True Anon Truth Feed - Episode 407: Wounded in Beita
Aired: 2024-09-23
Duration: 59:23


=== Daniel's Protest Shot (06:04) ===

[00:00:00]  My last thing on this.
[00:00:01]  I mean, when it comes to the Israeli killing of Americans, you know, Americans that are being killed by Israel and their family, they feel that these Americans are the children of the lesser God because Israel is committing the crime.
[00:00:15]  Israel is committing the murder.
[00:00:17]  Is that true?
[00:00:18]  It's not.
[00:00:19]  Look, it's not true.
[00:00:20]  Said, I'm not sure I fully understand your question.
[00:00:24]  They are less American than, let's say, when Israel commits, it is really the identity of the killer rather than the identity of the killed, so to speak.
[00:00:34]  So again, I'm not sure I fully comprehend what you're asking, but let me just be pretty clear about this.
[00:00:40]  In this context, in any context, to this government, to this State Department, an American citizen is an American citizen.
[00:00:51]  and we take the safety and security of American citizens incredibly seriously.
[00:01:20]  Hello, hello, hello, hello, Liz.
[00:01:22]  Hello, Brace.
[00:01:24]  You're Brace.
[00:01:24]  I'm Liz.
[00:01:25]  We're joined, of course, by you, producer Young Chomsky.
[00:01:28]  Hello.
[00:01:29]  And this is Tronan.
[00:01:30]  Hello.
[00:01:30]  Hello.
[00:01:31]  Too many hellos.
[00:01:33]  Not enough.
[00:01:34]  Hello.
[00:01:34]  Hello, hello.
[00:01:37]  We are, this is, this is, I finally got you guys to record kind of late in the day, huh?
[00:01:42]  Yeah.
[00:01:42]  You like it?
[00:01:43]  The pretty?
[00:01:44]  Maybe you like it better?
[00:01:45]  No.
[00:01:46]  Maybe we should record even later than this for now on.
[00:01:48]  I think we should record early in the morning, bright and early.
[00:01:50]  This has been the tension on the show since day one.
[00:01:54]  And I want to say, I've, in my head, been racking up points for never pushing back on it.
[00:01:58]  Although I realize that the two of you likely do not see it that way.
[00:02:03]  I get smarter as the day goes on.
[00:02:06]  How long does it take you to get home?
[00:02:09]  That's neither here nor there.
[00:02:11]  That's neither here nor there.
[00:02:12]  It's there.
[00:02:13]  It's there.
[00:02:14]  It could take me a really long time if I went to the house.
[00:02:18]  And yet it doesn't.
[00:02:19]  It doesn't, but it could.
[00:02:20]  It could.
[00:02:21]  No, it doesn't.
[00:02:21]  But we have a good system, and we are so excited to be here today.
[00:02:25]  We have a system.
[00:02:26]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:02:27]  And we are excited to be here today.
[00:02:29]  We are talking to Daniel Santiago, who on August 9th, I think it was, was shot by the Israeli army at a protest that he was observing in the West Bank.
[00:02:43]  Which is just a fucking crazy sentence.
[00:02:45]  You just said that.
[00:02:46]  There's an American citizen who was shot by the Israeli army at a protest he was observing in the West Bank.
[00:02:52]  Yes.
[00:02:53]  This, of course, came a few weeks before another American citizen was shot and killed by the Israeli army at the same protest in the same town in the West Bank.
[00:03:03]  And so I think without further ado, let's just get right into it.
[00:03:17]  Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the show.
[00:03:20]  We have with us here in the Truanon studios.
[00:03:23]  Daniel Santiago, a school teacher from New Jersey, who was shot about a month and a half ago in the West Bank by the Israeli Defense Forces.
[00:03:35]  I just want to start off here by asking you, why were you in the West Bank?
[00:03:40]  Yeah, so in the West Bank through FASA, an international protective presence organization, yeah, I was there to provide protective presence.
[00:03:53]  What that is, is we use the power of our passport and documenting what happens to pretty much provide a buffer between the Palestinians, the Israeli army, and the settlers.
[00:04:07]  Why would you be needing to use your passport, which is an American passport, as a buffer between Palestinians and settlers?
[00:04:14]  So I think people have a general knowledge that there's settlements in the West Bank.
[00:04:18]  There's these sort of like three areas, A, B, and C, and that there's some tensions between like settlers, which is like a distinct part of Israeli society that's also very well represented in the cabinet, and Palestinians who like live there and have some claim to the, it's like a, I think, a very vague thing in the way that presented the news here.
[00:04:38]  Like there's settlers and then there's Palestinians.
[00:04:40]  But you were there specifically to like basically stand there during a protest and like observe, right?
[00:04:48]  Yeah.
[00:04:48]  So with protective presence, the power of our passports is they do not want to shoot international people because it will create international outrage.
[00:04:59]  And then we just document.
[00:05:00]  Yeah.
[00:05:00]  So with our phones, with cameras, and that usually deters them from doing anything beyond the absurdity that they already do.
[00:05:10]  Yeah.
[00:05:11]  So, yeah.
[00:05:12]  When you say them, you're talking about the Israeli forces.
[00:05:15]  Yeah.
[00:05:15]  So the Israeli occupation forces, Israeli army, settlers.
[00:05:20]  But sometimes it doesn't deter them.
[00:05:22]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:05:23]  I mean, famously, there have been some casualties linked to the, I think the organization even you were with specifically, I think Rachel Corey was a member of it.
[00:05:34]  She was bulldozed in 2000, I think, three.
[00:05:36]  So another guy got shot in 2004 and I think was brain damaged.
[00:05:40]  Then another guy in like 2014.
[00:05:42]  Oh, no, he died in 2004.
[00:05:44]  And then a bunch of other people have been shot and I think another one killed and several others wounded.
[00:05:48]  Yeah.
[00:05:49]  So FASA is actually a fairly new organization, but we also work with ISM.
[00:05:55]  So that's International Solidarity Mission.
[00:05:58]  And that's been going on for decades.
[00:06:00]  So the only difference is FASA is like Palestinian run and led.

