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Dec. 12, 2023 - This Past Weekend - Theo Von

02:07:03

E474 Kat Von D

Kat Von D is a tattoo artist, musician, and entrepreneur. She is known for the show “LA Ink” which followed her tattoo shop High Voltage in Los Angeles. In 2021 she released her first album "Love Made Me Do It", and her latest single “Vampire Love” is out now. Kat Von D joins This Past Weekend w/ Theo Von to chat about her life since leaving Los Angeles, why she bought a “haunted” house in Indiana, the public reaction to her baptism and faith journey, why she’s choosing to black out all of her tattoos, the time someone called the cops on her for having a pet squirrel, why goths hide in trees, and much more. Kat Von D: https://www.instagram.com/thekatvond/ ------------------------------------------------ Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Celsius: Go to the Celsius Amazon store to check out all of their flavors. #CELSIUSBrandPartner #CELSIUSLiveFit https://amzn.to/3HbAtPJ Gametime: Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code WEEKEND for $20 off your first purchase. Manscaped: Go to http://manscaped.com and use code THEO to get 20% off and free shipping. Shopify: Go to http://shopify.com/theo to sign up for a $1-per-month free trial. BetterHelp: This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp — go to http://betterhelp.com/theo to get 10% off your first month. Füm: Start the Good Habit at http://tryfum.com/THEO to save 10% off the Journey Pack today. ------------------------------------------------- Music: "Shine" by Bishop Gunn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3A_coTcUek ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: tpwproducer@gmail.com Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Send mail to: This Past Weekend 1906 Glen Echo Rd PO Box #159359 Nashville, TN 37215 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend Twitter: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Ben https://www.instagram.com/benbeckermusic/ Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Producer: Colin https://instagram.com/colin_reiner Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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	I've got some new tour dates to announce.
	Excited to say we will be going to the Australia.
	And that is going to be Auckland, New Zealand.
	And that's February 23rd.
	Gold Coast in the Australia on February 29. Brisbane in the Australia.
	March 2nd, Melbourne on March 5th.
	And Sydney in March 8th.
	Both of those in the Australia.
	Presale starts Thursday, December 14th at 10 a.m.
	local time over there with code Ratking.
	General On sale begins Friday, December 15 at 10 a.m.
	local time.
	We also have tickets remaining for Charlottesville, VA, Raleigh, North Carolina, Columbia, South Carolina State College, PA, Syracuse, NY, and Amherst.
	And we will also be looking to add some shows over there in You Know Where, the Australia.
	All tickets are available at theovon.com slash T-O-U-R.
	Also, if the tickets get overpriced, just wait.
	Don't waste your money on these secondary sites.
	We'll add a date or we'll come back.
	And just thankful, grateful to get to bring the show and have people see it, man.
	I can't even believe it.
	And thank you guys for being a part of this journey with me.
	Praise God, baby gang.
	Today's guest is an artist.
	She's a tattoo artist.
	She is a musician, and she's a unique witty, a unique person in the world.
	She's a Christian, and she's just had quite a journey in life, as we all have.
	We're grateful to sit down with her today.
	Today's guest is my friend, Miss Kat Von D. Shine that light on me I'll sit and tell you my stories Shine on me And I will find a song I've been singing Almost there I'm
	here to go to the grocery store I'm fine Those are the you want to pull the mic up?
	Are you okay with that?
	Yeah, whatever.
	That's okay.
	You're going to the grocery store in those?
	No, I don't go to the grocery store.
	I can't even.
	I mean, maybe like on Neptune or something, I feel like.
	I don't know how.
	I wonder if they would even...
	I think it almost looks like you're shopping.
	We don't have to wear glasses, by the way.
	No, we can take them off.
	I just, I know that you, yeah, you walked in with these and I was like, wow.
	Yeah, I feel like that was virtual reality before they had kind of virtual reality, I guess.
	Well, yeah, because like glasses, like if you have dark glasses, I feel like then, yeah, the reality was kind of virtual because it almost seems like when you have glasses on, like that the world is a little bit separate from you.
	Yeah, I mean, when I walk around with these, I can like stare at people and they don't really, I don't feel bad about it because I can't see it.
	I don't know.
	Yeah, because they're skiing by you, probably.
	I would assume that's probably why.
	No, but you always look so stylish.
	And so that's why I wore this nice jacket.
	It's nice.
	Thank you.
	But yeah, we can take them off if that's okay with you.
	Yeah, sure.
	Yeah.
	And they look really neat.
	Thanks.
	Yeah, thanks for coming in.
	Thanks for having me.
	Yeah, it's a pleasure.
	It's really, really cool.
	I've known about you for a long time.
	Sorry if I seem a little bit rattled.
	I ended up watching a movie real late yesterday.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah, I was watching, well, it's holiday time, you know, so I was watching Family Man.
	That's my favorite Christmas movie.
	Okay.
	Have you seen it?
	No.
	Really?
	No, my son's on a home alone kick right now.
	So yeah, he really loves Harry and Marv.
	Yeah.
	Like to hear his little voice say like, I love Marv.
	I'm just like, this is the cutest thing ever.
	Yeah.
	I mean, it also shows he might be lightly be considering crime, I think, because Marv, they're the wet bandits, right?
	Yeah.
	I think it's the Tom and Jerry situation where he like laughs at somebody falling, you know?
	Oh, yeah, yeah.
	Yeah, I was watching that sequence the other day, and it was, it's so funny when he sets little race cars.
	And then I just love how they don't get deterred, though.
	They keep trying to get into the house and do the dumbest stuff.
	Yeah.
	I wonder if people like Harry or Marv more.
	Huh.
	I don't know.
	Harry was the lovable one.
	Yeah, that's Daniel Stern right there.
	He was kind of the.
	I'm a huge Joe Pesci fan.
	You are?
	Yeah, I think like my cousin Vinny is one of my favorite.
	My cousin Vinny, it feels like, is my life currently.
	Oh, really?
	Yeah, because my husband and I, I mean, my husband doesn't look like Joe Pesci, but he dresses like him in that movie, like with the cowboy boots and like the black leather.
	Oh, yeah, like an Uber driver in Tulsa kind of.
	I don't know.
	But we ended up.
	Oh, there's your husband and kid right there.
	Yeah.
	Oh, they're so handsome.
	Thanks.
	But we ended up moving to Indiana in the middle of nowhere, and it just kind of like weirdly fish out of water, but not really.
	Like we really, I really do feel like we belong there.
	Yeah.
	But yeah, so I always think about my cousin Vinny's scenario.
	Yeah, because he was kind of in a rural area, wasn't he?
	Yeah.
	Yeah, that movie was good.
	Yeah, I like Family Man.
	Do you have a favorite Christmas movie?
	I don't think so.
	I mean, I like Nightmare Before Christmas, I guess.
	That's kind of the token goth Christmas movie.
	I don't know.
	That is true.
	Yeah, I think after, what's that movie that, what was that?
	What's the thing that all the goth people do in town?
	I used to go to it sometimes.
	Rocky Horror Picture Show.
	Oh, yeah, yeah.
	Or is that a goth thing or is that not?
	I think it's like a theater kid thing.
	I don't know.
	That's what it is.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Sometimes like the goth kids would always get kind of grouped in with that.
	Yeah.
	Like I remember people would drive by them sometimes and be like, yeah, have fun at Rocky Horror Picture Show.
	And they'd be like, what?
	So maybe that's.
	No one's yelled that at me before.
	Yeah, did you see Macaulay Colkin was just on the news yesterday?
	He got a star.
	He got a star.
	Yeah.
	I don't know why that made me so happy.
	Like, I don't know why it took that long, I guess.
	He's like the most iconic child actor, right?
	Yeah.
	If you think about it, oh, yeah, I think so.
	Yeah, you know, I try not to think about children much that you know, because if I don't just for you know, checks and balances and all, but yeah, I love, yeah, he was the best.
	It was interesting kind of listening.
	Did you see his speech that he made?
	No, but I saw Catherine O'Hara was there and I love that support.
	I think it's so cool.
	Yeah, it was really sweet.
	Yeah, I wonder, I think of that a lot about like childhood actors, like how can you play it real quick?
	You can find it on Twitter.
	It was kind of interesting just because of growing up in Lost.
	It seems really scary place or the entertainment industry seems like a really uncomfortable place to grow up in.
	But yeah, thanks for coming in.
	Kat Von D, really nice to see you today.
	Yeah.
	And so just so for some of my viewers that don't know, right?
	So I know that you are artist and a tattoo artist and an entrepreneur.
	Thanks.
	And you started or people would know you a lot from LA Inc.
	and from a lot of your tattoo work and that whole universe, right?
	Totally.
	Is that fair to say?
	Sure, yeah.
	I think a lot of people know me from the tattoo world and the tattoo TV shows that I used to be on and stuff.
	And then I've done a lot of things along the way.
	And yeah.
	Nice.
	And so now you've moved out of Los Angeles, right?
	Recently, yeah.
	Yeah.
	How long ago did you move out?
	Well, I bought a house about two or three years ago in the middle of nowhere in Indiana.
	And it was really about the house.
	I mean, it was about a lot of things.
	There's a lot of reasons behind making such an extreme move.
	But I love restoring old Victorian houses.
	And in LA, I used to have a house that was built in 1890.
	And this one was built in 1874.
	So it's a second empire style Victorian home.
	And it was operating as a bed and breakfast for, I think, a few decades.
	And my husband and I, when all the lockdown stuff started happening in California, we just saw a different facet to where we called home.
	And we just didn't feel connected anymore.
	We didn't really want to be there anymore.
	And so we looked up rural towns in different states.
	And I feel like no one knows where this town is.
	Even my friends in Indiana have like never heard of it.
	And so that was a really good sign.
	We're like, let's find a place where we can be kind of left alone.
	And we went there and we loved it.
	And people say it's haunted, but I haven't experienced that.
	Yeah.
	Well, it's haunted by you now, it sounds like, because if it wasn't haunted, I feel like it kind of like, now it's got its chance, you know?
	Because, but also 1874, that is so crazy, especially in Indiana.
	Indiana, I think, had a lot of like, I don't know if they had like slave stuff up there.
	Actually, like, so our house was built by Benjamin Franklin Schenck, and he was the haymaker of the town.
	So his family made hay, and they also owned a lot of the steamboats.
	And it's called Switzerland County because a lot of the original settlers were from Switzerland.
	And what's really cool about the Schenck family is that there's actually underground tunnels that connected through underneath our house.
	So they were pretty big advocates for helping out.
	Yeah.
	Oh, so the Underground Railroad stopped there.
	Yeah.
	That's cool.
	Yeah.
	Wow.
	Yeah.
	I think I could see you being in a place that the Underground Railroad had stopped through and kind of hogwarts probably pass through it.
	Like definitely a thorough, you know, I just getting pigeonholed right now.
	I love it.
	I love it.
	It's good.
	The only way I know how to like accept things in the world is to pigeonhole.
	So was it tough choosing?
	Because that sounds like almost so much fun.
	Like once you guys made that decision, was it hard to make that decision to leave Los Angeles?
	No.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	It was almost overnight too.
	We were just like, we got to get out of here.
	And, you know, we have a son too.
	And I think like a little bit of what you were talking about before, just there's pros and cons to everywhere you live.
	You know, I think like LA has some really beautiful things about it.
	I love my friends.
	I love the, I think LA has the best food in this country, to be honest.
	But it's just my own opinion.
	Yeah.
	And, you know, I like the pretty things.
	I think there's like nice, like where I'm at, there's no sidewalks.
	Like we just have like a lot of dirt roads.
	So we don't, there's no billboards.
	There's no Uber, nothing, no delivery services.
	We have like one stoplight and a gas station.
	And it's, I don't know, I prefer the latter, you know?
	Yeah.
	But I go to LA a lot because we still have like, I make music.
	My husband is a musician as well.
	So we fly back out a lot.
	All of our producer friends and stuff are there.
	Oh, nice.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	I, uh, I, when you say of how it was interesting, like once you made the choice, kind of, that was kind of the same for me.
	Like, I've been living in Los Angeles for maybe 16 years, I think.
	And so I still have my apartment there, right?
	Just because it's cheaper than going and even getting a hotel for when I do go back.
	I know when I go out there now, I stay with Charo.
	She's my best friend.
	And she's nice enough to give us like a little room in the back of her house.
	And yeah, I look forward to it.
	I feel like being able to see my friends and stuff.
	But I also look forward to kind of escaping and just having like a safe haven.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, that's exactly how I thought.
	And once I made the decision, there was actually a friend that said, you should move to Nashville.
	And I was like, that's so weird.
	And I talked to a friend of mine about it, an old friend of mine.
	And he's like, dude, you used to talk about that when we lived.
	Oh, I was in Nashville?
	Yeah.
	He's like, when we lived together, you used to talk about that all the time.
	I was like, really?
	I don't remember it, but I was like, yeah.
	And so then I came here and before I knew it, I had moved.
	And I was like, oh my gosh, I always thought it was so scary to be able to leave Los Angeles for some reason.
	Yeah.
	You know, there's like there's something you're letting go of or giving up on kind of, but it's only been kind of like a gift, I think, you know?
	Yeah.
	Do you mean because of like the entertainment industry or something?
	I think, you know, that maybe that's it.
	I think, you know, I don't know.
	I don't know.
	There's nothing really.
	I kind of decided there's nothing really that I want out of Hollywood, really, which I think is why I'm grateful that there is a thing called that you can do podcasts, yeah.
	You can do your own stuff and you can do stand-up comedy where you don't really have to have a Hollywood involved really, you know, these days.
	Yeah.
	So what did you ask me?
	I'm sorry, Kat.
	I don't know.
	I don't think I asked you anything.
	Oh, damn.
	That's where I live right there a lot of times.
	Like people are like, yeah, sometimes I'll be talking.
	People are like, dude, who are you talking to?
	Did you ask me something?
