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Oct. 27, 2022 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
47:02
20221027_piers-morgan-uncensored-leaky-sue-harry-the-spare
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Behind The Prime Minister's Judgment 00:14:45
Welcome to Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Coming up on tonight's programme, as the pressure increases over Rishi Sunak's controversial rehiring of his Home Secretary, we'll ask, would a braver man have left Sawela on the back benches?
The NHS finally gets tough on the extremist trans lobby.
So are you finally moving into a new era of common sense trans advice?
And just 50 days after the death of the Queen, Harry reveals the title of his much anticipated memoir.
But is it time the monarchy threw the book at the increasingly disrupted prince?
Live from London, this is Piers Morgan Uncensored with Emily Sheffield and Douglas Murray.
Good evening from London and welcome to Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Myself and Douglas Murray are for the last time filling in for Piers before he returns from his sun lounger.
So it's been a pivotal few days in British politics with the livelihoods of millions of you at home set to be impacted hopefully for the better by the changes of this week.
Yet even in this most serious of times the dreaded identity politics has had to infest its mainstream namesake.
First up was the controversy over whether former comedian and future Labour MP and present attention seeker Eddie Izard could stand.
While the possibility of Isard standing on an all-female shortlist seemed to flummox Labour leader Kirstama, Conservative MP for Ashfield Lee Anderson wasn't exactly on the fence.
I'm going to be honest, now I'm controversial.
As always, if he does get elected and I'm still here, I shall be following him into the toilet.
Ignoring the slightly troubling question as to why Mr Anderson would want to follow anyone at all into the toilets, I'm bewildered that putting a man onto an all-woman's shortlist is even up for debate.
It's not much better across the pond where I spend most of my time these days.
One prominent American broadcaster decided to consider our new Prime Minister, this week's Prime Minister, solely through his race.
You hear a lot of the people saying, oh, they're taking over.
You know, now the Indians are going to take over Great Britain and what's next and what?
And I always find myself going, so what?
That's the fantastically ignorant Trevor Noah there, bringing into disrepute all decent men with two first names.
Klausevitz wrote that war is politics by other means.
But in 2022, identity politics has become war by other means, a way of eliminating dissent and forcing entire continents to think in exactly the same way.
But Putin, the economy, mass migration, our times and our troubles are too important for us to get distracted by pronouns, critical race theory, or even the great enormous wisdom of Meghan Markle.
But first, number 10 has given its full backing to Swaila Braverman, insisting she maintains strong relationships with the security services.
That despite MPs from all sides raising concerns about the Home Secretary's reappointment, six days, six days after being forced out, following a misdirected email.
Last night on this very show, former Tory chairman, Jake Berry, said Braverman committed multiple breaches of the ministerial code.
Listen to this.
From my own knowledge, there were multiple breaches of the ministerial code.
In fact, from multiple breaches of the ministerial code.
It was sent from a private email address to another member of parliament.
She then sought to copy that individual's wife and accidentally sent it to a staffer in Parliament.
To me, that seems a really serious breach, especially when it was documents relating to cybersecurity, as I believe.
To discuss whether Swela is going to prove to be the UTM's first big troublemaker, let's cross to former Boris Backer, now Rishi convert, Conservative MP, Justin Tomlinson.
Good evening.
Thank you, Justin, for joining us.
Let's just start with the question of Suella Braverman.
Is she the Prime Minister's first liability?
Keir Starmer and the Labour Party seem to think this is the great weakness of the PM.
Well, I mean, the opposition don't like Sawella because she is a strong Home Secretary who understands the need to crack down on crime, be tough with our control of our borders.
And as we saw today, we've now reached three quarters of our 20,000 extra police officers' targets.
And they're desperate for us not to be on the front foot on law and order issues, which is something that they lost a long time ago, trust within their own voters.
Look, she made an error.
She made an error of a judgment, but unlike many politicians, she put her hand up, she took responsibility, and she returned to the back benches now.
But can you imagine any other job?
She would still be there on the back benches with the likes of me.
But look, we've got a new Prime Minister and a new new secretary.
Thanks, Justin.
But look, can you imagine any other job in, say, the private sector where you had to leave your job, were fired or resigned, and then got reappointed a week later because you said, sorry, I did indeed do all this stuff wrong?
Well, look, as I said, she took responsibility for her error of judgment.
She paid the price because she returned to the back benches.
We have a new Prime Minister.
And yes, people make mistakes, private sector, public sector, we all make mistakes.
But she is the best person to be the Home Secretary.
The Prime Minister will have no doubt had conversations with her, and I trust his judgment on this.
But his judgment, his opening speech to everybody outside number 10, was to restore integrity.
And then hours later, he brings back a Home Secretary who had only just been removed for breaking the ministerial code.
Now, she'd only been out of the job, having resigned over that, for six days.
