True Anon Truth Feed - Episode 520: Tranche Three Million
Aired: 2026-02-05
Duration: 02:10:24


=== Ladies and Gentlemen (03:34) ===

[00:00:00]  Ladies and gentlemen, this is a pre-recorded episode that we are doing in the last week of January.
[00:00:07]  I'm just warning you guys in the cold open, just in case anything happens in the future.
[00:00:12]  We are going to be talking with the podcast GOAT that is Mark Marin for a, well, we've already recorded, but it's a three or four hour conversation about laughter, loving, and podcasting, and podcasting.
[00:00:29]  There's a lot of, there's not many secrets that are shared, but there's a lot of jocular back and forth and questions about his time in the club.
[00:00:40]  So get ready, buckle up, strap in, and prepare to have an amazing five-hour podcast with us and Marcus Marak.
[00:01:15]  I feel like Black Mark Man I feel like I feel like Black Mark Marin.
[00:01:18]  Ladies and gentlemen, just kidding.
[00:01:26]  Can I turn up the gain on this so that my just kidding is really, really, really difficult for our listeners to hear?
[00:01:32]  No.
[00:01:32]  Okay.
[00:01:33]  Well, I actually can turn up the gain and you can't do anything to stop me.
[00:01:36]  Check this out.
[00:01:37]  Hey, that's too much.
[00:01:39]  Don't do that.
[00:01:40]  Guys like that.
[00:01:41]  You can't, what are you going to do about it?
[00:01:43]  He's going to fix it.
[00:01:44]  He can't fix that.
[00:01:45]  That's true.
[00:01:46]  Not at the level that I'm putting that in.
[00:01:48]  I would remind you not to anger the producer because the producer holds some very important blippity bloops and knobs of things of that nature.
[00:02:04]  The producer decides the state of exception.
[00:02:07]  I don't know about that.
[00:02:08]  I use it.
[00:02:09]  Guys, I don't want to.
[00:02:11]  He could give you like girly man voice.
[00:02:13]  I don't want to bring our stuff kind of out in the open here, but I actually use a bespoke producer that I found on Fiverr.
[00:02:18]  Fiverr.
[00:02:19]  Fiverr.
[00:02:20]  That does separately produce more vocals.
[00:02:23]  Right.
[00:02:23]  That's why your voice sounds so low.
[00:02:25]  That's, yeah.
[00:02:26]  Then that's why I have.
[00:02:27]  And you know this?
[00:02:27]  I'm going to tell, we really got to get started here soon because this is going to be a long episode.
[00:02:31]  But ladies, there's a lot of podcasts out there.
[00:02:35]  People say, oh, Brace, how come you have such a womanly voice?
[00:02:39]  Do people say that?
[00:02:40]  Yeah, but it doesn't affect me or anything.
[00:02:43]  It's like, I mean, it's chill that they do.
[00:02:47]  First of all, years of training.
[00:02:49]  And third of all, that's because unlike other podcasts, we don't add a bunch of low end in.
[00:02:56]  But also, women have great voices.
[00:02:59]  So what's the problem?
[00:03:01]  And I like that question that they don't.
[00:03:04]  I'd like to elevate women's voices so far that they're just permanently on the moon.
[00:03:09]  Can I say something before we get started?
[00:03:12]  I'm elevating you.
[00:03:14]  I feel like the meme with the melting man.
[00:03:20]  Interesting.
[00:03:22]  And the, or like the old, like, oh, with the, and it's like, you know, the melting wojack man.
[00:03:28]  Oh, and then the big booby wife girlfriend.

=== Melting Memes and Meltdowns (09:40) ===

[00:03:34]  I don't know what it is.
[00:03:35]  Yeah.
[00:03:36]  But that one is saying, hey, Liz, more Epstein files have been released.
[00:03:43]  And I'm the melting man going, yes, more Epstein files have been released.
[00:03:51]  It's times like this that I wish we were like the worst, most generic, lefty ass podcast in the world.
[00:03:59]  We could just talk about the news.
[00:04:01]  Yeah, but any news.
[00:04:04]  We are talking about the news, Liz.
[00:04:06]  This is different news.
[00:04:08]  First of all, I'm Liz.
[00:04:09]  My name is Bryce.
[00:04:12]  We're joined by I'm producer Young Chomsky.
[00:04:16]  And this is Tronon.
[00:04:17]  Hello.
[00:04:17]  I'm kind of kidding, but also not because 3 million files is a lot of files.
[00:04:26]  I mean, Liz privately told me she heard it was more like 250,000 files.
[00:04:30]  But yes, it is, it is.
[00:04:33]  I don't even know how to think of that number.
[00:04:37]  You can't.
[00:04:38]  I can only picture it in gold or money.
[00:04:41]  Understandably.
[00:04:42]  Yeah.
[00:04:42]  For reasons I won't say.
[00:04:44]  It's okay.
[00:04:46]  But yeah, I can, it's difficult for me to picture it in file.
[00:04:49]  And the problem is, is you think it's 3 million files.
[00:04:52]  No, I think that's 3 million separate files.
[00:04:55]  Is that?
[00:04:55]  Or is that 3 million individual PDFs?
[00:04:58]  That's what they say.
[00:05:00]  I will say this.
[00:05:01]  I have a series of complaints that I would like to air.
[00:05:06]  Most of them directed towards the DOJ.
[00:05:10]  And I'm going to put that in quotation marks because I don't know what the fuck they're doing over there.
[00:05:15]  There's so much duplication in this fucking thing.
[00:05:18]  It is out of control.
[00:05:19]  It's out of control.
[00:05:21]  And there's no possible way to go through it in any kind of organized fashion.
[00:05:31]  You have to search stuff, but the search doesn't totally work that great.
[00:05:34]  And there's so much duplication.
[00:05:36]  But like, for me personally, I don't want to search stuff.
[00:05:39]  I would rather be able to just go through kind of a chunk of files at a time.
[00:05:44]  But they make it very, very difficult to do that for a whole host of reasons.
[00:05:50]  And the redactions are a mess.
[00:05:54]  A mess.
[00:05:56]  Absolutely a mess.
[00:05:57]  In fact, there's like lawsuits now because they are not redacting some of the victims, but then redacting like dogs' faces.
[00:06:05]  Like Jeffrey F.
[00:06:08]  It's so insane.
[00:06:09]  It is like such a fucking shit show.
[00:06:12]  And then on top of that, you've got the whole social media machine, which we do need to talk about.
[00:06:17]  It is the Goyam are out of control, Liz.
[00:06:23]  They are out of control.
[00:06:25]  It is, it is, you know, I don't, I don't know how to, I want to say this in the kindest way possible.
[00:06:32]  Everyone is so crazy.
[00:06:33]  Everyone is so crazy all the time about everything right now.
[00:06:37]  Everyone just believes every single thing that they read.
[00:06:40]  Everybody is just trying to get some fucking Twitter payout by lying.
[00:06:44]  That is a huge, we got to talk.
[00:06:46]  That's like a huge, huge like, you know, pull here, by the way.
[00:06:51]  The ease by which people lie and the frequency at which they do it now, I think is like unprecedented in human history.
[00:07:00]  It is so crazy to me, the shit that I've seen.
[00:07:03]  And like, I can't tell if people are lying or stupid in some cases.
[00:07:07]  I mean, this is a kind of common theme on this show.
[00:07:10]  It's a both, but it is just so crazy to me.
[00:07:13]  I think they're also like people are allowing themselves to indulge even when they know that it's yeah.
[00:07:22]  They're like, I know this is kind of like iffy on the fence, but oh, it's going to get lots of retweet and like, which equals blue check payout and Twitter fame and all that.
[00:07:34]  And it just like, it really annoys me.
[00:07:36]  And I also feel like we are living in Hillary Clinton had Bat Baby World.
[00:07:42]  It is.
[00:07:43]  There has been a roaring return of a lot of QAnon stuff and people who are essentially the same as QAnon, even if they don't realize it.
[00:07:51]  Pizzagate shit, all this stuff.
[00:07:54]  It's like all the colours.
[00:07:55]  It's like fucking grocery store tabloid national inquirer culture.
[00:08:02]  I'll just say this, and I don't want to harp on this for too long because I could go on for hours.
[00:08:09]  But please, for the love of fucking God.
[00:08:12]  And this isn't just unique to this situation, but really to every situation that happens now.
[00:08:17]  If something to you might seem a little ridiculous and a little maybe not possible or it beggars belief in some way, I would suggest that maybe you don't just believe it 100% and use some context or some critical thinking to figure out if it's even possible.
[00:08:38]  And if it is even physically possible, then maybe try to corroborate it in some way.
[00:08:44]  All these people are sending me some fucking, there's some guy out there that's like, I was a, I'm a veteran that I was, I was molested by Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:08:56]  I'm like, I'm sorry.
[00:08:57]  I just don't, there's no indication that Jeffrey Epstein was engaged in gay molesting of children at any point.
[00:09:03]  Like there's just child soldiers.
[00:09:06]  Well, no, he was a soldier later in life.
[00:09:08]  He was a child soldier.
[00:09:09]  He'd be able to easily dispatch Jeffrey Epstein and certainly Donald Trump.
[00:09:13]  But it's just like, come on, man.
[00:09:16]  I don't know what to tell you.
[00:09:17]  And I understand that maybe I am been sort of so enmeshed in this stuff for so long that like it's almost, I'm certainly less open to certain just insane shit than I've ever been in my life just because I know so much about shit now.
[00:09:35]  I know that sounds, that sounds cocky.
[00:09:37]  It's not how I mean it.
[00:09:39]  But come on, use your fucking head.
[00:09:41]  There is not, there's not a, Jeffrey Epstein is not doing gay pedophilia.
[00:09:46]  There's been no indication of that ever.
[00:09:48]  There's never been accusations that ever.
[00:09:50]  And that's just one example of many.
[00:09:51]  And we're going to, that's, that's it.
[00:09:53]  That's, I've said my piece.
[00:09:54]  It just drives me crazy.
[00:09:56]  All right.
[00:09:57]  So this is going to be, I think we're doing more of this in the next episode.
[00:10:02]  Yes.
[00:10:02]  I mean, there's a lot to get in.
[00:10:05]  I mean, unless something crazy happens.
[00:10:07]  I don't know.
[00:10:07]  We'll see.
[00:10:09]  There's so much.
[00:10:11]  It sucks because I feel like there are a lot of very interesting stories to be pulled out of these files.
[00:10:17]  And it just takes so long to go through this stuff and so much work.
[00:10:22]  And yet the demands of the content complex.
[00:10:27]  Oh, yeah.
[00:10:28]  Don't wait for nobody.
[00:10:31]  Train keeps rolling.
[00:10:32]  So our train will keep rolling.
[00:10:35]  But I do want to say we are going to keep looking at all this stuff.
[00:10:38]  I mean, I kind of joke about the Epstein files, but it's only because, you know, I do think that there's interesting stuff in here, but it just takes time to really get in and dig around.
[00:10:49]  I mean, I think that this batch, obviously, it's significantly larger than the previous batch that they released.
[00:10:54]  It was 3 million documents.
[00:10:56]  And again, I don't know if that's individual pages or individual PDFs, but a lot of these PDFs have a lot of pages.
[00:11:02]  Then again, also a lot of these are like, you know, there'll be like 15 documents that are just each individual email from an email chain.
[00:11:09]  Yes.
[00:11:09]  And then 15 more documents that are those in a different format.
[00:11:12]  And so it's like, it becomes kind of crazy to parse through.
[00:11:15]  But there are, there's so much in these that really, I guess I'm baffled by how much these guys were emailing.
[00:11:24]  I mean, I was alive in 2014, very much so.
[00:11:28]  And, you know, I used email on occasion.
[00:11:30]  These people are scheduling so many things via email and like do things that I guess would be text messages these days that it leads like sometimes quite extraordinary paper trails in some instances.
[00:11:43]  But there's also just so many different stories in here.
[00:11:46]  I mean, I've been obsessed for the past few days with just one strand of some of the Musk stuff.
[00:11:53]  But even off of that, there's like a bunch of like, we'll get into it, but just a bunch of shit that is sort of intriguing and gives a gives a hint at how Epstein was conducting himself, but also how all these rich guys were conducting themselves.
[00:12:07]  And I think a lot of people are primed to see, I don't know what.
[00:12:13]  I think people still think that the DOJ is somehow going to release evidence that Donald Trump had sex with a child or that whatever Bill Clinton had had that ditto with Bill Clinton.
[00:12:29]  I just, I mean, come on, the DOJ, which is highly, highly politicized, but even if it wasn't, I mean, it always is, but even if it wasn't politicized to this level, is not going to do that.
[00:12:41]  That's just not going to happen.
[00:12:42]  If that document exists, that is not coming out in this batch.
[00:12:47]  They have said, I don't quite see how that's possible, but they've said that there's nothing actionable in any of these documents in terms of criminal prosecution of anybody.
[00:12:58]  I don't know if that's the case.
[00:12:59]  In fact, we have actually already seen in the case of one of our social democratic gods, Lord Mandelson, that that is not the case because it appears that there is an investigation now, a criminal investigation in the UK against him.

