Speech Crime: Woman Sent to Prison for Saying Racial Slur
SUPPORT JOURNALISM. Become a patron athttp://www.patreon.com/TimcastMy Second Channel - https://www.youtube.com/timcastnewsA woman in South Africa has been convicted of a speech crime and is being sent to prison. This stems from a viral video where the woman said the racial slur 48 times to police officers.In the UK two teenagers were arrested for yelling racist things outside of a college dorm.At what point should people be arrested for speech? At what point does speech become harassment? Many people say there is no threat to free speech or that there is no hampering of Campus Free speech, but perhaps that is not true.Make sure to subscribe for more travel, news, opinion, and documentary with Tim Pool everyday.Amazon Prime 30 day free trial - http://amzn.to/2sgiDqRMY GEARGoPro Karma - http://amzn.to/2qw10m4GoPro 6 - http://amzn.to/2CEK0z1DJI Mavic Drone - http://amzn.to/2lX9qgTZagg 12 AMP portable battery - http://amzn.to/2lXB6SxTASCAM Lavalier mic - http://amzn.to/2AwoIhI Canon HD XF 105 Camera - http://amzn.to/2m6v1o3Canon 5D MK III Camera - http://amzn.to/2CvFnnm360 Camera (VR) - http://amzn.to/2AxKu4RFOLLOW MEInstagram - http://instagram.com/TimcastTwitter - http://twitter.com/TimcastMinds - http://Minds.com/TimcastFacebook - http://facebook.com/TimcastnewsBitcoin Wallet: 13ha54MW2hYUS3q1jJhFyWdpNfdfMWtmhZSEND STUFF HERETim Pool330 Washington Street - PMB 517Hoboken, NJ 07030Support the show (http://timcast.com/donate)
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The First Amendment does not grant us the right to free speech.
It protects our right to free speech from the government.
The right to free speech is something that we all just tend to agree on, and not everybody.
Currently, there are a few limits on what you can and cannot say.
You can't incite others to violence.
You can't create a clear and imminent threat.
But there are some people who want to impose new restrictions on speech.
They want to pass hate speech laws in the U.S.
In a few other countries, we have already seen instances of this.
For instance, Count Dankula, when he made his Nazi pug video.
He was convicted and tried.
We have a story now from South Africa, where a woman was charged and convicted for using a racial slur many times.
And another story from the UK, where two teenagers were charged after they yelled racially aggravated things.
At least, that's what the police have said.
We can look to these other countries as examples and get an idea of just where things might go if we don't protect free
speech.
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Our first story from the Washington Post's landmark ruling.
A woman is sent to prison in South Africa for using racial epithet.
Whenever I use the Washington Post as a source, I like to add this little caveat.
I'm not a big fan of them and have called them out numerous times in the past for putting out extremely shoddy journalism.
But because this is considered to be a large mainstream news organization, I do want to use them for the story.
The officers arrived to assist a South African woman whose car was just burglarized, but she didn't want their help, or at least she didn't want the help of a black officer, whom she repeatedly insulted in a racist rant.
In a video that went viral in 2016, she repeatedly called him the K-word, a South African equivalent of the N-word.
Now I just want to stop and say, I'm not going to say what the K-word is because YouTube will probably restrict my channel in some way for using the racial epithet, but if you're interested you can google search
this. It is akin to the n-word, but it is not in the North American vocabulary. That racial epithet
eventually led to the woman's arrest and conviction on four counts of crimen injuria, which in South
Africa is the statute barring verbal racial abuse directed at another person. On Wednesday, a
judge in South Africa sentenced Vicky Momberg to three years in prison with one year
suspended if she does not commit the same In the 2016 incident, Momberg used the K-word 48 times in her tirade, BBC reported.
The video, captured by apparent bystanders, begins with Momberg ranting on the phone to someone about her hatred for black people.
Last month, a South African man was fined 100,000 rand, or about $8,460, for calling a black man the K-word during an argument.
In 2016, a former real estate agent was fined about a total of more than $13,000 for repeatedly referring to black people as monkeys in a Facebook rant, accusing them of littering and being uneducated.
But in recent years, the South African government has been calling for far stricter penalties for racist and discriminatory behavior.
Earlier this month, the country's cabinet approved the Prevention and Combating of Hate Crimes and Hate Speech Bill, allowing it to be sent to Parliament for vote.
That bill would make hate speech or hate crimes punishable, Up to three years in prison for first-time offenders and up to 10 years for subsequent offenses.
Many people have talked about this story because it happened about a week ago.
And the courts are going after this woman.
They have convicted her because she was being racist.