Now, one understands there might have been a bit of backroom dealing because she was one of the right supporters, supporters on the right of the party, that threw her weight behind Rishi in quite a surprise move, actually.
But do you think there's any chance he's considering this has all turned out to be a bit too much of a headache?
No, I mean, he would have looked at what had happened.
I think the fact that she put up the money.
I know, but Justin, the fact is it is dominating the headlines.
Surely this is not what Rishi planned.
One assumes he's hoping that he can barrel his way out of this, but I don't see this as a great start to his tenure in number 10.
Yeah, well, you're going to get opposition MPs who don't like strong characters in politics, and Swella has that in bucket loads because she's not afraid to take a strong position around law and order.
I think she ruffles a lot of feathers within the Conservative Party.
No, I think she's well respected amongst the Conservative Party, and she was an obvious choice when she was first selected to be the Home Secretary and continues to have the support.
So why do you think Jake Mary landed her in it last night?
Well, you know, Jake's now got the freedom of the backbenches, but I don't remember him calling that out whilst he was serving as party chairman.
Look, she made an error of judgment.
Nobody's denying that, least of all her.
She put her hands up, she took responsibility.
Too many politicians don't.
They hide away from responsibility.
She took that.
Prime Minister doesn't make a judgment.
I think she's a result.
It was only when the evidence was put in front of her that she agreed to it.
But I mean, I think we can all agree she was having a fight with Liz Truss over immigration.
For sure.
Justin, we've only got a few seconds, but tell us, you're on your third leader this year.
We've got the third prime minister this year.
The Conservative Party is way behind in the polls.
If you had an election today, you'd be crushed by the Labour Party.
Do you think your party can actually do anything to come back from this state it's in?
Well, yeah, the opinion polls were certainly character building.
You can't ignore those when you ultimately have to have an election every five years.
And actually, that's why I had to agonise over the decision who to support in this leadership contest.
I was a friend of Boris.
I supported him.
I admired his ability to reach across traditional political divides.
But the country needs calm and stability, and there were too many potential distractions with Boris.
And what Rishi was able to do was unite the party.
And it didn't matter whether you were One Nation, ERG, Remainer, or a lever, he had at his disposal the majority of colleagues supporting him, which meant he could then select a cabinet of best talents, experienced people who can deliver quick, tangible, positive difference to people with financial sustainability underlying all of our decisions.
And this matters to the public.
It's their mortgages, it's their pensions.
We get these things right.
We're back in a fighting chance for that unprecedented fifth term.
There's a big if there, but thank you very much, Justin, for joining us.
Joining us now in the studio is former advisor to Boris Johnson, Oscar Redrup, and talk TV contributor Marina Perkis.
Thanks so much for joining us.
First of all, Oscar, what do you make of that?
The party's unbelievably behind in the polls.
It would be crushed if there is an election today.
Is there any way back for the party that you've worked for?
Well, it's actually really interesting when you watch an MP there having to take a line on an issue that is very contentious and almost potentially not quite believing it himself or not quite knowing it's going to hold.
The party does have a very...
That's a partly a hangover from Boris Johnson where they were sent out to defend all these decisions only to almost, as they went on air.
I mean, one can sympathise that some of them are feeling a bit nervous about defending their prime minister.
I do understand that.
And sorry, and with Liz Trump.
But you do have to measure cut through.
And this is a really interesting issue.
And the Suella Bravman issue is a really good example of that, where, yes, we're talking about it in the media and opposition MPs are, maybe even some backbench Tory MPs are, but ultimately, are people down the pubs and bars talking about these texts that went out by a Home Secretary?
I'm not sure they are yet.
Well, they don't.
They could snowball, don't they?
They're coming over in the boats.
Exactly.
And Suella, this is the thing with Suella.
She is so in touch with what the Conservative Party view as the key Home Office issues on police.
Well, I know that's an immigration party, but in two years' time, they've got to go to the country.
And I would hold that that video from the Conservative conference, when she talked with sort of utter glee on her face of her dream of sending refugees to Rwanda, which A was a completely failed policy.
But I think that won't lie very comfortably with a lot of centrist voters who may swing either way to Labour or Conservative.
Marina, what are your thoughts on this?
My thoughts are that any credibility that Rushi Sunak had went up in smoke the moment that he appointed her into the cabinet.
You can have...
You might say that, but he's actually ahead in the polls of Keir Starmer today.
His party is behind.
He is ahead.
He's on 38.
Keir Starmer's on 37.
I think that's just because there's been some positive movement after the whole fiasco that we've seized.
You've just said he's lost his credibility.
Clearly, with the voters, according to that poll, he hasn't lost his credibility at all.
I think it's one.
It's cut through colours.
It's one poll, and I think everyone will see what he's done here.
It's an ERG pandering move.
Let's be honest.
Compassion.
Yes, but this poll wasn't of the ERG.
This was of voters.
I think this is worrying.