=== Peter Adia Resigns (12:00) ===

[00:13:15]  But, you know, I think what we see most from both these documents and the last batch of documents is an extraordinary insight into the network that Epstein cultivated.
[00:13:27]  And there are girls involved.
[00:13:29]  There definitely are.
[00:13:32]  And, but there's just so, he really was enmeshed in all sides.
[00:13:36]  Oh, not all sides, but really with the liberal intelligentsia, certain conservative politicians.
[00:13:42]  It really, he was kind of everywhere.
[00:13:45]  And I think it's just such a great insight into how so much of his sort of class, which you can, you know, which are all, I mean, the names that come up in all of this, you know, everyone's like, oh, my God, everyone's in the Epstein files.
[00:14:02]  And it's like, yeah, I mean, it is interesting to see how all of this stuff kind of gets, you know, how handshake deals get made and how choices get, you know, get decided and, you know, kind of even the sort of like court gossip of it all of these like major figures, whether it's the former Treasury Secretary fucking Mnunchin or whether it's like, you know,
[00:14:31]  the Steve Bannon stuff or, you know, people asking about, sure, Howard Luttnick or Leon Black, you know, or Mark Rowan, who was, or like Ron Lauder, whose name just came up because his son-in-law is Trump's pick for the Fed, right?
[00:14:47]  Like these are major players to this day.
[00:14:51]  And it's a fascinating look at how, you know, one person who has always kind of sat in adjacent and within these networks like operated.
[00:15:04]  And you can kind of start to map that.
[00:15:06]  And that's, you know, there's a lot of stories that, like you say, flow out of that.
[00:15:11]  And I think it's, you know, worth worth our while to get into.
[00:15:15]  Yeah.
[00:15:15]  I mean, even just the connections to the Kurt administration are just striking in how many that there are, I guess.
[00:15:26]  That's kind of a weird way to phrase that.
[00:15:28]  From the president, you know, this is somebody who has flown on the La Lita Express, visited Jeffrey Epstein's home to, as I said, Howard Luttnick, who was just caught lying that he had only visited the home once.
[00:15:39]  And then emails came out showing that he had actually pitched Epstein on him and his family visiting the island.
[00:15:44]  And I believe 10 years after he said he hung out with Epstein and had a bad feeling and never saw him again prior to Epstein's conviction.
[00:15:54]  You know, to Elon Musk.
[00:15:56]  I mean, some of it is age-restricted in terms and wealth restricted.
[00:16:02]  I don't think Pete Hegseth is going to show up in these files for a variety of reasons.
[00:16:06]  But if you're older, richer, and in the Trump orbit, there is a huge chance that you are hanging out with Epstein.
[00:16:13]  Yeah, there's definitely a kind of like New York finance milieu that is in the tech world for sure.
[00:16:22]  Let's get into some stuff.
[00:16:24]  So just to start us off, you mentioned Lord Mandelson.
[00:16:29]  So some people have already, some people are already in trouble.
[00:16:33]  Yes.
[00:16:33]  Across the world.
[00:16:35]  Lord Mandelson has resigned from the Labor Party.
[00:16:38]  Now, he had already resigned or left his post as ambassador to the U.S. Canada's man in DC.
[00:16:47]  Yes, but now they might kick him out of the House of Lords too.
[00:16:50]  Liz, he is, I think he has already resigned.
[00:16:53]  I think this has all occurred in the past 10 minutes because I looked at my phone and Googled it when I was peeing before we started the episode.
[00:16:59]  I believe he has resigned from the House of Lords and there is a criminal investigation that has been opened up because of his unprecedented leaks to Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:17:09]  I guess it was something to do with Gordon Brown.
[00:17:11]  I haven't even looked it.
[00:17:12]  We'll probably cover it on another episode.
[00:17:13]  I haven't even looked into it yet.
[00:17:15]  But it is, it is, I think he is in major trouble.
[00:17:19]  And I want to be clear.
[00:17:21]  Mandelson was known, Peter Mandelson was known to be one of Jeffrey Epstein's best friends.
[00:17:27]  Yes.
[00:17:28]  Prior to Keir Starmer appointing him as ambassador to the U.S.
[00:17:34]  And just to hammer this home, I know I've said this on the podcast before, but we might have some new listeners and maybe our old ones forgot it.
[00:17:40]  That the night that Virginia Jeffrey died, Lord Mandelson was having a party at the ambassador's residence, I guess, or the embassy, one might call it, in DC, where, of course, our favorite, Jessica Reed Krauss, aka House and Habit, one of the people who is handed the Epstein files by Pam Bondi, was partying and yucking it up with him.
[00:18:08]  I mean, this is just, this isn't that kind of just like still break your brain.
[00:18:13]  It is just so crazy to me.
[00:18:17]  It's so crazy to me.
[00:18:18]  I mean, this fucking that the, they, they really have it locked up.
[00:18:22]  Like all of their, they're, they have this just such friendly, this alternative media ecosystem is turns out big surprise, just as corrupt as the previous one, but probably a significantly cheaper price.
[00:18:36]  It is just out of control.
[00:18:38]  I mean, it is, I think, Lady Hervey was there, one of, one of Ghelane Maxwell's best friends.
[00:18:44]  I mean, these, these guys are all, they are hanging out together and they are laughing and they are laughing and they're yucking it up.
[00:18:51]  But somebody who's not laughing is poor, poor Miro.
[00:18:57]  Your boy.
[00:18:59]  Miroslav Lakjak.
[00:19:01]  I still don't know how to pronounce it, guys.
[00:19:02]  And you will have to forgive me to all our Slovakian listeners out there.
[00:19:06]  Lazjak, Miroslav Lazjak, National Security Advisor to Slovakia's prime minister, who, by the way, there is mention of perhaps another Slovakian prime minister visiting Jeffrey Epstein while a bunch of girls are at his house in Paris, but close personal friend of Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:19:22]  And later, it seems Steve Bannon has also now resigned.
[00:19:25]  I actually don't even remember.
[00:19:26]  I don't even think I put in the document what he resigned from, but he held from the national security advisor position.
[00:19:32]  Oh, there you go.
[00:19:33]  But also, he is in a bunch of like UN adjacent organizations or connected organizations here in New York.
[00:19:41]  And I don't think that's going to happen.
[00:19:43]  It's funny.
[00:19:44]  There's like, I mean, we talked about him extensively.
[00:19:47]  One of the episodes we did on the last kind of jump of the files.
[00:19:52]  But Epstein and him were like real boys towards the end.
[00:19:58]  And it seems like a kind of newer relationship in Epstein's life.
[00:20:02]  Just as like you're kind of looking at all the boys in his orbit.
[00:20:07]  But he really was like linking him up with Bannon.
[00:20:10]  And they were like really trying to like, you know, link up and build, honestly.
[00:20:15]  Like the kind of stuff that they were trying to do.
[00:20:18]  I do think that like he's not resigning because of that.
[00:20:21]  He's resigning because there were like more emails where literally he's writing like Russian girls are incredible.
[00:20:28]  No, he wrote, the girls are unbelievable, Russia's best export in a, you know, saying it's better than the oil.
[00:20:36]  And then in another email, regards from Kiev, just to confirm the girls here are as gorgeous as ever.
[00:20:41]  So he's kind of like playing both sides there, which is very interesting.
[00:20:45]  There's an interesting Brock Pierce email, which we'll cover maybe in another episode, also from Kiev, talking about some beauty that he sees there.
[00:20:53]  Ew.
[00:20:54]  Yeah.
[00:20:55]  Just, ew.
[00:20:57]  Yeah.
[00:20:58]  Because remember, he's about 5'1.
[00:21:00]  So legal dwarf.
[00:21:01]  So it's, I mean, that's not legal dwarf.
[00:21:03]  I'm sorry.
[00:21:04]  I should fact check.
[00:21:04]  410 is.
[00:21:06]  But yeah, that's tough.
[00:21:09]  Another one was Joanna Rubinstein, who's a Swedish UN official at the UN Refugee Agency.
[00:21:15]  She's already resigned.
[00:21:17]  There was like stuff that came out about her going to the island.
[00:21:20]  And I'm like, really?
[00:21:22]  Okay.
[00:21:22]  There seems to be a lot of like different sorts of standards of accountability across different organizations.
[00:21:29]  Yes.
[00:21:30]  We'll say that it took like massive amounts of legal work to get Jess Staley to do to like move on anything.
[00:21:40]  Yes.
[00:21:41]  And then this woman that nobody has ever heard of at the UN is like, well, it's time for me to go.
[00:21:46]  Because my time has passed.
[00:21:47]  I'm a woman and I went to the island.
[00:21:50]  You know, I actually, speaking of Sweden, I have it now confirmed that I follow, I guess Instagram followers of the podcast might know that I have my, there's a, there's a true and non bespoke Epstein collection, but this photograph I have is 100% of Eva Dubin and I believe maybe her father, but certainly an old man.
[00:22:17]  And yeah, so speaking of Sweden, I think there'll be a lot more Sweden stuff coming up.
[00:22:22]  There have been some other shake-ups, the Dr. Peter Adia stuff.
[00:22:26]  Had you heard of this Joker?
[00:22:27]  I didn't know who Peter Adia was.
[00:22:29]  I have because I like to peruse the longevity world.
[00:22:38]  I like to know what they're getting up to, what they're hacking.
[00:22:42]  So yeah, I have heard of him.
[00:22:45]  He has a crazy rabid online following.
[00:22:50]  And the emails, Epstein's emails to him and like basically hiring him as his doctor and getting him to do a bunch of stuff.
[00:23:02]  That was in, I think, the last batch.
[00:23:04]  But then there was obviously more in this one that was more of a, let's say, friendly correspondence and suggestive at some parts.
[00:23:11]  And it sucks because.
[00:23:13]  Not even suggestive.
[00:23:14]  He just put it right out there.
[00:23:15]  You know, he had just gotten an awesome gig at this up-and-coming news organization headed by A startup organization headed by Barry Weiss.
[00:23:27]  And it turns out, of course, Barry Weiss's wife, the wonderful Nellie Bowles, who, by the way, after that came out, after Nellie Bowles' name was mentioned in the emails.
[00:23:36]  Stop saying it like that.
[00:23:39]  Nellie Bowles.
[00:23:41]  It's a subjective noun.
[00:23:42]  You can say it anyway you like.
[00:23:43]  Nellie Bowles?
[00:23:45]  No, no, keep going.
[00:23:47]  Well, whatever.
[00:23:47]  Nelly, that's a tough one, too.
[00:23:49]  No, but it's actually somewhat of a cute name, but not for her.
[00:23:52]  I had a bunch of people who went to middle school with her.
[00:23:58]  Really?
[00:23:59]  Yeah.
[00:23:59]  She went to, what's it called?
[00:24:00]  Hamlin?
[00:24:01]  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:24:02]  She went to Hamlin in San Francisco.
[00:24:04]  I had a bunch of people who went to middle school with her that I know, because I guess around the same age, and that I knew from back then, text me and be like, Nellie's in the files, like, and talk a lot of shit about her.
[00:24:19]  And again, this is shit talk from middle school, but I guess she was not well liked at the middle school.
[00:24:24]  In fact, she was seen as cocky, as unlikable, as pathetic by some of these people.
[00:24:33]  And it is just, it's too bad.
[00:24:36]  You know, it's just too bad.
[00:24:37]  But Peter Adia had just gotten signed to Barry Weiss's new roster, I guess to compete with Dr. Andrew Huberman, who also did.
[00:24:45]  But Huberman is also on there.
[00:24:47]  Huberman's in the— Huberman's in the files?
[00:24:49]  No, no, but in the CBS Rolodex.
[00:24:53]  Yes, that's what I'm saying.
[00:24:54]  He's in, but like he was, there was a list of people that CBS had hired and to be contributors.
[00:25:00]  And Huberman and Dr. Peter were both in there.
[00:25:05]  And I guess maybe, you know, Huberman's, he's keeping his mouth shut.
[00:25:10]  Well, it's come out now that, so Adia came out and was like apologizing.

=== Huberman In The Files (04:09) ===

[00:25:16]  He wrote some long thing that I didn't read because here's the thing.
[00:25:20]  If you're going to write an article or a long tweet, I'm not reading it.
[00:25:27]  It depends, but there's almost, if it's an article on Twitter, there's a 0% chance that I'm reading it.
[00:25:32]  If it's a long tweet, it depends on how I'm talking about.
[00:25:36]  I do.
[00:25:36]  I do.
[00:25:37]  It's four paragraphs.
[00:25:38]  I'm not reading it.
[00:25:39]  I did read it.
[00:25:40]  Conveniently, he says that there's actually a bunch of emails that aren't in the files where he's pressuring Epstein to come clean.
[00:25:48]  Wait, does he really say that?
[00:25:49]  Basically, yes.
[00:25:50]  And he mentions, and I don't have it in front of me, but he mentions that he was in contact with a clinic in Florida to pay for therapy for girls.
[00:25:56]  I'm like, really?
[00:25:59]  Well, maybe we should release your emails.
[00:26:02]  Yeah, why don't you just post those emails?
[00:26:04]  Presumably you fucking sent them.
[00:26:06]  So I love that they haven't released the emails where I was trying to get Jeffrey help.
[00:26:10]  How come nobody has, you know what?
[00:26:13]  Respect.
[00:26:14]  Nobody's tried that one yet.
[00:26:15]  Nobody's tried that one.
[00:26:16]  Well, no, Dr. Peter did.
[00:26:18]  He, yeah, he's breaking new ground.
[00:26:21]  I do not know.
[00:26:22]  Apparently, there's been some reporting that there is a war inside CBS that is just the one in a way it somewhat resembles, of course, the great Chicago fire in that is just one solitary but very destructive cow versus great hallowed yet decaying institution.
[00:26:44]  That's really been on your mind lately.
[00:26:45]  The Chicago fire?
[00:26:46]  I mean, the devastation that it caused.
[00:26:50]  I hear you're laughing right now.
[00:26:52]  It's not funny.
[00:26:54]  Because imagine if that happened and it was a city entirely filled with people you love.
[00:26:58]  Shout out to their families.
[00:27:00]  Yeah.
[00:27:00]  Well, they're in there too, unfortunately.
[00:27:03]  But she is at war with everybody about the cancel culture of him being on the Epstein in the world.
[00:27:11]  I love that she's bringing out cancel culture.
[00:27:13]  It's so funny to me.
[00:27:15]  It's so great.
[00:27:16]  She's like, I just don't want to give in to the cancel culture mob.
[00:27:18]  And I was like, I'm not really sure that's what's happening here.
[00:27:20]  I don't think that's what's happening.
[00:27:21]  A lot of the people who might be mad about this are not necessarily the you know biseptumed pierced.
[00:27:28]  You know, I think it's, I think it's maybe I can't imagine there.
[00:27:32]  If if Dr. If Dr. Addia is smart, he'll have forbidden replies to his post because it's 100% just going to be people being like, you are pedophile or whatever.
[00:27:42]  And I just, I think that posting your explanation for all of your saucy emails with Jeffrey Epstein on Twitter is probably, it's not a great environment for that.
[00:27:54]  But speaking of medical issues, I think that we got to get started with, there's been a lot of, we have been curious about Jeffrey Epstein's health for quite a while.
[00:28:05]  And we're getting, we were talking before this episode started.
[00:28:09]  I don't know how legal it is that they're just releasing all of his medical stuff.
[00:28:14]  It's not, I don't think that it, I'm surprised that this wasn't redacted.
[00:28:18]  I mean, again, the redactions were done very, um, like, I don't think there was really a logic behind a lot of it.
[00:28:28]  And it seemed pretty sloppy and haphazard just from what I've seen.
[00:28:34]  But there are, so Jeffrey, like over the years was very concerned with a bunch of health stuff, which fair enough.
[00:28:46]  Fair enough.
[00:28:47]  But so there's like a bunch of like quest diagnostics, other kinds of medical records in his emails because he's constantly like even eye-chatting or messaging with some of his doctors and different specialists trying to kind of like figure out some of his problems that we're going to get into.
[00:29:07]  But it is kind of wild that they are just like letting, I don't know, that those records can be out there because I'm pretty sure that's not, that's like sensitive information that should be, I mean, I don't, I don't know if I really care that much, but I mean, I think this is going to be a big deal with skeleton HIPAA in graveyard court.