	They're like, nah, dude.
	They're like, I'm just, I don't even know yet.
	And I'm like, all right.
	And I'm just going to go get in my car and leave then.
	But no, it was interesting.
	Oh, just moving and making that choice and suddenly being somewhere.
	Yeah.
	Did you guys look at, because you seem like a real, you know, like you seem like you go to some realms on Zillow that the rest of us aren't allowed into.
	Yeah.
	Like I feel like you probably have gotten some passwords.
	Well, it's funny because I do, like my real estate lady in LA like would always laugh because I'm just like, hey, let me know if anything interesting or obscure comes up.
	And it would be like just some of the weirdest stuff.
	Like I know all the castles in LA.
	There's not that many.
	But I used to live in one.
	But yeah, just interesting.
	Yeah, you're right.
	There are some.
	Oh, yeah.
	I think definitely if there's a bit of, you know, anything that's had a missing person in it or just like a, you know, they've found Femur.
	Maybe.
	I mean, one time I saw like the Unibomber had his little shack in, was it Oklahoma, right?
	Yeah.
	He had Oklahoma City.
	That was, that was for sale.
	And I was like, who, who would want, it was in the middle of the forest.
	Like, I saw that one for sale once.
	You're like, who would buy that?
	And then you like send it to your house.
	You're like, what do you think, babe?
	Like, I don't know.
	I mean, but yeah, people, some stuff is collectors' items.
	It's, you know, but yeah, it's interesting because like, I, like, I always say, like, you know, your idea of a good time is my idea of a nightmare, you know, and vice versa.
	And I feel like you look at these, these houses that, to me, I love the historical aspect and preserving things of the past.
	I like the human fingerprint of art in general.
	Like, I, you know, I have friends that are into like the complete opposite.
	They love the modern stuff or, you know, or even 1950s or art deco.
	Some of that stuff, it's cool.
	But to me, I feel like I just, I want every corner to feel like somebody dedicated their lifetime to it, you know?
	Wow.
	And so I appreciate that a lot.
	And I like conserving that and restoring it.
	So, but then some people would look at it and be like, let's tear it down and just, you know.
	Yeah.
	I think that happens a lot.
	Yeah, you seem like somebody that would have like crown molding in the top of their mouth, probably.
	Yeah.
	You know, like you seem definitely like you just are really ornate.
	I don't know if ornate is the word.
	Yeah, ornate's a wonderful word.
	Ornate.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And yeah, I'm not trying to judge it, but I'm just judging you out loud and clearly.
	That's funny.
	I never thought about that.
	Yeah, I always like to pigeon, I put people in like little spaces that makes it feel man.
	I don't know if it makes it feel manageable.
	I never thought about that before.
	I like it.
	I mean, it's to me, it's, it makes life a lot simple, more simple because I don't know, like, I only wear black.
	I know it's just, it's a choice.
	I just like it.
	And I remember the day that it happened, like, I had these beautiful dresses that I had accumulated over the years that I just, they were really colorful.
	And I was like, I'm just never going to wear them.
	Why, like, why am I kidding myself?
	And I just gave everything away and just kept, I simplified everything.
	And now I just, I just wear black.
	And it's, I pigeonholed myself into this gothy corner, I guess.
	Yeah, but that's, that's, yeah.
	I like to wear black when I do stand-up comedy because I don't like to make a lot of choices.
	Like even this today for me was making, it took, this took a long time to figure out.
	And, and, um, yeah, and I just don't, I don't know.
	I don't like making a lot of choices.
	Um, but yeah, did you, did you guys look at some other places when you were looking for your home?
	Um, because 1870, I mean, that's an old place.
	Yeah, it is.
	Uh, we, we were looking at different states and and I think, I think Indiana was appealing to me because I saw like the mass exodus of California happening and everybody was moving to Texas and Nashville.
	And I don't know what the other places were that they were, I think those, those two were kind of some Nevada, I guess.
	And I just wanted to get away from as much as I could from the California mentality in general.
	So I was like, Indiana seems safe.
	I feel like no one's going there.
	But yeah.
	Wow.
	And I like like our little town is, it's cool because it's right on the Ohio River.
	And so the houses along the river are like the prettiest, you know, because they're, I don't know, I guess.
	Yeah, because you got to have money to live out of water.
	Yeah.
	Usually.
	And then it's like, then we have like our little main street.
	And it's just like our downtown or whatever is literally one block long.
	And then in between that and where my house is on the hill, it's kind of like houses that could use a lot of love, you know?
	And I just felt like no one's going to move here.
	Okay, so you're from in California, you know, like Silver Lake and Echo Park.
	I was around when that was just super ghetto.
	Like, you know, nobody in the right mind would move there.
	It's like, it was actually quite dangerous in some areas.
	And now it's like good luck finding a tiny place for less than $1.2 million.
	And so I feel like I've bought myself a lot of time finding a place that's not going to get changed.
	Yeah.
	Like I don't want, you know.
	Yeah, yeah.
	You don't want, yeah, you wanted to get as far away from that as possible.
	Yeah.
	Interesting.
	Yeah.
	What were some scary parts about moving into a house that old?
	Like what are things that people do not think about, I guess?
	Because that's old, bro.
	That's like, that's only, I mean, that's, that's pretty old.
	I mean, 1874, you can't even really get much older.
	I don't think that wood before that.
	I feel like not in America.
	I feel like there are some houses from the late 1700s, I guess.
	I don't know.
	When did people start using wood to build houses?
	Because at some point we evolved probably from it's a regional thing really because you know like on the east coast you don't have earthquakes so you can have a lot more bricks oh it's whereas yeah so what's the most popular piece of uh house building material i'll look for that while you guys reboot well it's expensive now just because of inflation and everything oh yeah these days dang you gotta oh it is thought the first wooden structure was built over 10 000 years ago europe's neolithic longhouse
	constructed in around 5000 to 6000 bc is an example of the earliest freestanding timber dwellings huh so wow 5000 6000 bc so that's like almost 8 000 years ago yeah wow but i guess it makes sense dude if you're standing around and you're cold or something yeah and they got a lot of sticks around if you don't do something you're an idiot i think no offense to whoever that guy is you know but you gotta like you gotta figure it out there's
	only so long you can just go like this you know before you try to change the game you know um oh and the most common building material in the world is concrete wow is the most widely used uh is the most widely used building material in the world making it a good starting material to get to know um what did you guys have to do to the home when you got there uh we're we're actually still renovating it right now so so actually we we we don't live in it yet because it's um there's just so much work having to redo
	a house like that um so we live actually at our church's parsonage so um the pastor from our church lives in louisville and so he him and his wife will will they drive up every sunday so they were like hey you know there's just no place to rent out there like there's literally no yeah like people people live there forever and then they pass it down or sell or whatever so um when we first moved out here we're like man where are we gonna live and then they were just so nice enough to let us stay there oh that's nice of them yeah yeah so
	you're in a place where there's like not even really a real estate market yeah if you say there's no ubers like yeah yeah i was in a town recently and i couldn't get an uber at night it was like it was like what it's kind of a busy but it was like i guess everywhere doesn't really have it yeah no no not not where we're at yeah yeah um what have been some neat things about being out there like in this that um well i homeschool my son and so it's i like that um indiana has um they're very supportive like the state of indiana is very supportive to homeschool families and stuff so
	that was a very big selling point for us and why is it hard to do is there like a lot of regulation some some states and different places have different yeah so i'm to me i'm like the less government the better so i was like you know that's that's a one of the perks of the state of indiana and so um so yeah like i my son just turned five um last week so we're you know getting it ready to start like uh first grade yeah i know it's so cool wow and so do you like have to redesign
	the room for like the learning room or whatever each year to make the grade seem different or um i don't i mean right now he's like we're not doing crazy curriculum because he's just turned five so um but once we get into the house i do plan on having like a little schoolroom area but that's the cool thing about homeschooling is that you can teach anywhere really um i feel like the idea of putting your kid in uh you know like a like a school or a classroom setting it's i think that's
	kind of people are tending to steer away from that in in a lot of places so yeah well it feels some of it starts to feel dangerous too it seems like there's a lot of violence in school in schools yeah it seems really like but i don't know maybe that's just like the algorithm like for some reason sends me those videos sometimes but it seems like there's like a lot of violence in schools but i don't know it's one of the reasons why i chose to live in tennessee it's very safe or in nashville it's very safe here yeah it's super safe yeah and
	um yeah but i don't go to school anymore so i don't know what it's like same i didn't go to i didn't go to school you didn't i i started tattooing when i was 14 years old and then i i remember the first time i ever did a tattoo i'm like this is what i want to do like i i already i just knew it in my heart and so i was like why would i spend so much time in school when i don't need to you know yeah not that i would condone people dropping out or anything like that but it worked for me and i oh people will do it without you condoning i know a lot
	of people are just don't like it or they're yeah not even smart and they don't like it um do you your family started in your family because you were you're from another country your family's from another country yeah so my family's from south america from argentina and i was born in mexico and then i moved here in the 80s what were they doing there my dad was a missionary for the church so they were he's like long line of um like missionary doctors and so he was building um hospitals and
	like little puebritos that didn't have any hospitals and um and then my my me and my siblings were born there so it was it was pretty cool upbringing i loved it yeah um we came from nothing like literally nothing really yeah we had like dirt floors and no running water and it was like truly third world but wow it's cool and you're from nicaragua my father's my father's from there my father my grand my father's my grandfather i guess was a missionary oh really yeah and they were down in in uh nicaragua and
	that's where my dad was born because that's where my grandfather i guess met his wife or something and then that's where my dad was born at um and so he grew up there he used to tell me stories about kids in his village that would that would eat dirt actually and they didn't have anything to eat and they would eat dirt and their stomachs would get like all distended and stuff like he would tell me some kind of crazy stories but um but yeah that's interesting yeah that that they were missionaries down there as well and then so then your family moved up to america
	yeah yeah we came up through texas and then moved to a little town in southern california called low malinda when you say came up through what are we talking about almost like driving okay we just drove through i didn't okay i i was still i didn't have my papers yet because i was like underage okay i was gonna say if the d stands for deportation no i wasn't through like i wasn't in the trunk or anything like that okay it would have been so you to be in the trunk though i feel like i guess like some in some mysterious complexity this is
	the reason i look like this now you're like this is the closest thing i can find to a coffin hey this coffin's got a tire in it uh that's funny yeah Ho, ho, ho, boys and girls.
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	Were your parents, what were your parents?
	Like, did you guys have a fun family growing up?
	What was it like?
	Yeah, I mean, it was pretty modest upbringings, you know.
	Went to church a bunch.
	We didn't have a lot of money, but my dad and mom, they had a piano.
	And so all of us were trained, like classically trained in piano since I was five.
	And so I've always loved music.
	Music has always been like my biggest passion.
	I like classical music because that's what I was kind of brought up on.
	But now I make like more electronic, like Synth Wave 80s style music.
	Oh, sweet.
	Yeah.
	My childhood was good.
	I have two siblings who I don't talk to anymore.
	They actually live in this state here.
	Really?
	Yeah.
	You don't talk to them?
	Uh-uh.
	No way.
	They had no interest in it.
	Really?
	Yeah.
	Wow.
	Wish them well, though.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	I have one that we barely kind of, we don't really talk much anymore.
	It's weird, kind of, huh?
	Yeah, it's strange.
	Yeah.
	Family's funny, you know?
	Yeah, I think it's interesting because it feels like a lot of responsibility, but it also feels like the only people that maybe will have a lot of the same insight, like that shared some common information, I guess.
	Yeah.
	Shared like some common experiences.
	I don't know.
	I think it's interesting to, yeah, I think a family is something you really have to build and has to be put together pretty well by the by the parents a lot of times.
	Yeah, I mean, I can watch a movie and I see like people who are close to their moms or their siblings and I can understand it, but I can't really relate as much.
	And I probably will sound a little bit cold, but I just feel that there's, you feel a sense of obligation because you're related to somebody by blood, but I think it's kind of the opposite where, like, or what you said, where you have to work at it if you really want it to, you know, be a good relationship, like any relationship, you know?
	Yeah.
	But like, I look at my husband's family and like, they're just so cool and so warm and welcoming.
	And just like, like, I'm like, oh, I didn't have, I don't, I don't have that, but that's okay.
	You know?
	Was it just, yeah, because I think about family stuff a lot.
	You know, I think about that kind of stuff and like, how does it affect you as you get older and stuff?
	I'm really close with my dad and I'm trying to talk him into moving out with us.
	Oh, really?
	Yeah, that would be my dream is if my dad could like live on the same land with us.
	Does he have a cool Spanish name?
	Like his real name?
	Central American name or no?
	His name's Rene.
	Oh, Rene.
	It's like a painter, huh?
	Renee Carlos.
	Yeah.
	Oh, yeah.
	He's in, dude.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I'll buy.
	Look, I'll buy a 28 by 12 from him.
	That was a unique shape for art, but I'll take it.
	Yeah, Renee Carlos, too?
	Yeah.
	Oh, for sure.
	That's beautiful.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, I think if you're Spanish, you can have kind of a little bit of a woman's name and it lets you slide more.
	Yeah, I feel like there's probably a lot of Italian renees, right?
	Yeah, for sure.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, they definitely get away with being a little bit more of a woman in the name.
	My dad's like the opposite of that.
	He looks like a 1950s boxer.
	Oh, he does.
	Dude, yeah, because if I was like, yeah, this is my buddy Sarah right here, a lot of dudes would, people wouldn't be as accepting, I don't think, in America.
	Yeah.
	So your life now, so you moved out to Indiana, you live there.
	Oh, one neat thing I saw on your Instagram was you have this pretty crazy tulip garden.
	Did you grow it yet?
	So, yeah, so I got, there's like this plot of land right in front of my house.
	So people know where I live.
	Like once, once like they found out that I bought the property, it was in the news and stuff.
