppers into their trailers.
That's before we even get to the main event.
When the stakes were this high, doesn't it make more sense to hear our story from us?
Oh, shut up.
What do you mean the stakes are this high?
Who do you think you are?
Other than a latte-munching imbecile living in luxury in California while the rest of the world is a cost of living crisis, moaning and whining about an institution which gave you the titles on which you now trade millions of dollars.
What are you talking about?
What stakes are there other than the massive gigantic stake you're currently plunging into our monarchy over here?
And as for telling their story, sorry if I missed something?
I thought you'd been telling your truth, which is often a pack of lies, from the moment you abandoned this country.
Well, today's new trailer doubles down on the last trailer, and there's more tears.
Remember that clip of Megan once showing us how she could cry like that at the drop of a little tainy tarnished tiara?
Remember that?
She could do it like that.
Let's bear that in mind when you watch it.
Did you get that one?
And as for the shameful comparisons of Princess Diana, I remember Prince Harry being very, very angry about the media exploiting his mother for commercial gain.
Yeah, what has he done with this Netflix series?
He's used his mother to sell it.
Could there be a more grotesque exploitation or a more hypocritical one than him using his dead mother's imagery to engender sympathy for himself again as the great victim in this world?
I find it all puke making.
And I speak as someone who's actually in one of these things.
I pop up.
Yeah, me.
And to my astonishment, I was being very nice about Megan Markle.
Let's have a listen.
It's really hard to look back on it now and go, what on earth happened?
You hear that?
That is a sound of hearts breaking all around the world.
She's becoming a royal rock star.
Everything changed.
There's a hierarchy of the family.
You know, there's leaking, but there's also planting of stories.
There was a war against Megan to suit other people's genders.
It's about hatred.
It's about race.
It's a dirty game.
The pain and suffering of women marrying into this institution, this feeling frenzy.
I realized they're never going to protect you.
I was terrified.
I didn't want history to repeat itself.
No one knows the full truth.
We know the full truth.
Oh, God, you wouldn't know the truth if it hit you around the back of your head.
And Harry, here's the point.
We're not really interested in your truth.
You've been saying it for the last two, three years.
Your version of what you think happened.
And yeah, I did say Megan was becoming a royal rock star, and I'm pleased you quote me in there because it shows that I was, like the rest of the British media, very positive about your new bride until your mutual behaviour became hypocritical and ridiculous after the wedding.
Your claim that you're the victims of a dirty game is especially brazen given that these trailers have been released to deliberately overshadow a visit by the Prince and Princess of Wales to the United States.
The timing, of course, is unforgivable, if entirely unsurprising.
And a typically cynical ploy to overshadow a vitally important royal tool, the first since the death of Queen Elizabeth.
And what about his father in all this?
A man who's not even been coronated as king yet, still mourning the death of his mother.
Is he going to cop it in this series?
You can bet your life he will.
Charles is going to have to take it again from his son with no ability to speak out and return fire.
This series will do great numbers for Netflix, but maybe not for the reasons they hoped.
The Oxford English Dictionary defines hate watching as the activity of watching for the sake of enjoyment derived from mocking or criticising.
That's a measure of success.
Harry and Megan, you're going to have a smash hit.
But of course, the real measure of success of both of them will be the same as it always has been.
How much damage can they inflict on our royal family, on our monarchy?
How can they make it all about them?
How can they continue to play the victims when they live in such unparalleled luxury, the other side of the world?
This gruesome twosome only survived by cashing in on what's left of their royal status now.
I've said it before, I'll say it again tonight.
King Charles should strip them of all their remaining titles and cast them out from any connection to the royal family.
How could any of them trust them?
As far as I could throw them, because without it, they're just whining millennial windbags with a permanent victim complex, knowing that victimhood is what makes them all the money.
Well, joining me now is royal author Tom Bauer, former butler to Princess Dinapaul Burrell, and the Lauren commentator Paula Roan Adrian, who's turned up looking magnificent tonight.
Is this prompting me to stumble into a where are you really from question?
And ask me where my people are from, Piers.
Absolutely.
I actually wasn't on air after all that.
And I know you took part in a debate about it.
I mean, my thing is quite interesting.
A lot of friends of mine.
And some family, actually.
Well, I think the treatment of Lady Susan has been way over the top.
She's an 83-year-old woman, didn't really know what she was doing, dug herself into a hole, probably didn't even realise until the balloon went up the next day.
Where's our sense of forgiveness?
All this kind of thing.