=== Unprecedented Medical Revelations (09:26) ===

[00:29:26]  I mean, it's just going to be, I mean, that's the thing is like, I do think it is not, but all of this is so unprecedented to release like files related to a case where he was not convicted because he died that like, I don't know the legality of any of this.
[00:29:41]  And so it's like, why not?
[00:29:42]  Just put it in there.
[00:29:44]  It does seem weird that they didn't use like the ultra redaction stuff for this as opposed to like some other documents that are just fully blacked out because I mean, it is, yeah, it does bring, I mean, bring to mind some HIPAA questions.
[00:29:56]  What did you find?
[00:29:57]  I didn't look at these.
[00:29:58]  What did you find?
[00:29:59]  Well, so I only looked at a few.
[00:30:01]  I know that there's like way more and there's way more details about some of his concerns and a lot of the correspondence, but he had one of his most recent blood tests was showing that he was extremely low testosterone, clinically low.
[00:30:20]  Between there was like some that was like 150 and then like maybe the highest was like 185, but really, really low.
[00:30:28]  I think the range, the normal range, I can look it up.
[00:30:33]  Because yeah, the doctor was telling me I have 1 million.
[00:30:36]  Normal testosterone level for adult men generally considered to be 300 to 1,000.
[00:30:41]  Yeah.
[00:30:42]  So there was, he was trying to solve some issues.
[00:30:48]  According to my cursory medical search, because I don't know a lot about what low tea does to a man because I haven't really thought about it very much.
[00:31:01]  But Jeffrey was potentially feeling loss of libido, fatigue, depression, loss of muscle or strength, poor sleep, low confidence.
[00:31:10]  All of that could be coming.
[00:31:12]  But one thing that I was reminded of was that, so in Ghelane's interview with Todd Blanche, she mentioned that he had started taking tea, but in the 90s.
[00:31:25]  Yeah, I remember this because, you know, not to be scared to you guys or whatever, and like blame some chemical thing for Epstein's behavior, but testosterone is famously can make you act crazy in a horny manner, if that makes sense.
[00:31:47]  It has been known to do that to certain people.
[00:31:49]  Not everybody, obviously, but it can do that to certain people, or at least certain people have blamed external testosterone injections on some of their philandering behavior.
[00:32:03]  She said he started doing testosterone that altered his character.
[00:32:07]  And I believe that started in the late 90s.
[00:32:09]  And I believe that the FBI has his medical records and you may see that on his medical records.
[00:32:14]  Yes.
[00:32:16]  Yeah.
[00:32:16]  And then Todd Blanche goes, so you believe that he started taking testosterone in the 90s.
[00:32:19]  And when you say that altered his behavior, you're saying it wanted to made him get more massages?
[00:32:24]  Or was that just one part of what changed about him?
[00:32:28]  And Ghelane goes on and says, well, he became more aggressive.
[00:32:31]  I mean, I do want to pause and say, I do think she's trying to kind of maybe excuse some stuff, which I'm not really interested in, but I'm interested in him taking testosterone in the 90s.
[00:32:43]  Yeah.
[00:32:44]  And then she goes on, the second thing is that he is, he told me he didn't.
[00:32:48]  He had difficulty having an erection and I believed him.
[00:32:52]  And Todd Blanch says, when you said he said that, you mean he regularly told you that?
[00:32:56]  Which pause.
[00:32:58]  That's just kind of funny.
[00:32:59]  Like the idea that he's just like regularly telling you, like, hey, you know something fun about me?
[00:33:04]  Still, my shit still ain't working.
[00:33:08]  And then Ghillain says, when I first, because when I didn't have sex with him after the first time and it took, so I asked him, was it me?
[00:33:15]  And he told me it was him.
[00:33:17]  Okay, interesting.
[00:33:18]  Pause.
[00:33:19]  Yes.
[00:33:20]  So this is backed up by a couple of things.
[00:33:24]  One, tons and tons and tons of pages when you search Viagra or C. Alice in these emails.
[00:33:34]  Interesting.
[00:33:35]  Interesting.
[00:33:36]  He seemed to be a regular buyer, if not user.
[00:33:41]  Who knows?
[00:33:42]  Yeah.
[00:33:43]  Second thing is that there's other testimony that has said this.
[00:33:48]  Yes.
[00:33:48]  I mean, there has been, which, which I think a lot of people have focused on the fact that Jeffrey Epstein got these sort of massages quite often.
[00:33:56]  And he did, there are allegations that he had penetrated both consensual sex and rape and raped, you know, women over the years.
[00:34:09]  However, a lot of the sexual contact, both kind of non-consensual and with teenagers and consensual was in the context of massages, which were used both euphemistically and literally.
[00:34:24]  And there's been talk that, yes, he was unable to have traditional sex because it hurt him.
[00:34:32]  And he also has a strange-shaped penis.
[00:34:34]  Now, I want to preface that with, obviously, a lot has been made about him being asked in a deposition about an egg-shaped penis.
[00:34:45]  There is further questioning from detectives to an unidentified victim in, I believe, Florida about the shape of his penis.
[00:34:59]  And I think it just, it kind of has to be read to be believed.
[00:35:03]  I'll start it off.
[00:35:04]  This is an answer.
[00:35:05]  I mean, I'm sorry.
[00:35:06]  He is circumcised.
[00:35:08]  My bad.
[00:35:09]  He's circumcised 110%.
[00:35:12]  As a matter of fact, he has some sort of birth defect on his thing.
[00:35:17]  I don't know what it is.
[00:35:18]  And then giggles.
[00:35:20]  I've never really looked at it because I've never done anything where I had to touch it.
[00:35:24]  I've never touched it out of the whole time I worked for him and I never touched his penis.
[00:35:27]  Like he, I'm pretty sure he rubbed it against me, but I've never been like, okay, I'm letting you do this or I'm going to do this to you.
[00:35:32]  It's really weirdly shaped.
[00:35:34]  I don't know.
[00:35:34]  Do you want me to like tell you this?
[00:35:37]  Okay, I want to pause one second.
[00:35:40]  I know she's saying 100%, 10%, I'm sure that he's circumcised, but it is very funny to say he's circumcised 110%.
[00:35:49]  He's 100%.
[00:35:50]  That's really kind of how it sounds.
[00:35:52]  It is crazy.
[00:35:54]  Sounds like something you would say.
[00:35:57]  But I'm not.
[00:35:58]  Well, yeah.
[00:35:59]  But not about me.
[00:36:00]  You're famously double circumcised, I think.
[00:36:02]  Yes.
[00:36:03]  I'm circumcised in a way that nobody's, I'm circumcised in a way that nobody's ever been circumcised before.
[00:36:08]  Now, we've heard lemon, we've heard egg.
[00:36:11]  This is different.
[00:36:13]  Yeah, she goes on to say, it's like a teardrop, like a drop of water.
[00:36:17]  It's really fat at the bottom and skinny at the top where it's attached.
[00:36:23]  I don't like attached.
[00:36:24]  That sounds wrong.
[00:36:25]  I'm assuming she means the head of the penis.
[00:36:27]  There's no connection.
[00:36:28]  Where it's attached is like such a very that's just a weird way to put it.
[00:36:34]  Yeah, I mean, this is a weird circumstance in which she's describing it.
[00:36:37]  And he could never get fully hard ever.
[00:36:40]  Like I could just tell by looking at it.
[00:36:42]  Like by looking, you can obviously tell if you're hard or not.
[00:36:44]  And I could tell that he wasn't.
[00:36:46]  I like this detective.
[00:36:48]  Okay.
[00:36:50]  So I don't know if that's something that sort of thing that's wrong with him, but it definitely was not normal.
[00:36:55]  I mean, I have, I mean, it's not like I sleep around, you know, but I've seen and it was not normal.
[00:37:00]  So I actually, all right, the quoting is over.
[00:37:04]  This is back to Brace.
[00:37:07]  But I feel like we saw this and actually even maybe read this like in literally the first 10 episodes of the show, but I just can't remember.
[00:37:14]  The tear detect, yeah, I don't know, but it just reminded me of it.
[00:37:19]  It paints an extraordinary picture, though, I will say.
[00:37:22]  And like, you know, one can't help but be reminded of Harvey Weinstein.
[00:37:28]  But that was gangrene, I thought.
[00:37:32]  Yes, but it was also like people were like, I don't even know how to describe it.
[00:37:36]  You know what I mean?
[00:37:37]  Like there is a certain, you know, Lovecraftian element to all of them.
[00:37:40]  Almost Picasso.
[00:37:42]  Yeah.
[00:37:42]  Well, that, yes.
[00:37:43]  I think this might be more Picasso.
[00:37:44]  But like with Harvey's, people were like, I don't know what I was looking at.
[00:37:48]  Obviously, I mean, longtime listeners will know that Harvey Weinstein's balls were removed from the sack and placed into each of his thighs, or I think at least one thigh, and that his penis was sort of a desiccated, I don't know what, almost like a snake that's been dead for 10 years or something, some sort of rotted thing.
[00:38:10]  And he needed injections in order to achieve even a simulacrum of erection.
[00:38:15]  And, you know, it seems like Epstein was not there yet, but he was on his way.
[00:38:19]  But he does, I mean, a birth defect is different than saying like, it's not just that his dick is like, doesn't work because of some blood issue or something.
[00:38:27]  Like his penis is physically deformed.
[00:38:29]  No, but this is separate from the T, I think, the T issue.
[00:38:34]  I know.
[00:38:34]  I'm like, I wonder if those are.
[00:38:38]  Yeah, it is weird because now mentally they might not be separated.
[00:38:41]  Like his obsession with his T levels and what could be causing it is clearly tied to whatever hang-ups he might have about his own physical appearance.

=== Mental Objects and Deepak (09:11) ===

[00:38:52]  Yeah.
[00:38:55]  Yeah.
[00:38:56]  It is.
[00:38:57]  I just, I've never seen, I mean, I haven't seen, well, one's too many.
[00:39:03]  A thousand is never enough.
[00:39:04]  But I don't think I've seen enough penises to bring to mind one that has this shape.
[00:39:11]  I don't know.
[00:39:12]  I mean, I know that they can come shaped different, but I've never heard this described.
[00:39:19]  Yeah, it is baffling to me.
[00:39:22]  But I think it does sort of speak to it adds a weird kind of like layer of, I don't know, motive, but like there's something behind all of the shit that he was doing that this add, there's a perverse element, a further perverse element.
[00:39:37]  I know that's why I want to like get deeper in the health stuff because I do think that that's a window into some of the kind of, I don't know, his own.
[00:39:46]  Well, I'm holding his mental issues.
[00:39:48]  Methyl prednozolone right here in his unopened box.
[00:39:55]  Okay, so let's keep going.
[00:39:57]  This is just a little smattering of some stuff, but there were, we've, we mentioned his friendship with Deepak Chopra before on the show.
[00:40:07]  There's some very, I don't know if this is from Deepak, but I think it is because it's very reminiscent of Deepak's way of talking, I guess.
[00:40:21]  Is his way of being.
[00:40:23]  Yeah, okay.
[00:40:25]  But there are some other chats that I just want to read from Deepak because they're funny.
[00:40:30]  This is just us kind of pulling out some funnies before we get into the meat and potatoes of the episode.
[00:40:35]  But can you read this?
[00:40:36]  Because it's a little bit of a poem that was sent over iMessage.
[00:40:41]  Living in the transcendent now.
[00:40:45]  No anticipation.
[00:40:47]  No regrets.
[00:40:48]  No resistance.
[00:40:51]  Just flow.
[00:40:52]  Lightness in body, lightness of being.
[00:40:56]  Keeping company and enjoying youthful divine feminine energy and connection.
[00:41:04]  Staying in the role of mentor with no agenda.
[00:41:07]  It's certainly not coming from Larry Summers.
[00:41:11]  No, no, certainly not.
[00:41:15]  That is a touch of the Deepak.
[00:41:17]  It does, doesn't it?
[00:41:19]  There are, there's more Deepak to get into.
[00:41:21]  There's so much.
[00:41:24]  These two were like on something.
[00:41:26]  They were, yeah, on connection, on lightness, on being, on, on divine feminine energy.
[00:41:33]  Youthful divine feminine energy.
[00:41:35]  It is crazy to send Jeffrey Epstein a text message, an eye message in 2018, telling him to keep company and enjoy youthful divine feminine energy and connection, but staying in the role of mentor with no agenda.
[00:41:46]  Again, we don't know for sure that's what you call it.
[00:41:49]  That's like the idea.
[00:41:49]  Like, look, that was me counseling him.
[00:41:52]  But they are sending a lot of text together.
[00:41:55]  This next one, Liz, you have to read.
[00:41:56]  It's extraordinary.
[00:41:57]  See you then, prayer emoji, which apparently is high-five emoji, by the way.
[00:42:02]  It is.
[00:42:02]  Yes.
[00:42:02]  I have an idea, renegotiating peace with SA and Qatar.
[00:42:07]  Which Jeffrey Epstein definitely tried to insert himself into.
[00:42:10]  And maybe it was Deepak's ideas.
[00:42:13]  Now, at some point, there's discussion about him trying to get a deal done in favor of a friend.
[00:42:18]  And this is what Jeffrey has to kind of say about himself.
[00:42:22]  So this is Jeffrey to Deepak.
[00:42:24]  And he says, Re deal.
[00:42:26]  Everyone in one room, you lead.
[00:42:28]  Here's where I need to get to.
[00:42:30]  One, I am too old to work for anyone.
[00:42:32]  Freedom.
[00:42:33]  The opportunities are vast.
[00:42:36]  Wellness is the tech of the future.
[00:42:39]  Awesome Blage.
[00:42:40]  We work.
[00:42:41]  Joe, Alice, all can be accommodated, but not at the cost of freedom.
[00:42:46]  And then something redacted: research, Arkansas, Joe Florida, Spa, Awesome Baj.
[00:42:52]  I think he again means Awesome Blage.
[00:42:54]  And WeWork, franchises.
[00:42:58]  So I don't know if he's doing some sort of like Deleuzian startup mentality there or what's going on.
[00:43:06]  But he starts to confide in Deepak at one point about all of the press that he's getting.
[00:43:12]  Right.
[00:43:12]  So the heat's building on Jeffrey from basically 16 to 2018.
[00:43:17]  Yeah.
[00:43:18]  Within obviously the arrest coming in 2019.
[00:43:23]  But I just mean like there's so much.
[00:43:25]  We're going to talk about 2018 a little bit.
[00:43:27]  in a second because that was like the height, I think, the apex of me too.
[00:43:32]  Yeah.
[00:43:33]  And so there was a lot of stuff kind of coming out.
[00:43:36]  But he writes, hope you're well.
[00:43:37]  Another round of very bad, bad press.
[00:43:39]  Ugh.
[00:43:41]  And Deepak responds, how awesome would be this when you're like Jeffrey Epstein in 2018.
[00:43:49]  Deepak writes you, stay silent, meditate.
[00:43:53]  I'm focusing on meta-human prayer emoji.
[00:43:57]  And then later on in the conversation, he says this.
[00:44:02]  Yes.
[00:44:03]  We are fictional characters in a collective dreamscape.
[00:44:06]  Want to upgrade the illusion for a more peaceful world.
[00:44:10]  I'm on WhatsApp.
[00:44:11]  Are you?
[00:44:12]  So real quick, I just want to say Jeffrey does say that he is on WhatsApp, but we don't have the WhatsApp logs.
[00:44:18]  They're not the WhatsApp logs.
[00:44:20]  So the Fed's kind of fucked up on that.
[00:44:22]  Now, astute listeners of the podcast and also on the internet readers may remember from a previous email onslaught previously on the Epstein files.
[00:44:40]  There's this like infamous Epstein Schizo email where he laid out a bunch of his ideas.
[00:44:45]  He called it was like subject radical breakthrough.
[00:44:47]  And it was an email that he sent himself with a list of things.
[00:44:55]  And it starts, one, beards and long hair are meant to catch and hold smells.
[00:45:00]  Question mark.
[00:45:01]  Two, visual system, coherent image, 50 equivalent for sound making a coherent sound.
[00:45:08]  Question mark.
[00:45:09]  Does it make coherent concept?
[00:45:11]  Question mark.
[00:45:12]  Facts.
[00:45:13]  Three, a mental object, i.e. mobject, action on mental objects.
[00:45:17]  Question mark.
[00:45:18]  Now I'm going to stop there.
[00:45:19]  It goes on.
[00:45:20]  Remember?
[00:45:20]  Reddit.
[00:45:20]  Yeah.
[00:45:21]  Yeah.
[00:45:21]  There's also like a paragraph with a bunch of names at the end, et cetera, et cetera.
[00:45:27]  But I did find some updates on a mental object, i.e. mobject from this new tranche.
[00:45:37]  And I do believe this conversation is between him and Deepak, but I'm not totally sure.
[00:45:42]  But I think it's to an unknown sender.
[00:45:44]  It's from right.
[00:45:46]  Or excuse me, to an unknown person, unknown address.
[00:45:51]  He says, Chomsky liked mobjects, MACCHINS, mental objects and mental actions.
[00:45:58]  He explained to Wolfram why Wolfram language is doomed.
[00:46:02]  Wow.
[00:46:04]  Side note, Jeffrey says wow a lot.
[00:46:06]  By the way, that's just like his go-to response.
[00:46:08]  Wow.
[00:46:08]  That is also, I'm not even joking mine too.
[00:46:11]  Whenever anyone, it's, I alternate between wow and damn, that's crazy.
[00:46:16]  So then unknown replies, the entire universe is mobjects.
[00:46:21]  This is an amazing insight and should enter the dictionary.
[00:46:25]  Every perceptual experience is a mobject.
[00:46:28]  This includes body slash brain slash universe.
[00:46:31]  Mobjects are modified forms of consciousness experienced in consciousness and made out of consciousness.
[00:46:36]  They appear and disappear in space slash time.
[00:46:39]  Consciousness itself is non-local and not in space-time.
[00:46:44]  To which Jeffrey replies, MACTINGS are actions on mental objects, like rotating a ball in your mind.
[00:46:51]  It seems to involve the same brain places as actions in the material world.
[00:46:56]  Unknown agrees, says yes, three exclamation points.
[00:47:01]  Maxions evoke the experience of the universe.
[00:47:04]  Different maxions in different species evoke different universe.
[00:47:07]  Evolution of species is evolution of mobjects and maxions and consciousness.
[00:47:12]  Darwin needs an update.
[00:47:15]  And then it goes on and they write later.
[00:47:18]  They say, brain, body, universe are interdependently co-airing symbolic representations of species, specific consciousness, mobjects and maxions and species of consciousness.
[00:47:28]  If you think this is a good idea, I can do a draft for an article to be published with input from your prestigious luminaries as co-authors.
[00:47:37]  We're sending it straight to Slate Star Codex.
[00:47:39]  It'll be on there within a few hours.
[00:47:41]  They'll love it.
[00:47:43]  Bro, what the fuck are they talking about?
[00:47:46]  It is just like, what are you talking about?
[00:47:51]  They're literally talking about the Matrix.
[00:47:53]  And it's like, Noam Chomsky, you're sitting here listening to this guy.
[00:47:58]  Aren't you a linguist?
[00:47:59]  And you're like, oh, Mobjects, this is a really interesting idea.
[00:48:03]  Oh, wow.