I think this is worrying for Kier Starmer.
I don't think it is.
And actually, I think, you know what?
Leave Swiller in post.
Let her have more breaches because she's known as Leaky Sue, for goodness sake.
How has this person been allowed?
So you're not convinced that the MI5 training she's about to get is going to help.
And also a bit late in the day after the horse has bolted.
I mean, you've got a home secretary who has to be trained whilst in post not to breach security protocols and has to have like a learner program with MI5.
It's not ideal, is it?
But not when you're home secretary, not when you're the government.
I think that's a bit big art.
There are some points that I do actually have to agree with.
But what I would say is Labour don't want to fall in the trap of forgetting about the issues of the day and falling into kind of just trying to remove secretaries of state and not actually addressing the cost of living crisis and issues that do deeply matter to people.
That's Rishi Sunak's very, very, very narrow, I think, route to victory.
If he just keeps, because every leader needs a kind of gust of wind behind them.
Boris's was Brexit, and his is the financial crisis that we're currently competent.
Of course, you worked with Boris Johnson.
Perhaps then I can ask you the inevitable question, have we actually seen the last of him?
I think I got asked this last week and I kind of thought yes.
And then over the weekend, obviously that turned out potentially not to be the case.
Look, I think with Boris, and I really genuinely believe this, the guy's complicated.
He is a complex person.
He has faults.
But what he did in terms of the Ukraine-Russia situation, I think if a peaceful resolution is found in time, will be remembered in history for decades to come.
I think what we're hearing, I saw a few stories that he's planning on taking a job on the international stage, independently raising money for the Ukraine.
Overegg this thing for what he did for Ukraine.
Don't forget that for years, both Boris Johnson and previous Conservative governments denied any aid to Ukraine because they didn't want to ruffle Putin's feathers.
And now he's been painted as some sort of hero for what?
Doing what any other sane PM would do?
I don't think that's completely fair because we actually trained a lot of the army far faster than anyone else in the EU did.
And we've sent weapons in far faster than the other people.
And remember that.
And remember that's a really good question.
When it came to matter, he was the prime minister at the time and he oversaw that stopping.
Look, hang on.
I don't think any sane government.
Look, sane governments across the country.
So you can't take away their successes and blame them for every failure.
I'm afraid.
Look, the Germans weren't going to arm the Ukrainians at the beginning.
The Germans wouldn't even allow British planes to fly over German territory to arm the Ukrainians.
So if you're talking about sane governments, you've got to remember that there are a lot of insane governments by your standards.
Trusting Leadership In Hard Times 00:02:24
So we are now one of those.
But he does also, just really quickly, he does actually want...
You forget again, you know, there were millions of people who voted Conservative, who've never voted Conservative before.
And I think that ultimately he will just want what's best for those communities.
And if that's trusting, you know, the time moving forward to Rishi Sunak in terms of leading us through a very difficult financial situation.
Boris Johnson cares about communities.
Of course.
I mean, that's, I mean, ultimately.
Really?
The man who goes on holiday.
He's supposed to be supposed to.
This is during the parliamentary time.
That's what I've heard.
Something that's already dominating.
We've had a lot on immigration and swallow bravo and dominating our attention today.
But we've got Prince Harry, as we've seen for the first time, the cover of his book, his autobiography, which is landing in January, we now know.
It was going to land next summer, so it does look like he's managed to persuade his publishers to move it forward to January, because as anyone who works in publishing knows, you don't publish big books in January.
But you do publish them just before the coronation.
Yes, but the coronation is much later.
So I'm assuming there's been a bit of toing and throwing there.
But you've seen the title, there it is.
It's entitled Spare.
Now, I would have thought, given the controversy recently, the Queen's death, the falling out with his family, there was a moment at that, there was a moment at that funeral where you saw them all coming together for a while.
This is absolutely going to throw any kind of mutual coming together again out the window.
What's your thoughts?
Why has he done it?
Well, I feel really, again, I feel really in a strange place with this because if it's his truth and it comes from him and he really wanted to do this, then I think there should be a space in the world for that to be allowed to happen.
My suspicion is that...
The £36 million he was paid for it had nothing to do with him wanting to get into that.
Well, apparently.
Right, okay, that does change a little bit.
No, but my point is...
He's got such a problem with his voicing his views, voicing his experience.
No, I agree.
By all chance, he did have...
Right, I get, I know it, life of privilege, and I'm no royalist, but he also suffered with stuff.
He also suffered with the fact that his family didn't support him with his father giving him terrible advice with regards to the media and saying, well, I had to deal with it, so you're going to have to deal with it.
No parents would have.
36 million.
Marina and Oscar, thank you very much.
But I've got to say, Oscar, you can't come back again because you used the phrase, his truth.
Social Contagion And Gender Views 00:14:54
That is the most, that is the only triggering thing you can say to me.
His truth, if we have your truth, my truth, there's no truth.