I personally felt that her asking where this lady came from, given she was dressed in her garb from her African and Caribbean heritage, I thought it was perfectly reasonable to ask, where are you from, right to the point where she tells you, I'm born in Britain and I'm British.
At that point, the interrogation has to stop.
And she carried on in what became an increasingly cringe-making way, which I think if I had been a black woman in that position, I would have found actually very offensive.
And I'm glad that you said the word interrogation, because that's what it was.
It's the way it felt, right?
However, we stop there with our agreements because you reference her as being this 83-year-old woman who was digging herself a hole.
We're talking about somebody whose job it was and who was present throughout 50 years in terms of diplomacy, assisting the Queen as her lady-in-waiting.
This wasn't a woman who lived at the bottom of my street in Plasto or Upton Park, an East Ender.
Okay, this was a woman who was well educated and should have known better.
And with age comes wisdom.
There's no excuse.
You must know Lady Susan Husserl.
I know her very well.
What was your reaction to it all?
I actually felt sorry for the whole situation developing the way it did because Lady Susan is 83 and she's not upon the woke society and what we should say or shouldn't say.
How many policies are in place?
How many training sessions do they have?
No, they don't.
They're ladies in waiting who answer mail.
They answer the assigned letters.
How could they be so apparently insensitive after all the aggravation around Meghan Margaret?
Because the palace is.
It's dysfunctional.
You know that, Piers.
It doesn't work the way we think it works.
It works in 100 years.
Tom, why should age be an excuse?
I know lots of people in their 80s who don't feel it necessary to be that clumsy when they speak to black people.
Why should we give her a pass?
Well, you know, Piers, on this subject, I really want to pass because I don't really think that.
You know what, don't pass, because this is exactly what we need to do.
We need to have uncomfortable discussions.
Yes, please don't pass.
They're not allowed to pass, Tom.
I can't let you pass them, aren't they?
I don't think Lady Susan, Susan.
Because you think it's not really your place to decide whether a black person felt racially offended.
I think I'm sure she did feel offended.
I'm sure she's that's I have no doubt about that at all, is whether the situation should have arisen there.
I really don't.
I wasn't there and I'm going to pass.
Okay, let's move on to what we're going to talk about sometimes.
This Netflix series.
I mean, it seems to be, to me, to be confirming everyone's worst fears, probably worse, actually.
And them whacking the media is one thing.
They've been doing that the whole time, whilst using the media when it suits them, as they are now with Netflix.
If you're King Charles, if you're the new Prince of Wales, this is an absolute hammer blow, this series.
This is the real-life crown, sticking it to them, right, when they least want anyone to stick it to them.
They're trying to rebuild the monarchy after the death of our greatest monarch.
That's my objection with it.
Well, I think it's worse than that, because I think it's the lies, which is the bigger objection.
And first of all, the whole premise of today's trailer was about the impossible for a woman outsider to become an insider.
Well, Kate Middleton did it.
Perfectly accepted.
Sophie Wessex did it.
And Diana was not an outsider.
The Spencer family were as inside as you can be.
The second thing which I find really objectionable is their attack on the media.
This is a couple, as you rightly said in your introduction, with October Winfrey, the cut, variety.
Never stop.
Never stop a minute.
And so they are the greatest manipulators.
And you've forgotten in your list of Friday Freedom, where they lied on oath that they had no collaboration.
They're collaborating, yeah.
Collaborating.
So they are really very...
They're the rotten.
But I think the most important element now is how is the palace going to react?
What would you do if you were there?
I think the only way they can react is after the Netflix series, giving an interview.
I think either the King or William have got to break this idea of never complain, never explain.
They've got to take a head off.
You know what?
If you lie down with dogs, Tom, you get fluent.
Well, I disagree with you because I think that it'll be a global sensation.
Then comes the book.
And I don't think that the royal family can allow the lies which the Sussexes are perpetuating to go uncomfortable.
I mean, it's the sheer number of lies in the trailers about these pictures, none of which actually depict what we're being led to believe in.
But it's going to be much worse.
We know that.
We've known that for months.
We've been saying it for months.
This is going to be a bombshell.
It's Armageddon, yeah.
It is.
We've talked about this a lot.
How do you defend what they're doing?
Given that clearly the intent now is very clear, to do as much damage as they can to the royal family and the monarchy, regurgitating stuff they've been saying now for years to maximum damaging effect.
How do you defend it?
Piers, this isn't about defending.
This is about identifying pain.
And what we are witnessing here are two people who are in pain.
I don't believe it.