=== Liz's iPhone Update (04:19) ===

[00:48:04]  Jeffrey Epstein, what a fascinating insight you've had.
[00:48:07]  Darwin, look out.
[00:48:09]  You saw the email from Chomsky where he's like, you got to keep your head up, bro.
[00:48:14]  Oh, no.
[00:48:14]  It's totally like you're being savaged by the press.
[00:48:18]  You know, it's a really.
[00:48:20]  He's like, we're, I mean, we could read it, I guess, but I mean, we could do it another episode.
[00:48:25]  I don't think we have so much shit to get through.
[00:48:27]  But yeah, it is really like, I support, I know what you did and I support you.
[00:48:32]  Yeah.
[00:48:33]  And don't worry, they try to tar and feather everyone as a neo-Nazi.
[00:48:36]  Yeah.
[00:48:37]  I see that so he says that one.
[00:48:39]  Speaking of elderly gentlemen, well, that's actually a poor transition.
[00:48:43]  And I apologize, Liz.
[00:48:47]  Speaking of, you know, wow, I fail.
[00:48:50]  I don't know.
[00:48:51]  You've got to do it.
[00:48:52]  You've got to do a transition.
[00:48:53]  I can't do it, Liz.
[00:48:55]  Speaking of Me Too, old men, and woke moms.
[00:49:01]  There we go.
[00:49:03]  There it is okay.
[00:49:04]  So actually, no, I mean, that works.
[00:49:06]  That's fine.
[00:49:06]  But we all know about Jeffrey's friendship with Woody Allen.
[00:49:14]  I mean, Woody seems to, after a certain point, be one of Jeffrey Epstein's best friends.
[00:49:20]  Like, he's one of the guys that hangs out with Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:49:23]  Any party that Jeffrey Epstein has, he's like, you know what?
[00:49:26]  You know who would make this insane, amazing party with like Peter Thiel and Bill Burns better?
[00:49:31]  If Woody Allen was here, I heard that as Bill Burr for a second.
[00:49:36]  Yes.
[00:49:36]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:49:37]  Fuck it.
[00:49:38]  Let's start these rumors.
[00:49:40]  He's like, yeah, no, I think there's pictures of them together, even before all the emails came out.
[00:49:45]  And then you see in his diaries, like they're hanging out all the time, all this stuff.
[00:49:49]  What we didn't know is actually how close he was with Soon Yi, Soon Yi Prevan, Woody Allen's wife, daughter, wife, adopted step, wait, stepdaughter, step, adopted daughter, wife.
[00:50:06]  Well, because it was adopted daughter, but yes, it was Mia's adopted daughter.
[00:50:16]  Yes.
[00:50:17]  But it was just Woody's stepdaughter.
[00:50:19]  Yes.
[00:50:22]  The adopted daughter of Woody Allen's ex-wife that married him at one point and became his stepdaughter prior to their divorce.
[00:50:31]  After it was discovered, I believe that Woody Allen was indeed engaged in a romantic relationship with his wife's adopted daughter.
[00:50:39]  Not even romantic, sexual.
[00:50:42]  Well, that's, yeah, fair enough.
[00:50:45]  Yes.
[00:50:46]  So Soon Yee and Jeffrey are like crazy close and text all the time.
[00:50:51]  In fact, she texts him about everything.
[00:50:53]  There's texts about her with her.
[00:50:55]  I read so many of them where she's just like, the iPhone update is so great.
[00:50:59]  You need to get it.
[00:51:00]  Just bullshit like that.
[00:51:01]  This is the kind of text.
[00:51:02]  It's also like, no one's ever sent me a text like that, but you know what I'm saying?
[00:51:05]  When someone's just like saying a thing in a text, no, it's like, what?
[00:51:09]  Don't want to get started talking about text right now, but there's a lot of if you don't sometimes people start open-ended conversations over text via just like a comment on something.
[00:51:22]  I want to say this.
[00:51:23]  I am not, and I will never be interested.
[00:51:25]  I just cannot do that.
[00:51:26]  I cannot do that.
[00:51:27]  There's just too much.
[00:51:28]  That's from me.
[00:51:29]  It's just, you're just at an infinite bar with infinite, infinite room that you have to wander around while you're trying to get your work or anything your life done.
[00:51:38]  And then there is every single person you've ever known or given your phone number to is able to tap you on the shoulder at any given time and say, hey, new iPhone update's pretty good.
[00:51:47]  I don't want that.
[00:51:48]  I don't want that.
[00:51:48]  It's a small talk machine.
[00:51:50]  There's a bunch of other messages where Soon Yee's bugging Jeffrey to help her get her daughter into college, which is really funny.
[00:51:58]  And at one point, I think there's like an introduction.
[00:52:00]  I don't know where her daughter ended up going, but there was like an introduction email made to Leon Botstein at Bard on her behalf.
[00:52:09]  But there was also something like a back and forth that I don't have in front of me where she's asking about University of Pennsylvania.
[00:52:18]  And Jeffrey says something like, no, that's where middle-class Jews go.
[00:52:22]  Don't go, you're not going to send her there.

=== Dylan's Daughter Bid (13:36) ===

[00:52:24]  Something like that.
[00:52:26]  I was like, all right, Jeffrey.
[00:52:27]  Anyway, I'm going to start this exchange because this is a fascinating look at a real cultural moment, but also I will just say the Soony-Woody Allen relationship and the entire kind of,
[00:52:47]  I don't know, like the drama around the entire thing between Mia, between the kids, between Woody, between, it's fascinating outside of Jeffrey Epstein.
[00:53:00]  Like was just, it's such a fascinating cultural, I don't know, it's just bizarre.
[00:53:07]  It's not even just bizarre, but there's so much, these characters and these relationships and, you know, as a filmmaker and as a, you know, there's just so much there that is really interesting.
[00:53:18]  And no one knows how to feel about any of it.
[00:53:21]  You know what I mean?
[00:53:23]  And it spurs so many arguments.
[00:53:25]  And anyway, this is a fascinating look.
[00:53:29]  So this, all this starts in 2016, Soon Yee sends a link to Jeffrey Epstein from the Daily Mail.
[00:53:41]  It says, exclusive.
[00:53:42]  Anthony Weiner carried on a months-long sexual relationship with a troubled 15-year-old girl, telling her she made him hard, asking her to dress up in schoolgirl outfits and pressing her to engage in rape fantasies.
[00:53:51]  Okay.
[00:53:52]  Everyone remembers Anthony Weiner was at the time, this was what got him finally divorced from the beautiful.
[00:54:03]  Abedine, who is now married to Alex Soros, who loves making, I tell you this, Alex Soros, if you're listening to this, you got to stop making social media posts of you posing with people or causes that you support.
[00:54:17]  Yeah.
[00:54:18]  Because it is giving Grim Reaper a little bit every time you do something bad happens.
[00:54:24]  Because you look so bad.
[00:54:28]  You know what he reminds me of?
[00:54:30]  Is that the big YouTube podcaster?
[00:54:32]  That's, I always forget his name.
[00:54:34]  Oh, I don't know.
[00:54:35]  Yes, you do.
[00:54:36]  The big, Lex Friedman.
[00:54:38]  He's got, he's got a whiff of the Friedman about him.
[00:54:40]  Yes.
[00:54:41]  Friedman.
[00:54:42]  Friedman.
[00:54:43]  Okay.
[00:54:44]  So Sunyi sends this link.
[00:54:46]  This was, so this is Anthony.
[00:54:49]  This was like the final straw of Anthony Weiner's sexting addiction, I think.
[00:54:55]  He had kind of come back, remember?
[00:54:56]  And then this hit and it just like destroyed everything.
[00:55:00]  Was this, was this what Weiner was about, the documentary?
[00:55:05]  This was, I think Wiener, the documentary came out before this.
[00:55:10]  Oh, God.
[00:55:10]  Oh, yeah.
[00:55:11]  This is when she was like, I'm actually leaving.
[00:55:13]  I don't know.
[00:55:14]  Yeah, this Wiener documentary came out May 2016.
[00:55:19]  So it was about, that was about Carlos Danger, I think.
[00:55:23]  Which was years before.
[00:55:26]  And then he got hit with another sexting scandal.
[00:55:29]  And it was like, this was months after that.
[00:55:33]  Yeah.
[00:55:34]  I mean, it is athony wiener for you.
[00:55:38]  Well, Jeffrey Epstein responds, unless you want me to be Soon Ye or do you want to be Soon Yee?
[00:55:45]  I don't really care.
[00:55:46]  Which do you prefer?
[00:55:47]  Well, I know you've been practicing what you call the voice.
[00:55:50]  Oh, so you want me to be Jeffrey?
[00:55:52]  Okay.
[00:55:53]  You like that one?
[00:55:56]  Jeffrey replies to Link.
[00:55:58]  He says, wow, big surprise.
[00:56:01]  Soon Yee responds, I know.
[00:56:03]  It's an incredible story.
[00:56:05]  You have to feel sorry for him.
[00:56:07]  He can't seem to learn.
[00:56:08]  Most importantly, I feel sorry for his wife.
[00:56:10]  I also thought it was disgusting what the 15-year-old did to him.
[00:56:14]  I hate women who take advantage of guys, and she is definitely one of them.
[00:56:18]  Fact-checked, not quite a woman, a girl.
[00:56:22]  I hate women who take advantage of guys who is, and she is definitely one of them.
[00:56:26]  She knew exactly what she was doing and how vulnerable Weiner was.
[00:56:29]  And she reeled him in like a fish to bait.
[00:56:31]  It's also laughable when she says later in her letter that she is putting it out there to help him.
[00:56:36]  Well, that is kind of laughable, but how does it help him?
[00:56:38]  It only humiliates him.
[00:56:40]  We know this excuse that he has a sickness.
[00:56:42]  What is her excuse?
[00:56:43]  What is her excuse for being a despicable and disgusting person who preys on the weak?
[00:56:50]  I had not read this before we were doing this.
[00:56:52]  This is crazy.
[00:56:53]  It's crazy.
[00:56:54]  We know he's sick, but she's also sick to have done this to him.
[00:56:58]  So manipulative on her part.
[00:56:59]  She should be ashamed of herself.
[00:57:02]  So Jeffrey replies to that and he says, I'm not sure that a person's sex life, no matter who they are, can withstand disclosures, exaggerations, etc.
[00:57:10]  He hasn't had sex in a year.
[00:57:11]  What is he supposed to do?
[00:57:12]  He can't have a girlfriend, can't have a hooker.
[00:57:14]  So he thought he was safe.
[00:57:17]  Soon Yee says he thought he was safe with a 15-year-old over the internet, something he was caught doing many times or at least twice before.
[00:57:24]  It doesn't make sense.
[00:57:25]  Guess what Woody and I talked about on our way home?
[00:57:28]  I got to the bottom of the women.
[00:57:30]  I'm not good at letting things go.
[00:57:31]  Woody has a very hard life with me.
[00:57:33]  Let's just say Woody is a smooth talker so he can get himself out of anything.
[00:57:40]  So sent from Soon Yee's iPhone.
[00:57:42]  Oh, yeah.
[00:57:42]  We always got to include that.
[00:57:44]  She does have a funny signature with like little balloon emojis.
[00:57:47]  Yeah.
[00:57:49]  I don't know.
[00:57:49]  It's so fascinating to me to see Jeffrey Epstein gossiping about a sex scandal with Woody Allen's daughter wife.
[00:58:00]  A sex scandal that involves a 15-year-old girl, no less.
[00:58:03]  Yes.
[00:58:05]  Now, like I said, there is like so much correspondence between Jeffrey and Sunyi.
[00:58:09]  It's not just like dinner reservation stuff, want to get together with Woody type stuff.
[00:58:12]  It's like actual thick conversations.
[00:58:19]  There are a ton of iChat messages between the two after.
[00:58:25]  So in 2018, right, this is the height.
[00:58:28]  What I said was like the height of Me Too.
[00:58:30]  New York Magazine published this big profile on Soon Ye.
[00:58:33]  Do you remember this?
[00:58:35]  I didn't read it, but I remember when it happened because this is also like when a lot of the Woody Allen stuff was being, let's say, revisited.
[00:58:41]  Yes, this was, no, this was like basically their response to that.
[00:58:46]  Yeah.
[00:58:47]  So if you, if we go back to kind of the timeline of 2018, There was, so there was like a relitigation of all the Woody Allen stuff, but some of that came because there what Dylan, who is the one accusing, who accused Woody Allen of molestation.
[00:59:08]  Dylan Farrow, yes, went on CBS this morning and did a televised interview with Gail King early in 2018.
[00:59:16]  And it was the first time that she had done a like actual video interview.
[00:59:23]  Yeah.
[00:59:24]  So it was like a really big thing.
[00:59:26]  And then, you know, throughout the year, there was like Amazon canned one of the movies that they had done with Woody.
[00:59:33]  A bunch of actors came out and were like distancing themselves.
[00:59:37]  So it was like a whole thing.
[00:59:39]  So for those of you who don't know, Dylan Farrow alleges that when she was seven in 1992, Woody Allen sexually assaulted her in the attic at Mia Farrow's Connecticut home.
[00:59:51]  Now, Alan has always like denied the allegation, says Mia made it up.
[00:59:55]  And this was the same year that Mia discovered nude Polaroids of Soon Yee, which is like we said, Pharaoh's adopted daughter that Woody Allen took.
[01:00:09]  Soon Yee was in college at the time, I believe, or 17.
[01:00:13]  I can't remember if she was already in school or not.
[01:00:17]  But Woody, you know, so Woody and Soon Yee have been together since.
[01:00:20]  She never really talks.
[01:00:21]  Soon Yee never talks to anybody.
[01:00:22]  Like this was something that was like really famous.
[01:00:24]  So when this piece in New York Magazine came out, it was like the first big interview with Soon Yee because she had always just like kind of kept quiet about the whole thing.
[01:00:38]  Anyway, that's some context.
[01:00:41]  Jeffrey starts off this conversation.
[01:00:43]  So Soon Yee like links him to the piece.
[01:00:46]  And Jeffrey is like, I did not like it at all.
[01:00:51]  At all, he says.
[01:00:53]  And later he like refers to the writer as a C, which is, by the way, just side note, that's the exact response that he gives talking about the Woody's movie, Blue Jasmine, that he really didn't like.
[01:01:08]  Is that the San Francisco one?
[01:01:10]  With Kate Blanchette?
[01:01:12]  I never saw it.
[01:01:13]  Oh, it's great.
[01:01:14]  Anyway, this is from the New York magazine piece.
[01:01:17]  Do you want to, can you read this?
[01:01:19]  Once she was seen as a victim, her youth and relative innocence taken advantage of by a powerful, much older man who sucked her into his vortex.
[01:01:27]  Or alternate, alternatively, she was a Lolita, a seductress who wittingly betrayed the mother Teresa-like figure who'd save her from life in an orphanage.
[01:01:37]  These days, Soon Yee Previn is seen as an accomplice of sorts, who, in the wake of renewed accusations by Dylan Farrow that Dylan's adopted father, Woody Allen, sexually molested her, has stood by Alan even as his reputation has plummeted and his once revered films have been reassessed in the light of Me Too move, the hashtag Me Too movement.
[01:01:55]  Throughout this time, Soon Yee herself, the slim Korean-born woman with a curtain of dark hair who showed up occasionally at Alan's side in grainy news images, has said virtually nothing.
[01:02:04]  Her sphinx-like presence adding to the mystery of what actually took place.
[01:02:08]  He did what?
[01:02:09]  She's how old?
[01:02:11]  And whose daughter?
[01:02:13]  Wow.
[01:02:14]  Some real New York mag writing right there.
[01:02:16]  I know.
[01:02:17]  So Jeffrey, this is what he says about the New York magazine piece.
[01:02:20]  He says, I'm not sure what the point of it is.
[01:02:22]  It is bland.
[01:02:23]  You are definitely not.
[01:02:25]  It is like she interviewed Ma and Pa Kelly on an Idaho porch.
[01:02:29]  It says nothing.
[01:02:30]  It questions your truthfulness, perception, reality, and merely says there are two sides to the story.
[01:02:36]  And no one knows the truth except Woody and Dylan.
[01:02:38]  Ridiculous exclamation point.
[01:02:41]  So that's what he says initially.
[01:02:43]  Now, Soon Yee is in the in the exchange, she says like she's so unhappy with the piece.
[01:02:49]  She thinks it like portrays her as a little crazy, which I agree.
[01:02:55]  But she says that she wanted Michael Wolf to write it.
[01:02:58]  Oh, God.
[01:02:59]  Funny enough, which means that like this circle of friends is so weird to me, by the way.
[01:03:08]  But she says that even he agreed it should be a woman.
[01:03:12]  Fair enough.
[01:03:13]  And then she says that Mia threatened to sue the magazine and there was a huge pile on.
[01:03:19]  So this is what she says.
[01:03:20]  Do you want to read this?
[01:03:22]  You wouldn't believe the amount of trouble we had with the magazine.
[01:03:24]  They were spineless and cowardly to the very end.
[01:03:27]  They wouldn't even put the story on the cover after promising Daphne that they would if she made one change, which she did.
[01:03:32]  Then they let Dylan's lawyer look at it and they made it even more changes.
[01:03:36]  The article you're reading now is a lukewarm version of what it should have been.
[01:03:40]  Ronan also called Adam Moss, former editor-in-chief of New York Magazine, prior to publication, put pressure on.
[01:03:45]  I'm sure Mia's contingent will be out in force.
[01:03:48]  However, we have truth on our side.
[01:03:49]  Not that that's gotten us anywhere so far.
[01:03:52]  So Ronin, by the way, again, Ronan Farrow, who also wrote the Weinstein piece.
[01:03:59]  Yeah.
[01:04:00]  And kind of like became a big figure in the Me Too movement writing all of this stuff and is Soon Yee's stepbrother, I guess.
[01:04:12]  So then Jeffrey writes, it should not end with this.
[01:04:15]  It would be very unfair.
[01:04:17]  I think he means unfair.
[01:04:19]  I was not kidnapped.
[01:04:21]  I was rescued.
[01:04:22]  Dylan is a troubled child with loving siblings who want to support her.
[01:04:25]  There is not evidence whatsoever, none that Woody did anything.
[01:04:28]  It is ludicrous.
[01:04:30]  And then Jeffrey continues.
[01:04:31]  I know him better than anyone else.
[01:04:33]  I was there.
[01:04:34]  I was an adult.
[01:04:34]  Ronan was six years old at the time.
[01:04:37]  He is kind and wants to believe.
[01:04:38]  I respect that.
[01:04:39]  However, it is nonsense.
[01:04:40]  All of it.
[01:04:40]  Mia was a monster.
[01:04:41]  She is manipulative.
[01:04:43]  My view is that you can't leave this article at the last word.
[01:04:48]  And then Soon Yee responds.
[01:04:50]  The problem is I wasn't there at the time that the supposed molestation took place.
[01:04:54]  Mia was very good in planning it, conveniently out of the house shopping with her friend.
[01:04:59]  And then Jeffrey cuts in with some advice.
[01:05:02]  It is crazy.
[01:05:02]  It is not Woody.
[01:05:04]  It is custody battle time.
[01:05:05]  Two investigations said no.
[01:05:07]  Of course, Mia.
[01:05:08]  Losing side would say incomplete or some other nonsense.
[01:05:12]  Every losing defendant does.
[01:05:13]  Dershwich is such a suck up.
[01:05:15]  Maybe Woody can get him to acknowledge the money offer.
[01:05:18]  Acknowledge that people don't like Woody and the fact that he married you, but they should look at the facts, not the gossip.
[01:05:22]  Maybe tape an interview with a friendly person.
[01:05:25]  Keep that in mind for what we talk about next episode.
[01:05:29]  One that can make you seem normal-like.
[01:05:34]  So Soon Yee goes on the whole thing bemoaning that the press aren't interested in their sides and that they basically got lucky with the New York Mag piece, that they'd never been able to kind of get any press to talk to them, to hear what they want to say.
[01:05:50]  And Jeffrey's like, no, you got to go on video because that's where everyone is at.
[01:05:56]  Interesting.
[01:05:58]  And he's like, you and Woody should do it.