Anyway.
Still to come tonight.
First reviews of Prince Harry's books before 9pm.
And has the NHS finally transitioned to a sensible position on what some people describe as teenager gender confusion?
We're back in three.
Welcome back.
MHS England has unveiled new guidance for youngsters distressed about their gender.
Doctors should now carefully explore all underlying health problems, being mindful that this may be a transient phase.
But extremists continue to intimidate anyone who disagrees with them.
Just this week, Cambridge University had to apologise to students for inviting Helen Joyce, who believes that one's sex cannot be changed.
Luckily, Helen Joyce won't be silenced, and she's with us now, alongside Ollie London, who de-transitioned and now lives as a man again.
Good evening, both of you.
Thank you so much for coming on the show.
Now, Ollie, I wanted to talk to you first.
You were very keen to come on tonight and tell us a bit about your story.
You transitioned to a woman and now you're back as a man.
What led to that decision?
Did you feel forced into it?
Just give us a little bit of detail.
So my whole life, I was actually very unhappy with the way I looked.
So it actually started out as me wanting to change, wanting to look more perfect, more beautiful.
So I kind of went on this quest since 2013 to undergo surgery to try and achieve perfection.
And I've kind of realized that perfection is not attainable.
So do you think that was more sort of body dysmorphia?
I think so.
I've come to realize now I've had so many surgeries, about 32 actual plastic surgeries in total.
As you can see, I've got so many scars kind of all over my face.
So I feel like that's how it started off.
And then I got to a point earlier this year where I still hadn't achieved happiness.
So I thought maybe I should be a trans woman.
Maybe that's why I'm unhappy.
So, you know, I was trans for six months.
You know, I had the facial feminisation surgery.
I had 11 procedures.
I had the hair extensions.
And I just realized, you know, it just wasn't me, it wasn't who I was inside.
Were you taking any advice from anyone?
Were you seeking medical help, psychiatric help?
What kind of advice were you being offered at the time?
It was more seeing things online.
You know, I'm a social media person, so I'm always using TikTok and I'm not sure.
And we've got some pictures here of you as a woman.
So how long ago was that?
Was that quite recently?
That was actually at London Fashion Week.
So that was literally a month ago.
So kind of a drastic change.
But I'm always kind of changing my looks.
I'm always kind of changing up.
But yeah, I kind of saw on social media, you know, people constantly changing their identities.
And I thought, you know, why not?
Let me try it.
Let me see if it's for me.
But even as a trans woman, I was very respectful for women.
I would never use women's restrooms or changing rooms.
I never wanted women to feel threatened by me.
I was just kind of, I guess I was having an identity crisis or gender dysphoria, which a lot of kids have these days.
So I just want to speak up to try and raise awareness that, you know, kids should not be transitioning.
Well, Helen, this comes into something that you wrote about in your book.
I mean, there's been this whole question in recent years about suggestibility, which you address and have a lot of thoughts on.
And also this question of whether people who feel in some way uncomfortable in their bodies or not perfect, as Ollie said, are being sort of pushed down this road of saying, well, if you're a teenager and you're uncomfortable in your body, instead of being just a teenager, maybe you're actually in the wrong sex.
I mean, we know all people are quite easy to influence in this sort of way.
Like diseases get shaped in doctors' waiting rooms between the doctor and the patient.
And then the media play a part in that.
And in the last 10 years or so, I would say social media has come in to make a big, big difference there.
So yeah, I mean, I think it's inarguable that things like anorexia are social contagions.
And I think we're seeing a social contagion now with gender dysphoria.
That kids who would never have thought to themselves that there was any question that they could change sex.
I mean, that's not actually possible.
But, you know, get that idea into their heads.
They pick that idea up online.
Then they present it to doctors who are thinking about an old-fashioned way to look at this.
There are a tiny number of people who have this thing called gender dysphoria.
They haven't updated their thinking for modern times and social media.
They're diagnosing those kids and they're putting them down a pathway that it's hard to get off.
Now, we mentioned earlier what happened with you at Cambridge University this week.
Maybe tell us a little bit about this because it sort of seems surprising to me of all the people to sort of try to depict as some mad right-wing maniac nutter, I don't think of you as being number one on the list.
Almost everybody I know I'd put on the list ahead of you.
So how come you've become uninvitable at Cambridge University?
I mean, all I can say is I think the world has gone mad.
I mean, all I do is say there are two sexes and you can't change sex.
In some situations, that matters, especially for women.
That's it.
That's my three beliefs.
They're not even beliefs, they're just facts.
But it turns out they're inconvenient facts for people who think about the world through identities and who like to think about everything as changeable, everything as mutable.
You know, it's this modern sort of queer theory influenced way of thinking about identity, that all boundaries are fluid and that everything that is fixed is bad and constraining and that we have to try and overturn everything.