Problems With Professional Help 00:04:52
But you don't have to.
No.
But you are witnessing the fallout from the past.
She's an actress.
You don't have to.
She's playing the role of her life in this series.
You don't have to accept.
You don't have to accept that you've insulted me.
You don't have to accept it.
But you will have to accept a fallout from insulting me because I am going to react to it.
And this is the problem that the royal family have.
And I don't think the answer is for them to do an interview.
I think that would be the worst thing that they could do.
What they need to do.
What I want to do is get in a professional mediator.
What they need to do is now start dealing with the problem.
The problem exists.
And we had a glimpse of that with Miss Hussey and Mr. Lane.
No, don't conflate the two.
You say that, but when we're talking about racism, it's very hard to prove racism.
I've been complaining about it long before Lady Husserl came out.
I have.
I have.
Their truth is their lies.
That is the whole point.
They invented.
We know in Oprah that released 17 lies, right?
I'm going to be counting on Netflix.
There were six lies in the trailers about the pitches, which don't depict what they say.
Which were no doubt produced by the trainee part-time person who was putting together the flips.
Come on, that was nothing to do with Harry and me.
Here's my question, Paul Viewport.
You're King Charles.
What on earth do you do, given that one of these two people trying to ruin everything you represent is your own son?
You take away the titles.
I agree with you.
You do.
Absolutely.
They don't want to be members of the royal family, so why should they trade on?
The prince.
He will always be a prince.
He will always be a prince.
And she'll become a princess.
She's the princess.
So the problem is that the lies have got to be confronted.
You cannot rely on, you know, reporters shouting at William as they did after the opera and everything.
Are you racist?
He said, we're not a racist.
There's a problem with professional help.
But don't fall into the trap of fighting hate bombs with hate bombs because that's what's happening.
The only hate bombs are coming out.
Megan and Harry are hurting.
They feel...
They're not hurting, they're counting their money.
They have worked up.
But they have to earn peers.
Where else are they going to get?
The only way they can earn money is trashing their family.
It's the only thing they do.
It's just going to discount them.
That is all about sustaining their royal status so they can trash their family for the big bus.
It is.
This all smacks of self-obsessed narcissism to me.
And I always say.
And you've been quite supportive of Harry.
Absolutely.
You know.
I've crossed the line for you.
I've crossed the line because Harry decided to take this path to America.
He decided to do what he did for the right reasons to protect his family.
I thought, great.
Diana would have applauded that.
His mother would have said, great, Harry, you're doing the right things.
She would not have applauded what he's doing now.
No.
The commercialism around it.
She never took a cent.
Never took a penny.
And she never had a monarchy as an institution.
She was a great supporter of monarchy.
She said to me, I long to hug my mother-in-law.
I long to put my arms around her.
I know what goes on inside her head.
And she was very proud of her boys being members of the royal family.
She always thought it was Harry's job to be William's wingman, to be there for him on his path to monarchy.
Paula, that was his job.
Paula, if one of your family was doing this constantly for huge amounts of money, just abusing you and the rest of your family, would you be as tolerant of it?
You have to be.
Because the problem's never going to be resolved.
I'm not sure you do, actually.
I think actually we should cut them adrift.
You say no.
It will not be.
I'm trying to think, if one of my own sons, one of my own brothers did this to me, what would I do?
Actually, after years of it, you go, I'm done.
Yes, I'm done.
But Piers was a little bit more than a moment.
You don't ask for me to do that.
You say no.
We're talking about racism.
To trash their family.
We're talking about trashing the family.
You're talking about people who feel that their mental health is so affected that she was going to commit suicide.
That's what we're talking about.
As you know, I don't believe a lot of that stuff.
I know.
Right.
So I've heard.
Tell me one bad thing that Charles or William has said publicly about Meghan and Harry.
I'm not aware of any.
And I'm not suggesting that they have.
It's the opposite.
I'm suggesting that's the line they continue to take.
It's all one way.
I am completely willing to.
Not one word from either of them, critical of those.
But that doesn't mean we ignore what Harry and Meghan are saying.
And that doesn't mean we don't have a sex profile.
I don't believe it, Tom.
Well, I just think you've got to start at the beginning.
That Meghan came to Britain thinking she was going to be Numera Uno.
She was going to be the star.
She couldn't understand.
She didn't understand the hierarchy as well.
She didn't want to understand it.
When she understood it, she wanted out.
Who helped her?
They all went out of their way to help her out.
Peter Queen was helping her.
60 people were helping her.