=== Experts Speak on Video (03:30) ===

[01:06:00]  Re me, I've heard that before, but these are views of people that know more than me.
[01:06:03]  I always go to the experts.
[01:06:05]  I have no ego in right or wrong decisions.
[01:06:07]  This is the internet age.
[01:06:08]  You guys are talking to magazines.
[01:06:10]  And Soon Yi is like, the so-called experts haven't done, have not done very well for you either.
[01:06:16]  And Jeffrey says, no, exactly the opposite.
[01:06:18]  The experts tell me there's nothing to do.
[01:06:22]  So you've got like Soon Yi confiding in Jeffrey Epstein for his advice on how to deal with the Me Too allegations against Woody Allen.
[01:06:35]  It's interesting.
[01:06:37]  And I think that I also him saying that you should go on video.
[01:06:42]  I mean, that's a bit of a foreshadowing to our next to our next episode.
[01:06:46]  But to go on an interview and clear everything up, just seem like a normal person.
[01:06:49]  It seems like that might be advice that he is getting himself at this point and that he will soon put into practice.
[01:06:57]  So speaking of people who seem very normal both off video and on video,
[01:07:20]  on camera, off camera in whatever environments they find themselves in, people who can jump better than Wemby, they're saying.
[01:07:30]  His branzy doesn't need to jump.
[01:07:32]  He's so tall.
[01:07:32]  That's the whole point.
[01:07:34]  Exactly.
[01:07:34]  But if he did, it wouldn't even hold a candle to the roaring flame that is Elon Musk.
[01:07:42]  So I've changed my opinion a lot on Elon Musk over the years.
[01:07:47]  Well, it was depending on your position when Tesla's talk.
[01:07:50]  Exactly.
[01:07:52]  And I'm not elaborating on that.
[01:07:53]  I'm just going to say I've changed my position.
[01:07:55]  I've changed my views on Elon a lot.
[01:07:57]  I think he's great.
[01:07:58]  I think that he is somebody who is obviously a bit unorthodox in his behaviors and the physical proportions of some parts of his body I find grotesque.
[01:08:10]  And the things that he says at any time that he talks or types are stupid in a way that I haven't encountered before outside of him.
[01:08:24]  And I think his cars suck and are ugly.
[01:08:29]  And I don't like the things that he does.
[01:08:31]  But he's the greatest, obviously.
[01:08:32]  Like, you know, he's sort of the Edison of our time.
[01:08:36]  And it is really a heartbreaking because I've sort of held him up as this paragon of virtue.
[01:08:41]  And to see some of these emails come out after he's assured us for so long, there's nothing for him to hide.
[01:08:47]  It's just, I didn't think that he was capable of lying, Liz.
[01:08:49]  You know what I'm saying?
[01:08:51]  You know, like how robots aren't allowed to kill people in certain fantasies about robots?
[01:08:58]  No.
[01:09:00]  As a Gazimov, iRobotist, robots can't hurt human beings.
[01:09:04]  I didn't think Elon Musk could break my heart.
[01:09:07]  And it seems like he's violated that directive.
[01:09:10]  So there were some fake Elon emails.
[01:09:12]  Did you see those going around?
[01:09:14]  Yeah, there's a ton of fake shit.
[01:09:16]  I know.
[01:09:16]  And it was like, I think a lot of people, like the fake Elon emails went viral.
[01:09:21]  And so people like thought, and it was him being sort of like, whatever.
[01:09:24]  It was just clearly, so clearly fake, but people I think were sort of primed to believe it.

=== Elon's Orbit Mystery (14:42) ===

[01:09:30]  Like Elaine was in there and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
[01:09:32]  It just was not real.
[01:09:35]  But there was a ton of emails between the two or related to the two from 2012, 2013, and then a smattering from before and after.
[01:09:46]  So I want to start here in February of 2012.
[01:09:52]  There is an email from Jeffrey Epstein to Ian Osbourne.
[01:09:59]  He says, just finished lunch with Boris and Musk.
[01:10:03]  We'll be at the Weston in about 30 minutes.
[01:10:07]  So Ian Osborne is at the time running a PR group called Osborne and Partners and was in business of some kind with DST Global, which was run by Israeli billionaire, Russian Israeli billionaire, they often say, Yuri Milner.
[01:10:25]  Yuri Milner owns a huge stake in VK and various Russian social media websites through mail.ru, which is like a technology fund that he has for Eastern Europe.
[01:10:36]  He also has, I think, a stake in a bunch of U.S. technology companies as well.
[01:10:42]  He comes up a little later in the year, but Boris Nikolik, who is Bill Gates' sort of life sciences advisor and working with him on a bunch of investing stuff and is also one of Jeffrey Epstein's best friends, is working on a fund with Yuri Milner, who is one of Ian Osborne's business partners and clients, if that makes sense.
[01:11:06]  So Epstein's emailing Ian Osborne just finished lunch with Boris and Musk.
[01:11:11]  We'll be at the West In about 30 minutes.
[01:11:15]  So there's another email from February 29th that has Epstein's assistant giving someone a key to his hotel room at the Hyatt, which appears to be during a visit to the TED conference in Long Beach.
[01:11:32]  So it seems like maybe Elon Musk took a break from SpaceX because he is kind of all over the TED shit, as is Jeffrey Epstein.
[01:11:45]  And there's a SpaceX Factor near there, which will be useful.
[01:11:50]  Super close.
[01:11:52]  On this visit, Epstein also checks out a plane that he was purchasing, a Gulfstream jet he was changing the interior of, and also seems to meet with one of the Pritzkers.
[01:12:02]  But he's like, this is, I guess, an indication that he's already kind of in the Muskian orbit here without necessarily the two of them communicating directly over email, if that makes sense.
[01:12:13]  So it's like, it seems like maybe Boris introduced the two of them.
[01:12:17]  Which you, I know you mentioned is like one of his best friends, but I just want to say they're like, this is a boy.
[01:12:23]  They're both.
[01:12:24]  Yeah, this is not like just business.
[01:12:26]  Yeah, they're like very close.
[01:12:30]  So later in that year, it's 2012, Epstein in a email to Redacted says, Where are you?
[01:12:39]  Is there anything cute for you or for me?
[01:12:42]  Elon Musk is coming to lunch at house, so you will have time.
[01:12:47]  So I guess there's some kind of Musk lunch at the Epstein mansion then.
[01:12:51]  And at some point, Musk has referred, at some points, rather, Musk has referred to like briefly stopping by for 30 minutes at Epstein's mansion.
[01:13:03]  It seems like from these exchanges that that was actually something that happened much more often than that, and certainly for longer than half an hour.
[01:13:12]  On September 21st, there's an email exchange that Jeffrey Epstein has with Nicholas Pritzker of the Pritzker family of the West Coast Pritzkers.
[01:13:22]  And Epstein says, The Musk boys told me you are in town.
[01:13:26]  Come see me.
[01:13:28]  Now, boys plural.
[01:13:30]  Boys plural.
[01:13:32]  Good eye there.
[01:13:34]  He also tells Pritzker that John Brockman's in town and they end up having a lunch.
[01:13:39]  Nicholas Pritzker confirms that Elon Musk and his wife, Tallulah, are coming.
[01:13:45]  Absolutely.
[01:13:45]  And that he's working on inviting Kimball or securing Kimball coming.
[01:13:50]  So Kimball Musk is Elon's brother.
[01:13:53]  Of course, there's Kimball, Tosca, and Elon Tosca.
[01:13:58]  We love you.
[01:13:59]  She's doing passion flicks.
[01:14:03]  And she's mentioned in a roundabout way in these, but Kimball is sort of like Elon's, I don't know what, like cowboy brother.
[01:14:14]  Yeah, he's like his fail brother.
[01:14:16]  Like he, you know, he has this restaurant chain that I don't think is like that successful.
[01:14:22]  Certainly employees of it that I've talked to said it sucks.
[01:14:26]  And he's like on the board of Tesla and shit, but like he doesn't really do anything.
[01:14:29]  You know what I mean?
[01:14:30]  Like afterwards, Jeffrey writes to Nicholas, I really enjoyed seeing you.
[01:14:38]  I want more.
[01:14:40]  Nicholas writes, likewise, I'll find you.
[01:14:43]  There's another email exchange that's included here, too, that shows Elon agreeing to come to this like little lunch and at Epstein's request, bringing a plus one.
[01:14:53]  And I guess this is the same lunch, even though he mentions bringing Tallulah and Tallulah is mentioned in Elon's denial of hanging out with Jeffrey Epstein that he actually blames his visit to Epstein's house on his wife.
[01:15:08]  But this is what confuses me, right?
[01:15:11]  Because if that's the time he visited with Tallulah, then how come Epstein's demanding he brings a plus one?
[01:15:16]  Because isn't your plus one your wife?
[01:15:18]  Maybe Tallulah was already on the list, but yeah, it does seem weird.
[01:15:22]  It seems a little weird.
[01:15:23]  He says that that's perfect that he's being asked to bring a plus one because he was going to be hanging out with Jonah Nolan.
[01:15:30]  Jonah Nolan is, of course, the brother of one Christopher Nolan and also made the TV show Westworld, co-wrote the Nolan Batman movies and Memento and is making the new TV show Fallout.
[01:15:43]  So he's still in the mix.
[01:15:45]  Surprising that he hangs out with Elon.
[01:15:47]  I know, 2013, like 2012, hanging out with that combo right there.
[01:15:52]  Because Elon probably was telling the idea for Interstellar.
[01:15:56]  He's like, what if time?
[01:15:57]  What if love was the fourth dimension?
[01:15:59]  You know what I'm saying?
[01:16:02]  I think this is kind of an important part of this as well.
[01:16:07]  In the background, there are emails sent among Epstein's employees to each other.
[01:16:11]  Epstein is not a participant in these emails.
[01:16:14]  And there's some confusions about snacks versus lunch, how much food they should bring.
[01:16:19]  And then coming from a redacted email address is a message that says he has told four of us girls to come to the house at 12.
[01:16:28]  I don't know if he wants us involved in the snacks at 1 p.m.
[01:16:34]  And it appears that one of those girls, at least, well, at least, no, it appears that one of those girls was Ifkis Sturm, at least according to an email that Pritzker sent Epstein afterwards, saying that he delight, he was so delighted on meeting her and having a little walk with her afterwards.
[01:16:50]  She is a pretty famous model, no?
[01:16:52]  I had actually never heard of her, but apparently she's famous.
[01:16:55]  And she's Dutch.
[01:16:57]  So I guess maybe she's famous there.
[01:17:02]  But she's already had to come out and apologize, which I feel like.
[01:17:08]  Do the girls really need to apologize?
[01:17:10]  I don't know.
[01:17:11]  I don't know.
[01:17:11]  Yeah, I don't know.
[01:17:12]  I feel a little funny about that.
[01:17:14]  It is a little weird that I don't know.
[01:17:16]  Like, did she, what is she apologizing?
[01:17:19]  You know what I'm saying?
[01:17:19]  Yeah, it is a little, it is a little strange.
[01:17:23]  The party, though, seems to have gone quite well, or this little like lunch gathering of Jeffrey Epstein bringing these girls to meet these guys.
[01:17:33]  The next day, Kimball Musk, who I guess must have attended, invites Jeffrey Epstein and Boris Nikolaik to a party, a birthday party he's having at the Four Seasons Hotel.
[01:17:44]  It does appear via other emails that Jeffrey was unable to attend, but he was made aware that the password to the party is Pussy Riot.
[01:17:56]  Wow.
[01:17:57]  So USAID of the Musks.
[01:18:01]  I know, I know.
[01:18:03]  They didn't like USAID.
[01:18:06]  Maybe it wasn't in reference to the quasi-band from Russia.
[01:18:11]  Could just be their two favorite, well, two words he thinks are cool.
[01:18:15]  Well, the next day, which is the day of their birthday party, Epstein sends an email to an unknown recipient saying, add Alexa Staley to the Musk party.
[01:18:28]  And he eventually gets a response from Kimball that says, no problem.
[01:18:32]  So Alexa Staley would be Jess Staley's daughter, who later acted as a go-between when Jeff between Jeff Staley and Jeffrey Epstein, when Jess was supposed to have cut off communications with Jeffrey Epstein.
[01:18:46]  And actually, I didn't realize this, but Epstein actually floated Jess Staley as U.S. Treasury Secretary in 2016.
[01:18:56]  He passes.
[01:18:58]  Just trying to do his boy right.
[01:19:00]  Jess was named one of the trustees of his will at one point.
[01:19:04]  Yes.
[01:19:06]  Yeah.
[01:19:07]  I didn't know that.
[01:19:08]  It's in one of the earlier.
[01:19:09]  So in, I can't remember which files it is.
[01:19:12]  There's like, or like which tranche, but there's all the, I was looking at all the different versions of his will and testament over the years and of the estate.
[01:19:24]  And there was one version that had Jess as one of the trustees.
[01:19:29]  And then there was like an updated version that had Kathy Rumbler, who of course is one of his lady best friends as one of the trustees.
[01:19:39]  Those didn't make it into the final version, which was really interesting to read and actually has like never been seen before.
[01:19:47]  It's always been kept under seal or secret from the from like from the estate or whatever.
[01:19:56]  But some, yeah, some fascinating stuff in there.
[01:19:59]  Well, it's, it's Boris Nikolai, of course, named, was named in the final will as trustee, right?
[01:20:07]  I think that was sort of, and he says, oh, I had no idea that that was coming.
[01:20:11]  Alexa served as this like go-between because Jess Staley was like forbidden from talking to Jeffrey, but he was addicted to Jeffrey Epstein's attention.
[01:20:18]  And so Jeffrey was passing messages via his daughter to him and seems to have like helped her get into school.
[01:20:25]  And like, you know, she got a PhD at Columbia and then worked for an SF drone company.
[01:20:31]  And, you know, I don't want to get too much into it, but obviously her personal information has been not available on the internet since 2019.
[01:20:39]  Except I did find that she'd filed multiple patents from 2020 to 2024 at a Y Combinator quantum computing startup.
[01:20:49]  But yeah, very interesting.
[01:20:50]  Jess Staley actually sent Epstein an email upon her completion of a PhD saying that Epstein's counsel had been invaluable.
[01:20:58]  But back to the Musks.
[01:21:00]  And there's no way that Epstein's counsel was invaluable, by the way.
[01:21:05]  Judging from what we've seen so far.
[01:21:06]  He's like, you guys should study if you can smell hair.
[01:21:10]  Mobjex.
[01:21:11]  He needs to get her on Mob Jackson Maxions.
[01:21:15]  So September 25th, there's an email from Epstein to Elon.
[01:21:19]  If you find some time, come visit me on my island in the Caribbean.
[01:21:23]  I like that you have to like say that specifically as if no one knows where your fucking private island is.
[01:21:30]  Bring your friend or friends.
[01:21:32]  I will be there most of November and December.
[01:21:36]  Elon replies, sounds good.
[01:21:38]  We'll try to make it.
[01:21:39]  Now, I want you guys to keep in mind, the island will come back up later, but Elon's whole thing has been, Epstein kept trying to get me to go to his island.
[01:21:46]  And I said, fuck no, I'll never go to your pedophile island because I like adult women, specifically my wife.
[01:21:53]  And what you do is disgusting.
[01:21:55]  The stuff that you do with Reed Hoffman, who at this time of my life, I also hate.
[01:22:02]  So October 7th rolls around.
[01:22:05]  And I think that there is a, I can't actually figure out the exact day.
[01:22:09]  I could if I spent a little more time, but it doesn't really matter.
[01:22:11]  Sometime between October 5th, 6th, 7th, there is a lunch with Epstein and Kimball, just the two of them.
[01:22:20]  And maybe Boris as well, but certainly.
[01:22:23]  Meeting of the minds.
[01:22:25]  Oh my, could you imagine what they're talking about?
[01:22:27]  There's actually, there's some freak out because Epstein, and this is also from emails between his staff, Epstein has scheduled multiple lunches and they can't figure out if you mean snacks or lunch for each of them.
[01:22:38]  But, and they're really, can I just say as a side note, I love all that side drama.
[01:22:44]  There's no point in me getting into it too much in this, but there's all this drama with the Sultan and Epstein over the delivery of these like 30 to 23 of me kits,
[01:23:04]  DNA kits, and like who's getting charged and fake credit card charges or like incorrect credit card charges, and then trying to get these kits on a plane that was going to the Emirates or wherever.
[01:23:19]  And it was, it's like, it's so funny, the back and forth and the Sultan's insistence on getting these kits that he also makes like Jeffrey pay for it.
[01:23:30]  Like he doesn't have a credit card.
[01:23:31]  It makes no sense.
[01:23:33]  I will say, this is the stuff that I find riveting.
[01:23:36]  Some of these upstairs, downstairs drama.
[01:23:38]  You know what I'm saying?
[01:23:39]  The logistics of Epstein's downtown Abbey ass house is just fascinating.
[01:23:46]  But it also, it really does mean that when you're trying to like read any sort of documents, that half of them are just his staff confused about typos that he sent or like his inability to be clear and like sending 50 emails to each other to try to divine meaning from the master's message.
[01:24:01]  It's crazy.
[01:24:03]  So the next day, Kimball Musk actually sends an email and it's a forwarded email from May Musk who had sent a now dead link.