	And so, and also like the Shank Mansion is kind of like famous on its own because of like all the supposed haunting.
	I haven't seen anything, you know, but what do you squint?
	No, I'm just thinking of what it's going to be like when the ghosts show up over there.
	I just, you know, I've never seen a ghost.
	And I'm not saying that I have tons of friends that have like solid, you know, they're stable people and they have seen things and experienced things.
	I just personally haven't, so it's hard for me to, you know, I don't know.
	But you don't believe in ghosts, you think?
	Well, I don't know if I necessarily don't believe in it.
	I think like I just haven't experienced anything.
	And also I've lived in old houses.
	So like they make noises all the time.
	And I think that a lot of people want to like experience it.
	So they like, that's why they have like haunted tours and things like that.
	But I don't know.
	I just feel like I haven't seen it.
	yeah, people want there to be somebody else.
	Like, I think some people are lonely too, and so they want a ghost to be around.
	Like, there was this, like, these two guys that, like, when I bought the house, because I googled the house to see if there's anything that came up, and on YouTube, there was like a house tour that these guys did.
	They like rented out the bed and breakfast, but I don't know if they told them they were, they were going to film, and they were just like kind of dressed.
	I don't want to say goth, but like just older gentlemen.
	And they were just like really wanting to catch some paranormal activity, and it's so bad.
	Like, there was, it was like dust in the air, and they're like, look, did you see the orb?
	You know, and it's like, there's no, there's nothing there, you know, but I don't know.
	I haven't, I haven't experienced anything there.
	The Shank Mansion, there it is.
	Yeah.
	Yep.
	House was restored in 2000 and operated in a bed and records listed National Register of Historic Places in 2002.
	Oh, look, it says that I bought it.
	Yep.
	So.
	That's cool.
	Yeah.
	So back to the tulip thing.
	So there's this plot of land that's right in between, like right outside our gate.
	And it's just grass.
	And the lady who sold me the house, she owns it, my friend Lisa.
	And so I hit Lisa up and I was like, hey, look, I got a bunch of tulips.
	And I thought it would be cool just to bring something to the community, you know, just have people, because people are coming here to take pictures anyway.
	So why not give them something like really cool to look at?
	And so I got 10,000 black tulips.
	And I thought, like, this is going to be an enormous, like, just a field of black tulips.
	BTM, bro.
	10,000 is a lot.
	And then we did the math and the square footage is like, it's not that big.
	Like, I feel like it's maybe twice the size of this room.
	The tulip, the what?
	10,000 of them.
	Oh, that's all it makes?
	Yeah, because you plant them about three to four inches apart.
	So I feel like...
	Yeah.
	So we'll have to get a little bit of a little bit.
	So we have plants that were a little bit more like spread out.
	Yeah, just like they're cool with kind of doing their own thing.
	I mean, apparently tulips are kind of like, I guess they're, I guess they get lonesome or whatever.
	Yeah.
	Or, you know, whatever it's called.
	I don't know what the, what that would be like as a flower.
	Yeah.
	So we'll see.
	We'll see.
	We have like, you know, wildlife out there.
	And everybody in my Instagram was like, you know, be careful because the squirrels are going to eat, they're going to dig them up or the mole.
	So we're hoping that by the time spring comes, they don't eat all of them.
	Dude, if you had an OnlyFans of you just fighting moles, I think a lot of people would subscribe to it.
	I mean, I think you get a lot of the hunting audience, you know.
	How do you fight a mole, though?
	I don't know.
	That's up to you, I think.
	But I think it would just be pretty fascinating to watch.
	Do you feel different being out of LA?
	What does that kind of feel like?
	Does it feel like, were you kind of done with entertainment?
	I mean, you've had a neat career and at least gotten to experience certain things.
	That's one thing about having a different opportunity sometimes.
	At least you get to experience what it's like, whether it was great or you didn't like it.
	You get experience, you know?
	Yeah, I mean, I'm still, I haven't retired yet.
	So, I mean, I feel like, like you said, you know, the beauty of being able to create and do things that you don't necessarily have to be in LA anymore.
	And so I think before you used to, I feel like you had to live in LA if you needed to, if you wanted to do things.
	But now it's like, I mean, I make music, so I can do that from my house.
	I don't need to, or I could fly in and record.
	I don't necessarily have to live in Hollywood anymore.
	Yeah, that's nice, huh?
	Yeah, yeah.
	What else can we think about?
	So like, did you know that in the state of Indiana, like, you're not, it's illegal to own a squirrel?
	I found this out because my son found like a little, a little baby squirrel that had fallen out of a tree.
	And it happens a lot, like squirrels fall out of trees and stuff.
	And this one was like barely breathing and really dehydrated.
	And I used to work at the California Wildlife Center back in California.
	And so like rehabilitating squirrels is pretty easy.
	It's not, it's not like a, you know, like an owl or something.
	Like do you need two hands to do it or you can do it with one hand?
	You probably need two hands to do it, huh?
	Yeah, two, because you have to like feed them with this little like syringe thing.
	Okay.
	But so we rehabilitated him.
	My son named him Lucky.
	He's like the cutest thing ever.
	And then I got baptized and then I got like a bunch of criticism about this baptism video.
	So I had to make this, I didn't have to, but I was inspired to make a video like calling out like judgmental Christians or whatever.
	And in that video, Lucky is just like, just like flying behind me.
	He's just like running around.
	And somebody saw him and reported me to the animal control.
	And they showed up, like the guy showed up with like a gun and everything was like, hey, you guys have a squirrel?
	Like, you know, you can't have one, so we're going to have to take it.
	And I'm like.
	They put him in cuffs?
	No.
	No, but I...
	Because I know that's what you guys do.
	You're not going to house him.
	And they're like, yeah, it's going to get euthanized.
	Are you kidding me?
	So they took him out of a warm-up?
	Of course they didn't take him.
	Oh, you can't do it.
	I lied and I told them I'm going to release him the next day.
	Oh, cool.
	And then we made like a little Instagram video like.
	Of him leaving?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	We don't have to tell anybody if he came back or not.
	You got it.
	Lucky lives elsewhere.
	Wow.
	Dude, that's incredible.
	Like, who would do that?
	That's crazy.
	So cruel.
	Well, it's just also the just the weird, like how legislation is so obtuse from like, like, there's no intricacies a lot of times with like laws and rules, you know?
	It's just for this general thing.
	And so it's, and they don't have any room to ban a lot of these guys who come to, you know, it's like they're just trying to do the, whatever the, the, no, I was just more confused by who, who in their right mind would be like, oh, let me go and report a baby squirrel.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, I would feel so perverted even reporting it.
	Yeah.
	Or I would just be like, hey, imagine that call.
	Like, hey, I'm not trying to be a snitch or whatever, like a branch snitch or whatever.
	Yeah.
	But there's a scat Von.
	He has a squirrel, dude.
	They should, you know, they release that body cam footage.
	They have to release that call.
	That call, you should remix a beat to that call, and that you should.
	I wish they did have one of the best house songs ever.
	Get funny.
	Get funny.
	Well, the best is like my, it was my husband that opened the door, and he was like topless with like, and he's like fully tattooed with the squirrel on his shoulder.
	Well, then that didn't help.
	Yeah, yeah.
	People are like, people are trying to get, they're trying to get this handle in M Squirrel 13 over here.
	Like, there's not this bad stuff going on out here.
	Yeah, so how did your journey go to like, I don't know if I want to call it a journey, but like, what was like, what like role has religion like played in your life and stuff?
	Because, you know, I think if we're at a time in the world, I think it just in, I think we're always at a time in the world, but I think we're, it feels like a lot of people are looking for something that makes sense more.
	I feel like we're getting exhausted by the truth that a lot of the things that we feel like will make us feel good aren't doing it, you know?
	I feel like that a lot of times.
	But yeah, what has some of that experience been like?
	I mean, if you got baptized, it really, how, what kind of, and was it like a, what do they do it in?
	What do they baptize you in?
	Water.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah.
	Good, huh?
	Oh, here's your video right here.
	Oh, yeah.
	Oh, it's pretty there, huh?
	Yeah.
	...upon your profession of faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, and in obedience to his divine commandment, I baptize you, my sister.
	In the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
	Amen.
	Oh, congratulations.
	I also get teary-eyed when I see that.
	That's cool.
	That's powerful.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	What is that like in your life?
	Yeah.
	What's it like?
	Or how do you get there?
	Like, how do you get?
	Because I think a lot of people are lost.
	I feel lost a lot of times.
	I think a lot of us feel that way.
	And so how do you feel like you solved like you're lost?
	Well, I mean.
	Or is that even a fair question?
	I don't know.
	Yeah, I know.
	I get what you're saying.
	I was brought up with Christianity in my childhood and then I strayed.
	And so like in a nutshell, I just kind of, in the last five years, have like made my way back and have a different understanding than maybe when I was a kid.
	Because I think when you're a kid, you're like, or at least for me, it was like, we just go to church because that's what we have to do.
	And, you know, I don't, I didn't have actual profound questions that I want answered like I do now.
	And so I think as an adult, you get to have a different understanding of that.
	And so that's kind of what, you know, how I, in a weird, artsy way, just kind of came back.
	And I just, the last five years, I've just been studying the Bible.
	And now like at this church, like we have our women's Bible study and stuff that I, that I attend.
	And there's a meeting you go to, right?
	I watched another podcast that you were on.
	Oh, yeah?
	Yeah.
	Oh, yeah.
	I heard you talk about it anyway.
	You guys have a Bible study each week.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And, you know, I think I'm going to always have questions and continue to want to learn and have deeper understandings of things.
	And so, but in that podcast that you probably watched, like I talk about like a little bit, well, you said it's like we're trying to find meaning or want to feel again, you know, and I think there's a lot of temporary fixes or, you know, like, you know, I used to, like, I was an addict and, you know, I'm sober.
	I'll have 17 years sober in July.
	Wow.
	And so, you know, I think, I feel like those are all things that kind of like lead you in that direction.
	And yeah, I think, you know, it's such an intimate and personal thing.
	Like my relationship with God is my own.
	And I've never really felt like I belonged anywhere.
	Like, especially now, I think being public with my faith puts you into like this microscopic critical tank, you know?
	And so I get criticized from all sides now, which I don't care because at the end of the day, I'm, you know, my relationships with God and not you.
	Right.
	But it is interesting.
	I feel like now it just becomes funny, like some of the comments I get.
	Yeah.
	I think because people have a hard time understanding the aesthetic and pairing that with something, which is- Yeah.
	Right.
	The ambiance of you and then pairing it.
	And Christianity.
	And it's so silly to me.
	And like, I don't understand how people don't see how closed-minded that is, you know, and how, like.
	Yeah.
	Why would you think that you have to look a certain way to have an understanding of the Bible, you know?
	Yeah.
	Or, you know.
	Yeah, that's a good point, too.
	I think it's all, well, a lot of that, there's a lot of interesting stuff there, you know?
	Yeah, but like, like, I do, but I, you know, so.
	I mean, there's a lot to think about in all of this.
	Yeah, for sure.
	You know?
	Like, one time I went to like a Jordan Peterson lecture, and my husband and I were like the only people that looked like us there.
	But I was.
	Black people, you mean?
	What?
	You mean black people?
	No.
	I just like, and I don't want to diss on like Jordan's fan base, but I feel like everybody had their own uniform, you know?
	Like there was just rows of people in front of me and they all kind of dressed the same.
	And I was like, man, for some, for people, and I'm not, again, not judging or criticizing, but you would think that like free, free thinkers would, or maybe they just don't care.
	I don't know.
	Or maybe there's just only so many stores, too, where you can, I mean, I feel like it's a lot of Johnson and guys who like are sad, like, I don't know, I'm a Jordan Peterson fan, but I'm like, I think it's a lot of, like, there's, you know, it's a lot of lost boys, but who have an, who can comprehend well or well enough, you know, because otherwise lost boys who can't comprehend, they kind of, you know, they listen to maybe Hooba stank or whatever, you know.
	But I think if you get, or, or hey, hey, come out and fight.
	Remember that song?
	You gotta keep them separate.
	Oh, yeah, yeah, uh-huh.
	Offspring?
	Offspring.
	Yeah.
	Dude, yeah.
	So a lot of like, yeah.
	If you are a lost boy who can't communicate as well as you'd like to sometimes, and this is a judgment, but you probably have owned an offspring album.
	And then if you are a different version, then it's sometimes Jordan Peterson.
	But yeah, I could not imagine seeing, it would be like playing Where's Waldo if I saw you at a Jordan Peterson concert.
	So that's interesting.
	But that's awesome that you guys went and you found like that what the.
	Oh, so I, so my whole point was just that I feel like maybe we pigeonhole ourselves, right?
	Like I feel like everybody kind of like I went to this, like, so the church I go to is like a really small church and it's, it's, there's not enough people to have a running trend or anything like that.
	But when I went to like a big church in California recently, I looked around and it's like a lot of people have the same style.
	And so I realized that maybe because like modern day Christians are so used to being surrounded by people that look the same as them, when someone like like me comes into the mix, it's like, oh, wait, this is demonic or this is, because I get called demonic a lot or this is like, you know, you're serving two masters.
	And I'm like, I don't think any of that is accurate.
	You know, I don't think you have to, there's no dress code to be a Christian.
	Yeah.
	Oh, that's baffling to me.
	Yeah, but I get it a lot.
	Like, I just recently posted this, like my last post was just, I thought it was like a very cool, like modest image of me, like in a, in a dress and some funny shoes.
	And I just, oh, the comments are just hilarious.
	It's just people like Satan's going to bring you home.
	That's crazy.
	Yeah.
	I guess there's all levels of everything.
	Like, we should get into like the Christian.
	Like, if you like.
	Like, I thought I was going to get hate from my existing fans, you know, like just people who are.
	Like, feel like you could be a deserter or something, or maybe people that are fans of yours that don't have a religion or aren't Christians or something that they would have a thought about it.