=== Running Toward Ambulances (14:27) ===

[00:06:05]  But we have our trainings together on Wednesdays, every other Wednesday, and then we also go to the same protest in Beta every Friday.
[00:06:14]  Can you talk a little bit about these protests and maybe like what the scene is like a little bit?
[00:06:18]  Yeah, so the Beta demonstration.
[00:06:23]  So we're in the land of Beta.
[00:06:26]  They tried to go back to their land that a settlement is built on.
[00:06:30]  I think it's the Avatar settlement.
[00:06:32]  Yeah.
[00:06:33]  And it starts out with a Juma prayer for five, ten minutes.
[00:06:41]  After the prayer, that is when the chanting starts.
[00:06:45]  And almost immediately after, while the chanting starts, there's tear gas shot at us and live rounds.
[00:06:54]  Once the threat was a little higher, in my case, we ran behind a concrete wall.
[00:07:03]  And they were at some rooftop or watchtower to our right in kind of a cutout in the trees.
[00:07:11]  So we saw them, maybe like three to four IOF soldiers.
[00:07:16]  And yeah, tear gas and live rounds.
[00:07:21]  And we hid behind the concrete wall.
[00:07:23]  Still tear gas.
[00:07:24]  That was the first time I ever felt tear gas.
[00:07:27]  And live rounds, you could see the dust coming off the concrete walls.
[00:07:34]  Maybe five minutes later, there was a threat that they were coming down from their tower.
[00:07:39]  So the Palestinians were running, and we ran two.
[00:07:42]  We climbed over a concrete wall and away.
[00:07:48]  I don't even know where we were.
[00:07:49]  We were away.
[00:07:50]  Yeah.
[00:07:51]  And then we regrouped.
[00:07:54]  We saw the road that we went up, Palestinians running down, and then to our right in the distance.
[00:08:02]  And we waited until it was clear.
[00:08:04]  We ran two.
[00:08:06]  We had five minutes to have a little coffee and tea, a cigarette, you know.
[00:08:12]  But then more Palestinians went to our right at the foot of where the Israeli army was, shot tear gas at us, some live rounds, and they were coming down from the tower.
[00:08:26]  And our attention was there.
[00:08:29]  But at a certain point, Palestinians were running from our left and then behind us through the olive grove.
[00:08:35]  And then we ran.
[00:08:38]  So I didn't know if that was a threat that was coming from the left or they were just scared because the Israeli army was coming from that road that we were watching them from at the foot of it.
[00:08:51]  But we ran.
[00:08:52]  I made sure like everyone was in front of me and they were okay.
[00:08:57]  But right when I was about to step down in the olive grove further in, I felt a pain in my leg and a bang.
[00:09:05]  I thought it was a tear gas canister that hit me.
[00:09:08]  Because it felt like someone took like a blunt object and hit my leg.
[00:09:13]  Someone was able to help me run because I was still running after that.
[00:09:17]  They came back and like helped me run.
[00:09:19]  And then in the clearing, that's when the Palestinians lifted me up.
[00:09:23]  And then I realized that it was not a tear gas canister, that there was some blood on my pants.
[00:09:29]  And then, yeah.
[00:09:30]  So then pickup truck, emergency clinic, ambulance.
[00:09:35]  Israeli army blocked the road initially.
[00:09:38]  Somehow we got around.
[00:09:39]  And then two to checkpoints where they demanded to see me.
[00:09:42]  And that delayed my care further.
[00:09:44]  And then finally, to the hospital in Rafidia in Nablus.
[00:09:49]  Wait, sorry, the IDF blocked the truck that was carrying you after you'd been shot.
[00:09:54]  Yeah, it was also an ambulance at that point.
[00:09:57]  So the ambulance, you know, it was an ambulance.
[00:10:01]  They were blocking the ambulance.
[00:10:03]  And then two other checkpoints where they demanded to see who was inside.
[00:10:07]  Even though it was an ambulance and the lights were on, everything.
[00:10:11]  I want to back up a little bit.
[00:10:13]  Yeah.
[00:10:13]  So, because that's fucking insane.
[00:10:16]  Yeah.
[00:10:18]  You got shot by the army of Israel.
[00:10:22]  But, I mean, which is actually not that insane.
[00:10:24]  But like you said, I think, you know, I've been to a couple different countries in my life.
[00:10:30]  And like, part of you is always like, well, I have an American passport.
[00:10:33]  And like, there's this vague thing where like I'm like, well, I guess I don't mean someone will like hesitate before they shoot me if they're really going to shoot me.
[00:10:41]  But then, like, as history has shown us countless times, it doesn't, if really push comes to shop, someone will absolutely shoot you no matter what passport you have.
[00:10:49]  And in the case of groups, such as the one you were with, sometimes I think they'll do that maybe on purpose a little bit.
[00:10:58]  So you guys are at this.
[00:11:00]  I've never been to Palestine, but I've seen a lot of videos of like, especially like settler violence in the West Bank.
[00:11:08]  And they're generally like in these sort of dusty towns.
[00:11:10]  And then there'll be like a fully fortified, like a fort there.
[00:11:15]  And I know in the particular settlement that you guys were protesting, that one had been cleared by the government at one point.
[00:11:24]  Because Generally, for our listeners, people, like the most insane people in Israel, which is no disrespect, saying a lot, the most insane guys in Israel, like crackhead 20-year-olds, will like run out to like a Palestinian town, basically like throw together a shack, and then demand the army come kill anyone who fucks with them.
[00:11:43]  They're mobs, yeah, they're fucking mobs of like psycho frick, like how people used to talk about how people were like would go crazy on PCP.
[00:11:50]  These guys are like that.
[00:11:54]  In this fucking, they're wet as fuck.
[00:11:57]  In this instance, they got cleared in 2021, and then Smotrik, finance minister, a settler himself, big part of the settlement movement, has brought them back, has essentially legalized the settlement.
[00:12:09]  The Israeli state claims the land underneath it, which I'm sure is very legal.
[00:12:14]  And now they're being protected by, like, directly by the IDF.
[00:12:18]  So, when you say they're in a tower, are they like literally in a watchtower?
[00:12:22]  From what I saw, it seemed like it was.
[00:12:26]  But yeah, it's in the town of Beta.
[00:12:30]  And yeah, it seemed like a watchtower to me when I was looking at it from afar.
[00:12:36]  And yeah, it went from like three people to like five people, just tear gas, live rounds.
[00:12:44]  And yeah, they're there to protect the settlers.
[00:12:47]  Yeah.
[00:12:48]  That is their job.
[00:12:49]  So if the settlers are attacking Palestinians, that's not their problem.
[00:12:55]  International volunteers, even.
[00:12:57]  The settlers in the town we were stationed in in Khusra.
[00:13:02]  They were two weeks before I was there.
[00:13:08]  The settlers attacked international activists with metal rods and sticks.
[00:13:16]  They got beaten up.
[00:13:17]  One person had a huge like.
[00:13:19]  Oh, I saw that, though.
[00:13:19]  Like it's like a British kid, right?
[00:13:22]  He got fucked up.
[00:13:23]  Yeah.
[00:13:23]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:13:24]  Yeah, he got a huge bruise and like not even a golf ball.
[00:13:28]  It was wild.
[00:13:29]  Yeah, yeah, it's like a football.
[00:13:30]  And that was me like come going into Palestine.
[00:13:33]  I was like, oh, this is real.