=== Upstairs, Downstairs Drama (07:08) ===

[01:24:13]  I know, Liz.
[01:24:14]  It's tough for you, huh?
[01:24:17]  When I tell you some of our faves may be implicated, babe.
[01:24:21]  Not only did I put one gun in my mouth, not just two, I fit three full .45 caliber handgun barrels in my mouth, pencil across all three triggers at once, and was about to walk in front of her house and do it when I saw that, oh, it was a forwarded link.
[01:24:45]  She had nothing to do with this.
[01:24:48]  She is safe.
[01:24:49]  She is safe.
[01:24:51]  Hopefully, maybe she thought Epstein was too old for her and she prefers a bit of a younger man.
[01:24:55]  Not too young, but maybe sometime in his mid-30s, you know, regardless, it is a the dead link.
[01:25:04]  There's a subject line and it says, medication use higher among overweight, obese kids.
[01:25:10]  And the email is addressed to Epstein and Boris Nikolik.
[01:25:13]  The body of the email says, this is what Kimball adds, per our conversation.
[01:25:18]  So I guess they were talking about medication use higher among overweight, obese kids.
[01:25:23]  Per our conversation.
[01:25:24]  What are they fucking talking about?
[01:25:26]  You know, just, you know what, Liz, you've never been to Boys' Lunch.
[01:25:29]  This is what we talk about.
[01:25:31]  Yeah, sure.
[01:25:32]  We always talk about these little piggies are on that.
[01:25:34]  You know, I don't know what kids are on riddling, huh?
[01:25:37]  That would make you skinny, no?
[01:25:38]  But, well, this is, this is the kind of thing that's.
[01:25:40]  No one in the Musk family knows anything about that.
[01:25:42]  Yes.
[01:25:44]  Great to hang out today.
[01:25:45]  Jeffrey and Boris, many thanks for connecting me with blank, redacted.
[01:25:50]  I believe you both played a role, Smiley Face.
[01:25:54]  Smiley face.
[01:25:56]  That smiley face tells us everything.
[01:25:59]  Everything.
[01:26:00]  I do kind of wish it was a winky.
[01:26:02]  Would you read Boris's response?
[01:26:04]  Thank you, Kimball.
[01:26:06]  Just FYI.
[01:26:08]  You better be nice to Redacted.
[01:26:11]  Jeffrey goes crazy when someone mistreats his girls/slash friends.
[01:26:17]  So better be nice, very nice to Jen.
[01:26:20]  Well, they didn't redact that one.
[01:26:22]  Exactly.
[01:26:23]  This fucking fucking people.
[01:26:26]  And Jeffrey and I better have a special treatment at your ceremony, winky smiley face.
[01:26:32]  You knew it was coming, Liz.
[01:26:33]  You knew it was coming.
[01:26:35]  Great to hang out with you.
[01:26:36]  See you very soon.
[01:26:37]  Please keep me posted.
[01:26:38]  Read your travel plans to NYC.
[01:26:41]  I am in NYC very often as well.
[01:26:44]  Until sometime soon, B.
[01:26:48]  So we'll get to that name being unredacted later because it actually happens twice in the emails that involve Kimball and sloppy ass.
[01:26:57]  Fully, they redact her name and then fucking one sentence later.
[01:27:02]  Yeah, because they probably search Jennifer and not Jen.
[01:27:06]  Yes.
[01:27:07]  Well, they do spell her name differently at different points.
[01:27:10]  In fact, that's the only time that I see it as Jen with one N. Every other time it's Jen with two N's.
[01:27:17]  That's why I, when I write all of my emails with your name, I insert random letters a la Finnegan's Wake to then throw these sensors off the scent for when my emails are inevitably leaked in a big DOJ tranche.
[01:27:34]  I do mine all in wing bings.
[01:27:36]  So Kimball responds, Jeffrey, message received, wide and clear.
[01:27:41]  ESL moment.
[01:27:43]  And then Winky Face, our second of the email exchanges.
[01:27:47]  Seriously, I'm very happy with my time with blank.
[01:27:52]  Excuse me, with my time so far with Jennifer.
[01:27:54]  So unredacted again.
[01:27:56]  She's great.
[01:27:57]  I'll be back in NYC for Halloween weekend, October 25th to 28th.
[01:28:01]  It scares me to imagine what you'll be for Halloween, Boris, but I want to see it.
[01:28:06]  Let me know if you'll be there.
[01:28:08]  Maybe that scares me to imagine.
[01:28:10]  Like, you think he's going to be a monster?
[01:28:11]  Or you think he's going to be...
[01:28:13]  Hmm.
[01:28:14]  Well.
[01:28:15]  The idea of Kimball getting ready to party on Halloween in New York City is so fucking disgusting.
[01:28:21]  He's like, I can't wait to party with Boris Nicholas and Jeffrey Edwards.
[01:28:24]  Wait for Halloween.
[01:28:26]  He's going to fucking Halloween goes so fucking hard.
[01:28:29]  A lot of people ask about the Kimball hat, and I have been told by people who know and saw this occur that one day he went to Austin, Texas, and somebody took him to a hat store and he bought a hat.
[01:28:40]  He's worn a cowboy hat 100% of the time since then.
[01:28:43]  That is the one thing that I approve of with him.
[01:28:45]  Yeah.
[01:28:46]  I think that you go into a hat store and you're just like, now I'm this guy.
[01:28:51]  And I think that's great.
[01:28:52]  Just commit to it.
[01:28:53]  Just be the hat man.
[01:28:56]  So Boris responds regarding Halloween.
[01:28:59]  It scares you what I will be for Halloween.
[01:29:01]  Three question marks.
[01:29:02]  Good question mark, Boris.
[01:29:05]  Perhaps three of us could do something together.
[01:29:07]  For example, Jeffrey could be Holy Spirit, wise man.
[01:29:14]  I would go as baby Jesus.
[01:29:17]  And you, Kimball, could go as Virgin Mary, Winky Face.
[01:29:22]  Kimball, let's be serious.
[01:29:25]  So you should get your second residency in NYC ASAP.
[01:29:29]  It's about time and for a good cause.
[01:29:31]  See you soon.
[01:29:32]  All right, stop.
[01:29:34]  Yeah.
[01:29:36]  You have been, of course, studying the Bible.
[01:29:38]  Of course.
[01:29:43]  The Holy Spirit is not the wise man.
[01:29:49]  What is he talking about?
[01:29:52]  And why is he choosing, setting that aside, why is he choosing for Jeffrey to be the wise man?
[01:29:58]  He would be baby Jesus and Kimball to be Virgin Mary.
[01:30:04]  It's difficult for me to parse exactly because the way that these two men are speaking to each other more closely resembles flirtation rather than any kind of theological discussion that I've ever been party to in my life.
[01:30:19]  I don't know.
[01:30:20]  I'm actually not even really sure what the Holy Spirit is.
[01:30:23]  I mean, it's the Trinity thing.
[01:30:29]  I don't really, I feel like that's something that they came up with when they didn't have that much to talk about back in the day when they're like, oh, well, we don't really know how many things work.
[01:30:36]  So I guess we need something to argue about.
[01:30:38]  So we'll just come up with this thigh.
[01:30:40]  But obviously, I'm listening and learning.
[01:30:43]  I don't really know how you dress up as the Holy Spirit.
[01:30:46]  What he brings to mind, is he talking about like, because clearly by wise men, is he talking about one of the Magi?
[01:30:53]  That's what I think he's saying.
[01:30:54]  Yeah, exactly.
[01:30:55]  I'm like, maybe he doesn't really know.
[01:30:56]  I mean, the Holy Spirit obviously was in the room, but not a visible presence.
[01:31:02]  But certainly wasn't a wise man.
[01:31:04]  No, certainly not.
[01:31:06]  And so I think this may be Boris being a man of science, of course, and rationality, being somewhat ignorant of the matters of the spirit.
[01:31:15]  And so he, yeah, he's sort of bluffing here.
[01:31:19]  And there's Kimball, a virgin, right?