	No, they've been super loving and open-minded, and I love that, you know?
	But it's been the other side that I was just so surprised.
	Wow.
	Yeah, you know, that's, it's like, I think there's a lot of like interesting stigmas with Christianity, I guess.
	Like, I like religion, right?
	I like, I don't know if I care what religion people are.
	Yeah.
	You know, I think I wish I knew more about some of the religions, you know.
	I probably prefer Christianity for myself because that's what I know the most.
	Yeah.
	And, but, or I would say that I prefer God.
	That's the term I like to use.
	And most of my belief started through AA, through alcohol, through going to 12-step meetings.
	It was like the first time I ever started to get like an understanding of like starting to build a relationship with God and talking to God and feeling like that if I think or feel something, that there's something on the other side of the universe that hears it or cares about it.
	Right.
	And that it blew my mind, dude, because, you know, I'd been like, I've been electrocuted a couple of times.
	Oh, yeah, but I never had a feeling like this.
	It's not like being electrocuted.
	It's just like feeling like- You've been electrocuted?
	Yeah, I've been electrocuted, dude.
	I've been electrocuted, yeah.
	I mean, I guess a handful of times or whatever.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, I guess.
	One time I got electrocuted at a carnival when I was young.
	I got electrocuted, oh, three years ago, I stepped on, I was walking behind a hot, a food truck and I stepped.
	They had a plug-in, a big joint plug-in and I stepped right on it and just, it just, you know, I wasn't, it was like the opposite of being baptized, I think.
	It was uncomfortable.
	But yeah, but I was, yeah, but I, yeah, I like thinking about God.
	I love thinking about it now.
	Yeah.
	You know, I was just asking God this morning just to help me, just to help give me some better direction in my life, you know?
	Yeah.
	And help me with a few things I've been struggling with.
	Like I've been struggling to quit vaping, right?
	So I don't want to vape.
	And so it's just been so hard.
	And I realized like I'm an addict.
	Yeah.
	You know, it's like, dude, I will wake up in the middle of the night and like see if there's vape places open and stuff.
	And then some assholes started to stay open in 24 hours.
	Oh, yeah.
	Cigarettes was the hardest for me.
	I love, oh my gosh, I love smoking.
	Yeah.
	I love cigarettes.
	But I just can't, I don't want to be that mom.
	Well, it became my guy.
	Like vaping became my higher power in a lot of ways.
	Like if I have an uncomfortable thought, feeling, moment, whatever, let me hit this thing.
	Yeah.
	And so I realized, oh, this is the thing.
	I'm serving this.
	Like, whether I want to have a higher power, whatever I want it to be, this is whatever I am serving this thing.
	I show up when this, whenever the little like a pain goes off inside of me, I show up for this thing.
	That's crazy.
	Yeah.
	My life revolved around smoking too.
	And it's funny because you start like treating it as like little treats.
	Like I would be tattooing and I'd be like, all right, I'll just get through like two hours and then I get a treat.
	And then, you know, get these little breaks and stuff.
	And then, but then everything, like life becomes an inconvenience, at least for me.
	I've never talked about this before, by the way.
	Like I feel like usually when I talk about like sobriety and stuff, you're talking about like drugs.
	But cigarettes were the hardest.
	I mean, it's, I just, I love the ritual of it.
	I love the smell, like like leather jackets with, and cigarettes to me is like so sexy.
	I just, I, oh, Sam Elliott in the mask.
	Have you seen him in that?
	No.
	Was Shea remember in that movie?
	Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
	I was thinking the other mask.
	Yeah, yeah.
	I wish Sam Elliot was in that movie, too.
	Yeah, yeah.
	I like Sam Elliott.
	I mean, I don't like him like I like him, but I like him.
	Yeah, yeah.
	But yeah, people don't talk enough about that.
	It's, yeah, it's so, I mean, it just, all of it is.
	Yeah.
	I mean, I was like two packs a day.
	What?
	Huh?
	For like till recently.
	Pax Von D, huh?
	That's crazy, dude.
	Two packs a day.
	You're lucky you look so lovely still after having smoked that.
	I know.
	Yeah.
	True, true.
	And not, not, not, I know.
	I mean, like, no, it's a blessed.
	Yeah, it's like, that's fortunate.
	You see some people that are just like, yeah.
	Some people look like they start to eventually, they look like the inhale that they take off a cigarette.
	They're just like, you know, like, like their whole people is like, yeah.
	You know, yes.
	But if I see people doing drugs in movies, I just instantly get like sick to my stomach.
	I'm like, I just like the idea, the idea of doing drugs again is like, I'm beyond that.
	But if I see somebody smoking a cigarette, I'm like, man, like, I still have that in.
	Like, I can't, I, I can't cheat on that.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I stopped at a high, dude.
	This is the saddest story.
	I remember kind of milling around a high school to see if some kid was vaping after school one day when we were.
	And vaping's so not cool.
	Like, that's the one that's like, I'm like, why?
	Just smoke a cigarette.
	Like, why would you, it's like so, like, steampunk, like with your little things.
	The steampunks are the craziest.
	They're like putting together assembling.
	Like, it's so weird.
	Just get a cigarette and be a man.
	God, I didn't, I didn't know that was the loser right now.
	But I'm okay.
	This might be the conversation I need that helps me.
	Yeah, I just didn't.
	Yeah, but there's some, the people they put the crank and they make their own vape or whatever.
	They like add vanillas to these niggas.
	They have a machine that has a tumble drive setting on them.
	Like, what the?
	Yeah, these are the guys that are doing.
	This is a guy.
	Let's play that.
	Can we play that?
	Let's see one of these.
	Yeah, the people that blow the smoke.
	There's team comp, like a guy.
	You don't do any of that?
	I don't do it.
	No, this guy's out of his mind.
	This guy has a 12-gauge faith.
	Oh, my God.
	This guy, this guy's wife is missing.
	There's no reason to need that much nicotine unless you did something bad.
	Look at that.
	This guy's a damn motor.
	But the craziest ones are the competitions.
	It's almost like it's one of those dog shows now.
	It's like the guy will blow a big smoke ring and then his wife will like run and jump through it.
	It's like, what is this shit?
	It just, anyway, but it's hard.
	It is.
	It's hard.
	And I think since I don't have a family or anything that I constantly need to address, then...
	I feel like I probably wouldn't have quit if I didn't have a family.
	Yeah.
	I mean, the minute I got pregnant, like I got the plus sign, that was the day I quit.
	And then I started again after I had my son.
	Not right away, but like.
	And were you hiding and doing it?
	No.
	No.
	Fuck yeah.
	No, but I was pretty awesome that you weren't.
	No, I mean, I never would post, like, you'll be hard pressed to find.
	There's very few photos of me smoking online, but then when my son was two, because I had my little smoking nook outside, and he came out.
	My son came, he learned how to open doors, you know, and he came out.
	I was like, mommy, mommy.
	And he's like, what's that smell?
	And I just felt like such a loser.
	I was like, I can't be that mom.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I would hate that being that dad.
	What's that smell?
	It's like, oh, it's cranberry lime crush or whatever.
	Is that your flavor?
	Ice or whatever.
	Yeah, whatever.
	No, I prefer watermelon lemon.
	And sometimes I'll do watermelon lemon mango if they don't have the one that I like.
	But it's like, it's sad.
	It's all pretty sad, I think.
	And the guy knows me, huh?
	He calls me big boy when I walk in there.
	That's the worst part.
	And he's like, kind of like, he's Hispanic or like Egyptian or something.
	He's like, what's up, big boy?
	That's what he says every time I go in there, dude.
	And this is the saddest part.
	I will buy it, hit it a few times, and then throw it away so I don't hit it anymore.
	And then you have to buy it again.
	And then I'll go later on that day and buy it again.
	Oh, I was just like, I would just buy cartons.
	I just buy a carton.
	Cartons?
	Yeah.
	You'd buy a boatload.
	You'd be out there like on the Ohio River, like flagging down.
	I'd buy cartons.
	And then one of my biggest pet peeves was like when people would ask to like bomb a cigarette.
	Why?
	You have a carton?
	Well, yeah, but I've been prefer, like, I'm averaging one every 30 minutes.
	I don't have a spare.
	Like, why would you do that?
	Like, just go buy your own.
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	That's how I was, when I would do drugs, too.
	Like, I remember in the beginning, it was like fun party time.
	You're out with your friends.
	And then the minute that I realized like, oh, no, this is mine, I would just start doing drugs by myself.
	Oh, yeah, me too.
	Yeah.
	Like, that was it.
	Like, no, no sharing because there's so many freeloaders.
	Yeah.
	And I was one of them, first of all, and I'd finally gotten some drugs.
	So the last thing, if I'm, yeah, it's finally time I get to freeload off myself, you know?
	But yeah, I would go home.
	I would get cocaine.
	I'd go home and just do it by myself.
	And it would be sad.
	Yeah.
	Oh.
	Yeah.
	It was the saddest, man.
	I don't know why.
	But yeah, people do that.
	But yeah, I think through like going to 12-step meetings is where I started to build a relationship with a higher power and really believe in one.
	Before that, I just never had it presented to me in a way that felt, I don't know, that I, that it, that it like messed, you know?
	Yeah.
	I think that's important, I think, is how you, how it comes into your life too, you know, a lot of times.
	Yeah.
	And I just like having heart power.
	I like having an invisible friend that, yeah, I like having an invisible friend.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	I feel like I came from the school of thought where, you know, you have to be like empowered and, you know, just believe in yourself and all this idea that you, you know, it's kind of almost like self-worship.
	And I think NAA, you know, they do talk about that where it's like that, you know, you can't do this on your own.
	And I think taking that to like the bigger picture part of it, where it's not just with addiction, that for me, I'm like, I've definitely surrendered to that.
	And I don't think there's anything wrong, you know, to humble yourself and be like, I can't do this on my own.
	And so it's kind of where I, where I've, you know, landed, I guess.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Well, I think that's the part I struggle with a lot.
	Sometimes it's just on a daily basis, like turning my will over to God, you know, turning my will over to a higher power.
	Like, you know, I pray every day, but I just, I know that it's a relationship that I want to be stronger in my, in my life, you know, I can feel it all the time, like me just wanting like a stronger relationship.
	And then, yeah, one thing I like, one thing I liked about churches was just the sense of community or, you know, religious places people meet up, worship centers, was just the sense of people doing something together, kids being able to do like Sunday school or whatever.
	And you go in the back and you, you know, you back there, everybody's like making little arts or whatever.
	And I like that.
	I like that sense of community.
	I think it was good probably for communities to have some shared meeting space.
	And I think churches and religious worship centers used to be that more in America.
	I don't know what it's like in the rest of the world, but yeah, I love that community.
	I personally love like, I look forward to my Sundays and we do like church, well, we do choir practice on Thursdays.
	And like, I definitely feel, I mean, I think because we have a small church, which I think is a good thing, like when people are missing, like they're, you know, when they go out of town or like they're, they're missed, you know, like I feel like I genuinely miss my, my church family when I'm in LA.
	Oh, yeah, that's cool.
	Yeah, it's just cool.
	And I've never really had that before.
	And I'm not that kind of person either.
	Like, I don't like group therapy.
	I don't like doing, I don't like communal seating at restaurants.
	Like, I like lone wolf, you know?
	But where I've, you know, I have found my little, my little, I guess, tribe, whatever.
	No, that's fair.
	Yeah.
	Well, I think there used to be a lot more of that.
	I mean, there is even that book by Sebastian Younger, I think.
	It's called Tribe, maybe, where, yeah, it was about that.
	It was about when we were in smaller groups and stuff like that.
	And people used to, yeah, you would miss somebody.
	They'd be gone.
	It's like, otherwise you get so caught up with so many things and your space gets too big and it's hard to know.
	It's hard to pay attention.
	It's hard to connect, you know, or you're trying to connect to too many things, you know, and people feel like that's part of it.
	We're just trying to connect to too many things.
	I don't think our system is built for that a lot of times.
	Yeah.
	So I think it's nice, I bet, having a, yeah, a place where you notice if somebody's gone.
	Yeah.
	That's pretty cool.
	Yeah.
	It's cool.
	It's important.
	I think it's important for us.
	Yeah.
	You know?
	Yeah.
	What was it like when you, did you think you really had an addiction problem?
	What was that like?
	Oh, yeah.
	I mean, I was like a big time user, drug user?
	Loser, yeah.
	Loser, Yeah, that's fine.
	No, I mean, you know, I'm like a quick learner, so it's not like I can't, I'm never casual about anything.
	So it's like, you know, what starts off as innocent and just experimentational turns into like my entire existence.
	Yeah, wow.
	And I, you know, that part of my personality, I've changed, I've managed to change over the years too.
	Like I've grown up a little bit more, you know.
	Like what part of it you mean?
	Well, because I think before when I looked at like my relationships, when I looked at like just everything has to be an excess, you know?
	And now I'm like a little more balanced.
	Did you ditch the jacket?
	Yeah, I just took my jacket off because I don't know if I'm getting warm or not, or I don't know if I'm just feeling like if something's wrong with me, I feel fine.
	I'm not going to faint.
	I don't feel like sick.
	I just, I was like, do I still want to have a jacket on?
	And so I just took action, I guess.
	You know?
	Yeah, I think faith is just so interesting.
	I think it used to be probably a long time ago, people had to have more faith because there wasn't like your television screen was almost like the sky or the, you know, it was like watching nature.
	Like if you wanted to watch the nature channel, you had to go outside.
	Like you already lived outside.
	So you got to just look, you know, it was like, I think we were so much more connected probably to the universe.
	And I don't know.
	I think, I don't know.
	I just think it's interesting what religion is like.
	And some people say that it's bad for people, you know, that people call it like the opiate of the masses.
	You hear people say that.
	And, but I don't know.
	I would.
	I think there's bad representations of everything, you know?