But I do think it would be fair to point out something else that she said before being arrested.
In the article it says, Momberg only grew more irate saying, as she turned on her car, if I see a K, I will run him over.
If I have a gun, I will shoot everybody.
By American standards, she obviously made a threat.
She was creating a clear and imminent threat, and I wouldn't be surprised if someone did that in the U.S.
and they got arrested for it.
However, in South Africa, she wasn't charged or convicted for saying that.
She was charged and convicted because she was saying racist things.
The Daily Show with Trevor Noah posted this video about the incident.
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Yeah, and then she was arrested, and they sentenced her to three years in prison for saying that.
Which is, but it's like, it's crazy, because a lot of Americans, when they hear the story, will be like, but that's free speech, you can't arrest somebody for saying something.
But the thing, here's the thing, here's the thing, I understand that completely, and I mean, it's a larger discussion to wrap your head around, but I will say this, you gotta understand in South Africa, after apartheid ended, white people were never punished.
Right?
Like, it's not like the government was like, we're going to send white people to jail, and we're going to take white people's houses, and we're taking white people's money, and things white people stole.
No!
Government was like, hey, let's move forward.
OK?
Clean slates.
Let's move forward.
Let's get this country to where it needs to be.
The only thing we're going to take away is this racist word.
That's all.
And then some white people were like, OK, but I just want one thing.
Can I have the racist word back?
And then they still want to use the word, and they were like, no.
And so that's, like, now this person has gone to jail.
And what I find funny is, like, people who are online and everyone, they're like, this is, this is a tyranny.
That's what this is.
This is oppression.
Like, you know, like, what do I, what am I supposed to do?
It's like, just don't be racist.
I love how people make it like it's the hardest thing ever.
It's not like you go to jail for mistake racism.
This is like hardcore racism.
And people are like, I don't know how I can live in this country.
Trevor Noah's audience clapped and cheered when they heard that a woman had been arrested for being racist.
So when people say there is no threat to free speech in the US, well, that's incorrect.
This woman was arrested for saying a racist word 48 times.
Keeping in mind, she did threaten to run people over and shoot everybody.
She was convicted for saying racist things.
So she's going to prison for being racist.
Why that's a problem?
Well, Trevor Noah says just simply don't be racist.
But what is racism?
By the dictionary definition, it is positive or negative discrimination based on one's race.
To many people on the left, it is prejudice plus power.
To an even more fringe and extreme group on the left, they say that all white people are racist.
So if Trevor Noah's audience wants to clap and cheer for someone going to jail for simply being racist, and others want to argue that all white people are racist, you start to mix some dangerous ingredients here.
Though I would say I don't think anyone in the audience would want people to simply be arrested for being white.
That's not the point.
The point I'm trying to make is that what is or is not racist changes based on who you're talking to.
In fact, Trevor Noah himself About three years ago was under fire for jokes about Jews and women.
This from The Guardian.
Daily shows Trevor Noah under fire for Twitter jokes about Jews and women.
The newly tapped host has been criticized for controversial tweets from the past that some feel are out of step with the tone of a satirical news program.
In several tweets highlighted by The Guardian, He said,
Almost bumped a Jewish kid crossing the road.
He didn't look before crossing, but I still would have felt so bad in my German car.
He also said, Messi gets the ball and the real players try follow him.
But Messi doesn't go down easy just like Jewish chicks.
And he said, Originally, when men proposed, they went down on one knee,
so if the woman said no, they were in the perfect uppercut position.
And he's got many more.
In this one he said, a hot white woman with ass is like a unicorn.
Even if you do see one, you'll probably never get to ride it.
So perhaps Trevor Noah would need to take his own advice.
He shouldn't have posted these things about Jewish people over and over again.
Many people have pointed out that he's just making jokes.
He's a comedian!
And they come to his defense saying, don't get mad at him.
He's just telling jokes.
They're not supposed to be taken seriously.
But we can see many on the left are saying no to jokes.
From this article from Vox, how comedy has excused bad behavior like Al Franken's and why it might not anymore.
It's time for comedy to retire the, it was just a joke, excuse and face its problems for real.
And another article, this one from her campus, which is a feminist campus publication.
No, comedy isn't an excuse to be racist.
And finally, from the website, it stops with me.
They say casual racism.
Which includes jokes, off-handed comments, and exclusion of people from social situations on the basis of race.
I don't think, personally, that Trevor Noah should be in trouble for making stupid jokes.
I think the jokes were just actually not funny.
So if people want to be mad, that's on them.
But should he be punished for being racist?
No.
However, among the left today, jokes are not an excuse for being racist.