[00:13:34]  Like, I'm about to, you know, see the real deal in Palestine.
[00:13:40]  Because before that, there was no, I guess, precedent, at least through the organization I was in.
[00:13:47]  But then that happened.
[00:13:49]  I got shot.
[00:13:52]  I think two weeks after I left, they were throwing stones at international activists, shooting at Palestinians.
[00:14:01]  The settlers were shooting themselves, were shooting at Palestinians themselves.
[00:14:05]  Yeah, I believe so.
[00:14:06]  And the settlers were throwing rocks.
[00:14:10]  So it split.
[00:14:11]  I think one of the international volunteers heads open broke a hand.
[00:14:16]  And yeah, and then Aishnur was also murdered.
[00:14:20]  But that was by the IDF, the Israeli army.
[00:14:25]  I mean, when they started, if you don't mind me asking, has anyone ever shot at you before?
[00:14:31]  Not that I know of.
[00:14:34]  Maybe, but this was also my first time getting shot.
[00:14:39]  So tear gas and being shot.
[00:14:41]  Because I fully get, like, yeah, I mean, everyone kind of knows the settlers, like, well, basically, they're like football hooligans who go around and just beat the shit out of you.
[00:14:49]  Sometimes they'll kill you.
[00:14:50]  They don't generally kill foreigners.
[00:14:55]  But were you expecting, like, okay, like, you know, there's going to be trouble, but were you expecting to be like genuinely to actually be shot at?
[00:15:03]  Absolutely not.
[00:15:04]  I was like, I got a power of passport, but also, like, I knew that there was a risk.
[00:15:09]  But I thought it was going to be the extent of maybe the tear gas.
[00:15:16]  But being an international activist, I thought they'd be more cautious.
[00:15:21]  Yeah.
[00:15:22]  But at the same time, when I got to the hospital, one of the people we were with was arrested, and then they heard that they thought I was Palestinian running away.
[00:15:35]  So they did.
[00:15:36]  Yeah, which doesn't make it any better.
[00:15:38]  No, obviously not.
[00:15:40]  That's the excuse is they're like, oh, yeah, that's sorry.
[00:15:43]  It's like, you look brown through the scope.
[00:15:45]  Yeah.
[00:15:45]  And the official report was, oh, it was a mistake.
[00:15:49]  We were doing warning shots in the air.
[00:15:51]  They were definitely shooting at us and the Palestinians.
[00:15:55]  So that was definitely false.
[00:15:57]  Yeah, they were doing warning shots on the air on the ground.
[00:16:00]  Yeah.
[00:16:00]  Down low.
[00:16:01]  Wait, so when they were shooting at you, they were in the tower?
[00:16:04]  I don't know.
[00:16:04]  I was running.
[00:16:05]  Oh, you were at that point.
[00:16:06]  You were just taking off.
[00:16:07]  I didn't know if, because the Palestinians were running from our left, I didn't know if some Israeli army was coming from that end or the people that were up in the tower were coming down.
[00:16:20]  But either way, their story was warning shots.
[00:16:25]  But usually, if they're shooting in the air, it would come down on you.
[00:16:28]  This one straight through my right thigh from the back to the front.
[00:16:32]  Wait, can you just where do you get shot?
[00:16:34]  Right here.
[00:16:36]  Damn.
[00:16:37]  Yeah.
[00:16:38]  And I was very lucky.
[00:16:40]  That's why I was also smiling because I was like, I don't know how bad this is, but I want the folks back home to know I'm okay.
[00:16:48]  Yeah.
[00:16:48]  I think.
[00:16:50]  Did it go through?
[00:16:51]  Yeah, straight through.
[00:16:52]  I mean, that's lucky.
[00:16:53]  Yeah, when I was so no bone, no artery.
[00:16:56]  And when I looked at it, the one time I did at the hospital when they were cleaning it, it was like a flesh flower.
[00:17:03]  It was like pulsating too.
[00:17:05]  Oh my gosh.
[00:17:06]  I almost fainted when I saw it.
[00:17:08]  And I was like, good thing that I did not look at it in the ambulance.
[00:17:12]  Yeah.
[00:17:13]  Good God.
[00:17:14]  And so you said, I'm sorry to dwell on this a little bit.
[00:17:17]  Obviously, like everybody else, I'm afraid of someone shooting me.
[00:17:22]  So naturally I'm like kind of almost morbidly curious.
[00:17:25]  Like when you so you got shot, the adrenaline kept you going.
[00:17:27]  Oh yeah, I was still running.
[00:17:30]  But I was running and limping.
[00:17:31]  And then one of the other international activists came back and then helped me limp away until we got to the clearing.
[00:17:38]  And they shot other people too?
[00:17:40]  They shot at them.
[00:17:42]  In Beta, there's 17 Palestinians that have been murdered since October 7th.
[00:17:47]  And then also almost a month later, Aishinora was murdered and she was part of International Solidarity Mission.
[00:17:54]  Yeah, I know a couple other people, or at least one other person, I think a teenager got shot at the same protest as her.
[00:18:00]  How long did it take to get to the hospital?
[00:18:02]  Because you mentioned being stopped.
[00:18:03]  And that's a, that's like, kind of anybody who follows like Israel-Palestine, like one of the most, I think, well-publicized things because media isn't afraid to report on because it's kind of like, you can't really argue with this being wrong, but like medical people trying to get to hospitals throughout Palestine, whether we're talking about from Gaza, which is even harder, but like even through the West Bank with all the different areas because Israeli army controls some, some is technically controlled by the Palestinian Authority, some is this weird mix of both.
[00:18:34]  It took you a while to get there, and they just like open the ambulance and just look at you.
[00:18:38]  Yeah.
[00:18:38]  And they're like, okay, I guess.
[00:18:40]  So they close it.
[00:18:41]  Another checkpoint.
[00:18:44]  Yeah, so I think I got shot around a little bit after two.
[00:18:48]  And then took a little while to get to, well, it was pretty quick to get to the emergency clinic in Beta and then getting transferred into the ambulance.
[00:18:58]  And then I think that was all maybe like 2.30.
[00:19:03]  And then it took 30 minutes to get to a place that could have taken a lot quicker.
[00:19:08]  Yeah.
[00:19:09]  So like another 30 minutes after.
[00:19:11]  Jesus Christ.
[00:19:13]  I mean, what's going through your head at this point?
[00:19:15]  You know, I mean.
[00:19:17]  Oh, in the ambulance?
[00:19:19]  Yeah.
[00:19:21]  I was just like, I feel okay.
[00:19:25]  My vitals are stable.
[00:19:27]  Yeah.
[00:19:29]  My friend is here.
[00:19:30]  My friend's in the front.
[00:19:32]  The Palestinians have treated me well and showed me so much love.
[00:19:38]  I hope it's not that bad.
[00:19:40]  I hope I survive.
[00:19:43]  This is exactly what my friends feared and my family.
[00:19:46]  But all they're going to hear is that I got shot.
[00:19:50]  So that's why I was keeping the smiling face and hoping that this was the extent of the pain and it was not going to go higher.
[00:19:57]  Which thankfully that was the case.
[00:19:59]  Did people try to talk you out of going?
[00:20:01]  Yeah.
[00:20:02]  I mean, I think they they knew my passion.
[00:20:04]  They knew that I wanted to be there in solidarity.
[00:20:09]  You know, they were just like, don't go.
[00:20:13]  It's dangerous.
[00:20:14]  And I'm like, yeah, yeah, it's dangerous.
[00:20:16]  I know you don't want me to go, but you know, my mind's set, and you know, I want to show my solidarity in this way.
[00:20:25]  I get that.
[00:20:27]  Yeah.
[00:20:28]  And then two days after, it was two days, basically right after you get there that that happened.