She had really intelligent, devoted women, highly people who understand what it used to be a black female, who understand what it is to be an American.
She didn't do it.
Who understand what it is in terms of the family?
Okay, look, the good news is we've only seen the trailers, and the series dropped first three episodes on Thursday.
Yeah, I can't bear it.
We'll all watch it, whether we want to or not.
Over-The-Top Virtue Signaling 00:12:45
And we're going to have a big debate.
We're going to have a big debate.
Well, you can sit back on here on Thursday night and we'll debate it when we actually see what it is.
But I dread to think what they're going to come out with.
It's too much.
They are in danger of destroying what is good about Britain and the royal family.
Our king, not yet had his coronation, and William and Kate, who are going to be our future King of the United States.
There's something that's in public.
I'm going to leave you two to walk off into the sunset together, holding hands, the odd couple.
Tom, good to see you.
Thank you all very much, indeed.
Coming next, they covered their mouths in protest, but Germany was left with their feet in their mouths to crashing out of the World Cup early.
I'm going to talk to legendary, and I'm talking a proper legend here, sports broadcaster Bob Costas, most famous commentator in American sport and one of my sporting heroes.
Talk to him next about this whole issue of sports washing, virtue signalling.
Is this something athletes should be doing?
Should they leave it alone?
What does the World Cup tell us about this?
And what does he think of it?
Join Bob Costas after the bank.
Well, silly come Canyon West banned from Twitter again for posting a vile tweet of a swastika merger with the Star of David.
This came, of course, after he met with Donald Trump at Mur-a-Lago, along with another anti-Semite.
Should Trump denounce him, is it all too late?
We'll talk to the rabbi who addressed Trump's inauguration shortly.
But first, the World Cup in Qatar is becoming the most entertaining, perhaps, of all time.
A bit of disappointment for those who attempted to overshadow the tournament with sanctimonious virtue signalling, including memorably the Germany players who covered their mouths before their game against Japan before losing the game tier one and crashing out of the tournament.
They were widely mocked by Japanese supporters and Qatari TV hosts who covered their mouths and waved goodbye as the Germans got the first flight home.
Well Arsenal legend Arsene Wenger, now FIFA's head of development, summed it up rather well.
And the teams as well, who were mentally ready, like Jürgen said, at the mindset to focus on competition and not on political demonstrations.
Well, I'm thrilled to be joined now by the sportscasting legend, Bob Costas, one of America's greatest sporting commentators, a veteran of a record 12 Olympic Games, winning no fewer than 28 Emmy Awards for his peerless commentary.
Bob, what a treat to have you on Piers Morgan on Cesar.
Thank you so much.
Thanks, Piers.
Great to see you again, even from a distance.
I have one daytime Emmy, and I've never covered an Olympics, so you're slightly ahead of me, and I bow to your superiority quite willingly.
This whole issue, Bob, I just couldn't think of a better person to talk to about where the line is drawn between political activism or social justice activism for that matter, and sports and this issue of sport washing, whether it's in golf with the live golfers and the PGA at war, whether it's what we've been seeing in Qatar at the World Cup with people saying they're going to protest, then not protesting, then being ridiculed for it.
Others like the Iranian players making a genuinely powerful stand against oppression of their women back home.
Going right back perhaps to Colin Kaepernick, who was of course the NFL player who took the knee for the first time.
And the England players at this World Cup are still taking the knee in his honor, I guess, because he was the one who started it.
So it's a lot of stuff going on in this area.
What is your overview of political activism and sport?
I think, Pierce, we have to make distinctions from one situation to another, one person to another.
Just because I may agree with a general cause or issue and with the person's right to make a statement doesn't mean that I have to agree with everything they say under that banner.
Colin Kaepernick is a good example.
There's no question, even if some people may overstate the severity, there's no question that police reform is an important issue in the United States.
And where it needs to be reformed, the burden primarily falls upon people of color in the United States.
That's legitimate.
But then when Colin Kaepernick subsequently says, I don't vote because the oppressors will never allow you to vote your way out of your oppression, when he said that, Barack Obama was president.
I guess he didn't vote when Donald Trump ran against Hillary Clinton and then Donald Trump became president.
That's a silly and naive thing to say, even if I respect the initial point that Colin Kaepernick wanted to make.
Within this year's World Cup, the Iranians not only are making a very important point, it's a courageous point to make, because heaven knows what might happen to any of them when they return home.
And they're directly involved in that.
Some might say that others at a safe distance, covering their mouths or whatever, are merely virtue signals.