=== February 17th: Epstein's Entourage (15:54) ===

[01:31:22]  And a woman.
[01:31:24]  And a woman.
[01:31:26]  So on October 22nd, Epstein is forwarded in an email that was written by Kimball Musk, but not sent to him by Kimball Musk.
[01:31:35]  The person who forwarded Jeffrey Epstein's email or this email, their address is redacted, but I think we can guess who it is.
[01:31:43]  So the email, which was written by Kimball, this one is written by Kimball, says.
[01:31:49]  The universe is conspiring for us to spend more time together.
[01:31:53]  Birthday party is on November 17th in London.
[01:31:56]  I was not going to go, but now getting flack from my family that I'm a lame O.
[01:32:01]  So I think that's somebody else's birthday party, not his.
[01:32:05]  And I now have someone I'd like to take.
[01:32:08]  Winky Smiley Face.
[01:32:10]  Want to go to London?
[01:32:11]  Party is on the 17th.
[01:32:13]  We could leave on the Friday, return in time for us to get back with family for Thanksgiving.
[01:32:18]  Or we could stay through Thanksgiving in London.
[01:32:21]  Or we could go somewhere fun after London.
[01:32:24]  I'm a free man the entire week.
[01:32:26]  XOXO.
[01:32:29]  So the person who forwarded this email adds their own little message to Jeffrey Epstein.
[01:32:35]  It says, all who thought to introduce us are all caps genius, Winkyface.
[01:32:42]  The LA trip finishes on the 29th.
[01:32:45]  Should I come bother you?
[01:32:47]  And then parentheses, I mean, help out, ellipses.
[01:32:52]  Epstein responds, redacted deserves the credit, which I don't know what that means because their redactions here are so all over the place that it could be anybody.
[01:33:05]  But then he follows up with another email that says, stay through Thanksgiving, go somewhere romantic, Morocco, et cetera.
[01:33:12]  If you have no plans for the 29th to the 17th, fly through Mia to the island, which I actually believe is Miami Airport.
[01:33:20]  Yeah.
[01:33:23]  So this appears, we've been talking about this for years now, but this appears to be the woman that Kimball Musk was rumored to be seen from Epstein's entourage.
[01:33:36]  And there is precisely one article on this, a non-bylined article.
[01:33:41]  It's just from Business Insider in 2022.
[01:33:45]  Would you read the, there's not many details on it, but this is sort of the most juicy paragraph.
[01:33:50]  It's unclear how Epstein and Kimball Musk met initially, but they saw each other occasionally because Kimball was dating a woman in Epstein's entourage at the time, the people said.
[01:34:00]  The woman had previously dated Epstein and lived in an apartment building that Epstein's brother owned, which Epstein had used to house people close to him, including models from Eastern Europe.
[01:34:10]  So that's the 66th Street complex.
[01:34:15]  It's a relatively short article, a business insider one.
[01:34:18]  It's fascinated me ever since.
[01:34:20]  Tried to figure out what was going on with it ever since.
[01:34:23]  Again, it's not bylined.
[01:34:25]  There's no named sources for this stuff.
[01:34:27]  It really has the appearances of there is a story here, but they were kind of like the person who told it to them was like very reticent to give details to agree, certainly to go on the record.
[01:34:39]  And so there's just like the shape of it.
[01:34:44]  There has been long rumors over who this person might be because there's only so many people that lived at the E66 Street apartments that would fit the bill.
[01:34:55]  We do, however, basically have confirmation now.
[01:35:02]  This woman is named Jennifer Kalin.
[01:35:05]  And of course, there's multiple emails where that is unredacted, either in the longer form or the shorter form.
[01:35:13]  She first appears on the flight logs in 2004 on a flight from JFK to the island.
[01:35:18]  I believe she was 19 at the time.
[01:35:20]  Obviously, this is happening eight years later.
[01:35:24]  She's in Epstein's entourage until it appears to be maybe 2019.
[01:35:30]  She is at one point, in fact, about a year after she dates Kimball Musk.
[01:35:38]  She is married in a sham marriage to Jeffrey Epstein's sort of final.
[01:35:45]  I don't know how you would describe her, but his main final girlfriend, Karina Shuliak.
[01:35:50]  Yeah, well, his will and testament says that they were engaged.
[01:35:54]  Yes.
[01:35:55]  Oh, they hate a ring of promising engagements.
[01:35:57]  It's phrased in a strange way.
[01:36:01]  But Karina is from Eastern Europe and married Jennifer in a sort of citizenship marriage.
[01:36:12]  There's some articles about that identify.
[01:36:15]  They don't identify her name, but they like clearly show who she is.
[01:36:19]  There's other like assistants slash girlfriends, whatever of Epstein's that have also done that in the past.
[01:36:26]  I think we've talked about it.
[01:36:27]  Yes, yeah, yeah.
[01:36:28]  For visas and green cards.
[01:36:31]  And she's definitely, I mean, there's even in the, you know, this some kind of relationship with Epstein that's both after, perhaps during, and then before she's together with Kimball.
[01:36:43]  And further on that, there's actually a schedule that is sent between Jeffrey Epstein's staff to each other, which is Jen's schedule for the rest of the year.
[01:36:52]  And it matches up on Monday, October 29th, 12 p.m., land in Denver to New York City.
[01:36:59]  29th to the 7th, free.
[01:37:02]  November 7th to the 9th, Kimball in New York City.
[01:37:05]  November 9th to 13th, free.
[01:37:07]  The 13th to 15th, Kimball in New York City.
[01:37:10]  Then Kimball and Jen in London, 16th, 19th, Kimball and Jen in London to Morocco, Smiley Face, and then break free.
[01:37:18]  And then December 26th, January 2nd, Kimball and Jen to St. Barth's, assuming we're not sick of each other by the end of November.
[01:37:30]  So who else was in St. Barth's in December of January of 2012?
[01:37:35]  That would be one Elon Musk.
[01:37:38]  So there are some boring exchanges where he tells Epstein he will be in St. Barthes over the holidays.
[01:37:45]  And obviously, that is a different island than the one that Epstein has his private island or different country, I guess, than the one that Epstein has his private island on.
[01:37:55]  But again, these people all have private planes and shit.
[01:37:57]  So it's like, it's probably like a 20-minute flight.
[01:38:00]  At one point, he asked Jeffrey, this is Elon now.
[01:38:04]  What day/slash night will be the wildest party on your island?
[01:38:08]  Yeah, I think these are the emails that everyone saw all over social media because they're so Elon.
[01:38:16]  I'm going to be Elon in this exchange.
[01:38:19]  And this is sort of the main exchange here that is really bad for Elon, I think.
[01:38:25]  And this exchange, by the way, is happening on Christmas Eve and Christmas Day of 2012.
[01:38:30]  You're welcome to stay or just come for the day.
[01:38:32]  Plenty of room.
[01:38:33]  I will send Heli to get you.
[01:38:35]  Elon responds: Do you have any parties planned?
[01:38:38]  I've been working at the edge of sanity this year.
[01:38:40]  So once my kids head home after Christmas, I really want to hit the party scene in St. Bart's or elsewhere and let loose.
[01:38:48]  The invitation is much appreciated, but a peaceful island experience is the opposite of what I'm looking for.
[01:38:55]  And Epstein writes, understood.
[01:38:57]  I'll see you in St. Bart's.
[01:38:58]  The ratio on my island might make Tallulah uncomfortable.
[01:39:04]  And Elon says, ratio is not a problem for Tallulah.
[01:39:10]  Poor Tallulah.
[01:39:12]  What is your interpretation of that?
[01:39:14]  He's just talking about the amount of women that'll be on the island.
[01:39:16]  No, I know what the ratio is.
[01:39:18]  Oh, but do you think that Elon?
[01:39:23]  Do you think he's suggesting that she likes girls?
[01:39:26]  Is that what you mean?
[01:39:27]  I can't tell if he's suggesting that she likes girls or he just doesn't know.
[01:39:31]  Like, why would that be a problem?
[01:39:33]  No, I don't think he's like being, I think he knows what Jeffrey's talking about.
[01:39:38]  I think so, too.
[01:39:38]  I don't think he's being like autistic or whatever.
[01:39:43]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:39:44]  I think he literally is like either suggesting that she likes girls or suggesting that she doesn't care if he hangs out with girls.
[01:39:52]  It's either of those.
[01:39:53]  I mean, he is certainly, I've heard stories that he is.
[01:39:58]  Yeah.
[01:40:01]  It doesn't appear that they do link up.
[01:40:03]  And this is, this is, I think, an important sort of exchange because the way that Elon has made it seem is that this guy, Epstein, is like, come to my island, come to my island, come to my island.
[01:40:12]  Elon's like, I will never come to your island.
[01:40:15]  I will never go to your island where there's so many girls.
[01:40:17]  That was not something that I will do.
[01:40:19]  When it's like clear that he's asking Epstein to go to the island multiple times.
[01:40:23]  And in fact, he's saying, oh, it actually doesn't sound crazy enough for me.
[01:40:27]  He is the one guy in these emails who's saying your island and all the girls there sounds, it's not wild enough for me.
[01:40:34]  Everybody else is like, that sounds great.
[01:40:36]  I'll be right over.
[01:40:36]  Elon says, no, I need something more intense.
[01:40:39]  Yeah, he needs something crazier than Jeffrey Epstein's pervert sex island.
[01:40:44]  But Epstein, definitely come hang out with me at the crazier party, but yours is too peaceful for me.
[01:40:54]  So mind you, this is, of course, when I guess Kimball Musk and the woman from Epstein's Entourage are hanging out, I guess, with Elon and Tallulah during this period.
[01:41:07]  They're not mentioning these emails, but it would link up with their schedule unless they're all just at separate hotels in St. Bart's.
[01:41:15]  We next hear from Kimball via Boris.
[01:41:17]  And this email sent on February 9th from Boris forwarding it to Epstein.
[01:41:22]  And it's a fairly short email.
[01:41:23]  It's an email that Kimball sent to Boris.
[01:41:26]  And would you read it out?
[01:41:31]  Kimball writes, I'm now divorced.
[01:41:34]  Exclamation point.
[01:41:35]  Free to live my life.
[01:41:36]  Talking to Renacted again.
[01:41:39]  How are you doing?
[01:41:43]  You know, he did get divorced.
[01:41:45]  He was married to a woman named coincidentally Jennifer, no relation.
[01:41:51]  And I watched this morning an almost hour-long interview that he did on the Tushi Bidet podcast called Edge of My Seat, where it had 100 views.
[01:42:07]  It was posted eight months ago.
[01:42:09]  And it is a difficult watch.
[01:42:13]  He has, I believe, gold nail polish on.
[01:42:18]  And he talks about how he had this wild time with his wife.
[01:42:22]  It was awesome.
[01:42:22]  They both got into Burning Man together.
[01:42:24]  He talks about how much he loves Burning Man.
[01:42:26]  And the CEO of Tushy Bidet Company is like, yeah, I love Burning Man too.
[01:42:29]  It's so awesome to be a burner here with you in Austin, Texas, where we both live and we love doing Burning Man stuff.
[01:42:35]  And in fact, Kimball, I believe he says that his wife, ex-wife, even made the Burning Man man in either 2012 or 2013.
[01:42:45]  I can't remember.
[01:42:46]  But it's such a weird interview because their knees are touching.
[01:42:48]  They're like sitting so close to each other.
[01:42:50]  It doesn't appear to be in a sexual way, but like, just it's such a strange watch.
[01:42:54]  And Kimball's on the board of Burning Man.
[01:42:58]  Yes, he is.
[01:42:58]  And he is also facing calls to step down.
[01:43:03]  No, no, we're not bringing cancel culture to the playa.
[01:43:06]  That's not what we do here.
[01:43:07]  That's not what we do here.
[01:43:08]  We're about forgiveness.
[01:43:09]  What do you think we burn the man for?
[01:43:11]  Right.
[01:43:11]  Well, maybe there's a new man who could burn.
[01:43:16]  February was a great month.
[01:43:18]  And so I guess I don't know what's happening there.
[01:43:19]  I mean, he makes that he was very a bit of a sexual libertine.
[01:43:24]  So I don't think that him being officially married to his wife really mattered, obviously, for him seeing another woman with the exact same name that was part of Jeffrey Epstein's entourage.
[01:43:33]  But yeah, I guess he's looking for girls.
[01:43:36]  And he mentions to the Tushi Bidet woman that he was often dating several girls at the same time.
[01:43:41]  I don't know if, you know, far be it from me to know what's in his head.
[01:43:48]  February was also a good month for Elon and Jeffrey Epstein.
[01:43:53]  So Elon Musk has frequently denied, like on multiple occasions, that Jeffrey Epstein ever visited or had a visit, private or otherwise, SpaceX.
[01:44:03]  He's directly said in 2020 that, to the best of our knowledge, he never toured SpaceX.
[01:44:10]  Don't know where that comes from.
[01:44:12]  And shortly after he tweeted that, SpaceX itself finally responded to an article from Business Insider that came out months prior about this rumored visit in 2012, 2013.
[01:44:23]  Mr. Epstein did not tour the SpaceX facilities in 2012 or at any other time.
[01:44:28]  So they fucked up because this visit was in 2013.
[01:44:31]  So if they just said Mr. Epstein did not tour the SpaceX facilities in 2012, you know, obviously it sounds like they're hiding something, but it's not technically a lie.
[01:44:41]  What they did say and what Elon Musk said is 100% a full-blown lie.
[01:44:48]  There's another exchange that happens in February, or there is an exchange that happens in February between Jeffrey Epstein and Elon Musk.
[01:44:56]  This happens on February 17th, 2013.
[01:44:59]  Liz will be playing the role of Jeffrey Epstein as usual.
[01:45:02]  Did your brother tell you about Jen's pregnant joke?
[01:45:04]  Will you be at Ted?
[01:45:06]  Elon says, if you would like to talk, it would be best to do so at the SpaceX Rocket Factory, which is quite close to Long Beach.
[01:45:17]  Epstein says, great, we'll do.
[01:45:20]  So Long Beach is where Ted moved to.
[01:45:24]  And there's so much Ted shit in these shit.
[01:45:28]  Well, this is like high Ted time.
[01:45:30]  This is 2013 was like Ted was changing the motherfucking world.
[01:45:34]  Totally.
[01:45:35]  That's when you gave your talk on Lizology.
[01:45:40]  But it was more, it was less a talk and more of a rap.
[01:45:43]  Oh, what I liked about you is you sat completely in the Lotus position on the floor with just your little earbud in there and you did the breathing with everybody.
[01:45:51]  And then you just fully just let it rip.
[01:45:53]  I know it's so crazy that Australian ripped off my moves in the Olympics for this.
[01:45:59]  Oh, of course.
[01:45:59]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:46:02]  So Jeffrey Epstein's actually next request isn't, hey, Elon, could you cancel that tour?
[01:46:08]  Turns out I'm a pedophile or like, you know, you clearly don't like me and don't want to hang out with me.
[01:46:14]  Why don't we just cancel this tour?
[01:46:15]  No, no.
[01:46:16]  He says, actually, can I bring some guests?
[01:46:19]  Enthusiastic assent from the Musk side.
[01:46:22]  There's an email from Epstein's assistant sending the passports of three girls that Epstein is bringing to Elon Musk's assistant, Mary Beth, who Elon would later fire because he says he could do her job better than she can.
[01:46:36]  I'm not kidding.
[01:46:38]  And even, as if to prove Elon even more of a liar, there is a fucking Google calendar alert for Jeffrey Epstein's visit.
[01:46:49]  Alert, 1 p.m. LA time.
[01:46:52]  Lunch with Elon Musk at SpaceX, One Rocket Road in Hawthorne, California.
[01:47:01]  I have a question.
[01:47:02]  What?
[01:47:02]  Are they asking for passports because of security clearance?
[01:47:07]  Probably some security stuff.
[01:47:08]  Yeah.
[01:47:08]  So then we would have a record if Epstein, because Epstein would have been cleared too.
[01:47:15]  Oh, yeah.

=== Activision's Gaming Drama: April's Tweets (14:48) ===

[01:47:16]  I mean, I would assume so.
[01:47:20]  If you work at SpaceX and you have access to this information, the visit seems to have been on February 27th, 2013 at 1 p.m.
[01:47:33]  It was clearly lunch.
[01:47:34]  Mary Beth, the fired assistant, even though you have, I'm sure, an NDA that you are terrified to violate, I think it's time to maybe.
[01:47:42]  The NDAs are like HIPAA after exactly.
[01:47:45]  It's fine.
[01:47:46]  If you just violate the NDA, but nobody catches you, did you violate it?
[01:47:50]  Just put the NDA in the tranche and the DOJ morons won't redact anything and you're good.
[01:47:57]  Yeah.
[01:47:58]  Just, why don't you do this?
[01:47:59]  Why don't you consult with a lawyer about if you can break the NDA and give that lawyer specific information and then have that lawyer's emails get hacked?
[01:48:10]  How about that?
[01:48:11]  There's a lot of ways to break NDAs that people don't even want to consider, but I think maybe she should because it appears that Elon Musk is fully lying here.
[01:48:21]  I mean, he is lying here.
[01:48:22]  I don't know why I'm saying to appears.
[01:48:23]  Elon Musk is a fucking frequent liar.
[01:48:26]  He lies all the time.
[01:48:27]  And it's not like he's too stupid.
[01:48:29]  It's not like he's too, he is stupid, but he's not too stupid to lie.
[01:48:32]  It's like, it's no, he is just, he thinks you're stupid and he wants something.
[01:48:37]  So he's lying.
[01:48:38]  This is, this is, it is, it is not the behavior of what I would generally think of as like a good person.
[01:48:43]  Well, like, not that you have to be a good person, I guess.
[01:48:47]  It's, it's, well, I don't know what I meant by that, but you know what I'm saying?
[01:48:49]  I don't expect Elon Musk to be a good person.
[01:48:52]  It's just, it's the stupidity of the lies that is so frustrating to me.
[01:48:56]  At least try to fool me in some way.
[01:48:59]  So in an email to Activision's Bobby Kotik the night prior to the visit.
[01:49:04]  I know.
[01:49:05]  But by the way, Activision, wait, so that's the gaming.
[01:49:09]  Isn't he like a head of gaming?
[01:49:11]  Head of gaming at Activision.
[01:49:12]  I think Activision is a gaming company.
[01:49:14]  But it's like Call of Duty, right?
[01:49:16]  I don't actually know what games Activision is.
[01:49:19]  I got my man over here?
[01:49:22]  Well, Activision's a publisher, I think, right?
[01:49:25]  Like, not like a developer.
[01:49:27]  I don't know what the difference is.
[01:49:28]  I guess.
[01:49:28]  But yeah, I think they have Call of Duty.
[01:49:30]  Damn, that's a big one.
[01:49:32]  Oh, and what do they got?
[01:49:35]  Epstein was a gamer, by the way.
[01:49:38]  I don't know what to make all that yet.
[01:49:39]  I got to look into that.
[01:49:40]  We're going to talk about it next episode.
[01:49:43]  People texting me about the 4chan stuff.
[01:49:45]  Oh, yeah.
[01:49:46]  Oh, yeah.
[01:49:47]  Call of Duty series.
[01:49:50]  Wow.
[01:49:50]  Yeah.
[01:49:51]  Crash Bandicoot, too.
[01:49:52]  I remember that.
[01:49:52]  Oh, yeah.
[01:49:54]  And Guitar Hero.
[01:49:56]  You were addicted to that.
[01:49:56]  Liz, you still play guitar here quite often.
[01:50:01]  But in an email to Activision's Bobby Kotik the night prior to this visit, Epstein says he's actually going to head to Bel Air The next afternoon, where Elon Musk had actually just purchased a house a few months before.
[01:50:16]  And so I don't know.
[01:50:16]  He doesn't say he's going to Elon's house, but it would sort of follow.
[01:50:20]  Bobby's like, oh, dude, come to my house, man.
[01:50:23]  I live in Beverly Hills.
[01:50:24]  It's so close to Bel Air.
[01:50:25]  But Epstein's like, nah, I'm going to a Bill Gates suite to, quote, hold court in the evening.
[01:50:32]  As if that was not proof enough that Elon is just fully lying here.
[01:50:38]  Jeffrey Epstein on Tuesday, February 26, 2013, at 8:52 a.m., sends Elon Musk this email.
[01:50:47]  Thanks for the tour.
[01:50:50]  You would have had fun at Xmas.
[01:50:52]  Elon Musk replies, I see.
[01:50:56]  And then a smiley face.
[01:50:58]  Now, let's put our thinking caps on here.
[01:51:01]  Obviously, during Xmas, the two of these guys doing an amazing link up on the islands was stymied by scheduling and by Elon's insatiable need to find the craziest party on St. Bart's.
[01:51:15]  One does wonder if the smiley face in the IC is perhaps a reference to the trio of no doubt quite comely women that Jeffrey Epstein came to SpaceX with.
[01:51:48]  I'm going to go back to Kimball because I miss talking about him.
[01:51:51]  Me too.
[01:51:52]  And his relationship is sort of displayed within the Epstein files here.
[01:51:56]  He's sort of like the frontier, and the Andrew of the Frontier.
[01:52:03]  He really is.
[01:52:04]  He is.
[01:52:04]  He truly, truly, truly is.
[01:52:07]  And this, I think, is this is on April 23rd.
[01:52:11]  Jennifer forwards an email from Kimball Musk to her.
[01:52:14]  Also, this is, I will say, a lot of Kimball's messages to Jennifer are pretty much immediately sent on to Jeffrey Epstein.
[01:52:23]  I don't know how I, I mean, this is like, I don't know if that's, if that's okay.
[01:52:29]  Well, it's weird.
[01:52:31]  I mean, the only way it makes sense is because he has like linked up and has some sort of purview over Jennifer's activities.
[01:52:41]  And he's like lighting them up with Kimball.
[01:52:43]  That's the only way that that makes sense.
[01:52:44]  Otherwise, or, or Boris and Jeffrey are fucking caddy bitches and are talking a ton of shit about Kimball.
[01:52:55]  They do do that.
[01:52:56]  Well, no, I think that they do like Kimball.
[01:53:00]  I don't know because they do talk about a little shit about him later, but it is, I would say, the former sounds really kind of a lot like what's going on here is that he's like being like, you need to get close to Kimball.
[01:53:11]  And it's working until April.
[01:53:15]  This is an email from Kimball.
[01:53:18]  Hey, sorry I was in such a bummed out mood last night.
[01:53:22]  The load of everything around me has been so intense and seems to just get bigger.
[01:53:27]  Pause.
[01:53:28]  Yesterday was super sad losing Manhattan.
[01:53:33]  What?
[01:53:35]  Manhattan, of course, is annihilated by a nuclear bomb in April of 2013.
[01:53:40]  It's still soon redacted for.
[01:53:46]  And that causes me stress.
[01:53:49]  I have the awful insanity of redacted, how that is going to affect redacted terrifies me every minute.
[01:53:56]  And now I have my sister living with me.
[01:53:59]  Okay.
[01:53:59]  Well, okay.
[01:54:01]  Don't need to be mean.
[01:54:03]  I don't think I'm being very fair to you as well, and it's weighing me down.
[01:54:07]  I want to have time for you, but at the end of each day, I just want to pass out and then I don't sleep.
[01:54:13]  It's a wonderful routine.
[01:54:15]  Winky, smiley face.
[01:54:16]  It should be a winky sad face.
[01:54:19]  We know how much we like each other, but I am just not able to do a real relationship right now.
[01:54:26]  Wow.
[01:54:27]  Would you be up for going back a step to just dating?
[01:54:34]  First of all, you should say taking a step back, but yeah.
[01:54:38]  We would see each other on weekends when we can and focus it on fun stuff.
[01:54:44]  Bringing you into my drama can't be fun for you, and it isn't healthy for me either.
[01:54:49]  I could tell you were sad that you couldn't join me in Boulder, but honestly, I don't think I could handle staying relaxed with you in town.
[01:54:56]  Thoughts?
[01:54:58]  XOXO.
[01:54:59]  I hope you still come to LA.
[01:55:01]  I will dedicate Sunday to you so that we have some quality time together.
[01:55:05]  Smiley face.
[01:55:08]  Oh, my man.
[01:55:12]  He's all mixed up in the head.
[01:55:14]  I mean, listen, this is, and this is, I feel obviously quite outside the Jeffrey Epstein stuff.
[01:55:20]  And it's not a hard and fast role because it's not all true 100% of the time, but often, listen, Kimball had just gone through a divorce.
[01:55:28]  A lot of times people get into a relationship soon after a long-term one ends and in a few months discover that actually maybe that's not, they don't want to do that right again.
[01:55:39]  And I'm not saying that was the case with Kimball Musk, but that is, you know, a common occurrence.
[01:55:46]  But there is some drama sort of hinted at here with redacted names.
[01:55:49]  I assume one of his is his ex-wife and then maybe a kid in there.
[01:55:53]  I didn't realize that Kimball Musk also had a transgender child, according to his Wikipedia, which I'm surprised that maybe he's just so he can copy big brother or little brother.
[01:56:04]  I don't know which one he assumes is big brother.
[01:56:08]  But this is some family stuff that's happening here, it seems like a little bit with him.
[01:56:14]  And there's a hint of maybe some drama that did occur that he is afraid of kicking back up again.
[01:56:20]  So Jennifer adds on her own like email separate to that, but like she's forwarding this email from Kimball.
[01:56:28]  She adds thoughts, and she sends this at Jeffrey Epstein.
[01:56:32]  I just don't think I'd ever be a priority because he hasn't shown any ability to get over history or find a way to emotionally cope with the future.
[01:56:40]  My grandfather's funeral, whole family around today, and he sends me this.
[01:56:45]  And then Epstein responds, Good news.
[01:56:48]  I have you back.
[01:56:49]  Come to ranch tonight.
[01:56:51]  In an email a few days later to Steve Hansen, who owns the, I believe it's called, is it the Vanderbilt Food Hall?
[01:56:57]  But he owns a straight up Liz classic, the city beautiful or the city, whatever, the city authentic food hall in Manhattan with, you know, lobster rolls and coffee and all of these sort of ghost kitchen ass restaurants that are actually owned and operated by this, the company that owns the food hall.
[01:57:16]  This guy, Steve Hansen, who according to other emails, I need to look into this more.
[01:57:20]  I guess Jennifer was working for at this time.
[01:57:22]  Like that was her day job, but also working with Epstein a little bit still.
[01:57:28]  He says to Steve, Epstein does.
[01:57:30]  What she didn't tell you is that one, she is not with him.
[01:57:35]  She is home in Minnesota.
[01:57:36]  Two, she had a run-in with the ex-wife face-to-face, very unpleasant for Kimball.
[01:57:43]  Jen got feisty and then he says, planning on Disney World for May 12th.
[01:57:47]  So I guess they were making plans together to go to Disney World.
[01:57:51]  But it appears that some Kimball Musk, the brother of Elon Musk, who was dating a woman, seemingly at Epstein's behest or under Epstein's control somehow Had that relationship blow up due to a conversation with a Jeffrey or a confrontation rather between a Jeffrey Epstein girlfriend and his ex-wife who both have the same name.
[01:58:19]  I want to add that like that, you know, back during the Ghillan trial, the Daily Mail got, I think it was the Daily Mail, got a video of Jennifer Kalin outside of the Ghillain Maxwell trial.
[01:58:31]  Like she had been inside.
[01:58:33]  Yeah.
[01:58:34]  Observing, I assume.
[01:58:36]  But she was outside.
[01:58:37]  It looked like she was talking to an attorney.
[01:58:40]  Yeah, I think she's represented by Brad Edwards.
[01:58:43]  Okay.
[01:58:46]  I don't know if that's the attorney she's talking to, but yeah, like there's not a woman she was talking to.
[01:58:52]  She's, I believe, kind of never come out and sort of told her story.
[01:58:56]  Yeah.
[01:58:57]  But I, you know, and I don't know what to make of it, but this, you know, she was, she was sort of in the Epstein orbit for well over a decade.
[01:59:08]  And I don't know.
[01:59:11]  Apparently she got the divorce from Karina right, you know, shortly before Epstein died or maybe after he died, but in 2019.
[01:59:19]  No, it was shortly before.
[01:59:20]  It was like three months before.
[01:59:23]  Oh, weird.
[01:59:24]  Yeah.
[01:59:25]  And or a month, it was like, I actually, I think it was just before the arrest.
[01:59:35]  Interesting.
[01:59:36]  Yeah.
[01:59:36]  Yeah.
[01:59:38]  And then they had the planned Karina and Jeffrey had the planned engagement marriage commence, you know, whatever they were doing.
[01:59:50]  With diamonds.
[01:59:54]  I think what makes this sort of story notable, and obviously we included a lot of details here, but I think it's actually is important.
[02:00:01]  And some of it's just salacious, maybe, but it is important to like, you know, Elon, first of all, has wields immense power within the federal government and the economy.
[02:00:09]  Yes.
[02:00:10]  But like his relationship and his family's relationship with Jeffrey Epstein was significantly closer than a lot of other people who have been associated with Jeffrey Epstein.
[02:00:23]  You know, there aren't many other figures where you can point directly to them and then to somebody in Jeffrey Epstein's sort of, I don't know what, under his control and say these two people were romantically linked for this and this period of time.
[02:00:42]  You know?
[02:00:43]  Yeah.
[02:00:44]  And Elon has he does this sort of populist bullshit where he pretends he lies all the time.
[02:00:53]  And he's sort of tried to like make himself seen as like, you know, I'm one of the people that's actually been pushing for the Epstein files to come out.
[02:01:01]  Does anyone actually believe that?
[02:01:03]  I can't tell because I think they're just like so married to their own, to like whatever side they want to be on.
[02:01:11]  Yeah.
[02:01:12]  That they're just like, okay.
[02:01:15]  Yeah.
[02:01:15]  All right.
[02:01:16]  It is, it is just like, I mean, it's, it's, it's one of those things where like he'll never have to, he'll probably never address this.
[02:01:24]  He'll just make 500 tweets to Doge Designer, to Dougie Designer, being like, yeah, I wanted the Epstein files released.
[02:01:31]  In fact, there he has made so many tweets about the Epstein files, all like, it was Reed Hoffman.
[02:01:36]  It's Reed Hoffman was doing all this.
[02:01:38]  But like two things that he has directly lied about and one thing that he just have never mentioned is A, he is begging to party with Jeffrey Epstein on two separate occasions.
[02:01:48]  In fact, later in 2013, December of 2013, after Kimball and this girl have been broken up for months and months and months, Elon Musk initiates another email exchange with Jeffrey Epstein and says, I'll be in St. Barthes over the holidays.
[02:02:03]  When should I come to the island?