=== Funeral Flags (15:51) ===

[00:20:32]  Yeah.
[00:20:32]  So just like Aishinura, it was like our training was Wednesday.
[00:20:37]  And then actually the next day after that, Thursday, it was just very calm.
[00:20:41]  And I was like, ooh, is this how I'm going to have is this how it's going to be for the whole two weeks I'm there?
[00:20:49]  So that day, I only had like a few pairs of clothes.
[00:20:53]  I packed really light.
[00:20:54]  So I bought some clothes, got transferred, or you know, exchanged the money, and we had a beautiful dinner at a Palestinian house, a family's house.
[00:21:03]  And I was just like, whoa, okay.
[00:21:06]  I like to see this side too.
[00:21:08]  Yeah.
[00:21:09]  But I was like, okay, so when are we going to have to be alert and everything?
[00:21:14]  So the next day, that happened.
[00:21:16]  And then I got shot.
[00:21:18]  Yeah.
[00:21:18]  I mean, we've mentioned it a couple times, but I think it was less than a month later, maybe just a few weeks later, Aishinur gets shot.
[00:21:32]  And that, you know, it's funny, whenever stuff like that happens, especially in Palestine, but really mostly in Palestine, you're always like, surely something will happen, right?
[00:21:42]  Like, surely, like, this will make, because I remember seeing the news after you got shot and being like, damn, this dude got shot.
[00:21:50]  Yeah.
[00:21:51]  But, you know.
[00:21:53]  And I was like, that's pretty crazy.
[00:21:54]  Like, you know, and this is also in the context of Biden going out there and especially in relation to the hostages, like, if you harm an American, we will parm you or whatever the fuck.
[00:22:05]  I mean, I'm sure it took him 15, 20 minutes to finish that one sentence, but you know what I mean.
[00:22:09]  Biden saying all this shit, like about like, you know, if where we go one, we go all with Americans.
[00:22:15]  Obviously, we're discounting the numerous American Palestinians or Palestinian Americans, whatever.
[00:22:22]  They have been numerous and nothing's happened.
[00:22:23]  Nothing's happened.
[00:22:24]  Not even like, yeah, who that, yeah.
[00:22:27]  You got just Jake Sullivan out there being like, they're looking into it.
[00:22:30]  Yeah, that's it.
[00:22:32]  Was there any like reaction?
[00:22:33]  Like, did they like, did like the consulate contact you?
[00:22:40]  So the only official, I guess, concerning the U.S. act that they did was the U.S. Embassy contacted me.
[00:22:54]  They contacted me, wanted a report, and then eventually, because I didn't stay long enough to want, or I never wanted to go to, you know, a settlement or military base to give in the report.
[00:23:14]  But through the embassy, they were able to send the report to Israeli authorities.
[00:23:20]  And I just got that email two days ago that they finally received it.
[00:23:27]  After Aishnur was shot.
[00:23:28]  After I left already.
[00:23:32]  But yeah, so, and then the State Department had some notice where it was like, oh, we know that an American citizen was shot in Palestine.
[00:23:41]  I saw that.
[00:23:43]  Don't advise anyone to go to Palestine.
[00:23:47]  So no one else has reached out to you from the government?
[00:23:49]  No State Department.
[00:23:50]  No politicians.
[00:23:52]  But you got shot by the army of another country.
[00:23:55]  Of another country.
[00:23:56]  That's supposed to be the U.S. ally.
[00:23:58]  Yeah.
[00:23:58]  So it's wild.
[00:24:01]  The only politician that did try to reach out to me was Corey Booker.
[00:24:06]  No, fucking.
[00:24:07]  You're joking.
[00:24:07]  Yeah.
[00:24:09]  Because you're a Jersey boy.
[00:24:10]  Yeah, I'm a Jersey boy.
[00:24:13]  Go on, go on.
[00:24:14]  I'll take it out.
[00:24:16]  So he tried to reach out to me.
[00:24:18]  Someone was like, oh, you know, he's trying to reach out to you.
[00:24:22]  Can we give your contact information?
[00:24:23]  I'm like, no.
[00:24:26]  So in PBS NJ Spotlight, I told them, yeah, Corey Booker reached out to me.
[00:24:32]  But I invite him to the lobby day with Americans for Justice in Palestine on the 24th and the 23rd of this month.
[00:24:43]  So I want him to meet with me, but with other people that can give their testimony because I don't want to be the only one.
[00:24:53]  And I didn't want to give him my contact information because he'd call and say, oh, I'm sorry, man.
[00:24:58]  But what are you going to do?
[00:25:00]  What are you going to do about being sorry?
[00:25:02]  What are you going to do about not saying anything when I was shot, your constituent?
[00:25:09]  Which could have helped in the case of Aishanur, right?
[00:25:12]  Yeah.
[00:25:13]  The Friday right after, in beta, right after she was shot, there was no tear gas, no live rounds.
[00:25:22]  And that could have probably happened if something was highlighted by my senator or any other politician when I was shot.
[00:25:30]  And the media here too.
[00:25:31]  So it's just sad that it took the sacrifice of Aishanur to have that kind of change happen.
[00:25:42]  They still blocked off where they usually pray.
[00:25:45]  So they really weren't able to do what they usually want to do in demonstrations.
[00:25:52]  But yeah, it shows that there was a shift.
[00:25:55]  And that should have happened before anyone else was murdered or killed.
[00:25:59]  Yeah, I mean, that's that's sort of what I was getting at with the fact that there was no outcry after you got shot.
[00:26:09]  And when you, I mean, it's, it's, it's, we've seen this time and time again with like not only Americans, but internationals getting shot.
[00:26:17]  The IDF delaying investigation, impeding investigation.
[00:26:22]  In the case of, I believe the British guy got shot, I think it was, and again, I might be wrong on this, and this is going off memory.
[00:26:28]  I think it was a British guy got shot in 2003, brain dead.
[00:26:32]  I think he's maybe taken off life support in 2004, but he's killed by the sniper.
[00:26:35]  The sniper who did it, fucking sniper, sees him through a scope, shoots him.
[00:26:40]  He gets in prison for manslaughter, but then is freed by the government after serving a little over half his term of 10 years.
[00:26:46]  So he gets out after about six years.
[00:26:49]  You know, Rachel Corey, same thing.
[00:26:51]  And now, you know, her name gets smeared by all the Hasboris.
[00:26:56]  But the American government has the ability to temper Israel in some regards, right?
[00:27:03]  Like with Lebanon and Reagan even, with, you know, there can be some phone calls made, at least, tone it down.
[00:27:12]  Don't shoot any of our guys for the next month or so.
[00:27:16]  And they're just simply, they're just not interested in that.
[00:27:18]  It doesn't seem like.
[00:27:19]  Yeah.
[00:27:19]  And, you know, this administration, last administration, probably every future administration, you know, if we continue with this two-party system that, you know, perpetuates this, you know, will support Israel.
[00:27:34]  And, you know, we don't see any real change even in the politicians in their support of Israel.
[00:27:42]  And even to the point of being super ridiculous, right?
[00:27:48]  We heard Biden, you know, parrot the lie that, oh, it was unintentional, they said.
[00:27:53]  And then he added, right, that it was ricocheted off the ground into her head.
[00:27:56]  Like, it's ridiculous.
[00:28:00]  And yeah, there's testimonies on the ground from U.S. citizens.
[00:28:06]  There's people that were there, you know.
[00:28:08]  And she purposely was away from the protest and still was sniped in the head after, I believe she got up from her prayer and then got sniped in the head.
[00:28:19]  Yeah.
[00:28:20]  Which is, yeah, wild.
[00:28:22]  And it's not just the government.
[00:28:23]  I mean, you know, you mentioned the media and the U.S. media covering this has been basically non-existent.