But then it all circles back to the IOC in their case, putting two Olympics in China, another one in Vladimir Putin's Russia, and FIFA now going to Qatar.
As you have stated previously, and I agree with this, obviously, every nation has flaws and problems and issues and things that they need to correct and shame in their past, and maybe in some cases in an ongoing way.
But then there are nations in the here and now, we're not talking about history, in the here and now that are fundamental human rights abusers.
Qatar is one of those.
China is certainly one of those.
Putin's Russia is one of those.
And these athletes will never have a platform that will draw as many eyes and make as large an impact as they do at an Olympics or at a World Cup.
And it's ironic that FIFA and the IOC say, let's keep politics out of this.
Please keep politics out of this.
But they're the ones who put politics in it by placing these events in places like Qatar and Sochi and in Beijing.
So as long as the protest, whatever it may be, is not within the match or the game itself, because people do want to watch the game or the match for its own sake, and it's very exciting.
I think you undermine your own cause if you get in the way of the game itself.
But surrounding the game, or for commentators in the programming that precedes the game or at halftime or post-game, then I think it's okay.
You see, well, A, a brilliant response, as I would have expected, and very thoughtful and nuanced in many places.
I would take issue, I think, about a couple of things you said.
The main one, I think, is this.
There's a lot of, I think, over-the-top virtue signaling about Qatar from the UK in particular.
Not from America, interestingly.
But in the UK, a lot of sort of anger built up in the very last minute about a World Cup that was awarded 12 years ago.
The Middle East has never had a World Cup.
If the stick to beat the Middle East on human rights is ill-treatment of migrant workers and LGBT rights, for example, then you're basically saying you can't have a sports tournament in the Middle East at all, because they would all have similar issues with migrant worker treatment and outlawing LGBT rights completely in most countries.
But you'd also have the same situation in Africa.
You'd have the same situation in China, the same situation in vast swathes of India, of Russia, and so on.
And so I think that what I would say back to you, Bob, on that point, once you start putting the moral halo on about human rights, I'm not sure you can end up with many places in the world which are clean enough to actually host, say, a World Cup.
And I'll throw it back to you in this way.
You and I have both actually got into trouble at different times in our careers in America.
Yours more successful than mine.
About gun control, for example.
You expressed a view about gun control when you were on air once and got a lot of blowback.
I did a lot more and got a lot more blowback and got told to go back to the UK.
But the next World Cup is in America, shared with Canada and Mexico.
Should people be taking a strident view, for example, about gun violence in America as an issue, about abortion laws, which have just dramatically changed, which are very contentious in many other parts of the world, what America's done there.
In other words, if you continue down the road of putting a halo on and deciding who is fit to host these things, I think you've got to be consistent and accept that every country, including America, including Britain, which helped America illegally invade Iraq, of course, in 2003, that we all have actually pretty big abuses, which would be quite hard to defend.
Yeah, there are matters of degree.
The points you make are legitimate.
And by the way, just parenthetically, as you know, my point about guns in America and as it affects athletes was to say that there is a gun culture in America, not to take issue with the fundamental idea of the Second Amendment, which is a big deal in the United States.
But even if you believe in the Second Amendment, you should also be able to recognize that there's a lot of irresponsibility surrounding guns and some of it had crossed over into sports.
So that was the comment I was trying to make.
But sometimes people get irrational about certain things, hear what they want to hear, and take it from there.
So forgive me for that parenthetical aside.
I think the point you're making is legitimate, but it's a question of degree.
If we're looking for a perfect nation, maybe you'd have to hold every Olympics in Switzerland, which ironically enough is where the IOC is located in Lausanne.
But we're talking about degree.
The United States most certainly has its problems.
And athletes historically and sometimes movingly have registered their complaints and their protests about that.
But Qatar, Putin's Russia, Beijing, they are fundamental human rights abusers.
It's definitive about them rather than flaws that the nations we're talking about, the United Kingdom or the UK, America, Canada, they are actively trying to address, however imperfectly, however haltingly, it's within their DNA.
It's within the American Constitution to address these inequities and injustices.
Whereas it is the policy of the governments of Qatar and China and Putin's Russia to oppress people and engage in, in many cases, Russia in this case, international treachery.
Did the United States make a huge mistake post-9-11 in invading Iraq?
Yes, they did.
But I think you could make a strong case that that is not fundamentally what the United States is about.
I mean, it's an interesting rejoinder.
I mean, I would say, having been in Qatar last week, there's a lot of, I think, resentment and raised eyebrows about what they perceive to be the West's moral hypocrisy.