	I mean, there's like certainly bad representations of people in AA, you know, like I always had a hard time going to AA because I just couldn't stand a lot of the people, to be honest.
	And well, that and also like, I just feel like they were never, it was never really anonymous, especially in LA.
	Like people go there as a scene.
	Like you would go and it's like so-and-so was at a meeting.
	Or I remember I was going with a friend and then someone like took a picture of us like from, you know, the back or whatever and posts like, man, like, you know, it's like my friend's trying to get through something and then, you know, it's like this unnecessary attention.
	Or, or the worst would be comedians like that would show up and they would speak and they're just like practicing their.
	Really?
	Yeah.
	Oh, it's like the worst.
	The worst.
	I'm like, this is why I vape.
	At least now I have somebody to blame it on.
	But no, I'll say this.
	You know what?
	There is some things about that that make people feel uncomfortable.
	You know, I try to go to meetings and share as honestly as I can.
	That's cool.
	But it's sometimes, you know, that part I'm able to get over, like if somebody hears something I'm thinking or feeling about, because that sometimes could be, was a hangup for me a little bit.
	Like, you know, if people started to recognize you, it made me feel like scared, I think, a lot of times.
	I mean, it all helps and it all doesn't.
	I mean, you know, I feel like if it, if it inspires somebody to keep coming, that's cool too.
	But you don't want that to, somebody's sobriety hinged on that.
	But, and I think there's also, it's like, it's like churches.
	There's some that are mega churches that are, you know, preaching weird gospel and like, and then there's smaller ones that are, are not, or whatever.
	You know, I think it's like, because I know there's meetings that are much more private and like, you know, you know, it's not a scene or a dating scene or something, you know?
	Yeah.
	But yeah, A is interesting, though.
	I think it's interesting that A is interesting.
	But then also you're like, well, this is why I'm here.
	Sometimes it depends on my attitude.
	If I'm in a good mood that day, it's like, I don't care.
	Yeah.
	But yeah, there was a meeting in Las Vegas recently where a guy was like kind of filming like himself, like with this, with me in the background.
	And that made me just.
	Yeah, yeah.
	I mean, I spoke up for myself and I asked him what was going on.
	But it was just some of that stuff's a little bit weird.
	Yeah, it's to be, to be, you know, but then you're like, well, yeah, I don't know.
	But I love going to meetings that I really like.
	Yeah.
	I thought it was super helpful.
	That's good.
	I was trying to think of something else with faith that we could talk about.
	You want to talk about that stuff more?
	Is it okay with you?
	Yeah, yeah.
	Oh, I love thinking about it.
	I don't have a lot of people on that I guess that we talk about it with as much.
	I'm probably the worst person because I'm not like a studied, you know.
	Oh, I don't know anything about the history of it.
	I mean, I know that, you know, I know about the family in the woods.
	I know they had the apple.
	I know one of the sons killed the other one.
	So things got a little hectic right out of the gate, you know, but there's a lot of like the specific, I don't know a lot of the logistics, you know?
	Yeah.
	So I think I wouldn't, yeah.
	That part I don't know about.
	But I just think about feelings and stuff.
	Yeah.
	I like thinking about that kind of stuff.
	Some of that is intuitive too, I feel like, you know, like there's parts of, you know, I think there's like some things that are like ingrained in us that you can't really explain, you know?
	Like it doesn't feel good to harm somebody, things like that, you know.
	Yeah.
	But I don't know.
	Yeah, but then yeah, it's interesting how that kind of stuff happens in the world sometimes, you know?
	I don't know.
	I don't side.
	Yeah, but I think then people go, well, you know, if why would God let that happen?
	I don't know.
	I'm going to take my shoes off.
	Is that okay?
	Yeah, for sure.
	But just don't get a shot of it because that's gross.
	I hate people do that.
	I just want to do this.
	I don't even have my phone on me.
	Oh, but yeah, we can blur them out.
	No, you don't have to blur them up.
	Yeah, but I think sometimes people want to blame God when it's bad and not for the good stuff.
	But I think you look at like, I always think like we're human, you know, we sin.
	We were capable of making mistakes and we have free will to make good and bad choices.
	So it's like, yeah, of course there's going to be evil in this world.
	But I don't think God would be the one to blame.
	You still have to take accountability for your actions.
	It's a shame that bad things do happen to a lot of good people and innocent people.
	That's the way of the world.
	Yeah, I think that's always been there throughout time.
	I don't think God of God is like a specific instance to instance type of landlord or whatever you want to, leader, or champion or whatever.
	Some people call me different names, but I think of him more as just this jet of like, I think of like of, I like to think of his view of us as like a general energy, more like it's just something that's always there.
	No matter if, even if things are horrible, it's there.
	And if things are good, it's there.
	You know, it's almost like this, like, it's like this code or something that kind of fits to whatever you need it to be.
	I don't really think of it as like a little, like too much of like a rigid thing.
	So, yeah, I guess I wouldn't blame God.
	Like, if something horrible happened, I don't know if I would take it to God.
	I would just be like, that's what we do here, unfortunately, in the world.
	You know, I might talk to God to try and have understanding.
	And maybe I would blame him and he would let me blame him.
	You know, that's one of the things he does.
	He just lets you blame him.
	You know, that, I don't know.
	I don't know.
	I like thinking about this, though.
	Some of it's interesting, you know?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Because it's like, yeah, how do we, and I don't know if our brains can conceptualize everything.
	Like, we're only, we only have five senses, you know?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	I was just talking to my buddy about this the other day.
	Like, dude, we only have five senses.
	Yeah.
	Not that many, dude.
	A lot can be done with that, though.
	A lot can be done with that.
	No, no, and look, people are doing a great job.
	No, but you're right.
	I feel like there's like parts of my brain that can't comprehend the concepts of time, you know what I mean?
	But we just try our best to get to get through that.
	Like, I think about like the story of Job in the Bible.
	Like, that one is, you know, even if you look at it, you know, not literally, but like where like Job was this guy, and I'm going to just paraphrase it.
	Totally paraphrase.
	And look, if anybody judges somebody for paraphrasing out of the Bible, dude, we're not pastors, you know?
	Yeah, yeah, for sure.
	Yeah.
	We're just two people sitting somewhere trying our best to be alive in the universe.
	Yeah, yeah, it's true.
	But thanks.
	But, you know, like Job was put through all these trials and all the worst things that you can imagine happening to one person.
	And through it, he just maintained his faith.
	And even at a point where even at one point his wife was like, come on, are you serious?
	Like, how can you still like praise God when you're, you know, you're losing your children, you're losing everything we've had, you know, and now you're sick and covered in boils and on the brink of death, you know?
	And he was just like, praise God, you know?
	And I feel like a lot of times, you know, through my decades of tattooing people and hearing like the worst and saddest stories, like, just, you know, I was kind of known for doing a lot of portraits.
	And so I would do portraits of people, their loved ones who have passed or, you know, their loved ones who inspired them, things like that.
	And you just hear some of the most heart-wrenching stuff that like, I can't even begin to imagine like how you're still walking, you know?
	But they still find a way, you know?
	And I feel like that's like, I want to be like Job in that sense, you know, because like this, like the last few years for me, I've been so rough, like behind the curtains, you know, I don't share all my, I'm not the type of person that goes on Instagram and cries, you know, but it's like, you know, we, we suffer quietly through things and we like, you know, no one's, no one has a perfect life.
	And, but I'm still going to live in a state of gratitude, you know, and I'm still going to be like excited to be here sitting with you today, you know, and it's like the world could be falling apart.
	And I'm still like, I praise God, you know?
	Yeah.
	Yeah, it gives you hope, I think.
	Yeah.
	That's the thing that I think that's, I don't know, I mean, yeah, I love that.
	Yeah, and we do also, it is interesting how we suffer quietly, huh?
	Yeah.
	I mean, some suffer loudly like a dick, but.
	Oh, yeah.
	Like my freaking neighbor's dog.
	I think he's not even suffering.
	But it's loud.
	Yeah.
	But it's all going to be okay.
	Yeah, I think that's what God is to a lot of people.
	It's a real.
	It's like, I would way rather have hope.
	Me too.
	Than not have it.
	Yeah.
	That's the thing.
	It's like.
	And yeah, I don't know.
	I've just felt God.
	I've just felt God.
	Same.
	It was the only thing I could say it was.
	Yeah.
	You know, because one time I was smoking a bunch of menthols, actually going back to cigarettes, but my girlfriend had broken up with me and I was about to just, you know, peel my skin off of my body and feed it to something.
	And I wasn't doing real well.
	And I was just really doing real bad just on the inside.
	I was just, and I just remember, I mean, I swear, it's crazy, but I felt like something literally just like put like a, like a big hand went around my heart and I started to feel better.
	But I felt like a, it really felt like that, which is.
	Same.
	Yeah.
	I had the exact same feeling.
	Really?
	Yeah.
	It was weird.
	And I don't really talk about it because then you sound all like.
	Oh, I don't give a fuck.
	People know I'm that shit.
	You know, we're doing our best.
	Yeah, yeah.
	If anybody thinks, yeah, that they think I know anything about God, like any exact low-key BTS information about the Lord, they're out of their effing mind.
	And if they think they do too, then they're out of their effing mind.
	I just am trying to think out loud and feel out loud with somebody.
	Yeah.
	Is that what that, but you had something similar?
	Yeah, yeah.
	Where I felt like, like a hand, like just kind of wrapping me in warmth.
	And I just, I just had this feeling of surrendering to it.
	You know, where I was just like, oh man, like it's going to be fine.
	And it's not, it's not me just being like, oh, I'll tell myself until, you know, like, no, like I had, I had like a clear understanding that like, you got me, you know?
	Yeah.
	It's kind of cool.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And well, what's interesting too for me is that I've even taken my own will back so many times since then.
	Yeah.
	And that's the tough thing.
	I think that's where I want to get more into like just my morning routine.
	It's just like turning my, just thy will be done, you know?
	Because then it just takes all the pressure off of me.
	It takes all the pressure off of me to like feel like I have to make everything okay or that I got to make everybody okay or that I have.
	What are those pressures?
	I don't know.
	I think I just feel I've always felt like I'm running late for something.
	I've felt that my whole life.
	Like I'm, if I don't keep doing more, then I'm not enough.
	Or like if I don't do, I think I felt as a kid, like if I don't do something, like I just wasn't seen.
	my mother didn't really look at me, right?
	And so, I think I felt like I have to be perfect.
	If I'm not, the only way I have a chance of being seen is if I'm perfect, you know, and if I'm not, if I'm not like perfect, then I just don't have a chance to be seen, you know?
	And yeah, it makes me, it makes me sad to think that a kid would think that, you know, but I think that's how I felt, you know, I think, and I'm not blaming my mother, I think, or my father, you know, I don't know.
	I don't know what their lives were like, but I just remember like, as I've gotten older, I've been able to recognize that.
	Like, man, if I just, that's what you were feeling for so long, you know, I felt like I always needed to go do something to try and make myself better so that I was enough.
	Same, yeah.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	To be seen, you know.
	Yeah.
	So I think when I say, yeah, I will be done, it's like just letting like none of that, Matt.
	It does, everything's okay.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	You know, like no matter how you are, if you're good or bad or if you're not doing your best, if you're not even like, not if you're not even trying, really.
	I feel like you should try.
	Yeah.
	But just that everything is, you're just not alone, you know?
	Yeah.
	And so I think I've always had a tough time, like letting people love me, you know?
	Really?
	Yeah.
	It's been really, really tough.
	Like in relationships or something?
	Yeah.
	I think I'm just, I think that muscle just wasn't built up when I was a child with my mother.
	And so I just didn't, I just have had a tough time with it.
	And so I think the interesting thing about having trying through 12-step for me has just been having some, trying to build some relationship.
	It's the first time that I've kind of really let somebody into my life is in my negotiations with God.
	And I hate to call them that, but that's kind of, you know.
	That makes sense, though.
	Like, how much am I willing to turn myself over that somebody else is going to that somebody else is going to be with me, you know, even if I'm not even if I'm not enough or if I don't feel like I'm enough for them to keep me around, you know?
	Anyway.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Sorry.
	I don't know what it is.
	No.
	Yeah.
	I think I had this scenario this last week when I was in LA actually, where, you know, I had this makeup line for 12 years and it did really great.
	And then at one point, I got a bunch of backlash and I ended up having to like really like sit with myself and figure out like what I want to do with my life if I want to keep up this fight of like, I mean, I don't know, there's like contractually things that I can't talk about anymore.
	But when I sold my makeup line, I had to sit there in a meeting with the production company and lawyers and stuff.
	And I remember I just wanted to like shut it down.
	Like, let's just let it go.
	Like, I don't want to do this anymore.
	You know, and they were like, but I think they saw there's profits to be made and stuff.
	And so in order to buy me out, like, you know, there was negotiations.
	And at one point, and I was always very fair about things.
	I don't, I wasn't asking for, you know, the world.
	And I remember at one point, this guy, this old man with like, this balding old man with a potato nose, alcoholic potato nose, like looked me in the eyes and told me, you're not worth anything anymore.
	Like, and those words and his voice like haunt me still, even though I know it's not like, this guy's telling me what's cool.
	Like, you know, and I know it was just like a leveraging point to whatever, try to give me as little as possible.
	But so when I go to LA, I like, this is one thing that I don't, that I, that I do complain about where I'm at in Indiana is that there's no places to work out.
	And I actually like, it's, it's good for my health to work out every day.
	Yeah.
	So when I go to LA, I'll fly in and then I just go to I go to Barry's boot camp where I just have a bunch of people yelling at me to run faster.
	And so, but if you've ever been to like a Barry's workout, it's like there's no talking.
	And that's another thing I like about it.
	You just go, you work out.
	And then in between, like you do like floor work and then you have to switch to the treadmill, right?
	And in between that, you switch.
	And so we're right about to switch and I'm just sitting there like, and this guy's voice gets in my head.