[00:28:31]  Like even then the report on her funeral, the New York Times went out of their way to characterize the funeral as not very American looking.
[00:28:43]  Yeah.
[00:28:43]  Too hot.
[00:28:44]  Yes.
[00:28:44]  Oh, dude.
[00:28:45]  Yeah, they said you should pull it up.
[00:28:48]  Not very American looking.
[00:28:49]  I mean, you might have been, dude, it's been crazy because if you just read the Bear Women's media reports about her, you're like, this is a Turkish woman who moved to America at 24 and then went to Palestine at 26.
[00:29:02]  Like this is like a this is a Turk.
[00:29:04]  But like she moved here when she was less than one years old.
[00:29:07]  She's from fucking Seattle, which no disrespect to Seattle.
[00:29:10]  Some disrespect to Seattle, but she's a good part from it.
[00:29:13]  Seattle is a pretty, that is, come on, you kind of can't get more American, the boring side than that.
[00:29:21]  And it was just like, it's basically like portrayed her as this like, you know, maybe college radical Turk Muslim who goes over there and like sticks her nose where it doesn't belong and gets shot accidentally by our, the most moral army in the world.
[00:29:37]  And, you know, it's, it's, anyone who shot a gun can tell you it's fucking hard to shoot.
[00:29:42]  Like, it is.
[00:29:42]  Like, it's hard to shoot like super accurately.
[00:29:44]  There's a reason like you don't really like aim at targets for heads and stuff.
[00:29:48]  They're small.
[00:29:50]  It's just like when they shot Shireen Abu Akla.
[00:29:54]  It's like there was this whole thing where it was like, oh, well, the Palestinians shot her.
[00:29:58]  Oh, then like, oh, it was actually someone accidentally shot her.
[00:30:00]  And it's like, no, I'm sorry.
[00:30:02]  You shot her on purpose.
[00:30:03]  Like this video of you like shooting near her and then hitting her.
[00:30:07]  Yeah, I mean that's like, how did you feel when you heard about that?
[00:30:11]  Which one?
[00:30:13]  Aishnur?
[00:30:13]  Aishnur, yeah.
[00:30:15]  Yeah, it was a lot because it was the same demonstration I was shot at.
[00:30:21]  And for me, it was just, it just angered me because, you know, there was no attention when I was shot, which could have helped deter, you know, an escalation like that, where she was murdered, shot to the head, you know.
[00:30:38]  And when I heard that too, thankfully my students were chill that day because I was a wreck.
[00:30:45]  And yeah, so it also, also the cane that they gave me from Beta, it just reminded me that, you know, my duty here as someone that has been over there, saw it firsthand, and can share the stories is, you know, I use every opportunity to shine the spotlight on Palestine and now also Aishinur that was murdered.
[00:31:12]  You know, just carry the cane of Beta with me to remind me and, you know, just continue on.
[00:31:19]  So this is how the New York Times characterized it.
[00:31:21]  With Turkish flags flying and chants of, quote, God is great, resounding through the cemetery.
[00:31:26]  Aishner Ezgi Igi, a Turkish-American activist killed by Israeli forces in the West Bank, was laid to rest on Saturday in a town on Turkey's Aegean coast.
[00:31:35]  Although she moved to the United States as a toddler, acquired citizenship, and spent most of her life there, the funeral for Miss Egy26 was deeply Turkish and profoundly pro-Palestinian.
[00:31:47]  Hundreds of people, many carrying Palestinian flags and wearing Palestinian scarves, gathered at the central mosque in the town of Didem to say prayers for her, including senior Turkish officials.
[00:31:57]  No American officials attended, and there was not an American flag in sight.
[00:32:01]  Yeah.
[00:32:02]  Some incredible details that the New York Times decided to add.
[00:32:07]  Yeah.
[00:32:08]  I mean, that's like the last line of the article, I think.
[00:32:11]  Yeah, and just even the phrasing, acquired U.S. citizenship.
[00:32:15]  I don't know.
[00:32:16]  There's a lot of ways the media coats these things that is, maybe at first blush doesn't seem to be that terrible.
[00:32:25]  But when taken in total with the fact that they refuse to kind of cover this, refuse to point out who's responsible and why, you know, it starts to paint a bigger picture.
[00:32:39]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:32:40]  And they were in Turkey.
[00:32:43]  And also, Palestinians have a huge respect for any international activists.
[00:32:50]  And especially, you know, for the handful of folks that are martyred, they see them as heroes that are forever, you know, they are indebted to for standing up for them alongside them.
[00:33:05]  So, yes, there are Palestinian flags.
[00:33:07]  Yes, there are Turkish flags because they're in Turkey.
[00:33:11]  I'm sure that if it was in the U.S., you'd have U.S. flags around and probably Turkey and probably Palestinian flags too.
[00:33:20]  But also, it also saddens me that not one official went to her funeral.
[00:33:31]  The absence of American flags is also because nobody from the U.S. cared enough to be there at her funeral and pay respects to a U.S. citizen.
[00:33:44]  So the absence is on them.
[00:33:46]  I mean, even more to that point, this might have changed by now, but at least by yesterday, Biden still hadn't called her family.
[00:33:54]  Yeah.
[00:33:55]  Wild.
[00:33:56]  Didn't call me.
[00:33:56]  Yeah.
[00:33:58]  Didn't call her family.
[00:33:59]  And that's an American citizen that was murdered by your ally.
[00:34:04]  Yeah.
[00:34:06]  Yeah.
[00:34:07]  the absence of care and um yeah it's just disrespectful and disgusting so well i want i want to i want to go back to something you said about uh palestinians connection to international solidarity right Yeah.
[00:34:35]  The Palestinian movement has been internationalist in character since like the 60s.
[00:34:41]  I mean, like the PLO at that point, like really, there was a certain point where they really positioned themselves as like a global front or as part of a global front as part of the third world movement, but also just as part of the, at that time, like socialist movement.
[00:34:56]  And since that time, there have been a lot of people who've I've known many of them myself who've had some interactions with the Palestinians.
[00:35:08]  And say no more about that.
[00:35:10]  But I think one of the things that a lot of people, especially here, like in America, I can't speak for anywhere else, but in America, I'm talking specifically about a lot of the hubbub around the college protests.
[00:35:22]  There was this thing where it's like, why do you care about this?
[00:35:25]  Like, what you privilege white people or whatever.
[00:35:27]  I mean, that's usually how that's betrayed.
[00:35:29]  Why are you getting involved in this ancient feud between the Israelis and the Palestinians?
[00:35:36]  Which is crazy because I mean, just like, really?
[00:35:39]  I don't know what we were doing like 1,200 years ago.
[00:35:42]  It seems like it's mostly been for the past 70 years.
[00:35:46]  But there's this whole thing where it's like, you shouldn't get involved.
[00:35:49]  You're an American.
[00:35:50]  What are you doing?
[00:35:51]  Sticking your nose in somewhere you don't belong.
[00:35:55]  You know, it's like you're privileged or whatever, whatever the fuck they say.
[00:35:59]  But that's not the case.
[00:36:00]  Like, Palestinians do seem to really respect a lot of, and I know Rachel Corey is like, you know, the first I ever heard about it was from a fucking, there's a liquor store on H Street that has had a picture of her up there since I was like a fucking teenager.
[00:36:14]  And like a bunch of shit.
[00:36:16]  You know, like that, that, that, like, what do you say to people who have this sort of like self-doubt maybe even about that?