So I guess that, you know, somebody who just says very boringly, like mums are very boring people who say to you, you know, pack an umbrella, do you know where you're going?
And by the way, sorry, you can't have everything you want in life.
You know, that didn't go down very well.
I just wanted, because I wanted the pair of you to talk about this in a way.
You talk about the reasons why people are confusing sex with gender identity.
And one of them I thought was very interesting was socialization.
And because of you having lots of wanting to be more beautiful, you say that being a woman has now is considered by, say, the trans community, some members of the trans community, that that's about how we behave.
But that's not true.
We're talking about a biological, a biological difference between us.
I mean, we're mummies.
But I think it's interesting that you pick up on the beautifying of us.
And that's exactly what you were trying to do.
And confusing that maybe with wanting to change sex.
Is that something?
You know, I definitely feel I had gender dysphoria.
And I definitely think, you know, when we look at television shows, I mean, you have some really shocking things like on Channel 4, when they had the other day the trans person ripping all their clothes off, playing a piano with their penis.
I mean, that is just beyond shocking.
And unfortunately, when women try to speak out and say, you know, this is not good for our kids, they get cancelled, they get silenced, just like J.K. Rowling.
And, you know, I think it's wrong.
And I think there are so many people out there trying to push these ideas on young people.
And I think I was one of those people influenced by that.
You know, I was just chasing perfection, but I thought, you know, maybe I'm trapped because everybody else is saying, oh, you can change this, you can change that.
I understand biology, and I also agree with Helen.
You know, you can't change biology.
But I think with me, it was more trying to change my looks.
Let me make an observation, by the way, Holland, as we start to wrap up.
In the States, the trans debate is nowhere near as advanced as it is here in the UK.
And the thing that is missing there, and what we seem to have here, is left-wing women, among others, speaking up, gay women, straight women.
And that seems to be changing the debate.
You're obviously part of this, but do you agree?
I mean, there's a shift going on.
Yes, I think that in America, it's sadly become a totally polarized issue.
That if you're a Democrat, you have to believe that people can change sex and that gender identity overwrites sex.
And if you're a Republican, you can be against it.
But then there's a bunch of other things that you believe that a lot of women would find quite uncongenial.
And so each side sort of looks at the other side and says, you know, look at the mad things they believe.
Look what they'll do to us.
Whereas here, I think there are much more cross-party allegiances and much more cross-cutting sort of approaches to it and much more rationalist and focused on children as well.
That's the important thing.
We're misleading children.
I mean, Ollie's a grown-up.
If he wants to do these things to himself, that's one thing.
But leading a child down that path.
Children believe what adults tell them.
But also, I think the big thing that we're discussing is that this, this, it needs to be discussed.
It needs to be debated without being shouted down.
Of course, there are differences of opinions.
There are members of the trans community who want to bring their issues to the light, but we should be able to discuss it as adults and not be silenced on either side.
Including at universities.
And if you can't talk about this at universities, where could you?
Nowhere, apparently.
Thank you so much for both coming on the show tonight.
We really appreciate it.
Still to come?
Spare part.
Harry reveals the title of his upcoming memoir.
And after Trevor Noah implied, we are a nation of racists, we'll discuss whether he is right back in three.
Welcome back.
It hasn't been the best of weeks for late-night American talk show hosts, but Trevor Noah very much delivered a hold my beer moment to James Corden last night.
Just take a look at this.
Watching the story of Rishi Sunak becoming England's first prime minister of colour, of Indian descent, and all of these things, and then seeing the backlash is one of the more telling, it's just one of the more telling things about how people view the role that they or their people have played in history.
And what I mean by that is this.
You hear a lot of the people saying, oh, they're taking over.
You know, now the Indians are going to take over Great Britain and what's next?
And I always find myself going, so what?
What?
What's the backlash exactly?
Who's seen the backlash?
This seems to be an entirely imaginary thing.
It's like this is just happening in Trevor Noah's head.
I don't know if I missed something, but I think not.
Now, joining us from Alabama to discuss Noah's bizarre rant is American political commentator C.J. Pearson.
Thanks for having me.
It's great to have you with us.
What did you make of this, CJ?
I mean, it just strikes me as something for a different planet.
Yeah, but it's also a broken record.
Unfortunately, we have to deal with that here in America every single day of people like Trevor Noah looking to blame racism on every single thing in the world.
You know, they call our country fundamentally racist.
And I guess now you guys are getting the same treatment.
But notice in that segment, he didn't point out the people that are actually attacking the new prime minister because they're not from the Conservative Party.
So I wonder who those people must be.
No, but apparently this all came from one caller calling into a popular radio show here.
I mean, there has been...
Rishi Sunak's coronation as our prime minister has been welcomed by everybody.
Including by President Biden, who called him Rashad Sanook or something.
But yeah, anyway, apart from that, everyone seems to have welcomed it warmly.