And they feel quite strongly about it, that they've been over-demonized and the West under-demonizes itself and doesn't want to turn the same critical eye to its own moral failings.
And they pointed to, like in the UK, for example, we have appalling drug abuse now in our country.
It's sort of rife with drugs now.
Appalling knife crime.
you know all sorts of metrics for sort of moral uh degeneration if you like which is anathema to a lot of people in the middle east where they don't the drug drug laws are incredibly draconian you know there's very little knife crime of the kind we have in the uk and so on so it was actually being there on the ground was really quite interesting it's not to defend everything that they stand for but i do think it's a commonality through the middle east uh pretty much what qatar represents and they believe they're representing the whole region with the World Cup.
And I have to say, having been there, Bob, it was a very good atmosphere.
It felt very safe.
Everything was, you know, running very smoothly.
And it's not like, I know the Germans ran the trains well under Hitler.
It's more I was there and they all seem to be having a pretty good time, I have to say.
Well, the World Cup is a wonderful event.
And from what I hear from a distance, it has been run smoothly, just as you say.
One thing I heard repeatedly when I hosted the Olympics, I always asked the heads of the IOC when they brought them in for an interview, what is it with this seeming affinity for authoritarian nations with the IOC?
And the answer always was, we feel that by holding an Olympics anywhere, it helps to spread the Olympic ideals of equality and diversity and democracy.
It helps to spread those ideas.
Trump's Own Truth 00:14:30
How's that working out with China?
How's that working out with Putin's Russia?
And we'll see if there are any reforms in Qatar or Iran.
I tend to doubt it.
Right.
Bob, I could talk to you all night.
What I wanted to ask you before I let you go, you've interviewed so many fascinating people in the sporting world.
If you could literally, if it was your last hour on earth, which I hope won't come for a very long time, who would you, of every sportsman and woman you've ever met, who would you most like to spend that hour with?
Dead or alive?
Well, if it's the one.
All right, well, then you just answered the question, dead or alive, because of my affinity for baseball.
I would like to sit Babe Ruth down with Jackie Robinson.
Babe Ruth was the greatest player pre-integration.
Jackie Robinson is not the greatest player, although he's a great player, but he's perhaps the most significant player in the modern history of baseball.
And to have them talk not only about baseball, but about the country they grew up in.
Ruth at the turn of the century and Jackie Robinson in the middle of the 20th century.
That's the interview I'd like to conduct.
Brilliant.
I would choose Sir Donald Bradman, who statistically, Australian batsman, cricket, statistically the greatest sportsman of all time.
The gap between him and the second-placed international average player was greater than the gap between one and two of any other sport in the world.
You know, I once referred to Sir Donald in a piece on HBO as the Babe Ruth of cricket.
And in fact, there's a great picture of the two of them meeting.
It's a wonderful picture.
Yeah.
Bradman and Babe Ruth.
It's an amazing picture.
Bob, thank you so much for joining me.
I'm honest, I could talk to you all night.
You're such a fascinating guy, and I really appreciate it.
Thank you, Pierce.
Hope we talk again soon.
Good to talk to you.
All the best.
Bob Costas.
Well, coming up next, suspended from Twitter again.
This time, Kanye Yeh West posts a vile tweet of a swastika merger with the star of David.
He'd just come, of course, from a meeting with Donald Trump at Mur-a-Lago with another anti-Semite, but Trump hasn't denounced him yet.
Should he?
Or is it too late?
Rabbi Marvin Heyer, who addressed Trump's inauguration, thinks so.
He joins me live next.
Kanye West, or Ye, as he prefers to be known, is some genius, but also profoundly troubled.
His views about Jewish people are completely unacceptable.
I interviewed him six weeks ago and challenged him on what I felt was his anti-Semitic ranting at the time.
Our exposive exchange got many views and headlines around the world.
Let me ask you, Ye, if I can, about the allegations that you have made anti-Semitic comment.
When you said on Instagram, I'm a bit sleepy tonight, but when I wake up, I'm going DEF CON 3 on Jewish people.
What did you mean by going DEF CON 3 on Jewish people?
Being that I'm an entertainer, I've been wronged so many times by Jewish businessmen.
I didn't say DEF CON on anybody, though.
You said DEF CON 3 on Jewish people.
That is racism, Ye.
Are you sorry you said that?
Absolutely not.
You knew it was racist, but you decided to do that because people have been racist to you.
Is that your position?
I'm sorry for the people that are hurt.