	I'm looking at myself in the mirror and it's just like, like, you're not worth anything anymore.
	And I'm like, what am I doing with my life?
	And I was like on the verge of tears.
	And right at that moment, this like blonde girl just comes up to me and was like, hey, cat, really quick, I just want to talk.
	I think you're so amazing.
	And I just like lost it.
	Like, and then she just went on her treadmill and like went, you know, and I didn't see her again.
	And I was like, man, I know it's not, this is the part where you should blame God for like these beautiful divine like moments where it's like, man, you sent this girl like to me just to say like a few little words that like just changed my, you know, and I was just like so grateful in that moment.
	I like went back home after that workout and I just went to my husband.
	I was like, this girl just changed my life, you know, and he was just like, yeah, why are you even listening to that?
	I'm like, I know.
	And that was like years ago.
	And I just still like, you know, I don't know what part of me.
	And it's probably my childhood stuff where, you know, I don't know yours, but mine was like constantly seeking validation through, through my mom, you know, like that wasn't there.
	And it's like, and, you know, I've gone to like years of therapy to like fix myself and stuff.
	So I'm not where I was before, but before I was like, definitely like, oh yeah, like I need to do more.
	There's not enough.
	Like there's so much I want to do that it hurts.
	And it's just like, and it's not, it doesn't really matter if you have like a sea of people that are like cheering you on.
	At the end of the day, it's like, it's just all in here, you know?
	But yeah, it's just, it's crazy to see it in real time now.
	I feel like ever since I got to this place that I am now, like with my faith, like I start seeing it in real time all the time where it's like God's just kind of diving in and being like, cut that shit out.
	Like, you know, but I don't think it's ever going to go away though.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And that childhood stuff and all that kind of, like, I don't suffer from that stuff every day.
	No, it just creeps in sometimes.
	Yeah.
	Sometimes people shit, you know, they're like, man, you seem like I'm like, I'm, I'm okay.
	Yeah.
	You know, but it's still a part of me that lives inside of me.
	You know, and sometimes there's still like, I noticed there's a lot of feelings.
	Like I never got to have feelings when I was a kid.
	I didn't know.
	I was always in some type of mode of like, I need to be like seen.
	I need to make sure my mother sees me so I'll be fed, just taking care of, you know, whatever.
	So I net.
	So at that point, you're not developing any other feelings except for like, you know.
	Yeah.
	Like a stress.
	Yes.
	And so I think, yeah.
	But I think the first time I've ever really been able to have some sort of a even discussion of a relationship in my life has been through recovery and through the introduction of God that way because it was like, you get to choose your own God.
	Right.
	And I've just chosen the most common God that I know and the one that I, you know, friends, families would take me to church and stuff.
	And so, and that's fine for me, you know.
	But I think a lot of that's interesting.
	Yeah, man, I can't believe what gets me is that somebody would even want to work in a job where debating or negotiating for money is worth even the value of saying something like that to someone.
	Yeah.
	That's the sickest part of the world.
	I mean, it worked.
	I definitely was like questioning myself in that moment and was like, maybe I should just settle, you know, and it's like, you know, but lessons learned.
	I don't, I think everything turned out the way it was supposed to anyway.
	Yeah.
	You know, but that's a lot of LA.
	It's like you almost have to hire sick people to deal with other sick people and some of that.
	And it's like, you know, but that's the nicest thing about being out of there, I think, is having some semblance of like, I don't have a manager.
	I don't have, I don't know.
	I've simplified my life too.
	It's crazy.
	And a lot of these things have just, because, you know, I've been so used to being in this little bubble where it's like having the assistants and the managers and all this stuff.
	And then it's like, we move out here.
	And I was like, I can't really, I don't want to bring a compound of people over here.
	And, you know, we had a nanny, for example, like, and, you know, I wasn't blessed with a very close family.
	So when I had my son, it's not like I had a village of family that was helping us out.
	Like, it was just me and my husband by ourselves.
	And it's fine.
	You know, we can do it.
	But then I ended up hiring a nanny who was like family to us, you know, and she would just come from nine to five so that I could do all my work during the day.
	And then once we moved out here, it was like, I was kind of like left alone.
	And I was like, man, this is actually cool being a full-time mom.
	I know it sounds so dumb to say that out loud, but like where I'm, it's just me 100% of the time instead of having somebody help.
	And I think it's made me obviously a better mom.
	And, but, but you, you realize like with less is sometimes easier.
	It's definitely less complicated.
	You know, like my life is definitely like, I, I let go of publicists and all that stuff.
	I mean, we, we'll definitely hire like when we when I have an album launch and stuff, I'll put together a team and we do things.
	But in general, like I'm not dealing with a sea of people anymore.
	And it is, it is definitely liberating.
	And it feels like just there's just more benefits to it, I think.
	Like even when you guys hit me up and stuff, it's like, I used to be like, oh yeah, I'll just let so-and-so hand on.
	I'm like, that's cool.
	I'll just drive myself here, you know?
	Like, cause southern Indiana is not that far from here.
	And I'm like, my son and my husband, we took a little road trip, you know?
	Oh, nice.
	Yeah.
	And then it's just like, like, it's just easier that way, you know?
	Yeah.
	Oh, yeah.
	And these days, it's like, I don't want somebody fielding something that does, has no idea what my interests are.
	Yeah.
	Or what, who I, or what, you know, they may have some idea what my interests are, but they don't, they're not going to make the choices I, you know.
	Yeah.
	It's almost like a lot of that whole world is built on this shell system that you need somebody to help you be a human, you know?
	But these days, a lot of like people don't even believe a lot of stuff in the press.
	Nobody takes it.
	I don't believe any of it.
	It's all trap.
	It's all a bunch of fucking SoundCloud rap.
	Yeah.
	You know, it's all like a lot of fucking.
	I mean, it's anything.
	Usually if I see like certain headlines, especially with my friends, I'm like, well, you already know the truth behind things.
	And I'm like, oh, like, I'll be more, like, my first thought is to be like, oh, it's probably the opposite of whatever it is out there.
	But I feel like, do people still fall for it now?
	Probably.
	I don't know.
	Look, if you still fall, if you don't think that, I mean, there's just so, like, I have friends.
	It's like, who was my friend the other day was telling me that there's some celebrity that they pay a couple grand or something and then some people show up and take pictures of him and then it's gonna be in some tablets but it's all set up and none of it's like it's all for show none of it it's not real yeah you know it's like yeah and it's like people will come out with a brand and then they'll call their friend in a magazine and they're like hey can you say that this brand is amazing and then their friend writes an article says the brand is amazing and
	we don't even know if the brand it's just like so much of it is um it's just uh valueless yeah because it's not true yeah you know and i think that's the thing is just trying to sort out what's true and i think that's what we're all trying to do i think a lot of times just in our own lives even is like well what do i really think or feel what's true you know i think that's something i've had an interesting time um so i mean i i mean that's i think that's one of the
	reasons i've always loved you and everything you do is like there's a level of authenticity um and it's like like earlier we were talking about style and stuff and i'm like i love your style because it's it's just you're effortlessly doing it whatever you like, you know, or unless there's a lot of effort.
	I don't know.
	I mean, it took a while to stay in there and be like, I don't know if this is okay.
	But you gotta wear that black coat because I know you like black stuff.
	I love that.
	I wish I could be as brave as you, I think.
	I did think that's the reddest lipstick I've ever seen in my life, but it's kind of a nice Christmas color, too.
	Wait, what do you mean brave?
	I think it's just brave to be like to put this on.
	To be like, like, cause I remember when I was in junior high school, my friend Matt Shinovere, he was like, he was a neat guy, and his brother played in a band.
	And I don't want to say the band was bad, but the band was probably had a unique sound.
	Okay.
	Okay.
	So, and their name was like, you know, like shuddering, like it was something crazy, you know, like desperate victim or something, you know, like definitely like the name of the band was one guy was playing the drums, but he what he was just fucking shaking with anger so much and he had the sticks in his hand and he was just keeping some type of a vague wooden to metal falsetto.
	And it was just that's who they were, you know.
	But so I would go sometimes and try to be like, and I would listen to like Blind Melon and like fucking.
	Blind Melon is like the one that all I can say is that my but they somehow rolled, I guess they weren't goth, but they were kind of hippie.
	I don't know if we had goth, maybe we had one dude.
	Oh yeah, goth was different.
	Sorry, these were just kind of like the opposite.
	Yeah, these are just kind of like violent hippies.
	Okay, all right.
	So that's kind of the group I was in for a little while was this violent hippie group.
	And then, but yeah, the goth kids would wear like those shoes that were like, and then but they had to wait till everybody left to walk over the back because it was like such an uncomfortable walk sometimes.
	So like, why are those goth kids still hanging out by the tree over there?
	Like always in the trees.
	It's weird.
	There's even a website.
	I think it was called Goths in Trees.
	And for some, there's like a fascination with like goth people that are like in trees.
	I didn't, I've never felt the feeling calling, but I don't know.
	There's a lot of them.
	That's cool.
	It's a thing.
	So go on.
	There it is.
	Goths in trees right there.
	Let's look at a few of them.
	They all hang out.
	That guy's not that goth.
	Yeah, that guy definitely.
	Oh, that guy is goth, dude.
	Yeah, and they all hang out in trees.
	I don't understand.
	Ooh, there is something very Edgar Allan Poe about it.
	You know?
	Because of a raven?
	I think so.
	Now, this lady seems like.
	It's a thing.
	I have never done it.
	Let's see more.
	This is fascinating.
	Wow.
	Now that guy is goth.
	Yeah.
	Look, they're inside trees.
	It's weird.
	I wonder if there's something about it that feels good to him.
	To our species.
	Yeah.
	I could see it.
	Now, this is really interesting.
	She brought props.
	Oh, yeah.
	She has a scythe or scythe?
	Is it scythe?
	She has a scythe.
	Oh, wow.
	Yeah, these are goths on.
	In trees.
	Is it a treehouse or?
	Yeah, it looks like a treehouse or zipline.
	Goths on Zipline would be good, too.
	But I love this.
	This is really fascinating.
	I used to love when there was some dope Tumblr pages out there.
	That was fun, wasn't it?
	Yeah.
	But you were going to get to the point where, so you had the friends that were in the band.
	Yeah, but yeah, and I thought I was gothed, but I wasn't.
	I guess, yeah, we would just like listen to like skinny puppy or different bands like, you know, Epilepsy Lizard or some kind of shit like that.
	And then, yeah, that was it.
	That was about as got as kind of as goth as I get.
	But I was always marveled at the people that could go full dark winged duck, you know, like people.
	I like that, dark-winged duck.
	Yeah, I think the people that like could be like, whoa, like this person, like, how did they get to school?
	Did they flew here themselves?
	Like that type of, I think there was something like interesting about it.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And there was always like, there's such an allure, I think, about that sort of woman.
	Or yeah, I would probably say woman more because I think it's like there's something interesting about a goth person.
	What is it?
	What is it about goth people?
	Why is it?
	Like a, like the loose screws, probably?
	Or what is it?
	Like, why do they, what is like the calling towards?
	Like, is there like a code of conduct or something?
	I mean, there's got to be some childhood stuff, right?
	I mean, I know for me, like I said, I never felt a sense of belonging even within my own family unit.
	So I remember discovering music and then not necessarily seeing myself, but like there was a reflection of emotions happening.
	Like when I like, I love the cure and Susie the Banchy's the patch.
	And I think like lyrically and just like this, the soul to it, you know, I feel like a lot of people are sensitive in that sense, but and then they just like take it to the, you know, to the outward expression of that.
	But I don't know.
	I just I just like it.
	You know, I maybe that's it.
	Maybe like a way to be seen too, because I guess it was an outlier.
	Like I grew up in a small town.
	So but it's kind of not because like right because you have your own group then.
	Like is that what you mean?
	Well, I mean, I don't know.
	I'm not judging.
	I'm just looking at it.
	I'm like, it's just like it's funny.
	Like even this morning when I was getting ready, I was like, you know, I feel like I tend to dress very, I cover all the time.
	Like I don't, I very rarely show my tattoos at all.
	And I was like, you know what, I'm going to change it up.
	I'm going to go see Theo today and I'll just wear short sleeves, you know?
	But I feel like I would always get tattooed for myself.
	Like I just like to look at images or I like what it looks like, the appearance of it.
	I in the middle of nowhere in Indiana, like I dress like this every day.
	And it's like, but it's not for anybody else other than, why are you laughing?
	I get to see how any men got like pulled up back at home and like, honey, I seen a damn apparition down there.
	Damn this neighborhood's going to shit.
	So really, I think there's something interesting about, Or, no, there's something.
	Look, I think a lot of men, I remember in our town, a lot of men would go and cry over by the Winn-Dixie in their truck.
	I remember.
	Why?
	I don't know why, but we would go ride our bike over there sometimes.
	It was like a sad place.
	Like, I think men would just go sit over there and be sad sometimes.
	I remember seeing that.
	But, yeah, I think there was something very alluring about a goth woman to me.
	It seemed like a siren, you know, like in that book?
	Yeah.
	For Odysseus.
	You know what I'm talking about?
	Yeah, yeah.
	It seemed, that's what it seemed like.
	There was like something like, what's going on?
	Yeah.
	This is different.
	It's different.
	You know, I think it's, well, it's brave to be different.
	I think so.
	That may be like, well, yeah, was there an element of like, this feels brave to me?
	Like, I'm just interested how somebody kind of leans into that or how they, you know.
	Not that they're joining a group, but it's like, what, how does that kind of, yeah, why does one goth, you know?
	Yeah, I, I mean, I don't know.
	I just like what I like, I think, and I just do more of that or do a lot of that, I guess.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, it's interesting.
	I've never gotten a, you know, I think there's maybe I might have dated a goth woman at some point.
	I don't remember, but I probably, I think I could have.
	I think I did.
	She didn't write you a poem?