Why do you think he's so keen to paint the UK as having a problem with us having a prime minister with Indian parents?
Because he doesn't possess the deaf to talk about real issues.
He doesn't possess the deaf to talk about global inflation and doesn't possess the death to talk about UK politics or anything like that.
But what he can do is make everyone out to be some racist boogeyman.
This is exactly what the left does every single day, where there isn't an issue with race at all.
They make it to be as if it's something that you should consume yourself with every single day.
People are championing the new prime minister of UK and for good reason.
It's a huge milestone.
But let's also point out the historical fact that every single modern PM that we've had that's been a female has been from the Conservative Party.
And now the first Indian English men who is a British PM from the Conservative Party.
Where's Labour at on that?
I don't see him at all.
Well, one of the other interesting things about this, CJ, is the fact that all this has this weird American lens put over it.
I mean, you know, every country has its own historical problems.
Every country has its own issues.
But this is like watching a, well, first of all, Trevor Noah who grew up in South Africa.
So maybe he sort of sees some of this through the lens of apartheid.
But he then transfers that onto America and there from that transfers that onto the UK.
And it seems to be just, it just doesn't work.
And the most remarkable thing about our prime minister is the fact that race and religion weren't an issue at any stage in the campaign for anyone.
Nobody said he should get the job because of his race or his religion.
They said he should get the job because they thought he was the best person for the job.
Yeah.
You know, and what's most exhausting about the narrative that you're hearing from Trevor, and this has plagued America for far too long, is this perpetual need to be a victim and to see victimhood in every single story.
This is a moment of triumph.
This is a moment of something that you would think Trevor Noah would be heralding.
But instead, he's trying to point out racism simply where it isn't.
And you have to wonder, why is there that incessant need for them to have racism in a society?
Why is there this incessant need for them to have someone be a victim?
It just goes to show that the only thing they know how to do is divide and conquer.
They seek to do that through race, religion, and so much more.
And yet they blame conservatives for doing just that, but they do it every single day.
But I think, is it not true to say there are still, there are still problems with race, and we have still some issues here in Britain.
And you still definitely have some issues in America.
And these problems exist around the world.
But it seems like a sort of cry wolf situation here where wasn't he celebrating how enthusiastic we were with our new prime minister?
It wouldn't get him the ratings, that's why.
Well, I think it's just made him look rather stupid and ill-informed myself.
Yeah, you're completely right.
As a person of color, I completely agree with you.
But the thing about race here is if you call everything racist, no one's going to believe you when something actually is racist.
And that's the thing that these people don't understand.
That's why he's undermining real issues.
Yeah, exactly that.
Exactly.
This is a moment to be celebrated and not shamed.
And it's unfortunate that Trevor decided to reign on what otherwise is a very historic moment in the UK right now.
And what about in America, CJ?
How's this gone down?
Is Trevor Noah's ratings and the late night shows going to go up or down on the basis of this?
Well, notice Trevor Noah is leaving the late night show.
So I guess that says everything that needs to be said about his incredible career here.
He can go out on a sour note.
Thanks, EJ.
Exactly that.
Asylum System Overwhelmed By Chaos 00:07:35
Thanks so much for joining us.
Thank you.
Well, in Britain, we undoubtedly do have problems.
A report released today revealed the government is spending £5.6 million a day housing asylum seekers that could pay for 16,000 hospital beds.
Of the 38,000 illegal immigrants crossing the channel this year, over 10,000 were Albanian men, despite no conflict in the Balkans for over 25 years.
Have we lost control?
Joining us now, Chair of Migrant Watch, Alf Mehmet and Steve Valdis-Simmons, Refugee and Migrant Rights Programme Director at Amnesty International.
Welcome.
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thanks for being here.
Thank you so much for being with us today.
Tell me, do you get a sense that the government has actually got a plan to stem, to stop the tide of little boats coming over?
And also, once they're here, it seems that the centres that they use for processing are being overwhelmed and visas are being stuck in the system.
We've got 120, I've been doing 110 and 120,000 visas, which is waiting to be processed, meaning that many desperate refugees are being left sitting in hotels when they could be building new lives here, including 10,000 refugees that we invited from Afghanistan.
Alf, what's your opinion?
We're in a mess.
Unquestionably, we are in a total mess.
The system is overwhelmed.
The resources available to deal with those coming are totally inadequate.
And frankly, up until now, I think we haven't had a clue as to how to stop those coming across the channel from streaming across in ever greater numbers.
I think Suella Braverman actually is finally someone who may well be able to get a grip and deal with this.
Back it up with what proof.
Sorry, back it up with what proof?
Well, that's my question.
That's a feeling.
That's not a fact or a proof.
Having observed home secretaries, having worked for many of them as an immigration officer, what I hear from her is absolutely spot on.
And guess what?
This is why...
But what have you heard from her?
What have you heard from her?
Hold on.