I feel like I cause hurt and confusion.
Well, last week it emerged that Ye sat down at a private dinner at Mer-a-Lago with former President Donald Trump and a well-known Holocaust-denying anti-Semite, Nick Fuentes.
And the big question is, what should be done about that?
Should Trump be held accountable, given he's not denounced either of his dinner parties?
Well, I'm now joined by the man known as Hollywood Rabbi Marvin Hayes, the founder of Los Angeles' Simon Riesenfahl Center and his Museum of Tolerance.
He also spoke at Donald Trump's inauguration, the first Orthodox Jewish religious leader to address the ceremony, and joins me now.
Rabbi Hi, thank you very much indeed for joining me.
I appreciate it.
What was your reaction?
What was your reaction when you heard about this dinner?
Not just with Donald Trump seeing Kanye West after all he's been saying and in fact since that dinner far worse things again, but also this character Nick Fuentes who by any yardstick is a repulsive anti-Semite.
Absolutely.
Outrageous and unbecoming of President Trump whose children are Jews.
And here, as you know in the Hollywood Reporter, here's the photograph of him hugging West when in 19, this was in 2018.
So in 2018, he shows everybody that he loves the guy.
And then this anti-Semite makes these horrible comments.
Jews were born into money.
We need a government of Christians.
Jews can be here, but they can't make our laws.
That would be news.
In other words, he's saying that the Jews can live in the United States.
They can't have any positions because he's a notorious anti-Semite.
And President Trump needs to do what President Biden did, which is to condemn it.
If he fails to condemn it, he's as guilty as they are.
Well, that's what I think.
I think, in a way, it was terrible to have this dinner with these two people.
But it was also reprehensible.
Even after the Fiori that blew up, he still hasn't condemned them.
And we've now seen this unedifying spectacle of Kanye West going on a conspiracy shock jock Alec Jones' show and saying he admires Hitler.
And then he posts to Twitter a swastika in a star of David.
I mean, to me, Kanye West is done.
That should be the last we see of him in a public domain.
For that alone.
Absolutely.
And President Trump, He's announced he's running for president.
I'll tell you one thing.
Any Jew that votes for him under these circumstances, it would be astonishing to me.
And his family must be embarrassed.
You know, his family hasn't said anything.
There's nothing to say.
Here's a president that basically announces himself that he's running for president and then has the excuse, why did you invite these people right now to meet with you?
Oh, he says, I didn't know.
It's on my agenda.
That's nonsense.
But you mean an assistant for the president doesn't know that these two anti-Semites are arriving to meet with President Trump.
It's complete nonsense.
I mean, the reason I know it's nonsense, I was at Mer-a-Lago interviewing President Trump back in April, and it's teeming with Secret Service.
You don't think they go over every single person with a fine tooth comb?
All you're going to do is Google Nick Fuentes, and up comes this litany of anti-Semitic outrages that have spewed from his mouth.
Absolutely.
And the only way out of this is for him, if he wants to, look, I would say this.
Any Jew that votes for President Trump, if he doesn't apologize and recognize that what he did is outrageous, I would be shocked.
I completely agree.
And what should happen with Kanye West now?
He calls himself Ye now, but in the immediate aftermath of some of his anti-Semitic ranting, you saw horrible anti-Semitic placards go up over bridges in Los Angeles where you are.
As a rabbi in Hollywood, how did that make you feel?
Terrible.
And Simon Wiesenthal, once I asked Simon Wiesenthal, why do you live in Vienna, Simon?
The war's over.
You got all these Nazis.
Why are you living in Vienna?
He says, I'm living in Vienna because there are still Nazis there.
And here's my point.
If Simon Wiesenthal were alive today, he'd be living in the United States because that's where the bigots and the haters are.
What a terrible, what a terrible twist and turn of history.
Yes, absolutely awful.
Rabbi Hyatt, thank you so much for joining me.
I really appreciate it.
I completely agree with everything you've said.
I think it's reprehensible that Trump had this dinner.
I think it's even worse that he hasn't denounced the people that he had it with, particularly given what has now been said by Kanye West, and particularly given that his own daughter is now Jewish and is married to a Jewish man.
To me, it's all completely unacceptable.
And I really appreciate you taking the time to come on the show.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Well, coming next, our shameless former health secretary isn't satisfied just going into the jungle.
He's now brought a book out blaming everybody but himself, and in particular, blaming care workers for spreading COVID in care homes.
What reaction from my panelists?
Welcome back.