=== Faces Of Struggle (04:52) ===

[00:36:23]  Yeah.
[00:36:26]  I guess personally, right, with solidarity with Palestinians, I'm part of the National Democratic Movement of the Philippines.
[00:36:37]  So Anak Bayan, Bayam.
[00:36:42]  So we used to organize with some Palestinians.
[00:36:45]  Some folks know from New York this organization called Wool Palestine, within our lifetime Palestine.
[00:36:53]  So I was introduced up when I was at the protest on Labor Day by Nerdine.
[00:37:02]  And I didn't even know the story, but she told me that because of our organizing together with Anik Bayan and Bayan, that she created her organization, Wolf Palestine.
[00:37:15]  I always, back then, I always saw Palestinians standing up for Filipinos and our liberation for our country, true liberation.
[00:37:25]  And when I saw her organization starting up, you know, we always came out to support too.
[00:37:32]  So, yeah, it's very deep.
[00:37:35]  The solidarity between Filipinos and Palestinians.
[00:37:39]  Palestinians have also stood up for, you know, against police brutality.
[00:37:44]  You see it on the apartheid wall.
[00:37:47]  George Floyd's photo was up there.
[00:37:53]  And The thing about it too is all of our struggles are interconnected.
[00:38:02]  You know, our NYPD is trained by the IDF, some of them, right?
[00:38:10]  In the Philippines, I think the Philippines is like the third or fifth largest buyer of weapons from Israel.
[00:38:19]  So all of our struggles, we're oppressed by the same folks, right?
[00:38:25]  But also all of our struggles, you know, are interconnected because of that.
[00:38:29]  So the character of the Palestinian liberation movement is very internationalist in character, the Philippine movement.
[00:38:40]  And also, I hope that here too, it builds up.
[00:38:45]  And when people doubt that, oh, why am I, you know, or when folks critique people that are standing up for Palestine, I just say that, you know, all of our, you know, struggles and oppression are tied and we can only liberate each other, ourselves, when we're all together and supporting each other.
[00:39:11]  And if you have doubt, there's a genocide happening on our phones every day.
[00:39:17]  I think that's where a lot of folks, at least right now, they're joining in because they just can't get away from it.
[00:39:24]  Because it's happening right in front of our faces.
[00:39:27]  And those of moral standing and good hearts, they just know that this is wrong.
[00:39:37]  You know, they said the same thing about activists back when it's anti-war movement in Vietnam.
[00:39:45]  So don't doubt yourself and know that your heart's in the right place.
[00:39:50]  And it's right in front of our faces.
[00:39:54]  You can't not say that we're in the wrong.
[00:40:01]  It's undeniable.
[00:40:02]  So, yeah.
[00:40:04]  I had a question.
[00:40:06]  You know, I think a lot of people see, you know, you mentioned like people see this stuff on their phones, which I think some people maybe get sucked into just literally looking at pictures of dead bodies a little too much.
[00:40:17]  And like, I understand, you know, it's, I, I, and it feels, but I think, I think, not to get to whatever about it, but like, I think maybe sometimes that feels like, like, you're almost like punishing yourself and that feels like doing something because it feels like we can't do anything.
[00:40:31]  But the reality is, like, you can do things.
[00:40:35]  And I think that's like, because that's something I've heard from so many people is like, well, what can I do?
[00:40:39]  What can I do?
[00:40:40]  What can I do?
[00:40:41]  And, you know, you went over there.
[00:40:43]  Can you actually walk us through like what that process was?
[00:40:48]  Yeah.
[00:40:49]  So I was just very disillusion with the world when I was when October 7th the escalation happened.
[00:40:58]  I was teaching and I'm like how can I be teaching in the midst of this genocide and like as if nothing's happening.
[00:41:05]  Yeah.
[00:41:06]  Fast forward to like the end of the year at a Kafiya.
[00:41:10]  I guess someone stole it.
[00:41:12]  Hopefully it's someone that supported it and just didn't have access to one.

=== End Year Kafiya Orientation (03:22) ===

[00:41:15]  I was bringing my students snacks for the end of the year.
[00:41:19]  It was like the last week.
[00:41:21]  So I had to get a new one.
[00:41:23]  I got a postcard.
[00:41:24]  It said, you know, thank you for your support.
[00:41:27]  And then the right side said invitation to visit.
[00:41:29]  So I've always wanted to go to Palestine, but that was like the, I guess, the spark that was like, okay, this is your time right now.
[00:41:36]  You're about to go to summer break.
[00:41:39]  So I asked around and someone told me about FASA.
[00:41:46]  So it's similar to ISM, International Solidarity Mission.
[00:41:51]  And so you provide the protective presence.
[00:41:55]  So before I knew anything about that, I, I guess, applied or registered for an orientation with them.
[00:42:04]  Like on a website or something?
[00:42:05]  Yeah, so it's defendpalestine.org.
[00:42:08]  Or if you go on Instagram, it's at F-A-Z the letter, or the letter, the number three, N-A-A, underscore P-A-L.
[00:42:18]  So FAZA underscore PAL.
[00:42:21]  And I got connected and it started with the orientation.
[00:42:28]  And I was like, okay, this is pretty cool.
[00:42:31]  You know, I'm down for this.
[00:42:34]  And then there's like a four-hour training online a couple weeks later.
[00:42:38]  And I was like, whoa, this is a lot.
[00:42:41]  But it's good information.
[00:42:42]  You know, you learn about how to differentiate between all the different, you know, like settler or army.
[00:42:49]  You just learn how to get there, what to do, if certain things happen.
[00:42:57]  And then that was it.
[00:43:00]  And then after that, or actually, you kind of, you plan a certain time that you're going to go.
[00:43:08]  It's every other Wednesday that people go over.
[00:43:13]  And the minimum commitment is two weeks.
[00:43:16]  Oh, that's right.
[00:43:17]  Yeah, two weeks.
[00:43:18]  So obviously some people stay more.
[00:43:20]  There's people that have been there since the beginning of FASA and still there.
[00:43:26]  Some friends take three weeks, four weeks.
[00:43:30]  But whatever your commitment is, they do ask for like two weeks.
[00:43:33]  You really do need like the two weeks just to even familiarize yourself with everything.
[00:43:38]  And it's just a lot, right?
[00:43:42]  So if you can, it's two weeks.
[00:43:44]  And Within those two weeks, well, right when you land and you get there, you go to whole day training and then you go to wherever you're stationed.
[00:43:58]  So ISM is usually in the south.
[00:44:01]  FASA is usually central or north.
[00:44:04]  And then it's always consent-based.
[00:44:06]  So like, you know, if you want to go to, you know, see the refugee camp, or if you want to go to Jordan Valley, if you wanted to go to Master Ferryata, where ISM is, there are ways, right?
[00:44:22]  So you're not just always stationed in one place if that's not what you want, right?
[00:44:28]  And if you don't want to go to, you know, a demonstration, you don't need to.
[00:44:32]  There's always room for folks to do what they're able to in their capacity.