	Huh?
	I'm sure she did.
	I'm sure.
	Dude, I was in the French court the other day with my brother, and there's people there.
	If you go up to them, they'll write a poem for you and your friend.
	Oh, really?
	You and your friend that you're about you?
	Is it funny or is it like a no?
	It was like a nice poem.
	Okay.
	They're like, okay, tell us a little bit about yourself.
	And I was like, oh, this is my brother.
	And, you know, and so you tell them a couple little things, you know, and then you have to stand there for about 11 minutes.
	That's the tough part.
	You know, because they're on typewriters.
	Yeah, yeah.
	And they're all sitting there.
	They're sitting there on typewriters, like a row of like four of them.
	And everybody's just like, and there's like music playing.
	Like people are playing the street music.
	And it was pretty awesome.
	We had a great time.
	And yeah, we got a nice little Christmas gift there.
	That's cool.
	This was super cool.
	Yeah, it was real nice.
	That's cool.
	But yeah, they had, you know, I was, oh, I was in a class with this lady, and she was, she smoked a lot of weed.
	Like her, some of her, I think she had discolorated teeth from them belt.
	But she was awesome.
	She was like the stoner teacher, kind of her alleged stoner.
	And we would write poems in there all day.
	So I think that's maybe where I saw some golf.
	Were her teeth, they were yellow?
	I think they had a tint to them.
	I don't want to, yeah, I don't want to call, you know, I don't know she could have had a.
	I'm so self-conscious about my teeth lately.
	I feel like in pictures, because I wear red lipstick all the time.
	No, I feel like I'm looking at yours.
	Yours are super white.
	Mine.
	And I was like, I even Googled like, why?
	Because I brush and floss like crazy and I quit smoking.
	So I thought, oh, I'm going to get white teeth.
	It's going to be amazing.
	And then I just, it's just not happening.
	I don't know what to do about it.
	I don't want to get, I won't get the fake teeth that everyone's getting now.
	It's crazy.
	Everyone looks crazy.
	Hey, brother.
	They look so crazy.
	I'm like, damn, what have you been eating, buddy?
	Electricity?
	Huh?
	What the hell have you been eating, dude?
	Man, you got gloss-finished teeth?
	What's crazy is that your teeth look very nice.
	I have nice teeth.
	Your teeth are whiter than your skin.
	No, your teeth are so white.
	Nuh-uh.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I guarantee you that.
	But this is, look, everybody watching is like, these people have the yellowest fucking teeth, these idiots.
	I just won't, I'll live with my yellow if it means not having like chiclet teeth or whatever that everyone has.
	Oh, my mom was always brushing her teeth and putting on hand cream.
	Yeah.
	Oh, our house could be burning down, but as long as she was getting her hand cream on.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	It was pretty cool, though, actually.
	I think, yeah, it was just, you know, she'd always have that hand cream.
	You like to have it.
	I think it was probably calming to her, too, maybe to be doing to kind of do this with her hands.
	I wonder what my son's going to take away from, like, that's one of your little core memories.
	And I'm like, I wonder what.
	Oh, what his will be?
	Yeah.
	Ooh.
	Because he's so sweet.
	He learned the word ravishing.
	Now he's like, this morning, mom, you look ravishing.
	Thanks.
	You're like, go get in that tree for family pictures.
	Actually, no.
	Dude, that would be a neat thing.
	No, we do.
	We do a lot of family portraits together.
	And I love our little family because we just, we look like a little family, you know?
	Like, my son, he is not scared about like what I think, not scared, but like spooky to him is fun because it's what he's around.
	You know what I mean?
	So his normal is a lot different than like normal kids.
	And we get a lot of criticism about that too.
	Cause, you know, he'll, because he wears black or he'll, like, I'm like, that's what he likes.
	Like at this point, he sees his dad or his mom, you know, it's like, it's, it's normal to him.
	So, so we did like a photo shoot for this.
	It was actually for like a, an interview, like for a magazine thing.
	And they wanted to shoot us in front of our house.
	And so I was like, oh, there's like this little fountain.
	And I had like my little, like, Tim Burton, like parasol thing.
	And, um, and people just hated it.
	I think they just hated seeing, like, it bothers them that we, we don't look normal.
	I don't understand.
	It's really weird.
	I would think that you would think like, oh, it's cute.
	It's very like Adam's family or something, you know?
	Well, even like we were saying earlier, people want to put, and I do it too.
	I want to have a box.
	I want to have a safe space for things to be in.
	I don't want things to, I'm okay with the edges fraying, but I think there's a part of me, even like a system of organization, I think.
	Yeah.
	Because your brain just, all your brain does is just organize.
	That's true.
	Yeah.
	So I think when things start to get a little weary, they don't know, you know, you don't know what to get, what's going on.
	Yeah.
	What's your husband like?
	He's cool.
	He's his name is Raphael, and my son's name is Leofar, which is Raphael spelled backwards.
	Leophar.
	Yeah, it's pretty cool.
	Wow.
	I know.
	I wish I had a cool name that sounded good backwards.
	Yeah.
	I don't.
	Yeah.
	But it's cool.
	You don't.
	I just read it.
	I know.
	Sorry.
	Yeah, right?
	Sorry.
	But yeah.
	Dinovatak.
	Do know what that.
	But yeah, it's very...
	I bet.
	Anyway, sorry.
	Sorry for making so many jokes on it.
	I love it.
	I love it.
	Your aesthetic and stuff.
	But it's cool.
	Some are very accurate, though.
	Well, I wish I'd gotten to talk to more people that are goth people.
	I think.
	I think I don't ever do.
	I don't know if I don't go to enough goth places.
	I think I've always kind of had an affinity for goth women, maybe.
	I think.
	Oh, my brother likes goth women too, I think.
	Or he likes creative ladies, kind of.
	Like artsy.
	Yeah.
	And yeah, I think where I was growing up, being artsy was weird, you know?
	I think it was like people thought you was gay or something, you know, or you was damn gay or whatever.
	If you, you know, did like, I remember if you got good grades, you know, people thought you were homosexual.
	Really?
	Oh, yeah, dude.
	And so it was like, yeah.
	So I think being brave enough probably.
	Yeah.
	And when I was little to have somebody be like unique, like you seem, like you are, I think it, that would have been, so maybe that's why I think it's really fascinating.
	I think it's maybe the trauma.
	Like that's like, like, cause I think about why does it, why do I think cigarettes are sexy, right?
	Like, because there's this like sense of like, you don't care that you're damaging yourself.
	And there's like a, not a danger to it, but just like it's self-destructive a little bit.
	And I think with maybe it's just like there, I don't know, like some, some of my favorite bands and the music I listen to, it's like, there's some stuff that I'm like, oh, they're, they're good, but you could tell they just, like, they don't have any trauma.
	Like, so it's like, I just don't listen to happy music.
	I don't like happy.
	I don't, I'm not attracted to it.
	You know what I mean?
	Yeah.
	So yeah, maybe that's what it's, what it takes.
	I know I've had trauma.
	I mean, I've seen some crazy things.
	Do a lot of people mistake you and Dave Navarro ever or not?
	No.
	But you know what I do hate is like, cause I really want to have bangs.
	And every time I've ever cut bangs, people call, say that I look like Cher.
	And I don't think I look anything like Cher.
	I think it's because we have a deep voice, right?
	Oh, yeah.
	That could be it.
	I saw Cher at a game.
	She was running around with a young brother at the Super Bowl last year.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	She's dating like a 17-year-old, I think, or 18. Sorry.
	Yeah.
	But, yeah.
	Yeah, but I don't look like Dave Navarro.
	Take that back.
	Sorry.
	You don't look anything like Dave Navarro.
	I was just trying to think if somebody were like really ridiculous that they would run up and say that.
	Dude, the saddest thing, his mother got murdered.
	I know.
	I did a portrait of her on him.
	You did?
	Yeah.
	No way.
	Wow.
	The street I lived on is where it happened in Los Angeles.
	Oh, really?
	Yeah.
	And it always, I always think about him all the time.
	For some reason, I guess because of that or something.
	He's an interesting guy.
	I never got to meet him.
	I don't really know him that well.
	Yeah.
	I never got to know him or know anything about him.
	But yeah, I just remember that.
	I like Jane's addiction.
	Oh, dude.
	Yeah.
	Bro, a friend of mine threw his one-year-old birthday, his kid, his kid's birthday at Perry Farrell's house, right?
	So I knew about Perry.
	I didn't know, I knew about Jane's addiction, but I didn't know Perry Farrell, right?
	Yeah.
	So I'm over there just kind of lurking, loitering.
	Wait, somebody's kid's birthday?
	Yeah, my friend, they didn't have a lot of, like, they, like, you know, in LA, a lot of times if somebody finally gets a nice house, everybody starts throwing their children's parties there because it's a big enough space.
	Yeah, okay.
	So, yeah, they did it there, and Perry Farrell was in there.
	And I didn't know.
	I was just kind of loitering around in the other room because I'm hanging out with a bunch of fucking one-year-olds.
	You know what I'm saying?
	Well, I was just thinking about this the other day because it was my kid's birthday, right?
	And he's like super into Billie Idol right now.
	Like, he loves Billy Idol.
	And not even Billie Idol.
	He loves Steve Stevens, which is the guitarist of Billy Idol.
	And I just love that my kid thinks he's so cool, you know?
	And he has this little like plastic red guitar that like he'll be in front of the mirror at the house and he'll make the faces like Steve Stevens.
	And so I tattooed Steve a while back.
	I did a portrait of his beautiful wife on him.
	And I was like, I texted him.
	I'm like, I sent him a video of my son.
	And in the video, I'm like, hey, who are you?
	And he's like, I'm Steve Stevens.
	And like, you know, the coolest.
	And so there's a picture of him there.
	Yeah, right?
	Exactly.
	I'm like, oh, I love it.
	See, my son gets it, you know?
	And so I was like, should I, because my friends were like, are you going to ask him to come?
	Because I did a rock and roll themed birthday party for him.
	Like, you're going to ask Steve Stevens to come?
	And I was like, no, dude, I'm not going to do that.
	Cause I feel like that's one thing that irks me about like LA people that they'll do that when they get weird about their kids and they'll be like, I want to get like without naming names, I've like dated some people that put their kids on these weird pedestals and they'll like use their name to get people to, you know?
	Right.
	So it's like, I was like, no, I'm not going to.
	And also like, it'll be weird if he just like shows up and is just hanging out with like a bunch of and a five-year-old if he's hanging out with a five-year-old.
	Yeah.
	Or just, it'll be boring for him, right?
	Yeah.
	It's like they can't, it's not like him and him and Steve Stevens take a walk and talk about their careers or whatever together.
	It's like, yeah, that part I think when we got to the straight part, I think it'd be really probably sweet for your son.
	Even though I did ask Leo Far, I'm like, hey, what would you do if Steve, if you hung out with Steve?
	He's like, I would take him to the pirate park because there's like a pirate ship park there.
	I'm like, oh, cool.
	Show him your Sonic the Hedgehog toy.
	Did you?
	But one time, one time, a long time ago, Kirsty Alley hit me up.
	Really?
	And was like, hey, my son, True, is like your biggest fan.
	And he's having, and this is when he was really little.
	He's like an adult now.
	But we're having a Katmon D-themed birthday party.
	And she showed me the cake.
	And she's like, she's like, I know it's weird and annoying, but do you think you could come over and just like surprise him?
	And I was just like, Chris Daly's so cool, you know, like I loved her, you know?
	And I was like, should I go over there?
	And I was tattooing that day.
	And afterwards, I just rolled up and it was just so awkward because it was just like, hi.
	And then you're just like, I don't have any tricks.
	Like, you know, there's nothing to do.
	So, yeah.
	Oh, there's nothing weirder than when you realize you don't have a skill, like an actual like skill.
	Like big balloons or something.
	Unless you start tattooing little kids, you know.
	Dude, my best friend, Scott, his aunt worked with Kirsty Alley, and we went out to Maine one time.
	Wow.
	That's where they live at, like out on Islesboro Island.
	And so we got to go out there and we got to go eat dinner at her house one day.
	Oh, cool.
	It was pretty cool, I think.
	My memory's not that great, but I think it was pretty great.
	Yeah.
	And she had a tennis court that was like kind of in the ocean on these rocks.
	Really?
	It was literally in the ocean.
	So it was just like.
	So cool.
	And being on Maine is so like, you know, it's like so just like, yeah, we'll see about that.
	Yeah.
	You know, it's got that fucking grit in it.
	Yeah.
	Stephen King grit.
	Yeah, a lot of fucking domestic abuse up there as well.
	I'm not pointing fingers, but you could point him anywhere up there and you'd be right.
	But yeah, I love that place.
	Portland, Maine.
	Have you been there?
	Portland, no.
	One of my most favorite cities.
	Oh, really?
	Yeah, I didn't know it would be amazing and it actually blew my mind.
	Okay.
	Is there a place that you really like?
	I'm not going to say it because it's uber goth.
	Oh, it is?
	Transylvania?
	No, I would say like Prague was my favorite place.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah.
	Just the gothic architecture and stuff.
	And also, I love Beethoven and like, I'm going to be a nerd right now, but one of his apartments is there.
	And so I went and like took a picture in front of the apartment and everything.
	Oh, that's cool.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, I'm trying to think if I've seen anybody's good death place or something or place that's like, have you ever done any weird like rituals or something?
	I'm sure people think that you've done some.
	No, no, but my friend and I, we used to collect pictures at cemeteries all around the world, which I thought was pretty cool.
	Yeah, like the, I think my two favorite cemeteries that I've ever been to.
	Well, there's three, but they're obviously in Paris.
	There's the famous one where Edith Pioff and Oscar Wilde and everyone else is buried there.
	And then there's one in Argentina that is like the coolest one ever.
	And there's like this huge wait list to get buried there.
	But it's just the most monumental mosques or whatever they're called, but super cool.