This is why everyone is turning against her now, because Labour is frankly afraid that she's actually going to get it done.
What she's going to get it done because I have not heard a cohesive plan from the government at all.
She's going to get it done, A, by talking to the French, which is an old thing.
Secondly, she's going to hold on to those who have arrived.
She wasn't actually part of the group that wanted to talk.
Thirdly, she's someone who's going to resile from the ECHR.
Fourthly, she's actually going to pursue the Rwanda arrangement.
And finally, she's actually going to remove those who are coming in.
Done and dusted.
We didn't even get a flight off the ground, did we?
We spent 160 million.
And anyway, you can only take 200 people in.
We're waiting for the courts.
I think we'll see.
That will be done and dusted.
Sorry, sorry, Steve.
What's a real plan?
What is a real plan?
This government has not come up with a real plan and all that it has allowed is an absolute and absolute mess in the immigration office, which is costing the taxpayer 6.5 million a day in hotels.
So why don't they take some of that money and spend it on staff for the immigration system and get these people through the system and either they're going to be asked to leave the country and we have to deport them because they're not being approved or they can get out and make a life here.
We have got so many jobs waiting to be filled.
Let's be clear on the fundamental reason why this has happened.
We have Home Office policy introduced by the previous Home Secretary, Priti Patel, but pursued still by Sweller Breverman, that has put a stop on actually processing claims.
That's why only 4% of claims in the whole of 2021, even now, towards the end of this year.
Can you just clarify for me?
What do you mean they stopped it?
What did they bring in that stopped it?
It sounds to me more like it's just sort of chaos.
No, they brought in rules to declare all of them, if they wished, inadmissible on the basis that somehow they would persuade other countries to receive people rather than take our responsibilities with the claims that we get.
There are a couple of different problems though here, aren't there?
There's the issue of the backlog and then there's the issue of the incoming flow.
You're from Amnesty International.
What's your plan for stopping the illegal boats?
If you want to stop people coming by unauthorised means, the only way that you can do that is to provide authorised means for people who need to make those journeys.
And we make no such routes available.
There are no routes for legal asylum seekers to the UK?
Absolutely.
None.
To claim asylum in this country, you must physically be here.
Our immigration rules make absolutely plain there is no visa for anyone to come to this country to seek asylum.
So if you wish to seek asylum...
What about the Afghan asylum seekers?
If you're seeking asylum, you have to get here.
You may be fortunate to come within a resettlement program.
So there are ways, yes.
Hang on, there are ways.
Well, that was a resettlement program.
He said that there weren't any ways to get through legally.
Not for anyone to seek asylum here.
You have to be picked out, fortunately, under a resettlement program, of which we have one for Afghanistan, and we do have a visa system for Ukrainians.
That's it.
If you are fleeing persecution anywhere else, or you are just hopelessly at risk from Afghanistan and you are not being picked and have no information about it at all, this is all that is happening.
Why have we got the situation, among other things, of 10,000 young Albanian men fleeing the hellhole of France?
Why has that happened?
Absolutely.
The hellhole of France.
You've put your finger on it.
The fact is that all those who are coming across the channel have come from a safe country and very often have been through safe countries and very often something like 40% of them have already applied and been rejected in other countries.
But the fact is, you can't simply dismiss those who've come from Afghanistan, those who've come from Hong Kong, those who've come from Ukraine.
And if what Steve says is right, we shouldn't really have any asylum grantees here who haven't crossed the channel.
And the fact is that there are thousands who have been granted asylum.
If you were to set up a system, a process whereby people are applying overseas, it would be overwhelmed within days.
What do we do about the fact that this country now has an absolutely historic number of people crossing the channel?
This wasn't the case even a few years ago.
A few years ago, I think it was 20 people came across the channel.
Why is this situation happening and how on earth can it be allowed to go on?
They were coming under other means.
Be clear.
We do not have an historic number of people who have crossed the channel.
Royal Books And Political Suspects 00:07:22
When was there a year when there was more?
In 2000, the early 2000s, more people crossed the channel.
They didn't cross by small boat, you didn't see them crossing, but they crossed.
These were people who jumped into lorry, back lorries, and you're sure that that was.
That was more than there are now.
Absolutely yeah, the menu from the Balkans.
There were in the early 2000s, more coming over, but they were coming over legally.
They were not crossing the channel in small boats, they were not coming in the backs of lorries, they were making their way legally and they were all allowed to stay.
What strikes me about this is the fact that we've basically got a system where we do actually have a legal system where you can apply for asylum, but we've now also got a system where a first person across the channel in a boat gets to come in and stay and will never be returned whatever, and that's the reason why they will continue to come in ever greater numbers.
Yeah, and I have to say, 20 000 this year, 28 000 last year, 8 000 the year before.
We're talking about all the people and I have 290, but I have to say I wish I had your confidence that because the home secretary says something, it happens.