=== Jeffrey Epstein And The Gong (07:27) ===

[02:02:05]  And Epstein, it turns out, is actually not going to be around during that period.
[02:02:08]  So it doesn't happen.
[02:02:09]  So, this is Elon asking again, him initiating once again, when can I go to the island?
[02:02:16]  He says that Jeffrey Epstein, oh, kept begging me to come to the island.
[02:02:19]  I kept refusing.
[02:02:20]  That is just absolutely, unambiguously not what occurred here.
[02:02:25]  The conversations do become sparser over the years.
[02:02:28]  Uh, Epstein appears to at least try to link Elon with Sultan in 2015.
[02:02:32]  I think there's more mentions in 2017.
[02:02:35]  Um, but no, I think, as far as we know now, direct communication.
[02:02:40]  Maybe they moved to Signal, you know, um, maybe they're on the phone here.
[02:02:45]  But it is just the way that Elon approaches this, he is just lying.
[02:02:49]  He's lying to you because he doesn't want to get in trouble.
[02:02:53]  I don't know, but he's got himself in more trouble.
[02:02:55]  You know, it's it's, I mean, I don't know if trouble even makes sense in this context.
[02:02:59]  Is anyone in trouble?
[02:03:00]  You know, I don't know.
[02:03:02]  Um, I guess Lord Mandelson, yeah, Peter Mandelson is.
[02:03:07]  I guess you're in trouble if you have a boss, but if you are the boss, you're not in trouble.
[02:03:11]  I mean, this is a uh sample tweet of like he's had a million of these.
[02:03:17]  Can you just read this tweet out that he did?
[02:03:19]  This is from the other day.
[02:03:20]  No one pushed harder than me to have the Epstein files released, and I'm glad this finally happened.
[02:03:24]  I had very little correspondence with Epstein and declined repeated invitations to go to his island or fly on his quote Lolita Express, but was well aware that some email correspondence with him could be misinterpreted and used by detractors to smear my name.
[02:03:38]  I don't care about that, but what I do care about is that we at least attempt to prosecute those who committed serious crimes with Epstein, especially regarding heinous exploitation of underage girls.
[02:03:50]  I mean, there's a dinner that he goes to, and I can't remember what year it is.
[02:03:54]  It's 2013, 2014.
[02:03:55]  It might be 2015, even, which is Peter Thiel, Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, Reed Hoffman, Joy Ito.
[02:04:03]  It's like, okay, all of these guys that you say were involved, you know, or imply were involved in these heinous crimes, they're your friends.
[02:04:11]  They were your friends.
[02:04:12]  And well, some of these guys got red-billed too.
[02:04:14]  In fact, most of those guys got red-billed too.
[02:04:16]  But like, who are you talking about?
[02:04:18]  I think they're just talking about Reed Hoffman.
[02:04:20]  And like, it's just, it's so transparent.
[02:04:23]  These guys are just bullshitting.
[02:04:25]  And they were all friends with Jeffrey Epstein.
[02:04:26]  I mean, even that list of people I just named, there's 10 people at that dinner.
[02:04:29]  All of these are sort of Titans of industry.
[02:04:31]  And then Jeffrey Epstein is there.
[02:04:34]  Like, his name really does stand out as the odd man out on this.
[02:04:38]  You know, it's, it's, it, I don't know.
[02:04:43]  It is, it's just, and nothing will happen.
[02:04:46]  He'll just refuse to respond to anything and it'll just kind of keep going.
[02:04:50]  But I just, I do hope that if you are somebody who somehow now is listening to this episode, made it to the end of the episode, and there is some warmth in your heart for this guy.
[02:04:59]  You think that he's some, he's, the guy's a fucking liar.
[02:05:02]  The guy is a fucking liar.
[02:05:03]  And he lies to you because he hates you and does not respect you.
[02:05:06]  Not that we expect Elon Musk to respect this, but still, it is just, it bothers me.
[02:05:12]  But it just goes to show there's a lot in these fucking files, Liz.
[02:05:16]  Can I say, real quick, we have some breaking news.
[02:05:18]  I just received an email.
[02:05:19]  Oh, no.
[02:05:20]  Says Nell.
[02:05:21]  This is from Nellie Bowles.
[02:05:22]  No, to you?
[02:05:24]  No, it's from the free.
[02:05:26]  Oh, because you guys mostly text.
[02:05:27]  Yeah.
[02:05:28]  So Nellie Bowles, the journalist in the Epstein.
[02:05:31]  I had a chance to profile one of the darkest, most interesting characters of our moment.
[02:05:35]  Why didn't I grab it?
[02:05:37]  I'm not reading the whole thing.
[02:05:38]  I will say this because also we're recording, but I just want to say I just grabbed one thing that I want to mention.
[02:05:43]  But it does start this.
[02:05:45]  This week I was busted for the crime of reporting.
[02:05:49]  First of all, lady, don't say that you're busted.
[02:05:52]  You don't need to say that about yourself.
[02:05:54]  Let's have some let all the girls you went to middle school with say that to me about you.
[02:05:59]  You said a journalism professor is even on the case.
[02:06:02]  And it's true.
[02:06:02]  I met Jeffrey Epstein once for coffee.
[02:06:04]  I do want to say that like the idea of her strategizing with Barry in bed, like what should I write about Epstein?
[02:06:16]  Anyway, some long thing that I don't give a fuck about, but she does talk about meeting Epstein and at the mansion, it seems.
[02:06:32]  She says, so I agreed to meet the man for coffee.
[02:06:35]  I'll never forget ringing the doorbell of that mansion.
[02:06:37]  Doors the size of a truck swung open.
[02:06:40]  And an elegant woman in her 20s welcomed me in.
[02:06:43]  By the way, incredible writer.
[02:06:45]  That's what you got to say about the Epstein, by the way, that they're just, I'll never forget the mansion.
[02:06:51]  Doors the size of the truck of a truck.
[02:06:54]  Poetic.
[02:06:55]  We're fucking talking about, you know, East 71st Street.
[02:06:58]  Yeah.
[02:06:59]  Anyway, she goes on, whatever.
[02:07:01]  There's like some woman.
[02:07:03]  They finally get coffee.
[02:07:05]  Then she says, she's talking about Epstein at the desk, whatever.
[02:07:10]  He had a gong on the table to call for more coffee.
[02:07:17]  This to me is breaking news.
[02:07:20]  It changes everything.
[02:07:21]  Jeffrey Epstein had a gong.
[02:07:25]  I assume this is a mini-gong.
[02:07:27]  And it certainly did not have a smiley face on it.
[02:07:30]  If I had a house, a manse the size of Jeffrey Epstein's, I mean, I don't have a gong at home anyways, which is, I realize now is egregious.
[02:07:39]  But if I had a house the size of Jeffrey Epstein, there would be a full-size gong.
[02:07:44]  And I would, in fact, have a swaddled Japanese man who would bang it every time that, yes, I needed more coffee.
[02:07:52]  Do you think it's a tiny gong that he's using?
[02:07:54]  I think he's probably got a desk-bound gong.
[02:07:55]  Like a small bag.
[02:07:56]  I think his gong is probably smaller than mine.
[02:07:58]  No.
[02:07:58]  I'll have to pour over images of his desk.
[02:08:01]  For him to go gong versus Belle is an interesting choice.
[02:08:07]  And I will ask you this before we wrap up.
[02:08:12]  Was Jeffrey Epstein East meets West?
[02:08:15]  Jeffrey Epstein when he was in Palm Beach?
[02:08:18]  Not at all.
[02:08:18]  Jeffrey Epstein was in the island?
[02:08:20]  Not at all.
[02:08:21]  Jeffrey Epstein, when he was in Manhattan, I'm not going to say it's East meets West because that implies a sort of yin-yangian partnership, a 50-50.
[02:08:31]  I'm going to say he was maybe 75% West and 25% East.
[02:08:38]  A little taste of the East.
[02:08:39]  A taste of the East.
[02:08:40]  A touch of the East.
[02:08:42]  But I think also when you have a mansion that large, one's decor, I mean, his is very unique in many ways, but how do you say it?
[02:08:52]  The word that's like Chinese kind of stuff, chinoiserie?
[02:08:55]  Chinoiserie.
[02:08:56]  Chinoiserie.
[02:09:00]  The mansion, the decor of a mansion tends toward chinoiserie.
[02:09:05]  That's the arc of mansion decorating bend towards that.
[02:09:10]  And so it's difficult to get out of there without.
[02:09:12]  And when he tries, it's disastrously backfires.
[02:09:15]  It's really like he's got these cerulean fucking wallpaper or whatever.
[02:09:19]  It's disgusting.
[02:09:22]  There's so much in these files.
[02:09:24]  Like there's so much shit that like we're going to get to a lot of it, but there is is just, we're really.

=== Chinoiserie Wallpaper Disaster (00:51) ===

[02:09:33]  In due time, in due time.
[02:09:34]  We're looking through it.
[02:09:35]  We're looking.
[02:09:35]  We only had a few days on this.
[02:09:38]  Yeah.
[02:09:41]  Yeah, I guess like a day.
[02:09:44]  But there's a lot.
[02:09:47]  Well, fuck, Liz.
[02:09:49]  Until then, I guess I'm Liz.
[02:09:53]  I suppose I'm Brace.
[02:09:54]  And I think that we're joined by producer Young Chomsky.
[02:10:00]  And this has been Turadon.
[02:10:01]  We will see you next time.
[02:10:03]  Bye-bye.
[02:10:22]  Come on.
[02:10:24]  Come on.