	You just walk and see all the architecture.
	Yeah.
	And New Orleans is like that too.
	I went to the New Orleans ones.
	It was good, but it was right after the Hurricane Katrina.
	A lot of the body parts and things.
	Come back up.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	A lot of people coming back to like probably get money from the government or whatever.
	Like even bodies were like, you know, you see an arm coming out of the ground, like, give me a check.
	You know, it's just that kind of city, I think, over there.
	What else do you want to do?
	You've had an interesting life, Kat.
	Yeah.
	And look, I know some of the things we say, like being able to leave Los Angeles and do that kind of things, we've at least had enough been able to like, I don't know.
	I sometimes wonder, does that seem like egotistical, you know?
	I mean, I never want to put down like LA because I love L.A., you know, like I love the dirt there.
	I love my friends.
	I love a lot of aspects of it.
	Yeah.
	And the weather, being able to go to the beach if you want.
	Ugh, the beach.
	Oh, yeah, that's true, Mom.
	That's your arch nemesis.
	Yeah, the sun.
	Sorry.
	You got to put me back in that little box with a bow on it.
	Yeah.
	I know.
	What if your name had been Kat Vitamin D?
	That would have been so ironic.
	Well, you know, I thought like, what if you and I would have gotten married?
	Then my name would have been Kat Vaughan Vaughan.
	Yeah.
	Yep.
	You're like, damn, this lady is interesting looking, but even crazier, she's got dyslexia.
	Oh, who that stutter that?
	Yeah.
	The stuttering Icelandic chick?
	Yeah, she's something.
	Oh, that's cute.
	Yeah.
	Oh, there's some pictures that we had of some tattoos that we wanted to just look at with you.
	Is that okay for a minute?
	Okay.
	I'm sure people have done this a lot.
	Do I have to say bad things about them?
	No, no.
	We're going to say whatever we want.
	Oh, but I want to ask about your tattoos.
	So you are getting, you're getting inked out.
	What is it?
	Is there a term for it?
	It's really fascinating looking.
	It reminds me one of those hairless cats.
	Yeah, I have hairless cats.
	Yeah, I've been blacking out all my tattoos.
	And so I'm in the process.
	I have like almost 80% of my body done now.
	Oh my God.
	Oh my God.
	Yeah, but it's not going to look like I'm wearing a scuba diving thing.
	I'm going to have these black flowers kind of, you know.
	So how black, and how long does this process take kind of to do?
	So I think I'm up to 40 hours now.
	But I mean, I've done like the arms are weak.
	Yeah.
	But in increments, you know, I go and I can't sit for more than two or three hours.
	And there's this guy in Philly that he like specializes in it.
	But it's funny because, you know, when I first got into tattooing was during a time when there was no tattoo shows or anything.
	So it was like you would not get hired if you had a face tattoo or, you know what I mean?
	It was a different era.
	And then I think when like certain celebrities started getting tattooed, like the Drew Barry Moores and the Angelina Jolie's, like it started kind of bringing it to the, like if you had a tattoo, a cute one, it was okay, you know?
	And then the TV shows like blew up and then everybody has a tattoo now.
	And it's kind of boring.
	But, but I feel like ever since I started blacking out my tattoos, I feel like I went back to the time where people hated tattoos again because people just do not like this.
	They like, they're very confused by why I'm doing this.
	Every time I post progress shots, it's always like, why are you doing this to yourself?
	Like, this is so ugly.
	Like, this is, you know.
	I think it looks for some reason.
	I didn't know what.
	I think it looks nice.
	I did too.
	I like this.
	It's very interesting.
	Yeah.
	It's almost fascinating in a strange way.
	Like, it's like the inverse of something.
	Yeah, exactly.
	You know, it's like that car.
	It's like carb.
	I don't know what it is.
	But it's, yeah, it's, I'm not, I don't like pain.
	So I, you know, I just numb myself up.
	And, you know, he sits there and tattoos me.
	When you say numb yourself, what do you put on an analgesic or something?
	Like chemical anesthetics?
	Like, like a cream.
	Does that work, really?
	Yeah.
	I mean, it saves me like a good hour and a half or something like that.
	Yeah.
	No, I can't do pills.
	I can't do anything.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah.
	I can't do nothing like that, boy.
	Nope.
	I don't do no pills, bubby.
	Yeah.
	And so how much now you're going to get 80% of your body done?
	No, I'm going to do all of it.
	Your whole body's going to be in a, in a, uh, in dark ink?
	Your whole body's going to be in dark ink?
	Yeah.
	And now we're going to.
	But it'll have like sections that are like, you know, like, see how there's okay.
	So parts that aren't.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Oh, interesting.
	Wow, it's almost like it reminds you of like stained glass or something for some reason.
	It'll look nice.
	I'm like, like, people need to trust the process.
	It'll look good at the end.
	Yeah.
	If anybody has an eye for something that's unique or trying to do something new, I like that.
	Yeah.
	It seems like you would be at least granted that ability to experiment.
	Yeah.
	Oh, yeah.
	Here's a video of you right here.
	Yeah.
	So that's like my last session I did.
	Wow.
	Ooh, what is that?
	Boy, is that a damn cake cutter?
	That's 40 needles.
	God damn, brother.
	That thing.
	Wow.
	Yeah.
	That's cool.
	Where do your, do your folks, have your folks been to visit your new place?
	My dad has, yeah.
	My dad's my contractor, so.
	Oh, he is, huh?
	Oh, good.
	You can bitch at him easier.
	And what about your mom?
	She lives in Southern California.
	Oh, yeah?
	Yeah.
	Are you guys close or not?
	Not as close, yeah.
	But I think, you know, once I, when I had my son, I feel like she likes being a grandma.
	Oh, she does?
	Yeah, I think so.
	Oh, that's cool.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, that's one thing that's fascinating about kids.
	It gives your family a chance to regroup a little, I think.
	You know, I remember when my niece was born, it just was the first time that our family started to have any semblance of a family.
	Oh, really?
	Because we all had one thing in common that we cared about.
	Yeah.
	And it was undisputable.
	And so it was like, it starts to, like, other things start to kind of bloom from that a little bit.
	That's cool.
	Yeah, that must be traumatic hearing people's stories when they come and tattoo because some people are coming with a story, huh?
	Yeah.
	Every single one.
	I don't think I've ever tattooed somebody that just, you know, was getting tattooed out of boredom or anything like that.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	A lot of our therapists in the world are getting, they're oversaturated with pain, I think, from other people.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	What do you mean?
	I just think there's a lot of therapists, a lot of my friends that are therapists, they are oversaturated with people's, you know, because even if somebody shares their story of comfort or pain, it still lands on somebody.
	Yeah.
	You know, and I find a lot of my friends that are therapists are starting to struggle because they are like waterlogged with other people's like trauma and sharing of it and stuff.
	Yeah, it's going to be a heavy job.
	Well, that's what I thought.
	When you said it about tattoo workers, I never thought, or artists, tattoo artists, I'd never thought about that.
	Yeah.
	I mean, I love hearing people's stories.
	So I'm always very welcoming to, or I was welcoming to all that stuff.
	So, you know, it never bothered me, but I know that a lot of tattooers didn't want to.
	Didn't want to hear it?
	Yeah.
	What would they do?
	What do you say?
	Quiet tattoo time only?
	No, I just think that like I think when the TV shows came out, people saw it as an outlet for therapy, which it can be, you know, but some people aren't equipped emotionally to do that, you know?
	For me, I'm like, I can talk about anything.
	I don't care.
	Yeah, you know, and I ended up studying books on death and everything just so I could better understand grieving processes and stuff.
	I'm not a therapist by any means, but, you know.
	Well, these days, anybody who will listen to somebody caringly, I think, is better than half.
	Sometimes it's better even than half the stuff we have out there.
	Yeah.
	There's a lot of shit therapists out there, too.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Because anybody can do it.
	Yeah.
	You just have to go to school and then they let you do it.
	Yeah.
	That's like crazy, dude.
	Yeah, I wonder how that works.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	But I mean, there's a lot of great therapists.
	Do you have a lot of therapist friends?
	Yeah.
	A lot of friends that are therapists and you just start to see that they're getting, I start to notice a lot of them having a tough time.
	And it's like, I think a lot of that is just them taking on that people's pain.
	You know?
	And I'd never thought that tattoo artists hear a lot of it.
	Yeah.
	I just never even thought about it.
	Yeah.
	I mean, at different types, I'm sure.
	Like, if you're doing, you know, dragons all day, I'm sure it's not the same experience.
	But what's the toughest part for somebody to get a tattoo on them?
	What do you mean, toughest?
	Like the hardest part, yeah.
	I think like some people assume that like if you have like a fatty area, it's not going to hurt as much, but it's more based on your nerve setup.
	So, you know, your spine, you're going to have a lot of nerves branching off of it.
	So places like your lower back or your butt, like things like that are pretty sensitive.
	Like your butt cheek is sensitive?
	I remember like the crease where my leg meets my butt is was fire.
	Oh, that seems scary.
	The back of your kneecaps.
	Like, ugh.
	Do you think there's something about the pain of getting the tattoo that is also part of the- I'm not one of those people.
	I know there's like kinky people.
	I never, like, I was...
	I don't know.
	I have a hard time with it.
	I don't like it.
	Anything else we can think about or talk about?
	Do you ever find that video on Macaulay Colkin?
	Yeah, I did.
	I just thought that this was interesting.
	I'd like to thank Brenda.
	Thank you.
	Thank you.
	You are absolutely everything.
	You're my champion.
	You're the only person happier for me today than I am.
	You're not only the best woman I've ever known.
	You're the best person I've ever known.
	You've given me just all my purpose.
	You've given me family.
	You know, and after the birth of our two boys, you become one of my three favorite people.
	You're somewhere in there.
	But I love you.
	I love you so much.
	So yeah, to wrap things up, and in the spirit of the holiday season, I just want to say Merry Christmas, you filthy animals.
	His life is like, there's a part in the beginning of that where he seems kind of, you're kind of like, he still seems like a kid and a man.
	I never heard his speaking voice as an adult until now.
	Yeah.
	Is there anything else that you'd like to talk about, Kat?
	Is there any other endeavors you think about in your world?
	Do you think you'll go back to tattooing or do you still do it?
	Is that a weird question?
	I don't know.
	I don't know a ton about tattooing.
	No, no, it's cool.
	Yeah, I think I'll always want to tattoo until my eyesight goes or something.
	But I don't know if I'm interested in doing, like, I just, you know, I stopped doing tattoos for money decades ago.
	It's been like, you know, almost like 15 years or something.
	I just tattoo my friends, you know?
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah, because I think the dynamic can be pretty intense sometimes if you're tattooing like people you don't know.
	Yeah.
	So, because you're like in a room together intimately for like, you know, hours.
	Sometimes has it been a nightmare being stuck in a room with somebody?
	I'm never alone, but like, usually when I used to tattoo strangers, but now, you know, I just tattoo my friends.
	Do people like say they hire you for like a specific guest?
	Like, does that kind of thing happen as a tattoo artist?
	Like, when you get to have acclaim as a tattoo artist, do they say, like, I want you to come and do my tattoo?
	Like, I want to hire you.
	Oh, like, how do you book an appointment, you mean?
	Or like specifically, like, does that happen?
	Like, some people might, like, commission.
	No, it's a comp.
	Commission?
	Commission, yeah.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	I mean, I would always, yeah, yeah, I mean, it kind of works that way.
	Like, people, when I used to take appointments, it would be more like they'd have to show me what they wanted to get and have like, you know, a little bit of the backstory, that kind of thing.
	And then we would have like a booking process.
	But now, do people, does it ever, you get a ring from like a prince of like nodding at them or something and they want to, does that happen to?
	Yeah, and I don't like that.
	Okay.
	I don't like when people like, like, want me to go to them.
	Because like, first of all, it's like you're creating a sterile environment.
	And so like, I don't want to do that in your kitchen, you know?
	I've only done that like a few times for my friend's friends.
	But like something about like, I don't know, I don't like feeling like a like a stripper or something.
	Oh, so, okay, there's something about that then.
	Oh, yeah, that's interesting.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I would hate to be a stripper.
	I would be so bad at it.
	I don't like people seeing my, I think, like my butt sometimes.
	Like, sometimes if I hook up with a woman or something, I'll walk out of the room backwards.
	They don't look at me.
	Really?
	Yeah.
	I don't think there's anything wrong with it.
	I agree with it.
	Nothing is wrong with it.
	I think I just like, I think.
	You just know that when you stand up after we're done here, I think people just makes me nervous.
	I think because I know I look at people's butts sometimes.
	So I'm just like, dude, so I just got to stop looking at people.
	I'm self-conscious about that stuff too, to be honest.
	Like, I feel like I, even in photo shoots, I always try and conceal myself somehow.
	Yeah.
	I was like hide behind things, but yeah, I love to be hide.
	Dude, I play I can go seek, dude.
	I go hide.
	I'd fucking leave.
	I'd go home, dude.
	My buddy's out there looking for me for three hours, bro.
	Fuck him, son.
	That's life.
	You better get used to it, buddy.
	Yep.
	Thank you so much, Kapon D. And everybody, you can just find her wherever you usually find people.
	And best of luck with your new home.
	I want to see when that tulip garden's going to happen.
	I know.
	Yeah, you have to come up.
	Yeah, what's the ETA on that thing?
	I think in spring is usually when they come up.
	Yeah.
	Boy.
	Yeah.
	That's going to be interesting.
	Oh, you got to get a good scarecrow in it.
	Yeah.
	Maybe not.
	Yeah, you could.
	Yeah.
	You don't want to.
	It's fine.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	That's all good.
	Kat, thank you so much.
	Yeah, no worries.
	Thanks for having me.
	Yep.
	Now I'm just floating on the breeze and I feel I'm falling like these leaves.
	I must be cornerstone.

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