So by your own rules, Trevor, If you think being racist isn't a mistake, or you think people shouldn't be racist, that they should simply not do it, you'll probably need to take your own advice.
And this is why it's so dangerous to hear a large crowd cheer for a woman being imprisoned for saying racist words.
I understand.
South Africa is a very, very different country from the United States.
And whenever we talk about international issues, we need to make sure we realize the U.S.
has different laws and has a different culture than South Africa does.
But at least as a reflection of where our society might go, it's important to bring up these kinds of stories.
You don't know at what point someone will be arrested, fined, or imprisoned for being racist or for mistakenly being racist.
What if someone wants to use the word not in a disparaging context?
For instance, I can't actually say the offensive word on my channel because YouTube doesn't care if I'm explaining what the word is by simply saying it.
That is a punishable offense, and I could have my channel reprimanded.
I could have my video taken down.
So I just can't use those words, period.
What happens then?
What happens when someone tries to tell someone, hey, don't say the K word?
Someone has to know what that word is if they're gonna know they have to avoid it.
But if you say it, can you then be charged and convicted?
Keep in mind, this instance was a woman who said the word 48 times and also made a kind of threat.
But hearing this should raise a red flag to everyone in the U.S.
We don't want to create a situation where we have on the books saying something is worthy of you being imprisoned because even Trevor Noah himself has said racist things and been criticized heavily for doing just that.
Now this isn't the only story.
From CNN, video captured people chanting F the Blacks in a dorm.
Now two teens are under arrest.
Two young men are under arrest in connection with a video in which people can be heard chanting F the Blacks and other derogatory phrases outside what's described as a black student's university dorm room, police in Nottinghamshire, England said.
The video, viewed more than one million times since it was posted Wednesday to Twitter, shows only a wooden door with a metal handle.
It was posted by Rufaro Chisango, a black student who said she filmed it Monday from inside her room in a residence hall in Nottingham Trent University.
The arrestees, both 18, were detained in connection with racially aggravated public order offenses, following reports of the social media post, according to a statement by Nottinghamshire police, who reached out to Chisango in a response to her Twitter post.
Another story where people were arrested for saying racist things.
But this is where I think we need an important distinction on free speech.
Should these men have been arrested the way they were?
Well, according to the story, they were arrested after the fact for racially aggravated crimes.
And in my opinion, no, that's not how things should be handled.
I don't like the idea of criminalizing motivation because you have to put a motivation on someone else.
But I understand the point of hate crimes.
They're trying to reduce attacks of certain people on other certain people.
I just think it might be a little misguided.
In this instance, these men should have been arrested for general disorderly conduct or harassment.
There is a point at which speech is not protected and you will be arrested, and that is outside of creating a clear and imminent threat and outside of inciting to violence.
If you're standing outside of someone's room yelling for a long period of time, that's generally just disorderly conduct.
Most people would agree you're not really expressing any key ideas or trying to get your point across, you're just harassing somebody.
And, you know, could you imagine what it'd be like if you're trying to go to sleep and you got some hooligans outside your window yelling non-stop?
The police are going to come and tell them to be quiet or arrest them.
But in this case, it does get interesting because what they were saying was rather political.
And this is going to come down to the interpretation of the courts.
Whether or not this deserves to be called racially aggravated or hate crime, that's beyond me.
And keep in mind, this is the UK.
But the reason I bring these stories up is I find them rather interesting.
When you have Trevor Noah's audience cheering for a woman arrested for racism, That says something about our country and where we might be headed.
That says there are people who think you should go to prison for three years for saying a word.
And that is pretty scary to me.
I understand.
Free speech does have its limits.
But certainly if you want to express hateful ideas, hate is an emotion, people have it.
They should be allowed to express themselves and feel the way they want.
Keep in mind, when they talk about restricting people's speech, when they talk about hate speech, what they're really saying is that you should not be allowed to express your feelings.
And that's gonna be one hell of a terrifying existence if the government doesn't allow you to feel a certain way, or at least to express how and why you feel that way.
Certainly, this woman in South Africa was very aggressive.
48 times?
It's a bit much.
And I wouldn't be surprised if in any country, even in the U.S., she would have been arrested for disorderly conduct.
Using a racism law, though, is an entirely different story.
So let me know what you think in the comments below, because the theme we have here is basically, at what point does speech actually become disorderly conduct or harassment?
Should the woman in South Africa have been arrested for disorderly conduct?
How do you feel about her being arrested for being racist?
And how do you feel about these two teens in the UK who are yelling racist things outside of someone's window?
Again, comment below.
We'll keep the conversation going.
Thank you all so much for hanging out and checking out these stories.