Let's talk now to my stunning pack this evening, with one exception, obviously, with Emily Sheffield, so editor of the Delhi American Grand, political journalist Ava Santina.
Welcome to all of you.
Well, let's start with the beast in the middle.
Matt Hancock.
We've managed to go through a whole show without mentioning him yet, but this volume of diaries he's brought out, which looks suspiciously not like actual diaries to me, the stuff he's written after the event.
The thing that's really incensed me is that apart from the fact he takes no accountability for anything himself, is the way he blames care workers for spreading COVID in care homes.
Not himself for taking old people out of hospital without testing them and putting them into care.
Care workers risking their lives.
Yeah, that's Matt Hancock all over.
And I think that book, he says it's his diaries.
I think it should go straight in the fiction section of any shop because he's not taking any responsibility.
We can see how he's going to play now at the inquiry and why he went on IMAS Celeb and sat there with a toad on his head.
He wants to turn himself into some personality because he can't face the truth of what happened.
We're afraid, and we know COVID was a huge crisis and would have hit any government, but he made big, fatal errors and he won't own up to them.
Is there also something slightly distasteful?
He keeps talking about his great affair of his heart and everything and parading the new girlfriend around that he was fired over because they were caught roping in Breach of Loch Donalds.
And he's got his family watching all this going down.
It just all seems very distasteful to me.
Yeah, it's also quite farcical that this man somehow managed to run the health service, managed to have a family life, have an affair and also write in a diary or anything.
Like you're telling me he went home and wrote Dear Diary.
I just don't believe it.
And the fact that that poor woman is basically being trounced out for the public to assess, I think it's really quite disgusting.
Well, there are just ways of doing this.
And it seems to me, I'm not making a moral judgment about him.
He's perfectly entitled to follow his heart wherever he wants to do it.
But it is bizarre to see a politician so brazen, like, here's the new love of my life.
And forget everybody else.
And by the way, I'm not to blame for anything that happened in the pandemic.
Everybody else is, especially you care workers.
There's something so shameless about it all.
Yeah, but I think he's gone with the plan, whether we agree with it or not, that if the only way to sort of save himself was it did have to be a real affair of the heart.
Otherwise, the whole thing just looks horrendous.
Right.
Because he's broken the rules to have a bit of a fling with, you know, someone he's working with, while his wife, who allegedly had long COVID, was at home looking after the three children.
So I think that's his defense, isn't it?
That this was a true love affair.
To be fair, they've gone through the most gruesome 18 months and they are still together.
So I would say that was a true...
I think there was true love.
You can wish them happiness.
I mean, I bumped into him at Heath Row when he came back.
Literally.
Bumped into him.
It was one of the most awkward 100-meter dashes in my life.
I thought you were joking.
I didn't write that.
I literally bumped into him.
I didn't write that.
It was just me, him, his assistant, and my driver for 100 yards, right?
And you imagine, because I've been kicking him all over the place.
And I made small talk with him.
And I said, look, on one level, I admire your balls in doing it, right?
Because to put yourself into that.
But then there's something so shameless about him.
Oh, he's totally shameless.
That I'm not entirely sure I do admire his bulls because what he does is so shameless on every level.
There is a bit of a Harry and Megan about him of creating his own truth.
Now you can give verifiable facts to him that show it's not true.
What he says, it just ain't the case.
And he'll deny it.
He will brazen it out.
Well, you've raised the spectre of the other two.
What are your thoughts about this Netflix series?
Look, I'm not going to agree with what Kevin just said because I think that Matt Hancock, I think this is an allegory for what entirely happened throughout COVID.
I think that he lied to his wife and I think he lied during COVID.
I'm really looking forward to the Netflix documentary.
I think this is the moment for Megan to really, you know, speak freely about it.
She'd be speaking freely about gobblethon for the last two years.
Am I wrong?
I have to say it is the royal family and if they've got something to say about what happened, then let them say it and let the royals say that's not true.
But I think they should have their say and I think everyone's coming down on them incredibly hard.
I'm sorry, we've just, someone who's just watched the fifth series of The Crown, are we forgetting the Prince Charles interview?
Are we forgetting the Tampax conversation?
Are we forgetting what these two have stopped?
These two have stopped yapping to you.
They've already done Oprah.
They've done James Fawn.
They've done the podcast.
They've done this.
They never stopped talking.
Yes, but I'm sorry, Piers.
Everyone rounds up.
Unfortunately, we've got to leave it there.
Sorry, the public and I love it.
I've been ranting about this all night.
Thank you to my pack.
Keep it uncensored.
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