I have heard this from so many home secretaries over recent years.
I have no faith at all.
Anyway, next tonight, what a way to start 2023.
Prince Harry's memoir is out 10 days into the new year.
Should every one of us best-selling authors be quaking in our boots?
We'll find out.
Next, welcome back, spare us all.
We now know prince Harry's memoir will be published on january the 10th and will feature a brooding picture of him on the front and will be entitled, spare.
Now I just want to read you a little quote, uh, that's coming.
Uh, sort of description by Harry.
Uh, about the book.
I've worn many hats over the years, both literally and figuratively.
Figuratively, excuse me, and my hope is that in telling my story, the highs and lows, the mistakes, the lessons learned, I can help show that, no matter where we come from, we have more in common than we think now.
That's a perfectly nice sentiment, a bit gooey, a bit American for British audience, but a very nice sentiment.
I, I can't.
You know, you can't, you can't.
I don't know if you're kind of yeah, I know, but you wouldn't I feel kind of diabetic after that.
But this is a book which he has been reportedly paid for 36 million.
Now we don't know if that's true.
That's just a reported figure in Hello magazine.
I suspect it's slightly exaggerated, but we do know it's a very hefty sum.
As he's already said, he's donating 1.2 million pounds of it to go to charity now, if you remember, and the rest to go into his pocket.
And if you know anything about publishers, they will not have agreed to this book just being about Harry telling his now just wait here his truth.
Um, I know you're squirming and feeling a bit sick as I say that.
So we know there are going to be elements of this book that are going to prove highly controversial for the royal family.
Now, i've always been a big defender of Harry and Meghan.
I am slightly running out of steam.
So I just, we've got Dickie up.
I'm surprised you've lasted this long.
Joining us now to discuss this literary event of the century, we have Talk TV contributor Paul Larone Adrian and royal author Dickie Arbiter.
Thanks so much to you both for joining us.
First of all, with you, Dickie, I mean, this is now primed to come out just before the coronation.
What are the effects of that?
What are the effects of it coming out full stop?
I think it's a great mistake.
He's doing what his dad did in 94, the Jonathan Dimbleby cooperating.
He's doing what his mum did with Andrew Morton in 1992.
Why is he bringing out a book?
He's obviously got a lot on his chest that he wants to get off.
Unfortunately, we saw part one with the Oprah interview, My Truth, in which the Queen, late Queen came out with that wonderful one-liner, recollections may vary.
And I think we'll find a lot in this book where recollections may vary.
I think, Dickie, it's interesting that you bring up the fact that he's not the first member of the royal family to bring out a book or give an interview, as you say, that causes a lot of problem.
And I am concerned as someone who has defended them in the past that they get a very large degree of hostility about anything they do.
But having Harry must have seen the effect of his actions so far, the Oprah interview, I am slightly staggered after the funeral, where you saw...
It's very painful when families are ripped apart and brothers are not talking to each other.
Do you think this book was already in the process?
Do you think he might be regretting this?
He might well be regretting it, but it's too late.
There was talk, there was speculation that he was asking for changes.
Now, we heard how true it is, we don't know, that he had signed off on the book in summer.
Publishers are very quick to press the button to run the printing presses to get the book out in the autumn.
Did he make the changes?
We don't know.
What's he doing with the money?
Well, we know that a million pounds is going to Centre Bali.
£300,000 is going to wellness organisation.
Dickie, we're just going to get Paula in here.
Paula, what's your opinion?
How explosive do you think this book is going to be?
We're doing exactly what the publishers want us to do, which is getting frightfully riled up before we've even read it.
And publicity too.
Exactly.
And really and truthfully, what is it that we don't know already?
And I suspect that that's what's going to happen.
I suspect we're going to get this book, which will be interesting.
We will hear Harry's voice in the way no doubt he wants us to.
But ultimately, in terms of the shock factor, I'm just not sure we're there anymore.
I think we should...
You know, what more have we got?
We've had racism.
We've had mental health.
We have had Oprah.
We have had the sad destruction of a loving family.
You know, we've had it.
Where else are we going to go with this?
Well, here's the thing, though.
In my experience, a publisher does not pay $36 million to get reheated stuff they've had before.
They will be saying, you've got to give us more.
They want their pound of flesh.
They want their pound of flesh.
That's my concern, is even if it's the odd paragraph in there, and it really, thousands of words could be a lot more sort of self-help, my truth, garble.
But it only takes four paragraphs saying something entirely pleasant about his father, his upbringing.
Yeah, the queen consort.
But whether there's any truth in it, that remains to be seen.
Well, and Dickie, you know, we've had numerous biography, three, four of King Charles.
Look, we're not going to hear anything new.
We don't need to be excited.
I'm afraid I've got to break in.
That's it from us.
Peers will be making as much anticipated return on Monday.
And whatever you're up to, make sure that it's uncensored.
Have a good night.
Good night.
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