=== Important Work Happened (02:38) ===

[00:44:38]  You can just watch, you know?
[00:44:40]  Where we were, like on a hill, and you see a settlement here, settlement there, and you can see when the army trucks come down.
[00:44:50]  You can see when groups of settlers are around.
[00:44:53]  So that's very important work too, right?
[00:44:56]  I was on crutches, and the only thing I could do was watch.
[00:45:00]  And I was able to see, you know, the Israeli army come.
[00:45:04]  It's like the orange lights.
[00:45:05]  So whenever I'm here, you know, I'm like, oh, that street cleaner is not IOF.
[00:45:12]  You know, that park, you know, authority is not IOF.
[00:45:16]  Oh, goodness.
[00:45:17]  You know, it's just like the light.
[00:45:20]  So it's very apparent.
[00:45:22]  When you're there, you can watch.
[00:45:25]  And then in town, a lot of times the Israeli army comes in, you're watching shepherds, or you're accompanying them.
[00:45:34]  You're accompanying farmers.
[00:45:38]  And my favorite was going to the playground, the garden, they call it, right when I got out of the hospital.
[00:45:46]  And I was dancing with the kids, you know.
[00:45:48]  And they actually only opened that when the international volunteers came.
[00:45:52]  So there was no like real space for the kids to play until we came.
[00:45:57]  So that was a really beautiful thing to see.
[00:46:01]  And then that process, they'll help you when you leave too, as much as they can.
[00:46:06]  And yeah, it's great.
[00:46:09]  It's beautiful.
[00:46:11]  Sorry, I just assumed you flew home after you got shot, but you stayed out there.
[00:46:16]  Oh, yeah.
[00:46:16]  So everyone was like, come home.
[00:46:19]  And I'm like, I just got shot.
[00:46:24]  It's two days.
[00:46:26]  I want to stay here.
[00:46:27]  I want to be in Palestine.
[00:46:28]  You know, even when I left, I wanted to stay, you know, even longer.
[00:46:33]  I actually wanted to stay until more people came, which thankfully there was a whole bunch of people that came after because I was scared that it was only going to be a few people there.
[00:46:43]  But so many more people came.
[00:46:45]  I was really happy that they were safe and they had good peoples.
[00:46:51]  And yeah, every two weeks.
[00:46:54]  So there's always folks rotating in, out, going to different areas.
[00:47:01]  And it's very important work.
[00:47:03]  And the Palestinians recognize that and very much appreciate it.
[00:47:08]  So you wrote about your experience in Time Magazine.
[00:47:11]  We will link to that.
[00:47:13]  In the show notes so people can check it out.

=== Breakthrough Voices (09:42) ===

[00:47:16]  You did mention to us that you had originally submitted that at other places, but they were not so interested in the story.
[00:47:24]  Yeah, so that was the NEW YORK Times.
[00:47:27]  They rejected it um, for whatever reason.
[00:47:31]  Um, i'm sure they just I can think of one or two.
[00:47:33]  Yeah exactly uh, TIME magazine picked it up and they did say that, you know, they would only publish it if I put my real name out, which that was actually the second publication that uh, published my name, because also, Washington POST um, and Washington POST only used a little quote.
[00:47:51]  You know, it was very much focused on Eish and Are, which is great yeah um but um, they also were like okay, we're only publishing it if or at least your comment, if we use your real name and i'm like okay, you know, whatever you know sheds more light on Palestine and Aishinur.
[00:48:11]  So yeah, my name's out there.
[00:48:14]  I actually this is a stupid question, so I don't even want to end on this, but I do want to ask, you teach high school?
[00:48:20]  Yeah yeah, high school.
[00:48:22]  So you had to go during the summer.
[00:48:23]  Yeah yeah, this was, this was my summer break.
[00:48:26]  Um, this is just whenever I like read a story like this, I always wonder like, like details like this.
[00:48:32]  But like, when you came back to school, did all your students know that you got shot, like a few weeks ago?
[00:48:40]  So um, so I teach mostly freshmen.
[00:48:43]  There is one class where it's all the different grades, but when I got back um, my old students yeah um, they were like, mr Santiago, did you really get shot?
[00:48:56]  I saw it on tick tock and i'm like, oh my god.
[00:49:00]  I was like yes, I did, by the Israeli army.
[00:49:03]  Um, I was in Palestine, yeah.
[00:49:05]  And then my other students, my ninth graders, they didn't know so how.
[00:49:09]  I told them because you know, it's a guy with a cane.
[00:49:12]  Yeah, seems like a hip dude, whatever you know.
[00:49:14]  But um um, they were like um, you know why?
[00:49:21]  Why do you have a cane?
[00:49:22]  And i'm like, i'll tell you, i'll tell you.
[00:49:24]  So um, there was an Nj.com article that had my old name yeah Amadoson, that I used over there, and I had them all read like two sentences each, and just eased them in.
[00:49:39]  And once it was done, I was just like, okay, so you know, why do you think someone would go out there?
[00:49:44]  You know, I gave them a little background.
[00:49:46]  You know, I had to be like, okay, this is Israel's perspective.
[00:49:49]  This is Palestinian perspective.
[00:49:51]  You know, just generally how they view the situation.
[00:49:56]  And I was like, you know, yeah, this person was shot.
[00:50:00]  Why do you think this person went?
[00:50:01]  And then after everything was done, they gave their answers.
[00:50:05]  I was like, yeah, that was me.
[00:50:06]  And they're like, what?
[00:50:07]  And the ones that only paid attention for the two sentences, they were like, what?
[00:50:12]  Let me read this now.
[00:50:13]  Yeah.
[00:50:14]  So, yeah.
[00:50:16]  So it was fun.
[00:50:17]  And then, you know, now they all know.
[00:50:19]  So the kids that saw it on TikTok, were they like well-versed in what was going on?
[00:50:24]  Or did they have a sense of the context?
[00:50:29]  I think.
[00:50:29]  Like, what did they see?
[00:50:31]  Like, you're asked on TikTok.
[00:50:33]  What did they see?
[00:50:34]  I think they probably saw maybe the Breakthrough News video, maybe the Al Jazeera, but I feel like Breakthrough News was more, you know, something that they may stumble across.
[00:50:49]  More than Al Jazeera?
[00:50:51]  I don't know.
[00:50:51]  I don't know what the kids look at these days.
[00:50:53]  You don't know the breakthrough the PSL outlet?
[00:50:57]  Yeah.
[00:50:58]  Maybe actually maybe respect that.
[00:51:00]  You know what?
[00:51:00]  That's, you know, respect.
[00:51:02]  I've met some breakthrough people before.
[00:51:03]  They're nice.
[00:51:04]  Yeah.
[00:51:04]  But somehow someone found out about it.
[00:51:08]  And I guess they shared it with each other.
[00:51:10]  They're like, is this Mr. Santiago?
[00:51:12]  So that's how I guess everyone knew.
[00:51:14]  And then whenever they pass by, they're like, some folks don't know.
[00:51:17]  And then they're just like, hey, you okay?
[00:51:20]  You're Kane?
[00:51:20]  And I'm like, yeah, I was shot.
[00:51:22]  And they're like, what?
[00:51:23]  I was like, yeah, I was.
[00:51:24]  You got to end gun violence.
[00:51:26]  Yeah.
[00:51:27]  And yeah, the monopoly of violence Israel has on Palestinians.
[00:51:31]  Yeah.
[00:51:33]  Yeah.
[00:51:33]  Actually, I'd agree with that a little more.
[00:51:37]  Yeah, I think, I think, I think I actually want to end on a question because about kind of going back to why you went out there and going back to the subject of like people seeing all this stuff and feeling like really animated about it and sometimes even like kind of going a little crazy from seeing it a little bit.
[00:51:56]  What recommendation would you have to people who like are feeling like they're useless, that there's nothing they can do, that they're just watching these atrocities happen all the time?
[00:52:05]  Like obviously they can't go to Gaza, but like, you know, we've covered on the show before, but like also if you follow Palestine, like you know like the violence has escalated in the West Bank as it's escalated in Gaza.
[00:52:16]  You know, the raids have grown more frequent.
[00:52:18]  Now, well now they're moving up everyone towards Lebanon, but like You know, this violence is occurring in a place where, like, it's not just Godzilla, or it's not just, like, a declared, well, whatever the fuck they're calling it, war operation, whatever the fuck.
[00:52:34]  What would you say to people, like, who do watch this stuff and do feel, like, hopeless and helpless, and like, there's nothing they can do?
[00:52:40]  Yeah, so, you know, teach their own capacity.
[00:52:45]  Sharing always helps.
[00:52:46]  It allows, you know, visibility because a lot of times folks are shadow banned and the algorithm does, you know, put it down.
[00:52:58]  Beyond that, there is, you know, writing to your local politicians and trying to pressure them, even though we see that most of the time it doesn't work.
[00:53:11]  That's another way.
[00:53:12]  Beyond that, join an anti-imperialist organization near you.
[00:53:18]  Those that actively try to, you know, dismantle these systems through an anti-imperialist lens.
[00:53:30]  You know, the same structure that upholds, you know, this U.S. system and Israel itself.
[00:53:40]  And, you know, building organization, getting people together and mobilizing for all these protests, which is another thing that you can go to, right?
[00:53:48]  To raise visibility.
[00:53:51]  Fundraisers that happen sometimes after those.
[00:53:56]  Go to film screenings.
[00:53:59]  Organize film screenings for your friends.
[00:54:02]  Like, these are things that are doable, right?
[00:54:05]  You can organize a film screening of Israelism or Where the Olive Tree Weeps or Five Broken Cameras, right?
[00:54:13]  You can do that with your friends.
[00:54:15]  And then from there, the interest can grow, you know, if you're in a place where there's no real organization out there.
[00:54:22]  And then do it up, right?
[00:54:26]  And beyond that, too, that the Palestinians are asking for, which if you are able to, right, mentally, physically, go to Palestine, right?
[00:54:39]  See for yourself through organizations like International Solidarity Mission or through FASA, which I was part of.
[00:54:48]  Because it's absolutely different being there.
[00:54:53]  Seeing the oppression that Palestinians face every day firsthand.
[00:54:58]  But on the flip side, seeing how beautiful Palestine is, and feeling the love and care that you get from Palestinians there, it's just an experience that I would not give up.
[00:55:15]  I think it's if you are able to, you know, and FASA does try their best not to turn anyone away if they have difficulties financially.
[00:55:27]  So, yeah, if you feel willing and able, going and volunteering is a great way to show solidarity.
[00:55:35]  And you see it firsthand.
[00:55:37]  It's so beautiful and it's so terrible at the same time.
[00:55:42]  But the Palestinian people just make it all worth it.
[00:55:45]  Palestine itself is so beautiful.
[00:55:48]  And even though I was shot, I want to go back.
[00:55:51]  So whether it is next year, you know, you want to come with me, if they even let me go back in.
[00:56:00]  Or, right, they are asking for people to come for harvest season.
[00:56:04]  When's that?
[00:56:05]  Which is like October 10th to November 10th.
[00:56:08]  And it doesn't need to be then either.
[00:56:11]  But if folks are able and willing, you know, one of those two weeks, they do need a lot of volunteers to help with all of harvest and obviously provide protective presence as well.
[00:56:25]  So that would be amazing, you know, if, you know, listeners are able to.
[00:56:32]  Well, thank you so much for coming on.
[00:56:34]  Yeah, it's been a pleasure.
[00:56:36]  Pleasure meeting you.
[00:56:37]  Absolutely.
[00:56:38]  Pleasure to be here.
[00:56:38]  Thank you so much.

=== Move In Together (02:25) ===

[00:56:58]  Well, we're going to link to a whole bunch of things in the notes.
[00:57:02]  A lot of information for people to check out, including His Op Ed, but links to some other organizations.
[00:57:08]  And yeah.
[00:57:10]  All right.
[00:57:10]  Well, let's get the hell out of here.
[00:57:12]  You can go home.
[00:57:14]  Maybe I don't want to.
[00:57:15]  Okay, well, let's all just stay.
[00:57:16]  We should all move in together.
[00:57:18]  Have you guys thought about that?
[00:57:19]  Yes.
[00:57:19]  And you.
[00:57:20]  You thought about it?
[00:57:21]  Well, only as a joke.
[00:57:23]  You thought about it to yourself as a joke?
[00:57:25]  Like, what if we all live together in a half-year?
[00:57:27]  I wasn't thinking that we would permanently live together, but I did.
[00:57:32]  I was thinking if we were to go to a remote area and all stay in closed quarters for a specific amount of time, what that would be like and what would be required, like amenities-wise.
[00:57:48]  Yeah.
[00:57:49]  I mean, I think that you guys would soon understand a few things about me that very few people have understood in the past, which are my deplorable personal habits.
[00:57:58]  And whatever you're thinking right now, you're wrong.
[00:58:00]  And it's something that you could never even imagine.
[00:58:02]  See, in my head, I'm picturing like a dollhouse, but we each have a floor, but then we all have to sleep in one bed.
[00:58:09]  Willy Wonka stops.
[00:58:09]  We have to sleep in one, we get to sleep in one bed, but like head to toe.
[00:58:12]  Yeah, head to toe.
[00:58:13]  Head to toe?
[00:58:14]  Yeah.
[00:58:15]  I'm just kidding.
[00:58:16]  I'm never doing that ever.
[00:58:17]  Neapolitan.
[00:58:19]  Because we are kind of Neapolitan.
[00:58:21]  I'm the strawberry.
[00:58:22]  Yeah.
[00:58:23]  Well, I'm chocolate.
[00:58:24]  Okay.
[00:58:25]  Put that.
[00:58:26]  No, it's true.
[00:58:28]  I think that, I think that we should all move in together into a picture of the city.
[00:58:32]  Obviously, I'm strawberry.
[00:58:34]  Yeah, you're obviously.
[00:58:35]  I'm not arguing with you being strawberry.
[00:58:36]  What are you talking about?
[00:58:37]  Yeah, you're strawberry.
[00:58:39]  No, but like, I mean, I think people, I think the viewers will vote me a strawberry.
[00:58:43]  Well, we don't have viewers.
[00:58:44]  We have listeners.
[00:58:44]  Yeah, you're always calling them viewers.
[00:58:46]  Because they view me.
[00:58:47]  They remote view me.
[00:58:49]  A lot of our listeners can see me in their dreams.
[00:58:51]  It's crazy dreams last night I had.
[00:58:53]  I'll tell you guys about them afterwards.
[00:58:54]  All right, everyone.
[00:58:55]  All right.
[00:58:56]  I'm Liz.
[00:58:57]  My name is Brace.
[00:58:57]  We are joined by producer Young Chomsky.
[00:58:59]  And this has been Dronon.
[00:59:01]  We'll see you next time.
[00:59:02]  Bye-bye.
[00:59:23]  Come out.